protection

[lusty grotto]

anyway yeah it seems to hit for jack shit with wall + Demo + SR up

[storm stone]

sense is hitting it for it those windows so im assuming that means SR does work for it then

so case closed

i appreciate ur help

[lusty grotto]

yup

really unlikely that something tagged with cosmic damage wouldn't be MDR'd

cosmic is holy+nature+shadow+arcane like it says in the wowhead list

so its all magic

[storm stone]

yeah thats what i figured too before someone was telling me i was wrong, so i just needed to double check

[lusty grotto]

maybe AMS has a weird interaction with it

but i wouldnt know

[frigid plume]

ya AMS immunes it for reasons unknown to me

[lusty grotto]

yeah but the guy told icarus that it didnt work

but its nice to have some confirmation that the dude was wrong

[drifting pewter]

Wonder if a good item to pair w/ my heroic antenna once dinars come out is heroic brand, or mythic pace

[undone beacon]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/148897941883584512/1411084908960677959/Adobe_Express_-_deth2.gif

@lusty grotto

is this the other pally gif???

no theres no pally there

im high disregard

[lime spruce]

woooooo resilient keystones

2962 so close

[lusty grotto]

yupp

[hard loom]

What should be 3rd craft?

[errant wagon]

Is it a fair assement to say that If I am having 0 trouble surviving, I don't need to wear the reshi wrap boots?
One vault week I rolled myth boots and it was the only thing I had available to use, so I have 723 maxed myth boots & a champ cantrip boot.
I figure the cantrip boots don't give us more damage and i'm running 16's currently with 0 survivability issue

[hard loom]

Sim says Ring Binging of binding

[neon elk]

Yes, those boots are only better on equal ilvl , for dmg go for any higher ilvl

[lusty grotto]

no

[lusty grotto]

bracers or belt with dusk/dawn whichever sims best out of the two embelishments

those are your next two crafts

with our total 4 sparks

[neon elk]

I would say his sims sugest ring because he has one at 668 which is hella low , also idk stats on that..

[lusty grotto]

right but they dont have our 2 embelishments

5th spark it can go on lowest ilvl for sure

[neon elk]

Yea ofc , just wanted to clarify it for him why u sugest craft "against" his sim

[lusty grotto]

idk why i associated it with a pally

[glacial socket]

Morning! any of you have good macro for spellreflect? People to see to not interrupt while u use it? :D

[sick merlin]

Oh to be so innocent again as to imagine pugs will heed a macro

🙏

[fringe lava]

If you find one let me know. I found spell reflect to be the best way to get pugs to kick 😂

[glacial socket]

[sick merlin]

I honestly think your best bet is to say before that you’ll ping a mob/boss when you’re going to reflect but even that is not a guarantee they won’t kick tbh

[fringe lava]

Macro spell reflect with drums and they will be to occupied with DPS to steal the reflect 😂

[flint wharf]

this crafted ring binding of binding how it work now in s3 dose it applay random stat to random alay if teh targert allay is not in party or ?

idk what to craft thsi week

[jagged pier]

Just play around ppl i turpts honestly

Get s atracker its far easier

/ be ready om bosses to just sr with like .2 second left

[past oxide]

Is there a trick to dealing with the fliers at the end of ara? We had 3 deaths to people getting 100-0'd in +18 and don't really wanna try 19 till we get that sorted out. I tried to desync them a bit but 3 hits was enough to kill hunter

[mellow yoke]

if they are melee range they wont get charged to

[past oxide]

Oof thats rough we play them with drones and overseers and I've been kiting the drones between dispels so that moves the flies too so they jump on people

Thanks

[leaden grail]

how much do you guys go for dps when choosing gear for prot? Right now my sims tell me to equip a vers mastery ring cuz its 2% above a same ilvl crit haste ring. i would still be sitting at 22k haste so that's fine

[elfin elk]

Am I missing something with this sim, its telling me to craft neck over swapping over embels to double dawnthread https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/gufo7Bs6RC6uZ3qYQUV66k

[cerulean tusk]

Basically not at all, I just vibe play. But, Vers/mast ain't bad stats at all. So if robot said 2%, I would consider it.

But as you said, I prob would end up with doing crit/haste or at worst crit/mast personally (I just prefer it)

[paper coral]

How button heavy is warrior now? Im considering coming back to wow and charging around like an angry ball

[cerulean tusk]

Same as always, around 5-10 rotational, 20-30 buttons in total

[paper coral]

Seems like MT is the generally recommended spec, thats a lot of tclap spam, yeah?

[cerulean tusk]

Sums it up, clap and slam

[mellow bridge]

Yea, with MT it's one of the highest apm specs rn

[paper coral]

I can give it a whirl, but in case you know, what would some lower APM tank classes be?

[mellow bridge]

Like on fractillus I had about 90cpm

23 higher than the next person lmao

[paper coral]

Note: I wont be using the rotation assist whatever that thing is.

[mellow bridge]

Most tanks are kinda high cpm rn, brew is the most chill prolly

About 60 for brew

[paper coral]

Gotcha. Last question for now if you dont mind, assuming its played decently well, hows the damage intake on warrior? is it relatively smooth outside of of course big hits/spikes?

[sharp gale]

68 for brew on the simulationcraft site / similar to fury if you want to compare

[paper coral]

I havent played retail in awhile, i did SOD/MOP for awhile and then took a break from mmos. Saw legion remix coming and some other neat stuff and thought i'd get back into it.

[molten vault]

Can someone help me with this log, im a little confused

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/MKgB79vLjfJ8nFmk?fight=1&type=damage-done

just completed this dawnbreaker, it says i only had 73.2% shield block uptime. But i swear I track it in combat and it's always up. Is this just counting out of combat as well?

and if someone smart can point out anything else im doing that's glaringly wrong, I just finished my resil 12s, and hopefully pushing higher keys so just trying to find ways to improve

i also notice almost every single tank on WCL is using Tome of Light's Devotion, but on murlok.io nearly no one uses it in the top 50, so a lil confused ab that too

[mellow bridge]

Very smooth generally as long as you press your buttons before you take damage

That's warriors while thing

[nocturne spindle]

24% of your hits taken were unblocked, 9% of them were when shield block was up

so 73% accounting for dawnbreaker flights is probably right

[hot girder]

do we play any mastery or do we play the least amount of it

[nocturne spindle]

as far as tome vs something else

right now meta comp is double prio damage dps

so realistically the prio single targets are diein with the group already

and its better for the tanks to go cleave damage on trinkets

[mortal cypress]

I know arcane is good at this, but is dh brought for aoe and stops? Or is it good prio?

[nocturne spindle]

its funnel dps as well

dps slots are brought for big damage

[mortal cypress]

So what is the 3rd spot usually? Doesn't matter at my key level, just curious

[nocturne spindle]

rarely cause of stops

its some combo of ele sham/dk/mage/DH

usually

[mortal cypress]

Ele? Interesting. Thought they were a 3min wonder so not great for m+

[nocturne spindle]

oh or hunter right now

[mortal cypress]

Yeah bm hunter is great fun but stuff rarely lives long enough to make it worth it so I just go mm

[molten vault]

Ty for the help!!

[molten vault]

How do you get to this? I was trying to find it

[steady spruce]

Do you guys soak 2 beams at the end of HoA ?

[leaden grail]

yes. afaik it doesn't even increase damage taken as the debuff doesn't stack. I have only ever done this on +14 though and that's still immortality zone so

[steady spruce]

so it seems i had no idea

just had a +12 fail cause 2 people stayed out expecting other to soak the 4 beams

[leaden grail]

In a perfect scenario only 2 people soak, and that's also most likely the way to go. one soak tank, other soak wahtever kinda tanky class you have. just assuming that's gonna happen in a pug is very bad play by everyone else tho

[molten vault]

what flask do u guys use for M+? I've been going back and forth w/ crit and alchemical chaos

i have 20k crit unbuffed tho hah

[steady spruce]

praise

[leaden grail]

alchemical chaos if you use tempered potions at all, other than that it's vibes i think

personally I would only ever use anything other than alchemical chaos if it was necessary to reach stuff like 100% shield block uptime etc. since I use a lot of tempered in raid/m+

[molten vault]

i use temepred pots alot for dps

idek what other combat pots i would use? haha

[odd plume]

which should i use guys? i only play m+, is the reshi effect any good for tanks anyways?

