protection

[strong forum]

SB cap is 3x it's duration

[fiery gale]

true but if it ends to be the same level of activity, I rather not track and just press it on CD

[strong forum]

Aka 24sec with enduring defenses
18sec without it

Activating Last Stand with Bolster talented ignores this rule to avoid waste

And you absolutely want to track SB uptime, you do not want be caught with your pants down

[fiery gale]

that for sure yeah, but whether it makes a difference of applying SB using the timers or using it on CD im not so sure about.

[rugged wind]

Go for double shield wall

[strong forum]

You can technically just perma send it on CD

But there's times where you wanna avoid doing that like the end of a pull or downtime on a boss etc

[fiery gale]

I see yeah, thats good to know. Im still thinking about correct wording for this. Maybe what one needs is recharge time = buff uptime for this to make sense, or all uptimes to stack (which they do as discussed up to some amount)

[fiery gale]

yeah thats common sense 😄

[jaunty jacinth]

hey, Is there any point in playing TR?

[fiery gale]

so technically when I go on a dummy, I should be able to have 100% SB uptime? Or will there possibly be downphases? Im at 29% haste fully unbuffed / no flask etc

[strong forum]

With that amount of haste you're nowhere near 100%

Unless you play Heavy Repercussions

[fiery gale]

oh ok, thats close to diminishing returns though. Do we ignore DR and still continue stacking haste?

[strong forum]

TR performs worse than Spear if you're playing Thane in the correct talent setup.

However for QoL reasons some people play TR + uproar which makes it easier to build threat more frequently

[strong forum]

If you aren't close to 30k haste, you're more than nowhere near the relevant DR point

Cuz 25k haste is only like 35% haste

[fiery gale]

alright, the soft-spot seems to begin at 30% Ive read some time ago

[strong forum]

Since pwar gets 4-12% haste for free

It's haste rating you care about

Not %

[jaunty jacinth]

Should i be holding cds to line stuff up with spear and SC, etc.. ?

[strong forum]

As the rating determines when the DR is applied, and haste is a % multiplier

[fiery gale]

good point yeah, currently im only at 16k haste

[strong forum]

The cds line up naturally as they're 45sec and 1.5min

[strong forum]

Which if you mouse over it, says you're closer to 25% haste

[jaunty jacinth]

I must be misplaying then, sometimes there are gaps

[strong forum]

Then you're not using stuff on cd, ye

Happens

But should ideally be try to be re-aligned again

Cuz the whole point of spear is having it + cds be used together

Also what's pivotal is having all 3 spear talents

[main locust]

For those of you without Swarmlords, what has been your go-to trinket alongside Sacbrood so far in m+?

[strong forum]

I have swamplords but I use transmitter+skarm shard instead

Cuz I like to do damage

[fiery gale]

in which tree do I find that talent? Still have to learn names lol

[jaunty jacinth]

Think it's the Avatar which on use on cd and sometimes i don't have it up for spear,SC

[strong forum]

Avatar in this scenario doesn't/shouldn't matter

You spend more time inside avatar than outside

And delaying or holding avatar can longerterm lower your performance

Same goes for delaying other CDs to line them up with avatar

[strong forum]

Spec tree

Just type the name into the search bar in the bottom left

That's also why I typed the name out instead of the abbreviation :p

[fiery gale]

ive found it yeah. I noticed the build I copied used into the fray instead. Might heavy repercussions be better here with 16k haste?

for SB uptime

[main locust]

I do have both of those. Isn't Transmitter really awkward to use as a tank in m+ or is it alright?

[strong forum]

HR grants you full SB coverage without breaking a sweat

[strong forum]

As tank it's especially easy if you're aware of the fact that the circle and orb both spawn in your front right

Cuz mobs move with you, instead of being dps where you gotta use the transmitter at a time where the tank won't move shit away from you

[fiery gale]

So i guess the only benefit of into the fray is higher DPS over HR?

[strong forum]

Theoretical dps ye

[fiery gale]

alright then I'll try out HR

[strong forum]

Often on bosses, especially with a ranged heavy comp, you don't have full stacks of ITF

Meaning you lose dmg

ITF is indoubetably more aoe dmg, but ST in m+ it depends

[loud wave]

Are glided crests dropping from +8 already?

[strong forum]

Think so

[smoky anvil]

Yep. Since the announcement.

The dungeon changes took till Tuesday but the gilded change was instant.

[loud wave]

Okay ty 🙂

[rancid kelp]

Any recommended prot warrior streamers? Having a hard time finding any.

[high wyvern]

Yoda is kinda controversial around here, he played well but his build is questionable. Kira also stream high key too

But you can watch to see their route and how they use their CDs and how to pull / interrupt / gather packs

[deft mortar]

My mathematical uptime is 8/12 + 8 / 45 + 15/120 = -96.94%

But I'd ez have 100% in short fights

ngl I like stamina trinkets

And actual good whatever trinkets

But I can't cope with loosing 7k strength

I love a fkn strength trinket

[tribal wharf]

i dont understand what this means yet but i will look into it soon enough

as col?

or itf or somethin different

[deft mortar]

I don't use Heavy Repurcussions so it's probably the max uptime I can achieve besides things like BL and external buffs

My SB cd is 12 seconds so 8/12. SC gives 8 sec SB every 45 secs so 8/45. I use the last stand talent so 15 sec SB every 120 secs, so 15/120

[strong forum]

yes with bolster talented you can get really close to 100% with ITF

[high wyvern]

I cant go back to HR after using using ITF, it just “feels” so much smoother. There is probs some downtime for shield block over the course of the dungeon but i havent gotten punished yet

[terse pine]

Yo guys, i got these 4 trinkets and im unsure which to use, i see many use ara kara trinket + the beetle one but that's liek in extremely high keys, im prot war (obv) in 8->10 keys

[high wyvern]

I do like the extra rage and shield wall cooldown reduction over extra shield wall tho

[ornate thicket]

Im using sacbrood and skarm shard

[molten gorge]

Skarm + Sac ya

[obsidian pilot]

Any chance that dracthyr prot may become bis in keys? Currently thinking about swapping to dwarf but might as well wait for scaleboi

[ornate thicket]

Dragons got nerfed for non evokers

Think theyll suck compared to dwarf

[obsidian pilot]

Thank god haha

[high wyvern]

Dracthyr priest would go crazy

Giving caster / range even more mobility

[ornate thicket]

With options you have here for mythic+ id probably do swarm and arsenal. Meathook and mandate are really good prio dmg trinkets though for single target like raiding.

Mandate can be used to nuke mobs in m+ too that need to die asap

[terse pine]

i dont rly get the aresanl tho

like do i swap betwen them or is there 1 stance better than others

that i just stay in

[mighty valley]

Smoother how? With HR on Thane I’m drowning in rage, never have a missed gcd… I used to understand people yearning for ITF early in an expansion but hero talents fixed that for me

[ornate thicket]

Pretty sure you just use arsenal on cd

[terse pine]

and then when i get ara kara 1 i should use that plust swarm yeah?

[ornate thicket]

Ideally ara sacbrood and skarm trinket

Can goto swarm if you are struggling with dmg

[terse pine]

wtf is skarm

the crystal

[ornate thicket]

Its a str trinket with 1.5m cd on use mastery boost from stonevaults

Lines up well with spear and ravager for big fuck dmg

[terse pine]

ye aight

[high wyvern]

Did you try ITF?

Try it and see if you feel a difference

If you dont then just stay with HR

I think ITF vs HR is personal preference anyway as long as ur base haste isnt too low that it make you have no shield block during pull

[shut badger]

So what exactly does the Shield Slam / Ignore Pain macro do? Does it just use Ignore Pain instead of Shield Slam so i will end up having one less keybind?

[mental scarab]

You snipe SS procs if they happend when you press IP

[violet ginkgo]

no you still have keybind for Separate SS.

My IP and SB all have SS in it, so whenever I press IP or SB and SS reset procs I can snipe. then I still have separate SS button.

