After the pack, just check details, damage taken. And you will get a snapshot to go "oh" over
#protection
cerulean tusk
pallid quiver
Yeah, best way is to just look at your HP bar
drowsy narwhal
After the pack, just check details, damage taken. And you will get a snapshot to...
I cannot do that, we are on a timer.
cerulean tusk
You can do that
pallid quiver
Things that pose actual threats to tanks are noticeable
tardy abyss
Damage taken is not a good indicator
pallid quiver
I cannot do that, we are on a timer.
Timers are very lenient outside the absolute top keys
You can casually, painfully, agonizingly pull and CC packs and plan
And still time
cerulean tusk
As a new tank, you got so much time. Dont worry about it
Wonder if you can get away polymorphing parts of the pack
tardy abyss
Yep
pallid quiver
agonizingly pull
holy shit my tempest, please, i beg you
pallid quiver
Wonder if you can get away polymorphing parts of the pack
yes
tardy abyss
Honestly don't do that
cerulean tusk
I got a new idea, to do then - I am going to force my group to CC
drowsy narwhal
Well, tbh, from what I read and talked to people, they say people are toxic in m+. So just telling me to be selfish on top of that and like take my time... i dont know about that.
pallid quiver
Oh the community as a whole is mondo toxic. But people won't care unless you die
And the above
cerulean tusk
Do what you can do improve your situation, so you can do your job well
pallid quiver
The average WoW players has zero idea how their own spec works, let alone how tanks work
cerulean tusk
The PuG community as a whole will thank you for the sacrefise of some dead keys in the long run
tardy abyss
Lower keys are rarely toxic
pallid quiver
So you can pretty easily learn as long as you have the basic rotation down
tardy abyss
Toxicity starts ramping at 10
cerulean tusk
12 keys 
drowsy narwhal
😄
pallid quiver
Lower keys are rarely toxic
Debatable. @warm plinth Your thoughts based on our experience?
tardy abyss
cerulean tusk
Mastery is a bad stat tho 
What happened to this place
cerulean tusk
Vers/Crit, fight me!
pallid quiver
It's worse than the others, ut isn't bad
tardy abyss
It is the last stat we prio but it's not bad
pallid quiver
In fact, having a splash of mastery is one of the biggest defensive upgrades you can do
Since it like more than doubles your chance to crit block for minimal investment
cerulean tusk
Critblock chance is RNG tho, hms hms, I take parry RNG over it
Crit also buffs my dam, go burrr
pallid quiver
his name stems from people insisting it was bad enough that they were sacrificing lots of ilvl and str to get haste over mastery
tardy abyss
You need a bit of mastery
cerulean tusk
Need is a strong word
pallid quiver
You don't even need a point of haste if we're saying need
cerulean tusk
And why this magic number?
pallid quiver
And why this magic number?
It's a splash of like one item of mastery worth
Like I said above, it like doubles crit block chance
pallid quiver
It's more value than adding on to more crit or vers si ce those will generally be higher
cerulean tusk
Meh, I rather just take the 100% damage reduction from the parry
pallid quiver
So DR and the like, as well as other factors, make the splash very useful
tardy abyss
And if you dislike the rng part of crit block you must be ignoring crit too lol
Parry is also rng after all
cerulean tusk
If I chose between 40% DR, or 100% DR, 100% just sounds more apealing
tardy abyss
That's not how the math works
tardy abyss
Do you not understand that DOUBLING your crit block chance for very little investment is good
That very little investment does nothing for parry
cerulean tusk
Dont need to block, when I pling the attack away
cerulean tusk
pallid quiver
Based, that was me one season in DF
I had literally zero pieces with haste
ignoring tier
pallid quiver
Brother, I'm your partner in crime
drowsy narwhal
I watched Yodatv's video and he says prot warriors are one of the losers for the next patch (next season). Do you guys agree with that?
cerulean tusk
Can't lose, when you never won. But sure, the rage change kinda sucks, for sure.
drowsy narwhal
oh okay, sorry, i m also new to discord, my bad
cerulean tusk
Dont worry about it, you part of the warrbro family now. Nothing is stupid, wrong or in any way silly to bring up when related to warrior 
tardy abyss
Unless you try to argue why BSV is supposed to be good
tardy abyss
drowsy narwhal
Thanks. To be honest I love being a tank, I also play STR builds on all rpg games like Dark Souls, and Prot Warr gives me the same feeling. But what I don't understand is that like in WoW there is a shortage of us and reading the patch changes why they nerf tanks.
Like what is the big picture here, I don't get it.
drowsy narwhal
And the solution is to nerf us? 😄
tardy abyss
Yes
keen leaf
warriors got too comfy this season, blizz has to show us who's boss again
tardy abyss
Why do these new outdoor sets of 11.1 look better than tier sets lmao
The plate one is so good
old heron
is prot warr dead after 11.1?
obsidian harness
I doubt it's dead, but it certainly will be overall less fun to play.
devout basalt
were there changes to the gems? swear bis the yellow/blue were different a couple days ago
shrewd grove
Thanks. To be honest I love being a tank, I also play STR builds on all rpg game...
There will always be a shortage of tanks in every MMO because it is the most prominent role and gets most of the blame when you fuck up, while also defaulting to being the "leader"
drowsy narwhal
Yeah, but since that is the case, shouldn't the game developers like make the role more attractive to counter that? Instead of nerfing tanks?
chilly brook
BSV is good
jagged pier
Yeah, but since that is the case, shouldn't the game developers like make the ro...
Yes but they dont and have never done that
Well they did it once with venegance in mop
But then all the dps complained
And there are far more dpsers than tanks in the game so 
shrewd grove
Yeah, but since that is the case, shouldn't the game developers like make the ro...
Damn, you should be a dev. Go talk to blizzard. We've been saying it for decades
remote heron
I wonder if they made Arms into a support-dps class like AUG - would that make us meta in M+?
remote heron
aw tru, sorry i do tank when Prot is the closest to meta
and idk killing rage generation means we're DOA imo
iron sphinx
i mean the only reason we had crazy rage gen was because of mountain thane, collosus is now just dead in the water
remote heron
30% more absorb from IP is a drop in the bucket compared to the massive flow of rage we get
that funnels into CDR for shield wall and other stuff so idk how you quantify that compared to just 30% more IP
iron sphinx
30% more but like half the casts so
remote heron
yeah that already doesn't sound equal
maybe I'm bad at tanking in M+ but i am spamming IP for my life the whole time
any disruption of that means i die
My solution: all the Warriors really should complain like the pallies do when anything goes wrong
iron sphinx
but we are not blizzards pet class
remote heron
Pallies have proven that you can have them walk it back
remote heron
but we are not blizzards pet class
True, catch 22, warriors are never as popular as pally
iron sphinx
the only warrior spec they like is fury and its still their ugly stepchild
remote heron
I suspect there's just a disconnect between the dev teams. Whoever is in charge of Warrior class design is just phoning it in. That may seem hyperbolic, but c'mon man. Look at the Pally, Rogue, and Monk class designers.
