😦 i was ms painting this lmao
#protection
modern brook
didnt even know it existed
BSC not highlighted
technically synergstic with crit cause more parry
topaz latch
so, i should slowly vert my verse equip over to crit
modern brook
so, i should slowly vert my verse equip over to crit
your take away
mighty valley
BSC not highlighted
another massive blizzard L
modern brook
should be
untold scroll
How do I remove nameplate from spiteful shades? OOOO
modern brook
"My secondaries do not matter that much"
topaz latch
and by logical conclusion, my best dps offspec is arms?
ornate wagon
ironkid, what level of keys you running?
topaz latch
"My secondaries do not matter that much"
thats a nice take away
modern brook
and focus on whatever your sim tells you does the most damage
mighty valley
your best dps offspec is the one you have the most fun with since balance will go all over the place
modern brook
for most people
ornate wagon
20-23, you just need haste
modern brook
that will be a haste>crit split
mighty valley
if you've just started, for a very long time your entire gearing decision tree should be "is it higher ilvl? i equip"
ornate wagon
ive ran heavy crit and heavy vers, both survived, crit did noticeably more dmg
topaz latch
that will be a haste>crit split
and the DR from verse is not additive rite?
topaz latch
if you've just started, for a very long time your entire gearing decision tree s...
i already do that, and have done so. this is more for gems and enchants
modern brook
and the DR from verse is not additive rite?
multipliciative like everything most things
mighty valley
additive DR would be pretty funny, we'd all be shooting for 100% DR
topaz latch
additive DR would be pretty funny, we'd all be shooting for 100% DR
correct lol
but i dont know the workings of this game yet, so its always been wise to confirm from those who are wiser
and i already, without a doubt, look for ilevel first
this is more for gems, enchants, and what gear to swap when i do offspec dps
and i like fury and arms the same
so id rather choose the more gear complimentary one
im 90-95% tank, 5-10% dps gameplay
mighty valley
well, most of us here like to gem/enchant for haste+crit, it's not gonna really be noticeable if you go haste+vers, and in any case is a negligible factor in your success
simply vibe and focus on playing real good
topaz latch
when imp vic crits, does its healing crit too?
topaz latch
most macro decisions can be hand waved away if you're hitting the correct cpm
what is cpm?
modern brook
iv is % heal
ornate wagon
APM?
modern brook
idt it crits at all
same concept, different implications
walking is technically an action
topaz latch
idt it crits at all
wut
ornate wagon
oh lol
ornate wagon
ive always taken APM to mean casts per minute i suppose
modern brook
i could be wrong idk
its not something ive ever cared about
you should focus on avoding putting yourself in a situation where you need to know if your iv will crit
topaz latch
if i vert over to haste/crit cult, would arms be more gear friendly?
strong forum
absolutely
modern brook
arms likes haste crit yeah
mighty valley
yeah it doesn't crit, or i'm insanely unlucky
topaz latch
absolutely
sorry, is this an affirmation to Arms Warr?
topaz latch
yeah it doesn't crit, or i'm insanely unlucky
ah, i fking love numbers. thanks for the 99% confidence. ill take it that it doesnt crit. its really good to know, even for no reason at all
mighty valley
you'll love numbers until you share a log here and we tell you all the Bad Numbers
topaz latch
ok, so im gonna vert my gems, missives and enchants over to hast crit cult. and learn some arms on the side
topaz latch
you'll love numbers until you share a log here and we tell you all the Bad Numbe...
bad numbers is where the learning happens though
mighty valley
that's the spirit
topaz latch
i love bad numbers, my whole career is based on anal eyesing bad numbers
then learn and make bad numbers go away.
strong forum
sorry, is this an affirmation to Arms Warr?
yes
topaz latch
then i go home, gf makes me play wow, and i get to do the same with numbers accomdated with my gf telling me i suck
topaz latch
"Girlfriend makes me play wow"
makes is a lil strong lol
we just play together, but shes been playing for far far longer. i told her if she plays my killing games ill play her wowcraft
and then i fell in love with dragonflight and now i even play without her
plain vapor
yeah were gamin
modern brook
this guys living my fairy tail wtf.
modern brook
its smh but im bad at typing
mighty valley
oh yeah i'm married to a wow person
topaz latch
this guys living my fairy tail wtf.
lololol, its not all roses. sometimes i gotta stop playing and pay attention to her new mogs
topaz latch
oh yeah i'm married to a wow person
hell ye lol.
mighty valley
everyone complained so much about the maw and torghast and i'm like "don't you all duo with your spouse, what's the problem"
topaz latch
everyone complained so much about the maw and torghast and i'm like "don't you a...
people complaing about getting into keys, she heals and is a tank i like to play tank.
me: me and my healer gf get into every group we apply for, why arent you and your gf/bf getting into every group?
topaz latch
everyone complained so much about the maw and torghast and i'm like "don't you a...
i honestly skipped sl. then she tried for the third time to get me into it at DF start. I wasnt sure and didnt think id like it. then i got to the quest where you learn to ride a dragon for the first time at RLP, and let me tell ya, the music score. it did things to my soul. it spoke to me. decided i was going to do things like raid, dungeons, learn what "sim yourself" means etc etc. all the hardcore stuff.
strong forum
yeah were gamin
im holding off on upgrading mine cuz i dont wanna farm 60 fragments again to upgrade other gems once/if this gets nerfed
tropic gorge
I've tried 3 times now since wod to get the gf into warcraft
mighty valley
that warms my old soul as a person who loved auto-attacking troggs for hours in vanilla
tropic gorge
She just doesn't care for it
topaz latch
She just doesn't care for it
lolol, my story is the exact mirror. she tried three times to get me into it.
tropic gorge
Tried again a few months ago wjth the new dragon class. Still the same. Mmo games bore her to death
topaz latch
that warms my old soul as a person who loved auto-attacking troggs for hours in ...
lolol jfc. that got a snort out of me
tropic gorge
I don't think she truly grasps what an mmo is, and how big the world's are etc etc
mighty valley
honestly the mmo combat style just can't click for some people
woeful whale
Hello warrior players! Is the new ring good for us?
mighty valley
when they right click on a guy they're trying to attack a hundred times, you know you're in for an uphill climb
mighty valley
Hello warrior players! Is the new ring good for us?
