both thane and colossus
#protection
cyan bronze
both thane and colossus
Colossus loves crit
sour flicker
guys, wanted to ask something.
Why Colossus is simming similarily to MT whereas on raid the results are significantly better?
strong forum
Dmg profiles
Mountain thane is consistent dmg whereas colossus benefits more from additional targets to generate additional colossal might stacks
Aswell as sniping of quick aoe dmg with demolish
sour flicker
funny thing is that aoe fight on mythic raid should be favoured by MT, not colossus thats why my concern
in colossus im having 80% ilvl parse, whereas on MT roughly any 40% 😄
just by changing hero talent
smoky anvil
I got rightfully dragged for not using ITF with 38% haste
I swapped
It’s made me like playing the game a lot more
tardy abyss
Yeah the amount of haste you get from ITF with all haste buffs is just insane
wooden widget
I just got the awakening machine mount
Got it last week. Feels so nice I was considering the engineering one but that’s crazy grind
heavy sparrow
How are we feeling with vers, should we swap all vers items to something else so we're at 0?
tardy abyss
No
Just follow what the guides say
No need to overthink it
Haste > Crit = Vers > Mastery
mortal pecan
Is there an easy way to remove an embellishment? Or do I have to re craft? Can I craft a 3rd piece and put an embellishment on that to override one of the other 2?
cosmic pivot
ayo is prot good on pvp?
sick sentinel
hi guys wich talent we can use for the zekvir battle i ve an elf prot war 608 thanks guys
smoky anvil
Is there an easy way to remove an embellishment? Or do I have to re craft? Can I...
Recraft and remove. You cannot have 3 embellishments so you’d have to pick between 2 to wear if you make another.
Rather, you can have as many crafted w/embellishment as you’d like, can only equip 2.
sharp gale
hi guys wich talent we can use for the zekvir battle i ve an elf prot war 608...
I used the standard raid talents the time I did zekvir
heavy sparrow
ayo is prot good on pvp?
Yes
Stun galore
And you get to 1v1 people where you're guaranteed to win
And 1v3 for like 2mins
sweet egret
hi guys wich talent we can use for the zekvir battle i ve an elf prot war 608...
oof, elf prot war can't do zekvir man
sweet egret
Haste > Crit = Vers > Mastery
last I heard haste > crit > vers = mast?
cosmic pivot
And 1v3 for like 2mins
the stats are such different from fury?
seriously thinkin to switch specs
prot look so good
woven pecan
new tier set bonuses in s2
wicked pollen
jagged pier
not sure why u inpersonating me and where u got that from
woven pecan
pallid quiver
not sure why u inpersonating me and where u got that from
Better than unpersoning you
untold bane
sim suggests I shave off 780 haste with craft. i'd still be 18k+ but I want 20k. is it possible there's a bias or something
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/otjxhDCmXDqGMdWk17knYW
wicked pollen
you would do more damage
that is what the robot says
does not take into account sb uptime during keys
sweet egret
I feel that
jagged pier
cyan bronze
new tier set bonuses in s2
this is not April first
sweet egret
we rogues now
cyan bronze
am i tired or
sharp gale
There is this one too
jagged pier
probably
cyan bronze
perma avatar and shieldwall uptime in m+
sharp gale
ours is doggo in raid
Stand in that puddle !
cyan bronze
There is this one too
this is so ass in m+
wtf
unless it actually heals for a lot itself but
5% healing amp
wicked pollen
lmao i wonder if it works with unstoppable object
was just thinking this in aug chat
too bad you hate me
cyan bronze
giovanni fifty seven ily
wicked pollen
tardy abyss
Our S2 set is busted in M+ no?
wicked pollen
all i know is if that interacts with talent i linked, blizzard will nerf it or remove the interaction
tardy abyss
It all depends on proc rate ye
jagged pier
and theres still tuning to come
indigo hawk
Hello guys ! I'm actually on Princess on the mythic raid, I see a lot of War prot taking talent Seismic Reverberation for only mono but for me this talent is only for AoE or I am missing something ?
cyan bronze
i mean the cdr on shield charge could mean we need like 0 haste to run itf
and the random shield wall seems like it scales with damage taken events, so seems good in m+
jagged pier
Hello guys ! I'm actually on Princess on the mythic raid, I see a lot of War pro...
what else u gunna take?
that talent does nothing but nothing else u can take will do anything ither
mighty valley
the proc rate will prob be normalized/capped so it isn't a billion times stronger in aoe vs st
strength depends on tuning, kinda zero gameplay besides desyncing our CDs even more
but crits are fun so
cyan bronze
the proc rate will prob be normalized/capped so it isn't a billion times stronge...
said that about vdh s3 tierset
also
that set seems quite strong for colossus
50% chance to crit shield slam
indigo hawk
that talent does nothing but nothing else u can take will do anything ither
I take the 2 points on rage
jagged pier
if your overcapping that badly
but u shouldnt be overcapping at all with 1 point in it
sweet egret
it's fine bro
indigo hawk
But you are right, it’s not a big diff but taking an aoe talent for full mono rly trigger me x)
sharp gale
But you are right, it’s not a big diff but taking an aoe talent for full mono rl...