[high wyvern]

It will cast both cuz ignore pain is not on gcd

You could do it i guess but its not ideal

I know people who do it cuz they dont wanna press ignore pain like 100 times per dungeons run. But then you could bind it to ur scroll wheel

[sleek sun]

How much % haste do you need for 10 second Shield Block recharge? Like 52?

[timid solstice]

hello everyone

i have this shield, should I craft a 636 ?

just considering the leech

[obsidian finch]

for a crafted shield ,which emb. should i pick ?
i see some using double duskthread lining and some are using sigil

[echo egret]

Battering ram vs Instigate ?

[karmic plinth]

whats the context

[high wyvern]

For survivability a higher ilvl shield trump everything

[long bronze]

#protection message

[frosty mango]

That’s not really the point of it - ignore pain is off gcd so really all you’re doing is also pressing shield slam when you press ignore pain. You still have a normal shield slam button - but if you get a ss proc when you’re pressing ignore pain, it will use it.

It’s a minmax tool not a convenience tool

[long bronze]

you also basically never DON'T want to hit SS when it's available, so macroing it into IP doesn't lose you anything

[thorn basalt]

So it would just be
#showtooltip Ignore Pain
/cast Ignore Pain
/cast Shield Slam?

[long bronze]

correct

and to be clear, you only replace your ignore pain with this macro, NOT your shield slam

[thorn basalt]

obv

[long bronze]

you don't want to ignore pain on every shield slam

[thorn basalt]

Rage who?

[thorn basalt]

By that logic, do we also macro it into shield block?

[long bronze]

generally you're not hitting shield block often enough to really do much there

you're not*

[thorn basalt]

And all other off gcd spells?

Yeah but quote: "you also basically never DON'T want to hit SS when it's available"

Like yeah its not much in that regard, but it would still do a marginal amount

And since it was brought up as minmaxing, that would fall into exactly that category

[long bronze]

the ip/ss macro is for sniping ss resets

not because you're too lazy to press ss

[thorn basalt]

Yeah but those button presses would be a "waste" of time you could be using shield slam in

Nothing happens if the gcd is running anyways but ye

Not really sure I'm following, how are the ss procs on IP different from any other off gcd spell?

[karmic plinth]

you are just going to press ip much more than any other off gcd spell and the macro shines in situations where u might be doing ip > ip to dump excess rage

[thorn basalt]

Ah

Yeah that makes sense, other off gcd spells will usually happen off gcd anyways

[orchid sky]

Guys have u got maybe a weakaura to track shield block ??

[long bronze]

and you basically never press SB back to back

[thorn basalt]

Yeah got it now

tyty

[karmic plinth]

the difference of having ss on your ip macro and not having it is a larger difference than having it say on sb / sr / sw etc

[long bronze]

it likely wont hurt anything to put sb/ss in a macro but in reality it's not going to do much for you

yep

[echo egret]

Mythic+, raids

[karmic plinth]

it depends on what else you have talented

[thorn basalt]

I mean you could still overlap gcd with ignore pain->shield block pressing, but yeah it would be way less significant than spamming IP

[karmic plinth]

but battering ram right now is a lot weaker than it was in early df

[orchid sky]

Guuuys do u use any wa to track SB When its ready?

[gritty eagle]

@long bronze missed the discussion and might be a stupid question, but thunder blast in aoe has higher prio than ss, so if you press ip to dump aggro wouldnt you in aoe want to press tb instead of ss?

[echo egret]

Okay thanks

[gritty eagle]

dump rage*

[long bronze]

wasting the SS proc due to spamming IP is probably worse than an occasional non optimal press of SS

[tribal wharf]

if you constantly gain rage at the maximum rate, and spend it before it over caps at 100
you will be doing most dps and most survival

[long bronze]

hmm that's an interesting take

[hoary crystal]

How does that work, is it like a permanent buff until its used or is it for 1 hit?

[long bronze]

not hitting shield block is technically possible with your statement and then totally breaks your most survival part

[tribal wharf]

its the amount for up to 30 seconds on a 60 second cd

[long bronze]

the shield lasts like 30 sec until broken, it's also a trashcan trinket so I wouldn't take it

[hoary crystal]

mh

[tribal wharf]

so you could get a 2.7m bubble from it

and then get smackked for 3million

[hoary crystal]

As you can see my other options are not very ... good also haha

[tribal wharf]

and then you no longer have the buff

[hoary crystal]

nahj it would take then 1.3m or?

from the shield

its like

ignore pain

on taunt

[long bronze]

that is a pretty good ring

[tribal wharf]

it can be very easily consumed is what im saying

[long bronze]

unless you have two haste myth rings already or the queen ring....

[hoary crystal]

thought mastery is badge or?

[tribal wharf]

if yogi made that trinket himself me, it would start at 5 million

[long bronze]

no who the hell told you that

[mighty valley]

no stats are bad

[gritty eagle]

@long bronze ok

[hoary crystal]

So i take the ring

thanks guys

[long bronze]

I would

[native ember]

which one do i take guys i play fury offspec aswell figured since neck is very rare might not see it in raid compared to transmitter and only 2 melee dps in my raid group

[hoary crystal]

i ahtet hat trinket

[long bronze]

the neck is very very very good

[toxic pewter]

if loot is mailed to you from a raid can it still be traded to another person that was eligible for the loot

[tribal wharf]

if you took the ram trinket i probably think it wasnt a great move, maybe if its myth an you can upgrae it for free

[toxic pewter]

I would personally take the neck myself, as everyone wants it and like you said you may not even see it

[karmic plinth]

neck could even be bis into next season

[long bronze]

no, it wouldn't be lol

[karmic plinth]

nope

[tribal wharf]

maybe you can use it on harder weeks to reduce dmg if healer asks it

[native ember]

word thanks and i really dont like trinkets u have to do some extra shit tho ive heard there is a wa that make it super cheese

[long bronze]

it's very good now, as soon as it gets out ilvl'd its not that good

[toxic pewter]

yeah damn that needs to be fixed tbh

[native ember]

thanks for the advice guys just wanted to make sure i wasnt crazy thinking the neck was a good choice

[tribal wharf]

i love that trinket personally

but thats just me and my boomer bad taste

[long bronze]

neck also saves you crests

[tribal wharf]

it felt like it was doing tons of work during the debuff affix

[high wyvern]

Having two on use trinkets is psychopathic behavior

[tribal wharf]

ya

i been saying this shit since bfa

an probably longer tbh

[timid solstice]

guys I read the discussion u had up there

it took so long

what was the conclusion ?

macroing Shield block into shield slam ?

or SS with IP ?

xD

[long bronze]

#1269009097525694616 message

[long bronze]

it's not that bad when a lot of the on use trinkets just do damage and you don't really have to sync them with other stuff so they can just in a macro

it does seem like basically all trinkets worth using are on use outside of like sacbrood so it feels a bit more forced than it has before though

[high wyvern]

kinda cringe

passive trinket needs to be better

on use trinket if use correctly should be a lil better than passive, but shouldnt be by a lot

[red dock]

Seems like something that requires more effort and thought should just be better

[dusty raven]

guys, im looking for a other tank for alt, any recommendations for who closest rotation/gameplay wise looks like prot war?

[long bronze]

on use trinkets being "better" is typically their ability to synchronize with other cds

and that varies LARGELY depending on how much power a spec gets from cds, that's impossible to balance really

probably bear?

seems strange to look for an alt that plays the same though, people usually want an alt because they are bored with the same gameplay style

[dusty raven]

i want to experience some new, but similar enough, i have a monky brain

i tried monk but def is not for me

[long bronze]

bear is kinda a warrior with fur instead of a shield

not 1 to 1, but nothing s

is

[tribal wharf]

how often is the BFA warmode quests

[long bronze]

I play dk and warrior, warrior is much more fun in keys and I prefer dk in raid

[tribal wharf]

i need 31 or so of those tokens for mount

[zinc trellis]

to my fellow tanks, i am new to prot war, was wondering what's your shield block uptime in keys (10-12) and ignore pain, i got 85% + on IP but i seem to struggle with shield block around 60% 😦

[long bronze]

95% +

more important to look at your % blocked melee hits

[zinc trellis]

will look into it thanks

[long bronze]

with that % you're either not hitting SB, not hitting shield charge, or playing ITF with incredibly low haste

[zinc trellis]

the one i always forget is the charge

[long bronze]

thats a gigantic mistake

SC should be on CD, perma

[zinc trellis]

my fury 2 brain cells are not used to charge for a defensive cd i guess

thanks mate

[long bronze]

its your highest priority dps button

outside of consuming violent outburst or hitting thunder blast with 2 charges

[ornate thicket]

Its really good aoe threat plus the SB uptime. Huge

[long bronze]

also it has no mimimum range

[thorn basalt]

But we don't play ITF usually, do we?

