They took out the one interaction we had in raid
#protection
fringe marten
You know why too...they made reflect a lot more easily trackable/identifiable in combat log which is why details now sees it.
fringe marten
Even with the small'er pool of things we can fully reflect, when we can reflect..if anyone looks at details during that fight I always hear "wait..WTF is that?"
Pretty much every spires run, with the stun+reflect on the 5 pack of the wyrms.
Or boss at end of ToP
uneven mason
SR on the scyth
chilly brook
Still not sure why they removed the deflect on darkvein
uneven mason
๐ข memories of Argus
Because other tanks QQ'd
"Fun detected"
Warriors can single tank Lady! WAAAAAAAAAAA
fringe marten
I don't either matt, we got like 1? or 2? heroic kills in before they nerfed it
chilly brook
It wasn't even busted
fringe marten
Nope
chilly brook
Like if it applied the dot to the boss ok
But like
We did this on vectis in Uldir
uneven mason
yeah
chilly brook
No nerf
chilly brook
Then all of a sudden
uneven mason
There was only like 12 of us in Uldir
fringe marten
But yes, it means you could solo tank her, using the ability to time it to drop off stacks..which is what I was doing (but we were still duo tanking just? 'cause normalized strat)
signal plover
Negating the stacks on vectis didn't eliminate the other tank from the fight iirc
fringe marten
You can also dink the cast from the ..? prideful add in that fight too...wtf that does, I think it makes you weaker to the stuff she casts? or it casts? I dunno
spare oracle
is warr th only tank with cool mechanics like this?
fringe marten
The debuff carapace did is very similarly timed to lardy darkveins...IE we could do the same thing; time it so you can dump stacks or delay their application.
signal plover
Yep
fringe marten
No warrior is the one with really specific abilities that have small windows of execution where you have to be more surgical with it. Other tanks have dumb shit that you can build entire raid strats around...spell warding, amz..etc.
signal plover
I think mythic carapace is one of my favorite fights tuning-wise in BFA
lavish oracle
and somehow reflect is the one that always gets nerfed ๐
signal plover
Yeah spell reflect usually helps the warrior, other tanks usually help the raid kek
spare oracle
so we have hard shit to use and it doesnt do anything special lol
fringe marten
The..? bird in legion...well? spider bird in Emerald Nightmare; our fight was built around the assumption of a paladin tank with spellwarding.
No it does special shit..for us.
lavish oracle
Ours is on a shorter CD, which is probably why it always gets the most attention
uneven mason
Ours is on a shorter CD, which is probably why it always gets the most attention
It gets the most attention because a warrior has it
signal plover
Having a reflectable ability in a raid encounter is always risky
Imo they've done a decent job this time around
uneven mason
When warriors are strong we tend to become the overwhelmingly most popular class.
signal plover
Since dps warriors get reflect now as well
fringe marten
Warriors do fuck all for anyone else except rally cry and it's why we don't have the tools to be a cool PVP tank like paladorks.
lavish oracle
there are some reflectable tanks mechanics in dungeons that I wish would do damage back to the boss
fringe marten
(we have battle shout too but a dps warrior can bring that a well)
signal plover
Reflect balls on Hungering, traps on artificer
lavish oracle
but otherwise, it's still pretty strong
fringe marten
What warriors had was the best mitigation in game for physical strikes; and we could keep it up nearly 100% of the time which is half the reason warrior was so popular in keys in bfa. We still have that very strong physical hit mitigation but there's gaps in that uptime now.
uneven mason
What warriors had was the best mitigation in game for physical strikes; and we ...
I stopped playing in 8.1.5 before we had 100% uptime.
but had 100% of the DPS
lavish oracle
Yeah, we're harder execution than most tanks for at best similar payoffs, which is why it's an unpopular spec atm
fringe marten
We also had being the highest damage tank (aoe wise) which makes sense because we bring not quite as much utility as some of the other tanks. But now that's gone...and hoppy batwing boys with better tools do more damage too...and so do paladins.
spare oracle
comparedto like monk?
uneven mason
IDK I see plenty of prot warriors
signal plover
Execute obv
lavish oracle
from playing a bunch of the tanks?
uneven mason
its nothing like the desert that 8.0 was, where I literally managed to get on the front page of raider.io for protection warriors
fringe marten
Not doing tough content. Often times in groups I hear "oh you're the first prot warrior I've seen doing keys this season"
undone jacinth
tru
lavish oracle
Like, I play 4 of the tanks, prot's resource management is way harder than the rest, lol
uneven mason
yeah, we're proactive
undone jacinth
what tanks do u play
uneven mason
rather than reactive.
lavish oracle
Bear, DH, Pally, War
spare oracle
which would you say is hardest
undone jacinth
and u find maintaining shield block and casting IP when u need it more complex than them
?
undone jacinth
harder to execute then
fringe marten
Not that they're great...but as a comparative you can run around as a bear, hit literally everything around you constantly, not have to worry NEARLY as much about keeping things in a cone in front of you and generally mitigate a lot more damage with less work. You have to work so much harder for it as a prot war.
undone jacinth
using ur words
lavish oracle
certainly more punishing of mistakes
undone jacinth
and ur mistakes are what
uneven mason
harder to execute then
The other tanks can screw up, and press a button and heal that mistake away
spare oracle
isnt bear pretty boring though?
lavish oracle
Not having mitigation when you need it
uneven mason
or in the case of BrM, continue watching netflix while their healers hela that mistake away
fringe marten
Same thing in raid, my bear cotank has to do SO LITTLE to be as or more durable than I am, and on demand he can be much more durable for a bit.
lavish oracle
You basically have 100% uptime on Ironfur, you have so many CDs to roll through if you ever somehow fuck that up, and frenzied regen
undone jacinth
ironfur is nothing lol
fringe marten
But yes, playing prot warrior is higher APM than other tanks.
lavish oracle
look I main warrior, I'm not saying it's hard
undone jacinth
what do u mean higher apm
lavish oracle
what even is your point here, dolphin?
undone jacinth
how can u have differing apms when you are gcd locked
unless u have tons of off gcd
which u dont
fringe marten
Not every tank is, or has to be...any 'good' tank is casting something all the time but we absolutely have to, and non stop.
