protection

[nocturne spindle]

i didnt see that

[jagged gust]

also yeah like Fancy Z said, this is MT right?

[sick sentinel]

Mhm. MT.

[keen leaf]

pick up booming voice and I think ur fine

[sick sentinel]

okay. will do ty (:

[drifting hull]

So, where do people stand on Intervene?

[chilly brook]

it's good when it's good

[keen leaf]

I use it in raid, not in keys

[chilly brook]

bad when it's not

[nocturne spindle]

its mid unless it breaks a mechanic

[chilly brook]

great in NW

couldn't tell you where else it's good lol

[keen leaf]

so dead in 21 hours

[pallid quiver]

It's extremely nice when transmog farming when your mage friend blinks ahead of you for you to regain ground on them

[nocturne spindle]

i mean itll probably break something in the new pool

[chilly brook]

idk if it's dead

[nocturne spindle]

and itll be good for that dungeon

[pallid quiver]

It's also neat with the shield talent Thane gives it

[chilly brook]

just saying I couldn't tell you where else

[keen leaf]

it was a joke, pls dont yell at me im sensitive

[pallid quiver]

Since, although the shield is real small, you can apply a lot of them over the course of a dungeon

[drifting hull]

I was really hoping that the MT upgrade would make it better, but the SS is just stupid small.

[urban bane]

Intervene good on the fixate add boss in Motherlode.

[late temple]

i think i used it only on NW when the first boss spits

[nocturne spindle]

i swap it out for fastfootwork if its not specifically used for something in a dungeon

[keen leaf]

the MT intervene upgrade is just insulting

[nocturne spindle]

more zoom zoom

[urban bane]

the kobolds on first boss in darkflame also fixate, intervene helpful

[drifting hull]

Does it force blightbone to target you?

[jagged gust]

during his frontal yeah you intercept the hit

[drifting hull]

I take it still, weather or not I use intervene, because the SB alt is reeeeally not great either

[pallid quiver]

assuming the player you intervene doesn't lose their shit and run seven miles away

[keen leaf]

I mean yea, if I take intervene I take it

[drifting hull]

That is actually really useful. I wish I would have known before the last day of the season

[mighty valley]

it adds up if you use intervene on cooldown, it ain't nothing

[drifting hull]

So do you take the AoE SB if you don't take intervene then? I hate the increased cd.

[nocturne spindle]

no you just have a red talent

sb cd is ass

[mighty valley]

aoe storm bolt just puts cc dr in places i don't want it usually tbh

[drifting hull]

Yep yep alright glad I'm not the only one

[jagged gust]

https://tenor.com/view/run-running-away-indian-native-gif-7291311

Me chasing after them, indigenously

[pallid quiver]

damn it's been a while since I've seen that gif

Made me chuckle

[jagged gust]

discord is seriously lacking in indigenous gifs sadly

[round cliff]

get ur own then

[jagged gust]

I'm too lazy fok

[chilly brook]

it was definitely useful, they didn't even need to pop a defensive

[lusty tiger]

So pwar avoided nerfs?

[round cliff]

they're coming

be patient

[jagged gust]

https://tenor.com/view/homer-homer-simpson-simpsons-worst-day-of-your-life-so-far-bart-gif-11689059539835963602

[drifting hull]

Plsno

[pallid quiver]

If we get nerfed, Blizz just hates Warrior

[round cliff]

they do!

[pallid quiver]

We're not even like overpowered or anything. Other tanks deal similar damage to us (except Brew)

[chilly brook]

everyone is bad

they just don't press buttons so they flip out when warriors do

[agile elbow]

Last minute tuning today was BM nerfs anyway.

[oak ivy]

Anybody got a good way to watch RWL

[chilly brook]

those are old

they're just being implemented today

announced last week

[nocturne spindle]

RWF you mean?

like besides their twitch stream?

[oak ivy]

nope, RWL

[drifting hull]

Nah Race to World Last Queen

[jagged pier]

still twitch

u just have to prey the guilds are streaming

just search race to world last or queen prog

[oak ivy]

I'm a LiquidGuild/Maximum watcher for RWF

o7

[nocturne spindle]

oh right i forgot the rwl is a thing

[pallid quiver]

just use wow as a distribution platform for spyware that lets you view client screens, so you can watch every player at your leisure, no matter if they're streaming or not

[oak ivy]

Oh actually hugebrain, gotta get on that

[jagged gust]

https://www.reddit.com/r/CompetitiveWoW/comments/1j28mrh/race_to_world_last_nerubar_palace_and_season_one/

There's a reddit post for people to share their streams

not sure if anyone's currently running but good place to keep an eye for it

[strong forum]

Thane is extremely competetive on ST with colossus and has the stronger execute

But also, nobody knows how gallywix actually plays

It's just placeholder for now

[jagged pier]

rumor is theres a hidden boss

[pallid quiver]

My prediction is that he's going to hit the tanks at least once

[strong forum]

Checks out

[jagged pier]

even worse

[jagged gust]

#protection message You never know

[pallid quiver]

huh

I guess the Jailer's machinations were beyond my understanding

[dusky canopy]

Honestly a hidden 9th boss would go hard

I hope they do that!

Imagine the RWF reacts

[atomic basalt]

I just lost 50k gambling

Am i cooked

I made 10k back in a duel against enchantment shaman

Crit em for 3mil

[jagged gust]

Elvui doesn't display any text on notification boxes, I accidentally blew a couple hundred thousand buying a bag slot for my warband the other week

We're all cooked down here

[atomic basalt]

Holy

Dayum man

I'd smash my shit so hard

[pallid quiver]

i haven't experienced this

[jagged gust]

Weird, wonder what's causing it on my side

[oak ivy]

How dogshit troll is being a Haste/Vers prefer-er over Haste/Crit if I'm just aiming for like 12's and CE

[sudden lynx]

Yo does anyone remember at which level of haste ITF becomes better than HR? I've been looking but I can't remember where I read it first

[sudden lynx]

Just don't tell anyone don't even worry about it

[jagged gust]

DPS wise it's a sub 1% decision

[oak ivy]

oh sick. I imagine vers is actually less tanky than crit in M+ but more in raid?

[small steeple]

So the first 5 bosses are col because they aren't pure single target?

[atomic basalt]

Has anyone tried pve trinks in pvp yet

Any damage ones

[jagged gust]

Parry is indeed stronger in m+ due to more white hits, but it's all relative. You're usually talking a 1-2% DR diff with vers vs a similar diff in parry

Secondaries besides haste are all quite close in the end, both defensively and offensively. WWhich is why we always say sim for DPS because then you have something consistent to base your choices on

[lusty tiger]

Ya but who doesn’t love a big crit shield slam

[small steeple]

I saw a 5m SS crit last night. Juicy

[atomic basalt]

With prot?

Daam wtf

Bigeest i done with prot was 3.4

[small steeple]

I had spear, avatar, and demo shout all up

[atomic basalt]

Hooly dayum

Was it demolish?

[small steeple]

oh and the demolish debuff too

[atomic basalt]

Whats ur max shield slam crit cuh

Mines like 2mil

[nocturne spindle]

its so funny seeing SS and revenge hit for the millions

and then execute tickling

[small steeple]

The 5m was my highest SS crit I've seen

[neon elk]

U need to align like 4 things tho

[drifting hull]

Does MT run both spear and shout still?

[atomic basalt]

Revenge is not good

Slam is better

It does waaay waaay much

[nocturne spindle]

fuck slam

whirlwind for lyfe

[atomic basalt]

💀💀💀

[drifting hull]

Colossus Revenge is nuts my dude

[jagged gust]

even colo runs spear now, roar is falling behind

[atomic basalt]

Yeee idk revenge is balls imo, its not even hitting properly bruh

[jagged gust]

but it's very close

[atomic basalt]

Slam is giga

Its like idk 517k damage in pvp

Without anything

Doesn't even need talents points to be good

🤪🤪🤪

[pallid quiver]

I'd like to direct you to another channel

[covert helm]

#pvp

[pallid quiver]

since every time I've seen you, you've been talking about pvp

[drifting hull]

O damn, I'm behind the times then

[small steeple]

I also had a 10m demolish last night I think

[late rock]

10m normal hit is kinda wild

[small steeple]

same key I had a 5m ss

[atomic basalt]

Zamn

Whaaat the fuck

Are u crit?

