Real
#protection
dusky canopy
frigid valley
alts n os is basically same shit for us, farm we just press need if need
and u pray
warm plinth
What kind of music do fish listen too?
The band Phish
lofty warren
What's a key value
warm plinth
He sings country music now
lofty warren
K value
lusty grotto
yeah rough times ghash
warm plinth
A hidden variable based on content type that affects mitigation
Basically, it makes it so you block a larger percentage of damage in easier content.
dusky canopy
I got something that’ll affect your mitigation
warm plinth
lofty warren
If it's easier why do you need to block more
warm plinth
The point is to make harder shit harder
lofty warren
Is it the same across content or is it spec specific?
warm plinth
It's tier and content type specific
So like mythic dungeons all have the same k value (including all m+ levels). But normal raid has a different k value, as does heroic and mythic. Next season, the k value for each will change
lusty grotto
increase*
warm plinth
As we get stronger, the k values will increase across the board to keep things in line
dusky canopy
The point is to make harder shit harder
lusty grotto
until midnight when the stat squish happens
warm plinth
Are they actually doing another squish?
lusty grotto
yes
warm plinth
Ugh
warm plinth
I hate all the squishes
warm plinth
Surely not level yet
lusty grotto
but its blizzard so
warm plinth
We got to 120 before
mighty valley
they shoulda squished pre-tww so we could just get stronger over this lil trilogy thing
lusty grotto
i agree
lusty grotto
its fine though it is what it is at this point
dusky canopy
Ngl I kinda wish they would have never lowered level
And only adjusted stats
But I get why
warm plinth
Pretty sure level squish happens because no one wants to level 8 billion times to get to max level
mighty valley
Ngl I kinda wish they would have never lowered level
Can you imagine the pace of leveling if we got up to like level 180
you'd do two quests and bam, 6 levels
dusky canopy
Well nah it would be more like a gacha game where they spread the exp out so every 20 minutes you flash a level up on your screen and it recommends a wow token to buy more gear from the AH
See I should do marketing for blizzard
I’d make them millions
cerulean tusk
What if: No leveling, but - you get to watch a cinematic instead that sums up the story. Make it high quality, so ppl would want to.
I get to AFK, walk away and come back later.
New ppl get to... "enjoy"... the lore
lusty grotto
good one
cerulean tusk
win/win
lusty grotto
cat has a good take
warm plinth
Hear me out
warm plinth
Remove heirloom gear. Instead, every time you do a quest that involves more than talking, you get a generated armor/weapon reward that is always the slot of your lowest ilevel piece (or random if multiple of the same lowest slot)
lusty grotto
dont like
frosty mango
What if: No leveling, but - you get to watch a cinematic instead that sums up th...
and then when you’re done you get three skills - “dps, tank, heal”. Only one is active based on your specialization. You can’t actually control your character, you queue into a dungeon which is now a side scroller and you just mash your one button
The faster you mash it the more loot you get
warm plinth
Roid you really want that spec button huh
cerulean tusk
Nah, you just make a 30min intro quest event
that leads you through things
"this mob hits you, it hurts! Use shieldblock to stop hurt!"
frosty mango
Roid you really want that spec button huh
Yes I need peak autohotkey gaming
lusty grotto
"you used ignore pain, you failed and died, oh no!"
"stop taking tips from reddit, you ouchie, floor friend"
warm plinth
"Imagine pressing ignore pain instead of revenge, noob!"
frosty mango
"you used ignore pain, you failed and died, oh no!"
“Buy 15 crystals from the blizzard shop to continue from here, or restart to try again”
lusty grotto
i dig it
lofty warren
Ip is a dps loss i think?
warm plinth
No, bad
jade hazel
frosty mango
Ip is a dps loss i think?
Don’t think, that’s not the warrior way
torn gulch
I will be pretty surprised if both the dinar system and turbo boost don't come next season
i think we're getting both
torn gulch
i am fine with the current dinar system but i want all the gear on the vendors
if i want to use my dinars on a head piece let me do so
urban portal
If it's easier why do you need to block more
essentially its there so you have to upgrade your shield and armor every tier
without boss damage going overboard
i think the easiest way to think of k value is armor penetration
sharp merlin
I will be pretty surprised if both the dinar system and turbo boost don't come n...
They need it, to falsley inflate the season length
solid sun
How does it "falsley inflate the season length"
If people play longer, they play longer. What's false about it
mighty valley
this is actually a real problem - if you want a more in-depth explanation of how it's gonna affect upcoming seasons, google "xalatath inflation"
warm plinth
@lusty grotto tell me I don't have to take this pls
mighty valley
you don't HAVE to do anything
warm plinth
Thanks man
sadly this is my only other option; ngl I thought I would've had 3 slots this week for sure. Felt like I did a ton of keys lol
lusty grotto
<@131897531251556352> tell me I don't have to take this pls
take it you nerd
warm plinth
YOU'RE NOT MY DAD
mighty valley
don't clean your room
warm plinth
It's gonna make me have to take HR again 
I'm playing jumprope with that shit this season
I have crit for fuckin days though
warm plinth
don't clean your room
You're my dad
warm plinth
take it you nerd
I did, but it hurt a little
lofty warren
essentially its there so you have to upgrade your shield and armor every tier
If k value didn't exist why would that make boss damage go overboard
Boss do more big damage and your gear more better = no need for k
wet osprey
is colossus the way to go for m+?
warm plinth
You can play either
sharp gale
If k value didn't exist why would that make boss damage go overboard
To squeeze variance between the high/ low damage swing I guess, tune gear better etc
warm plinth
Thane sims very close to colossus for me
warm plinth
I didn't think it should be but thane is like 5% ahead on ST and like -2.5% on aoe
lusty grotto
it was at least 19% more on my sims for aoe as colossus
lusty grotto
the usual
frosty mango
Thane should be very far behind colossus
Even on sim
8-15% I’d imagine depending on your gear
warm plinth
Blah, I need to enchant my helm rq lol
urban portal
If k value didn't exist why would that make boss damage go overboard
its a way to limit disparity between tank damage and dps damage
warm plinth
All Nim's fault
lusty grotto
warm plinth
This is using Thane M+ and Colossus M+, with Spear/Roar variations on Thane. It's actually even smaller than before on AoE (was probably several ilevel ago that I did it).
