If you're trying to adjust around the proc, there's an issue with your sending of IP
#protection
pallid quiver
quiet monolith
Will have long strings of shield slam / tclap and enough I damage coming in to just ip dump
pallid quiver
Even when you're playing Colossus, it doesn't influence what you do
And that spec's main focus is on Revenge
quiet monolith
I only use it if I feel like I'm totally safe, block is up, and I'm capping rage
But I play pretty defensive
cloud shuttle
what is ip 😭
pallid quiver
If Revenge isn't a normal part of your rotation, you're actually playing less defensively
pallid quiver
what is ip 😭
Ignore Pain
cloud shuttle
ah
shrewd grove
Doesn't impact your rotation at all. Any energy you devote to worrying about this is wasted. You only use IP to prevent overcapping on rage. Thus you will always have rage to cast revenge, if needed. Which you will only need to do if SS AND TC are on CD.
pallid quiver
Its main use time is to dump rage that you can't spend otherwise
You need enough rage saved to use Revenge when you need to so you can get more Shield Slams out
quiet monolith
What do you mean you only up to not cap, is it incredibly wasteful to use it at lower values of rage ?
pallid quiver
If you don't, you limit your rage generated over time, costing you rage sent on defensives, meaning
- Lower amount of IP
- Lower casts of shield wall
- Less healing from Indom
- Less rage fueled into Outburst, which generates rage
- Lower casts of Avatar, which gives rage on use and with more Thunder Clap casts
The above is the summary of most of that, Rye
You need to maximize your generation first off
IP doesn't help you generate, while Revenge does
Since it can reset SS
shrewd grove
What do you mean you only up to not cap, is it incredibly wasteful to use it at ...
There's exactly 0 reason to IP unless you're going to overcap on rage on your next cast. You are better off focusing on increasing the amount of rage you generate
quiet monolith
Right, I was just wondering about ip usage, sometimes I'm just spamming it if I feel in danger
Is that bad practice
shrewd grove
Spamming IP does nothing. You cap almost immediately
pallid quiver
If you're raw spamming it without like Ravager being down, you'll starve yourself
So you'd end up dying
quiet monolith
Ah ok, holy shit I'm dumb
pallid quiver
Prot War slowly bleeds out; if you're not slowly bleeding out, you're making mistakes like SB not being up or not using CDs properly
shrewd grove
Right, I was just wondering about ip usage, sometimes I'm just spamming it if I ...
So you're trying to fill a bucket that's already full, and all the while hurting your rage Gen, so you get fewer IPs out over the course of a fight
pallid quiver
or getting clipped in the back
shrewd grove
Thus putting you in more danger and making you feel like you need to spam IP more. It's a spiral
quiet monolith
I guess I need to work on that
The idea of my bucket being full is foreign
I panic when my IP is low or empty
And I end up spamming
cloud shuttle
what does this mean
shrewd grove
The idea of my bucket being full is foreign
You want your rotation to look like this
Cast Shield Slam
If Shield Slam is on CD, press TClap
If Shield Slam AND TClap are both on CD, press revenge
Use IP ONLY when your next SS would make you overcap on Rage
cloud shuttle
noted, never cast IP
quiet monolith
Thanks I will have to do some serious muscle memory retraining
shrewd grove
Thanks I will have to do some serious muscle memory retraining
No worries. You got it
quiet monolith
So realistically you might charge into a pack with no ip up, and go 3-4 globals without even pressing it ?
cloud shuttle
dont you just charge into shield charge pop shield block slam into ip?
shrewd grove
So realistically you might charge into a pack with no ip up, and go 3-4 globals ...
With CDs up you should overcap on rage in 2 GCDs
IP is also VERY good at mitigating the damage you take over long periods of time. Not for burst damage moments. So it's not doing the thing you think it's doing
quiet monolith
Ok, I will need to relearn a bit. Thanks for spending the time breaking it down for me
shrewd grove
No worries at all
cloud shuttle
anything on scroll wheel is crazy
quiet monolith
Is it ? Is there a time you don't really wanna shield slam ?
If it's up it's pressed
quiet monolith
Oh I weirdly got used to it over the years and it's become a bad crutch
quiet monolith
Is it ok to macro ss into my IP since IP is off gcd and if ss is up I should press it anyway ?
cloud shuttle
i think its a good habit to not bind multiple abilities together
unless theyre always used together
and i dont think you'd want to always use IP when you press slam
quiet monolith
Pretty embarrassing I noobed myself up to timing 12s not playing it correct
mighty valley
Is it ? Is there a time you don't really wanna shield slam ?
basically only when you have offensive cds to press (spear, shield charge, ravager)
quiet monolith
Ok. I had had the ss macrod Into my IP because I felt like I was missing globals during lust by moving my finger to press up and then back to ss
heavy sparrow
Great trinkets but nope!
cloud shuttle
man..
doing a +2 dawnbreaker as prot
randomly when we're on our way to the last boss our healer and 1 dps just goes offline
and they've been offline for 8minutes now
and we got 8min left of the timer
:(
they were offline for 17min before the rest of us called it quits
gg
shrewd grove
Is it ok to macro ss into my IP since IP is off gcd and if ss is up I should pre...
I use this and it's fantastic for my wrist health. Make sure you have this on your IP bind and not your SS bind. You need to be able to SS without IP
brazen glacier
Any tips for putting together M+ groups? If I join someone else's key it always seems to go well, often ++ or +++. But whenever I put together a group for one of my keys it often falls apart, so I feel like I'm doing something wrong when inviting. I only invite people who've timed keys at the same level as mine (6-8), have a good score, make sure someone has heroism/bloodlust, etc., and yet...
cloud shuttle
Any tips for putting together M+ groups? If I join someone else's key it always ...
tbh regardless of what class i play, doing my own key always ends in chaos
idk, maybe we just suck at picking people
💀
quiet monolith
I use this and it's fantastic for my wrist health. Make sure you have this on yo...
So in general, if my IP bar is full using one of the various UI packs... I should never IP, just revenge if I'm going to cap
shrewd grove
So in general, if my IP bar is full using one of the various UI packs... I shoul...
No. Tracking IP is worthless. Just send it when you're gonna overcap
quiet monolith
But if you were just clapped, and suddenly have no IP up, would you still wait to press again for when you are in danger of capping rage ?
Like, you wouldnt just SS and IP immediately to get a buffer ?
I feel naked without IP up so I'm probably spamming it way too much at lower rage
shrewd grove
IP does not provide the level of defensive benefit you are giving it credence for. You are much better off ensuring you maintain SB and use your defensive CDs properly
quiet monolith
Ok thanks !
tacit smelt
I cannot recall if throngus (2nd boss of grim), his rp starts (his channel + roam) the moment we kill first boss or when we enter room
shrewd grove
avatar into revenge spam
Avatar into WW or bust 
pallid quiver
Any tips for putting together M+ groups? If I join someone else's key it always ...
The absolute, most surefire way to vet people is to look at log history of that person and actually parse through their log; not rely on parses, but actually process what they're doing; what interrupts they do in keys, how they use their defensives, etc.