What's ur exp in arenas

[small steeple]

Haste. Then i got roughly the same crit/mastery because of the ring. I got 0 pvp xp lol

[atomic basalt]

Bruh

[small steeple]

A different key for demolish

roughly the same ss

[drifting hull]

9m max for demo non crit is crazy

[neon elk]

With spear, do i use it before or after demolish?

[small steeple]

look 2 up, I showed a 10m

[atomic basalt]

Yall talking about pvp or pve

[drifting hull]

Before. I don't think after does anything

[pallid quiver]

this is a pve channel

[drifting hull]

This channel is exclusively pve.

[atomic basalt]

Aah dam

[pallid quiver]

Hence why I directed you to PvP earlier

[small steeple]

https://discord.com/channels/148872210742771712/897055819475091456

[drifting hull]

#pvp for all pvp talk

[lofty warren]

How much more dps does pwar do in m+ compared to other tenks?

[atomic basalt]

I thought u were critting 10mil ij pvp dam

[drifting hull]

I dunno why you would be running Prot in pvp though...

[small steeple]

Not really. kinda the same as vdh/ppal. Roughly equal

[neon elk]

Colo increase your dmg based on stacks , hence stronger spear, thats why im asking whats better

[lofty warren]

I asked how much more

[lofty warren]

Ur saying that it doesn't do more than other tanks?

[small steeple]

opener

[small steeple]

not compared to vdh or ppal, or at least for people who can pilot them well

[lofty warren]

How much more squishy is pwar compared to others m+?

[small steeple]

Not at all

[jagged gust]

It's pwar, we're brick walls

[neon elk]

It would say average pwar is waaay tankier than average ppal/vdh

[small steeple]

@drifting hull

Opener you spear first

[small steeple]

@drifting hull normal rotation you demolish first,

assuming pure single target

[neon elk]

So if u have no stacks u go spear first if u have stacks u go demo first

[small steeple]

Seems so

[nocturne spindle]

you spear as you charge in theory once you get rid of ravager anyway

[oak ivy]

Anybody got that chart of tank sims all together

[drifting hull]

Makes sense. I was assuming that the crit boost was more worth for a larger demolish hit.

[lofty warren]

Thiss

[small steeple]

Not gonna be accurate

Vdh apl is super out of date

and I couldn't tell ya about others

pwar apl is good

[drifting hull]

This. Spirit bomb is a really fucky thing to sim accurately, so they are still doing a lot of discovery on target counts and rotation

[small steeple]

If you've looked at the current vdh apl, its fucking cursed. 200+ lines and it looks like it was made by an ai

[jagged gust]

200 lines?!

whyy

[smoky anvil]

Y’all are spearing instead of bleedy bois?

[small steeple]

no clue

[nocturne spindle]

when are we adding the shield wall on CD for avatar damage buff to the pwar sim

:p

[drifting hull]

Looooool I have not gotten too far into the weeds, but I don't doubt it. Theres a lot of builds and complexity bc soul shards are actual entities. It's a pain in the ass.

[small steeple]

It's more complex than it needs to be

[lofty warren]

Is pwar really the highest damage and most tanky m+ tank s2?

[small steeple]

No and No. You literally just asked this

Its pwar so defensively its a brick wall

And it does roughly equivalent damage to vdh and ppal

[jagged gust]

Yeah like I can write hello world in brainfuck, doesn't mean it was an efficient way of doing so

[smoky anvil]

I was scared with the rage changes, but colossus is big fun. Looking forward to actually being able to key on Tuesday.

[small steeple]

Not as complex as in malbolge though

[formal geyser]

Let’s go no nerfs!

[jagged gust]

it uh, already is

[nocturne spindle]

lmao do they actually sim it?

[drifting hull]

Do the tierset procs of SB grant avatar as well? Or is it on casts only?

[lofty warren]

Haven't tried collossas is the rage starvation bad in m+?

[small steeple]

nope

[jagged gust]

I spec into Overwhelming Rage, it's fantastic

you get a bigger rage pool which means fewer empty GCDs during bad rng tactician procs

or w/e the prot version of tactician is called I never remember

[small steeple]

strategist?

[jagged gust]

yeah that sounds right, SS reset talent

[small steeple]

We got 2 of those

[lofty warren]

What uptime do you have in m+ collossass on avatar/shield wall?

[gaunt pewter]

i don't understand this macro for prot => Casts Shield Slam if it resets when you want to press Ignore Pain. Replace your Ignore Pain with this, not Shield Slam.

someone can explain me ?

[small steeple]

No

yeah seems weird

[jagged gust]

in case SS resets, since IP is off GCD it'll spell queue SS

so you dont wind up accidentally sending a revenge or TC and wasting a potential strategist proc

[small steeple]

Does anyone actually use it though? I just see SS I hit SS

[jagged gust]

you lose nothing for using the macro

[nocturne spindle]

slightly faster SS instead of human reaction timing sometimes

das all

[jagged gust]

think of it as occasional CDR

[urban bane]

good uptime

🙂

[jagged gust]

Nome was saying he was getting somewhere between 30-40% SW uptime, and judging from S1 Avatar as colo had slightly higher but similar numbers. My ST sims are showing 64/30% respectively

[lusty tiger]

Is shield block uptime still basically permanent and send off CD

[jagged gust]

we have mongo SB uptime with the tier set

perm uptime should be relatively easy even with lower haste

[lusty tiger]

What if I have no tier

Maybe I can max out my catalysts charges tonight lol

[neon elk]

Its s2 that allows us to mantain it more

[lusty tiger]

Ohh

Sorry it’s been a while for me, what gives the increased uptime?

In s2

Outburst and shield charge give uptime already right

[drifting hull]

The 2pc tierset gives shield wall

4pc gives shield charge, which gives shield block

[lusty tiger]

Ohhh yeah

Ok gotcha

[gaunt pewter]

i'm learning prot colossus, there is gcd i cast nothing on dummy, it's normal ?

[drifting hull]

If you get unlucky, yep

[lusty tiger]

Are you spamming ignore pain too much?

[gaunt pewter]

no, maybe dummy tank isn't enough to have a correct rotation ?

[lusty tiger]

You don’t want to be out of rage with ss down. If ss is down you want to have enough rage for at least 2 revenge casts

Also could be unlucky

I haven’t played colossus yet

[nocturne spindle]

single target every once in a while

multi target probably shouldnt happen

[maiden forge]

question, anyone know from the ptr if the tier set procs of shield wall give avatar with Immovable Object?

[small steeple]

it does not

they made all the tsets boring and interact with nothing

[maiden forge]

oki, just was wondering

[inner forge]

I feel like the rage generation is really shit right now, Is that the case?

[mighty valley]

it's lower than it was on purpose but you should still be able to press something every gcd

[gaunt pewter]

On colossus ST, the priority if revenge > TC or TC (on cooldown) > revenge ?

[placid frigate]

Tanking wise in general how hard does the new raid look compared to Nerubar?

[drifting hull]

Not 100% sure, but I believe TC is lower in prio than revenge unless rend needs to be refreshed, or you need rage. With that being said, for ST col, you need every scrap of rage, so it might be higher prio

[drifting hull]

From what I have seen, should be really straightforward in terms of tanking. Don't have info on Gally obviously, but there shouldn't be much in the way of surprises for the rest of the raid.

[covert helm]

Yeah, ofc the damage intake might be crazy high but in fairness it's prot warrior - there won't be any insane tech you need to do

And if the adventure guide is anything to go by, I genuinely doubt anything except like Rik Reverb week 1 and Gally will hurt

Rik might be nasty as it's full magic, and typically endbosses hurt a bit (and Gally has a lot of different tankbusters in the journal in just p3 alone so might be intense in that sense)

[jade trench]

Is there a reason you need that reserve of rage?

[drifting hull]

I think the idea is that you can revenge if SS is down to fish for an SS reset.

[jade trench]

Ahh ok so spending when SS is down then takes priority. Makes sense

[drifting hull]

All this is assuming SB is rolling. I don't think there's ever a situation where you don't have SB rolling, and refreshing it isn't highest prio, be it through SC or a normal cast.

[jade trench]

Yea but I'm one of these nubs who have SB macrod after SS. So if it's available it's down.