[paper coral]

So im playing again and I didnt do Undermine at all, should I do that chain or head right to Karesh or whatever that new city is?

[high latch]

The general advice given around here is that for tanks ilvl > increased reshii uptime. I would personally stick with the 704 ones until you can upgrade the myth boots a little bit.

[high latch]

If you care about the story then you should do the main quest chain of Undermine. It is largely its own thing, but the overarching story is very relevant to TWW and what is happening now and into Midnight.

[paper coral]

I do care about the story. I have watched some of the cutscenes, so I know roughly what happens with regards to the ethereals tricking the goblins. Is there more subtlety to it what I need to understand?

[high latch]

That is the most important part for sure, but the zone also starts introducing a new race that will be important in Midnight. And the Undermine story on its own it pretty good.
If you're not in a rush to catch up to the current content I would recommend doing it anyway. If you just do the main quests it doesn't take very long. Else you're not missing out on that much since you've seen some cutscenes and stuff.

[paper coral]

im not in a rush. I have to relearn to play and get the muscle memory down. Im also considering switching from tauren to BE/Drak for aesthetics/xmog compatibility

not strictly relevant to the storyline tho, but it gives me some time to figure out what im doing before I jump into the larger grind

[steady spruce]

Is this normal damage repartition ? Anyone has a M+ run on warcraft logs i could check out ?

[main sinew]

Hey guys. I can pick light devotion mythic or champ brand (Got neither already) from the vault. Which one is best? Some people say lights devotion isnt as good as it seems from sims.

[high latch]

You can go to Warcraftlogs and filter on prot warriors and sort by rank, then pick any you'd like. I would recommend picking the dungeon you also did to get it as relevant as possible.

[high latch]

Personally I would pick Tome, but that's mainly because you can only get that from your vault (and dinars during the Turbo Boost patch). Champ Brand is relatively easy to farm.

[storm dove]

guys do you think war within in 2025 is better than vanilla in 2004?

[high latch]

They are very different games. I prefer modern WoW, but also think vanilla was better in some ways.

[steady spruce]

good idea thx

[main sinew]

Hm. That is true. I Suppose tome is better than champ brand. thanks mate

[uncut dome]

seems interresitng lol

[strong forum]

no stamina

no other stats

[minor aurora]

No stam is wild.

[uncut dome]

yup hahaha

[peak lily]

Is there a weakaura to track who has the item for the roleplay in streets? Or am i just blind, and can use eyes?

[frosty mango]

Let’s be honest tho if we could trade stam for something else we would

“Roidberg why do you have 11m hp”

laughs in 70% crit

[lime spruce]

You can see it but it can be hard to see

I’ve been holding it and looking for it and still not seen it before

[paper coral]

How is drac better than belf for tmog? its basically the same + scales, no?

[jagged pier]

because u dont ever play body type one

then u have the best body type for tmog

and more customisation for that body type

so it is the best

but tmog is subjective

also why am i being pinged about somthing from like 2 months ago

[orchid narwhal]

im like 90% sure its bugged if you start the rp early

Cuz it won't tell me that I've picked it up half the time that I do, I just walk over and then the extra action button appears

[frosty mango]

It can bug but there doesn’t seem to be any reason

[round pendant]

holy I finally figured out how to dynamically size weakauras

[frosty mango]

For example last night we started the oasis rp and then did mail boss, came back, tossed item on ground and I picked it up and had no button. Could see the thing on my head but couldn’t use it

Sometimes you can go get a new one sometimes your key is bricked 🤷

Happens often ish tho

[round pendant]

I had that bug but my extra action button bind still worked

[frosty mango]

Mine didn’t

I was sad

[round pendant]

game just works

[lime spruce]

🤣 apparently we keep receipts around here

Time to go back through my post history

[jagged pier]

opinion hasnt changed to

just very weird to get a ping on something from 2 months ago is all

[undone beacon]

Hey Jakey is IP still bugged

[frosty mango]

Quick someone find jakeys first message and ping him

What key is harder to tank at 16/17

Dawnbreaker or floodgate

I feel like dawnbreaker is worse for me but floodgate is like impossible to time

[solid sun]

One of them has a tight timer and one of them sucks

Mirite

[mellow yoke]

DB is easy except for 2/3 pulls

Floodgate 1 wrong step and ur dead

at pretty much any given point into the dungeon

[lime urchin]

Dawnbreaker because the dungeons bricks itself

This morning the ships on the side of the main ship did not spawn

[mellow yoke]

yep

I find new DB bug every day I play it

and that is not even exaggerating

The one Dungeon they shouldn't have brought back

[round pendant]

kinda agree

I've not done them that high yet

dawnbreaker has things that actually kinda hurt

floodgate has a tight timer

[formal salmon]

Guys in gambit what is the best course of action when the team gets to the end of the "Γ" mountain walk on 3rd boss do we retrace back from the end and make a 2nd layer of fire or just run back to where we started the boss fight
idk if that made sense XD if not, I'll try to explain it better

[warm plinth]

You want to attempt to get back to the start, because the earliest fire will start to disappear. That's a lot easier said than done though as you can't make it the full distance without both a breath and a new spawn of fire happening

[formal salmon]

ye I tried running back once and I got breath mid run and I and every1 panicked and messed it up

so like just yolo run back and hope for the best?

[warm plinth]

No, run back with the group staying with you. You can aim the breath at the mountains because it will be a between adds breath and no one is gonna walk through the fire to get to the beginning

Then after breath you full send back to the start

[formal salmon]

ahhh I see.. ye that makes sense, tysm 🫶

[undone beacon]

That boss alone makes me dread doing gambit

It’s either super clean or the key bricks

[steady pond]

Yo guys i think im bad at mountain thane or i dont really understand how to play it, Colossus feels like i have way more defensive tools

i think immovable object is so nice to have

am i trolling if im playing colossus at 13~15ish keys?

[formal salmon]

I know the feel, I just rolled a Gambit key, and that’s why I’m here asking XD stressing before it even happenss

[undone beacon]

You’ll be doing basically average or slightly less than average tank damage as colossus

[lime urchin]

It’s the one of the few bosses where the tank plays an important part of the fight
I quite like it
Compared to last boss dawnbreaker

[lime urchin]

Probably better if you are more used to play colossus

[steady pond]

I mean i feel like i cant keep up with thane rage generation, feels like wasting resources but tbh i think i need to pratice more

as thane

[formal salmon]

Ye, it's a good fight tbh I’m just new to tanking :P I started about a week ago, so I have no experience with those kinds of fights

[fervent hearth]

how do i hold aggro on the big aoe dungeonn when dps wont give me 3 sec to dps the adds?

12-14 range

[lime urchin]

You don’t, but you should have threat within 1,5sec or smt
But if you are still gathering and dps go full blast
You just sit back and watch and go find another key

[strong forum]

Make fun of them

That's how you keep threat

[fervent hearth]

ARA is the worst

[undone beacon]

Thane leans on IP a LOT more than Col just cuz you have so much rage

Make a habit of slamming IP when you’re gonna cap rage, it’s off gcd

[steady pond]

even if im already at IP "cap"?

[undone beacon]

Yep

Spending the rage is more important, since it feeds things like Violent Outburst and Anger Managment

More rage gen = more rage spent = more cdr = more damage = more rage gen

Don’t think about IP, just smack it

[karmic epoch]

[steady pond]

should i ravenge just when it proc?