undone jacinth
"any 'good' tank is casting something all the time" this is all u need
uneven mason
ironfur is nothing lol
until it stacks 3x
bears also have bonus healing
๐คทโโ๏ธ
lavish oracle
Yeah
fringe marten
bears also have the tether effect from spear (and theirs is better) which we had to get from Blueman group...as an actual class ability.
undone jacinth
it costs 40 rage on a spec that doesnt get as much rage
lavish oracle
You can easily have like 2-3 stacks up at all times with NOW
And then spike to 6-8 during convoke or incarn
fringe marten
We went to james cameron's greekworld and borrowed a cool spear ability...they got it in legion for freebies.
lavish oracle
Yes
signal plover
Yeah but kleia smiled at me once so
undone jacinth
and demo every however long
u press demo like u press bark
u press wall like u press incarn
u press ip/block like u press fur
u shield slam like u mangle
u clap like u thrash
u revenge like u swipe
undone jacinth
warrs get a bit more in their active in exchange for crap healing, but thats just class balance not ease of execution
enraged regen is still dog and stuck on gcd
signal plover
What's your point?
signal plover
Because it doesn't matter tbh
undone jacinth
right then keep ur sarcasm to urself then
lavish oracle
It's significantly less forgiving of execution mistakes
you're nitpicking to make a really stupid point, tbh
mighty valley
Pulling is harder than, say, paladins or brews
signal plover
right then keep ur sarcasm to urself then
Nah
undone jacinth
pulling?
lavish oracle
you're making a semantic argument to deflect the actual point which is that if you make a mistake on warrior you have no tools with which to easily recover
like, you overspend your mitigations 2 pulls ago and now you don't have any CDs or shield block charges?
You're dead in the water for 30 seconds
mighty valley
yeah, getting aggro on a spread pack takes a lot more buttons for warrior
undone jacinth
yeah 2 pulls ago
mighty valley
vs. one press of shield
undone jacinth
im sure u have no shield block charges
if only there were down time
at any point
lavish oracle
Other tanks don't have to think about that shit at all, is what I'm saying
DH actually does a bit
but they always have great self-healing to back them up
undone jacinth
other tanks like pala and dk have to worry about getting 1 shot on every pack
lavish oracle
That's just because their class is made of paper, lol
undone jacinth
yet somehow its easier to execute
lavish oracle
yes?
chilly brook
yeah, getting aggro on a spread pack takes a lot more buttons for warrior
There aren't too many spread packs to worry about
lavish oracle
that's a balancing issue
chilly brook
Most of the ones that exist you can charge the proper mob and they all come to you anyways
mighty valley
spires and other side are the main ones I'm thinking of
chilly brook
other tanks like pala and dk have to worry about getting 1 shot on every pack
Eh part of that is blood is sitting in the past
Their design doesnt mesh with current wow
uneven mason
ravager yes, clap is about as much aggro as a wet paper bag nowadays
uneven mason
Its just diff styles at this point
chilly brook
spires and other side are the main ones I'm thinking of
In spires if you charge the right mob they basically all come to you or it's a simple 2 step drag
lavish oracle
DK is the one tank I don't play so /shrug
chilly brook
And in DOS all the casters are stacked on themselves
uneven mason
we have no error recovery, we act before our damage happens, the other tanks, can recover if they screw up was the main point.
vocal bison
As someone that has every tank, warriors played faceroll are safer than a DK and DH and Pally - especially this expansion with all the baseline buffs like vanguard, but has the highest skillcap to get maximum optimization, doesn't really feel close tbh.
mighty valley
In spires if you charge the right mob they basically all come to you or it's a s...
yeah, i'm just saying that's already too long for your pug DH who's already eyebeaming lmao
undone jacinth
we have no error recovery because our up front tools are much stronger
undone jacinth
u cant use every weakness to justify difficulty
uneven mason
this doesn't really make us harder
undone jacinth
because dks have more weaknesses than any1
uneven mason
just executed differently
undone jacinth
so they will be automatically the hardest
signal plover
The usual point in here isn't that warrior is harder to execute it's that it's more punishing on mistakes
chilly brook
yeah, i'm just saying that's already too long for your pug DH who's already eyeb...
Oh rarely lose aggro tbh
uneven mason
I'm not trying to justify the point, warriors are head and shoulders stronger than they were in BFA 8.0
chilly brook
uneven mason
and we're <redacted> now
lavish oracle
I don't think we are stronger than we were in BFA 8.0
signal plover
Our dmg isn't
chilly brook
Defensively we are
uneven mason
not DPS wise, but we're a world away from base mitigation
lavish oracle
but I think part of that is just because all tanks are weaker than their BFA counterparts across the board
uneven mason
in 8.0 if you sneezed you died
it was very focus intensive to keep prot at peak mitigation
in 8.0
fringe marten
Griff that was true for a while.
fringe marten
Or on the fort weeks where ? Queen Patla? the chick with the raptor pet in the 4 kings room..would wreck you
For the first half ? or so of BFA
we couldn't block ranged autos
signal plover
Pew pew shooty shooty
fringe marten
like throw wrench, shoot, etc.
uneven mason
I remember that
signal plover
Because it's not like shields were made to keep ranged projectiles from hitting you or anything
fringe marten
So yeah..throw rock? was it? in the jail cells in the prison dungeon.
fringe marten
Yeah, and they were lasering our faces off.
signal plover
I'm just glad they changed that before m jaina
lavish oracle
being able to block ranged was literally our biggest defensive buff in BFA
that shit was so cancerous
nimble drift
just got the haste ring from ToP
fringe marten
And then blizzard added ranged autos to blockables, and I couldn't wait to hit that 4 kings room...but shade of? dazar or whatever was still a demon.
nimble drift
feels great
uneven mason
yes throw rock, wrecked me on those keys
lavish oracle
having to do crazy los strats for every ranged mob was tiring, to say the least
uneven mason
And then blizzard added ranged autos to blockables, and I couldn't wait to hit t...
shade of zul?
