protection

[proud cosmos]

Just dropping that here but I did 2 +16 (Rook and Mead) as Mountain Thane with similar build as last season and it was surprisingly very tanky. DPS was quite good too. Had a lot of fun playing last season style gameplay.

[frosty mango]

Thane is perfectly viable from both a dps and survivability standpoint currently, the major difference is damage output and cc capability via colossus shockwave knock up

[proud cosmos]

Well in terms of damage output, i was close to what i m usually do as Colossus. Agree for CC

[frosty mango]

I’m pretty sure you could play thane at bleeding edge and be fine

[frosty mango]

If you’re playing optimally colossus should be pretty far ahead, 10% or so

[pallid quiver]

Generally, this comes down to not really using Revenge enough in the large AOE pulls to cycle Demo CD/not using Demo on CD/sending outbursts on TC as Colo are usually the main things holding back Colo damage

[frosty mango]

But really I’m 99% sure if you went into a +20 as thane with a brain you could time it with zero issues

[proud cosmos]

Not enough good for that 😄 especially since i only pug

[tulip pumice]

Man spittin fact right there!

that needs to be on a coffee cup

[solid sun]

You want a coffee mug to say you can do 20s as thane?

[frosty mango]

This is 2025 you could have that coffee cup tomorrow

[pallid quiver]

2025 isn't real

[chilly brook]

Then you’re not playing colossus well

[frosty mango]

Here you go

[proud cosmos]

Yeah probably why i m stuck at 17 😅

[solid sun]

No read the coffee mug right above you

You can time 20s as thane easily

Doesn’t matter if you suck at colossus. Just be thane instead

[proud cosmos]

I like playing colosus too. Was just testing for fun and was surprised. I guess it also depends on the group.

[chilly brook]

I doubt it would kneecap you too hard, you’re probably just over pressing IP and not pressing revenge enough

[proud cosmos]

Just for some numbers, i ended up that rookery 16 at 2k56 overall. I don’t remember exactly with colossus. Guess I will redo an equivalent run and see. Don t have the feeling i press too much IP.

[proud cosmos]

Maybe I should try this before season end, since I hit a wall as Colo 😂

[solid sun]

Yep just follow the coffee mug wisdom

[cerulean tusk]

https://tenor.com/view/wait-what-what-do-you-mean-cute-anime-boy-shocked-surprised-gif-4978182267327762807

[tacit smelt]

whats teh fastest way to get valor stones currently? been tank for so long that i'm always capped but on alts i'm starved

[slim dove]

goblins in undermine

[frosty mango]

Timewalking can be fast as a tank too

[plush tendon]

Does anyone know if a Dinar system is coming back for next season?

[frigid valley]

SL had last season, DF had last season, there's a high chance but no1 knows

[urban bane]

the difference isnt as big as some make it to be, there's a thane enjoyer out there doing similar keys and performing competitively with colossus. out performing some of the posters here, even

if the shoe fits 🤷‍♂️

[pallid quiver]

Yeah, it's mostly just easier to play, since you don't think about rotation, just send the usual at all times

tank damage diff between optimal hero specs will not be the key timing difference

[urban bane]

100%

[plush tendon]

Thane is at a clear disadvantage

Losing 5% size is no laughing matter

[urban bane]

yo true

otoh not the size of the weapon it is how you make it clap

[plush tendon]

I hope so

deciding if Im going to Mythic Raid this tier... if we have the OG dinar system like in DF and not this season system, id be so happy

[solid sun]

How do you just decide to mythic raid or not

Do you know people who will just accept you onto their team

[plush tendon]

uh, yea

[mortal cypress]

Can I come?

[frigid valley]

https://tenor.com/view/money-money-money-gif-3641396535535975514

[plush tendon]

Im a cutie patootie

[solid sun]

I’m not

It’s rough out here even for endangered species

[plush tendon]

Guilds are inbred cesspools anyways

people know people who know people

also finding a new guild aint that hard (at least not for me... I dont think?)

[solid sun]

You mean to tell me all this time all these people could have hooked me up

And they just chose not to

Yeesh

[plush tendon]

honestly, building solid relationships with people is such a cheat code in WoW

for literally all content

[restive oak]

but i'm kind of a dick

[plush tendon]

the player with the most poppin friendslist

is having the best time

[solid sun]

I add people sometimes but never talk to them

Or I add someone and they escape to the sand dunes of Arakkis @lusty grotto

It’s gotta be a me problem

[plush tendon]

its a time problem for me

idk if I can/want to commit to 2/3 days a week

heck, I may just sell keys and make a lot of gold and a buy a carry from a friends guild/current guild

https://tenor.com/view/think-about-it-use-your-brain-use-the-brain-think-brain-gif-7914082

once they get CE

If I need to have the mythic achievement for the looties

Mythic raiders are notorious for being brokies

unless their GM/RL sets up sales

[solid sun]

Selling keys sounds fun

[nocturne spindle]

finally level a brewmaster

kinda boring atm

does it pop off after 70

is that just every class now cause of hero talents

[solid sun]

Iirc brew hero talents are fairly passive

[plush tendon]

Brew's getting a glowup next patch Ive heard

its a tank I dont play, but people generally like it

[buoyant sparrow]

For season 3 are we going MT or Col in M+? What about raid?

[solid sun]

We don’t know

[vale escarp]

Play whatever you are more comfort with, thats what better for you personally

[plush tendon]

all things being equal, I prefer Col

tuning will decide which is better though, and Ill prob play that

[frosty mango]

I mean this is how I rejoined CE raiding

I said “friends, who wants to carry me to CE this season so I can raid with you next season”

Much like in real life it’s who you know not what you know

[solid sun]

Roid carry me to CE

So I can raid with you

[frosty mango]

Gotta wait till next season I got carried myself

They put me in on mugz and gally blind to heal

I triumphed

[solid sun]

Is healer the easiest carry

[frosty mango]

If you have more than 3 I guess

[glad crater]

Is the auto ravager really usefull you think? As far as i have tested, ravager doesn't seem to do a lot of damage overall, wouldn't be better to take bloodsurge instead?

I mean, more rage = more revenge or IP

[solid sun]

Last I heard the passive ravager talent was doing a lot of damage because it was procing quite a bit

[frosty mango]

It’s the consistent rage gen you get from it that makes it valuable

And yes as of right now it’s proccing quite a bit

[jagged gust]

60% increase in uptime is pretty good

[solid sun]

Also we’re def gonna probably maybe run MT

Already gonna have a lot of ip

[plush tendon]

still awaiting tuning

I pray for Collosus being better

much prefer the emphasis on Revenge over TClap

[copper vine]

Is prot warr good for wpvp ?

[warm plinth]

Way to say that with confidence lol

[solid sun]

Lmao that’s how I do everything. Very little confidence, roll with the punches, fake it til I make it

[warm plinth]

I'm actually fine with it however it turns out. I enjoy the old pwar playstyle but I also really enjoy demolish

[solid sun]

I actually thought it would be pretty funny if they gave MT spell block

“Tired of you idiots demolishing everything, so if you want spell block back you gotta be Thor”

[warm plinth]

https://tenor.com/view/cosplay-thor-jack-black-custome-gif-20281552

Me:

[solid sun]

Best Thor

[astral stump]

This has probably been asked a million times, but what is the best way to do the duds on mythic Gallywix?

