Or can we still have WA suites
#protection
nocturne spindle
i cant wait for like
round pendant
Or can we still have WA suites
I won't be playing without it
nocturne spindle
addons to start reading say chat for cooldowns
and everyone to constantly be spamming
frosty mango
They are basically saying that any combat related logic will no longer work
round pendant
Part of what I enjoy about wow is making my own ui and wa packs and stuff
nocturne spindle
for a week until its nerfed
round pendant
if they kill that shit it's over
frosty mango
So basically you can see what the UI sees
jagged pier
yes
frosty mango
Based on what they are saying it won’t break cd trackers
But would break for example the arcane mage arcane barrage auras
Or basically all of the liquid auras
round pendant
so my crimson tempest WA that tracks how many targets I applied it to last cast
won't work?
that's cringe
mighty valley
they clearly would love to get to a no addons world, just gonna be taking bites out of what exists as they can
frosty mango
That would? I think? You know you cast it and you know the value - it doesn’t perform any logic it just displays data
And based on their post that’s ok?
It will be clear once they send info out to addon devs
nocturne spindle
yea i think the way they worded it was anything you could theoretically see in your UI
is fine
which is like 99% of weakauras
round pendant
yeah I mean
I can't think of anything I use that relies on stuff you're not really supposed to know
frosty mango
What this will probably break is a lot of plater functionality
mighty valley
this sounds like it's just killing WAs that can parse combat events and give you assignments/positioning/etc based on that
nocturne spindle
the only thing that im unsure of is like, dungeon weakaura packs and CD trackers for non boss abilities
frosty mango
I think that is what most people will feel the most
wild merlin
how's netherprism
nocturne spindle
because like MAYBE you could consider a mobs CD not known information
frosty mango
the only thing that im unsure of is like, dungeon weakaura packs and CD trackers...
Most of the liquid/ns/causee packs will almost definitely stop working
nocturne spindle
idk
round pendant
this sounds like it's just killing WAs that can parse combat events and give you...
killing CLEU will break some innocent things tho
nocturne spindle
as long as my UI can scream at me when my rages hits 100 i think ill be okay
frosty mango
Like for example for fractilus it determines where to send you based on your assigned position and it communicates with the other auras to handle overlaps
mighty valley
as long as my UI can scream at me when my rages hits 100 i think ill be okay
i'll come to your house and scream at you when rage hits 100 if you like
frosty mango
The underlying comms and logic will prob not work
nocturne spindle
aight ill DM you my address
undone beacon
Theyre baking in improved nameplates so, plater is probably dead in the water
granite pond
Hell I’d still use plater just for the cosmetic options. Ain’t no way the baked in nameplates have the same font and look options
granite pond
Rip avatar?
undone beacon
its in prot tree now
granite pond
Ah
vague trout
god damn this talent tree has enough loose branches to be carniferous
undone beacon
fury gets a true cheat death before us
"If you are not victorious, you die" is pretty metal text though
vague trout
"If you are not victorious, you die" is pretty metal text though
Deeply unserious talent.
I'm taking it in every single build I don't give a shit what's meta
undone beacon
Its also barely a cheat, more like that old dk ability where they came back as a ghoul for a bit after death
When our fury warr stands in shit in the first 30 seconds of a fight he still dies, its just... delayed cuz hes so pissed
warm plinth
Hmm, anyone notice that AM does not have shield wall mentioned?
undone beacon
Hmm, anyone notice that AM does not have shield wall mentioned?
We have
warm plinth
Just now got a chance to start looking at this stuff
undone beacon
They took defensive CDRs away from a lot of tanks
vague trout
Hmm, anyone notice that AM does not have shield wall mentioned?
I imagine a lot of it is still tbd. Like a bunch of the buttons in talent trees don't even have costs or cooldowns listed
proven mantle
bob isnt that bad compared to 2x dawnthread right 
warm plinth
Idk what Bob is
hardy snow
im very positively surprised with these talent trees
proven mantle
bob obviously (binding of binding)
undone beacon
build o' bear
hardy snow
they, for once, didnt fucked us
vague trout
im very positively surprised with these talent trees
I like what I imagine the cleaned up versions of these trees to be
warm plinth
I imagine a lot of it is still tbd. Like a bunch of the buttons in talent trees ...
Yeah just making an observation
grizzled nova
they, for once, didnt fucked us
wayyyy to early to say that
At the very least we didn't get maged
poor fucken mages
hardy snow
wayyyy to early to say that
well, I was opening it with a fear that its gona be 
, but it isnt, and thats great
nocturne spindle
i didnt have prot war becoming the raid utility tank on my midnight bingo
can i get a new sheet
warm plinth
Realistically it's hard to say what's fucked and not fucked. If addons can no longer do anything real time in combat, the game at its core has to change drastically.
warm plinth
Things that in the current game state would be tragic may be whatever in the new wow
manic shoal
Is there any situation where Fueled by violence is played over Burtal Vitality
warm plinth
It does not matter
vague trout
anger management getting btfo'd feels bad
Confession: I didn't like Anger Management
specifically, I didn't like that it only affected some abilities and caused a bunch of desync
grizzled nova
Confession: I didn't like Anger Management
Why not? It's just postive feedback on all your important buttons.
grizzled nova
Yeah but doesn't work on wall and is literally half as good
vague trout
AM just being one button is something I'm totally okay with
nocturne spindle
yea but
its on the button you complain about desyncing still
who cares if shield wall deseyncs
mighty valley
why would you care about "desync" on shield wall haha
warm plinth
Yeah exactly weeshy
vague trout
damn 🙁
manic shoal
Do we have a cutoff for haste? I'm at 50% rn but do I just keep sending?
mighty valley
Do we have a cutoff for haste? I'm at 50% rn but do I just keep sending?
what's your rating
warm plinth
No idea because 50% doesn't mean anything really
grizzled nova
Playing quickly/correctly to maximize AM for more Avatar uptime is like the metric by which pwar is gauged tho, there's very little "sync" consideration here.
You can basically judge how well someone is playing pwar by just looking at their avatar uptime
manic shoal
what's your rating
I will be around 3k in a day
warm plinth
Your haste rating
mighty valley
I will be around 3k in a day
no, your haste rating
warm plinth
Not your m+ rating
nocturne spindle
toooo much haste
vague trout
Further am I stupid question: Did we lose Last Stand, or was that always a baseline ability?
mighty valley
yeah, don't prio haste from here haha
warm plinth
Further am I stupid question: Did we lose Last Stand, or was that always a basel...