[warm plinth]

You mean you don't like taking a nap for the last ~5 mins of the key?

[undone beacon]

If it procs and you don’t have anything else to do with the global

But even on procs it’s lower prio

[warm plinth]

I don't care if it procs. If I have TC or SS available, I'm not touching it until I don't

[undone beacon]

Colossus gets a lot of modifiers to revenge that make it big, thane does not

[lime urchin]

It took me quite a while to get into MT ie 2000+ rage wasted over a key but when you get the spammy hang of it it is fun to play

[undone beacon]

I love it, I go brrrrr

[lime urchin]

I am now at 900 wasted rage on avarage over a key and it becomes incredible smooth to play like that
Avatar goes brrrr

[fervent hearth]

the grp always make me aoe taunt at the start of the dungeon

[drifting basin]

Hey folks, I'm looking for some help with priory pathing. I don't know if I'm pulling too much per pull but I always seem to have people dying early. I'm not losing threat but maybe too many fireballs/potshots getting off. Is there somewhere I can go look at other peoples routes?

[coarse bay]

Post your route and people will give feedback as well 🙂

[proud blade]

does anyone know if theres a WA that shows shield amounts remaining? hard to tell when health bar is full

[drifting basin]

To do that, do I just click export in MDT and copy the text string?

[coarse bay]

Can also just screenshot the route and post. Im not at my computer to import

[drifting basin]

gotcha

This is the route I'm attempting to use. I've been told right side is the way to go this season, but that first boss with having the caster seems to be a hefty problem. I'm running 10's at 705 ilvl

[lime urchin]

Don’t go right in pugs
Just play left

My fingers are to fat to paint the route on my phone

[coarse bay]

Ya, the route should be ok for 10s. If youre having problems on boss, its more than fine to go left side. More kicks on trash, but right side needs kick coordination on boss or people can die.

[carmine solstice]

You can go either side really. Keep in mind going right you’ll need interrupts on the ad

[coarse bay]

If you ask an rdps to handle all kicks on the boss, you can just kinda watch the other kicks and fill where they cant on the caster. Still sometimes some bad overlap of interrupts but i havent had problems going right at any key level. At 10 people should survive a cast anyways

[nocturne spindle]

Double knight to start is kind of diabolical

You basically have all the pain of pulling a knight and dailcry without the time save of miniboss one being with list

Lust

[wild prawn]

Why does it appear the highest rio prot warrs are "avoiding" crit? They go heavy vers wherever possible, or is it just that when deciding between crit and vers, vers is "ahead" at higher keys?

[drifting basin]

So something like this for left side pugging?

[coarse bay]

I agree, but I think at 10s its not a huge deal. There’s optimizations in the route to make it a little better, but nothing looks crazy. If his main failure point is the boss, his only option is to go left if it keeps happening

[coarse bay]

Where do you tank the first miniboss? No matter which side you choose to go, he should usually be tanked in the same spot. Right corner of right stairs

[drifting basin]

Generally I just pick a corner of a staircase. I figured if I'm going left then I should tank him on left stairs to avoid pulling extra and if right then right corner next to the stairs.

[coarse bay]

Honestly i do agree with the other guy though about the double knight first pull, i know some people do it and its not too bad this season but have you tried a knight into the mini?

[drifting basin]

I have not, I've done the pull a few times as dps and it seems kinda okay. Just trying to run that far before people start hitting shit or before I get capped is concerning.

[coarse bay]

If they rip aggro when youre running that, theyre wrong

[drifting basin]

Right or wrong, their corpse still eats our timer ;-;

[round pendant]

I can give you my left side route

[drifting basin]

I'd appreciate it. I'm kinda just coming up with shit and hoping it works. I don't really have like a basis for why I'm going where I'm going other than when I plug the pulls into MDT I make enough percent.

[coarse bay]

Are you comfortable with chain pulling?

[round pendant]

I lost my route and don't remember how I used to do it

[coarse bay]

Im looking at mine but it seems to be 1% short now

let me see where something can be dropped and picked up

[round pendant]

oops

ignore that

lmao

https://threechest.io?id=cpy7i6tqdx7

[coarse bay]

the reason i ask about chain pulling is that my left side route has a lot of chian pulling as casters die

that was a crazy gif as i was typing lmao

[round pendant]

That should work

[lime urchin]

They play a different game than 99% of the players
Just sim yourself for stats, and get haste capped

[round pendant]

idek how that got into my clipboard

[coarse bay]

that threechest route yam linked looks more pug friendly than mine, and not a bunch of chaining

id try that one first

[wild prawn]

so, assume crit and vers the same then, just maintain correct haste?
simming prot warr also on raidbots?

[coarse bay]

pull 3 on mine is chained into 2 as casters are dying

[coarse bay]

generally crit and vers are pretty equal ya

[lime urchin]

Get haste and crit is the cookie cutter go to stats, just sim yoself en don’t overthink it

The moment stats start to matter you won’t be asking about it here anymore

[drifting basin]

pull 13 looks terrifying with all the mages but otherwise this seems a lot more solid than anything I was trying to come up with.

[round pendant]

you can break that up if you're afraid of it

as a pwar you can just solo that pull tho in regards to kicks

[coarse bay]

save aoe interrupt for volleys and hope everything dies, or chain it / do separate

[round pendant]

once their volley is off cd, you shockwave and they sync their volleys and you aoe kick

[wild prawn]

Thanks both! but its raidbots for tanking too? general setting? (sorry, this is my 2nd alt, and there is no tanking on QE live :p

[round pendant]

same thing with pull 9 btw, break it up if you're scared

[drifting basin]

ngl, I forget that that mass taunt is also a kick now.

[round pendant]

doesn't matter below like 14

pull 9 is a pug killer if your puggers don't kick

so you can kill casters then chain paladins into the second half

[coarse bay]

ya raidbots, i think dungeonslice works

priory is a lot of keeping the amount of casters to a controllable level, and chaining as you can

but dont be afraid to just slow down, you're not hurting for time on a 10

[round pendant]

btw you should prob take the opposite side in pull 1 (north side of the fountain) and tank in the north stair case corner

since suley spawns right there

it's easier

https://threechest.io?id=cpy7i6tqdx7

there

jesus I'm paranoid about my copy pastes now lmao

[idle copper]

Which mob fears on the first big pull in Ara

[wild prawn]

and we chase the dps upgrades it suggests?

[coarse bay]

the miniboss

[coarse bay]

in general, ya

[idle copper]

ty

[lime urchin]

No you sim for damage
and don’t sim dungeon slice, sim 5 targets 1.5 mins

[coarse bay]

horrifying shrill is the cast name

[lime urchin]

Or 8 targets

[idle copper]

Just healing an 8 on my shammy, not seen the fear go off on my pwarr (probably because i dont do the large pull) but I (heals) got feared group wiped

[idle copper]

which makes it even bonkers that it was the groups plan to pull large but no one thought to cover the fear

[lime urchin]

Wait what

[coarse bay]

was wrong reply

lol

[coarse bay]

the tank should be covering the fear, expecting group to not get it. or someone gets assigned that kick before key start

[idle copper]

Seems fair, i always cover the big interupts on this guy - but it was destined to go wrong, not one of them bar the tank popped a def or used a healing potion, it doesnt really matter i got feared as i was busy getting battered

[round pendant]

yeah you can cover every fear and aoe kick to group everything up at the start

we're pretty good at that pull I think

[kind urchin]

Yeah that pull is super chill for us.

[round pendant]

everyone else is running and screaming during the gather tho

[cedar grove]

Hey guys and gals - I got some questions that I'm not seeing any answers too about Prot Warrior. So currently my guild is 2/8M, and we walked into M Loomi where I got slapped like a little bitch. Been doing some research, and I think I found some answers, but I'd really like a confirmation that I am or am not bark up the right tree.

