Yeah
#protection
plucky galleon
Guys, any1 know about bosses and adds armour scalling in m+. I mean how much armour actually do they have?
undone jacinth
most stuff has 30% physical dr
plucky galleon
does it increase with higher key?
undone jacinth
nah
strong forum
No
undone jacinth
maybe that’s the change blizz need to make to put dps on par with tanks 😂
plucky galleon
pastel tundra
are there any recommended M+ Prot Streamers to watch and learn from?
ionic fern
are there any recommended M+ Prot Streamers to watch and learn from?
Sense and Nomeratur (you can find them in the "Stormforged" section).
astral crystal
You only need to skip the 3 pack to get pride on mordethra anyway
icy dirge
Would that 207 trinket that reduces covenant ability by 20 percent any good for raiding ?
undone jacinth
I said pull all 4 not skip
astral crystal
Ooh
undone jacinth
but you can skip all 4 with feign death or shroud or anything
you don’t need pride for mordretha, it doesn’t really help
astral crystal
Well like I said, the mounted guy has stealth detect but I guess fd will do it
pastel tundra
Sense and Nomeratur (you can find them in the "Stormforged" section).
Ty what is the twitch name of Sense? If I search for Sense I am unable to find him
astral crystal
Running with a rogue reeee
astral crystal
Ty what is the twitch name of Sense? If I search for Sense I am unable to find h...
Snse
undone jacinth
well anyone with a way of stealthing
ionic fern
Right click on his name here->Profile and you can find his channel.
pastel tundra
Ty Atticusw and Mwahi 🙂 Gonna check them out
ionic fern
For DPS sim yourself.
For "general usage" take Celestial.
warm thunder
Alight
lost egret
is there any updated spellreflect-able spells cheat sheet or something?
oh nvm I found it
sorry
desert skiff
@pastel tundra twitch.tv/plkatv
inland garnet
Hey I recently got 184ilev Overflowing Ember Mirror and Flame of Battle from wqs.
Would you use any of these over 197 haste pvp trinket or 213 skulking wing (no surv here obv) for M+ tanking (14 keys)
Flame of Battle lines up with Avatar, pvp trinket with spear but the latter is just strength and the former vers
To add also I am a bit unlucky with drops so haste is on the low side, 13-14%, and I am going with vers gems/enchant to be fool-proof. Would be great to see In the Fray baseline :))) since Ravager is too good for M+ to pass
undone jacinth
Need to link them, don’t know all wq trinkets but the answer is likely to be no
inland garnet
https://www.wowhead.com/item=177657/overflowing-ember-mirror?bonus=6706
https://www.wowhead.com/item=181501/flame-of-battle?bonus=6935
These ^
inland garnet
52 str both, 21345 absrob of the mirror and 473 vers of the flame
undone jacinth
meh just keep your current ones and do dos for a scale
inland garnet
oki, and yeah I have to farm the dos one maybe
undone jacinth
you’ll get something from somewhere but if you wanna target something then running 7s in DOS isn’t too bad
or 10s if you’re comfortable
inland garnet
Hopefully it would pop up in the weekly cache 🙂 It's the best tank trinket outside CN or elite pvp?
jovial zodiac
Str translates into armor, so saying just str has no benefit isnt entirely true.
outer solstice
hey guys, ansone else having the problem with warcraftlogs of not getting all-star points for sun king?
I was wondering
jagged pier
hes not worth any
jagged pier
as its too easy to cheese
jagged pier
yes they do it with loads of fights
strong forum
Str is also our best dmg stat
lunar perch
thanks
outer solstice
strong forum
I still have 4hrs of work left, but nice weekend to you too
outer solstice
4 hours *gasp
YOU CAN DO IT!
I started at 4am... because some database died
wanna trade?
strong forum
I had to walk half way to work cuz my backtyre blew out and got 45min late to work
outer solstice
oof
strong forum
strong forum
Happens
outer solstice
yeah but always in the worst moments 😦
btw, can anyone confirm that sun king yields no all-star points on WClogs?
outer solstice
lol I wasn't even padding xD
strong forum
Ye but you could make it so you get to freely aoe dps 24/7 while others deal with the boss
strong forum
Thus inflating your dps insanely
outer solstice
well... we messe up both intermissions xD
strong forum
While not contributing to the fight
strong forum
I forgot how like 90% of hc bosses go
outer solstice
it's the same
- shield
I feel like many of the hc bosses are quite close to the Mhyitc ones in terms of abilities this tier around
that's the reason why so many hc players are running into these problems
dry spear
is spike a good trinket for prot?
outer solstice
it's ok
but there are better
you want some numbers? I can check my logs I wear it 😦
@dry spear
6:30 shriekwing fight: about 2% dmg (16.3k in 53 hits, resulting in 34 DPS)
dry spear
it is jsut i got i as a dps and i never uswd it
outer solstice
for healing it healed for 31.6k in 49 hits
resulting in around 82 hps
that's at least more healing than my leech or my health stone + health pot
dry spear
and i looks good for mythic +
dry spear
shriekwing and memories
outer solstice
@dry spear oh wait I forgto the secondary damage effect , it also dealt another 50% of the damage with the secondary effect, so about 3% of my dmg
more than oil and skirmish enchant ^^
astral crystal
minmax bro :^)
outer solstice
it's around 52 DPS actually
outer solstice
it's 52 DPS combined with the secondary effect
that supresses the healing
oh wait I'm dumb
I shifted in the line
64 DPS xD
that's the 213 spike
also can anyone tell me what's wrong with shriekwing?
