protection

[tribal wharf]

and then my brain broke

something in my brain snapped and broke at that very moment and i said no more

[coarse bay]

All of this for one of the most mid of mid trinkets of the season

Unless this was s1

[upbeat plover]

Find better friends

[tribal wharf]

i play with pugs since 2004 wow lol

LFR

[upbeat plover]

What kind of pugs are rolling off trinkets on your behalf lmfao

Tell em to piss off

[lusty grotto]

leland getting yogi'd for 2 hours ohno

[tribal wharf]

HE WILL LEARN

NOTE, the priest at the very start of the video. "Peakclown"

[upbeat plover]

Are you telling me he's a troll?

[lusty grotto]

no

hes dead serious

but

[wintry nymph]

he's yogi

[lusty grotto]

yea pretty much

[tribal wharf]

yup, i am deathray, as in shooters

straight shot to the heart/brain

[wintry nymph]

but forever known as yogi

[lusty grotto]

80s-90s shooters

only

nothing past 2010

[wintry nymph]

i miss the days where yogi asked for prot advice in the prot channel

those were the days

[tribal wharf]

yup, only known as yogi bc my nieghbour who is now dead had a cat boo boo "hey boo boo go get me a pickanick basket"

and death is negative

so i changed it and it stuck too hard

tbh, yogi bear is one of my LEAST favorite cartoons

not that its bad at all, just not what i would watch

definitionally campy

[upbeat plover]

More bear hate

[tribal wharf]

then i found out all it is is just do rage things and face towards with shield and shield slam and thunder clap and etc

[sharp gale]

2 hands you are not a germanic barbarian

[tribal wharf]

you are doubting that i might be a big fat guy

tall

and everyone refer to me as yogi, one of most famous bear of all

[sharp gale]

dwarf is german folklore

[undone beacon]

German more like germ man gottem

[tribal wharf]

depends how dried out the wood is tbh

[toxic pewter]

do you prefer to be called deathray

cuz I will call u that if u like

[tribal wharf]

nah, i just go with whatever the story sets my name as if its final fantasy is an example

[toxic pewter]

alright

[tribal wharf]

i dont set a custom name for those, i might in pokemon

[sharp gale]

i mean if you woodcut 1 piece in half, sure do it with one hand, but if you do more, i suggest 2 hands to not break your arm

and to cut down a tree, not shot you do it 1 hand

[tribal wharf]

bandsaws and chainsaws existtoo

[wintry nymph]

1handing a chainsaw?

[sharp gale]

i admire the potential adrenaline rush to hold a chainsaw with 1 hand

[tribal wharf]

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQe9pz3mawnd3xWGIjqZ1k4KOPWE3bKeymYuA&s

[sharp gale]

old ppl where i live heat themselves with wood still, some even used to get coal deliveries when i was a kid

you cut a ton, A TON of wood for 1 winter

[tribal wharf]

fuck yes tree chopping wood heating in an old cast iron stove is still very much a real thing

saves a whole lot of money on electricity in the winter time

[sharp gale]

tree chopping it's not really YOU who do it, since it is really physical, but you still have to size what you get to fit in your stove

[solid sun]

https://tenor.com/view/lets-get-physical-olivia-newton-john-working-out-gym-zumba-gif-18904174

[tribal wharf]

some ppl use a pellet stove

parents had a pellet stove but i didnt full understand it

[sharp gale]

can rhinos swim ? i learned today hippos can't

[toxic pewter]

interesting

[solid sun]

Hippos can walk underwater though

[toxic pewter]

arents hippos in water a lot

how the hell they get out of the water..

[solid sun]

They walk

[toxic pewter]

interesting

[sharp gale]

yes but they are too heavy to swim, they walk and they actually stand on 2 feet when they are stationnary

[toxic pewter]

so they walk into and out of the water?

[solid sun]

lol just like most animals yes

[toxic pewter]

so they will only proceed if they can deem it safe to walk

well I mean they wont enter it if they cant get out I mean

[tribal wharf]

and yes, 1 hand chainsaw DOES exist

but its more for like, branches

[toxic pewter]

lol

interesting

[sharp gale]

so basically if you see a hippo not moving in water, it is standing up on 2 feet, like a dog trying to walk

[toxic pewter]

interesting

[tribal wharf]

i mean like, hedge trimmers exist

[toxic pewter]

can elephants swim

[solid sun]

Also yes rhinos can swim

[tribal wharf]

does that not an XL chainsaw?

[toxic pewter]

my fav animal elephant

[solid sun]

Some rhinos wade through rivers and lakes

[pallid quiver]

nuh uh, not when i push them down

[toxic pewter]

whoa apparently elphants are great swimmers

[solid sun]

https://tenor.com/view/realkimdahyun-rhino-dead-gif-21335364

[toxic pewter]

lol

[toxic pewter]

lol

[undone beacon]

I’ve got a pellet stove in my house and it’s very nice tbh

[pallid quiver]

man, this makes me feel like working to help out at a zoo

[tribal wharf]

something along the lines of

the pellets are nice to use and easy to use but expensive i guess is it

and then you need other wood for the real fire

[solid sun]

We could use all the help we can get

[tribal wharf]

so its almost like ball of kindling dusted

[sharp gale]

ironic when hippos can't

[pallid quiver]

see, the downside is that I'm lazy and an incompetent worker

One of those utter reprobates and slights against humanity itself kinda lumps of flesh

[solid sun]

You’re just being modest

Bet you’d be fantastic

[pallid quiver]

you don't understand, i need you to end my miserable existence as i lay here bloated with gas and in pain

i've just been laying in bed for about 4 hours

send help

[toxic pewter]

[pallid quiver]

The actual issue is that my parents would not approve, and my Dad would probably literally kill me over the perceived slight on a serious note

Not what he thinks would be a respectable job and all

[solid sun]

I’m sorry

If it helps in any way, I don’t think your dad would fight me or my people

We’re very large and have dangerous horns

We could protect you

[pallid quiver]

he 100% would

You'd just need to have him play a game of CoD first, then he'd be filled with enough delusional gamer rage that he'd do it

[solid sun]

All jacked up on Mtn Dew code red and rage

That’ll do it

[pallid quiver]

no code red is for bitches

he just drinks diet mountain dew

I understand that it's difficult to get into the mindset of a delusional bully with extreme overconfidence in their own physical abilities despite being like 60, o erweight, and not working out for 40 years, so I don't fault you for the slight miss

entirely unrelated, can someone check my tracking numbers so i know if my digimon cards are coming in today

i was so excited for those today before The Agony

[solid sun]

Did you take any medicine

[lusty grotto]

idk laying in bed for 4 hours sounds like a chill time to me

unless youre dealing with anxiety

[pallid quiver]

it's the bloated with gas part, because it has to go out one way or the other, and until then, it feels like swelling

[lusty grotto]

one thing that helps if you do is just to recognize when thoughts go into anxiety area (things you cant control, the "what ifs") and then you can just name the demon and suddenly they go away

[pallid quiver]

the furthest i've managed to get today was the bathroom across from my room

[lusty grotto]

o

take nap, fart a lot, it go away

[solid sun]

A little Gas X

[pallid quiver]

that's what i've neen attempting but it hurty a lot

[lusty grotto]

what did you eat lol

[pallid quiver]

Dude,

a sandwich

and a cookie

[toxic pewter]

do u have food poisoning or somethin

[solid sun]

Did the sandwich contain meat that was decaying

[lusty grotto]

could be, i got massive vomitting from a sandwich once

[pallid quiver]

I don't even know how this much gas exists because I actually ate less than usual yesterday

I think it's probably related to the migraine I had in the middle of the night, since I weirdly get gassy anytime after I have a migraine

[solid sun]

Do you work with your hands and maybe some substance was on them and the bread soaked it up

[pallid quiver]

but it's normally not this bad

[lusty grotto]

it was the day before thanksgiving, we went to a deli at work, i ate a turkey sandwich, thanksgiving comes up and im literally vomiting every 30 mins

[pallid quiver]

wait

fuck i think there.might have been ham on the sandwich?