It's in the class tree
nocturne spindle
assuming your unbuffed
mighty valley
Further am I stupid question: Did we lose Last Stand, or was that always a basel...
in the current alpha it's now a """cheat death""" passive in the class tree
vague trout
ohhhh, interesting
manic shoal
assuming your unbuffed
No pot no nothing
vague trout
I will complain about this: If they're gonna make us take champion's spear let us choose the targeting for it like Shadowcrash or Earthquake
mighty valley
yeah nvm I had into the fray
that's not a rating increase
manic shoal
Ah okay
mighty valley
how did you lose 3k rating...
mighty valley
26k is a fine place to hover around
mighty valley
oh lmao
nocturne spindle
smh my head
undone beacon
She chaos on my flask
manic shoal
So stay around here?
mighty valley
yeah this is fine
nocturne spindle
yea your fine
manic shoal
oki ty
finite lily
how much crit do we aim for?
manic shoal
I could change the pure fiber thing to crit
nocturne spindle
until somethign else sims higher
warm plinth
Other stats give more damage well before you should actually stop chasing haste.
finite lily
ï have 5,9k vers, 14,5k crit.. which embellishment to pick?
nocturne spindle
grizzled nova
So we lost 4% leech in the class tree, but I guess that's okay because we get both brutal vit and fbv in the spec tree
warm plinth
You're not chasing haste for damage. You're chasing it to allow you to use into the fray instead of ItF
manic shoal
Yeah cause I aint got a lot of crit lmfao
warm plinth
Er
Instead of HR
You can theoretically run ItF as low as 21k haste (before flask) but it will feel most comfortable around 25-27k
shrewd grove
i'm a full vers boy
🤮
warm plinth
13% dr and he only had to spend like 21k stat rating to get it!
solid sun
I’m so hungry
torn gulch
vers hasn't been good since bfa s4
grizzled nova
Using cursed stone idol and antenna, crit is fine
better than giga dring my trinket effects
and parry has massive diminishing returns, I'll take 13% dr against everthing all the time
mighty valley
yeah cmon gang vers is fine lmao
we can push back against "how much vers i need to tank" without saying stat bad
crit is cool and hot though, i will agree there
shrewd grove
The stats fine but I like to crit
warm plinth
I never said it was bad. Stacking any stat just because you want to stack it is bad.
mighty valley
I never said it was bad. Stacking any stat just because you want to stack it is...
What if it brings you joy in a dark world
shrewd grove
I never said it was bad. Stacking any stat just because you want to stack it is...
Im just trying to hit 100% crit. Leave me alone
warm plinth
Then I think you probably need like therapy or something
solid sun
I love stacking W’s
warm plinth
And I wish only the best for you
solid sun
Not stats
mighty valley
we're playing world of warcraft in 2025, we all need therapy
plush tendon
undone beacon
year of the spear is over its shotgun season
warm plinth
I'm assuming the duration numbers are just nonsense at this point
grizzled nova
we can push back against "how much vers i need to tank" without saying stat bad
yeah I mean that question is annoying, most people aren't playing anywhere near the point where it matters, but for my money the extremely minor difference in dps between haste/crit and haste/vers, I'd rather have a lot of vers
it isn't in anyway necessary, but I prefer it
mighty valley
yeah at that point it's feelycraft, it's fine
solid sun
Are we going to do a pwar charter neighborhood
grizzled nova
yeah at that point it's feelycraft, it's fine
kinda? it's dr against things that are dangerous to me and I'd rather that
am I giving up ~1% damage for it? ye, but I'll take 13% magic dr
velvet knot
Dear lord (midnight alpha notes)
undone beacon
Dear lord (midnight alpha notes)
deserved and based
solid sun
Ooo big healer post
mighty valley
patch notes out bye
nocturne spindle
link post
grizzled nova
Dear lord (midnight alpha notes)
accounting for loss of current 4pc, I guess
shrewd grove
Dear lord (midnight alpha notes)
mighty valley
that's kinda crazy
ok the thunder blast buff is the only meaningful change that we didn't already see on the talent tree
undone beacon
awww we were so excited
nocturne spindle
rend being its own button is arms fury as well
grizzled nova
no prot talent?
tf why would they not give that to specifically prot?
vague trout
It's currently a choice node with Intervene in the class true
so either the notes are behind a version or there's some nonsense with it
strong forum
patch notes arent always accurate
undone beacon
resto druid lost their int rip
grizzled nova
yeah so that 100% tb buff doesn't feel out of place, makes up for loss of 4pc and that we can't vo a tb proc
revenge is target capped at 3 targets now?
weird asf for applying deep wounds in aoe
mighty valley
revenge is target capped at 3 targets now?
another talent makes it aoe
and deep wounds is execute only now lol
lotta change
tropic pond
hmm seems not good?
undone beacon
You wanted to send it on SS most of the time anyways, its whatever
warm fern
I hope we still get unstoppable force somehow. Gonna be ass if removed completely
mighty valley
i'd guess each hero talent tree is gonna have something that buffs avatar
or something
although idk, if they've literally just 2x'd Thunder Clap, maybe they don't let Unstoppable Force live
mighty valley
hmm seems not good?
this is good for most players who were sending outburst on TC when they really shouldn't be lol
grizzled nova
hopefully this means that the intial aoe on spear is way way bigger now
mighty valley
oh shit I didn't even realize that it's a pseudo gorefiends now
grizzled nova
trying to hit all the targets with a penny size aoe is annoying
undone beacon
hopefully this means that the intial aoe on spear is way way bigger now
oh thats pretty slick
chrome sapphire
Anger Management will no longer reduce the cooldown of Shield Wall? That feels like a kick in the nuts.
grizzled nova
and it's half as good
unreal yarrow
Spearing in archer mobs, that is actually amazingly. Prot warrior grip. Hell yeah
grizzled nova
the shield wall loss thing is basically just dependent on how blizzard tunes incoming damage, if there's half as much stuff to wall it doesn't really matter
chrome sapphire
Youre right, 10 rage vs 20.
Is the double Shield Wall even worth taking anymore in MN? It turns it into Guardian Druid's 2x Survival Instinct talent
undone beacon
Youre right, 10 rage vs 20.
Is the double Shield Wall even worth taking anymore ...
hehehehe theyre removing that bear talent and giving us two SIs baseline again
grizzled nova
intimidating shout is actually a useful stop again, they swapped the menace effect into baseline, so that's something
tribal wharf
tf
they are trying to brain was pwars into casting more intervene /s
thats my immediate reaction to them there words
chrome sapphire
hehehehe theyre removing that bear talent and giving us two SIs baseline again
See how the Guardian changes pan out, the role tree still looks a bit bloated, but they did thin out the T3 talents.
Might swap back to Guardian, depending on how the two specs feel by release.
shrewd grove
hmm seems not good?