he's always biting me as non-active tank
just bugged? or are we doign anything wrong?
astral crystal
threat, maybe
if youre close enough to your co-tank in threat he'll just chomp you
signal plover
It's threat
You need 110% threat to rip, but if you're above 100% he will bite you.
silent fog
As you are talking about trinkets, how do you feel about quantum device ? Let's say for the discussion you can always proc haste
And maybe use it for heal in dire situation
signal plover
I can proc haste off box like 80% of the time on pull
But after that it's kinda a raid buff boi.
silent fog
I can proc haste off box like 80% of the time on pull
same, not that hard
signal plover
There's better trinkets but I like it based on my other options
sweet summit
Its better in m+ than raid
signal plover
I run a 207 box and a 220 vintage for both raid and m+ (double on use is meh)
But I have dogshit else
No luck with scale yet
But I'd run scale over box instantly
silent fog
and in higher key, 14+, do you tend to run with 2 def trinkets, 1 def & 1 off ?
outer solstice
@astral crystal oooooh ty, so if our active tank is taunting before the bite she'll get it?
astral crystal
before yes
if you taunt during the cast i believe it goes on the original target
not entirely sure though, only time that's ever happened is when co-tank gets close on threat just doing dmg
outer solstice
it happened whole evening
and as I wasn't tanking I was pumping pumping pumping ...
I think the only time I actually tanked was after transition xD
undone jacinth
I’ve had pulls where it just bites my co-tank for the entire pull. I highly doubt that he’s exactly in that threat window for the entire fight
without pulling off me
lavish hare
Talking trinkets, what about the Slimy Organ from Plague or Spikes???
outer solstice
but yeah DK doing 1.5k DPS I doing 2.15k DPS, might be actually possible that it was that way @undone jacinth
@lavish hare I use gluttonous spike, it's a nice 3% of dmg for me and nice tickle healing that actually adds up over a fight
lavish hare
Thing is its a huge buff to stamina
outer solstice
@undone jacinth yeah look at that, we had like the first bite that went correctly on her, probabyl due to MDs:
yeah but does stamina really matter? it increases the max size of your IP and makes you a bit more spongy
no clue how good the organ actually si
undone jacinth
idk what you’re linking or if you’re trying to say you think it is threat or not
grave flume
Tbh one tanking shriek is totally viable
Can save kyrian pot for a clear if you really need it
grave flume
That’s a big true there
sweet summit
sweet summit
What
sweet summit
O
undone jacinth
the gcd is fine isn’t it
grave flume
Condemn does look fun tho
outer solstice
oh ask Erga
undone jacinth
you can just only press it once every 3min
jagged pier
boost starting to get 99 logs now time to reroll necro 
pseudo raptor
Necro feels better with the third soulbind open now.
astral crystal
you still have banner tho
outer solstice
how trash? like orange trash or purple trash?
strong forum
Blue
outer solstice
yep
study dem logs
and queeze out the last melee hit more you can block or the 20 more rage you can gain
just to do 1 more revenge
strong forum
For example my shriekwing log, only gained 40 dps even though I went from 203 to 226 weapon
But then again, we are still 2phasing so my logs are trash by default
outer solstice
we have 2 intermissions as well
went from 1800 DPS to 2150 DPS with upgrade from 184 weapon to 220 weapon
and first week when I was called to tank during the raid as our tank ragequitted the guild
I was at 1400 DPS xD
strong forum
Man, getting to 1phase shriek would prolly be easy r1
mossy sluice
our first mythic week and our only warrior for battle shout got banned for a fishing bot. 
byebye 215 brewmaster hello level 51 warrior
outer solstice
.... but yeah our DPS are kinda bad... we didn't even get 50% before I1 ..
180 days? that's harsh...
probably some more things involved than a fishing bot
outer solstice
maybe history
mossy sluice
nah first strike on that account, think he was doing it for honor grinding as well
idk this is all his word
outer solstice
well yeah they are really looking into PvP rn
like 80% of pilot carries getting banned
valid zodiac
Just got mount from conservatory seed O_o
outer solstice
we had one of our gold-hoarders banned for 4 weeks xD
@valid zodiac nice
he bought ALL the flasks on our server and all the flowers for them
and inflated the prices by like 500%
mossy sluice
stonks
outer solstice
yeah they told him: can't do that, makes game experience for others bad
kindred warren
It’s a scumbag move, deserved it tbh
sick sentinel
i did exactly that but too a lesser extent in wrath with flasks on my paladin
and some ores and essences, but mainly the lotus flower, i bought every single one, and made the flask which i made huge margin on, and then buy out the super low price flasks
turn 10 gold into 30-50 gold just on the lotus alone.
outer solstice
it's considered them same thing as blocking a quest NPC with an oversized mount
and it's obvious it's on purpose
astral crystal
imagine being put in gay baby jail for buying flasks smdh
sick sentinel
if he was doing it to the point it was over a federal tipping point like 1k or 10kusd in a timespan they would look into it yes
for like, RWT
sick sentinel
so it was just a 1 off and not like a huge co-ordinated attack?
outer solstice
don#t forget he also bought the specific plants
sick sentinel
in that case fuck blizz
outer solstice
he did that solo
outer solstice
I bet he got a warning before
outer solstice
well it goes as "runining the fun for other players"
sick sentinel
so, he bought the flower, players got salty, and they mass reported him
chilly brook
So?