fringe marten
zul! thank you
fringe marten
whatever..I just hated him LOL. I never remember the exact names most of the time, just "the shade before the final boss, please pray..and use all the cd's"
uneven mason
never tuned it
chilly brook
He's kidding
I wasn't, shoot shoot and throw rock/throw wrench was actually scary in 8.0 cuz we didnt have projectile block yet
uneven mason
๐
lavish oracle
I think it was during beta
uneven mason
yeah they changed it
I was always in a cloud of rage during beta
because of the state prot was in
fringe marten
Dude..like? what do you do? You CAN move him, if you have aggro and run super far he'll follow you
chilly brook
Before they nerfed our passive rage gen
uneven mason
Literally that was the tactic
chilly brook
uneven mason
you burned CDs to get aggro and then heroic leapt and kept running
and running
and running
fringe marten
But 2 of shade of zul? I guess you just get to that and say "ok look we had 5 mins left, so we WOULD have timed this, good job guys."
uneven mason
you high five and burn the key
lavish oracle
tbh that was kinda the high key strat for him anyways, lmao @uneven mason
fringe marten
You mean the test runs for shadowlands all keys running?
chilly brook
Now you'll have the same problem in high fort ToP keys when you do the one mini boss that does a ton of aoe damage
uneven mason
without the 780% Threat bonus
You mean the unblockable AE physical damage?
or the shadow blob thing
fringe marten
I'm not doing them but I know there's prots doing 17's, 18's+ ?? What is that? "heroic Leap in..block/clap/revenge/shockwave..intervene out: OK keep that misdirect running...BYYYyyyyee..."
uneven mason
Eh
more CCs, target control, and yes, kiting
you can tank an aweful lot
between healer CDs and your CDs
we can brick up
lavish oracle
again, we're still pretty tanky against physical damage
fringe marten
(yes I know it's more, and you can facetank for like a few seconds but still it's so ridiculous that tanking is NOT tanking for high competitive key pushers)
uneven mason
Some of it comes down to the fact that these pushers ( watch some streams for actual teams) do insane damage
which most pugs will not be capable of.
damage is a strong point in M+ if the mobs die within 10seconds you'll have them stunned for like 6 of that.
chilly brook
or the shadow blob thing
I think it does a Roar or something that just hits your whole party cant be stopped or anything
uneven mason
yeah
fringe marten
Oh of course; you don't 'tank down' keys (or any real challenging content) you just live long enough through cd's and defensive management to let DPS go mongo and blow it up
uneven mason
Unless you're VDH
chilly brook
Huge heal check tbh
uneven mason
in which case you meta
and are god for that duration
then leap out
with brand spreading
and decree
๐
someone got all the good presents for CHristmas
I swear.
chilly brook
I still miss BFA DH tbh
chilly brook
Call me weird but popping into and out of meta was way cooler
uneven mason
demonic
chilly brook
DH from VoP onward
fringe marten
I'd agree...that's the class fantasy though.
chilly brook
Demonic is nice but I think worse
uneven mason
it is
almost everything in SL is worse than the equiv in BFA
"Anger Management"
they could've just left it at nerfing Bolster
but nerfing AM and putting bolster on the same tier as it
bastards.
fringe marten
That's the odd thing for warrior, what is our fantasy? charge/leap/face smash into mob...'rawwwrrrr' until it's all dead? (yes for me)
uneven mason
Yes, we're screaming cannonballs
fringe marten
What would make that better? avatar grows a huge beard, and you scream non stop about blood and thunder?
uneven mason
No beard thanks
fringe marten
We don't have a cool "I'm gonna emo my soul into my demon self..then play BAT COUNTRY for 200th time on the radio!"
rich ember
I still miss BFA DH tbh
You mean twilight dev machine?
crisp dragon
How much damage does it take to break Intimidating shout?
fringe marten
Actually, 100% legit would fulfill prot warrior fantasy. No cooldown on charge or heroic leap. (I know you could break the game and pvp and all kinds of other shit, but ..DUDE)
Very little siin, but I prefer it that way. Are you trying to use the conduit to increase damage taken before breaking?
crisp dragon
I just got the 226 conduit
chilly brook
You mean twilight dev machine?
That was only 8.3
crisp dragon
I was wondering if it was effective at all this week with Necrotic
chilly brook
And tbh I'm talking more about meta uptime and i found the popping in and out of meta far more interesting than press a button for it
Imo gluttony should have remained
Just baseline
Instead of a talent
fringe marten
The use for intim shout is honestly MOST of the time; another spell interrupt. You want it to break right away so the pack DOESN'T run away. You could use it as a legit CC for a few seconds..or to maybe run away IF everyone stopped dps'ing?
crisp dragon
I dont have any of these abilities you are talking about, are you sure you're talking in the right channel? thinking
fringe marten
(griff has been on about his DH for a bit...so if you're reading that he's talking about demon hunter crap)
uneven mason
I'm not mad, I'm just disappointed.
fringe marten
Siin as far as using a 'cc' to get away and clear necrotic your best bet is to shockwave and run, or intervene to a healer/ranged dps behind you or away from mobs. (mouseover intervene macro clutch for this) or leap away.
mellow patio
Running? Grats bro nice exercise
uneven mason
I remember when Sense played their DK in the MDI and the world ended in #protection
chilly brook
mellow patio
I prefer to walk my errands
fringe marten
But remember the shockwave n' run move is limp if there's an inspiring mob in the pack.
Blow up the yellow guy~ (most of the time, sometimes you have to cc it out)
fringe marten
Remember the yellow guy is stunnable so you too can prevent forest fires by Stormbolting that chump; and getting the other stuff to run away...and then someone else cc's it.
though it will lower the duration of their cc
uneven mason
had to remind a hunter that they had tranq shot
when I was getting mauled by the big uglies in NW
"Pug life"
chilly brook
@mellow patio now I got me some Costco za
lavish oracle
I really like demonic on DH
Kinda gets at that popping in and out of demon form thing you were getting at
amber herald
does demo shout affect blood barrier on hakkar?
or does the DR have to be on yourself?
chilly brook
Wdym
fringe marten
Dr reduces the damage a thing does to you..you are the source of the cast. it must be ON hakkar, to reduce the damage to YOU
You 'debuff' the target
you don't buff yourself with 20% dr, that would be Iron Bark
chilly brook
It's a dr not a healing debuff
fringe marten
No but hakkars bloodshield builds based on how much damage it does, to all targets
including his little hakkar brosnakes
Which is why you gotta' dumpster them or gets gigashield.
