one of the soulbinds allows you to do it while moving
#protection
hybrid sierra
maiden ravine
it's 4 seconds. Healers drink pretty dang often, we can leap to a pack faster than most dps can walk.
jagged pier
I mean its what like 4 or 5k or somthing as its 20% of our hp isnt that like smaller than an IP?
hybrid sierra
20% if no corpses
jagged pier
okay what is it with a corpse?
maiden ravine
With just a couple elite mobs in a dungeon it'll be 50%
hybrid sierra
up to 50%
jagged pier
still not worth imo
maiden ravine
I mean it's not as good as Kyrian spear currently, but who knows what will change
hybrid sierra
if banner gave rage, or increased rage gain might be really good
maiden ravine
perhaps they'll slap on base strength to the banner on top of the conduit, or extra crit, or affect more people
jagged pier
no it wouldnt as its still on a 3 min cd, compare to much shorted cd rage gens
hybrid sierra
well the rage gain, would help give glory faster
which would increase its own dmg
my only real idea on making it better
maiden ravine
in a vacuum, at least for the dps specs, a 3 min cd that increased strength by 28% and crit for 10% for 20s would be considered good, but it's just competing against other stuff
hybrid sierra
yea the 3 minute CD on it hurts it a ton
maiden ravine
it's pretty comparable to some other 3 min CDs in game which is likely where the initial CD came from
woven kiln
Banner sounds like it was designed for m+ by someone who hasn't do e much m+. Banner to help push group dps, shield at the start of boss fights. Problem is, the shield is a channelled ignore pain, which you can only use out of combat, and the banner amounts to a 1% crit boost over a fight die to low uptime. I think it would be cool if it boosted vers with a higher uptime, and if the shield was on-use, and a higher absorb that focused on magical damage.
It's such a shame because every fibre in my being wants to join the necrolord, but I cant justify it. Bad system.
maiden ravine
If you want to that badly, you can do it, unless you're a world first guild or planning on doing +25s
plus the strong possibility of a buff to it over the next few weeks
quaint crystal
Morning. Is prot warrior far behind prot paladin in m+? I mainly play m+, I just play with a friend of mine and we like to push keys, how much is choosing warrior going to hold us back? I enjoy playing both tanks but my heart is always with my warrior
maiden ravine
Warrior is a bit lower in damage, but I think tankier
quaint crystal
Is DH stjll the king in M+ at the minute?
maiden ravine
Tanks have been brought at lot closer I think.
quaint crystal
I guess I should just play what I want then. Don’t think it will matter for me in the end. I’m not world first raider etc thanks for the answers
maiden ravine
Playing the class you enjoy will lead to much higher chance of success if you play it well
woven kiln
If you want to that badly, you can do it, unless you're a world first guild or p...
My thing is mythic raiding, not top world, and m+ to the early 20s or so. I'm not top region or anything, such that I'd happily take the 2nd best option, but dead last by a large margin? I'd constantly be regretting it.
woven kiln
Morning. Is prot warrior far behind prot paladin in m+? I mainly play m+, I just...
The worst tank of SL is still like a B+. Everyone's sulky about prot because they've been nefred down from very overpowered. Switching your tank for m+ pushing will only be a factor when people are in the high 20s, imo.
maiden ravine
For the small % of people who do that type of content, sorry? System not fully designed around that level.
woven kiln
For the small % of people who do that type of content, sorry? System not fully d...
I think it should be designed for all. Divorcing it from player power means everyone can just pick their fav one. Its the racials argument really.
maiden ravine
but then there'd be no real point in the system. I think they've accomplished pretty dang close to their goal of meaningful choices for 90-95% of players
woven kiln
The differentiating points can be cosmetic and reward mounts, with the player power being equal. The 90 percentile care infinitely more about transmog and mounts anyway
maiden ravine
We have the system we have now. They've gotten it a lot closer than I expected them to be able to. Player power has gotten super close with a few outliers. Hell even necro is only 10% behind for the dps warriors, that can easily be fixed.
wary beacon
is it better to use a110 ilvl with crut haste stats or azarite piece 130 ilvl? (head shoulder chest)
wary beacon
is it better to use a110 ilvl with crut haste stats or azarite piece 130 ilvl? (...
for shadowlands lvling
astral crystal
KyleEverette and speculative necrolord buffs, name a more iconic duo
burnt wharf
still pagoda
thorny laurel
Does Thrill Seeker require actual killing blows to gain 4 stacks or is it like damaged in the last few seconds before it died?
ember vault
"You kill an enemy" is usually killing blows, but I don't have access to beta so I haven't tested it
rough jasper
There was a macro for Charge/Intervene in the pins of the Shadowlands protection channel. Do any of you maybe have it at hand?
cosmic canyon
Druid has some really solid legendary powers for their tank specc & in general. I do feel we lack some in that department compared to quite a few other classes. You have any thoughts on this as well?
forest fern
i mean its basically a choice between a faster shield wall or a faster demo and which is the environment of content you are running to determine which is better. The others have some semi interesting ideas but very poorly implemented currently
ember vault
Aren't the wall and thunderlord both quite solid?
forest fern
they are solid, but its how needed they are vs other things probably
sweet summit
#showtooltip Charge
/cast [@mouseover, help, exists] Intervene
/cast [exists, harm] Charge
@rough jasper
cosmic canyon
whats the estimated uptime with thunderlord on Demo ?
forest fern
in appropriate conditions i think it halves its cooldown
cosmic canyon
so from 17.5 to 35% in optimal conditions?
