protection

[jagged pier]

well its a 12 so suddenly cant press buttons or u die

[strong forum]

apparently

[rigid yew]

Tanks so damn paper this season you can't go wrong just spamming IP

[waxen cradle]

I don't know I know they want to redesign the wheel here but this ain't the way if you ask me

[strong forum]

the funny thing is

they JUST buffed Imp Wall

this season to 4 rage

and now "nah fam sorry gotta run it back"

[urban bane]

why are you picking on meeee 😭

[strong forum]

im not picking

im genuienly asking!

[jagged pier]

[urban bane]

https://tenor.com/view/kagami-hiiragi-kagami-hiiragi-hiiragi-kagami-lucky-star-gif-1045223700407532817

i am but an egg

[strong forum]

[chilly brook]

Are we?

[strong forum]

yeah apparently thats a thing this season

[hardy snow]

yea, redesign wheel by making it square :V

[strong forum]

most people complain about tanks dying mostly

and im here like

[waxen cradle]

AH well it is boys

[chilly brook]

Nothing really changed that much in the grand scheme of things from last xpac to this xpac at least if you were pressing buttons

[jagged pier]

well we will next season

[strong forum]

we will still be sturdy

[chilly brook]

Like sure we’re not as tanky as we were

But we’re still not paper

[strong forum]

but we deal less dmg

and play a bit more clunky

[dusky canopy]

Tanks gotta play properly to live

[jagged pier]

ppl already struggle now and they are gunna have even less rage

in the general consensus of the game

[strong forum]

it will just be turbo off meta agian

[jagged pier]

warrior will be dogshit

[strong forum]

vdh and ppal meta

[dusky canopy]

Hopefully buff warrior

[waxen cradle]

Don't worry they will fix us for 3/4th or 2/3rds of a Season in 12.0 it's all good

[torpid fiber]

oh yay. i love the vdh gameplay of you better hope you dont fail a few parries in a row

[rigid yew]

God forbid you don't have a defensive for 1 of the 300 tank busters
12+ will literally one shot you

[chilly brook]

It’s like the brews that I see these days, they complain about how bad they are when they’re the best they’ve been in years for keys

[chilly brook]

I’m on my last 12

I don’t get one shot

And yes at some point pressing defensives for big hits does matter

[shrewd grove]

The tank changes just made it more punishing if you aren't playing correctly. So bad tanks get folded like cheap laundry

[strong forum]

pwar has the comfy part of being able to reflect or block 90% of tankbusters this season

[wicked pollen]

how do you get oneshot

like actually

[strong forum]

so theres not much that actually does anything to us

[chilly brook]

^

[wicked pollen]

are you just not playing the game

[chilly brook]

Minus the venomguards in CoT

Fuck those mobs

[wicked pollen]

only time ive been oneshot is being 585 in 10s

[hardy snow]

meanwhile in raid we cant block physcial tankbusters

[strong forum]

huh

which one

[wicked pollen]

its impossible to get oneshot in keys idk

[torpid fiber]

fuck City of Threads* fixed it for you

[hardy snow]

Kyveza physical part, Court big guy

Sikran phyiscal part, but it not big of a dmg, but still

[strong forum]

ah ok ye but they kinda dont matter tbh

you have SW for every combo on sikran

and spellblock/sw for most of kyveza rest is healer job

[hardy snow]

I know we can survive wihtout blocking it, I did, but still not cool :v

[chilly brook]

Not really impossible tbf, like if you’re not sending something on the dark claw cast in SV you’re probably gonna get clapped

But you should be able to no problem

[strong forum]

its possible to get "1shot"

but only really if you misplay earlier

[chilly brook]

Especially since you can reflect it and it does giga dam to the mob

[strong forum]

or if you arent knowledgable enough to know whats in the next few pulls going on

[wicked pollen]

i just dont know how its possible if you play human

[strong forum]

some people learn faster than others

[chilly brook]

Like I said take a natty shadow claw

[strong forum]

same with general awareness going on

[chilly brook]

But also I was able to time a 12 at 616 ilvl

So like

[strong forum]

some people are just turbo blinded by sensory overload in m+

[chilly brook]

People who are complaining about prot in 12s at 630+ just legit aren’t pressing their buttons

[torpid fiber]

thats why i wear horse blinders in m+. gotta stay focused and not get spooked

[wicked pollen]

idk only time ive been scared is doing 10s without gear

[dusky canopy]

Prot war is definitely sturdy

[chilly brook]

12s are just a wake up call

You either play well or you don’t

[dusky canopy]

If my dumbass can go into a 10 with a shield and sword after having been strictly dps for 2 years, a seasoned Prot player can very easily do it

[gentle violet]

Prot War only dies to getting hit in the back to much or not even mitigation or healing to sustain the inc damage on giant pulls. Never will die to 1 shots ATM.

[wicked pollen]

i agree

[gentle violet]

brew, BDK, VDH, Prot all got either not enough changes to make a difference or in our case nerfed. If they don’t tune/change again before S2, it will be ppal again or guardian cause guardians changes/set looks super solid.

[pallid quiver]

I've seen people complain about Prot in +7s

At 63x ilvl

[jagged pier]

would not suprise me

[pallid quiver]

They, in fact, are just not fucking playing the game they're paying for

[waxen cradle]

We may all be overreacting anyway as these changes may not see the live servers and that is certainly my hope. Either people will roll with the punches if that happens or jump ship. Not the first time we have seen nerfs and won't be the last

[hardy snow]

https://tenor.com/view/frankly-thats-a-skill-issue-hazzikostas-ion-ion-hazzikostas-skill-issue-gif-21595688

[pallid quiver]

One of them had their highest damage as Devastator

[jagged pier]

https://tenor.com/view/milj-milk-skill-issue-spill-issue-spill-gif-25572474

[gentle violet]

Praydge

[hardy snow]

its not the tuning itself thats worrying, as you said it may not go live, the important part is what they think, that they want us to have less fun spending rage

[pallid quiver]

No matter what they do, they're lost with me. My complaint, as I keep standing by, is over the reasoning they gave and how they objectively failed at that

So they're either lying to us for some reason or have just abandoned us to someone ridiculously incompetent. I'm still more mad about the reasoning for the Colo change, even

[waxen cradle]

@pallid quiver I absolutely agree there logic if you can call it that is fundamentally flawed. Hard to call this a logical scenario on there part though.

[hardy snow]

yea, its weird, its like it was done by some intern from cleaning service at their office, not by a dev

[wicked pollen]

@strong forum i think i figured out my cb issues in world

[chilly brook]

Honestly if they’re going to buff anything to make it pull ahead at least make it BDK, that way everyone can have fun

[wicked pollen]

just needed more reps

[chilly brook]

No such thing, blizz should be told that these changes are ass so they can fix them

[urban bane]

GPT is doing the tuning direction

[waxen cradle]

@chilly brook Completely agree there ass and should not make to to live servers. Though I doubt they care what I think.

[pallid quiver]

That wouldn't even surprise me

[waxen cradle]

If not the tuning then at the very least there blue posts as if you read it carefully you notice the post contradicts itself. Glitch in there AI

[shrewd grove]

Chat GPT unironically has better (vague) ideas for improving prot

[cyan bronze]

?