[dusky canopy]

Don’t

[lusty grotto]

WHY HAVE YOU SUMMONED ME

https://tenor.com/view/mouse-surprised-jumping-finger-shookt-gif-16292092

[solid sun]

You’re welcome

[dusky canopy]

Mouser

[lusty grotto]

[lunar flare]

Hello 🙂 Does shield block carry over if I use another charge before my current one expires?

[warm plinth]

Yes, it will stack duration up to a maximum of 3 full uses.

[lunar flare]

Nice, thank you for answering!

[warm plinth]

Realistically there's not really a situation where you would overcap it short of using shield charge, both shield block charges, and getting a chain of shield slam crits

er, not crits. Resets

And you'd have to be using Heavy repercussions

[lunar flare]

I've been panicking this whole time trying to time them all perfectly 😄 So this is good news

[warm plinth]

Basically you should just avoid pressing it if things are dead in a couple globals from now. Otherwise just send it

[lunar flare]

Gotcha

[solid sun]

Listen

3D glasses skeleton guy is like 100,000 dps away from Roid

Are we sure we should be listening to his advice

I’m jk

[warm plinth]

👀

[solid sun]

I’m not calling you don’t press whirlwind or slam

And I’m also not calling you doot

So you’re just skeleton guy now

[cerulean tusk]

The roid, roid or the roid?

These things matter

[solid sun]

Roid

[cerulean tusk]

so not Roid, roid

but roid, Roid

[warm plinth]

What's wrong with doot?

[cerulean tusk]

Hi Doot

[solid sun]

Because you’ve never been doot

Also it keeps autocorrecting to door

[warm plinth]

You could just call me ghash like nim does

Or pinky though only mpf really calls me that

[jagged gust]

I'll call you Rain

[warm plinth]

Wat

[jagged gust]

Because rain rhymes with brain, ala pinky and the brain

[warm plinth]

Believe it or not, the name pinky doesn't come from that. But I did have a pinky pfp for a while. And in mpf I'm currently Pinky and, and my friend is the Brain XD

[cerulean tusk]

I like doot

[chilly brook]

can't not call ghash

[cerulean tusk]

https://tenor.com/view/pixel-art-trumpet-doot-doot-meme-dancing-gif-27309766

[solid sun]

doot doot doot

[frosty mango]

Wait

My name is being used I have no idea what we’re talking about

Or do we mean roid

[solid sun]

It was probs a few days ago but Doot came in here and tagged you and revealed he was 100k away from you in damage

And you told him to blame the dps for being too slow on bosses

But then today doot was giving advice

So I ribbed him real good

Now you’re caught up!

[frosty mango]

He’s no longer a padawan, he took roid-kwon-do

Now he’s a revenge enjoyer like me

[warm plinth]

I had a 3.2 million dps run but it was a 9 so it doesnt count lul

Was helping a friend

[lament osprey]

What are ideal stats for mythic plus running colossus? Or Don’t matter? Crit heavy and haste heavy.

[urban bane]

ilvl

haste good crit good vers/mastery wont hurt. but ilvl

[solid sun]

Can we use the brew picture here?

[mortal cypress]

What's that?

[mortal cypress]

Lol. Why is that brew

[solid sun]

Because a brew made it and they pinned it

[mortal cypress]

Oooh

[tribal wharf]

while im here, and on about it,, its getting re-released for snes apparently with faster frame rate some how

[frosty mango]

It counts

[waxen frigate]

Hi @tribal wharf how are you buddy

Did you see they remade fallout 1 as an fps doom mod

[rain light]

Ayo?

👀

[blazing ridge]

I knew these would be nerfed, were doing insane amount of dmg

[next trench]

do we get double parry vs our target? is it a warrior only thing?

[mellow bridge]

Parry tooltip is notoriously buggy

[patent scroll]

All those tooltips have been bugged at least a few dozen times

It should use the k values from the zone you're in? to calculate your actual parry against a target in that zone

I think it worked like that, but it's been a few silly years when that was really borked and I was looking into it

Like unequipping some but not all items with PvP on could lead to armor cap against targets according to that tooltip

[humble rose]

Are we expecting any rotational changes to Prot in the coming season?

Nothing I could see seems to suggest it, it still looks like SS on cd, keep bleeds, spam revenge

[mild river]

I'd say no changes.

[idle copper]

I might be gaslighting myself but didn't Blizz state a few years back that they were looking to simplify talent trees?
Basically they were going to remove what were essentially default options - things like increase Xs amount of dmg by Y or talents like heroic leap (as in simplify the tree and make the talent baseline).

Doesn't feel like they have followed through

[crude spoke]

For col seems about right.. Thane a bit diff

[idle copper]

From what I've read (in the absence of any further change) both specs are going to be more comparable with Thane being slightly ahead in S3

[idle copper]

Does brutal vitality add to the cap of your ignore pain?

[hardy snow]

Blizzard says alot of things, and then deliver something different. Thats not new.

[jagged pier]

I memebrr when they said thane was too high apm

Now its back again if not higher than before next patch

[neon elk]

Carpal tunnel inc

[kind urchin]

No. Cap stays the same.

[lime mantle]

Source?
Please I need this 🙏

[mellow bridge]

Imagine how much it would've been before the changes

[torn gulch]

Sense said that he had 105 apm on first boss of priory on ptr

#protection message

[jagged pier]

Sense is the source

So pretty reliable

[torn gulch]

I gave him the receipts

[sharp merlin]

anyone else finding 12's super rough?

holyeeee

[lime mantle]

Our god is a merciful god 🤲 🙏
Don't nerf it.

[frigid valley]

the people in the group makes 12s harder now than it was 2 months ago

[cerulean tusk]

15s is the new weekly key area

The shitters, the garbage ooze, has reached the resi 12 level

I join a 12 my friend is in? The randos do 2m DPS in 680+ gear, healers don't heal and no interrupt is found between all of em

[pulsar wedge]

end of season

[cerulean tusk]

It is not bad, it is shit city

[pulsar wedge]

how is prot looking in s3?

[torn gulch]

very bad you should reroll

now for the serious answer: pretty decent

[idle copper]

Like some dom pinky purple adult toy

[sharp merlin]

its sooooo bad

like, I just did Priory

[idle copper]

Well one of the sets does anyways

[sharp merlin]

with a 680 boomie

doing 1.2M overall

like howwww?

[torn gulch]

what? you do more with one button

[sharp merlin]

no shit

[torn gulch]

i was seeing tettles doing like 3-4M with one button on his 680 boomie

kekw

[sharp merlin]

But yeah I was just trying to gear my brew

And see if I could do them as 12s

I can do em, the others however.. cannot

We took 2 min to kill the knight and Suleyman

[frosty mango]

I had a 4.4m IPA kill last night

[torn gulch]

please don't kill beer

we need it

[frosty mango]

After fighting that boss for almost 5 minutes I needed beer

[torn gulch]

let me guess a couple of heals?

i will settle on about 5 of them

so 50% extra

[sharp merlin]

4.4 min? Holy shit

Would you say if you can do 13s as a tank, without any real need of a healer, you’re pretty much fine for next season?

[frosty mango]

Next season should be relatively easier

Or at least I think

People already know most of the dungeons

Tazavesh is gonna be a rough one for sure though

[sharp merlin]

I actually don't play ptr for the reason that if I did, I would be burnt out by the first month

[alpine anvil]

does prot have to change between stances much? i wanna play it but, i'm not interested in all the stance switching stuff

don't wanna play classic on retail

[sharp merlin]

You don't have to

I only do it to squeeze out that tiny bit more dmg on stationary bosses, especially when they aren't doing anything to me

[inner arch]

How long, if any at all, is it acceptable to hold avatar or demo shout to use with big abilities?