[long bronze]

which you probably already know

I play ITF

a large chunk play ITF

you always play ITF in raid too

[thorn basalt]

The guides say Heavy Repercussions in m+

hence why im asking

[woeful trellis]

HR is BIS SB uptime means SS 2+ mil crits 😍

[long bronze]

at 4 stacks HR is about -6-7% dps loss over ITF

4 stacks of ITF*

for me that's about 50k dps

ST, per a sim

[woeful trellis]

Do we talk about raid or m+

[toxic pewter]

only want to play itf if you have a lot of haste otherwise you have a lot of sb uptime gaps

[thorn basalt]

I was talking about m+

[long bronze]

this was my blocked % with ITF and being an occasional idiot in an 11 sv

I have 20600 haste unbuffed for reference

[deft mortar]

I am never taking a goddamn mage in my M+ again

[long bronze]

At the end of the day, if you're curious about ITF vs HR for YOU, run a key with both, look at your % blocked hits and go from there

HR has a significant advantage that you can play worse and have better uptime

but even with lower haste, you can cover gaps in SB with our mirad of other defensive cds

[loud plover]

Hey all! Have been a healer main all my time in WoW (2 years now) and have alted a few tanks like prot pally and brewmaster. I'm going to be making a prot warrior and gearing up as my main. I wanted to play Kul Tiran for race - is that decent or should I play something else?

[long bronze]

KT is fine

[thorn basalt]

I'm thinking Burst of Power gives HR an edge POTENTIALLY, but I feel like ITF has a lot of value, I just see it fall off in ST for m+ with range heavy comps

[loud plover]

Thanks homie

[long bronze]

dwarf is the "best" race because of their cleanse racial, but there are no particuarly poor race choices

I think nom actually calls out KT as a notable race choice in the wowhead guide

[thorn basalt]

Speaking of:
Earthen can't have main stat food, do we go haste or crit?

Was thinking stam if you're undergeared but meh

[long bronze]

you'd probably go haste

at some point, crit will probably sim higher for DPS, but haste will always be best defensively and nearly best offensively

[thorn basalt]

Also

Spell block vs tough as nails?

[plush tendon]

difference in race is fairly minor

[long bronze]

ah here: Dwarf Dwarf - Arguably the best Alliance tank race. Stoneform is one of the best defensive racials around. Might of the Mountain is an excellent offensive bonus, especially when your Critical Strike chance is high. Dwarves are great! They only have one weakness: Reaching the top shelf.
Kul Tiran Kul Tiran - The other arguably-best Alliance tank race. Brush It Off and Haymaker are both excellent racial bonuses. A fantastic choice in all situations unless you really don't want to be W I D E.

[plush tendon]

Dwarf cleanse is really cool, but so is Human stun break

[valid bridge]

Hmm. How y'all feel about this one?

[long bronze]

it's a trinket

[valid bridge]

Is it a good one?

This is my current setup

[long bronze]

there are no good trinkets, really

[long bronze]

this season is just bad trinkets season

[tulip remnant]

Da finger tho

[valid bridge]

wondering if its worth dropping the candlestick for

[long bronze]

I would replace your taunt shield one with it

[thorn basalt]

Ah I think sacbrood is fine for raid

[long bronze]

the taunt shield is a pile of steaming garbage

[valid bridge]

is it worth losing all that strength though? the taunt one is 623 mythic

[long bronze]

sacbrood is a "fine" trinket, it's not special though, it's just better than other mediocre trinkets

the fact a 586 Tome will do more damage then any of the trinkets you can get this season tells you the entire story you need to know

[thorn basalt]

I mean, what would you consider a good trinket then?

[long bronze]

outside of a max level mandate basically

you can make a hero sikrans 626

[loud plover]

This is great, thank you!

[long bronze]

dont thank me, thank nom

[valid bridge]

Yeah queens mandate is the one I want the most

[long bronze]

if you're asking if replacing 623 with 613 you'll need to sim it

[valid bridge]

maybe folloed by swarmlord

[long bronze]

swarmlord 😦 why do people think this trinket is good

[buoyant lintel]

he should be upgrading it to 619 at least since it wont cost any crests so the str diff is not that big

[thorn basalt]

For big pulls it would mitigate quite a bit but other than that, meh

[long bronze]

no

[valid bridge]

Do you know something that 3/5 of the top ranked Prot warriors in M+ don't know about swarmlord?

[long bronze]

that it's details bait?

[valid bridge]

If it isn't good, why are the people pushing the hardest keys using it?

or many of them at least

[long bronze]

because they could push the hardest keys without it?

[chilly brook]

mandate kinda not good for keys tho

[long bronze]

it could be if you need ST priority dam

it's incredibly good for mists and SV

[chilly brook]

eh

[thorn basalt]

It's not a gamebreaker, but for big pulls the mitigation could be valuable from swarm, damage is fin

It's a "dont have to think about it" kind of thing

[long bronze]

funny you said 3/5, so let's say that's exactly true, the other 2 didn't need swarmlords to live the same keys yet did more damage huh?

[valid bridge]

It is 3/5, im looking at them right now, and that doesn't change anything. Whether they need it or not, they chose it

over the other trinkets

I'm asking why you consider it bad but they don't

[long bronze]

at the end of the day, the trinkets you equip don't matter that much, if you're convinced you need swarmlords go for it. You are WRONG though

[tulip remnant]

Swarmlords would be hot ngl

[mighty valley]

spell block is a hugely powerful defensive against a lot of magic, can see everything it works on in the spreadsheet in pins. but in trivial content or the rare place where there's nothing to use spell block on, tough as nails is a small dps increase

[valid bridge]

I never said I needed it, just that it's the one I'd like to have the most

[strong forum]

It's a 2-3mil absorb every minute

When you have 11-12mil hp

You do the math how impactful that is

[thorn basalt]

Oh lol I was thinking about the wrong trinket the entire time

[chilly brook]

I should sim the difference between my mandate and other trinket option in single target

[mild river]

Hey guys, Anyone has a Necrotic Wake Route after the nerfs? Do we still have to pull almost everything on the dungeon?

[chilly brook]

but honestly

it feels like bait in keys

[strong forum]

Mandate isn't that hot in keys

[chilly brook]

because it's not

[strong forum]

It's neat

But you benefit more from static str trinkets

[long bronze]

it sure is fun sending a 40m crit into skarmorak though

[chilly brook]

you can tell yourself "prio dam" but it's meh

[strong forum]

Cuz the secondary budget on trinkets is hilariously bad this season

[mint imp]

yo, with colossus do I wait for all cds to line up with demolish or send as it comes on cd?

[strong forum]

What's my profile pic say

[long bronze]

its clipped so

[mint imp]

thx

[chilly brook]

cooldowns on cooldown

🙂

[strong forum]

You can read all 3 words

[long bronze]

ooldow n cooldo

[valid bridge]

@long bronze Genuinely curious, what trinkets do you consider better than sacbrood and swarmlord, since you've said both are meh

[long bronze]

sacbrood is GOOD relative to other options

[valid bridge]

i hate how true that is lol

[long bronze]

relative to trinkets we've had before it's MEH

[valid bridge]

I miss some of last season's trinkets

[chilly brook]

doesn't matter

we're not using those trinkets

[strong forum]

Most trinkets this season are meh at best

[chilly brook]

they're irrelevant

[strong forum]

There's nothing you'd be genuinely excited about

[long bronze]

this is exactly what I said @chilly brook #protection message

[valid bridge]

Griff is right though, we're stuck with the pool we have, so when discussing whether a trinket is good or not, it should be assumed we mean in relation to the other trinkets available this season

[chilly brook]

Every season exists in a void, so the only things that matter are what are good this season

[strong forum]

If you're going by that standard

Then only sacbrood, transmitter, Mark and shard are quantifyably "good"

[valid bridge]

that seems to line up with usage at high keys fairly well

[long bronze]

hang on let me check the tierlist in your guide

wow, looks like you've documented this all before incredible

[chilly brook]

if only transmitter would drop for me 😦

[valid bridge]

Yeah, who would ever go to a discord channel to have a discussion about something that might be more nuanced than a tier list written by one person might suggest?