So if you reduce how much damage hakkar hits you for, you will reduce the shield by a SMALL amount. It's all about the aggregate of how many targets for how much damage he did..IE EVERYONE needs to mitigate it to make a real dent in it.
fringe marten
Now that is a healing reduction..and his bloodshield builds on the damage it does? uhh
Maybe a disc priest or shadow priest ability might interact the same way? (would be folly to assume it's identical though)
sweet summit
MS should not affect it
fringe marten
I would..think? not? If the spell works exactly as description
yeah that's what I'm thinking erga
I just read it in journal..Does 3600 shadow damage, forming protective barrier immune to interrupt, based on damage to all targets..can hit brosnakes.
turbid cargo
it's probably treated as a drain like vit conduit not a heal (or like neither since it's a drain -> absorb)
fringe marten
So the calculation should be "Do X damage, Build Y shield" heal reduction shouldn't factor in.
But you'd have to science it to know.
safe quarry
whats best conduit for prot
fringe marten
It's like the only ability where if he gets a big shield I'm like "OH OH OH Time for shattering throw...between these blood pools..fkn..move..damnit..got it!"
sweet summit
whats best conduit for prot
Endurance? Potency? Finesse?
lilac sleet
What is your preferred healer in M+ (10+ keys)........I feel that I've had the most success with a resto shaman but would like to hear from others
ionic fern
safe quarry
Endurance? Potency? Finesse?
sorry but I found it ty
fringe marten
In M+ all healers are good dependant upon the player. If player skill is equalized SUPPOSEDLY the hierarchy is Shaman..druid...Other peoples~
fringe marten
Hpal can cure deezeez
mellow patio
That is all
fringe marten
MW is strong man
their raw HPS throughput is awesome
as in like "I have 10 bear bleeds...whatevs~"
mellow patio
they can only heal you through half the pull cause theyโll chew through their mana so fast lmao
Exaggerating but you get it
fringe marten
But that just speaks more to the point; they're all great if played well simple as that. Each has a cure that'll be clutch somewhere, and some niche abilities that are great everywhere.
Honestly I don't research other peoples classes too much since I don't pvp, so I still find out about shit that makes me think "Why don't other people do that..??" like the guy in Mists of tirna scithe you probably sap/invis passed/whatever to skip the pack before the wall with shrooms behind it
I didn't think we had a cc for it and priest was like "oh I'll mind soothe it.."
"WTF Is mind soothe?"
"!!!"
fringe marten
Right, I get that..almost all cc is limited to a creature category of some sort.
But the point is No other priest ever went "oh maybe I can mind so..naw it's not a humanoid.." anywhere else..ever.
and then the "..who are these people I'm playing with.." question creeps into your brain.
lilac sleet
can mind soothe before 3rd boss in SoA at the top of stairs also
eternal musk
48 more for what matt ๐
warm warren
does shield block only mitigate physical damage?
fringe marten
Deep yes and no. There are a LOT of blockable abilities that seem like spells/etc
But as a general rule of thumb, all auto attacks INCLUDING ranged auto attacks. and then you need to learn the other specific abilities that are blockable spell type abilities.
warm warren
i c thanks
fringe marten
But the big addition in late bfa was the ability to block ranged autos and abities that included 'shoot' 'throw' etc. If you just started warrior in SL you wouldn't realize how terrifying that stuff is without the ability to block it.
fringe marten
BFA is now a mash of time in my brain where there was? SOMETHING before azshara tier? some boats..? Then corrupted gear shattered the game
and..'visions of nzoth' ...omfg..
Shadowlands will be the same thing
"yeah there was like..this vampire fratboy sword? and then we flew up to the ziggurat of the necropolis of ogres above maldraxxas...and then we fought this ripped jailhouse guy with a hole in his chest.."
Everything before tier sets will be forgotten.
"Did the vampires have the tier1?" "no that was the undead necropolis ogres, then the MawRaid had the tier 2"
You think the next dungeon will be in the maw, or above maldraxxas? (aside from twisting corridors of torghast)
ebon hound
People running AM to get Shield Wall on every other Rip Soul for Mythic Huntsman?
fringe marten
Helya is making a comeback, we fight her somewhere. Not sure if raid or dungeon.
You could pan; but don't need it. Ask for external if you want and spell reflect it. Mythic huntsman is all really on the people managing sin seeker.
undone jacinth
the boat we were on in maw of souls 1 is sailing through that soul river in the maw
fringe marten
? really
never noticed; where?
Also uhh...WTF happened to denathrius' castle? Is that vortex going to the maw, or the void...?
fringe marten
That's what I thought but both Sire Denny and the Gaoler speak of 'serving death..' like it's a person, entity.. not the concept of it.
Right, those not using azeroth auto pilot saw the cinematic~ lol
So, Sire Denden isn't collecting anima for the jailer...I don't think? unless it explicitly says so? They're both doing whatever they're doing for "death"
Who is either the final big bad of this expac, or the next.
lavish oracle
I mean maybe there's a bigger void involved meta plot but if there is it hasn't been directly referenced yet
Yeah, revendreth is supplying the jailer with anima and artificially creating an anima draught
Drought?
fringe marten
Draught
? I thought?
no wait..Draught is 'draft'
Drought is shortage of substance
lavish oracle
Ye, always get the spellings confused
fringe marten
Yeah; Draught is the old english 'draft' where draft beer comes from..etc. (Draught of souls trinket.. everyone always said 'drot" ..)
But jailer is doing it for 'death' so he says? so..? At some point the drow archer from DOTA will double cross him. And we will round house the jailer in the kneecaps...and then slap Bluegirl group on the wrist..
lavish oracle
Ye, I'm familiar with both words, just mix up the spellings sometimes ๐
fringe marten
(I know you are, was basically remember everyone in my guild butchering the trinkets name every time they spoke of it.)
lavish oracle
I mean, 'at the hour of her third death, she ushers our coming still hasn't happened yet
fringe marten
Just like Gaol is the old english "jail' and they criminally underused it in this xpac.
I just hope the mythic jailer fight ends at 10% hp, then Illidan startrek teleports in from the USS JailShip he's on and says "you were not prepared" and deletes the jailer and then summons Sargeras and we finally get to fight him legit...and he's weakened because GaolEssence.
lavish oracle
I think there's like a 0% chance they don't bust out illi again next expansion
Or at least the one after next
fringe marten
Oh it's comin' back
like..100%
Yeah he's their "I TOLD YA'LL THIS IS SRS" macguffin.
