protection

[fathom oasis]

yes

[frosty mango]

It has a chance to yes

[shut vigil]

so then we should indeed be spamming revenge

[fathom oasis]

not spamming

[frosty mango]

No

[strong vine]

Oh fuck that's new

[shut vigil]

when shield slam nor clap are up

[fathom oasis]

only when SS and TB/TC are not up

it's a chance too, as roidberg says

so it's not guaranteed

[strong vine]

what's the % chance to reset it?

[fathom oasis]

thing is, if you over-press IP you won't have enough rage to weave in Revenges as needed

[frosty mango]

The entire prot warrior car is a feedback loop fueled by rage and shield slam is your primary rage generator, so the entire purpose of the optimal rotation is to get as many shield slams as possible.

More shield slams = more rage = more rage spend = more shield slam resets = more shield slams

[shut vigil]

suppose you are caught without a shield block, but with shield block cd available but no rage to cast it

should you still press revenge?

or should you try to save up rage to shield block?

[frosty mango]

You should never be in that situation

[fathom oasis]

ideally, teach yourself to press IP when you are 70 rage and try to NEVER overcap rage. Even if your IP shield is at full (if you are tracking it), if you reach 70 rage you press it again

[strong vine]

because it lowers avatar and shield wall cd

right?

[frosty mango]

If shield block falls off and you don’t have enough rage to recast it then you’ve been spamming revenge

[fathom oasis]

and it feeds Violent Outburst

[frosty mango]

To kind of put it simply, you will cast revenge fairly often, but almost never twice in a row

[strong vine]

Thank you, idk why but this made so much sense in my brain lol

I'm excited to give it a shot

[shut vigil]

if you're pressing revenge whenever SB/TC aren't up you will be in that situation sometimes

[fathom oasis]

you can renew SB before it hits 0

[frosty mango]

It’s not uncommon for you to

Have ss on cooldown
Have tclap on cd
Have enough rage to revenge

But it would be very uncommon for shield slam and thunderclap/burst to be on cooldown for two gcds in a row

So if you find yourself in that situation it is almost certainly because you hit revenge twice

[shut vigil]

I might be pressing ig pain too early

[fathom oasis]

yes

that's a very common mistake

[shut vigil]

yeah I'm testing it out on the tanking dummy

I'm just ig paining too early

to be fair I did start playing the class 3 days ago and just now got barely good enough gear to not explode

with no gear you do just instantly explode with no ig pain / sb up

[fathom oasis]

prot warr rotation is in essence very simple:

• dont let shield block drop while tanking
• don't overcap rage (press IP at 70+)
• press SS > TB/TC (except if 2 TB charges, in which case you press TB before SS) and use revenge if both are on CD

[fathom oasis]

SB must be up at all times you are actively tanking

[shut vigil]

not possible with very low haste

M+ environment

[fathom oasis]

then you run Heavy Repercussions instead of Into The Fray

[shut vigil]

2 days ago I had 12k haste or some crap

[frosty mango]

You don’t need ip up to live

You could remove it from your bars and it would have no bearing on your survival

[shut vigil]

believe me with 675 average ilvl in a 10 you do, although the best solution to that problem is no be there

[frosty mango]

Shield block and proper defensive usage is what keeps you alive

[frosty mango]

I promise you i was tanking 10s at 650 on ratty alts

It’s not keeping you alive

[shut vigil]

in carry groups?

[fathom oasis]

i mean, it does help, but you get more IP by not pressing IP when you don't have to

[shut vigil]

how are you maintaining 100% shield block uptime in lenghty M+ pulls at 650 ilvl?

[fathom oasis]

if you don't grief yourself by pressing IP too much, you'll generate more rage, thus press more IP, and have more avatars, which generate a shit ton of rage

[lofty glen]

another ID another DD that rolls need on Brand and gets it. love it

[shut vigil]

I was definitely playing wrong I'm not denying that ofc

[bleak scaffold]

even when you know the theory you still have to apply it :/

And it's not always easy

[fathom oasis]

I left when my pug RL kept inviting DDs that were clearly tanks (just need raider.io addon to realize). Then I formed my own group later and rejected all the fake DDs. Only added a tank that already had brand.

Then brand dropped and i was the only one to need 🙂

[shut vigil]

but specifically when you actually have no gear, nor previous tier sets or anything, ig pain not keeping you alive is lalaland nonsense. The 50% damage reduction makes you barely healable in a 10 (*with very low gear), unless you're running a carry group where mobs just die too quickly for it to matter

[bleak scaffold]

You are playing it for just few days, you are learning and getting details on how to master it, no worries man !

[fathom oasis]

takes effort, but you are guaranteed Brand if it drops

[bleak scaffold]

If your whole group is 675, for 10 you need a good group, where all do their jobs and manages themselves.

[shut vigil]

ofc

no wipes happen in isolation nor are ever entirely a healer's or tank's fault

[bleak scaffold]

exactly, first job of all is to manage mechanics of the trash/boss, lots of people seems to have forgotten ..

Better have a 4M DPS that stays alive rather than a 6M DPS (while active) that dies at 50% because he stayed in the FùùÎNG FIRE PIT under his feets.

[shut vigil]

the heavy need for interrupts, stops and CC is the real anti-pug affix

[bleak scaffold]

and they removed a LOT in S3 😄

[shut vigil]

yeah it was worse before

[round pendant]

eh 10 is trivial at 675

[shut vigil]

but tbh idk I think in pve a kick should not consume the cd unless it actually kicked something

[round pendant]

for healer it depends on the spec and dungeon tho a 10 can def be a bit rough

[shut vigil]

if only one person is 675 sure

and depends what 675 we're talking about

if you're using last season gear then it is a lot easier

if you're a fresh 80 held together by duct tape and promises it's a different story

and if you're in a premade or with people who are actually all good running the 675 then it is entirely trivial

[round pendant]

I'm tempted to just hop on my other lvl80 warrior and prove that wrong

I'll only invite lowbies too

tho I will give you that the healer has to be competent at 675 in 10s

[bleak scaffold]

It's not a real debate on ilvl requirments. If you are playing premade and all knows how to play correctly, 10s is fine at 675.

[shut vigil]

that's guaranteed

I'm down to be proven wrong

do it, stream

[plush tendon]

why do content at 675 anyways

just run some delves and get some loot

[shut vigil]

why do anything at all, the challenge is fun

[plush tendon]

prob a better time->gear investment

[shut vigil]

and also I was rushing to get keys in before reset

[bleak scaffold]

I carried a friend of friend in a 10, he was below 680. Only difficulty was to stay alive with unavoidable damages. Some big techs can hit HARD

You need to know how and when to use your def CD 🙂

[shut vigil]

one person needing a carry is really easy if you're taking or healing

[bleak scaffold]

In the end, wrong debate. as we discussed hundreds of times

Difficulty depends on many criterias. ilvl helps definitely, but it's not what will make you good.

[round pendant]

ilvl definitely carries

[bleak scaffold]

Be good in 6-7s to get geared if you feel more comfortable.

[shut vigil]

yeah 7s are incomparably better than 10s for early gearing

myth vault slot was too juicy tho

[round pendant]

I don't really agree with that

especially not this late in the season

7s are harder than 10s lmao

[frosty mango]

You spec heavy repercussions

[round pendant]

10s more crests, myth vault, better players

[bleak scaffold]

In PUGs same same ... you can be lucky in whichever.