Did you see the vdh changes

If you’re including any non ppal tanks

vdh should be one

[chilly brook]

Vdh changes looked nice

[cyan bronze]

Very good

Very very good

[chilly brook]

Well other than their hero talent damage getting nerfed

[gentle violet]

Blizz just needs to use more AI

[cyan bronze]

The tierset encourages aldrachi

Fwiw

[chilly brook]

Which is ass

[cyan bronze]

meh

aldrachi is good

[chilly brook]

Aldrachi feels bad

[cyan bronze]

tankier when played well

[chilly brook]

Nah

[cyan bronze]

just hard to play well

[chilly brook]

It’s not

[cyan bronze]

vdh is so weak it needs felscarred 36 sec meta window to look at any of the scary pulls this season

is part of the issue

but we

[chilly brook]

TLDR it’s not tankier

[waxen cradle]

Got to admit with the little I have played Colossus as I prefer MThane the change to Colo makes me laugh a bit, more of a sarcastic laugh not a real one

[cyan bronze]

i have also talked to meyra and topple in dms, yes griff

[dusky canopy]

If they’re saying that both are comparable then I would preference the one that requires less thought so that you can focus more on the dungeon mechanics instead

[cyan bronze]

ye, felscarred is tankier inside of cds

weaker outside

the idea is that if vdh isn’t uselessly squishy then you can live whatever pull with aldrachi meta

[chilly brook]

Fel scarred is just more fun

[cyan bronze]

meh

i hate fel scarred also

and have played significantly more aldrachi

[chilly brook]

Meta being a dps cd is fun

[cyan bronze]

so I’ll admit I’m heavily biased

[chilly brook]

Also more meta is great

[cyan bronze]

meta being a dps cd is awful

and more meta is bland

imo

[chilly brook]

In some aspects it is awful

Holding meta sucks because you know you need it for something else

But if you don’t it’s fun

[cyan bronze]

yep

aldrachi also feels rewarding to play

[chilly brook]

I should probably gear my dh more

But I mean you could also just play around the fact that you have a window you want to play around anyways outside of bosses

I.e. don’t just do the “normal” routes and play around your meta specifically

Should line up well with DPS CDs anyways

[cyan bronze]

yeah idk

also i think aldrachi’s rotational difficulties are a bit overstated; it’s just that felscarred you could time keys just hitting meta and letting healer heal you

[chilly brook]

It’s just weird

Maybe I didn’t get it

[cyan bronze]

it’s not too bad

[vestal moat]

how much of a damage buff would we need to compensate for these rage nerfs?

[dusky canopy]

400%

[wild chasm]

150% would be nice to catch up to palas

[strong forum]

im guesstimating 30%

[dusky canopy]

Nomer, what’s your highest damage key so far just curious?

[strong forum]

NW with 1.82mil

[dusky canopy]

Dayum!

💪

[strong forum]

was actually yesterday funnily enough

cant remember which keylevel tho

[dusky canopy]

Any monk Aug?

[pallid quiver]

+58, ofc

[strong forum]

no aug

[dusky canopy]

I mean it is nomer talking lmao

Prolly

[strong forum]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/vhAfxjcQVawyYtGZ?fight=last&type=damage-done

nah just +11

hadnt done NW in like 2 months

so i was kinda surprised

[wild chasm]

Do you have the route that you ran?

[pallid quiver]

That is why you should assume a +10

Nome cba to push

[strong forum]

i can whip it up rq

[dusky canopy]

If you’re doing 1.8m your dps must be doing like 3m

[pallid quiver]

I mean, the log is there

you can look at it

[strong forum]

did this i think

[pallid quiver]

doesn't warcraftlogs have an option to show only active dps somewhere

[strong forum]

mouseover

[wild chasm]

Pretty crazy stuff there

[strong forum]

this + a few reflects here and there

[pallid quiver]

that's where it was

[strong forum]

and youre at 1.8mil

[wild chasm]

Looks like a lot of overpercentage though

[strong forum]

not rly

pretty standard route

[dusky canopy]

Yeah it looks fairly standard

[pallid quiver]

I think you can skip like a pack or two near the start, but I also haven't looked at routes since

literally ever

[dusky canopy]

You rocked it that’s for sure!

[pallid quiver]

Highest on details would have been 2.2m for the reason I was checking active dps

[frozen berry]

Could anyone tell me why i'd want a macro for Ignore Pain that casts shield slam? Is there a reset somewhere when doing ignore pain?

[strong forum]

auto attacks

[pallid quiver]

It can help catch resets from Devastator

[frozen berry]

ok fair enough

just streamlining a little bit

[dusky canopy]

It’s worth having

Can’t go wrong by having it

While you’re here just incase it wasn’t clear you still want to have your regular SS bind

[frozen berry]

Yeah of course

its just to use when you're wanting to press ignore pain

[dusky canopy]

Yep!

[frozen berry]

and in the offchance you catch a reset in that press

since IP is off the gcd

[dusky canopy]

Number goes up!

[frozen berry]

is the standard M+ build the one from Archon also?

[dusky canopy]

I’d recommend wowhead or iceyveins

[frozen berry]

wowhead is normally trash imo, stuff is outdated at least for dps

[dusky canopy]

Mwahi and nomer spend a lot of time on them and are active here if you have questions

[frozen berry]

may be different with prot

[dusky canopy]

Nomer maintains the apl for Prot and also plays it at basically the highest skill ceiling he also maintains the wowhead

Definitely safe to trust his information

You can also just play around with different builds from different places and stick with what works best for you

[tardy abyss]

The standard build from Archon is pretty bad actually

But it doesnt matter because playing properly will get you through keys

[frozen berry]

I gotcha, i appreciate the feedback

[shy python]

Lol don't tell that @steady karma 😂

[steady karma]

Yeah, because "random user who joins and leaves the server every few months" is a real expert authority

[pallid quiver]

based response

I was waiting for that before I make food

Thanks for bringing a smile to my face in these dark times, Archi

[steady karma]

Glad I can be there for you

https://tenor.com/view/egg-frank-can-i-offer-you-a-nice-egg-in-this-trying-time-gif-13802522

[frozen berry]

Wasn’t saying for warrior dps mind you, don’t play warrior dps in TWW

You can’t tell me all of the people that write for wowhead are spot on with their updates, because they aren’t

[steady karma]

https://tenor.com/view/safety-inspector-walk-backward-gif-11917549

keep goin

[frozen berry]

Not walking it back my guy, just wasn’t trying to shit on you, specifically and wanted it to be known

[steady karma]

You are absolutely walking it back
"wowhead is normally trash imo, stuff is outdated at least for dps"
"oh but not you, just other people"

whether you believe it to be true or not, the comment was rude, unnecessary, and irrelevant to the conversation, so why don't we all just move on

[tardy abyss]

From my experience most wowhead guides arent outdated

dunno

[strong forum]

okay stonevault is also good for overall

noted

just did 1.78mil

no monk this time

[chilly brook]

Most of the wowhead guides are maintained by the class discord TC's???

[hollow citrus]

this might be a dumb question, but as long as i have a good shield, its better for me to set my loot preferences to fury, for trinkets, right?

[tardy abyss]

Missing a good 1h weapon but you can do that yes

[keen leaf]

1.78 DPS? I fucking suck at prot lol

[tardy abyss]

Hes going full dps mode with colossus

And various other talents you wouldnt play in high keys

[strong forum]

just standard colossus build

it is high key viable

[tardy abyss]

Is it

[keen leaf]

ohhh. I was about to say, I did like 1.1m max but I only play MT

[strong forum]

just not recommended

its straight up standard colossus build

its just squishier than thane

highest as thane was only 1.4mil

but i basically never play thane cuz its boring and sad to look at how little dmg it does

[keen leaf]

I understand that, I like the lightning theme, but im over it now

[strong forum]

playstyle is boring

[keen leaf]

warrior is my lowest DPS tank

[strong forum]

and just looking at dps meter and being so low is depressing as thane

[keen leaf]

Gonna try out Colossus in keys then, lol

[strong forum]

need some crit on your gear tho

[keen leaf]

who needs survivability when ur doing 10s at 635

[strong forum]

can easily play 12s with it aswell

prolly up to 14 comfortably

[keen leaf]

I just started pushing 12s last week, theyre not as bad as people act

[merry trout]

hey in the upcoming 11.1 patch, those warrior changes, are they nerfs or buffs? i couldnt tell

[strong forum]

explained in pins

but its a significant nerf

[keen leaf]

hopefully more changes are coming, those look awful

[strong forum]

need a compensatory dps buff

if we dont get one, its likely a meme season for us

[keen leaf]

That's about par for warrior lol

[strong forum]

eh we were competetive all of DF

but this nerf is quite something, and out of nowhere

[keen leaf]

I cant speculate, I only played s3 & 4

[strong forum]

s3 and s4 is when we were our strongest

dmg wise behind, but not bad

[shut summit]

they should revert the indom nerf too, where it takes more rage to proc

[keen leaf]

I love prot warrior right now, I think my only complaint is its damage is lower than my other tanks

[strong forum]

yea

indom nerf wont make ANY sense with the coming rage nerfs

[urban portal]

10% aura buff

[vale bobcat]

the lack of attention to avatar uptime due to worse anger management is also annoying. Presumably that's what they were addressing with the shield wall CD but they left avatar as is.