[solid sun]

Could be bad ham

[lusty grotto]

drink lots of water

[pallid quiver]

I mean, my body don't like ham, ut it's ormally not this bad

[sharp gale]

it can be the bread too

[solid sun]

Luerce you know how this works

[toxic pewter]

just drink a lot of water u will be ok in a day or 2

[solid sun]

We need you to post the sandwich eating logs

[lusty grotto]

yeah lots of water

[solid sun]

That’s the only way we can verify what’s happening to you

[pallid quiver]

dude i was so known for making sandwiches when i was in my speedrun watching arc that i actually got a chat command named for me about it

[solid sun]

lol

[pallid quiver]

because invariably, without fail, every single time i walked off to make a sandwich, success was had

[lusty grotto]

its probably salmonella

just care

H2O

[pallid quiver]

Also, I didn't have this issue with any of those sandwiches, and I personally made them, so clearly I just never trust another human being to handle my food ever again (I was also like, 12 years younger or something)

[lusty grotto]

i dont think you should not trust people with food just because of those things

but 🤷‍♂️

[sharp gale]

you should not trust me about food, i'm a doberman on this, i eat potatos which have sprout on them

[drowsy comet]

my ass is kinda lucky today, got this beauty today in Diablo 2 :p

[lusty grotto]

congrats

[toxic pewter]

gotta love magic find

i remember back in the day gotta have that entire magic find set

[pallid quiver]

Nope, I gotta axe murder the 16 year old for bagging my bread now at the grocery store, please understand

It's the only solution

[drowsy comet]

I have a Sorc that has 400 MF, yea its really fun xD

[toxic pewter]

damn nice yeah has to be the sorc i had sorc for MF also

[drowsy comet]

god damn

[pallid quiver]

man came in at the wrong end of this convo

[drowsy comet]

apb do u have a stroke or why did u edit the message 4 times

[lusty grotto]

RIP poor kid

[toxic pewter]

just conbined my messages into one line

[drowsy comet]

Ohh

[undone beacon]

Valid crashout

Has anyone played Creature Kitchen?

[pallid quiver]

Oh, Pash, what kinda human sacrifice is the best for making sure I get the green bear from Moragh?

[sharp gale]

if you hid your bread to not let it dry, it molds, maybe it's that

[pallid quiver]

now that you're here and I'm here to ask

[drowsy comet]

murder this kid ngl valid crash out

[lusty grotto]

in world of warcraft, or in an online multiplayer game

[undone beacon]

Honestly I gave up farming the emerald dream rares for their skins

I'm not going to use any of them anyways

[drowsy comet]

but keep it SFW

[pallid quiver]

extremely valid take

[drowsy comet]

i dont wanna see a mute here

[drowsy comet]

roblox

[pallid quiver]

The rates on the rare skins are wildly low

[sharp gale]

roblox is no longer valid for that

[lusty grotto]

i believe thats included in online multiplayer game

[undone beacon]

Shockingly low for how you get them yeah

Its like a sub 2% chance to get the skin off Moragh

[toxic pewter]

ngl never realized all those emerald dream skins and stuff were rare

wow that sucks

[lusty grotto]

just do it with 4 druids 4head

[pallid quiver]

I was just thinking that maybe I'll mess with my Druid, so I have slightly more interest in getting the skin, so I've just been afk with a rare scanner the oast few days

[drowsy comet]

i can grow a garden in game

[undone beacon]

Honestly the mage tower felbear is shockingly easy for guardian if you want a cool bear skin

[pallid quiver]

I think some of the drop rates count non-druids who killed and can't loot it, but it's definitely lower than 5% ez

[lusty grotto]

it was always easy for guardian even in legion, you only needed luffa

[pallid quiver]

I'm not actually a bug fan of the rune bear looks myself

[undone beacon]

Thats fair enough

[drowsy comet]

ofc youd say that

[pallid quiver]

I think they're cool to exist, and I'm glad they're around, but they're not my preference

I'm currently decently fine with the ash colored bear from the Emerald Dream, but I do like green so

farming hell

[undone beacon]

I mean it literally is since the stupid eyes that spawn and kill you can be shot down by moonfire

I used the silly owlbear for a while before i got the Aurostar runebear

[lusty grotto]

yes that was the same way it was done in legion

with luffa

[pallid quiver]

The owlbears are super cute and they're pretty great, ngl

[undone beacon]

Snowy Umbraclaw my beloved

[pallid quiver]

who needs to cancel knockbacks when you can just remove the knockbackers

[drowsy comet]

big green bear cool

https://giphy.com/gifs/bears-gummy-imgur-aKJcobXRuLEdO

[sharp gale]

i hope baby owlbears are not as ugly as baby owls

[undone beacon]

I use Runebear, Owlcat, Moose, Lemix Fel Owl, and funny Amirdrassil fish as my forms

[lusty grotto]

you know whats even cooler though?

[pallid quiver]

ur mom

gottem

[lusty grotto]

the og werebear that nimchippy has

🙂

[undone beacon]

https://tenor.com/view/howl-harvest-howlharvest-moonguard-moon-guard-bear-gif-1865620123706967638

[lusty grotto]

also that yea, ty luerce

[toxic pewter]

STOP POSTING MAGE TOWER APPEARANCES RERRRRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

RRREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

[undone beacon]

https://tenor.com/view/shut-up-femboy-gif-26334068

[toxic pewter]

[lusty grotto]

shall i post all of mine?

[toxic pewter]

i cant stand seeing it

I REFUSE TO LOOK

[lusty grotto]

ok i wwont

[pallid quiver]

i need to farm legion dungeons iirc for my owlcat appearance

i just got owlcat like, last year or something

[toxic pewter]

[lusty grotto]

but you best be ready cause mage tower appearances are perma locked in all my characters so get ready for friday

[drowsy comet]

yea shut up..

[pallid quiver]

whichever gave the white owlcat

[toxic pewter]

lololol

[upbeat plover]

This is a pretty good gif

[toxic pewter]

aaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh

[upbeat plover]

Ngl

[lusty grotto]

except my warrior who has it but i prefer fish

cause its funny

[toxic pewter]

fish owns

just realized i dont even have fish...

