dmg intake
#protection
spring ermine
play the exact same dungeon
strong forum
target count
spring ermine
in the same way
strong forum
1 sample size isnt large enough
jagged pier
U would need to play the same dungeon at the same level with the same ppl pressing the same buttons at the same time
spring ermine
its an estimate only, yes
jagged pier
Multiple times
strong forum
fbv is 2-4k hps
jagged pier
To get an accurate result
strong forum
brv can provide way more than that
proper roost
Play the exact same way in an entire key 🤔
spring ermine
keep in mind though that brv does nothing if you dont have an active ignore pain...sure if you play perfect you'll almost always have, but reality is you dont. check logs.
spring ermine
often when you die, you did no longer have an active IP
strong forum
like i said
you can play both
both scale the same way
weak in ST
strong in aoe
both fairly inconsequential
spring ermine
@strong forum why 4 % pseudo leech
strong forum
cuz its only deepwounds dmg healing
spring ermine
yes only with 4p of t29 its 15
spring ermine
and its in reality even less than 10
since it will not always trigger
so more like 8-9
strong forum
yes and i like i said before
fbv is trickle healing, which can potentially steal healing from indom, actual leech and other hots aswell
the more sources of healing you add, the more it conflicts with others
spring ermine
that is true
strong forum
so as said 3x before
fairly inconsequential
not large enough to matter between the 2
spring ermine
yeah i know both is viable, i just like discussing the pros and cons
strong forum
like in the ultra pull dungeon BH fbv wouldve been ~6% pseudo leech for me assuming it would always heal all of its dmg its ever ddone
its super hard to evaluate how much BrV contributed to my IP value
cuz you cant just math it out
nor will doing the same exact dungeon twice suffice as enough data to hint at anything
vocal nimbus
whenever i inspect someone the window closes like 5 seconds after opening it
spring ermine
what would you say, when you die, how often do you have IP up?
vocal nimbus
anyone had a similar problem?
strong forum
i dont die
spring ermine
you would in higher keys at some point
strong forum
sure
hollow bolt
when i die its cause i got my shit hit by like some 235k hit
both are useless tallent into none
strong forum
when you play optimal rotation, the only time you dont have IP up is, is when you didnt get SS resets
strong forum
yeah so what will 1k hps do
in that situation
cuz you mostly only die to 1shots in high keys
which often occur from bosses
or very specific mobs
hollow bolt
man someone blocked keeps messaging me
strong forum
the "only" way to die in high keys is to mistakes
and those mistakes happen quickly
spring ermine
exactly. the reality is mistakes happen.
hollow bolt
shit the only way to die is mistakes class is so strong it plays itself
that or healer sleep on big pulls
hollow bolt
truuue give reflect 2 charges blozzardo
strong forum
if you didnt use your CD at the correct time -> death or extremely low hp
spring ermine
@hollow bolt if you are experiencing this, just push higher keys
until you hit a point where you no longer feel like that
which will come eventually
strong forum
keys are all about group coordination
not about perfect individual player skill
which is why its not super uncommon to see players in the higher ranks with not perfect rotations
especially tanks
hollow bolt
that2 in groups its fun to talor your talents to your groups ability i refuse to use spellblock, thats an extra butten and its confusing i just yell for ss or external
then they yell at me for depleting kek
spring ermine
strong forum
using an external is perfectly fine, you have only so many CDs available, but especially this season the most scary abilities arent magical
oak ivy
no sry i was referring to the one where he picks a target and beats on them for a bit, not savage charge
strong forum
outside of those previously named dungeons
hollow bolt
yeah its all bosses throing an extra empowered brick to your dome
daring marlin
no sry i was referring to the one where he picks a target and beats on them for ...
I am a fool then
healer just gotta heal through it
fast knot
I've been hard focusing Gnashtooth for that exact reason, feel like past a 20 that fixate with goobers being late on their defensives is a death sentence
spring ermine
is honed reflexes that bad? barely see it picked
hollow bolt
same that motherfucker scary
been debaiting runing intervene and see if i can eat that fixate
strong forum
honed reflexes rarely adds value unless you specifically need the CDR for kick on a specific mob to have a 2 man/ solo interrupt rotation
the shield slam CDR almost never gets any value due to resets of shield slam
fast knot
I've tried and I don't think the ability is classified as a melee attack
hollow bolt
damn ty
fast knot
my poor healer died in front of my face anyway 
daring marlin
I've been hard focusing Gnashtooth for that exact reason, feel like past a 20 th...
WHY DO PUGS ALWAYS TRY TO FOCUS CASTER
like bro he does NOTHING
fast knot
Because kicks are scary and he heals and stuff
hollow bolt
yeah just set em on focus
fast knot
I dunno, lead poisoning or some shit
daring marlin
must focus this useless caster
spring ermine
@strong forum yeah thats prolly true
sick sentinel
yeah, so that thing i mentioned
daring marlin
meanwhile the other hogger eatin' dat ass
proud patrol
on uldaman last boss do you guys use reflect to reduce the sand breath or deflect the debuff?
sick sentinel
we died to flame eruption and if we didn't we would have timed
strong forum
aoe sims should now be a bit more accurate on raidbots
just make sure to sim using the "latest" version
warm plinth
Thanks dad
proper roost
WHY DO PUGS ALWAYS TRY TO FOCUS CASTER
it is actually pretty scary if you don't have coordinated kicks (aka pugs)
earthbolt + the rogue fixate is a guaranteed death
but yeah the rogue is better to focus
daring marlin
I'm a paladin I got it covered
strong forum
its so funny when people kill the cyclone adds first in VP instead of the soldiers
daring marlin
:^)
strong forum
yup
warm plinth
Plus the adds literally make you immune if a cast gets off. Not exactly the end of the world.
strong forum
people gonna have a rude awakening when theyre suddenly gonna get destroyed by the soldiers in high keys
daring marlin
😉
warm plinth
That's the pro strategy is to let all the dps get stunned and then the soldiers can't damage them
Giga brain
fast knot
I'll pass it on to my healer so they can stop going OOM
proper roost
can the cyclones even target tank? 🤔
warm plinth
Don't think so no
strong forum
they can if youre first
warm plinth
Lolol
proper roost
powerful
warm plinth
We're talking about the cyclone not the damage thing
daring marlin
can the cyclones even target tank? 🤔
Negative. But I always start seasons straight tanking and shift over to also DPSing partway through.
strong forum
its always the fuckoff ability if they have 2 kickable cast but they spam 1 and the other only rarely
daring marlin
More variety!
strong forum
that usually means the rare cast is scarier or aoe
warm plinth
i dont even know what the cyclone cast itself does
It stuns for 6 seconds undispellable bit also makes the target immune (like druid cyclone)
proper roost
i feel like halfway through every season, a bunch of my friends get fed up with dps queue and reroll tank alts
strong forum
im wondering how fuckoff 5 tank would be this season
proper roost
so then I get baited into playing dps, and then at the start of the next season i'm stuck with 0 tanks again
sighdge
daring marlin
i feel like halfway through every season, a bunch of my friends get fed up with ...