5 min ST w/ Lust
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/6NKBm9oV2ZigQkQvBp2Bmv
1.5min 5-target no lust
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/uEEC33pjqf97yMeNjbhSSJ
1.5 min 8-target no lust
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/oEpr4NH1dbZJSUWXX5WQG4
lusty grotto
dont use nightly
rerun it, youre gonna make me log off dune to show mine
and im knee deep in the deep desert atm
warm plinth
Since when don't we use Nightly o_O Which one do I use then? Latest or Weekly?
lusty grotto
latest should be fine
warm plinth
That one says there's an even higher chance of bugs than Nightly XD
lusty grotto
yeah i guess thats accurate, use weekly then
warm plinth
rerun it, youre gonna make me log off dune to show mine
5min ST w/ lust
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/aRau1QoaL2aKtEZX71prC4
1.5min 5-target no lust
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/5rtFCpGR2LXjiPLa6wCqVT
1.5min 8-target no lust
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/5w5wupju9FsQKZewACqWBT
Sorry in advance
lusty grotto
the ST sim is unnecessary
wet osprey
is execute used often as prot?
lusty grotto
yes
all of it is used
except for Slam, Whirlwind and Rend since Thunderclap applies it
lusty grotto
it does, which is why i alt+f4'd dune
and im instantly logging in for a recent simc profile
frosty mango
My last st sim was like 2.3m
warm plinth
it's M+ build, not ST
frosty mango
Or something like that
frosty mango
Depends on your stat breakdown, if you have like 2000 haste it may
lusty grotto
youre also
warm plinth
I have 15890 haste
warm plinth
It's BSV vs Indom
warm plinth
? I don't have battering ram
lusty grotto
yes
thats the point
not having it is screwing your numbers
at least do BSV vs BSV
or no BSV vs no BSV
you dont indom
warm plinth
How would that have anything to do with the sim
warm plinth
BSV does no damage. Indom does no damage
warm plinth
It doesn't matter...
lusty grotto
you should be talented into battering ram
warm plinth
It has no impact on the sim at all
lusty grotto
yes it does
warm plinth
I mean I can change indom to BSV but it's going to do nothing
slim dove
lusty grotto
but talenting into battering ram will
cause of our tier
let me dust it off
NEVER INDOM
indom is banned from colossus
warm plinth
I am not even using Indom in the Colossus build
warm plinth
And the only reason Indom is in the thane build is because it's in the Thane build on wowhead, which I said should be removed like 2 weeks ago and Nome said no.
lusty grotto
you do not have battering ram talented
warm plinth
I'm aware of that
warm plinth
I mean Indom is in the colossus build too XD
lusty grotto
youre shooting the colossus sim in the foot by not taking battering ram and having BSV instead
warm plinth
That's why I told him about it
warm plinth
Yeah, I know. I just didn't want to waste my time simming with it in all 3 and then you yell at me for having it in thane XD
lusty grotto
i mean
im just trying to figure out why youre simming low
and battering might be one of the reasons
but probably not the only reason
anyway my vault was ass
as expected
warm plinth
1.5min 8 target no lust
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/so5yhDtdGpPLx36Gvu5fTd
1.5 min 5 target no lust
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/wiCptWxStYeBkSwJeCBQ2R
warm plinth
Idk, maybe something dumb we're just overlooking
sharp gale
What’s the issue
lusty grotto
his thane sims close to colossus
cyan bronze
You don’t have aoe kick on thane
frosty mango
big diff is youre not using tome
cyan bronze
Ur taking a dmg node for thane vs a util node for colossus
frosty mango
thats one big diff
cyan bronze
Sim colossus no aoe kick or thane w it
sharp gale
Ur taking a dmg node for thane vs a util node for colossus
Not gapping 20% damage
frosty mango
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/oikUsts2ps5j5Lec2F55Qy
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/1HDd9PD1L5C5gyxWLGfL9z
cyan bronze
Not gapping 20% damage
Still some
warm plinth
I'll check after my aotc carry w/ show of force talented on colo. It's a pain in the ass to change talents in the middle of the tree on raidbots XD
frosty mango
i have a big ivl gap
lusty grotto
yeah roid but
youre simming ST
i guess you wanted to see the ST difference
we're talking about the aoe sims though
sharp gale
i forgot i went from raid col (with bleed col talent)
frosty mango
I stripped his addon string and then resimmed with his specs and colossus is pretty far ahead
default sim settings, 5 target 1.5m
lusty grotto
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/qL1KHLVbbvdBN6rgMXsA3x
yeah my sims are similar
frosty mango
lusty grotto
could it be his simc is outdated or something?
frosty mango
I used his string
frosty mango
im assuming his browser has some sort of settings cached and stuck because his sim has no consumables on it
sharp gale
after correcting my mistake
frosty mango
thane is 11% behind for me
lusty grotto
its 12% behind for me
sharp gale
yes, disrupting col is 9% above thane for me, i would guess ITF fill the rest
warm plinth
WE'RE GETTIN THERE
sharp gale
(9% is almost a number i can make the sacrifice, not yet)
sharp gale
make thunderblast blast
cerulean tusk
Alternatively, you could just make Thane tankier. So there are two different philosophies between the two 
lusty grotto
you mean like s1?
and then nobody plays colossus except for in vault keys?
surely that will turn out well 
frosty mango
Alternatively, you could just make Thane tankier. So there are two different phi...