[sharp gale]

At least Amirdrasil form is not a pain to farm right

[drowsy comet]

aaaaand there he is again

Sup unc how ya doing

[lusty grotto]

i have the og island expedition one, but you can do the saturday fishing thing in hallowfall for another

[toxic pewter]

Yah I saw they had added that hallowfall one... hmm

[lusty grotto]

or just buy it since the island expedition one is boe

[toxic pewter]

yah was just gonna ask if i can buy island one

i wonder how much it goes for these days

[undone beacon]

The hallowfall one is like 200 or 300 derby marks so its a pain in the ass but doable

[lusty grotto]

no idea tbh

i got it in a drop, was lucky

[toxic pewter]

yeah I think i only have like 50 or so derby marks

[lusty grotto]

during bfa grinding fucking garbage AP

[toxic pewter]

[drowsy comet]

and now he doesnt even answer.. rude

[sharp gale]

i bet it was a guilty pleasure to do them

[lusty grotto]

lol

[undone beacon]

I hope they do BFA remix so we can have supercharged M+ style islands with affixes and bronze

i wonder if farming islands is a decent gold making strat these days

i dont know how well transmog moves on the AH tho

Seems like a slow market

[lusty grotto]

it is slow yea

not really worth

unless you plan on reposting a lot

[drowsy comet]

Shadowlands remix when

[solid sun]

I’ll show you some transmog moves

[undone beacon]

I need to recoup my losses from buying this stupid dimmy dragon

[toxic pewter]

I think i did buy one item a while ago the 2h sword.. the blade of ancient kings or whatever its called. sweet sword

[sharp gale]

At least you enjoy your purchase

[undone beacon]

I will enjoy it very much

And i will especially enjoy not having to farm MFO for years

[solid sun]

If I get it first run when it’s farmable I won’t tell you

But I’d think about telling you

[undone beacon]

lmao

[lusty grotto]

my brother got it last week

and big g

literally the same day

cause his guild has been farming the instances

[undone beacon]

I got big g and ansurek mount from clears with the guild but we arent going to prog dimmy so

[lusty grotto]

i lost all big g rolls

when it was current lol

[toxic pewter]

dang big g and dragon same day that is badass

[drowsy comet]

I dont wanna see a rhino in a swimming pool with sunglasses, if you mean that as transmog move

[upbeat plover]

https://tenor.com/view/youre-weak-wimp-weak-sauce-weak-cant-handle-it-gif-13750035

[undone beacon]

I'm our resident goblin enjoyer so someone handed me their big g

[upbeat plover]

Get in there and prog dimmy

[undone beacon]

lmao

Nah

I have the gold I'm just gonna throw money at the problem

[sharp gale]

I scraped the ansurek one few weeks ago when we did one reclear before starting boosts

I openly said I don’t want it

[drowsy comet]

ppl like that mount?

[undone beacon]

Its my go to mount, I love the Big G

[drowsy comet]

its just a big chunk

[undone beacon]

Big freakin goblin head its awesome

[toxic pewter]

big g is badass mount

[drowsy comet]

I fw the fire horse from..the shop

[toxic pewter]

highly coveted

[upbeat plover]

Can you throw irl money at my irl problems?

[sharp gale]

Big G maybe is one of the few mounts I directly wanted when I saw it

[undone beacon]

I'm already throwing irl money at my own irl problems smh

[upbeat plover]

Exactly. You sound rich

[undone beacon]

Far from rich but I keep myself afloat

[sharp gale]

You read rich*

[solid sun]

I’ll take a money throw

Make me a target

[undone beacon]

lmao

[upbeat plover]

Lol

[drowsy comet]

I can throw you some pennies in yo face, how about that

[pallid quiver]

Can you just hit me with some money? Like grab hold of a stack of bills and just wallop me real good?

[upbeat plover]

That is technically profit. We take those

[undone beacon]

Our director is trying to get us a pay bump across the team so fingers crossed

[drowsy comet]

https://giphy.com/gifs/betawards-bet-awards-2015-l46C7mUzRAca62Rtm

[sharp gale]

I once threw my coins at the taxi driver bc I was really drunk

[upbeat plover]

I just now considered the implications of your name when factoring in my prior statements.
@undone beacon

[pallid quiver]

instructions unclear, everyone on your team takes a 10% paycut, but the buying power of each individual amount if your currency is tripled

[coarse bay]

I too am a big g enjoyer

[undone beacon]

lmfao

Emissary of bear implies i herald your arrival and tout your messages

Is you being in prot my fault

oh man

[upbeat plover]

Technically Khailby

[coarse bay]

We arent allowed to say that name anymore

[upbeat plover]

But you did prolong it

[undone beacon]

https://tenor.com/view/world-of-warcraft-warcraft-wow-gallywix-cry-about-it-gif-10633337806997351093

Fair enough

[coarse bay]

https://tenor.com/view/harry-potter-dont-speak-his-name-gif-12688511

[upbeat plover]

Now go spread the good gospel of PvP

[sharp gale]

Racism ?

[undone beacon]

Yeah prot pvp was fun and easy and i got my set sooooo

everyone should prot pvp

[lusty grotto]

GRRRR

[upbeat plover]

Where the subject are free to emote and react till their hearts' content

[upbeat plover]

We can't get that meta in there

[lusty grotto]

tank pvp is banned!!!

[sharp gale]

Niche meta makes it more enjoyable

And I play prot in bg

[upbeat plover]

I agree with Nim

Don't do that

[undone beacon]

There are dozens of us prot pvp enjoyers

@pastel summit my beloved prot pvp icon

[lusty grotto]

https://klipy.com/gifs/punt-kick-1

[sharp gale]

Only in heroic ones, bc clap root is funny, I play fury in regular ones

[undone beacon]

https://klipy.com/gifs/nepunator-cat-7

[upbeat plover]

I know the good one yes. The furry

[pastel summit]

Heys.

[lusty grotto]

https://klipy.com/gifs/jackie-chan-17

[undone beacon]

[pastel summit]

It was good in blitz last season and there's a reasonable chance it's better this season. Biggest concern is bear being s+++ tier again.

But most bears kind of derpy so.

[lusty grotto]

in rbgs right?

https://tenor.com/view/padme-gif-24474700

[pastel summit]

RBGs are about as close to dead content without being deleted as possible.

They're like one stumble away from pvp islands.

[undone beacon]

I forgot about pvp islands

[lusty grotto]

goddamn it, then i stand by what i said really loudly

[pastel summit]

I think pvp islands could've been cool if 1) you didn't need 3 same faction 2) didn't have to be at the docks 3) wasn't limited to only playing into enemy faction

[sharp gale]

I enjoyed PvP islands tbf, even tho I rarely PvP

[round pendant]

Natalie Portman looking

[sharp gale]

You made me remember pushing m+ in bfa while I’m alliance

Not cool

[pastel summit]

Keys and arena were not a good time in bfa, holy heck.

[undone beacon]

Keys were great when corruptions were a thing and I could watch tanks hold W and twilight dev the whole key into dust

[lusty grotto]

cross faction has been so good to the game

[sharp gale]

Yes it was a pain, content itself and access wise, but it was weird to know EVERYONE you tag with and having to play at night bc Russians

[round pendant]

Wait that scene is from Star Wars 2 right?

Right?

[undone beacon]

Honestly sometimes I miss the BFA Essences

[toxic pewter]

they should bring back pvp islands and make other new pvp style content

[undone beacon]

These things

[sharp gale]

Fuck conflict of strife

[lusty grotto]

i dont cause i fucking hate AP

[pastel summit]

I thought essences and corruptions were fun.

[toxic pewter]

yeah essences definitely fun

[sharp gale]

Yeah but before it was account wide, fuck conflict of strife

[pastel summit]

What was bad about that one

Oh, that's the pvp one innit

[sharp gale]

Having to do PvP for weeks on alts

[undone beacon]

Oh yeah didnt most specs want Conflict and Strife for PVE and you needed to grind PVP for it

Because the minor power was just a stacking vers buff

[pastel summit]

[sharp gale]

It was also the root clap

[upbeat plover]

Just enjoy pvp

Ez

[round pendant]

Someone answer me 😭

[sharp gale]

It was vers + a PvP talent becoming pve

[round pendant]

Also there's too much pvp in here

[lusty grotto]

i had cnf but i didnt like to play it i just did TB first pull manmode

[round pendant]

Someone grab the flamethrower

[lusty grotto]

yes its attack of the clones, yam

[round pendant]

Thank god

[upbeat plover]

On your problems?