[shut summit]

very half-baked

[cyan bronze]

Weren’t we good s4

Iirc pwar was second best

at least in title representation

[pallid quiver]

All tanks were good in S4, even S3 of DF

[cyan bronze]

no I know

I mean relative

like wasn’t prot the second most played in title range s4

[pallid quiver]

there was just one that was a little better, especially in community eyes, so all other stats got diminished

I think it might have been, but it was so miniscule it was barely a meaningful blip

[strong forum]

pwar was 2nd best since s2

in theory

just under- and misrepresented

like always

[shut summit]

next season gona be even more bleak if shit dont change

[wild chasm]

I mean it is from the usual place- some wicked head in blizzard. They don't play their own game after all

[mighty valley]

(Boston voice) I’d like some wicked head

[chilly brook]

Time to move onto 13s

[strong forum]

all 12s isnt even 3k nani

[shrewd grove]

I think it can be if you time them well enough? Idk what the math is

I feel like I hit 3k without a 13

[dusky canopy]

He just needs like 3 maybe 4 13s

That’ll be 3k

[sharp olive]

Has the Gem hot fix gone live

[fringe chasm]

Gem fix is live

[oak ivy]

Has anyone cooked what gems we should be running

[marsh dove]

afaik it's these

[fringe chasm]

equiping this ring will drop me a lot of haste, would it be recommended to use the gem that will give me haste?

in order to get back to my haste point to run ITF

[wooden widget]

Sim

[sharp gale]

Well you can’t sim if you have enough haste to take ITF in m+

(For m+) If you go way low haste threshold when you equip the ring with no haste maybe sim between ITF no cyrce/hr cyrce, itf cyrce and haste gem if you have enough etc

[fringe chasm]

what am I simming for exactly as prot?

isint the haste "requirement" for ITF to basically have a decent uptime on SB?

[mighty valley]

simming for dps is typically just the best way to settle your tiebreakers between two items that are close

[cinder marsh]

ok so i have the crafted sword and shield because i was lazy to get the gear, im getting into the endgame where stats and gear matter, should i keep them or get the BIS from raid and dungeons?

they are 619 i can make them 639

[jagged gust]

up to you, crafted 636 sword+shield is pre-bis, but personally I just sat with hero gear until vault gave me myth pieces

but with how cheap enchanted crests are now it's hard to say not to craft

[median garnet]

So are we cooked do I have to be a paladin?

[tulip geyser]

I was watching a +15 stonevault from kiratank and seems like a prot warrior can intervene someone to prevent the damage from golems ground pound?

I thought we could only block directed damage towards a player not aoe hits

[fringe chasm]

ground pound does magic dmg, so i assume he shielded part of it with Stormshield?

[tulip geyser]

i dont know that ablility? but he calls it out which is why i thought he could block the damage. Here is the clip

https://youtu.be/V7I6zG2Igss?t=112

The rogue seems to not take damage

[tulip geyser]

Nvm found the ability, I never knew it gave a shield that is very helpful for magic damage to the group

[oak ivy]

Gamers am i banned for running seabed leviathan

Stam + Thorns

[final mist]

yes

[oak ivy]

[mighty valley]

i'd wait til we're closer to the patch to see if any of this goes live. but if you can't live if you're not meta, you should be paladin already

[oak ivy]

ok in my defense sims appear to not consider it

[lone hemlock]

Not being meta is one thing (and fine for many)- the class playing like garbage and rage starved is another thing. Time will tell.

[proven ice]

Rage gen reduced in 11.1 so we can’t spam ignore pain

So we’re just getting one shot now?

[fringe chasm]

nerfing ignore pain spam so we get more agency

[dim moth]

I’m completely ok not being meta, but I’ve got a feeling we gonna be resource starved which isnt fun in any iteration

[violet ginkgo]

I mean to be fair some ppl ask “what to do if IP still cap? Do we still cast it?” So I don’t think we getting 1 shot is the issue.

The issue is they felt we dumping rage to IP too much but what can we do? IP is nice because not on gcd.
If they don’t like us dumping rage on IP then give us some damage button off gcd.

[mighty valley]

i think there's an issue with the play being a little unintuitive that's maybe worth solving

this isn't how to do it

and it probably takes a way more meaningful change than is appropriate for right now

[knotty pewter]

I wonder if Instigate + Battering Ram will now be one of our higher rage generating options. (with the tierset giving more Shield Charges)

[warm apex]

Who even asked to stop spamming ignore pain. The devs dont even play the game. Bad change.

[violet ginkgo]

Who? Well I think devs listen to players who said “Do I still have to press IP while my IP still max/near max value?”
Then instead of giving us off gcd damage button they be like “Let’s nerf the rage gain so they don’t spam IP to avoid overcap.”

[strange night]

This smells like heroic strike my man !

[jagged pier]

Bring her back

[sweet summit]

🙅

[round pendant]

I think ignore pain spam is dumb

just because it's extra APM and is super braindead gameplay (just don't rage cap)

but this change ain't it lmao

Just ruins the spec entirely imo

[violet ginkgo]

Heroic strike ftw!

[violet ginkgo]

Y U no like off gcd heroic strike? Too cancer?

[sweet summit]

I think some mechanics are best left in the dirt

[formal geyser]

What gem u guys using?

[jagged pier]

Depending on your gear tho wont be an upgrade until high ilvl tho

[quaint sinew]

i just followed wowhead

[tribal wharf]

if its the old disc, sure

where you deal damage to make healing

[fair beacon]

is the cyrce ring bis for us now? if so, which citrine?

[jagged pier]

u sim for yourself

it will be bis tho eventually

[violet ginkgo]

New disc is not like that? Sorry I got 0 knowledge on priest.

[obsidian girder]

Dslice sim fine for m+ or not maintained for prot ?

[jagged pier]

it is not

[inland garnet]

Hey, is there a pin with the most interesting Citrine gems for prot? Can't find the exact wowhead page

[jagged pier]

just go to gear

its under best gear page

[inland garnet]

Oh got it tnx 🙂

[tribal wharf]

it came from twitter

[sick sentinel]

oh no

[lean ledge]

Is it just me or does it seem like prot is taking more damage since the patch? I was tanking 11's before and now im doing 8/9's with the same pulls and struggling to stay alive when it wasnt a problem in an 11.

[primal sentinel]

https://i.imgur.com/oQBpg4I.png
am i blinde?

or something is wrong?

[strong forum]

ignore

datamining

[silent shard]

Any toughts about prot rage nerfs?

[strong forum]

pins

[silent shard]

After i send my message i find it, thanks xdd

[strong forum]

xd

😄

happens

[silent shard]

Sometimes i do things before thinking 😄

[primal sentinel]

sry???

[jagged pier]

ignore it

its not gone anywhere

[high wyvern]

Why is Prot getting nerf again? We arent even meta

[strong forum]

cuz blizzard cant cope with the CPM of thane

probably

[high wyvern]

But the feedback is that Thane Prot “feels” good to play right now even tho its not meta like Prot Paly

Why change a good playstyle

[silent shard]

Because they love to nerf the fun things

[high wyvern]

I understand if we were OP like prot pally and is brought to like 95% keys

But thats not even us

[raw parcel]

We just need to ensure everyone who mains prot warrior doesn't just rage here. When feedback opens up, flood them with feedback. They need to hear loud and clear that this is a mistake, and why.