Gonna be healers this time around.
strong forum
should be alot more chill than s1
there arent that many dispells
and you can pull decently big
daring marlin
I'll prolly pick up the Holy hammer once again in 10.1.5.
Heals are so few and far between now!
proper roost
yeah i'm definitely alting rsham this season
there are a fuckton of prot pals
and rsham kinda braindead easy
crude notch
I'm alting augmentation evoker
strong forum
free invite to everything
final mist
holy priest my main alt atm
crude notch
Time to turn on your total DPS bar in details going forward
strong forum
i did normal abb on my 410 prevoker and my god, you dont have to heal anything
also lost 3/3 tierset rolls to the same warrior who already had 4pc but from lfr
daring marlin
holy priest my main alt atm
A man of culture I see
crude notch
I'm down bad for tier on my druid. Please someone.
oak heart
what can you reflect on naraxas
strong forum
the dot
toxic retch
it applies a dot after its finished its channel
if you SR, you send it back
you can get every other cast with it
oak heart
ooh thanks
strong forum
sometimes you can get 2 back to back
crude notch
Spell queuing is wild in that dungeon
strong forum
its actually fairly static imo
crude notch
My bw will countdown on totems on navarogg like 5 times before it goes off.
strong forum
yeah thats the one part where its a bit off
before intermission shit takes a bit longer than bw says
but its smth like bellow -> sunder -> intermission
proud patrol
Sorry to ask again, I just did Uldaman 20 and the last boss frontal was insane, however our heal was complaining about the time sink debuf which i could prevent with spell reflect but i was using it to mitigate the sand breath (because arcane dmg i think) when i did not have other def cds - did any of you guys have a similar experience or am i dumb to use spell reflect on that frontal? 😅
strong forum
or sunder -> bellow -> intermission
crude notch
One thing I've learned with that boss is never trust others to track the totem
strong forum
and im pretty sure you cant reflect time sink
quiet minnow
Los the breath
strong forum
lemme check my log
proud patrol
but the frontal is just insane and i can only really los it twice without trolling my melees 😄
quiet minnow
You can los it on pillars all around the room
quiet minnow
but the frontal is just insane and i can only really los it twice without trolli...
Oh
quiet minnow
Ya
latent steppe
biggest issue that i have is HoI last boss cause the push back and swirlies... the swirlies are coming inside of the boss sometimes
strong forum
hm okay
quiet minnow
Line the frontal
Sorry did not see you said didn’t mean to repeat you
strong forum
apparently something else ate my spell reflect then
cuz when we did 20 this week i got the debuff despite pressing SR shortly before it
maybe stepping into the pool removes SR
crude notch
I'm proud of you bro keep up the good work
latent steppe
latent steppe
I'm proud of you bro keep up the good work
i am proud of that you proud of me bro
proud patrol
I guess im just trolling my healer, have to learn to los the breath and reflect the debuff
daring marlin
On a 20?
crude notch
I believe in you dirt jumper
latent steppe
I'm proud of you bro keep up the good work
daring marlin
Sounds like a git gud issue on your healer's part if it's a 20
proud patrol
you are probably right
but i like playing with him so i can try to make it a bit easier on him
crude notch
Guilford this is a positive hour please and thank you
latent steppe
Sounds like a git gud issue on your healer's part if it's a 20
yeah, in the end of the day we are not blood dk. people should see the diff between sustain and mitigation tank if they play healer
marble cipher
also crazy on naraxas + navarogg
which one do you SR on Naraxas? I always do the puddels but there might be a better one?
cinder nova
Are you talking about retch?
marble cipher
yeah, that's the one I SR
and then just stand in the puddles
that's correct right?
cinder nova
Toxic Retch applies a debuff to the entire group as a poison DOT.
Rancid Maw places slow areas on the ground.
You reflect Toxic Retch before the cast completes to deflect(?) the DOT application.
It's basically like having a DPS that can dispel themselves, except it's only you, and you can only do it preemptively.
marble cipher
yeah, that's what I do, but toxic retch is also the one that puts all the green goo at the boss' "feet" right?
cinder nova
Yes. Just don't stand in it. There are ample places to stand and the worm has a hitbox the size of Siberia.
marble cipher
fair, never seemed to get any dmg from it though, but, makes sense to still go to a safe spot just in case
cinder nova
That's what separates us, the enlightened, from the animals scraping in the mud: the DPS.
Never reduce yourself to their status.
marble cipher
then on totem boss it's Sunder, and on last boss it's Molten Crash iirc
First boss doesn't really have anything to SR, maybe when you have to run during crystal floor thing I guess
cinder nova
Can you reflect Sunder?
marble cipher
y
cinder nova
Wild. I was just taking them to the teeth. I'll have to do that.
marble cipher
very annoying spell queue on it though
as it's often off cd, but boss does a ton of other stuff first cause reasons
cinder nova
He always will Sunder right as he comes out of his intermission. You can plan on that, at the very least.
novel cloak
how do you guys feel about season 2 mythic, would you say its harder than season 1 mythic?
cinder nova
Yes and no, but overall: no.
Yes because the healer nerf means everyone - not just healers - needs to be playing more intelligently and deliberately when damage starts hitting certain thresholds.
novel cloak
im finding it REALLY hard going in PUGs
cinder nova
No because overall you're just battling the dungeon's mechanics, and the affixes are an occasional nuisance.
PUGs are being pushed to the bottom because they can't just overwhelm mechanics with gear and FOTM memes.
novel cloak
so you think its cos im running in pugs?
cinder nova
People need to be pressing defensive CDs more proactively, and I think I've seen two DPS do that this entire season outside of immunities.
Absolutely. I run in PUGs and it's nightmarish to get them to do anything, even at 20 onward.
I recently hooked up with a group in need of an M+ tank for that reason, they were all from one guild but proactively did mechanics that made the key a snooze.