They're not perfect but they get iterated on like crazy
Warrior gets some talents reshuffled and then call it a rework
iron sphinx
not to mention the warrior class looks dogshit
there is one cool ability and thats bladestorm
remote heron
I will say that Prot feels good to play
and so Does Fury
but Arms is a hot mess
I'm gonna miss the rapid-fire Shield Slams
tardy abyss
maybe I'm bad at tanking in M+ but i am spamming IP for my life the whole time
It's not supposed to be that bad with some exceptions
But these exceptions will be very bad next season
remote heron
Tanking in general tho, shouldn't feel this intense
remote heron
idk why
tardy abyss
It is what it is
remote heron
People already don't like to tank
on average
why make the unpopular role even more daunting?
tardy abyss
The outcry will be insane next season
remote heron
What i really don't understand is, don't the devs want money?
tardy abyss
When people realise it's another ppal only season
remote heron
They have the data and the blueprint from DF Season 2 and 3 to make a chill season
but they want us to feel bad for tanking for some reason.
Whatever, maybe we're just dooming, right?
.....right?!
iron sphinx
Whatever, maybe we're just dooming, right?
surely
urban bane
Won't really know 'til after the holidays probably
cerulean tusk
Interns will be back by then, things will be fixed and all will be ok
urban bane
If blizzard is listening there's not a lot of people who think the prot warrior changes are good. So maybe they'll re-evaluate
waxen frigate
They have the data and the blueprint from DF Season 2 and 3 to make a chill seas...
DF S2 and S3, notably 2 of the worst seasons of M+ ever
cinder marsh
ok so i dont get whats the difference between having the crafted shield and the raid shield, they both have the same stats and the crafted can have an embelishment on it
iron sphinx
i think u would rather have crafted other piece so u can have either dusk or dawnthread lining
cinder marsh
yea but i have duskthread lining on the shield
jagged gust
3ilvls
cinder marsh
yea but how big of a diff is that>
jagged gust
Minute
tardy abyss
yea but how big of a diff is that>
If you don't do hard content it's whatever
If you wanna minmax, you do care
broken widget
How much haste is required to keep into the fray over heavy repercussions? I was at 19k haste before the island ring at 17.3k with the new ring. Should I just swap back to haste flasks?
pallid quiver
Technically, depends on dungeon/content, since your goal in M+ is to have 100% blocked hits
so whatever haste you need for that is what you rock
tardy abyss
I run Haste flask with 22k haste lmao
pallid quiver
I'd rather just run HR if there's any concern, since ITF is really just more dam
tardy abyss
Just feels too good
pallid quiver
I run Haste flask with 22k haste lmao
i recently realized that not running alch chaos flask means your potions are weaker, since tempered pots will lose out on giving you haste
pallid quiver
I don't even notice a difference between 0% haste and 35% haste, though, so I couldn't imagine flasking for feel
tardy abyss
Mate what
pallid quiver
i'm just pressing buttons, man
tardy abyss
Do you genuinely not notice the Haste debuff in Siege?
pallid quiver
Not particularly, no, not gonna lie
tardy abyss
Man
pallid quiver
i forgot there was a haste debuff
remote anchor
cant feel it in siege since all you run is mists and dawnbreakers..
broken widget
feels like you're lagging
pallid quiver
is that attached to the curses going around?
pallid quiver
I can't read your comment for what you mean
I'm absolutely brain blasted by the memes
I can only think of the Power Glove now
broken widget
alright thanks I'll run haste flask tonight to be safe and experiment on lower keys
mortal pecan
i recently realized that not running alch chaos flask means your potions are wea...
Do you think macroing the pots to avatar would be a good idea?
pallid quiver
I think that'd stop you from pre-potting in M+ and might potentially cost you a strong use in fights that go long enough for you to get 2 uses in raid, but honestly, it probably wouldn't matter that much.
mortal pecan
Do you just have a separate bind for them?
pallid quiver
i actually have separate binds for everything myself
I just never did bind things together
pallid quiver
i even have multiple keybinds for ravager/spear for @cursor and @player uses
dense cradle
avatar is way too short a cd
pallid quiver
For raid, you throw it right at start with all CDs, then on CD
M+, if you're really willing to chuck money, you can send one before key since it resets CD
dense cradle
to macro pot to
pallid quiver
yeah, but you also press it enough
it'd end up getting pressed eventually
It's probably not optimal since
In M+ you want to be using it as close to on CD as possible
so preferably big pulls/bosses/etc happen around every 5 mins
I generally don't use pots in M+ since I'm not pushing and I'm a cheap poor boy
dense cradle
~~I generally don't use pots in M+ since I'm not pushing and I'm a cheap poor bo...
real
say cheap poor boy while riding on a bruto
pallid quiver
Thank you for your service
All the people who bought the bruto have been saving me so many seconds in my day
dense cradle
its such a qol honestly
boreal heath
All the people who bought the bruto have been saving me so many seconds in my da...
Until you encounter the ones that intentionally dismount when you use em
pallid quiver
I murder those people. In real life. With a wooden spoon.
We have diametrically opposed viewpoints, those people and I. I'll go out of my way to keep my yak out for people I see are using it
boreal heath
Since Blizzard decided that the mount makes a sound whenever the ah is used so you just know it's probably on purpose
pallid quiver
That's less common these days, but that's still what I just used to do
boreal heath
At least the yak it's probably not on purpose, since you don't know if someone is using it or not
Unless it's one of those people who intentionally move a little bit everytime you try to use one
jagged gust
the transmog toy really helped mitigate that
hardy snow
if you want to use ah from mount, just get one 🤷♂️
primal moth
I hop on my bruto and just afk until the game kicks me
mortal pecan
I can't justify $90 for a mount
pallid quiver
I was tempted, but so many other people got it
that it's like i effectively have it
unborn island
Do we have a solid answer on the ring for M+ yet, or is it just what's on icyveins/wowhrad?
split stratus
Hey all, just got I tap in a GB +11 on 2nd boss and I really don't understand why.
According to the logs, I'm facing the boss and SB is up but the boss killed me with a 15M melee
Any idea what's happening here ?
Thanks !
(Logs if it can help: https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/aZNphFBqykxQctr9?fight=last&type=resources&view=events&source=6&eventstart=22390272)
pallid quiver
Do we have a solid answer on the ring for M+ yet, or is it just what's on icyvei...
You can sim with all stones to see what's best in both ST and AOE
sharp gale
sir that is $90
I bought it and I still go to the AH
pallid quiver
you can also just sim what's best in ST and be fine
fringe chasm
Hey all, just got I tap in a GB +11 on 2nd boss and I really don't understand wh...
Probably got hit while he had mace equipped. He has 1000% dmg buff. Gotta kite him
azure shadow
Hey all, just got I tap in a GB +11 on 2nd boss and I really don't understand wh...
i'm semi new to protwar but at a glance i think you just crit blocked the first 2 swings of mace buff and don't live it w/o the crit block
split stratus
Probably got hit while he had mace equipped. He has 1000% dmg buff. Gotta kite h...
He forged mace at 10:08 and 10:59, I got melee at 10:17 so nope :/
split stratus
i'm semi new to protwar but at a glance i think you just crit blocked the first ...