Check pinned messages!
topaz latch
here we go again
woeful whale
Check pinned messages!
Alright, thank you! 🙂
mighty valley
we were too busy talking about stats to appreciate my pins poem
topaz latch
we were too busy talking about stats to appreciate my pins poem
damn, share it again, for me. and every time we have to check pins
mighty valley
If the Pins icon glows bright and red, your post is better left unsaid
You've checked and pins have naught to say? Go ahead and post away
topaz latch
you should write side quest dialogue for the Dragonscale Exp gnome
mighty valley
i do enough games writing in my actual job
topaz latch
oh, that sounds better than my bad number anal eyesing
so do we really take mostly phys damage?
its seems like the dragon isles is just permeating in magic damage
everything is magic damage
i take magic damage just from walking around. when i was exploring tank specs, one of the first things i looked for was magic dam mitigation
restive crown
shield wall nt enuf to face tank last pack tjs +21 for 8s?
wanted to face tank a bit with sw and spell block bt i died before sw ran out
strong forum
should be
but i guess you got synced up by all claws at the same time
or your healer didnt heal you back up
warm plinth
o/
strong forum
so do we really take mostly phys damage?
yes
mighty valley
so do we really take mostly phys damage?
In M+, the biggest total source is physical, it's just the big chunky hits are magic. or bleeds, to really fuck with you
strong forum
all the actually dangerous magic dmg you use CDs for
the trickle dmg and random boss aoe dmg doesnt matter
warm plinth
@ionic fern hi ily
topaz latch
In M+, the biggest total source is physical, it's just the big chunky hits are m...
ah rite. yeah looks like im off to redo my gear. but not begrudgingly, this is good info and you all have helped me a great ton.
ionic fern
<@238357283996696576> hi ily
strong forum
thats another point for crit gang
https://i.imgur.com/B3wxVhu.png in this +26, 54% of dmg is physical dmg
mighty valley
again, since the difference is minimal, i wouldn't worry about switching around gems and enchants til you get new gear
sacred coyote
echoing thunderstone is earth or nature?
strong forum
and most of the other dmg taken is just random aoe
topaz latch
again, since the difference is minimal, i wouldn't worry about switching around ...
its honestly not a big deal, made about 800k since i started a month ago and find this gear play very interesting
mighty valley
share your money secrets
topaz latch
gf is also a top notch JC, so again, no biggie
mighty valley
or just pay us directly for the advice
topaz latch
share your money secrets
parked an army of alts at soup and been selling fart pockets
toxic pewter
Twitchers are all pink class all of a sudden lol 🤣
cinder storm
parked an army of alts at soup and been selling fart pockets
That sounds like something I should start doing
cinder storm
Twitchers are all pink class all of a sudden lol 🤣
Probably a good chunk of them prefer to play pwar but are now stuck playing pala for their teams
toxic pewter
cinder storm
Honestly, I've tanked up to 14s on my 370 alt, and even though utility wise they are cool, I feel them to be slightly less boring than bear and more boring than dk
toxic pewter
Yah I can’t deny they are fun to me
Still wild they gave them two guaranteed raid spots and a brez on top of all other df changes
velvet current
parked an army of alts at soup and been selling fart pockets
Fart pockets? 😮
jade pulsar
alchemical flavor pocket, the 2x food time and stays after death im guessing
topaz latch
Fart pockets? 😮
Lol flavor pockets. Same thing lol
topaz latch
That sounds like something I should start doing
Easy money if you got enough lvl 60 alts.
strong forum
Twitchers are all pink class all of a sudden lol 🤣
bandwagoning is absolutely massive among tanks
like insane amounts
jagged pier
Twitchers are all pink class all of a sudden lol 🤣
good
strong forum
not even on top end, just in general
toxic pewter
It never ceases to amaze me though
topaz latch
I feel like being second best class in this game is better than first
strong forum
theres like 5 today
toxic pewter
I guess I haven’t been around as much
toxic pewter
🤣
topaz latch
Yeah it's me. But I'm not just new to pwar but also to this whole game
toxic pewter
WELCOME TO THE WORLD OF TOMORROW
vocal bison
Hey guys new to prot, I heard the must have talents are barbaric training and aegis? Stack vers right?
toxic pewter
random field
Haven’t seen a new guy in a week
New guy here, let’s talk about that ring /sarcasm
fallow nova
Messed around with stones a bit in keys. If the earth shield triggered more often, the obsidian aoe would be really great.
At one point it was like 4% of my damage, but then we also killed a boss without me seeing it trigger a single time
If the pinned combo gets nerfed, I'm almost willing to try obsidian with earth/ice shields just to see
warm plinth
Nome vs me 
fallow nova
It's easy enough to upgrade. Fragments drop all over the place, especially if you're opening vault chests
vocal bison
fallow nova
You definitely want to stack verse. Prot is one of those classes where you passively shrug off damage without needing to use your cooldowns.
The less you press Avatar, the better 😉
fallow nova
Lol
uneven mason
Hey guys new to prot, I heard the must have talents are barbaric training and ae...
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
stable raft
how much does the fire belt proc btw?
uneven mason
how much does the fire belt proc btw?
Yea
peak kiln
Anyone knows why this paladin have 443 ring? can we upgrade it more then two times per primordial socket? https://raider.io/characters/eu/drakthul/Yonteau#season=season-df-1
ionic fern
Visual bug.
stable raft
Anyone knows why this paladin have 443 ring? can we upgrade it more then two tim...
its a bug i think
peak kiln
hmmkey, coz i do have 424 and it shows 424 seems buggy af
stable raft
@strong forum sorry to tag you but wanted to pick your brain with something, would the humming arcane stone proc off the fire belt ?
strong forum
99% dont check log dps
strong forum
<@192743144276623360> sorry to tag you but wanted to pick your brain with somet...
sure
dusky canopy
What’s a log?
shut summit
🪵
strong forum
strong forum
so if we want a good dps stone, that would be a decent choice then no?
the combo named in pins is currently the best one
strong forum
for 2-4 targets you replace humming with storm infused
strong forum
i have it 
hard vine
slow harbor
scroll up, convo just happened. tldr yes
mighty valley
we just have to make people look at the pins like this before they get posting privileges
tropic gorge
Looog! Looog!