Yeah that would never work
lusty grotto
just remove the dumb 5 target softcap
sharp gale
I would say S1 Col was dysfunctional, not that thane was tankier
frosty mango
Tankiness only matters insofar as you don’t die
sharp gale
Bc rage starving
warm plinth
Look at roid using that big ass fancy word INSOFAR
lusty grotto
cat being silly
frosty mango
Look at roid using that big ass fancy word INSOFAR
Did I mention I was a professional writer for a while
Of the technical persuasion
My favorite is the oxford continuation
Thane is garbage compared to colossus; however, it is still viable.
warm plinth
I'm a big lover of semi-colons
cerulean tusk
rapid narwhal
Would I take a myth shield over a hero Titan of Industry or is the effect from the shield too good?
kind glen
The effect is like .1% lol
rapid narwhal
can you tell i dont play prot
lusty grotto
treat shields like weapons
ilvl > all
but for a different reason
that reason being block
there hasnt been an expansion and/or season that shield ilvl hasn't been better every single time
that is, until they create some dumb shield that procs for a billion damage or something
frosty mango
As a general rule this expansion cantrips suck
I think there’s only two good ones right? Best in slots and the mugzee knucks and even then they don’t outclass ilvl like some of the ones from last expansion
rugged root
i know i could sim but since were tanks should i take myth shoulders or weapon?
solid sun
15 floodgate is cursed
frosty mango
15 floodgate is cursed
lol why
solid sun
Well the first time we tried it tonight somehow after we did the barrel of explosions after ib gmomma a bunch of extra stuff just started running after our rsham and idk why
And then the second time we tried it people just started dying to swampface and idk what they were doing there
frosty mango
The belt pulls extra stuff
lusty grotto
i thought nobody used bolts after the nerf, but heh..
frosty mango
ALL the time in floodgate
We had it pull the kelps while we were up on the rampart before the glider
Pulled half the instance to us
mighty valley
i know i could sim but since were tanks should i take myth shoulders or weapon?
Probably weapon unless shoulders would be a huge ilvl upgrade
Or you could craft weapon take shoulders
mighty valley
People are resistant to simming but
I love when I can offload decisions onto something I can pretend is perfect and objective
lusty grotto
chrome sapphire
Far as I can tell, Raidbots doesnt have a dropdown to change the ability of the titan belt. Is it actually of value to prot warriors if you have a heroic or mythic belt already?
rugged root
Probably weapon unless shoulders would be a huge ilvl upgrade
yeah im in just full heroic rn havent crafted anything yet and havent gotten mythic pieces yet on my alt
lusty grotto
yeah im in just full heroic rn havent crafted anything yet and havent gotten myt...
sim
rugged root
oh okay!!!
lusty grotto
and if a sim yields higher dps due to stats, it means those same stats will give you defensive value
rugged root
ill sim lol
lusty grotto
you sim as a tank on ANY TANK CLASS
lusty grotto
dps also means threat
so its very important for us
you just cant sim defensiveness
thats it
not directly, at least
round cliff
lusty grotto
Far as I can tell, Raidbots doesnt have a dropdown to change the ability of the ...
yes
go with the wowhead guide recommendations
which is haste
warm plinth
@lusty grotto so with HR on all builds, Show of Force on Col/TL on Thane, and BR on both, it's about a 6-7% loss to run Thane in AoE compared to my current build (which is with Disrupting and no BR), and about a 12-13% loss compared to if I was running SoF/BR. That seems more in line, since I can't run itF right now
lusty grotto
yeah probs
spare goblet
Far as I can tell, Raidbots doesnt have a dropdown to change the ability of the ...
you can sim belt options in top gear
wet osprey
whats ignore pain uptime supposed to look like in a key?
mighty valley
whats ignore pain uptime supposed to look like in a key?
varies a huge amount depending on key level and ilvl etc. Don’t focus on it
frosty mango
whats ignore pain uptime supposed to look like in a key?
dont worry about IP uptime
use it when youre in danger of overcapping rage (70-80 rage)
and outside of that you wont have to do much with it until 15-16 range
rugged root
so im currently 650 ilvl a
and im having trouble with doing the first big pull on priory
i get mobs down to like 30% and maybe the mini boss to like 40-50 and then all of sudden im dead
mighty valley
Have you got a log to help see what kills you
rugged root
shoot ill get one next time im there
frosty mango
i get mobs down to like 30% and maybe the mini boss to like 40-50 and then all o...
are you tanking in the corner by the stairs
rugged root
i was practicing on a +10 btw. but its tytpically when he does that big tank busting hit
rugged root
are you tanking in the corner by the stairs
yessirr
also rip me i just ran Siege of org 10 times today and no shoulders 😦
frosty mango
If I had to guess I would say most likely one of two things
shield block is falling off and you are taking the shield slam natty and dying
you are not using a cooldown for the shield slam
if you get a log like harrow said we can tell you with 100% certainty
rugged root
ill watch for those, i figureed id ask too cause im also not sure if it was the healer lol
rugged root
i did notice orange/yellow circles under me in the corner before i died too
frosty mango
whats your character name
rugged root
kickaxee-area 52
frosty mango
nope no parses, thought we might get lucky
rugged root
ill hit yall up again when i run it again later and possibly brick someones key ❤️
frigid valley
brother what is this vault 
frigid valley
i also run embel on cloak
sharp gale
If I had to guess I would say most likely one of two things
shield block is fal...
isn't the shield slam unblockable phys damage ?
frosty mango
isn't the shield slam unblockable phys damage ?
Yes but if shield block falls off you’ll get clapped by white hits and shield slam can chunk
Put you in the danger zone so to speak
Like Kenny loggins
sharp gale
it reminded me that i did a 10 without any source of shield block x), but it was regular route and ToP
sharp gale
it is good if they changed it, unblockable phys is more of a raid tuning, in m+ it is a pain
and sometime we block random frost named casts like ???
crimson furnace
was there any posts regarding the current state of prot warr on the ptr?? just like an overview of where we stand and how bright our futures look??