[frosty mango]

There’s not a standard really, because of cdr. I do 8 seconds

You often won’t find yourself in that situation, more often it will be you’re holding demolish

Because avatar has a long duration so as long as you can fit demolish into the window it’s fine

[frigid valley]

i usually do if pack will die before dmg amps expire it aint worth it

[wicked plank]

Is there a mimiron (raidbot) simulation we can find somewhere for season3 ? Or is the profile not yet implemented with tierset ?

[inner arch]

Ok good info. How long would you hold demolish?

[frosty mango]

If there’s 8-10 left on avatar and I know I’ll be in combat for a bit I’ll hold it

[cerulean tusk]

less than 5 globals, if that means to line it up with an avatar source (or ish 10-15 sec of CDR), is my rule of thumb

[frosty mango]

Conversely if I know I won’t be in danger for a while I’ll just shield wall to get avatar up and send it

[inner arch]

Thanks fellas

Good comms

[cerulean tusk]

<@&257983573498265600>

Blast em

[stray wedge]

ty

[cerulean tusk]

https://tenor.com/view/explosion-explode-clouds-of-smoke-gif-17216934

[frosty mango]

https://tenor.com/view/flame-thrower-leonardo-dicaprio-lance-flamme-burn-burning-gif-21661296

[cerulean tusk]

Scams used to at least give us steam gift cards

"help me win 100 000 dollars, I will pay you 10%!"

https://tenor.com/view/braindead-cat-brain-damage-gif-583403308765934478

[ionic fern]

That's some Indian prince level scam.

[proven stratus]

One of these days we are actually going to get an Indian prince that actually does this lmao

[strong forum]

https://tenor.com/view/it-is-not-this-day-not-today-lord-of-the-rings-gif-14797074

[cerulean tusk]

A onetime investment from IndianScamsCorp to make ppl 100% more gullible. The darkest timeline.

"But I saw on the news, it was real!"

[frosty mango]

I had an Indian scammer text me the other day and say their name was Olivia

I kept the conversation going long enough for them to tell me they also enjoyed disc golf and they would love if I trained them

I told them that could be arranged but first they need to go to target and get me 4 100 dollar Apple gift cards so I could escape my poverty American life

https://tenor.com/view/leonardo-dicaprio-laughing-reverse-reverse-card-reverse-uno-gif-3758578067338957449

Olivia ghosted me, sad

[frigid valley]

man my youngest just discovered Uno, i swear all he wants to do is make ppl suffer in the game, he dont give a shit about winning

[frosty mango]

Mine is 12 and she’s become exceptionally good at the game

We watched the new Star Wars and when hux said “it doesn’t matter who wins as long as you lose” she said “just like uno”

She gets it

[small steeple]

lmao

https://tenor.com/view/homer-simpson-crayon-de-cires-cerveau-brain-gif-18166157344745467544

[frosty mango]

I love, love messing with scammers. My daughter finds it hilarious and it breaks up my day

[small steeple]

have you heard of I think its James Veitch? Hes a british comedian who trolled scammers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9RL4RATwoY&list=PLjaZD_N3WCf-SzY9lQqsUNbubksD_KCPT&index=1

[frosty mango]

Yeah we’ve watched it lol

She also loves the mark rober glitterbomb videos

We’ve been doing rPi and arduino stuff I thought about trying to make one with her

[serene wave]

I have 6 coins to buy hero raid gear, what should i get for trinkets?

I have House of Cards and Jastor Diamond(hero), should i get Bombsuit or Eye of Kezan?

[small steeple]

do you raid or do m+?

[serene wave]

I meant 3 coins sorry

Bit of both, m+ mainly

[small steeple]

Whats your other trinket currently?

[serene wave]

I have house of cards hero and pacemaker champion

[small steeple]

Well, unless you plan on getting all 12's done and can get a mythic one, hero pacemaker would be your best direct upgrade unless you can farm 7+ keys for one, or get lucky from vault for a myth one

bombsuit is good too if you want more survivability, or another defensive cd

[serene wave]

I think i might go pacemaker, while i do like another oh shit button vs. bleed or magic heavy fights, I think i should be fine for now

Oh also real quick what should i get in the delve belt socket now that i have it at 701?

[small steeple]

Probably the crit or haste one

[serene wave]

Culminating Blasphemite?

[small steeple]

oh the uh gem socket?

[serene wave]

It has a prismatic socket

Oh nevermind blasphemite stacks with the more gems i have, not worth it as a single sockjet

[small steeple]

I usually use deadly emerald

[serene wave]

haste crit

yeah

might do that

and pacemaker

sounds good

[clever heart]

Hey I am wondering what trinket I should be using in M+ 13-14 Key range.
Fun House @ 671 or Tome of Light @ 671.

I see most prots are using tome, but on bloodmallet Funhouse sims WAY higher. any advice ? wat am i missing ? both increase survivability as well as damage.

[small steeple]

i believe bloodmallet does't use the APL that has tome configured, I'd say tome

[clever heart]

kk ty 😄
is tome better damage ? better surviability ?
in ur opinion. just curious why tome is better.

O i also have 671 Eye option

[small steeple]

tome is better damage st, and it gives a ton of crit, which is great damage and survivability

[clever heart]

kk. as far as using tome. is it better to be on one buff most the time ? or just use off cd to maximixe the doubled uptime

[small steeple]

you want to be on the crit/sword/damage proc as much as possible. There are some occasions where you may want to be in the absorb mode, but generall stay in the damage mode

[clever heart]

ty ❤️

[frosty mango]

At the beginning of the season I made a claim that TOP will end up being the worst key to time due to poor dungeon design and reliance on single target

Everyone clowned me and I just wanna say I was right, again, so nyah!

I’m not at all biased by the fact that I hate that terrible dungeon

[nocturne spindle]

How are we on the tier lists today boys

[frosty mango]

S+

[nocturne spindle]

Are we S or F today

[nocturne spindle]

Mannnn

[small steeple]

lol

nice job Kira

[neon elk]

Today 2 tierlist poped on me, in one we are S in other we are A ( with other 3 tanks) and man the reasonings were well..

[nocturne spindle]

Ain't no way kira put us in S after we were below bdk on his objective spreadsheet lmao

[hardy snow]

thats why "tierlists" are waste of time

[neon elk]

U watched that ? He gave all tanks some pros and cons and at war he gave MT that he is tanky cuz u spend all your rage on IP, not most, he literaly said u only use rage on ip , not sure if he even used revebge

[nocturne spindle]

I wanna go back to being f tired plz

[small steeple]

lol I think tierlist in general are a joke so I don't take em seriously

[neon elk]

As nobody should, all they do is create a bad comunity perception , like if i wasnt playing tank i would take D tier bear over s tier ppal any day cuz most people will just flop on ppal

[frosty mango]

Tierlists assume two things

• the person playing the class knows how to play it
• the people playing with that class know how to play

Those are two huge assumptions that make tierlists dumb for the vast majority of people

[hardy snow]

and both of them are false

[neon elk]

Also idk how is everybody giving brm an S

[frosty mango]

IMO if someone is new to tanking they’ll do infinitely better on a Druid (very forgiving mitigation) or a warrior (very little skill interaction) than a brew (unintuitive mit) or a vdh (requires very precise play to be moderately effective)

I would go as far as to say most tank players would do better on a Druid or warrior than anything else because they are just easier kits to manage

Then all these streamers make a “ermagad vdh s++++++++ broken” video and I have to suffer these rerollers dying in 10s 57 weeks into the season because they got the impression the class is free win