Gonna make log reviews easier for sure lmao
tribal wharf
what why
are they doing conduit energy for set slots?
make it 8 set pieces again then if we doing this route
mighty valley
no it just means once you have 4set you can turn future drops into tier more often
grizzled nova
what why
Because if you can just farm catalyst charges then you're never holding charges for vault
mighty valley
so you don't feel like you need to wait on charges til you get myth items
just send them and get 4p asap
grizzled nova
you just get 4pc as fast as possible and then farm charges whenever you get a track upgrade
tribal wharf
so, this means i can just go in and zug zug gotta go fast the LFR and get 4 piece and quit and GG more set
i would imagine they limit it to you have to get the track i think its called, of normal raid or m0
solid sun
@dusky canopy I need a reaction to the news from today
If you’re too busy to know anything make something up
tribal wharf
that VO might be a good change
solid sun
Poor feral
mighty valley
i want my VO with thunderblast no?, that what give us the dopamine hit
currently you want to do that with tier procs or with a high enough target count but tier procs prolly gone
dusky canopy
If you’re too busy to know anything make something up
||haven’t had anytime to browse really|| the design intentions from the tldrs they posted sounds promising
tribal wharf
cinder nebula
yo im new to prot when i checke for talants on wowhead i was met with 7 of them
jagged pier
so having it as a different talent is pointless
undone verge
theres no point imo, just make it blood and thunder and not a choice node. I really dont think we ever take just rend. Sure it does like 400 more bleed damage, but is the gcd gonna be worth that 400 extra bleed damage?
in st*
undone verge
fair actually
I am very prot and fury oriented so I never care about arms
'I can do this all day' actually seems like a really cool talent
undone verge
so my question is wich is best m+ and st builds atm
https://www.wowhead.com/talent-calc/warrior/protection/mountain-thane/DAPBVUBRFFhIUJoUEQBUNVURVRBUGVRVEVCVAEFVVUCQQ I use this for ST
this for aoe
then for st cleave just drop something and pick up the execute cleave talent
dry skiff
after 1st boss of priory, would it make a difference to chain when there are 2 paladins alive vs 5 paladins alive ?
supposedly casters are dead at that moment
mellow bridge
after 1st boss of priory, would it make a difference to chain when there are 2 p...
yes definitely
lofty warren
Bis pwar midnight talent tree available?
dry skiff
i mean paladins are going to keep casting for 3 minutes anyway
raw parcel
At a glance, the new Midnight talents look pretty cool. They seem to have given up trying to make Fueled by Violence compete with Brutal Vitality and we just get both.
lofty warren
What this mean?
strong forum
cant get knocked back or pushed around
solid sun
anyone have a tier list
S stands for surv hunter
A stands for aff lock
B stands for bear
strong forum
solid sun
Or entirely unmoved in any direction
strong forum
largely unmoved
solid sun
I saw they posted an article about healers
lofty warren
It says it pulls ppl in.. but from like forever away like abom limb?
solid sun
I feel like every expansion now they say healers need to be changed
lofty warren
Also where is the note where they added spell block back plus an apology?
finite lily
guys why dont we just go for ascendance instead of the dusk/dawnthread?
hardy snow
It says it pulls ppl in.. but from like forever away like abom limb?
"affected targets"
mighty valley
Bis pwar midnight talent tree available?
never change, dude
cursive tree
I’m thinking of maining prot warrior in midnight
It’s been since legion since I’ve tanked properly are we lookin pretty good still?
lofty warren
How big is area spear now? It says 8 yeards
mental scarab
@cursive tree we never bad
Just misunderstood
And being autistic I can only play warrior tank, I know I do wrong when my HP drop. Which is not true for other tanks
mighty valley
I’m thinking of maining prot warrior in midnight
It’s been since legion since ...
we're good on live, impossible to predict the outcome of midnight alpha/beta
tawdry cloak
Still waiting for warrior to get bloodlust. Call the talent “Drill Sergeant - at the warrior’s command, all players within the group hasten their abilities by 30%”
tribal wharf
are you stupid or are you fucking blind
its from dives before i get in trouble for somethinglol
vocal flame
I’m thinking of maining prot warrior in midnight
It’s been since legion since ...
They are changing a lot for tanking in general. Gonna be pretty interesting how it plays out.
dry skiff
i dont see any class tunning, what r u guys talking about
lofty warren
Look at wowhead midnight notes out
dry skiff
aa i thought it was for this season
round pendant
hmm seems not good?
actually good
"Blizzard have released an article talking about the design philosophy for class changes in Midnight. Making classes easier and clearer to play, and more approachable, is the main goal."
This doesn't bode well
wow is fun cause of skill ceiling
raw parcel
Anyone know if we'll be able to get all four capstones in the class talent tree? There's no calculator for it yet, that I've found
lofty warren
If you stun a spam caster mob in 12.0 will he keep spamming?
strong forum
we'll find out once m+ testing begins on the beta!
torn gulch
we do not know that yet
jagged pier
Are we meta next expansion? 
torn gulch
lofty warren
Overall what the smart ppls thoughts on pwar 12.0 changes? Sounds interesting to get some more utility with shouts
round pendant
theyre dumbing the game significantly down
Yeah I'll quit if they significantly crush the gap between skill floor and ceiling
it's just cooked at that point
sleek current
Overall what the smart ppls thoughts on pwar 12.0 changes? Sounds interesting to...
Other than the fact they're putting rend spread back into its own talent again... I don't understand that decision.
It's basically a mandatory pick. It's perfect the way it is. 😂
strong forum
read the choice node carefully
its either "tc applies 5 rends, which hit for less"
or manually spread rend among ALL targets which hits for more
sleek current
Ah, sorry. I'm only reading the news post on WoWhead
lofty warren
Fck manually pressing rend
strong forum
sleek current
That makes more sense
lofty warren
Is the number of buttons for ppal going down since last stand is going baseline?
sleek current
Yooo, Battlefield Commander sounds sick though
Specifically Rallying Cry's benefit
round pendant
why the fuck did the soak just one shot me on dimensius
as dps
I get in soak
insta die
no one else died
strong forum
Didn't cap defense and got crit
round pendant
oh I was the only one in the soak
oh wait no
I just stepped in it too early
lmao
charred coral
Is a shield or belt higher priority for crafting?
hardy snow
thats cool
fathom oasis
Is a shield or belt higher priority for crafting?
shield
is literally your first craft
fallow beacon
Has spear changed in radius at all on alpha ptr? New wording isn't exactly clear how big the initial circle is
fathom oasis
shield>weapon>bracer>belt
charred coral
shield>weapon>bracer>belt
thanks
thin silo
holding out hope that this will be the expansion they finally remember to take Demo Shout back off the GCD after their disastrous BfA experimentation with CDs
oak lark
Can anyone tell me what I should get crafted first? I find some conflicting info, Weapon/shield seems obvious? but... maybe not?
