protection

[strong forum]

It's baffling

[uneven mason]

This is true

[steep schooner]

Fury is fun to play though

[uneven mason]

because Fury is fun/easy to play

[steady spruce]

their strenght is in their numbers

[uneven mason]

thats why it wasn't getting buffs thus far as well ><

[steady spruce]

is it true that they have great self healing? might be nice on fights like sludge

[uneven mason]

I mean, I play "Warrior" (preferably prot) but outside of tanking I run whatever spec does the most damage.

Not reall

[strong forum]

Idk, I tried fury in pre-patch and omg I wanted to kms, legit negative dps and crippling capral tunnel

[uneven mason]

Fury self healing is a meme

Arms has better self healing

[fierce tendon]

They have ok self healing there are so many specs with better

[strong forum]

And I wanted to kms everytime I missed to cleave rampage

[steep schooner]

Carpel tunnel is fun

[uneven mason]

2nd wind isn't interrupted by environmental damage.

[strong forum]

Cuz not cleaving rampage is such a huge dps loss

[uneven mason]

it is

[strong forum]

It's so tilting

[uneven mason]

not cleaving Siegebreaker

is big ouch

[steep schooner]

When you cleave rampage with death maker leggy and it doesn’t apply a single debuff that shit is fun af

[uneven mason]

But nah Nom, I wasn't like ERMAHGAWD FURY BIS!
More like I'm looking to see how it does in Raids vs my arms numbers because of how well it does in M+ with Condemn cleave.

[strong forum]

That's fine

[uneven mason]

so I can stop splitting my legos up 😄

running 3 legos hot fun

although, I'll keep PVPing so Fury will prob still be 3rd seat.

[restive flax]

Would you guys think that its ever worth it to switch to Kleia in M+ just to deal with bleeds / diseases easier? I find myself tempted everytime I go Plaguefall / HoA

[strong forum]

Eh not really

Only for necrotic when kleia had 1 conduit more

[restive flax]

Because you loose that potency conduit atm or just because the pelagos soulbind passive?

Combat Meditation

[strong forum]

Cuz like, you only get to cleanse once per pack right, the 8sec immunity rarely overlaps with additional casts

[restive flax]

ehhh what?

[strong forum]

And ye, Combat meditation

[chilly brook]

Tbh

[restive flax]

In what way does it not overlap?

[chilly brook]

Potion is kinda a meme

[uneven mason]

doesn't pelagos give you like big extra healing?

[strong forum]

8sec of immunity vs what mechanic are you thinking

[restive flax]

Like... the HoA bears stack bleeding all the time

[uneven mason]

55% Pot over 10s

[strong forum]

Yeah so you cleanse once you get high stacks

[uneven mason]

(Stun the bears?)

[strong forum]

They don't perma apply it with every auto

And stun

[chilly brook]

Or move out of melee

[strong forum]

When/if they're enrage you have to move away anyway

[restive flax]

In some pulls you really have no space

well

in one pull

[strong forum]

You can run in circles

If need be

[chilly brook]

Or if it's really a problem

Change your route

[restive flax]

I did, precisely because of that

[strong forum]

Like, sure you can play kleia

Absolutely

But you will lose out on that sweet +20% dmg buff

[chilly brook]

Or do the big brain move

Bring a paladin

Bop cancel

[strong forum]

My healer rather quits

Than play pally

[restive flax]

I have a ret in my party LUL

[strong forum]

Woah

Rare

[chilly brook]

Yea so tell him to stop being dookie

And to bop you on the dropdown if you need it

The dropdown has never been an issue for me outside of grievous

[restive flax]

Well you probably have DPS that kill them fast enough. Or help you to cc them

Or I'm just bad, also a possibility

[strong forum]

They're just terribly designed packs

That need to be kited alot.

[uneven mason]

CC the hunter is also a possibility

I Mean

[restive flax]

For example the "running in circles thing"... would require a big slow on them no?

[uneven mason]

[chilly brook]

Finally killed my boi heroic donny last night

[strong forum]

Did you also get nothing

[chilly brook]

Not really

[uneven mason]

I got nothing

[strong forum]

But your sweet anime

Very fulfilling feeling

[restive flax]

I guess I gotta practice kiting more

[uneven mason]

Its amazing going through a full run and seeing 1 weapon core drop

for the whole 20 people.

[chilly brook]

Well almost nothing

[restive flax]

Also thanks for stating the obvious with

[uneven mason]

Looks nothingy to me.

[chilly brook]

Basically

Definitely not worth the 80ish wipes

[strong forum]

Is that where you get it from?

[chilly brook]

Yea

[strong forum]

Oof 80

[chilly brook]

Yep

[strong forum]

(we had 60ish so its not that much worse)

But only like 10 with full roster

[chilly brook]

Imagine, we decide to raid on an off night and go to 2/3/8 and kill it in like 10 pulls

[strong forum]

We tried to 2/3/9 it for 50 pulls

[ember junco]

i like the pinned message about necrolords

way on point

[strong forum]

Then we yolod at 2/4/14 and took like 10

[chilly brook]

I'm just very surprised that the boss is that intensive in heroic

He's basically a mythic encounter tbh

[uneven mason]

Great sheet

if only we could get everyone to

[chilly brook]

At least we finally move onto mythic now

[strong forum]

We didn't even bother to finish heroic before going into mythic

Was just a spurt of the moment thing cuz 1 healers power went out

For like 4hrs

So we went into HC and killed generals and donny

Otherwise I still wouldn't have aotc cuz cba

[chilly brook]

Tbh we probably shoulda just said fuck donny

[slow warren]

anyone getting a weaponmaster proc with signet? it's changing my appearance and i can't remove it

[strong forum]

Isnt that a glyph

On BattleShout

[slow warren]

already vanishing powdered off fury's recklessness but idk if you can still do that for prot

[strong forum]

Also, why would you use signet

Don't you have enough Ash to craft a prot leggo?

[slow warren]

i do but i want to go straight to r4 to save gold

[strong forum]

Sounds like a fun interaction though

Getting a big ol 2h weapon by accident

[slow warren]

yeah i put it on ages ago for that reason

but i think they removed battlecry

so you can't vanishing powder anything now

[strong forum]

Yeah

Try avatar?