Either that or I need to dust off my paladin ;~;

[shrewd grove]

Yeah, historically they've taken that feedback to heart lol

[late lotus]

Where would we give them said feedback, forums?

[pallid quiver]

Or we loterally all just don't play prot war, even in ptr

[raw parcel]

On one hand, yes, they are often slow to fix problems. They're even slower to fix them if they don't have people with bullhorns announcing the problems though.

And unlike Brewmaster, Prot Warrior is a real spec people actually play and care about, so slightly higher odds of us being repaired.

(No offense to the two brewmasters out there)

[cinder marsh]

anybody got a macro that shows up on ur screen when heals run out of mana>

[dapper vapor]

Feels ironic too that Prot Pally is looking even better next patch

[regal yarrow]

Is there a reason that guides don't say to keep the flesh crafters alive in necrotic wake anymore so that you can use it to help kill mobs or bosses? Was it patched out in shadowlands at some point?

Or even past guides, why you don't generally see people doing or even trying it

[cyan bronze]

https://tenor.com/view/miss-you-gif-11374444315394231730

My only hope for ppal not being meta is ret or hpal being super broken next tier inshallah

[fluid widget]

That just means you would use ret and prot

Paladin utility doesn’t get weaker when you stack it

[cyan bronze]

Inshallah our only hope for ppal not being meta next tier is that ppal is dogshit and can’t live the pulls

You are actually right tho yeah

[fleet flicker]

who needs gear to do 10s

[violet ginkgo]

Blizz doesn’t like when protwar (or warrior in general) having fun with their class/spec.

[dapper vapor]

Does seem like a more elegant solution would be to have an off gcd offensive rage dump ability if they dont like spamming a defensive button to build offensive momentum

[violet ginkgo]

Which is the old heroic strike

Though I don’t think they will bring it back again.

[dapper vapor]

take revenge off the gcd, and demo shout while youre at it

[vital pollen]

Prot warrior right now literally one of the best playing tanks in the history of the game. Imagine being a professional game dev and being like, "Hm let's mess with that."

[jagged pier]

u mean intern they gave the spec too

[dapper vapor]

I mean they're right that warrior defensive play is too easy right now, its literally just all about optimising for offense

But at the same time our offense needs optimisation and this hurts bad

[vital pollen]

What's wrong with that?

Like seriously.

Playing BrM to defensive perfection is rocket science compared to every other spec. Playing Ret paladin to perfection is easy compared to most DPS specs. This game has always has wildly different degrees of complexity for optimal play from spec-to-spec within the same role.

So not rhetorical - why do you think it's bad if warrior's have easy defensive play, but modestly complex offensive play?

[dapper vapor]

I dont know that I agree with the philosophy, just the analysis

But I'd assume they'd argue that tanking, as a role, should involve more weighting on figuring out defensive control over offensive control which is what a DPS does

I am just assuming that though

[vital pollen]

Yeah, seems reasonable. I think having a tank whose gameplay is more offensively focused is fine though. Even desirable. I don't like tanking per se - I just like prot warriors.

Make prot slower and less offensive? I just won't play it, I'll go back to DPS. And I think a lot of other people will too. I think yo usee the issue there...

[dapper vapor]

Yeah it definitely seems like a shot in the foot generally that the "solution" they've come to is to make the spec just like, less fun

[vital pollen]

Anecdotally, I think that the more offensively tanks play in M+, the more people play them.

Same with healers, hence the current apocalyptic state of M+ healing.

[cinder marsh]

anybody got a macro that shows up on ur screen when heals run out of mana>

[long kayak]

what gems are we supposed to use in the ring?

[long kayak]

usually you notice it when your health stops bouncing up and down

[dapper vapor]

I'm sure that's true although everything I've seen from the random comments about M+ gripes are that M+ is basically a game of the Tank and Healer controlling the entire experience and taking responsiblity for failure while the DPS blast, and interrupt if you're lucky, so that particular issue is there's just too much mental required for most people who play solo

[cinder marsh]

but im not sure how to get the last gem

[long kayak]

great all of the ones i dont have xD

[cinder marsh]

got the other 2

[long kayak]

the stormbringer is super bugged

[dapper vapor]

Think you buy it from the Tortollan vendor

[vital pollen]

That might be the perception. The reality is ofc that the DPS are critical. Only difference is that criticality is defined by n / 3 . But as a tank I really notice DPS performance.

[dapper vapor]

Trying to get Stormbringer like

[vital vale]

yall actually wiping to the event boss?

[strong forum]

Not wiping

[vital vale]

or am i missing something

[strong forum]

It's bugged and the event despqwns before you can kill the boss

[wheat bronze]

The world quest despawns in like 15 seconds

[strong forum]

So you have to kill the boss while the cave is being opened

[vital vale]

oh rip, glad i got it this morning

[strong forum]

By pulling it out early

Any pet class or mage can pull the boss early as the cave event is ticking down

Mage can blink through and pets can just walk through

So just do that

And you'll get your gems

[wheat bronze]

Obligatory "I never pull out"

[mellow heath]

do we use the ring at this ilvl? the amount of haste i loose feels crazy

[dapper vapor]

Just sim with and without it

[long kayak]

thank you for the info 🙂

[strong forum]

Sim says it's a 25k upgrade

I trust sim

And it appears to be working

[fleet flicker]

🤷‍♂️ worked fine when I killed it

[strong forum]

https://i.imgur.com/y7Xo9OH.png

ring works good

[strong forum]

then you got lucky

[fleet flicker]

heroic parses

[strong forum]

would do mythic but our tanks cant for the life of them play dps

so anlaki

[wicked pollen]

so how do thry do damage

[strong forum]

they dont

[fleet flicker]

[pallid quiver]

Raid tanks not beating the allegations

[tardy abyss]

One of our tanks is the same

The jump from tank to dps is not even big

[pallid quiver]

But is your tank doing dps, tho

[cerulean vine]

Does anyone have a focus target macro for Pummel by chance?

[wheat bronze]

Depends what you want it to do

[wicked pollen]

/cast [@focus] Pummel```

[wheat bronze]

something like this? /cast [@focus,exists,nodead,harm][] Pummel

[cerulean vine]

I didn't know there was a difference to be honest. Was just needing something for M+ x3

[wheat bronze]

The one I wrote will pummel your focus if it exists, isn't dead, is harmful - otherwise it will Pummel your current target

[wicked pollen]

i dont see the reason in adding all the modifiers

[gentle violet]

Anyone do high keys with ring yet? Ring is 642 with BiS sockets and seems a bit worse to me but maybe I'm trolling. Sim shows a 10K dps gain in 5 mins but the loss of haste/vers seems bad right now.

[wicked pollen]

oh

[wheat bronze]

because you want to Pummel your current target if focus doesn't exist

[wicked pollen]

ico

i just had 2 binds

🙂

[wheat bronze]

You can do with like this, if shift then focus - otherwise target

/cast [mod:shift,@focus][] Pummel

Spice it up with other modifiers as needed

[carmine frigate]

The boss doesn't seem to spawn until the cave goes down tho

[strong forum]

Keep the previous boss alive by spam resetting it

Then re-trigger the event by handing it in at the table

[strong forum]

Define "seems bad"

Cuz iirc more stats > better stats still remains true

And the ring, especially with the legendary skipper, can proc multiple stat gems at the same time

Giving you extra 8k+ stats

For extended periods of time

[high wyvern]

Back to POE2 until next patch

[strong forum]

I gotta poomp

Get them new big numbers

[high wyvern]

If these prot warr changes come thru idk if ill be playing prot war next season

[strong forum]

I always will

And I'll always make it work

And, we're certain to receive dmg buffs as compensation

It'll be a feels fucking bad moment, but it all comes down to what we get as compensation (if we don't then it's just a laugh anyway)

Cuz what's the point of anything

[hardy snow]

I prefer current version instead of these notfun changes and dmg % buff compensation 😐

[strong forum]

Oh yeah certainly

I'm moreso hoping that it'll make colossus better

Cuz thane is just boring

[high wyvern]

It just doesnt seemed fun

Taking like half the rage gen away

[hardy snow]

and whats sad, if they do such dmg compensation - they will do it without even thinking for a second "WHY such compensation is need?"