[shut vigil]

idk it depends, I got decent sign ups on 7s and 8s

there is definitely some rating bloat going around milestones

[bleak scaffold]

ironically you find alts in 7 from people who know how to play. They can't really get invites to 10s in PUG because they have low ilvl ..

[fathom oasis]

we are not talking about someone that's already experienced with the class though. If I was lacking experience on a specific class, I would not jump straight into 10s either

[shut vigil]

yeah exactly

[fathom oasis]

skill level matters a lot more than ilvl, up to a point of course

[bleak scaffold]

I did last week because I couldn't find a 10 and wanted a loot from ... priory Fing tome is avoiding me

[fathom oasis]

took me 40 something priories to get it 🙂

[shut vigil]

I got a myth tome from that 10 I did when I just started playing prot warrior

[frosty mango]

Any alts I have I dump them directly into 10s

[solid sun]

Idk we have people with terrible builds, terrible amounts of rage wasted, getting hit in the back, etc doing like 14s and 15s and they come in here and we see the logs to show they don’t know what they’re doing

If that can happen then someone can def just go right into 10s

[shut vigil]

unsure how great it is for M+ but it's pretty good in raid

[frosty mango]

Doing anything below that is pointless imo - but pure pugging can be tough

[fathom oasis]

haha that is kinda true

[bleak scaffold]

2 DPS were alts and were crushing the 3rd that was like more 20ilvl than theirs ..

[shut vigil]

skill is always the bottle neck to results

[fathom oasis]

i mean, you get 690 ilvl in like a couple hours

it's so fast nowadays

[shut vigil]

yes, I started playing and gearing the character from 500-something ilvl at 3 hours before reset

tbf, it's a specific, random situation, and I just wanted a myth slot vault for no reason

[round pendant]

I shall bite my tongue

[frosty mango]

I invited two 700 melee dps alts to my 16 yesterday bc they had mains that were 3600 with hundreds of keys completed

Idc about ilvl in my keys I care about iqlvl

[round pendant]

I love you roidberg

Thanks for having a fucking brain

[bleak scaffold]

Rhino, look at the group and not just the tank ... if the tank is not great but the others are then it can work 🙂

[frosty mango]

This is the prot channel only the tanks are important

Dps are disposable

[bleak scaffold]

The only situation were ilvl really matters is if they don't have enougth HP to survive unavoidable AOE

[frosty mango]

Zug zug

[round pendant]

I crash out at people declining for ilvl and taking the guy who's done like 1 15 over a slightly lower ilvl who's done 10

[shut vigil]

I play both healers and tanks, my respect for dps has never been lower

[sharp gale]

Im guilty

[frosty mango]

I care zero about IO or Ilvl

[shut vigil]

I don't really look at ilvl, I check their key clears

[round pendant]

the only time I consider ilvl is if they're way ahead of the curve (like 718 or something rn?) but keys completed is more important

[shut vigil]

also I'm starting to be tempted to check parses on people who myth raid

[solid sun]

Sure it’s a team effort. I’m not going to time your 12 by myself but it doesn’t change the fact that you can just do whatever and complete a 10 fine

[shut vigil]

I am about 99% sure I've invited a few people who just bought myth raid boosts

[sharp gale]

Yeah it’s more 718 ilvl = I kinda know it’s not a late fotm

[fathom oasis]

i'm shit at recognizing skilled people, so i go by io and ilvl. If I see a non-meta spec with tons of io, I usually think higher of them than I would a meta class

[frosty mango]

I look at their mains role and completed keys. If it’s a 500 IO 700 ilvl melee dps and they have a 3500 IO melee dps main with 400 keys done I will invite that person

[shut vigil]

the dk fotms are absolute trash people, the amount of toxicity I'm seeing from DKs is ruining the class's stellar reputation for being friendly pillars of the community

[sharp gale]

Or raid gaming dude / but raid prog shows it

[solid sun]

Since when have DK’s ever been friendly pillars of the community lmao

[plush tendon]

[shut vigil]

idk old DK mains have always been friendly but that might just be my experience

[plush tendon]

why you gotta do me like that

[frosty mango]

Knowing the keys and the meta game of utility usage is far more likely to lead to successful key than dps

[round pendant]

The only DK fotm reroller I know is a giant racist

so

it checks out

[frosty mango]

If someone does 5m overall chances are you still time the key

[plush tendon]

also, any MLG FoTM reroller is kind of cringe

[frosty mango]

If someone uses no kicks or stops and dies 5 times, doesn’t matter if they do 10m dps bc it’s a brick

[shut vigil]

100%

[bleak scaffold]

We all agree on that ^^

[plush tendon]

unless they doing the highest level content possible

[round pendant]

I think people playing F tier specs in premade even though their friends beg them to play a real spec is cringier tho

[shut vigil]

well if you're doing actual title keys or anything close to it then everything matters

[plush tendon]

equal cringe

theres not many bad specs right now though if im being honest

[round pendant]

holy priest + shadow priest in my premade

and it's miserable

[plush tendon]

Shadow is really good

[round pendant]

yeah

[plush tendon]

suffers from key too low syndrome

[round pendant]

but kicks

-1 on healer, 45s on shp

[plush tendon]

yea... 45 second kick not great

[solid sun]

You could play Ppal

[round pendant]

yeah I could tbh

[shut vigil]

you need a prot paladin and 2 shamans to balance it out

xD

[round pendant]

you're right

[plush tendon]

also, that might just be a comp defficiency there

[round pendant]

yeah the comp is cooked

[plush tendon]

rather then a spec issue

[round pendant]

pwar, rsham, udk, shp, hpriest

[plush tendon]

r sham?

[round pendant]

ye

he was forced to reroll to that

[plush tendon]

two healers?

[shut vigil]

two healers?

xD

[round pendant]

sry

esham

[plush tendon]

yea, comp is a little cooked

[round pendant]

he does play rsham when hpriest isn't on tho

[plush tendon]

with the two priests

but thats sort of a you problem ngl

XD

[round pendant]

hpriest is trolling 😔

[solid sun]

So do you push when the rsham is healing

[shut vigil]

you just need to find god and start praying

[round pendant]

yeah pretty much lmao

[plush tendon]

yea, one of the priests needs to reroll

[solid sun]

lol

[shut vigil]

you invented push weeks after they got rid of push weeks

[plush tendon]

and not because spec is bad

[round pendant]

had better luck with 1 pugger over 2 priests

[plush tendon]

but.... thats just not greaaaat

[round pendant]

and rsham

[plush tendon]

from a gameplay perspective

[solid sun]

No it isn’t one of the priests needs to reroll. It’s the h priest

[plush tendon]

you can play Holy Priest fine

[round pendant]

He never will, unfort

won't even try disc

[plush tendon]

the shadow can also swap

[shut vigil]

I can kinda respect that

rdruid is the only healer that I like playing

[solid sun]

You’d need to be some otherworldly holy priest to push keys on that spec

[bleak scaffold]

Depends on the goal, it's a premade, if you can go as high as you'd like ...