That takes a lot of time, and people will generally leave before you can find a good group that way since it's not easy finding quality people
IO is effectively meaningless, since people can be carried through some real high keys
I'd say it's more likely for a bad DPS to ruin a group than a bad tank, though, since healers are generally inclined and used to carrying tanks through them being horrifically bad
So it's really a crapshoot in general without dedicated effort, but the more effort you put in, the longer keys take.
mighty valley
I feel naked without IP up so I'm probably spamming it way too much at lower rag...
here's prot warrior theory: we get SO MUCH just from the act of spending rage that we just want to generate as much as possible
which means if IP is capped, and you're gonna overcap on rage with your next SS... you press IP anyway, because spending rage is good, therefore wasting it is bad
but the reason you don't want to run low is because when ss and tc are on cooldown, you want to have revenge available to press
because revenge spends rage (good) and can reset shield slam, to give you more rage (good)
simple drum
Does this not imply that the statement ‘Trust the sims’ is objectively incorrect?
mighty valley
sims are just the best tiebreaker between two similar pieces of gear
or two trinkets etc
simple drum
In the context of that conversation, a couple people were essentially saying ‘you unconditionally want as much haste as possible and less of every other stat’ which I was confused about since my sims say my top gear is more crit heavy than haste heavy
And that was the response
Sims sim for ‘purely damage’ lmao
mighty valley
well that part is true, it's only strictly telling you a dps value
there's a correlation between best dps gear and best overall gear but it's not always 1:1
but gearing for survival just isn't an exact science, we just loosely know that haste does the most for our kit
pallid quiver
Does this not imply that the statement ‘Trust the sims’ is objectively incorrect...
Sims have a different purpose, but also, on a practical instance, you can actually hit thresholds depending on your gear available to you, specifically; it is actually technically possible to get enough haste that getting more isn't quite worth it, but it requires you to pretty heavily ignore the other stats, making it not quite as valuable. When still getting trace amounts of the other stats, pretty much every piece will have haste on it when getting near bis
However
that is such a minor thing that is solved by just listening to sims for the gear you specifically have available, anyhow
And when getting geared towards cap, it's not fussing over in the long run, since you can't go drastically farther past haste breakpoints than in coming seasons, where gear will have stronger amounts of haste, and there's a possibility there won't be cantrip type rings that don't have haste or things like that
On top of that, haste is the best stat defensively, so you can just compare between pieces of gear that all have haste on them at the least + things like queen ring and the like
chilly brook
Does this not imply that the statement ‘Trust the sims’ is objectively incorrect...
no because then you are simply ignoring everything else
Trusting the sims is the objectively correct answer if all you care about is doing the most damage
Most of the time you do
However if you want more survivability then the sims are not the most accurate method for that
chilly brook
Sims sim for ‘purely damage’ lmao
Because they do...
In the grand scheme of things people focus way too much on gear/stats for tanks. It's really fairly simple. Equip ilvl, favor pieces that have haste if you can and sim if you just want to have the most offensively minded setup (most of the time this is the move). If you need more defense look at the known best items (usually trinkets) for that.
oak ivy
So this just happened on court prog https://www.twitch.tv/kappa_elite/clip/HelplessSmoggyBaconDoritosChip-qEDDQxf5Cdc6IoTi
heavy sparrow
anyone have a necrotic wake 10+ talent tree build to share? I just wanna see some comparison to see your thought process
proven plume
sweet summit
can't really think of anything
double wall can be useful in necrotic wake but probably not on a 10
spell block is only nice for narzudah pack which dies fast on a 10 so tough as nails is minor damage increase
tardy abyss
Wouldnt BB be better
sweet summit
need 2 points in it to continue down
tardy abyss
oh right
sweet summit
very sad
fresh pilot
yo, what would you recommend as the better option. Myth track shield from first boss in Nerub, or crafted 636 with haste?
jagged pier
myth track
fresh pilot
Understood, thank you. I am now above 20k haste rating Jakey, and switched to ITF, you were right, went my lblocked attacks go from 70-80% to 85-95%
paper coral
How is soloing Vek'vir in ?? as prot?
chilly brook
Man what is with people dying to the lines on first boss of GB this week?
violet ginkgo
Man what is with people dying to the lines on first boss of GB this week?
it's just annoying have to move around Matt.
I hate the tank fight where you have to constantly move.
tardy abyss
His bleed damage is way more annoying tbh
jagged pier
How is soloing Vek'vir in ?? as prot?
its a joke
paper coral
its a joke
Oh, nice. are thre guides or is it literally that much of a joke?
sharp gale
I think now with actual ilvl it is even more a joke, it’s been a long time but if I remember you have to kick the heal, and dispel with avatar the poison
And focus the add but I think it gets destroyed
jagged pier
imm be honest
if u need a guide to understand the like 3 mechanics in that fight
u probably shouldnt be playing the game
pallid quiver
jakey, there's a lot of people who can't understand tank swap as a mechanic
and it's the only mechanic they have to deal with
The game would die if everyone who couldn't understand Zekvir quit/got shoved out
brittle owl
u probably shouldnt be playing the game
didn't know you were a gatekeeper jakey
brittle owl
The game would die if everyone who couldn't understand Zekvir quit/got shoved ou...
shove dn
paper coral
u probably shouldnt be playing the game
violet ginkgo
u probably shouldnt be playing the game
ok I'll stop playing the game then
sweet summit
u probably shouldnt be playing the game
that was unnecessary
half sapphire
u probably shouldnt be playing the game
I mean tbf, it’s a badly designed fight. I kept dying to the stupid poison move because I didn’t understand it was basically a gimmick check. Interupt heal or poison? Oh the answer was actually just use that one niche talent node on slayer to remove slows on charge.
Or in prot’a case: save an avatar cast to remove it.
But every class has a weird remove slow talent node to make it doable (fade, mage barrier, hunter disengage, tiger lust, freedom, vengeful retreat, shapeshift?)
jagged pier
Or just use avatar
Or take a talent that reduces your inturpt cd
Or a talent that gives u another intuprt for when brann is feared or doesnt bother
Doesnt baldestorm removes slows too?
Sounds like you just didnt read your talents i dunno
half sapphire
Oh yeah try and save dps cds to cleanse when there is a fucking egg about to hatch, real optimal at 620 ilvl. I’m sure at 630 it’s a joke now but you can’t do that earlier in the patch
half sapphire
Sounds like you abused early game brann, idk man.
jagged pier
Nope
Was done after that point
Was done after brann got nerfed and after zekvir was impossible for 2 weeks because of it
Was done after spell reflect got fixed too
strong forum
There's only a handful of people who did it with OP brann
I did it during the window where brann was turbo nerfed and the fight was "impossible" aka just 4x harder than it is currently
616ilvl as arms with healer brann
But with the spell reflect cheese
All that you have to do is meet the dps check for the egg
And exclusively kick the heal
Then the boss will just flop
half sapphire
shrug idk how you survive boss auto attacks at 537 ilvl, but I do see a world where you take 10-15 minutes to kill staying in prot stance 90% of the time and rotating blade storm and avatar. I just feel like that is very unintentional design.