[strong forum]

I'm 95% sure

Whoever came up with this nerf

[jagged pier]

cant play thane?

cause its too speedy

[strong forum]

Is absolutely not aware of the repercussions this nerf has

[jagged pier]

oh thats for sure

[strong forum]

Nah I fully expect them to not think that this is a dps nerf

Just a "shift in what you press when"

When it's not at all that

It's just a slow down of the entire spec

Nothing changes about the decision making process which they used to explain the nerf for

[jagged pier]

it just shows they dont actually know how the spec works anymore because u ask anyone in here what happens when u loose rage

the first thing they say is less Avatars

[high wyvern]

Slowing down the playstyle isnt necessarily a bad thing

But there are so many side effects of losing rage gen

[zealous narwhal]

since all gems were added is it worth equipping the new ring for m+?

[cerulean vine]

Sorry was in a dungeon, appreciate it!

[long kayak]

are we down to earth with using the mastery gem

because its going against all i ever know with stats atm

[untold bane]

Legendary skipper doesn't have ICD?

It can proc multiple citrines in a short period?

[dapper vapor]

Hopefully the problem is so obvious it'll be addressed during the next two months before patch right

[pallid quiver]

The spare 5% is the lingering unease that someone in Blizz just actually hates Prot War and wants it to suffer

they're mad that warriors are able to remove their bubble in pvp or something

[obsidian girder]

As zandalari paku (crit proc) is recommended?

[shell pendant]

Recently came back to the game and have been tanking some keys left and right and am now looking to craft some gear for upgrades, currently looking at boots but a ring is also looking tasty, what would be my best way to go?

https://raider.io/characters/eu/tarren-mill/Çirakh

[slow obsidian]

were not using this?

for dmg

[fluid widget]

Colossus is even more fucked tho right?

[strong forum]

not entirely

we will see

tierset heavily favours colossus

cuz crit = more colossal might stacks = more demolish

[strong forum]

sim yourself but according to my sims you want the stat ones

[pallid quiver]

inb4 proc rate for Colossus specifically is 1 proc per season

[brazen glacier]

Are we simming with dungeon slice if we mainly run mythics?

[strong forum]

nah

simming aoe is generally whatever

ST is what matters

you can use it as an informed decision

but take it with a grain of salt

[forest orbit]

Hi team. im new to prot warrior, 3 weeks in, and ive got a question regarding shield block. ive read guides claiming i must have shield block up 100% of combat time, but i cant seem to figure a way if i run Into the fray talent instead of Heavy repercussions. how do u guys go about this? br

[wild chasm]

What you want to have is 100% blocked hits, not exactly uptime. If you’re running Into the fray then you should have around 18k haste unbuffed at the least, with Shield Charge it should give you almost constant shield block

Not having block when there’s no hits incoming because the boss is channeling is fine, it’s the blocked hits that matter

[pallid quiver]

You're gonna run into those uptime issues without enough haste, by the way

So, like, run HR if it keeps dropping on you. You're really not missing out on that much

It is more damage, but it's not dramatically more damage

[night gate]

I ran with Bolster talented when i started out on my warrior, it helped me out a lot

[pallid quiver]

If you're grabbing Bolster, you're generally saccing something of note or going way overboard on SB uptime

[night gate]

Yes, i didn´t have Spell Block, but it worked out fine since i wasn´t doing very high keys anyways. Obviously not adviceable if you´re doing higher keys than like 10´s

[harsh trellis]

Has the legendary skippers citrine been availble for anyone yet

[mortal pecan]

I thought mastery was no good for war

[jagged pier]

yes

[tardy abyss]

Mastery is good but we dont wanna stack it

[smoky anvil]

There are no bad stats, only slightly better ones. Except haste. He’s first amongst equals.

[mortal pecan]

So what do the raw stats look like with those gems?

[harsh trellis]

Oh I bet the legendary skippers citrine cant spawn till they fix this bugged one thats currently up

[dense cradle]

you just buy it

[fluid widget]

legendary you can get from the turtle

[dense cradle]

from the turtle

[fluid widget]

its the 2 shudder ones that are kinda fucked

[harsh trellis]

what turtle

[dense cradle]

runed one got rewarded to me like 10 minutes after i finished bugged event

[strong forum]

so

its still damage

[dense cradle]

the ring would be mid if skippers couldnt proc the queen one

[fluid widget]

ring > heroic queen ring

[strong forum]

just use both

[dense cradle]

i meant proc the queen citrine

[dense cradle]

which triggers 4 other runed citrines in group

real

a bit funny how everyone is using the same gems

@strong forum btw wanna hear something funny, i heard something argue to use bolster and “gaps in shield block uptime are ok that’s what last stand and shield wall are for”

[strong forum]

[pallid quiver]

i mean at least they're pressing buttons

[dense cradle]

Will last stand even save you from being smacked with no block up

from 100-0

[pallid quiver]

depending on situation, yes, you'll just need healer help to get back up

which you shouldn't need healer attention outside of mechs that designate healer attention on the tank, but

[dense cradle]

Not as bad as this uldaman pug i had in df

[pallid quiver]

you won't die

[dense cradle]

where the tank let the mage get meleed

40% shb uptime

[pallid quiver]

Listen, that's still good compared to a lot of pug tanks I see

[strong forum]

you shouldnt have SB gaps

[pallid quiver]

Let me see if I can find a particular log from this season

[strong forum]

if you do, play HR

[pallid quiver]

^^^

[dense cradle]

Yeah my confusion was man saying

he was playing itf

at low haste

[pallid quiver]

Not a Prot War, buuuuuut

Here's how a key I attempted on a DPS alt went one time

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/a:R3aLtWZc94XdpKh1?fight=last&type=casts&source=123&view=timeline

There's just some people who hate playing the video game they're paying for, either with real money or time

[dense cradle]

Swipe that often?

[pallid quiver]

You should also consider the ironfur casts

maybe check out the death tab, too

[dense cradle]

isnt it supposed to be always up

[pallid quiver]

oh shit i never even realized he literally never pressed mangle

maybe i did know but forgot, but

[pallid quiver]

it's their main form of mit

Like SB is ours, SotR is Pala's, and so-on

[dense cradle]

Yeah players like that

[pallid quiver]

he literally ran in, cast 4 swipes, and died

[dense cradle]

im unsure what their gcds are spent on

[pallid quiver]

Swipe

It'd be like if you just cast nothing but Devastate as a Prot War

[dense cradle]

isnt thrash better

[pallid quiver]

Thrash is what you're suppose to stack as a dot

Swipe is literally Devastate tier

You preferably press that button pretty much never

Thrash also gives you rage; swipe does not

[dense cradle]

yeah thought its thrash mangle

generally

[foggy ingot]

I was simming for AOE and it was preferring Fathom

Also finally hit 3k

[urban portal]

last time swipe ws good was classic hearthstone

[cyan bronze]

swipe technically gives rage in that it procs ggtm

and gore

and you press it as a filler occasionally

generally, it’s overpressed(like in your case)

[cyan bronze]

correct

you’re supposed to take all melees with at least 1 stack of if, iirc it’s ~22% dr for phys hits from 0->1 stack

[pallid quiver]

shhhh, i'm trying to keep it simple

[dense cradle]

makes me wonder what some pug tanks are doing with their globals

if falling behind on damage and mitigation

[pallid quiver]

Nothing.

