protection

[violet spruce]

do you guys run the Punish Talent? Also, Into the Fray vs. Heavy Repercussions...

[sweet summit]

punish yes
hr yes

[warm plinth]

I think I just heard Judas Priest's Turbo Lover start playing

[sweet summit]

what the heck is that

[warm plinth]

How old are you Erga, am I showing my age

[sweet summit]

22

[warm plinth]

Oh lord

It's a song from 1986

[edgy grail]

[sweet summit]

slightly before my time

[warm plinth]

yeah it's even a couple years before my time lol

[old sinew]

I thought spell block just turned your block into spell block, which means shield block should be 100% chance to block a spell right?

[sweet summit]

spell block just allows for block to block spells as well as regular attacks

[old sinew]

right so there's not RNG if you have shield block up (other than I guess if you're depending on a crit block - can you crit spell block?)

[last pebble]

how many stacks do you switch on ras?

[sweet summit]

so 100% block chance with shield block as always

[sweet summit]

you can crit block with spell block yeah

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/297358986175578113/1057005070203502662/image.png

[deep spruce]

1

[sweet summit]

look this epic crit block

[warm plinth]

I was also told that spell block somehow snuck past the 85% cap

It literally just doubles no matter what *when you crit block

[sweet summit]

seems like it yae

[lost dock]

Hello, i was wondering what Prot warrios can do in Temple/LiuFlameHeart/ to better survive Jade Serpent Kick? i was thinking to rotate cooldowns but was wondering if its blockable with SpellBLock talent? of if it can be Reflected?

[sweet summit]

wall+IV 1st
external 2nd
spell block+IV 3rd (but you can only block the initial hit. the dot/absorb still turbo fucks)
wall+pot 4th
ls+IV 5th
healer should be aware and ready for the hits

[jade tartan]

Hi, how do you guys deal with RLP first boss? She hits to hard with her cast.

[sweet summit]

sr on ever other

and IP should be up for all too

[lost dock]

Thank you lots.

[sweet summit]

spell block/rotate CDs/minmax IP/all of the above

[warm plinth]

do you have a sticky note of this yet

[sweet summit]

not yet

[fickle bear]

pls stop talking about spellblock i dont wanna take it

[sweet summit]

why not

it owns when it owns

which is like

3 dungeons

2 on fort weeks

[blissful storm]

What craft order should we go with for prot

[sweet summit]

pins

[fickle bear]

i think i have to soon, i think running 17 without it will be hard 16 was possible but higher is tough shit i guess

[lost dock]

what is IV? and what is Ls?

[sweet summit]

impending victory
last stand

[lost dock]

thank you

[sweet summit]

[craggy pilot]

anyone here use OmniCC?

[sweet summit]

pvp addon 💤

[craggy pilot]

nah thats OmniCD isnt it?

[sweet summit]

[craggy pilot]

just have OmniCC installed for some reason, and kinda forgot what it actually does 🤣

[sweet summit]

no idea what it actually does

omnicd shows cds for party and shit

[craggy pilot]

it supposedly adds CD names to CDs, like 2min and shit like that

[sweet summit]

very handy for tracking stops

[craggy pilot]

but i feel like its implemented in default game by now

no clue why i even had it in the first place

[warm plinth]

Yeah OmniCD is a very useful addon for dungeons

[sweet summit]

also goat kick tracker

[craggy pilot]

yea i mean OmniCC though

i use OmniCD no cap

[warm plinth]

OmniCC is a PvP thing tht shows enemy and friendly CC cooldowns

It's not really that useful in PvE since you can do the relevant shit with either WAs or a nameplate addon

Like I have a WA that shows any CCed mobs and how long is left on the CC

[craggy pilot]

yea but it also seems to add timer to a bunch of debuffs/spells

like on Plater im getting double overlapping numbers

i think youre thinking of OmniBar though

which is the PvP addon

[warm plinth]

I have no idea what OmniBar is. OmniCC has been recommended for PvP for years

[craggy pilot]

i think this is what you think about when you say OmniCC though?

[warm plinth]

Yeah never seen that before

[craggy pilot]

lulwut?