forest fern
same with the wall for shield wall if you have the conduit slotted also
rough jasper
Thank you @sweet summit
cosmic canyon
that to me sounds super crappy
forest fern
20% reduction for a third of your fighting time in m+ isn't bad
*damage reduction
for progression raiding a 2min shield wall is kinda big deal also
sweet summit
yeah we have two good legos, the rest are kinda whatever
cosmic canyon
Let's compare it with:
Lycara's Fleeting Glimpse Every 45 sec while in combat, cast a spell based on your form:
Bear Form: Barkskin (Lasts for 12 seconds) you have 30% ADDED uptime on your bark
forest fern
i mean you can only wear 1 anyway, so 2 i think its fine to be honest
just means you can save soul ash till a balancing pass goes through and changes a bunch of things
ember vault
That is a lot of barkskin
cosmic canyon
yes
astral crystal
thicc
cosmic canyon
50% of the time
if you play your on use bark properly
and you know, you don't need to have 3 targets more more around or maximize the use of a secondary ability
to get the effect
plus, you get a different effect if you change form, for different scenarios and added utility
forest fern
right but comparing flat things like that when the classes are balancing around their usage is hard to do, way harder than 2 dps comparing flat dps increases
also isn't barkskin you "take less damage" and demo "your targets do less"
sweet summit
ye
cosmic canyon
Barkskin is reduced damage intake, and demo is reducing the damage they do to you
ember vault
It's "your targets do less to you"
forest fern
"before mitigation" they do to you
sweet summit
just curious, what lego effects would you like to see for pwarr @cosmic canyon
forest fern
something that makes IP more interesting would be nice
sweet summit
could you elaborate?
cosmic canyon
It's too wide of a question for me to answer like this and regardless of what I say there will be lots of arguments against that.
Let's just boil it down to I'd like more thought through legendary powers.
forest fern
that's what the devs are for 🙂 Not sure just something, though honestly then i would want it baseline
cosmic canyon
there are too many 'fringe' ones atm with very very specific useages
reprisal? Ubreakable Will?
forest fern
i think it more argues it was a system that was not needed to be implemented if anything
less systems with more pep in them would have been more appreciated
cosmic canyon
Need is a strong word, don't get me wrong, I really like diversity and thats what I think the game lacks.
but every option should be viable in the majority of situations
forest fern
its hard to have diversity in a min max environment is all
even if it is there you have to convince people it is there which is a thing to do
strong forum
"Shieldblock additionally grants you an absorb for the amount of DMG blocked"
Makes no sense, but sounds cool and would be broken AF
forest fern
like until you make a crit block?
still pagoda
Makes no sense, but sounds cool and would be broken AF
only if numbers are broken
otherwise, ded
strong forum
1-1 ratio
cosmic canyon
all I'm saying: basically my opinion of the legendary powers are that they should all be useful in most situations.
then, under that premise; affect different abilities in different ways.
why on earth would you make thunderlord reach full effect on 3+ targets? why not just give it the effect flat?
why reprisal only affect intervene? and not charge?
sweet summit
because then you run the risk of making the wall obsolete
cosmic canyon
you don't though
The wall shines in aoe sitautions as well, you will get a lot of extra rage for defensive use. and you make sure that if stuff ever gets to heated, your shield wall is ready at hand
etc etc
I dislike the "this leggo is good for this scenario" "this leggo is good for that" scenario
I want more of "all leggos are good at most scenarios, but its up to you which one you pick that favours your playstyle more"
and to circle back
strong forum
That's impossible
sweet summit
i disagree
cosmic canyon
I don't like being 'molded'
strong forum
If math is involved, you will always have a best
cosmic canyon
when the game chooses for you
forest fern
is there that many ways to play your class already though to support that
the other systems seem to fix you in pretty hard to certain ways of doing things
cosmic canyon
there are too many parameters for that to be the only factor nomeratur
pack sizes & downtime in pulls, boss cooldowns, boss abilities, party buffs, etc etc etc etc etc
heck, it even comes down to 'passive' effect or 'activated' affect
where passive should obviously have a 'tax' for being for 'free'
whilst if you click a certain ability only to get effect X, well then you choose that above pressing ability Y which you otherwise would've considered. So the alternative cost etc
Just because I PVP I don't want to have only one option for my leggo, or just because I do dungeons I don't want to have just one option for my leggo, or just because I raid I don't want to have just one option for my leggo etc etc.
then you might as well remove the system
like micke wrote
sweet summit
there's always gonna be one lego thats better in any given situation
forest fern
right but since you pre set up before doing something you have to convince people of the possibility of those variables. Most people play the game now by being told how to play the game, the information age is made them used to it.
cosmic canyon
just curious, what lego effects would you like to see for pwarr <@!1278012816694...
Hope I stilled your curiosity to some extent at least with the answers above. I've gotta bail, so chat laters
sweet summit
stay safe bud
worldly osprey
There was a macro for Charge/Intervene in the pins of the Shadowlands protection...
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/useful-macro-templates/42937
Basic Help/Harm Macro - use the variant version and remove the [mod:alt,@player] HELP_SPELL; condition set
astral crystal
I don't like being 'molded'
unfortunate consequence of playing a game that, for better or worse, is designed around having some semblance of balance, which really just means intended behavior of systems
astral crystal
"Shieldblock additionally grants you an absorb for the amount of DMG blocked"
dude MUH DICK
why isn't this real
bring back something like the prot archimonde tricket
where sblock and IP have a more synergic relationship
Warrior:
Protection - Shield Block now also reduces magic damage taken by 20%. Shield Barrier now also increases your Armor by 20%. Shield Charge now also increases Shield Slam, Revenge, and Heroic Strike damage by an additional 20%.
cosmic canyon
unfortunate consequence of playing a game that, for better or worse, is designed...
Not what I meant, they're not even giving us any options of what legendary to play. Basically there is one BIS and it's bis by so much that it makes the other picks obsolete except in very, very fringe situations. That is what I'm resenting at. The system could've easily been tweaked so that most, preferably all legendary powers made sense in a 'base' scenario; but depending on what way of playstyle you prefer you had the option to decide for yourself. You can balance a game either to the point where you're playing chess with the opponent, or you can balance it by making items & effect different, yet have a similiar power level, but "equal" value.
the legendary powers hardly have 'equal value' as it stands
astral crystal
idk you have to remember we're playing WoW, no matter how close you make legendaries, there's always going to be a best case for each one, and i dont know that there's enough divergent scenarios in this game to justify having a rotation of perfectly situated legendaries. i think what you want isn't possible without some hardcore either homogenization or trivialization
cosmic canyon
Well for example, what I wrote about Reprisal:
Reprisal The first attack you intercept with Intervene grants you Ignore Pain and makes your next Revenge cost no Rage and deal 200% more damage.