[sharp gale]

Alcohol

[round pendant]

I have no problems

[sharp gale]

I keep forgetting about them

[undone beacon]

I was unlocking nzoth assault on an alt the other night and had to do the intro to essences and was like damn

I miss those

[lusty grotto]

all AP exps had baller s4s

buy your leggo legion s4 goodge
buy essences bfa s4 goodge
dinars sl s4 goodge

before s4 = 🤡

fuck AP

i should say crests now

c:

[upbeat plover]

Surrrrreeeellllyyyy

[undone beacon]

Yeah cuz it takes three seasons of bullshit for blizz to make an AP system not awful

[sharp gale]

I kinda liked it, everyday doing my world quests when I logged in, my few PvP stuff etc kinda ritual

[lusty grotto]

i dont wanna play a game to do chores

i would much rather play other games

AND I FUCKING DID ALL OF THOSE CHORES TRUST

[undone beacon]

meanwhile im playing A Little To The Left

[sharp gale]

You over focus on island degen farm, which you never had to do

[undone beacon]

which is a puzzle game where you do chores :3

[sharp gale]

You barely were ahead once they introduced the first few weeks of 30% AP

[lusty grotto]

if you skipped a week you were forever behind before they activated the catch up

time is best spent having fun and doing the real content

not doing a mindless farm

fucking s1 torghast holy shit

expeditions, the woons WQs

the artifact AP

[sharp gale]

Yeah we are not the same, I liked those tbf

[lusty grotto]

did you have fun?

can you say that time was well spent?

[sharp gale]

Yes, and it’s not nostalgia, at that time I already enjoyed them

[lusty grotto]

we were already playing a game that took so much time out of your hands... and looking back its time completely lost

[sharp gale]

Time is never well spent when you play wow

[lusty grotto]

doing... grinding

it is, when you have fun

[sharp gale]

Ik it’s just to mention the game I want to waste my time in

[lusty grotto]

dw though thats coming back in midnight

[daring marlin]

GOOD MORNING PROT FRENS

[lusty grotto]

but at least youll get crests doing actual content

[undone beacon]

Good morning guilford!

[lusty grotto]

better get ready for that 50 crest cost to upgrade from 5/6 to 6/6

[sharp gale]

The only thing which was a pain for me was alts, the only content I didn’t enjoy was korthia

[lusty grotto]

i had multiple alts

and i did the chores on them too

[round pendant]

wow sux

[sharp gale]

I had 2 char and at the end patch I had almost every classes bc we were in nyalotha for almost a year

[gusty hearth]

Wow only sucks if u dont play all 3 specs of warr

[lusty grotto]

i had 3 active alts at all times until DF, where i dropped to two

and then TWW where i dropped to one

[sharp gale]

So it really was your guilty pleasure

[lusty grotto]

hell in Legion i had more cause i ran 6 classes through mage tower

chores? not a pleasure at all

the more time passes the more i regret it

[sharp gale]

But I wish the grinds content looked more like thorgast or chaos dungeon in Lost Ark

Maybe I have to add, bfa is the first expansion I actually played, before I only did the leveling and quit each expansions, everyone loves their first expansion whatever it is

It is scarred in their brain

[lusty grotto]

thats nostalgia

i enjoyed vanilla

doesnt mean i would do it again

or that it isnt better now

you liked the moments, not the game

[sharp gale]

No I mean, you enjoy the content at that time too

[lusty grotto]

at that time

sure

not now

[sharp gale]

Nostalgia is you enjoy now the old content bc you were a kid

Ppl who have nostalgia for vanilla enjoys classic today

[lusty grotto]

no

thats not nostalgia

nostalgia is thinking something like classic could be the same thing as vanilla was

and its not

it was a product of its time

if you enjoy classic now youre having new experiences

[solid sun]

I think nostalgia is that prophet fella

[sharp gale]

It is the same game, a bad one

[lusty grotto]

classic players with nostalgia get hit with the "everything is figured out" wall relatively quickly

[sharp gale]

Vanilla already was bad

[lusty grotto]

and the parse gatekeeping etc

[solid sun]

Is that fair

[lusty grotto]

they quit extremely quickly

[upbeat plover]

You just had to be there

[solid sun]

Vanilla wasn’t bad for the time period it was released in

[upbeat plover]

pepesmoke

[lusty grotto]

right, it was a product of its time

[sharp gale]

Having no comparison possible doesn’t mean not bad

[solid sun]

I should have replied specifically to happy

[lusty grotto]

i dont think thats fair either

it was fine in the moment

a huge improvement over Everquest

and i know cause i played both

[solid sun]

It did what it set out to accomplish

[lusty grotto]

but that does not mean i would do it again

because like happy said, there's more than enough to compare to after 21 years

[sharp gale]

But I agree I’m not right when I say bad

[toxic pewter]

the maintenance within continues on

the maintenance saga

cant wait for next expansion 'world of warcraft: maintenance extended until midnight'

[sharp gale]

It’s more of tbc I’m really up against

[lusty grotto]

im not really against classic as a whole im glad it exists

its just not for me

my biggest problem is with the whole remaking/remastering thing the industry has and obviously that includes classic in some way

there's less new stuff coming out and more of the same

[sharp gale]

It’s not for me but I’m easily baited by the debate

As with everything

[lusty grotto]

granted there's some good remakes like FF7 and shit

also not limited to video games, movies too

[mighty valley]

yeah like, "new artist wants to do a take on an old story" has existed forever and is cool

[sharp gale]

Idk I watch the same movies every year, I’m not in the team against remaster/remake or even for new movies

[mighty valley]

it's just when all the investment forces are saying "we are scared. new stuff might not make money. we just don't know because it didn't make money in the past. please make old thing that people already like. but also make it feel new. cheaply."

[lusty grotto]

its more about rereleases

cause remaking can yield some good shit

like Dune, for example

[upbeat plover]

Just depends on the intentions

[sharp gale]

Skyrim Gold Microwave edition.

[upbeat plover]

Some people hop on an IP because they think it's a free success

[round pendant]

It's not bad even now

[upbeat plover]

Because if they made something themselves it would suck.
But the ultimate result is ruining the IP

[solid sun]

I had fun with the anniversary vanilla server I dabbled in

I didn’t find it bad

But I wouldn’t play it forever

[round pendant]

Being able to play something forever isn't what makes it good

Vanilla is a good ass game

It doesn't have the complex gameplay or seasonal content to make it last

[sharp gale]

But I don’t find it good, maybe it’s close to my popcorn movie category I have in mind

[round pendant]

but the game itself is great

And it's not nostalgia for me because I didn't play it when I was younger

thought ig you could say I have nostalgia for the time period and how games were designed back then

[upbeat plover]

Not everyone has the same taste

[solid sun]

I enjoy chicken Alfredo

[upbeat plover]

But the leveling and RPG elements of classic are far superior to what they are now

[solid sun]

I have exquisite taste

[upbeat plover]

Wow now is better for endgame and competition/meta if that's your vibe

[round pendant]

yep

hesright

[upbeat plover]

Always am

[solid sun]

No you foster racist chats

[round pendant]

yknow I never rated a game worse because there's no future updates coming or I can't play it for an eternity

[solid sun]

You are a mean planet eater

[round pendant]

I take the experience I have and think

did I enjoy that?

Was it kino?