Cuz that replaced it

For prot

[slow warren]

yeah it's when avatar procs reck

[strong forum]

Ye but just press vanishing powder on avatar

Cuz it replaced battle cry for us

Going from legion to bfa

[slow warren]

rip doesn't work

only allows DW to be targeted

[strong forum]

Mh...

Ticket then

[slow warren]

is it even possible to use weaponmaster as prot these days?

[strong forum]

Na

Unequip signet

Go into fury

Proc reck

Then go into prot and put signet back on

Maybe that works

[slow warren]

welp just gotta wait another 90s and hope it procs reck to check

did they nerf queensguard vigil btw?

[strong forum]

Must've been a stealth nerf at best

[slow warren]

or was it never as good as people said

[strong forum]

It was insane on beta

When it was 226 ilvl

:)

Then it got nerfed on beta, but it was still 226 ilvl

That's why it was so broken, ilvl

[chilly brook]

Just unequipped signet

[slow warren]

yeah still procs weaponmaster on reck lol

[strong forum]

F

[slow warren]

it never selects the 2H

[strong forum]

GM ticket it is then

[slow warren]

always some shitty 1h and shield

[chilly brook]

Real talk rank 1 legos are pretty cheap

[strong forum]

Ye a R1 leggo will outperform signet already

If its wall or tl

[slow warren]

yeah but it makes it take longer to get a r4 of a different legendary

im not sure how much i want to commit to prot m+

[strong forum]

Well to get the R1 leggo to r4 will take same amount of time

[chilly brook]

It's literally like what 4k gold

To get TL rank 1

[slow warren]

i mean making TL/wall r1 will delay a pvp r4 legendary or something

and i'm undecided

[strong forum]

Well I have TL R1, wall r4 and unhinged R1

Currently

Which is perfectly fine

The ilvl doesn't matter as much

[uneven mason]

yeah >< I gotta make a Unhinged

bene using Signet in PVP thus far because its fun with 2 storms

long time no CC

[wheat sleet]

I have r2 signet, wall, and unhinged. Thinking about making TL but not sure

[strong forum]

Me neither

[chilly brook]

If you're undecided waiting to craft rank 4 is even worse

[uneven mason]

just make all of them rank 1

in that case

[wheat sleet]

this tbh

afaik you can skip ranks later so youre not forced into going r1>r2>r3, etc. anyways

costs the same amount of soul ash and like already mentioned, a rank 1 legendary doesnt cost much gold

id make the rank 1 legendaries and see what you vibe with

[strong forum]

Yuh

[slow warren]

damn weaponmaster definitely doesn't work on 2H weapons

removed all the 1h from my bags and didn't get taeshalachs

definitely gonna ticket it away

[ocean bloom]

Imo theres very little reason to upgrade 1 leggo past rank1 until you have all of the leggos you would want for the content you do. Like since I pvp and do keys and raid I want wall unhinged thunderlord and signet incase I play arms in raid ever

[dark lark]

For Mythic Huntsman, does the timing of spell reflect allow for us to soak every Sinseeker?

[dark lark]

oh, easily

[slow warren]

might be sketch if you want it on rip soul 1 and SS 2

[dark lark]

Is that from the disc priest post on competitive wow?

[slow warren]

it's been floating around

probably

the thought of leaving legendaries at r1 never even crossed my mind as a dps

but i suppose it's perfectly fine for tanks

[dark lark]

The only reason to leave it at r1 is if you're stingy with gold

[signal plover]

Do you not have enough immunes for Sinseekers?

[dark lark]

lol

[slow warren]

well ash too

[dark lark]

sure but in one week you could just upgrade to r2, etc

or just wait several weeks to get to r4

[signal plover]

Imo the prio for the boss tank on huntsman is to move boss away from the immune rip souls asap since he roots during the seeker cast

[dark lark]

@signal plover not sure, I haven't fully mapped it out yet. We have two DKs, a rogue, 2 hunters, and a mage

I don't know if AMS and cloak soaks it but I listed them anyway

[signal plover]

I also tried to SR the seeker bleed last week and still got it, and our rogue got clapped by it

But I mighta scuffed the SR tbh

[dark lark]

Sense's sheet says you can deflect it

So I'm assuming that counts as something you can immune soak it with

[signal plover]

I'll have to look at vod

You can get targeted by it while tanking which is what I think happened

I may have just mistimed tbh

[dark lark]

Oh yeah we have a Pally bubble

So I might be able to have him fill in on the rip soul/sinseeker

[signal plover]

Bubble and hunter turtle r best

[dark lark]

Yeah we only have two hunters and 1 pally

[signal plover]

Also, the immunities aren't all that required anymore imo

The boss falls over with decent dps

[dark lark]

ic

[signal plover]

If u got limited immunes, use those for P2

Then have some folks soak the others

As long as they don't get multiple stacks the debuff isn't awful

[slow warren]

how things changed since week 0

that dot was 9k or someshit

[signal plover]

Week1 heroic it slapped so hard we had to 6 heal at a 26 man roster just to get through it

[chilly brook]

So this Kaal thing in SD

Am I missing something or does it just not work

[tardy parcel]

Running her back into Proctor's room? Didn't work for me either last night 😦 she just ran to the next spot in the gauntlet for like 30 minutes

[chilly brook]

Yea

[astral crystal]

the bug out is that she pulls the whole corridor

[chilly brook]

Someone in here said it didnt work yesterday then a guildie said it did and he did it that day

[astral crystal]

or that's supposed to be it anyway

[signal plover]

Found out about the spear minigame cheese in a spires 15 yesterday

[chilly brook]

So I did it

And it definitely didnt work

[astral crystal]

assplain

[signal plover]

During intermission, one brave lad jumps off the side and then does a minigame with the floaty rings. Everytime you hit a ring you get a spear to throw and it does like 120k

I think it's for a m0 cheevo

But currently works in m+

[astral crystal]

oh it actually does dmg to the boss in m+?

does it knock her off the flight phase too?