It's big, it's heavy it's wood
Looog! Looog! It's better than bad
It's good!
nocturne spindle
Only if you put full absorb stones in it
nocturne spindle
what if i wanna use it ilvl epeen reasons
old sinew
Nom said it himself “use it if you’re bad” essentially
99.9% of players meet his definition of bad I guess
dusky canopy
Yeah basically you have to be doing above 99 percentile damage to out perform the ring
nocturne spindle
i mean pretty sure it was actually said "use it unless your really good" if your not memeing
dusky canopy
Oh yeah for sure we all will use it
Unless you’re like the 40 dudes who can out perform it
tropic gorge
So basically everyone will use it except a handful of people who probably aren't playing until the next season starts
ionic fern
Ah.
ionic fern
hybrid gust
i know stones or not a dps increase but are they better for utility/survability?
dapper vapor
Can you not upgrade these damn magic rocks after socketing them
agile elbow
you remove them afaik and upgrade
wanton orchid
so what stones should we be using for prot?
fresh igloo
check the pins
dapper vapor
you remove them afaik and upgrade
amazing thank you
coarse agate
trying to decide if its worth going for the ring, curious to hear thoughts on the power level of the ring in harder keys 25-27 range where mobs do dmg and you can't sit battle stance the whole key would it gain value or lose value, seeing the pin mention it being worth if not doing 70k overall but that seems super arbitrary since its key and level dependant 70k in court is very different than 70k in algethar
wanton orchid
So far im seeing Humming + Prophetic + Desirous Stone as the best stones?
limpid anchor
limpid anchor
trying to decide if its worth going for the ring, curious to hear thoughts on th...
Do you mean taking def options as well or just bcs you lose dmg due def stance
But prob not either way bcs you lose a lot of haste
And haste is nice :>
vale ravine
so is everyone using the 3 stones that are bugged ?
agile tiger
Its in my opinion bad if they make a piece and people are breaking there head if they should use. Give the ring stats. And voila…. Problem solved
limpid anchor
so is everyone using the 3 stones that are bugged ?
Yes
limpid anchor
Its in my opinion bad if they make a piece and people are breaking there head if...
What
coarse agate
I mean like damage #wise what is the difference in damage would love to see the sim profiles, Im assuming sitting dstance doesn't effect the gem procs so value goes up the more you have to dstance? but you lose defensive power in secondaries
limpid anchor
Yes
dusky canopy
Sims are in pins also
warm plinth
Though not likely updated for the bug I wouldn't think.
But tl;dr: unless the bug is fixed, you'll use it
and once fixed, you still use it for raid
coarse agate
ty didn't see updated sims mb
dusky canopy
They should just throw stats or at least one stat on the ring then this debate would be over
limpid anchor
That’s not true
dusky canopy
Yes it is true
limpid anchor
Now we have different shot for m+ and raid
dusky canopy
No you don’t
limpid anchor
Yea
dusky canopy
If you want bis you use melandrus and egg nog
limpid anchor
Bcs I won’t use the ring in m+
dusky canopy
Otherwise you’re not bis
limpid anchor
And in raid the onyx
limpid anchor
And in sbg I would use onyx as well
dusky canopy
Hard locked items are not as bad as people make them
You’re also locked into what’s bis anyway
So who cares
serene yew
hey guys do we ever use thunderclap on ST?
agile tiger
What
The design is bad. Lit 90% of the player base does not know if it’s good or not. It does not even feel strong. If they want to make a play around this ring. Just give it stats. I remember that they removed reforging because it’s not normal a person need to calculate it out, and needed robot to do it). What they did now is almost the same.. you just can’t tell if it’s worth it
dusky canopy
hey guys do we ever use thunderclap on ST?
Yes absolutely
You press in order as much as possible
Shield slam>Thunderclap> revenge
warm plinth
hey guys do we ever use thunderclap on ST?
The only abilities that change between ST and AoE are that we use Execute in Execute range over Revenge on single target (technically up to 2 targets).
hybrid gust
Bcs I won’t use the ring in m+
why not?
strong forum
Desirous + prophetic can proc any other gem
serene yew
thunderclap on ST is for rage generation?
hybrid gust
oh ok
warm plinth
thunderclap on ST is for rage generation?
Damage, rage generation, and it can reset shield slam.
limpid anchor
The design is bad. Lit 90% of the player base does not know if it’s good or not....
That goes for any item
And any skill
coarse flower
The only abilities that change between ST and AoE are that we use Execute in Exe...
would you ever bother pressing revenge to buff the execute dmg or is it not worth offensively?
strong forum
Desirous procs both from the healing and the dmg proc of prophetic, therefor prophetic can proc any other gem
strong forum
would you ever bother pressing revenge to buff the execute dmg or is it not wort...
Not worth
coarse flower
ok tyty
strong forum
Ignoring tierset is more dps during execute
warm plinth
If I get this day shift position we just answer questions on shifts. I take NA shift you take EU shift
strong forum
Perfect
limpid anchor
If I get this day shift position we just answer questions on shifts. I take NA ...
But what do you know if you don’t even use barbaric
warm plinth
More accurately it would be like "Stop Using Barbaric Training In M+ and Most Raid Bosses"
AFAIK it's not even a very big damage increase in most cases anyway so unless you're seeking out top parses, you probably don't need to.
strong forum
Kill time matters more on council
strong forum
I only missed r1/r2 Council cuz my kill is fucking 2min slower
At 2min on that boss in at like 130k dps, which is R1 rn
Ideal killtime is technically 3:10
But 2:30 is just shorter fight, so the Lust and potion uptime carries more
With pugs you just can't compete with mythic speed reclears
Just can't
Eragon R1 is 1:40 killtime and 3 grieftorch uses
granite pond
Has anyone mathed out ideal grieftorch death resets + combat rezzes? 🙂
dusky canopy
My 106k council could be 120k if we’d kill it alot faster
It dies in the middle of my cds recharging
warm plinth
@strong forum 😱
slim dove
low kindle
They are listening
warm plinth
45% is not bad, but it's not 100k either. It's a bit more than a revenge I think?
warm plinth
The increase on last stand CDR is pretty good though. .5 sec was just way too low
Now we should have like 1:25-1:30 CD on Last Stand I think
low kindle
cdr is still doubled during LS right?
dusky canopy
Noms going to riot when he sees it at 45% ap
median tulip
45% is not bad, but it's not 100k either. It's a bit more than a revenge I thin...