There is no diff you have just to spend the points somewhere
They do there that’s it
fading sand
obsidian girder
You can increase luck via a weekly time gated event
sharp gale
And with deluxe edition of Diablo 4
obsidian girder
sharp gale
Each store mount obtained increases the chance
obsidian girder
You guys should apply as senior game designer.
sharp gale
the tier set that does nothing if you are not the active tank
maiden ravine
Maybe they'll make all tank fights in the raid single target/s
sharp gale
I really hope there is an item that does dmg on ourselves
strong forum
^
sweet egret
it must or riot
sweet summit
good luck on your riot
sweet egret
ty I go to paris and learn
sharp gale
If they chose to not make thane random proc interact, the set will not
obsidian girder
Will be fixed 3 months into season, don't worry
cyan bronze
it would be cool af if it did
alpine shard
i heard you like charge weaving
sweet summit
i heard you like charge weaving
shield charge has 0y min range 
maiden ravine
Tanks proccing their major CD randomly feels so problematic.
obsidian girder
Guys you can intervene the active Tank and redirect damage this way
sharp gale
cyan bronze
@strong forum does this not feel very colossus coded
sweet egret
it can't very well proc your shield wall
cyan bronze
or what
alpine shard
shield charge has 0y min range <:erga:1225875048590737460>
oh damn
jagged pier
hey gys wow lets give them some credit now they havent got to balance 2 piece for every spec in the game. surely they can cover these interactions with the free'd up dev time
sweet summit
<@192743144276623360> does this not feel very colossus coded
thane with their 3 back to back to back ss casts or
cyan bronze
for col
maiden ravine
Didn't they remove Vengeance's random meta chance for reasons.
jagged pier
cause it was trash
cyan bronze
thane with their 3 back to back to back ss casts or
me when i get 6 stacks of demolish in 3 globals
and my demolish cd is 4 seconds
sharp gale
And ofc it will be tuned toward raid, so adding lots of target will be capped
cyan bronze
And ofc it will be tuned toward raid, so adding lots of target will be capped
i remember saying this about vdh s3 tierset
sweet summit
And ofc it will be tuned toward raid, so adding lots of target will be capped
how do you tune that for raid??
cyan bronze
and then I remember popping eggs in DHT boss
sharp gale
how do you tune that for raid??
With 2 prot warrior in dev tests
cyan bronze
If it’s ppm it’s fine in raid
sharp gale
cyan bronze
no?
wicked pollen
what s3 tier
cyan bronze
what s3 tier
u get avatar when u cast tc
sweet summit
If it’s ppm it’s fine in raid
nah it's still worthless
sharp gale
If it’s ppm it’s fine in raid
Ppm of active tanking/dmg taken
cyan bronze
maybe there’s just slight ticking rot dmg every fight
so u can always proc it
ebic
sweet summit
if they bring back corruption it would be good
sharp gale
I Hope a trinket does dmg to myself
sharp gale
They turned me into a masochist
sweet summit
I bet 50 gold it'll have like 60sec icd
cyan bronze
if SC is low enough cd
and pickup something like thunderlord for colossus
or ig free mass kick on thane
sharp gale
Idk I like the tierset a lot in m+
Idk, you have to see other tanks sets first, random cd proc is weak compared to a flat dmg reduction for example
sweet summit
surely if i make a forum post they will reconsider and maybe redesign it
cyan bronze
80% sw uptime
sweet summit
sharp gale
Yeah or SW becomes a flat 40% dmg reduction
pallid quiver
I think Nome's idea should be the eay to go, 2% per year of char age
sharp gale
It is but I meant a permanent
cyan bronze
Could we theoretically ED?
.?
jagged pier
I think Nome's idea should be the eay to go, 2% per year of char age
right reroll back to the warrior i made in classic
sweet summit
drop ed? possibly
cyan bronze
i mean cus like
sweet summit
highly depends on uptime
sweet summit
on the outlaw themed buff name
cyan bronze
thunderlord is a huge pickup for colossus
sweet summit
yeah
cyan bronze
and free mass kick is
nice
or whatever u want to take ig
this feels very colossus coded tho
sweet summit
is it jugg or massacre on that node
wicked pollen
sd
sweet summit
huh
wicked pollen
massacre
strong forum
drop ed? possibly
never
sweet summit
oh
wicked pollen
im dumb
sweet egret
erectile dysfunction?
pallid quiver
Enduring is so much stonks in how much duration you get
strong forum
unless you mean for parsing
pallid quiver
You have to either have ridiculous uptime on that tier buff so you're pressing SC every few seconds or there's literally nothing blockable incoming and SS drops off as a major damage source
sharp gale
Well every time it proc, each slam will reduce SC by 6 sec
Idk if it’s lot of sb uptime
pallid quiver
Enduring affects the duration of the block SC gives
strong forum
yup
cyan bronze
oh
sweet summit
oh really
cyan bronze
ty
sweet summit
shit
strong forum
yes
cyan bronze
didn’t know that
wicked pollen
oh
cyan bronze
yeah don’t think u drop it
pallid quiver
That's a huge portion of why enduring is so good
cyan bronze
I actually did not know that
pallid quiver
The only thing it doesn't affect is Bolster SB iirc
pallid quiver
Enduring is the single strongest block talent on the tree
cyan bronze
wicked pollen
nah massacre is
sweet summit
the more you know 
cyan bronze
ye my thought process was that maybe with the tierset cb would be instead
but i guess
u would need inSANE uptime
pallid quiver
Which I'd be down for; it'd be funny to stun DR mobs with a single target ability
Just casting it every foruth global or something wild
sweet summit
Which I'd be down for; it'd be funny to stun DR mobs with a single target abilit...
would be really cool in pvp
holy moly
cyan bronze
LOL
sweet summit
i'm onto something
sweet summit
my minigame > your minigame :chatting:
sweet summit
I have a hard time imagining numbers above 4
hollow bolt
mood thats why my rotation is just 1-4 everythign else gets macroed
5th butten introduced, pain :C
maiden ravine
What did vision of perfection proc for protection in BfA?
