protection

[fathom oasis]

ok ok

[round pendant]

it's better to just slowly go and thunderclap as you go rather than go as fast as possible

I make sure to hit every mob on the way to the bridge

you lose a few seconds by being slow but you save your randoms from getting themselves killed

[bleak scaffold]

I just do it plitted :/ down the stairs up to the platform and trying to cath the first caster

[round pendant]

it's fine but it desyncs lust/cds

[bleak scaffold]

Running 10 at the moment

[round pendant]

since they added those poison spiders, you kinda gotta get threat since the healer will be having to heal people during the gather

[bleak scaffold]

So it's fine

[round pendant]

yea 10s are chill just W key

[fathom oasis]

i guess you could also do this (chaining the caster pat as it paths close) and send BL+CDs even before miniboss

never tried it though

[round pendant]

My brain is just like

if you're gonna do that why not just send it and take the mini too

as pwar you can just aoe kick the casters and get everything right under the mini ezpz

[fathom oasis]

it's 2 less casters (1 caster + miniboss), so almost no casts. Also, pull is big enough you don't feel bad by sending BL

[bleak scaffold]

there is 1 caster in patrol

[fathom oasis]

but yeah

[round pendant]

I'd feel bad not sending lust on mini

[bleak scaffold]

I'm not the best player, doing as I can with the people I have "helping" me ^^

[round pendant]

3 casters usually works fine in pugs

you as the tank just lock in on the shrill

[bleak scaffold]

You get the PUGs you deserve 😄

[round pendant]

and shockwave barrages

[fathom oasis]

when im saving kick for shrill and i'm out of stuns but i see a spider full channeling barrage

https://tenor.com/view/sweats-gif-25346666

[round pendant]

classic

[fathom oasis]

then you decide to kick barrage and hope some dps can kick shrill

shrill goes off

[round pendant]

it's just a shit dungeon

if any dungeon needed caster adjustments like hoa got, it's this

the patrols on the platform after first boss are obnoxious too

[fathom oasis]

i personally hate patrols

[bleak scaffold]

I mean, why put all of this on the tank ? there are 3 people that can manage kick ... you put all on 1 player, and then if he misses the slightest it's a shitstorm

I'm excluding healer because he has other priorities 😄

[round pendant]

Yeah same, the only time I notice them is when they're in an awkward spot and it delays my route by like 5-10 seconds

[round pendant]

The more people that have responsibility the more likely it'll be a shitshow imo

[fathom oasis]

that 1 patrol in the last room in priory is so zzz

[round pendant]

I like that pull tbh

triple mage shockwave aoe kick volley

[fathom oasis]

but if it's on one of the corners you need to wait

[bleak scaffold]

It depends for everyone I guess 🙂

[round pendant]

eh you just kill the solo mage pack and wait in that case

makes the double pull easier

[fathom oasis]

unless you pull em with miniboss? but i think that's ilegal

[round pendant]

https://tenor.com/view/jail-right-to-jail-right-away-parks-and-recreation-parks-and-rec-gif-16177531

[bleak scaffold]

[plush tendon]

most people have someone CC the far attendant

like Poly, repent, imprison whatever

so its only 1 caster and mini boss

[round pendant]

had someone do that in my pug and I gotta say it's fuckin awful

without a dk and with clueless puggers it just leaves it there casting for an eternity when you chain into pull 2

it slowed everything down so bad

ig I'm privileged tho cause I mostly play wow with 1-2 other people so the 2-3 puggers just have to deal with the remaining mechanics

[plush tendon]

well, you dont even pull it

you just cc, leave it there

and never do it

[mellow yoke]

this is just so not optimal

[round pendant]

oh that makes sense xdd

[warm plinth]

Yeah no, that attendant is close enough that virtually every pug is going to break the cc or at the very least get in combat with it

[round pendant]

yeah that's what happened in mine

it got broken near the end of the pull

it was such a grief

[mellow yoke]

What I do in my pugs is usually DH cage it, then usually at the end of pull dh cage goes down and he patrols down and we go past him

rarely fails in my pugs idk

[plush tendon]

and, quite frankly, if we are worred about CC breaking or something... key is prob not high enough to actually need to do that pull

just split in two

[round pendant]

or we can do all 3 casters

[plush tendon]

theres no reason to brick the key on the first pull

[round pendant]

it's ez

[warm plinth]

I just don't do the miniboss pull at the start. Optimal or not. It's the same nonsense as the workshop first pull. It's unnecessary to time the key and has a very high failure rate.

Let the high key people worry about that kind of pull

[plush tendon]

anything 15 and lower

[round pendant]

well mechagon had a pretty lenient timer

[plush tendon]

you really dont need to do it

[mellow yoke]

I mean low keys you can just go around and pull anything that moves and still time it with time to spare

[round pendant]

yeah and 15s and up pugs should be able to handle 3 casters

[mellow yoke]

this pull is not optimal for a reason

people blast all CDs first pull on mobs that dont do anyything

[plush tendon]

of course its not optimal

[mellow yoke]

then they have to do miniboss+ 2 casters

[plush tendon]

but its either that, or wipe to the big pull

[mellow yoke]

without BL/CDs

[plush tendon]

weve all seen it

[mellow yoke]

I'd rather wipe first pull and get it over with

[blazing ridge]

If you need to do it on later keys I would just brute force it, it isnt that hard, just sap G11 and the first pull is ez

[mellow yoke]

rather than lose time like that

[plush tendon]

it just depends on key level

you doing a weekly 12

split in 2

doing a 16, people should know what to do

[warm plinth]

Frankly it's not the casters that are the failure point in most pugs. It's just people wanting to start attacking shit well before they should

[mellow yoke]

That's why I stop at bridge

and throw a few TB/TC

then I proceed

[round pendant]

I just clap the mobs as I go and even throw a troar just before the bridge

to hit the fliers that for some reason don't social aggro properly

[warm plinth]

Yeah except then everyone assumes you're stopping there and there are still mobs coming in from up top, and then you end up having to stay there anyway

[mellow yoke]

I dont like taking fliers

fliers are a reason people die

cus of the bleed

and we talking abt this and I get invited to arakara

smh

[round pendant]

then as I cross the bridge I throw a rally while gathering the lil guys

then I walk up to double caster, aoe kick

then mini

worked every time so far

[fathom oasis]

yeah, i've had that happen

[warm plinth]

I would love for us to have an actual not shit speed pot again

[round pendant]

yeah that's why I make sure to not stop moving

[lusty grotto]

yeah id love to have a good speed pot

[fathom oasis]

i just make sure to communicate before starting

[mellow yoke]