I've 635 ilvl, hope I can still tank melees from boss in 11 while having SB active
azure shadow
the buff lasts 10sec so it's 3 buffed melees
pallid quiver
Yeah, he definitely forged axe after he murdered you it looks like, since you died at 10:17 and he went back to axe at 10:19
split stratus
At 10:17 mace was not up, right ?
pallid quiver
I'm not sure what to tell you, but
it was 100% up when you got hit all three times
split stratus
Wow, I've always charged back as soon as my weak aura doesn't tell me KITE and the boss isn't on fire anymore. So I should kite it till he changes weapon ? Never realized that ! 😮
Thanks guys, will watch that closely next time ty
pallid quiver
He has a buff you can watch for that's actually called Molten Hammer; that's what the bottom graph is representing
As soon as that's gone, you're 100% safe to go back in
sharp gale
Wow, I've always charged back as soon as my weak aura doesn't tell me KITE and t...
What do you mean, as in fire from switching weapon or as in fire for mace buff
I think it is visual when you can go back on him
split stratus
What do you mean, as in fire from switching weapon or as in fire for mace buff
As in fire for mace buff, like I've done this boss 10s of times and I've never had this issue
So according to the logs I indeed did all the kitting before he started casting molten mace and charged back as soon as he cast it
I guess I was really tired during this fight, cause I really don't understand how I could have done that kek, but I guess logs don't lie and I was not looking at my screen
sharp gale
It happens to everyone don’t worry
I did nw I forgot to intervene on first boss because I was elsewhere
split stratus
Trying to do 10 keys in a day, too old for this shit I guess 
sharp gale
If you spam to much m+ in short sessions you might just burn out and stop (i know bc that’s what I do when season opens)
jagged gust
If you spam to much m+ in short sessions you might just burn out and stop (i kno...
brother I got burnt out before m+ started lmao
sharp gale
brother I got burnt out before m+ started lmao
Wtf you did that’s not like there was a lot to do before
jagged gust
It's not so much what I did, just the experience of the xpac being out for like 5 weeks before the content actually started
More like I got boredout lol
sharp gale
Tbh I found it fine, playing with the AH is my jam at expansion starts
But yeah I mostly didn’t play but AH during the 3-4 weeks before raid
jagged gust
True, playing the AH is wild on release
errant oriole
when is 11.1 going to be on ptr does anyone know?
jagged gust
Didn't imagine I'd break 7 digits in the bank from flipping ore
sharp gale
I lost everything I gained because I’m an addict
jagged gust
as long as you had fun
sharp gale
I did 2 m in 2-3 hours the day of release and lost everything on bismuth flipping
Ofc it is so fun
pallid quiver
"After the new year" So 2026 at the earliest
sharp gale
"After the new year" So 2026 at the earliest
They need to follow their own roadmap, they said 11.1 is in winter
A blitz ptr like we all love
weak bronze
So prot bad in 11.1?
sharp gale
We will always have brewmaster to take that role
jagged gust
They could very well be layering in adjustments, still 2 months minimum before S2
sharp gale
They could very well be layering in adjustments, still 2 months minimum before S...
Shadowlands was on alpha/beta for 6 months, and still….
I’m sure they will do it right this time
jagged gust
SL was such a bad xpac I don't base any of my views off of it
sharp gale
I base my views on everything I experienced (so since bfa / before I was not really playing)
jagged gust
I would say having played for at least a few months of every xpac, BFA+SL are in my top 3 worst xpacs overall
sharp gale
Before I just max lvl and quit so i just have 3 expansions to judge, hard to class 3 things
And biased because bfa is my first real exp
jagged gust
yeah wildly different perspectives
sharp gale
And Covid
jagged gust
a lot of what those expansions did were borrowed power from previous iterations, so it was all kind of boring the 3rd or 4th time around
Yeah covid made everything slow to a crawl
sharp gale
No i meant Covid made nyalotha my favorite tier ever
jagged gust
oh haha
sharp gale
Everyone irl playing wow
First mythic raid with the boys, blind progging with the dungeon journal
jagged gust
hey man, when you can actually be sociable in a social game it's always a good time
sharp gale
but yeah sepulcer and SoD worst tiers
sharp gale
sepulcher ruled lol
shadowlands is your first expansion ?
sharp gale
yeah i'm not 40 so i didn't play that time
sharp gale
the first time i played was wrath so i was like 10
i got lvl 80, did ulduar (it was icecrown patch) and quit
jagged gust
Wrath is actually the only xpac I didn't play
I didn't like the welfare epics system
mighty valley
the state of the game for the rest of its entire existence must've really chapped your ass huh
deft mortar
when tf we gettin the damn new season
buoyant ermine
feb or march
jagged gust
the state of the game for the rest of its entire existence must've really chappe...
yeah it just kept getting worse until I finally learned to embrace it. Like fuck it, kill 12 kobolds and I can buy an epic? gimme gimme
mighty valley
i mean
i don't think it could stay the way it was forever
just expecting people to find guilds to go through every raid in sequence
catchup gear is fine
novel steeple
If you had to do something to get an item it's not a welfare item. You still had to commit time and effort ( no matter how easy or hard ) to get that item. The term welfare epic was used by douches who ( still many in the game ) think that only the top people should get gear. It was a thought process that came from vanilla and TBC where it required a guild to get the best gear.
mighty valley
yeah i broadly agree
it's nearly impossible to keep rarity truly exclusive like that without your game becoming extremely unhealthy in one way or another
novel steeple
Exactly. By that logic all crafted items, vault items, delve items, etc wouldn't be in the game. Opening up a path to progress your character for the largest amount of people is healthy for the game both in business and in population for the players.
mighty valley
"I dropped out of wow for a few months, would be fun if I could come back and play with my friends... oh wait, I'd have to do how much work? never mind then"
novel steeple
Yep. It's all around good to have easy catchup mechanics. It's also good for those who do play with the ever changing state of class/role power and those that like to play multiple characters
jagged gust
If you had to do something to get an item it's not a welfare item. You still ha...