maiden ravine
For some reason my brain has shield wall locked away as "major CD" to the point I thought vop procced that haha
sweet summit
we would not've played it if it did i think
cyan bronze
Btw
Role specific 2pc
Perhaps means that all DPS warriors get same 2pc
or all DPS get same ported 2pc
Which is really weird for tanks
Because it either means
Each tank gets spec specific 2pc
Or each tank gets 4 sec proc of major cd
kind glen
Kinda reads as if it functions similarly for each tank
maiden ravine
Most tanks have a major defensive, only outlier is Veng which really only has meta
pallid quiver
GoAK, SI, IBF, Fort Brew, SW, etc
I think those are the specific abilities considered each tanks major
cyan bronze
What’s ibf again I’m schizophrenic
wicked pollen
What’s ibf again I’m schizophrenic
whats dn
cyan bronze
Ty sorry
sonic badger
What’s ibf again I’m schizophrenic
ibuprofen
left temple
Most tanks have a major defensive, only outlier is Veng which really only has me...
Just wait until it’s actually an application of fiery brand
And veng becomes unkillable
B)
left temple
Unholy set poggers
cyan bronze
Just wait until it’s actually an application of fiery brand
That’s so bad
Like actually so bad
left temple
Nothing quite like gaming stacks during sylv intermission to coke out with the greatest possible parse
left temple
Like actually so bad
Why would it be bad
wicked pollen
Unholy set poggers
hi cutie
left temple
it’d probably be your main target
cyan bronze
True
left temple
I’m just here to shitpost
cyan bronze
Good point
wicked pollen
me too
cyan bronze
Fiery brand would be insane if it’s manipulated
wicked pollen
mr hammer i miss you
cyan bronze
Like insanely insanely insanely good
left temple
I miss me too
wicked pollen
any new concerts
cyan bronze
But if it’s just random target it’s gonna get wasted a lot sadly
left temple
Like insanely insanely insanely good
It’d be like s2 tier for vdh
left temple
S2 dragonflight
cyan bronze
I PRAY
left temple
Which was strong
cyan bronze
Bring back recrim
cyan bronze
Which was strong
I mean
left temple
A bit of a bitch to work around
left temple
But I mean if you spread to the wrong target by mistake you kinda just became really sad
left temple
any new concerts
Nothing much really
left temple
What’s the difference
wicked pollen
can you imagine dn?
left temple
I haven’t played vdh since s3
left temple
I should play vdh again
cyan bronze
I don’t recall new brand spread behavior but it’s insanely faster
wicked pollen
will hammer be returning to raiding
left temple
And then immo aura
cyan bronze
from charred flesh
left temple
will hammer be returning to raiding
Probably not
Unless a non-shit guild that raids after 10pm est wants me
And there’s like
2
sharp gale
If you look for very specific guilds you need to be open to give up smth
For example if you want to myth raid and are a main tank, you might just give up tanking in raid
yes i describing me
wicked pollen
mr hammer what rank did you peak
left temple
I dont raid tank
In guilds or all stars
xd
I think my highest guild rank was like WR 180?
wicked pollen
holy blasta
sharp gale
GoAK, SI, IBF, Fort Brew, SW, etc
I think monk will have dampen harm procs
torn geyser
chilly brook
Unless a non-shit guild that raids after 10pm est wants me
lol define non-shit
plush tendon
I dont know how I feel about that tier set
seems boring AF
and random proc of defensive is lame AF
maiden forge
Hey, depends on the proc rate and icd, if it's "pull big, get infinite shield wall" then funny
Wait, would those shield walls proc immovable object, or whatever the talent that isn't unstoppable force is
Hmm
Would feel really bad to not have unstoppable force tho, like rotation wise
plush tendon
itll prob like a a 2 procs per minute type deal
maiden forge
Ye
cunning bane
The new 4 set is a bit fucked in principle if you ask me. You are essentially forced to pick up shield charge in every scenario.
Which you do though, but still. In principle it's fucked.
round pendant
I mean
tardy abyss
Its not that bad
round pendant
Tier sets buffing specific abilities isn't new
cunning bane
man
round pendant
Then you're playing wrong
cunning bane
read what I wrote
tardy abyss
Your point is so irrelevant
Because nobody does that anyway
It couldve been a much worse spell honestly
cunning bane
it is not irrelevant. The other talent choises become irrelevant.
odd flint
shield charge is a goated abilty why would they make a generic tier set where u can use everything to appease the 1% who dont want it
round pendant
yeah I don't get the point
cunning bane
Yes there is literally is.
tardy abyss
Or do you want it to decrease BSV for some reason
round pendant
You always take shield charge and ravager pretty much
tardy abyss
Which would be beyond terrible
cunning bane
just because no one plays them doesnt mean they dont exist in the talent tree.
tardy abyss
I mean, we are pretty locked in with our talents
normal rampart
isn't that the point. to use the tier set to buff an ability so you HAVE to play it to encourage mixing it up
round pendant
the only option you could be talking about is like
ashen hearth
you making a point for the point of making a point.
tardy abyss
It is really hard to play anything else
round pendant
the ravager capstones or bsv?
tardy abyss
ye ^
Ravager capstones are bad and we shouldnt be playing BSV
So like
Whats the point
Wouldve been much cooler if it was Ravager instead of Shield Charge ngl
round pendant
Buffing an ability that most people are using is how they make the tier set feel good for most people
if they buffed bsv it'd be a dead 4 piece
cunning bane
What's the point? The point is the irrelevance of the other talent. Let's say that you want to play something else than shield charge - what do you gain from tier set bonus?
cunning bane
are you mad
tardy abyss
Like youre making a point but not giving a single example
normal rampart
like altering disrupting shout to do a dmg inc or dmg reduc would be something that disrupts the talent tree
cunning bane
room temp IQ. How can you not understand what I'm saying?
tardy abyss
I do get what you say but its pointless
round pendant
lol
cunning bane
Ther quite literally is other options.
ashen hearth
there is not other valid choices
pallid quiver
The new 4 set is a bit fucked in principle if you ask me. You are essentially fo...