[neon elk]

Thats a bad macro, dont use it

[drifting hull]

This next season that isn't enough to guarantee uptime (on Colossus anyway; not played with MT yet, so can't comment). You will need to cast SC on CD to ensure uptime, and to take full advantage of the 4pc bonus

[formal geyser]

Do other tank classes do as much DPS as us?

[sudden lynx]

I'm pretty sure you can just skip all SB uptime talents by just having the 4-piece no?

[sudden lynx]

Yeah

[formal geyser]

Cuz I haven’t seen it since the patch

[sudden lynx]

Pally and DH are kinda similar I think

[formal geyser]

I out DPS some DPS in overall damage in +13-15

It’s pretty damn funny

[pallid quiver]

welcome to finding out that people don't press buttons

[formal geyser]

They were doing 1.5m

Overall

[pallid quiver]

yeah

so they're not pressing buttons

[formal geyser]

We still timed it 🤷‍♂️

But I haven’t seen any tank come close to colo warrior tank dos

Dps

[naive panther]

yeah, a good dps you'd be lucky to do 75% of their damage. But lots of dps doing sub 1.5m problem is them.

DH can hit 1.5 if speccing for damge, bdk can get close as well

[formal geyser]

I was very close to 2mil dps lol

[naive panther]

did you have top dps person close to 3m?

[formal geyser]

He was doing 2.3m

Ele sham

But colo prot is soo much fun right now lol

I hope they don’t nerf us

[daring narwhal]

should be safe for at least just after rwf

[lofty warren]

What uptime do you have in m+ collossass on avatar/shield wall? There's a talent that gives both when one pressed

[round cliff]

whats the quickest way to get to darkmoon from dornogal

do i still gotta go to the mage in org

[wheat bronze]

Get 3 people to summon you

[gaunt pewter]

hey ! i'm learning tank, should i replace SS for Revenge in the opener aoe ?

[pallid quiver]

Your standard opener with everything available usually won't even have SS, TC, or Revenge for a while, since you need to get your CDs on CD,

[round cliff]

wat

no

[pallid quiver]

but that's entirely ignoring the whole gathering aspect of packs

[round cliff]

ur pack gathering should be handled by ur cds too

roar is huge and shield charge is yuge

[pallid quiver]

you drop those once things are gathered; you gather by ramming your face into packs with charge/leaping near packs with leap/throwing shit at them

And get some aggro on the way with SS/TC/etc as you run by until they're gathered

[round cliff]

tbh i just charge in and clap to stall for time if its a very loose pack

gotta apply rend anyways

[pallid quiver]

Also, once you're settled, SS will still be higher prio than revenge in AOE because it gives you rage to work with and does a non-zero amount of damage, especially on outbursts

[waxen frigate]

🤨

[pallid quiver]

ravager will carry most of your like, standard opener sequence

But like I followed up, there's a lot of things that go into scenarios where you're starting an AOE pull

It's not very common that you have all CDs, going into a single, static group that you're starting on

Even Council fights in raid aren't even always straight stacked

[glacial grove]

Who on earth still skills ravager?

[pallid quiver]

everyone before tier set comes out in full

as long as you're not grabbing bsv or doing something wild

[glacial grove]

bsv 4ever

[pallid quiver]

i'll, uh, see you later, then, on the meters, or complaining about aggro
It's a fine point, but a lot of people over-value it. It's also optimally never the correct pick, since it's never needed; it does end up being a good safety net at the cost of optimization. It's like a cost-benefit analysis of whether you want to perform the best or ensure things work

[urban bane]

oh lord the bsvers are here

if only they knew they were battle-scarred because they talented into that

[glacial grove]

sth a rookies says, who isnt a veteran 😛

[pallid quiver]

i mean you can literally ask nome that

[mighty valley]

what if you're a veteran who's got no scars because you're too good

[glacial grove]

no veteran ever comes out without a fucking scar 😮

[glacial grove]

At the end, for 98% of people here it doesnt matter what you skill. But thats just imo.

[pallid quiver]

honestly, with like medieval era stuff, there'd probably be more people around that you see without scars because if you had scars, you were generally seen as filthy and unclean.

that and the whole infection killing you thing.

Though maybe the illness scars

[pallid quiver]

you can clear even high keys with any random build, without any thought

[glacial grove]

Exactly!!!

[pallid quiver]

The tree is built well enough that you are physicially required to take enough good talents that you'll survive

The problem is that your point of view is focused on justifying and glorifying yourself by making statements like that

BSV and Ravager are both valid picks, and solve issues

[glacial grove]

But we are playing WoW. Nothing that a bit of magic cant repair

[pallid quiver]

As well as battering ram when tier drops

[urban bane]

You can ultimately do what you wish. And I will be free to think people taking that talent outside of world first keys are quite silly :)

[pallid quiver]

It's technically not even needed in world first keys from what I remember seeing. It just helps act as a safety net like I mentioned so that you can focus more on the sheer nonsense that goes on in their pulls. Nothing literally mathematically required to have it.

[urban bane]

Case in point!

[mighty valley]

if you were trying to win the world record for best time in highest key, you probably wouldn't take it and just keep trying for a run with zero mistakes

but no one's doing that so

do whatever

[pallid quiver]

^^^

[glacial grove]

Alright. Lets keep the fire burning and throw in some oil.

Roar or Spear ?

[pallid quiver]

I don't think there's a culture around playing literally as optimally as possible in top end keys

probably because fuck that, so much time waste

[pallid quiver]

literally whatever going into S2

They've been close enough, and they'll continue to be close enough

Spear will probably win in sheer damage terms for both hero specs eventually, but it is not enough of a difference to fuss over

as long as you have at least one of them talented instead of, like,

dropping points into earlier gates for honed reflexes or something

[glacial grove]

Nah, i mostly drop avatar for immunity. So all good.

[pastel sleet]

95% of my playtime is spent as prot in keys. However, im going to be maining Arms in raid.

Would you craft a shield tomorrow? Or hold off til week 3 to craft a 2h? OR do i caft a non wep that usable in both specs?

We will be raiding mythic later in the season but not next week.

What are yalls thoughts?

[jagged gust]

I prio my raid DPS over m+ performance personally

so option 3 is my go to

3 weeks is 9 chances at a 2h in vault anyways

[pastel sleet]

I guess thats big true, if it comes up i could quick swap to crafting 1h,shield

[glacial grove]

When you are raiding and 19 other people think you focus on doing dmg and play arms, then go for a weapon. If its more of a casual thing and you have like two days of raiding go for a shield. Thats my take.

And this time im not trolling 😛

[pastel sleet]

Do both shield and 1h need to be crafted to free upgrade a m2h?

[covert helm]

yep

[sharp gale]

Gear yourself towards arms if you talk about myth raid, you don’t need max ilvl crafted shield to tank 10s

[mighty valley]

Either way I wouldn’t craft week 1 if you’re optimizing, see what your first vault brings

[sharp gale]

Yeah that too 100%

You don’t need crafts to kill nm or hc raid

[strong forum]

yes

[sharp gale]

I wouldn’t take 99th percentile for 11.1 nerubar palace

[pulsar wedge]

anybody have anything regarding sims for all tanks this upcoming season?

[formal geyser]

I’m talking m+ @strong forum

[strong forum]

time will tell how out of line we are

but from what ive seen, paladin is incredibly close

and its pala so.

[neon elk]

I dont think we are that ahead, also i didnt see any sims but from look of it pala tier is way more dmg gain than ours

[strong forum]

our tier is pretty strong but ye

i did barely sim outside of ST

been very lazy

[neon elk]

Yea i forget to count in cdr on demolish it can provide, but still , that pala tier ..

[urban bane]

Wow paladin finally having its time in the sun. Good for them

[supple meadow]

Ha! That's a pun

time in the sun

Light abilities

[urban bane]

Indeed.

[supple meadow]

You made a funny Muse

[jagged gust]

Muse be musing

[small steeple]

Museless Mused that the Muses must be musing

[past torrent]

coming back after Rival'ing instead of playing, we're playing Col instead of Thane now?

for M+

Checked the pinned and didn't see "what you should be doing" so figured I'd ask

[small steeple]

both are viable and good

col does more damage

and is somewhat behind mt in defensive ness

not tons tho

[autumn fiber]

what do we think is the 2nd easiest dungeon in s2 pool? (darkflame cleft is 1st easiest)

[agile elbow]

Rookery

[small steeple]

yo momma

[autumn fiber]

that's what i said, my friend is dum and thinks it's theatre, like r u serious right neow?