Slot: Legs, Feet
You stuck a legendary effect on a very niche ability. ---> Why not, put it on a core ability like charge instead?
Or:
Unbreakable Will Shield Wall also grants 50% of its effect to all party members.
Why not on top of that also add something that benefits you; when you don't use Shieldwall?
Idk, from the top of my head: 5% damage reduction or ANYTHING that makes you want to play it and put it up in similiar power level to that of: The takeaway here is that it has to be balanced.
And so on and so on and so on. The system isnt tweaked, SL is delayed and I for one aint satisfied with what I see. There is ample time to try and balance this, so we don't play in "Beta test" circumstances for the first season of SL. I mean further, if there for some reason is a situation that can be cheesed with say Reprisal or Unbreakable will. Guess one time what they'll be doing? Well, they won't buff the legendary, I can tell you so much. Basically making it obsolete.
I shouldnt have to sit here and come up with ideas, there is a number of previous abilities that can be used as inspiration by the dev team. Certain pvp talents etc etc. Many of the "pvp" talents were originally baseline talents anyhow.
baseline abilities*
Can someone confirm or deny that Seismic Reverberation triggers the chance for a free Shield Slam an extra time?
Protection: If Whirlwind or Revenge hits 3 or more enemies, it hits them 1 additional time for 40% damage.
rigid edge
I understand where you coming from and I agree, but I'm pretty sure B doesn't design the game with balance in mind, and not by mistake
I'm not looking forward to SL systems personally, and I know I might be a minority...
astral crystal
i know it's not the core of your argument but let's be real here, shifting the leggo effect from intercept to charge wouldn't make it a viable legendary, and the reason the second leggo is bad is because reserving shield wall as a group cooldown is bad for you individually
you can't save the current systems by making small alterations to them because the problem is pretty much the systems themselves
open monolith
Wowhead soulbind guide is trash. Doesn't even mention Kleia as a possibility
astral crystal
listen, Llarold is a smart guy but he's monkbrained, don't hold it against him
worthy ingot
Has anyone tried signet with Ravager talented? does the extra rage gen/dps gain from it warrant a look?
ember vault
I asked the same question a while back and most of the feedback was negative
sweet summit
its a mediocre meme
ionic fern
Has anyone tried signet with Ravager talented? does the extra rage gen/dps gain ...
Ravager does not proc Signet.
worthy ingot
ahh, that kills the idea outright
ionic fern
Signet is bad since you get like 4 seconds of Recklessness or you start randomly spinning with Bladestorm for a short time.
Both of them are lackluster.
worthy ingot
yeah, was hoping ravager replaced bladestorm entirely as far as the legendary was concerned
shut summit
same
open monolith
How important is mastery for prot
ionic fern
Not very. 🙂
errant ledge
Thoughts on the wall vs demo shout lego? Both seem very good, demo having the obvious advantage for m+ the wall seems like a more solid versatile choice for both raiding and m+ which would make it the best candidate for our first legendary. Then building demo lego for m+ later on no?
narrow karma
Niche question: Going AM with pelagos and have a conduit question. Is it really worth 2 potency traits? Ours seem pretty meh. Thinking 1P 3E?
strong forum
1p 3e or 1p 1f 2e
strong forum
Thoughts on the wall vs demo shout lego? Both seem very good, demo having the ob...
I'll craft TGV instantly, then once I can craft the wall I'll max it ASAP.
Use the wall for raiding and TGV for m+
worthy ingot
Will world bosses be up week 1 to get verdict?
errant ledge
@strong forum You start running into the problem early on where you can only obtain enough ash to upgrade one at a time until catch up mechanics much later on. Wouldn't it be better to focus all your mats to allow yourself the highest upgrade possible rather then splitting your resources into 2 legendaries? Later on it won't matter of course.
strong forum
you will be set back 1 week
by crafting TGV early
im not saying you should upgrade TGV
just craft it, and let it sit at rank1
then pump everything else into Wall
cosmic canyon
Think they'll add another tier of talents during the SL expansion? 55, 60?
cosmic canyon
more leggos?!!?!?! ;D ;D ;D ;D VERY SANE LoOK
strong forum
more leggos probably too yes
cosmic canyon
and the ability to wear several
strong forum
maybe
dark lark
What happened to @shut summit 's reflect sheet? It's not in the pins anymore
strong forum
itll be in guides and resources i reckon
dark lark
The old BFA one is linked there, not for SL
strong forum
emphasis on "itll be"
errant ledge
I'm a sense fan boy, here you go https://tinyurl.com/ReflectGuide
still pagoda
^
ionic fern
It will be updated in the FaQ shortly. 🙂
gaunt dawn
MYTHIC+ ON TANKNOTES IS LIVE
https://www.tanknotes.com/Mythic-Plus/
It's finally here! This project has been worked on by @spice crystal and peer reviewed extensively by high end M+ players.
This part of the website will be actively maintained as the expansion goes on and new information will be added when it becomes available to us.
Hope you all find it useful.
blazing dune
**MYTHIC+ ON TANKNOTES IS LIVE**
<https://www.tanknotes.com/Mythic-Plus/>
It's...
ty appreciate u
open monolith
Why does wowhead still recommend Unstoppable force and Anger Management as "the standard"
strong forum
because, as it states, the offensive build mostly used for raiding and lower keys
narrow karma
What’s the thoughts between Rallying cry or last stand conduit as the last conduit to use?
heavy dock
covenant for protec war?
sweet summit
Kyrian
jagged pier
depends on the content you plan to clear, anything you want really
heavy dock
just pve for tanking m+ raid etc
jagged pier
okay do you push keys? are you pushing raid content?
heavy dock
more keys than raid
shut summit
kyrian or nightfae then generally
heavy dock
k ty, just to push some keys with friends smoothly so
narrow karma
You guys like Rallying Cry Finesse conduit or Last Stand endurance conduit better?
