protection

[mossy sluice]

for some abilities they do

[jagged pier]

^^

[uneven mason]

I'l check it later

[mossy sluice]

fists of fury requires weapons

as odd as it is

[uneven mason]

but I only run disarm vs hunter rogue and DK

[jagged pier]

they need it enough to make my healer just survive

bit then again i have also seen a monk one shot my healer through duel

so theres that as well

[uneven mason]

yup

WW are deadly

CC em

peel em

[jagged pier]

i do that too

[grave flume]

Can karma be reflected?

[jagged pier]

like the one person on my friends list i pvp'd with sub ran out yesterday

[undone jacinth]

what renown is this week

14?

24

?

[jagged pier]

and we had a great tactic

[mossy sluice]

yeah 24

[grave flume]

24

[uneven mason]

afaik

Karma can be reflected

[jagged pier]

he was druid and had a leggo that gave him 160 movement speed

he would just kite

XD

[jagged pier]

I thought it was one tick

[uneven mason]

its a burst of nature

but

its instant

so woh knows

[mossy sluice]

karma can only be removed by bop/immunities

[heavy sail]

I usually just wait a second for WW to blow some of their CDs then pop DBTS and run

[jagged pier]

nah you wait for xuen

and fear

cause it s most of their damage

then they trinket and you stun

then u percing

and they cry a little

.

[steady spruce]

Are boss adds improved by fortified or only by tyrannical?

[jagged pier]

only tyran

[chilly brook]

No one knows

Not even blizz

[steady spruce]

ahaha thanks

[chilly brook]

Nah but jokes aside it's been variable in the past

[shut summit]

https://www.wowhead.com/news=316683/tyrannical-mythic-affix-no-longer-affects-minion-health-in-shadowlands

[undone jacinth]

think the question was more about when the wrong affix affects them

but I haven't seen any examples of that yet

[shut summit]

yea dont think it does

[steady spruce]

I think some spells on boss or boss's adds can be improved on Fortified week if they share ID with the Trashmobs spells

like necrotic bolt for example

[signal plover]

Omg dat face

[undone jacinth]

I like vulpera but ur dude

[chilly brook]

So ye DR for single target

[undone jacinth]

is looking

so damn ugly

[signal plover]

Looks better on the zoom

Barely

[chilly brook]

Slyfox lite

I mean I'm playing vulpera

I can't exactly ask to look nice

[true hazel]

coming back to wow. hows warrior for M+?

[heavy sail]

Furries

It’s good but you’d be better off asking in #fury @true hazel

[true hazel]

so prot isnt good for m+?

i should go fury

[heavy sail]

Oh I misread what you wrote

Yes they’re good for m+

Not the best

[chilly brook]

I blame @strong forum for me playing Vulpera

[true hazel]

oh ok. middle of the pack im guessing. not god mode like 8.3

[undone jacinth]

you'll find it easier to get groups as prot than fury most likely

[heavy sail]

Well we’re the worst technically speaking, but the worst is still good in the world of tanking

You won’t have a problem finding groups

[undone jacinth]

I refuse to accept we are below bdk

it will never happen

[chilly brook]

We're the worst how exactly?

[true hazel]

lol. i didnt want to start a fight. lol

[sterile moss]

I mean I don't play bdk but I would think physical damage in high keys is really rough for them. And it's not like they have dmg

[chilly brook]

High burst damage is rough for them period in high keys

[sterile moss]

They can't even kite well

[undone jacinth]

hm

they have like

the best kite in the game

[sterile moss]

I was thinking mobility

how the best kite?

[uneven mason]

TFW strong snare != good kite

[undone jacinth]

if the mobs are slowable

D&D is crazy

[uneven mason]

most of the ones which are dangerous are not

[undone jacinth]

idk about that

every pack is dangerous at a certain point

and most are slowable

and AMS is pretty strong although theres way too many spells these days

[heavy sail]

We have really poor magic damage mitigation, our physical mitigation is very good but it has unavoidable gaps in coverage, pretty shitty overall when it comes to kiting. Not the most durable, second or third lowest DPS by most accounts

I guess you could make an argument that bdk is as bad or worse

[chilly brook]

I mean

[heavy sail]

But pwarr has the most issues of any of the tank specs

[chilly brook]

Technically

IP is better than AMS

Outside of keeping you from getting debuffs

[undone jacinth]

thats not the comparison

it's death strike vs ip

if ur not getting put to 0 dk is better

trouble is dk often gets put to 0

[chilly brook]

And uhhh

[uneven mason]

Reduction of damage up front or recovery of health after

do you math?

[chilly brook]

Spell reflect is kinda nuts

[heavy sail]

Spell reflect and intervene are cool spells

[chilly brook]

Not a whole lot of dungeons are big on spell damage anyways

[uneven mason]

SR is pretty buff

[undone jacinth]

yeah if you math it healing ur full health bar is better than absorbing 10% of it

[heavy sail]

Like I can’t stress enough that I don’t think warrior is anything approximating bad

I just think the other tanks are better

[uneven mason]

I haven't seen a BDK do a full HP Bar heal in forever

[lavish oracle]

What is the debate here? Tank tier list stuff?