Yeah

I'll be a slightly faster forrest gump with a speed pot

[fathom oasis]

but i do more or less this: #protection message

[lusty grotto]

BFA speed pot or bust

[warm plinth]

Skystep potion my beloved

[mellow yoke]

man what these people

[round pendant]

I actually think the third miniboss is the hardest

[mellow yoke]

Join a group and instantly say I got a friend

and when u dont invite their friend they leave

just duo q atp wtf

[fathom oasis]

shady strats to bypass rio/ilvl/whatever check

[mellow yoke]

Thing is this shit dont work in higher keys

Like atp im playing with the same 50 or so players everyday

[fathom oasis]

you miss all the shots you don't take

i guess

[hardy snow]

720>710

[warm plinth]

Overvaluing a defensive cantrip, couldn't be skyhold

[round pendant]

I got the hero boots on my rogue

[fathom oasis]

as much as 720 > 710, i'd definitely prioritize replacing other low ilvl slots rather than boots, if I already had the heroic cantrip ones

[cerulean tusk]

https://tenor.com/view/lessar-toaru-to-aru-majutsu-no-index-to-aru-kagaku-no-railgun-anime-gif-936703522623316960

[mellow yoke]

BDK detected

how much is ur overall

[cerulean tusk]

Pretty low

like 4.5m to 5.5m on avg

some 6m highrolls, but no monk (8-10m) situations

this is a pretty standard Tome farm run

If you go higher keys, dps increases

[mellow yoke]

tbh they need to entirely rework BDK

[cerulean tusk]

Luckilly DPS expontentially increases their value

[mellow yoke]

I dont see it becoming meta any time soon

[cerulean tusk]

BDK just need DS to not work as clunky as it does now with Vampiric Strike

Also, remove the DS nerf

[plush tendon]

BDK needs some TLC

[cerulean tusk]

And buff Will of the Necro to 70% to stop oneshots

[plush tendon]

it can be pretty miserable to play

at least, when I compare it to my Prot Pal and Prot War

[cerulean tusk]

Few thing is as misserable as BDK, as when someoen AoE stuns all, and you cant move to stagger

Death tolls for thee, Death Knight

[plush tendon]

hopfully in midnight they look at BDK

but my worry is they are just gonna target FDK and Unholy for some nerfs

[cerulean tusk]

At least remove the DS consumes the dam taken portion of the kit

[plush tendon]

honestly, both those specs are little indestructable

[cerulean tusk]

ruins the most fun part of it

[harsh trellis]

Fdk is fun af

[plush tendon]

I agree

[cerulean tusk]

Who cares about FDK?

[plush tendon]

but both are way too tanky for DPS

[mellow yoke]

Nerfs? Hell nah. Blizzard aint leaving DKs without atleast 1 meta spec

[harsh trellis]

I took my pos low level fdk out to try and ended up gearing it out.

[cerulean tusk]

I just want QoL changes, BDK as is, is fine

[plush tendon]

[cerulean tusk]

stop the oneshot (will buff) and return the fun high dopamine gameplay minmax

And we guchi

[lusty grotto]

Who cares about BDK?

[plush tendon]

[cerulean tusk]

RAT!

https://tenor.com/view/angry-cat-hiss-gif-16141788

[lusty grotto]

leave my FDK homies alone

[plush tendon]

Frost very fun

wish it were rider frost

but oh well

[harsh trellis]

I just like how spammy it is. But im goin back into my prot war brain.

[fathom oasis]

tbh it's odd that BDK isn't gaining more track this season, DS is usually busted when we reach end patch stats

[cerulean tusk]

Cause they ruined Death Strike

[plush tendon]

thats not how that works

[cerulean tusk]

And Vamp Strike mechanic ruins the flow

its pretty grim

[mellow yoke]

Also, it's being way overshadowed by other tanks

[fathom oasis]

then we get an end of the expansion DS nerf, into shit expansion start with DS nerfed

[mellow yoke]

so that's another reason

[harsh trellis]

Bdk needs a couple of things to be awesome. Mainly a charge ability. A shield for offhand and battle shout.

[fathom oasis]

i swear it feels like i've lived through this on 3 separate occasions

[plush tendon]

prob not

the last time BDK was the meta M+ tank was because of way overtuned tier set

in S3 of SL

but theres nothing that ties Death Strike healing to gear

[shut stone]

I have a 704 weapon and shield. Should I craft a 720 weapon or shield first? For M+

[lusty grotto]

shield first

[plush tendon]

shield

[mellow yoke]

Shield

[shut stone]

Ty

[lusty grotto]

but yes do both

[plush tendon]

but also, tomorrow is reset

soooo

you could wait a day

see if vault gods are good

[lusty grotto]

especially if you dont get or have access to myth tracks

[mellow yoke]

but

[shut stone]

Good point

[mellow yoke]

if he is european

it's the next day

[shut stone]

I’ll wait

[plush tendon]

im like 78% sure hes NA

[mellow yoke]

ok I looked into his profile picture

You could be right

[shut stone]

Yes NA lol

[plush tendon]

[mellow yoke]

why this server so NA dominated

😭

[lusty grotto]

its not

but its NA morning

[plush tendon]

its 10am on a Monday east coast NA

we're all at work

[lusty grotto]

you guys are on the wee hours or whatever

[plush tendon]

avoiding being productive

[mellow yoke]

It's bulgaria independence day so

I got the day off

[lusty grotto]

speak for yourself, i already finished most of my work for the day

[plush tendon]

I have to make hard phone calls

today sucks already

[lusty grotto]

except the million meetings i have

[plush tendon]

but im getting ramen after work

soooooo

[hazy pivot]

hi! why do guides show mastery ring from raid is bis? didn't think we'd want any mastery

[lusty grotto]

because the bis set is just that... a "set", it needs every piece in it to be considered, otherwise you sim

and mastery isnt bad

its last in prio, but still very good for us

all secondaries are

[hazy pivot]

simming for tanks work fine? do we sim dungeon route?