But suffer them we do because we gotta teach em to be better tanks

[neon elk]

Same gonna happen with brm and ppal imho

[tribal wharf]

nope, as much as i love to fawn over post apocolyptic, hororor, resident evil, zomibes and demons and gritty edgy serial killer / postalguy/duke nukem type shit, i actually quite rarely play them these days an find the constant and excessive gore and poor taste jokes/humor, i just simply dont play those all that often really

example this is the last game i took seriously, you can tell because i added an old shitty dumb stupid meme because i died like an idiot

i cant think of a better way to say it, but basically it comes down to these days i play whatever the fuck i want, and what that is, is something i can expect to finish at some point in future and it wont make me overly angry

because the round in that game take 5-10 minues max, and its very easy to tell what im doing and supposed to be doing, so if i feel my self getting mad at it, i can quit and come back later when im not

cuz i want to come to some final boss who feels impossible to beat, fail at them for like 30 minutes and then come back that night/next and kill them and be done with game

there is no power in the universe, that would make me want to return for chain week after week raids and keys, just for a vault

[frosty mango]

That’s why you don’t

Once I meet my goal and no longer need a vault, I just don’t

I’ll run to help friends, or to keep prog raiding

But there’s no point to running content that isn’t fun just to get a vault so you can what….use the loot to run the same not fun content?

[plush tendon]

tbf, that seems to be pretty close to most people perspective on the tank right now

and this last tier (although VDH was 'best') I dont think the tank meta was as locked as it has historically been

[frosty mango]

It was pretty locked

[plush tendon]

yea, but it wasnt like S3 DF VDH

where you legit couldnt make the argument for anything but

[frosty mango]

I mean realistically no season is locked because all tanks can do all content

Can’t recall a season where that hasn’t been the case

[plush tendon]

Theres always one that takes the top dog spot, but by how much is kind of the question

[frosty mango]

Community is just meta slaves, though double sigil dh was pretty nasty

[plush tendon]

S3 VDH DF was oppressive

we dont have that right now

not even close

[frosty mango]

This is now

[plush tendon]

honestly, not bad

[frosty mango]

This is df s3

[mellow bridge]

df s3 had 20s for weekly

[plush tendon]

you might want to adjust key level

[mellow bridge]

you are comparing weekly keys with push keys

(at least i think it was 20s? maybe it was 15s)

[plush tendon]

we were doing 30s

in S3

[frosty mango]

Still remotely as bad as it is now

[plush tendon]

I mean, did you play it?

[frosty mango]

That’s 12+ now vs 20+ in df

[mellow bridge]

balance wise now it's way closer than it was in DF

but rerolling is also so simple and way more common now

[frosty mango]

Yeah, I did

[mellow bridge]

that almost anyone that pushes, does it

[plush tendon]

then you should remember how it was

and its not comparable to now

[frosty mango]

You’re saying the meta was skewed more towards dh than it is now in df s3

I’m saying the data shows that’s not true

[plush tendon]

I'm saying tank classes are closer in balance then they were then*

I think most would agree

[frosty mango]

No shot imo tank balance is the best it has ever been right now probably

[tribal wharf]

if i want to play a game thats really hard, i already have 2 of them

[frosty mango]

I really enjoy retro style side scrollers

[tribal wharf]

both of them are skill issue, but i can almost garunteed noibody here can get a W in sub terrania

[frosty mango]

Do you like throwback pixel type jrpgs?

[tribal wharf]

i like games that aren't completely shitty and unplayable

[frosty mango]

https://store.steampowered.com/app/2090210/Threads_of_Time/

Steam

Threads of Time

Time-Traveling Adventure
From an age where dinosaurs roam to the far-flung future and alternate realms in between - travel across fantastic and distinctive time periods, and discover the threads that bind the ages. Uncover an epic tale of interwoven fates, and secrets that shaped civilizations…and follow th…

Release Date

To be announced

▶ Play video

I’ve been watching this for some time it looks great

[tribal wharf]

depends on the rpg, tend to stick to easier onse

did finish ff tactics but that was on psp and the power button is within easy range, so i could effectively stop the game from advancing to the next input select by ending failed attack or my guy dies

sort of like a save state, but physical

[waxen quarry]

show sl s3 and s4

[frosty mango]

Not sure if it goes back that far lemme see

[waxen quarry]

97% bdk

2% pwar

[waxen quarry]

holy

s4?

i rmemeber bdk

was busted

s4 ig

not s3

[frosty mango]

So basically like now

[waxen quarry]

im surprised bdk wasnt higher

it was much better iirc

[frosty mango]

My point in all this was tank balance is great now but representation disparity is still present

[waxen quarry]

pwar just had stigma cause early sl pwra

pwar*

was awful

[waxen quarry]

until s3 tierset and necro iirc

i played a lot of pwar in s3 and s4

necro prot was so based

[frosty mango]

That’s 14 and up right now

So if balance is good, why do we still have a disparity?

[waxen quarry]

idk m+ players are sheep

[warm plinth]

Because balance and meta are not the same thing

[waxen quarry]

unironically

[frosty mango]

TLDR dumb community perception driven by streamers and tierlists

[waxen quarry]

ye

[warm plinth]

It's a popularity graph, not a balance graph

[frosty mango]

No but logically you would think balance would drive a less polar representation but like you said it doesn’t because people largely listen to tierlists/streamers

[warm plinth]

Well, even moreso when you limit your review to a smaller, higher group

[tribal wharf]

popularity graph usually is a balance graph, because the goal is usually to win

so players will go to "whos the easiest to play"

[warm plinth]

The higher you go, the more slanted a graph like that will be

[frosty mango]

I compared like groups, I linked 12s and stuff earlier

[warm plinth]

Popularity is never balance

[urban portal]

Because even if the best spec is only 1% better

Everyone will flock to it

This is true in every game

[warm plinth]

Exactly

[frosty mango]

That’s not true at all or everyone would be playing Druids

[tribal wharf]

its like, well, im going to go in a race tomorrow, do i want to take my 1989 chevy taho truck, or a corvette

[warm plinth]

What

Yogi pls

[tribal wharf]

which is going to give me the best probabilty to win the race

ah, the corvette

i chose corvette

[warm plinth]

That's not remotely the discussion at hand

[tribal wharf]

dodge viper comes out, i want to drive that car now in the next race

[frosty mango]

Let him cook

[nocturne spindle]

there is no balance graph, higher tier will sort to the class thats 1% better and the general graph will have the ret paladin at the top

[frosty mango]

lol this is so true

[tribal wharf]

well, what if i like my god damn old ass 1980s chevy truck looks like mater from cars

rusted to hell

[frosty mango]

Yogi got into the medicine cabinet

Let this man pontificate he’s going somewhere

[nocturne spindle]

https://tenor.com/view/scout-in-a-mental-asylum-scout-laughing-in-a-corner-scout-in-a-mental-hospital-scout-laughing-gif-18390446700958692071

irl cam of yogi

[frosty mango]

https://tenor.com/view/gene-wilder-willy-wonka-charlie-and-the-chocolate-factory-gif-8481908

^

[tribal wharf]

how do you take a game about swords magic and dragons, skeletons and elementals, demons and gods from outerspace

and then i dont want to play any of it

[agile elbow]

Hulk Hogan died. Jesus.