[undone jacinth]

I bet you've seen them do more than 10%

[heavy sail]

Ye

[uneven mason]

maybe

[lavish oracle]

Literally pointless

[uneven mason]

IP is more than 10% Of your HP

[undone jacinth]

20%

30%

whatever number

I bet you have seen more

[chilly brook]

I'd argue we're at least more durable than paladin, BDK and monk

[uneven mason]

you can't try and argue and be arbitrary and just pull bullshit out of your ear

[heavy sail]

Less than Monk, but the way Monk works is kinda hard to be compared to

[signal plover]

The debate is the same as always, subjective "ranking" of tanks based on feeliness and opinion, with the eventual consensus that, hey, we're all kinda ok

[chilly brook]

Not worth debating the specifics

[heavy sail]

Stagger and EB don’t give the pure mitigation but there’s value in delaying it

[uneven mason]

Old news, SL monks are more squish

[chilly brook]

Basically

[undone jacinth]

? lmao it's a very simple and well accepted concept

[lavish oracle]

More durable against blockable physical damage, probs

[undone jacinth]

nobody is more durable against blockable dmg

[heavy sail]

Having played both exhaustively I certainly feel more durable playing the monk

Though the mitigation % is lower

[lavish oracle]

You're rarely taking exclusively blockable phys, though

[undone jacinth]

exactly

[lavish oracle]

Honestly what's more of an issue for BDK is lack of mobility for dungeons, mostly

[heavy sail]

And monk has the benefit of easy and super strong kiting tools

[undone jacinth]

mobility really isn't the issue

getting globalled is the issue

always has been

[chilly brook]

The fact that you notice the kiting tools tells me all I need to know

[heavy sail]

Haha I choose to kite more often because it’s fun

Face tanking every pull is zzz

[lavish oracle]

Why would you not notice monk's kiting tools?

[amber herald]

there used to be a bug where monks took the damage from soulshatter in dos twice

pretty funny

[lavish oracle]

They're like easily the most mobile tank

[heavy sail]

VDH is probably just as well

But yeah

[chilly brook]

Kiting is fun?

Lmaoooo

Bruh

[heavy sail]

I think so.

[chilly brook]

Choosing to hold a movement key and running away is so fun

[heavy sail]

That’s literally not what monk kiting is at all

But

W/e

[lavish oracle]

Using movement abilities can be fun

[chilly brook]

Using movement abilities can be fun

Doesnt mean kiting is fun

[heavy sail]

Who needs to mitigate the damage when you don’t take any

[chilly brook]

Who needs to play the game

[amber herald]

might as well play a hunter

[undone jacinth]

maybe it's their long term strategy to test out introducing the first ranged tank in next expac

[lavish oracle]

Me, so I can stay in and hit stuff

[undone jacinth]

do damage from range and kite entire time

[chilly brook]

This kiting meta wont last

[lavish oracle]

If I didn't wanna take damage I woulda played DPS

[amber herald]

all I wanna do is revenge pump 🙁

make revenge apply shield block, that'd be nice

[chilly brook]

Member legion?

[heavy sail]

Lmao that would be so busted

[chilly brook]

And the nerfs specifically to stop kiting?

[heavy sail]

I’m chillin

I obviously play Prot too so face tanking isn’t an issue

But kiting can be fun

[chilly brook]

I dont see how but you do you

[heavy sail]

Playing keep away with mobs is a good feel

Reminds me of boosting ZG in classic

[chilly brook]

[heavy sail]

[silver trout]

😬

[chilly brook]

Maybe I really should just gear my rogue

[open monolith]

I wish the azerite trait that made revenge lower incoming damage from the enemies (stacking 3 times) was base line

that is a fun idea to incentivize MOAR REVENGE

[chilly brook]

All the revenge

I just wanna pump

And have no responsibility

[cedar rose]

I can't for the life of me tank the spider boss on high keys tyrannical. The adds with the boss hit way too hard.. just killed a key on 14. Anyone else struggle with this?

[open monolith]

On Heroic you can basically safely spam revenge and ignore IP on every fight except Darkvein, Sludgefist, and Flexnathrius

That boss is always hard on Tyrannical Pinoyy, but I wouldn't say that I struggle to tank her, no.

What talents are you using / what ilvl are you / what ilvl is your shield

[chilly brook]

I've struggled to tank her

In a 14

When the priest was 500io and 200ilvl

[open monolith]

lol yeah. If your healer is not the best, anything is hard to tank 😮

[chilly brook]

Really the only scary part on her is grabbing the adds

Imho

[deft bridge]

my raid takes so much damage every fight i literally have to use all cds on cd to stay alive

[open monolith]

Bounding Stride = leap always up for that at least.

[deft bridge]

and still die occasionally

[chilly brook]

@open monolith rogue or warlock

[open monolith]

lol Chacha

I don't even use Bolster on most fights in the raid

[chilly brook]

I dont either

[open monolith]

ITF on single target fights, Ravager on anything with a second

AM on virtually everything

[deft bridge]

yeah i mean i do that too

but, i dont think it pays off

fkn quel thalas

[open monolith]

oh, found the problem

LOL

[deft bridge]

we have a 20 parse fury warr

[open monolith]

my guild is blessed with solid healers (the dps is... questionable at best)

we have several 10 - 30 parsing DPS

several

[deft bridge]

i guess the damage is not so bad then

but people fail mechanics so much

i had to call for tanks during innerva h

while trying not to die

[open monolith]

I'd rather have a gray/green parsing DPS that stays alive and doesn't take avoidable damage over a blue/purple/orange who constantly gets hit by shit and/or dies

[chilly brook]

Or do I just take my monk and make that my dps boi?

[deft bridge]

why tank
you get insulted
you're the only one that gives half a fk to know what's going on

reject humanity embrace boomie

[open monolith]

you only get insulted if you suck

I get praised

🙂

[deft bridge]

lol no

i get "u should kite more" "why did you die??????" etc with guildies

[tepid niche]

on my druid i get praised, on my warrior i get insulted, go figure 😛

[deft bridge]

on a 10

never timed one

[grave flume]

I had an hpal tell me I need to heal more on my warrior

And I’m like yea lemme ignore pain harder

[tepid niche]

spend more rage lol

[grave flume]

Even then you’re maybe getting a 5-7% heal from Indom if you have a bunch of rage to dump

[open monolith]

well... why DID you die?

and why DIDN'T you kite if you were about to die?