I'm late, but
Your argument is years outdated
cunning bane
damn man
round pendant
Because theres no choices
Blizzard gotta give the people who purposely pick bad talents buffs
pallid quiver
Tier sets have generally always preferred apecific builds over others
tardy abyss
Blizzard gotta give the people who purposely pick bad talents buffs
ikr
pallid quiver
And this isn't even the first case with modern tier set design
small steeple
I'm late, but
Your argument is years outdated
Yeah wasn't that the argument against tier sets coming back in DF?
pallid quiver
You can dislike it, but it's considered as a whole worth it by the community
pallid quiver
Yeah wasn't that the argument against tier sets coming back in DF?
A valid one, but one people opted to be fine over
round pendant
If there was more variety in builds
like for example in some horrible world where you couldn't pick both shield charge AND ravager
I would agree it's bad if only shield charge got a buff
cunning bane
There will never be variety in builds if tier set bonus forces you to pick a certain talent.
round pendant
lol
tardy abyss
no
round pendant
It's the design of the tree that dictates which builds are possible
and then that's what they design the tier sets around
I guarantee if it was pick 1 between SC and Rav and people actually chose differently depending on scenario
this tier set would not be designed like this
Fundamentally the issue is the boring trees we have
ashen hearth
isnt the tree boring cause min maxing tells us there is no other way ?
tardy abyss
No because we are so limited with our points
And some talents down there are also just bad
Such as BSV and ravager capstones
pallid quiver
There will never be variety in builds if tier set bonus forces you to pick a cer...
There wouldn't really be variety in builds that aren't hurting themselves without, either. The most notable bits of flexibility is when there's nothing of value, or you have a lot of niche value points. You already can clear content with non-guide builds, even ones that are objectively bad if you're looking for variety.
It's just not optimal.
normal rampart
Such as BSV and ravager capstones
bsv would be nice if it was like 45-60sec, 300 sec is wut
pallid quiver
This is the same across all specs; it's just how it works out since WoW is a deterministic game; if you want variety, you need content that can adapt, like PvP games
cunning bane
Getting a lecture here
pallid quiver
Well, you came in with an unpopular viewpoint in a public forum
round pendant
I'm just not sure why you'd be bothered by a tier set requiring you to pick a talent if you're otherwise okay with picking sub-optimal talents anyway?
pallid quiver
And then defended it in a relatively haphazard way
round pendant
If you don't care about optimal talents then the tier set shouldn't affect your choices anyway
cunning bane
I said in principle. People please.
pallid quiver
And in principle, the community doesn't care
cunning bane
Apparently they do since we have this discussion going, no?
round pendant
And in principle the people who care about the tier set dictating their talents are the people who would pick the best talents regardless
pallid quiver
You can complain you don't like it. You can't try to have a high brow design discussion when design is a game of balancing conflicting interests
cunning bane
man
cyan bronze
Because nobody does that anyway
no shield charge for bsv is fine
pallid quiver
Apparently they do since we have this discussion going, no?
Damn, this man is the community
jagged gust
Free SW feels pointless, but we're about to have some juicy ass SS Crits next season
cyan bronze
and I’m glad it’s being done away with
cunning bane
Damn, this man _is_ the community
you dont have to start with that. I'm just saying...
fringe chasm
It does feel odd to get random procs of a defensive ability. If this was a dps tier set and it gave you random procs of avatar, that would make sense
round pendant
Free SW feels pointless, but we're about to have some juicy ass SS Crits next se...
just free damage reduction innit
I won't complain about being able to turn my brain off even more
cyan bronze
It’s free shield wall on the two piece
Which is pretty good imo
is it crazy? No
should 2pc be insane crazy omega poggers ?
round pendant
It's strange tho because didn't they say they wanted less spiky damage profiles in TWW?
pallid quiver
you dont have to start with that. I'm just saying...
Your argument is the same as my feelings toward Fury. I don't like that it is forced and thematically based around 2Hs, and 1Hs aren't a valid option.
But people don't actually care and like that. It's fine if I say, "Damn, sucks for me that Fury's design forces 2Hd", but it's not cool to say, "Isn't it terrible to not allow Fury to seap between 1H and 2H as needed?" when the community has decided it prefers the design of one being preferred
round pendant
I guess healers can just track your shield wall
cyan bronze
Assuming that means all tank gets the same 2pc
It just means tanks randomly get their major cd
round pendant
I guess it's not spiky and it's more.. valley-ey
cunning bane
Your argument is the same as my feelings toward Fury. I don't like that it is fo...
It's fine when you say but when I say it's not? I said "The new 4 set is a bit fucked in principle if you ask me." knowing very well what talents are chosen in all scenarios as we speak. EDIT: mean 4 set
fringe chasm
Damn, this man _is_ the community
cyan bronze
It's fine when you say but when I say it's not? I said "The new 4 set is a bit f...