[chilly brook]

Idk

trinkets are pretty cut and dry

[valid bridge]

I'm seeing a lot of weird one-offs being used by people at high keys too though, i wonder if its because they simply couldnt get their preferred ones

or something else

[long bronze]

I'm mostly memeing about the fact we had to say the same thing 10x times an it's actually already said in the guide before it seems the point got across

[chilly brook]

We saw a lot of weird use of trinkets that are objectively bad at top end "because they look good"

Nothing new

[long bronze]

It also may clue you in that it doesn't really matter that much what you play, again as I said before

[chilly brook]

Feelycraft goes hard at high end for some reason

[valid bridge]

You actually said the opposite of what the guide you're referencing suggested. The guide spelled out that sacbrood and swarmlord were the ones worth pursuing, and your exact stance was "why do people want these trinkets"

[long bronze]

what

I must have missed in the guide where it says to get swarmlords

I also said sac was better than other options already

do you need to continue misrepresenting what I said or are we good here?

[valid bridge]

Ah you're right, swarmlord is not high on the list on the guide

[chilly brook]

The guide has swarmlords as a C tier trinket

[long bronze]

.............

[valid bridge]

which is counter to what nomeratur just said

[chilly brook]

🤔

Is it?

[valid bridge]

Nome said a moment ago it was objectively one of the better ones

[long bronze]

you need to slow down an ACTUALLY read things man

[chilly brook]

Where?

Cuz that's not at all what I read

[valid bridge]

Lmao wow I think I need to take a nap

I read shard as swarm

[long bronze]

troll or?

okay, just failure to launch got it

hopefully you got the answers you needed

[valid bridge]

I mean I didn't, I still don't understand why people pushing the hardest content would intentionally use trinkets that are not considered good (like swarmlord), when they'll do everything else in their power to minmax the hell out of every variable

Is it just that the tanks performance is just not the bottleneck at the highest keys atm and they're leaning damage purely?

[chilly brook]

tank performance never been the limiting factor I'm gonna be honest

[strong forum]

Tanks survivability has not been the bottleneck of pushing keys ever, it's always group survival

Lots of people don't optimise beyond details

That's a fact

[valid bridge]

I don't know why that's surprising to me, that's pretty much been the case my entire progression this season

[strong forum]

Big bar go brrr is a very observable thing

Swamplords does provide a big bar go brrr

[long bronze]

(on hps)

[chilly brook]

Feelycraft reigns supreme for a lot of key pushers

because "I'm right and discord is wrong"

[long bronze]

just look at some of the talent picks they have

[strong forum]

Is it impactful? Does it let you safe a CD at some point? No not really, but a lot of high key pushing is done via feelycrafting

[long bronze]

again, goes to show how good warrior is even with...interesting choices

[chilly brook]

There's a non-zero amount of top tier players that have beef with class discords for reasons

[pearl rampart]

at what point is haste not good to stack anymore ? im over 30% so im not sure if i should just continue getting haste

[chilly brook]

until sim says to no longer use haste

[long bronze]

get more haste

[chilly brook]

[strong forum]

Defensively? When you're over 25k haste or some crazy shit

Offensively? Just sim

[valid bridge]

Thanks for the tips though, and apologies for the momentary dumbassery in misreading messages

Appreciate your input as always

[tardy abyss]

25k kek

I have 23k with flask

[strong forum]

Yeup

[pearl rampart]

all right 😄

[strong forum]

(you can't have too much haste)

((not reachable))

(((especially in s1)))

[valid bridge]

I'm in the unfortunate boat of being 620ish ilvl and only having 15k haste unbuffed

been trying to chase sacbrood or haste heavy rings but no luck

[strong forum]

630 here with also only 15k

[tardy abyss]

I could get really close to 25k if one of my rings was major haste

But thats w/e

[strong forum]

Life's tough when the only haste neck is very rare

(meanwhile I have it on 2 of my alts....)

But not on main

[valid bridge]

I have the good haste neck but it's champ track unfortunately

[strong forum]

Still more haste at 606 than the best m+ neck at 639

[deft mortar]

At this point where I don't fail 11s ever

But also can't time 12s because DPS forget to pop defensives for mechanics they were able to ignore

[valid bridge]

i put the crests in to get it at 619 so im guessing ill be wearing it until i ge tlucky and get the hero or myth version

[valid bridge]

PUG life

[deft mortar]

This arcane mage popped off 5M and got aggro from a non-elite and got one-shot from a melee

[strong forum]

The jump from 11 to 12s even right now is over 2 keylevel

[deft mortar]

It's like 40% more dmg and hp right?

[strong forum]

Nah they nerfed the affix

[deft mortar]

ah

[strong forum]

From 20% to 10%

[deft mortar]

So still like 30% jump from 11

multiplicative

[strong forum]

More like uuuhhh

22?

But you also lose the gain of the "positive" affix

So it's just you, your mum and the timer. No fancy cooking

[deft mortar]

I love that

Hate these affixes

[stone moat]

yea i mean

these affixes are amazing

compared to previous ones

soooooo

[obsidian violet]

recently started tanking on warr somewhat seriously for the first time. should I always prio shield slam resets even if I'm maxed out on rage? or should I spend a global to dump into IP/revenge?

[deft mortar]

I hated them too

[valid bridge]

IP is off GCD

you'll be dumping rage into that vast majority of the time

[obsidian violet]

true, would it make sense to dump into IP even if it's almost maxed out too?

[valid bridge]

so spam shield slam pretty much whenever you can unless you're in an aoe pack and thunderblast is up

[valid bridge]

yep

[obsidian violet]

rgr rgr, thanks!

[valid bridge]

its more important to never cap rage, its okay to hit IP even if you're only getting a portion of the absorb and hitting absorb cap

[obsidian violet]

makes sense 🙂

[smoky anvil]

More rage spent means more AM CDR so you can bang with Avatar

[strong forum]

also means more outburst which again means more rage

[deft mortar]

also more indom heal frfrfrfr

(trying to see how long this can go)

[chilly brook]

Which means more defensives

which means

bigger pulls

which means

more rage

[tribal wharf]

more pings....

....which makes the loop tighter

[long bronze]

And more carpel tunnel

[valid bridge]

also means you can stand there at full health and rage while all your friends are dead because they didn't use their defensives, and you're so tanky your self-sustain is technically better than a prot pally

(or at least a pre-buff prot pally, I dunno what they're like now)

[deft mortar]

I wish more mehcanics were tank-only

So these idiots could just pump their DPS and chill

[toxic pewter]

wat

they literally dont do anything as it is

[chilly brook]

I wish more tanks actually played DPS

[red dock]

Trying to swap to ITF kind of shows how bad I am at this spec lol

[chilly brook]

So they'd not be bad and actually understand limitations

[long bronze]

Until necrotic bolts start going unkicked

[red dock]

Shield block was such a gimme with HR

[chilly brook]

SB really isn't a skill thing with ITF

it's just a numbers game

[red dock]

It is if you let it fall off

[chilly brook]

Shouldn't

press button

duration stacks

[red dock]

Sure

[chilly brook]

up to like 20 something seconds

[red dock]

I don’t think that’s true is it?

Shield charge and block stack

[chilly brook]

it is

[red dock]

But you can’t hit both shield blocks can you?

[chilly brook]

You can....