[lusty grotto]

no

and yes all tanks sim

[plush tendon]

we sim like a dps

[mellow yoke]

tank simming is simming only dps

[plush tendon]

1 target 5 min

5 target 1:00/1:30

[mellow yoke]

but higher dps usually = higher survivability

[lusty grotto]

the only thing you dont really sim are Shields and pure defensive trinkets like Mud, for example

everything else you throw into the clanker

[hazy pivot]

appreciate it, ty guys

[lusty grotto]

but shields youre using ilvl > all anyway

[hazy pivot]

i just went with a crafted one

ty very much

[plush tendon]

my Paladin is really juiced

but his boots....

https://tenor.com/view/whatarethose-shoes-gif-4488681

[hazy pivot]

thats the most alliance character I've ever seen

[fathom oasis]

5set new meta?

[plush tendon]

Ima make him a blood elf in Midnight

[plush tendon]

we need new pantaloons

I just got the hands yesterday in a Mythic pug

[bleak scaffold]

Don't shit on minions !

[plush tendon]

but its legit impossible to find boots

I swear to god

[bleak scaffold]

If you had minions crocs on your paladin you'll be happy !

[plush tendon]

granted I did just sell mythic boe boots for 750k

[bleak scaffold]

🥳

[patent scroll]

Mythic BoEs exist?

[plush tendon]

I should be farming mythic boes

mythic boe rings are going for a arm and a leg

[fathom oasis]

fdk bis stats i think

[torpid dome]

how much does an arm and a leg cost nowadays?

[patent scroll]

They have random stats though

[plush tendon]

hope for good random stats

[fathom oasis]

ah, the most expensive ones i think

[bleak scaffold]

probably 2 kidneys

[plush tendon]

there is distinct lack of mastery/crit rings/necks this tier

[fathom oasis]

crit mastery i think? can't remember

[patent scroll]

I mean admittedly we did get one ring, like a week before you could trade them

[torpid dome]

man i dont wanna go to silkroad to find out the price of a BOE ring 🙁

[plush tendon]

prob 5-6 mill

[torpid dome]

ufff

would you guys sell it if you get one?

[plush tendon]

100%

[patent scroll]

Absolutely

[lusty grotto]

here you go: https://www.wowpay2win.com

[jagged pier]

1000%

[bleak scaffold]

I mean if you get a BOE Myth, it means you are running Myth raid and have more chance to get one from vault/loot sooooo

[plush tendon]

id sell it, buy it again, just to sell it a second time

[lusty grotto]

but yeah i would sell, fuck it

[jagged pier]

if u keep a boe u get or buy boes u are just dumb

[bleak scaffold]

🤑

[lime spruce]

Massive true

[plush tendon]

after this reset

[fathom oasis]

would you take a myth ring or €250 in blizz cash

[plush tendon]

if Paladin cant get boots from Mythic raid or HM...

we crafting some

[jagged pier]

i already did

[plush tendon]

my war crafts are a little behind

since we sent on wep and shield

and replaced them

[lime spruce]

Oof

[plush tendon]

now I got bracers and belt

and I kind of want to try some fury

[fathom oasis]

heresy

[lime spruce]

Is fury the prot retirement home

[lusty grotto]

i did 2h into bracers for fury first

[fathom oasis]

straight into carpal tunnel territory

[lusty grotto]

so 4th spark was shield for me since ive been unlucky and cant open vaults with prot

[plush tendon]

Id like to pratice my dps chops a bit

been playing tank so long

[fathom oasis]

although i guess prot has more APM currently?

[plush tendon]

I should be able to dps on a whim

and not be a complete dunderhead

[jagged pier]

nope

[plush tendon]

I can already heal up to 12s on my cool resto shaman

[jagged pier]

ramapage counts as 3 casts or logs

unless they fixed it

[lime spruce]

I tried Arms again on ?? Ky’veza and wooooooo was I rusty

[jagged pier]

like spirits for shadow count as a cast

[fathom oasis]

but like, how many buttons are you actually pressing a minute

[jagged pier]

81

ish

[lime spruce]

No way fury has higher APM than Prot right?

[blazing ridge]

yeah 80s sounds about right

[lime spruce]

W/ all the oGCD rage dumping we have to do

[lusty grotto]

its similar

[plush tendon]

they prob in the same ballpark

both are high APM classes

[lusty grotto]

prot pally too

[plush tendon]

yea, Prot Paladin pressing lots of buttons

[lime spruce]

Switching my oGCD mit to mouse wheel scrolling is the best QoL thing I’ve done for myself, wish I knew to do that before my grind lol

It feels sane to play again

[lusty grotto]

🤷‍♂️

R and F work just fine for me

and like ghash mentioned

i like having camera control

[fathom oasis]

SS on Q, TB on E

QEQEQEQE

[lusty grotto]

they said ogcds

so SB and IP

[lime spruce]

Flipped for me but yeah

[fathom oasis]

just macro them to SS and TB

embrace the QEQEQE

[lusty grotto]

NO

/ban Nephtus

[fathom oasis]

https://tenor.com/view/kermit-darkside-star-wars-evil-innerme-gif-12686883553708718330

[lusty grotto]

no

[bleak scaffold]

I'm curious, how are you binds ? :x I mean you move ZQSD (sorry ZASD for the US), using the keys around, first digits 1 to or 5 and then with Shift, Ctrl ?

[lusty grotto]

this is seriosuly banned

there is no embracing, youre doing it wrong if you do that

[lime spruce]

ZASD? 👀

[fathom oasis]

all you'd need to do after that is just macro Shield Wall and LS as well, for optimal uptime

from the creators of the 1 button rotation

[bleak scaffold]

W 😄 my bad

[lime spruce]

I’m calling a wellness check on you @fathom oasis

[fathom oasis]

i jest, i jest

OR DO I

[solid sun]

SS 1, TC/TB 2, Revenge 3, SB 4, Execute 5, taunt 6, IP E

With an mmo mouse

So cozy comfy

[lime spruce]

I’m a weirdo I have all my base keys on letters and I use 1-4 and shift 1-4 for cooldowns

[lusty grotto]

i dont use an mmo mouse

[fathom oasis]

my oGCDs are on X,C and my generators are on Q,E. Send help pls

[lusty grotto]

but 3-4-5-R-F are prime real estate for skills i use a lot

[lime spruce]

C is interrupt

[fathom oasis]

mouse button for interrupt here

[lime spruce]

I have charge on R because it’s been there for me since 2005

[cerulean tusk]

3-4 and shift 3-4 is prime spots

5 is a bit out of the way, and perfect for execute

[plush tendon]

wait, yall keybind?

I thought clicking was the way

[lime spruce]

Given how much class pruning is coming in Midnight I may use leveling to re-do my binds somewhat substantially

[bleak scaffold]

I'm trying to! clicking too much :x

[fathom oasis]

i wonder how high you could get your apm by using your mouse, exclusively

[lime spruce]

Wait you guys are clicking?
/cast Avatar

[bleak scaffold]

Or i need to change keyboard because I'm hitting caps lock when trying to shift ...