[small steeple]

Depends on the tan

k

and party i think

like ToP is 100% blockable

so easy peasy for protwar

[past torrent]

that's what I was wondering, good info to have, thank you.

[primal lantern]

Hello, I'm a new prot warrior! I have a little question about shield block.

Should I Shield Block as soon as available (so always have the 2 stacks in cool down?) or rather when a tank buster arrives (for example on raid bosses). Regarding Ignore Pain, I know it's between 60 and 80 rage.

[pallid quiver]

Ultimately, your goal is to block 100% of blockable hits coming your way

However you need to manage SB to achieve that is what you do

In practice, this means you send it fairly frequently with the strong and many talents we have for assisting with SB uptime. In M+, it pretty much boils down to don't send it if it'll bring you low on rage or if the pack will die soon enough for you to waste duration

In raid, since you'll usually run a few less, it mostly means you might not press it as often while not actively tanking the boss to ensure you have full duration when it's your turn to tank again.

[vocal pewter]

Is there a talent where revenge is refreshing or adding to IP?

[pallid quiver]

You still want to keep SB up as much as possible even when not taking damage, as it increases SS damage

[pallid quiver]

All damage; it's brutal vit at the top right

[vocal pewter]

Thank you lol

[primal lantern]

Tyvm for these tips 🙏

[long bronze]

is overwheling rage in the colossus ST for any real reason other than it's a spare point?

[mighty valley]

in raid there's just nothing better to take

[oak ivy]

Rotate yo self up to level 80 and check the guide

[mighty valley]

delves are pretty good

each one has a first-time completion bonus

the rotation doesn't really change from 70 to 80 - you want to use offensive cooldowns when they're available, then fall back on the basic priority order of shield slam > thunderclap > revenge while keeping up shield block and spending excess rage on ignore pain

[shy python]

Did you test this lately? I took the point from Ravager and put it there and found that this greatly increases rage regen (more than it was on ptr). However it doesn't seem to proc out of combat which makes it difficult to test on dummies.

@strong forum

[onyx vessel]

Not worth it

[shy python]

Did you test it after ptr went live?

[onyx vessel]

Nope just why drop ravager our best on pull tool for a low chance at rage gen

Vs a cd that generates a massive amount of threat and rage

In season 1 I dropped bloodsurge for aoe silence cuz pugs don't kick anything

[shy python]

I woud not call 60 rage every 1.5 min "massive".

[onyx vessel]

Idk test it I doubt your gonna get much more then 60 rage every 1.5min from bloodsurge

More dmg is

[pallid quiver]

It gives less rage than instigate on like 4 targets or less, is roughly equal on 5, and doesn't beat it by much afterwards. So you're potting all of your rage eggs in doing mass pulls at all instances

[shy python]

Did you test it since ptr went live?

[pallid quiver]

The rage it gives might be more over the course of a dungeon or instance than ravager, but will give less in ST where you have more rage issues

This has all been constantly checked by Nome and likely Mwahi

so you can check in with the TCs

Bloodsurge got nudged more than a few times during the PTR cycle, so they had to keep adjusting

Since bloodsurge was pretty much always a go-to in its 11.0 state

it got slapped real hard being reduced to only deep wounds, but at least the proc rate is higher than it was

doesn't make up for the less instances to proc on

[shy python]

I'm testing right now (and did on ptr) and it procs way more often than on ptr last time.

[pallid quiver]

Did you check after the increase to the proc rate I mentioned riiiiight

[shy python]

Maybe not.

[pallid quiver]

since that was on PTR and should be what we have on live unless some blizz employee has gone rogue

It got nudged a lot during PTR, so I wouldn't blame you

It was at a point where it was just dead for a little bit

[onyx vessel]

I'd still drop it for aoe silence if it becomes a issue of lack of kicks

[pallid quiver]

think it gave less rage than instigate at like 9 targets or something

[shy python]

This happens some time.
All I can say right now is that as Colossus I can now spam Revenge AND IP without getting rage starved.

[onyx vessel]

Idk with new dungeons how badly we need more kicks maybe rookery

[pallid quiver]

The bigger issue is, again, the rage gen in ST

since it only procs on deep wounds

[onyx vessel]

I overcapped rage all day in s1

[pallid quiver]

The proc rate is higher, but the instances that roll for a proc is only deep wounds now

[onyx vessel]

[pallid quiver]

M+ isn't only AOE; if it was, bloodsurge would be better, since it's roughly equal at like 5 targets and gets better the more there is. The damage from ravager also gets better as well, but that's kinda tangential to the main issue

[shy python]

Sure but the deadly situations are big pulls in M+. Not so much bossfights

[onyx vessel]

Your going to get more rage early into a pull from the other talent along with ravager

Get unlucky get no rage no thanks

[pallid quiver]

The other issue is that big pulls aren't deadly enough, and you still can't sack on boss fights. You'll have less rage to funnel into anger management. It probably won't matter as much this season, since most of the CDR is just raw from picking double wall and SW's base CD being reduced, but rage gen in ST was important for keeping the overall flow of the spec going.

it also just did more damage

While more rage gen is more survival overall, it also helps to front-load rage in large pulls since the start of large pulls is generally where things go wrong

[onyx vessel]

Pulling huge hitting a fat demo

[pallid quiver]

Once you're settled in and have thing like punish rolling, and healer passive sources are going in, it's a lot easier to stay alive.

That's the benefit that Ravager brings to rage gen

that being said

[shy python]

I see.

[pallid quiver]

This is all pretty much invalidated once tier is achieved, since battering ram will be much higher value in like all situations than either Rav or Bloodsurge

[onyx vessel]

Just test it in live keys

Can't start slamming 10s right away

Or higher so it doesn't matter

Only get a 2

[pallid quiver]

If you want to run bloodsurge, it's not really like a bad talent or anything; we don't really have many of those, and you'll 100% still function. All of these talks are pretty minor in the grand scheme of things, so if you want to get rid of ravager, rush tier set feel free to grab bloodsurge. It'd mostly just be a damage loss

[onyx vessel]

If im pugging keys tomorrow I'm checking there gear for 4pc cuz there gonna be alot of fotm garbage

My guild put a lock on tier set and there's 8 people on my tier

[onyx vessel]

Do we get a free charge for making tier on reset?

[shy python]

Can Details show the rage generated by Bloodsurge?

[onyx vessel]

Yes

[shy python]

👍

[hot orbit]

Iyo what s the ideal ilvl for M0 and M2 ?

[remote anchor]

Ideal is 680

[hot orbit]

Cmooon 😆

[keen vine]

if you played in s1 im prety sure you can just jump into them

[hot orbit]

Prot warrior was my alt. 620 ilvl

[blazing condor]

U can do it

🙂

[idle copper]

Is there a trend of difficultly from previous seasons to the next season?

As in a +10 S1 would be the equivalent +?? In S2

[jagged pier]

12 is the new 10

yet u get max reward from 10 still

and ppl will be going them day 1 incurrent gear

[keen vine]

i doubt most people will be able to

[jagged pier]

i didnt say most

[keen vine]

true

[silent sparrow]

How big is the gap between thane and colossus for m+?

I'm not vibing with the switch to colossus

[jagged pier]

then dont

u stil might want to be thane for defensive purposes anyway

[silent sparrow]

Well yes, but I also don't want to grief my group if colossus is running a gap on dps while being just fine tank wise

[jagged pier]

u wont greif your group playing any spec in the game

if u dont like something dont play it. you arent greifing anyone and anyone telling u different is wrong

literally the only place class or spec matters is literally too the top .1% of players

[silent sparrow]

I feel you are being facetious, because yes yes bring the player not the game but please, you know what I mean

I'll just go to warcraftlogs, ty for your time

[keen vine]

if you wanna pug 10s (or 12s) i dont think you can grief your team, thane is still fine

[silent sparrow]

Alright looks like colossus absolutely dominates thane on dps in pre season

[idle copper]

Non of the DPS you'll be pugging with will be able to draw any distinction between you playing Thane or Colossus.

The DPS difference between you playing either won't make or break a key.

They are pretty close in defensives and again in their own right won't make any difference

What will make a difference will be how comfortable you are with either spec and how you get your big CDs to line up which tbh isn't generally a problem for PWarr

[karmic stream]

i just resubed the other day, i see ppl go both colosus and thange, so that means both are viable or does it make difference for low geared tank?