The real question is how do you do it on other classes? You don’t have those kind of options on other classes, and that’s why I think it’s a gimmick fight.
jagged pier
Did it on ele as well was a joke witht hat too spirit walkers
Or ghost wolf
Tbh u can intuprt everything as ele but just spamming lughtening bolt
half sapphire
Well they removed that talent so now you’re forced into either poison totem which also got nerfed or you just take the ghost wolf talent.
jagged pier
*shrug* idk how you survive boss auto attacks at 537 ilvl, but I do see a world ...
there is a difference between 537 and 537 with
jagged pier
Well they removed that talent so now you’re forced into either poison totem whic...
no?
well maybe now
i did it a while ago
jagged pier
havent touched shamman in ages
lightening bolt is boring
meatball or nothing
but u run both spirit walkers and gohst wolf anyway
and if u dont take posion cleanse just incase fro zek i dunno
again thats just inting
u take talents to help with the content
cloud shuttle
went to sleep was almost 4 AM apologies 😂
No worries, but take the other macro. Its better than the one i made
cloud shuttle
Yea
normal crag
thanks, appreciate it 😄
cloud shuttle
☝️🗿
solar hill
anyone have a WA for IP percentage?
sweet egret
what would the max singletarget dps colossus spec look like?
sharp gale
anyone have a WA for IP percentage?
sharp gale
what would the max singletarget dps colossus spec look like?
In raid ?
sweet egret
yes, but single target same no matter where right?
sharp gale
1 m i guess
sweet egret
no, the talent spec
jagged pier
U drop spell block indom and intesgate (i guess can remeber the last one u drop) go 2 points in bb take battering ram swap hr to itf and punish to jug and ed to massecre
sweet egret
I'm unsure about instigate, bloodsurge, impenetrable wall etc
sharp gale
Im looking at wcl, thane made a « come back » on 3 of the first 4 boss
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/R9KnwkPCDQhJvdVA#fight=17&type=summary&source=67
this is the rank one prot, but 3min30 kill time is crazy
Nvm I have 2 kills at 3 min30 too
strong forum
Wish I could play prot on mythic every now and again
That being said I lost 1 all-star ranking spot on HC. ..
sweet summit
it's so over...
strong forum
It's okay those parses are 13ilvl on weapon and 1 embellish ago
Soon I can pooomp the mooscles
(once I'm bored of poe2, helldivers and dbz:SZ)
harsh trellis
So, I keep using raidbots and its telling me to use crit/mastery gems over crit haste... is this thing lying to me or should I follow what its tellin me in the sim
strong forum
Link
But yeah if you have like 0 mastery, getting just a little bit can be an increase
strong forum
But also
It's a 387 dps side grade to change all gems
SooOoOoOoOOoooo
Just don't bother 😉
Just craft belt, catalyse boots
And you're good to go
harsh trellis
Thanks as always Nom
strong forum
Or better yet
Just upgrade your gloves to max
And save a few crests for your next myth item
Altho I can't recall if I had that discussion with you
Or someone else
harsh trellis
it was with me
I was trying to sim out different crafting things
I was going to craft a sword, and then the sword dropped
then I was trying to decide between a ring and a belt
the belt simmed out better
Love how I took my BS all in on making the GD sword only to have the myth sword finally drop when I finally put enough points in to make a 5 star sword
strong forum
yeyey
sweet egret
how strong is leeching strikes talent
rain swan
hi, quick question, do you guys spec bitter immunity for this weeks affix?
or too expensive to take?
sweet egret
no
sweet summit
healer affix innit
rain swan
alright, i main healer, so i was wondering if i should take it to help or not, my fellow healers...
sweet egret
but mostly just don't worry about it at all (not playing low enough keys anymore but that's what I used to do)
sweet summit
tank is getting healed regardless, we can IV/LS/dwarf it if needed
rain swan
thanks
harsh trellis
hi, quick question, do you guys spec bitter immunity for this weeks affix?
You can last stand out of it instantly also if you need
harsh trellis
I honestly dont think ive ever specced out of it at all in any build
sweet egret
neither have I, I was just trying to find a point and saw 3% leech
CkEAmidFBOBFf5oKuZ7r/WeW7YEDAAAAzMzwMmZmZbmlZmZWYGDTjBzMDglBG2YmhZYmHYYAAAAAAAzMAALbbAGGstNjZZZZ0YGmBzWjNmNA
to have this
I would like to have 2/2 cruel strikes too but I can't find a point for it
so I guess there isn't one
strong forum
you cant
sweet egret
I figured as much
harsh trellis
is this for keys?
sweet egret
what about frothing berserker?
yes
is the entire second wind healing when out of combat
or just the first part
do we actually need enduring defenses with HR (in a m+ setting)?
sweet egret
I have 20k unbuffed
strong forum
fair
sweet egret
whereas with hr it's just passive
never have to worry at all about it
and I'd rather have that as I'm trying to push into 14-15s
pallid quiver
No one here would blame you for that
It's bot like ITF buffs your damage by a massive amount; I think in optimal AOE it was like 6%, right Nome?
sweet egret
I really don't like the ultra hype about itf
I'd rather be 100% secure in shield block than having it drop off
pallid quiver
People just like haste because it feels better
sweet egret
as it does when I play colossus in low keys
mighty valley
it's fun when you see people running itf and then just not pressing buttons
tardy abyss
It's bot like ITF buffs your damage by a massive amount; I think in optimal AOE ...
yeah something like that
sharp gale
ITF in some dungeon you may find some issues with too close haste (where you chain pull constantly like GB)
But mists it’s easy, so much downtime
chilly brook
I'd rather be 100% secure in shield block than having it drop off
most of the time it's not an issue assuming you hit the haste breakpoint before spec'ing it
But that also does mean you have more responsibility on you as a player to efficiently use your shield block and shield charge
i.e. don't send a 2nd charge of shield block when the pack dies in 3 seconds and you have 5 seconds left on the duration of it
warm plinth
Don't tell me what to do griff
tawny raft
hey all, i picked up prot warrior for the first time last week. was loving it until i got to the +10 keys in m+. i feel really squishy and im not sure what im doing wrong. i was wondering if anyone could have a look at a random (not very good) key i did today and offer some advice. thanks
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/dwc96mz3FgpPWbHM#fight=1
chilly brook
hey all, i picked up prot warrior for the first time last week. was loving it un...
you mitigated less than half of the anima slashes
you didn't interrupt patty cake
ate a dodge ball
warm plinth
Your cpm are very low
tawny raft
the patty cake was already i wipe, the party told me to jum,p away to reset and it did patty cake when i was miles away xD
ashen hearth
https://wowanalyzer.com/report/dwc96mz3FgpPWbHM/1-Mythic++Mists+of+Tirna+Scithe+-+Kill+(31:58)/Captnkronic/standard
shows you can improve on defensives uptimes?
tawny raft
thanks for all the replys!
tawny raft
Your cpm are very low
what is cpm ? 😄
warm plinth
I don't think wowanalyzer has been updated in quite a while
warm plinth
Yes
tawny raft
a h makes sense
sweet summit
you have enough haste to run ITF if you want
i despise rally in keys it is so worthless grab intim shout or movespeed or something instead
92% blocked hits with HR is not great
you wasted ten bajillion rage (not good, press IP more)
you picked the wrong shroom
tawny raft
loving this!
chilly brook
6 anima slashes with no CDs is gonna fuck
tawny raft
i tried ITF for a key but found it hard to keep shield block up without the extension
ashen hearth
i have a diff question. is there a haste target prot warrr should have ? or we maxing it ?
tawny raft
6 anima slashes with no CDs is gonna fuck
are the anima slashes magic or physical
sweet summit
not really
only "breakpoint" we have is 35% ~21k rating, where we swap to ITF
chilly brook
i tried ITF for a key but found it hard to keep shield block up without the exte...