Currently I'm around 26k Haste, 15k Crit, 12.5k Verse. So I'm thinking I need to get down to around 21k Haste and spread around Crit/ Verse... I'm just struggling to find a decent stat breakdown.

[lusty grotto]

stats are not why youre getting slapped around

what was hitting you hard there? you should be reflecting+wall the lines

your stats are fine as they are

[lusty grotto]

read above

also if you have logs we can help you further

[cedar grove]

@lusty grotto honestly - I think I wasn't reflecting/ Shield Wall as well as I should. We went AOTC to 2/8M in one night, and I wasn't as prepared as I'd like to be, but I was still being chunked. I could have had Block or Demo Shout down and was seeing that.

It was all a blur and I should pull Logs and see exactly what was happening. Tonight after the kids go to bed

[lusty grotto]

yeah just remember both strands and the soak in p2 are your tank busters so you should play accordingly

both are magic, so SR can MDR them (and it does a reflect sound even though it doesnt reflect or deflect)

and since its low cd you can pair it with wall easily

and make sure you have SB up while youre actively tanking

that stat breakdown, i wish i had as it is ngl

well less vers and more crit but thats about it

none of that should affect you living in myth raid

[cedar grove]

Should I consider dropping some Verse? I've got like 6 Haste/ Verse gems I could move to Crit/ Haste

[lusty grotto]

up to you

but it should be fine as it is

i think its fine if you only raid

[cedar grove]

Okay. It's just always a little confusing sometimes when you read through like Wowhead/ Icy/ Maxroll etc and they say HASTE>CRIT=VERSE... Like how much Haste? Do I do what I used to have to do with Aug back in the day and just go Engy bracers and stack Mastery (for Aug) or do I want to stack Haste 2:1:1 ratios

[lusty grotto]

nah

you stack haste until your SB uptime is manageable with ITF

meaning you can manage the gaps

the more haste you got with ITF the smaller the gaps

but of course DR comes into view so around 27k is preferable

[cedar grove]

Sorry - brain is mushing up a little.... ITF?

[cedar egret]

into the fray

[lusty grotto]

you play ITF after 21k haste rating

before that, you play HR

the entire pick is centered around keeping SB up

and your haste rating

because of how SB's cd is affected by haste

youre well past 21k so youre playing ITF

[cedar grove]

10-4 thank you

[lusty grotto]

at 26k, youre close to 27k so your SB should be comfy to keep up -- youll stilll have gaps but they will be less, and in raid they are super manageable consider you dont actively tank all the time

just stay around that mark and then get more of the other stats

also mastery

[languid light]

Any tips to aggro everything until first miniboss in Arakara? Just respecced Prot.

[fossil mountain]

From what i understand Thunder Blast is higher prio than Shield Slam in AOE is that true in single target? The Icy Vains guide suggests no, but then says its highest prio in the Thane section

[warm plinth]

Yeah, just don't do the pull in pugs. Pull to the first platform and save yourself the headache.

[warm plinth]

The tier procced TB has prio over shield slam in ST

Otherwise it's lower than SS

[fossil mountain]

Ok thanks. Is there a way to track the proc from tier?

[late surge]

yeah it gives you a buff so you can do any weakaura you want

[orchid narwhal]

You can do the pull by going up the right side

Its a very hard pull for prot to manage in general, especially in pugs

But pull everything up until just before the miniboss, so ssticking to the right side of the platform, then pulling miniboss as part of the chain as one of the casters die

[warm plinth]

Track this spell ID 1252096

It's called Severe Thunder

[foggy raft]

What tools are you guys using to review where you can get better? I'm reaching into the +17 Key range and i feel like a noodle at certain points \

[lusty grotto]

logs

[foggy raft]

specifically what in logs if you dont mind?

[lusty grotto]

SB uptime

SB during blockable hits

reflects

wall use

rage use

[jagged gust]

CPM, unmitigated hits

[lusty grotto]

outburst use

CPM yup

[lime urchin]

80 CPM bois

[foggy raft]

Copy thanks! Just compare myself to some higher rank fellas?

[jagged gust]

VOs sent on TC instead of SS/TB

[lime urchin]

Yet I am doing 14s

[lusty grotto]

or post here and we can do it for you

or in #1347646810457636974

[foggy raft]

Awesome thank you

[lime urchin]

Some of Sense’s logs are public, which are nice to check and compare yourselves with

[lusty grotto]

yup

comparing with Sense is always good

plka too (and any of our Mods)

anyone else, i wouldnt really recommend

but if you dont know what youre looking for, you might fall into a trap with comparisons

[foggy raft]

Yea honestly have no idea lol. My last log from keys is a 15 so I'll have to run one shortly and I'll send the log over

[lusty grotto]

any key level works

log checks arent a key level thing

it checks fundamentals

because its often the case the fundamentals are wrong

[mellow yoke]

I just did an 18 gambit with zaelia and it was sooo fucking smooth wtf

and I'm stupid and forgot to log

[lime urchin]

Whoa! That must have been a cool experience!

[hybrid gust]

in M+, is there a big difference between 2x duskthread and 2x ascension?

[lusty grotto]

its not massive, but you should be running 2x dusk/dawn

[mellow yoke]

sim it, but usually dawn/dusk is better

[noble mountain]

is there a preference whether we craft 1h or shield first?

[lusty grotto]

shield first

then weapon

then embelishments

bracers/belt

[noble mountain]

ty 😄

[ruby musk]

Is there some trick to that first pull in ARAK?

[hybrid gust]

but whats best for survival?

[ruby musk]

I find that after gathering DPS just agro and blow themselves up.

[mellow yoke]

Eh

It is really really minor

like someone said <1%

[foggy raft]

Take a beat after the bridge. Hit a couple thunder claps and then p[ull into mini

Also CCing one of the casters is my go to

[ruby musk]

Hmm, that's what I've been doing.

I'll try waiting longer for the stragglers

Just sucks watching keys blow up because a dps dies and autoleaves

[foggy raft]

Sometimes the jabbers will 1 shot somebody so i try to limit them in the first pull but whaddya gonna do if no one used CDs

[heavy sparrow]

Write in your diary now you've made it

[plucky grotto]

gotta ask you fellow tank people, how often do you press execute as tank?

[warm plinth]

Depends what build you're using

If you're using the execute build, you press it a lot

You'll press it less if you're not running heavy handed since it won't cleave

[plucky grotto]

ye i get that part idk just feels weird pressing it so much as a tank

[lusty grotto]

you dont spam it

you dont wanna ever rage starve

so youre not pressing it as much as Arms for example

more like fury if anything

[lusty grotto]

whatever sims best is best for survival

stats have defensive value

if their offensive value increases, so does their defensive value even though its not tracked by sims

[minor aurora]

3.5m overall on Priory

feels low

even with execute cleave build

[warm plinth]

You have a log?

[minor aurora]

Nop, did not log it, my SB uptime still bad, i want to get a little better on that front to do a proper run

this is 13+

[warm plinth]

Ok well, if you can get logs, then we can help more. But I will say there's probably something else going wrong that's unrelated to Execute if you're doing 3.5 overall

[minor aurora]

I read some logs on the log analises help-and-review, it's about the same distribution of dmg.

Im low crit tho, 10k with flask, tha'ts aroung 20%

[storm moon]

any downside when macroing thunderblast + shield block ?

[lime urchin]

Why would you do that

[storm moon]

to avoid missing pressing it, when doing tanky stuff

just asking

[lusty grotto]

yeah you shouldnt

you dont wanna rip an SB when shit is about to die

and SB does have a duration cap as well

[storm moon]

ty

[lusty grotto]

do not ever macro SB to anything

[scarlet copper]

are fish totems in gambit indefinite range? or can you outrange them

[warm plinth]

They're fairly short range, like maybe 30 yards at most

You can just ignore them if they're alive at the end of a pull and move on

[scarlet copper]

okay cool

thank you!