I have x2 Runed Crests and working on getting to +7 mythic to get some gilded, but figure I should craft something to help myself out...
lusty grotto
Can anyone tell me what I should get crafted first? I find some conflicting info...
4 lines above someone said what to craft
4 lines above your message
oak lark
Thanks! got it
round pendant
I thought killing addons would be the worst thing about midnight
but holy shit
These changes are something else
lusty grotto
i dont agree
round pendant
I'm not just talking about pwar
lusty grotto
i think it all looks promising, but it depends on execution
lusty grotto
its a change
and all changes have growing pains
and theres nobody more resistant to change than WoW players
sinful copper
and theres nobody more resistant to change than WoW players
What about mormons
round pendant
no comment
lofty warren
What did ion say about addons the wowhead thing had way too many words for me
round pendant
actually no I will comment
mighty valley
What did ion say about addons the wowhead thing had way too many words for me
if pepega installs an addon he will be sent to prison and executed
round pendant
and theres nobody more resistant to change than WoW players
I'm not hating it for changes sake, I'm hating it cause they literally said they're toning down the complexity and their first action is to gut half of every specs stuff
lusty grotto
im fine with it
round pendant
idk why you'd want the gap between the skill floor and ceiling to be tiny
mighty valley
yeah, to reduce complexity, you have to remove stuff
round pendant
unless your whole enjoyment in wow comes from just mount farming or something and you don't actually care about the gameplay
lusty grotto
we're not competing for the WoW olympics
lusty grotto
its still a game
round pendant
yeah and it's not engaging if it has zero complexity
gets boring very fast in fact
round pendant
classic nimchip
mighty valley
yeah there's definitely zero room inbetween current wow and zero complexity
fathom oasis
4 lines above your message
round pendant
yeah there's definitely zero room inbetween current wow and zero complexity
Have you read some of those class changes
lusty grotto
do you want this game to live on? you need to pull people in
less complication means more players
our achievements mean nothing without players
mighty valley
so much of the complexity of many specs is just doing reps until the parts with no interesting decision making become rote
round pendant
more players to consume slop content like delves and pump those sub numbers up meanwhile people who actually stick with the game for decades just get to have their watered down gameplay and like it
solid sun
Or when they get too complex you have a robot tell you when to do what
lofty warren
if pepega installs an addon he will be sent to prison and executed
Omg
lusty grotto
youre just not seeing it the way people do
mighty valley
plus we're going to increasingly need to get used to an addonless world where we're not being fed all decisions into our brains directly
lusty grotto
do you think people wouldn't want to go into keys, but are largely afraid that they'll do well?
what about tank anxiety, etc
you need a sustainable entry point
what we have now IS NOT sustainable
solid sun
When I look at the wowhead page for arcane mage, I just close it and select my warrior again.
lusty grotto
and it keeps getting more complex, without the changes they are promoting
solid sun
I think the idea of specs being more easily approachable and less complex means that the game itself can offer challenges in other ways that allow me to approach them case by case
As opposed to just struggling on a spec and feeling like shit
lofty warren
What if i want the addon to tell me qhat to do?
lusty grotto
i think we're also looking at it in extremes
they said they want to maintain some degree of skill gap
not completely eliminate it
it was pretty clear in their message
and in the addons message
mighty valley
yeah video game communities are afraid of change and only know how to be hyperbolic
lusty grotto
whether they do it adequately or not, we will have to see, which is why i mentioned execution
lusty grotto
right thats what i was going for
mighty valley
the last big pruning worked out for the better long term
solid sun
I think this is going to be the greatest change to wow of all time forever and the game is going to skyrocket in popularity. It's about to become the new fortnite
mighty valley
I think this is going to be the greatest change to wow of all time forever and t...
put naruto in wow
solid sun
How about hyperbolic in the positive
lusty grotto
i think the intention is pretty good
and thats enough for me
a lot of these things needed to happen
mighty valley
yeah, it can't stay this complex without the audience shrinking and dying
oak lark
Ability Bloat does not = Complexity, game can be complex without ability bloat.
just my opinon
lusty grotto
sure
solid sun
I don't really think it's about ability bloat necessarily
lusty grotto
but its not just ability bloat
solid sun
How many different things interact with chain heal
P sure Theun had a whole video on how crazy it was that healers have so much crap that interacts with different spells and then the base spells just suck
lusty grotto
its a huge combination of things
solid sun
Was a super interesting video
lusty grotto
yeah venruki also had a video on it
native reef
Hey legends, anyone ever had a weird interaction of threat loss due to maybe terrain on overseer pack to last boss Ara kara?
I pop AOE Taunt like 2 seconds in, does nothing to the mobs they just ingore me - no BoP from paladin..
https://www.twitch.tv/smokystwitch/clip/BenevolentConcernedStarPanicVis-p4YYLs2nwMMADSyc
not sure if this is the right channel to ask these thingies pls excuse meee ^^
lusty grotto
talent interaction, decision making, cognitive load, and everything we use to manage those (see: addons, WAs, etc)
i for once am fucking glad juggernaut is gone
holy shit
mighty valley
a bunch of my friends have talked to me when they try out prot warrior over the years, none of them are remotely close to playing it right lol
and i don't even think we're in the top half of complexity
just have to press a lot of buttons
warm plinth
Hey legends, anyone ever had a weird interaction of threat loss due to maybe ter...
It's the terrain; stay away from the inside of that platform. It's happened to me before. AoE taunt doesn't work because the mobs technically evade for a second
Always pull to the outside near the wall
native reef
@warm plinth thanks homie - may we never brick keys that way again !
shut summit
Hey legends, anyone ever had a weird interaction of threat loss due to maybe ter...
its the add thats flying around in the left of your clip, its evading and causing everything you're in combat with to evade / drop threat
warm plinth
Hm, I suppose that could be it. I figured that other mobs wouldn't make the existing mobs evade though so I assumed it was flukey terrain, as I was standing in roughly the same place he is in the clip
If it's the mobs, then I'm not sure how you really avoid it, since it's not really safe to leave that patrol alone
Easy to pull during the boss since it comes all the way down over the arena
native reef
I had them with wonky pathing in the past - so i pulled them in early - however those two that @shut summit is suspecting to be bugging the pull had weird pathing until the end. They kept going back and forth and never joined up with the pack
I guess only surefire way to go about it is either pull em early and wait until they stack completely
or wait to pull with boss
Ill leave full pull clip of pull here for reference in case another poor soul is facing the same fate: https://www.twitch.tv/smokystwitch/clip/RefinedResoluteSkunkCmonBruh-BzvWae8C92qXALYM
warm plinth
Yeah
native reef
I put the full clip of the pull up there in case people wanna see how to not do it in the future hehe - thanks for helping me out 🙂
warm plinth
Yep
lusty grotto
so we got our boy back
warm plinth
Well, maybe. The development notes specify that that talent is arms/fury only
lusty grotto
yeah thats true
but honestly thats not a bad thing at all
added utility for the dps roles
warm plinth
Curious if arms will be able to dbts the damage
raw parcel
I know it's just the alpha and will change, but at a glance how we looking? Saw that we're getting both BrV and FbV, so that's nice, but no more cooldown reductions for Shield Wall?
warm plinth
Ngl they kinda picked the best possible time to do Seat and Skyreach, two dungeons that could've been incredibly bad, at the same time they make a big simplification push. What I'm a bit concerned about is the whole no immunity to stuns and longer lockout on kicks. They could easily turn that into well we can give them more kicks because they can stop them easier
warm plinth
I know it's just the alpha and will change, but at a glance how we looking? Saw ...