Revenge is 42.75% Physical. Is this "Wave of Force" affected by armour, or not?
chrome falcon
45% is pretty good value
low kindle
45% is actually better than I thought, SS is only 80%
lavish oracle
Not sure if 45% attack power is good?
better than a thunderclap
warm plinth
Revenge is 42.75% Physical. Is this "Wave of Force" affected by armour, or not?
If it's physical, it will be. If it's not, it won't. Idk the damage type of it
median tulip
45% is pretty good value
For something that's basically free damage, yeah. I mean, let's face it, We already use Shield Slam on Cooldown/Reset anyway; this is not going to affect our rotation in the slightest
lavish oracle
so the wave of force buff is only for the 10s after LS fades, right? it's not active during last stand?
median tulip
Ofc the point of Revenge and TClap is to fish for Shield Slam resets, so it's not really the same anyway
lavish oracle
I guess we can't test it but that's my reading
chrome falcon
that is correct yes
lavish oracle
a little clunky
chrome falcon
yep
lavish oracle
wish it was just active during last stand
lavish oracle
That'd be fine with me
median tulip
They should stop being cowards and just change the 2pc to "Last Stand is now affected by Anger Management"
lavish oracle
how much CDR do we get after the buff? just eyeballing it, 30-40s ish?
chrome falcon
it's gonna be so funny having a button that just activates and immediately cancels LS
to get the buff straight away during burst phases
median tulip
how much CDR do we get after the buff? just eyeballing it, 30-40s ish?
Ish. Lucky Resets and Haste both affect the CDR
mighty valley
this actually might slightly affect rotation in that huge pulls currently encourage you to drop shield slam entirely
it's niche but it's real
warm plinth
Why would you want to immediately cancel LS 🤔
median tulip
Why would you want to immediately cancel LS 🤔
Because the AoE component kicks in when Last Stand ends
warm plinth
Yeah but you're losing out on 15 seconds of a 30% SS increase
median tulip
True
lavish oracle
the shockwave is better than 15% extra damage, no?
strong forum
45% AP is less than a thunderclap
Not sure I like this
2pc bonus was expected and necessary
warm plinth
Plus it's only like...3 shield slams during the 10 second window
Not exactly insane
and that's best case scenario
strong forum
Yeah 3-4 shockwave every 1.X minutes
median tulip
assume 1 SS per 3 GCDs
lavish oracle
TC is 41% AP, no?
warm plinth
There's no chance you would ever cancel LS though
strong forum
Yeah but we have +10% from blood and thunder
lavish oracle
true
lavish oracle
As bonus damage, it's not bad
median tulip
I don't really think any of it is especially compelling in terms of rotational impact
warm plinth
Yeah it's not going to mean anything except hey we press LS now
lavish oracle
it's just annoying that it happens so long after you press the button
median tulip
It's very much "Hey, you know that thing you do 100% as a priority? How about you push that button harder"
honest hazel
TC also does less dmg beyond 5 targets if this doesn't that's at least something 😂
strong forum
warm plinth
Yeah I would much prefer the shockwaves happened during LS rather than after. The after part is kinda awkward
median tulip
TBH I'll probably just macro Last Stand into my Avatar button and have done with it
dapper vapor
Anyone got a Details string to combine the ring effects damage like someone put together for All-Totem?
sick sentinel
id rather the buff be 20 seconds
since its a longer cooldown, dunno how many end of ls dmg windows ud really get
warm plinth
What do you mean
strong forum
Anyone got a Details string to combine the ring effects damage like someone put ...
Details.OverridedSpellIds[403225] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[404974] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[405220] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[405221] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[405209] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[403391] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[404911] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[404941] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[403087] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[403273] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[403171] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[405235] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[403381] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[405118] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[403408] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[403336] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[403392] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[403376] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[403253] = 404884
Details.OverridedSpellIds[403257] = 404884
Amazing, thank you parrygodx
warm plinth
That would just mean you'd have to make sure to use it even earlier so you don't run out of buff before shit dies
It doesn't help anything
warm plinth
I mean that would definitely be better
atomic nest
Let me start by saying I’m bad and mained guardian Druid having access to tons of aoe for threat on pulls:: I feel like I scuff so many pulls in the opener how do you guys normally gather multiple groups .. so I wait for them to all be close to do thunderclap or is there some secret I end up thunderclapin too early I think
warm plinth
Even if it was only 10 seconds of LS
It would still be better for it to happen during LS
sick sentinel
i think at end of LS and short buff is the weird parts to me
dire cedar
What kind of sims do y'all do to say that annulet isn't an upgrade in m+ over regular stat rings?
median tulip
The uptime is pretty bad, but the delay is awful. Make it the same duration as Last Stand and apply during its uptime, and then further increase the CDR and we'll be talking
warm plinth
Let me start by saying I’m bad and mained guardian Druid having access to tons o...
throw my weapon at a couple as I'm getting closer, charge in, thunder clap, demo shout, shield charge, ezpz lemon squeezy
Can also throw down a ravager as you're going in
Can taunt/leap/taunt if things get really hairy but we don't really have trouble with snap threat
atomic nest
Like my example would be the two pack pull before vex one on each side
mighty valley
i'd always rather have "encourage normal rotation" than "annoying rotation change" - obviously there's a perfect "cool rotation change" but those are rare
atomic nest
Like I throw to the right and charge left and then someone pulls right off me hahah
median tulip
But as it stands it's both unimpressive (both in offensive and defensive terms, esp the latter) and it's very very boring because most of the set effects are completely ignorable from a rotation perspective
low kindle
They either need to buff the 4p number or bake it into LS duration so we have a longer window of getting the proc
warm plinth
Yeah so, that can either be really clean or really not clean depending on how antsy your group is. Generally as long as no one touches casters, they will just run to you (or most of the way to you) before they start to cast.