[tribal wharf]

it will be better now that these people are ghosts such as ozzy

eventually enough will disapear and new ones will appear later

[cerulean tusk]

Next in line is us Soon Skyhold will be full of ghosts, Funky shall haunt these pages with always nagging feelings of 'odyn fury should be buffed...' or 'it is fine, we are fine, it is fine...'

Sometimes your discord will minimize, for no reason

SpooooOoooooky

[undone beacon]

The ghost of spell block shall haunt these halls

[solid sun]

If you take the mater truck and put a jet engine in it fast and furious style it might win if it doesn’t explode

Idk if this helps or not

[tribal wharf]

nah, im rebuilding the mater truck (my pc)

old outdated parts, well, not entirely outdated

next week, probably

[warm apex]

It's my turn to play Prot next season, how are we looking fam since season 1?

[violet ginkgo]

despair

jk, ask Roid he knows a lot since he plays PTR

[warm apex]

I can cope with despair

Ignoring the pain is the job

[jagged pier]

we are fine as usual

[tribal wharf]

this case i will use for build

[nocturne spindle]

rbg computer cases are the worst

i will die on this hill

[tribal wharf]

yes down with 4 pin , up with 3 pin

ARGB is superior, i am so glad you have finally seen the light

and also, you dont like the rgb? turn it off

use signalrgb, #notsponsored

[idle copper]

Havn have a similar looking case with 40mm thick fans

[dusky canopy]

Who’s got the best tree run guide for osrs

I haven’t played in like 5 years so I have totally forgotten the route

[tribal wharf]

this case has 160mm fans, so i want to see what that is like after using 140's

[jagged gust]

Clean white case is nice, but not a fan of how visible it makes any imperfection

[frosty mango]

My unofficial completely biased opinion is that prot war is awesome

[jagged gust]

A nice side effect will be you can off spec into fury and have TB as 70% of your APM

you won't even need the one button rotation

[jagged pier]

bring them back

[violet ginkgo]

no issue at all with the missing spellblock? all things can be handled with Spell reflect and shield wall?

[frosty mango]

Unless you’re running like bleeding edge keys at lower ilvls, after the dungeon changes I don’t think it will be a major issue

Not having spell block will definitely suck but functionally I don’t think it changes anything other than maybe needing to ask for an external more often

At the level of content most people are doing (heroic raid, mid level keys) I doubt the removal of spell block matters whatsoever

[shut summit]

tons of the tankbusters in m+ have been nerfed so should mostly be fine

[jagged gust]

It's already highly unlikely I press spell block below a 12 tbh

[frosty mango]

For raid if we use today as a reference you can go through all of heroic raid in battle stance and never pressing spell block once and you will be 100% fine

Your healers might curse you a little on gally but assuming you press your other buttons you’re fine. So in that vein I doubt it’s removal is highly impactful in that sense

As we get into late mythic, rwf, early push keys - I think those players will feel the loss much more

[solid sun]

Oh I bet I can suck hard enough on accident that I’ll miss spell block sometimes

[frosty hull]

Does your Build have indomitable?

[tribal wharf]

https://pcpartpicker.com/list/8gLgfd

it contains a that, and one of those

[nocturne spindle]

thats a lot of ram dear god

do you do somethign besides games

[tribal wharf]

light video editing

[nocturne spindle]

fair enough

i assume thats what all the storage is for

[tribal wharf]

primary monitor 1440p x 144hz but ran at 120 for sanity sakes

[nocturne spindle]

is this what you have or are buying

[tribal wharf]

video often gets recorded to variable frame rate, need to alter it to 60, pain in ass

[nocturne spindle]

the 4tb hdd/2tb non nvme ssd seems kinda silly

[tribal wharf]

just waiting on last final bits and then ill do it, bit of a transfer of 2

[nocturne spindle]

just go big on an HDD if you need the huge storage

ah

i assume those are just leftover parts then

[tribal wharf]

i have this case which is old and bad, and has dual glass,

sell it or bust it up or something i dunno, too much glas on it

i need the remaining case fans to arrive

the ssds are supposed to be some from of m.2 gen 3 or 4 i think dunno HDD is common place for storage of large files cheaply

[nocturne spindle]

specifically this one is just like

a sata drive thats a shitty inbetween

if this isnt a old part i wouldnt bother with it

[tribal wharf]

oh, i was probably going to throw it inside of a modded xbox 360 and i never got around to it, gpt said get that one

but its 2tb and its not trash tier for 2.5

[nocturne spindle]

yea its just not good if its going into the actual PC

just get a bigger hdd if you need lots of storage for the same price

[tribal wharf]

cross that bridge when its nessecary

2 of the m.2s are placeholder anyway

[frosty mango]

I have 256gb of ram lol

[nocturne spindle]

i mean

you either threw a bunch of money in a fire for fun

or you know why you need 256gb

so you do you

[tribal wharf]

imagine having enough ram to run all of wow inside of it

[frosty mango]

I work with windows containers

Which take up astronomical amounts of resources

[nocturne spindle]

yea

no one gets to the point of buying 256gb without knowing why

[jagged gust]

128 I could understand

[tribal wharf]

like really on the am4 board i got i have 64gb

which apparently is super overkill already

[jagged gust]

I wouldn't say super

Like 32 feels comfy

[tribal wharf]

minimum for gaming is 4, reccomended is 8, encouraged is 16

[jagged gust]

Double that is a little excessive but not crazy

[tribal wharf]

sometimes it doesnt mater if you have a bazillion petabytes

memory overflow is very gross

[urban bane]

Yogi all you play is Doom why do you need a Giga Gamer PC

[frosty mango]

64gb of ram for most users is a good play

[tribal wharf]

yogi play every game nothing off limit except banned games

[frosty mango]

If you do a lot of web browsing while gaming - chromium based browsers eat truckloads of memory, and being able to load that to mem while gaming without using swap can help a lot

But beyond that I really can’t see anyone needing more than 64gb unless they’re working with containers or big data

[tribal wharf]

yogi play anything except atari 2600 levels of shit, and even lots of that i would suffer through, (not all of them)

[jagged gust]

2600 Levels of Shit sounds like a decent title

A toilet based roguelike

[tribal wharf]

im all for retro gaming and all that, but, atari 2600 is how do i say it, primitive

rogue dungeon games are my favorite

you wake up in a dungeon that you can't escape from and you are fucked, and you have to fight way out and if you win thats the prize

[jagged gust]

The prize is you wake up back at the bottom, but now everything is harder

[dull parrot]

Prot warrior is good guys?

[toxic gyro]

Trash. We all rerolled dh already.

[toxic gyro]

100% this. When I open few tabs, my memory usage skyrockets on chrome. I’m almost capping 32gb.

I guess it’s time to throw in another stick.

[frosty mango]

Sub 4k therefore it’s trash

Reroll vibes

[lofty warren]

Reroll to what?

[nocturne spindle]

bdk

[solid sun]

If you reroll to paladin you can take your shield with you

[nocturne spindle]

you reroll BDK so you can keep your weapon the same when you switch to fdk and give up tanking

[lofty warren]

Bdk is sheet i saw it on yodas yt video

[solid sun]

Yoda doesn’t even know how to play bdk

You gotta watch the real bdk tier list videos

[lofty warren]

Where

[solid sun]

Just keep watching new ones until you find one that shows bdk is great

You might have to make your own video but regardless you’ll get one eventually

[frosty mango]

Arms warrior is actually meta tank now

Spamming mortal strike with a shield on

[lofty warren]

His latest put pwar ppl brew and vdh all same tier that's clearly not write there's always 1-2 tanks that is best

[solid sun]

Guess we can’t listen to Yoda anymore

Drat!