Yeah, I'm laughing now, it was neat to be in the 5% of the population of the game who got to experience certain things and get rewarded for it, nowadays you can run through an entire raid in npc mode and you don't even have to press a button. Works for me though, seasonal grinding is boring asf, I just wanna press buttons and watch cutscenes these days
sharp gale
They can do whatever they want if it doesn’t affect me
I play for myth raid (now) so everything else they can fuck around and try
wicked pollen
how much crit is too little to play spear as thane
i think i might have reached it
pallid quiver
Whenever it sims worse
pallid quiver
If you're in real spitball territory, 1T for 3/5 mins (whichever seems more akin to your times) and 5 for like, 1.5/2 or something, whichever fits the times better
wicked pollen
omg i wasted so much ragus
mr luerce can you check if there is any thing egregious i did here
pallid quiver
It looks like you opted to take some tank hits without defensives at a quick glance; looks like you opted to take 4 igneous hammers without any real defensives up, even though you had Spell Block off CD for
jagged gust
TC cpm seems kinda low
pallid quiver
like 10 minutes by that point
pallid quiver
It looked decently fine on my end, since he had a reasonable amount of SS
wicked pollen
waoh
pallid quiver
Heck, he has more TB and TC casts than Nome did on one of his runs (though the one I'm looking at is from September from Nome, so lower haste overall)
Yeah, SV is a dungeon where you can get a lot of spell block use out, so that's the biggest kneejerk quick thing I noticed
From the Shadow Claws, to like every boss tank hit, to the Earth Bolts before last boss
pallid quiver
You also didn't press Storm Bolt at all
dps/heals issue, they're the ones dying anyway smh
wicked pollen
🙂
pallid quiver
It's not letting me peep your talents, but I wager it's picked up
jagged gust
The logs arent show your stats for me
pallid quiver
Also, could still send less outbursts on TC; it's tons better than the large majority of the population, but can always go better
wicked pollen
i swear i avoided that shit like the plague
pallid quiver
It gets really hard to improve it at the point you're at
but you can get it lower
I believe Nome, Jakey, and Sense all have logs with similar cast numbers, yet still somehow less TC outbursts
wicked pollen
we are going to have to have stats manually smh
pallid quiver
Oh, I wager you're using 45s Roar talent, which also makes this interesting:
pallid quiver
that might have been your 100 key% parse smh
not really, you'd likely have to swing Colo for that
pallid quiver
It doesn't really require crit or anything, just being careful with your rage and really taking advantage of your defensives
Since you mostly just start sending out revenges in big aoe, with bloodsurge keeping you fed
pallid quiver
and because you're pressing so much revenge, you get to demolish more
wicked pollen
Oh, I wager you're using 45s Roar talent, which also makes this interesting:
wait i know why this happened
i was just sending sc on cd for sb uptime
and holding tr if it came at the end of packs for more damage
pallid quiver
If you're holding roar, you'd also hold SC in the same situation, since the pack won't be living long enough for the uptime on Sb to be an issue
wicked pollen
ig i prob also didnt have shield block charges either
proven stratus
Do we know the proc chance for the new tierset yet?
wicked pollen
nope mr pvper
wicked pollen
Protection
(2) Set: Each time you take damage you have a chance to activate Luck of the Draw! causing you to cast Shield Wall for 4 seconds. Your damage done is increased by 15% for 10 seconds after Luck of the Draw! activates.
(4) Set: During Luck of the Draw! Sheild Slam’s chance to critically strike is increased by 50% and its critical strikes reduce the cooldown of Shield Charge by 6 seconds.
jagged gust
proven stratus
https://discord.com/channels/148872210742771712/148897941883584512/1319775991106...
.5 ppm means?
jagged gust
.5 procs per minute
proven stratus
So roughly 1 per two min
proven stratus
No, that's pretty shit
jagged gust
not enough info to go running with that statement
proven stratus
If it barely goes off it means done diddly fuckall
wicked pollen
i think for his case its a lot worse than our case
have fun getting 1 per 2 min proc to get lethal
jagged gust
2ppm I'd be happy
proven stratus
Yeah im trying to delete healers, you are trying to hold aggro, we are not the same
2ppm would be baller ngl
A free go every 30 secs roughly would be wild
jagged gust
like 33% uptime on insane SC cdr+massive SSs
proven stratus
Shield Bash into some Warlock 
jagged gust
the SW is literally just there for flavour, but w/e maybe it saves me randomly some day
proven stratus
I mean the tierset says cast Shield Wall, not grant it
proven stratus
or be disabled
Like Blizzard's class design team?
wicked pollen
yeah but i also dont proc reck when i get ava from thane
jagged gust
why would you be taking immovable object in the first place? I'm confused
wicked pollen
pvp
proven stratus
yeah but i also dont proc reck when i get ava from thane
Because it's granted not cast
proven stratus
why would you be taking immovable object in the first place? I'm confused
Pvp
I like having multiple dps cds
It's kinda gud
wicked pollen
ah i see what you mean
jagged gust
yeah I get the philosophy, can't just burn down a target these days
proven stratus
You say that like Shield Slam doesn't hit people like fat kids after twinkies
Especially casters
wicked pollen
ig activating and being granted avatar is not the same
proven stratus
Nope
wicked pollen
😦
proven stratus
Otherwise all of the get X when you do Y would recurse infinitely
Immovable Object would infinite out
So when you cast one you are granted the other
proven stratus
But yeah, the tierset entirely depends on proc rate, and I really do want it to be good
Mainly because the kaching from it is fucking stupid
proven stratus
how does prot even kill in arena
You sit on 10 Demo Stacks and murder some fuck
wicked pollen
wtf is the stall mechanic called again
proven stratus
You don't need damp
wicked pollen
you just oneshot in ava dshout demolish?
wicked pollen
if i get 2400 and get bored enough to queue pvp again ill try
proven stratus
You are also tanky so no one wants to hit you
So your tree can just be full dps tbh
pallid quiver
i miss pandaland vengeance
wicked pollen
ig ip having 0 cd helps
proven stratus
If they are hitting me as a Prot War in pvp they fucked up
wicked pollen
you surely press sb for ss damage
wicked pollen
hr?
proven stratus
Ye
proven stratus
Prot War is the forbidden pvp spec because it's actually fucking disgusting
proven stratus
It does and so does sitting on 10 stacks
wicked pollen
number increases so much
proven stratus
The fact that Demo and Ravager are now heal cuts is fucking dumb
on Prot of all things
maiden ravine
awww, why do they hate prot using execute...
pallid quiver
you should broaden that a bit
since they also hate fury and even arms using execute
jagged pier
u should widen it to why do they just hate warrior
violet ginkgo
awww, why do they hate prot using execute...
They hate arms too for using execute and hate fury because they give puny execute to fury.
maiden ravine
oh, all I saw was the prot colossus change, or did they do that to arms too
violet ginkgo
Same things for arms
maiden ravine
it's... execute. You use it in execute...
The entire execute mechanic exists because of that ability
Like the entire reason execute gave Colossal Might was so you didn't feel bad about using execute during execute
Sometimes I wonder if the designers truly understand the class they're designing for.
violet ginkgo
They said that both spec use execute too much while ignoring the primary button maybe they mean mortal strike for arms and shield slam for prot, the thing is it’s far from true.
I mean in execute phase for arms they do execute-execute-mortal strike because literally there is talent to improve MS damage by doing 2 execute first so I don’t understand how they see it as too much.
For prot we still have to spend rage for shieldblock and some IP. So it’s not like we press execute too much, we still prioritize shield slam all the time especially after execute reset the SS
maiden ravine
I think this is more an arms change and because the devs still see hero trees as having to be identical as possible for both specs they made the change to be consistent.
Prot was only really executing in single target when it had spare rage right?
violet ginkgo
Yeah but still I think ever since talent tree introduced in DF arms always do that execute twice then MS for big MS damage. How the hell they see it too much after letting it be for 1 entire expansion + 1 season of new expansion.
maiden ravine
I'm just partial to execute, I'm a sucker who tried to make condemn work.
violet ginkgo
Basically execute replace revenge during execute phase for prot.
maiden ravine
only on single target though.
I honestly thought it felt great in execute when you could get to demolish more.
rancid tiger
They said that both spec use execute too much while ignoring the primary button ...