There's only so much you can save the DPS from before they have to save themselves, honestly, and better for it.
I'm out here with the Doomfist mentality:
Either the hardship will break them, or it'll temper and harden them into decent players. Knowing PUGs, it's going to be overwhelmingly the former rather than the latter, but you can bet there are players out there that are actively attempting to get good and adjust.
novel cloak
thats for the feedback. i think you are dead right, and its a pug problem. i look at cds used, kicks done and they are next to non existent and the mmechanics from the trash just wreck them
fast knot
There's a lot of upreaching as well
fossil cloud
hello, could someone help me with the crafting of Primal Molten Defender at 447 ?
cinder nova
Upreaching?
fast knot
People that should be in 14-16's queuing for 18-20s
cinder nova
I see.
Yeah, I had to deal with a ret paladin trying to tell me how to do Sentinel in ULD and that you only need to stun her when she's casting empowerment.
Completely missing the fact the group is losing 2/3rds of their HP on unbuffed stomps.
mighty valley
you could get back to your previous season key level pretty much immediately in previous expansions, but now the community as a whole doesn't know anything about the new set of dungeons for a couple weeks
cinder nova
Absolute clown.
lone arch
Any good websites for tanks to review keys/raid?
Doesn't look like tank notes is updated anymore.
mighty valley
I think it's overall easier than s1, certainly feel less threatened as a tank overall, there's no crawth or kokia
cinder nova
Honestly the trash is more hazardous than most bosses, I find.
Lots of frontals, some bleeds you can dodge that you should absolutely be dodging.
fossil cloud
is good put the Shadowflame-Tempered Armor Patch to the shield?
mighty valley
Yeah true - but I do also think that the timers are all on the easy side
cinder nova
They are.
mighty valley
So often you can fuck up trash and make partial progress and still time
cinder nova
They're still on the easy side post-reduction.
mighty valley
If bosses are the wall, then the key is just dead
cinder nova
I still see plenty of boss wipes, usually from low DPS, people dying to predictable or avoidable damage, or just not doing mechs.
I also just see a lot of people not pressing their buttons, honestly. I ran ULD with a Prevoker that didn't once use CF despite getting 3 stacks of Crunch.
novel cloak
it tokok me about 5 attempts to clear underot today cos pugs dont know to soak the worms from crawath or whatever his name is. every group just falls apart.
cinder nova
Dude was holding it for the next key I guess.
mighty valley
I don't run with a lot of pugs tbh so I don't know what the randokillers are
cinder nova
I don't run with a lot of pugs tbh so I don't know what the randokillers are
See: anything that involves having to do something besides mindlessly DPS.
I'm not joking.
novel cloak
then i get like 8 ticks spawn and hit me for 120k each 😦
daring marlin
mammoth in neltharus
mighty valley
it tokok me about 5 attempts to clear underot today cos pugs dont know to soak t...
god, even after four seasons of BFA pugs still ate shit to this boss
fossil cloud
hello, could someone help me with the crafting of Primal Molten Defender at 447
cinder nova
hello, could someone help me with the crafting of Primal Molten Defender at 447
You can put the patch on the shield, it's fine.
fresh igloo
if you're looking for a crafter to do it for you they need to be on your server
cinder nova
Where the patch(s) go doesn't matter.
long chasm
is good put the Shadowflame-Tempered Armor Patch to the shield?
Yes, unless you’re gonna play dps too then maybe go with boots or something non tier
proud patrol
what haste are you guys running? with my simmed max dps build im at 4.245 which seems quite low - i have a neck with 900 haste which would cost me the same amount of crit but might improve my ressource generation
sick sentinel
https://tenor.com/view/bh187-austin-powers-noo-move-get-out-of-the-way-gif-19284...
cregmaw
crude notch
good job yogi
sick sentinel
There was no good jobs by yogi today, depleted 11 nelthqrus
pallid quiver
what haste are you guys running? with my simmed max dps build im at 4.245 which ...
The largest majority of your rage gen is not particularly affected by haste. It does increase it, yes, but if you're having rage problems, you're messing up the rotation/play in some way, shape, or form
the minimum amount of haste necessary to play prot is 0
it just feels bad to have 0
slender terrace
you guys see any eranog groups forming for ring?
sick sentinel
It sort of amazes me blizzard didn't expand fire theme gear to frost gear nature
daring marlin
you guys see any eranog groups forming for ring?
Check pf every now and then
I see 'em rarely
clever heart
How much better is Talisman of the Cragshaper trinket vs Treemouths Festernig splinter ? & why ?
tropic gorge
wopo 437 molten defender w\shadowblame
flame
is shadowflame wreath a good weapon enchant?
viral elk
How much better is Talisman of the Cragshaper trinket vs Treemouths Festernig sp...
Cragshaper has no up front damage on use and shorter CD. One minute CD on over 300k negated is pretty tight.
viscid zealot
im zug zug rn, can you craft and equip two pieces of gear with shadowflame armor patch? one piece being tier 3 & other tier 2?
crude notch
yes
plush tendon
how do we feel about the Sark cloak
fast knot
If you are even considered to get cloak over a dps that's pretty wild
my hot take anyway
Getting in vault would be pretty sick
plush tendon
If you are even considered to get cloak over a dps that's pretty wild
got it in a normal
fast knot
That's understandable
plush tendon
fast knot
my guild wants me to roll on it for BIS over a dps I'm passing
tight gull
plush tendon
i mean thats really good
loud wave
Can someone tell me how often Voice of the Silent Star procs during a 30 minutes m+ run? i am not sure if 30k HP is worth like a 5/6 procs for 8s
cinder nova
Yeah, it's everything around.
steady lynx
What's the tier piece we don't use?
cinder nova
worst stats is legs iirc
steady lynx
How come the simcraft gear has a crafted helm and 4 piece rest?
urban portal
the "bis" gear from simc
steady lynx
Yes...
lusty grotto
are you... are you running simulationcraft the program instead of raidbots?
steady lynx
I'm talking with my tank and I'm not one, nor do I know have any resources on what to craft/what's best
If anyone could help me out
No, I'm talking about this BiS gear from the website:
lusty grotto
so the simulation craft site instead of raidbots
steady lynx
Yes.
lusty grotto
why are you looking at that
steady lynx
Doesn't that tell you what the best possible dps combination is?
lusty grotto
do you mean a bis set? take a look at our pins
similarly icy veins and wowhead have suggestions
but just so you understand
the crafted helm is there due to the shadowflame embelish
which can go on any crafted armor piece and on the crafted shield
like the pins say the optimal embelishment set is either 2x shadowflame or 1x shadowflame + unstable frostfire belt
that list is close to being accurate, but only if you have access to Mythic sarkareth cloak and Mythic echo of nelth' shield
anything lower than mythic loot will have to be simmed
(and its entirely possible a lot of stuff from vault/keys can outdps heroic versions of the shield for example)
daring marlin
Yeah, it's everything around.