[frosty mango]

I’m making my own tier list

[lofty warren]

Petko?

[frosty mango]

Please look forward to it

[lofty warren]

Share list pls

[mortal cypress]

Bear is always best because bear

https://tenor.com/view/kaden-bear-walk-gif-15031442544519350917

[nocturne spindle]

you really do have an obsession with tier lists

lmao

[solid sun]

What kinda content do you even do, Pepega

I never see you talk about what you do in wow.

It’d be so funny if you didn’t even play wow and just kept asking about tier lists

[lofty warren]

I did ce but now only m+

[solid sun]

So you normally just stick around for the easier rewards or do you play the whole season

[sharp gale]

Tbf he is the tier list dude to me

[lofty warren]

I usually get sick of the same dungeons after 12 weeks

But nobody wants to live as weak tank when you can just be the strong one instead

[solid sun]

I don’t really know that there is a weak one

Maybe paladin since the general consensus is that it’s pretty fragile in comparison to the others

Demon hunters are saying they won’t see changes until one week before the season starts because that’s what usually happens or something silly like that

[lofty warren]

Brew vdh is my take for best based on the meta of lists i seen

[frosty mango]

Pepega is prob like 4k io top 10 gamer or something

Just hiding in our ranks

[urban bane]

it is just so funny how quickly people want to dispense of any agency over what they play in a game

[mortal cypress]

what about bear

[urban bane]

oh well, looking forward to a new season's installment of demon hunter Dunning–Kruger effect gifs

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1055196260329590874/1320668978732859402/big2.gif

[jagged gust]

im gonna miss SV

[solid sun]

Survival isn’t going anywhere

[chilly brook]

nah it's a paladin season

[solid sun]

If you think about it, we could add a prot paladin to our prot war keys and they could hit us with blessing of spellwarding as a workaround for not having spellblock anymore

[chilly brook]

truuuu

supposedly healers are saying prot pally best tank to heal rn lol

[solid sun]

Interesting

If only healers had opinions that mattered

[chilly brook]

Yoda and Kira both have Warr/DH/Pally/Brew in like meta territory

paladin is the one tank where I will legit say it becomes meta because of its utility

but that's only assuming it's on the same level as the other tanks and it's seeming that way this season

[solid sun]

Why do you think paladin is the one tank that becomes meta because of the utility?

You don’t think vdh also becomes meta because of utility?

[chilly brook]

because the utility actually negates mechanics

and or directly suppliments the group

[sharp gale]

On live from memory tank are kinda balanced and just bear lack some damage (and dk is still dk)

[frosty mango]

If pld is the best tank to heal why is it so damn awful at staying alive

[solid sun]

I think pwar was better than vdh this season and it still wasn’t meta

[chilly brook]

being able to bring extra externals, solo kicks, remove debuffs, negate mechanics entirely, help keep people alive (specifically squishies) is just a very loaded kit

[solid sun]

So either vdh is meta because of utility or you’re classifying it as something else. It isn’t dam

[chilly brook]

The only other tank that came close to being that way was vdh last expansion imo

[chilly brook]

it's just been the best at living in higher keys

the utility it brings is similar to warrior

[sharp gale]

Vdh is meta bc it is magic meta comp + combo sigil/druid beam

[chilly brook]

and it synergizes better with the current dps meta

[solid sun]

This sounds like utility

[sharp gale]

We have the exact same

But not magic

[chilly brook]

+/- 1

basically

[lofty warren]

Aoe silence and stun and can jump

[solid sun]

So vdh beats us because of the utility brought by chaos brand

[sharp gale]

And if it’s thane season you have - col bump

[chilly brook]

VDH mainly beats us because it lives easier

That is the main difference imo

[warm plinth]

Disrupting shout is not remotely the same as silence sigil smfh

[lofty warren]

Ehrps for vdh vs pwar?

[inland garnet]

Make Commando Shout Great Again in 5m and PvP!
Thank you for your attention!

[chilly brook]

Having done the same level of keys on both with an ilvl deficit on the DH it's apparent

[chilly brook]

It is for all intents and purposes

There is nothing that it does that I haven't been able to do on the warrior

[sharp gale]

Kinda the same, you combo sigil with Druid beam usually, for casts, I know it’s a silence vs a mass kick

[lofty warren]

Silence sigil requires more skill bc there is a delay

[chilly brook]

requires less

[warm plinth]

What

[chilly brook]

unless you're needing to interrupt a cast

[warm plinth]

What

Like

Come on lol

[chilly brook]

which there are only two places where that comes into play tbh

[warm plinth]

People trolling here

[chilly brook]

candle boss room and first pull of mechagon

[lofty warren]

If you press it while shit is casting it will trigger after cast is done

[inland garnet]

vdh 190 iq spec

[chilly brook]

otherwise you can send it without much thought and you get like 80% of the value out of it

[chilly brook]

sorry you don't agree with my opinon

[lofty warren]

It spell locks out if it interrupts so you have to preplan it and hit on when they cast but can't put while casting

[chilly brook]

😦

[chilly brook]

you absolutely can put it down during a cast and still interrupt

[solid sun]

Sigil is an interrupt and a silence

[chilly brook]

it's not that long

[lofty warren]

With war it is just "oh they are casting. I'm gonna press the interrupt instant ability"

Is warrior aoe interrupt ongcd?

[chilly brook]

you can also just chains into silence to basically guarantee the interrupt

but most casts are like 2+s

and for something like explosive flame you're going to be chains/stun into the silence to sync the casts anyways

[mighty valley]

give us chains

chains + disrupting would rule

[sharp gale]

We have chains in our class tree wdym

spear

Should be chain

[mighty valley]

bake the current two capstones into one

make another that gives it gorefiend's

[lofty warren]

Yea but sigil is on gcd and it has a delay

[mighty valley]

and uh. 50% more damage too while we're in there

[lofty warren]

So with both and brain lag it's like 3-4 sec

[sharp gale]

Delete the capstones, and remove damage component of spear

[chilly brook]

it's really not

average reaction time is like 250-300ms on visual

[lofty warren]

Idk in my experience I need to preplan it to fit with other gcds. Thinking like the first boss room in rookererey

[mighty valley]

well, are we talking average brain lag or pepega brain lag

BOOM gottem

[chilly brook]

then you need to train yourself to see faster

[sharp gale]

Im curious what gcd i will have as fury next season, it goes kinda insane already during bl now

It’s been quite some time I didn’t play prot, what is your gcd usually ?

[lofty warren]

War silence is off gcd right?

[mellow bridge]

dont get baited by pepega

[chilly brook]

Go play outlaw, great way to fix it

[lofty warren]

There is a 1 second global min gcd too I think

[chilly brook]

GCD always 1s and you have to react to procs

[sharp gale]

I have 0.8, I don’t think there is a min gcd depending on the spec

During bl

[chilly brook]

energy classes are always 1s iirc

[urban bane]

the prot woyer <--> outlaw rogue pipeline goes hard

[lofty warren]

If you stack all the haste in the world and then bl what's the lowest gcd possibe

[chilly brook]

challenging shout/disrupting shout is off the gcd

[sharp gale]

Oh, they don’t have haste reduced gcd ?