[frosty mango]

Just based off this very high level it looks like you’re wasting a ton of rage (low outburst procs), not using all your thunder blast procs, not using your all shield slam procs, and when you do get outburst not using it effectively

[minor aurora]

As SS on ST and Tb on AoE?

[frosty mango]

generally yes

hard to tell those things without a log but the damage of your brand relative to the others and your avg thunder blast points me in that direction

what level key was it?

[quaint rune]

looking for advice on what to craft, im leaning towards chest or belt, butmaybe ring since i got champ ring...https://raider.io/characters/us/durotan/Handsome

[minor aurora]

13

[minor aurora]

13 Priory, sucesseful run

[frosty mango]

this is a 14 I did in push build, so not as much execute and I played not great, but you can see I got in 500 shield slams

[minor aurora]

And i feel like i waste a lot of rage, i main pally tank, so it’s somewhat counter intuitive.

[frosty mango]

if you log some keys and put them in log review im sure we can give you all kinds of constructive advice

[minor aurora]

Yes, im trying to get a better handle on war before logging.

I kinda realise the rage waste and the low reaction to some procs as im worried about living without heals.

IP is a weird concept for me

As pally you’re both proative to pop heals and reactive.

Here its constant spammage

[frosty mango]

kind of a backwards methodology there

logs are a learning tool, we can help you get the handle

unless of course you want to learn it on your own which is valid too

were not judgemental warriors, unless you don't like a good smoked brisket, in which case theres some problems

[minor aurora]

just wanna get a general better grip before improve on specific points, thats all.

[lusty grotto]

you dont log after youre good

you log during the whole thing

[minor aurora]

I still forget SB uptime, which is basic.

[lusty grotto]

theres no point at looking at logs if you know exactly what youre doing other than extremely min maxy shit

and parses

thats it

[frosty mango]

im honestly not even on the damage train this season

I sent a bunch of keys in execute build ripping like 5-6m dps just to make sure I could and Ive been a push build enjoyer since 14s

4-5m dps plenty

execute build is so much brainpower

[minor aurora]

i feel a lot squishier with it

rage just goes out too quickly

but even then, i was doing 3.5m

[frosty mango]

its not really any squishier....just the brainpower of shifting targets constantly to maximize it

which isnt much brainpower

but relative to not doing that

tldr i am lazy

[sinful copper]

Is it? Isn't it just like low target count u spam tb and execute every global?

[minor aurora]

Less rage on IP, overall

[frosty mango]

see above, lol

[frosty mango]

true but I think you'll find if you dissect your rage use that you are sending a lot of rage into a capped IP

which is fine and expected

[minor aurora]

I need to think, do i dump 40 rage on dmg or on survival?

And thats a step too much rn

[frosty mango]

pressing ip or not pressing ip has very little to do with your survival

ip is a damage smoothing tool, but in its current iteration largely a rage dump tool to use as a vehicle to get violent outburst procs which = damage

whether you live or die is dependent on your positioning, and your mitigation/cooldown usage

[sinful copper]

You're supposed to swap targets for execute tho? I never rly changed from my push build

So I don't use the execute < 35% talent either

[minor aurora]

If indomitable did not fucked the dmg that much, i would love it

[frosty mango]

as mobs die they arent even so you can get far more executes by swapping targets constantly for more execute uptime

[sinful copper]

Ohhhhhh true. Is there a target count where u don't execute, even with the cleave execute?

[frosty mango]

in thane? im pretty sure you execute even at 2-3

its in the wowhead guide

[sinful copper]

What about 6+ or something?

Oh ok I'll check again

[minor aurora]

Stupid ass question, but the ravager talent its not the castable on, right?

[frosty mango]

you would still execute but it would be lower priority than say blast

but functionally you are still executing

[frosty mango]

the auto one is just all around better currently

you would only choose self-cast if you need it as a gather tool

[minor aurora]

Its such a low dmg that the execute cleave and > 35% execute isnt flat out better?

[lusty grotto]

im not using massacre either

unless im in a key i know is doable without BSV

but i do run full execute talents except that one

no SD though

just RRR and Heavy Handed

so literally the weekly build from our guide except swapping massacre for BSV

[chilly brook]

If indomitable didn’t get kneecapped we’d still take it

But blizz kneecapped it last season

[lusty grotto]

no

they kneecapped it coming into TWW

we just didnt have anything else to get so we picked it

[chilly brook]

They kneecapped it twice

Then

[rocky crest]

Floodgate seems to be a myth to be cleared

[chilly brook]

S2 had a indom nerf

[lusty grotto]

it did not

[rocky crest]

Fueled by violence or imp IP ?

BB paired with fueled

[chilly brook]

Ah you right my b

It was rage nerf

Paired with the TWW indom nerf

[frosty mango]

floodgate is a big tank dungeon

theres a lot of running so you can impact key time a lot as the tank by just dragging shit as you go and chain pulling

imo number one reason a lot of fgs dont get timed is bad route or too much downtime

timer is tight

[rocky crest]

The breaking points for me are either 1st boss, bombs or momma ppl eating shit they aren't supposed to. While im tanking 10 / 15 mobs

Especially on the way to 1st boss, grabbing the diver duo pack and 3 man pat with 2 crabs, that pack takes ages

Also triple demo guys. Another panic dps time drainer.

17's timed on FG is a myth atm

@frosty mango Do you run Imp IP with BB or BB with fueled ?

[frosty mango]

Uh

I run imp ip as thane

I feel like playing fbv as thane is throwing

[rocky crest]

ya doing any keys as colossus ? higher ones like 17 n up

[frosty mango]

I’ve run some for fun but thane is just better

At the moment

[rocky crest]

also shield spec Yay or nae ?

[frosty mango]

Assuming we’re talking about keys not taking it would prob be trolling

Where’s @jagged pier when you need him

[rocky crest]

Aye but I see so many run w/o just blows my mind

[frosty mango]

I think Kira or yoda don’t play shield spec so you will see a lot of people emulate their builds

Most people are not Kira or yoda and they don’t run with their groups, rolling into your pug 17 without shield spec is idiotic

[rocky crest]

100%

[elfin grove]

How do you guys go about pulling big rooms that you LoS, Im a new war comin from vdh before I could just chuck a sigil of fire and tag everything easily but am struggling on war.

Rooms like the big lust pull in priory, the houndmasters and reaver room in hoa, pulling all of postmasters room etc.

[chilly brook]

Love this shit

https://youtu.be/6mI30w4vG1E?si=CYzx3JckHd7dN2Pk

“Prot is unreasonably tanky”

[frosty mango]

lol ok

Sure

[chilly brook]

Despite us losing tankyness

[frosty mango]

“Tanks being tanky is unreasonable”

[chilly brook]

In comparison to last season

[frosty mango]

What a clown

[lusty grotto]

just your casual shaman rager

[frosty mango]

Hold on I need my copypasta

[chilly brook]

Well I guess since everyone is clamoring about prot warrior being S tier I gotta bite the bullet and play my favorite tank

Oh darn

At least until 11.2.5 when the meta changes because of some small nerf or buff that doesn’t change anything realistically

[lusty grotto]

meta is already kind of a tie between ppal and warrior

and vdh/monk is 2nd

any other tank is down bad sadly

[frosty mango]

Warrior isn’t any more tanky than monk

Or pally

[lusty grotto]

agreed

[chilly brook]

You will never find me playing paladin

[lusty grotto]

🤝

[chilly brook]

At least not without a major rework to prot

[frosty mango]

How anyone could look at the data and arrive at that conclusion just leads me to believe they’re an idiot

[lusty grotto]

well not prot paladin at least

the other 2 specs are fun

[chilly brook]

Prot paladin sucks

Design is bad

[frosty mango]

You suck

Gottem

[chilly brook]

Ironically it might not be so bad if they brought back consecration being anchored to the paladin

But I’d still find sotr and their reliance on so many buffs gross

[jagged gust]

I hate how we're finally in the limelight and I cannot bring myself to play this season's dungeons

[hidden sinew]

Does shield block have a max duration? New to the spec and have been sending pretty liberally in keys – now wondering if I should be spacing out more

[lusty grotto]

3 times its duration

[hidden sinew]

Got it ty. So it’s pretty hard to hit that max unless you’re working with tons of haste

[warm plinth]

If you're not using Heavy Repercussions, you basically can't overcap it. That being said, you also don't want it up when you're going to be wasting it, like if you have to do running before next combat or something like that.