😄
crimson furnace
ok, so we are expecting a bit of a shakedown and tuning before giving a verdict
makes sense
get it, sense
HAHAHAH
🤦🏻♂️
sharp merlin
was there any posts regarding the current state of prot warr on the ptr?? just l...
I unsub and unrecommend any youtubers who make tier lists
crimson furnace
they all made one, atleast the guys I am following who were doing tank content :)))
sharp merlin
Scourge of WoW, I swear to god
patent scroll
It's fast slop that doesn't need any actual research or numbers that brings in a lot of clicks
I get why they make them, but yeah, it's a cancer of gaming
blazing ridge
Sim is telling me to craft Haste/Mastery Shoulders
would you guys rather crafter Gloves or Shoulders
or nothing and wait for another mythic vault drop
mmm
I mean If I dont craft I could keep the Helm as it is and not convert it.
jagged gust
Shoulders/gloves share the same stat value, both tier pieces are high haste with a 2nd stat that can be offset with ring enchants/gems
truly doesn't matter which you choose, I went helm because I was really low on haste/crit when gearing
Crafting at this point in the season tho? Up to you, it's only gold but personally I'm not spending any more gold on gearing this season
blazing ridge
Yea kinda true, but I like to juice myself up even though at this point its only small increases
patent scroll
Very likely replacing the lower ilvl tier piece is a bigger gain, regardless of stats
blazing ridge
I have 671 chest / shoulder / gloves atm and I could chose Shoulder or Chest from this vault
patent scroll
Yeah like here https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/3R2cyrfMUWecEGbiR1m1X5
Shoulders or gloves doesn't really matter, haste mastery/haste vers doesn't really matter, they're within variance anyway
Hell just crit/mastery or crit/vers or crit/haste are all within .15% as well
so tldr craft a piece, stats basically irrelevant
jagged gust
youtubers
blazing ridge
Not taking ITF is this trolling?
sharp gale
they all made one, atleast the guys I am following who were doing tank content :...
If you skip at the end / take the tiermaker thing into account : you lost the game of tierlists, you didn’t watch for informations, you watched for the tierlist
And to talk about rankings like it mean something
sharp gale
Only 5 specs will be meta 1 tank 1 healer and 3 dps, the specific specs will be determined a lil bit after launch of season, couple tuning hotfixes (especially post world first one or .5), and the meta tank depends on the meta comp
What is the most wild choice ? No instigate or bloodsurge, no ITF, or 2 first gate picks over things below
jagged pier
wasted points going for TLs as colossus 
jagged pier
and with this u can move Best served cold somewhere else and bloodsurge
sharp gale
TL is not the wildest pick
blazing ridge
This is like the same points I just set on my loadout and I didnt even need to think tbh xd
jagged pier
TL is not the wildest pick
i dunno dumping 2 points into LS and TLs over stuff they missed is giga wild
cause it stops them even going for other talents
in ther first place
sharp gale
Yes but you get more use than then early magic DR of def stance, and switch best served cold for TL (similar as live where ppl take TL somehow)
Im not huge fan of TL as Col myself, but I have the vision for the ones who do the choice
Blizz should 100% do something about those stats nodes too, they are still so good
crimson furnace
aoe execute for life
no other way to play this S3 as a prot warr
its all about execute, dmg and execute visuals
lets gooooooooo
frigid valley
remove spear and put in condemn then allow a exectute cleave build 
sharp gale
There is a world where thane prot AoE execute in raid
jagged pier
aoe execute for life
have fun with thane
crimson furnace
why thane, jakey??
jagged pier
i mean u can but not taking bloodbounre as colossus feels dumb
jagged pier
when if u want to go purely execute u will want sudden death
thanes tier dont touch bleeds
and more rage in general to execute with
crimson furnace
true, f*ck, that bleed synergy atm is just to sweeet
saving this, jakey, thank you, u opened my chakra with this comments
thank you
jagged pier
i mean thats based off my feelings and what I think
sharp gale
And thane likes executes
crimson furnace
thunder clapper, execute pousher, big damage bringer -- Mantra for S3
tulip oar
The bleed synergy seems to be their, "Hey let's make Prot War more like the rest of the tanks," nonsense.
tulip oar
Only instead of spirit orbs we have bleeds.
sharp gale
It will get nerfed you know?
jagged pier
yer but thats with colosus and BB
crimson furnace
never
jagged pier
It will get nerfed you know?
most likely but we dont actually know yet
crimson furnace
we will never get nerfs, just buffs
tulip oar
100% it will be nerfed into the dirt.
blazing ridge
Maybe they change than Tierset to be good so we might have a choice either going sustain col or execute heavy thane
jagged pier
i would put money on it tho
crimson furnace
insert fun detected meme, jakey???
sharp gale
4 m hps and you can block, S3 parry chance, no shot Blizz let it slide
jagged pier
no it, is overtuned
tulip oar
Nah, it's Blizzard. They nerf the shit out of it and that's it. They'll leave the rest a janky dog shit.
sharp gale
insert fun detected meme, jakey???
I don’t find hps fun on tanks unless I’m a bdk
cerulean tusk
I dont care much about HPS; I care about DTHPTS, if we reach the point being basically 0. Then it is too strong. Before then? THen it is about what leaves you with the best DTPS profile.
crimson furnace
well, atm if ur down to 3 mobs on ptr and there is no proc, its basically useless
but, when in a bigger pack, plus the set proc
pew pew pew heals heals heals
so yhea, its a 2 edge sword
thats for sure
ST feel bad as well, ST boss fights
cerulean tusk
Sure, it might heal a lot during that timeframe. But is it efficent EDTPS when you look at things as a whole. Does it make you go from 200k to 150k EDTPS, or does it make that a 0 sum.