[signal plover]

No

Only main spear does it

[dark lark]

Lol

That's awesome

[slow warren]

i asked my group about this and someone said you could only jump off before the intermission?

we didn't try it

[signal plover]

That's possible

I wasn't doing it, our mage was

[slow warren]

something about needing to slow fall back down

[signal plover]

He pushes big boi keys on rogue

[slow warren]

cos leap would make you drop the spear

[signal plover]

We almost missed the timer cuz immediately everyone in the group was like ooo cool wow let me see and try

And I'm like BITCHES KILL THE BOSS

[chilly brook]

[signal plover]

Also is the frontal on the first boss in SoA still sidesteppable to reduce dmg or did they fix that

[chilly brook]

I'm tryin to get to pushing big boi keys

No

[latent tusk]

What is happening! Step it up boys! Rise of the demon hunter??? Assss

[chilly brook]

They fixed it

It just does less damage now

[carmine crag]

way less

[signal plover]

So unavoidable now?

[chilly brook]

Basically

[signal plover]

Kk

[chilly brook]

I think you can probably range it

With leap

[signal plover]

I'm ok with that

[carmine crag]

but there was a brief time were it was unavoidable and did a shitton of damage

[chilly brook]

But haven't tried

[carmine crag]

made me lose a +10

can't range it with leap

[chilly brook]

Good to know never had a reason to try lol

[carmine crag]

it was fine when you could dodge it, don't know why they changed it

[chilly brook]

Eh

Way better now

You could never "dodge" it

You just either moved and took half the damage or got gimped

[carmine crag]

well

it was kinda unique

now it's just another pop defensives

[chilly brook]

It also wasn't working as intended

Per the ability description

[signal plover]

And was terribly telegraphed

At least, if there was an intended dodge component

[undone jacinth]

0.5second mechanics that kill u are not good

[chilly brook]

You basically either were moving before you got the alert

Or you got clapped

[undone jacinth]

trying to dodge it as bear was big fun time

[steady spruce]

Doesn't Demo shout gives some threat as it did in first Expansions?

[chilly brook]

Not afaik

And why would it matter

Just do damage

[steady spruce]

just curious

[chilly brook]

📈

[steady spruce]

i think debuffing a target would give threat

[chilly brook]

Not enough that it would matter

And you cant spam it anyways

[desert skiff]

@dark lark can you pm that sheet to me please or is it private from him? :)

[chilly brook]

So matters even less

[chilly brook]

Pins

[undone jacinth]

has anyone been getting rating from rated bgs instead of arena?

[sweet summit]

arena

rbg takes so long

and guild stopped doing em

:(

[strong forum]

It was doing 2x (2x 200%) the damage before the fix, as it procced twice instead of only once, the 2nd (200%) half being a dodgable cone.
Now it's fixed but does 240% but completely unavoidable

[undone jacinth]

that’s what I was wondering, if you have a good group if rated bgs can be easier to get 2100

[sweet summit]

yeah

[strong forum]

Ye for pve Bois it's prolly easier to just rbg to 2100/2400

[undone jacinth]

not sure what the time investment is tho

[sweet summit]

takes a while

[dark lark]

@desert skiff https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1QX845flKljq1nFSrAy9Bvx8C6gmArE7xwDb_BWrm6Rg/htmlview?usp=sharing&pru=AAABdxZzQA0*KGBnjOAKVCnrUApFi_Pe7A# It's more designed for healing officers

[strong forum]

Desmephisto got 2.1k with 18 games

[sweet summit]

gain so little rating for wins later on

[strong forum]

12 wins 6 losses

[sweet summit]

maybe we're just shit then 🤔

[strong forum]

I think

[undone jacinth]

Wtf lol 12-6

that’s so worth

[chilly brook]

Tbh I just like RBGs better

[undone jacinth]

they are less cheesy I guess

[strong forum]

Nvm

It was ~80 games

[sweet summit]

sounds more like it yeah

[strong forum]

So same amount as arenas if youre semi decent

But for 1800

Atleast thats what it took me

[carmine crag]

I'm out of the loop on arena meta, is prot warr viable?

[strong forum]

No

Not in arena

[carmine crag]

sad

hate seeing prot palas

i play arms with a balance druid

[strong forum]

Only scum plays arena as tank

[chilly brook]

I mean scum comment aside

[carmine crag]

double rogues

[chilly brook]

You dont bring anything as prot warrior tbh

[carmine crag]

is worse

[chilly brook]

At least as prot pally you have decent damage and you literally have utility and healing out the ass that keeps you guys alive

Prot pallys out here doing more healing than healers

[carmine crag]

it's fucking ridiculous

plus bubble

luckily shattering throw exists

[strong forum]

I'm surprised they haven't nerfed pally and druid off healing by 70% yet

Like...

It's such an easy fix

[carmine crag]

druid off healing saved my ass so many times

[strong forum]

"all tanks healing in arena reduced by 70% effectiveness"

[chilly brook]

Hybrid healing is just broken rn period

It's not just the tank specs

[undone jacinth]

palas attacking during bubble still feels insane during a 1shot meta

[slate sandal]

anyone ever go into toghast and clear it with ease then get to last boss and blizzard has it heal way to much and you cant kill it

[chilly brook]

Ret pally and any of the druid specs are dumb

[carmine crag]

only happened to me during the overtuned week

[strong forum]

Not really no abathorn, bosses were always the easy part

[chilly brook]

The only parts I struggled with in torghast (and struggle is kinda a stretch it was more of a surprise by the fact I had to try a little) were layer 7 and 8 first floors with no power

And that's of twisting corridors btw

[carmine crag]

can't really comment tho since I also play torghast with my balance friend and he oneshots the boss with 3 million dps

[strong forum]

Every floor felt the same, but I tried getting alot of powers ASAP, so I could skip the last 4 floors

[chilly brook]

I solo'd it all

[strong forum]

I maximised early floors

[carmine crag]

i could solo but it's much more fun with a friend

[chilly brook]

Granted I also started floor 8 with 8% hp drain every 5 seconds so that's probably why

[strong forum]

Eh that was kinda irrelevant

I started with 17% magic dmg

Boss hit me for 500k

Reflect also did 500k

[carmine crag]

nice

[strong forum]

Did 1.6mil dmg with reflect

[carmine crag]

which boss?

[chilly brook]

That's really the reason why people struggle imo is they don't maximise their power gain because they're so focused on going fast

[carmine crag]

the tree dude?