M+15 and below
strong forum
i prefer Last Stand as ill be playing bolster most of the time
for raiding rallying cry is gonna be better though
narrow karma
Does AM make last stand conduit less attractive?
sweet summit
Yes?
narrow karma
Leveling as prot?
strong forum
highly likely
sweet summit
Prob as fury
narrow karma
I am going prot
strong forum
since its the only of the specs that can pull more than 5 targets
sweet summit
:/
sweet summit
WM 
narrow karma
Was originally planning Aff lock main and prot warrior alt. It I’ve just switched to prot main lock alt and am soooo ready to go slam my shield into peoples faces while I repeatedly stomp my feet
sweet summit
Na bruv devastator owns
sweet summit
strong forum
EVERYTHING
torpid granite
jagged pier
I NEED TO GO FAST TO LVL ALL MY 4 WARRIORS!!!!!!!!!!!!
narrow karma
I prefer to level with my tanking build so I can practice my aoe rotation all the time
strong forum
i guess
narrow karma
But I’m not in a speed leveling space with my work schedule
strong forum
sweet summit
still pagoda
@strong forum @steep bone
one of 2 final DPS optimisation options for PoJ tempest rush
shitty rolls but i can use it for now until i get ancient shenlongs OR better rolled Flying Dragon
strong forum
big
inland mesa
are we doing the wall on shoulders, tgv on feet?
still pagoda
Chest >= Legs >= Head > Ring = Amulet > Shoulders
= Boots >= Belt = Gloves > Wrist > Cloak
strong forum
gloves or feet doesnt make a difference really unless theres easy gloves to get with way better stats than feet
wall on shoulders 100% cloak is the absolute worst item to make a legendary
still pagoda
^
sick sentinel
Would it be fair to say that Kyrian is a jack of all trades if I plan to pug some raids/M+ as prot/fury? I mainly main fury, though
sick sentinel
Yeah, I've read that Venthyr is ahead of Kyrian in ST dps, but Kyrian isn't an awful choice for ST raiding as fury at least
and kyrian of course outperforms in AoE, I think
dense umbra
kyrian is a solid choice for all specs, best in pvp, and best for prot overall
I was thinking Venthyr personally for the extra mitigation
strong forum
extra mitigation?
nice joke
its something but venthyr is at best 3rd for prot
its only good in raid
its still usable, but if you really want the best for both worlds (tank and dps) then kyrian is gonna serve you better
jagged pier
I was thinking Venthyr personally for the extra mitigation
good joke XD
dense umbra
Okay sell me on Kyrian, whats so good about it
jagged pier
well how is venthyr extra mitigation?
strong forum
venthyr only reduces the dmg you take from the target you condemned
so its uselss in aoe
still pagoda
^
strong forum
its worth about half an IP in mitigation
its good for ST, as ive said.
Kyrian offers a ton of aoe dmg on demand, decent rage + mastery through pepegos and the kyrian potion
which is invaluable defensively
lusty grotto
fucking nome
strong forum
still pagoda
Night Fae offers good stun that is not on DR and a bit of mobility
strong forum
i recommend only doing the quest chain, and ignoring rares and dailies
still pagoda
and also gigadamage ability
lusty grotto
oh i did that i just want the stupid memento so i can pair it with my old one
so rip me
lusty grotto
F
still pagoda
now i actually wonder
lusty grotto
anyway ill be playing on launch day at least
still pagoda
Does second shenlong gauntlet even exist?
strong forum
yes, but not for you 
still pagoda
lusty grotto
gonna be fucked up with classic naxx dropping a week after
strong forum
easiest way to force getting it, is upgrading a rare fistweapon in cube
if you have a ton of mats
next to gambling
still pagoda
like, 350% free DAMOOOOOOOOGE multiplier because i can fit all tempest rush stuff into my damn cube
lusty grotto
wheres my mod buddies
still pagoda
highest completed is 121 already
strong forum
130
still pagoda
oh
lusty grotto
i miss sal
lusty grotto
he would get on your diablo3 asses
strong forum
@final mist no you wouldnt
lusty grotto
get that shit outta this channel!