[lusty grotto]

classic is garbage now

sorry

[round pendant]

and that's it

[upbeat plover]

Asking someone what their race is, isn't racist

[lusty grotto]

end of story

[upbeat plover]

smadge

[lusty grotto]

if you didnt play it you will feel otherwise

but it is garbage

now

so im with Happy on this one, as long as it applies to now

[upbeat plover]

I will go horn hunting

[round pendant]

Why would I feel otherwise I'm confused

I've played classic in recent years

it's good still

[solid sun]

Is this like rich people who go hunting on horseback

With other rich people

Because of how rich you are

[round pendant]

so

[sharp gale]

Leveling is a good experience in classic yes bc it has no involvement required, it is chill, cookie clicker type of effect. For the RPG element idk I never understood where is the rpg part of wow tbf, but it is a me issue dw

[upbeat plover]

Yes

[round pendant]

If I like it and I played it when I was younger -> It's bad actually you just have nostalgia

If I like it and I didn't play it when I was younger -> well.. you'd like it but it's still bad

[lusty grotto]

its a new concept for you

[solid sun]

Dang can I be rich too

[upbeat plover]

I mean it's not quite that level lmao

[lusty grotto]

i didnt say you had nostalgia

[upbeat plover]

But not every game is supposed to be some uber challenge or something

[round pendant]

no I'm just saying no matter what my experience with the game is, it's used against my position

[lusty grotto]

im not arguing against you at all

[upbeat plover]

Also, back in the classic days we played on toasters with dial up internet so it was a lot harder back then

[solid sun]

You know trying to hit max level on the hardcore server is pretty exhilarating

[upbeat plover]

[lusty grotto]

we can have different opinions

[sharp gale]

I meant on the effect on the brain, not actually playing wow is the same mechanics as cookie clicker

[lusty grotto]

classic is still garbage

thats mine

and thats it

[upbeat plover]

Yes. Make sure to bring me

Because I'm sitting in a cubicle rn

[toxic pewter]

i am rich in waht matters in dis lyfe

money

'

[round pendant]

Classic levelling is dumber than retail? have you played retail? you could have half your brain scooped out and still succeed

[undone beacon]

All this because of BFA islands

[upbeat plover]

Well classic just felt a lot more role play'ie

[solid sun]

Classic remix would be so funny tbh

[upbeat plover]

More like a world, than a game

[round pendant]

Yeah cause classic had rpg elements

[toxic pewter]

i can get from 1 to 80 before a classic dude has to walk from org to xroads

[upbeat plover]

You start so much shit you know that?

[undone beacon]

I know im a rabblerouser

[solid sun]

Do you think team nochanges would be mad at classic remix

[toxic pewter]

hell yeh they would

[solid sun]

Or would they leave it alone because it’s a different game mode

[round pendant]

I mean you're basically saying that anyone on the side of liking classic is basically on some copium

[upbeat plover]

2nd option

Cuz it'd be retail classic lmao

[round pendant]

that's all I'm arguing against, idc if you like classic or not nim

[fathom oasis]

I think people are free to not like classic

[sharp gale]

It is the same dumb level, less inputs but irrelevant for my thought

[fathom oasis]

Much like some people dont like osrs

[solid sun]

Yeah I agree. Probably second option. Leland is so right

[fathom oasis]

Yet others play the shit out of osrs

[toxic pewter]

first thing i wake upo every mornin thank G-d i am not a classic player

[lusty grotto]

no youre putting words into what i said

[solid sun]

Let’s just get a little daddy down here

Cmon daddies let’s chill

[round pendant]

I don't really know how else to read it

but it's not that big a deal

[upbeat plover]

Why is everyone your dad?

[lusty grotto]

its good for people that are gonna have a new experience with it

thats not copium

at all

[solid sun]

Wait

That’s the wrong video

https://youtube.com/shorts/SKyAVoePYQo?si=oEgHmUqORFLZl112

There you go

[upbeat plover]

Lmfao

[toxic pewter]

who here like taco bell

[undone beacon]

Need a little daddy down

[sharp gale]

Yeah I will not understand, the first time I played was on wotlk, already at that expansion I’m unsure to see it

[solid sun]

Everybody could use a little daddy down sometimes

[upbeat plover]

Ain't no one going down on daddy

[round pendant]

https://tenor.com/view/twink-cat-twink-get-more-twinks-on-my-screen-screen-gif-5535107344679470536

[solid sun]

The other video I posted is funny too

[undone beacon]

https://tenor.com/view/zombielandsaga-sakura-minamoto-xd-gif-627758404327754450

[upbeat plover]

I watched both. In order. First had me confused

[round pendant]

I cba explaining my point but I'll just take your argument in good faith

I'm learnding

[round pendant]

rude

[solid sun]

I think dude’s chat has a high libido in ffxiv

[fathom oasis]

Role play elements are those that make you feel more connected to how it would feel to actually play that character.

Usually opposite of convenience, i fell:

• you need reagents to use spells, typical of rpgs
• the world is huge and you actually need to spend a long time traveling
• your class does things that no other class can
• quests are more about the story behind it than just a step to gain exp

I think those are some examples

I feel*

[round pendant]

That guy instantly outs himself as an idiot

[lusty grotto]

that quickly fades after wrath though so...

[upbeat plover]

No, not the word!

[mighty valley]

yeah once people had played wow vanilla for a long time, their motivations shifted from "i like being in the world of warcraft, seeing stuff and growing stronger" and into "i need to get to the REAL GAME as soon as possible"

there are things that we have lost but the players changed. oh well

[lusty grotto]

im not saying the RPG element is not a factor just to be clear

it 500% is

[fathom oasis]

Yeah, i feel the fun of the rpg elements tend to fade and become inconveniences for a lot of people

[lusty grotto]

just saying classic Cata and beyond? uhh...

[round pendant]

Which is where a lot of people say WoW started losing a lot of it's charm

[solid sun]

Bring back ammo

[fathom oasis]

Ammo is an rpg element too, much like reagents

[round pendant]

I still kinda liked Cata though but I didn't play it much

[fathom oasis]

True

[round pendant]

It's not that good nowadays tho

[solid sun]

I want all my bag space taken up by ammo for my boomstick

[round pendant]

I guess I kinda forgot classic cata and classic mop were a thing

fwiw when I'm arguing for classic I'm talking vanilla, tbc, wrath

[lusty grotto]

wrath and cata did start the shift into the real game being the end game

[fathom oasis]

Yeah

[round pendant]

and wrath is a lil bit of a stretch it just had a sick story arc and vibes

[fathom oasis]

Tbc kinda started it with gating stuff after lvl 70

[lusty grotto]

yeah but it had the roots of it

[sharp gale]

Realism ≠ roleplay

[round pendant]

what

[fathom oasis]

Eh

Not all realism is roleplay, but most roleplay has some realism to it

[round pendant]

Realism's function is immersion, which aids roleplay vibes

[fathom oasis]

Given it's all a fanatasy world and all

[sharp gale]

Immersion is self contained, and ammo is not the realism I’m thinking, idk where it brings immersion

[fathom oasis]

Makes you feel like a hunter, preparing before hunting your prey

[mighty valley]

wow used to have a lot of prep -> adventure -> return in the loop

[fathom oasis]

Yeah

[mighty valley]

oh my bags are full, i'd better go back to town

[round pendant]

I think a classic+ with more horizontal gear progression could be cool

idk how I'd execute it tho

to keep people playing long term

it's not like osrs with skills that take 200 hours to max

[fathom oasis]

Now: my bags are full, let me magically summon a mammoth and sell stuff to this random guy riding it with me

[solid sun]

We need survival elements so we can have sick moments where like someone forgot to eat and now they’re trying to kill the boss before they pass out from hunger

[mighty valley]

i think if they kept making a classic+ it would slowly sand off a lot of that stuff the same way they did the first time around

[fathom oasis]

Wow but with hunger and thirst

[mighty valley]

and then there would be a demand for classic++

[sharp gale]

You already have 5 bags, and swords in them, don’t.