Literally sitting there

I've looked at enough of my own logs and noted that enough times

I've had a prot war who had among their highest damage dealt was devastator

[fresh pilot]

Anyone else actually found a working way of getting the runed citrine?

keeps butgging for me every time

[pallid quiver]

If that's the one where the boss despawns or something, Nome said to have a mage blink inside during the countdown

And to pull boss outside

Can send hunter pet inside, too, iirc?

If it's that one

[cyan bronze]

Jerkin their shit

[fresh pilot]

thats not working luerce, pets wont do anything it doesnt pull back

it just sits in there

[pallid quiver]

I don't know the specifics of how it's supposed to work, but I wager it needs to be sent in, told to attack, then manually pathfind back out

I haven't touched gems at all so I can't give more details myself, unfortunately

[dense cradle]

I saw someone not play devastator once

[timid nacelle]

We successfully did it yesterday, by pulling the boss out and resetting him. Its to do with the bonus achievement timer being off, it disappears during the fight. So pull him out reset him and the bonus achievement will come back and then nuke him.

[fresh pilot]

just got it.. fucking buggy shit

[rough niche]

so is ring now a must or still shit

I got all the citrine gems that wowhead say are bis

[celest zephyr]

Sorry for asking a thing I think people might have asked many times but I see no pinned post

Are the 3 gems from wowhead post accurate?

Which ones are you using?

[dense cradle]

They’re on raidbots

[pallid quiver]

Generally, but there could potentially be other combos depending on your stats and gear, as always

[dense cradle]

I havent seen any deviance from using skipper in wind slot though

[hardy snow]

my guild stopped doing hc altruns, so Im pugging queen few times now, god its terrible, why people "play" like this

[pallid quiver]

yeah it's fucking rough in the pug raid streets

there's a reason i ain't got aotc yet

[mortal pecan]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/ixWjUjC6mjJXjJqRBwP11q

Why is Cyrces not simming highest? Did I do something wrong? Also figured the Stitchflesh would be one of the 2 considering it has more haste

[hardy snow]

you sim it with healing gem

[mortal pecan]

I thought I just highlighted all the gems to see which it would piock

[hardy snow]

I dont think these gems are available in raidbots like normal ones, you have to pick in gear compare I think

[cinder marsh]

did anybody figure out how to get the legendary skippers citrine ?

[orchid mural]

you can buy that one from the tortollan guy

behind Bargus

[cinder marsh]

ok ty

[cinder marsh]

the gems changed up on me

does it really matter if i change mine

im rocking thunderlord, undersea, and lego skipper

[dense cradle]

if it sims higher sure

[cinder marsh]

i really only sim dps

[dense cradle]

Yeah i mean depends on your setup i imagine

[cinder marsh]

im prob gonna stick to the ones i got

so i dont got to farm that shit again

[hardy snow]

farm is like 20 min flying around island

[dense cradle]

i imagine if you have worse gear the damage procs sim higher

[cinder marsh]

i mean if they were the bis a few hours ago on wowhead, im guessing keeping them wont be the worse thing'

[dense cradle]

They’re account wide unlock

so not like theres any loss for like 10 minutes of work

[hardy snow]

thats in top gear?

[mortal pecan]

ya

thats why im confused as to why it didn't pick the ring

[hardy snow]

lol, I dont have such options 😄

[mortal pecan]

it's under gems

[hardy snow]

oh no, I have, its just blended into other, due to resolution I guess

[hardy snow]

I think you must have empty sockets for it to work, if you had equipped some in the simc input, it wont change them.

[pallid quiver]

There's an option to override equipped slots as well

[mortal pecan]

oh maybe thats it

[mortal pecan]

https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/mpYdh8nsTvHwNcraVW9DJk

picked slightly different gems

[keen leaf]

my sims say fathom, stormbringer, and legendary

[hardy snow]

same for me, only undersea changed for two target, ST and multi is same

but ive tested Legendary on Queen, and its not good

12,6k dps and 14k hps

[keen leaf]

Dont forget it proc's extra stats too sometimes, which u wont see on the dps meter directly

[hardy snow]

hmm, right

[final mist]

It's also entirely RNG, so the variance can and will swing (sometimes wildly)

[dense cradle]

Such is the nature of being able to get either a small absorb or another dps pot on your opener.

[sharp gale]

Aka enh sham

It’s crazy on queen our enh sham sometime does dog shit (like me) dmg but sometime he destroy the boss

You can see variance in the report

You see it follows a normal distribution, the flater it is the more random you are

[nimble plover]

What are the best defensive trinkets obtainable in dungeons?

[proven plume]

Refracting Aggression Module but its pretty bad

only swarmlords is usable as a defensive

[jagged pier]

ara ara sac, and shard or mark are probably your best defesive trinkets from dungeons tbh

[frail ibex]

It makes me annoyed that the 3 14s I have timed are harder then ara kara and dawn

And I cannot get an inv to either

I mean even 13 sv is harder than 14 ara kara and dawn

Pugging is goingn to be the death of me

[tardy abyss]

It's almost as bad as module

If not as bad even

[rugged verge]

Currently @35 haste unbuff. Do I give up ITF if I use the new ring?

[undone orbit]

which gems do we rock rn?

i prefer stats i dunno

[violet ginkgo]

#protection message

Hopefully still valid but can always contact mwahi/nome again

[quasi lintel]

I hate this shit

I hate that I sim higher with the new ring but I lose out on 2311 haste and 3268 Vers

idk if worth

Currently running these

I was so close to hitting the required haste for ITF too 😦

this now puts me at 12,787 Haste

lowkey about to ignore the sim

[jagged pier]

Brah that loosing that ver aint gunna change anything

[quasi lintel]

significantly more upset about the haste

[wooden zodiac]

Hello guys, I am new to warrior tank and i have been winging it a bit with stats. i am not sure how much haste to get
did 11-12s pretty easy damage taken wise, ist here like a haste % that we are aiming for?

[quasi lintel]

Aiming for the neighborhood of 17k so you can take Into the Fray and have 100% uptime on your shield block

Right now I'm forced to run Heavy Repercussions instead of ITF because I don't have enough haste and there'd be like a 2-3second gap where I won't have shield block up

very scary if that gap happens in a big pull

I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm wrong

[mystic yoke]

anyone got a guide or video specific to protection warrior on how to handle NW12+

e.g. perfect composition, perfect route

i mean i've got the routes from keystone guru, i've tried many attempts, but just so many packs and fails that can happen...

[untold bane]

is revenge higher prio than thunder clap in colossus?

[sharp gale]

Why the fails happen?

[mystic yoke]

different reasons each run...

[sharp gale]

Because if it’s kicks on a regular pack well there is not much I can say

[mystic yoke]

can be just too many deaths, and time penalty, can be not good enought interupts on the mages 2nd boss

[sharp gale]

You can use orbs if you are worried on 2nd boss

[mystic yoke]

yeh been doing that, getting through that boss 60-70% of time

[sharp gale]

If you have a dk he can’t grab each set

[mystic yoke]

yeh aiming to have a DK in group everytime

but they aren't always great at doing there job... sadly

like pulling in a warrior instead of a mage.. sigh

i can see sucess rates are higher when an Aug is in the group, but i do feel like dmg suggeres

suffers

[sharp gale]

Comp doesn’t really matter in a 12, there just gb if you have 0 curse dispel it may be calling for trouble

[mystic yoke]

you say this, but if you're a 3k+ player.... it might not translate to puggin a 12 NW - key seems way harder 13s of other keys

[sharp gale]

Im not 3k (i don’t’ push)I stepped into few 12s in november I didn’t see the difference with an 11 or a 10

[mystic yoke]

erm, then you're opinion is going against most of the active m+ player base fyi

[sharp gale]

I did siege, mist, db and ara (ara is the only one failed but on last boss)