[lusty grotto]

depends on your haste rating and talents

so esentially what Ghash said

[hidden sinew]

Yup makes sense. Thx guys! Shocked it took me this long to try the zugzug out. Such a fun class

[chilly brook]

Time to trim up some steaks

[lusty grotto]

ok im omw

im getting declined over ppals already haha

wild shit

[grim pilot]

@strong forum rate gear

man when i look at other guys and their gear i feel jealous

missing big dam

[chilly brook]

Dry brining these 2in bad boys

[lusty grotto]

[rocky crest]

nice cuts

Salt n pepper smoke or ya mixin u P?

[chilly brook]

It’ll be salt pepper and garlic powder but it’s going in the fridge to dry brine for like 20 hours

Straight to the grill after

[storm stone]

hey yall how hard is it to get to 1800 pvp rating with prot? those elite appearances look pretty juicy

[chilly brook]

No idea tbh

[lusty grotto]

no idea ask in #pvp

also prot pvp is bad outside of rbgs and you should feel bad if you sandbag your team by playing it

or any tank pvp for that matter

[nocturne spindle]

get brand, besides that damage is a skill thing not a gear thing

[grim pilot]

I'm definitely missing a lot of damage

When people are at 717+ comfortably

[sinful copper]

I got 2 inch meat for you

[round pendant]

damn I finally pumped on my rogue

I just wish boss fights didn't brick my overall

[proud blade]

just hit 2k as 689 ilvl 😄 slowly learning this spec

[steady pond]

Yo guys yall use causese dungeon pack? if so does it have the tank alert for indirect attack from the guy in tazavesh streets?

[chilly brook]

Play sub

You’ll pump overall and boss dam

[round pendant]

it's too hard

I like sin

apply bleeds

win

[sinful copper]

What's indirect attack mean?

[steady pond]

well im not sure if the name cuz my game is not in english

but its a tankburst

from an add

on the first pull from streets

[lusty grotto]

proxy strike?

put it in wowhead and then hit translate to english

[steady pond]

yea ur right

thats the thing

[lusty grotto]

ive no idea i dont use causese

but just try it out in like the heroic SL version

or something idk

i would imagine it does

[warm plinth]

I think it does? But I think LittleWigs did anyway before I got causese pack

[steady pond]

Hmmm im running only DBM, but anyway i just created one for this MF

[warm plinth]

yeah proxy strike makes me sad inside

[steady pond]

hits kinda hard

[pulsar epoch]

guys its really hard to tank this pull i mostly die in 16 key. Any tip to survive it ?

[trim marten]

.014 cents was used is wild haha

[lusty grotto]

thats just a popular WA

[jagged gust]

I'll be honest, never done that pull past the first week of S1

[cerulean tusk]

I avoid all tacticans I can - but I mainly tank as BDK, and their 18million autos hurt big time

[pulsar epoch]

i need new db routes than

[grim pilot]

That is extremely standard pull

Like biggest constant in db

[grim pilot]

Rotate defs as per usual and ask for help before the key

Like if you ping a mob to get a vortex knockback stun whatever

So u can reset stacks

[cerulean tusk]

What kills a warrior on that pull, just the stacks?

[grim pilot]

Melees, potentially dot, stacks

[cerulean tusk]

Git gud, DRW or AMS

[grim pilot]

But yes stacks is the biggest disadvantage

[whole glade]

In Priory, I sometimes avoid getting knocked back on the first miniboss, what causes this?

[jagged gust]

Yeah I'm looking over this season's recommended DB routes, absolute goose on the loose vibes

[vocal flame]

I feel like this trinket is under reated

under rated*

[jagged gust]

I'm sorry to inform you but the trinket isn't overperforming, you're underperforming

[vocal flame]

could be but it still does a lot of damage

its also all i got lol

[dusty echo]

are u pulling all of green at once? I do mini +2 and then when the 2 die I wait for stacks to fall and grab the other 2 and they still die b4 mini

[pulsar epoch]

no 2 by 2

yellow the harder one

[cerulean tusk]

For S3, they allowed you to parry/dodge/block the knock-back attack

[warm plinth]

You could always parry/dodge it. Just couldn't block it. When you parry/dodge it is when you don't get knocked.

since it doesn't hit you

[royal mist]

This "correct" was to the deflect comment meaning you take no damage. So on Nexus king, you simply Spell Reflect the Vanquish abilities and solo soak conquer with SW and Shout?

[lusty grotto]

yeah it would work on vanquish

but why solo soak

im assuming youre doing mythic saladbar so im guessing you dont wanna split the raid?

if youre doing anything less than myth though, there's 0 reason to solo soak

people need it to get oath off

[dusk ice]

I found that pull too inconsistent in groups (16+) so I changed my route a bit to this. (Pull 6 the extra 2 shadowwalkers come in as the first 2 die)

[blissful pecan]

While doable it is pretty sketchy to solo soak with just SW and shout, would definitely want some sort of external or another player to immune soak with you.

[lusty grotto]

agreed

[royal mist]

Got it. Yeah an immune soaker would make it 50% less. That's huge.

[royal mist]

absolutely. We just stack the whole raid for heroic. lol

[jovial smelt]

Boys, I've just started playing tank for the first time this reset and im currently trying to time my 13s, I find that I'm struggling to keep my rage up (and ignore pain) during big pulls/damage events, could this be a stat issue or would I be better running a defensive trinket?

Or am I just doing something wrong in my rotation

[cerulean tusk]

Problem is likely that you try to keep IP up

[warm plinth]

Neither, and the fact you're overly concerned about Ignore Pain shows a fundamental misunderstanding of the spec.

No offense

It's a very common misunderstanding

[cerulean tusk]

IP is a rage dump, nothing you try to keep up

[jovial smelt]

Right okay, I thought it was something I needed to have up as much as possible provided I have no shield charges left

[warm plinth]

You should never not have Shield Block

[sinful copper]

Yeah if you're going too close to the max, u press it. There's a lot that's prioritized over it like keeping up shield block, shield slam, thunder blast, demo shout, etc

[warm plinth]

If your haste is below ~21,000 rating (pre-flask), then you should be running Heavy Repercussions

Instead of Into the Fray

[jovial smelt]

Off the top of my head it's like 30k right now

[warm plinth]

Then you should not have a problem with Shield Block uptime

[cerulean tusk]

If you are new, just run HR for now. Save yourself the pain

[warm plinth]

If you do then something is wrong

[sinful copper]

Nah it's too fundamental to learn to keep high shield block uptime

[warm plinth]

Shield Charge also grants Shield Block, and you should be using it on cooldown

[cerulean tusk]

No need to learn something that is automatic, when you already struggling with basic rotation, routing and overview

[sinful copper]

Do u ever hold shield charge for when shield block is lower tho? Like if your shield block is falling off, u press it, then shield charge is up 1 sec later

[jovial smelt]

Shield block isn't an issue, I think I just miss understanding priority on IP

So at the moment I send SB on cd no matter what then dump rage into IP, revenge and slam on procs

[hardy snow]

never use slam

[warm plinth]

No, as long as I'm going to get value out of the shield block uptime, you should send it

[jovial smelt]

Shield slam I mean

[sinful copper]

Lot of the top m+ warriors hold it for a bit so I'm not positive

[warm plinth]

Everything we have that has a cooldown and isn't purely defensive (meaning Spell Reflect, Shield Wall, and Last Stand) should be sent on cooldown.