(you guys ever been in maldraxxas when the necropolis flies over? it's so cool)
it's like absorbing all the souls from the dead on the ground.
lavish oracle
Like all the tanks play Kyrian so no :c
lavish oracle
My druid gets to be night far, tho
pseudo raptor
I have seen it. I am necrolord cause I like to be difficult and less than good.
fringe marten
I'm broke AF in game
lavish oracle
Oooh, thought you were asking if I've ever been inside the necropolis
fringe marten
Can horde go there like they could in legion? or is that going to be a dungeon/raid?
lavish oracle
What, the necropolis?
fringe marten
MAN...WTF all we get is startrek pads.
They get a life absorbing Necrodome..
SO EDGY..jealous.
I would be less jealous if the blue lightning buff lasted for like..an hour..
it should. No it should be permanent.
chilly brook
@hallow phoenix Can I bother you regarding ToP?
hallow phoenix
sure but i cant log in atm
game kicked me out in oribos and now i cant log back in
๐ฆ
fringe marten
For putting up with these melancholy blue assholes, we should become the flash..perma.
chilly brook
So
If you're setting up prideful for the Mord
Do you skip both packs?
Or just one
hallow phoenix
at the very start of dungo?
chilly brook
ye
tropic smelt
How does prot do in mythic+ atm?
hallow phoenix
Then I go clear the first room in abom wing, then head to lich area. For portals go right then left
Then clear lich boss -> abom wing -> war wing
chilly brook
How does prot do in mythic+ atm?
Seems great to me
Aight that helps a lot
Got a 13 ToP that I'd like to turn into a 14
fringe marten
earlier in the week I did ToP 14, I was expecting it to be harder than it was.
undone jacinth
prot warr is perfect for last boss
lavish oracle
I've seen groups skip both
undone jacinth
its so much easier on prot than my bear or whatever
lavish oracle
The reflect helps a lot
undone jacinth
the reflect is insane
lavish oracle
being able to stop it from hitting during some really terrible overlaps is huuuuge
fringe marten
Yeah it was just..? eh? like the one spot with all the jumping disease assholes is bleh, but that's literally about it. I thought necrotic was going to be WAY worse on the first boss, it wasn't.
lavish oracle
wasn't too bad with phials
fringe marten
Well due to necrotic, my group just focused the melee guy (normally not a good idea) but they were just kicking most casts and ? np
lavish oracle
I reset on 20 stacks and then he died before I hit 10 again but this was on like an 11 so mileage may vary
more sophisticated strats may be needed for higher keys
or wait, we talking about the stitchwork boss or something else?
fringe marten
I get to be a derp..I just go "ohh damn..38 sta "Fireblood"" facetank continues..
undone jacinth
first trio boss
fringe marten
first trio.
lavish oracle
oh, we blew up the melee
fringe marten
"WHA 32 stack again..packs still half alive...Phial.."
undone jacinth
if u get the guy low he fixates
and u just get the reset
then dispel
its actually a girl
but w/e
sullen drift
is there any soft cap in haste?
fringe marten
You're 100% right, but just for me personally since I'm crutching on Fireblood so hard, I don't know what it's like not to have necro cure since BFA, now with 2 it's dumb. I legit ignore necrotic as an affix, sometimes I pay for it not realizing both are on CD.
It's like DK's going "what do you mean line of sight the caster packs..?"
undone jacinth
oh ur dwarf as well
ok then doesnt count for u
i try not to use phial if i can avoid it because the cd is so rotten
and i like it for the downstairs packs
lavish oracle
Anyone having trouble logging in atm?
fringe marten
Yeah, but I have a 2 min crutch.
..or a demon hunter "Don't the caster mobs just follow you into the pull after you sigil of silence them..???"
chilly brook
game finally decided to give me the rest of the catchup today
fringe marten
"No I have to go behind a wall, then peek out to try and put shots on guy trying to diffuse the bomb.."
solar spear
lavish oracle
Oh, yeah, just got a little bnet banner on my launcher
seems like I can log in now, though
undone jacinth
feel like that message has been on my launcher for the last 2 years
nimble drift
@chilly brook how long did that take
pallid ermine
Hey everybody, anyone know if there is a wa that shows somehow what spells are reflectable?
sturdy sable
There's a spread sheet in pins
pallid ermine
I did view that which helps alot
sturdy sable
I'd just learn the big ones
pallid ermine
Agreed
sturdy sable
Like scythe in top
As I do not think someone is working on a WA for that but if you find one lmk
pallid ermine
for sure
pallid ermine
ikr
chilly brook
<@!133532617940140032> how long did that take
caught up from 1 to all the way in 1 week
lilac sleet
the reflect is insane
what are you reflecting on last boss?
undone jacinth
scythe
spare cobalt
Barb from hakkar too
undone jacinth
indeed
spare cobalt
Thereโs a lot of half and halfs
fierce tendon
should i just spell reflect on any boss defensive in case lmfao
undone jacinth
around half of overall boss spells are reflect or deflectable
and a big majority of the trash spells
although for some reason patty cake in mists is not reflectable, which I repeatedly forget
spare cobalt
You can reflect the explosion dot from Sd third boss
Helps your healer a lot too
Idk if it does dam back I never actually go through my meters for it
undone jacinth
dont think it does
lilac sleet
infectious rain on last boss in PF?
astral crystal
nope
spare cobalt
It stops a few stacks though
spare oracle
hey on spire are you able to tank the right two mobs together right before last boss?
cinder nova
I wanna peel my face off.
The DH in my +9 Mists just keeps getting frozen.
He's so fucking stupid it hurts.
And after he's wiped us enough that the key is basically dead he says, "My bad - now that the key is done I'll focus."
Do you not focus when the key isn't depleted???*
Like
pseudo raptor
Sounds like a DH. Surprised he didnโt rage quit yet.
pseudo raptor
Hah.
cinder nova
I just alf-f4'd. Not worth the headache.
My fucking god people are so stupid.
Oh, I also had a BM hunter that didn't Hysteria on the first boss.