I've been playing this shit since legion lmao

[long bronze]

Mash um baby mash um

[chilly brook]

TLDR you're not pressing button

[deft mortar]

They can't even pop defensives

At my keys, dps can now interrupt and stay out of fire (maybe)

[urban portal]

dumping both charges on pull is not optimal but it’s fine 90% of the time

[deft mortar]

But no idea when to pop defensives still

[chilly brook]

yeah not necessary to just immediately double it

[red dock]

Ok so we go back to my original statement

Realizing how bad I am at the spec

[deft mortar]

At 12 and above SoB trash pack screaming kills ppl lmfao

[chilly brook]

but like 3-4 gcds in it's fine to press it again

[long bronze]

Yer bad kid lmao

[chilly brook]

as long as you're not pressing the button when mobs are dead and you're getting no value

press button

[long bronze]

That's a good realization to have because it's usually easy to start fixing!

Make an obnoxious WA that yells at you when you have a SB charge and duration is low

Eventually you won't need it

[chilly brook]

You need to spend rage anyways 😛

[long bronze]

Audio queue weakauras are so so so goated

[red dock]

Definitely need an audio queue

Would help

[long bronze]

You're already trying to see a lot, but not all that much useful to hear stuff unless you add that manually

You can even add your own sound samples

[red dock]

That’s when it’s usually a problem. When I’m trying to gather packs, interrupt a ranged mob, stun, and position all at once

[long bronze]

But with details and base weakauras here are quite a lot in there

[red dock]

An actual group would help too but I just ping

Pug

[long bronze]

Your job is primarily to live so not hitting SB is an int

[vast tiger]

hi, i have a question about trinkets, i have several different options and im wondering whats the best for m+ (10-12keys) and raid. here is what I have and they are all hero track 619;
ara-kara sacbrood
swarmlord's authority
shadow-binding ritual knife
opressive orator's larynx
throngus's finger
refracting aggression module

[deft mortar]

check up wowhead guide

[dark cosmos]

swarmlord + sacbrood most people would run out of those

[deft mortar]

not hitting TC is also an int ngl

if u are thane

shit gives phatt rage

[long bronze]

Or shield charge for that matter

Well yeah naturally but he was lamenting his SB uptime

[vast tiger]

i have already but it gives very different bis to what most top m+ are playing so trying to ask here to get other opinions :)

for example it rates swarmlord as C tier, when yarn recommends it and most top m+ are playing it

[dark cosmos]

like i said empirically speaking many people prefer sacbrood + authority for 12+ myself included

can i prove its better? not in any way shape or form

[vast tiger]

yeah okay, thanks :)

[long bronze]

If you want details bait go swarmlords. If you want to do dam go larynx with those options

[dark cosmos]

https://www.archon.gg/wow/builds/protection/warrior/mythic-plus/trinkets/10/all-dungeons/this-week#trinket-combos

[long bronze]

Sac in both cases

🥚👜

[dark cosmos]

its not "details bait" its just much better defensively than other trinkets

[long bronze]

If I was you I'd farm a skarmorak shard or mark

And if you want a defensive trinket silken chain weaver is a better option

[vast tiger]

so the refracting agression module and finger both arent good defensively?

[dark cosmos]

I have both silken and swarmlord and have prefered swarmlord

[dark cosmos]

If you can find a good use for a trinket like refracting then it can be good, i havent really

tank trinkets like that arent so black and white

[vast tiger]

up to now i have been using swamlord + sacbrood for m+ and swapping swamlord for larynx on ST

[dark cosmos]

a lot of defensive in a key moment is much better than a bit of defensive over time yknow?

its contextual

[vast tiger]

i get you, thanks :)

[inner oracle]

I heard silken is still bug and the atk speed debuff doesn’t work

[dark cosmos]

I would definitely run sacbrood and then just try the others

And ya authority is more common and people seem to prefer it but its not like its "definitely correct" in the sense a dps trinket might be

anywho

[long bronze]

It's crazy when people show 100m overall healing from swarmlords in the same log with 30m overhealing from indom and 400m overhealing from healer

[dark cosmos]

are you refering to something that happened or

[long bronze]

Look at basically any log with a prot warrior using swarmlords

And try to see where they got reasonable value out of the dr

[high wyvern]

so swarmlord is good...?

[long bronze]

Also amusing because if you used the taunt trinket on cd you'd get about the same healing bar in details yet it's also never used because people actually realize it's trash

[high wyvern]

or u saying it overheal too much

[long bronze]

I'm saying it looks like it's helping you when in reality all it's doing is giving you unnecessary hps in exchange for doing basically fuck all damage

But if you feel better playing with it that's totally fine. You're just factually losing dps for very provably insignificant hps gain

Prot is disgustingly tanky you don't need help from a trinket lol

[red dock]

Is the boomerang trinket any good?

Relatively

[tribal wharf]

wdym boomerange trinket

[red dock]

Gear-a-rang from stonevault

it has no stats so I assume not

[tribal wharf]

oh its a boomerang? go figure

well, i looted it, and then i turned it in for a quest before i used it ever

ummm, i heard it was fine though, better than most trinket u can get, better than many of them, not S tier though maybe around a/b

[red dock]

gotcha ty

[tribal wharf]

dont delete it in way you cant get it again if you havent got the mount quest

requires you to have the item and give it up from your bags

[unique wyvern]

IP is out of the GCD so using a macro for IP and SS and replacing your IP bind will help you a lot in this scenario. You will burn 30 rage before casting SS at the same button press.

[mystic pewter]

How often do you guys press IP I feel like spamming it way to much and hardly ever pressing revenge. Trying to break myself of the habit.

Only been playing warrior for like a week so trying to get my fundamentals down.

[fluid widget]

Maybe I’m bad but revenge feels like shit damage unless in colossus

[mystic pewter]

It adds up on target dummies just in actual content I find myself hitting ignore pain so I take less damage more often than I’m looking to do more damage.

[tender reef]

that is kinda based

[tender reef]

yes

[stone canyon]

anyone happen to know how much of an overall nerf it is to dragon roar with the target cap change?

[tender reef]

also depends on gear, better gear less IP spamming, more dmg

[toxic pewter]

just did a pug heroic court

and a hunter literally ranked last

in the entire world

[dark cosmos]

"disgustingly tanky" its not like you arent still taking giga damage in 12+ keys on certain pulls

[toxic pewter]

LOL

[dark cosmos]

people talk about this spec like "ya u just never die dont even think about it"

that doesnt mean swarmlord is correct like i said im not trying to prove anything here, but its not really accurate to say you dont want extra survivability

[heavy sparrow]

How or where can I sim?

[dark cosmos]

doing the first pull of nw or ara or something on 12-13 ya i definitely would like more survivability

[cerulean wigeon]

Fury refugee, how do you do fellow tanks?

[nimble laurel]

what's the recommended haste from gear before switching to Into the Fray for M+?

[strong granite]

https://tenor.com/view/fellow-kids-no-text-how-do-you-do-clip-meme-gif-25672029

[mystic pewter]

So revenge above 50 below 70? If your always holding 30 for SB?

[dark cosmos]

generally speaking you are just revenging if TC&SS are on cd

and you IP above 70 which doesnt share any sort of CD with revenge anyway - so theres not really any relation to eachother so to speak

[violet ginkgo]

judging by how much he want to press revenge I think he played colossus.

[mystic pewter]

I hardly ever press it. Was just curious how often others press it. I’m running mountain thane.

[dark cosmos]

i press it exactly as i described

or sometimes in st i use it even if TC is up to fish for SS when i have VO

[violet ginkgo]

with thane then revenge use is just easier, you use when TC and SS on CD, trying to fish the SS reset that's it.

[mystic pewter]

Gotcha

[tender reef]

about 0.001% of prot warris play 12er keys or care about trinkets for that 👍

[dark cosmos]

i think well over 1% of people are trying 12s now and prot warriors its probably even higher

and if you are doing easier stuff then you can run whatever, i dont understand

[tender reef]

this is a discord channel for the other 99

[dark cosmos]

how

he asked what trinkets to run

[tender reef]

so ask him what keys he runs

im pushing 18, what trinkets should i run ?