No atm u ms once u have 2 op stacks 2 ep stacks and 2 stacks of 4p if not u execute
This is bad
Should always be 2x ep = ms worth
oak peak
good morning all! Aiming to main prot warr for next season is a good ideia or not really? 😄 😄 I don't main a tank since probably WoD ... thanks all!
wicked pollen
No atm u ms once u have 2 op stacks 2 ep stacks and 2 stacks of 4p if not u exec...
you dont ms with 2 op
rancid tiger
All 3
rancid tiger
that is incorrect
well lets put it like this gio
u wont have rage to only execute
and 4p comes from OP resets
sooo
wicked pollen
thats just wrong
rancid tiger
true hmm
in broad terms though, most of the times u do have a mp or 2 up 🙂
but its incidental thats true
tiny atlas
The millionth question regarding the new ring. Checked out the (atm) best gems for the ring and equipped it, but losing so much Haste on my origanal ring seems bad somehow. Have not done a M+ with it yet but we somehow have to compensate with more Haste on other items, dont we?
jagged pier
the ring is giving an enormous amounts of stat
like all of them
yer u loose some haste
but more stats> less better stats
wicked pollen
gm jakey
jagged pier
its the afternoon but hello
jagged pier
good luck
urban portal
They said that both spec use execute too much while ignoring the primary button ...
nah for arms you jam execute until you have 4 piece stacks and EP stacked
so you are pressing way more execute than you do in dragon flight
but yeah for prot its not an issue at all
prot just got caught in the crossfire
wicked pollen
urban portal
gio how r u this morning/afternoon
deft hinge
Were the worst spec of all time now
This is the way
odd flint
Were the worst spec of all time now
maybe prot warrior will get the prot paladin treatment where in the .5 patch its omega giga buffed then is meta the rest of the season
sweet summit
How come they nerfed Prot for 11.1
they will revert it
wicked pollen
urban bane
proven stratus
Were the worst spec of all time now
I'm waiting to nuke people in pvp
Free goes for having 2pc is fucking stupid
fluid widget
Were the worst spec of all time now
Vanilla prot pally wins that
Though vanilla boomkin does come close
compact oak
what is the best gem selection for prot warrior [Cyrce's Circlet]
icy veins and wowhead both different
compact oak
sim?
pallid quiver
ye
What gems are best for your char vary with the stats and gear available to you
Minor changes can suddenly make one better than the other
pallid quiver
If you play a DPS spec and don't want to fuss over it much, I'd recommend simming for the DPS spec
then just rocking it for prot
you'll be fine, overall
past sedge
guess its over for prot once nerfs hit
no way we can do title keys with that rage gen nerf
good for half a season thanks blizz
pallid quiver
Nah, we'll still be able to go that high; it's not like Prot's survival suddenly got dumpstered
It sucks a lot, but you'll still keep 100% SB uptime
which is where the single largest majority of your mit comes from
past sedge
ok tell me what happen when u have magic dmg incoming and ur rage starved no ip
its just not doable
pallid quiver
Magic damage is the thing that CDs are for
wicked pollen
ok tell me what happen when u have magic dmg incoming and ur rage starved no ip
spell block
pallid quiver
That's why we have:
Spell Block
Shield Wall
Spell Reflect
Last Stand
you'll get less walls from the rage gen loss, yes
past sedge
mate this is like telling someone the sky is blue
pallid quiver
As well as less SS
past sedge
i know this, but the issues are with the nerfs
pallid quiver
That's because you're overreacting to the sunset showing the sky being orange
IP helps keep you stable, not make you suddenly survive
pallid quiver
It's like bone shield on BDK
wicked pollen
i mean im 3300io
pallid quiver
it's the secondary button mitigation method to supplement the primary mit method
You should be more worried about bleeds, since that kicks multiple of our defensive CDs off the table, and even ignores our primary mit
pallid quiver
Honestly, the biggest issue with pushing higher keys with Prot come next patch will be the damage loss
I think Nome was spitballing like a 30% drop or something in ST alone
Means you might run into situations where you need more stops because things live too long. Tank DPS doesn't matter as much as actual DPS class DPS,
but that's a lotta damage to lose
smoky anvil
I hate losing damage. I play this game to see numbers fly across my screen.
pallid quiver
sure they will
they should, but currently, they're not on the listed table, so they 100% can choose to not to
pallid quiver
I'm gonna be completely honest; I've never understood that reasoning. I don't know why the WoW community adheres to it so much. It's fine if something is considered the strongest for a while as long as everything's playable, which it has been, by and large
But people act like it's a shit game if they aren't "forced" to play something else, which I personally think fuels bad game design
proven stratus
I'm gonna be completely honest; I've never understood that reasoning. I don't kn...
This isn't FF14 where I just hit job change and call it a day
past sedge
issue is with pugs only wanting one tank only
pallid quiver
that doesn't solve the issue
They'll still want one tank only
it's just a different tank
Just because it might benefit you personally this time, that means that the players of every other tank spec are in the shit zone now
And are either socially pressured to swap or just get rejected by the community
I don't think that's a game design problem; I think it's a community problem
tardy abyss
That's a community issue
pallid quiver
Fighting games from literally the 90s still have people playing games with zero patches, nothing has changed
People will still play not the strongest chars because they provide different experiences, even though old fight games are fucked up
past sedge
no, its a game design issue, ppal is objectively much stronger than pwar
by so much
that
people will onl ytake ppal
tardy abyss
Meh
pallid quiver
Yet in WoW, it's considered a dev issue that you choose to not play Ken in Third Strike
past sedge
ppal, aug, disc, enh, dk
thats the same comp been season day 1 its so shitti
surely things change in s2
tardy abyss
That's in fact wrong
pallid quiver
Prot War was meta at the start of S1, just to clear the record, even if it wasn't necessarily the best tank
pallid quiver
Your comment is factually false if they played it for one week
past sedge
cuz it doesnt matter to be specific about it?
pallid quiver
You can't make logical arguments while blowing hyperbole into things
past sedge
ppal has been dominating the meta
for most of the season
there you go
and its ass game design
tardy abyss
That's how every season goes anyway
past sedge
that people only take one tank
tardy abyss
Pwar is good enough for these keys
pallid quiver
You've still yet to say how it's a game design problem that you choose to do this to yourself and the community chooses to do it
Even if something else can do literally the same content
past sedge
bcuz i dont wanna play ppal? xD
pallid quiver
You say it's stronger, but it does the same thing in the end
past sedge
its a game design issue because the balance between tanks are not proper
pallid quiver
The balance between tanks in S1 was some of the best it's ever been. DF, too
past sedge
so why is every 16 key and up only taking ppal
pallid quiver
Have you actually played during a time when tank balance was shit? Did you mess with Wrath Classic? Prot War was getting murdered in ICC in comparison. Cata Classic now, too
tardy abyss
so why is every 16 key and up only taking ppal
Because that's how meta works
pallid quiver
so why is every 16 key and up only taking ppal
That's what I'm saying; people are choosing to do this and gatekeep based on it
tardy abyss
You can play every tank at that level and there are plenty offmeta players
So it is not a design issue
And if you believe every tank can be balanced at the same time you're a fool
That's just not how games work
pallid quiver
You could ask why everyone who wears green when they play WoW wears green
they're choosing to do it; you can't design around the playerbase for a good game with things like this. You can only string along people for financial game with live service changes
novel steeple
It's a community perception issue 100%. They base it on things like MDI and streamers. It's 100% not based on fact but feelings.