I mean sure
The tierset forces you into shield charge
If it wasn’t going to be a tierset
It would have been something else
Wow has always forced you into a specific direction with borrowed
Me when 20 year long trend continues
& the 2 piece sucks or is incredibly op depending on tuning and content, sure
But from how blizzard words it, it makes it seem like all tanks will get the same 2 pc
So it’s kinda an irrelevant argument
It’s a nothing burger issue, frankly
cunning bane
Actually I made a typo, talking about 4 set not 2
but you probably picked that up already
cyan bronze
Ah, okay
mighty valley
sometimes they deliberately incentivize talents people don't usually take with tier sets
this isn't even one of those times
cyan bronze
this isn't even one of those times
Yea
I would of preferred them like
Incentive double ravager
mighty valley
this is like if it buffed thunder clap and we were like "in principle this sucks........"
cyan bronze
Btw can they rework double ravager node to be 2 charges vs 45 sec ravager
Thanks. A lot
cunning bane
this is like if it buffed thunder clap and we were like "in principle this sucks...
fair enough
tardy abyss
Dont think we would take that if it didnt come with something else
cyan bronze
Dont think we would take that if it didnt come with something else
Yea would still be cooler and more sensible than… ravager.. extension…?
Like what is that talent man
tardy abyss
Yeah that talent is completely burned
tardy abyss
Even if it wasnt, something has to die for the extension
cyan bronze
Like at least double ravager you could theoretically(if it wasn’t a fucking damage decrease) justify in some weird circumstances
cyan bronze
Even if it wasnt, something has to die for the extension
I mean
I thought we weren’t even gonna talk about that part
tardy abyss
cyan bronze
Like double ravager i could see you taking if there was like
A minute long fight MAYBE if it wasn’t a damage loss
cyan bronze
Or just really short fight
tardy abyss
ye
cyan bronze
But ravager extension on death is actually, and i am not being hyperbolic
The worst talent ive ever seen
tardy abyss
And drop what
pallid quiver
It's fine when you say but when I say it's not? I said "The new 4 set is a bit f...
You did not get my point.
You also don't know what you said. You're incapable of this discussion.
cyan bronze
But I really really really doubt
tardy abyss
Losing Rav sucks tho...
cyan bronze
How much rage do you get per min with auto attacks
tardy abyss
Id rather drop VO than Rav
cyan bronze
Good fucking night
tardy abyss
In terms of feeling ofc
cyan bronze
Get out of the kitchen
tardy abyss
DPS VO is obviously ahead
cyan bronze
Yea
pallid quiver
If maybe the perma uptime on auto attacks
We used to take Battering Ram instead of Enduring Alacrity before nerfs to former, buffs to latter
cyan bronze
We used to take Battering Ram instead of Enduring Alacrity before nerfs to forme...
Oh interesting
pallid quiver
So I'd wager if we drop anything, it'd be that
tardy abyss
Oh true thats an option
cyan bronze
I could see that, that’s a good point actually yeah
pallid quiver
But EA kinda got some stronk buffs, and battering took hefty nerfs
cyan bronze
Idk 10% auto attack speed doesn’t seem
That great
It’s better damage than indom ofc but
pallid quiver
It used to give more damage and speed iirc
tardy abyss
mh
cyan bronze
Yea i remember vaguely
tardy abyss
Maybe they will buff it
cyan bronze
It was 20, i think
I mean
Maybe the shield charge damage is just worth it
For raid
tardy abyss
EA is alright to lose altho 8% armor is a lot
cyan bronze
Not even considering the aasi
pallid quiver
I'm pretty comfy in assuming we do nothing with our talents, ignoring other patch changes
tardy abyss
But the question is, does Battering Ram also give more damage than EA does through ATTT
- Haste
cyan bronze
But the question is, does Battering Ram also give more damage than EA does throu...
No
👍
tardy abyss
Thought so
cyan bronze
Unless
We have crazy uptime
And we cast sc every like 4th gcd
St stun dr’ing
Let’s hecking go
tardy abyss
I think 10-15s cd on SC would be hella good already
tardy abyss
Minus 1.5 because you cant do so many SS in one GCD
cyan bronze
Ye
cyan bronze
It’s probably just 50% crit chance
So additive yes
It would be so weird to be mult
tardy abyss
ya
tardy abyss
Did you think it was also only 4s this entire time
cyan bronze
Yes lol i thought it was fucking balanced ?