[jagged pier]

no i type it out

[coarse bay]

Keep pinky resting on shift?

[lusty grotto]

ASDF

rebind strafe to A and D

[plush tendon]

I use a rockband drum set

[solid sun]

I wonder how ridiculous typing out abilities would be

[lusty grotto]

thats it

[plush tendon]

for my rotation

[solid sun]

Like imagine just doing a single boss and typing out all of your casts and uses

[bleak scaffold]

it's not easy to fetch them from the book you know ... (that is a joke)

[fathom oasis]

i need an MDI-style competition where competitors are only allowed to type out their spells

[coarse bay]

I was on my dk and my click casting wasnt working so i had to spellbook 2 bresses

[plush tendon]

I dont think they be able to complete a dungeon

one spelling mistake and you lose one of your 5 second GCDs

XD

[fathom oasis]

just have your most used skill* saved to your clipboard

[lusty grotto]

windows key + V is so good

[plush tendon]

interrupts would be non existent

[lusty grotto]

best thing to come out of Win11

[solid sun]

What’s the easiest boss in the pool this season

[fathom oasis]

what, that's present on W10

[solid sun]

For the entire group

[plush tendon]

Halkias

[lusty grotto]

also the one thing i miss on my linux/mac rigs

[lime spruce]

😂

[jagged pier]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RsVtZEicTj8

[lusty grotto]

oh yeah youre right

[jagged pier]

[lusty grotto]

why are you laughing

im serious

[solid sun]

So do all of Halls normally with the single caveat being that you must do Halkias with all casts and uses typed out

[lime spruce]

Wait a second

[solid sun]

Could you do it

[lime spruce]

You can disable the windows popup w/ the windows key can’t you

[fathom oasis]

guy has some typing skills

[lime spruce]

I literally never thought to use that button I thought you were messing

[plush tendon]

I need to level my hunter

[lusty grotto]

what

[plush tendon]

its perfectly alligns with my current skill level

[lusty grotto]

Windows key + V is universal clipboard

which is fucking great

just press it

right now

[fathom oasis]

yes

[lime spruce]

The hell is this???

[lusty grotto]

everything youve copied

and can paste

[solid sun]

Would it break my game because rn if I go to my appearances window my game freaks out. Universal Clipboard sounds potentially disastrous

[fathom oasis]

Win+V has saved my ass plenty of times

[lusty grotto]

it is so good

[lime spruce]

Literally never knew about this

[fathom oasis]

type first time pass from pass manager > forget to save it > overwrite it pasting something else > panic

it does create some issues where sensitive data that goes through the clipboard stays there for longer than you might want

[past summit]

I use threat plates for frames, the target frames appear over the mobs. Are there any addons that will arrange the enemy plates into a grid, similar to a healer's raid frames?

[lime spruce]

What problem are you trying to solve w/ this particular solution

I don’t think an addon like that exists and if it does I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone good use it in streams or VODs

[lusty grotto]

no, ffxiv style frames were banned from the game

[lime spruce]

Yeah that’s what came to mind for me too

[lusty grotto]

if there is a solution, blizzard is actively working against it

so i advice to not look into this

[lime spruce]

My guess is you're trying to solve nameplate clutter and trying to click around to make sure you're interrupting / stunning the right targets or whatever

[lusty grotto]

the best you can do is use boss frames, but not for trash

[lime spruce]

there are more effective ways to accomplish that then by trying to click through nameplate clutter

[solid sun]

I think most of us use plater or something like that because you can have the enemy nameplates to change color based on what they’re aggroed to. Like you or another tank or a non-tank

[past summit]

I just want something in a predictable place to make interrupts easier

[lime spruce]

namely knowing who your main target is and using a focus target

Yep you want to solve that through picking your main target as you pull and using focus targets

[past summit]

its not an issue when there are only 2 targets, but when there are many it gets difficult

[lime spruce]

weirdly enough the UI not letting you do that is actually teaching you how to approach the game better

you *generally shouldn't be pulling more than 2 targets that NEED to be kicked and if you are you should be in a coordinated group where you can communicate that stuff

[past summit]

in any case, if there are no addons it is a moot point

[lime spruce]

yeah but as soon as you asked I figured I knew what problem you were trying to solve and that's the bigger issue

my #1 lesson in pugging to 3k this season was that our job is much less about surviving tank damage and much more about understanding how to manipulate packs w/ casters and archers into the free melee mobs

and knowing that you really only want to pull 2 at most (at least for pugging) helped me a shitton

It helped me understand why the routes are how they are too, it's not just "mob health efficiency"

[lusty grotto]

if its for this specific reason, bind focus target, and have your kick be a focus cast

[lime spruce]

you can pug well into 3k without even using focus targets but marking the second caster for your dps to interrupt

[lusty grotto]

and/or use a kick macro with focus target kick as default and a mod for non-focus kick

any combination of that helps a lot

[lime spruce]

Yeah

We don't have the CDs to support bouncing around trying to interrupt 6 different guys anyway

I had the same frustration as you @past summit so I get it, and nameplate clutter still drives me crazy, but it's actually not the problem it seems like

[solid sun]

How much more difficult is H Dimmy over the normal version

I think we’re gonna extend since we killed Saladbar on Tuesday so we can just push for aotc but I’m wondering how likely it is we will have time after killing him for extra activities

[lusty grotto]

extending heroic is a bad idea

you need loot

[solid sun]

If we don’t extend we would just do the skip. They have no desire to rekill most bosses outside of the spider

[lusty grotto]

well they should

[solid sun]

Even though they claim they enjoy wow they try to play it as little as possible

[lusty grotto]

heroic dimmy is a step up in diffy

but largely the same

most notably intermission and p2 changes

[solid sun]

P1 is the same?