Considering it's an affix mob I didn't think about it. It was just funny cuz my Priest buddy screamed about it being huge and chasing him.
torn gust
did you hear, shattering throw is able to kill one of the incorporeals
cinder nova
Bullshit
limpid estuary
Hey guys,
Bromach's Disentombed Locket or Ionized Choker?
warm plinth
With Priest MC
daring marlin
huge for dk tho
daring marlin
*Note: The first stack applied seems to correctly apply a 5% damage reduction. Currently the second stack applied seems to bug and apply a 100% damage reduction (more like 99% in practice) meaning a single DK in your group can make the entire trash or boss do almost no damage for 10 seconds.
what the fuck
warm plinth
Yeah we thought we just discovered this but they must have posted the article right around the time we noticed it
daring marlin
YOu missed the 100% reduction part <:keks:936231610850897992>
actually nuts
warm plinth
ikr
lusty grotto
thats a bit fucking broken
warm plinth
We noticed it because our priest memed and was like oh I'm gonna MC this
And the whole time we're just like what the fuck...
torn gust
im actually kinda pissed :y
cinder nova
Festering Harvest hitting hard af amirite
What is happening.
warm plinth
Mind controlled incorp
fast knot
I swear to god any of my raiders get a 30 day vacation by pushing keys to this
I'ma kneecap em
cinder nova
Wait do you MC it to nuke boss damage with the affix debuff
warm plinth
We didn't do it on purpose. We were just doing it to CC them
But we noticed that our paladin just facetanked a bloodswarmer in UR and it did no damage
ebon wren
do we use repentence for incorporeal? am I missing osmething stupid?
lusty grotto
repentance?
that is wild
hell repentance doesnt even exist anymore for the class that used to cast it
well i guess it does... in pvp
oh no nevermind, im just perma blinding light in my pally
clever heart
I swear to god any of my raiders get a 30 day vacation by pushing keys to this
Surely blizz can’t ban / punish players for using this ?
It’s not a dks fault if he uses control undead as intended & it happens to cause a bug.
Would they really ever punish it ?
lusty grotto
its literally reported in wowhead's front page
fast knot
I think once known repeating the action could have consequences
but then again I'm not gonna do relevant keys with it so 🤷♀️
crude notch
Yeah okay banning people for M+ exploits is like not a thing
We've had far more degenerate shit happen in M+
lusty grotto
they didnt with the crazy fucking snaps we did back in the day and which were used (up to SL iirc) in MDIs
clever heart
This is so crazy too. Like the players could actually do this not even knowing it’s an “exploit”.
Like people in fetching low keys could do it having no idea what is happening
lusty grotto
its a bit fucking op yes, but its on wowhead's front page
fast knot
I doubt it'd happen for sure
lusty grotto
they usually dont tell you how to "exploit" with detailed instructions
crude notch
Like I don't think you understand
They've literally
Never
banned people for M+ stuff
NEVER
And there's been far more degenerate shit than this in M+
lusty grotto
a bit paranoid on their part tbh
warm plinth
yep
I mean there were no special instructions for this "exploit"
It was just a bug that caused the second stack to go the rest of the way instead of another 5%
slender terrace
why are so many prots still running annulet in subcreation data; tyrannical?
crude notch
Can't get a better ring, their mothers never loved them as children, they like the way it shines in their finger?
They're obviously not running it for ST as they're mostly running storm infused
@shut summit this kind soul would like to know why you're still running Annulet in keys, qt
crude notch
why are so many prots still running annulet in subcreation data; tyrannical?
He's also still running melandrus so something tells me he isn't getting any good ring drops
torn gust
looks like they reverted the change :v
unkempt fox
why are so many prots still running annulet in subcreation data; tyrannical?
Cause it's big damage, gonna run it till 10.1.5 prolly when they nerf it
crude notch
Tbf, it gets outsimmed in MT
lusty grotto
so im guessing the shattering throw fix also go reverted or only the Control Undead thing?
unkempt fox
Ye with perfect play and not moving around and just clapping, which is not the case in m+
crude notch
okay tell me you don't know how to play warrior in M+ without telling me you don't know how to play warrior in M+
unkempt fox
Aren't u the meme guy around here, prolly shouldn't have responded my bad
crude notch
7% of Sense's damage in his 23 Underrot was Thunderclap, my guy.
So no, "not moving around around and just clapping" is wrong.
warm plinth
looks like they reverted the change :v
Yes because it was badly implemented and was making mobs do no damage
torn gust
heccing lol
crude notch
can't wait for the "blizzard hates fun" crowd to comment
torn gulch
wowhead comments are my go to popcorn content
crude notch
slender terrace
They're obviously not running it for ST as they're mostly running storm infused
that's what i don't understand, only value in sim is purely for ST
and healing portion is like 50% overheal in keys
and you're not even factoring in the defensive loss from secondaries
crude notch
He's also still running melandrus so something tells me he isn't getting any good ring drops
toxic pewter
i still do more dam with annulet than even 441 ring
crude notch
I'm pretty sure the confusion should've stopped there
crude notch
and healing portion is like 50% overheal in keys
no one ran the annulet for the blood healing
They ran it because it helped increase the damage stone procs substantially
toxic pewter
the healing is just a means to trigger more dam
crude notch
Honestly that's all they need to do to make everyone stop running them.
earnest canyon
Hi everyone
Is there a target count where sonic boom is worth playing over TR?
lusty grotto
id be fine with them doing like 30% less damage
with it*
would be great for DKs
and not ridiculously op
cinder nova
Cause it's big damage, gonna run it till 10.1.5 prolly when they nerf it
Dogpiss in M+/AOE.