The only way to 100% balance anything is to completely homogenize it to the point where it truly doesn't matter because they are all the exact same.
tardy abyss
^
tardy abyss
Nah
weak cedar
hi, is this the tank with the lowest self healing?
tardy abyss
Indeed
waxen cradle
What I hope the devs realize after they return from vacation is that these nerfs won't fix anything. We will still use IP the same way just use it a lot less and it will be a net loss of dps and survivability. Clearly they couldn't care less whether we are having fun or not, but I hope there plan was not to intentionally drive people away from the Prot Warrior though I would hardly be surprised if that is exactly what they meant to do.
novel steeple
There will always be a "best" both objectively and subjectively. The truth is that outside of like the top 1% of players in the world people will not be able to actually utilize the small difference in the classes.
I.E. Look at the damage comparison between players in Liquid compared to say the #15 guild in the world. Hell, you could even compare it to the second best guild.
The difference is in the player and it's massive. We plebians aren't going to be able to utilize the small differences to the level that it matters so play what is fun to you
pallid quiver
What I hope the devs realize after they return from vacation is that these nerfs...
There's precedent for that, actually. Demo Lock in WoW
dammit, wod
muscle memory too stronk
They didn't want people playing Demo since they didn't want people to get attached due to the upcoming Legion revamp
since DH had to steal like half of Demo's identity
past sedge
There will always be a "best" both objectively and subjectively. The truth is t...
nah id say title players would be close to the level of those guys which is where the 1% meta argument comes into play
novel steeple
nah id say title players would be close to the level of those guys which is wher...
So the top .1% are compareable? lol
pallid quiver
real talk, even the absolute top most players don't take full advantage of classes and everything they offer
it's why we're able to find issues in logs they have
They're just better at actually solving the issues stopping keys, no matter what it takes for the comp they're rocking
past sedge
Couldnt tell ya, I would need to check someone like FiredUp vs some random title mage player
pallid quiver
which is usually focused on DPS, since more DPS means less stops needed
past sedge
And if thers a huge difference
pallid quiver
It's most notable for tanks and healers
Since they aren't as directly tied to performance in spec -> pack dies faster as DPS specs are
novel steeple
The point stands. 99% of people don't play at that level and therefore the small differences don't matter. At this point in the xpac play what you like. It's not going to matter other than to your enjoyment of the game.
pallid quiver
Since more DPS means pack lives less, meaning you need to find less ways to live
simple drum
Now that they nerfed Prot I’m just chilling playing Palworld
novel steeple
Since more DPS means pack lives less, meaning you need to find less ways to live
Yea, playing some alts in lower keys the difference is in the dps. Those packs that live forever...you just run out of ways to live lol
pallid quiver
The point stands. 99% of people don't play at that level and therefore the smal...
It will due to the extreme meta chasing in WoW, though, due to how prevalent it is in the community. It's very hard to pug things overall due to meta chasing and overall player inability. Though, even the devs have really stated that's not something they can realistically fix
since you can avoid almost all of these issues by
simply making a group to play with
novel steeple
It will due to the extreme meta chasing in WoW, though, due to how prevalent it ...
Which goes all the way back to it being a community issue not a game design issue which i agree about 😄
violet ginkgo
I think Nome was spitballing like a 30% drop or something in ST alone
Thirty freakin’ percent!? That is yuuuge…drop.
past sedge
yeah but what if you dont want to have a premade group on a strict schedule and just chill and pug high enough for title keys
pallid quiver
Thirty freakin’ percent!? That is yuuuge…drop.
yeah no it's fucking bad
It's a lot less SS due to the reset change before we even consider avatar uptime
pallid quiver
yeah but what if you dont want to have a premade group on a strict schedule and ...
That's the sort of content that's generally considered strict enough by the dev team to be considered "un-puggable", so they just don't design around it. It's like M Raid
You're actively working against what is feasible
novel steeple
You're actively working against what is feasible
This
pallid quiver
They don't even design the first 4 to be puggable
if they are, neat
That's not the design goal; it's not what the content is made for
Game design is a process of decisions and sacrifices
If you want high-organized, very punishing content, you reduce the availability to just simply drop-in and play if you're reaching a wide-audience base
past sedge
this season especially i guess, nobody is doing giga high keys
or its slowed down al ot
novel steeple
First season i've said screw pushing. Enjoying being an AoTC hero and weekly +10 farmer. Enjoying the game so much more. Quite a few folks i've met are doing the same
totally anecdotal i know. Just a diff perspective
pallid quiver
imagine even doing weekly 10s
cerulean tusk
I am sure not having to worry about balance and minmax is chill, for sure
pallid quiver
i cba playing the game seriously at the moment
past sedge
this season has to be one of the hardest to get title so im trying for it
novel steeple
imagine even doing weekly 10s
guildies and alts. tank responsibilities lol
pallid quiver
imagine even having a guild
novel steeple
imagine even having a guild
It's like an emotional support animal. The illusion that somebody cares is fantastic to wake up to 😄
cerulean tusk
Just place your character in a guild for free raidboosts if there ever is loot you want
violet ginkgo
imagine even doing weekly 10s
Honestly weekly 10 seems like a chore right now with how challenger’s peril then tyran and forti active. I mean in S4 DF weekly 8s seems way more manageable and relax as weekly homework.
weak cedar
No that would be brew
really? i thought brews had good self healing with expel harm/vivify
past sedge
really? i thought brews had good self healing with expel harm/vivify
nah was just trolling
idk probably
weak cedar
oh lmao
pallid quiver
Brews do on average heal more than Prot War, ye
Sheer force of healing orbs alone even if you don't expel them
cerulean tusk
Is that comparing warrior HPS against DTPS?
past sedge
brewmaster cuckmaster
weak cedar
im looking for the tank with the lowest self sustain, assumed that would be the one with the highest mitigation (and also the easiest/most predictable for the healer?)
kinda new
pallid quiver
Is that comparing warrior HPS against DTPS?
Just raw healing ability
cerulean tusk
The most meme of data
past sedge
im looking for the tank with the lowest self sustain, assumed that would be the ...
pwar
pallid quiver
What you mean by self-sustain, just healing or ability to stay stable in pack?
If former, P War. If latter, Brew; Brew takes the most overall damage that they can't handle alone on average
weak cedar
healing, i know prot war for example has ignore pain which technically counts for HPS but i wouldnt count it
alright
pallid quiver
depends on damage profile for which tank actually takes the most damage they can't solo handle
Yeah, tanks are pretty much on a scale of how much upfront mit they have in relation to the self-healing they have. One end is Prot War, with highest upfront mit, lowest self healing, and BDK is the other end, with lowest upfront mit and highest self-healing
cerulean tusk
Just keep in mind, pwarr is low HPS. But if you relate it to the damage we take, we are up there
weak cedar
would most healers say that prot warrior is easier to heal than brew? i guess this is a weird question for a tank discord
pallid quiver
yes
weak cedar
lol
pallid quiver
So they don't do the upfront mit part
Combine that with the low self-healing part
you end up with the healer popping CDs to keep 1 guy alive
cerulean tusk
We don't count ppl that don't press buttons for the discussion. If we did, BDK would be the worst tank in this discussion
pallid quiver
i dunno, i've had better no button pressing BDKs than Prot Wars
because they can happen to press a button after the fact and be better off
cerulean tusk
No way, they get one shot 
pallid quiver
would most healers say that prot warrior is easier to heal than brew? i guess th...