outer solstice
and put them in at 5-6 times the price
chilly brook
Again so?
soft flower
others should've farmed then, doesn't matter if he controlled market imo
outer solstice
and ruining the game for other players is against ToS
soft flower
dont pay it and farm your own
sick sentinel
soft flower
or pay
outer solstice
oh I got flasks from him
vivid pumice
any prot here running condemn? i'm switching to prot from arms, to save the guild tank role, and i'm wondering if the shield part of condemn is any good
astral crystal
antitrust laws in video games pogg
outer solstice
@vivid pumice there is Erga, when around
chilly brook
"Ruining the game for others" is so vague
outer solstice
yep
chilly brook
Me getting killed my 60s while leveling in WM is "ruining the game" for me
sweet summit
yea its alright, u can replace IP with condemn on ST
sick sentinel
i'm still a blue nerd sorry
chilly brook
It's still not breaking ToS
sweet summit
its not as big, but its a full absorb
solemn magnet
Condemn is fun, but in the week I had it rarely got to use it, but maybe I'm bad. Kyrian is way more noticeably helpful
outer solstice
@chilly brook thing is there are sections in the ToS that you can be banned for whatever they think is harmful
sick sentinel
chilly brook
Like every server has inflation either day if or night before the raid reset
vivid pumice
full absorb is nice if I always get enough rage to spam condemn right?
sick sentinel
full blue nerd boi now
chilly brook
So one guy being banned because he had enough gold to do it himself is fucking stupid
sweet summit
full absorb is nice if I always get enough rage to spam condemn right?
kinda yeah, but you do want to keep up SB as well. not just rely on condemn (for "relevant" content
vivid pumice
yeah i know SB is prio
chilly brook
guess how he go the gold...
I would assume, through doing exactly what he did, playing the AH
outer solstice
is it worth not runnign SB anyway for the dmg part on SS ?
chilly brook
Shield slam damage increase from block isn't worth just hitting block
outer solstice
yep @chilly brook and it's a legit strategy as long as you don't go too fast and grab the whole server by the balls
vivid pumice
so basically the rotato potato would be: SS>thunderclap>condemn rinse repeat
outer solstice
if you're about to overcap
chilly brook
You'd probably grab more damage from the revenge cast
outer solstice
use condem/revenge before tC
also I like to push more revenge during avatar instead of TC if I sustain it, probabyl goes the same for condemn
sweet summit
so basically the rotato potato would be: SS>thunderclap>condemn rinse repeat
for dps its condemn>ss>revenge>tc
if you wanna play more safe its SS>TC>condemn>revenge
as long as you wont overcap rage ofc
vivid pumice
perfect thank you erga 🙂
sweet summit
then you can spend on IP/revenge
vivid pumice
condemn absorb is a debuff on the target is there any nice weakaura that transforms that absorb amount into something i can look fast enough to see if the absorb is almost depleting?
sweet summit
its not relevant information
vivid pumice
5 condemns is still the same 1 condemn absorb right?
sweet summit
its stacks like 3x
vivid pumice
i'm happy to see that there are still niche prots going venthyr, makes it easier to compare and learn
sweet summit
sir, i am dps main in raid tanking in dungeons, sir
vivid pumice
well, i'm main dps in raid but now guild needs a tank
sweet summit
i see
vivid pumice
since it is not permanent until we find a decent tank, i won't be changing kyrian
sweet summit
fair enough
vivid pumice
looking at the pins i feel sad that signet legendary doesn't proc on prots ravager 😦
covert bison
what is the mythical + highest they have made?
outer solstice
@vivid pumice same situation here but luckily I was NF all along, so works out nicely in raid as well
vivid pumice
looking at the damage portion of condemn and at the full absorb it provides i think venthyr is actually nice
plus you get nice defensive stuff from souldbinds on the venthyr port
sweet summit
its nice, but costs rage and is pretty bad in aoe
draven is good, but forces you to pick fucking potency conduit(s)
and our potency ones suck major pp
vivid pumice
well i have nadja for arms and draven for prot, fits nicely
i hope that fury benefits from mr tea party soulbind
XD
lunar perch
I like how we have a dedicated venthyr prot guide in the discord
sweet summit
theotar sims higher than nadja for my arms sims, and nadja sims the highest for my fury
wait we do?
lunar perch
It's you! I think.
undone jacinth
lol yogi
sick sentinel
i checked after the fact
undone jacinth
and yeah aren’t all venthyr soulbinds insane
sick sentinel
i just need to hit 21 reknown so i can go back to using pelagos
sweet summit
ye theyre good
jovial lily
Venthyr prot let's go
sweet summit
where are we going 👀
sick sentinel
im not going
jovial lily
Straight to the top
sick sentinel
i am going to ascend to the top withe the blue boi angels
undone jacinth
if necrolord had venthyr soulbinds I think I would switch
iron forum
For those of you who have tanked slugdefist, did you find it a difficult boss? (On mythic) my guild is going to start prog on him Monday, I'm an arms main but was talking with my gm about tanking that fight since prot slaps on auto attack based damage and arms hardcore bottomfrags that fights
And I haven't tanked in a long time
novel wagon
Is it possible to trade 226 tank trinkets if you got 226 dps trinkets, or vice versa?
undone jacinth
well it’s relatively simple to tank, I’d be pretty scared with no xp though, he hurts
you got a good shield?