[dark cosmos]

but if hes doing +5s or something then who cares, you are gonna get tons of gear still and it really doesnt matter vs. you just playing the fights correctly

anyway im not arguing about this lol

[royal rune]

which embellistment gives ascendance?

[toxic pewter]

i think its called ascendance

darkmoon somethin ascendance

[royal rune]

cant see it on AH

[dark cosmos]

i think if you search darkmoon ascension it should come up?

or just search darkmoon, make sure youre in the right category though

[royal rune]

ah yep

kira is using it

maybe i should redo my embellishments

[violet ginkgo]

you shouldn't tbh

[royal rune]

over dusk/dawn thread?

[violet ginkgo]

I mean why would you want to redo embelishment in the first place?

[royal rune]

because it's better?

[lofty nexus]

can we use Berserker Rage to drop the grasping slash stacks on the drones at the end of Ara Kara?

[toxic pewter]

who says its better

[lofty nexus]

or rather, what else besides Avatar, can we use to drop those stacks?

[toxic pewter]

can intervene, heroic leap

charge

freedom from a pally

tigers lust from a monk

afaik berserker rage does not work

[lofty nexus]

thx

[toxic pewter]

I bet gnome racial works on it too now that I think about it

[lofty nexus]

dwarf?

[toxic pewter]

and I guess dwarf racials may work too?

not sure dont play 1

[royal rune]

top warrior on raider io is using it

[toxic pewter]

doesnt mean anything

[stone moat]

doesnt he use it for raid

[smoky anvil]

Have you considered that one individual isn’t statistically relevant and that his success could be due to a variety of factors larger than an embellishment?

[royal rune]

vice versa could be true - his success could be due to alot of factors - of which this embellish could be one

[toxic pewter]

lol

yeah but which is more likely

embellishments literally do hardly anything

it practically doesnt even matter which ones you choose

my main issue with ascendance is it has to be on a weapon so it cancels out 3 ilvl on a myth track weapon, plus apparently it drops relatively easily when leaving combat (like 10 seconds iirc)

[long bronze]

Apb is precisely correct

[tropic tangle]

I mean you see this all the time with talents too

Top player picks x, when y is generally agreed upon as the best overall

[tropic marsh]

Hell yeah, like how in Like Mike how the shoes were everything. Great point

[tropic tangle]

Because the top player is likely picking specific to their group strat for pushing the absolute top end of keys

[jagged gust]

I hadn't thought of intervene, still not used to talenting it

[mild river]

How big is the difference between a 10 and a 11? The gap is that big?

[urban portal]

about 15%

[mild river]

Bc i timed every 10 but I'm afraid to try a 11 with pugs, since I know nobody haha

Gotta start adding ppl I think

[urban portal]

just add ppl

its op

[toxic pewter]

The issue is finding someone to intervene to lol. Usually everyone is clumped up and stuck in close area

11 is basically like a 10, the jump from 11 to 12 is def felt more

[mild river]

Ok thanks

[inland raft]

11 honestly probably easier then 10, 10 is full of weekly key andies who just want vault 11 is the beginning of people who actually just enjoy m+ still not geeat but generally better group in my very limited data sample of one person

[tardy abyss]

ye people are a lot better in 11s

But dw they start being bad in 12s again

[mild river]

Maybe bc they are not used to the damage and all?

[tardy abyss]

No theyre just bad lmao

[mild river]

Lol

[lucid nimbus]

anyone knows why it keeps swapping ara kara for swarmgland

[tardy abyss]

What is that even

[tardy abyss]

No I mean that entire ui

Is that some kind of addon or website

[lucid nimbus]

that's ask mr robot

XD

[tardy abyss]

Surely youre not supposed to use that

Or any other 3rd party tool outside of raidbots

[high wyvern]

11 is not bad. 12 has a big jump in difficulty though

[pale badge]

Hey folks, resources say to enchant weap with authority of the depths but I'm exclusively M+, is there a case to be made for any other enchant?

seems like more of a raid enchant

[chrome falcon]

the tank damage on this kyveza fight

is fucking wild

100->0 through shield wall and 2 ignore pains

in one tank buster

[violet ginkgo]

if you exclusively M+ use radiant

[jagged gust]

have logs? That doesn't sound right

[daring copper]

Got a crafting question, i can make 1 ilvl639 craft. Do i go for shield or weapon? what i got currently are both at hero track

[jagged gust]

Shield is your best slot defensively for increasing ilvl due to how important block rating is

weapon would be better if you're not doing content where you're taking damage and you just want more DPS

[daring copper]

I see, thanks a bunch!

[chrome falcon]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/JF1RyvghK3Z2GcVz#fight=60&type=deaths&death=4 was from 80% so i lied

but still. goddamn.

wait why is it saying i didn't use shield block for over 1 minute

that can't be right

[jagged gust]

yeah you're taking way too much damage from shredders

the fight lasted longer than you were dead so you gotta exclude after death

I'm not seeing Spell Block either which is huge mitigation against gash

[rough crater]

Why does the priest take dmg if i intervene him on first boss NW?
I did the same for druid and mage and they took 0 dmg

[jagged gust]

oh also you Shield Wall'ed .5 seconds too late, should be casting it a second or two earlier because you took unmitigated shredders for ~7mil in the span of .5 seconds (Including the dot) once chasmal gash started ticking

[chrome falcon]

oh yeah i'm playing bad for sure

was still trying to figure out CD timings while also raid leading our first 20 pulls

7 million damage in .5 seconds is still wild though lol

i tried tanking a shredder with just IP+demo+SR and still got knocked down to ~30%

[jagged gust]

you can basically spell block on prepull and then on CD, and SW when shredders is about to go out and you'll reduce your damage intake by more than half

[chrome falcon]

yeah that's the plan 👍

not sure if i want to spell block the first or second shredder but

i guess i'll do the first and yeah just roll it on CD

[mighty fulcrum]

swarmlords bad?

[jagged gust]

You can see you'll spike damage intake on the second shredder, but with all your other defensives rolling for the second (SW/IP stack/Demo Shout/SR) You shouldn't peak higher than 2kk optimally

also remember you've got healer DRs you can call out if you fuck up at any time

[pale badge]

appreciate it

[jagged gust]

quite bad

[mighty fulcrum]

606 swarmlord or 606 ritual knife with chain weaver

[jagged gust]

ritual knife very good

[mighty fulcrum]

no mention of it on wowhead

[jagged gust]

weird, still very good though

[hybrid fossil]

is there a way to skip the two curseforged honor guards in SV before the final room?! they have invis detection

[tawdry seal]

If someone drags them away then meld/die while group goes in

[onyx spruce]

do we have here some site with builds etc from this channel?

[edgy bone]

Why is this in none of the guides on wowhead

Seems good

[restive plaza]

anyone ever figure out how to spell reflect putrid waters 100% of the time?

[edgy bone]

Which ability is that

[restive plaza]

siege last boss dot

[spark lichen]

@edgy bone blue circle on siege last boss

[edgy bone]

You can spell reflect that?

[restive plaza]

works sometimes

[spark lichen]

Is it in the pinned spell reflect sheet

[gritty eagle]

isnt a hero track quickwick candlestick pretty sweet?

[spark lichen]

Reflect prob needs to be cast before the application?

[winged slate]

Isn't that one that you have to have SR up before the bosses castbar starts?

[frosty mango]

Because @ 90s you don’t really gain much out of it besides in niche situations….and the trade off is rarely worth it

I was a big challenging shout enjoyer in DF for some dungeons - like nokhud….this season there there’s not really any dungeons with mass quantities of dangerous caster packs….stonevaullt maybe

[fiery gale]

is it possible to have a spell reflect up for every shadow claw in SV?

Provided theres only 1 shadow claw mob

[frosty mango]

If you time it right and cast it early yes I think you can catch them all

[fiery gale]

ah, thats good. I noticed without spell reflect, even with IP up and some def CD, it hurts very hard

[frosty mango]

I think you can spell block it?

[fiery gale]

true though I had that on CD

[frosty mango]

ip + spellblock should reduce it to basically zero

Same with anima slash in mists and that one is way worse

[fiery gale]

might be worth to pull both shadow claw mobs at once then, to have spellblock for whole duration of fighting them?