chilly brook
Too bad you wont ping Vel to tell him to give us outside emotes
lusty grotto
lel
strong forum
him
final mist
ngl I'd kick all ur asses at d3
lusty grotto
wait im forgetting a regular that complained about OT
lusty grotto
shit i dont doubt it
chilly brook
Them
chilly brook
Take your pick
final mist
I'm a monk d3 main, I kick everything
still pagoda
I'm a monk d3 main, I kick everything
you know what's the best now? TEMPEST RUSH FLURRY EXPLOSIONS
no kicking
sadly
no explosive palm either
lusty grotto
only point and clicking for me is dota2
strong forum
Diablo is still my main franchise at heart
strong forum
if D4 is baller, ill quit wow in a heartbeat
chilly brook
D3 felt kinda too gamey for me
still pagoda
if D4 is baller, ill quit wow in a heartbeat [2]
lusty grotto
ill be playing d4 cause i hope it has a good story
still pagoda
D3 felt kinda too gamey for me
you haven't played PoE then
strong forum
they made d3 way too casual
strong forum
they tried to appeal to casual gamers way too much
and ruined it
in that sense
same as with wow
poe is extremely beginner and casual unfriendly
still pagoda
they made d3 way too casual
tbf, some of things from D3 are actually good. Combat specifically. Yet they need to change pacing of gearing and leveling
chilly brook
Kinda my thoughts on it Nom
lusty grotto
the d3 story blows ass too
still pagoda
poe is extremely beginner and casual unfriendly
and also not friendly to any weirdo builds
chilly brook
Eh combat is just spam fest in d3
lusty grotto
except for the expansion
strong forum
the only game whos story i cared about in the past 10 years was DOS2
still pagoda
Eh combat is just spam fest in d3
better than holding RMB on double strike in PoE IMO
spam fest can at least be fun
still pagoda
^
chilly brook
Like the most basic bs builder spender with bottom of the barrel token utility stuff
still pagoda
^
same
though
few builds i liked in PoE
scourge arrow potfinder for example
pretty fun
strong forum
poe is so fucking ugly and terrible combat to me, i just cant
still pagoda
and not so spammy
final mist
you know what's the best now? **_TEMPEST RUSH FLURRY EXPLOSIONS_**
I exclusively play inna gen
still pagoda
i hope it makes it to PoE2 in its current glory
still pagoda
I exclusively play inna gen
it's ded (no)
- current starter set is PoJ
gib me my shenlongs already blyat
i want that damooooge
flat nymph
Good ol d3 rng
Say goodbye to all your mats 😛
still pagoda
already did
just as to numerous batches of blood shards
i also lack one of core items
still pagoda
4th slot in cube
probably only for that season
but it boosted quiet few builds into sky high rates of damoooooge
including PoJ monk
flat nymph
True that would be interesting
Yeah thats cool
The point of playing Diablo is to feel like a god so pushinh higher grs is always fun
fading oyster
might as well rename this channel poe discussion lul
warm plinth
@lusty grotto
lusty grotto
😮
atomic maple
is prot warri gonna be able to aoe farm effectively in shadowlands?
ionic fern
AoE farm what?
atomic maple
openworld solo stuff
ionic fern
Yes.
👀
Doubt any class will have issues with that.
We're still the same old tanky AoE dps machine. Our damage is just shifted a bit.
atomic maple
how is prots selfsustain?
ionic fern
how is prots selfsustain?
It's fine- we have Indomitable as a Talent which will provide us with a decent amount of sustain and when doing open world content you also constantly refresh your Victory Rush. 🙂
fading oyster
for leveling tbh i'd just go fury.
chilly brook
how is prots selfsustain?
Your self sustain isn't really what you should be worrying about
atomic maple
for open world aoe farming it does matter, no? 😄 thanks mwahi
strong forum
its hard to drop below 95% in the open world
indom makes sure you stay 100% at all times
mellow patio
If you are falling low hp while questing it is likely you are afk or actively trying to die
naive mauve
Will either of you be playing Warri Tank in SL from the start?
Somehow I'm not so sure ^^
eager glen
I will be but I am leveling in a group
strong forum
i will be playing prot from the start
you can literally tank world bosses without dropping HP
so why should you lose HP whilst leveling
mellow patio
If dying in world content: bad
mellow patio
Kyrian is the move for prot
mellow patio
Kyriangud
fallow mortar
venthyr was never the go to for prot?
strong forum
never
fallow mortar
it was always between night fae and kyrian
strong forum
its always been kyrian, especially before the spear nerf
after that its kyrian >= nightfae if you compare spear vs AA
fallow mortar
fair
mellow patio
And... speargud
still pagoda
would do too much damooooge for that game
aight, i figured out there's a different pair of DW weapons that can be used instead of shenlongs
and i have only one piece of it
but guess i'll stop now
pushed as far as RNG allowed me so i'm satisfied
maybe next season
still pagoda
19 hours and 621 paragon
strong forum
smh
still pagoda
yea, i'm not willing to tryhard that
without 2 crucial pieces of gear, my damage started to fall short in early 90 GR's
no cesar's and shenlongs or paired blades
still pagoda
nah
velvet stag
thank you still learning the class and how to tank
still pagoda
condemn is too niche for prot
strong forum
venthyr and arms want venthyr, but kyrian is the best if you wanna play both dps and tank
fiery badge
I meant Kyrian sorry
strong forum
Kyrian > Nightfae > Venthyr >>> Necro
fiery badge
But everyone I’ve talked to is super sus about Kyrian getting nerfed really bad
strong forum
Nightfae is close 2nd, but still a bit weaker
mellow patio
It’s not going to get nerfed bad at this point imo
velvet stag
sorry i am very ignorant and still learning the game what makes one better than the other im on wow head reading abilities and having trouble understanding
mellow patio
sings
strong forum
the absolute only way to make nightfae better than kyrian would be to nerf Kyrian potion, and reduce Spear dmg to be less than thunderclap
inland garnet
Is the Signet of Tormented Kings that bad for Prot when Ravager is talented? https://www.wowhead.com/guides/protection-warrior-best-legendaries-shadowlands
strong forum
prot Ravager doesnt proc it afaik
and the 3seconds of Recklessness or 3sec Bladestorm really doesnt offer us anything worthwhile
inland garnet
SIGNET OF TORMENTED KINGS: UPDATED
Arms and Prot warriors that take Ravager can now cast it to proc Avatar or Recklesness.
When an Arms Warrior casts Ravager, it will always either be Recklessness or Avatar.
Also, when an Arms Warrior casts Avatar (when both are talented), it will always proc a Ravager or Recklessness.
HOWEVER, when a Prot Warrior casts Avatar, even when Ravager is talented, it will still either cast Recklessness or Bladestorm.
On top of that, if the Prot Warrior casts Ravager, it will also cast either Avatar, Recklessness OR Bladestorm (yes I tested this, it happened).