iron forum
Yeah, my main concern would be in regards to always positioning him right, since my understanding is that you have to be his primary target to block his autos
iron forum
Got good gear, even trinkets the only downside is I'm venthyr but I'm under the impression it wouldn't be too significant for a fight like that
rotund halo
how do i IP more without feeling starved
undone jacinth
venthyr is very good for sludge
iron forum
Oh, I thought that his cleaved autos weren't blockable
undone jacinth
they are
iron forum
Okay that's good to know
sweet summit
the only downside to having prot warrior not main tank is that you dont gain rage from damage taken
iron forum
Oh, yeah that's it. That's what I was thinking about
No rage, not that it's not blockable
sweet summit
which is not a huge deal, you can get around it
undone jacinth
your raid should have agreed his positioning, so even if you are MT just move him accordingly and don’t move around while you are tanking other than to move out of the circle and get back to him quickly
ideally with no xp you should just follow your co tank though
chilly brook
Good morning
sweet summit
gm
undone jacinth
then condemn his head in during pillar
iron forum
Makes sense, it sounds like it's pretty straightforwards them and my covenant wouldn't be a downside on it
sweet summit
dont get too greedy with condemning
iron forum
May end up trying it out then, that fight does not look fun as arms so tanking would be a welcome change
undone jacinth
it’s a fun fight for everyone imo
sweet summit
id recommend doing some m+ as tank this weekend
iron forum
Yeah for sure, I also plan on watching some vods of prot warrior kills to see when they are rolling defensives and externals
chilly brook
Always hold enough rage for block
sweet summit
sounds great mate
median niche
is prot the way to go in torghast?
chilly brook
So you're gonna take hits
chilly brook
is prot the way to go in torghast?
If you have a tank spec on any class it's usually the way to go for torghast
median niche
If you have a tank spec on any class it's usually the way to go for torghast
ty, some say fury blasts in there
turbid cargo
is prot the way to go in torghast?
it was for me. I did TC 1-8 as prot. 7 and 8 would have been sketchy AF as dps
median niche
it was for me. I did TC 1-8 as prot. 7 and 8 would have been sketchy AF as dps
thanks
turbid cargo
aye
chilly brook
From 1-6
turbid cargo
lol my first time through 8 I got the shitter end boss that constantly summons caster adds + the one-shot howl. I had a garbage anima setup and he womped me. Second time through was a breeze
chilly brook
Never depleted a torghast run on my warrior
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
The monk tho
That's a different story lmao
turbid cargo
that failed 8 was the only one I'd depleted. I think outside of that run I've died like... 3 times, total
median niche
Never depleted a torghast run on my warrior
brewmaster?
chilly brook
That's more than fine
turbid cargo
aye 214 should stomp it no problem
chilly brook
I did layer 1-7 (normal torghast) on my monk in one night at like 180
Layer 8 is where I died
iron forum
I feel like warrior is just across the board one of the easiest classes in torghast
chilly brook
But I did layer 8 of TC on my warrior at like 209? 210?
Something like that
Ez pz
undone jacinth
Prot is definitely torghast god
chilly brook
You're basically unkillable as a warrior
urban bane
I saw in the pins it is not recommended to go anger management for M+ -- is the value just not there compared to strength of bolster?
urban bane
Makes sense. Yeah, I've noticed around 10 or 11 w/ puggy heals I can get trucked more easily.
chilly brook
In lower keys anger management is the play
urban bane
I'll give bolster a whirl
chilly brook
But over 10s tbh bolster is the way generally imo
urban bane
That's helpful. Thanks.
chilly brook
Definitely over 13 I'd swap to bolster permanently
steady spruce
On NW 2nd boss If you shockwave or Stormbolt the adds right before the explosion do they still inflict damage?
mossy sluice
think its gotta be hard cc to avoid the damage
undone jacinth
should do yeah
chilly brook
By still inflict damage do you mean blow up and give the boss a stack?
Because pretty sure that's unavoidable
Even when they're dead they do that
steady spruce
if they're hard cc they don't explode so you basically don't need to care about them
undone jacinth
means the damage that kills everyone
steady spruce
With 2 hard CC like priest shackles/Blind/freeze trap you can just hard cc the Mages and GG
sterile moss
shockwave prevents the big aoe dmg
undone jacinth
how have you tested that
sterile moss
yes
undone jacinth
I’m asking how
sterile moss
once I had two adds survive and shockwaved them just as boss finished casting his spell
we took no damage
sterile moss
sorry misread initially
steady spruce
Darkmoon duh
sweet summit
Which one should I use?
ideally, neither
steady spruce
also yes
sweet summit
but yeah, darkmoon cos ilvl
mossy sluice
bigger str on the dm card
warm thunder
Alright
steady spruce
You probably can get better trinkets in Expeditions
chilly brook
With 2 hard CC like priest shackles/Blind/freeze trap you can just hard cc the M...