[neon elk]

As low ilvl i would go thane, slightly better rage managment

But u can try both maybe u are lucky and even your progresion gear has tons of haste

[karmic stream]

hmm okay i like thane more aswell, not sure why ppl go colossus but i see plenty ppl do

[karmic stream]

hope so thanks mate :)

[neon elk]

Colosus has bit more dmg ,and most ppl ( i guess) played MT in s1 so colo is a new fresh air , at least for me

[shy python]

You sure? 639 is enough for +10?

[hollow sphinx]

By far 😅

[supple warren]

Is there really a drop in APM? I have wrist problems and I couldn't play protection because of that

[shy python]

Colossus is a bit slower.

[fast oracle]

what's the haste breakpoint for into the fray to be worth it?

[vale escarp]

About 18k haste

[fast oracle]

I have 20k and it feels kind of shitty

[lofty warren]

Should I be pwar or vdh m+?

[onyx vessel]

Meta slave or

[lofty warren]

Meta slave

[fast oracle]

the shame

[lofty warren]

What's the correct meta slave pick?

[fast oracle]

vdh

[rigid edge]

Uninstalling

[supple warren]

Yes I know that, but I was wondering if there is a significant drop in APM with 11.1 (sorry for my english haha)

[vestal sierra]

doesnt that depend on the flavor of meta slave? if its dps arent we rippin'?

[shy python]

From Thane Prot to Colossus Prot yes, definitely.

[lucid gulch]

with which build are to starting next season? colussus or thane? colussus new meta?

or booth viable?

[oak ivy]

Does thane also play Immovable object or is that only colo

[hot orbit]

Col is so damn slow 😆

In solo... but i think in dungeon will be faster. More mobs = more rage. We ll see

[idle copper]

Both viable

[idle copper]

Guides are still saying Unstoppable force

[idle copper]

I tried it out and it has some awkward lulls but nothing that killed me

[mild river]

My friend tried colossus in some dungeons and after 3 keys he said "I'm afk tanking. Sometimes I have no button to press"

I loled the definition of afk tanking

[tribal wharf]

my pwar build is really meta bro, it melts

[pallid quiver]

i'd recommend them to press less ignore pain

[idle copper]

It's a shame they don't go with similar coefficient for the leech from Revenge as the do with VDH

[inner belfry]

Do you ever change to battle stance during M+?

[cerulean tusk]

You could do it for a very minor DPS gain, esp in lower keys where you are supersafe and dam taken doesn't matter at all

[urban bane]

every time i press demolish i try to stance dance

just as an example of how i do it

damage amps thing like that

[strong forum]

3% crit is 3% crit

[winged yew]

I am looking for a tank to play with friends in the key range 8-12. How does protection compare to other tanks like bear and ret (not playing s tier vdh)?

[neon elk]

First of all ret isnt even a tank spec

[vocal flame]

Noms prot guide says pick it anyway I think?

[neon elk]

Second in that key range all tanks are perfectly viable just pick whatever u like most

[lament forge]

every spec in the game is viable at least until 12s, these tier list creators make it seems like some specs are pure shit when this min max stuff only matters for 0.1% title type players

[winged yew]

Thanks

[winged yew]

Ment prot ofc

I am just looking for easy survival as tank

[lament forge]

as long as you keep active mitigation up and dont get hit in the back, youll be fine, prot is going to do well this season

[neon elk]

Also take them with grain of salt , saw petkos last tier list ( like 10tlast tiers.. ) first he put war at s because of dmg then he changed his mind and put him at a because we might get demo buff reverted, so 4-5% dmg is difference between A and S tier for him .. makes no sense to follow tierlists

[winged yew]

I am not really interested in those tier lists; I just want a tank who is “easy” and has high survivabilty. People always say prot is not as tanky, hence I’m here

[sharp gale]

Prot war remove a damage type from being an issue I don’t see how it’s not easy/ tanky, ofc surviving is not the only part

[neon elk]

Ppal has better utility and more kicks so i would say it can carry group bit easier , but war is way tankier ( imho) so it kinda depends on your group . U play with people that know how to kick and can press their buttons ? Go warr, if they are just mashing dps go pala but your performance will suffer the more utility u use

[lament forge]

prot war is easy enough as long as you dont rage starve yourself when you need it for IP and/or SB, 2 charges of shield wall is OP and prot war has a lot of CC

[neon elk]

Or u could also go bdk , where on those keys u most likely dont need healer at all, if u are like decent . Its more complex than war tho ( might be biased)

[sharp gale]

Just play Heavy Repercussion if you want to not worry about SB (I recommend if you start)

[winged yew]

Thanks! Makes senses!

[winged yew]

Never liked dk, so I’ll skip those

[unborn island]

Anyone clapped some 10s yet?

[toxic pewter]

lol

[jagged pier]

dont know how thats gunna have happened as servers arent supposed to be up for another 5 hours ish

[toxic pewter]

anyone got a tier list thhey can post i need SOMEONE TO TELL ME WHAT TO PLAY

IMMEDIATELY

[jagged pier]

spin the wheel

[mighty valley]

apb is in a tier, for apb

[toxic pewter]

XD

ANOTHER SEASON

[shut summit]

surv hunter

[toxic pewter]

ok that works thank you i will be REXXAR!!!!!!!!!!!

[jagged pier]

apb pretty much the same as apt

so play resto shammy

[toxic pewter]

lol

my fav healer

[jagged pier]

https://tenor.com/view/rose-apt-rose-blackpink-rose-mak-rose-apt-rose-gif-5948498849163160762

[toxic pewter]

lol wait ngl i dont know what apt is

is that a band

[jagged pier]

its rez totem

[toxic pewter]

listening to song now oh god

i know this song

lmao

[plush tendon]

its a really catchy song

like expresso

[heavy sparrow]

Wow wow wee wow

[jagged gust]

This song is a bop

[toxic pewter]

that my song

wow should let us have songs associated with our char when we enter an instance or area it plays

[jagged gust]

Like tinder?

[heavy sparrow]

Download Musician + Extended version of it

You can play 8 bit versions of songs

[toxic pewter]

interesting addon i will check it out thx didnt even know this existed lol

[heavy sparrow]

Other people can hear it too if they have a double cleft icon near their name

It's for RPers

[toxic pewter]

i mean apparently many peopl have met their partners in wow

actually kinda cool

[shy python]

Testet Bloodsurge a bit more. 2 cases. ST and 5 target AoE. Each 1.5 min fights (Ravager CD):

In ST Bloodsurge generated 10 more rage than 1 Ravager in the same time. 70 Rage = 3x Revenge which is roughly the dmg of one Ravager if not more (3x400k+ VS 1.1 mio)

In 5 target AoE Bloodsurge generated 75 more rage than 1 Ravager so BS does 2x and more the dmg of Ravager in the same time.

[urban portal]

Consider that ravager rage is more compressed

[toxic pewter]

how much rage does instigate generate

[urban portal]

And ravager is used with cds

And yeah consider instigate

It’s very good

[toxic pewter]

is battering ram auto attack speed with instigate better for rage than ravager

[urban portal]

Maybe

Need some testing

Since we have a lot of shield charge cdr now

[toxic pewter]

yeah I plan to use battering ram myselff prob

this season just makes too mcuh sense

not to take it

[mighty valley]

wait, counting all of the bloodsurge rage as revenge damage doesn't make sense

ravager does damage AND gives you rage, which you could spend on revenge

[mighty valley]

it definitely seems like the choice once we have tier set

[toxic pewter]

yeah with the instiagte buff its even better

love that instigate buff

i swear i feel the rage from it too

shit adds up

[jagged gust]

Instigate was already superior before the buff up to 2-3 targets

now BS nerf+instigate buff it's not even a competition

[toxic pewter]

interesting yep

plus instigate 10% dam buff to auto attacks not amazing but its more dam

[pallid quiver]

If I remember right, Yanthir's overall idea was having both Instigate and Bloodsurge due to them both giving more rage iver time than Rav

Which is true, but like the Tor boy said, Ravager's rage is compressed and very front loaded.

[toxic pewter]

damn never even considered getting both lmao interesting

is anyone doing that

what would drop for that though seems an expensive trade off

and difficult to even find a point to have both

[jagged gust]

It would only be somewhat clever until 4p

so like a week from now?