So it makes it a bit easier to group
mighty valley
if the sfx/vfx satisfaction from the SS shockwave is good, this'll be plenty good enough for a season 2 tier set
warm plinth
Usually I'll just throw out a shockwave on one of the packs, try to kick something in the other pack and go from there
dire cedar
Newbie prot war, especially when it comes to simming, but how does one sim Prot war for M+?
strong forum
Need to sim several scenarios
1t 3min Lust
5t 1-1.5min no lust
10t 1min lust and no lust
Then draw a parralel and weigh your options
And to get a broader average, need to sim a random number of targets above 5 for 5 minutes, to see consistent dps
Because Sims assume that all CDs are ready on pull, when that's not always the case in m+
warm plinth
yeah I usually do my 5-10 targets at 3 mins
mighty valley
run 6 sims and then ignore the results and take the thing your gut told you to take in the first place
unless your gut is terrible
warm plinth
Can we start telling people to run a stat weight sim just one time when they're just starting out as prot so they can see the damage that you get from weapon DPS 
Because I don't think people understand.
dire cedar
Well honestly Im not entirely new to prot
Did some 22ish keys so I know some basics :p
warm plinth
Sorry I wasn't referring to you actually Amoone; you just made me think of that
dire cedar
Ah yeah no worries
warm plinth
Because people come in here all the time thinking theys hould make lariat first
instead of weapon/shield
dire cedar
But I was considering the ring especially since this broken combo is a thing now
strong forum
Very simple for that one actually
Only use it in raid
In m+ it's only usable if you're average or bad at pwar
dire cedar
I got 415 melandrus no socket, and 421 nokhud with socket
warm plinth
Pretty sure I'm just gonna use my alts to feed my main keys lol
strong forum
You can only do so many vaults
warm plinth
since it's good on outlaw regardless
dire cedar
Only use it in raid
In m+ it's only usable if you're average or bad at pwar
Hmm interesting
warm plinth
I thought you were just limited on doors
strong forum
Ye
warm plinth
like 29 or something?
sick sentinel
28 doors
strong forum
Ye smth like that
warm plinth
28, that too
strong forum
I have only 4 doors left
warm plinth
I've barely touched it so I have only used like...10 or 13 keys? Idr
dire cedar
Pretty sure I got 29 on my war but 28 on my main
warm plinth
Do you get every gem if you open all the available doors?
dire cedar
Do you get every gem if you open all the available doors?
Not necessarily
warm plinth
Gotcha
strong forum
Entirely rng
I think some gems you can only obtain from the vendor
And not get from doors
dire cedar
The pin explains what's up with ring
I'll still try out some sims and actual live testing tomorrow, but I guess I'll be taking it with a grain of salt anyway then, thx for the explanation
strong forum
It is 1 target
quiet monolith
Humming rune or whatever pumps
strong forum
He overwrote the raidbots option with a manual line
quiet monolith
It was like 5 percent of my DPS in a 21 nok
strong forum
Yeah that's only 4% worse than a ring with stats
pallid quiver
I assume he was simming 4 target stuff before and just sidn't change that option
warm plinth
Yeah that's only 4% worse than a ring with stats
dire cedar
That's the thing with stuff that deals flat dmg vs stats
Stats are hard to see number wise
strong forum
Yes the procs look good on details, but you gotta keep in mind you lose a full 9% worth of stats
To get that funny looking details number
Or well, closer to 8% I guess
dire cedar
slim dove
does 85k on all our sennarth wipes
strong forum
That's 20k more than tank dmg
strong forum
Ah my bad, 55k
But yeah, the ring does 6-8k dps in raid
If that's 25% of your dmg
slim dove
🤷
warm plinth
Yeah looks like Jakey is the only pwar who has done 55k on Sennarth :p
slim dove
ill get him to do a 5min st test
boss falling over in 1.5 mins might have something to do with it
warm plinth
The range on that fight is nuts though
1st place is 55k, 100th place is 30k
Private logs?
dire cedar
Yikes
strong forum
boss falling over in 1.5 mins might have something to do with it
Yes
Very much so
That's makes it actually believable with lucky procs
warm plinth
I have a 0 parse on mythic ra-den back in BFA 🙂 I think I did like, 13.9 dps
dire cedar
First prog kill I got mythic raden weapon + bonus rolled the weapon with socket
strong forum
Funny thing is
Warlocks can't ever beat those parses anymore
Cuz their overperforming talents are now worthless
warm plinth
tbf I had bought a boost so that was literally two nakey throw glaives from my DH
Surely those logs will be invalidated anyway?
Doesn't he normally yeet the logs that were gotten by bugs?
warm plinth
Yeah it got fixed earlier today
strong forum
Don't think they will be invalidated
pallid quiver
Damn, didn't have a chance to play broke lock
strong forum
Yeah it's broken af
warm plinth
Kinda fucked if they don't get invalidated tbh
What's the point of even trying if those stand
strong forum
They have a permanent shield which is 50% size of their max hp
No joke
Ret pally is literally immortal in keys now
median tulip
Ret pally is literally immortal in keys now
You haven't partied with my guilds Ret main
strong forum
strong forum
Yeah, basically, they are infinitely tankier and they gained like 20k dps
warm plinth
Blizz was basically like, you guys die (supposedly) more than any other spec, so enjoy being immortal
strong forum
slim dove
its like arms but insane
strong forum
And with that ret rework, holy pally and prot pally are also buffed
By a good chunk
slim dove
yup
strong forum
Hpal + prot pal might legit be best m+ comp
nocturne spindle
dang pwar sucks now? damn
strong forum
If youre not first you're last
nocturne spindle
its a joke my man
dire cedar
I kinda wanted to level my pala before they even announced all the things they were gonna do, but then literally everyone I know starting playing prot pala or leveling ret pala for 10.0.7 so I couldn't be arsed anymore
slim dove
yeah just the already S tank got buffed more
strong forum
uncut juniper
so what gem to upgrade first or better to hold fragments till they fix stuff?
strong forum
I'd hold
warm plinth
strong forum
Unless you want to farm another 60 fragments
uncut juniper
but the cheese wombo combo won't survive anyway i assume
nocturne spindle
its also like
not hard to get enough stuff
so if you have the time
you can just refarm it in like an hour
strong forum
60 fragments with a completed vault?
dire cedar
Can you though?
strong forum
In an hour?