Oh the hard CC disappear thing
Gotcha
warm thunder
Is Leash bad?
sweet summit
both are bad
undone jacinth
you can buy the other dark moon dps deck
sweet summit
:(
warm thunder
Cry
warm thunder
warm thunder
I've that too
steady spruce
please send more screenshot of trinket
warm thunder
Great at least I've a good trinket
undone jacinth
link all other items xd
steady spruce
send feet then
sweet summit
steady spruce
i mean boots
warm thunder
Lol
sweet summit
kinda weird
steady spruce
"kinda"
warm thunder
Which trinkets should I aim for?
steady spruce
yeah that's the good stuff right there
sweet summit
blood splattered scale and anima field emitter
steady spruce
Blood Splattered Scale from Hakkar Dos & Anima / Sun King Phenix stuff
sweet summit
^
warm thunder
Alright thanks
chilly brook
I hate myself for being a vulpera now
sterile moss
LOL
chilly brook
But also worth the memes
steady spruce
I feel like Sun King trinket is god tier but might be cause i don't have it
warm thunder
Why is Anima a good trinket?
chilly brook
Eh
mossy sluice
stats + good stats
sweet summit
lots of haste
jovial lily
Haaaaasssteee
chilly brook
Sun king trinket isn't that great
sweet summit
with good uptime
chilly brook
Super niche
warm thunder
I see
sterile moss
I have the sun king trinket and it's nice when it saves you. But the annoying thing is you're missing out on any value from it unless it does save you
chilly brook
^
sweet summit
^
steady spruce
i know but for M+ there is so many mistakes that would be saved by this trinket
like DOS Zg entrance pack for example
signal plover
I like vintage over SK but can't deny the cheat is yuge
chilly brook
Tbh
chilly brook
ZG pack if you're going to die something else is probably gonna kill the run
For most peoples runs that is
undone jacinth
it will save your keys a non zero amount of times
signal plover
Def
undone jacinth
if you are at risk it’s always good
steady spruce
ZG pack is so nasty in pugs
signal plover
If US insurance won't cover you cuz you're at risk for preexisting conditions
Iz gud trinket for u
undone jacinth
wooosh
signal plover
I mean, it just makes you less likely to be the reason for da depleto
chilly brook
Ye
signal plover
Which is gud
undone jacinth
exactly
sterile moss
tbf though, it's more likely to deplete because tank died than because he didn't use scale
chilly brook
I'm not disagreeing with that just giving a more nuanced point
undone jacinth
lol
signal plover
tbf though, it's more likely to deplete because tank died than because he didn't...
Yes but SK trink directly counters this at least a couple times
Same reason why VDH cheat is yuge
sterile moss
that's what I mean
signal plover
Ya not disagreeing
chilly brook
tbf though, it's more likely to deplete because tank died than because he didn't...
Most of the time you die because you didnt do something or the healer didnt, or dps are mongoloids who dont interrupt
mossy sluice
sun king rez doesn't come with a dr like vdh cheat or rogue cheat. you can instantly die after it going off if youre getting absolutely trucked
it's still a sick trinket tho tbh
sterile moss
well it has a nice heal
chilly brook
Same reason why VDH cheat is yuge
VDH cheat is a little more nuanced than that tbh, for one it's already a part of the kit and they are at more risk of just falling over than warrior or at least were. It's also really the only good pick on that row and as meta is so powerful it's just an excuse to pull bigger to get more meta uptime to enable pulls you wouldn't do otherwise.
undone jacinth
DHs still run SK even with LR
steady spruce
ah yes, LFR
undone jacinth
that’s how you know
steady spruce
mossy sluice
nobody kills me three times -vdh
sterile moss
overgeared? lol
chilly brook
People also using whatever they can get their hands on tbh
undone jacinth
I think people like naowh and nerf probably have a few options
undone jacinth
just get it in your box bro
sweet summit
i touched him
mossy sluice
chilly brook
Naowh and Nerfs use case isn't exactly everyone's use case
sterile moss
I'm still working on 'just getting' a shield
chilly brook
Again the trinket has a place
undone jacinth
I got scale in my box but still no shield
chilly brook
Just niche compared to others
undone jacinth
always next week
mossy sluice
having to pvp to upgrade my shield. very cool blizz
undone jacinth
I refuse to pvp on warr because it doesn’t have convoke
undone jacinth
I don’t want games that last longer than 5 seconds
ionic fern
I will rather be with a 210 shield/wpn than pvp.
chilly brook
Pvp is literally broken
undone jacinth
definitely
chilly brook
Pvp gear should have pvp stats or scaling that makes it not the best for pve
solemn magnet
How's the stone Legion trinket? I low key fuck with vers
chilly brook
And vice versa
mossy sluice
are you guys doing arena or rbgs for rating?
sweet summit
||vers is for nerds||
im doing arenas
jokes aside, its solid. a lot of vers for free with full uptime
chilly brook
Bring back WoD pvp gear
Good enough to start raiding
But best for pvp because ilvl scaling
And pve gear being scaled back in pvp
undone jacinth
Ion said they are happy with pvp loot but could do more for dungeons and raids... currency is coming, I’m confirming it
undone jacinth
If they just bring back coins or something I will be mad
sterile moss
please give us currency for doing m+ so it doesn't feel horribly unrewarding
signal plover
Arms PvP kinda fun idk
lusty marsh
Maybe we will get 2 picks out of vault
undone jacinth
interesting idea
signal plover
I do think they're gonna try a pve currency next patch
And bonus rolls prolly coming back
undone jacinth
yeah I think it’s currency for sure
undone jacinth
tier sets are coming
lusty marsh
Wtb mythic nathria plate mog
chilly brook
Currency and vendors would be welcome tbh
turbid cargo
wtb shadowghast plate mog
chilly brook
I'm already doing like 10-14 dungeons a week
lusty marsh
Can't you actually buy shadowghast mog?
chilly brook
So if I dont get a drop currency to compensate would be welcome
signal plover
They'll have to cap a currency like they do conq but that's ok imo
turbid cargo
Can't you actually buy shadowghast mog?
nope
sterile moss
with enough soul ash, sure
lusty marsh
Oh, do you have to make it a Lego for an appearance.
undone jacinth
yeah capped but quite high so that high dungeon players get more rewarded
turbid cargo
you don't get the appearance, at all. you can't transmog other pieces to the shadowghast/leggo appearance
undone jacinth
keys above 15 right now feel horrible and pointless
can’t motivate myself on tyran weeks to even try
signal plover
This tbh ^
sterile moss
you don't get the appearance, at all. you can't transmog other pieces to the sha...