[static notch]

should i do colossus or thane for raid? is the damage diffrence big?

[mighty valley]

they're close in st

play what you like

[static notch]

aight tyy

[tribal wharf]

ah shit its not just wow thats down

also d2r and wc3, rip

[shy python]

Thats right Ravager gives rage on demand.
My point was to show that Bloodsurge is really good in rage gen right now.

The larger the pull the more rage. 5 targets is a really small pull normally

[urban portal]

No one said surge is bad

Just that opportunity cost is high

[shut summit]

i have debated dropping indom to run double rage talents, indom is fairly lackluster overall the only problem is that when it's good it's really good

was gona try on PTR but never got around to it, willl mess with it on live

[gaunt pewter]

Hey ! I m learning on mythic+, i m struggling to gather mob on opener, can you give me some tips, or youtube channel to check ?

[opaque bobcat]

Don't turn back to mobs, keep up shield block and IP at all times, and use shockwave advantageously, those are what I find to be important

[jagged gust]

Are you struggling with surviving or holding aggro?

[gaunt pewter]

Holding aggro/gather mobs on opener

[unborn island]

Which particular pulls are you talking about? Or just all pulls?

If you're doing lower keys there's a chance that you're playing fine and it is just DPS being idiots

[gaunt pewter]

I m talking about 3 différents packs fir example, i need to gather them and holding aggro in the first 5 sec

[opaque bobcat]

Thunder clap and a revenge or two you should be fine, you Thane or Colossus?

[jagged gust]

^

TC and revenge for the dot application should be more than enough until all the packs are congregated

[dusky canopy]

Man you know Prot is down when dropping the staple passive heal for more rage generation is a consideration

[chilly rover]

Question for my fellow prots: Does the GCD feel different since the patch? I know they slowed our rage gen but at 30% haste I feel like I'm suddenly waiting forever between abilities

[opaque bobcat]

Are you by chance like 600 and running with like....639 elly shamans and arms warriors?

[opaque bobcat]

I haven't noticed anything, personally

[jagged gust]

Did you swap from MT to colo? Colo feels slower in general due to the lower rage gen

[shut summit]

gathering multiple packs as colossus is unironically painful if your dps cant wait, tclap being 5secs is an eternity and revenge arc is tiny, so if they run in different directions it can suck

[jagged gust]

and fewer SS/TCs

[gaunt pewter]

I m not 600 ilvl but yes 639 elem sham ^^

[chilly rover]

Nope, still MT. Went and did a SoB last night to shake off the cobwebs for raid tonight and it just felt clunkier than normal

[dusky canopy]

They intentionally made changes to lower the apm it’s probably going to feel slower yeah

[opaque bobcat]

100% the reason I went thane. Colossus dps is SO fun, but anything past +6 I was struggling

[jagged gust]

Thane has such an easy time gathering

[chilly rover]

I thought it was just to our rage gen though. Weird. I'll have to do some testing during raid tonight to see if the timing is any different than before. Or it could just be me. Problem with playing warrior for so long you make a change to the flow and it breaks my brain lol

[shut summit]

ok well im not on board with that, i've done 15s on ptr as colossus and its more than fine, just haffta play around it / tell dps to wait a sec

dragon roar is huge for helping with initial threat

[opaque bobcat]

Ahh, I mostly pug, yeah I imagine with the tinest bit of coordination it would be fun. I usually just pug as an absolute wrecking ball and go 300mph

[dusky canopy]

This is the way

[jagged gust]

Pugs are gonna be pugs

[small steeple]

I havent noticed any issue doing 12s as col on my war

[opaque bobcat]

I think I just prioritize dps'ing as hard as I can so my rage is spent when I need it for IP and SB

Because fun

[small steeple]

Never drop below 30 rage

[opaque bobcat]

That leads me to be WAY better as thane

[neon elk]

U have roar and aoe taunt unless u have complete apes its mostly manageable

[small steeple]

I personally use spear but yeah

[opaque bobcat]

I are complete complete ape

[opaque bobcat]

I use spear also, I'm saying generally, spear and challenging shout are rather big cds when going balls to the wall. Those help me only in the short period's they do. Outside of that, I'm usually rage starved in Colossus. Maybe not starved, but not electrified like I am in thane lol

[small steeple]

Can you show your talents? You shouldn't be having rage problems. Or maybe your not using violent outburst on SS only like you should

[unborn island]

Yeah, it's pretty ass by comparison. I thought we had it hard compared to paladins before, it's worse now 🙂

[neon elk]

Just spam less ip as colo

[opaque bobcat]

I can when we get in yeah, I haven't used the spec in a while, went full thane. Enjoying it alot, but missing demolish, hence whining here

[small steeple]

@strong forum is there any raid boss this tier that you would recommend going execute build for? And thane execute is better in pure st than col execute yeah?

[dark lark]

Both one armed bandit and mugzee have major execute phases

There's a reason arms is going to see a lot of play this race

[small steeple]

Well that explains why he recommends thane for them. Is there any boss that just does such little tank damage that theres not point in going a punish build?

Well arms is also just strong too

[dark lark]

I doubt there's a definitive answer there yet

[south goblet]

ngl, i go punish builds for every prog boss. The extra dmg you get for not wont make or break a boss kill. Where as the extra tank you get in punish build could make or break a kill

[sharp gale]

^

[mighty valley]

on bosses where you're gonna be stuck a while, might as well play it safe while everyone's learning, help extend some pulls where healers struggle etc

then if it becomes clear after a bunch of pulls that your life is not in danger and dps matters, can easily switch

[sharp gale]

Yeah basically if it requires to really tank the boss, just play safe

[mighty valley]

on heroic? max dps all the way baby

[south goblet]

the tankyer you are > healers have to heal you less > Healers can heal dps more > dps can fk up more OR greed for dps more which will be a far greater dmg done increase over the tank doing 10% more dmg

[sharp gale]

You will reach the boss when every dps of your raid will have an % dmg buff and the bosses will be nerfed

Yeah heroic it’s just big dam

[small steeple]

When tanking in raid as pwar, do you keep shield block up even when not tanking? That increases SS damage right?

Ok so heroic just go execute build then?

[mighty valley]

you keep it up as much as you can while ensuring 100% uptime while actually being hit

sometimes that means you chill on it a bit

[small steeple]

Because I was wondering why enduring defensive is taken even with punish builds, with the shorter active tanking time

[south goblet]

it depends on shild block. If you will need the full duration you can possibly get when its your turn, then you dont want to get it up perma. If you are swapping every 30 secs. Then you can maintain it for dmg

[small steeple]

So like that uhh, 2 target arena boss, you have 100% tank time so ED then

[sharp gale]

Because shield block increase the damage of shield slam and it's safe

[south goblet]

its also the tankyest build you can realistic run without putting your dmg in the ground. Also what else would you take over enduring for a super safe tanky tank build? def not massacre

[nocturne spindle]

BSV

[small steeple]

nah thats a gate below it 😉

[small steeple]

Bolster

[south goblet]

lol sir, if BSV is makeing you tanlyer than enduring, your raid got problems

[small steeple]

'twas a joke, my good sir

[south goblet]

the only time i would take bolster over enduring would be if i needed to maintain shield block for like 2 min straight for some reason. overall enduring will be a better overall uptime gain

side note, has anyone actually been able to log into bnet?

[dusky canopy]

Try the .exe

[south goblet]

yea i did, i just get stuck in the authentication loop

[mighty valley]

there's an auth server problem, as usual

[small steeple]

Will the arms execute nerf hit us too? Or does arms have its own execute spellid right?

[south goblet]

arms has its own, but i sware i read somewhere that it was "bugged" and the nerf hit prot to

[small steeple]

uh @strong forum or @ionic fern do you know?

[urban portal]

arms uses the same spell id

Cc @south goblet

However they can change the damage of execute in a specific spec through auras

[dusky canopy]

I’m sure they would have added it to the updates if Prot was effected

[urban portal]

Not sure if they’ll do that

[small steeple]

tell that to hero tree changes. Dks would like to know your location

[dusky canopy]

Yeah our people keep us informed

We’re chillin over here

[small steeple]

So its a firm maybe on if execute nerf will hit prot too?

[nocturne spindle]

yes

[south goblet]

per the patch notes it shouldnt but we wont truely know till the severs come up

[tardy gazelle]

what is the current m+ go-to build?