[fathom oasis]

And your character actually pooping in between wipes too

[round pendant]

I think it's a bit of a fallacious argument

osrs is proof that you can keep something to the same vibe as the original while expanding it without losing what gives it it's vibe

[solid sun]

Bodacious

[round pendant]

But we have the benefit of hindsight, we can avoid the drastic changes like the fork in the road that is wrath's design

[solid sun]

https://tenor.com/view/tmnt-michelangelo-bodacious-concept-great-concept-teenage-mutant-ninja-turtles-gif-8725963681468585408

[fathom oasis]

Thing is

Where do you draw the line between convenience and roleplay

[coarse bay]

Ya, SOD proves that they can do classic+, I agree with DaddyYam

[fathom oasis]

Everyone has a different threshold I feel

[solid sun]

Whatever gets us away from raid splits

I’ve never done one in my life so it doesn’t impact me at all but get them out

[mighty valley]

the resources needed to maintain and update osrs are orders of magnitude lower than wow

[solid sun]

You’ve never even seen an order of magnitude

How do you know

[fathom oasis]

I love when people hate on top level raiders, as if the game is worse because of them existing

"Yo, fuck these elite gamers"

[coarse bay]

Tbf splits only affects like the top 50 guilds in the world

[solid sun]

If we can’t have ammo we can’t have raid splits

Simple as

[sharp gale]

To me I’m not really sure what is roleplay bc when I’m thinking on where I considered myself being my character, plenty of weird examples come to mind, mostly bc kid

[solid sun]

I am unsure where you’re going with this. It’s my understanding top level raiders also hate raid splits

[fathom oasis]

Have you ever played dungeons and dragons?

[sharp gale]

Like I thought I was crash bandicoot when I played it

[round pendant]

That's literally irrelevant

How does that have anything to do with the design direction of the game

[lusty grotto]

budgeting

work costs money

[fathom oasis]

You can argue that it doesnt play that big a role, but it's no doubt relevant

[lusty grotto]

literally everything does

[round pendant]

It wasn't resources that made Jagex create a whole rework of the combat that made half the playerbase quit

[sharp gale]

Yes but wow is not really close to dungeon and dragon, the only part would be turn base since vanilla was that basically, with server ticks

[round pendant]

it was a decision

Not to mention I'm advocating a less is more approach

[coarse bay]

I have no idea how the classic side operates, but I’d imagine if they cut down on all of the different classic versions, theyd have the dev space to continue a sod/classic+ if they saw enough money in it

[fathom oasis]

If it had cost him 100million dollars to do so (extreme example to highlight money's importance) he wouldnt have done it would he

[mighty valley]

you're still advocating a 3rd branch of wow, someone has to make the case that this would bring in enough new/lapsed players to be worth the cost

[fathom oasis]

If wow is hard to modify, though, I think that's on blizzard for not mantaining a proper developer workforce/tools

[round pendant]

Right I mean

I didn't say anything about classic+ viability as a whole

idk if it's worth the money or resources to get a team to do it

I just think the concept could work and be cool

[mighty valley]

the osrs case is different because they went "oops we lost all our players. maybe if we just give them the old one we can get some back"

[fathom oasis]

Ive seen private servers change things in days, that wouldve taken blizzard months

[solid sun]

We can just derail classic and create classic+.

[coarse bay]

Im pretty sure thats just a big corporation thing, they cant just push stuff through

[solid sun]

Nimchip said classic sucked so we don’t need that one

[mighty valley]

i've got really bad news for you about the entire history of the video game industry

[sharp gale]

It is mostly on the game engine, and the impossibility to change it

[round pendant]

That's just how it be in big companies

[lusty grotto]

i also said i dont think its a bad thing it exists Rhino

[fathom oasis]

Look at sod though

Is that a big company?

That was like an actual indie project

[solid sun]

We gotta make room for new classic though

It’s the only way

[round pendant]

My whole point is. It was SOMEONE's decision to take the "wrong" (debatable) turn in wrath into leaning less on the rpg experience of classic and more on the big set pieces endgame stuff

[fathom oasis]

And the impact sod had cannot be understated

[round pendant]

and maybe money was a factor in the sense that it's big and exciting and attracts more subs

but I think it made the game worse

[solid sun]

I think everyone agrees sod makes a huge impact on how good your yard looks

[mighty valley]

was probably a reaction to the awful mishmash of tbc, where they brought back a bunch of big name story characters and then threw them in the trash compactor

[coarse bay]

Idk if decisions in wrath were a bad turn, but it’s bad for games to remain stagnant and theyre always looking to change, even if everything seems fine

[fathom oasis]

Really? For me as a kid it was absolutely awesome that you got to fight characters I played in wc3

[mighty valley]

continuing the story of wc3 was a big part of the promise that drew people to wow, and they did kinda need increased story fidelity to do justice to arthas, their biggest guy

[fathom oasis]

Wotlk was the pinnacle of that

(To me as a kid, again)

Let me throw a wild question to the wind

What % of the population do you think read through quests in the original vanilla release

[round pendant]

yeah and I don't think the increased story fidelity is necessary bad, I just think it cost a bit much elsewhere

[mighty valley]

low%

[round pendant]

but the more I think about it

[fathom oasis]

And what % do you think reads through them in retail nowadays

[round pendant]

the more I think vanilla was just an accident

[solid sun]

Idk that continuing the story was a big draw

[mighty valley]

similarly low%

[solid sun]

I think being a daddy within the world was the big draw

[mighty valley]

there can be more than one big draw for different kinds of players

[round pendant]

I think it was low in vanilla but near-zero in retail

[mighty valley]

i think yam's implying that wow felt better when you weren't a Big Daddy

[round pendant]

Vanilla also had environmental story telling

[fathom oasis]

I remember not even knowing what an addon was and reading the quests to figure out where the objective could be lol

[solid sun]

It definitely felt better when we weren’t big daddies

Imo

[fathom oasis]

Maybe other people were better at finding questie-likes

[coarse bay]

Thats just a diff era more than a game thing

[solid sun]

Just being a regular daddy is enough

[round pendant]

idk it's hard to describe

[mighty valley]

you could kind of tell how few people were engaging with quests in that way by how often people screamed in trade chat for where to find quest steps

[round pendant]

and I'm stupid

so

I didn't play back then

I only played vanilla vanilla in recent years

[fathom oasis]

Historically that was for quests that gave you no clue

[round pendant]

but I remember everyone could barely complete basic quests in osrs back in the day

[undone beacon]

Vanilla wasnt innundated with guides, resources, and content creators so a lot of the charm and appeal was discovering things yourself

[kind talon]

What do you guys think is the best looking horde/allied race for Warrior transmogs?