I thought they changed that coming into SL 🤔
lusty marsh
They don't have to make it capped, super slow would be fine as long as I know progress is being made.
mossy sluice
what heros are gonna name their mdi team "bring back valor"
undone jacinth
just low amounts for low keys and more for big keys
turbid cargo
I thought they changed that coming into SL 🤔
do you see them in your appearance tab? 🙂
lusty marsh
Just use a bottle, ez
sweet summit
convert it to strength also
miss me with that simp mentallity
lusty marsh
Rba it up
undone jacinth
you don’t like strength or what bro
sweet summit
i do thats true :/
grave flume
Ion has already said that they like the system in place for pvp so idk why they wouldn’t be in favor of a currency system for pve
undone jacinth
nothing better than a strong man
sweet summit
two strong men 👀
undone jacinth
holding his ocarina tightly
grave flume
The fact that pvp is the most viable way to gear for pvp is v int
blazing gale
pvp should be about skill not gear 
grave flume
Pve*
blazing gale
naa like in gw2 you just selects the stats you want for pvp and thats it
so everyone can have w/e they want
grave flume
Also vers shouldn’t be the new resilience when it is also super viable in pve
undone jacinth
well what ain’t they playing gw2 😂
sterile moss
do you see them in your appearance tab? 🙂
welp, I guess not
blazing gale
😮 good thing I wanted to farm all legends for mog, now I dont have to throghast anymore 😄
mossy sluice
bfa pvp and gear not mattering was some of the most cringe stuff ive ever seen
grave flume
Shouldn’t pvp be more about skill anyway? I shouldn’t get globaled by a mm Hunter who paid for a 2100 boost
And got full 220 gear with fucking honor lmao
undone jacinth
you can’t really argue that there’s no skill in pvp though
heavy sail
PvP being a more viable path to more and better gear than m+ is retarded.
undone jacinth
the top guys are all legit
heavy sail
blazing gale
there is no reason to go higher than 14 if you are not interested in rio
lavish oracle
I'm not saying there's no skill but also gear advantage does make it waaaay easier
grave flume
I mean right now in arena there is very little skill and mostly relies on comp
blazing gale
apart from the mount ofc
undone jacinth
gear should make it easier
otherwise I’ve got no fucking chance
fuck learning pvp
grave flume
Gear should be a reward for skill not a way around it
heavy sail
I like the PvP gearing system, don’t get me wrong, but it shouldn’t be better — that’s where I take issue. Give us a M+ currency.
blazing gale
if there is a chance for a 233 weapon from pvp why there isnt a 233 gear for completing a +20 lets say
grave flume
I mean sure glad is different but you can buy a duelist boost in 2s
It’s so cheese right now
heavy sail
There’s also a concern about RMT and buying arena carries is legit just buying top tier loot.
But that exists just as equally for m+ and raid I guess
It’s just the ease of getting loot from PvP is nuts
undone jacinth
carries are a thing in all content though you can’t really complain about that until it’s banned
grave flume
To MUCH lesser extent tho
mossy sluice
bfa trade chat "selling 15 carries" every other message
undone jacinth
yea pve carries are insanely common
people don’t understand it’s worthless yet for the most part
grave flume
And we’re talking about random 210 pieces in m+ and a full set of 220 in pvp
mossy sluice
yeah and m+ used to be super lucrative in bfa. now its pvp thats super lucrative. Same stuff just diff avenue
undone jacinth
yup
grave flume
In the next couple of weeks people will easily be able to purchase like 5-6 pieces of 220 gear
heavy sail
Ideally I would want raid gear to be the best and untouchably so, want the best gear? Be a CE raider. M+ and PvP gearing being equal would be the next step a tier lower.
That’s my philosophy on it anyway
But everyone bitches when raid gear is the best
undone jacinth
yeah couple of weeks 5 pieces isn’t a full set tho
main silo
Hello everyone. I used to main Prot war in BoD, and i miss playing it. Obviously ive heard bad things about prot so far, but aside how bad it is or not, what is the biggest issues with Prot War currently? Mainly for M+.
undone jacinth
it should be that way, raid is the hardest content tbh
chilly brook
Hello everyone. I used to main Prot war in BoD, and i miss playing it. Obviously...