Stats on rings are better.
unkempt fox
ty
spring ermine
Whats up with the pinned message only mentioning annulet and diurnas as notable rings, and none others?
stoic ore
around how much vers should you be aiming for? simming goes mainly for damage so it always prio's crit for me
spring ermine
There is no vers cap that you need to aim for
toxic pewter
i dunno for some reason i do better with annulet/eggnog ring still
spring ermine
Keep in mind though annulet does not provide any survivability (or almost none)
Sure, pure dmg wise its fine
lusty grotto
it specifically says for raid
the items there have very notable procs or effects
so you can figure out what rings you will need based on stat prio and sims
outside of those 2
spring ermine
usually shield block is capped to like 24 seconds or something. why does it go up to more than 30s during last stand?
lusty grotto
because bolster bumps up the cap
the standard cap is double the base duration
so 12 seconds
bolster bumps it up
spring ermine
ah thats crazy
doesnt even say that in the tooltip
thanks!
i often encounter that i have so many procs that i can use SS and thunderclap a lot, and therefore not using revenge that much. this in turn leads to massive amounts of overcapped rage, which of course is then dumped with IP. anyone else encountering the same? i dunno, it kind of makes "show of force" seem like not a great talent. it simms good, but only because the sim is just spamming revenge.
lusty grotto
and since IP is off gcd, you can dump with revenge + ip on a gcd cycle
warm plinth
the standard cap is double the base duration
Standard cap is 3x duration. And it's generally 24 seconds because of Enduring Defenses.
lusty grotto
i stand corrected
warm plinth
But yeah, Bolster doesn't give a shit about the shield block cap
and will still give you 15 seconds regardless
spring ermine
@lusty grotto should you use revenge when you have ss or tc up?
i mean once for deep wounds yes
but besides that
spring ermine
for example, i often pull with avatar etc, and for the full duration of avatar im maybe using a couple of times revenge because i can use ss and tc all the time
warm plinth
SS>TC>Revenge is the priority
spring ermine
so it makes me think show of force is trash
during avatar, surely tc has prio over revenge
lusty grotto
you should be TC to Revenge to TC to Revenge during avatar
SoF will buff each other out
spring ermine
yes but in reality i get so much ss procs
that it doesnt get to that a lot
i guess its due to a lot of haste plus the weapon speed from shield charge
spring ermine
what i'd like to know is if you guys go in with all cds (for example freehold first pull), how often to you actually use revenge during the avatar window? on average
because i rarely get to do it
spring ermine
nah
lusty grotto
that pull is always lusted, and you still revenge quite a bit
either way if you dont, i hope youre tabbing targets fast enough with the sped off gcd, or you have a slave hunter/rogue
spring ermine
can you explain a bit? i would see several reasons why
lusty grotto
cause there's no way youre gonna keep threat on 9 mobs with only SS
spring ermine
well during avatar you are clapping like a crazy mofo
lusty grotto
with lust, pre pots
spring ermine
and you have ravager and thunderous roar
lusty grotto
what level key is this?
lusty grotto
do you have a log?
spring ermine
i'll make one next time
good point
a bit unrelated, when i log in my shield is often gone until i attack a mob
anyone experience the same?
by gone i mean its not visual
lusty grotto
also
dire sparrow
you're in your profession gear
lusty grotto
if youre clapping so much, dont you think its best to buff the TC with SoF?
spring ermine
you're in your profession gear
my god thank you, finally fixed
lusty grotto
im kinda confused here
spring ermine
thats the thing nim, yes i would like to buff it but not if i have ss up due to procs
lusty grotto
im sorry i just find what youre saying hard to believe
dire sparrow
TC takes prio over revenge, you just wanna make sure you're not overcapping on rage, dumping rage into IP isnt a bad thing, because you're building more outburst procs
lusty grotto
geared dps will rip the shit out of your agro by avoiding revenge
spring ermine
yes i know dumping rage with IP is fine, the point is that if revenge is rarely used, then show of force is not good
i will create a log next time
then we can check that
threat is alright nim, and im running with guys that pull 140k+ overall
yes sometimes it is tough but its doable
dire sparrow
i mean you dont have avatar up every pull so show of force gets a heap of value over the dungeon regardless
you could take disrupting, if it's a cast heavy dungeon though
spring ermine
with unnerving focus, rage gen is so insane that i have avatar almost every pull
lusty grotto
scroll right to see how many revenges were cast on that pull
up until 51 seconds? i believe
spring ermine
im checking
yeah
interesting
i'll also create a log soon
maybe im also messing up something, its of course possible
dire sparrow
you also need a way to get ITF , so you're picking your best option there, could go with AOE silence as well
lusty grotto
i never use it
spring ermine
(in my personal preference)
dire sparrow
yes for pugs it is
crude notch
@warm plinth tell blizzard to fix their game.
I did the untradeable loot workaround again
dire sparrow
personally i feel like unnerving focus is a little unnecessary with how much rage you're getting from aoe in dungeons with bloodsurge, so you could drop that and see if it feels better
spring ermine
@lusty grotto even in that log though, in total you used revenge 78 times and tc 223 times. which means 145 of your tc are unbuffed.
spring ermine
in that log, tc did 10 % overall damage. now only 1/3 tcs (3.33%) are buffed by 20 %. So 3.33 * 0.2 = 0.666. That is roughly how much overall damage is added there by show of force
(well, plus the additional damage to revenge, but thats not a lot)
sleek current
Shattering Throw now removes an incorporeal from the field. That's nice. 3 minutes though and a cast. 😔
spring ermine
i looked at "revenge!" :D
crude notch
I was rooting for you Pressive.
vocal nimbus
Dont remove my incorporeal homies
lusty grotto
im sure there are
vocal nimbus
Incorporeals did nothing wrong
sleek current
Dont remove my incorporeal homies
I'm coming for them mate. 😂
I only have raid logs.
Unless a pug logged one of my keys.
crude notch
@spring ermine sense logs his keys and has 4p
lusty grotto
i immediately hopped on a quick key with shattering after they reverted to see if it only applied to the DK thing, and shattering did absolutely nothing
spring ermine
perfect ty
spring ermine
why
restive scroll
i immediately hopped on a quick key with shattering after they reverted to see i...