[round pendant]

reason sham is playing sham is because those two refuse to reroll, he wanted to play druid at first so he was like okay we need lust I'll play prevoker

that didn't work since that's even worse on kicks

sham was the only solution to be had

lmao

and it's basically me + him carrying the kicks and ccs

[shut vigil]

I mean

you can kinda get away with 1 really stubborn person

2 is a bit much

[round pendant]

yeah that's why I told them we ain't gonna be pushing very far and we're gonna start bricking the shit out of keys at like 14-15

[solid sun]

How good of a friend is the holy priest

Because if you can network another person you could push with that person and then do other keys with the holy priest

[bleak scaffold]

Rhino breaking premades lol

[round pendant]

It's just wild cause I know everyone would be having more fun if we just fotm rerolled

[shut vigil]

he wants to break your family apart

[solid sun]

Well it seems clear Yam isn’t happy in the situation.

If anything the holy priest is the villain here

[dusky canopy]

It’s actually more cool to push as non fotm with a full friend stack

[round pendant]

yeah hpriest is the lowest rated rn since we all can't play 5man every session and our failure rate is the highest as a 5man lmao

when sham is healing it's so fucking easy

[plush tendon]

yea, but not two priests

XD

[round pendant]

They're all good friends

[dusky canopy]

Two priests is pretty ass yeah

[round pendant]

They're just stubborn

[dusky canopy]

No class stacking

[round pendant]

I could try ppal ig

[plush tendon]

you can play off meta, but you gotta have some cohesion with the comp

[shut vigil]

is the shpriest blasting on meters at least

[round pendant]

https://tenor.com/view/chappelle-fif-i-plead-the-fif-dave-chappelle-the-chappelle-show-gif-4882456

[bleak scaffold]

ho no you di... YAM ! you can't say that 😉

[plush tendon]

The key is prob too low for shadow

honestly, just tell em that one of them needs to reroll cause this aint working

and its becoming unfun

[bleak scaffold]

ppal ...

[plush tendon]

and find a new person

sucks, but like... what ya gonna do

[round pendant]

are 13-15s too low for shp

[bleak scaffold]

It's blizzard's fault if the class/spec is not good ...

[plush tendon]

our SPriest rerolled mage

[round pendant]

I had a pugger shp do 40% more dps than him in one of my 12s I did for a weekly

[shut vigil]

how quick are the mobs dying in your group?

[plush tendon]

he only really started blasting in 16s

like 2-3 weeks ago

I imagine its worse now

[solid sun]

If I had a friend stack and I was playing a spec that was holding us back and making it unfun I’d change specs. But my friends would also help me gear up a new character

[fathom oasis]

are alts out of the question?

you can con them into playing viable alts

[shut vigil]

would you help whichever priest rerolls gear their char?

[round pendant]

Yeah basically if the solution isn't something I can do or the sham can do, it's just cooked

but I'm mainly just venting

[round pendant]

he hasn't done a key without me in 3 years

well, maybe a couple with the mutuals

[shut vigil]

has he even tried the other classes?

or just refuses to even try?

[round pendant]

I'd cry tears of joy if he woke up one day and said "I'm rerolling resto druid"

[shut vigil]

resto druid is extremely fun and when played well probably the best healer atm

[round pendant]

He used to play resto druid and boomie in shadowlands but I wasn't playing back then

[shut vigil]

pug restos are 50/50 though

resto is insanely fun rn

[solid sun]

So it’s your fault

[shut vigil]

blooms everywhere

[solid sun]

You show up and he won’t do anything but h priest

Very interesting hmmmmmmm

[plush tendon]

literally one of them just needs to play 'not priest'

XD

[fathom oasis]

bold

[plush tendon]

mage, lock, ret paladin, havoc, rogue

literally anything

[round pendant]

I've been telling him holy is making him have a way harder time in keys

since DF s2

[solid sun]

Yeah I remember you talking about this before

[plush tendon]

I only started healing this season

Resto Shamn is pretty fun

[round pendant]

but he likes it and is convinced he's good at it since he's played it for 20 years

[bleak scaffold]

so it's high degree of stubborness indeed

[plush tendon]

but, honestly, with the people I play with I basically just DPS until theres a mechanic that needs spirit link

[frosty mango]

Anyone who plays a holy priest in your keys isn’t a good fiend

[round pendant]

and incase it comes off like I'm shittalking my buddy, I've said all of this to him

[fathom oasis]

problem i have with druid (started an alt a couple of days ago) is: i have no fking what is ACTUALLY healing

[fathom oasis]

it's a fiend alright

[frosty mango]

Druid is all about funneling healing into regrowth via your mastery

[shut vigil]

I will continue spreading propaganda for my favorite healer until it becomes true

[round pendant]

also his ui is atrocious and he tracks nothing but PoM (which is in the bottom right corner of his screen)

[frosty mango]

And catweaving

[round pendant]

[shut vigil]

catweaving is slightly overrated

[fathom oasis]

most healing comes from the hero talent hot, which i feel lke... im not toootally in control?

[solid sun]

Resto Druid is beans

Everytime I invite one they suck

It’s all about Resto shaman

[round pendant]

rdruid will just outheal rsham at a certain point

[shut vigil]

you have generally 2 modes of healing assuming you have the current 2 or 4 piece. The super mana efficient way is to just maintain two lifeblooms, efflo, and just send out clearcasted regrowths here and there. You get massive healing from the symbiotic blooms. That's the main power house.

[round pendant]

but rsham has insane utility

[plush tendon]

honestly, way too much class power is tied to hero talents

war included

[fathom oasis]

it feels like i just go through a checklist:

• efflorescense down? ✅
• 2x lifeblooms going? ✅
• wild growth up? ✅
• rejuv up? ✅

and so on

[shut vigil]

and also WG on CD ofc*

[plush tendon]

I really like RShaman

has lust, has windfury

has a short cd kick

as someone just learning to heal, perfect training wheels

[fathom oasis]

convoke feels great to press though

cat feels kinda a lot of effort for not a lot of damage tbh

[shut vigil]

the mana inefficient way of healing is abundance ramping. You spam out rejuvs like your life depends on it before a big damage break, and then just spam regrowths on people. It's like a giant healer cd, you can heal through almost anything

[solid sun]

Not a lot of damage? Isn’t Resto Druid the highest damage output of healers?

[shut vigil]

healer damage is a joke and I don't think you're a clown so don't play along in the circus

[frosty mango]

That’s bc Rsham is broken

[fathom oasis]

swiftmend into whatever you need is your shortish CD right?

[frosty mango]

It’s gonna get nerfed

[fathom oasis]

it buffs it somehow

[half jewel]

Pretty sure Pres Evoker does more dps than R druid

[frosty mango]

It does

[shut vigil]

for most druid stuff you want to be basically use stuff on CD

[plush tendon]

Well, anytime if tried learning how to heal, I’ve defaulted to shaman

[round pendant]

idk why they would nerf rsham

[shut vigil]

also don't swiftmend into WG it's nerfed

[frosty mango]

Rsham far and away does the most dps, followed by vw disc

[plush tendon]

If feels like the easiest to understand for me

[half jewel]

Cuz I am consistently over 1mil dps not even trying on mine

[fathom oasis]

rsham just casts chain lightning and it goes wild

[shut vigil]

basically if you're just starting out, your main and only priory is just using every single gcd

[plush tendon]

I had a hard time getting Hpal

[fathom oasis]

maybe a lava burst here and there

[round pendant]

They need to just buff other healers dps

[shut vigil]

you'll get a feel for when you want to press what

[round pendant]

rsham feels good why make it feel not-good

[frosty mango]

I regularly finish keys on my sham over 2m dps

[shut vigil]

activity uptime is your primary metric when starting out rdruid

[frosty mango]

It’s gross

[plush tendon]

Oh, I’m not there yet

[solid sun]

Healing doesn’t even make sense

Worst role

[round pendant]

details right

[frosty mango]

Logs too, details usually 2.2v

[plush tendon]

Heck, I havnt even crafted, gemmed or enchanted my gear 😅

[fathom oasis]

you go cat, you need to start tabbing targets non stop, getting dots on everything, tracking the fake HotW so you don't overlap HotW's...

and a million keybinds

[round pendant]

what key level

[frosty mango]

That was a 12

[fathom oasis]

dam breakdown?