[lusty grotto]

that i recall yes

well

no, actually there's no poop drops in normal

so all phases have something new

[solid sun]

Perfect

We never did missiles right on Saladbar

We killed because the bdk and I could live

So this should go swimmingly lol

[lusty grotto]

poop drops and prepositioning in p1, the adds and frontals/miniboss circle in transition, and the tank pulls in p2

i think thats about it

maybe im wrong about intermission

and that was largely the same

idk

[solid sun]

Send good vibes for my sanity tomorrow

[lusty grotto]

i wish i could but it sounds like you guys are fucked

especially if not farming gear for it

[solid sun]

Our “group composition ilvl” is 710

[plush tendon]

wait.... extendo on heroic

[lime spruce]

has anyone else tried to play VDH but struggled to transpose the Prot mitigation kit onto it

[lusty grotto]

no i play both regularly

wait

[plush tendon]

Im meh on VDH this patch

[lusty grotto]

what do you mean by transpose

[plush tendon]

I just do 4 keys a week on him

but, idk

[cerulean tusk]

Spike = block, and so on

[lusty grotto]

just put demon spikes on your shield block bind yes

[lime spruce]

yeah like that, I get that with spikes it's the other buttons I feel less certain I'm getting right

[lusty grotto]

spike gap inc? use Fel Dev

and then use Meta on CD, its not really hard tbh

[lime spruce]

is metamorph closer to shield wall or last stand

[lusty grotto]

its stronger than LS

way stronger

so it can be a wall

but brand is a better wall

[solid sun]

Do you not send meta almost on cd and plan around it

I would think you rarely would want to sit on it

[lusty grotto]

when i say brand i mean fiery brand

also there's a lot more emphasys on stacking frailty

than punish for us

super important to do so as vdh

[plush tendon]

you ideally dont sit on it for too long

you can plan pulls around your meta timing

[lusty grotto]

yup

[solid sun]

I assumed so

[plush tendon]

the thing to get used to about VDH is that they dont really have the same number of CDs as a Prot War

its basicaly fiery brand, fel dev, meta

[lusty grotto]

i mean they do

immo aura is MDR

there is slightly more reliance on having spikes + frailty up sure

but available at all times, youre right

since cdr is scarse, if it exists

[lime spruce]

I think it's frailty that my prot brain is having hte most trouble trusting

like I see the number, number look good, but because I'm not really pressing mit button per se it's spooky

[lusty grotto]

shouldnt be, cause youre already stacking punish as warrior

[lime spruce]

bro code tells me I'm obligated to out myself here I have no idea what Punish is

[lusty grotto]

and frailty is just something that happens from shear + SoF amongst others, just tunnel what hits you hardest

put it in your talents search

[cerulean tusk]

When shieldslam enemy, they go OUCHIE! They dont want that! So they flinch while trying to hit you. Effect stacks

[lime spruce]

Ohhh okay I did know that

am I supposed to be tab targeting around to spread that?

[cerulean tusk]

Nop, effect stacks

[plush tendon]

I never think about punish

its there, its exists

[lime spruce]

okay yah taht's how I've been treating it

[plush tendon]

talent gives SS damage

good enough for me

[cerulean tusk]

well, stacking is the wrong word, per se. It stacks and overlap, but dont extend

[lime spruce]

"cool it makes bosses hit me a little less hard"

I mean like if I'm in a group of melee should I be trying to spread it around, it hasn't mattered yet really

feels more like a single target mitigator

[plush tendon]

yea, as long as your pressing SS on CD

[cerulean tusk]

dont think about it

[plush tendon]

theres not much else to think about

[cerulean tusk]

it is just there

[lime spruce]

great

yeah by comparison frailty feels a lot more relevant to how to understand VDH

and why it lives in big pulls

[plush tendon]

so, with VDH the biggest thing to be concerned with is soul gen and soul abosorbtion

in AoE

[lime spruce]

and for whatever reason my brain understands "you take 20% less damage from all sources" more than "enemies deal 20% less damage to you"

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[plush tendon]

in ST Frality is more important

[lime spruce]

🤣 see this is why I'm all jacked up

[lusty grotto]

nah frailty is important in both

you have more than enough tools to spread frailty in aoe

But be mindful of prio targetting, because frailty does get more stacks on whatever you're targetting

And of course, get the funnel right as reaver

[sinful copper]

What is this stinky dh talk

[lusty grotto]

Whatever you glaive should always be the prio target and should never be some little critter that's about to die, and you always go fracture into shear soul cleave after for the brrr combo

At least this season due to tier

[lime spruce]

Yep got that down, I would be willing to bet all my problems on other tanks have actually come down to not having a good understanding of how to pull and manage proper group sizes and caster quantity

prot I actually understood well enough to learn that piece so now coming in other tanks I have better context to play them with

[lusty grotto]

OK sorbitol is right, enough dh talk

[lime spruce]

yeah yeah

why you gotta be named sorbitol though

bad memories mang

[plush tendon]

Fracture into Soul Cleave

[lime spruce]

I miss all the haste on my main warr 😭 actually have to think about when to smash active mit button on [redacted other toons]

[lusty grotto]

yup thats what i meant

fixed

[round pendant]

https://tenor.com/view/lol-gif-5923988

oh jesus that's an old message

why does discord just not scroll to the latest

[coarse bay]

:0

[round pendant]

I should post my keybinds

[coarse bay]

Yuh

Show and tell

[lofty warren]

How get blizz to buff pwar even though they are fine like they did for bm hunters?

[round pendant]

can't

good players play pwar so they don't look undertuned on wcl

[round pendant]

keep in mind this is usually all hidden

[lofty warren]

So we need to have yodar not touch pwar anymore. Idk how such things can be done

[round pendant]

yoda touching pwar will help our case in getting buffed

[coarse bay]

Looks good, ive always played mmo mouse so i dont use that many keyboard binds

[lofty warren]

How big are your hands to be pushing shift 6

[bleak scaffold]

Never tried mmo mouse. I always as afraid to press 2 keys at once :x

You have like the razer naga? With 10-12 buttons in the side right?

[lofty warren]

Also alt 5 for avatar is yucky unless ur using a mmo mouse

[coarse bay]

My naga stopped working, im using corsair scimitar again rn, ive used scimitars for like 10ish years

[lofty warren]

Naga with the buttons is my favorite. I used corsair but multiple times all my settings memory got reset and it was a pain reconfiguring

[coarse bay]

The naga feels so good, but it stopped working pretty quick after buying so i didnt want to try another

[coarse bay]

Ya the software is kinda ass to work with on them

[bleak scaffold]

Maybe I’ll give it a try thank you guys

[undone beacon]

mmo mouse is for chumps real gamers use an ergonomic ball mouse

[shrewd grove]

I use V as in aVatar

[round pendant]

yeah that's my most regrettable bind

shift+6 is fine for me and I have womanly hands

but I don't press it, that spell isn't even talented this season

alt+6 was awful tho, so I made it alt+e instead

[shrewd grove]

6 bound and alt bindings but no F? 😱

[round pendant]

I just don't need any more buttons otherwise I'd add alt+qrf in there somewhere

[jagged gust]

I play with a guy who uses the numpad for camera movement, so he's got two hands on the keyboard and maps half their abilities to 0-9...