[warm plinth]

Maybe it's just something that forked off of OmniCC idk

[craggy pilot]

looks like omnicc is literally just something that adds CD numbers to your own spells and abilities

[warm plinth]

I'll add CD numbers to your spells and abilities

gottem

[craggy pilot]

which seem redundant currently in default UI because of this thing

[warm plinth]

yeah that's odd

Looks obsolete from checking out the curseforge page

[craggy pilot]

yea thats what im wondering

[warm plinth]

Though I guess it might be useful for classic? Idk if they have cooldown text on there or not

[craggy pilot]

only difference might be you can modify it a bit, and it changes color when the CD is getting low 🤔

like changing the CD to red, or change something like 5m to 5:00

[warm plinth]

The picture you listed above is somewhat similar to what I thought OmniCC was, so I guess I was wrong

But I've never seen it look like that on streams and shit

[craggy pilot]

dont know if old WoW ui had something like showing long CDs like 5:00 ?

and i installed it to get 5m or some shit

[warm plinth]

maybe

[craggy pilot]

hmm, ill keep it for the color coding of "soon to expire" etc

but aparently its just plater messing up, since the "show timer" is disabled, but not actually disabled for real

[hollow yacht]

So I have some questions for M+ tanking. I was told to be in battle stance. Any reason as to why?

[warm plinth]

Because you don't need defensive stance 99% of the time

It's basically treated as a defensive cooldown. You use it if you need it to survive a tankbuster or something, but other than that, the extra damage is better.

[hollow yacht]

Ok cool. Do you guys know of any WA that is better at tracking how long you have left on shield block and when Ignore pain needs to be refreshed

[warm plinth]

You don't really need to track IP that closely. It should refresh naturally if you're doing your rotation properly.

Or rather, it'll have high uptime naturally

[frosty mango]

The layman's version - healers generally aren't gonna oom. It doesn't matter if you take 15 or 500% more damage as long as you're not dying. Your health can be 12% or 90% and there is zero functional difference if the healer isn't ooming

The extra damage is however very relevant

Especially with how much AOE a tank can dish

[warm plinth]

As far as Shield Block goes, you can make one that'll serve your purpose just using a buff template in WA

[mellow quartz]

b vs d stance is all relative and depending on the key levels and pulls you do 🤷‍♂️

[fickle bear]

Well today i learned, after 3 weeks of prot: dont use dstance all the time ggwp

did my ksm completly in dstance, lol

[hollow yacht]

I don't know the proper rotation. I just leveled this guy up like 2 days ago and just kinda reading wowhead and going off the seat of my pants

[mellow quartz]

As long as you are not depleting keys due to timer issues and lack of dps by all means be in dstance.

[fickle bear]

had no issues so far honestly pulled my weight

[mellow quartz]

If you are the damage intake is probably high enough you wanna be in dstance anyway

[warm plinth]

tl;dr: You should use IP as a rage dump when Revenge is not enough to prevent overcapping.

[fickle bear]

doing 15+ atm and it feels like without dstance its alot

[mellow quartz]

You would have pulled 14% more weight in bstance but doesn’t matter much.

[warm plinth]

well it's not like being in defensive stance is gonna ruin your progress in 15s anyway

[fickle bear]

will try tomorrow i guess

[warm plinth]

But it's definitely better to use bstance if you don't need defensive

[hollow yacht]

Fair. I have noticed I tend to rage cap if I get Shield slam procs to extend my shield block. Still very very new to Prot.

[warm plinth]

You can use the macro in the pins to help with that. Replace your IP button with it

[hollow yacht]

i normally play Brew, but it feels like a wet paperbag

[warm plinth]

whoops

/cast Ignore Pain
/cast Shield Slam

put this on your IP spot and it'll make sure you dump rage before you shield slam

you still want SS bound separately though since you don't want to cast IP every time

[rain briar]

what prismatic gems should i be using as prot?

just pure 88+ haste?

[warm plinth]

No, haste/crit or haste/vers

Or crit/haste vers/haste if you want haste proc from lariat (assuming you have it)

[rain briar]

ya thats what im socketing rn

[warm plinth]

can also use the main stat/haste gem but that's irrelevant for lariat anyway

[prime robin]

is lariat fairly necessary? I want to make bracers just for the much bigger ilvl increase unless lariat really is the big big

[sweet summit]

it's the biggest of the minor gains

[hollow yacht]

That does bring up my next question, What is best to use the Spark on... I felt like I might have wasted my first spark.