If we can make it become close to a 0, then there is a lot of value in pulling things under bosses and such. It might even be seen as lowkey broken.
But if it moves the needle from 200k to 150k, and you lose busterpower, then we can start to argue worth.
solid sun
Some bosses you won’t be able to do that to and at least one of them is already gonna be scary
First boss dawnbreaker
sharp gale
Sure, it might heal a lot during that timeframe. But is it efficent EDTPS when y...
Tbf it will be useful for dots, since it happens 100% after demolish
And with actual gear, you can have lot of shield slam crit
cerulean tusk
Yeah, its fancy. But, I care more for the actual effective value. I am not against it being better, I just want the numbers before I decide to preach the good word or not.
solid sun
No reason to preach it anyways since it’s gonna get nerfed
sharp gale
It will not have huge effective value, we are prot, we block and IP most damage
cerulean tusk
Why would it be nerfed if it brings value from only 250k to 200k?
sharp gale
Unless you are in prot usual danger situations
solid sun
Because it’s already known to be overtuned. The amount of healing is crazy
And unless pwar is getting a new identity it doesn’t match what their design for pwar is
sharp gale
Yeah if it is really the 4 m star said, I don’t know what it does on us
cerulean tusk
4m HPS per target with a bleed, or 4m on 20 mobs?
4m for 10 sec, or 4m overall.
sharp gale
4 m but mitigate 80%, seems off, for the effectives idk I took his words, I don’t want to tank with 200+ ping
warm plinth
I wake up, I go to skyhold, and first thing I see is a ptr build with ravager smh
cerulean tusk
No reason not to take his word for it, but I can turn 650k DTPS to 150k EHPS with shields alone. The value of this huge number change is kinda low. As the healer was already cowering this passively. Where healer had to heal, he had to heal either way.
But the closer you can get to 0, it becomes so much better.
But a change from 250k potential to 200k is not worth as much one would initialy think.
Question: Anyone else had warcraftlogs remove your logs?
Cause I cant find my uploaded meme logs
Yeah, they are gone even from the uploaded-logs log
the heck
why would they be gone
now I am wondering if they removed my Fury logs as well
solid sun
Unfortunately you have been punished for being a non-believer in fbv
cerulean tusk
Now I am just annoyed that logs are gone
Oh yeah, they removed most of my gigalogs
These are the only surviving ones
Guess they removed a bunch of logs on accident or to clear up trash data at one point
slender bison
Maybe they just want to make tank self-heal DF tier again so healers can focus on DPS unavoidable AoEs 
cerulean tusk
Maybe they really want Pwarrior to be meta
but every time they do, VDH is just VDH
slender bison
We won't be meta with 5M hps and 5M DPS until they fix chains/solar combo
slender bison
"Bro look at my heals, heal afk. Report" - random pwarr Mythic 6, ca. August 2025
strong forum
theres no way in hell fbv stays as it is
cerulean tusk
If HPS turns it to a 0 EDTPS for the whole key, then it is relevant. We can pull the whole instance as 5 prot warrs and kill it all 
5x prot, new meta
frigid valley
lemme see y'all outheal tankbuster on first boss in dawnbreaker from bleeds
cerulean tusk
We can snap mobs to it, dont worry
slender bison
"4x Prot + BL. Pumpers. Bring xp"
cyan bronze
lemme see y'all outheal tankbuster on first boss in dawnbreaker from bleeds <:ke...
we can force our priest to mind dom a mob and release it onto it
cerulean tusk
bring 4 priests
cyan bronze
We won't be meta with 5M hps and 5M DPS until they fix chains/solar combo
I mean
cerulean tusk
That is why you bring 5 warriors
cyan bronze
it existed in s1 tww
cerulean tusk
smh
cyan bronze
vdh was just bad
so it didn’t matter
ppl were saying the same thing about a tier ago about ppal being unshakably in the meta with sac spellwarding avengers shield etc
frigid valley
wasnt vdh the "meta" until pala got the double buff out of nowhere or was that prot war?
slender bison
Developer notes: We noticed that VDH is meta for 3 years now, so we took Prot warr HPS from a random warcraft log and then we tripled it. You're welcome
cyan bronze
that was pwar
cerulean tusk
The point is:
We meta now
slender bison
Meta in Beta 
cyan bronze
meta in beta
cerulean tusk
Nome just mad, cause now he meta, he got to stop playing other games and push warrior to #1 spot world in all content
cyan bronze
I think pwar has a decent chance of being meta tbf
but depends on tuning and other specs
cerulean tusk
If we bring 4million HPS, sure
cyan bronze
disrupting shout&shockwave knockup is p not bad
slender bison
That 4M hps won't allow you big pulls if DPS dies because no sigil/beam
cyan bronze
That 4M hps won't allow you big pulls if DPS dies because no sigil/beam
i mean
if vdh gets gutted
then sigil+beam won’t allow big pulls if the vdh dies
suuurely that spec gets shot
mellow bridge
god chains is the most overrated ability in the history of this game
fucking crazy
cerulean tusk
I dont want VDH shot, I just want Pwarrior to oneshot bosses with demolish 
slender bison
I think each team works on their class in an echo chamber and then the lead class balance guy aggregates the patches and he just loves VDH
frigid valley
biggest meta is to not log in
cyan bronze
god chains is the most overrated ability in the history of this game
real and the truest thing ive ever heard
cerulean tusk
Chains pulling in and syncing everything up for Silence is quite efficent tho
Cant hate on chains, chains do chains things
slender bison
Chains silence beam giga pull is what makes 4k
Disrupt shout Mekagon 1st pull into Beam is literally pain
cerulean tusk
Yeah, but: we got 4m HPS
frigid valley
Accidently put a chain sigil in the roof and not on the ground 
cerulean tusk
With 4m HPS, we got what, 90% overhealing?