[coarse bay]

Any time i try changing a bind to be better, i always drop back into muscle memory and need to go back. I do ignore pain on 3 and leap on r, i tried putting ignore pain on r like my other tanks but just cant

Tried moving grip from r on my dk and went a whole key wondering why my grip macro wasnt working

[plush tendon]

unironically, one of the best ways to learn new binds is make a new toon

[coarse bay]

I dont need more :0

[plush tendon]

and each time you get a new spell, put them on the new bind you like

well, you just delete after

[coarse bay]

I already have every class, and duplicates. Dreading legion remix

I think my biggest bind regrets is t for trinkets and y for pots

But i started that in legion

[dawn herald]

is pacemaker better than astral antenna?

[coarse bay]

Can sim them both

I think usually antenna is better as long as u arent missing the orbs, but def sim it

[dawn herald]

thanks

[undone beacon]

my account is full it wont let me make more toons so, checkmate

[idle copper]

is it a tier token or crafting spark on the next reset?

[undone beacon]

Catalyst next reset

[idle copper]

ty

[round pendant]

You just have to stick with it

[coarse bay]

Tbh if i move my ignore pain, ill have so few buttons on my mouse, idk what id do

I did force the change on my pally last season thanks to the tier set tho

[oak ivy]

i have a 12 button mouse but i only use 6 of them, the other 6 feel super weird to get to

[remote tusk]

hey stop stealing my keybinds

[round pendant]

them's not the same

[remote tusk]

keybinds, not the same abilities bound to the key

just unsure why you'd keep dead abilities on some

[sinful copper]

i've been doing lfr, normal, and heroic soul hunters every week and still no boots. should i just craft a pair or is that a waste? lol

[round pendant]

no point in removing them if there's nothing else to go in there

[remote tusk]

a waste, you'll get them eventually

[lusty grotto]

500% a waste

you want ilvl not vet tracks

[sinful copper]

yeah thats what i figured

[round pendant]

wait what

[undone beacon]

It’s not a waste to craft boots

[round pendant]

it's a waste to spend that time not crafting boots

[undone beacon]

It’s a waste to farm reshii boots

[sinful copper]

huh?

[remote tusk]

[lusty grotto]

a waste to farm soul hunters boots

[round pendant]

unless you play fury/arms

ig

[lusty grotto]

not even close

sim them and youll see

[undone beacon]

I think Nim meant it’s a waste to farm boots instead of craft, not a waste to craft

[sinful copper]

ohhhh okay, that was confusing

[lusty grotto]

they are a good dps increase for dps roles, but not at anything under hero track

[round pendant]

crafted boots > hero reshi boots

[sinful copper]

damn for real?

[undone beacon]

Yeah

[lusty grotto]

any ilvl increase is better

[round pendant]

yeah the cantrip is just whatever

for tanks

[lusty grotto]

the cantrip is a nice bonus but you dont really want to sac ilvl for it

[sinful copper]

okay cool, so ill just craft boots at reset then, in case i get some

[round pendant]

that's the play

[mellow yoke]

3 score away from 3600 sadge

[round pendant]

beg blizzard to nerf ara-kara timer

[mellow yoke]

I just timed arak

[undone beacon]

Blizzard should add 18 minutes to every timer cuz I said so

[mellow yoke]

With 2 mins

[lusty grotto]

AK timer is fine

dont fucking go right (and dont pull bloodguards that dont need to be pulled)

problem solved

we've gone over this

[jagged pier]

Having a timer is old news, they should get rid of it. And just have it infinte scale until u need bloodlust for every mob

[undone beacon]

Hard mode TV week 1 experience

[sinful copper]

@mellow yoke how many times do you press revenge in a key? do u even bother using the proc revenges?

[orchid narwhal]

Yk its crazy how much better good players are

[mellow yoke]

On average or arakara?

[orchid narwhal]

I just timed 17 halls and I was like damn that felt good

Then I realized I wasted 7,000 rage

Wp noob tank

[round pendant]

7000 holy

[mellow yoke]

How do u manage that

[orchid narwhal]

Yea literally lmfao

[round pendant]

that's like 30% or something

[orchid narwhal]

well i know what i did

i was shotcalling for the first time cuz ive started inviting people into discord for keys

and tbh that has made the 17s feel like 14s

like straight up

so i wasnt really looking too much beyond just hitting buttons at my rotation

[sinful copper]

on average

[orchid narwhal]

But alos I wanetd to try this talent

[mellow yoke]

Depends on dungeon

[orchid narwhal]

And ngl i know its objectively WORSE, but it feels so much better

[mellow yoke]

If smaller pulls less

On big pulls I press it a lot

[round pendant]

how much haste do you have

[orchid narwhal]

w nothing

[coarse bay]

Im the exact opposite, i think it feels horrible to use that talent lol

[round pendant]

ITF should feel fine 🤷‍♂️

[orchid narwhal]

Thats what I mean by objectively it should be okay

but its just smthn else to track, which is a bit hard when shotcalling

bleh

this way i could juts forget abt it

[coarse bay]

Still a ton of wasted rage, spam that IP for me

[jagged gust]

there's a lot of things that a protwar can do that's objectively worse but feels better, like stacking vers/mastery or taking BSV

as long as the dungeon is timed you do you, boo

[orchid narwhal]

Yea for sure

Its a lot to get better at

[mellow yoke]

But well

Wasted rage equals less shield wall

And avatar

[cerulean tusk]

Crit/Mast is underrated, and is fun as a sidebuild

[orchid narwhal]

Yea for sure

[round pendant]

You're a fun sidebuild

[orchid narwhal]

Just stuff I gotta work at improving

[cerulean tusk]

D'aww, Yam so wholesome lately

[jagged gust]

took me until this xpac to realize the power of the low haste build

[orchid narwhal]

I gotta figure out a different keybind for things, I think some more important things are too far out of my range

Ngl though its fun, going from outlaw rogue to prot war in one month

Lots to press, lots of mistakes to make, lots of fun

[round pendant]

huh

[jagged gust]

outlaw rogue is best rogue

[round pendant]

outlaw is way harder

[jagged gust]

you're on the right path

[round pendant]

pwar should feel like a walk in the park

[orchid narwhal]