At any rate both Prot War and Brew are very easy to heal from a healer perspective
Brew requires the most attention on average, but due to stagger, it's very smooth intake pretty much guaranteed
And the thing that makes tanks hard to heal is spiking
This would normally make BDKs very hard to heal, but they can almost always just self maintain if played right, so you just don't heal them
cerulean tusk
Pwarr is so great at being predictable, 10/10
Would recommend
Maybe not after rage changes, but meh
weak cedar
would most people say brew is harder than war?
ive tried brew and offensively brew feels a lot simpler and has a more "static" rotation with no procs
while on warrior i find myself constantly looking at my weakaura for procs
but defensively warrior seems way simpler
so im not sure how to compare those
pallid quiver
On average, Brew's been considered harder to play well than Prot War
Particularly when playing Blackout Combo
violet ginkgo
but defensively warrior seems way simpler
Well kind of simple yeah basically if your rage cycling is good then Ignore pain and Shield Block should be up all the time, these 2 already cut some damage intake.
Now you just need to know what is some hard hitting skill or tank buster then cast Spell Reflect/Spell Block/Shield Wall according to the situation.
onyx pike
is there a way to make a macro that has 2 spells on 1 button (only 1 learned) and automatically switches?
I have demolish for Silken mythic where i usually have my stormbolt
pallid quiver
Yes; I think there's like a learned modifier for macros?
I'd have to check what it is again, dang
onyx pike
#showtooltip
/cast [known:Execution Sentence] Execution Sentence; [known:384052] Wake of Ashes; Templar's Verdict
does this look correct?
was a quick google search
onyx pike
it works
#showtooltip /cast [known:Thunderous Roar] Thunderous Roar; [known:Champion's Spear, @cursor] Champion's Spear
love chatGPT haha
tribal wharf
when gpt is good its good
otherwise meh
like alot of things in life
sometimes gpt has really poor answers, not always
heavy sparrow
what addon can make you do /simc
tribal wharf
"Basic Rotation for DPS and Shield Block Uptime
Start with Shield Block:
Always have Shield Block active to maximize uptime. Use Rage to refresh it when needed.
Use Shield Slam on cooldown:
Prioritize Shield Slam for high damage and Rage generation.
Spam Revenge when it procs:
Use Revenge when it’s free or if you have excess Rage.
Maintain Thunder Clap:
Apply Thunder Clap on cooldown to keep AoE damage and slow enemies.
Avatar and Demoralizing Shout:
Use Avatar during burst windows.
Pair with Demoralizing Shout for extra Rage and mitigation."
see what i mean?
"spam revenge" i saw that and i instantly knew
rest of its kinda okay
ya like, it knows what a dragon flight and the maw and the wall legendary effect is all about
lofty warren
Why blizz spend all this time making every mob has some spam cast or group buff nonsense or other BS when all anyone wants to do is blow up all the enemies?
dry maple
I dont know if im going to tank as my war now, no matter how i look at it... going to rough to play now after the patch. I do hope they revert their idea on rage.
lofty warren
They didn't nerf pwar.?
chilly brook
Why blizz spend all this time making every mob has some spam cast or group buff ...
Idk it's honestly my least favorite part of M+
chilly brook
They didn't nerf pwar.?
Pretty sure he's referring to 11.1 changes
which are a nerf
chilly brook
look at the pins
lofty warren
Are any tier lists updated for 11.1?
sweet summit
yeah i'll look into the future real quick brb
wild chasm
As always we can count on erga
sweet summit
I have been informed that it is in fact, over
sick sentinel
Are any tier lists updated for 11.1?
Is it an intention to force usage of new tier sets?
dry maple
They didn't nerf pwar.?
Sry, speaking about the 11.1 patch im not looking forward to.
lofty warren
No I just want to know if pwar is low tier so I can change to the good one now
Even though I did like the gameplay but if blizz gonna make it illegal to play then gotta adjust
frosty mango
Don’t really understand their rationale on the 11.1 changes because it’s going to not only slam dps it’s probably going to make it feel bad because of the rage changes
It’s not like warrior was overpowered on either a dps OR servivability front
mighty valley
yeah we don't think they get the full ramifications
rain light
blizzard wants to make sure everyone is playing prot pally
mighty valley
if they want to achieve their stated goals the rework has to be more comprehensive than "rage down, IP up"
frosty mango
I can deal with doing shit dps that’s a tuning thing
mighty valley
we just have to hope they hear that feedback
frosty mango
But changing spec fundamentals like rage gen changes how it feels to play
And throughout all of wow history anyone can tell you “not enough rage = not enough fun”
How they continue to miss that point is wild to me
mighty valley
well
i think there's a middle point in feel between right now and not having enough rage to press buttons
lofty warren
Sorry that was only part of the post. Here is his full dissertation
mighty valley
the problem is they've put so much power into the act of spending rage
it's clearly not that intuitive since we have to tell new people all the time to pump rage into IP even if you're at IP cap
i just want them to articulate what making meaningful choices on rage spending would look like
our decision making won't change at all if these patch notes go live
lofty warren
I just think they want pwar dead
mighty valley
I just think they want pwar dead
please engage your brain
lofty warren
What you mean?
mighty valley
why on earth would they want to make a spec unplayable
chilly brook
I don't think they want it dead
But I do think they don't understand the class
idk which is worse
dusky patrol
helloo, i just decided to level a prot warri, its my first tank ever and just a question regarding QoL, is it recommended to use WAs or addons for rage tracking e.g?
or is it in the leveling process enough to just hammer my spells
aggro*
not rage
chilly brook
I would always recommend using a general prot specific WA
like Nom's
no you don't need anything special to track aggro
mighty valley
most people here like a nameplate addon like plater for threat highlighting
but while leveling, you basically just smash shield slam > thunderclap > revenge
and your offensive CDs when you get them
lofty warren
why on earth would they want to make a spec unplayable
They rotate which specs are good to indicate which specs ppl should play instead of just 1 the whole time?
dusky patrol
like Nom's
got the luxthros one for the start
chilly brook
I'd recommend Nomeratur's
dusky patrol
okay
chilly brook
pallid quiver
why on earth would they want to make a spec unplayable
Demo WoD
chilly brook
You get more relevant information provided to you since it's created by our TC
pallid quiver
they actively would rather have not had people play it due to the upcoming Legion rework
dusky patrol
You get more relevant information provided to you since it's created by our TC
thank you!
dusky patrol
first i need to get a shield 
lofty warren
Sir are reasonable ballparks and quantifiables available on this?
chilly brook
He said something like we'd need a 30% buff
lofty warren
Here is my 11.1 m+ tier list prediction (arrows indicate which go up/down)
cerulean tusk
Well, we still C tier, so we are fine
chilly brook
Personally I don't find it "fine"
cerulean tusk
It's fine, all is fine, it fine.
chilly brook
But then again I'm just a salty fuck over the changes
cerulean tusk
That is fair, pwarr play really well atm - slowing it down, well, not a fan.
pallid quiver
We'll be fine performance wise, although way behind in DPS. The bigger issue is that either we have a dev who phyisically does not understand the design of the class, or the dev is willing to just lie straight to our faces to push changes through
chilly brook
Here is my 11.1 m+ tier list prediction (arrows indicate which go up/down)
The irony of this picture is that both Brew and Guardian are ahead of the top prot warrior this season
pallid quiver
Neither is good for the long term health of the class
lofty warren
The picture i sent originates from current tier list
pallid quiver
Even if they rollback the changes, the root problem still exists
chilly brook
The picture i sent originates from current tier list
Yes
I'm aware
You should read what I said
cerulean tusk
If I had to guess, the dev who decided on the changes - and the one who wrote the notes, are not the same, nor did they communicate.