left temple
lol define non-shit
At least US 100
cyan bronze
I mean that’s insane lol
left temple
Or US 150
cyan bronze
That’s so so so so good for colossus if it’s additive man
tardy abyss
I guess with BL or some shit we could sqeeze 2, or even 3 SC in that window
left temple
I just lose so much fun when the bosses get easy
tardy abyss
TIL colossus has a SS damage amp
mighty valley
man, it does sound cool for colossus. but fucking thane gets triple shield slam proc lmao
mighty valley
nerf thane into the ground imo
cyan bronze
Just from the pure cdr you’ll get
(Each ss crit is I believe 4 sec cdr on demolish after 10 stacks, i know many of you have never seen colossus)
tardy abyss
If only colossus wasnt also Revenge focused 😦
cyan bronze
If only colossus wasnt also Revenge focused 😦
It is but it’s also ss focused
The more ss crits you get the more demolishes
tardy abyss
I dont think we would get away with colossus but thane playstyle
cyan bronze
Praying we get demolish dr buff to 30%(where it should be)
mighty valley
colossus still has to smash every shield slam it can get to keep up its comparatively sad rage gen
tardy abyss
Oh that would make it nutty
tardy abyss
Couldnt be any less satisfying
mighty valley
the numbers on revenge in colossus are satisfying but yeah agree, revenge is a vanilla ass button they've never really reexamined for feel
cyan bronze
tell me why
demo shout
is 20%
for 8 sec
and demolish is 10% for 2
might be one of the worst tank “defensives” in the game
tardy abyss
I wouldnt be sad about another thane season
dapper vapor
I mean youre not really using it for the defensive you wanna use it for big dam
cyan bronze
I mean youre not really using it for the defensive you wanna use it for big dam
atm
yes
tardy abyss
Make Tide of Battle increase TC instead of Revenge
cyan bronze
and I don’t think that’s perfect
tardy abyss
cyan bronze
what is tide of battle again
tardy abyss
Revenge damage per stack of might
cyan bronze
oh that is cool ye
idk I think colossus would be a lot better in m+ if you could cast it more often(2pc allows for this) and it actually provided some meaningful dr
fine if they nerf the damage to make it playable in high m+
cyan bronze
i have to build a desk 👍
wicked pollen
darn i have raid tonight
cyan bronze
it’s not like it matters tho
wicked pollen
try to juice your character to 620
cyan bronze
no point doing keys for another 6? 5¿ weeks
cyan bronze
If VDH gets fiery brand...
please god please god please god please god
cyan bronze
Insanely
Unless it’s on random target
Then it’s just really annoying half the time
And stupidly broken the rest
tardy abyss
But it just spreads anyway
tardy abyss
hm
cyan bronze
Like in necrotic wake if it goes on a little mini mini mob gets nuked before it can spread
Would be annoying is all
If its main target it’s insane
If it’s meta, it’s also potentially broken with felscarred
Depending on if it gives demon surges
tardy abyss
But Im 99% sure its not gonna be FB
cyan bronze
Yea it’s 100000000% meta unfortunately
tardy abyss
ye
tardy abyss
Especially with a good 4p
cyan bronze
As it still heals you
Vdh likes random procs of cds a lot more than warrior does(not a ton, but still more)
tardy abyss
I could live with VDH meta
Its a tank that doesnt bore me to death
Or is annoying to play
cyan bronze
I love vdh(it’s my main)
tardy abyss
Get rid of ppal
cyan bronze
Please?
I think vdh has the most potential to be broken with the tierset
I mean if it’s fb on the 2 pc, vdh is insane
tardy abyss
Inb4 vdh 4p is spells used during meta reduce FB cd or some shit
cyan bronze
Insane dmg insane surv
cyan bronze
Inb4 vdh 4p is spells used during meta reduce FB cd or some shit
please god please god please god please god please god
why are you such a chef
tardy abyss
Im burning everything
cyan bronze
I mean
Fiery brand tiersets are epic
Recrimination was some of the best vdh gameplay ever imo
tardy abyss
But if 4p like this happens I want Feed the Demon to be viable
For vdh plebs like me
If they follow the same pattern for vdh as for pwar it might be Fel Devastation for the 4p though
mortal pecan
can someone TLDR the last hour of chat
shrewd grove
No
pallid quiver
can someone TLDR the last hour of chat
chatting
There was one fellow who didn't like that tier sets favor some builds and talent choices over other
My understanding was that he wanted to frame his complaints as a greater design issue that troubled the game
I think that's about it for the past hour
Most of it has been people hoping new tier set works in whatever beneficial way
buoyant ermine
Dumb question - when the expansion was newer i didn't think i'd be crafting much gear, so i picked the ascendance embelishment (bc my first craft was a weapon ) -but now with the crest changes i'm likely gonna craft a heck of a lot more and since ill have actual armor prices now - wondered if it was worth switching over to duskthread,
I mostly run mid level M+'s with friends I don't raid ,
Just curious if its worth the fairly large cost to swap it out or if the potential gain is too small to care
pallid quiver
All embels are too small to affect much
You're fine just sitting on it, tbh
It's not optimal, but no sensible person will break your legs over it
If you're living the casual life, you can be fine without crafting entirely, too, if it's too expensive
buoyant ermine
Oh i want to craft - i want to get the best gear i can without raiding and thats HIgher M+ and crafting i just didnt think i'd be crafting 636's but with the changes its easy to
fringe chasm
Once i hit 20k haste for ITF, what kind of shield block uptime and I looking for? Just testing on dummies atm im at 92%. Should I be looking for more? (I have 19.5k haste and was running ITF on those dummies)
jagged gust
You'll still have small gaps at 20k, I remember ~1-2 seconds every 45 seconds while waiting for SC to reset
fringe chasm
so 92% would be fine it seems
are those little gaps dangerous moments i need to look out for?
jagged gust
Won't be an issue, you'll naturally have downtime in m+ to make up for that small gap
fringe chasm
makes sense
mighty valley
you do have to think about it a little more than you do with HR (where you think about it none)
but yeah, log a key and see how it goes
mortal pecan
Most of it has been people hoping new tier set works in whatever beneficial way
@pallid quiver always coming through
torn gulch
Protection
Developers’ notes: Protection Warriors are currently constantly flooded with Rage which undermines rotational defensive decision-making and encourages constant dumping of Rage into Ignore Pain to maximize effectiveness. We’re taking a pass at reducing Protection’s overall Rage generation to make decisions on when and how to spend it more meaningful, without reducing Protection Warriors’ ability to tank effectively.
Chance to reset the cooldown of Shield Slam from Devastator and Strategist reduced to 20% (was 30%).
Impenetrable Wall no longer increases Rage generated by Shield Slam.