Fundamentally we haven't really changed. Same gameplay, same CDR loop (albeit a slower one). A big thing that will be important is how they design the content around what we have available because we will have Shield Wall a lot less (though we'll have Demo Shout with higher uptime due to the shout extension talent in the class tree)
lime mantle
Surv gets a shotgun
The canonically american spec 🦅
idle mesa
Guys whats the name of the invis pot for skips?
idle mesa
I thought so too, but for some reason, when i grabbed the sentinel and tried to use it after jumping i couldn't. And I haven't used prepot or anything
warm plinth
That's because you can't use invis pots in combat
lusty grotto
do you mean the meld pot?
idle mesa
yeah the meld pot
lusty grotto
umbral essentia
lime mantle
Does meld pot trigger normal pot cd? Yes right?
lusty grotto
yup
idle mesa
Ah thanks guys 🙂
round pendant
nimchip
lusty grotto
whats up
round pendant
whats up
hi
I don't know I just said nimchip
uhhh but yeah I got distracted by something else
I wanted to talk about how wow is doomed actually and we should all panic
lusty grotto
solid sun
do they actually?
Yeah. It’s referred to as a boomstick
Fury of the Eagle was retooled and is now a shotgun
But to your earlier point my healer friend is def concerned about Seat coming back when healing and defensives seem to be getting big changes
lusty grotto
seat wont be the same seat
solid sun
Seat absolutely folded up groups when it was released. I remember well the crying as people got humbled by that place
lusty grotto
right
solid sun
I know it’ll get changed
lusty grotto
defensives were just way too weird between classes
they are getting evened out
like mages vs anyone else for example
solid sun
That doesn’t always mean for the better. I’m not going to doom about it though. If it launches in a state that just annihilates groups they will nerf it
shut summit
seat also had the problem of coming so late in an xpac where people had "figured out" the rest of the dungeons for 1+ year
warm plinth
To be fair, they probably chose the best time to bring Seat back because they have no choice but to drastically change everything anyway
shut summit
cant wait for it to come back, dungeon was actually good
warm plinth
I just hope they do some visibility changes. I can't see shit even when it's not the same color.
shut summit
not hard on that front 
solid sun
:)
warm plinth
Skyreach is also well timed, though tbf I don't think that one would be too bad re-released as it is since it's already neutered for timewalking.
solid sun
Wasn’t skyreach the one that had like the wind obstacle course
warm plinth
yeah
shut summit
ye
solid sun
Yeah I like that place
shut summit
we can just leap across it
warm plinth
The bosses used to fuck too
Like even in the early days of it being timewalking it was really bad
It's fine now though
solid sun
Skyreach is going to remind me of glad spec though
warm plinth
RDM?
frosty mango
cant wait for it to come back, dungeon was actually good
Pls go to the doctor Jakey
Have them do a brain scan
warm plinth
Roid, that's not Jakey; are you sure you don't need the brain scan
lusty grotto
hello, Dr Nimchip here, im afraid you have rabies
frosty mango
I’m pretty sure I’m going insane from eating so much
round pendant
<:okayge:917646812519739433>
seriously tho
did you see any of the healer changes?
I need somewhere that puts all this shit in a concise place
it's WAY too much
lusty grotto
yeah but yam you havent seen tuning
youre lacking the whole picture
plus defensives prune
round pendant
Tuning isn't really relevant to fundamentally changing the gameplay of healing tho
frosty mango
May as well not look at it yet lol
round pendant
tbf I only care about m+ context
sinful copper
Doc says I need to eat 3300 cals of low fat high protein food
How many cals in roids?
frosty mango
Zero
sinful copper
Oh dang
solid sun
Idk yam
I get having concerns, but I think it’s pretty popular commentary that some of these changes can really help the health of the game
round pendant
I get having concerns, but I think it’s pretty popular commentary that some of t...
How do they help the health of the game though?
I'm not saying that cause I don't believe that take
I genuinely want to know how complexity is harming the health of the game
warm plinth
Simplifying the game makes content a bit more approachable to those that are intimidated by complexity (or if not complexity, things that are not intuitive)
round pendant
Wouldn't you say most of the content in the game doesn't require any familiarity with that complexity in the first place?
It seems very "feely"
warm plinth
The game in general, sure
lusty grotto
especially important to the healer role since its one of the two roles that could use the numbers
warm plinth
But the people participating in raid and Mythic+ are a small part of the game's playerbase. Getting more people into that content is certainly not a bad thing
round pendant
By crushing the skill ceiling tho? doesn't that kinda alienate people who enjoy the depth of the game at those levels?
warm plinth
Maybe
round pendant
sure they're a minority and ig since it bothers me I'm part of that group even though I don't push very high
but it certainly makes me less interested in getting better and playing good challenging content
warm plinth
In the end, only you can decide if the game is still fun after these changes
round pendant
if there's just less to learn and improve at
solid sun
How often do they play things because they’re complex? Don’t the highest achieving players tend to just play what’s meta, regardless of complexity
fathom oasis
Can you guys point me to which changes supposed crushed the skill ceiling?
lusty grotto
absolutely Rhino
fathom oasis
Interested on reading up what's come out of midnight
round pendant
How often do they play things because they’re complex? Don’t the highest achievi...