[strong forum]

Idk the name

Na was a huge wraith

[carmine crag]

the tree dude cucked me hard during the overtuned week

[strong forum]

Tree dude does nothing tho

Kick the heal

[carmine crag]

stun every 20 seconds and heal

yeah now

[fierce tendon]

Worst torghast boss is blob for me

[strong forum]

Blob I could blow up luckily

Has infinite rage for him

[carmine crag]

the toblerone sucking blob?

[fierce tendon]

ye

[carmine crag]

never had issues with that one

[strong forum]

(bought the rage potion for him and just spammed away)

[chilly brook]

I've still never died or failed a torghast run or boss except for the week after our nerf when I was testing to see if I could carry someone

[carmine crag]

stacking rage generation+the execute power is super braindead but probably the best way to power through torghast

as long as you get it early that is

[fierce tendon]

That plus the resonant throatbands trait is hufe

huge*

[carmine crag]

oh yeah

[fallow mortar]

Blob is easy for me. I just stay targeting him and let condemn do the work. If he splits I simply ignore and keep on condemning..... That is if I get the condemn power that allows me to condemn any time

[carmine crag]

resonant plus the 500% shout increase if you get lucky and get demo shout

48s demo shout

[fierce tendon]

Yup permanently shout lol

[carmine crag]

best run I got I had 100% demo uptime, 100% avatar uptime and 100% last stand uptime

[fierce tendon]

I had an 8 minute shield wall with the duration buff

Was pretty cool

[carmine crag]

shame it was before twisting corridors and ended right after I had the good shit

duration buff is awesome as well

especially in twisting corridors since you get to the end with almost 100 soul remnants

[fierce tendon]

Also the only twisting corridor I failed was when I got floor 2 damage buff/hp loss

Was on floor 13 with like 3k health

[carmine crag]

oof

[chilly brook]

Tbh

[fallow mortar]

Oof

[chilly brook]

Once you get the first shield wall duration extension

The rest aren't worth

[fallow mortar]

Mhm

[fierce tendon]

True, I found with am/wall leggo pretty much 1.5m shield wall is all u need

[carmine crag]

if you get skoldus hall make sure to use ravenous cell on the archers and it's an easy 10-20 souls

[fierce tendon]

but the 10% hit into free IP that procs shield wall is hilarious on big packs

[carmine crag]

that, the ghosts and the guys with skeletons are the only worth using ravenous cell

[chilly brook]

Tbh I find ravenous cell not all that worth buying

[carmine crag]

usually aren't

[fierce tendon]

The only one its extreme useful is the 75% fire dr on the fire level

[carmine crag]

that as well

fuck traps

it's so hard when I'm a fat tauren

[fierce tendon]

The traps that wait for you to walk thru can eat me

[carmine crag]

skinny races are easy to visualize your hitbox

[fierce tendon]

Everyone with speed buff ignores them

[chilly brook]

All of the traps trigger when you're next to them not when you walk through

[carmine crag]

getting hit by floor traps while midair with heroic leap is awesome as well

[chilly brook]

Well not all

But most

[fierce tendon]

Well yeah but you have to consciously wait but most ppl that have speed buffs (literally almost every class) can walk thru them unharmed

just an annoyance

[chilly brook]

Just Nightfae

[carmine crag]

just go night fae

[fierce tendon]

Tru

[chilly brook]

Become the dragon

[worn bear]

you can soulshape straight thru spikes usually

[carmine crag]

HOW DO YOU GET THE DRAGON

[chilly brook]

Killing Donny

[carmine crag]

donny?

[chilly brook]

Denathrius

[shut summit]

Heroic denathrius

[carmine crag]

ah heroic

[uneven mason]

TFW you're venthyr with 2x door

[carmine crag]

my guild never takes me on heroic runs and cba to do heroic with pugs

[uneven mason]

Find another ugild?

[carmine crag]

tempted to leave my guild yeah

[open monolith]

^

[chilly brook]

Heroic Denathrius is actually kinda aids tbh

[uneven mason]

He is rough

but prot isn't bad for him

[chilly brook]

No not at all

[carmine crag]

they'd rather take a MM hunter that does less than 2.5k dps because they're an officer

[chilly brook]

Just that if your group isn't 100% there

You're gonna have issues

If people die p1

You basically need to wipe

If people die p2

[fierce tendon]

I got floor PoV for our first kill last night

[chilly brook]

You basically wipe

[fierce tendon]

Paladin tank lived for like 30s after somehow

[chilly brook]

Because pally isn't bad

And is less squishy than people give it credit

[fierce tendon]

Very tru

[uneven mason]

TFW he was sitting on all of his CDs

[fierce tendon]

he was lmfao

[uneven mason]

until the healers died

[fierce tendon]

I told him to XD

[chilly brook]

I rotated the fuck out of my CDs on donny

[uneven mason]

"Its a healer problem, until its mine!" - Prot paladin motto

[open monolith]

Holy pally best pally. Holy feels so good to play

[chilly brook]

My healer messaged me and was like "whatever you did to be more tanky thank you it was huge"

[fierce tendon]

yeah I ran AM for donny, cycling the fuck out of rage

[chilly brook]

Oh no

Bolster all the way for donny

AM is for damage not mitigation

[signal plover]

AM is fine for HC denathrius if you're not dying

[fierce tendon]

Tbh we were having problems with heals during last phase so I was just trying to cycle shield blocks to keep myself alive

er wall

[chilly brook]

I might not be dying but other people were

[carmine crag]

their fault then

[chilly brook]

96 parse on healing tho

[carmine crag]

nice

[chilly brook]

3 casts of shield wall in a 7 minute fight

Not bad I guess

[dark lark]

My guild is asking me to switch back to prot war for mythic prog since battle shout with me playing it is still a better option than our dps warriors

[fierce tendon]

LOL

[dark lark]

I was veng for fotm m+

[fierce tendon]

They're asking you to switch to prot from vdh?