[sharp gale]

Im not the type to be pressured by so called majority

[strong forum]

My friends pushed break the meta as bdk + 3x unholy + mw

They did 15s and if they tried harder they coulda done 16s

Comp doesn't mean shit

Bring the player not the class

[sharp gale]

You maybe know I’m friend with mordrim, he pushed with no bl a DF season

[strong forum]

Yeah I always push without BL

[sharp gale]

Drums for the win

[strong forum]

Like, people overvalue buffs

BL is an 8% dmg gain, for 30sec once every 10 minutes over drums

Woweee

[pallid quiver]

boy that monk probably has a new outlook on their philosophy after hanging out with so many dead people for so long

[strong forum]

He didn't have to heal

So that's neat

[sharp gale]

But on topic, we are now way overgeared for 12s that’s it

[strong forum]

Absolutely

[mystic yoke]

thanks all, food for thought

tripple dk and drums sounds fun

[sharp gale]

Yeah maybe if group is 20 less ilvl I could see an argument for maximize comp

Pick the dudes who will not troll the key

[mystic yoke]

yeh, just in puggin you never really know what you're gonna get. RIO only tells you so much

[pallid quiver]

If you really want to vet people, you read through their logs

[sharp gale]

Which key they did is a clue with how many 12s they did

[mystic yoke]

yes ofc, this is what rio tells us

[pallid quiver]

Rio and clear clears only tells you that someone was present for a key clear

[sharp gale]

But you can check their logs with wcl installed you can see logs for queued dudes

[pallid quiver]

which doesn't help most of the time since people can get carried through some very high level keys

[sharp gale]

If his only 12 is mist, ara or db, you know it tells nothing

[mystic yoke]

i do have wcl installed, but didnt' realise i could do this? is it auto or am i just searching each time?

[sharp gale]

When someone tag in your key, the wcl logo has a red 1-2-3 etc

You click you can select the dude and you see his logs in game

[waxen quarry]

@strong forum holy prot rage gen got gutted or am i clueless

Impenetrable Wall no longer increases Rage generated by Shield Slam.

cinema

outburst by 50% too

[wild chasm]

That's for 11.1 and yeah it got gutted. Demo shout giving less, Shield charge not giving any, Bloodsurge most probably nerfed

[waxen quarry]

why

typical blizzard

[wild chasm]

"Fun detected"

[sweet summit]

ït's the most over ever

[waxen quarry]

lets go back to 9.1 prot warrior

3 bolts and u are dead without shield wall

[fleet flicker]

erga no longer stormforged?

[waxen quarry]

noob demoted

[sweet summit]

long time gone 👴

[waxen quarry]

[sweet summit]

[fleet flicker]

long time no see bud

[sweet summit]

[untold bane]

is circlet + itf viable?

[hardy snow]

yes

[untold bane]

does that mean instead of 18-20k you should aim 15-17k with circlet

[hardy snow]

no, circlet doesn't change threshold point for ITF, why would it?

[untold bane]

cuz it rips 3k haste

[hardy snow]

it doesnt change amount of haste you need to be safe with playing itf

if you dont get it from 2nd ring, you can get it from other items

[untold bane]

rings give by far the most secondary stats tho

[sweet summit]

you can try it and see how it feels

[shell pendant]

What missives are we going with on crafted gear? crit/haste or vers/haste?

[violet ginkgo]

I like crit/haste

[jagged pier]

whatever u like

[dapper vapor]

Both good

[raw parcel]

I've been doing crit/haste this season for the tier set, but in prior seasons did haste/vers. We thankfully aren't married to certain secondaries like some specs.

[orchid frigate]

is the mag'har racial really worth compared to dwarf?

(for both dps and tanking)

[sharp gale]

for tanking magh'ar orcs didn't get a dispel so no. and for dps/dmg, dwarf is mid and dmg difference in races are really small

[orchid frigate]

thanks!

[mortal pecan]

How do you guys like ITF? I just broke 18k and going to try it out.

Just wondering you guys like it

[idle copper]

...whats ITF?

[sharp gale]

basically there is no point to check race changes for tanking if the change doesn't include something on dwarf dispel

[sharp gale]

Into the Fray, you pick either Heavy Repercutions for infinite Shield block or 8% haste

[idle copper]

i have Heavy repercussions and usually sit at 97/98% uptime, should i switch to ITF? I have 33% haste

]

[sharp gale]

switch, do a key and see

[idle copper]

Are people equipping the new ring yet?

[pallid quiver]

If it sins better

Yknow im keeping that typo

And ITF is basically you get damage, but have to remotely think about SB uptime and need enough haste to not have major gaps

[torpid merlin]

I'm going to try the ring out in some high keys, but I'm skeptical about giving up that much haste.

[vital pollen]

Always go with what sins the best.

[sweet summit]

i'm really good at sinning

[tropic pond]

im having a hard time get into +13, seems they only invite prot pally, is this the case, or im just unlucky?

[violet ginkgo]

That is the case

Because I think above 12 is “push” category and when push is involved ppl want meta or prefer meta.

[shrewd grove]

Run your own key. Sure it sucks when you deplete a key, but it's faster than applying for an hour

[bright ember]

Late arrival to TWW, only been 80 for a few weeks, iLvl 610. With S2 coming up real soon, is it worth trying to get some M+ runs in these next few weeks?

[edgy bone]

Doubt it. Game sucks right now. Been the same five classes in m+ for three months now

Go form your own push group or you won't get to play

[violet ginkgo]

I am thinking that his key probably not the key he wants to push. But to change the key to other dungeon he got to run the key with potential deplete.

What a dillema.

[edgy bone]

M+ will never be fixed until they figure out a way to let the community log in and click PLAY then instantly be in a m+dungeon

Every other big online game lets you log in and click play.

Let me log in, click play, and try to boost my rank/rating.

[tropic pond]

this is very true my io score is 2991 i just wanna get the last 9 point and be done for the season, but i only got +13 mist which i already done

that itchy to get 3k is killing me waitin que for hours

[drowsy narwhal]

Hello, new player/tank here. Does anyone know a way/addon to display total dmg monsters do to me in real time above their names, like this: https://snipboard.io/0DWz7p.jpg

So when I am pulling a group of monsters, I can see which hit the hardest, to memorize and learn from my mistakes

[tropic pond]

i think overall as a prot, you don't wanna depens it with number, rather just memorize the tank buster and using mitigate properly, it's not just about the damage incoming, sometimes we can get debuff, bleed, etc

[drowsy narwhal]

As a new player, it is overwhelming for me to memorize routes and all type of monsters. It would also signal me which ones not to pull next time, if I can avoid them. I also don't know which ones the tank busters are, there is no indicator for them.

So basically other than "get good" and "with experience", this type of display would immensely help me with it.

[tropic pond]

i think you can start with tww dungeon pack

its gonna tell you when is tank buster, or when you got debuff, bleed, etc

[keen leaf]

Thats not a good way to do what u want, your gonna have a better time learnign the dungeons and busters

but u do u

[cerulean tusk]

Tip: Get Mythic Dungeon Tools, you can in it look up what all the mobs do in the dungeon.

All tank busters are telegraphed, with a castbar, so don't worry too much about it. Easiest way to learn is simply doing keys

[drowsy narwhal]

I have MDT, but I cannot open it during fights or a dungeon run cause we are on a timer. And no way I can memorize it by reading, I need to see and experience and have that "aha" moment.

[cerulean tusk]

What I would do is just do an overview, then do the dungeon. If you die, check the deathlog, keep it in mind. And adapt from there

[drowsy narwhal]

Link?

[cerulean tusk]

99% of stuff is pointless to remember - you only need to know what can kill you, and you know that when it does

[bright ember]

Thanks. I’ll just keep practicing my tanking and get ready for S2.

[tropic pond]

https://wago.io/twwdungeons

[drowsy narwhal]

Again, if I would have indicator, and a total dmg indicator would be one, I could experience live and see which ones are busting me.