[sinful copper]

Like I see it off cd for up to 10 seconds sometimes

[warm plinth]

Including Thunderous Roar, Shield Charge, Avatar, Demoralizing Shout

That's not them holding it on purpose; they're just making a mistake. I've seen Kira go 30+ seconds without pressing it before

There's no reason to hold it unless you would waste the uptime

e.g. the mobs are dying in the next couple seconds

[hardy snow]

I could understand holding it if some specific mob needs to be stopped with the stun and team is out of stuns for it, but thats very specific niche that shouldnt be followed if ever exists

[warm plinth]

Right, and if you're coming down to shield charge as your absolute last resort, I think you're probably already fucked XD

[cerulean tusk]

Just shockwave knock up

[warm plinth]

Hell in pugs, mobs are stun immune before even get shockwave out sometimes

before I even*

[sinful copper]

Knock up sigh. I miss it

[jovial smelt]

For sure, so I feel like that's what I'm doing at the moment but i might just be pressing IP too often, even when I don't have any charges of anything left

I have a weakaura that tells me as soon as I can use SB so uptime doesn't feel like a problem

[warm plinth]

If you have free globals where SS and TC aren't available, you can spend rage on either revenge or execute since at that point your generators are on cooldown and you're not at risk of overcapping rage

[hardy snow]

if you overuse IP you may rage starve and dont have it when you need it for SB

[cerulean tusk]

If ya die, ya could also simply allowing mobs to surround you

Keep that in mind

[jovial smelt]

But just on some fights/pulls I just absolute feel like I'm getting destroyed and barely hanging on, for example like momma on flood, last boss flood

I can probably imagine my spell reflect usage is shit

[warm plinth]

Those are two bosses that you should not be feeling danger on

[cerulean tusk]

Momma do leave a nasty DoT, SR and wall it, and rest is up to the healer

[dusk ice]

In those cases SR is up for every buster of those bosses

[warm plinth]

Like the last boss you can SR and never use another cooldown and you'll be perfectly fine in a 13

On Big MOMMA I use shield wall unless Demo shout is active when Electro is going out, then I just use SR

[cerulean tusk]

Depends on gear no? I remember it hitting quite hard at 685 area

[warm plinth]

it's magic so other than taking a larger part of your health bar just due to having lower HP, it shouldn't hit any harder

outside of vers I guess

[jovial smelt]

Thing is I'm pretty well geared so I shouldn't be struggling, after reading I think I'm just using stuff badly and not using SR enough

[warm plinth]

If you have/can get logs, that would be ideal; we could tell you exactly what you're doing wrong.

[cerulean tusk]

My guess is putting your back to the enemy, only thing that can hurt you in a 12-13

[jovial smelt]

Unfortunately I'm not at home ATM so I haven't got access to them

I'm using double DPS/stat trinkets so I guess that could be hurting a little?

[warm plinth]

No

[cerulean tusk]

Not at all

[warm plinth]

You basically never need a defensive trinket this season

I don't even think anyone's running them in the highest keys

[lime spruce]

Boys, 2 weeks ago I tried my first +10 after treading water in the 7-9 range, @plush tendon gave me the courage and knowledge to go for it

We fuckin made it

[warm plinth]

Pwar in general rarely needs defensive trinkets, but there's always one or two that become popular safety blankets for people every season.

[cerulean tusk]

Gz

[warm plinth]

Nice job SnowBeast

[lime spruce]

all pugged too lol

[warm plinth]

4k here you come

👀

[lime spruce]

😂

[jovial smelt]

I was using the mud trinket for a bit but my guildie said nobody uses tank trinkets outside maybe the priory one/soul hunters and I should just use antenna and soleahs

[lime spruce]

couldn't have done it without you guys

seriously though there is way too much shit to learn in this game anymore lol

[cerulean tusk]

Meh, just use mud if you want to. Noone will stop you, but with mud, there is no way you are dying

[warm plinth]

You can use mud if you want, but you don't need it and shouldn't think you do. I don't care if you use it as long as you understand that NOT using it is not what is killing you

And realistically, floodgate is one dungeon that it gets quite a bit of value since you have dots on you damn near the whole dungeon

[cerulean tusk]

That moment went it clicks in your head that crit Trinky got more value than mud, for defence

[hardy snow]

i cant look at top runs droping shield spec for bloodsurge

[warm plinth]

It's very painful to see

[hardy snow]

https://tenor.com/view/mickey-mouse-classic-blind-cant-see-gif-9801173

[cerulean tusk]

If ya don't die, take the dam, is the logic
Just makes mastery a better stat

[warm plinth]

I'll make you a better stat

fuckin gottem

[hardy snow]

ok, I see Skylark takes it, I will cheer for his team on MDI

[warm plinth]

[jovial smelt]

I think end of the day I just need to play better and it will come with xp, crit is better for defense right so I just need to recraft some stuff and change enchants as I'm HEAVY haste mastery

SR, Demo shout usage needs improvement 100%
And I'm probably taking back shots so just experience

[cerulean tusk]

Take one step at a time

Ya will get there

[round pendant]

I mean we had 100% SB uptime for free for like 7 seasons

[warm plinth]

Stats are like

1% of your survival

if that

[round pendant]

wait you guys use demo shout for the defensive value?

[cerulean tusk]

Well

[warm plinth]

You could stack 45k mastery and you'd still be fine

[cerulean tusk]

Shieldblock value

Is big

[warm plinth]

Our survival is like 95% gameplay

Yeah the block value is the 1% stats mattering

[cerulean tusk]

90% shieldblock value, 9% gsmeplay

[jovial smelt]

Oh yea stats are whatever but it can't hurt to swap things to more preferred weights

[round pendant]

gz king did my route help

[cerulean tusk]

Gameplay is facing the enemy

[hardy snow]

and what % for shield ilvl?

[lime spruce]

Of course

[cerulean tusk]

That is part of the 90%

[hardy snow]

[lusty grotto]

"gameplay is facing the cat"

[round pendant]

I'll be taking all that credit then

[jovial smelt]

Learning a route is still frying my brain for a couple dungs anyway I'm used to just w on the tank and click health bars ggez

[lime spruce]

what level keys are you trying to do

I can tell you what helped me but take it as a kind of pedagological progression and not "always play this way"

[jovial smelt]

Just trying to finish up my +13s got a couple left

[lime spruce]

oh okay nvm thought you were earlier

yeah enjoy the brain fry gl get there king it's worth it

[cerulean tusk]

It really isn't, but enjoy

The DPS salt tho

[lime spruce]

lol it was my first time, you always remember your first

[cerulean tusk]

Tasty

[jovial smelt]

Ara Kara and priory makes me want to headbutt a fridge door tbh

[lime spruce]

are you trying to do everything on 13

do you have any 14s

[cerulean tusk]

Priory will become your fav soon, don't worry

Ppl just got to interrupt

[jovial smelt]

Yea I have streets done on 14

[lime spruce]

this was my final spread

[cerulean tusk]

Snow ❄️ do 15 next as a goal

Get that achievement

[lime spruce]

There's an achievement for that???

NO BRO

DO NOT TELL ME THAT

[cerulean tusk]

An achievement for every resi level as far as I am aware

So

Gl

[lime spruce]

oh pfffff that's nothing

3k is really the top of the midcore mountain right

[cerulean tusk]

I would call 3k the bottom, but maybe

[lusty grotto]

well sure but its higher than the average

nah its not cat

3k is like 5%

[cerulean tusk]

It is tho, rat

[jovial smelt]

Is mine, picked up tank on Thursday or so?