[dark lark]

It's not even an issue of their dps, they're just literally keyboard turners that die to mechanics

But we need the battle shout since we're melee heavy

Yup

Got my ksm on vdh, then shelved the poor guy

Had a good run

[chilly brook]

I still haven't been asked to change so hey

Even if they do ask me to change

They're just getting a worse option

Cuz my alt tank is BrM

[fierce tendon]

Brm sure is fun tho

[dark lark]

What's worse is that my cotank is going from bear to vdh, and by all accounts he drops mitigation in keys a LOT

[chilly brook]

It is now

[dark lark]

Help me

[steady spruce]

yes but WW monk is dope dps

whereas arms..

[chilly brook]

BrM has definitely gained a lot going from BFA to SL

[steady spruce]

or dh..

[chilly brook]

It feels so much better to play now

Especially as Kyrian

But it's really nice to have stagger be less important and them bringing back Guard aka Celestial Brew

Makes for a nicer skill ceiling

[fierce tendon]

Overall most of the covenant class designs are dope, cant fault them on that this expac

[chilly brook]

Weapons of order is just a nice interaction for BrM

Doesnt really change much but it's nice having that increased damage window

[heavy sail]

Weapon of order really helps you get a huge threat lead

In the past with BrM, if enemies were too separated on pull and one was missed by keg smash it could be hard to get it back while it’s on CD without taunting

Legendary makes it trivial as well

[chilly brook]

Still had some threat issues last night

But I mean what do I expect when doing 8s at 183

[uneven mason]

BrM gained(lost?)

[outer solstice]

@chilly brook I think I beat that, let me see

the 3 SW in 7 mins

[chilly brook]

It gained in playstyle

[uneven mason]

I dunno, didn't thye remove a button

because it was too hard to press 2

[chilly brook]

Like it plays a lot more interesting and theres actually a gap in the difference between skill floor and ceiling now

[uneven mason]

down to 1 button.

[outer solstice]

@chilly brook 4 in a 6 minute fight:

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/Gmn2xDTJqt7QbCAL#fight=20&type=casts&source=6

and it was ready at the end

but I was off tanking

[chilly brook]

Well I mean I wasn't spamming it all the time lol

I was trying to be deliberate

Use it in periods of high movement where healers wouldn't be able to do much etc.

[chilly brook]

Let's be real pressing ISB wasn't exactly a skill

[uneven mason]

No it wasn't

but at the same time, they took that and went "Oh they don't like buttons"

[chilly brook]

I would have preferred moving back to Chi and having the old shuffle

[uneven mason]

"Lets just roll ISB into the base staggr"

[chilly brook]

And they lost ISB but gained CB

And Dave

And ToD

And SCK

[stray sierra]

how do you guys go about marking mobs in dungeons

like what is the most efficient way

do you just bind the macros

[chilly brook]

And technically they didnt roll ISB into stagger just took the old shuffle made it so you could have 100% uptime and changed the buff to be the ISB buff instead of a parry buff

[uneven mason]

I say

in discord

"Kill the <insert dangerous mob in pack>"

if i"m pugging no one follows markers anyway

[outer solstice]

I have CTRL space for skull and CTRL shift space for cross, the other marks are often set by addons @stray sierra if there are any marks needed

[chilly brook]

WAs

There are auto mark WAs

[lime plume]

Is there a way to check on logs if you’re wasting ignore pain buffs? Apparently wasted IP HP isn’t included in Overhealing according to a guild mate of mine

[heavy sail]

BrM is super dumbed down so far as stagger uptime, but to be fair the old mechanic was kinda shitty.

[stray sierra]

how does that auto mark wa work

[heavy sail]

Like it didn’t feel good to keep it up.

[stray sierra]

can you link me one?

[uneven mason]

Correct IP Only gets counted when its used.

[heavy sail]

It made your DPS rotation more clunky and it wasn’t necessary

[chilly brook]

Your purify is more important tbh

And so is your CB

[heavy sail]

Right

But in the past keeping uptime on the stagger buff was equally important

[chilly brook]

You can get away with spamming both

[heavy sail]

If not moreso

But now it’s something you don’t even think about

[lime plume]

Is there a way to check my useage of IP and if I’m wasting it then other than *comparing casts to better parses and guestimating from there?

[modern brook]

any particular reason you care? IP efficiency is pretty tertiary

[chilly brook]

But theres actually a notable difference between someone who does that and people who actually use CB around mechanics etc.

[chilly brook]

Uhhh

[lime plume]

I think I’m wasting a lot of rage on it and I just want a reliable resource to confirm where and how

[chilly brook]

Your brain?

And your eyes?

[outer solstice]

you could overlap IP casts and IP healing with buff uptime on logs

[chilly brook]

If you have a full IP why cast another IP

When you can revenge

[brave sapphire]

expunge deflect. before cast or before bubble comes out?

[orchid oar]

https://wago.io/IPoverlay check this out

[uneven mason]

Its like revenge, but reduces damage too

[orchid oar]

I dont use this one, but it seems very similar to the one I run

[heavy sail]

IP as a maintenance buff is hard to justify until your rage gen is really popping off anyway.

[outer solstice]

no DW @uneven mason 😛

[heavy sail]

I tend to use it just for magic damage

Having gaps where you’re rage throttled and can’t cast SB is no bueno

[outer solstice]

just call an external

if it's a problem

[chilly brook]

I'd have to be Venthyr then

Which would be great

If it actually cleaved

[outer solstice]

you onlyget a cleaved condemn if you're bottom on DPS 😛

in ST

[lime plume]

I’ll be using it going forward I just wanted a way to compare my IP usage versus better parses by someone like Sense since I seem to have roughly double the IP casts with similar healing received from external sources so I just wondered if there was a way to compare it via logs but if not that’s cool

[chilly brook]

You can

[lime plume]

Based just on the fact that I’m using it twice as much I’ll just assume I am and go from there

[chilly brook]

But you're focusing on an aspect that largely doesnt matter

[outer solstice]

use IP before hairy situations

[chilly brook]

Are you hitting IP when you're not actively tanking

[outer solstice]

not just to maintain it

[heavy sail]

If you’re using IP twice as much as a better parse, safe to say you’re using it too much.

[chilly brook]

If you are that's probably where those casts come from

[heavy sail]

But your question is just how you can see a breakdown of that right?