[tepid niche]

trouble is there are soooo many VDH out there, people are just used to healing easy

[grave flume]

Oh I did kite

It was in theater too tho so there not really much room to do anything with out losing

[deft bridge]

sometimes you don't even get the time

all cds up, no one interrupting, everyone taking avoidable damage so the healer can't focus you

[open monolith]

well the obvious answer is stop playing with bads

[grave flume]

But also for most of warrior shit you have to be either in melee range or actively attacking to have any dr

[deft bridge]

someone ass pulls an extra group

[deft bridge]

quel'thalas

babe

😢

[grave flume]

I was just so dumbfounded that a healer actually told a prot warrior to heal more

As if they knew of some heal button that wasn’t bar

[open monolith]

oh.. right

[grave flume]

VR*

[open monolith]

just transfer off of quel thalas?

[outer solstice]

@grave flume wooot? xD luuul

[grave flume]

More like fail’thelas am I right

[deft bridge]

i could honestly, but im not sure what my ping would be

[open monolith]

I won't invite any Quel/Azralon/Ragnaros folks to my group. Unless it is a ret pally. IDK why, but those guys know how to ret.

[deft bridge]

oh hold up, are all the us servers in the same location?

[grave flume]

Idc if they have 8mil io I’m not inviting anyone from that realm

[deft bridge]

omg im so leaving when i can

[open monolith]

like hosted in the same area?

I... think so?

[chilly brook]

I don't get insulted, just between m+ being the way it is and raid being the way it is, it's kinda killing my desire to play a tank

[open monolith]

no no, they are spread around

[grave flume]

Nah there’s a bunch of server locations

[open monolith]

new york, chicago, phoenix, and LA

[deft bridge]

yeah that's the biggest thing

[cedar rose]

I used heavy repurcusions and ravager. 220 shield from SLG and 214 ilvl. It definitely ended up being a tank/healer issue. I was getting molly whopped

[deft bridge]

all the same when you're in arg lol

[outer solstice]

heavy repuc

gasp

[chilly brook]

Well heavy repurcussions would be part of the problem

[deft bridge]

now im reevaluating my choices
how likely am i to find a guild if i have 5/10 heroic

[outer solstice]

what kidn of guild you're looking for?

top end raid guild, 0/0

[deft bridge]

mostly raid, im content with doing only aotc and some mythic

[cedar rose]

Lol

[outer solstice]

pretty good chances

[cedar rose]

What do you guys use? FML

[outer solstice]

we do 6 hours/week in 2 raids

and we just invited a hunter with 4/10

[chilly brook]

Plus I would like to get CE, finding a spot in an actual CE guild is kinda easier to do as a DPS and I'm not sure if my guild is gonna survive this tier

[open monolith]

@cedar rose stop using heavy repurcussions.

[grave flume]

Honestly it’s pretty difficult to get anywhere as a prot warr rn

[open monolith]

Bolster for m+

never look back

and use the unnerving focus conduit with it

[outer solstice]

getting in a raid is not that hard

[grave flume]

I still like AM for dam in keys

[open monolith]

well, yes, AM in keys when you aren't struggling to stay alive

[outer solstice]

especially for a random half-casual guild

[open monolith]

but that topic was specifically: struggling to stay alive

[deft bridge]

wouldn't it be better to use bolster to save rage from sb and use it for revenge spam?

[chilly brook]

You'd still cast block

With bolster

[grave flume]

The duration stacks so you really don’t save casts

[chilly brook]

^

You get far more out of it

[grave flume]

I think depending on your haste you’d be able to get like 30 seconds (?) of sb from bolster?

Assuming a 12 sec recharge

[deft bridge]

wait, so if i cast sb 2 times inmediately i get double duration?

[grave flume]

Correct

[deft bridge]

huh

it do seem to be like that

[grave flume]

But rarely is it advisable to do that imo

[chilly brook]

Whether you get full value out of that or not depends on if the mob swings that whole time

Hence why it's not advised

[open monolith]

you should not cast 2 shield block when you press bolster instantly

You should cast shield block to make sure you don't let the charges cap during bolster

other than that, use shield block as needed. If you cast both you might end up wasting some of the duration

[deft bridge]

right

so the ideal way is to not "cap" sb stacks

[open monolith]

during Bolster, yes

[deft bridge]

now im curious if im using sb wrong on raid

i was trying to stagger them so i didn't use them at once

but if that's not a problem

should i use it asap?

[grave flume]

Typically the only time I’ll blast 2 sb back to back is in keys when I know that the pack will die in that amount of time and I don’t wanna have a gap in duration

I would still stagger them for larger hits

Like saving sb for overwhelms on hungering

[deft bridge]

ahh so like, use one stack for regular damage and use the other for overwhelm

[open monolith]

@deft bridge You should use SB as needed in raid.

[signal plover]

In raid you usually want to min max the SB useage because there's a ton of "baits" where a boss will cast like 2 abilities back to back with no melees

[mossy sluice]

never shiedl block, always revenge

[signal plover]

And u waste like 4 secs of block

[open monolith]

Keep in mind though... SB increases shield slam damage by 30%

it's a DPS increase even when you're not tanking 😉

[signal plover]

Slam but ya ;)

[grave flume]

Spell queing rn just absolutely fucks

[open monolith]

oh, right

[deft bridge]

what about when casting shield wall

should i stop the sb? or use it too?