[sweet summit]

pins

+ring is good too

[toxic pewter]

Ring does seem like a good idea

[sweet summit]

or just and non tier slot you need an ilvl bump but that's a last resort

[toxic pewter]

Another socket can’t hurt

[warm plinth]

It's also gonna be the best necklace you'll ever get if you make it

[sweet summit]

yep ^

[warm plinth]

shield/weapon/lariat in that order imo, unless you already have one of the first two at a high ilevel

[toxic pewter]

Yah I’m gonna do weapon haven’t had any luck for a weapon drop this entire time

[sweet summit]

same

still using 382 from a rare

very not epic

[hollow yacht]

I had the base blue crafted shield So i made the PMD, I have yet to get a weapon drop, and I have like a 376 neck

[toxic pewter]

You guys think the weapon embellishment worth it or just skip that for another embellishment

[warm plinth]

I've been trying to get the agi 1h on my rogue from the big mammoth dude in dragonbane but he keeps dropping fuckin trinkets 😡

[toxic pewter]

Fang adornment

[warm plinth]

I'd probably skip the weapon one

[old sinew]

yeah I'm starting to think I should have gotten a weapon, but I expected to loot a weapon as a drop

[warm plinth]

It's pretty meh

[old sinew]

I did shield + lariat

[toxic pewter]

Yah it doesn’t seem too strong as far as I as far as I hear

[warm plinth]

Or you can just embellish it with the alc thing? I assume that can go on any slot but I mgiht be wrong

might*

[toxic pewter]

Oh the potion thing

?

[sweet summit]

better than nothing, on par with shield spikes(?), else but worse than lariat

[warm plinth]

the food thing

it doesn't count as an embellishment

so no reason not to have it really

[toxic pewter]

Oh food last through death?

[warm plinth]

yeah

Means no having to eat mid-dungeon

[toxic pewter]

That doesn’t count as embellishment? That’s good to know

[warm plinth]

Nope, it's awesome

[toxic pewter]

Can that go on weapon

[sweet summit]

fire dmg ring is vers crit

[warm plinth]

I don't actually know that part

[toxic pewter]

Yah I’ll have to check

[sweet summit]

but no haste

[warm plinth]

Wait I need to do a haste check

Why are there 18 morgans

[old sinew]

are there any good PWar tier lists for trinkets? I feel like double on-use is dumb but I'm not sure

[warm plinth]

@compact jackal Haste check?

All-totem is sick

[old sinew]

I don't raid

[warm plinth]

the hoof trinket is good

[sweet summit]

which one is boon

[warm plinth]

I'm sadge they didn't decide to bring back dinar

[sweet summit]

ah

[old sinew]

I meant more like... I have hoof and then I can't decide if I continue to use the fenrir trinket or the horn trinket

[warm plinth]

I'd probably go hoof and whetstone then but that is double on-use

[sweet summit]

horn of valor and whetstone/hoof is solid

[warm plinth]

Hunger of the pack?

[old sinew]

ya

[warm plinth]

That's pretty good too

Solid stat stick

[sweet summit]

hunger is a decent statstick ye

[warm plinth]

and 15% movespeed between packs

fast as fuck boi

[sweet summit]

don't think it procs from m+

[old sinew]

nah it does

[sweet summit]

never noticed it

[old sinew]

🤷‍♂️

its only like 7% move tho not 15%

[warm plinth]

My 405 is 15%

[old sinew]

O

[warm plinth]

I guess I should have specified that

it was my rogue's vault last week

[old sinew]

oh you're right, mine is 14%

I dunno if the 7% was the m0 version or something I dunno, somehow 7% popped into my head

[sweet summit]

it's only ST damage

prob good in raid

[warm plinth]

Could be

idk why it isn't just a flat 15% instead of the speed stat though

[sweet summit]

is it scent of blood?

[warm plinth]

Still a shadow of its former self either way

Used to be fixed 30% movespeed

[sweet summit]

only procs off killing blows i think

[warm plinth]

yeh

this is one of my rogue's keys

[sweet summit]

that'd explain it yeah

[warm plinth]

does seem to only proc if you get the kb though

feelsbad

[sweet summit]

i'd rather listen to nome than me

i just don't see the hype for it in aoe

even the raid is filled with aoe situations

maybe i lack lore

[warm plinth]

I'll fill you with aoe situations

gottem

[sweet summit]

sounds good
it's also a sim angle

[lilac bloom]

whats the minimum ilevel required for heroic raid

i'm doing kurog heroic and i'm getting smacked hard at ilevel 384

[sweet summit]

think most of our guild stepped in at around 390?

could be wrong, memory bad

[lilac bloom]

yah then i might be too low

i just did kurog .. .. tried at 385 then realize one of my trink is pvp.. end up dropping ilevel 383.. with the right gear then end up dying

i went to the first set of 3 eggs.. as soon as he did mortal strike on me.. i went down hard

[foggy ruin]

does the 20% spell damage reduction apply to dots already on you before u spell reflect

[slim dove]

you mean broodkeeper?