[outer solstice]

well "better" parses are more DPS

also check raid size if not M and EHRPS and such metrics

[uneven mason]

Also, are you checking Sense's external defensives? his crew is tops and actually support their tank

[outer solstice]

sense is a DPS monster

[chilly brook]

It's also highly dependent on situation

I probably have a lot more casts of IP than people who parsed well on Donny

[lime plume]

I was using darkvein heroic as the basis since I would still use IP when off-tanking to help reduce the bleed damage as that fight has less clear cut Revenge uses because of that dot

[chilly brook]

Because I threw DPS out the window to make it easier on an already hard fight for the healers

[lime plume]

And I was still doubling and tripling senses IP casts

[chilly brook]

Eh

[outer solstice]

well darkvein is a DPS race....

[chilly brook]

When you're not tanking anything the dot is the healers problem

[lime plume]

On some *Erga and Sense logs (*Erga is a tough example since she uses Codemn) they had 10-12 IP casts and I had 30-40

So seeing wasted IP seemed like an easy way to compare it but if I can’t then I’ll look at externals and the timeline instead compared to damage taken

Thanks for the input guys, appreciate it

[chilly brook]

Fuck

[outer solstice]

😛

[chilly brook]

Donny dropped my average

Was like a 95 average

[uneven mason]

RIP

gotta work on that DS uptime

[sweet summit]

@chilly brook should've condemned harder

[outer solstice]

damn

maybe I should really switch to Ventyr ...

[signal plover]

If u care about heroic parses sure...

[heavy sail]

Damn a 100% parse on SD is only 2.4K

[sweet summit]

i dont tank mythic

its from like week 2

no longer rank 1s

[chilly brook]

My parse vs senses

[heavy sail]

Makes sense

[chilly brook]

He just doesn't press IP that much when parsing lol

[outer solstice]

yeah I guess so

just pump

[chilly brook]

Likely because he doesnt need to

[signal plover]

It's counterproductive to doing dps

And you don't need to cast it

Healers wanna slam too

[chilly brook]

Also tf is squeak

[sweet summit]

https://www.wowhead.com/item=179295/squeaky-bat

padding cpm

smh

[heavy sail]

He squeaked more than he used SS

[chilly brook]

[outer solstice]

[chilly brook]

Just macro it

Not that big brain

[outer solstice]

CPM padding xD

[chilly brook]

I mean I'll take my parses without them actually being active padding parses

Just fucking donny ruining the average

[outer solstice]

yeah I wonder how I got my purps on mhytic without padding xD

[chilly brook]

Because a lot of your damage comes from playing properly anyways

[lime plume]

Maybe I’ll look at some of their logs that aren’t absolutely top-tier instead then since it sounds like they may have been leaning on the healers more to get a higher parse

[chilly brook]

I mean that's a guarantee

[outer solstice]

@chilly brook yeah but I seriously expected more tanks to already be paddin hard with PI and other fun things

[chilly brook]

Parses are just for damage

At least the top ones you're looking at

[outer solstice]

yeah top parses are nearly always padded

[chilly brook]

Check his first kills on mythic

And you'll get a more accurate idea

[outer solstice]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/QdgrYnMNPb9zq1F6#fight=12&type=damage-done

there you go

[chilly brook]

Because prog kills and farm kills are two completely different beasts

[outer solstice]

that's a proper representation

and you see

sense 38 IPs

[chilly brook]

Every IP is 2 revenge casts

[outer solstice]

[lime plume]

I was just using heroic because my guild is progressing on heroic, we don’t have mythic logs so comparing mythic to heroic logs seemed like a not so good idea

[chilly brook]

My 99 on shriekwing

[lime plume]

I’ll track down some of his progression heroic logs then, even if the ilvl is going to be super different

[outer solstice]

you have to compare progress to progress

[chilly brook]

As you can see IP casts way down

But revenge casts way up

[outer solstice]

@chilly brook 15 IP? that's at least 7 more revenge

REEEEEEEEEEEE

also I assume you had him in 2 phases?

[chilly brook]

3:38 kill

Idk how many times he phased

[grizzled forge]

can we assume 3rd soubind tree will be on reset since we will be 9/9 chapters?

[weak spindle]

With hungering Destroyer mythic what talent set up you lot use

Fray/AM/Wall?

[outer solstice]

not sold on fry for that one yet though

pretty split raid and we don't have many pets

[weak spindle]

ravager bois?

We are running the square tactic so usually have at least 4/5

[jagged pier]

take bolster

its makes the fight ez to tank

[outer solstice]

why?

you have downtime

so that you can reset charges

[jagged pier]

depends how much you have

[uneven mason]

pretty frequent swaps

[outer solstice]

AM/stalwart/wall is just insane

[jagged pier]

yes but so is bolster

[uneven mason]

Bolster bigboi

[weak spindle]

Bolsterbois?

[heavy sail]

The damage intake from devourer can be lined up pretty easily with your cool downs

[uneven mason]

Bolsterbois

[heavy sail]

Because it’s so swap heavy

Bolster is probably the best in that tier for every mythic fight though

[jagged pier]

start with bolster, if you dont think you need it you can always change later

but it will make the intake of damage very ez to deal with

[uneven mason]

oddly enough, HR probably gives you exactly the block uptime you need

but having LS on a 2min CD

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[jagged pier]

personally i found it useful for times where healers are running away with expunge

and im left tanking hungering

[weak spindle]

That's where i find it sketchy atm

[heavy sail]

I don’t think there’s ever been a time where I’ve gone with HR lol

[outer solstice]

well SW on a 1-1.25 min CD is jsut what I prefer

[weak spindle]

Usually having to drop major CDS in expunge

was just curious what others used

[uneven mason]

[outer solstice]

yeah

every time ^^

[weak spindle]

No so much my damage just the lack of healer top up during

[outer solstice]

healthstones, pot

[weak spindle]

always using SF to remove my orb

[heavy sail]

Anger management all the way unless you’re pushing difficult content

[uneven mason]

'Mythic HD" qualifies

[jagged pier]

personally if its progress run bolster

once your used to the fight etc

[heavy sail]

100%

[uneven mason]

Probably

[jagged pier]

go AM

[heavy sail]

Bolster is a get out of jail free card for progression fights.