[round pendant]

do it in a 14 and raise those bars that I screenshotted

[frosty mango]

Chain lightning

lol

[fathom oasis]

lol

[solid sun]

Do you get to hurl meatballs

[frosty mango]

That’s so much work

[frosty mango]

On single target lol

[shut vigil]

total dps in a dungeon is like what nowadays

40 mil or something?

at the top of the top level

[round pendant]

I do wonder what it's like playing with a 5man that's actually got skill parity

[frosty mango]

Most rshams don’t use their cooldowns in m+ to facilitate dps

Like

[solid sun]

I think it’d be sick to learn how to heal

[frosty mango]

First pull of gambit

[solid sun]

But it’s so hard

[frosty mango]

99% of shams spamming chain light

[round pendant]

play disc priest

it's easy as fuck

[fathom oasis]

so hard to generalize, depends so much on which key

gambit goes brr

big numbas

[frosty mango]

But you can literally drop slt and then htt, press zero healing buttons and full send dps and do like 6m dps

[shut vigil]

all I'm trying to say is that 1 mil dps will almost never be worth it over a better safety margin for other players

[round pendant]

well that's just wrong

[shut vigil]

pres I think just does damage easily through their main rotation

[round pendant]

healer dps saves a lot of time

[fathom oasis]

any overhealing doesn't help complete the key either

[frosty mango]

Your overall isn’t really where healer dps is important it’s your burst dps on large dangerous packs

[solid sun]

Of course healing circle doesn’t care about dps. You aren’t damage circle

[frosty mango]

And healer dps is skill expression

[shut vigil]

someone gets me

[frosty mango]

If people aren’t dying then there’s zero value to extra healing

[fathom oasis]

it's just... it'd be cool if the whole cat extravaganzza rewarded you with a bit more dps

[round pendant]

if a healer does 5% dps (easily achievable) it cuts off like 90s off the timer

[shut vigil]

well sure but if people aren't almost dying what tame ass pulls are you tryna do

[frosty mango]

People should never be almost dying regardless of pull size

[proud nimbus]

healer dps on bosses is pog, but on aoe its just useless padding

[frosty mango]

Nearly all damage is avoidable and unavoidable damage is predictable

[round pendant]

wrong

[frosty mango]

Super duper not true

[half jewel]

I like that pres does dmg naturally cuz if I played any other healer I would hate trying to eek out dps while healing. I just wanna do my job man, if people live I am happy

[shut vigil]

it depends on the healer spec on some it's just more natural and easy to do damage

on druid it's fairly annoying

[solid sun]

Idk how you’re supposed to figure out if you’re supposed to be healing or damaging at any moment in time and if someone dies I’ll feel bad

[round pendant]

experience

most deaths are self inflicted anyway

[frosty mango]

Healer aoe dps is MORE valuable on trash bc it reduces the number of kicks needed monumentally on large pulls

[fathom oasis]

druid doesn't get extra healing from going cat right? and because you are not running raid talents, you aren't getting mana out of it either

[frosty mango]

Most healers have this bad mindset that their job is to just heal

And that’s wild

[shut vigil]

not really no, you get 4% hps but you lose haste from a different talent

[round pendant]

it's from classic or something idk

[shut vigil]

you lose like 6% haste or some shit

[round pendant]

boomers

[shut vigil]

so overall it's barely even

[fathom oasis]

it's very season dependant

[frosty mango]

No it’s not

[shut vigil]

you should also not run master shapeshifter

[round pendant]

sure sometimes healers do proportionally less damage, but extra damage is extra damage and if there's nothing to heal then there's ZERO valid reasons to not dps

[shut vigil]

it's not worth the 5% hot tickrate loss

[frosty mango]

A healers job is to keep people alive. That doesn’t always mean unga bunga max healing

[fathom oasis]

you tell me that season

[round pendant]

that was one busted ass season

lmao

[frosty mango]

It means helping to prio dangerous mobs to prevent overlaps, it means using your kick, it means using your stops, externals etc

[fathom oasis]

is the same as the current one?

[blazing shuttle]

That was the fucking Aug season.

With that stupid god comp.

[shut vigil]

utility, stops and kicks absolutely matter if you're healing

[fathom oasis]

tbf, the enablers for the no healing were the SPriests and the druids, right? with vigil and vampiric touch

[blazing shuttle]

And VDH being VDH.

[shut vigil]

if you aren't doing those on purpose and not because you're still learning or just are in a bad spot to push those buttons then you are griefing your group as a healer

if doing 5% instead of 2.5% of overall group damage causes everyone else to be forced to use rotate their defensives perfectly

you're padding meters

[round pendant]

https://tenor.com/view/how-it-feels-when-you-meme-nanami-jjk-gif-10683277372535996893

[shut vigil]

part of good healing is enabling other roles to focus on their main responsibilities

utility is a different story though

without using that you can very directly help wipe a pull

at least rdruid specifically, it's a proactive healer that benefits hugely from maintaining hots ready for incoming damage events

if you can do damage without sacrificing or risking on other stuff then obviously you should be doing damage

[fathom oasis]

i think it's a fair thing to say, that healer damage this season is not as relevant as it has been in other seasons in the past. Otherwise it would make 0 sense that 1 of the 2 meta healers out there is one of the worst at dishing out damage

Nevertheless, you should never let a chance to contribute to the team's dps slip by

[shut vigil]

if there's little opportunity cost to doing that I absolutely agree

[fathom oasis]

ideally, you do 0 overhealing and spend every moment you are not healing by doing damage

ofc this is unrealistic

[shut vigil]

depends on class rdruid is impossible to not overheal on

[proud nimbus]

meta healers have almost always been the highest hps healers and more or less ignoring everything else

[shut vigil]

1000%

[solid sun]

I don’t think that means healer damage isn’t as relevant. We’ve had conversations here where we said that prot warrior might do the most damage but that won’t make it meta and we wouldn’t say that tank damage isn’t as relevant

[round pendant]

And those meta healers in the highest keys are still optimising their damage as best they can

It's simply wrong to say healer dps is irrelevant

[undone beacon]

healers stinky take 11.2 PTR colossus that heals a billion and ignore all mechanics, those dps can figure it out

[fathom oasis]

how about this season though, isn't rdruid one of the (if not the) worst healers at doing damage?

[shut vigil]

it's irrelevant as a goal but it is often a side effect of just being a good player

[fathom oasis]

no damage is irrelevant, period

imo

[shut vigil]

idk man I just saw someone lust p1 dawnbreaker final boss

[fathom oasis]

if someone dies because you were doing dps though, that's a grief. Need to know how to balance it out

[fathom oasis]

is that bad?