[mighty valley]

archim is usually pretty good at talking about implications of balance changes in the #updates-midnight channel, and yeah, for execute he says we won't know til tomorrow if they accidentally hit us too

[south goblet]

theres a decent chance they mess up and hit prot as well since prot is getting a exe nerf in pvp

[distant meadow]

looking to switch to prot war this season. why do prot war go for crit instead of vers or mast? better defensively or what

[strong forum]

bandit and mugzee

[south goblet]

mast is only really valuable when shild block is down, but we almost always have it up so it weakens the stat. Vers just doenst give the boost it used to and is hard to stack. Crit gives both dmg boost AND parry chance, which is huge in m+. Feel free to correct this, its the basic understanding i remeber when looking into the stats years ago

[distant meadow]

makes sense. thanks!

[neon elk]

Wouldnt say that exactly true about mast, as it inceases your crit block and ip , and also your ap, so its still a good stat both for defense and ofense

[jagged gust]

All stats are good, sim to find whats best

[halcyon idol]

Hi folks! New tank here! 🙂 How would you suggest I learn the routes for all the dungeons?

[neon elk]

Just press W and yolo

[south goblet]

well simming will only really give you the best dps stat spread. It wont help you find that good balance between dmg and survival

[jagged gust]

defense is pretty net neutral

thats why we sim dps

[neon elk]

There isnt a single stat that will cause your death or make u kill boss

[tribal wharf]

imagine if blizzard added MDT to the game by default

[south goblet]

we sim dps becasue its our only metric we can sim

[halcyon idol]

With in-world arrows

[nocturne spindle]

run them all first then look up specific pulls once you know what the dungeon is like

[halcyon idol]

MDT is so overwhelming tbh

[tribal wharf]

and then i can go in and its updated by the game updates and for all 4 of my party members, that we all know the poison spell cast for 3 seconds and does 227k dmg per second on a lvl 14 key

but then again

route lords

like really bad ones

[nocturne spindle]

just jump into the dungeon

its usually not that big a deal to back track for some %

[tribal wharf]

and its not just like an estimation by some dude

its a number from blizzard so its more likely to match that its going to smack me for 2.3 million

[jagged gust]

Personally I have a hard time translating 2d maps to the 3d game world, but it's handy just as a reference "I need x % by y mob" sort of thing, or just in general to check out what abilities mobs cast at a glance

[opaque bobcat]

That's honestly good advice. Be attentive and just do them. Ignore toxic shits and learn at your pace. Don't suck (even if you do), and don't let it get to you (even if it does)

[south goblet]

i cant wait to spam 4/5 lvl keys for 2 days. So i can figure out what pats the pugs will always suicided into and update my routes.

[tribal wharf]

mdt has alot of quirks to editing routes cant stand

click 1 guy, 8 others get tagged

some 2 patrols only selects the 1

[sudden sable]

at least it lets you manually deselect individuals lol

there was a time where life was rough

[opaque bobcat]

I made MDT a hotkey on my mouse, imported routes I liked, and made it a minimap instead of a big map and I just pull it up while tanking, more when I'm learning the new stuff. Maybe that's an option?

[south goblet]

ngl the way MDT decieces what is and isnt pre grouped is wack somethimes

[mighty valley]

Everyone's brain is different but I find it hard to follow a map until I've done a dungeon a bunch of times

[halcyon idol]

I was thinking of actually printing the routes lol

[tribal wharf]

if blizzard has damage meter and mdt and weak auras, im back

[opaque bobcat]

Maybe throw mdt on another screen if you have 2

[tribal wharf]

and removes wall lamps and chandeliers

[south goblet]

blizz hates weak auras and will never add them

[opaque bobcat]

ur in warrior discord, actively reading. Someone wanna tell him?...

[toxic pewter]

I am sensing a maintenance extension

I have felt a disturbance in the force

[lament forge]

just announced until 12psty

[toxic pewter]

I knew I felt something

yeah dang the tweet was 2 min before I typed what I said

[urban bane]

https://tenor.com/view/shadow-the-hedgehog-shadow-sitting-down-waiting-legs-crossed-gif-1511513935999842675

[nocturne spindle]

i entirely blame apb for this

[jagged gust]

The real reason is the lefts lack of work ethic

go fast rather than do it right

and in a petersonian sense...

to elevate alternative sexual archetypes in the marketplace (fastest hedgehog)

[toxic pewter]

lol

[lofty warren]

Aside from the 2x weekly boxes and world boss, are there any places to get "free gear" to go from 606 ilvl up to easy 630+ for a toon that I abandoned in 11.0 but now going to main it because it is showing as S on tier lists?

By free gear i mean like "show up, hit enemy once, get 639 ilvl".

Anything that takes over 20 min I might as well be actually getting gear

[toxic pewter]

-cyrce circlet ring make sure u get that

-crafted items

-renown gear buy from vendors

[jagged gust]

if you wanna drop a few bucks pretty sure you can craft 629 with all the renown rewards

Should be like a dozen or so

[lofty warren]

What you mean make sure get crafted with ring?

[lament forge]

world boss will drop champ gear warbound 1 item per week

weekly caches, crafting

delves, m0 world tour

LFR first wing

[mighty valley]

pepega showing up to prot warrior discord to ask traitor questions... smh...

[toxic pewter]

omg just remembered pepega lolol

forgot about that dude

[jagged gust]

was pepega the dude that ran thrones of tide like 160 times in two week?

and still didnt get the trinket drop

[sullen gust]

Would anyone happen to know why guides are saying to take instigate? I can't imagine the devastator damage is relevant, and 2 rage for basic attacks seems like less rage than the 5 from each deep wounds applied. Or is the bloodsurge chance for rage really small?

[toxic pewter]

that guy so cringe LOL " for a toon that I abandoned in 11.0 but now going to main it because it is showing as S on tier lists?" 🤣

[mighty valley]

the bloodsurge chance is pretty low, and we get a lot of uptime of the aspd buff from shield charge once we get tier set

[sullen gust]

Sorry what's aspd?

[neon elk]

Dudes gona roll vdh just to get floped in +5 and then be like " wtf i was supposed to be s tier immortal"

[mighty valley]

melee attack speed

[sullen gust]

OH right okay that makes a lot of sense then. I forgot that was a factor with shield charge, thank you!

[toxic pewter]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/148897941883584512/1253819345939857449/rlp.gif

this pepega in a couple days in every dungeon

[mighty valley]

We haven't taken that talent in a while but the tier set makes it worth it

[sullen gust]

So I guess you'd swap the talent point for shield block for it later on?

Or i see a lot of guides have dropped ravager

[mighty valley]

sense was gonna experiment with dropping indomitable and see if we can live without it

[neon elk]

[mighty valley]

now that we're in a lower rage spend world

[sullen gust]

Mad scientist energy, I like it

I've found the colossus build feeling quite clunky and missing globals when shield Slam doesn't get reset. Hopfully some more Haste and the tier set can help out

[vocal flame]

Taking ITF no matter what our haste is? I see it selected in Nom's guide

[small steeple]

Haste in s2 will be high enough

[urban portal]

even without tier set instigate was better in low targets

[small steeple]

plus tierset helps a ton

[vocal flame]

Typically we need to meet a threshold to take it right?

[mighty valley]

yeah, but that usually only matters in s1

the ilvl jump on everything will make it pretty trivial once you're moderately geared

[small steeple]

Up till 5 targets Instigate rivals bloodsurge in rage gen, and even after its actually consistent, plus we are flooded in rage in huge aoe so in those lower target counts its more valuable

[vocal flame]

ahhh ok makes sense

[jagged gust]

Though yes the S2 tier greatly reduces the necessary haste to keep SB up with itf

[toxic pewter]

I am sensing another disturbance in the force..

another maintenance extension.. it is coming...

[restive oak]

i mean i knew that when i saw a 2pm est maint on season start, i can't remember the last season it was up that early lol

[toxic pewter]

servers up

wwwwwwooooooooowqwwwwww'

[mighty valley]

your force sensing sucks

[toxic pewter]

its actually the force that was wrong that time not me

[drifting hull]

Is Legendary Skippers still the go to for Circlet? or Is it Windsingers?

[ruby musk]

For the dinars, are they upgradable to ilvl cap?

Wait nvm

Just found it in the guide. The answer is yes.