[sweet summit]

bolster is just shield block on a longer cooldown

[uneven mason]

Erga is one of those warriors

[grizzled forge]

general draven in venthr seems pretty strong no?

[uneven mason]

he prefers the juicy Avatar uptime

[jagged pier]

true, but im finding useful on fights where im tank all the time like sun king im never not being meleed

[sweet summit]

draven seems good aye

[uneven mason]

I can't wait to findout if I can LS + RC and explode for 70k

[signal plover]

Late to discussion but bolster on HD prog was beeg smooth

[jagged pier]

anyway time to kill sun king

[signal plover]

GL

[jagged pier]

we were 10k off the last shield last night

he should die pretty quickly

[shut summit]

[signal plover]

Ofuk

Didnt even think of that

[jagged pier]

yer i used that sense

on first and last

[outer solstice]

shatter stronk

[uneven mason]

"Sense's daily wisdom"

[shut summit]

lol

[outer solstice]

[sand obsidian]

New to Warrior tank, what macros do you guys find most useful?

[chilly brook]

Not a whole lot

[outer solstice]

checked the pins and icyveins?

[chilly brook]

Heroic leap

[outer solstice]

intervene/charge

[jagged pier]

charge intercept, hc, spear and rav at cursor

[chilly brook]

One for charge/intervene

And ravager

[outer solstice]

mouseover interrupt

[subtle island]

is a high hps in logs an indicator you're doing well?

[hallow phoenix]

/cancelaura Blessing of Protection

[hallow phoenix]

No it means you're taking a lot of damage, generally

[jagged pier]

or your over using ip

[sand obsidian]

Yeah so far I've got the mouseovers for interrupt and taunt and the cursor one for heroic. Wasnt sure the use of focus charge

[chilly brook]

HPS is basically a trap

[subtle island]

Any good indicators to look for in logs?

[jagged pier]

mitigated damage

if your looking at survival

or dps if your looking for damage

[uneven mason]

effective uptime on SB

utilizing IP for damage when it would help.

[chilly brook]

Ehrps can be helpful somewhat

[subtle island]

whats a decent percentage for damage mitigated, or does it vary a lot by fight?

[uneven mason]

ehhhhhhhhhhh

yes it varies

[chilly brook]

Depends on fight

[uneven mason]

72%

is best

ask Griff

[chilly brook]

And how the damage breakdown is

Tbh

The best metric is to talk to your healers

[modern brook]

If u died you weren't doing well

If you lived check your parse

[subtle island]

How could I up dps?

I feel like I just replace IP with revenge if I'm pushing damage more

[open monolith]

The best damage mitigated % is the amount that lets you live while also pumping as hard as you can

[subtle island]

I'm getting really high hps but my damage is in the toilet

[open monolith]

More revenge, less ignore pain

Make sure you're properly reacting to Shield slam resets

[chilly brook]

This is probably the highest mitigated % I've had

But effective block casts would be a better metric to look at

[subtle island]

How can you check effective block casts?

Is there an easy way?

[ionic fern]

Damage taken->Melee->Hover over "Hits".

That's the "blocked" attacks.

[subtle island]

ah nice

[chilly brook]

Like so

[scarlet copper]

thought on a 207 chest with 74v/52c vs a 213 chest with 88m/44c?

[chilly brook]

213

There is no thoughts

[scarlet copper]

cool, ty

[chilly brook]

Ilvl

Is

King

[scarlet copper]

fair enough

[chilly brook]

Especially on pieces that actually offer main stat

[scarlet copper]

yeah for sure

[subtle island]

Thanks for the help guys

that was really useful

[pale epoch]

The Wall or thunderlord's for high m+?

[shut summit]

whichever you prefer

i use wall cuz higher ilvl for raid already

• just like it better

[spice yacht]

okay i have tried so many times to find meaningful disscussion on Spear vs Condem as I play both arms and prot reguarlly arms in raids prot in mplus / back up tank. I have read both the icy veins guide and wow head guide anyone one have expereince with both as Id like not to level a 2nd warrior this xpac.

[pale epoch]

I feel like I'm getting smacked around alot and also rage starved in higher keys

[oblique garnet]

If you play venthyr prot you practically have no covenant ability outside of few niche situations that are not relevant for 90% of m+ or raid content

If prot had fury warriors execute where it was a generator instead of an spender you could make an compelling case for venthyr but as long as it stays as spender in 99% of the cases venthyr is just not an covenant

[spice yacht]

thats what I was thinking as well, but does spear make up enought of a difference that running kyrian would be okay in raid?

sorry if thats dumb

[uneven mason]

Kyrian is bestest

[spice yacht]

I dont want to cut of my nose to spite my face

[uneven mason]

I have used both, I was kyrian, went Venthyr because I was asked to DPS in raids

and Kyrian definetly was much stronger for tanking

the potion alone

[odd warren]

whats the best wep enchant?

[chilly brook]

To be fair, the meaningful discussion has been had. And the simple answer is Kyrian or NF is just simply better for prot

You can do Venthyr

And do well

But it's just not as good

[spice yacht]

yea i think leveling a 2nd warrior for soley prot is going to be best course of action and with renown catch ups it wont be that hard

[chilly brook]

I mean you could just be a Venthyr prot boi

It's not going to be the difference maker in getting KSM

Or even beyond

[spice yacht]

yea i do 15 - highest ever was a 22 last xpac so im not the highest end pushing content by a mile

havent had to much trouble as a vampy boi in my 6s-7s

just wondering if I should switch to get to 10+ easier

[jagged pier]

upgrade?

[chilly brook]

More stats is more stats

[chilly brook]

You could do 15s without a covenant tbh

[jagged pier]

@strong forum im getting there

[spice yacht]

true that would be interesting

[strong forum]

huge

[chilly brook]

Mythic Shriek?

[strong forum]

na shriek has more parses

think this is hungering or sunking

[jagged pier]

sun king

[chilly brook]

Ah

Mythic sun king?