Gaps in mitigation
blazing gale
for ce you need to coordinate at least 20 people and prog on certain days. pvp just go in and whoever oneshots first win
undone jacinth
mainly because you have to organise 20 fuckers to do it
chilly brook
It's still more than fine for m+
mossy sluice
community perception is much worse than where war is actually at
chilly brook
^
blazing gale
imo it was fine in bfa M+ dropping 5illv higher than heroic raid which is pepega content and 10 ilvl below raid
heavy sail
I thought M+ gear in BfA devalued cutting edge raiding
chilly brook
Lol no
heavy sail
To the point my guild in BfA legit just didn’t bother raiding anymore
mossy sluice
it devalued heroic raiding for sure
jagged pier
it didnt devalue mythic, some pieces were bis sure but only a handful
gheti comes to mind
main silo
Sounds nice, i will still end up hating myself doing all torghast floors for a 5th time but
jagged pier
and i didnt even get one from the chest 
chilly brook
But mythic was still better than not mythic raiding
jagged pier
^^
blazing gale
geti wasnt even bis for arms
chilly brook
And some mythic trinkets were nuts
blazing gale
because had no stats
grave flume
I think the only real reason it got changed was because of RMT and the fact that a high end m+ player could easily jump into pvp and clap people with better gear. They just need to separate pvp and pve gear again
mossy sluice
that wasnt the case tho, bfa ilvl scaling was fucking whack
jagged pier
or give pve the same system as pve, like getting a 20+ in time you can upgrade a piece to 233
mossy sluice
you could be a ilvl 10,000 chad and you still couldn't one shot a ilvl 100 guy
jagged pier
same as clear the raid on mythic
blazing gale
but like in bfa if you were a hunter you basically had to luck out bis shoulders for m+ from pvp chest ( bis traits)
grave flume
I honestly think resilience was a great system
chilly brook
Yea rmt had nothing to do with it
The best system was literally the ilvl scaling from WoD
No wacky extra stat to balance
Just simple hey you're better for having pvp gear in pvp and you're better having pve gear for pve
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Super simple from a design perspective and also really effective
heavy sail
What about an M+ currency that you could use to upgrade items dropped from dungeons by your highest key completed that season
mossy sluice
ye that'd be sick
blazing gale
Imo it should be by highest average completed key
undone jacinth
and not much from lower
blazing gale
you'd just do 1 higher key and get bis gear
undone jacinth
it should just apply to any dungeon drop
mossy sluice
you could just gate it behind a similar system to conquest, complete all dungeons on a 10 to unlock 213 gear etc
undone jacinth
you should be able to target items like you can in pvp
blazing gale
yea like that
you can target by farming 207/210 piece xd
but can't compare that to pvp
chilly brook
You can
Because pvp is so incredibly good for gearing
Because you CAN target exactly what you want
blazing gale
no because the item might never drop in m+ if you have bad luck and in pvp you will eventuallybuy it
chilly brook
And it's at mythic level
heavy sail
It would give people a reason to do m+ beyond their weekly +10 or higher, and it would help people fill gaps that they otherwise can’t in their gear.
I’d be totally down for it
undone jacinth
you could have a vendor that had every dungeon item on it first but I think it just takes too much away from the concept of looting stuff
chilly brook
Whatever you're trying to get from m+ will eventually drop
blazing gale
or m+ would just drop tokens for items off that key
mossy sluice
even if its on a m2 or something, as long as the upgrade system exists you wouldn tmind getting it
heavy sail
I think there’s value to the idea of running a dungeon over and over for that one piece of loot
Hence why I think upgrading is a better philosophy than just using points to buy the item
Because you still need to farm the item itself
solemn magnet
I'd be okay with get a m+ drop then earn currency from doing other m+ and you can upgrade only if you've completed the same dungeon at a higher difficulty.
blazing gale
think everyone would be ok with that
I;d be fine wiht removing vault if we had that
heavy sail
I just think it would put it a little more in-line with how PvP gearing works, and it gives people who adamantly don’t want to PvP an avenue to get similar gear upgrades
mossy sluice
vaults the only way i get the game to give me loot
chilly brook
Especially considering pvp still benefits from it and raid
undone jacinth
it does feel weird that gearing is now basically based around the vault
heavy sail
Right, I like the vault. These two systems could coexist I feel like.
blazing gale
yea but I mean if we could upgrade items to 226 via m+ currency
undone jacinth
instead of it being a supplement
chilly brook
Also really think removing roll tokens was a stupid idea
blazing gale
+1
mossy sluice
mythic gold
undone jacinth
they were a shit concept, but we need them now becasue of how shit the gearing is
solemn magnet
Roll tokens were trash
blazing gale
I think I got most of my items in bfa via coin
chilly brook
Roll tokens might have been trash
But so is 35 anima every single fucking raid boss
blazing gale
there were better than no gear at all
mossy sluice
killed 10 bosses got a cape
chilly brook
I said this when they were first said to be removed
heavy sail
There would need to be a significant hurdle to reaching 226 via upgrades beyond just getting the currency though. Like timing a really high key, timegating the pace of upgrades (same they did with PvP vendor)
cosmic charm
beginner prot warr question: does intervening targets that are fixated in dungs redirect the auto attacks to me?
chilly brook
They might "suck" but they dont hurt to have
chilly brook
beginner prot warr question: does intervening targets that are fixated in dungs ...