Yeah, doesn't seem to work all the time for me
tried it a few times
lusty grotto
we dont use unnerving for keys
spring ermine
having a ton of rage is great because you will have avatar up a lot, you will have tons of violent outbursts, you heal a ton
lusty grotto
for ST/raids sure
dire sparrow
because blood surge generates you enough rage in keys
spring ermine
have you tried it together with 4p?
lusty grotto
check the pinned builds
dire sparrow
you have rend on so many targets
yes
in raid it's great
keys it loses some value
spring ermine
for example you will literally have avatar at almost every pull
because you get so much rage
lusty grotto
you dont
dire sparrow
you're not being rage starved though without it
lusty grotto
you literally started this whole conversation with something along those lines
dire sparrow
what are you taking off in your bulid then to take SOF and Disrupting shout?
spring ermine
yes nim, i have more rage than i need, but of course i dump it
well mtom thats the point, im not using sof
thats exactly it :D
lusty grotto
spring ermine
nim in the sentence after that i say i dump it
spring ermine
sorry i did not express myself great, im not a native speaker
what i meant is i am about to be capped and then dump it
dire sparrow
i mean you have 2 builds here from some of the best prot warriors in the world not taking UF in keys? If you're not finding value from it dont take it but they are
lusty grotto
bedge time
crude notch
anyone with more than 3 brain cells is able to determine what he means from that sentence.
spring ermine
mtom i absolutely see the value in the builds that are linked here, i think in the end it's just personal preference and i was interested in the input from the guys here
if anyone is experiencing similar stuff etc
dire sparrow
yeah that's exactly it, if you can play with or without it, dont stress about it
lusty grotto
i mean its pretty simple
Unnerving with bloodsurge and he has said again and again that he has no space to fit in revenges
so do you really think, he can dump enough rage with IPs alone?
spring ermine
*not a lot of revenges
spring ermine
ip is off gcd you can just spam it like crazy
lusty grotto
on this hypothetical scenario
spring ermine
also i have 1 point in overwhelming rage
i think you would be suprised if you would test that build
proven tide
Why did they give them take away shattering throw incorpeals... Stupid
toxic pewter
anyone know any cool intervene uses this season
crude notch
Why did they give them take away shattering throw incorpeals... Stupid
Because the other spells were breaking the game, so they just reverted everything they did. Calm down chief.
You'll get your once every 3 minutes you can stop an incorporeal
spring ermine
That's what's a bit sad about prot warr. Dmg and survivability is great, but so few utility compared to pala etc
dire sparrow
@spring ermine i would try take UF off for 1 key and see if it feels any better with SOF but you really need logs to see.
crude notch
log dn
warm plinth
why are you taking off unstoppable force?
dire sparrow
Unnerving focus*
crude notch
ursoc's fury?
warm plinth
Shouldn't be running that in keys anyway
spring ermine
youre asking why im taking unnerving focus?
warm plinth
In keys, yes
spring ermine
well im currently testing it. the idea is due to the new 4p, you will have last stand up a lot, like 30 % of the time. so 30 % of the time you have 50 % more rage gen. you will then of course be rage capped, and then you will dump the rage with IP. this will make you spent tons of rage, which gives you more avatars, more violent outbursts, more healing by indomitable
reef haven
you are already focus capping a lot of times, is not it better to get the extra block and damage from brace for impact?
warm plinth
what are you dropping for unnerving focus?
reef haven
"focus capping"
dire sparrow
bruh
spring ermine
actually, no honed reflexes
dire sparrow
was about to say either bloodsurge or punish is being dropped
reef haven
why disrupting shout instead of show of force?
dire sparrow
i can get behind Disrupting in pugs
warm plinth
especially this season. There's like nothing to kick
warm plinth
I mean, the strength of disrupting is that it can interrupt multiple things at once. Like all the dangerous casts this season only happen one at a time
spring ermine
dire sparrow
yeah
crude notch
Can y'all coordinate instead of asking the man the same question 5 times?
reef haven
you have aoe stun, st stun, interrupt, spell reflect and an aoe taunt already, disrupting seems eh
warm plinth
I mean it's not a big deal. But why would I take no damage vs some damage when I'm not actually getting value out of the no damage option.
spring ermine
check out this link. blood surge gives 1600 rage, and the guy had a total of 16000 rage, that means blood surge gives 10 % rage. unnerving focus however on average gives about 15 %
or even more
because for 30 % of the time you have 50 % more rage
or for even more than 30 %
depends how many SS you get
jagged pier
brah how long are you keys if your in LS for 30% of the time
dire sparrow
you're trading rng for consistency
spring ermine
its not rng
warm plinth
I'm really confused how you're getting 30% uptime on Last Stand.
jagged pier
your in LS about 20% of the time
reef haven
and what happens in the moments where you don't have last stand? your focus gen will be stumped
jagged pier
if that
warm plinth
Yeah it's more like 15-20%
spring ermine
last stand lasts 15 seconds. the cd of last stand is 2 min. that already makes last stand be up 12.5 %.
without ever using shield slam
each SS reduces the cd by 4 seconds during last stand
and out of it by 2
i easily get 5-6 SS during avatar
reef haven
from the log you linked,
spring ermine
that already is 24 seconds off the cd
jagged pier
2 different keys
reef haven
15.59% uptime
warm plinth
And if you think Jakey isn't playing optimally...lol
dire sparrow
Lord and saviour Jakey coming to the rescue ❤️
spring ermine
its not just about playstyle
crude notch
17% in uldaman 22.
17% in VP 22.
14% in NL 22.
For Sense.
spring ermine
for example
warm plinth
I'm looking at a freehold log right now and it's the first one I've seen even 20%
And it's 20.34%
jagged pier
right stop using sudo math and examples
and use stats
we've linked stats to u
telling u its 20% at most
not 30%
spring ermine
you are right theres no point currently, i'll first create some logs
toxic pewter
16.78% on bh i just did
reef haven
how do you check it in details?
jagged pier
buff uptime
jagged pier
reef haven
16% in an NELT
spring ermine
pin that please
come on, you already have 12.5 % uptime by default
without ever using SS
jagged pier
i dont know where you getting these number from but ok
warm plinth
15 second duration / 120 second last stand CD
spring ermine
120 / 15
crude notch
15/120 but yes
dire sparrow
this was my 20 BH last night
spring ermine
how long do you use SS in 2 minutes
tell me
what do you think
each of these SS reduces the cd by 2 or even 4 seconds
warm plinth
But you have to realize that in order for you to have 30% uptime, you'd need Last Stand to have a 50 second cooldown
reef haven
let me check the top logs in warcraft logs for the big boys uptime
warm plinth
Yes but you're not using SS for 2 minutes in between LS.
crude notch
i just said sense's numbers
jagged pier
let me check the top logs in warcraft logs for the big boys uptime
dont bother its nextback
warm plinth
Because each SS reduces the cooldown.
crude notch
but no one wants to listen to me
jagged pier
he doesnt play correctly
look at sense if anyone
and we already know his uptime
someone just said
spring ermine
@warm plinth wait youre not using SS in between LS?
crude notch
17% in uldaman 22.