If your vault is done, how the fuck do you get stones to scrap
Besides your rares
slim dove
im holding
nocturne spindle
if you have the whole vault completed you can probably redo it already?
slim dove
raid isn't till friday anyways
fast knot
You cannot redo vault
strong forum
You can redo vault?
nocturne spindle
it took me like 1 1/2 vault floors to get the whole
no i mean like
unless you spent all your gems
untold zinc
vault should reset weekly
nocturne spindle
getting the one meme combo
fast knot
You get more fragments from the rare spawns and the hourly chest as well?
strong forum
I have only 4 doors left
fast knot
I think that's the only real source
strong forum
And 0 fragments
dire cedar
After I finished my vault on my main, I got 20 extra unused keys, but 0 extra gems/fragments
nocturne spindle
oh
maybe i just got lucky ididnt even open the 3rd floor and I have the full meme ring setup
strong forum
I got giga ducked by vault
I had the 3 gems I wanted in 1hr
Then I had to spend 3 or 4 more hours to get 60 fragments
dire cedar
What how
nocturne spindle
okay well if you arent nome you can get a few maxed setups in one vault
uncut juniper
what gems are you running now?
strong forum
The broken one
Only in raid
In m+ I use normal ring
Cuz the broken combo isn't broken enough for m+
To beat 1300 stats
dire cedar
I upgraded the 3 "bis" according to Wowhead list before I knew about broken combo 
vale ravine
I did the 6 key quest on my monk warlock and rogue and sent my warrior all the keys and got all the stuff I needed to get 424
strong forum
I upgraded the 3 "bis" according to Wowhead list before I knew about broken comb...
If they fix the combo, you will have the best option
dire cedar
Well
nocturne spindle
hey now
dire cedar
But the treasures are everywhere
nocturne spindle
thats 165 rep with the bonus
dire cedar
Did you get the 60min buff to find treasures?
vivid sonnet
all totem master anygood on forti weeks?
strong forum
It's bis in m+ period.
dire cedar
Honestly though, the 60min treasure buff that you can buy for 2k Elemental overflow
nocturne spindle
are nokhud trinket+ whetstone the best M+ trinkets, assuming i will not get any trinkets from raid for now?
glass spear
If your vault is done, how the fuck do you get stones to scrap
there's like 4 floors in the vault, I legit got more than 130 fragments total by scrapping shitty gems
dire cedar
I flew around for like 30 min and I got 20 keys
strong forum
there's like 4 floors in the vault, I legit got more than 130 fragments total by...
Yeah I scrapped like 30 gems
vivid sonnet
dont like granyths
strong forum
are nokhud trinket+ whetstone the best M+ trinkets, assuming i will not get any ...
No
vivid sonnet
since its a random deffensive buff
strong forum
The only good trinket from m+ is whetstone
Granyth is garbage, trample hoof is alright, blazing hoof is alright
nocturne spindle
okay whats the least awful trinket since i wont get any mythic raid trinekts lol
glass spear
I even have 2 rings that are 424 just cause I can't be bothered to switch gems for ST and AoE (playing pally tho, gems are good on pally even in AoE)
strong forum
Heroic raid trinkets beat all m+ trinkets besides whetstone
strong forum
Deco of flame is uh...
glass spear
I thought this ring would take a couple of weeks to max out but it's super fast
strong forum
A starter trinket is appropriate answer yes
distant crystal
does 415 stone beat 411 torch?
strong forum
No
distant crystal
or you need gv?
jade trench
Hoof is nice, it either pumps or under performs. Make me feel like a big boy sometimes. No skill required.
nocturne spindle
so blazing hoof if i wont get any heroic or mythic raid trinkets?
strong forum
Ye
strong forum
I even have 2 rings that are 424 just cause I can't be bothered to switch gems f...
Lucky you
dire cedar
I could've probably had that
If I didn't have to spend like 100 fragments on gem gambling
glass spear
yeah, I got pretty lucky with gem drops, only had to buy 1 box for the prophetic gem
strong forum
I had to re-gamble all the other dmg proc stones after I found out that the "bis" combo might be cuz of a bug
That cost me a leg and a half
glass spear
oh I can see that
dire cedar
I actually got pretty much all gems I could need at some point if they buff/nerf stuff on my warrior without a single gamble, it's ridiculous
glass spear
I had to re-gamble all the other dmg proc stones after I found out that the "bis...
I saved all the possible-BiS gems just in case lol
Ion said they intended the ring to get replaced my 10.1 mythic-ilvl rings
so this could even get some buffs, idk
strong forum
I knew the ring was garbo on aoe so I only bothered with ST
Idk why, I don't even raid
glass spear
I knew the ring was garbo on aoe so I only bothered with ST
boss dam speeding up the key
glass spear
yeah, it's something I'd only do if I was andybrew or something pushing the highest keys
but since I'm trash, we go full aoe
azure ivy
But losing 2k dps everywhere else but on bosses is also scuff
Facts. I’ve tested most of them, they are in fact, negligible in aoe.
Rough, considering, brew seems to be blasting with the stones
mighty valley
this is meant to be a catch-up item, why can't it be full deterministic?
it's also open world content to last a while
sometimes game design gotta serve multiple goals
azure ivy
What do you guys think about the auto attack gem? Bad as well?
marble cipher
Did the "broken combo" in a +20 just now, "for science", I must say the damage output isn't all that bad.
But it's obviously not as easy to compare to flat stats, and I'm fairly sure (like others here have said and simmed) it's not good for keys anyway
Though, blizz gives me new item, I gotta play new item at least once right....
fallow nova
Maybe they'll leave it in just because it's the only thing making the ring truly worthwhile
marble cipher
¯_(ツ)_/¯
dapper vapor
Yeah if they nerf the suspected bugged combo with no offsetting buffs
The ring goes right back into the trash for most
And I'm fairly sure I recall the intent is for the ring to be BiS for everyone until next season
Even the bugged combo isn't there atm
sand drum
I had to re-gamble all the other dmg proc stones after I found out that the "bis...
Nom, bloodstone only procs when you have lost some HP right
tried it on HC and it felt garbo
lone eagle
alright got my ring loaded up with the 424 juicer combo
sand drum
with arcane missile+ blood + twilight (proc thingy one)
topaz tinsel
idk it did 7% on +20 Sadana, 9% on nerzhul. Seems bonkers on solotarget
glass spear
idk it did 7% on +20 Sadana, 9% on nerzhul. Seems bonkers on solotarget
you lose a lot of stats
so it's not an extra 7% and 9%
sand drum
idk it did 7% on +20 Sadana, 9% on nerzhul. Seems bonkers on solotarget
probly cus your loosing HP :p did not do that on my HC reclear :<
lone eagle
@strong forum Currently running 421 Hunger and 415 Whestone. I have a 421 Totem of the All Master. You think its worth swapping to for more magic damage with the nutty ring?