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/feedback-warrior-class-changes/490692/147
strong forum
it aint
hollow arrow
can someone explain to me why all sources i read on youtube and forums say prot is bottom of barrel tank right now
velvet stag
im switching over from prot paladin to prot warrior tanking so its all new
fiery remnant
@velvet stag you are a crazy man but we like that around here
strong forum
because its highly misinformed and outdated of people wanting to grab a quick buck off of early expansion tierlist hype copying each other
velvet stag
i always been a warrior but paladin just boring
strong forum
mostly people not even knowing how to play the spec
velvet stag
i dont see pally tank as fun i am item lv 112 this was before prepatch event but man so boring to play not a fun rotation, prot warrior seemes like its a class thats always wanted but i could be fucking my self
fiery remnant
well
hollow arrow
I am clueless about prot but saying the many sources are wrong without any evidence doesnt mean much
fiery remnant
its all outdated
fiery remnant
defensively all the tanks are pretty even i hear
hollow arrow
and active mitigation
fiery remnant
we were bottom because damage was shit
hollow arrow
shake my head
velvet stag
why is the spear better than the aftershock?
still pagoda
Tether and less wonky positioning
hollow arrow
Spear looks cool too
velvet stag
so the spear is a target or just instant on the ground
strong forum
defensively all tanks are pretty close together, in raiding AM downtime arent much of an issue given tank swaps are a thing and pwar has good CDs
Our insane Physical mitigation is whats very desirable for m+
our Dmg itself isnt halfbad
velvet stag
cause if target dont you have to make macro
strong forum
you place spear on the ground, hitting everything in its area of impact
still pagoda
we were bottom because damage was shit
Tbf, it's a fucking beta. Judging something as worse or better is even more meaningless during that time
fiery remnant
i agree ❤️
fiery remnant
which is why the tierlist stuff is kinda stupid
still pagoda
And 11 minutes
fiery remnant
as none of us are top 100 players lol
strong forum
in 9.0 prot isnt the strongest because of low ilvl, but in later patches prot warrior has solid potential of being a/if not the strongest tank for m+ again
velvet stag
games gonna be buggy as fuck calling it
strong forum
simply because of Shieldblock
strong forum
What did that mean actually?
620 is low for 19hrs is what i meant, but given you havent played for 4 years its aight
still pagoda
as none of us are top 100 players lol
Top10*
strong forum
yeah "tierlists" dont matter outside of top10 maybe top 20
maiden ravine
Warriors are still my favorite yelly boys and girls
strong forum
does that make any sense to you @hollow arrow
still pagoda
620 is low for 19hrs is what i meant, but given you havent played for 4 years it...
Since season 3 to be precise
also monk is slow af to level if not cheesing
- i tried using EP during leveling and it went horribly wrong
fiery remnant
so do we know if they plan on buffing some of the weaker covs? Like necro for prot
strong forum
na
still pagoda
so i dropped that idea and started dropping tsar-bells on shit
strong forum
EP during leveling is only a thing if you get the bracers for it
hollow arrow
I mean
still pagoda
exactly
still pagoda
since otherwise you can't spread it
still pagoda
if you're satying that Warrior just requires scaling
it requires your fucking hands
maiden ravine
I think we'll see a buff to necro for warrior and DH at some point once it's clear no one's picking it
still pagoda
and avoiding all the typical tank mistakes
maiden ravine
Not sure how they can make either competitive
still pagoda
less window for errors
cursive hedge
Hey fam, can someone link me to resources to show that prot isn't the worst M+ tank? My guild is really trying to convince me to play something else and insisting it's the worst m+ tank
still pagoda
hollow arrow
Good luck Rodek
hollow arrow
I think Blood DK is a good tank spec
cursive hedge
@strong forum I'll check it out! Thank you
strong forum
BDK is the worst m+ tank
hollow arrow
tyhey should just give warrior blood DK talents
strong forum
kek
still pagoda
BDK is the worst m+ tank
i'm gonna have a BDK alt right after warri
hollow arrow
and then give warrior concecrate
still pagoda
guess i'm here to dab on people with blood high keys
hollow arrow
Give prot concrecrate and rune strike
hollow arrow
no trust me
fiery remnant
so how does changing covs work? can we even do that
strong forum
You can change Covenants every week basically
if youre smart about it
the second you decide to swap, you get 1 quest
still pagoda
also
strong forum
next reset you get the 2nd quest to complete the swap
still pagoda
Ion talked about being able to swap covenant without regrinding once every major patch
strong forum
if you swap for the first time, you dont need to do any weekly quests
still pagoda
not on release tho
strong forum
well, it takes 2 quests
1 quest you get insta
2nd quest you get after reset
if you decide to swap ON reset, thats a massive waste
if you want to swap, do it at the end of the week
hollow arrow
I mean a hot fix can happen on any day of the week
thats the main reaso nI see someone wanting to randomly swap immediately
still pagoda
^
it was intended to right away
you do one part on one week
and another on the next
strong forum
also @cursive hedge keep in mind that all tanks are pretty close to each other defensively
hollow arrow
i meant
hollow arrow
a hotfix that nerfs or buffs a covenenant ability
still pagoda
also <@!223065268820246529> keep in mind that *all* tanks are pretty close to ea...
and that the only outlier on offense is DK
hollow arrow
why else would you need to swap covenents on the fly
maiden ravine
I think some tanks struggle with higher level keys. I've heard complaints from Protadin, DKs, and VDH that eventually they'll just get one shot when other tanks won't.
still pagoda
BDK: Proud zero damage since 2016
strong forum
nobody will ever be able to say for certain that X covenant will never be good
yes Kyle
thats the nature of selfhealing tanks
they will reach a point where they just die
hollow arrow
Fury has access to shield slam and block now
they can basically tank
but still do FAT damage
maiden ravine
Tell that to 3 drops from 20m. 😄
strong forum
like, arms and fury getting shieldblock is 99.9% useless
as it triggers a GCD equipping the shield
ontop of you not being tanky enough even with SB up
ontop of shieldslam not generating rage or doing good dmg
and swapping back to proper weapon also triggers GCD
eager lake
i mean if your tank dies you might be able to take few hit with d stance xd
strong forum
die by the sword
and parry it
way better
after that you speedpot away
until tank is back
📈
eager lake
what if you have no b res
maiden ravine
I still personally dislike a lot of the unpruning
strong forum
well, in most situations the tank can run back from the spawnpoint
eager lake
no ?