[shut vigil]

right but all I'm saying is that at the very least, for rdruid, I don't play other healers, you are often risking people by focusing on dps

I mean it's not ideal it was a late lust as well

p1 is pretty scripted at least from my understanding

[fathom oasis]

dmg carries over to 2nd phase

[shut vigil]

does it?

[bleak scaffold]

All the damage done in P1 is not to be done in P2 anyway ...

[shut vigil]

pretty sure p2 always starts at more or less the same hp

[fathom oasis]

if CDs were not up, it's griefing though

[shut vigil]

then I might just be misinformed and stupid if damage does carry over

[fathom oasis]

barrels always remove the same % amount from boss iirc

[bleak scaffold]

No, the boss moves after the 6 bombs (that's 6 right ? :x)

[shut vigil]

I think the boss caps out at 63.5% hp

[bleak scaffold]

but the HP follows

[round pendant]

the bombs do a flat amount of damage afaik and there's a fixed amount of time before p2

if you hit all bombs

so it roughly ends up around the same place

[shut vigil]

does p1 damage carry over to p2 though?

[round pendant]

yes

[fathom oasis]

yes

[shut vigil]

alr then I'm just misinformed

nothing new for me

[fathom oasis]

season 1 it worked in a very weird way though

[shut vigil]

the p2 health bar is annoying in general though wish it'd be easier to tell how much hp the boss has left

[fathom oasis]

boss died at 60.X% where X was the YY.X% at which it left after p1

extremely weird

[shut vigil]

you mean 63.X?

[round pendant]

the boss just has a ridiculous amount of hp and the bombs bring it down so it's a reasonable amount you have to deal to finish it off

[bleak scaffold]

lust in P1 or P2 I would say isn't it the same more or less ? since in P1 you have the bombs and P2 theres the thing he throws

[shut vigil]

ah okay

ty

weird fight

but anyway if you focus too hard on catweaving, because of the way druid mastery works (your healing gets massively buffed the more hots you have up on the healing target), missed kicks can become deadlier and more dangerous than they would be otherwise

not to mention you'll drop rejuvs almost every time you start going cat, which means a slower regrowth cast

[fathom oasis]

if it left at 62.9%, you needed to deal 2% of its hp, but if it left at 63.1% you needed to deal 3% of its hp

[shut vigil]

there's a very real healing cost to focusing on dps for rdruids

[fathom oasis]

so basically, any damage from 63.9% to 63.0% was useless in p1, because you always needed to deal 3% extra HP phase 2

if you managed to bring him to 62.9%, however, you saved yourself from having to do 1% extra damage in p2

as i said, very odd (but now fixed)

[shut vigil]

oh

[fathom oasis]

that's where the idea that damage from p1 was not carrying over to p2 was stemming from

[bleak scaffold]

So if it's fixed ... why the hell are you giving us math problems ?

[shut vigil]

xD

[fathom oasis]

merely food for thought

[shut vigil]

he likes making warriors do math

it's his guilty pleasure

[fathom oasis]

zugzug in the game, differential equations in the discord

it be how it be

[shut vigil]

I wish there was QE live for tanks

it's such a nice website, no wait times

just the premium healer experience

is there anything we have to sim survivability btw?

[bleak scaffold]

not that I know personnaly

[round pendant]

no

[bleak scaffold]

I have questions on log analysis ... when you talk about the actual block %, you look at an overall or only on the melee ?

How do you see the overall rage generated/wasted, I see the details per spell but not the overall ..

[fathom oasis]

send log (can dm if you dont want to post here) and i'll send you the link back with the correct tab

but basically:
resources > rage > dont select anyone specific: that shows you overall rage generated and wasted

[round pendant]

Melee hits column

for block %

[bleak scaffold]

hooooooooooo i selected myself 😄

when I just leave all friendlies and select resource rage i see the overall ! thank you

So just the melee in this table right ?

[lusty grotto]

and whatever is blockable

but we mostly look at melee since it can give a more accurate representation

of how youre maintaing SB

and yea thats low SB

but close, you want as close to 100% as you can possibly can

[next warren]

guys one quick question, should i get at least one of each gem for the blasphemite or just stack deadly emeralds?

[lusty grotto]

its up to you, i personally dont bother

i just stack deadly emeralds like you mentioned

[bleak scaffold]

Thanks 🙂

[kind glen]

Diff gems for speeeeed

[bleak scaffold]

I thought I was logging but didn't noticed i have to enable it everytime in game, I have installed an addon to help on that now 🙂

[next warren]

do you use elusive instead of culminating?

[kind glen]

Absolutely

[lusty grotto]

its personal preference

[kind glen]

But it's all preference. Sometimes you may gain from being a step ahead, sometimes maybe not.

Feelycraft

[lusty grotto]

i havent done speed all expansion

or even in DF

[undone beacon]

gamers im doing it, im turning my goblin warrior into a dracthyr warrior

[lusty grotto]

morning bear

[undone beacon]

mornin

[lusty grotto]

why you lizarding

[next warren]

thanks for the insights, gonna try the elusive for a while to check things

[undone beacon]

Rocket Jump keeps disabling my Heroic Leap

[lusty grotto]

[undone beacon]

And its pissing me off

[next warren]

i did that tho days ago, never been happier

two*

[shut vigil]

dropping leech enchant for speed though probably definitely not worth it right?

[lusty grotto]

sure i guess?

[undone beacon]

Goblin patch is over its dracthyr time

[kind glen]

You will notice it, it's quite a bit of movement speed. Stacking tertiaries is sometimes just kinda fun.

[undone beacon]

speed bis stat

[mystic arch]

every day is dwarf day

[shut vigil]

undead master race

[next warren]

gotta go fast

[undone beacon]

stinky alliance

[shut vigil]

tasty though

[lusty grotto]

https://tenor.com/view/bear-fight-kung-fu-punch-kick-gif-17355780

[shut vigil]

fuck it I'll get the speed talent too

[fathom oasis]

let me introduce you to the church of SPEEEEED

[shut vigil]

gonna make all dks turn their heads, looking at their death's advance

[sharp merlin]

Starting to plough through 15s as I've had a month off, I have Tome / Myth Pacemaker - is that okay?

[lusty grotto]

you guys are taking the speed meme way too seriously

and lurkers are getting the wrong idea

[sinful copper]

Go get a brand

[fathom oasis]

i blame Augusto

[lusty grotto]

sure

[sharp merlin]

Hmm

[lusty grotto]

augusto is a bdk main

[mystic arch]

if you were really commited to speed you would have a WoTLK belt rocket boosters enchant

[lusty grotto]

of course he wants speed

[mystic arch]

but you're fake speed fans

[lusty grotto]

wheelchair fucking class lol

[sharp merlin]

I'll try my best to, but it's not quite.. easy lol

[fathom oasis]

honestly, when we have nothing to charge we are kinda slow too. Felt like a BDK a few times during the soul collection part of the last boss of ED

[sinful copper]

It's easy, just do it

[lusty grotto]

🤷‍♂️

we have leap

anyway its a meme discussion

[shut vigil]

I miss vdh double jumps

[shut vigil]

and two leap charges on a 10s cd

[lusty grotto]

optimally... speed does not matter except to farm old mounts or some shit

[dusky canopy]

Woops

[lusty grotto]

[dusky canopy]

Not that one

[lusty grotto]

hey man

[lusty grotto]

we need to revive that copy pasta

[solid sun]

lol

[undone beacon]

not if you rocket jump

then you have no leap

[lusty grotto]

😬

[undone beacon]

and look like a damn fool

[dusky canopy]

Fucking goblins am I right

[jagged pier]

i mean he has a point like some of the questions we have in here are pointless

[undone beacon]

uwu?