[signal plover]

I don't SB during SW

[grave flume]

I use sw as a filler

Or for magic dam

[deft bridge]

ahh so, when sb runs out, sw up

[mossy sluice]

depends on the fight. i will layer sb + sw on bite from shriekwing cuz i know im not gonna be tanking for awhile and literally cant be healed

[grave flume]

Because TW is probably one of the best legos in the game

[signal plover]

Sw is either to reduce huge dam (m artificer tank boom) or rotationally to recharge SB charges when your *active tanking uptime is high

[deft bridge]

yeah with am you can get like 1m cd it's cray cray

[deft bridge]

never thought about using it for that

will do

[grave flume]

Depending on procs and how much you revenge spam you can get it to under a minute

[signal plover]

In heroic SR is enough

[grave flume]

Esp with conduit

Yea SR for glyph is plenty

[signal plover]

I gotta play around more with SR- only compared to wall in M to see if I can use SW for other dam (active tanking during the succ kinda slaps)

(in ref to artificer)

[sterile moss]

Gear your rogue. Pumping in m+ with Outlaw rogue feels so good

[deft bridge]

its hard to know what can be sr and what not to and when to and stuff

[mossy sluice]

theres a sheet

in the pins

[deft bridge]

yeah!
but memorizing it and handling the use

i learned to use them on the pushy mages on top

it deals good damage

[sterile moss]

doesn't hurt to save rage and IP the glyph as well

[sturdy sable]

Well as a rule of thumb if it looks like magic damage try to reflect it if you don't know

[sterile moss]

you can easily SP and IP every glyph

[sturdy sable]

If you play with sound it makes a very noticeable sound when it reflects (or you can check details)

[sterile moss]

I like the weakaura that Sense uses for SR

It looks very similar to this one https://wago.io/KCYpBMg6Y

[chilly brook]

Tbh I'm already pumping in dungeons and I'm chilling with 120 weapons

[sterile moss]

those adrenaline rushes...

[sweet summit]

https://wago.io/SpellReflectionTracker

see how this works

should be updated for SL

not in this context sorry

[mossy sluice]

F unguent caress

[sweet summit]

but like in general for m+ and raid i guess

[deft bridge]

is that one not updated?

awww

[chilly brook]

Tbh

[sweet summit]

maroks is

[chilly brook]

Outlaw is basically prot warrior but dps

[signal plover]

Go on...

[deft bridge]

somehow a rogue is like a warrior

i am in pain, but you may be right

[chilly brook]

Combo points are your rage

Adrenaline rush is avatar

Spend combo points

Reduce adrenaline rush CD

Totes warrior

📈

[signal plover]

nods

My rogue is like lvl 20

[sterile moss]

the hilarious part is the effortless damage that comes from blade flurry xD

[chilly brook]

Between the eyes, is just basically demoralizing shout

📈

[mossy sluice]

stonks

[sterile moss]

sinister strike is shield slam

I think I'm getting it

but no cd

[chilly brook]

Energy is your CD

[sterile moss]

lol

[chilly brook]

Mine is 60 but I cry with 120 weapons

Literally everything else is like 168 or slightly above

[signal plover]

F

[chilly brook]

Restless blades really unironically makes you feel like you're playing pre nerf AM

[lime urchin]

I am crying from happiness.

[sweet summit]

pogpogpog

grats mate

!

[sand obsidian]

Drawing a blank, can you get legendaries out of M+? Just did m0 spires but got unlucky.

[sweet summit]

you can, yeah

[tender phoenix]

is it best to stack haste or just big ilvl gear?

[sweet summit]

ilvl>>haste>vers>=crit>mastery generally

you can sim for pure dps

[grave flume]

Do you have to have dps loot spec for anima field?

[sweet summit]

i dont think so

[mossy sluice]

you dont

[tender phoenix]

according to adventure guide no can be in both

[lusty marsh]

Energy is your cd
So rogue is if warrior had mana

[chilly brook]

Pistol shot is your revenge

[outer solstice]

what is ignore pain?

for rouges

[sweet summit]

feint

[amber herald]

higher the key higher chance of drop too

[outer solstice]

and what is our vanish ?

[sweet summit]

charge

[outer solstice]

dying?

oh well xD

nice

[chilly brook]

Hey I mean not everything is gonna have an equivalent

[outer solstice]

[chilly brook]

That's why it's a different class

[sand obsidian]

Lol well I'm only 174 and new to warrior so I think +2 is max right now for me

[chilly brook]

Grappling hook is just heroic leap

[outer solstice]

finish the campaign and you can upgrade your armor to 197

[chilly brook]

See how well this works out?

[sweet summit]

yep

[outer solstice]

whirlwind?

aka never used AoE ?

[chilly brook]

Blade flurry

[outer solstice]

this is getting out of hand

xD

[chilly brook]

Basically yes WW is ded button

[outer solstice]

for us at least

[uneven mason]

Fury loves WW

[outer solstice]

nah

[uneven mason]

Arms and Prot "eh"

[outer solstice]

you want to press the least amount of WW you can get away with as fury

you only want the buff

not the spell

it's super weird

[uneven mason]

yes, I love WW for cleaving

as its intended

[chilly brook]

The only time I've ever hit WW as arms is when using the talent that rolls slam into it

[outer solstice]

yeah but it deals shit damage ...

[chilly brook]

[uneven mason]

Which you shouldn't be doing

But it allows you to cleave executes on 5 murbs

[chilly brook]

Condemn cleave for prot when

[uneven mason]

I'd be content just having fury's execute

[chilly brook]

Nein

Condemn is fine how it is

[rare kraken]

No

[chilly brook]

It just needs an aoe component

[uneven mason]

But to answer your question. When we get heroic strike back

[rare kraken]

Fury execute has a cd

So no

[chilly brook]

In effect we have a CD to

Because rage

[outer solstice]

@uneven mason just so that we have a secondary GCD we have to track?