[sharp gale]

That’s a nice gcd (I think Blizz might tackle this)

But it is less painful than prot thane during bl I admit

[chilly brook]

nope, except for outlaw because AR has some weird interaction

[lofty warren]

But some of those are off the gcd and some on

[chilly brook]

AR specifically knocks your GCD down from 1s to 0.8

fast boi spec

but the effect of AR reducing GCD is influenced by haste

it's a bit odd

but every other energy spec/class is 1s always

[sharp gale]

Yeah I know outlaw is insane on this, but I like ass so much, I can’t play the gamble

[solid sun]

Outlaw is stupid

“I would like carpal tunnel please”

[chilly brook]

sin is nice but the single target is so bad

[sharp gale]

Like 0.3 reaction to proc ? Idk what is the proc, but I know it is a thing

[chilly brook]

mostly just during crackshot windows deciding whether or not you need to use another builder or if you can immediately BtE again

[sharp gale]

Sin in ST m+ is awful to play I agree

[chilly brook]

It's not great in raid either

it's just held up by the fact that is has good passive cleave

[sharp gale]

It is chill in raid / if it didn’t’ change from S1

[chilly brook]

I sim at 2.6m in pure single target at 683

[sharp gale]

I really like the ambush procs talent they play in raid

[chilly brook]

my evoker sims at 3.2m.....

the pure single target is garbage

[sharp gale]

2.6 m, I think I’m very close as prot

Give me 5 min

[chilly brook]

just shy of 3m as outlaw

[solid sun]

Why does that matter in raid

Do you mean in general?

Because there’s not a lot of pure single target going on in goblin town

[sharp gale]

Sprocket, mugzee, cauldron

Cauldron (depends on the specs)

[solid sun]

I said what I said

[chilly brook]

because it's abnormally low

[sharp gale]

But 1 choice node and insane cleave smh

[chilly brook]

like someone has to be the bottom sure, but we're talking bottom by a wide margin

[urban bane]

I forget how many pure st are in new raid? 🤔

[chilly brook]

Like the next lowest DPS spec on that list is 10% ahead of sin

that's a huge margin

for going from last to 2nd to last

[solid sun]

Is less than 300k a wide margin?

[chilly brook]

that's 10%

[sharp gale]

half i would say from my ptr vague memory

[solid sun]

Yeah is that wide?

[chilly brook]

yes it is

[solid sun]

If Roid did 300k more damage than me would you say he gapped me? I wouldn’t

Does sin have other things it does better than what those specs do on that list?

Is that thing valuable?

[sharp gale]

the first, there are adds but only 2 during intermission, the spider there is just the wall as extra, fractalis

[chilly brook]

in terms of performance and the actual numerical impact yes especially if the same class/spec

[nocturne spindle]

yea i mean

300k is gapping

thats like from green parse to purple parse status

[solid sun]

I’m just gonna have to disagree. 300k is nothing. I see that kind of thing all the time just playing the game with normal people

[chilly brook]

To put it in perspective, the highest simming single target performers are 25% above sin

[chilly brook]

300k is a lot of damage in single target

like wut

[solid sun]

There’s almost no single target that happens in raid and even when it does happen if you’re just like walking into the raid with people you’re going to see way crazier variance than a measly 300k

[chilly brook]

.........

the hardest boss this raid

was basically entirely single target

[solid sun]

We literally tell people in this discord that there’s almost no single target

It’s been laughed about

Memes about

[chilly brook]

cool and the hardest boss was basically single target

the small amount of adds fell over/you just stopped dps to align with mechanics

[solid sun]

So it suddenly matters now because of sin rogue

[sharp gale]

2.1M as prot YAS

[chilly brook]

no

but I think you're being a bit obtuse

[solid sun]

No I just think sin rogue absolutely cranks in the right situations and in single target it doesn’t and that’s fine

I don’t think 300k is very much

[chilly brook]

raid fight design is not an excuse for certain specs to be uncharacteristically shitty in anything that doesn't fit whatever niche is theirs

[sharp gale]

300k is 12% diff with THE OTHER LAST

[solid sun]

It’s less than 300k

[chilly brook]

being 9/10ths of the 2nd to last performer in pure single target and or 3/4ths of the top performer is though is not great

[chilly brook]

you are focusing on the number without looking at what that number represents as a whole

[sharp gale]

bandit is single target now for me x)

[chilly brook]

which btw that top performer

is good on every fight

single target or cleave or aoe

Surely there is a PTR pass today

surely

[urban bane]

unless... waiting for friday to drop a juicy one on us

[solid sun]

I just looked at 95th percentile for 11.1.5 and 11.1.7 and I don’t see ass on the bottom of any of the bosses in raid

So idk what I’m doing wrong but it seems like it’s doing okay?

[chilly brook]

are you also looking at the fight lengths specifically?

[urban bane]

"Vengeance DH removed from the game. Void-dance DH takes its place." HOLY

[frosty mango]

Uh I’ve never said that and this raid was entirely single target

[chilly brook]

18% raid buff, fight lengths and people ignoring adds so others can parse does a lot

[frosty mango]

Unless you count stix but if your raid is using brain that’s st too

[frosty mango]

Who says that, dox them. Do it!

[solid sun]

Nome asked what pure ST was these days when talking about our shitty head enchants

Boom owned

[chilly brook]

must be nice for your group to let you pad

this guy getting an extra like 400k from adds that normally you get yelled at for killing too fast/everyone else is trying to snipe

[urban bane]

I mean it isn't like he's doing much rotationally to make that happen. It is spatter, it just kinda happens

[chilly brook]

not when you get assigned jails 😦

and have to stop dps

but ye

[urban bane]

If he was giga padding he'd be swappin his darkest night over to really make it go kaboom

[chilly brook]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1050218176241225850/1396403484634517554/image.png?ex=6883e456&is=688292d6&hm=06ba6215d79d916702fd2f9863dffa8428eae1263617593bb9e336f0c33e2928&

I finally did well in a key at least

https://tenor.com/view/boat-kid-aura-farming-pacu-jalur-indonesia-boat-race-aura-farming-kid-gif-13961136228978115920

[urban bane]

Bleed build?

[frosty mango]

Yuge

That’s a floodgate looks like?

[chilly brook]

Priory

[chilly brook]

Hybrid actually

[urban bane]

[chilly brook]

Kinda like hybrid more than bleed

But bleed is simpler

[frosty mango]

Tell me the tank let you restealth without telling me

[chilly brook]

He didn’t actually lmao

[frosty mango]

Rude

[chilly brook]

Just had to use some good vanish

[agile elbow]

I know your healer in that key that's my friend lmao

[chilly brook]

Small world

[agile elbow]

Yeah haha

[waxen quarry]

dtb kb?

the envenom build ye

oh i cant read

unlucky

[chilly brook]

yea the hybrid tho not the pure cleave

[waxen quarry]

idk i just came back to assa is pure cleave the one where u dont garrote on aoe

i remember when assa was the noob rogue spec

funny how it turned around completely since df

[chilly brook]

I mean it's a decent design

easy to pick up but a lot of small optimizations

[waxen quarry]

ye the no garrote on aoe hybrid is not easy at all but its fun asf

[chilly brook]

no idea tbh I have it in my builds but haven't actually used it yet, it's a lot more prio dam focused iirc

never bothered cuz afaik it's not really worth running until higher keys like 16s

[waxen quarry]

ye that's the no gsrrote on aoe

the one played in high keys ye

full envenom fucks build

[mint knot]

hello prot bros, is this the thane execute build for m+? is it a drop massacre for whirling blades angle?

(ptr question)

[nocturne spindle]

i mean you probably dont execute for m+

[mint knot]

also thinking about dropping shield spec for enduring alacrity, see how that works

[mint knot]

probably not aye, but curious how much damage it does vs the "regular" build

[nocturne spindle]

thats probably what you would do then

or possibly drop bsv grab auto ravager and assume your living if your meme execute build

[worthy lichen]

why are we calling it a meme build?