[tawdry cloak]

It’s good for amarth and other big pulls in nw, good for big pulls in dawnbreaker, big pulls in ara kara, early pulls in city of threads, siege of boralus in the monkey and hadal area, grim batol warlock packs.

Only niche cases in MoTS

[fiery gale]

usually I go like this in that area

[frosty mango]

You get the orb in nw to deal with that, and adds aren’t living long enough for it to matter imo. City you generally lust that gross first pull, and siege you usually skip monkey area

Dawnbreaker is fair but that key is free anyway, rather take the dps gain

[tawdry cloak]

In lower keys yea, not necessary. In high keys where every bolt that goes off is chunking your dps, and packs live too long to just zerg, there are some very good use cases for it that can make dangerous pulls much safer

[frosty mango]

What would you consider high

I’m doing 11s-12s and I’ve really not come across any specific place I felt it would be high value if you have a group doing their job

Your point isn’t wrong but I don’t think it’s a problem you solve by talenting into a suboptimal spec- your dps should just play properly so that shit doesn’t happen

[mortal finch]

hi, started gearing my pwar and now im on weapon + shield craft and i see "many" options ppl play rn - so whats the best embelish to craft now?
its ascension + writhing or weapon grip + 1x vers or 2x vers?

[pallid quiver]

The bigger issue with Disrupting is usually that it doesn't really enable any pulls and that it has notable opportunity cost in talents; if you're concerned about yourself dying, you're probably grabbing BSV instead. If you're concerned about the group dying, one stop won't fix it, usually, since you need a rotation to keep things locked, and Disrupting is still too long to add to most rotations. You can't give up TL in reasonable scenarios since that's a lot of DR with the number of claps coming out. So it's a strong option, just one that's situational and not a default go-to

[tawdry cloak]

I’m working on 13s atm and yea, everyone should play optimally and get every kick, but we all know that doesn’t happen, and 6s of silence can give everyone a chance to breathe in some of the more complex pulls

[pallid quiver]

It's also notable that it only silences if it interrupts, which can be of niche value

Since there's often more than one mob casting "This DPS is gonna eat shit" in packs these days

[frosty mango]

Imo that’s not an excuse at that level. 12+ is really the top end of play right now and saying “we should plan for suboptimal play from the group” is a cope

[pallid quiver]

There also is the point that it eats up your AOE taunt, as well, removing that as a tool for enabling snap pulls, but that's usually a minor thing and not a problem in high keys, anyhow

[frosty mango]

If that’s your logic then that means you’re holding it for a niche situation and then you’re getting even LESS value out of it

If we had more keys with packs of 4+ dangerous casters who spammed shit that oneshot dps I’d say yes probably go for it (looking at you nokhud and uld) but I just don’t see it right now.

I mean if you wanna run it I don’t think it’s really actively harming you either

[hybrid fossil]

hm, ok ty 😄

[viral elk]

Anything for singing steel attack in siege of boralus? Feel like I have a hard time mitigating through it on tens and higher.

[quiet zenith]

Dwarf and hope is ur best friend and typical IP

Maybe pray for heals I feel like some healer missed the self sustain nerf on tanks since tww atkeats in 12+ keys hehe

[mighty fulcrum]

i belive the prot wowhead guide to be shite

[marsh stone]

Did you just join to say that?

I'm sure the person that wrote it, the one currently online in this channel, will appreciate the well worded critiquing.

[lyric flax]

Hey folks, I need a bit of help real quick...In a raid fight, is battle stance the standard? Should I be in BS the entire time, only when not tanking the boss, or always in defensive?

[marsh stone]

Depends on the fight for me, some fights I stay in D, others I switch to BS when not tanking

Easier content is just BS

[frosty mango]

depends on your gear, but I usually pop wall and demo for these, drop rage on IP

I hold stops and if it gets dicey I'll throw stops to let the healer catch up

dont be afraid to kite if you need to

[lyric flax]

hmm, ty

[frosty mango]

for heroic I usually sit in battle stance, theres really no real tank damage

[marsh stone]

Yeah Ansurek would be the main one I'd stick in defensive in phase 1

[frosty mango]

for mythic i usually keep d stance up

the gain in dps imo not worth

preference though

[lyric flax]

i see...makes sense

[urban portal]

if you have to ask you probably should sit in defensive stance

[marsh stone]

Not true.

[frosty mango]

thats really the kind of passive-agressive non-answer that puts people off of asking questions

[pallid quiver]

For a good way to figure out whether to be in Battle Stance or Def Stance, think about where damage is coming from and when it's high. To take most Heroic raid encounters, for example, tank damage is fairly minimal outside of the tank swap mechs themselves, and even then it may not be particularly high. So you can value the extra crit versus the DR based on this. Just normal smacks going on? The DR isn't serving any real purpose. Ansurek about to feast you? That gets extra value from being mitigated harder, and Def Stance is like a free defensive CD, so minimal reason to not be in def stance

[remote tusk]

oh no i found one

[pallid quiver]

It's generally a lot harder to do this in M+, since damage sources can vary wildly and tank damage as a whole is a lot higher overall

[remote tusk]

[pallid quiver]

Oh shit, the boys are out

[remote tusk]

slam and whirlwind

[long bronze]

giga

[pallid quiver]

yeah but he's a skeleton so he gets a pass

[pallid quiver]

Oh, no one ever answered this.

Embels aren't particularly impactful no matter what, but Dusk/Dawnthread (depends on your stats on current gear which is better) x2 is generally the best option. Lens is better in pure ST only, and not by much, so if you want to maximize ST damage, you grab that embel

[cloud finch]

do you think pal prot will be more meta than war ?

[blazing condor]

usually thats what happens with time

[sick helm]

I've just come from guardian druid to prot warr and yeesh this is more buttons haha. Having a great time though.

[tulip remnant]

Prot Pali eventually powercreeps healers in general

[teal linden]

Does anyone have an idea on how I can overcome this instant delcline meta for 12s? I have 2750rating everyhing on 11 plus some ++

I legit can’t get into a group

[eternal terrace]

how as a prot?

[teal linden]

Yeah

[turbid shuttle]

is your ilvl low?

[quiet zenith]

Do we go the double vers or double crit embalishment pls ping me for answer need to og back to work but need this info on +12-14

[turbid shuttle]

prot is generally an easy invite. I was 2750 a week or so ago and got invited to most 12s I app'd to

[teal linden]

625

[turbid shuttle]

yea I dunno then

[terse hollow]

It's a lot of mixed reports, I'm 2400 and 624 ilvl and regularly get declined for 9s and 10s

[eternal terrace]

crit is barely worth imo, i went movement speed. dunno about vers

[terse hollow]

Yeah crit was fine on low keys but going above 10 vers just seems way better

[eternal terrace]

i mean statwise, you dont get much with the 0.15% . Is there even a vers blasphemite gem?

[terse hollow]

I don't think so I do have the crit vers on I believe

Then versatile emeralds everywhere else

[turbid shuttle]

the person you're replying to is asking about embellishments not gems

dusk vs. dawk

which is whatever. flip a coin.

[eternal terrace]

fkn hell, yea ure right

[toxic pewter]

movement speed is best 10% more movement speed owns

and I use 1 of each gem color myself

i know many do not but I think its worth it

just solid quality of life

[inland raft]

10% isnt there only 4 colors? Or am i regarded?

[eternal terrace]

iirc the crit gem simmed about 500-1k higher on fury.

so basically scam

Only 4 different gems. it counts only the color, not whole diffrrent gem

[inland raft]

So would he 8% right?

[mortal finch]

ty!

[solemn current]

There’s 5 but one is stam.

[inland raft]

Ah i completely forgot about stam gems ya no 2% speed not worth that lol

[nimble laurel]

is there a way to see block "performance" in Details?