[chilly brook]

And block

[rare kraken]

Oh wait this is the prot section lmfao I thought I was in fury

[chilly brook]

[outer solstice]

❤️

[uneven mason]

who the hell tracks GCDs

[outer solstice]

talking 2nd iteration HS/Cleave

[rare kraken]

In which case yeah prot should have fury’s execute since prot has much higher priorities to spend rage on

[outer solstice]

it was off the GCD with a shared 3 sec CD

[jagged pier]

its been said

[uneven mason]

ok

[outer solstice]

so basically the CD of that was a secondary independant GCD

[rare kraken]

Figures

[uneven mason]

k

[outer solstice]

just press more buttons

[uneven mason]

who tracks GCDs?

[outer solstice]

I do

[uneven mason]

🤤

[chilly brook]

Just slam your next button

[outer solstice]

slam harder to get gold logs

[uneven mason]

probably still has a swing timer installed.

[outer solstice]

you can bet

[chilly brook]

[outer solstice]

but yeah I am too impatient to ask our raidlead for a 15 second pulltimer on sludge xD xD

so I only parse 87

[chilly brook]

15 second?

Wut

[outer solstice]

yeah to pop ancient aftershock before the fight

[low kindle]

this would make venthyr prot so much better and I'm looking forward to it, blizzard please

[outer solstice]

to not waste 15 seconds of niya buff

[chilly brook]

Bruh

[outer solstice]

so that it's back up again for the first pillar

and I can' click it because of impatience

can't

I always out of habit use my CDs on pull...

even though I should only use demo shout

[signal plover]

That's def not why you're getting 87s lol

[outer solstice]

on sludge?

not having CDs for pillars

it is

[chilly brook]

I uhhhh

Dont do that

And still got a 99

[outer solstice]

you NF?

[chilly brook]

Yep

[outer solstice]

you as retarded as I am?

[chilly brook]

Wdym

[outer solstice]

to use your CDs before the pillar?

[chilly brook]

I've literally never done that

[outer solstice]

see

[chilly brook]

I try to line things up

But like

[outer solstice]

that's the thing I am too retarded xD

[signal plover]

Aaaaand there it is

[chilly brook]

It doesnt matter that much

[outer solstice]

btw what happened on council?

[low kindle]

if you are NF, you shouldn't be using on pull

[chilly brook]

Pretty sure I just hit it at the start

And lived with missing the first pillar

[chilly brook]

You mean why is it only a 90?

[outer solstice]

but yeah that's the whole thing I said I want a 15 sec pulltimer so that I can use AA before pull adn get 15 second niya buff for the start AND don't have the risk to hit it otu of habit

haha yeah xD

[chilly brook]

Cuz I literally don't get to slam damage really

[outer solstice]

I mean it sticks out

oof

[chilly brook]

Especially in last phase

[outer solstice]

what order you do?

[chilly brook]

Cuz I usually get the gargoyle boi

[signal plover]

Council parse depends a bit on boss order

[outer solstice]

oh you do that order

[signal plover]

And how much u pad kek

[outer solstice]

we do friedy last

[chilly brook]

Caster girl, lungy boi, stabby boi

[outer solstice]

so I can jsut execute like a big boi and get some extra rage from intervenes

lol xD we do lungy, stabby, caster

[mossy sluice]

lungy caster stabby here

[outer solstice]

because ppl are too retarded to dance

[mossy sluice]

^ big true

[chilly brook]

Same with Sire

I play uber defensive on Sire

And it was our first kill

[outer solstice]

well we haven't attempted sire at all yet...

[chilly brook]

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[outer solstice]

yeah first kills don't count

@signal plover oh yeah lots of padders in here and we're not the hardest padders in here

I'd say that probably falls to Erga, Sense and Nomeratur

[chilly brook]

Tbh I dont go out of my way to pad

[outer solstice]

yeah it only naturally happens

if I need that IP

I take it

[blazing condor]

do i need another vessel to upgrade legendary item?

with higher ilvl

[outer solstice]

yep

[chilly brook]

The 99 for sludge though I did play super offensive

So really it was healers that let that happen

[outer solstice]

how many externals did you have?

[chilly brook]

Honestly not much

[outer solstice]

ok so they just pumped xD

nice

[chilly brook]

I had a lot of my stuff ready for enrage

[mossy sluice]

we lusted 4th pillar and he died before the stun ended and i didnt get to milk execute

[chilly brook]

Before that he didnt do much

[outer solstice]

you maintanking sludge or just walkin along with the other?

ooof

[chilly brook]

Walkin along

I cant compete with that threat

[outer solstice]

what your other tank?

pally/DH ?

I do with a DK

so ez

[chilly brook]

Literally can't compete

He takes like 90% of the exsanguinated bites on shriek lmao

[outer solstice]

lol

I take like all of them xD

[chilly brook]

I take the melees but because hes riding my ass on threat he takes the bite for some reason

[outer solstice]

as I was talking about earlier

[blazing condor]

also dumb question but you cant go from rank 1 legendary to rank 3 right? if you have the ash

[jagged pier]

yup

[chilly brook]

You can

You just need the ash and the item

[blazing condor]

hm okay

[outer solstice]

it depends on the ilvl of teh base piece you put in

[blazing condor]

i got the 190 one right now

[outer solstice]

you can go from any level to any up

[blazing condor]

and almost enough soul ash to get rank 3

[chilly brook]

I.e. you just need rank 3 base item and the ash

[outer solstice]

or wait

and do rank 4

it's cheaper and "only" eats time

[blazing condor]

cheaper in terms of gold right

[outer solstice]

more costly in terms of time

same for soul ash

well not even costly in time

only in the meantime you're stuck with the lower ilvl legendary

which isn't really a big deal

gonna build my 2nd wall lvl 4 next week xD xD xD

got the cloak from stone legion generalz

finally

[blazing condor]

lmao nice

aight so if you were me, with an ilvl 190 piece and 1,25k soul ash. Would you wait one week and go directly on the tier 4 one?

tryna wrap my head around this

[outer solstice]

how much do the pieces cost?

and how much gold you have

[blazing condor]

400k

[outer solstice]

you have to weight these things gainst each other

if you "only" have 400k I wouldn't bother with R 2 and R3

[blazing condor]

yeah i think i get it now

[outer solstice]

just buy the R4

base

[blazing condor]

makes sense yeah

[outer solstice]

and wait until you have the soul ash

or even better

wait until you have the soul ash

then buy the R4

base

[blazing condor]

yeah im thinking that

[outer solstice]

it'll save you 100% of the gold cost for the R3, if it's cheap, go for it

if not you can just pass

what slot you building? shoulders?