Yes
You can also intervene things like the gargoyle mauling people in Stone Legion Generals
cosmic charm
ok thank you
heavy sail
I don’t mind the gearing system being what it is for raid, I just think M+ needs a little bit of help and PvP is just overwhelmingly more consistent and better than both.
chilly brook
The raid gearing system is ass
heavy sail
Gear can be rare and meaningful for all types of content, rather than just overwhelmingly easier for X or Y
heavy sail
I don’t mind it, no.
undone jacinth
you can go 20 kills with nothing xd
heavy sail
I also cleared MC every week for over a year without a binding
I think that’s fine for gear to work that way.
undone jacinth
that's not even
chilly brook
Vanilla=/=SL
undone jacinth
a remotely close
comparison
binding was one of the rarest items in the game lol
in the hardest content
you can do an entire normal raid and get nothing
heavy sail
My point is just that, something taking a long time or lots of clears to get an upgrade is conceptually fine in my opinion.
undone jacinth
yeah things taking time is totally fine
heavy sail
The problem as I see it, is just that other sources are just flat out better
undone jacinth
you shouldnt do a full mythic clear
and get no loot
its not right
for the effort
chilly brook
No option feels good
Except for pvp
Because it's so incredibly broken for gearing
Too bad I dont want to grind to 2100 in content I would rather not do
Raid barely drops gear
M+ barely drops gear, and considering how much is on the table for it means you're likely not to get what you want anyways
And you're definitely not getting it as an ilvl that's relevant outside of your vault
undone jacinth
the least they could do if they dont want to drop items is make loot tradeable
a character getting an item they dont need and cant trade in mythic is awful
heavy sail
The thing is that if everyone was gear starved or rather just on an equal playing field, doing a whole raid without loot wouldn’t be nearly as bad as it currently is.
undone jacinth
3 but yea its madness
heavy sail
People have inflated ilvl because of the inequality in gearing sources, that’s what’s making it so lopsided
Exactly
But if everyone was getting equally shafted by the raid and was in the same boat
It wouldn’t matter nearly as much
chilly brook
Doesnt matter if we were equally getting shafted
sterile moss
got a bag from artificer tho, ez
I got to see the other tank loot a shield 😦
undone jacinth
because currently all the ppl with access to pvp gear arent complaining
they all would be too
the raid is actually hard and if we're stuck at even lower ilvls it would be awful
m+ hard too
chilly brook
Spending hours on a boss and only like 14% of your raid getting something that wont even be a guaranteed upgrade is madness
chilly brook
And m+ being largely worthless outside of an avenue to get one item per week
After doing 6+ hours of m+
sterile moss
The thing is that the one item you get at a time from m+ in vault kinda is the way we're gearing up
just very slowly
surreal heath
avatar then spear or vice versa?
chilly brook
Spear is buffed by avatar
chilly brook
Why tho
sterile moss
I love those avatar-empowered 
sterile moss
haha those three essential-oil spitting slimes before the manastorms are a joke
heavy sail
Essential oils 
chilly brook
Ehhhh
heavy sail
Karen mobs
heavy sail
Still pretty easy, at least compared to the rest of DoS
sterile moss
throw us a bone
sterile moss
yeah
chilly brook
Still pretty easy, at least compared to the rest of DoS
You would think so but they actually truck at high keys and you don't have enough control to really avoid people getting clapped. And people can get targeted by all 3, theres a reason Dorki and Growl are trying to make a route skipping that entire area of DoS
blazing gale
talking bout pvp gearing, world are live now,, feral just got oneshotted by ele sham 😄
uneven mason
@chilly brook can I see the log of your first (only?) heroic Council kill?
chilly brook
My first?
uneven mason
yeah, rebuilt my guild, doing prog on that one
just wanna check the pacing
if its your 2nd ya'll are truckin and padding and slapping ass
jagged pier
which order you gunna do cause theres one which had no mechanics,
uneven mason
S/N/F
jagged pier
which we no longer do as we 'need to practice mythic mechanics'
chilly brook
Take your pick
My first kill was actually not great
Didnt really pad this fight until last kill
Even then hard to pad cuz I dont even get to execute
uneven mason
k see you did FSN
sterile moss
Oh you're running dragon roar
uneven mason
best ST dmg
chilly brook
For raid ye
uneven mason
If they don't jump you right off the bat
Ele is nasty in PVP, in 2s if I see one I tunnel it to keep em from getting their feet
jagged pier
its a 1 dps increase for me
uneven mason
👏
jagged pier
i dont see a point in swapping Xd
uneven mason
margin of error
uneven mason
eh
jagged pier
39 dps increase POG
heavy sail
I’m always tunneling hard on warriors and warlocks.
jagged pier
Id get a bigger increase to get 1800 rating I think
heavy sail
If you can get a HoJ or some equally long duration on an arms warrior where they can’t trinket it, they just evaporate
Incredibly squish
jagged pier
yer im 1600
but i have to pug healers
as no one really pvps in my guild
so im kind of dead stuck
with a 203 wep
but ill get there
i won 2 games against warlock yesterday
took 15 min games each time
but I won
heavy sail
What spec? Affliction?
mossy sluice
sacrolash corruption snare is some keyboard throwing frustration
jagged pier
What spec? Affliction?
yes
strat
is pillar
till healer can out heal your dam
then u just go ham
uneven mason
If you can get a HoJ or some equally long duration on an arms warrior where they...
TFW Orc with Warbanner
jagged pier
I am a orc
but in a lot of cases there are just better choices than war banner
from what ive found
I mean im still a big noob in pvp so i could be wrong
uneven mason
I tend to prefer it because it has CC reduction and movement
Warbanner - keep up with Ghostwolf
heavy sail
CC reduction is pretty invaluable.
uneven mason
yeah
heavy sail
Especially for squishier classes
uneven mason
also run defensive stance
uneven mason
yeah
jagged pier
work wonders for them not to blow up your healer
heavy sail
I usually go sharpen/d stance/war banner
uneven mason
monks don't need weapons iirc
heavy sail
Exchange one of them for disarm against melee