[mighty fulcrum]

https://i.imgur.com/9qjCABU.png just did a little 7 mists on shit prot alt

whats going on here

[toxic pewter]

i beg to differ i think 2% speed is worth taking bit of stam

literally like 205 stam or some crap ultimately is meaningless in the big picture. meanwhile 2% speed is actually very valuable

[molten gorge]

It does a lot of healing ya, but it isn't really necessary healing in a +7 especially

[mighty fulcrum]

what about when one is learning prot

[molten gorge]

🤷‍♂️

Like your IP usage seems low from that healing breakdown

[mighty fulcrum]

yes indeed

prob capping my rage hald the time too

[molten gorge]

Which is making swarm look even bettwr

[smoky anvil]

Really low. Rookie numbers, gotta pump those numbers up.

If you hit 100 rage slap IP

Your avatar uptime will thank you

[molten gorge]

For comparison

Over a Mists

[mighty fulcrum]

i will see how i go in next key

[molten gorge]

Legit best suggestion I can make is put IP on a mouse button

So that it's easier to use mid rotation

[mighty fulcrum]

im so new i forgot to even use it

tweaking ui

[molten gorge]

[round pendant]

I figured this is relevant for this channel

[maiden meadow]

i too believe that prot wowhead guide to be shite

[round pendant]

Well, you're wrong

[toxic pewter]

one of the most wrong individuals I have seen in a long while.

[frosty mango]

If you’re getting declined for 11s at 2750 then you have very few completed keys is almost certainly the problem

Most people will invite the person with more completed keys

At that rating really it’s the only factor

[terse hollow]

Not the community being fucked and expecting carries and will only invite people that have done 2 levels higher than their key?

[frosty mango]

No, no one running at 2700+ on the reg is asking for stupid requirements like that

That’s a mid level key problem

Always is and has been

[terse hollow]

I've played to title like every season since it's existed, mostly in pugs

It's an everywhere problem

Always has been Always will be, humans fear failure

[frosty mango]

Only inviting those people is one thing but strictly asking for it? No chance

[terse hollow]

I never said its asked for but it's quite obvious when it's happening

[frosty mango]

If you got your choice between a 2650 tank and a 3k tank with 3x as many completed keys who are you gonna take

[round pendant]

Tanks aren't so abundant

That's not a reason for him getting declined from every key

maybe some of them, sure

I agree with Xavious, the reason is puggers brainrot

[frosty mango]

Sorry, 2700+ getting declined from 11s doesn’t mesh

[late narwhal]

Hey everyone I just leveled up my warrior and started running some
Keys. I check the pins but what is the WA everyone uses for dungeon routes in game

[maiden meadow]

tis the rules of world of warcraft, thou shalt not receive invite unless thou is 200 io higher minimum

[hexed shore]

maybe he plays on ragnaros

[frosty mango]

Need to be 3700io to have a chance at carrying those dudes

[terse hollow]

The joyful thing is majority of the time as a tank you don't have to get invited

[round pendant]

That's ok, you have your experience as does everyone else

[terse hollow]

And if you're actually good you're gunna drown in friend requests

[maiden meadow]

everyone in lfg has the tinder fomo (what if someone better comes along?)

[terse hollow]

The age old answer to m+ is run your own key

[leaden grail]

first boss necrotic wake intercept: my old ass cant always click the person thats getting the spit, can you just use like a targettarget macro or sth?

[frosty mango]

Ragnaros is a statistical anomaly to me. Logically I know there are good players on rag. But my experience is almost always overwhelmingly negative. Why?

[round pendant]

NA?

[terse hollow]

I use click cast in left click and just click on the person who has it in party frames

Works wonders for me

[tribal wharf]

languages barrier

thats the whole issue

[frosty mango]

I speak their language

[leaden grail]

U got like a weakaura that will show who has it in party frames? cuz i dont

[frosty mango]

They never respond

[hexed shore]

jaja

[terse hollow]

You can display debuffs in default blizzard ui

[toxic pewter]

its just like any server tbh have good players and bad players from my experience

[round pendant]

Also I gotta say, NA vs EU pugging experiences are vastly different

[terse hollow]

Little wigs or dbm also call it out

[tribal wharf]

i think that if you are CLEARLY typing in spanish, say, or french, it should attempt to auto translate to english

[frosty mango]

They don’t speak Spanish

[leaden grail]

yeah but that is what I was referring to earlier. I am too slow to read the guy thats gonna get it and then click their party frame

[terse hollow]

I don't know if there's an answer to that

Better to just untalent it and pray they use a defensive 🤣

[tribal wharf]

what i think i have heard is that ragnaros basically = northern south america no real idea

[frosty mango]

Ff11 had a good system in place that should have been the gold standard for mmos

Never caught on, not sure why

[hexed shore]

brazil

portuguese

[leaden grail]

hmm so the dude targeted by the spit is gonna have a debuff then?

[frosty mango]

Yes they speak largely Portuguese

[maiden meadow]

i think its just difference in play styles and in some cases language barriers

[tribal wharf]

if wow has glossary with images of what this spell effect often looks like (eyes for chase, swirl for stun purple swirl for fear)

and auto correct

and lag fixed

[frosty mango]

But even when I try to speak to them in Portuguese they just ignore me, along with everything else (like mechanics)

[tribal wharf]

thats only things needed to be fixed

[maiden meadow]

though i did get called a racist for rejecting a rag player the other day. Like bruh im a tauren playing with a night elf, 2 dwarfs, and a goblin. How am i racist?

[hexed shore]

theyre all hopped up on yerba mate and can’t focus

[maiden meadow]

stuff is good

[tribal wharf]

example there is fear, horrify, and cower at the bare minimum

[frosty mango]

One time a ret pally from rag with 3 interrupts and zero blinding light uses did speak to me at the end of a dungeon. He said “healer is ass can”

[tribal wharf]

not everyone understands the difference

cant tell you precisely what horrify does, but i bleive it makse you run 100% of time, cower is you sit there, cowering not moving, and then fear i think is a mix of the 2

randomly selects if its going to cower or flee you

[frosty mango]

My experience is with the Latin realms is largely neutral but definitely slanted negative and it doesn’t track with me logically. I know there are good players there. I don’t understand it :/

[tribal wharf]

i don't play warlock and i don't like hitting int shout,

im not a fear expert, i do think priests absolutely should be able to talent into fear ward like old wow

not all tanks can remove fear, definitely not many dps

[late narwhal]

Is there an ideal location to get MDT routes?

[tribal wharf]

that'd be the one thing i would change about priest beside just buff them to be easy to play/good in general. not fan of playing other healers for most part

priest then (probably dragon #2, but not played dragon) shaman then monk

[frosty mango]

just give priest a kick

life would be good

[frosty mango]

raider.io has some

not sure I'd call them ideal but they do have them

[tribal wharf]

i really do think fear ward and MAYBE its a group fear ward with choice, or up to 3 players

very iconic priest ability from warcraft

[frosty mango]

yea but thats just tremor totem/beserker shout

it would be cool but ultimately pointless

[tribal wharf]

its like SS for fear

[frosty mango]

they really need a kick

[grim pilot]

@strong forum

gg

[tribal wharf]

they have uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

stun fist

i cant think of the name

[frosty mango]

chastise

not a kick, lol

[tribal wharf]

that

why do they need a kick, maybe the solution is there are more ways to deal with the problems you cant kick due to ran out of kicks or bad kicks

mage can dispel the curse, priest can remove the fear

[frosty mango]

because every other healer has a kick and it's actively griefing to bring a healer with no kick to a high key in like 90% of comps?

disc brings a lot of powerful mitigation that can make it solid in a good comp (aug/sham/dk) but outside of that literally every group will run shaman because of poison + curse dispel and kick

holy is just non viable in high keys right now

not even a discussion how bad it is lol

[tribal wharf]

you would think at a certain point they would just overwhelm the mechanics (most of the not 1 shots) with healing

notorious for big healing meter

[frosty mango]

thats kinda the thing about this season though

everything is deadly and theres no outhealing it

because of overlaps

like last week if you tried to brute force heal off the affix AND heal through trash on some keys 12+, no chance

shaman just drops a totem and lols

disc can kinda get around it by good shield planning/management, holy just has to struggle

[turbid shuttle]

the affix isn't a heal absorb what are you talking about. if you're healing through trash you're passively healing the affix

and the only other healer seen in super high key comps is priest so... lol