[round pendant]

because we were all dumb kiddos

[fathom oasis]

Mankriks wife quest tells you nothing about where the fk she is

Same with raptor silver

[undone beacon]

Goblin best race (no bias), if you want horde allied then Zandy Troll looks good in plate

[coarse bay]

It was back when you bought guides in book/magazine form LOL

[fathom oasis]

Some of the most prominent quests in barrens chat

[sharp gale]

That’s more of a roleplay thing I can grasp

[round pendant]

Human Male or Orc Female because they have the best skeletons to prevent clipping and other weird things

[mighty valley]

sure, some quests gave you nothing, but there were tons of quests around stormwind where people straight up did not read the text

[solid sun]

And then in sod when we had to find the rune things everyone was chomping at the bit for guides to reveal locations

[fathom oasis]

That's definitely one of the most heavy rpg aspects i agree

[mighty valley]

or like. thought they did. they skimmed it and the quest text/objective text was not optimized for skim reading like it became

[sharp gale]

But I played wotlk I didn’t experience it

[fathom oasis]

As soon as you install questie that's gone

[round pendant]

I will say it again, the A->B quests in retail are fucking atrocious

[mighty valley]

"roleplay" isn't a great word for it... players subconsciously live in a fantasy of what they're doing in a video game whether they intend to or not

[round pendant]

worse than ANY "kill 100 wolves til you get 3 wolf paws" quest in classic

the only upside is they're low friction so it's easy to just forget about em

[sharp gale]

I think it is gone forever, whatever you do, the info drop on a text block in that form is just bad, today

[undone beacon]

I mean modern questing design is just different. Retail questing is about moving the story along whereas a lot of classic questing was “do these expected tasks that a random mercenary might do”

[fathom oasis]

Imo if wow had held on to it's rpg side rather than move on with convenience it wouldve actually died

The market was changing rapidly

[undone beacon]

Classic had a lot of go from A to B quests but it was more like, hey man can you deliver this letter cuz I’m stuck at this outpost vs you need to report to the big name NPC so you can save the town!!

[sharp gale]

Thank god text blocks in FF14 are cut per sentences and more wide, it is still archaic imo

[solid sun]

I don’t think the current quests are void of “roleplay”

We are just a different character now

[round pendant]

Classic A->Bs were also just natural flows through the zones

whereas retail A->Bs are like, we gotta use up this whole playground for the main story quest

[coarse bay]

I also dont think questing is the only form of rpg fwiw

[round pendant]

put some shit here, and some shit here, etc

[undone beacon]

Ehhhhh I wouldn’t say that for a lot of them honestly. Go from barrens to org to feralas in 20 levels back to org to silithus at cap

[round pendant]

but there's nothing happening in those areas beyond listen to NPCs yap and clicking and few glowing objects

[coarse bay]

I can role play and put myself in the shoes of my character in any game without paying attention to or caring about a story

[round pendant]

TWW main story questing experience actually made me mad at how bad it was

[fathom oasis]

The worst design of A->B imo is when there is a continuation but you cant do it because you are at B and didn't grab A

[mighty valley]

vanilla quests were pretty haphazard in a lot of zones. did help them feel "natural" but sometimes they were just... woefully insufficient lol

[sharp gale]

Character creation = I can roleplay if the game is that good

[fathom oasis]

There should be a way to get to B and get told A leads to it

[solid sun]

Yeah everytime I log in I roleplay a person trying to catch up to how great daddy cam is

No quests needed

[round pendant]

You're doing lots of stuff in those areas tho

[coarse bay]

I sometimes log in and just sit in dorn wishing daddy rhino was around to carry me

[round pendant]

idk maybe I'm cooked

I'm too stupid to explain things

[undone beacon]

Last time I leveled through classic leveling it did not feel like there was much going on in any of the areas that felt relevant. Heres a hub with 5 quests to go to different corners of the zone and kill 30 quilboar/ogres/bugs type beat

[fathom oasis]

If Sally from Tirisfal tells me I need to help her mommy in Hillsbrad, I'd like her mom to tell me that she has a daughter in Hillsbrad she hasnt heard from in a long time

[round pendant]

I wish I could just insert my intuitive understanding into your noggins so I didn't have to explain myself

[coarse bay]

Ive never once played a game for story

[sharp gale]

There are things you need to give up bc sandbox doesn’t exist

[undone beacon]

Which like, that works but its not exactly better or worse than modern's "go here and do a few tasks and then go there and do more tasks" across a zone

[fathom oasis]

That way you can go to Tirisfal and talk to Sally if you hadnt at that point

[round pendant]

Which is very rpg-ey

You're doing tasks for people and their problems

[solid sun]

TWW had a bunch of quests to introduce the rock dwarfs to us

Part of the achievement to unlock them

[round pendant]

Story quests in retail feel like padding

go to NPC, click some meaningless shit, go to next npc, listen to some yapping, repeat

[solid sun]

That seemed like a pretty rpg thing

[undone beacon]

I mean the main story arc stuff yeah is designed to move a plot along but honestly the sojourner questlines are very RPG

[round pendant]

I didn't do whatever that is

[mighty valley]

i think i get what you're saying yam but "padding" is how i'd describe like half of original wow quests

[fathom oasis]

DF had a lot of good RPG quests

[mighty valley]

oh shit, there's nothing to do in this whole zone. have a guy who has three consecutive "kill rock guys" quests

just to try and have something here

[fathom oasis]

The one with the dwarf was a heavy hitter

[solid sun]

Yeah how could 97 out of 100 timberwolves not have spleens? Thats gotta be padding right

[undone beacon]

The side quest chains where you like, help a dwarf with his rams or you help lay a family member to rest or help and orphan avenge her family

Lots of really strong worldbuilding and heartfelt moments but

[mighty valley]

i do think modern wow questing feels overengineered, i just feel like you can see how they got there

[undone beacon]

If you just do the main arc and ram through into endgame without engaging in the world, thats not on blizz

But genuinely the side stories in TWW were really strong

[mighty valley]

every moment of "i don't know where to go" is a data point on some graph of where players stop playing. we'd better make sure what never ever happens again

etc

[fathom oasis]

Thing is, rpg stuff in retail feels so out of place to me sometimes

[sharp gale]

Cinema rpg : nesingwary with his copy pasted 3 step quests

[fathom oasis]

Like putting survival aspects in a car game or sth

[coarse bay]

The questline about when they get too old is sadge

[undone beacon]

banjoe kazooie nuts and bolts

[solid sun]

Super sad!

I felt something

[undone beacon]

Honestly yeah you help the dementia dwarf craft one final lantern

I was sadge

[fathom oasis]

The one about Alzheimer? Rough one that was

[round pendant]

I think I did every quest in every zone, or most of them

because I usually go for the loremaster chieves

I just don't remember

😔

I remember the dementia dwarf

I didn't like that one

Not because it's bad but because it hits a lil too close to home rn lmao

[undone beacon]

I mean, if you take some time to read and engage with them a lot of them were really good imo. Obviously not like the height of cinema but they feel connected to the world in a way a lot of old quests were. Helping people with their problems

[fathom oasis]

I agree

[undone beacon]

I liked the one in Undermine where a goblin got turned into a rat and became a chef

Chef rat

[round pendant]

well this leads into another thing

[fathom oasis]

Theyve been making some really good quests these last few xpacs

[solid sun]

Remember when the Gobbo area opened up and there was a quest about like a rodent knight daddy

[round pendant]

The actual mechanisms you go through to complete the quests trivalises them

[mighty valley]

yeah i agree. the main story of tww drove me nuts but there's a lot of good stuff on the margins

[undone beacon]

Knight of the wax table or something was great

[round pendant]

Flying from the get-go was and is a mistake

[lusty grotto]

highly disagree

[undone beacon]

I mean, does killing 50 wolves to get 8 paws make a quest more engaging?