Prob 3 steps between them.
lofty warren
You said that brew is ahead but the picture doesn't show that
pallid quiver
There's absolutely no review in that case, which is also problematic
chilly brook
You said that brew is ahead but the picture doesn't show that
Correct the picture doesn't but raider.io does
pallid quiver
You said that brew is ahead but the picture doesn't show that
Damn, guess all those people who aren't playing top 1 chars in fighting games are cheating then
chilly brook
hence why I said "the irony of that picture"
lofty warren
Let me check the other tier lost
chilly brook
Tier lists are irrelevant
lofty warren
Where to find tier list on raider io?
What is your evidence that brew above pwar on raider io
chilly brook
cerulean tusk
chilly brook
There's your evidence
Only 1 warrior in top 100 tanks
and a handful of brews and guardian druids
lofty warren
But that is the top top ppl. What drives tier list is not the very top that are bug abusing or whatever?
mighty valley
it's not the only measure of balance
chilly brook
They're bug abusing?
spiral jetty
Good god man
mighty valley
but that's why tier lists are pretty weak
balance is more multi-dimensional in reality
lofty warren
Yea skill cap plays into tier list (at least for my practical purposes)
cerulean tusk
If brew stack with mastery, they can get a big bump from the ring. But prob other things out there as well.
chilly brook
If brew stack with mastery, they can get a big bump from the ring. But prob othe...
The ring just came out
it hasn't had an impact
lofty warren
Like if old bm hunter was like low s tier dps or current complex dps rotation is regular s. The effective tier list for me would have bm higher because it's easier to execute
chilly brook
BM hunter has a complex rotation currently?
cerulean tusk
Nop, why?
tribal wharf
looks like i picked a good time to break from wow lol
cerulean tusk
Heh, ya did
lofty warren
No it's an example of 1 - easy rotation spec vs 2 - hard rotation spec
If brew is lower on archon tier list why do they make up more of the top 100?
tribal wharf
but uh, like for me, its like, i dont mind if its slower if its dealing damage still
chilly brook
Enhance is "hard" and it's S+ tier basically, I don't think difficulty of the spec should have any bearing
sharp gale
BM hunter has a complex rotation currently?
You just have to fit the kill shot in the rotation I think, not super complicated
sweet summit
you need to stop thinking about tier lists
tribal wharf
i wish the whole game was slower and less pin point pain points on timers
chilly brook
you need to stop thinking about tier lists
real
tribal wharf
like, oh, we can take a minute break at the boss, to explain the mechanics wait for healer reconnect
cerulean tusk
can you buy low level shields in origrimmar by any chance?
Auction House
chilly brook
like, oh, we can take a minute break at the boss, to explain the mechanics wait...
You don't have to do M+
and if you do just don't do it when you know you can't dedicate 20-30m to the key
¯_(ツ)_/¯
sharp gale
like, oh, we can take a minute break at the boss, to explain the mechanics wait...
That’s exactly what I did the first couple weeks
cerulean tusk
You can take breaks for a few min in the 1-11 range
plenty of time to stop and talk
sharp gale
On third boss nw for example
tribal wharf
i'd rather feel like i'm slightly more towards over powered. as the patch ends forwhatever im fighting at the time
sharp gale
They shouldn’t add dmg increase to guile in my opinion
tribal wharf
like with half life say the end of the first chapter whenver im seeing headcrabs i want like a pistol and maybe shot gun or some other higher tier weapon, then im back to struggle, and then at end of the next chapter im fighting army men and aliens so i want a shotgun and grenades and stuff
little bit struggle fine but something to work over
cerulean tusk
I have no clue where you are going with this
tribal wharf
i feel as though it is too much almost arbitrary a b testing did you do everything right or not
and its timed
so it ruins it for me, totally kills it
chilly brook
i feel as though it is too much almost arbitrary a b testing did you do everythi...
You can do a lot wrong and still time keys no problem....
tribal wharf
play half life 1, play half life 2, play doom and doom 2 and you will get it
any one of those
tribal wharf
go play it right now
cerulean tusk
I have played them, different games - I am so confused what the point is. Mind trying to reformulate it?
sweet summit
what the hell are you on about yogi
tribal wharf
game good, me play, game bad, me turn off
cerulean tusk
I am sorry to hear that you don't enjoy WoW
chilly brook
Yogi posting as usual
tribal wharf
i enjoy warcraft
cerulean tusk
Just not WoW, got ya'
tribal wharf
in general, i think the wheelchair and they do a rez in a cutscene and its like, almost like, the character does it lazily doesnt want to
cerulean tusk
Too much eggnog
sharp gale
My English skill is not enough developed
tribal wharf
im not dissapointed in the qaulity or that it happened but they way it was portrayed felt off, i think it looked great sure
chilly brook
I think I should just go back to listening to kpop edm mixes and go do keys on my undergeared vengeance DH
pallid quiver
What did I just read
Let me translate. I believe Yogi is complaining about the scene where Anduin gets Khadgar back up. He finds the emotions portrayed by the characters during it to be rather unflattering and unmoving, as if the characters engaged actually don't want to do it
cerulean tusk
How did you even manage to scrape together that context?
Gotta be an AI doing that
sharp gale
I thought khadgar died in the beginning
spiral jetty
You missed a chapter then
pallid quiver
I thought khadgar died in the beginning
someone hasn't been doing plot
That's where the wheelchair part comes in
tribal wharf
i thought that as well, until the cutscenes and a quest you find him near the landing point
pallid quiver
It's the large majority of the context
sharp gale
Yeah I skip all cinematics, I just watch the first ones
pallid quiver
There's even a whole mini-chapter where you chase after Xalatath
And Khadgar pokes out after you, Alleria, and Anduin utilize the power of not being petty bitches but still doing what you have to
but he finishes dying there, then anduin's like, "wait, i'm a paladin lmao"
pallid quiver
He was
sharp gale
So he br khadgar ok
lofty warren
Paladin is going to be the good tank next patch I think?
pallid quiver
So he br khadgar ok
This is the real reason Palas got BR in Dragonflight
cerulean tusk
Paladin is going to be the good tank next patch I think?
what does the tierlists say?
sharp gale
I thought rez was not an actual thing in the lore
tribal wharf
cuz next comes dk