[blazing condor]

yep shoulders

r4 is liek 35k

[outer solstice]

well you'll have to pay that at some point anyway

[uneven mason]

only 35k?

must be a dead server

[open monolith]

??

lower prices indicate the opposite of a dead server

r4 shoulders on Thrall, the biggest horde server, are 34k ish

r4 shoulders on Zul'jin, 5th biggest horde server, also 34k ish

[tardy parcel]

lol yeah

[open monolith]

is "wowrealmpopulation" accurate?

2 weeks ago I looked at it and Zul'Jin was the 5th most populated horde server. Today it is 94th

wat

[uneven mason]

mass exodus?

[chilly brook]

I'll mass exodus your tree

Oh wait

[sick sentinel]

It feels overpopulated on ZJ.

[chilly brook]

We already did that

[open monolith]

yeah it's just broken

stormrage shows 0 population

[turbid cargo]

lol I paid 16k for my r4 shoulders on illidan horde

[undone jacinth]

I paid 20k for my 190 helm

[charred hinge]

Guys anyone running prot NF ?

[chilly brook]

Yes several people what's up

[heavy sail]

Furries

[strong forum]

My r4 shoulders were 34k

[chilly brook]

Nom made me a furry

[strong forum]

Didn du nuffin

[chilly brook]

All that data and shit

[strong forum]

[dark fog]

i hate devastator, i hope they buff devastate to make the other talents more competitive

[undone jacinth]

you really like clicking extra useless buttons huh

[dark fog]

ya cuz its consistent, whereas devastator you can get a proc as you press something else and then you have shield slam sitting through a gcd

[vestal moat]

I went furry yesterday and am loving it. It does feel a little tiny bit easier. I finally got KSM a nd that second pull in DOS in particular, which was the bane of my existence, went fine today for the last d ungeon.

[undone jacinth]

the alternative would be just adding one more gcd in to the equation

[dark fog]

so are you saying people who want to play with devastate are just wrong? whats the point of the other two talents

[cinder nova]

I farm ore for mine during callings and trips into the Maw. A guy on my server had R4 of everything (all slots, proffs) by like week 3 and just has them on-hand to trade to me when I bring him raw mats.

It's startling.

[undone jacinth]

there isn’t much point right now but I don’t think most people are bothered because it makes everything smoother

[strong forum]

devastate is just more damage

[wicked lantern]

And more importantly, less key binds 😄

[uneven mason]

Opportunity cost as the gcd could be used for ss

[grave flume]

I petition to bring back shield barrier and throw away ignore pain because it is a small pp skill

[sturdy sable]

Man shield barrier those where the days

[woven trellis]

bargast leach is better than sanguine vintage

change my mind

[sturdy sable]

Vintage won't kill you

Vintage won't kill your friend *

[woven trellis]

tbf i used bargast leach a lot

i barely see the dmg it does on my friends

its very veyry widespread

[sturdy sable]

Well I tried

[woven trellis]

thats why im saying that rn

[strong forum]

thats a hot take

[woven trellis]

what are ur thought abt it

[strong forum]

dogshit dont use it

[sturdy sable]

It's trash

[strong forum]

thats my thought

[woven trellis]

and why

its a lot of dmg

prevented

and it doesnt kill my friends like never

[strong forum]

its only 25% so it doesnt actually do anything

the good thing about absorbs is, you can use it to cover certain things/hits

a 25% DR doesnt cover anything but situations where youre already gonna be fine

[woven trellis]

i have medium gear soo i mostly use it on cds on big pack to smooth up damage

like IP would do

[strong forum]

youd need to take over 120k dmg to even fully use the trinket

in 30seconds

[sturdy sable]

So your using a trinket slot to have a on use ignore pain?

That sounds like a bad use of a trinket to me

[strong forum]

you dont even have 4k dtps in raid

but you need to take 4k+ dtps to even get 100% use out of the trinket

[sturdy sable]

I mean if you let block drop you could probably get full use out of it

[strong forum]

[fathom sundial]

Hey boys I main arms, but sometimes tank if our pala cant make it, and im not sure what soulbind i should use as venthyr. because of the way conduits work I cant use Nadjia. any recomendations would be greatly appretiated

[strong forum]

Draven is the tankiest tank soulbind out there

👍

[grave flume]

Leash is the dumbest trinket from the game besides the HoA trinket with a 12 second slow lmao

[strong forum]

na theres defo way worse trinkets than leash

leash does atleast something

but slimy consumption organ or bladedancer kit legit do nothing

or the hoa trinket

literally nothing

[grave flume]

That hoa trinket is mindboggling

[strong forum]

bladedancer is 1000% worse

the hoa atleast gives you a bad heal

but bladedancer does just nothing on a 5min CD

[grave flume]

At least the blade dancer trinket doesn’t make you 50 percent slower in a tier with a metric fuck ton of movement lmao

[fathom sundial]

would you go left left middle or right left right?

[lavish oracle]

Well slimy consumptive gives you an equally bad heal at least

Shouldn't be in the same league as bladedancer

[grave flume]

Scale/anima field are broken tho

[cinder nova]

Jesus.

[woven trellis]

for some context i used Bargast leach cause i only had it, and it felt like it smoothed up packs

[cinder nova]

How the fuck can you play the FOTM spec as Fire and only average 3K in a +12?