shouldn't be that difficult
tawny raft
❤️
sweet summit
with ITF you really really wanna use shield charge on cooldown
chilly brook
if you have a mob CD addon for healthbars its a big help
ashen hearth
cheers guys!
chilly brook
SR the first, SW the second set, SR the 3rd set, spell block 4th etc.
tawny raft
i use a custom plater profile for all my characters from someone called jundies
sweet summit
jundies owns so frigging hard
chilly brook
They are a bit desync'd so for the SR only sets you're gonna eat one anima slash but only eating one isn't a huge deal
at least not in a 10
tawny raft
@sweet summit how could you tell i wasted my rage?
tawny raft
ah sweet
chilly brook
@sweet summit can guardians be stunned/
sweet summit
no
sweet summit
that would be too cool and epic blizzard would never...
chilly brook
real
sweet egret
most of the time it's not an issue *assuming you hit the haste breakpoint* befor...
which breakpoints would that be? nome said my 20k unbuffed was enough but I'm not feeling it atm
tardy abyss
If he says its enough, its enough
sweet summit
that should be enough, yeah
chilly brook
which breakpoints would that be? nome said my 20k unbuffed was enough but I'm no...
idk I'm running it at 18k unbuffed
gray spear
Hi guys, new prot tank here <---- , do you guys ever switch out of defensive stance to do more dmg? is it even worth it?
sweet egret
I am switching out but idk if it's worth much
gray spear
tooltips says 3% crit, not sure if its worth the dmg mitigation sacrifise in any scenario. Maybe for the burn phase in first boss Mist?
sweet egret
tooltip is right
wicked pollen
you can be in bstance and press defensive stance as defensive
chilly brook
Hi guys, new prot tank here <---- , do you guys ever switch out of defensive sta...
most of the time being in defensive stance isn't necessary
tawny raft
you have enough haste to run ITF if you want
i despise rally in keys it is so wo...
sorry what is HR?
wicked pollen
Heavy Repercussions
Shield Slam generates 2 more Rage and extends the duration of Shield Block by 1.0 sec.
thanks
lofty warren
Heavy Repercussions
```
Shield Slam generates 2 more Rage and extends the durat...
We get buffed?
pallid quiver
We get buffed?
I'd recommend reading the tooltips on your talents.
sweet egret
We get buffed?
yes, every time
lofty warren
Ohh that is just an ability it isn't a blizz note
blazing zinc
Hello, I just had a weird thing happen - in Dawnbreaker, the "orb MINI boss" seemed to use the orb on me.... so far I never ever seen a tank get it. What could cause it? We had a Night Elf but he said he didnt Shadowmeld. Then we had a DK who wasn't sure if he AMS'd. The rest was Aug + Mistweaver + Boomie. Any ideas? 😂
wicked pollen
you sure it didnt that just target you (threat wise)
but target someone else with the mechanic
strong forum
Maybe no-one else was in combat
Or in range or w/e
It's certainly not a normal thing for you to get it
sweet summit
nah it just does that
even tho its on someone else
the line thingy from the mob to the person it's going towards is what you want to look for
blazing zinc
we were all in combat and it happened when the boss was half HP already so I don't think there was something unusual from us, except maybe the DK AMS
they said the target was me but idk if it shows correctly
sweet summit
wait did the orb actually go on you?
blazing zinc
that's what they said happened
sweet summit
because it will always target you
blazing zinc
me and DK were on the other side than other ppl
sweet summit
but go on someone else
blazing zinc
oh okay
the DK said he didnt get any notification about the orb
so he thought it wasn't on him
sweet summit
idk how it looks from dps pov
wicked pollen
do you have a log?
blazing zinc
not me but mby the DK, I'll ask
half sapphire
Sounds like maybe some shadowmeld/invis shenanigans?
untold wave
I strugle against bleed mobs in siege any tips?
tardy abyss
Either have SW up or pray that your team has a brain and helps out
Unfortunately there is little you can do
untold wave
Right, sadge then ill get I go dorf
untold wave
What mobs bleeds in GB? I did both tonight and only strugled in Siege
untold wave
right, did 12 and could pretty much rotate all my Cds to keep me topped all the time.
tardy abyss
You will notice a big difference from 12 to 13 to 14
On 12 I found it pretty chill too
14 is a whole different story
untold wave
oh no, don't say that hahah
tardy abyss
But its only really that bad because the shout hurts us too
Which unfortunately also deals phys damage
So spell block and sr and straight up useless
GB in general is mostly a tank dungeon imo
untold wave
I really enjoy GB but the dmg can be a bit spooky sometimes
tardy abyss
Gotta love when the first auto after mace chase on 2nd boss is bugged
And hits you for almost all your hp
Or even oneshots you
untold wave
That has never happend to me, jeez wow is good game
tardy abyss
Doesnt happen often
But when it does you will notice it
And the fact they shadowfixed blade flurry still tilts me
untold wave
hmm. what shadowfix?
untold wave
Does not really sound intended to be able to do it but I see
tardy abyss
well yeah
But considering how much it hurts it was nice to have
Sure we have SW up for every blade flurry but 
wicked pollen
the strongest part about the flurry was not getting the puddles
the tank buster is so irrelevant
pallid quiver
oh no, don't say that hahah
Keys get exponentially harder with level, so the gap from a 12 to a 13 is less than the gap between 13 to 14
simple drum
I’m not doing mythic+ keys until they’re correct again
mighty valley
correct how
chilly brook
But on higher keys it hurts really badly
Hurts less than the aoe
The bleed isn’t that bad
Imo
wicked pollen
the aoe does big dam
wicked pollen
does it also increase per cast
chilly brook
ive heard it like 3-5 times
I don’t see it mentioned in any guides
wicked pollen
ig healer moment
violet flume
once again im reminded of the prot war supremacy
last boss of NW gives me heart attacks as brew
...warrior theres no damage
violet ginkgo
last boss NW is the most chill boss indeed
just move a bit once in a while
then let the DPS and healers panic all the mechs
violet flume
meanwhile on brew, every bolt slaps 20% of your hp and give you heavy stagger, you keep chasing the sefheals and defensives lol
sharp gale
I had fun watching my brew friend getting ravaged by second boss but of mist melees
timid nacelle
Any high key streamers still running prot warr or all moved on to pally? I really enjoy the high key guides but would be great if there was some warrior options.
sharp gale
Any high key streamers still running prot warr or all moved on to pally? I reall...
You still can watch the pre-11.0.5 videos
It’s not like they got deleted
blazing zinc
do you have a log?
jagged gust
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/bKGnrq2FdBD1Tg6R#fight=3&type=summary got i...