[remote anchor]

they dont exist yet

[half anchor]

are we doing 2/2 or 4 piece for changing gear

[lusty grotto]

2pc

swap as soon as you get 2pc

[torn gulch]

my god we're doing so much damage in raids

[oak ivy]

So the non-TWW dungeons are infinitely easier huh?

[mighty valley]

what level are you at

[neon elk]

Was there any info about eu maintenance ? Or we supposed to be ready after reset ?

[remote anchor]

eu should be live instantly

[undone beacon]

First key of the season, poggies

[unborn island]

Poggers

Which key is that?

And presumably it's a DPS spec trinket?

[trim fjord]

How big of an ilvl increase am I looking for when replacing s1 tier? Looking at 616 tier piece vs 629 atm.

[jagged gust]

So underpin ??

kind of a mess

[small steeple]

What ilvl to break 4pc and 2pc? 13 higher?

[jagged gust]

2

Quite literally the moment it's an ilvl upgrade

do delves still max out at 8?

for the bountiful coffer

[wicked reef]

hows warrior feeling gameplay wise?

smooth?

[round cliff]

whats with all the shots at BDK

its funny

[undone beacon]

It’s from Operation Floodgate, dropped for me in prot loot spec

[small steeple]

So did arms execute nerf hit prof

prot too or no?

[mortal cypress]

what guide talks about feel?

[novel temple]

So why aren’t we using the capo fist weapon?

[lucid gulch]

with Colossus - sometimes we have nothing to press, right?

[round cliff]

the only one

[mighty valley]

i've been able to have something every gcd

just have to be more careful about pressing IP

[primal lantern]

Hello, I have a little question about vaults in warrior protection. Do you have to open them in fury or arms?

[lucid gulch]

even if u want to pool rage for block? idk, sometimes i can press for example revenge but maybe i lose uptime on block or ip .. but idk

[pallid quiver]

Hey, Mwahi writes guides for us, too. It even has the word feel in it, too. We love Mwahi, don't be hatin'

@ionic fern we love you

[mighty valley]

you want to ensure max block uptime but that should be trivial. IP uptime doesn't really matter

[pallid quiver]

IP uptime isn't a consideration, hence "be more careful about pressing IP"

IP uptime is determined by damage profiles, anyway

[mighty valley]

i guess it's more accurate to say - IP is obviously good to have up, but overall you want to maximize your SS resets for more total rage gen, so you don't want to panic press IP every time it drops and drain your rage reserves

[lucid gulch]

okay, so dont spam IP anymore, i got it

[pallid quiver]

You technically never should have; it's supposed to be used when preventing overcapping. It does its job of draining the damage you take as a result

It just felt spammy when playing Thane because of the rage gen before and lack of spending via revenge

[mighty valley]

we also got so many shield slam and tb/tc casts that spending with revenge was rarely even a consideration

[tribal wharf]

mythic raid in a nutshell

[spice rivet]

Last boss theatre reaping sythe can no longer be reflected

[tribal wharf]

why though

thats a damn shame, best part of theatre for warrior

[unborn ore]

Are we always keeping into the fray as colossus or is the SB uptime a challenge? Suppose with 4 piece set and shield charge reset, we can always run Into the fray…

[jagged gust]

You're on the money

[vocal flame]

Flame 0 I feel like all i push is revenge lol

[chrome falcon]

hi guys do we play colossus in stuff now

i spent so much time prepping raidleading stuff that i forgot to actually learn how to play my class

[chrome sapphire]

This seems pretty strong for prot warriors, or am I misjudging it?

[pallid quiver]

You can play either, Matta, though Colo does better overall since it does more damage and is closer in tank value now

[chrome falcon]

more damage you say

[pallid quiver]

Outside of Execute phase intensive fights, mind

Thane still has a stronger Execute

I haven't learned what the raid fights are like, yet, but if there's any with big execute phases, Thane might be the play

[chrome falcon]

interesting

is our tier set good? numbers look good

i don't even remember what nerubar's tier set does.

[pallid quiver]

It's infinitely better than last tier set

as you shouldn't

it was like a 0.5% damage gain or something

swap out as soon as you get 2p

[chrome falcon]

god bless.

does it change anything about talents or playstyle?

[pallid quiver]

You'll swap to battering ram once you have 4p

[chrome falcon]

what happened to the pins in this channel

[pallid quiver]

Getting rid of Rav for it

[chrome falcon]

we used to be a real country

[pallid quiver]

There was a cleaning at the start of TWW

and we haven't really added more back outside of damage control posts that got unpinned

[strong forum]

its essentially only half a trinket

[pallid quiver]

it gives speed, tho, nome

only sometimes tho

[waxen frigate]

That actually loooks… awful, no?

[strong forum]

i think it needs to be 2x the numbers

[chrome falcon]

oh im only just looking at our talents, why did i think war machine was getting removed or heavily nerfed

[pallid quiver]

it was better when it didn't take a trinket slot and was just a free bonus brann gave you

[waxen frigate]

What does a normal 649 trinket give for mainstat

[strong forum]

idk like 4k?

or 5k

[waxen frigate]

More than double the numbers I’d imagine then

Because even if it were 6k strength on 50% uptime… that’s just a loss the other 50%

[strong forum]

yea

[round cliff]

if i have both quazii plater and causese's dungeon pack which one am i supposed to mute

theyre gonna be talking over eachother arent they

or does quazii plater make the causese pack not needed

[waxen frigate]

Whichever one you like less

[round cliff]

idk how to mute plater tbf

[vocal flame]

we keeping the Season 1 tier set or swapping for higher ilevel?

[strong forum]

4pc -> 2pc 2pc

[vocal flame]

ahh ok

thank u

[toxic pewter]

this any good

just got it

[mighty valley]

solidly in Pretty Good tier

[round cliff]

my 2 boxes got me a weapon and a shield

and my boxes last week got me trinket

basically, im god's chosen

[cinder marsh]

does DBM cover tank swaps in raid?

[toxic pewter]

Just did 6 bosses and yeah mostly decent

But still kinda weird on some bosses need to be aware

[cyan bronze]

bdk has the least mitigation

if bdk had pwar block

https://tenor.com/view/stonks-meme-gif-16107418

[neon elk]

Or if war had bdk selfheal

[cyan bronze]

yep

[sharp gale]

If it’s like bw you can even turn on a countdown

[timber nest]

collosus > MT?

[hollow citrus]

Thoughts on Anodized Deflectors (wrists from Mecha)

[vocal pewter]

Tips for keeping up up SB with out taking Enduring defenses?

[mighty valley]

in m+ or raid? in raid just don’t press it when you’re not actively tanking. in m+ you’ll probably need every other source of shield block

what’re you trying to take

[vocal pewter]

it was raid

was just curious but didnt think about it lol

[sharp gale]

Parsing logs from S1 did take the 35% execute talent, they just don’t press shield block like harrow said

[stark vapor]

hei pipo

[raw parcel]

Surprised this isn't in the pins, but what's a good point to break our S1 tier set?

[small steeple]

immediately

s1 tier was trash

[pastel atlas]

we take 2 shieldwalls instead of resets for m+ now?

[small steeple]

always

now

[small bone]

Seems like a lot of our gear has crit and haste on them. So are Prot Warriors stat'ng for Haste/Crit over the Haste/Vers?

[worn sand]

is the go to thane or colossus?

[onyx vessel]

+20ilvl in 2 slots is not worth

[kind urchin]

Depends on what you prefer. Colossus does more damage. Thane is a bit more active. They're both close in tankiness.

[fossil wind]

is reinforced wax plating bis or useless lmk

[mighty valley]

They took the rage gen off the other talent and reduced the base cd

[mighty valley]

badddddd

[mighty valley]

it barely matters, crit is fun

[waxen frigate]

terrible

[rare kraken]

Is there a new WA for spell reflect yet?

[pastel sleet]

Accidentally killed gally before doing the quest. Am i fucked til next week or can i still get my enchanted free runed crest somehow

[fluid widget]

you can kill him again

[rain light]

[rare kraken]

They removed spell reflect from ToP last boss wtf

[hearty terrace]

lol

[chilly brook]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/405827164655583233/1346714350630731847/image.png?ex=67c930f9&is=67c7df79&hm=351ed2f8460879c27a05650b3cf565da543e5baef0831325abfea840384dd76a&