17% in VP 22.
14% in NL 22.
For Sense.
warm plinth
YOu are, but I'm saying you aren't using SS for 2 minutes in between SS
er, in between LS
Because every SS you do lowers the cooldown
reef haven
I'm gonna look at some chinese for cracked mechanical players @jagged pier
warm plinth
So it is impossible for you to press Shield Slams for 2 minutes from the cast of one LS to the cast of the next.
spring ermine
i get what you mean
crude notch
So then you're not actually gonna look at top warrior logs
spring ermine
yes
ok how often do you estimate you use SS during avatar
on average
with average procs
warm plinth
here's the thing
reef haven
all leaderboard Sadge
warm plinth
You're doing math that you don't have to do
You can just look at logs and see their LS uptime
warm plinth
You can calculate all day, but there's no shot you get Last Stand down to a 50 second cooldown in 50 seconds.
You'd have to reduce its CD by 70 seconds in 50 seconds.
spring ermine
all good guys, i will make some logs and check :D
reef haven
rank 3 in a 22 VP, only log available in the top 10s, 17.41% by Sense
crude notch
Sense averaged 22.4 SS PM in Uldaman 22. Even best case scenario that'd be 19.73% uptime.
jagged pier
please pressive go log and prove us all wrong, im still waiting for r1 prot warrior at the start of last season to link me a log where the haste legs were 100% at 5 stacks as he claimed
crude notch
ZODIAC
jagged pier
but he never gave us a log
crude notch
are you blind?
reef haven
@crude notch apparently yes x) he has a bunch in top 10 available
crude notch
We've already linked his numbers
in here
multiple times
at length
The work as already been done
You're just feeding into this man's unnecessary and pointless math.
That's obviously wrong
spring ermine
guys let me clarify, im not saying im right and you're wrong, im just discussing possibilities. and you are right, bloodsurge being more consistent is also great, and the rage it generates comes close.
reef haven
calm down dude lmao, I was looking myself when you typed your message and already had to scroll to see it
spring ermine
because of course LS is not always used as soon as its up
reef haven
You're just feeding into this man's unnecessary and pointless math.
????????? wtf
spring ermine
for example if there are only 2 mobs left you dont use LS
lets close that topic until logs are generated
warm plinth
Like let's say you cast 20 SS per minute (which is honestly very very generous in keys) and have a 1 second GCD. That means you're casting approximately 5 of those during Last Stand so that's 20 seconds. The other 15 are 2 seconds each at 30 seconds. That's a 50 second reduction. Which still puts the CD of LS at 1:00-1:10. Which is still not short enough to get your 30% uptime.
And that's like...as good as it gets and an outlier, not the average key
crude notch
calm down dude lmao, I was looking myself when you typed your message and alread...
you mean 12 minutes ago, you were looking up the numbers?
warm plinth
And ofc you also have downtime in the key where you can't reduce the CD because you're going to the next pack or have to move away from a boss for a mechanic, or whatever.
crude notch
Nome's best in logs was 19% uptime.
spring ermine
@warm plinth well that would be 25 % uptime, which to be honest would still make unnerving focus better than blood surge
warm plinth
Which again is basically an unrealistic scenario and not at all the norm (as proven by the only 2 logs in here that even had 20+)
dire sparrow
you're still trading consistency
warm plinth
and neither had 25
dire sparrow
vs rng on SS resetting
spring ermine
mtom yes, which is why im actually considering using blood surge instead
but its interesting to discuss it
crude notch
Is it interesting to discuss bad math?
spring ermine
please, as i said, it is pointless to discuss it without logs
i will generate them and then we can see
warm plinth
I look forward to it
spring ermine
youre right, estimating this doesnt lead anywhere
warm plinth
Please ping me once you get them together
spring ermine
and again im not saying im right :D actually i will probably play blood surge
reef haven
am I the only one that presses last stand even if not it combat so I can have Earthen Smash sooner in the next pull?
and is that dumb?
spring ermine
after im done testing that is
zodiac i wouldnt do that
i press it exactly at pull
you want to get the 4 seconds reduced cooldown by SS
and the 30 % increased SS dmg
crude notch
How do you plan on pressing 35 SS per minute?
spring ermine
i dont
jagged pier
no?
dire sparrow
toxic pewter
I believe it
crude notch
did you just link an enchanting rod?
what happens if you take crackling thunder?
are you na or eu?
yo wtf
says 12 in TT
tooltip
12
are you horde or alliance?
are you in game rn?
join the group "testing drug related stuff" in premade dungeon groups
toxic pewter
dire sparrow
this has been a wild hour hahaha
spring ermine
did you open a ticket?
toxic pewter
Honestly always felt like thunderclaps radius was too small
spring ermine
did you already check demoshout
crude notch
shit that normal people say at this hour https://i.imgur.com/RYLokOh.png
spring ermine
youre doing gods work
crude notch
LMAO
nice spec nerds
don't get in any duels with guardian rn, y'all screwed
mangle 8 yds
let's find out if it's 6 rq
because i can change my range on mangle to 6
okay it's 6
dire sparrow
all those keys bricked because 1 mob being out of range killed a dps
drifting pecan
Does intervene + spell reflect work on the 3rd uldaman boss dot??
willow lark
based on the pinned list in the #268491842637660160 , does that mean that ilvl upgrade is more valuable for prot than keeping 4 piece from previous season?
dire sparrow
spring ermine
thanks for reporting man
fringe folio
Is there a weak aura to help with what you can reflect ? Or pretty much memorise the google doc in pins ?
dense shell
The lariat is valuable or we prefere the 2 shadowflame embellishments?
crude notch
Yeah if you ever need a spec to compare ranges with Bear has spells that are 5, 6, 8, 9, 11, 12, 13, 15, 16, 18, 25, 26, 28, 40, 41, and 43 yds. 🙂
brittle veldt
Is there a weak aura to help with what you can reflect ? Or pretty much memorise...
https://wago.io/tDT26wrXg believe that’s the one I use
spring ermine
great ty
brittle veldt
There’s more updated versions so get those ones they’re just the ones I have off hand as not at pc
jagged pier
The lariat is valuable or we prefere the 2 shadowflame embellishments?
lariat is dead
ruby steppe
hey guys, quick question, how do I live ticks in underrot? Had no problems on my BDK but struggling with my warri there
oblique kayak
hey guys, quick question, how do I live ticks in underrot? Had no problems on my...
don’t pull them
dense shell
lariat is dead
Thank you
sleek current
Anytime my guildies retri rips aggro from me now I'm blaming it on the two missing yards from TC. 😂
ruby steppe
don’t pull them
ye well if my team doesn't play second boss good i have to deal with them
is there a cd which is especially usefull for them?
hallow phoenix
Ticks are mean
sleek current
They shouldn't be killing you. I'd be more concerned about the party dying. 😂
I charge after the boss twice which puts me in place to stand on the ones that are far away then heroic leap back if that helps.
ruby steppe
okay ty, at least good to know it is not really my fault if i die to them
fringe folio
https://wago.io/tDT26wrXg believe that’s the one I use
Thank you !
restive scroll
I know people didn't like that I'm saying that I go in the shadow realm on Sakareth hc, but I have to say, that's very confortable.