Shadowmeld at 13:20 by the druid and a dark orb goes off at 13:24, seems suspicious
blazing zinc
that's the first thing I asked about but he said he didn't Shadowmeld 🤔
but if it's in the log then he clearly did
could you check if it's the same orb where the tank got hit by the orb = got the DoT from it? (I'm bad at navigating logs sorry haha 😂)
if 13:24 is the same orb that touched the tank which would mean it was actually Shadowmeld as the reason
unless tank got touched more than 1x, I think someone placed it opposite way another time if it was the same run (we did 2x Dawn in a row)
sweet summit
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/bKGnrq2FdBD1Tg6R#fight=3&type=summary got i...
i am 90% sure it went on the DK
i have never once have it go on me unless i'm the only person alive/in combat with it
see the mob targets me and is facing at me but the orb was going on someone else.
the DK was the only person also standing in front of the mob at the time, and you both got hit
it can't be meld because the orb cast that was fucked was at 12:50 and shadowmelds were at 11:12 and 13:20
i'd need a recording to be 100% sure as it's not the easiest to see in logs since dark orb casts target environment or something
like i mentioned earlier there will be a visual line going from the miniboss' arms to the player the orb will go to, which is the real indicator. so if you're tunnel visioning it can be easy to miss
if blizzard was cool and nice and epic they could fix it so the mob actually targets the player like what happens on the 2nd boss but you know how it is
edgy falcon
Hello now to prot warri and loving it. Should I track the absorb from ignore pain?
wooden widget
Nah. Just press ignore pain when you’re above 70 rage and ggs
edgy falcon
xD ok, ty
wooden widget
If you’re doing the rotation well (especially in thane) you’re gonna have a fat IP most of the time
blazing zinc
@sweet summit thank you very much for the analysis! Much appreciated 😃
sweet summit
🫡
fallow hinge
Can you parry, dodge, block while channeling earthen racial azurite surge?
pallid quiver
iirc no
fallow hinge
so it would just kill you if you tried doing it in a big pull
jagged pier
well depends on key lvl and size of pull
sweet summit
Can you parry, dodge, block while channeling earthen racial azurite surge?
i don't see any "allow defense while casting" or "allow defense while channeling"
pallid quiver
You can slap on Shield Wall then press it, but
it's also not a very strong racial
It feels like it'd be a DPS loss sometimes, even, but I haven't gone through the effort to check
warm plinth
Mornin
sweet summit
good morning cutie
warm plinth
pallid quiver
decided to finally hit zekvir
fight sucks
Brann just fucked off to the door instead of dispelling me
we love my quest list being all fucked up right now
why's brann gotta be so toxic all the time
sweet summit
that greedy bastard needs his reward...
dusky canopy
Luerce, you got it!
pallid quiver
I had time to turn around and just watch him run all the way from the entrance hallway to the door
dusky canopy
pallid quiver
and i just stood there
i could've avatar'd it off but I was just like
"this fucking guy"
pallid quiver
Luerce, you got it!
the hardest part was not losing attention span during the fight
and then suddenly wonder why i'm stunned for 5 seconds
i had to do 3 delves before even getting to try, too, since I never did any above tier 8
dusky canopy
I was in the same boat, I don’t think I’ve completed an 11 delve yet even
They are tough on the final bosses!
pallid quiver
i just pressed buttons
I don't even remember which delves i did
I'm too dumb to know if something was hard or not
I just didn't die, so it's k
oh i didn't get quest credit for killing him
i got the achievements tho
full heart
hmm yeah it seems like almost every popular tree does not use ravager, and opts for battle-scarred veteran, even the alternative trees
which may reduce some of those o shit moments for me
pallid quiver
That's because they all copied some of the people who were doing it at first by just looking an Archon
and not looking at the logs for what value they got out of it
It's fine to run, but you're losing on a lot of value from Ravager's burst rage at the start of a pull, especially the first pull
patent orbit
I only use Battle-Scarred when I'm going into a fight where I know I'm gonna take lots of damage and my healer isn't a god
aka Court
pallid quiver
You also need to remember that it's not a Cheat
full heart
I mean, if I'm having survivability issues then I should probably look into it
pallid quiver
If you're having survival issues, it means there's issues with your play
BSV's only up once every 3 mins
full heart
my shield block uptime isn't too great
pallid quiver
It won't magically solve all your problems
pallid quiver
It's more like an extra defensive CD
full heart
well, it could help reduce some of those hairy moments during the the length of the run
pallid quiver
It's got a few specific, notable problems that can make it not even help you when you need it, since there's a lot of times where you get down to 30%, but don't actually need it to activate (taking tankbusters from bosses, for example)
So it forces you to play around it since it's not a real cheat
Otherwise you just chose to lose out on a button that'll actually help you during hairy moments from the rage influx
full heart
I'll play with it and see how it works
pallid quiver
It's not a bad talent, but you have to be aware of how it works, or else you'll fall into the trap of making yourself squishier at the cost of "feeling safer"
Like the people who overspend on IP to play "more defensively"
patent orbit
Otherwise you just chose to lose out on a button that'll actually help you durin...
I don't disagree with you, the pure dps burst is honestly a must in a lot of situations. but if you are using it for rage influx there might be bigger issues
pallid quiver
wym, Ravager's one of the highest bursts of rage you get when you send it
You generally send it at the start of packs, which is when your life is in the most danger
patent orbit
I'm saying the way most builds are you shouldn't be too worried about rage
pallid quiver
So having rage cycling for Indom/SW CD/just raw IPs is pretty useful to get going at the start of a pull
patent orbit
the only time I have rage issues is when I do my Collosus build and that is still rare.
pallid quiver
But every bit of rage you gen is more rage you generate. That sounds weird, but we scale exponentially with rage gen due to Outburst
It's not having rage issues, it's just you get more tank value from generating more rage
full heart
Do you guys have any links to WA's that help track shield block and ignore pain? Trying to give my UI a bit of an overhaul to help my gameplay a bit
patent orbit
But every bit of rage you gen is more rage you generate. That sounds weird, but ...
oh gotcah
pallid quiver
You get more SW the more rage you get
patent orbit
I misunderstood the argument you were making
sweet summit
Do you guys have any links to WA's that help track shield block and ignore pain?...
shield block yeah
ignore pain isn't too important but i track that too
pallid quiver
Do you guys have any links to WA's that help track shield block and ignore pain?...
Nome's WA pack should have everything you need; mine's very dum-dum hardcoded because it's just made over the years
I personally don't use a WA to track IP, since I'm sending it often enough, I can press it multiple times if I need to stack it for whatever reason, and I can tweak my healthbar to show absorbs if I care
forest spruce
I was looking on murloc and there seems to be a few different talent build not to sure what one to use
brazen glacier
How much of the trash do you clear before pulling the second boss of GB? I had always just pulled the first three packs and that was always enough, but now that I'm doing higher keys I'm finding I have to kite him longer and longer and eventually run out of room and have to pull him into packs we haven't cleared yet. Do you clear the whole room beforehand on higher keys?
strange urchin
I was looking on murloc and there seems to be a few different talent build not t...
If you're going for massive pulls or pushing higher keys, nothing wrong with having Battle Scarred Veteran over Ravager.
Based on the top 100 Prot Warriors, these are the talents that they are picking based on percentage.
waxen quarry
nome spawning with an essay in 5 minutes
prob not actually as he explained it 90000 times already
tardy abyss
If you're going for massive pulls or pushing higher keys, nothing wrong with hav...
Except that Ravager will help you a lot more than BSV ever could
dusky canopy
I’m actually very surprised ravager isn’t well represented
tardy abyss
Thats because people cant think for themselves and just copy
dusky canopy
It would seem logical to me that the rage gen flood would be good survivability through ip spam
strange urchin
I’m actually very surprised ravager isn’t well represented
To be fair I use it for certain dungeons!
tardy abyss
Theres no pwar otp playing afaik
I cant think for a single dungeon where BSV could have a legit use-case
Simply because its so dog
strange urchin
BSV is great when pushing higher key levels, particularly with pugs
tardy abyss
No its not?