[tropic pond]

yeah, i agreed it's about the vibe you will be getting by practicing a lot

[drowsy narwhal]

Thank you.

[tropic pond]

i never seen the total damage thing, it's gonna be problematic once you get into higher and higher keys

[drowsy narwhal]

Just a number above the head of a monster, how would that make it more problematic?

[tropic pond]

yea like you pulling big with those all number, it's gonna be super hard to see what's goin on

[cerulean tusk]

Think me and Silver just see it as information bloat, if you can pull useful data from it - there is nothing wrong with it. It is just that data will be only as useful for the key level you are doing

My opinion is that running, example SV, the best way to learn what you can tank and what is dangerous, is simply pulling everything till the point of failure. Figure out what happened, was it the curses killing your team - do you got to pull smaller for that? Is it the claps AoE killing the team, so you got to split the gollems. Did I die, if so, was it too many casters killing me, or was it melee debuffs getting too high: Can I play around that? Casters can be line of sighted, melee adds can be kited. So on and on.

In my book, it aint a problem before it is

[keen leaf]

its a terrible way to gauge how your doing, some mobs may have higher numbers because u let SB drop, or didnt use a defensive

[drowsy narwhal]

Actually wouldnt that be useful? since if normally a mob does 1m dmg, and now does 2m dmg, it shows me that i did sth wrong

[cerulean tusk]

And how would you on the fly know?

[drowsy narwhal]

the dmg meter would show it

[keen leaf]

so you'd rather memorize that that mob usually does 1m damage though

[cerulean tusk]

Logs is needed, to then check and see if you didnt block an attack, why that happened

did the mob go around you? Did you turn?

[keen leaf]

im not trying to bash u, I just dont see how that number is gonna be useful at all

[cerulean tusk]

so many questions

[drowsy narwhal]

but for the logs, this would be an indicator that sth went wrong, then i can still go check the logs, since the indicator indicated it

also "learning from dying" means I should do all of this by the expense of the whole group

[cerulean tusk]

That is WoW keys in a nutshell

[drowsy narwhal]

would you like to have a tank in your group who pulls too much so he learns from mistakes?

[cerulean tusk]

For my premade?

For sure

[keen leaf]

your healthbar is a pretty good indicator too though

[drowsy narwhal]

i do not have any premades, i also do not want to disappoint the pug group i am playing with

cause i decided to make the run a learning run and ruin all their time

[keen leaf]

thats the nature of the beast when u try something new

[cerulean tusk]

I get the feeling, but you got to just bite the sour apple on that. In the PuG world, it is dog eat dog. And you will want to play it safer, but still push yourself.

[tropic pond]

you have too disappoint them, it's the path to became much better

only by doin it you will learn

[cerulean tusk]

^ this, so much this - then you get to the level of ppl starting to whisper you thanks after the keys

before then, lots of broken keys

[drowsy narwhal]

yeah, only by doing, not readin, hence why a dmg meter above monster heads would make my life so much easier

[tardy abyss]

I mean in the case of SV you have to go big at some point and play 3 golems at once

And that goes for some keys

[cerulean tusk]

I would not recommend it for your weekly 10 PuG tho

[tardy abyss]

It none of them track enemy cds yes

[tropic pond]

i mean if you still wanna look for the dps thing, i don't have the answer for that

[drowsy narwhal]

i dont know, i mean, its just a number, i m not asking to adapt weird strategies or gaming behaviour, just asking how i can display 1 simple number

[cerulean tusk]

Meh, dont remember the addon's name, but if you search Plater DPS numbers, you prob find it. In it you can set numbers to be shown on the plater addons plates, go into settings, activate numbers shown on you; move number to source not target

[drowsy narwhal]

i asked in the plater/details discord

they said there is no option for that

[cerulean tusk]

Then ya doomed, if they cant split the numbers to source, it is over

[drowsy narwhal]

"damage taken" details actually does that

the source is there, they just dont have the feature to display it

[cerulean tusk]

It reads damage you take, but doesnt display it on the source. So you would have to have the addon breakdown the source of the ability, in real time, then read that data and apply it to the plates

I can see it be done tho

[drowsy narwhal]

the answer i got, i assume from the dev himself, was this: "It's not a thing about possibility it's just a thing about is it an option. And no, it's not an option"

[pallid quiver]

You want to be careful doing that (if this is still that convo about total damage dealt to you) because there's a lot of variation in the damage you take at any given point based on RNG, with things like Punish overlaps

So it's possible to give yourself the wrong info

[drowsy narwhal]

sure, but it is an indicator, not the whole truth

[cerulean tusk]

Sounds like a ton of work for weird data, probably why ppl dont create the tool

[pallid quiver]

On top of that, sometimes you do pull what does high damage to you because it's easier to manage for the DPS/Heals

[drowsy narwhal]

i just need an indicator to help me to see my mistakes

[pallid quiver]

The best thing for that is mostly to look at logs; there isn't a hard solvable solution to M+ runs, unfortunately

Since they're dynamic and not fully scripted like raid encounters, it is something you have to gain field experience to adjust with

[drowsy narwhal]

yeah, but like the runs are so fast cause we are on a timer, i do not have time to digest it, from one pull to the next one

[pallid quiver]

It helps a lot to actually review what you did outside of the run, as your mental facilities are occupied during the run managing your rotation and the like

[drowsy narwhal]

a live indicator would help me in real time

[cerulean tusk]

Dont worry, Tanbur. You get used to it, when a problem arise, you take the time. The group can wait

[pallid quiver]

No, like, actually sit down and look at a log you upload after the run

[keen leaf]

your healthbar is a live indicator 🙂

[pallid quiver]

A live indicator can potentially cause the issues you would need to fix by pulling attention. It can help some people, but you need to be careful

[cerulean tusk]

https://tenor.com/view/good-boy-pat-on-head-stitch-gif-6929366788372516752

[pallid quiver]

Sometimes it's a mindset adjustment rather than an indicator/interface adjustment

[cerulean tusk]

Can't you just details, open a window to show damage taken, and use that to see what source do what realtime?

Sudo does what you want

[pallid quiver]

It's really hard to grapple with sometimes, but I think it'd be helpful to try a mindset adjustment.

[cerulean tusk]

We tried that, not achievable atm

[pallid quiver]

He wants it tailored to the specific mobs so he can evaluate the mobs themselves

[drowsy narwhal]

sudo? during fights i cannot spend my attention to other windows, but all right

[cerulean tusk]

Details breaks it down into mob names, tho, and damage done by said type

[pallid quiver]

Which is understandable, but things also don't exist in a vacuum in M+

[tropic pond]

i think we all here never learn from that specific mob doin what damage, only learning by doin, keep SB up, IP up then the rest will follow

[tardy abyss]

Huh?

[cerulean tusk]

Well, not completely true. Certain mobs make your health drop fast, so you check why. Fix it till next time. So we do learn what mob does what

[tardy abyss]

It's always the same mobs

[pallid quiver]

At any rate, I think you stumbled on it, but it's not really an option that's baseline input into nameplates, as it's generally considered ot a valuable metric by pretty much everyone. You'd probably need to code your own Weakaura for that, and it might be a chonky one with the amount of calcs being done dynamically

[tropic pond]

well that's true, but from the new tank prespective, thats the most important part for prot

[tardy abyss]

For any tank

But you learn what mob is dangerous before they can actually one-shot you

Unless you jump into 15s right away

[wicked pollen]

or you die and figure it out next time

[keen leaf]

u mean "leap"

hehehe

[cerulean tusk]

Did I die? No - we good
Did I almost die? Why - can I soften that?
Did I die? Yes - why and what can I do to prevent that
^ This be the way

[tardy abyss]

Good one

[drowsy narwhal]

And one dmg indicator would help me with the 2nd questions, that was my goal.

Anyway, there is no way it seems, all good then.