Like

Why

[fathom sundial]

thanks

[strong forum]

ah i skipped 1 potency

just throw ashen in there i guess

or sof

doesnt matter

potency ones suck

[cinder nova]

Wait... is Draven BIS now, or...? 🤔

[strong forum]

for tanking yes

hes broken

[cinder nova]

Temporarily or permanently?

[strong forum]

perma

[cinder nova]

Oh FR?

[open monolith]

Important question: when did you degenerates start referring to Paladin as Pala instead of Pally.

[cinder nova]

When did this change??

[strong forum]

untill they nerf him

[open monolith]

It's pally.

[cinder nova]

I thought spear was imba

[grave flume]

Is he the haste proc one?

[strong forum]

no

[woven trellis]

what do u think about alar trinket btw

[strong forum]

he grants you 10% less dmg taken below 40%

thats broken

[fathom sundial]

is double potency really better then the improved rally?

[cinder nova]

How's that broken?

[strong forum]

wdym

[grave flume]

Yea I spend a lot of time at that health

[strong forum]

hows that broken

???

[open monolith]

Alar trinket is great in m+, i love it. Also good for progression

[strong forum]

Alar is good if youre pushing insane content

very early on

[cinder nova]

You probably aren't gonna be floating below 40% long enough in a fight for it to matter

[strong forum]

bad if you dont

[woven trellis]

well its good ure pushing any content ure not confortable with

[grave flume]

Alar saved my bootyhole on M Hungering at 209 ilvl lmao

[open monolith]

Losing Spear for Draven. Not worth.

[cinder nova]

^^

[strong forum]

thats not what im saying

lmao

[open monolith]

I know it isn't

[cinder nova]

Nom, is there any actual math to back this or is it just feelycraft?

[fathom sundial]

hes saying if you are venthyr draven is bis

[strong forum]

Huh? wdym S

no need for math

[open monolith]

10% less damage as a soulbind trait is the most powerful trait there is

[cinder nova]

For tanking as prot warrior is Draven BIS across all cov?

[open monolith]

That doesn't require math

[strong forum]

Draven is the single most powerful soulbind for tanks

defensively

THAT BEING SAID

[open monolith]

soulbind

[strong forum]

im not saying you should go venthyr

[open monolith]

You still go Spear lol

[cinder nova]

Then why do all our guides tell us to go Bastion? 🤔

[strong forum]

im done

[open monolith]

Omg

[restive flax]

^^

[open monolith]

Are you trolling S.?

[cinder nova]

No.

[open monolith]

Okay let me explain this to you slowly

[strong forum]

im not telling you to reroll your covenant

[cinder nova]

You're saying Draven is BIS tanking, then why are we told Bastion.

[restive flax]

the soulbind being good doesnt make the covenant ability good

[open monolith]

In terms of benefits specifically from a soul bind, draven offers the most defensive value by a LOT

This does not take into account the covenant ability

[strong forum]

IF you are Venthyr, you play Draven.

thats whats being siad

[restive flax]

^

[open monolith]

So if you are already been there, draven is the objectively best choice

How was that hard to follow o.o

[strong forum]

if you could choose soulbinds independantly of covenant, Draven is by far the best choice defensively.

[restive flax]

Isnt Bonesmith also very strong?

[strong forum]

no

nothing compares to Draven

not even remotely

[restive flax]

didnt he have like 3% damage reduction perma or something?

[cinder nova]

Because when I ask if a soulbind is BIS I'm assuming it factors abilities in that covenant. Parsing a bind in a vacuum doesn't offer clinically useful information when comparing it to other soulbinds if the end result is still weaker as a whole.

[grave flume]

Just play what you enjoy man

All of it is viable

[strong forum]

i answered which soulbind to play as venthyr

so

[cinder nova]

Viable =/= BIS

[strong forum]

yeha

[cinder nova]

Right.

[strong forum]

hes still bis

[restive flax]

also its not all "viable"

dont gimp yourself by choosing what you think looks cool. If that choice is necrolord dont do it

its annoying af

[cinder nova]

Imagine playing Mald prot 😆

[strong forum]

VDHs are arleady considering rerolling Venthyr just for Draven

[grave flume]

I mean necro is kinda int but you can push content with it regardless

[strong forum]

for m+

btw

[restive flax]

Dude its so much harder going necro

[cinder nova]

I sincerely wish Necrolords were actually good. I love their gear and the zone despite how fucking obnoxious the geography is compared to Bastion.

[strong forum]

if they dont nerf draven, theres gonna be a chance that every tank will be venthyr for high keys

[restive flax]

excuse me? how is maldraxxus more annoying than bastion?!

[cinder nova]

Bastion is like 85% rolling small hills dude

More than half of Maldraxxus is giant fucking impassable mountains.

[grave flume]

The bastion covenant sanctum is so far away 😭😭

[restive flax]

and maldraxxus is a circle

[open monolith]

I never had any issues with maldraxxus

[restive flax]

just use a flightmaster?

[open monolith]

Or a goblin glider

Or the teleporter

[grave flume]

I do but it takes forever

[restive flax]

^

dunno. Bastion is far less accessible than mald for me

[cinder nova]

Imagine spending money to justify the ease of linear movement in a zone 👀

[open monolith]

Or be a distinguished gentleman and go Vulpera and make camp IN Elysian Hold

[cinder nova]

Are you vulp?

[open monolith]

Of course.

[cinder nova]

Get away from me

[strong forum]

https://i.imgur.com/2rrXJVP.png

[open monolith]

So is Nome

[cinder nova]

EUGH

[grave flume]

I’m honestly thinking about race changing to vulp just for that

[open monolith]

And all the GOOD tanks

[strong forum]

conversion complete

[restive flax]

i mean. Vulpera ius objectively very strong as a tank

[cinder nova]

One of the top Prot Warriors is a tauren with a gaudy purple transmog and it makes me irrationally upset.