What makes you think that
Have you ever checked the actual value of BSV in high keys?
strange urchin
Yes it is, otherwise top 100 prot warriors, all which are likely better than you, 96% are using it
knotty pewter
All my experience using it is what makes me think it
knotty pewter
I really dont understand the common sentiment in this discord that all the top 200 warriors only copy the top 1 warrior without thinking
tardy abyss
Because thats just how it is?
sweet summit
i don't think it's as binary as this
knotty pewter
How are you determining the "value" in logs?
tardy abyss
Kira was using it because he was doing all the calls and wanted a cushion
Which is fair
But Im 100% sure he knows its not a good talent
tardy abyss
How are you determining the "value" in logs?
You can actually check how much it absorbed
Which in a lot of cases is close to nothing because 30% is a very high threshhold
So it will proc despite you not needing it
knotty pewter
right and i dontn think thats a good waay to measure its value
tardy abyss
Yes it is
knotty pewter
disagree
knotty pewter
he is and there are others here that are too
tardy abyss
If it absorbed no damage then it procced for no reason
knotty pewter
its so bizzare
tardy abyss
Thats not a hard thing to understand
sweet summit
wdym absorbed
strange urchin
top 100 warriors, 96% use it, and he said its simply garbage. Doesnt make sense, it obviously has value for pushing higher keys where damage is spikier.
tardy abyss
And anyway, other tank specs dont require a cheat death despite them being way less tanky
sweet summit
oh i see nvm
knotty pewter
it saves my life regularly
tardy abyss
Pwar is by far the tankiest spec
strange urchin
Sure buddy
knotty pewter
and I can feel it in game and see it in logs
tardy abyss
top 100 warriors, 96% use it, and he said its simply garbage. Doesnt make sense,...
The damage in higher keys is not spikier
knotty pewter
the conscript pulls in CoT, first pull NW, Shadowstalkers in DB etc etc
dusky canopy
The thing is, the statistic websites like murloc only tell you what’s popular. And the vast majority of players just copy paste what the people in the top 5 are doing. And if you’re in the top 5 I’d imagine you copy what the guy in 1st is doing and then try to improve on it to take the spot
knotty pewter
The damage in higher keys is not spikier
it isnt about spiky damage
tardy abyss
The damage in higher keys is higher, if it was spikier it would mean the mechanics change with key levels
knotty pewter
who saaid it is?
dusky canopy
The thing is, the statistic websites like murloc only tell you what’s popular. A...
That doesn’t make BSV a great pick
sweet summit
there are a lot of cheats for other tank specs (idk anything about bear or monk)
dusky canopy
It’s just everyone copying the top guy
rocky ledge
top 100 warriors, 96% use it, and he said its simply garbage. Doesnt make sense,...
This says that dmg is spikier
knotty pewter
its an 80% dr for 8s. that isnnt about spikey daamaage
strange urchin
The thing is, the statistic websites like murloc only tell you what’s popular. A...
I see what youre saying but I doubt the top 200 highest rated warriors are just copying what the tank above them are doing. They all know what theyre doing.
knotty pewter
thats about being able to stand in a pull that has 20 mobs meleeing you and 3 casters casting on you
sweet summit
if 96% of top warriors jumped off a bridge would you do that too?
tardy abyss
I see what youre saying but I doubt the top 200 highest rated warriors are just ...
No they just hopped on the meta bandwagon when pwar was meta and dont wanna change to pally
Thats all there is to it
dusky canopy
Most tanks in the game copy yoda
knotty pewter
absulutely insane takes on BSV ive seen over the last few weeks that are just dismissed as everyone copying and not thinking
dusky canopy
So because yoda doesn’t play optimally now we all do
You see what I’m saying?
It doesn’t make Bsv good
Yoda plays to time the highest keys with a highly coordinated team
strange urchin
Not everyone follows those people, some people use the talents they like because it feels and operates better for them
tardy abyss
absulutely insane takes on BSV ive seen over the last few weeks that are just di...
Now give me logs that actually have decent BSV value
knotty pewter
yeah the copying takes are crazy
strange urchin
yeah the copying takes are crazy
yeah what are these people talking about? XD
knotty pewter
some do for sure but i think you guys are out of touch. lots of good players out there making good decisions on their own that dont play the game 7 days a week 12 hours a day
tardy abyss
And honestly even if it was good, its not like many are at a level where its needed
Like if you need BSV in a +12
tardy abyss
You might wanna read a guide
strange urchin
top 200 prot warriors only use these talents because one other tank does, and not because they recognise the value themselves.
rocky ledge
How are the copying takes crazy when it literally happens every single season, and 99% of the people arguing for the talent choices don't say anything other than "the top ppl are playing it, it must be best kekw"
strange urchin
yeah those same people are like "COPY WOWHEAD"
knotty pewter
Now give me logs that actually have decent BSV value
i do not care about changing your opinion. Im just pushing back on your bad takes. others can decide what they want
tardy abyss
i do not care about changing your opinion. Im just pushing back on your bad take...
So you dont have any logs, got it
dusky canopy
Nome explains why BSV is bad. I trust nomes incite on talents because he donates hundreds of hours of his time to theorize this stuff
tardy abyss
Meaning you cant claim that I have a bad take
When you cant prove otherwise
¯_(ツ)_/¯
knotty pewter
bro this is discord. i can claim what i want and not have to prove shit. just like anyone else
jagged pier
not 100% true but ok
rocky ledge
And that is why people are hostile in these conversations
strange urchin
Not sure who Nome is. But its hard to talk snarky advice from doylums like Stjpa when he talks down to people without explaining it fairly
dusky canopy
Nomeratur
strange urchin
Ill look him up!
jagged pier
literally nither side of the agruements have explained anything
dusky canopy
The literal theorycrafter apl maintainer and guide writer for protection warriors
It amazes me people don’t know who he is yet they hangout in skyhold
strange urchin
Where did you explain it Stjpa
jagged pier
he doesnt talk much anymore because its the same topics over and over
and spec is dead
cause no changes in 4 years
strange urchin
you just say things like "everyone copies it" or "thats just how it is"
dusky canopy
and spec is dead
knotty pewter
believe who you want for whatever reasons you want. i know who nome is and i know why he makes the arguements he does. I disagree based on my experience using various talents in the keys that i push. has nothing to do with blind copying
tardy abyss
No I explained that it has close to no healing/absorb whenever it procs
Which is true for a very large amount of cases
So when it doesnt do anything...it is bad
Its pretty much the same for double shield wall, people claim its good because all the warriors take it
jagged pier
believe who you want for whatever reasons you want. i know who nome is and i kno...