Because they're complex not necessarily
but the pushers like hard content which is partially hard because the game is complex
It's "hard" to optimise your dps and it feels rewarding when you PUMP in a high key or a hard boss
round pendant
Yeah they might support it, this is just my opinion
round pendant
I wouldn't really still be playin the game if I felt like I'd mastered my classes and gameplay
I like that I can always do betterer
round pendant
just something to keep in mind
yea ofc
the healer changes are just cooked imo tho
warm plinth
idk, healing is definitely something that needed to be more approachable for dungeons. And in raids it's all just planned out anyway
It's not skill to read a time stamp and press the CD when it says to
solid sun
Healing imo is the least approachable role. Some may say tank and I’m skewed in my objectivity because I tank all the time
But improving approachability to get more healers seems like you’d gain more healers than you’d lose
warm plinth
I think in terms of how much pressure people feel, they're probably comparable. But in my opinion, healer has the highest floor of any role because they have to have more knowledge than anyone else
round pendant
Every healer I know doesn't like the sound of these changes
warm plinth
At least until you get to the high level of things
round pendant
they might get more people healing
like you could giga simplify the healer role and make good/bad healers basically not consequential
but that's not really fun or deep for people who like healing?
lusty grotto
if you want a very personal take, i feel like existing complex priorities are on average not a problem with me (in fact simpler prios are usually more of a problem for me, ask Brew how im dealing with Fury) but whenever i do those i log off feeling absolutely exhausted, even spamming keys feel like i get brain rot extremely quick... so while the dopamine does hit, the side effect is very punishing
round pendant
it's an extreme example but hopefully my point is clear lol
idle mesa
Boys this is my damage breakdown from a 17 eco, does it look normal or am i messing something up
lusty grotto
this same exact thing happened to BLM on FFXIV recently
ive been playing black mage for a while
sinful copper
Healing imo is the least approachable role. Some may say tank and I’m skewed in ...
Nah, tank def is way less approachable haha. Especially in m+
lusty grotto
and people were panicking about simplifying the job
round pendant
The only spec that kinda fried my brain on wow is outlaw
That's an example of something that's a bit goofy
lusty grotto
i welcomed it, its fine, people still play it
the core gameplay is still there
while being more forgiving
and i shit you not, the reaction to the changes were on par or worse than the average garbage wowhead comment
solid sun
Also I’d like to point out that you can absolutely improve your play even if a spec if simple
idle mesa
The only spec that kinda fried my brain on wow is outlaw
I still have carpal tunnel from playing outlaw, never never again
sinful copper
If they simplify damage rotations, it's better for health of the game because u know how many keys I do in 12-14 range where people have 0-5 kicks in a dungeon? 0-5 defensives used? 0-5 cc done?
warm plinth
The only spec that kinda fried my brain on wow is outlaw
Looks like they've greatly changed outlaw from what I read. No more offensive vanishing, RtB is basically a maintenance buff that you level up, AR is a fixed duration, more meaningful cooldown
solid sun
Dadgum
full mist
Yeah RIP outlaw, was my favorite DPS spec
warm plinth
Sad to see crackshot go though, ngl
solid sun
Please stop making all my favorite dps specs better
warm plinth
Was a great talent
solid sun
I need to be ranged
round pendant
Yeah I need to read more of the changes
warm plinth
Still annoyed they kept KIR because what a boring ass button
sinful copper
Yeah I need to read more of the changes
I think u need to read less tbh
solid sun
Does trickster still have hidden blade
round pendant
also hate the sin changes
sin is already very simple
it's just pretty hard to master
mighty valley
Boys this is my damage breakdown from a 17 eco, does it look normal or am i mess...
Shield slam way too low
round pendant
example of a good spec that's very easy to get into and has a lot of room for growth
but if they're simplifying that it's kinda
mighty valley
dot specs are the hardest to rework if we’re moving towards a no addons world
sinful copper
They need to start incentivizing tanks for queuing into m+. Way too few when I'm on my DPS toons
solid sun
You’re the hardest to rework
mighty valley
Because I’m nearly perfect?
warm plinth
Does trickster still have hidden blade
yeah, I think coup de grace got reworked a tiny bit but that's about it for trickster changes
warm plinth
dot specs are the hardest to rework if we’re moving towards a no addons world
Yep, those are the ones I'm most concerned for
solid sun
I hate hidden blade. It makes me change up what I’m doing
warm plinth
Well, now it'll be like...easier I guess?
Since you don't have to worry about vanish windows
sinful copper
Why does rhino have a star nipple piercing?
warm plinth
Not easier but less thought required
solid sun
It’s a badge
sinful copper
Pierced on your nipple
solid sun
You’re welcome
sinful copper
Thank you
round pendant
I felt like we were at a pretty good point complexity wise
just a few specs have a few goofy things that could be toned down
m+ is pretty accessible for all rewards relevant to most people
3k requires a little bit of learning but what's wrong with that?
Tankxiety is literally a self-inflicted thing that the game can do NOTHING to address
people have it in ffxiv in trivial content
round pendant
yeah and people are still too nervous to play tank
because it has nothing to do with how difficult it is
lusty grotto
its not because of anxiety
round pendant
It's the pressure of feeling like you have the team on your back, which the role is always going to have
lusty grotto
its because the dps jobs are just not boring as fuck
sinful copper
Tank has the most work of anyone in the group. Gotta remember pathing, positioning, % needed, your rotation, etc
round pendant
My point is, even in a game like ffxiv where it's trivial, there are still people who are too anxious to tank
sinful copper
DPS so easy and chill compared to tank job
round pendant
How is it not?
lusty grotto
its not because of anxiety
round pendant
everybody I know who's played ffxiv cites pressure as why they haven't levelled their tank jobs
lusty grotto
its because the dps jobs are just not boring as fuck
round pendant
They'd have to play tank to know it's boring. I'm talking about people who never touch the role
lusty grotto
tanks are so boring even Yoshi-P addressed it in the last live letter
why would you ever want to play a tank post HW or SB
tawdry cloak
Google tank anxiety ffxiv and you will find a plethora of Reddit threads suggesting yam is right @lusty grotto
tawdry cloak
Source: YouTube https://share.google/uIaSoGCmI2DEgaIG8
sinful copper
Anyone with tank anxiety is a lil bitch
round pendant
I mean it's just how people are idk why it's such a controversial take
I think nim is kinda missing my point
tawdry cloak
round pendant
I'm talking about a specific subgroup of ffxiv players who won't touch the role in the first place, not people who don't main tank in general
lusty grotto
these are videos for new players btw
anyone that has been playing ffxiv for a period of time knows that tanks are just fucking stupidly boring and the reason why they dont get a higher pop is because of what i said
round pendant
The underlying reason they're anxious is the same as any other game and my point is that difficulty has nothing to do with it
tawdry cloak
anyone that has been playing ffxiv for a period of time knows that tanks are jus...
Source?
round pendant
okay but that's a ffxiv specific concern
lusty grotto
ive been playing since ARR
so the source is me
but maybe @frosty mango can chime in
do you play XIV?
sinful copper
but maybe <@228540157333078016> can chime in
He's too busy eating
Man has to eat 9000 calories
round pendant
can we not nitpick lmao
lusty grotto
Google tank anxiety ffxiv and you will find a plethora of Reddit threads suggest...
this Roid
tawdry cloak
You don’t speak for all players though nim, and clearly tank anxiety is a problem for players, whether they have tanked before or are new. There’s still a shortage of tanks in XIV because there is an inherent leadership role in tanking which most people don’t want to take on
frosty mango
Imo it’s not nearly as bad in xiv
tawdry cloak
The same reason there’s a shortage in wow. No matter how easy the tanking becomes
frosty mango
Bc things like positioning and routing dont really exist
There’s no tank shortage in xiv
sinful copper
The same reason there’s a shortage in wow. No matter how easy the tanking become...