Booming Voice causes Demoralizing Shout to generate 20 Rage (was 30).
Champion’s Bulwark no longer increases the Rage generated by Shield Charge.
Bloodsurge now causes damage from Deep Wounds to have a chance to generate 3 Rage.
Violent Outburst has been rebuilt to be easier to understand and track progress towards the next Outburst. Additional Rage generated from Violent Outburst reduced to 50% (was 100%).
Shield Wall cooldown reduced to 3 minutes (was 3.5 minutes).
Amount of damage ignored from each use of Ignore Pain increased by 30%.
Colossus
Colossal Might is no longer applied by Execute.
Developers’ notes: Using your hard-hitting rotational ability regularly is core to the Colossus playstyle, and Execute applying Colossal Might pushed Colossus away from that during Execute phases.
An issue causing Demolish’s animation to not correctly play sometimes is now fixed.
Blizzard does not like us swimming in rage
pallid quiver
They fucking hate imp wall
buoyant ermine
wheres all that from ?
pallid quiver
Patch notes
torn gulch
11.1 development notes
buoyant ermine
ahh saw the title that said holy and druid and kinda went on my way
pallid quiver
execute is the hard-hitting rotational ability
Or it SHOULD be
@strong forum I need you to complain with me, because you understand
I feel like most of these changes come from not really understanding how Prot War has been working, and them wanting to hit it because it keeps being strong
mortal pecan
Is DA now the choice over IW?
pallid quiver
Since this is going to hit our damage a decent margin from lower rage gen
pallid quiver
Is DA now the choice over IW?
Knee jerk, probably not still?
I'm not great at napkin math
But losing the extra rage on Imp Wall is gonna hurt rage gen a lot
I feel like a lot of this is also going to disproportionally hit Colossus, too, since it already didn't have much rage to go around
mortal pecan
Also reduction in SW might make DA more attractive? Or am I dumb
mortal pecan
Also reduction in SW might make DA more attractive? Or am I dumb
Or just make IW give you SW even faster
jagged gust
I feel like a lot of this is also going to disproportionally hit Colossus, too, ...
Based on the next* tier set, I'd say colo suffers from fewer SS procs and again further pushes it down the tier list
pallid quiver
oh this i kinda hate
The people least affected by keys losing a level from failing a key are the ones getting the benefit of this
jagged gust
that's gonna make the weekly 10 a pain in the ass
pallid quiver
Because people hovering at the +12 range are, like
not far enough for it to feel like a waste and also are doing it for the fun of it
So if they lost key levels, it's not that big of a deal
I feel like that one's actually a shit change
paper geyser
jagged gust
unfortunately it's one of the most often asked for things right now
pallid quiver
If they did it to all key levels at once
I think it's a good change
Hitting that specific area alone?
That's rough
The people pushing the highest keys would save so much time if they didn't lose keys,
mortal pecan
@pallid quiver thoughts on the new set bonuses
pallid quiver
And there'd be less toxicity in lower keys if key levels didn't lower
pallid quiver
<@111288222750924800> thoughts on the new set bonuses
gamba
I think it's funny, but no thoughts until actual proc rates drop
It's gonna feel like shit in ST almost guaranteed
mortal pecan
Looks like the CDR on shield charge will make ITF more viable?
mortal pecan
Guess it really depends how the rage generation feels
jagged gust
Looks like I'm gonna be maining priest next season is what it feels like
mighty valley
i don't totally disagree with the intent of these changes but i feel like as written they will be a pretty big accidental nerf
will see how tuning goes
pallid quiver
I don't think this is the way they solve the problem
The problem comes from IP being both offensive and defensive, as well as not being a main mitigation source
It supplements the main mitigation source
mighty valley
if they want us to "make decisions on when and how to spend" rage they need a way bigger overhaul than this
they haven't changed the raw value of spending rage, so we still just want to prioritize buttons in a way that generates maximum rage
hardy snow
yea, its just we will have less rage now
pallid quiver
We make the same decisions, but are just less tanky and do less damage
From less avatar uptime, less shield slams overall
I'm still mostly mad about the Colossus change because of their reasoning, though
I'm actively mad about this
mighty valley
yeah i........... do not get this one at all
pallid quiver
They don't want Execute to be a hard-hitting ability.
It's not supposed to be by their reasoning.
pallid quiver
That single thing is literally pissing me off so much, I thought about not playing next patch
mighty valley
it just... doesn't make sense to me, we currently press shield slam every single time we're allowed to
wicked pollen
i don't go to arms, how is execute for them
does 0 fucking damage
mighty valley
and execute also having the same effect is a fun bonus! that makes me happy to be in execute phase!