[grave flume]

I’ll have to get used to yiffing tho

[strong forum]

Tauren are cringe

[open monolith]

It's not so bad

The yiffing, that is

Gets a little warm during the summer months

Some juices are harder to clean out of fur

Worth it.

[cinder nova]

Miss me with that furry shit. If I didn't already have an established RP character as a worgen I'd swap one of the dwarfs no hesitation.

[grave flume]

In your suit it’s always summer months

[restive flax]

[open monolith]

LOL you make fun of Vulpera

But you RP

Gtfo

[grave flume]

Go back to moon guard

[cinder nova]

I've been playing tabletop RPGs half my life, of course I RP you spaz.

[strong forum]

🌑 💂

[open monolith]

Tabletop rp is acceptable

[strong forum]

i could never get into RP

[open monolith]

Video game rp is degen

[restive flax]

sock you dont like RPGs?

[strong forum]

too much cringe, feel very uncomfortable

[restive flax]

take Witcher for example

that is an RPG

Or you mean RP in mmos

[strong forum]

RP

[cinder nova]

WoW RP is like 90% power fantasy and edgelords, so it's hard to find people who are actually in it for more than surface-level gratification or kitschy high school-esque behavior.

[strong forum]

proper RP

[grave flume]

That’s an RPG but I don’t RP as Roach

[restive flax]

😄

[grave flume]

teleports from the ether ride me daddy geralt

[open monolith]

"Miss me with that furry shit. Established Worgen RP character by the way"

Big kek

K I'm done being toxic

I feel better now

Got it out of my system

[undone jacinth]

isnt worgen RP the literal definition of furry

[open monolith]

Think so.

[cinder nova]

It's easier to think about if you aren't trying to constantly draw attention to how 'LOOK AT MY WOLF MAN' traits.

Because that tends to be all people fucking do.

[undone jacinth]

huh

[open monolith]

Too late, you big furry boy, you

[fickle dust]

Hey, I'm doing some back of the napkin math right now -- twice a week raiding, 2-3 hours. How many feasts would you have for a casual guild working on heroic prog?

[open monolith]

Come here, let me give you a scratch behind the ear

Who's a good boy?

[open monolith]

Just tell your guild to buy their food

[undone jacinth]

depends how fast you pull, probably a couple of stacks

[open monolith]

Is feast better than secondary stat food?

[undone jacinth]

yes

[strong forum]

yes

[undone jacinth]

by a lot

[open monolith]

Ah. Never looked at the buff

[strong forum]

mainstat is 3-4x worth of secondaries

so 20 mainstat is worth about 60-80

[undone jacinth]

if you have a significant brain then just stay dead when you wipe and let a Druid combat res you

30 main stat

[deft bridge]

if (if) i were to transfer svs

what is a good option?

[strong forum]

svs? server?

[deft bridge]

yeah

[strong forum]

any big server i guess

[astral crystal]

what faction

[golden tapir]

hey i see some war's run bolster over AM in raid

[strong forum]

yes

[golden tapir]

as well as NS over IND on some bosses as well

[strong forum]

Bolster is perfectly fine and actually recommended

NS is inting

[golden tapir]

im trying to get batter ranks on my clears and just trying to see what i am doing wrong/missing

[strong forum]

killtimes are a huge factor in parsing better

[golden tapir]

okay

[strong forum]

but even with bad killtimes

you should be able to get orange logs if youre playing properly

[golden tapir]

yea im not even close o

so i think it has to do with my rotation or stats

and getting my dmg up

[strong forum]

98% its your rotation

[golden tapir]

yep yep

i think i am over doing the D cds trying to avoid stress on the healers

[strong forum]

you can throw your log into wowanalyzer to get a better understanding

[golden tapir]

thank you!

forgot about that

[strong forum]

itll prolly throw up some good stuff

[golden tapir]

you rock man!

always come in strong for me

[restive flax]

is wowanalyzer really accurate though?

[dawn imp]

so im running 42% haste with ITF, would it worth using heavy rep. in raid scenarios?

[paper valley]

hows everyone doing in keys i wanna try to tank em but i feel like prot sucks atm

[restive flax]

yeah but does it account for downtimes during a bossfight for example?

[astral crystal]

keys are fine, you can easily get ksm

[restive flax]

for example at Shriekwing it always shouts at me for not doing pressing my buttons often enough.

[astral crystal]

i think wowanalyzer is kind of a trap

still thinks you should be spamming tclap

[undone sun]

sounds like something you should bring up to the author

@sullen valve

[astral crystal]

idc about wowanalyzer, just commenting on what he said :^)

[restive flax]

oh speaking about shriekwing

do you guys know what causes the tank aggro bug that makes her bite the inactive tank?

as in: Tank A is tanking Shriekwing -> She bites Tank B

?!

[strong forum]

doubt

HR is unreliable

if anything, AM becomes more attractive

[strong forum]

aggro table

[restive flax]

so its not a bug then

[strong forum]

if you have 101% threat, you dont get aggro but the mechanic

[exotic spoke]

It hits the highest threat target

You dont pull aggro until you get to 110% threat

[strong forum]

^

[exotic spoke]

Also, Nome is a qtpie

[restive flax]

Ah I see

[exotic spoke]

Now that I've made my appearance I bid you fairwell for a bit

[strong forum]

blessed with wisdom

[astral crystal]

i've been saying its threat since yesterday

but non-believer contrarian dolphin kept running game

[chilly brook]

say it ain't so

[empty spindle]

Is it true prot tanks are haste vers?

[restive flax]

yes

[dawn imp]

ilvl >> haste > crit=vers >> mas