Not sure if sims are accurate with the current interaction
limber flame
marble cipher
I'd give my left nut for Totem at 421 😦
lone eagle
I'm talking about for raid
placid vale
Protection
Aberrus, the Shadowed Crucible: 2-Set Bonus – Shield Slam now reduces the cooldown of Last Stand by 1 second (was 0.5 seconds).
Aberrus, the Shadowed Crucible: 4-Set Bonus – The wave of force generated by the 4-set bonus deals 45% of Attack Power.
lone eagle
Ring is w/e in M+
placid vale
They just posted this
lone eagle
they posted it a couple hours ago
2 set change was needed and good, 4 set is pretty disappointing
45% ap is pretty meh for 3-4 times per last stand basically
placid vale
Eh, im used to being dissapointed by Blizzard so nothing new
plain hatch
is it aoe caped?
untold zinc
which magic do i buy for the blood gem?
condensed magic, that is
necromantic, found it
noble jetty
Is this ring worth it for me to farm. Im progging mythic rasz right now
pallid quiver
"45% attack power"
Not AOE shield slams
Tier set belongs in the trash with my hopes and dreams
warm plinth
It was never gonna be aoe shield slams to be fair. That would've been silly.
plain hatch
so the wave of force generated by the 4-set is single target only?
warm plinth
No, it's aoe. But it's not an AoE shield slam which is what a lot of people were referring to it as.
placid vale
tbf...a wave is an AOE, so...they should reword it if its ST...
warm plinth
It isn't ST
placid vale
Then all is good
plain hatch
alright, thanks!
placid vale
any word on what the KSH reward is this season?
plain hatch
a bag of chips and a pat on the back probably
placid vale
Great xD I love chips tho
If the reward's nice ill prolly do it. If not...Diablo it is
plain hatch
i've seen people talking about it being a reskin of the same mount we got S1
placid vale
Thats KSM, not KSH
warm plinth
There's no mount for KSH though 🤔
plain hatch
transmog i guess
warm plinth
That seems kinda high. 20 SS in a minute is 20s, or approximately 25 seconds assuming 5 SS during LS. That would put your LS cooldown at 1:35 with bolster.
twin bramble
newb here. am i supposed to use taunt or challenging shout? i see taunt all over the guides but not challenging shout
warm plinth
So it's probably closer to like, 1:25-1:30? Which is still notbad
warm plinth
newb here. am i supposed to use taunt or challenging shout? i see taunt all ov...
You use challenging shout anywhere it would be handy. There's not really a wrong time to use it
warm plinth
I think bolster is still worth it for sure
But we'll have to wait til we see what the sims look like (and any potential further changes ofc)
lusty grotto
yeah
just napkin math crafting with my buds in disc
and just happen to see the bolster tier set thing
was literally telling them about bolster when i swapped in here and saw it
warm plinth
I think what really pushes bolster into worth it territory is that we should have no real issue running ItF once we're geared next season because we should be able to hit 40% haste a lot more reasonably
lusty grotto
yeah
twin bramble
You use challenging shout anywhere it would be handy. There's not really a wron...
so i should keybind both?
warm plinth
Yes, you should keybind both
hard dust
should I swap to a ring with secondaries?
twin bramble
Yes, you should keybind both
thanks! so challenging shout for more aoe trash situation and taunt for single target?
warm plinth
Yes
hard dust
that's... a lot of revenges
im still somewhat new to prot warrior
warm plinth
I mean, how much DPS are you doing?
Percentages don't really mean anything by themselves
hard dust
26k in the last dungeon (Court)
hard dust
no more rage overcapped
lusty grotto
cause you might be if youre spamming revenge
lusty grotto
then youre probably not using IP
hard dust
how does that help with damage? what dont i realize?
warm plinth
Overcapping rage is really really really really really really really really really really bad
really bad
hard dust
which ones AM and VO?
warm plinth
Anger Management, Violent Outburst
lusty grotto
use IP every time youre close to or are overcapped
hard dust
so stop using revenge nearly as much and spam IP more
warm plinth
The entire spec operates on a feedback loop. If you're not keeping things on CD and you're not spending your rage, you're going to see significantly shittier results.
No, not necessarily.
Just understand that revenge by itself is not going to keep you from overcapping
lusty grotto
yeah not necessarily
if you are using revenge to dump rage, then in some cases you're using a gcd when you can use an off-gcd and a SS or a TC
you should be using SS more that's for sure
if youre overcapped dump rage with IP
if youre over 30 rage and not close to overcapping, then sure as fuck go for the revenge
warm plinth
You're likely not using TC enough either. Remember TC takes priority over revenge
lusty grotto
i think its very likely that hes using revenge as a spammable
aka filler etc
and i mean you can do that, but it's also affecting your overall throughput negatively
also ghash
how long are you gonna stay with that nickname lol
i havent been around but were people really using Barbaric Training that much?
warm plinth
how long are you gonna stay with that nickname lol
I changed it the other day and immediately had like 2 people using it
lusty grotto
LOL
warm plinth
So my work isn't done
Bro
I read that really quickly at first
And I thought you were about to drop some Revelations verses in here
lusty grotto
prayge
warm plinth
I was like oh shit we about to get a sermon
mighty valley
there's too many numbers here
i'm struggling to parse
Oh you're talking about relative value
I was confused because like... bolster does just literally reduce the CD by 60 seconds
The other complicating factor is that ITF is going to be worth more as our haste climbs higher, so we might want Bolster anyway
but this is all for math to work out after tuning
rough hazel
Anyone tested if Searing Smonkey stone works with Discrupting Shout on all targets, or has an internal CD?
robust lark
Is the crafted wrist a free embellishment or no?
prisma crane
no
robust lark
ty
left beacon
is there a reason why when i try and stance dance a bit like 30% of the time i will have no stance
is my stance swap getting like interrupted or something?
prisma crane
you have to have the correct macro
left beacon
it happens sometimes when i just click it
prisma crane
yea because if youi double click it you can remove it
just use the macro in the pins
left beacon
i see maybe i'm double clicking it i guess
rough hazel
wow down?
winter pasture
im still on
knotty vortex
tepid otter
Maintanance in EU ye
old sinew
I have no idea what this screenshot is of
prisma crane
the stone dmg
rough hazel
Server down and I just want to sim stones 😦
old sinew
I've done 4 keys with the ring, a 24 AV, 24 SMBG, 24 RLP and another 24 RLP, and the ring consistently does about 7-7.2k DPS for me, and about 400 Leech worth of healing. If you can get better value out of that with another ring (421 has 1300 secondary stats), then the ring is "bad". Seems good to me tho
prisma crane
you're not accounting AT ALL for how much dmg the rest of your stuff lost
rough hazel
I was really wondering about the stones and prog chances, I like the concept but feels like a bit too much.