eager lake
lets say one of the two tanks die in raid
eager lake
and theres a stacking debuff
what if there 5% hp left
and itrs ur first mythic kill
i dont say its THAT good
strong forum
then you blast everything you can into your 1 tank of healing leftover
eager lake
I say it's better than nothing
strong forum
SB alone, and Dstance wont make you live
eager lake
yes it will
strong forum
i doubt that
eager lake
I've tried tanking tank dummy
I could outlive any other dps by a large margin
up to 25 dummy stack
could get barely to 15 with any other class
let alone I was playing arms
so I had virtually no healing
strong forum
well 25 stacks doesnt even put a dent into a tank
eager lake
no but it's still very stronger than any other dps
you could easily back up a tank
and that's why im gonna bind it
strong forum
i wont believe until i see it
eager lake
maybe use it 2 times in the expac idk
but I will def be able to do it
that's the whole point
being able to
die or not to die
lets say ur doing m+ and ur tank die
so u challenging call + die by the sword
that's 8 sec gained
if thats not enough then at 7 sec u swap to shield
and kite
still pagoda
well 25 stacks doesnt even put a dent into a tank
99+ is where it actually "hurts" as far as i remember
strong forum
which is exactly what i said
still pagoda
and even then it was tingling
eager lake
its different
strong forum
i got to 73 as pwar
eager lake
ive been to like 40 on my prot war
eager lake
its not like they've been taking things from us with it
they just throwed it in and w/e
so I'll take it for what it is
I wont complain for added niche play for absoltely no drawback
maiden ravine
But it has drawbacks
maiden ravine
It takes a global to equip a shield, locks you out of some dps
maiden ravine
For subpar defensive
eager lake
it's worth as much as bear form
call it what you like
I've seen resto druids tank boss during necro whole legion
eager lake
whats the difference
maiden ravine
Shield block is just there to fill the spell book
eager lake
you have as much armor as guardian affinity and more with shield block
hell you have more armor than a fucking blood dk with a shield
strong forum
🤔
strong forum
i severely doubt that you have more armor than a bdk
eager lake
yes you do
strong forum
and why would you
eager lake
check it before talking stupid
eager lake
no
only war get an armor buff
well dh brew guardian also
but thats cause they're leather
maiden ravine
Like I wish shield block was worth it for dps, but you'll just do better popping a cd and occasionally using ignore pain
eager lake
thats what ur gonna do 95% of the time
hell even 99%
but I'll be happy for that 0.001% time I'll get to shield swap
shield block is probably, hell , surely the best physical defensive in the game
scales directly from shield's block value and it was up to 56% in last tier
that's 56% damage u dont take off the bath
strong forum
SB is the best physical defense in the game
but in no situation besides open world was it 56%
theres K values in different instances
in mythic raid it was 35% at best
eager lake
idk it was tooltip after all
maiden ravine
Do k values scale with m+ key level or is it actually lower than open world k value
strong forum
they stay the same
and its higher k Value than open world
you have open world -LFR
m0/m+
normal raid
heroic raid
mythic raid
maiden ravine
Oh, one chart someone linked me had m+ k value slightly lower than open world
strong forum
its based on instance type
maiden ravine
Like it was 1450 or something open world and 1440 m+
I'll have to ask to see the table again
maiden ravine
It was a sl k value table
maiden ravine
There we go, sorry
strong forum
lmao thats so stupid
maiden ravine
I figured k level scaled with key level or else gear scaling would make active mitigation stronger and stronger as you go up
strong forum
which is precisely the case, AM gets stronger the higher you go
the issue with K value is
it fucks over DPS even harder than tanks
because they dont get as much armor to even out the increase in K Value requirements
so they take more dmg per patch
languid elk
is protection warrior viable as a tank in in sl for raiding?
strong forum
pwar hasnt been best for raiding for over 4 years
languid elk
so they will hold there end up well then i guess?
strong forum
i will get CE and push higher keys than most people in here, as pwar
so... yeah
itll be fine 👍
languid elk
awesome, heard that they will have a ruff start since they have nerfed the legos.
maiden ravine
Warrior isn't best but lots of warriors get ce and hall of fame due to comfort with the class
languid elk
with everything scaling up?
strong forum
yes we will get better with gear
languid elk
thoughts on the covenant for pwar?
maiden ravine
I'm going to be going Venthyr even though I know it does nothing for prot in aoe haha
maiden ravine
For most people Kyrian or Night fae will do best
Venthyr is not as great, but if you main spec dps specs, it won't stop you from doing m+
languid elk
i had the same thoughts! am going for pwar in sl but iam worried that they will fall sort in the long run! either i have to reroll to a diffrent tank or go dps!
still pagoda
Venthyr is not as great, but if you main spec dps specs, it won't stop you from ...