strong forum
chains is overrated, but what yall seem to miss
cerulean tusk
pretty good
cyan bronze
I love watching vdhs cheat to chains
cerulean tusk
If that is true, why no massgrip on BDK?
hmmmm
I say as I play massgrip on BDK for fun
cyan bronze
If that is true, why no massgrip on BDK?
gorefiends fucking sucks
it doesn’t count as a kick iirc
cerulean tusk
Nah, it is awesome
slender bison
Speaking of fun - brb Brewmaster quick dungeon
frigid valley
we need this yes sir
strong forum
cuz gorefiends is on a much worse position on the tree
cerulean tusk
Its doable to get it
strong forum
and you already have 2 grips
cyan bronze
chains silence beam is good
strong forum
gorefiends fucking sucks
its literally a bigger and better chains
cyan bronze
its literally a bigger and better chains
it’s a better chains
worse sigil of silence
no?
cerulean tusk
if only grasp actually silenced more than half of the time
strong forum
grasp silence is pointless cuz you already move the mobs and therefor stop their cast
so like
xd
cerulean tusk
Nah, 3 sec of chill after is nice
cyan bronze
vdh silence is pointless because you already moved the mobs w chains and therefore stopped the cast
surely
cyan bronze
surely there wasn’t a change in tww causing this to no longer be true
strong forum
has there?
cyan bronze
surely they won’t recast immediately
strong forum
ah you mean that
strong forum
i thought they backed it into base grasp for a sec
cerulean tusk
Well, it is a pure silence, so 3 sec they cant cast anything
cyan bronze
think it’s 2nd point
cerulean tusk
(when it works)
cyan bronze
for grasp silence?
cyan bronze
but it’s sad because it’s
grip silence in one button
it’s not silencing the cast
which counts as an acc interrupt, which matters in a lot of places
cyan bronze
yep
strong forum
yeah but is it fun tho
cyan bronze
vs sigil of silence, disrupting shout actually fully locking it out
cerulean tusk
it do be fun, why I take it
solid sun
counterpoint: vdh is awful to play and isn't fun and is the worst
strong forum
always has been
cerulean tusk
I dont enjoy VDH, so I agree with Rhino
cyan bronze
45 sec cd 8 sec silence
sigil of silence is 4x worse(hyperbolic), 90 sec cd, 4 sec silence
mellow bridge
beam doesnt count as a kick outside the main target at least
cyan bronze
yah
silence has also been gutted since df
like, 1.5x cd, think half duration, half as many charges()
strong forum
for good reason
cyan bronze
yea
I agree
I just don’t get why bear, brm, much less extent bdk don’t get something meaningful for their interrupt kit
the difference between avengers shield, SoS, disrupting shout vs rop(), bear grip?(), and gorefiends/abom ( ) is wild
cerulean tusk
RIP grippyhands
cyan bronze
and abom also got fucking removed for bdk
cerulean tusk
I have actually not checked, what replaced that node spot?
cyan bronze
think empty
cerulean tusk
trim timber
can bleeds be blocked?
trim timber
ok ty 🙂
warm vale
the saddest thing about slappy hands getting removed is that spear will probably never get turned into a grip like dh chains :(
cyan bronze
Wish it would
tulip oar
I don't get why they decided to remove slappy hands. It was one of the best things to come out of Shadowlands.
solid sun
Anyone else had a slappy hands assassination during ipa
wet osprey
do you guys macro tome into any of your skills?
wet osprey
roger that thanks
strong forum
the key to using tome is using it CORRECTLY
if you just use it on cd itll fuck you over
its not just an on-use that gives you positive effect
its on-use switches modes
you wanna switch into the correct mode
and not just on cd
wet osprey
do you use a WA to track the mode?
lofty wren
Is it just me or Tome is quite annoying on prot warr I often get into situation where I brun quite fast through 50 stacks and it is still on cd
strong forum
has nothing to do with pwar
they nerfed the icd
so it changes modes quicker
its based on how often you get hit
so in big pulls, you get hit more frequently
lofty wren
I thought perry might not count
strong forum
we also have like 35% parry
perma
and its every dmg instance
not just melee hits
lofty wren
Aight
wet osprey
ty kindly
strong forum
this one is a bit much
lotta pointless shit
this one looks better
i have my own but i cba logging in xd
blazing ridge
Install WA that tells you when to change, it doesnt use a GCD just press it and then forget for next 2-3 minutes its not rocket science
frigid valley
this is all i use on it, dont need extra icons to track n shit
jade hazel
That’s actually hilarious
sharp merlin
Almost 10 years
finally..
I even got Cutting Edge and Scythe from Argus
but that weapon evaded me for far too long
frigid valley
undeserved
sharp merlin
LOL
dusky canopy
wet osprey
any must have WA's or macros? besides the ones on wowhead/icyveins?
cerulean tusk
As long you got the Ability Timeline and SR WA, you are set
cerulean tusk
Its RNG drop, one one char, so - farmable, not impossible. But ya need RNG on your side as with most things.
sharp merlin
but do you need to do a quest before it?
dusky canopy
Nope just go clear MC
Get lucky
Small questline to craft it once you have both halfs
sharp merlin
The entire Molten core?
dusky canopy
Well you can just do garr and baron
dusky canopy
Might as well full clear for the hammer
sharp merlin
The Hammer?
dusky canopy
Sulfuras hammer or whatever off ragnaros
sharp merlin
oh boy
dusky canopy
Another legendary
sharp merlin
I'm sucgh a sucker for tmogs ahahah
runic granite
Takes like 10 minutes to full clear it
Even on slow ass warrior?