[dusky canopy]

Stg

[lusty grotto]

the guy that posted that originally

was high on something

saying raidbots was gpt

[dusky canopy]

Guys is tome a good pick from vault if I have mud

Like???

Nim! Log into osrs quick check it out

Lines getting long hurry

[lusty grotto]

is that

mom?!

[dusky canopy]

I hope that isn’t your mom brother

That’s uh not good

[solid sun]

That’s crazy

[shut vigil]

that ain't the village bicycle that's the village pavement

[solid sun]

Osrs is wilding out

[dusky canopy]

The shit people come up with bro I stg

I get so much entertainment

[solid sun]

lol true

[fathom oasis]

All im saying is you guys sit and analyze trinkets and numbers and forget to play the game. I bet you lose at least 10% dmg due to keybinds, addons and flexibility. Then you login and see people with less gear outperfoming you and wonder why 😄 (not intended for you personally ofc). This isint data analyst excel shit you do at job...more factors take place than you think. And yes im 100% sure that Sim is total shit. (not enough filters to use it as you think it works atm)

[dusky canopy]

All im saying is you guys sit and analyze trinkets and numbers and forget to play the game. I bet you lose at least 10% dmg due to keybinds, addons and flexibility. Then you login and see people with less gear outperfoming you and wonder why 😄 (not intended for you personally ofc). This isint data analyst excel shit you do at job...more factors take place than you think. And yes im 100% sure that Sim is total shit. (not enough filters to use it as you think it works atm)

[lusty grotto]

tell me you didnt type that out

and instead used the search to look it up

[solid sun]

All im saying is you guys sit and analyze trinkets and numbers and forget to play the game. I bet you lose at least 10% dmg due to keybinds, addons and flexibility. Then you login and see people with less gear outperfoming you and wonder why 😄 (not intended for you personally ofc). This isint data analyst excel shit you do at job...more factors take place than you think. And yes im 100% sure that Sim is total shit. (not enough filters to use it as you think it works atm)

[lusty grotto]

All im saying is you guys sit and analyze trinkets and numbers and forget to play the game. I bet you lose at least 10% dmg due to keybinds, addons and flexibility. Then you login and see people with less gear outperfoming you and wonder why 😄 (not intended for you personally ofc). This isint data analyst excel shit you do at job...more factors take place than you think. And yes im 100% sure that Sim is total shit. (not enough filters to use it as you think it works atm)

[dusky canopy]

All im saying is you guys sit and analyze trinkets and numbers and forget to play the game. I bet you lose at least 10% dmg due to keybinds, addons and flexibility. Then you login and see people with less gear outperfoming you and wonder why 😄 (not intended for you personally ofc). This isint data analyst excel shit you do at job...more factors take place than you think. And yes im 100% sure that Sim is total shit. (not enough filters to use it as you think it works atm)

[undone beacon]

All im saying is you guys sit and analyze trinkets and numbers and forget to play the game. I bet you lose at least 10% dmg due to keybinds, addons and flexibility. Then you login and see people with less gear outperfoming you and wonder why 😄 (not intended for you personally ofc). This isint data analyst excel shit you do at job...more factors take place than you think. And yes im 100% sure that Sim is total shit. (not enough filters to use it as you think it works atm)

[shut vigil]

All im saying is you guys sit and analyze trinkets and numbers and forget to play the game. I bet you lose at least 10% dmg due to keybinds, addons and flexibility. Then you login and see people with less gear outperfoming you and wonder why 😄 (not intended for you personally ofc). This isint data analyst excel shit you do at job...more factors take place than you think. And yes im 100% sure that Sim is total shit. (not enough filters to use it as you think it works atm)

[dusky canopy]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/148898720803586048/1153694496261947442/caption-1.gif

[jagged pier]

https://tenor.com/view/pog-fish-pogging-currently-gif-2252544987340524926

[round pendant]

still can't believe nim said that

wild

[solid sun]

lol

[lusty grotto]

https://tenor.com/view/peace-out-gif-3584473422170938815

[solid sun]

The original

[bleak scaffold]

J'ai pas la réf et en plus c'est trop long a retaper ....

[round pendant]

don't ruin the joke wtf

[solid sun]

Someone gonna call me out for misinformation

[round pendant]

https://tenor.com/view/fortnite-gif-4169442390448293969

[fathom oasis]

#protection message

[round pendant]

you should try it

[lusty grotto]

https://tenor.com/view/thats-my-secret-im-always-hard-im-always-hard-thats-my-secret-that's-my-secret-i'm-always-hard-i'm-always-hard-gif-13949726044878110332

[fathom oasis]

https://tenor.com/view/ban-button-keyboard-press-the-ban-button-gif-16387934

mods when they see the same copy pasta spammed over and over

[round pendant]

our mods are chill

[solid sun]

I remember when Ghash realized all the hulk secret gifs were inappropriate

And Nimchip ripped one before reading it all the way

[lusty grotto]

im just posting that whenever possible

[round pendant]

There's another hulk gif that I think of whenever someone posts that gif

I will say nothing more

[lusty grotto]

lol

[dusky canopy]

Smart hulk smirks

[fathom oasis]

is black widow in said gif

[dusky canopy]

||Yeah she’s bent over getting railed||

To direct?

[fathom oasis]

https://tenor.com/view/black-widow-hulk-scarlett-johansson-avengers-gif-17970446

[dusky canopy]

🤣

[fathom oasis]

i prob scared someone

somewhere

[lusty grotto]

[dusky canopy]

Somebody panicked and closed their discord at work so fast

You know it

[solid sun]

I work in construction. You just pass the phone around so everyone can see

[dusky canopy]

Ayyoo fellow blue collar man

🍻

[solid sun]

Cheers

It’s why I’m never one of the math wizards here

[dusky canopy]

Likewise I’m a true Zug brain

[mellow yoke]

construction worker the most prot warrior job out there

[dusky canopy]

Idk if I can post pictures of weapons so I won’t but I make firearms and aerospace tooling

CNC operator

[solid sun]

My job isn’t that cool

I’m a plumber

I handle people’s crap. Professionally

[dusky canopy]

Ahh yes laying pipe all day

[fathom oasis]

funny, it seems we do it as hobby over here

[solid sun]

[dusky canopy]

🤣

[dusky canopy]

Pay ceiling is worth ngl

As far as blue collar goes

[solid sun]

Can be for sure. Right now a lot of people want work done for nothing and it leads to some fun conversations

[round pendant]

https://tenor.com/view/denzel-washington-thank-god-relieved-relief-almost-got-me-gif-10995894

[solid sun]

Someone had me come out to look at a full bathroom remodel and told me they only had $300 in the budget for plumbing 🤣

[mystic arch]

that'll get them a new faucet for sure

[fathom oasis]

"hey come on, we are friends. You surely wouldn't charge a friend would you?"

[dusky canopy]

Kinda funny short story here,
My cousin is a plumber and during one of his on call weekends he was called out to some guys house at 2am because “the water/waste wouldn’t go down”
This guy ended up getting like a 500 bill to get his bowl plunged

[solid sun]

Yep

[dusky canopy]

Like bruh… did you even attempt to fix it?