[cerulean tusk]

No fucking way

3k was week 1-2 stuff no way that is 5% now

Maybe 40%

[lusty grotto]

for us

[grim pilot]

10%

[lusty grotto]

that doesnt mean its something that is

super high

[lime spruce]

40% of WHAT 😂

[lusty grotto]

a lot of people play this game

[lime spruce]

3k is not 40% of anything

[lusty grotto]

we're in a bubble Cat

[cerulean tusk]

Stats are given

[jovial smelt]

Loads of people are like hard stuck in 7-10s
You just don't see them in places like this because they don't care enough imo

[cerulean tusk]

Fake stats

Photoshop

[grim pilot]

Also lots of alts

[lusty grotto]

its just not being able to see outside the bubble

[grim pilot]

people will do 1-2 keys on them

[lusty grotto]

which is very normal

[cerulean tusk]

Yeah, so actual players are like 50% bracket

[lime spruce]

yeah dude even just stepping out of "thinks about the game outside of playing the game" you've lost like 80% of people that play it

[cerulean tusk]

Removing alts

[grim pilot]

this was my evoker in s1, and it still counts towards that

[lime spruce]

let alone sweats in a spec discord all day

[cerulean tusk]

Scalie, just like Nome

Smh

[lusty grotto]

hey man, summer is over we're not sweating anymore

or so you would think

[lime spruce]

speak for yourself I'm fat as hell

that's my secret cap'n

I'm always sweating

[cerulean tusk]

So put that sweat to use, go for all 15s

[lusty grotto]

it be like that sometimes

[cerulean tusk]

I believe in ya

[lime spruce]

I have no interest in going for 15s

my vault keys next week are gonna be on Arms Slayer

[lusty grotto]

cat is the reason yogi doesnt play wow anymore

[lime spruce]

retirement victory lap

[lusty grotto]

and instead posts doom memes all day every day

[cerulean tusk]

What I do with Yogi

[lusty grotto]

pushing him

[cerulean tusk]

I only told him to face his enemy once

[lusty grotto]

🙂

dw i know it was for good intentions

[round pendant]

I agree with kitty

3k is like top 40%

[cerulean tusk]

See?

[round pendant]

source? I made it up

[cerulean tusk]

Knew I was right

It confirmed

[lusty grotto]

im also secretly John Blizzard

trust

[lime spruce]

bro we've known this whole time you weren't fooling anyone

[lusty grotto]

but how?!

[cerulean tusk]

You are a rat

Come on

[round pendant]

it's hard because there's a lot of people who just play to 3k and then stop but they're more than good enough to get like all 16s

but then there's a lot of people who struggle like hell to get there

[lime spruce]

you know what the #1 thing I learned from hitting 3k is

I have abolutely no idea how good I am 😂

[round pendant]

everybody sucks? yeah

oh

I mean you can get 3100 ezpz

[lime spruce]

the more rank I got the more I realized just how much I don't know about these dungeons

[round pendant]

add another 100-150 points with turbo boost

[grim pilot]

well yeah since they introduced mount for 3k

[cerulean tusk]

Honestly tho, try to push higher. Gameplay is so much more fun as a tank

[lime spruce]

truly the dunning-kruger curve

[grim pilot]

you're basically counting raiders

which are very often better than avg m+ pusher

[lime spruce]

if I had a guild I would

[cerulean tusk]

Higher you go, the less worse and bad the team is

And it becomes a ton more fun

Low keys is hell

[lime spruce]

I'll probably take a week off since I got a little fixated on it

[round pendant]

yeah at this point in the season all the puggers that feel good to play with are in 14s+

[lime spruce]

dps for keys

[grim pilot]

18+

[lime spruce]

was thinking about trying prot pally to 2500 too

[round pendant]

lol

14+ players are competent at the game

mostly

[cerulean tusk]

Just don't forget, and don't experience the better player experience

[round pendant]

12s are hit and miss

[lime spruce]

18?? bruh like 40% of mythic+ players are doing 18s by now

[grim pilot]

most of the time they have no idea what's happening around them

and that's my definition of competence

awareness

dk that will grip a mob

[lime spruce]

yeah dude 12-13 are elo hell this week, it's pepole trying to claw up for 3k but once you have 3k and you're just playing for fun I can see why you cull all the bads

[grim pilot]

people that understand you don't have to aoe spam on a boss with 3 useless adds

not gonna count class knowledge/mechanical gameplay

[round pendant]

I love playing my sin rogue as the only funnel class in the group and everyone goes ham on my funnel mobs

I don't think that's ever going to stop in pugs though

[grim pilot]

goes hard

fdk is basically boomie of s3

[cerulean tusk]

Fury is better

[grim pilot]

Fury just doesn't fit in with prot warrior

[round pendant]

Yeah for the best experience in m+ you really gotta stay ahead of the curve

or have a premade

but my premade sucks

3 of us with 2 puggers generally have a better time than all 5

lmao

[cerulean tusk]

As tank you can push up efficiently tho

As DPS tho?

Waiting simulator

[round pendant]

yeah tanking is so good for actually being allowed to play the game

[grim pilot]

lots of tanks nowadays

the easier it is

the more tanks are available

s1 was dead in that aspect

[round pendant]

Doesn't feel like it

It's a pita to get into groups as a sin rogue and then when I run my own key we're waiting for a tank for 15 minutes

:)

and that tank is a gamble since I don't exactly get to pick and choose

and they're usually fucking awful

[grim pilot]

yeah idk that's surprising

how people are bad at pwar

[lime spruce]

I have accepted my fate as the Forever DM and Forever Tank

[grim pilot]

there's a very very low skill floor

[lusty grotto]

it really isnt, fotm rerollers do that

[round pendant]

I need to show you guys the route this pug pwar did in a +12 eco-dome on my rogue

[lusty grotto]

more pop = more bad players

[grim pilot]

idk what's stronger tbh pwar of s3 or vdh of s2

[lime spruce]

yeah man I mean I can flex I'm a 3k player now and I just learned like 2 days ago that we don't spam into IP lol

[grim pilot]

similar level

pwar just less self sustainable

if there's magic damage or a bleed

[lime spruce]

Idk how this changes at higher levels but I never once felt during my whole climb like my health was ever the liability for our group's success

[pulsar epoch]

so you pulling with mini boss and front of mini bos together when 2 dies you pull other 2 right ?

[lime spruce]

like my job had nothing to do with "pull things to me and then mitigate to survive" it was "understand how to manage quantity of casters and archers" and how to route that

[grim pilot]

i can send you a good route

[lime spruce]

since that wast he actual survival check

[grim pilot]

let me log onto wow

[lime spruce]

This is my first season going for any kind of real rank, is that how it's always been or is that unique to this season

[round pendant]

nvm I can't remember the route the guy took but it was a joke

and raider io doesn't show it

[grim pilot]

this is fine and not too hard

at most u need help with kiting on 2 pulls

rest u just facetank and group doesn't need any real coordination

it's not bis route but it's pretty good

[dusk ice]

As the first 2 debuff guys die I get the next two yeah

[lime spruce]

bruh fix those last pulls 😂

[round pendant]

wdym

[grim pilot]

what's there to fix

[round pendant]

You go kill that pack near the church while the boss is chilling at his end location

[lime spruce]

pull 14 how are you pulling that pack w/ boss after 12

[grim pilot]

during flying rp

[lime spruce]

I mean am I just bad is there tech I am too rookie to understand

[grim pilot]

u just go there

and kill the pack

👍

[warm plinth]

He's pulling it during intermission

He doesn't take it to boss

[grim pilot]

can send rally for flying back

[warm plinth]

You just kill it

[dusk ice]

It’s a good time save

[pulsar epoch]

thank you

[dusk ice]

Or if healer has loom trinket just pop that for flight pack easy mode

[lime spruce]

oooooooohhhhhhhhh

oh that's cool I didn't know that was a thing

[grim pilot]

it is

[round pendant]

I don't really see how it's much of a time save tbh

[grim pilot]

boss aoe doesn't scale with m+

[grim pilot]

u are basically getting 40 sec on the dungeon

straight up

[dusk ice]

Well the amount of time you stand around waiting for boss to land

That is dead time