But it's not easy
frosty mango
If anything the opposite
round pendant
i never fucking said that "tanxiety" doesnt exist
and I never said people don't play tanks exclusively because of tank anxiety in ffxiv
round pendant
It was just an opposite side of the spectrum thing
wow tanking = hard
ffxiv tanking = easy
both games have players with tank anxiety
and as M+ gets easier objectively, the tank problem is still happening
cause it's a perception issue
not a game design issue
imo
sinful copper
If FFXIV tanking is easy and ppl have anxiety over it, they're just lil bitches
lusty grotto
ok so whats your point
round pendant
well that's the thing, it was part of a wider point that I already thought we're at a good point in terms of the game's complexity and difficulty
lusty grotto
you cant just equate both of them
round pendant
for moving into harder content (starting m+ for example)
lusty grotto
youre looking at it in a vacuum
dying in a dungeon as a tank in FFXIV means nothing
dying in a key as tank in WoW means key dead
there's numerous shit that can be addressed other than "anxiety"
which is what blizzard is focusing on
round pendant
It's pretty hard to screw up tanking in a +2 unless you just go wild and pull the entire instance
but people won't even try
round pendant
there's numerous shit that can be addressed other than "anxiety"
You brought up tank anxiety earlier on so I'm just saying that I don't really think it's caused by any objective measures of complexity or difficulty
lusty grotto
do you think it helps them decide to try it or not by making gameplay more accessible or not
round pendant
at least not primarily
lusty grotto
regardless of anxiety
lusty grotto
does having a simpler gameplay loop have any negative connotation to those players
or effect
it does to you, obviously
but what about to them?
round pendant
I don't think tanks being simple will make more people play them tbh
at least not significantly
tawdry cloak
I think prot warrior is already plenty simple, and I don’t see people flocking to play tank
round pendant
like I can imagine someone trying vdh after playing hdh for a bit
and going splat and going nah too hard
but I genuinely think most people don't even bother with the "trying" part
lusty grotto
we're picking this example and just dissecting it
obviously tanks in general need more appeal
like idk, more damage
round pendant
all my friends don't tank and I ask them and they say shit like "too much pressure", "everything's on me to not make one mistake", etc
but it's wild cause two of them are healers
where their mistakes actually just kill everyone
lusty grotto
ok im just gonna end this and say i think its a good thing and i hope it does get people into the content as intended, and that's that
round pendant
like idk, more damage
lol
I kinda agree
I honestly think we see eye-to-eye on this
just slightly different lenses like you said
tawdry cloak
Can we not react to posts in this channel? I was trying to put a Chad face on more damage
round pendant
I'm just saying I think the lack of tanking is players' perceptions of tanking as a role, not based on the actual difficulty or complexity of it
fathom oasis
i know it's not very comparable, but tanks in MoP classic do huge damage, and dungeons are basically W, and there is still ahuge shortage of them queueing
dusk ice
Fwiw a lot of perceived tank pressure is also the routing homework and everything that goes into keeping up to date there. Not always but it’s a factor I see raised alot
round pendant
also they should give healers more dps
well prevoker and vw disc is pretty good
but the gap between worst and best needs to be way less
fathom oasis
allow healers to deal more dps by sacrificing healing (so if you are in a group that doesn't need the healing, you can actually pump) is what i was thinking
round pendant
It's already kinda like that tho
fathom oasis
is it?
round pendant
unless you're disc ig but that's disc's thing
fathom oasis
druids jump through a ton of hoops to deal damage, and their damage is still kinda crap
i'm not asking for SLands ashen hollow levels of damage, but being 1/3rd of a tank's dps feels perhaps a bit too low
...or you could go the prevoker way and make them deal damage through their regular healing rotation, but that is more boring imo, and takes the choice away
lusty grotto
did any of you guys play prot pre DF
do you think SB management being easier made prot worse?
that skill cap got lowered SUBSTANTIALLY from previous expansions
and yet
people still fail it, and there's growth in improving it
round pendant
I didn't play pwar pre-df
lusty grotto
what about rage intake and management
round pendant
people still fail it, and there's growth in improving it
I mean you can make it less punishing to not optimise, or easier to optimise something
and it'll always come at the cost of some "depth"
I just don't think the game (or any game) should EVER reach the point where there's very little room for gains from optimisation
It's kinda silly but that's why I liked spell block
Super powerful if you just take the time to learn to use it well
ig the issue truly arises when content is balanced around some optimisation existing
half jewel
I have played prot since 2006 and almost every iteration has been an improvement over the years minus some changes. But I don't think dumbing it down further will make more people want to play warrior or tank in general
mighty valley
i don't really know why tank complexity and tanxiety are big topics in here today when our rotation is basically untouched in this iteration lol
we just have fewer shield walls, which if anything is more skill testing
round pendant
WoW is just in a state that I mostly like and most specs I've played feel pretty decently complex but not too brainhurty
so sweeping changes for the sake of simplicity, especially the healer ones which speaks to how they'll be tuning content (which affects every role)
half jewel
Then we go back to old prot where you had to use SW as a real defensive instead of a less frequent active mit
round pendant
just makes me paranoid
the tankxiety thing is just that my belief is that it's more peoples perceptions of the role rather than what the role actually requires that prevents them from doing it
half jewel
agreed, I know its alpha but I think almost every time blizz has made sweeping changes across all classes and roles it almost always been bad
round pendant
idk why we got hung up on that tho
mighty valley
agreed, I know its alpha but I think almost every time blizz has made sweeping c...
i think it's usually felt bad while they're dialing it in and then works out for the better long term
round pendant
Wasn't WoD pruning notoriously bad
half jewel
I bet a lot of warriors don't recall losing best boy Heroic Strike /s
mighty valley
Wasn't WoD pruning notoriously bad
it made a lot of people mad but it was necessary long term
sometimes you gotta rip a bandaid off
round pendant
the best classes are the ones that have unique util and niche abilities or just niches in general
I feel like this whole thing could potentially lead to even more homogenization
half jewel
i think it's usually felt bad while they're dialing it in and then works out for...