so its feelycrafty then not numbers or data provided? which is fine. but that doesnt mean its correct
tardy abyss
When you mathematically get a lot more out of it when using the other option
jagged pier
if u claim something like it saved u regularly its polite to show evidence
dusky canopy
They’ll be hard pressed to show evidence because it rarely has a use case
It’s just there and you proc it right before getting full healed and then stabilizing
So it’s useless
tardy abyss
Like play what you want if it suits you, just dont claim its good because its popular
jagged pier
ive literally been proven wrong about 1 dungeon and 1 talent choice in that dungeon through logs this expansion
we are happy to change our minds
and as ive said multiple times BSV has its places niche places
waxen quarry
idk if i were to do high keys as prot i would play bsv
less effort
i think kira said something like
dusky canopy
People picking it so they got one less button to juggle
jagged pier
its technically not that your dropping some fro of tankiness for another
dusky canopy
waxen quarry
he is playing it cause he is making calls
so during brain downtime it helped him a few times
jagged pier
i think kira said something like
nah he said he play not the best talents but the easiest talents to play so he doesnt need to think about playing as he calls, yet still doesnt take HR which means he would need to think less
waxen quarry
itf more fun to play
urban bane
S-tier level copypasta well done
waxen quarry
idk i never had sb uptime issues with itf
but i never played pwar early in the expac
or with low gear
jagged pier
so during brain downtime it helped him a few times
i mean he also just doesnt think seen him tank a beam ON DB without pressing a cd for no reason
waxen quarry
so idk
waxen quarry
bsv saved him
sweet summit
true real and based
jagged pier
rocky ledge
Bsv good talent because you can go afk for a mechanic every 3 minutes, yesyes
tardy abyss
Bsv good talent because you can go afk for a mechanic every 3 minutes, yesyes
<14 it would still not proc
jagged pier
well thats also an arguement what u do when BSV is down just afk 3 mins because u might make a mistake in the next 3 mins
rocky ledge
"but it makes me feel safe"
jagged pier
if thats how it makes u feel and due to that u play better then fine
knotty pewter
I literally dont know how you survive first pull NW without it
tardy abyss
How do I make PoE2 run on Linux
jagged pier
something has to be said for the placebo effect same for stacking vers
knotty pewter
that is not the take that is being passed around by all these people
tardy abyss
Not doing the giga pull in NW with 3 vanguards is a solution too
knotty pewter
and there are a number of places this season where you straight up need it to live
rocky ledge
Noone said it is never useful
jagged pier
but could be misplay could be bad group cordination. could be lots of factors why u proc it
we need logs to tell
but id understand on like a 15/16+ for the pull its a niche place u need it same with double wall
double wall like BSV outside of its niche cases are just objectivly worse talents to take
they do less for u
knotty pewter
i thought thats what we were talking about this whole time. me and one other guy brought up the need for it in higher keys and were told that ravager is better
jagged pier
and make yu less tanky over a key for more specfic cases
higher keys is a general statment
in like 80% of them i dont think u need ither talent honestly
tardy abyss
NW is the only dungeon imo
jagged pier
as in BSV and double wall
tardy abyss
But I dont pull in a way that I need any of these in that dungeon
Problem solved
👍
jagged pier
the point is u cant make general statments as i said early in the expansion my mind was changed, and from saying u need or should run HR in all keys with less than 18k haste rating. u can run ITF in DB whatever rating cause nothing melees
proven by log data
u can just give logs to show your evidence on whats procing (outside niche pulls like NW) because you said it saves u alot. and it might just show u dip to 30% a fair bit just because thats how it goes
the problem with BSV is just because u get the debuff doesnt mean u 'died' sometimes sure but sometimes not, and i think a lot of this is a lot of ppl see the debuff appear and just equate it, to being saved from death
violet river
Should your DPS hold off until a pack is fully gathered or is that on me to get threat faster/sooner
jagged pier
depends on the pull
if its like gaining resources until u finish thats fine
but if u plan on pulling like 2-3 packs and they fucking pop all cds on the first
thats a them problem
waxen quarry
idk i link mdt whenever i tank
jagged pier
yer dps dont look at it
they ask and dont look
best just to say
imma pull 3 here or whatever
violet river
Yeah it feels like that is what happens sometimes. Even with small pulls where it's mainly annoying because one pack has a caster in it or something like right before the bombing run in grim batol yknow the earth caller and the one melee guy opposite the last pack at the drakes
jagged pier
like if dps want to blow thier wods early and die thats on them
violet river
True
waxen quarry
i dont even bother using challenging shout/distrupting
if they cant wait
2 globals
sweet summit
you're being way too real rn
violet river
Ik it's such a small period of time
waxen quarry
theres a difference
jagged pier
when u do the double pull at the end of mists after second boss ive had ppl full send cds into 1 pack ive not even hit properly yet
because im waiting for them to gather
LIKE BRAH YOUR WASTING YOU DPS ALREADY THEY NOT EVEN STACKED
violet river
Yeah exactly
violet river
As a healer main getting into tanking it's just cemented that people who only play DPS have extremely high rates of brain dmg
jagged pier
based
waxen quarry
idk i noticed the same for other 2
saw some pwar main die in a 10 at 625
idk
how is that even possible
tardy abyss
when u do the double pull at the end of mists after second boss ive had ppl full...
Never seen that happen
violet river
Like the amount of DPS who don't know what mobs even do
waxen quarry
jagged pier
or the group dies if u one of them
waxen quarry
df was so bad for me cause we never had a good healer premade
and pug healers are
well
pug healers
jagged pier
violet river
Loool
sweet summit
press IV noober
waxen quarry
i pressed iv more times than ms
jagged pier
press hp pot
sweet summit
🧢
waxen quarry
jagged pier
violet river
Tbf I recently started playing with a healer in our guild just doing 10s and he genuinely has no idea what anything does
I was tanking and he was like you're out of range on Edna for dispel
I was like uh what do you mean
He didn't know the beams pierced the spikes
jagged pier
waxen quarry
i have no clue about those tank mechanics i just kinda ball
sweet summit
'
sweet summit
peelove
waxen quarry
my goat
waxen quarry
peelove skilled player but that is not normally, This very very insane....They need to check him pc and game.....Maybe he not cheating but maybe he using the game deficit ...and this cant seem on game screen..He needs to check-up...
violet river
I'm either not in on a meme or having a stroke
sweet summit
👴
sweet egret
How much of the trash do you clear before pulling the second boss of GB? I had a...
I usually take first pack by the door and continue down to the next pack of the same mobs, killing them by the edge of the arena by the anvil while letting the boss patrol past, then I take the two packs of 3 mobs one after the other which both clears the arena for the boss and lets bl cd come back around (using bl on first pull in the dungeon)
violet river
Yknow in GB, do you guys tend to clear all the packs in Throngus' area or do you skip some and do later packs?
I usually clear them all and then just all the leftmost packs afterwards including the 'sleepers', but I'm conscious that the packs in Throngus' area are quite small
sweet egret
and there are a number of places this season where you straight up need it to li...
on which keys (and levels) do you need bsv to survive a mechanic?
sweet egret
Should your DPS hold off until a pack is fully gathered or is that on me to get ...
yes, they should
violet river
What's bsv sorry
knotty pewter
on which keys (and levels) do you need bsv to survive a mechanic?
there is no single mechanic i survive with it. its sustained damage in certain dungeons on 14 and up
GB SV NW and CoT being the most imporant.
sweet summit
What's bsv sorry
battle scarred veteran
knotty pewter
the opening of arakara can get a little hairy
violet river
Ty
tardy abyss
GB and SV are a matter of skill, CoT has nothing dangerous
jagged gust
Yknow in GB, do you guys tend to clear all the packs in Throngus' area or do you...