[jagged pier]

yer

[chilly brook]

Nice

[jagged pier]

phased a tad slower so we had an extra vanquisher

[chilly brook]

Finally gonna start mythic prog

[jagged pier]

have fun dude

[chilly brook]

We killed shriekwing once and decided to kill donny before actually doing prog

[jagged pier]

well hes harder than the first few

so its a good choice

[chilly brook]

Kill me

This fucking kill time

I also.gained 14 ilvls since then so should be a much higher parse

[sand obsidian]

A lot more keybinds than I expected for tank lol

[jagged pier]

you dont need WW

or hamstring

[lavish oracle]

Sometimes I use hamstring

[jagged pier]

but TC has a slow

with it

🤔

[lavish oracle]

20% vs 50%

[sick sentinel]

isn't TC a fairly short snare? i believe that hamstring is better longer duration

not that i'm arguing anyone should actively use HS

[lavish oracle]

Yeah, it's got some niche use, probably won't lose a lot from unbinding it but occasionally it's nice not having to ask someone else to slow a mob I'm trying to kite

[bright hornet]

why cant healers keep me alive if i have 70% uptime on ignore pain and 40% uptime on shield block?

in an M+

[ionic fern]

Because IP uptime doesn't matter and 40% uptime tells me literally nothing.

What you need to look at is blocked hits.

[bright hornet]

how do find that?

[ionic fern]

Logs.

[bright hornet]

why does IP uptime not matter?

[chilly brook]

Hamstring costs rage doesnt it?

[sick sentinel]

i'm pretty sure you only block in front of you too 180 degrees

[jagged pier]

yes

[chilly brook]

Waste of rage

[jagged pier]

it doesnt

[chilly brook]

Tbh

[sick sentinel]

10 rage tho, it's nothin

[chilly brook]

TC slow is enough

[bright hornet]

but the moment it drops i instantly die

[chilly brook]

That's half the rage for a revenge

[ionic fern]

o.o

[jagged pier]

thats half a revenge

[jagged pier]

then your doing somthing wrong

[chilly brook]

TC is free

[ionic fern]

Then you are 100% not using SB.

[lavish oracle]

Def gonna miss that 10 rage while I'm running the fuck away 😄

[chilly brook]

And give rage

[sick sentinel]

still even if its a 50% slow for 15 seconds let a dps do it

[bright hornet]

i just said i have an uptime of 40% on SB xD

[chilly brook]

That's low

[ionic fern]

ANd i just said that provides 0 information.

[chilly brook]

Very low

[bright hornet]

how? 15 sec recharge and 6 sec duration

[sick sentinel]

use 10 rage to deal 10 damage and snare

[chilly brook]

Bolster

And you have 2 charges

With bolster you have 30-40 seconds of straight block

And that's every 2 minutes

[sick sentinel]

you use shield block when you are getting the melee attacks, if not you use IP and reflect for 20% MR

and you have to face whatever you want to block.

[sand obsidian]

Any reason to use focus charge macro over a mouseover charge macro?

[ionic fern]

This is the information that matters @bright hornet .

[jagged pier]

73% huge

[ionic fern]

It was a mists +15

[sick sentinel]

i'd round that up to 74% personally

[ionic fern]

You stating that you fall over as soon as IP drops makes me believe that you are not using your mitigation properly.

[finite prairie]

Don't use shield block when you aren't taking hits. It wastes a charge

[ionic fern]

And IP is NOT your main mitigation tool. Shield Block is.

[sick sentinel]

but that is insane blocked hits,

[bright hornet]

kk. ill give it a shot

[lavish oracle]

@sand obsidian I can't think of one. PvP maybe

[sick sentinel]

sometimes if you have a huge scary pull as prot warrior, you can pre-shield wal right before you engage

[bright hornet]

@ionic fern how much do i care about secondary stats?

[chilly brook]

From my 14 ToP

[sick sentinel]

you should always be going in and immediately be casting avatar too.

[ionic fern]

What do you mean how much? 👀

The more the merrier.

[sick sentinel]

haste is our best secondary, versa or crit next
versa for raid, crit for dungeons

[chilly brook]

14 Sanguine Depths

[sick sentinel]

haste is best, but crit versa and mastery are all more or less equal value to us.

[valid scaffold]

Hi guys, during bladestrom we can block-parry-dodge?

[chilly brook]

Yes

No it's not worth using signet

[steady spruce]

Wich consumables do you guys use in M+? I'm running stone and Strenght/Stam pots

[sick sentinel]

thunderlord is better if you want to do m+

[chilly brook]

Tbh I dont use any pots except for health pots in m+

Strength flask, sharpening stone, armor kit, haste food

[jagged pier]

never stam

[sick sentinel]

main stat flask, phantom fire and shadowcore oil, whatever the haste food is called

[jagged pier]

strs pots or invis pots oil armour mkit

[warm blaze]

what u guys think of stam flask over main stat flask

[steady spruce]

But that's expensive 😄

[warm blaze]

for m+

[jagged pier]

never

[chilly brook]

Never

[jagged pier]

never in 1 million years

[chilly brook]

Strength flask is a million times better

[sick sentinel]

whats the logic behind never stam flask

[chilly brook]

Stam flask really has no place

It's useless

[jagged pier]

STR >>>>>>>>>>>>> stam

[undone sun]

you are very likely to not get one shot

[chilly brook]

You would only ever need it for avoiding one shots

But that's unlikely

[undone sun]

therefore needing to stack stam is useless

[chilly brook]

If you're getting one shot it likely wont make the difference

Strength is both a damage increase and a survival increase

Stam does basically nothing for you

[warm blaze]

gotcha ty guys

[valid scaffold]

i did not play prot war in BFA, why is the thunderclap build soo bad now compare to the BFA version?

[bright hornet]

do i decide to use IP on individual pulls that are heavy magic damage and thats it?

[civic rover]

because you can't hit it every other gcd anymore

[bright hornet]

or are there other reasons to use IP

[low kindle]

can't have bolster and AM at the same time anymore now

[chilly brook]

Several reasons, not the least of which being less rage generated and Tclap just doesnt do a lot of damage anymore

Revenge is now the big boi damage

[jagged pier]

demo shout and LS arent on AM anymore

[chilly brook]

https://tenor.com/view/drd-dr-disrespect-neck-v-warcry-scream-gif-16576120

Everytime I shout in keys

[cinder nova]

Think I should Bolster for H Generals? 🤔

[jagged pier]

yes