So no binding shot, no lust
Like
WHY.
gloomy sundial
Do you guys think it'll be worth running Unstoppable Force starting next week over Ravager once we get our 2nd Potency Conduit for Pelagos and can run Show of Force?
fossil summit
so Im watching Sense Nurfed's Prot Warrior VODs and I noticed this
this kinda orange whirlwind
is that a covenant effect? Is he not Kyrian?
fossil summit
OH right, why is he using that? It's a +15 HoA, I thought Unstoppable Force was BiE
BiS
tho I use Thunderlord so maybe Unstopable Force is better for me
gloomy sundial
Afaik the general consensus is that Ravager is currently better.
fossil summit
even if I use Thunderlord?
gloomy sundial
I don't think so, I use The Wall, though.
fossil summit
I'll stay with Unst. Force for now because it does Synergize well with my chosen legendary
undone jacinth
Ravager is better regardless
clap is weak sauce and you have enough rage to spam revenge a good amount
hybrid kestrel
I thought you were supposed to use thunderlord with unstoppable Force
undone jacinth
nope
hybrid kestrel
Hm
undone jacinth
although that does seem to be the message most people have
hybrid kestrel
Yeah well I mean a 50% cooldown reduction on the ability that helps you reduce your demo cooldown
Seems big
Where'd you hear otherwise
gloomy sundial
Only when Avatar is active tho.
hybrid kestrel
Omfg
How did I miss that
Maybe I need to redo reading comprehension
Jesus Christ
gloomy sundial
It's fine, we're all low Intellect here.
hybrid kestrel
Lol
undone jacinth
even if it were outside or avatar Iโm not sure if itโs better
gloomy sundial
It'd be a 2s CD if it was outside, I'd say that might make it worth.
hybrid kestrel
So what talents do you guys use?
hybrid kestrel
Do you use different talents during raid
undone jacinth
then bolster for hard content am for the rest
undone jacinth
they just arenโt updated is all
hybrid kestrel
Where do you guys go for your info then?
undone jacinth
they still have true info in them for the most part
from playing
and logs and maths
gloomy sundial
Deva > SB > BV > CT or BS > Indom > Ravager or ITF > Bolster or AM for M+
Deva > DT > BV > BS > Indom > Ravager or ITF > Bolster or AM for Raids
undone jacinth
just use ravager one time and u will notice immediately
hybrid kestrel
Yeah I guess I should
gloomy sundial
I use The Wall so UF is completely useless for me either way.
hybrid kestrel
I have both the wall and thunderlord
gloomy sundial
With Thunderlord it might be useful but even then I like Ravager more cause it goes brrrr
undone jacinth
doesnโt matter what Lego
undone jacinth
that is fine but it doesnโt matter that much
hybrid kestrel
Hm ok
undone jacinth
Iโm using signet rn
gloomy sundial
Having Shield Wall up every other pull is pretty sweet in M+ imho so I just use The Wall in both.
hybrid kestrel
Are you guys all kyrian?
gloomy sundial
I am, yeah.
hybrid kestrel
I went night fae and I really wonder if I should switch
undone jacinth
lol no
gloomy sundial
It's pretty great on Necro weeks especially.
undone jacinth
thereโs not enough balance issues for anything Prot based to be changed even if there was one
phial is ok but donโt think itโs gonna dramatically change ur life
my bear is slow af and isnโt kyrian but manages necro fine still
chilly brook
Btw
Wracking Pain definitely doesn't get reflected
Still get the debuff
And doesn't do damage
undone jacinth
Necro warrior needs to be changed for sure but thatโs like 4 months away
wild hollow
The sexy blue ladies aren't convincing enough?
Who needs blue ladies when you have half fawn ladies
hybrid kestrel
Kyrian look dumb af ino
Basically a shitty version of the warrior class hall from legion
Lol
fossil valley
should I wait for Hecutis to get X stacks before moving him?
I winged it first time yday and just kept him moving steady pace excdpt during sinseeker
hybrid kestrel
From my understanding you should try to keep him at 1 unless the raid is low
cinder roost
Xandria is badass though, I want that mass grip spear
hybrid kestrel
We usually just drag hecutus in a circle around huntsman
fossil valley
ok nice thats kinda what I did lol
hybrid kestrel
Only time we stop dropping stacks is when the raid is under 5o% health
open monolith
What's our 2nd best potency conduit for tomorrow?
Is it the revenge makes tclap clap harder?
nova salmon
Is there a way to run nathria outside of some special day\time \group\ thing
I haven't done it yet and I'd like to
open monolith
LFR
tropic drum
looking for ragnaros you mean?
undone sun
lyric fossil
Anyone else having a hard time staying alive in the Time walking dungeons?
empty dirge
Yep!
lyric fossil
Its terrible ๐ฆ
chilly brook
I'm just having issues keeping my raid alive long enough to actually kill Denathrius...
undone jacinth
we wiped like 6 times in the boss and I died on every trash pack multiple times on the ramp the first time i was there lol
first boss
lyric fossil
I was dying on trash too I'm like WTF
undone jacinth
yup nightmare
lyric fossil
I'm just having issues keeping my raid alive long enough to actually kill Denath...
Rough
uncut zephyr
frost giant guy fucks, yeah
lyric fossil
What about high keys? Do you guys have any tips for those? ๐
chilly brook
What about high keys? Do you guys have any tips for those? ๐
how high?
lyric fossil
Well I'm still getting those up I the highest I've done is 7 and it was rough
lyric fossil
thank you
warm plinth
@chilly brook You're super cute
coarse kestrel
griff you finally recorded a key
near shard
Going to save that vid for later, good stuff
astral orbit
I got an imba route for SD
I can post the string if you want to check it
Timed a 13 with it today, I know itโs not that high but given the week it is + it was pugged, it went really well
chilly brook
<@!133532617940140032> You're super cute
you don't even know what I look like
agile holly
prot wars pretty good rn?
undone jacinth
yes
astral orbit
Here's a string for my route in SD
Prideful for every boss
Let me update it 1 sec
Why isn't it working lol
Message is too big lol damnit ๐ฆ
subtle pier
Just make a pastebin
astral orbit
So it becomes a file?