That Freezing Ice is popping off :O, whats the 3rd stone?
old sinew
you're not accounting AT ALL for how much dmg the rest of your stuff lost
Bruh I just said. If you can do more than 7.2k DPS with 1300 secondary then you can say the ring is bad. But I don't think 1300 secondary stat is, for the vast majority of players at their skill level, doing more DPS than 7-7.2k which is the range of performance I saw from the ring across 4. 4 is a small sample size but it didn't vary outside that range
hard vector
wtf is this 4piece tier bonus!
its like aoe shield slam with double dmg on shield slam :O!
am I missing something here?!
prisma crane
fair enough
lusty grotto
🙂
warm plinth
wtf is this 4piece tier bonus!
its like aoe shield slam with double dmg on shiel...
Something is not right with this picture lol
prisma crane
imma get omega bruhhed
rough hazel
I just wish they would have put it on demo shout instead of LS
hard vector
Something is not right with this picture lol
what is?! 😄
prisma crane
old sinew
I was really wondering about the stones and prog chances, I like the concept but...
he's using the twilight stone combo, so the 3rd gem doesn't do damage itself. It's just multiplying the proc rate on the other two gems
warm plinth
Yeah uh, you need to test longer lol. Anything can look that silly in a 30 second fight
hard vector
I'm just showing you the 4piece dmg
lusty grotto
ty for showing us
hard vector
you can check average or w/e
hard vector
but it looks really good isnt it?
lusty grotto
ty sir
warm plinth
How can we check the average if you only gave us 30 seconds
Like shield slam wouldn't be that low on your meter if you did a real test
And TR wouldn't be that high
Like that doesn't really show us anything
mighty valley
please take 5 mins out of your day to mash a ptr target dummy and copy paste the damage breakdown for us 🙂
hard vector
we totally werent aware
you knew it was aoe shield slam from the tooltip?
lusty grotto
or or or... or don't because there's still like 200 more balancing passes
hard vector
it only says wave of force
warm plinth
It's not aoe shield slam?
It's literally just a damage proc off of shield slam. That doesn't make it aoe shield slam
warm plinth
TJS is fixed
weary saddle
lol gm. i just read the 4pc has changed to 45% attack power. what a complete write-off. Even shockwave with talents is better.
lusty grotto
kinda confused how "Shield Slam unleashes a wave of force dealing damage to enemies in front of you" is not interpreted as aoe
weary saddle
is the aoe still there?
warm plinth
I'm fairly certain that it wasn't changed to anything? They just specified how much damage it actually does instead of the very vague shit that it was before.
weary saddle
at 45% attack power even if aoe, it is still less than shockwave talented.
lusty grotto
what in the everliving fuck
weary saddle
its just disappointing.
warm plinth
That's a very weird thing to compare it to since we don't run the shockwave talents
It's basically the same damage as revenge
weary saddle
yes i am just comparing to illustrate.
lusty grotto
its literally free damage lol
braindead even
"oh no its dissappointing" well shit
warm plinth
Yeah idk. It's more exciting than this season's bonuses imo
weary saddle
well just cos its free does not make it good, the buff is relative
warm plinth
Gives me a gameplay change, however minor, and I assume has a visual effect on the waves which is nifty
lusty grotto
well just cos its free does not make it good, the buff is relative
as opposed to what
crude notch
You know what you're right, it's not busted so I don't want the free damage.
lusty grotto
what is your bar here, lmao
crude notch
Take it back blizz
old sinew
5% DR after last stand falls off a ndbit of extra damage seems okay. the 4-pc is weak but I'm kind of fine with that. I hate when the 4-pc is too strong. Most of the value should be in the 2-pc IMO
warm plinth
Take it back blizz
crude notch
If it's not doing a Touch of Death worth of damage every time I press Shield Slam, I don't want it.
weary saddle
I'm not interested to argue guys. I am just expressing disappointment.
ignore me if u think i am braindead. have a good day
crude notch
We're not interested in arguing either, we're just expressing our disappointment.
warm plinth
No one is suggesting you're brain dead
lusty grotto
the free damage is whats braindead, it does not mean anything negatively, it just means you dont have to think about it at all
it just happens
old sinew
to be honest I think people who want SFO-level of tier power are braindead
warm plinth
We're not exactly thrilled with the damage of it either but prot is already not exactly bad in the aoe damage department.
We wouldn't want to end up like bears last tier right 😏
RIGHT SENTENZA?
warm plinth
They don't allow global emojis here anyway
crude notch
crude notch
old sinew
crude notch
Turns out Senteza is the braindead one can't even use discord
warm plinth
old sinew
crude notch
warm plinth
If Thyme was in here he'd be very upset
crude notch
@undone sun
warm plinth
Wow Jordan just calling me out like that
lusty grotto
snitches get stitches
warm plinth
crude notch
Do it bish
lusty grotto
and bfa too
warm plinth
lusty grotto
but mostly legion
warm plinth
Shadowlands changed everything
undone sun
hello
lusty grotto
lets not forget 🥑
warm plinth
Oh god
lusty grotto
alavisto the great
warm plinth
sir please give him the respect he deserves
ALAVISTO
Well, respect isn't the right word
but you know what I mean
warm plinth
You don't remember that dude?
crude notch
scram
mighty valley
500 and 600 are the same number
undone sun
i refuse to give the same level of respect/acknowledgement by capitalizing his name as i do MF DOOM
warm plinth
LOL
crude notch
No I remember him.
warm plinth
Thyme when will you come back to woyer
undone sun
no
crude notch
Thyme is a OSRS main
undone sun
i don't even play wow anymore