Particularly for pugs.
I don't see a dispel, nor do I take damage for that duration.
And wayyy safer transi p2/p3 too
If someone else wants to try
sleek current
Are people not going in the in-between with the tank dot? Just seems like unnecessary damage to the raid and you don't get all that tasty haste. I don't see why you wouldn't go in.
cobalt jungle
Guys, is there a reason to not macro Avatar with Thunderous Roar or is it ok to do it?
restive scroll
Are people not going in the in-between with the tank dot? Just seems like unnece...
Not in P2, apparently
sleek current
Guys, is there a reason to not macro Avatar with Thunderous Roar or is it ok to ...
Avatar resets far more frequently than Thunderous Roar. So, if you're relying on it to cast Thunderous Roar you'd be missing casts.
sleek current
Not in P2, apparently
Oh P2. No, no point. You can just move away from the raid.
restive scroll
I'm trying to explain that there are reasons to do so :/
Not necessary though, totaly agree on that
cobalt jungle
Avatar resets far more frequently than Thunderous Roar. So, if you're relying on...
oh right, anger management, forgot about it, thanks
sleek current
I'm trying to explain that there are reasons to do so :/
Personally, I don't see that reason being strong enough in P2 the dot only affects you if you're playing it correctly.
Ultimately if your tactic is consistently ensuring you kill Sark, do whatever mate. 😊
sleek current
oh right, anger management, forgot about it, thanks
No worries. 😊
restive scroll
Personally, I don't see that reason being strong enough in P2 the dot only affec...
Of course, I'm just trying to share it, that's it =)
The dot doesn't hurt that much, but 2/4/14 raids are common, and heal is a bit tight.
And often, I go down.
But not having to worry about the space, the bump & Stacking that hast buff is also quite nice
worn nest
Question people, is there an official world of warcraft discord server? i randomly got to this discord server
sleek current
I think it ultimately comes down to whether or not those 10 seconds or so in the in-between will equate to more DPS in the long run.
worn nest
if so could anyone send me a link to it
restive scroll
I think it ultimately comes down to whether or not those 10 seconds or so in the...
exactly
sleek current
if so could anyone send me a link to it
I don't think it's official.
No idea though.
crude notch
Wtf only 105k people play wow
worn nest
https://discord.gg/wow
Thanks alot, i think thats the server i had joined on another discord account, i just couldnt find it
sleek current
Thanks alot, i think thats the server i had joined on another discord account, i...
No worries
marble cipher
That wowhead title got my hopes up, and then I read we kan 'kill' an affix every 3 minutes.........
sleek current
The hotfix has been reverted because DK was broken.
brittle veldt
Prot warriors can handle them fine?
Not entirely alone but that change is just for dps specs
marble cipher
I stare at them while yelling on voice: dickheads are up, handle them
sleek current
Very inefficiently compared to other classes.
Shockwave doesn't even work on them because it counts as AoE.
brittle veldt
I usually stormbolt them instantly and if one of the team dies just fear and then you’ve charge up
sleek current
Personally, I ignore them and just take druids, priests and warlocks.
brittle veldt
Yeah I stormbolt cause it’s easy fear and charge are for emergency
marble cipher
I have evoker, priest, lock and retri in my team. So we're fine. But it's just crap seeing a title going "warriors can handle them now" and then see it's a 3min cd
brittle veldt
Since AoE fear works when targeting I wonder if shockwave works too? Haven’t needed to try but could come in clutch
marble cipher
Thanks for the clarification. Cause I didn't mean to come over whining lol
Shockwave doesn't
brittle veldt
While targeting the incorp?
marble cipher
As it works without a target. Fear is a target shout
marble cipher
Yeah, even with targetting, for the game, shockwave is still a non targeted aoe
Fear is a targeted ability that has a secondary effect on the mobs around your target
brittle veldt
Yeah makes sense
marble cipher
Clutch stormbolt into a fear and shield charge if needed. That works, if you have cc'ers dead at the moment. So yeah, I'm fine with what we can do to them.
But hey, I wouldn't say no to an actual 20s cc
brittle veldt
Any tips for the mammoth in neltharus? Seems to cause a lot of problems in pugs, feel like it’s getting lava buffed too often but it spawns that shit at its feet and then when trying to move it away it just stops in lava and aoe nukes the group
marble cipher
Lust, nuke, bait well, move him
Nothing more you can do.
Sometimes it will just not move, nobodies fault, just heavy dmg to heal through then
Ideally you'll have people bait puddles near old puddles, and then move to bait charge. But good luck in pugs with that
brittle veldt
It’s annoying that it’s the first boss, people aren’t committed to the run but good to know there’s not much else I can do
marble cipher
Only thing you can do on that fight as a tank, is make sure you move him from or through puddles as much as you can. And maybe position him nearish the walls so dps know you want to bait the charge at those walls
brittle veldt
Yeah that’s what I’m doing just keeps wiping the pug groups had 3 bricked keys the other day because we couldn’t get passed him
Forgestorm in the vault may be the only hope
cerulean tusk
With pugs it is better to let it charge quite a distance, allows people to react and dodge easier. Then, you basically pray that they handle the spray damage with their CDs
orchid mural
Hmm, man the annulet ring still does so much damage - do i replace it with a 441 ?
granite pond
jagged pier
thats up to u
basically it will be more damage
but your loosing stats
so its your choice
personally i probably wont ever replace it
or is it sims within like 1000 dps i might consider it
i dropped eggnogg ring for that reason
new ring was 700 dps less but more favourable stats but 20ilvls so worth imo