I guess there’s enough trash to charge
dusky canopy
Yeah just charge and leap on cooldown
Goes pretty quick
I toss on a rocket belt too for the hallway between garr and baron
heavy sparrow
I guess there’s enough trash to charge
Smart to get speed enchants on mog run bracers and cape
nocturne spindle
where ptr nerfs
dusky canopy
Speed set!
frigid valley
<:copium:839076283467431956> where ptr nerfs
runic granite
What are our predictions? Slight tuning to our FbV healing? Gut it?
strong forum
anything between 20-50% nerf
runic granite
Full healing every tick is probably a little too good
strong forum
when they buffed fbv to 200% they kinda forgot that colossus exists
and its tierset
so yeah
solid sun
Healing nerf, damage nerf, and probably the removal of spell reflect because it requires too much knowledge
:)
solid sun
Can’t forget that
strong forum
maybe they nerf it, it prevented 25mil total over an entire raid night
thats almost as much as 2 healthpots
!
dusky canopy
Wow so broken and overpowered
nocturne spindle
excuse me
your forgetting the 2% aoe reduction
(r is that the other talent lmao
solid sun
Maybe they’ll rework spell breaker so that the first spell that hits us every 45 seconds is completely negated
Idk if that would make it good but at least you could count on it
nocturne spindle
it would have to be some sort of jank solo target only spell
or else it would be useless
and if it wasnt useless
it would be OP
solid sun
Throw up a weakaura to track it so you can use your defensives around it idk
solid sun
True we probably shouldn’t have any defensives because they require you to know when you’re gonna get an owwie
Hey @frosty mango I know priest and Druid have spells they can use on me as an external like pain supp and whatever the Druid one is
But what about rsham and mw?
wet osprey
do you guys macro avatar with anything?
dusky canopy
Surely the datamined changes will be accompanied by blue post
small steeple
Surely the datamined changes will be accompanied by blue post
what datamine changes?
solid sun
“Hey prot warriors we have been listening to your feedback and we hear you. So we have decided to rename spell breaker to spell block”
dusky canopy
Not sure just seen it briefly mentioned in another channel
small steeple
cant find it on wowhead
frigid valley
But what about rsham and mw?
earth shield "Lol" , and cocoon
strong forum
rsham doesnt have an external
so nothing to track there
they increase max HP a ton tho, give you skyfury and instead can just heal a lot on demand
cerulean tusk
Stoneskin totem?
strong forum
stoneskin is personal
cerulean tusk
It is a totem no? Or is that PvP only
strong forum
or do you mean the other stone totem the one that absorbs like 30k per dmg instance
cerulean tusk
I will find someone
strong forum
and competes with a good talent instead
nocturne spindle
ya know
instead of a BTM
we shold have BTT
break the talents, all shit ones
the worst build you can make
dusky canopy
UDK making it is something else
urban bane
didnt they remove it after consideration?
strong forum
btm is just as as arbitrary as the actual meta
ban the top 2/3 specs
even if its like less than 5% participation for the 2nd highest
solid sun
I’m just thinking about when I make an oopsie on a boss like momma or dailcry and need an external for a buster or heavy bleed. Doesn’t sound like rsham has an answer for that except more heals
strong forum
correct
urban bane
A single instance of it in the top 200 = ban?
dusky canopy
Kek
solid sun
Probably deserves it
urban bane
sounds like throwing out the baby with the bathwater
dusky canopy
Imaging banning BRM from btm
urban bane
cutting off your nose to spite your face
urban bane
There are a lot of ways people can define meta. It sounds like your conception of it is pretty exclusive
cerulean tusk
That would make me even happier
viscid star
so I'm just picking the class up and I have a question, is just my feeling or does the warrior have way more keybinds than other tank classes?
urban bane
Arguably if things are well balanced your conception of it would lead to very few eligible specs
dusky canopy
so I'm just picking the class up and I have a question, is just my feeling or do...
Rotationally like 5 buttons but it has a ton of “extra binds” yes
frosty mango
But what about rsham and mw?
Rsham has spirit link and monk has life cocoon
nocturne spindle
probably only h priest andddd
strong forum
spirit link is a fake external
link can actually kill the tank
or the tank can get killed between spirit link ticks aswell
real fun
viscid star
Rotationally like 5 buttons but it has a ton of “extra binds” yes
alright thanks that was my first thought but I was just checking in
frosty mango
I don’t cast it and it stops me from dying, or kills me outright, depending
cerulean tusk
so I'm just picking the class up and I have a question, is just my feeling or do...
Not really, and you can combine quite a few. But we sit as most with around 25-30 buttons. Combine things like Charge and Hamstring, Heroic Throw and Pummel, and you reduce things quite efficiently.
storm stone
Is Yoda worth listening to on prot warrior stuff? I saw his video on the prot warrior talents a month ago that seemed interesting
solid sun
lol
cerulean tusk
Yes and no, he isnt always right, isnt always wrong. He usually (from what I seen and heard) come with statements that is 'true', but only half truths based on lack of overall knowledge of the situation.
I am sure this time around he gotta be closer to the real deal tho, for sure.
storm stone
So is disrupting shout not worth picking up for example?
Cuz he strongly recommended it
cerulean tusk
Disrupting is awesome in many scenarios
solid sun
Everything I’ve learned about prot warrior, I’ve learned right here.
cerulean tusk
So that is why you are greylogging and using the 1button rotation
solid sun
There isn’t a YouTube video that has taught me anything about pwar. Not even one
And if I watched a video and got info that was contrary to what is said here I’d ask here about it lol
cerulean tusk
So is disrupting shout not worth picking up for example?