Insane

[solid sun]

Had someone pay me $250 to get a fork out of their disposal

[fathom oasis]

Don't reveal the job's secrets

or else the plumber mafia will getcha

[dusky canopy]

Probably true

[solid sun]

My disposal is making this insane noise can you come check it out

Is there something inside it?

No

Show up and pull a fork out

[dusky canopy]

[solid sun]

Brew when are we doing dungeons

I need to swap to dps and we can do big keys next expansion

[lusty grotto]

what classes we playing in remix

[dusky canopy]

I don’t tank anymore bro I just hangout here because of the all the kool kats

I’m doing feral I’m pretty sure

[solid sun]

Pash wants me to be a wizard

[lusty grotto]

what is bear playing

dont tell me

[plush tendon]

warrior

duh

Gotta hang out in Odin's Halls

[solid sun]

I kinda wanna play rogue

[sinful copper]

When u pull more adds into 2nd boss eco, u do it while the boss is split, or after? It's so weird because you're like phased too so u have to walk out far until they phase in

[plush tendon]

I do it while they are split

[undone beacon]

uwu

[undone beacon]

oh yeah wizard time

I'm gonna play evoker!

Oh wait

[lusty grotto]

well you can

[undone beacon]

I thought they said no evokers in remix

[lusty grotto]

did they i mean its not legion classic

[undone beacon]

No evokers

[lusty grotto]

i honestly dont know what to play

i guess i can do shaman since its one of the two ive played the least

[undone beacon]

I'm prob gonna do a spriest since i have fond spriest memories

plus casting while moving makes casters seem nicer

[solid sun]

Does cross faction work

[lusty grotto]

it should

it did in mop remix

id imagine the evoker thing is due to artifact weapons

cause there were DHs in mop remix

[plush tendon]

I think you are gonna wanna play something you dont mind grinding a lot on

only reason Im playing legion remix is for cosmetics

[dusky canopy]

Feral is going to be fun

Can’t wait to bleeds

[plush tendon]

we arent getting legion talents

are we?

[lusty grotto]

no

[plush tendon]

[lusty grotto]

current talents

[fathom oasis]

what would they do with the campaign for evokers

[plush tendon]

best legion campaign is still the DK one

[coarse bay]

Turning them away at the door would be the best choice

[fathom oasis]

DK campaign is insane

Alextrasza was not very thrilled by it though

[plush tendon]

sucks to suck

I got orders from the Lich King himself

[fathom oasis]

those paladins that didn't let us ress uther either

[plush tendon]

dragon lady can suck it

yea, Paladins ruining everything

[fathom oasis]

only to find him later in the shadowlands

i mean

[plush tendon]

we dont talk about the SL

as a DK player.... was a big let down of a expansion

[dusky canopy]

Have you seen her in humanoid form!?

[fathom oasis]

understatement of the year

[dusky canopy]

[plush tendon]

yea, but DKs have Whitemane

[fathom oasis]

SL so bad, not even Venari wants to talk about it in the current expansion

[cerulean tusk]

What SL did to the helm of domination was a pure act of spite and hate

You can't convince me otherwise

[fathom oasis]

torghast? the maw? what are you talking about champion?

[dusky canopy]

SL story was bad direction imo story wise

[fathom oasis]

A COSMOS DIVIDED though

[dusky canopy]

But I’m not a big enough lore nut to have a valid opinion on it

[cerulean tusk]

We are not prepared for what is to come...

Also, all part of the plan

[fathom oasis]

Sargeras? just a puppet mate

[cerulean tusk]

Infinite army can't conquer anything

[plush tendon]

it was just silly.... not a huge fan of their description of the death realm

[fathom oasis]

the early concept is not too bad... an arbiter judges your past deeds and sends you to a subrealm fitting your life choices

that in essence isnt so bad

[cerulean tusk]

One in 4 then each got subrealms

[fathom oasis]

it's hinted at that there are thousands of said subrealms, but we just visit some of the most notable ones, iirc

[plush tendon]

yea, I didnt like idea of thousands of different realms

I would preferred something more akin to Dante's depiction of hell

where you have different levels

[cerulean tusk]

There are levels

3 of em

[fathom oasis]

the maw was hell

the others were kinda like different heavens

[plush tendon]

the Maw shouldve just been a pit

[round pendant]

honestly

[fathom oasis]

in a way

[plush tendon]

it wasnt hellish enough for me tbh

it was more like a desert

[round pendant]

midnight should end with you waking up at the top of icc and your character had just slipped and got knocked out and you dreamt all the expansions since

[broken light]

what are we dropping here to get shield spec

[fathom oasis]

some midway points, like revendreth being a realm where you are not doomed just yet, and you need to attone for your sins

doesnt sound so bad

[plush tendon]

it all shouldve been hell

[cerulean tusk]

Angry orange cow

[plush tendon]

and no souls were going to heaven cause it was broken

[jagged pier]

bloodborune

[plush tendon]

the expansion story shouldve been us descending into hell

[fathom oasis]

Elune: oops, hehe

[plush tendon]

that is my head cannon

[broken light]

so eitber 2 haste or bloodborne

[fathom oasis]

it is never explained why we are a maw walker

or why we can activate those weird artifacts

[dusky canopy]

@solid sun btw can key anytime my availability is just unbelievably dog as far as being consistent goes, outside of raid time I pop on completely at random when it fits

[bleak scaffold]

It's not like Blizzard does not know about levels of hells ... Diablo (first of his name)

[fathom oasis]

it is also never explained how the devs could think that keeping us from summoning a mount in the maw could be well received

[mental scarab]

Do the first boss in ara kara eat the spiders she spawn

[fathom oasis]

i was a dk back then

[round pendant]

yes

[fathom oasis]

looooots of walking

[round pendant]

Don't let the boss do that

[dusky canopy]

Can we get a Diablo 2 again

That was fun

[fathom oasis]

only if they overlap her hitbox

[fathom oasis]

spiders fixate players, not the boss itself

[broken light]

also just started pushing with prot what is the general consensus on stats? i see people going haste > equal crit vers > mastery

do i go more crit if i want more damage instead of vers

[lusty grotto]

look at the wowhead guide

[round pendant]

no you sim your character and aim for 23-27k haste

[blazing shuttle]

Thank you for reminding me, as an RPer, how shitty SL was.

How the hype died in mere MINUTES.

[lusty grotto]

and yes sim

[mighty valley]

shadowlands griping...

https://tenor.com/view/i-can't-have-this-conversation-again-tony-soprano-the-sopranos-gif-16274142811887245291

[mental scarab]

@fathom oasis got flammed for not tanking the boss right on topp of the adds in a key

Pushing my 14s and need to min max

[lusty grotto]

you dont tank it on top of the adds

you tank it right beside the eggs

[mental scarab]

Yea it sounded weird on my head

[fathom oasis]

this is what you do

they probably meant that

[mental scarab]

That is what I did isch

[fathom oasis]

it's prone to fail if one player doesnt position correctly

but in a high key you kinda should invite people that know mechanics

you can bring it to the eggs, after the spider goo comes down

[bleak scaffold]

Are the spiderlings doing lots of damage ? everytime i saw one getting to a DPS he run away like his life is on the line ...