that usually takes more than 1 xpac to be realized which is why I am not a fan of it
mighty valley
they couldn't just keep stacking shit on top of classes forever then and they can't now
half jewel
I feel like this whole thing could potentially lead to even more homogenization
what is old is new again, they have had that happen before lol
round pendant
and people cite frost and bm as examples of good simplicity
they only love those specs cause they're busted
not cause they feel good to play
this is kinda facetious tho
but I do genuinely believe people get more enjoyment out of being an S+ tier spec than what they actually feel like to play
mighty valley
a certain type of player does
round pendant
and crushing the gap between floor and ceiling will just incentivise fotm play
mighty valley
but bm hunter is popular through its ups and downs across the wider player base, people like simple spec with animals
round pendant
there's lots of spoopy repercussions but it could also just end up being good if they get the tuning and gameplay right
round pendant
but bm hunter is popular through its ups and downs across the wider player base,...
yeah that's true
mighty valley
idk they might fuck it all up
but i'm interested to see them take a big swing
and we've been through so many dooming cycles in here and yet i'm still playing prot warrior
just gonna chill and let them cook
round pendant
It's a one-two punch for me
if addons get cucked and more things get homogenized
I may skip a few seasons
let's be real tho I'll prob keep playing
it's something I get to do with my friends
half jewel
They eventually figure things out, its just the "eventually" part I have an issue with
solid sun
and we've been through so many dooming cycles in here and yet i'm still playing ...
maybe you'll swap to bear
round pendant
also what is with the constant raids where the first 7 bosses are complete pushovers and the last one is unpuggable (in heroic)
mighty valley
maybe you'll swap to bear
zero chance
if they deleted prot warrior I dunno what my tank choice would be
brew maybe
round pendant
I can't stand holy power on ppal tho
mighty valley
but even then i'd just mistweave
solid sun
Harrow if i main dps next season would you tank keys for me
I feel like having a professional writer tank keys for you and tell riveting stories would be like a sick combo
round pendant
tbh you know saying all that stuff I said
I might get my gameplay enjoyment ruined a bit
but if my friends have less potential to fuck up
I might end up having a better time in keys 
mighty valley
I feel like having a professional writer tank keys for you and tell riveting sto...
I dunno if I'm that good at tanking keys and telling stories at the same time
Maybe if they simplify the whole game!!!!!
round pendant
Also someone said how the blue posts sounded good
But do we forget all those times where they say some paragraph on why they're changing something and everyone's nodding along but then the change is the worst possible way to achieve it?
Like I remember the drama during the s2 changes for us
was it s2? I don't remember ngl
solid sun
I think if we can be trusted to call out poor blue posts for being poor blue posts
That means if we react positively to other blue posts that's probably an indication they aren't poor blue posts
Am I crazy
round pendant
I'm talking about how like
their reasoning for wanting to change something makes good sense and we all agree
but the changes themselves (at least initially) are completely fried
like the tank changes coming into tww
granted it usually ends up in a pretty acceptable spot
mighty valley
But do we forget all those times where they say some paragraph on why they're ch...
i think they're capable of the opposite too, where i think i agree with the changes but their post feels like a precision nuke intended to make everyone mad
solid sun
Yeah I know nimchip mentioned execution earlier
It definitely is possible it's just gonna suck
But I don't see any value in dooming or glooming over something when we don't know if it's going to be bad or not and can't control it anyways, yeah?
round pendant
I mean I'm chilling til it comes out but I just have thoughts
heavy sparrow
lusty grotto
btw ill take credit for the MDR with block up, that was one of the things i suggested coming into s3 in the class change thread on the spell block removal im dumb and its just IP
round pendant
nimchip our saviour
heavy sparrow
Collosus looks promising
The revenge tweeking looks like an interesting test. Your target takes 100%, 2 other targets take 90%
Demolish 10 stacks or 7% damage increase per stack for revenge
frosty mango
This is how FFXIV handles aoe soft caps
Sliding damage scale
It sucks and I hate it lol
zenith aurora
22518 natty haste good for ITF?
warm plinth
~~btw ill take credit for the MDR with block up, that was one of the things i su...
the what?
warm plinth
22518 natty haste good for ITF?
yeah, I'd get a bit more before you're finished, but you can make do
warm plinth
Demolish 10 stacks or 7% damage increase per stack for revenge
huh? What are you referring to by this?
round pendant
just remove all aoe caps
warm plinth
You would have both of those things still?
mighty valley
just remove all aoe caps
we would spend the rest of our lives in a kite meta
warm plinth
Making Revenge require two talents is easily the dumbest thing they changed.
sinful copper
lol my tank in my group's overall...
pastel sleet
Our guardian druid is getting melee 1shot on frac without even having aggro. About 20 seconds into fight. About 10% of the time. Any ideas whats causing that
heavy sparrow
huh? What are you referring to by this?
I agree with your name btw. Raidbot for some reason loves me to have 53% mastery for highest sim
heavy sparrow
we would spend the rest of our lives in a kite meta
I'm okay with this
mighty valley
i don't really know how new revenge tuning will work out
heavy sparrow
Yeah best to see
mighty valley
is it relatively stronger in the low target version?
mighty valley
I'm okay with this
i like pressing buttons and hitting things
heavy sparrow
This thing is new thing though :
frosty mango
Our guardian druid is getting melee 1shot on frac without even having aggro. Abo...
Your other tank is getting out of range
pastel sleet
Thats what i figured
rose flame
Do I go champion sacbrood, or hero ritual mud with leech?
lone current
you only really need mud if you're pushing high keys and need the extra defensive for priory / floodgate
rose flame
well i timed my first 11, so I'm pretty happy with that 😛
I just want something better than a champ trinket without farming the same dungeon endlessly
lusty grotto
the what?
its only IP 🙁 i gaslighted myself
its ok ill just pretend its MDR
and have a fake win
@dusky canopy i finally got a myth 2h, how many weeks in?
araz dropped his, now to wait for trinket drops which apparently we're blacklisted on
dusky canopy
<@224952758808215555> i finally got a myth 2h, how many weeks in?
Hollyy shit grats!
Like 10 weeks or some shit lmao
Idek
I stopped counting
lusty grotto
we just got our first netherprism LAST WEEK
frosty mango
I’m still rolling prot vaults sad sad
lusty grotto
0 ritual forges
everything has been through vaults, if at all
if i ever get an arcanocore, i can just perma prot vault
but thats...
a huge if
heavy sparrow
I’m still rolling prot vaults sad sad
All day errrr day
lusty grotto
no brand yet either
we still have 3 m+ tanks that want it
our raid tanks have it on 3 characters at least each
and then it just stopped dropping from heroic clears, we should kill myth hunters this week though if everything goes well
heavy sparrow
Best of luck on that one man
lusty grotto
im benched for it, but should die
heavy sparrow
It's alright man, I'm also a cheerleader
lusty grotto
heavy sparrow
Some buds were doing the whole arena tournament for trolls
Their 2nd opponent was last year's finalist
lusty grotto
haha
lusty grotto
thats an unfort seed