[nocturne spindle]

not really that memey

just less good than clap more build in M+

[worthy lichen]

getting close to 30% of my dps from execute on ptr

[mint knot]

hmm, I'd never ever drop bsv, unless it was some ez 12 farm key weekly then yeah it's whatever

feels like the most OP tank cheat death ngl

[nocturne spindle]

i dont think it should be 30% of your dps

seems awfully high

but i havent dont too much ptr stuff

[mint knot]

is it thorim's might or gathering clouds?

[nocturne spindle]

thorims for sure single target

have to wait for everything to be updated for PTR for m+

[slim oracle]

unfortunately tanks need to think about survivability before they consider dps, and the execute build requires you to drop a lot of important talents to make it function well

[solid sun]

Why

[nocturne spindle]

its not a survivability thing

[solid sun]

Nome said he would run cleave execute and sounded like he wouldn’t have to give up important stuff for it

[nocturne spindle]

im just not sure if exe build is worth it in M+ for damage

it might be by numbers

[slim oracle]

if youre talking about just pure damage wise in a small target count dungeon its competitive if not better

like dawn

but if u wanna keep ravager plus take the execute talents u have to drop other important talents

[mint knot]

shield spec node seems to reduce my block value from 32%/48%(current) down to 29% (44% current)

while staying at 100% block chance

[solid sun]

@frosty mango what important nodes are you giving up in ptr to take execute cleave stuff

[mint knot]

idk about that node, maybe worth to rather take 4% magic DR instead of shield spec?

[nocturne spindle]

i mean you give up most likely enduring alacrity and ravager node

like he did

you do lose some stam from enduring

its just a matter of math if spending the global and rage on execute is worth it over sending more claps and slams

[solid sun]

Just going by the brief conversation Roid and Nome had

Highlights included “we have too many clap global anyways” “you lose basically nothing” “execute is your strongest hitting button up to like 8 targets”

And calling them sexecutes

Which was awesome

[mint knot]

enduring alacrity is 5% stam 2% haste loss over shield spec 3-4% phys DR

[solid sun]

But idk how much math was involved

[worthy lichen]

like what?

12 streets, only 3.2m with execute doing 29%. I dont know how youre going to drop that

[slim oracle]

not to be rude or anything but you're doing a 12 which you basically can just drop shield block for with the PTR gear and still live

[warm plinth]

What % of your damage it's dealing also means nothing

[slim oracle]

the rage youre spending on executes you would need for IP spam on a higher key like a 16

also what they said ^

here's a log of my eco 16 on thane with clap build and thunder blast did 28% of my damage

[warm plinth]

I could make slam do 30% of my damage. Doesn't mean anything because I'm obviously playing wrong

[slim oracle]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/W84hqxT2P1gc3BbC?fight=last&type=damage-done&source=2

[jagged gust]

The real problem is we have too many good nodes to be able to feelcraft our way to optimal damage

[slim oracle]

also i was running a garbage trinket testing it too

you will 100% get clapped on thane if ur just rage dumping on execute, and if youre actually using IP to live on thane then u might as well just run clap build

[warm plinth]

Talking about dropping shield spec in general is kind of insane unless you're doing keys that just don't do damage

[worthy lichen]

is it really though?

[jagged gust]

I think the call for thane is to drop BB

[worthy lichen]

3% phys dr and block chance that does nothing for 80% + of the time

[slim oracle]

i want u to run your build in a 16 and then tell me how u feel about survivability

and if u live and time the key, link your log so we can see your execute damage

i promise you it will be much lower because if you cared about living youd be dumping into IP

[worthy lichen]

so youre talking to me like i took IP off my bars

[slim oracle]

in my log i linked, i'm doing over 50% of the top dps's damage with the clap build in a 16... without having to compromise good talents

[worthy lichen]

you know that rage can be speant on both, correct?

did you know that?

[mint knot]

with and without shield spec, am i looking at it right? goes over 100% even without the node

[slim oracle]

you are naturally doing less damage with execute if you are spending rage on IP

not sure how that is something that should be argued about

until u send me a log of you actually running your build in a key where you can press w without defensives there's no point in discussing anyway

[worthy lichen]

without defensives?

bro wtf are you talking about

just muting

[slim oracle]

youre doing a 12 on PTR

and people have 20% avoidance

lmao okay

gl

[jagged gust]

Revenge with 13 CPM is kinda wild as MT

[slim oracle]

you dont really press it as mt

unless ur actually capped

and max IP

[jagged gust]

no I mean that's really high

[slim oracle]

yeah i main colossus so i prob overpressed a bit but

tbf

i dont think eco is a hard dungeon on tanks

im sure i was sitting max IP for a lot of time

[jagged gust]

well that doesn't really matter

but you didn't really waste rage either

[solid sun]

I think I’m getting confused

Maybe I’ve been playing Col too long?

I thought we didn’t care about ip uptime or maxing ip

Does that change as thane?

[jagged gust]

it matters even less as MT

Colo might occasionally have to pay attention, MT spams it like there's no tomorrow

[nocturne spindle]

It's just that revenge does bad damage as thane

You press it if you get unlucky with procs

Kinda same as with tc as Colossus

[solid sun]

Okay I thought so. I was not understanding why we were talking about IP so much

[slim oracle]

was just saying why i pressed revenge still as MT

i was max IP for a lot of so i'd press revenge over IP when at max IP and didnt have shield slam or proc up

[jagged gust]

Just looking at my S1 logs, revenge was on average 6-7CPM, probably goes a bit higher in S3 with more haste, though the tier set with higher TB proc chance is probably gonna even that back out

[solid sun]

Seems like there’s some room for execute

Which isn’t the same as spamming execute

I’m not gonna count it out

[slim oracle]

yeah i think MT loses less for pressing execute than colossus so u could def fit it in the rotation during low proc times

[jagged gust]

Inside of CDs on MT, the ICD on IP was long enough that I would cap rage if I wasn't spending rage ahead of time or didn't have a SB charge to blow through a chunk of it, we're gonna have plenty of room for exe

[slim oracle]

but tanking is just weird where u can have moments of lots of rage to spend on damage and then suddenly your IP is dropping just as fast as u apply it

[worthy lichen]

nah pressing execute means you cant IP ever again. Infact you have to take shieldwall off your bars if you want to press execute

[slim oracle]

not sure why you're so pressed; u linked a screenshot in a 12 of your execute damage

go run your build in a key where youre actually in danger of dying

and show the logs

honestly it was only a 16 but i think the damage on thane is super competitive, i'm just worried that once u get to a higher key level thane survivability falls behind pally/dh

even if it is one of the highest dmg tanks

[solid sun]

Where is this pally stuff coming from

Did they get buffed

[slim oracle]

they're a tank that just scales really well with more stats

[solid sun]

Paladin just always be dying

[slim oracle]

i play all 3 and paladin has the most upside

problem is its the most punishing

you know where the execute build is gona go crazy though

soul hunters

[mint knot]

My prot paladin feels like paper next to my warrior. I dread thinking pala meta again.

[slim oracle]

3 target cleave on execute is gonna go crazy

not the pally disc but a big part is being comfortable with your cds and naturally procc'ing your cheat as a cd as well

a lot more to juggle compared to war

its ok though its prob one of the lower damage contribution tanks anyway and warrior is one of the highest rn so just play war for big dam

[frosty mango]

Hunker down and disrupting shout