[mental scarab]

Yea I’m bricking other people’s keys

[fathom oasis]

right next to it

[fathom oasis]

they do some damage, but it's not too much

[mental scarab]

The step from 13-14 is prty high

[fathom oasis]

depends on who you ask

13-14 is low key territory for most people here

[mental scarab]

Yea

I don’t get how they are doing 18+ the dps they need is super saiyan

Like I don’t die from trash but dps do

[fathom oasis]

in essence, you executing one of the spiderlings should be able to cleave the big spider

if you can't cleave it, they're not close enough

[mental scarab]

Did a 14 flood and healer died 738282829 times to random

[fathom oasis]

happens

[dusky canopy]

Me when I do 9.5m overall and then I see Critcake do 12m overall in the same key

[mental scarab]

Think I’m pumping with my 4-4,5mil overall

[fathom oasis]

also big pulls, that are only pullable by coordinating kicks

(and stops)

[mental scarab]

Yea but still

[bleak scaffold]

9.5 - 12 as fury not prot 😉

[mental scarab]

Ah

Hahaha

[fathom oasis]

bosses are usually where most of the time goes

[dusky canopy]

[fathom oasis]

i feel

[mental scarab]

Yea big momma in flood yikes

Haven’t had a grp in 5 keys that kill adds before shield

[fathom oasis]

which is why people are exploiting the current funnel meta to bring as many mobs to the boss as possible

[mental scarab]

In 14s

Yea I’m trying that to

[dusky canopy]

Just bring a BM hunter who plays dark ranger

They’ll do like 8m dps to bosses

[mental scarab]

And the trash efter first boss in prio THEY SCREAS DPS

[fathom oasis]

the reason arcane mage is so popular on the highest keys is precisely for their ST damage right?

[mental scarab]

that’s rough

[fathom oasis]

as well as general utility, ofc

[fathom oasis]

(when funneling)

[dusky canopy]

Every mage I’ve ever pugged that I can remember is unbelievably sandbagging the key

Floor pov

5m overall

Rarely kicks

Like bruh

[mental scarab]

Had a frost mage do me dmg in my hoa key

3200rio

[frozen berry]

I haven’t run with a warlock that’s worth a damn. Last night had one do tank damage in a 14 streets

[mental scarab]

Never seen a bad lock this season tbh

And free cookies

[round pendant]

they also dunno how to use their bres

[fathom oasis]

hey man, revisionist bias is hitting some shitty expansions hard. Need to keep a constant reminder of what a shit design looks like

[fathom oasis]

i haven't run with a warlock, period

[dusky canopy]

Bad luck vallon
The few locks I’ve had did like 50m openers on big pulls and like 10m overall lmao

[mighty valley]

i don't think people were very objective in their analysis in 2020 lol

[fathom oasis]

i see almost none

[mighty valley]

idk, something was going on at the time

[fathom oasis]

ngl, SL was in a very decent spot (gameplay wise) by the end of it

[lusty grotto]

something WAS going on

but the expansion was shit anyway

[bleak scaffold]

ho that's why there was a thing with toilet paper then ?

[fathom oasis]

who thought forcing you to do torghast evert week was a good idea

keep that shit for cosmetics

[solid sun]

I had so much fun in SL. I recognize there were pain points for sure but I had a ton of fun

Prot paladin was such a great selection for that expansion

[lusty grotto]

the people that stole maternity shit from the fridge and had a cosby room, thats who

[fathom oasis]

lmao

"maternity shit"

[dusky canopy]

LOL

[lusty grotto]

https://tenor.com/view/tasting-milk-antony-starr-the-homelander-the-boys-lick-gif-17834498

[bleak scaffold]

that one is nsfw 😄

[dusky canopy]

Why’s he gotta tongue it like that

Cmon bruh

[vestal beacon]

Hi guys.

Violent Outburst - best usage?

[solid sun]

Homelicker

[lusty grotto]

in pure ST only on SS, anywhere else you use on TB

[vestal beacon]

That what i though. Thanks bud

[fathom oasis]

it's crazy to think that back in the SL times, we had the same M+ pool for the whole expansion

or am i misremembering

[lusty grotto]

no

youre not

[fathom oasis]

M+ sure has come a long way

[lusty grotto]

thats what it was for Legion and BFA

and SL

until s4

[fathom oasis]

i also remember that dragonflight season where every dungeon was more or less "balanced", and then there was Vault of the Wardens

[solid sun]

What was the underwater raid in bfa called

Was it nazjatar

[fathom oasis]

Eternal Palace iirc

[solid sun]

Yeah that’s it

[dusky canopy]

Then… I get to milk ya!

[fathom oasis]

you get to milk the quest giver

[bleak scaffold]

🚭

[warm plinth]

What the fuck

[lusty grotto]

https://tenor.com/view/cheese-challenge-cat-fall-off-table-taking-a-tumble-cheese-on-head-gif-1757873524679935804

[solid sun]

Why did the cheese completely blue screen the cat

[lusty grotto]

rat's favorite food

[bleak scaffold]

Because he is running windows ... but he is black and white, like a penguin, should have runned Linux :/

[mighty valley]

cat brains have zero understanding of things being stuck to them

they like, want to get away from it, but moving away doesn't seem to help

so they go AAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHH

same thing happens if you put masking tape on a cat apparently

(don't put masking tape on a cat why are you being weird)

[solid sun]

lol

[chilly brook]

This sounds awesome

[glacial kestrel]

I am doing 13/14 right now and still did the Weekly RIO PUG routes.
Do you suggest the expert routes with PUG on that level? Because it says 12+ but also requires voice com according to the guide

[warm plinth]

I generally refrain from putting things on my cat

[lusty grotto]

nah you're good

[warm plinth]

I have never used a raider.io route so couldn't tell you

[glacial kestrel]

With the PUG routes? Ok thx

[glacial kestrel]

Which do you use?

[lusty grotto]

yeah 12 routes are fine for that

16+ is when you should consider some time savers

[fathom oasis]

are you regularly pulling mobs into bosses?

[warm plinth]

I just make my own for the most part

Sometimes will make adjustments based on routes i see while dosing that i like

Dpsing

[fathom oasis]

depending on the site, some weekly routes don't pull any mobs into bosses, and i think that's something that should change if you want to do higher keys

[lusty grotto]

the rio weekly routes are good enough this season

[fathom oasis]

if you are doing halkias alone, you be trollin mon

[glacial kestrel]

Sometimes yes, but not always

[lusty grotto]

for that range

[idle mesa]

Guys I’m having trouble surviving the first pull of streets on 16-17 keys… they do so much damage to me. I never felt so weak.

[lusty grotto]

use reflect

[fathom oasis]

any logs?

[warm plinth]

I assume you mean tbe second pull of Streets? And yes, use reflect

[lusty grotto]

and read our blockable/reflectable sheet thats always pinned, every season, and always updated

and in #protection-faq

[idle mesa]

Not the second pull, the first pull

[fathom oasis]

huh

[idle mesa]

As soon as you start the key

[lusty grotto]

use reflect

[glacial kestrel]

Thank you guys

[lusty grotto]

literally everything that kills you in streets is reflectable

[idle mesa]

That proxy strike wrecks me

[lusty grotto]

use the sheet

[warm plinth]

Same difference either way

[lusty grotto]

so wall it

[warm plinth]

It's proxy strike regardless

[lusty grotto]

proxy strikes alone shouldnt kill you

especially with wall up

proxy + 4x batons that you dont reflect will

[round pendant]

okay so

What's the actual way to survive those punchy guys in gambit

[warm plinth]

Punchy guys?