astral orbit
How do I do that
chilly brook
fix your ability bar overlapping on your play frame rage bar
It's not
warm plinth
@chilly brook I'd do you just based on the voice
fervent kestrel
Alright, help me out with understanding something here folks... why is warrior, with a nearly identical important part of the kit (the kiting) in M+ compared to DH, considered doodoo, while DH is considered top tier? Like, our kits are super similar for it. Kyrian Spear = Sigil of Chains, Heroic Leap = DH Jump, plus we also have charge and intervene
chilly brook
DH has sigils and higher aoe damage
fervent kestrel
DH has sigils and higher aoe damage
I feel like the only sigil that would make any sort of difference would be Sigil of Silence though, and the DPS difference isnโt extreme enough to put warriors in trash tier. I mean, weโre basically a DH with a bit less damage, but still ahead of other tanks for damage
chilly brook
we aren't trash tier
fringe estuary
is there a doc this tier that lists all spell reflectable abilties in dungeons/raid this tier?
chilly brook
astral orbit
Because DHs are overtuned, then kiting, they just double jump and dash away
On top of that they got perma 40% reduced damage taken on every pack
And their AOE+Metamorph
It's a Hero class prone to get nerfed
Just a matter of time before DH tanks are shit and Warrior tanks are on top
fervent kestrel
Iโm so tempted to play Brewmaster so I can just consistently decent the whole expansion Q_Q
chilly brook
play what you like
Warrior hasn't been a limiter for me
I'm like 952 io and the only thing that's stopping keys is people just being bad tbh
fierce tendon
god bless sun king trinket, just finished m shriekwing cuz it saved me in enrage lulw
spare oracle
is there such thing as too much haste?
fallow mortar
nope
spiral wave
How is the bargast trinket dmg transfered? And is it recorded in logs?
spare oracle
should i still use haste enchants and stuff?
fallow mortar
having vers and crit helps too. THe only thing you don't really need is mastery
fallow mortar
seems like good stats
maiden ravine
Am I mean if I expect faster than 4-5s response time from a resourceless brez class?
fallow mortar
any more context?
solar crown
I really hope DH gets tuned down in line with us. Warrior feels good and ive gotten positive feedback from the healers in all my pugs. We are not shit, DH is just very strong
open monolith
viscera of coalesced hatred: how do you guys feel about this trinket?
just got it at 203 and have no experience with it
spare oracle
yea my buddy told me i didnt feel hard to heal, which was nice to hear
open monolith
Hot Take: this week of M+ feels extremely easy
solar crown
Yupp. Ive heard most healers are frustrated with the current meta because so many shit tanks are now DH, and it can only carry them to a certain point before they need to know how to play
People who play prot are a stubborn bunch, but we know how to play our class :D
nimble drift
viscera of coalesced hatred: how do you guys feel about this trinket?
Psure it sucks dick
solar crown
:D they are paper if you try to facetank stuff
silver trout
I've had similar comments about the DH co-tank I roll with
sick sentinel
is anyone else getting nerco stacks off bosses
exotic spoke
You should get necrotic from bosses
chilly brook
Weekly 14 done
chilly brook
is anyone else getting nerco stacks off bosses
It always happens
All melees outside of the prideful mobs give necrotic
sick sentinel
i know that but bosses normally never gave u stacks in BFA
sweet summit
They did
sick sentinel
does anyone know how long it usually takes to phase the 3rd boss in spires and it goes in recharge mode
time wise
i know its 0 energy
quaint fjord
hello, i just got https://www.wowhead.com/item=179350/inscrutable-quantum-device?bonus=6805:1472 would you consider it as a tank ? (ILVL 207) instead of https://www.wowhead.com/item=184017/bargasts-leash?bonus=6805 (ILVL 213) i only do mythic but the only time i used this trinket on a ally he died so i stopped using it lol
snow hill
question: how much will i hate myself in a few weeks if i go necrolord with my prot warrior just for the transmog?
smoky wave
hello, i just got https://www.wowhead.com/item=179350/inscrutable-quantum-device...
You stopped using it because they died? I thought that's the whole point of owning it
quaint fjord
:D
hollow flax
whats everyone's opinions on using Heavy Repercussions w/ the Wall legendary, specifically in raiding?
jagged pier
bolsters still better
hollow flax
was considering that myself, found myself using last stand a lot and feeling like i was missing out lol
jagged pier
well bolster it stupid strong for raiding as it covers the sb downtime
hollow flax
i can get decently long chains of SB if my shield slam refresh procs are good though i suppose thats really rng based
jagged pier
well yer thats rng, where with bolster you can just let your charges refresh same with Sw
dont get me wrong HR isnt a bad talent but you just wouldnt pick it over the other 2
if you need to be more defensive bolster is just better for that
and if you want to do damage AM is just better
jolly thistle
HR is pretty good for some fights. e.g. I had 94% blocked hits on sludgefist
jagged pier
I mean sure but i would still run bolster then
like 2 sb charges get you to a stomp
LS gets you to a stomp
SW and a charge gets you to a stomp
so just rotating cds gets you through the fight
celest adder
Looking in FAQ but cant see what to put Thunderlord on Feet or Hands.
fringe marten
Anyone have a log, or screenshot..or remember pretty accurately how much Healing, overall in a Sanguine depths 10 or above their blood spattered scale healed them for? Not % but the actual number.
fringe marten
Just for some science I tossed on a 187 queensguard Vigil, and a 171 beating abomination core..and did a 10 sanguine depths for the test. They did ok healing, but man I lost a serious amount of damage. also Necrotic.. So trying to get some kind of baseline comparative. But I've used the scale heaps and I believe it had WAY more healing overall.
on CD pretty much or close to
I also have a 213 gluttonous spike but it's healing is meh
astral orbit
So basically my choice of thunderclap legendary boots is shit?
fringe marten
No why?
Most warriors who use that leggo made the boots.
Or do you mean..Boots VS 'the wall' shoulders?
strong forum
So basically my choice of thunderclap legendary boots is shit?
Both gloves and boots have the same stats
So you can't really make a wrong decision
Most common choice is to craft them on boots
strong forum
Just for some science I tossed on a 187 queensguard Vigil, and a 171 beating abo...
I found both abom and Queensguard to be incredibly underwhelming once you do actual stuff
Whereas bloodscale can cover mitigation gaps or eat hard hitting stuff
Aka actually useful vs trickle healing every now and again that's totally rng
It's an on demand 20-50k absorb
jolly thistle
50k is that an ilvl 226? my 207 goes to ~32k
young glen
Would switching loot spec to fury before opening the great vault increase chances for both a 1 handed weapon and anima field emmiter?