Mmmm

Idk comes easier to me

Rogue in general comes p easy to me

Its my main, Im just playing tank cuz i wanna do more M+

[round pendant]

what tank should I learn

bdk or vdh

[cerulean tusk]

BDK, 100%

[orchid narwhal]

vdh sorta boring rotationally

[cerulean tusk]

Pwarrior and BDK are polar opposites, so is great for that reason alone

[orchid narwhal]

throw glaice fracture soul cleave ggs u mastered the offensive rotation

[round pendant]

so much effort gearing a character from s1 tho

[orchid narwhal]

675 gear in like 20 min

Just go to all the renown vendors and grab weathered crests

Then craft it

Grab trinkets from siren isles

Do arathi highlands for whatever you can't fill in

[round pendant]

my alts never got those rep rewards refreshed

and idk why

[orchid narwhal]

Are you on NA

[round pendant]

nah

[orchid narwhal]

I'll carry your dh through a 10 before reset if you need one

Damn

On another note, being able to call spell reflect

laughing what the fuck is that

[coarse bay]

Why choose one tank and not do all

[nocturne spindle]

what was that even reflecting

priory last boss?

[lusty grotto]

thats what happens when you do no damage

also

its very likely priory since you can reflect 2 different bosses

[cerulean tusk]

Priory last boss reflects

https://tenor.com/view/lessar-toaru-to-aru-majutsu-no-index-to-aru-kagaku-no-railgun-anime-gif-936703522623316960

[nocturne spindle]

whats the 2nd thing you can reflect?

miniboss fireballs???

[cerulean tusk]

Shield throw thingie and targets

[lusty grotto]

2nd boss ...

[nocturne spindle]

oh

neat

[round pendant]

imagine getting declined from a 7 when I've done it on 12

[cerulean tusk]

Cause u bad

and should feel bad

[round pendant]

clearly

[orchid narwhal]

That is one boss

3rd boss of halls

[solid sun]

I knew it was halls!

Spell reflect blasts off into infinity on that boss it’s so sick

[lusty grotto]

yup

[solid sun]

I’ve finally got my team to just ignore kicks on that boss and I handle all of em solo

[orchid narwhal]

Actually crazy how much it does

I knew people were talking abouit spell reflect as this massive time save in higher keys

but ive never had comms in a key before until like an hour ago

and i am sh ocked LOL

im literally a 4th dps

And prot war dmg is already giga

[solid sun]

My healer doesn’t want to do halls without pwar because they hate if that boss goes too long

And they’re big happy when they see all that spell reflect damage cutting the boss kill time down

[shut summit]

uhhh proly not til turbo boost, haven't really been playing that much, just sporadically

[solid sun]

Did you participate in the fellowship beta? I think that was this past weekend right?

[cerulean tusk]

https://tenor.com/view/thanos-balanced-gif-3226445978144001245

[lusty grotto]

ok ok so soon!

[lusty grotto]

its even more insane how that boss melts with 2 warriors in the group and taunt+reflect on the dps ones

[cerulean tusk]

NL last boss SR

[lusty grotto]

just last boss?

cause all of the bosses were reflectable there, except maybe for the first one

[undone beacon]

Halls of Infusion boss melter beam

mmmmmm

[cerulean tusk]

Melter beam?

[undone beacon]

Yeeee the uhhhh channel that water boy did

[solid sun]

lol that sounds sick

[round pendant]

I'm retiring from healing

These clowns are just getting hit by everything imaginable

I hate low keys

[undone beacon]

Just heal harder 4head

[round pendant]

and getting into groups on my rogue is just absolutely demoralizing

[violet ginkgo]

ahh the hall of infusion and nokhud yeah the fun last boss big damage reflect. We actually need this more encounter like this, so spell reflect really shine on boss fight not just for adds.

[mellow yoke]

How about

Its prot warr meta

Every ssn

And other tanks are just inferior

Actually this season is nice

There is much more variation

To anything

[frosty mango]

Yes prot wars are unreasonably tanky

https://tenor.com/view/reptile-lol-hehehe-gif-5441436

-# that’s sarcasm

[coarse bay]

Last season wasnt bad with tank variety, people just pay too much attention to the bleeding edge meta

[frosty mango]

If only there were some data that could tell us whether or not variety was bad

Someone should get on that

[mellow yoke]

Very little

[coarse bay]

Ok maybe not variety, but viability

[mellow yoke]

Physical comps last season were just so few

[coarse bay]

For a large majority of people, any tank was fine

[mellow yoke]

Im talking

Big boy keys

Variety

You see some prot pals

Some brews

Hell even a few VDHs every once and then

Last season was VDH or no invite

[vocal cave]

whats your cd plan for mythic salhadaar 1st phase?

[frosty mango]

Every tank is viable every season at every level

That hasn’t changed in many years

[mellow yoke]

I mean

[coarse bay]

Once a “meta comp” is figured out and decided on, itll be the same as every season

[mellow yoke]

Have you tanked psf 1st boss with PPal last season

[frosty mango]

When the was the last season a tank didn’t title

[mellow yoke]

1 mistake and it was ggs

[frosty mango]

Yes

And there were in fact many paladins who did so at very high key levels which means it’s perfectly viable lol

[mellow yoke]

There was

Around 6 PPals

Last season

That title’d

Against how much VDHs

[coarse bay]

And many of the top tanks couldve done it as pally too, its just teams rolling the absolute best

Thats how meta works

[frosty mango]

The conversation is dangerous because it just feeds into the already dumb community sentiment that the only thing that’s viable is meta, which fuels fotm rerolls every season

[lusty grotto]

nope

[frosty mango]

It’s a fact that basically every season, every tank is viable, and no tank is necessarily “better” than another in a vacuum.

[lusty grotto]

thats not how meta works

meta works on group synergy

[frosty mango]

It’s the comp interaction that decides what meta is

[lusty grotto]

period

tank pick isnt made because of x and y reason belonging to the tank, they are picked because they synergize

FDK meta? Battle Shout + Skyfury

[coarse bay]

Ya, and none of the top tanks will play pally if there is a better tank for the comp. Doesnt mean a pally cant do it

[lusty grotto]

sure, we're not saying that at all

[mellow yoke]

I mean ofc people can do it

However

[coarse bay]

I was just arguing viability and he brought up the metrics at the top

[mellow yoke]

It is much harder

[frosty mango]

It isn’t though

[lusty grotto]

the question "whether a tank can do it or not" is not something thats relevant nowdays, not even in DF

[frosty mango]

It isn’t harder

[mellow yoke]

Maybe if you got a group

But if u pug

Its borderline impossible

[frosty mango]

But that is a community problem

Not a viability or game design problem

[mellow yoke]

Meta is just the comp people decided to run, not the only viable one

[frosty mango]

Which brings me back to why those types of conversations just feed that issue

[lusty grotto]

yeah its pointless

[frosty mango]

I’m like ultra anti streamer sentiment don’t mind me lol

[mellow yoke]

If you dont go meta you are kind of neglected

[lusty grotto]

people will copy without thought because they think having x, y and z class makes it easier, so "apparent" lack of friction always pulls in decision making

[mellow yoke]

I personally rerolled warr this season

But i went in with the mentality to chase high score

So I just play only warrior

And try to master it

[jagged pier]

what happens when meta changes?