[round pendant]

yes

[fathom oasis]

The gobo area with the car "minigame" was actually fun hahah

But a bit annoying at times

[solid sun]

Welp

[undone beacon]

Interesting take

[round pendant]

because in retail it's like

[solid sun]

We just different daddies at this point

[fathom oasis]

Oof

[round pendant]

You accept a quest, even if you read the dialogue

[fathom oasis]

That's just gambling with extra steps

[round pendant]

You hop on your mount and zip across the zone in 2 seconds

do the first objective

[fathom oasis]

Same mechanism arpgs use

[round pendant]

then you look at your map

repeat

you're not in the world at all imo

[lusty grotto]

dont care

the game isnt questing

[undone beacon]

But walking for 5 minutes to kill wolves for 10 minutes to walk back for 5 minutes doesn't make me feel engaged with that quest, it makes me not want to do it because thats a pain in the ass

[round pendant]

Well we're talking about the quality of the questing

[solid sun]

Tbh if I kill 83 wolves to collect wolf reagents I’m zoning out and watching something on my other monitor

So I wouldn’t be in the world then either

[lusty grotto]

flying didnt diminish good quests like the dementia dwarf

and thats a good ass fucking quest

[fathom oasis]

If you ask me to kill 40 wolves they better respawn fast or have many spawns/wide area

[undone beacon]

I will agree I think the overall impact of flying from the get-go is something to consider. Honestly if they said flying was unlocked by hitting cap that wouldn't bother me

[fathom oasis]

If you make me stand around until they pop up im gone

[undone beacon]

It doesn't diminish the quest quality imo but it does cut down on the sense of scale for the world

[fathom oasis]

Mop did this pretty well imo

First character has to walk

[lusty grotto]

i wouldn't be opposed to it Pash, but not flying doesnt really add anything

[fathom oasis]

Every character after can fly

[undone beacon]

My counter to this is the spider city from Az'kahet. Its very clearly designed to be like suramar with all the little secrets and mechanics, but you can just... fly over everything

[round pendant]

Just being forced to traverse the world goes a long way to making you feel like it's an actual world you're exploring

[fathom oasis]

I definitely get to see more of a map when i travel by ground spec now with zoomy dragon riding

[round pendant]

with flying the world is just a backdrop

[solid sun]

I’ve never understood why flying didn’t just open at max level. It doesn’t need to be anything complicated. Just explain it as needing to properly explore or smth before you can fly and it opens at max

[lusty grotto]

and people that want to explore it do so with flying in, i did

[round pendant]

I barely remember any zones in DF and TWW

I remember key points like walrus soup guys

[mighty valley]

they took a stab at zones designed to be interesting with flying in tww, at least everything after the first one. ymmv if it actually helped

[fathom oasis]

Df first zone was gorgeous

[round pendant]

TWW was better

[undone beacon]

Which is fair, but its hard to deny it diminishes the experience. Compare it to suramar with the portal networks, the disguises, the city-specific perks and upgrades. They tried again with spidertown but it doesnt hit the same

Theres so many items to buy with kej that interact with things in that city nobody touches

[lusty grotto]

you cant just force "the experience"

[mighty valley]

the gambit with df was that having a new kind of flying was novel, plus your actual traversal power started out low and went up as you explored

[lusty grotto]

that you know of

[round pendant]

Meanwhile I remember so many zones in classic that I can play wow geoguesser and hit shit down to the meter

and I can't exactly describe what to attribute that to

[sharp gale]

i really liked the previous achievement = flying, but i'm unsure if i would like it after ALWAYS flying

[undone beacon]

How many of you bought any of the kej items to open new tunnels or disrupt guard pheremones in Azj'kahet

[round pendant]

That's a thing?

[lusty grotto]

i did

[fathom oasis]

Required too much of a rep grind

[solid sun]

I bought the pheromone disrupters but then decided I don’t need them

[fathom oasis]

Fuck time gated rep grinds

[mighty valley]

none, i honestly barely did zone content this expansion after hitting max level

[undone beacon]

But why did you bother buying them when you can fly over all the guards?

[fathom oasis]

That's a hill im willing to die on

[round pendant]

and now imagine if everyone was forced to do it, they'd remember the content

crazy

[sharp gale]

i'm not against timegated stuff

[fathom oasis]

Either no rep grind, of rep grind you can do at your leisure

[lusty grotto]

i had everything down there, even the tradeskill thing

[fathom oasis]

Time gated rep grinds are a scourge

[undone beacon]

I think its clear they spent time designing an experience that was circumvented by other systems in the game, which is a consequence of being such a system rich game

[round pendant]

nah fuck dragonriding

[undone beacon]

You can go out of your way to engage with it as intended, but thats like telling yam to just turn off their flying mount and walk everywhere if they want that experience. It doesnt address the underlying onus

[mighty valley]

it's kinda sad, almost every zone has someone's little pet project in it that most people don't look at

revendreth had its own currency... thing...

[undone beacon]

I personally do go out of my way to walk the roads of the zones because its cool and engaging to me

[fathom oasis]

Fuck SL zones

[undone beacon]

Infused Rubies my beloved

[sharp gale]

revendreth was so cool

[mighty valley]

yeah i won't hear revendreth slander

[fathom oasis]

Why did we have to NPC fly accross zones and WHY did it have through Oribos every time and be so slow

Zones were cool, their interconnection was stupid

[undone beacon]

All of SL should've just been the maw and the maw jr and the maw jr 2

[mighty valley]

maw the 3rd

[round pendant]

Yeah and then the game's designed in that way and they see that nobody's doing this stuff so they'll put less resources into it next time

[fathom oasis]

The maw definitely did a great job with the rpg side

Roleplaying actual hell

[mighty valley]

then someone on prot warrior discord calls that stuff "slop"

[sharp gale]

but korthia = bad for me

[round pendant]

The quests might have cool stories and the zones are pretty

but I feel like it's all devolved into just looking at your objective, flying over to spot in 2 nanoseconds and clicking the glowing yellow thing

and not actually engaging with anything

and that's shit

[fathom oasis]

I love exploring Korthia and finding the specific events for my covenant

[round pendant]

Now you could say "just don't play like that"

[mighty valley]

that is how most people play classic now too tbf, just install a questing addon and follow the arrow

[round pendant]

But with everybody playing like that, the quests get dumbed down into "just click the thing"

[fathom oasis]

Now, checking daily on the quest givers to see if they offered a random transmog item? Who the fuck's idea was that

[round pendant]

and it becomes not fun to do them, I barely even get to kill shit in the world when questing

it's like 10% of the experience

and it's just pull the whole area and aoe it down

[sharp gale]

idk the theme didn't catch me, it was too much cheap maw jr

[round pendant]

yeah and it makes me sad every time I see that addon lmao

I think it's fair to use it if you're levelling your like 20th orc warrior or something tho

[mighty valley]

i have more respect for the old school "go to thottbot dot com and scroll through the quest comments til you find a helpful one"

[sharp gale]

what should i find if i search thottbot.com ?

[round pendant]

wowhead is what you'll find

[mighty valley]

yeah it's the precursor

[undone beacon]

wow, head?!

[solid sun]

Libido

[sharp gale]

oh it actually is wowhead

[upbeat plover]

It unfortunately does not provide thots

[sharp gale]

yeah i expected gold, i found copper

[round pendant]

Quest Helper in osrs is kinda dire too

at least when people read guides for it there was enough friction there to kinda get what was going on

even if you're a spacebar holder

but because quest helper exists, everyone just uses that