Or is Single Minded Fury out of the loop in terms of GV
jagged pier
its not out of the loop
strong forum
50k is that an ilvl 226? my 207 goes to ~32k
My 200 is sometimes 40k so idk chief
jagged pier
but the only thing it will do is increase the chance you get dps trinkets and 2 handers though
it wont affect 1 handers or trinkets in the loot table chance
strong forum
Would switching loot spec to fury before opening the great vault increase chance...
Yes you can get 1h and 2h as fury lootspec and avoid tank trinkets and shields
jagged pier
unless you need that juicy 2h for pvp
jagged pier
but emiiter and 1 handers are in out loot table so changing spec will not change the chance if anything will reduce as more wep chances
strong forum
And the chance of getting bloodscale is rather slim
sweet summit
But its there
young glen
I haven't seen bloodscale at all in this game
but I am also running m0 anima field emitter due to being unlucky as it seems
jagged pier
I still sometimes use my 171emitter
and i havent seen bloodscale
but i have sire trinket
so dont really want 2 on use anymore
strong forum
Got a 210 anime emitter and a 207 crit haste chest from my 4 weekly 14/15s this week as end of dungeon loot
jagged pier
lucky
strong forum
Starting to slowly get some ilvl
young glen
Just glad necrotic is ending tomorrow
strong forum
Was kind of a none issue tbh
But then again, I play with boomy and 2 shamans
Alot of hired guns to take some hits for me
jagged pier
tbh been dealing with nero for so long now i dont really notice it anymore
kleia made it even more a none issue
fresh epoch
does anyone have the route for plaguefall when u kill 2nd big add before first boss to get 20% or even have to kill a pack after first boss to reach 20% including the 2 big ones?
strong forum
I mean, you just kill all 3 or 4 shroom packs
And that should spawn prideful right after killing the 2nd big add
iirc
cinder nova
Officially a 812 io andy.
undone jacinth
does anyone have the route for plaguefall when u kill 2nd big add before first b...
Kill the big monster at the start with the first shroom pack, kill two more shroom packs, skip the last shroom pack by running past it then clear the boss room = done. You can get pride for every boss
cinder nova
...um
You can avoid the shrooms.
Just kill a roc before the opener, kill the wandering gaint.
Two hives on the left
Then clear as normal.
dark mountain
hives are so aids tho
dark mountain
maybe its just on bolstering then
obsidian moth
Hey
Does anyone know a good prot guide i need to see some things in detail cuz i have inner questions ๐
sweet summit
Check the icy veins guide. If you cant find the answer(s) there, feel free to ask here
jagged pier
Hey
Does anyone know a good prot guide i need to see some things in detail cuz i...
remeber a guide is a starting point its not a end all, so i might not answer the questions you have
undone jacinth
You can avoid the shrooms.
donโt need to though? my route there gives perfect count
strong forum
Ye avoiding shrooms seems like alot of effort for no gain imo
undone jacinth
one of the only fun to kill packs in the dungeon
not just chain casting or spamming slows on you etc
strong forum
Love me some blobs spamming diseases without stopping 
Or uninterupptable disease claws
Top tier Design
sweet summit
Fuck claws fuck claws fuck claws fuck claws
muted pendant
Iโm still running around with my 171 scale and saw someone in Oribos with a 220 scale. Thatโs more than 10k difference in absorb shield
Couldnโt see the dmg though cause the guy moved - whatโs the dmg of a 220 scale?
strong forum
Can check tooltips on wowhead
And move the ilvl slider to 220
Couldn't care less bout the dmg portion of scale tbh
I you want to go for dps you just don't play scale
undone jacinth
my m+ energy has actually dwindled for the first time this season
tyrannical is worse than ever imo
chilly brook
Idk if it's the tuning or if certain people really do be holding us back that hard
Tyrannical can definitely be aids
I wouldn't want to do some of these past 14 on tyrannical
Like moredretha
undone jacinth
sheโs not that hard
chilly brook
If you dont have SR she literally just claps you
You say that
But pugs are stupid
undone jacinth
my problems are more with bosses that kill all my party when I canโt do anything
she does sometimes but itโs dodgeable
chilly brook
Her physical portion of the hit isn't bad
But 26k spell hit component
Literally almost half my health in magic damage
undone jacinth
I mean as Prot u only ever need to get hit by scythe when ur not in danger from anything else
itโs kinda free
chilly brook
It's free damage if theres SR up
It does get a little hairy sometimes
Did it on both a 13 and a 14 today
undone jacinth
she doesnโt cast two scythes in a row with bad overlaps though so u always have reflect for the bad one
chilly brook
Sure if you dont just hit reflect all the time just to pump
Big dam
Theater still feels overtuned
undone jacinth
naw
chilly brook
Caster boss is nasty if you don't have two dispels
undone jacinth
itโs one of the best tuned dungeons imo
chilly brook
And it still has nasty overlaps that are kinda just unfair
proven grail
Leveling a hunter rn... it feels so bad. Ranged isn't fun but everything is just so easy.
chilly brook
I need a dps alt in case things go south
undone jacinth
I wouldn't call 50 dps really good dps
what trinket are u running thatโs giving u a lot more than that?
strong forum
Hymnal of the path does 100 dps
undone jacinth
and scale also does more than that
strong forum
Scale doesn't do more than 50dps unless you spam it literally on CD
Which defeats the defensive purpose of it
undone jacinth
thatโs such a blanket statement thereโs no point even responding lol
strong forum
It's factual
chilly brook
It is true
strong forum
blissful iris
just went from hunter dps to full time prot warrior for guild for M+ and raid .. and I feel like my plater just isn't the best for tanking .. any suggestions?
strong forum
Edit it until you think it's good?
Or what do you mean
Public profiles of plater?
blissful iris
just any popular tank plater profiles on wago to start with that is more tank focused that i could tweak
strong forum
Idk im using nnoggies, that thing is ๐ but not free afaik
Unless you twitch prime
muted pendant
I you want to go for dps you just don't play scale
I know that but the absorb with the aoe is great - I would always prefer this trinket over sireโs trinket
undone jacinth
yeah it does good damage
steep schooner
My guild wants me to run a prot off spec exclusively for m+ is it worth taking AM and UF over bolster rav?
chilly brook
Hunter, warlock, monk or rogue?
chilly brook
My guild wants me to run a prot off spec exclusively for m+ is it worth taking A...
Not really no
sweet summit
I recommend Bolster rav