I basically full clear and skip final dragon
knotty pewter
GB and SV are a matter of skill, CoT has nothing dangerous
sure. good point
tardy abyss
GB only has the enforcers that are scary, which you can cc and run from
SV...dunno, they deal phys damage and we are good against phys
jagged gust
Get really nice chain pulls in throngus area and can time how to pull based on group DPS based on the bosses pat position
tardy abyss
Just kite at >25 stacks
knotty pewter
i think we do different pulls
sweet egret
I'm either not in on a meme or having a stroke
I'm having the same stroke
tardy abyss
2 Pulls to 1st boss, 3 pulls to 2nd (skarmorak), 3/4 pulls to twins
Cant get much shorter than that
knotty pewter
yeah its only the twins trash that i like bsv. nothing else is threatening
sweet egret
there is no single mechanic i survive with it. its sustained damage in certain d...
I use heroic leap if I need to live after the rest of my things are done for 13-14, didn't get higher yet
sweet egret
Yknow in GB, do you guys tend to clear all the packs in Throngus' area or do you...
didn't I just answer this 3 minutes before u asked
tardy abyss
yeah its only the twins trash that i like bsv. nothing else is threatening
Just kite after demo and SW, maybe some external if you can get one
violet river
Get really nice chain pulls in throngus area and can time how to pull based on g...
Do you just chain after casters are dead or
tardy abyss
If they live longer than that you have other worries
knotty pewter
kiting too much does int your dps
and on a 15 the pack is going to last longer than your cds
sweet egret
nah, only really need to kite for 10 sec max
tardy abyss
4-5
sweet egret
very rarely 10, yes
violet river
I think a big thing I'm getting to grips with is what packs I can realistically pull together, and also what to do if a patrol isn't where it ideally would be iykwim
tardy abyss
But usually you cant jump back in without being careful
Else you get os
In higher keys at least
knotty pewter
i dont know man. i play the game 6 hours a week. that alone is reason enough for me to run bsv
tardy abyss
Fair
knotty pewter
i see it proc all the time and I also see myself getting hit very hard for the 8s there after
sweet egret
when I was first starting to push into 12s I too swapped from ravager to bsv but I just saw it proc over and over again when I was safe which meant it was not up for the scary pulls which just made it a wasted talent for me
knotty pewter
I also see it proc a lot and do nothing
tardy abyss
With proper pulling the lost dps from ravager wont matter anyway
knotty pewter
that is also true
i am curious still how you guys are measuring its value in logs though
tardy abyss
Altho Rav helps a lot on the first pull
knotty pewter
if you could give me a link to what you are looking at
tardy abyss
To stabilize
sweet egret
I have never been in a situation once where I felt I would have died if not for bsv proc
tardy abyss
It shows the reduced damage as healing
sweet egret
ravager is nice for threat on a pack I don't want to run to but still pull
knotty pewter
It shows the reduced damage as healing
im not sure i see that
youre saying the 80% dr for 8s is shown as absorb?
sweet egret
just yeet it off into the distance and don't have to worry about stray mobs going for the healer
knotty pewter
cause thats not what im seeing
tardy abyss
Can you hand me some logs
I know for certain that details does that
Should be the same in logs
knotty pewter
jagged gust
Do you just chain after casters are dead or
Depends on group and key level, those flamerender packs are kinda lame pulls, I try to incorporate either one in to boss and clear the other with anvil group, or chain them in to the final pack near the rooms exit. Lava boys I just start moving whenever the rest of the pack is cleaved down
knotty pewter
thats the only absorb the whole dungeon.
tardy abyss
Looks accurate to me
sweet summit
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/p1BjdFf2QhYJTAgL#fight=4&type=healing&source=26&options=16384&ability=386397 idk how accurate it is but this also exists
tardy abyss
Only procced once, absorbed 1M there
sweet summit
it procced at least 4 times
knotty pewter
sweet egret
I have never looked for deeper info on it, just felt like I live without it and want to be able to push as much dps as possible
sweet summit
here is a better picture
tardy abyss
115M sounds a bit brutal
knotty pewter
sweet egret
I would feel completely different if it was a cheat death, it just procs all the time when I don't want it to which makes it moot
knotty pewter
Alll of that plus more if you scroll down has 80% dr
its not about surviving one shots
its about sustaaned damage
that whole 8s he is mitigated 98% of the damage taken
thaat doesnt show in logs
unless you look at events here
sweet egret
yes, I understand that, it's just that u can solve it through different means
knotty pewter
but this cuts against all the arguments you guys have been making
sweet egret
I didn't make any arguments other than I feel like it isn't useful when I play
knotty pewter
yes, I understand that, it's just that u can solve it through different means
and no in the first pull NW the only solution would be pull smaller
sweet egret
do you pick up the shield?
knotty pewter
im talking generally with what many people have been saying
yes shield plus double wall is not long enough
sweet egret
what exactly do you pull in nw?
I live doing what I feel like is a big pull, without double wall or bsv
knotty pewter
but its not just NW. theres all kinds of sustained damage in these keys and 80% dr for 8s is great for it
tardy abyss
I live doing what I feel like is a big pull, without double wall or bsv
Youre prob not taking the double vanguard pack on top of it
sweet egret
it would be if u could proc it during those times
knotty pewter
if you guys thought it was only the absorb then yeah of course its a terrible talent
tardy abyss
Which makes the pull scary in the first place
I dont pull that pack into the first pull either, I skip those
knotty pewter
i assumed everyone thats been talking about how bad it is understood the 80% dr.
i dunno
tardy abyss
I mean we do, but NW was also named as an outlier where BSV has its use
knotty pewter
bobas is dead in that pull and doesnt time that key without bsv. and that is true in a lot of places in numerous dungeons in 15s and up
sweet egret
do you need to pull that much?
tardy abyss
do you need to pull that much?
No
knotty pewter
if you wanna time higher keys yes
tardy abyss
You can play the start differently
knotty pewter
especially if you dont have a priest or dk
you can but it makes it way tighter and much less forgiving
tardy abyss
But gotta go a bit bigger later on
Which I find safer personally
Because we cant live 3+ bonemancers as pwar
So naturally we have to do at least 1 more pull than a pally would
sweet egret
bonemancer = bonecarvers?
tardy abyss
ye
sweet egret
#hate
fallow hinge
since you use a blasphemite, do you wanna use different gems, or just the haste + crit one?
tardy abyss
since you use a blasphemite, do you wanna use different gems, or just the haste ...
Whatever sims best
sweet egret
how do you actually pull all that though?
tardy abyss
Which most likely is different ones
tardy abyss
how do you actually pull all that though?
wdym
tardy abyss
Heroic Throw does the job
sweet egret
now I wanna try this
knotty pewter
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/p1BjdFf2QhYJTAgL#fight=4&type=healing&sourc...
thats a pretty cool new feature. didnt know they added that. definitely paints a different picture assuming its relatively close to accurate
sweet summit
i don't think it's perfect but it's closer to accurate than just the healing done for sure
knotty pewter
well, thats more the picture i hada suspected since i think its a great talent
oh yeah no doubt. im surprised people thought that was the only value of it
sweet summit
are you in wcl discord?
knotty pewter
ya
i havent looked at it for a few seasons though
ive been checked out this season
sweet summit
could ask there if they have any idea how it works maybe (the mitigations thing)
sweet egret
I feel like nome needs to come here
sweet summit
what for?
knotty pewter
its not rocket science. you can see when the buff is up in the event logs and you can see the damage you take while its up
sweet egret
thoughts, opinions
sweet egret
still, my one caveat is the same. how do you make sure it's up when you need it