it won't, but stupidity and meta-driven attitude of pugs will
unless you find a group or do it with guildies
maiden ravine
I'm tanking, my key, idgaf
still pagoda
exactly
maiden ravine
I'll invite the survival hunters and assassination rogues
grand drum
Convenant will hold you back less than your spec and class choice already do
still pagoda
I'll invite the survival hunters and assassination rogues
i pushed high keys with Spriest and MW in S4
2 specs that were considered garbage
languid elk
😄
maiden ravine
I usually hate meta, but even I'm tempted to always have a rogue in group
still pagoda
and i myself didn't give a fuck about vers stacking
TD the pack before you ever need CD's and use everything proactively
@strong forum just red up a bit. PoJ build i was using relies heavily on items i didn't get yet
the goddamn DW set and fucking bracers
next season i guess
pushed into 90's on casual pace so i'm satisfied
so i was technically able to push into almost high GR's without core items
languid elk
not a fan of meta but, from the sound of everyone here it looks that pwar arnt that far of as everyone says it is:P
still pagoda
and it is fun popping hungreds of trillions worth of damage from correctly timed Tempest Rush flurry rune explosions
civic rover
hey woyers how u cuties doing
civic rover
at least the transmog is sick though
still pagoda
it's "Fine" if you don't care for performance as much
but it is heavily undertuned right now
maiden ravine
I fully expect they'll try to buff Banner when they realize maybe 5% of warriors go it
How, I dunno
Watch it be something stupid like 30% crit to you and 4 others
still pagoda
Watch it be something stupid like 30% crit to you and 4 others
100% crit for yourself and only for yourself
then it's balanced
treat it as banner from Path of Exile
topaz zenith
I just wanted a grappling hook made of bone 
still pagoda
"idgaf about playing with group so i use my Dread Banner as impale passive"
civic rover
kyrian rook transmog 
still pagoda
kyrian rook transmog <a:catjam:741127114845061211>
toilet shoulder transmog
topaz zenith
Ori and the blind forest tmog
civic rover
toilets are beautiful
even though one covenant is very clearly ahead of the others for prot, at least all the transmogs look cool
civic rover
i'd be surprised if you did
dense pivot
my guess is not, maybe you'll get others after SL
astral crystal
remember that transmog you worked really hard to farm up and complete special challenges for? :^) can't wear it when we switch the meta, loser
maiden ravine
You're not supposed to switch like that
civic rover
remember when everyone wanted meaningful choices
maiden ravine
I feel like I have them on most classes
civic rover
i remember like 10 months ago when everyone was saying they want meaningful choices in shadowlands
now we have meaningful choices and people are upset
maiden ravine
Well that's the point. People are angry they can't be told what to do
"I have to make a decision on my own and go for one I like better?"
NOT IN MY AZEROTH
still pagoda
I never said that
Idgaf
I will even play, god forbid, focused rage if it is ever to come again
And if it actually takes its rightful spot of top tier SSlam gigaslap damage talent
dense pivot
anything to make MS to do damage
strong forum
#arms ?
if so, no you dont
even with 2x OP + 2x EP stacks MS will only do the same dmg as execute
vocal skiff
Will it be faster to level alts through threads of fate or the main story again, assuming it's done on week 1?
burnt torrent
If anyone remembers, my guild was strong arming me into being a blood dk and was strictly against me playing a prot warrior, that guild is "Motion - Area 52" Who have since recruited over me and they did so weeks ago, but instead of telling me like adults and people who have respect for others they decide to tell me less than 24 hours before the release of shadowlands.
vocal skiff
I seem to remember it
Assholes, and it kinda sucks to be thrown into the bus
However, the upside is that you find out what kinda place you were sooner rather than later
burnt torrent
My only issue with it is that they waited until the day before shadowlands releases
Well the actual guild leader was supposed to have been my friend for like 13 some odd years
civic rover
if they feel the need to have you play a specific tank then they aren't a guild worth being in.
burnt torrent
They legit told me
That they wanted me to be a blood dk due to healer and dps shortcomings
civic rover
blood dk isn't gonna solve the dps shortcomings
and it won't help the healers having you on a tank you might not be comfortable with.
like they're world 3500, they shouldn't be worrying ab meta at all.
sick falcon
@burnt torrent you’re an actual clown my dude
sick falcon
You said you’d make a dk for backup to be raid ready after baby raging like a 5 year old and then didn’t. And we’re told you’d be backup tank now because you didn’t have another toon
steel mauve
they may want to look and fix their actual shortcomings instead of band aid fixing some thing thats still gonna hinder them in the long run any ways
autumn pendant
sick falcon
Nah @burnt torrent is just making stuff up because he doesn’t know how to play anything but prot war , as per his previous comments
civic rover
so why force him into something different
sick falcon
Coming here for moral support
civic rover
idk man the only clowns im seeing are the guild that got one mythic n'zoth kill at the very end of the expansion requiring tanks to be meta
burnt torrent
lmao
burnt torrent
leif i was in that guild, im not disrespecting them, i was glad i was there for a kill
sick falcon
That’s all
jade socket
proven breach
civic rover
😳
burnt torrent
Lmao, I was just speaking out about how disrespectful it is to tell someone they are replaced a day before release of the new expac
Simple stuff
maiden ravine
Thinking any tank sucks in this day and age.
mellow patio
C r i n g e
civic rover
cute
mellow patio
Can y’all quit crying and take it to dms already jfc
burnt torrent
He can't DM me lmao
grand drum
What flavor?
civic rover
yo hawgz hand some over rq
grand drum
caramel?
civic rover
thanks my guy
civic rover
salt n butter?
mellow patio
Of course brother
civic rover
i get on live for the first time in like two weeks today, people fr trying to sell +15s still lmao
maiden ravine
especially considering no cache on Tuesday
grand drum
i think they're doing it in case its bugged like bfa launch and people get a +14 or +15 on m+ week
maiden ravine
Nah, Ion already confirmed they won't let that happen again
grand drum
...or they want KSM for the artifact appearance
maiden ravine
I'm a little amused that a guild so worried about warriors not doing well asked for bdk as the back up.
chilly brook
Damn I missed some raid leader drama didn't I? Imagine being world 2381 and trying to force people to play something they would rather not and then waiting until the day before xpac to replace them because you gave an ultimatum you knew wouldn't be met
civic rover
does anyone know of any purple plate sets from old raids
grand drum
forcing someone to make a tank and not even making them choose VDH lol
strong forum
clearly taken the naowh vid to seriously
but we've had this discussion a couple weeks / months ago
with the same people i think aswell
grand drum
was just trying to make a point
strong forum
literally not even actual CE guild asking for anything and then having a dispute over it
chilly brook
I mean I think we did say it was a landmine
chilly brook
Hate to say it but we were right
strong forum
i wouldnt even reroll for a top 20 guild away from prot
mellow patio
Is bear good rn can someone give me a straight answer
strong forum
bear is amazing defensively