pallid quiver
And Arms still presses Execute twice to buff mortal strike during execute phase
wicked pollen
not 2
its legit gamba
2 is min
ive done 8 executes in a row getting my tier set
dogshit
mighty valley
no one was skipping shield slams to press execute and ruining the vision of the colossus playstyle
pallid quiver
I'm talking about Executioner's Precision
the thing that's been there for ages
and will stay even when tier sets change
pallid quiver
i don't go to arms, how is execute for them
Execute ends up being a decent amount of damage, but that's just because you press it a lot; it's not like a mega hard hitting ability, but it's probably the hardest hitting Execute atm
fury's
isn't even a spender
mighty valley
yeah, fury uses it at max slayer stacks, otherwise unthrilling
but anyway
fury irrelevant, this is colossus country
pallid quiver
colossus starving
they're not getting enough nutrients for their bigger bodies
oh, i just realized they're hitting our leech again
Since One-handed spec is becoming a 2 pointer with 2% leech per point
At least it's 3% damage per point
stonks
mighty valley
that was kind of a wild single point talent
indom healing is the bigger passive healing nerf though
pallid quiver
Well, the reason they're doing it is to make up for Endurance Training being removed
Reinforced Plates is also a 2 pointer now
It gives stamina now, though, too
granite pond
Im curious what the hit to avatar uptime will end up being
hardy snow
"We feel that Warriors are in a good place overall, however, there are a few places we’d like to make improvements to each spec"
I would prefer they don't do such "improvements"
analog lantern
yh they more I think about it the more I cringe
pallid quiver
The fuck is this
If you missed it, I'm more mad about their reasoning for the Colo change
pallid quiver
The changes they're making also aren't going to have the impact they want
We're going to literally do exactly the same thing we're doing now
except we're just worse
hardy snow
the only change will be that we may actually drop imp wall for aegis, which is also bad 🤷♂️
mortal pecan
How do I undo the muscle memory to IP smashing I literally just got accustomed to
sharp gale
i would rather be in the brewmaster mindset right now...
mortal pecan
the only change will be that we may actually drop imp wall for aegis, which is a...
Maybe, but IW will give you SW even faster now with the CDR to SW
hardy snow
Maybe, but IW will give you SW even faster now with the CDR to SW
but we will have less shield slams due to resets nerf
mortal pecan
but we will have less shield slams due to resets nerf
True
hardy snow
generally our high apm (which is one of reasons I like prot war) will be reduced alot
mighty valley
How do I undo the muscle memory to IP smashing I literally just got accustomed t...
you won't need to, when bar high press IP. that'll just happen less if this goes live
chilly brook
Maybe, but IW will give you SW even faster now with the CDR to SW
Yeah except this is just a net nerf
you're losing damage because of this
period
mortal pecan
you won't need to, when bar high press IP. that'll just happen less if this goes...
I don't even think, I just smash it. I am probably the reason they are doing these changes. I am sorry for not thinking, boys.
chilly brook
you won't need to, when bar high press IP. that'll just happen less if this goes...
I like how they just ignore the fact that this is how the fucking spec has worked since BFA
Arms and fury changes are fine
pallid quiver
I don't think they're so much as ignoring that as suddenly deciding they don't like it anymore
chilly brook
but the prot guys is actually fucking brainless
mighty valley
i'm not against them rethinking the paradigm, i just have pretty severe doubts that they can do it in a seasonal patch of this size without missing the balance mark pretty bad
chilly brook
i'm not against them rethinking the paradigm, i just have pretty severe doubts t...
except they aren't doing that
this is just wildly throwing shit at the wall
pallid quiver
^^^
chilly brook
without any thought about how it changes things
mortal pecan
I don't think they're so much as ignoring that as suddenly deciding they don't l...
With the general lack of tanks, why potentially make changes to further deplete the tank pool.
pallid quiver
Like I said at the very start, I don't think they really know what they're doing
pallid quiver
With the general lack of tanks, why potentially make changes to further deplete ...
fuck prot war
That's the best I got for you
They do need to keep tanks balanced and engaging, but
This doesn't change how engaging the spec is
They're just reducing one of the reasons people like Prot War as a misguided attempt to bring depth to the spec
hardy snow
With the general lack of tanks, why potentially make changes to further deplete ...
tbh if I wasnt mostly focused on raiding (and guild needs stable tank), I would change to dps if such changes goes live
pallid quiver
I'm not against them adding depth; I'm against them just doing shit with terrible reasonings for things
mortal pecan
When is the target date? Like Feb?
pallid quiver
From what I saw at a glance from the DPS War's specs, their reasonings are fine
I don't know what it'll do for them, but overall reasonings seemed fine
granite pond
Lucky for them by February nobody will be playing tanks at all so these changes won't affect anyone
Big brain moves
pallid quiver
Enha reasons for changes seemed fine
hardy snow
end of february, probably right after TGP or week more
mortal pecan
I doubt this exact change goes into effect by target date
pallid quiver
prot war change reasons don't seem fine at all
mortal pecan
end of february, probably right after TGP or week more
What is TGP again?
pallid quiver
The Great Push
mortal pecan
is that just last couple weeks of season or something?
sharp gale
prot war change reasons don't seem fine at all
Fake reasons to make class more accessible (real reason)
hardy snow
and Feb 18 would fit 2month cadnece of patch
hardy snow
Fake reasons to make class more accessible (real reason)
but it will make class less accessible, as it will be just weaker
sharp gale
but it will make class less accessible, as it will be just weaker
Less off GCDs is more accessible, weaker is not related to accessible requirement since 90% of players doesn’t care
rough jasper
ffs and i just started playing prot and i love it, started doing 12s... but these changes look like shit
sharp gale
Don’t forget you do all 10s your are top 20% of wow
pallid quiver
at least the tier set looks neat
hardy snow
at least the tier set looks neat
isnt it kind of a rip off from mythic antorus?
sharp gale
I Will not too heavily judge that patch note because usual ptr shenanigans
But it starts bad
hardy snow
well, changes are just changes, they may not make it to live
but their reasoning, i.e. their goals and how they want achieve them are not good
warm plinth
I don't think it looks that bad
chilly brook
I don't think it looks that bad
It's pretty ass
warm plinth
Just slowing the spec down from 120mph to 100mph
sharp gale
The rage change will make it live 100% the form can change
chilly brook
Just slowing the spec down from 120mph to 100mph
It's a net nerf with no real adjustment in the design
0 damage buffs to offset this
you're going to have less avatar