Best thing you could do, is just check the wowhead guide and feel free to watch Yoda. When something seems odd or information crash - come in here and ask about it
solid sun
Yoda is a talented player, so you can pick up some things from him like maybe how he gathers things up or how he routes. It isn’t a 1:1 because he plays with equally talented players that we don’t necessarily have access to
But if I were to want to learn pwar specifically I’d go with the cat’s Strat of wowhead guide and here
jade hazel
Tbh when I’m trying to learn I go to twitch and find a player I think is kind of same skill and watch them lol even if they have like 5 viewers
After reading wowhead and discords ofc
jade hazel
Usually not
cerulean tusk
Would make Asmon a WoW god
solid sun
Is he not
jade hazel
Banshers and Noxiv deserve more views
stiff gate
So is disrupting shout not worth picking up for example?
i think not taking disrupting is pretty troll in many dungeons. The point you pick up by not taking it is a few % damage, whereas having an aoe kick frequently saves a run or reduces pressure on your dps to kick perfectly in dungeons like priory, the first pull of workshop, some pulls in motherlode, etc. I basically never take it off, even if worst case scenario its just a long-cd backup kick. I don't think I've depleted a single key this season to "our tank didn't do 3% more damage" but I've depleted MANY keys to "we didn't have any kicks/stops left and a cast killed someone."
storm stone
i think not taking disrupting is pretty troll in many dungeons. The point you pi...
I’ve just been using the recommended m+ build on wowhead so I dunno. I really only dabbled warrior to 2500 last season before healing this season
Thanks for the information though
wet osprey
im coming from fury and prot has too many damn buttons
frosty mango
link can actually *kill* the tank
My favorite is when there’s a tank frontal like workshop first boss and the sham links and you hit everyone with it
And they live but you die
I’m not saying I had that happen
Not saying I didn’t
stiff gate
you can look at the top warriors on raider io and see how many of them take disrupting. its not a perfect indicator of the best talents in every scenario, but when you see every warrior in the top 10 running it in virtually every key its safe to assume its a very strong talent
storm stone
Well I’m glad I asked cuz I thought it looked good when I was learning the talents to
dusky canopy
It’s very beneficial to understand why people use the talents they use
So ask away in here someone should chime in 24/7
stiff gate
yeah, i think the other point you commonly see top warriors drop that isn't recommended in the guides (last i looked) was trading ravager for thunderlord, which is again a fairly substantial dps loss but some keys you just need the demo shout uptime when youre tanking an 18 and you know you're a fallible human who might not perfectly rotate cds for some of the crazier pulls in floodgate or priory or something
sharp gale
im coming from fury and prot has too many damn buttons
It’s the off GCDs most likely
You have less different button on prot main GCD rotation (revenge-thunderclap-shieldslam) than fury (bt-rb-rampage-ww-execute)
So it may be what keybind you chose to put off gcd so that can be weird on the fingers, since it is button you press between GCDs
(Shield block and Ignore pain)
nocturne spindle
i also cant think of a dungeon where a clutch disruption should wouldnt literally save the dungeon
in a perfect world theres enough stops to manage in like, ToP without it
but its still great
wet osprey
Thanks 100k
nocturne spindle
and its also an amazing grouping tool
since if you line it up all the casters group up
wet osprey
also how much haste/crit is a good %% to have? any specific thresholds?
hidden kindle
looking at some crafting options, how would we feel about a trade like this?
+55 haste
+236 vers
+931 crit
-1207 mastery
-30 str
-296 stam
-121 armor
thinking for +20 keys - I have the mastery heavy boots (684) but thinking about swapping to 684 cloak and using crafted boots to get rid of the mastery in favor of better stats, but since boots are higher stat budget than cloak I would lose some stats overall for this 🤔
nocturne spindle
i mean if your breaking into 20s
theres only like 15 people doing them on war
you might be better off asking directly
frosty mango
Disrupting is really only necessary in like three keys imo - floodgate, priory, rookery
frosty mango
The tradeoff is usually show of force which is relatively strong for dps but having an aoe silence while not being clutch for key saving probably enables more overall dps than show of force because of how strong it is for gather
hidden kindle
i mean if your breaking into 20s
yeah im resi 19 but the question was more theoritical relating to how much we value the stats rather than exactly for some specific key I guess
frigid valley
Disrupting is really only *necessary* in like three keys imo - floodgate, priory...
for me its a "better to have and not need than need and not have"
frosty mango
its criminal to not have it in DFC for some of those gather groups
Dfc is big Los vibes tho
frosty mango
for me its a "better to have and not need than need and not have"
Fair mindset - I play show of force on like sub 14 and disrupt above
Because I don’t care if casters freecast on sub 14 and I don’t wanna be chasing casters on upper level keys
naive panther
Disrupting is insanely good first pull of workshop. Can pull entire thing, do some individual kicks, then shockwave to get them to cast at once, then pop disrupting, then never have to deal with a kick again,
frigid valley
where the fuck is my patchnotes
mellow bridge
later
strong forum
around 10ish?
jagged pier
imma guess in around 4 hours time
cause they usually come around the end of raid time
frosty mango
Disrupting is insanely good first pull of workshop. Can pull entire thing, do s...
Or conversely if it’s like a 12, you can pull it all, do a bunch of dps with show of force, shield wall if bombs are gonna go off then solo the pack while you dance on those non-kicking dps corpses
How else will they learn?
mighty valley
i miss the first pull from last time it was in rotation
tank says "stay, doing solo strat"
runs in
dies offscreen
quits key
mighty valley
the rockets used to hurt enemies too
and it wasn't that threatening to a solo tank so long as you didn't get hit by them yourself lol
naive panther
Lol yes youd be the only one alive. But definitely could beat them in dps over the dungeon if you pull "right."
mellow bridge
solo all the bombs going off??
both the swirlies and the hammers did damage to everything standing in them, including the mobs themselves
so you'd just send the tank in alone, they'd tank all the explosions going off with a defensive and solo the pack via swirlies/hammers
jagged pier
some good shit in there
u know why its good, cause tanks wouldnt be able to tank it otherwise, with the changes
patent osprey
mellow bridge
i wonder where bubbles it at now
jagged pier
doesnt matter what the dungeon changes are, as ive said many times if they dont nerf FbV i would be suprised like seriously suprised
frigid valley
bubbles in dawnbreaker on boat
jagged pier
our dps already bad anyways thanks to them nuking revenge from orbit