[mellow yoke]

If this season meta changes ill stick with warr

Since im alr comitted

• no time for other chars

[undone beacon]

Reject “meta” return to bear

https://tenor.com/view/bear-run-stutter-fast-smug-rave-gif-18430984182494984776

[mellow yoke]

When was bear last meta

[vocal cave]

df s2

[mellow yoke]

Bear is cool tank

[undone beacon]

Right now cuz I’m playing it

Easy

[gray mirage]

Has anyone had issues taunting H dim? I taunt him as I’m getting knocked back when dbm says to taunt. I’m pulling more than double the dps of the other tank yet I’m not getting agro and at times it’s telling me I’m too close to taunt which makes no sense to me

[undone beacon]

I’m gearing an aug evoker rn, maybe if I’m bored I’ll push io on it

[coarse bay]

Just keep all tanks geared, or at least vaulting. Play what u want to later

[undone beacon]

Logs help here. Also taunt is pointless if you aren’t hitting the boss at the same time. I wait until after I land and position properly to taunt

[mellow yoke]

I cant

[undone beacon]

I did that S1 but all it did was make me burn out faster cuz alllll I did was tank on 6 chars

I keep 2-3 tanks in the wings and then dick around on Hunter or mage in my spare time

I also just don’t like playing BDK or VDH so I’m not gonna force myself to

[mellow yoke]

I have

2 days a week

I cant fit 4x 8x10

And raiding

[undone beacon]

Not with that attitude

[mellow yoke]

And pushing rio

[digital salmon]

and 4 kids and 2 wives

[undone beacon]

Multibox six different tanks at the same time easy

[plush tendon]

yea, theres too much woe is me in here right now

just zug zug

[tepid raptor]

oi, i got some issues where i cant see when enemies is buffed by some aura or shit on platers. For instance tacticians rage buff. Any tips on how to get them? I got naows package

[undone beacon]

If you can’t play VDH and prot warr at the same time you’re bad

[digital salmon]

Pull and Elon musk and pay some guy to push ro for you

[mellow yoke]

I just dont like VDH

[undone beacon]

But what if you were playing it at the same time as prot warr

Easy

[mellow yoke]

Hm

[torn ginkgo]

does Intervene work on the physical portion of Vanquish (big cone frontal on Nexus king)? our comp is not amazing for externals and just wondered if it worked

[mellow yoke]

Why do you need externals

For vanquish

Is that mythic

[tepid raptor]

oi, i got some issues where i cant see when enemies is buffed by some aura or shit on platers. For instance tacticians rage buff. Any tips on how to get them? I got naows package

[torn ginkgo]

yes on mythic

[jagged pier]

its not blockable so i doubt it

[mellow yoke]

I think you should be fine with shield wall and SR?

[jagged pier]

i mean

we SR it

[orchid narwhal]

I use naowhs packagae andsee it fine

Update your stuff

[torn ginkgo]

its not for the warrior if the warrior is intervening 😄

[jagged pier]

it deflects the whole thing

[orchid narwhal]

Jf its still not working after that, find a different plater

[mellow yoke]

Whats the other tank

[torn ginkgo]

its a monk, none of which matters as I am sure he can tank it all no problem, was a specific question on intevene

[jagged pier]

i doubt it will do anything

as u have ot be within 10 yards which your unlikely to be

and a monk should be able to solo it right?

[mellow yoke]

Well, try it

Doubt it works

[round pendant]

I'm gonna crash out

I need a guild lmao

[plush tendon]

[jagged pier]

crash out

do it

[round pendant]

no

I won't

[jagged pier]

https://tenor.com/view/do-it-star-wars-emperor-palpatine-palpatine-gif-799657800635657398

[round pendant]

I'm not allowed to play dps because half the tanks in pugs are incompetent as hell

and getting into groups is miserable as always

[jagged pier]

why u think i tank. i just anggy so go back to tank

i was supposed to dps first tier

and go annoyed by boss 2

[round pendant]

I just wonder what goes through these peoples' heads

it really can't be much

https://tenor.com/view/hop-on-the-cycle-frontier-the-cycle-frontier-hop-on-the-cycle-frontier-gif-26888181

[mellow yoke]

Idk why they removed the one button rotation WA

That shows when people use it

[jagged pier]

because its toxic towards ppl that use it

[mellow yoke]

Thats community issue

[jagged pier]

im tell u, u are playing with ppl useing no blizzard one buttons

and u have no clue

so it really doesnt matter

[mellow yoke]

Bro

U cant tell me

People at 700+ ilvl

Are doing well below tank damage

And not using OBR

[jagged pier]

we have proof of top io warriors using one button macros

so

[mellow yoke]

Thats

Much different

From OBR

[jagged pier]

its not it one button

[undone beacon]

people that do well below tank damage are prob not using OBR, it takes a special kind of not hitting buttons properly

[mellow yoke]

Obr does a wrong rotation

And has a gcd penalty

[jagged pier]

but for some classes its not really a dps loss

or doesnt effect them as much

[mellow yoke]

I mean

[coarse bay]

I dont think any class performs well with it

[jagged pier]

no one button macro or thing will ever perform at the top

[mellow yoke]

For some with a simpler rotation

[coarse bay]

The tettles thing isnt something good to go off of

[jagged pier]

https://imgur.com/5fLVSJv

this is a one button macro for prot

used in high push keys in the past

[coarse bay]

Oh nice

[jagged pier]

its just shows u dont need to top perfom to do high keys

[orchid narwhal]

Take it from me

I just did a 18 halls where i wasted 4500 rage

Im setting records

[mellow yoke]

An improvement from 7000 wasted

[jagged pier]

can just focus on mechanics and intuprts with one button if u loose like 10% too not wipe a key probably fine