[warm plinth]

yes

[lilac bloom]

its like i can't keep myself.. up same

yah

[warm plinth]

but only for the 5 sec it's active ofc

[lilac bloom]

thats probably it

i can't survive

[sweet summit]

there's no snapshotting for us warriors

[lilac bloom]

i thought warrior was good

[sweet summit]

it is

[lilac bloom]

now.. this is a turning point for mme

[warm plinth]

Warrior dying is like 95% chance a gameplay issue tbh

[lilac bloom]

ihate this

[warm plinth]

Not using CDs at the appropriate time, not keeping shield block up, etc

[lilac bloom]

also dathea.. i died too

it might be my ilevel not high enough

i've done 4 bosses atht e moment on heroic

[warm plinth]

I mean going from 384 to the 390 that Erga mentioned isn't gonna magically make you survive

[lilac bloom]

well i dont know what is

cos i try to survive it some random hit just kills me

[warm plinth]

do you have logs?

[lilac bloom]

problem is wowlogs my comp can't handle it

it just slows my comp while plyaing

[warm plinth]

are your aiding with your guild or with pugs?

[lilac bloom]

pugs

trying to get into pugs

[warm plinth]

look up your toon's name; surely someone was logging in at least some of them

[lilac bloom]

yah i doubt it it was a pug.. but in experience

i should be higher ilvel to get in right?

unless the gear i'm wearing isn't suitable

damn i realy hate how i can't wow log and ppl ask me about it but my comp can't handle this log ..

and i got nothing to show

i've been using spell reflect on the flame thing on the floor and i do use ignore pain with demo shout.. and sb.. what else can i do

[warm plinth]

What do you mean your comp can't handle logging? You don't need to live log

[lilac bloom]

my wowlogs makes my comp lag

e.g. i was doing terros fight.. and i coudn't taunt or use my buttons correcty cow wowlogs.. just makes the gameplay lag

[dark warren]

guys, any tips on TJS 3rd boss? any specific talent i should be using?

[waxen pilot]

Any ideas on second spark craft? Lariat is given as first it seems, but for second it seems a bit divided. Some say sword/shield, some say frostfire belt or Infurios Helm.

[cinder storm]

Lariat is not a first

More like third option

[waxen pilot]

According to most sims ive seen Lariat is first by far, it has between 60-80% uptime

But of course it can be individual

What would you say is first and second option @cinder storm ?

[strong forum]

Lariat has 30% uptime

Not 60-80

Lol

[cinder storm]

Shield if ilvl is low > weapon if weapon is low

And Nome didn't like his lariat craft so now I'd rather wait on a third option lol

[waxen pilot]

Really? I must be reading the sims wrong then :S

[ivory hornet]

Is there a decent M+ tanking build stickie'd anywhere?

[steady steppe]

how can i see uptime of lariat in logs?

[cinder storm]

[ivory hornet]

❤️

[steady steppe]

o i see

[steady steppe]

do u have 3 proc gems

[strong forum]

?

I have 3 gems, yes

[steady steppe]

no only certain ones can proc

the elemental ones

the one with primary stat doesnt proc

[strong forum]

Yeah so it'll just pick one of the 2 others

[cinder storm]

[strong forum]

It's not like "oh I can't proc primary, guess I don't proc anything!!"

[steady steppe]

yea ok lol

[warm plinth]

And the proc doesn't change based on how many gems or anything. As long as you have an elemental gem, it's gonna proc ~30% of the time

[steady steppe]

i was just wondering cause mine is lower

[strong forum]

Skill diff

Idk

[ionic roost]

I've seen it vary from 18% to 33%

[strong forum]

Get ready for this then

Rngod

[warm plinth]

the new infinite stars :kekw

[steady steppe]

gyat

[strong forum]

Yeah those 2-3% secondary stat are gonna pump me to R1 logs without breaking a sweat

[warm plinth]

yep, ezpz

[cinder storm]

It's free real state

[waxen pilot]

@strong forum What would you craft, or what did you craft other than the lariat?

[warm plinth]

weapon/shield is what you should make other than lariat, provided you don't already have them at high ilevel

Single most impactful items for offense and defense

[waxen pilot]

Alright, feels like im going shield then before weapon then i think

[ionic roost]

Bracers are good too

[waxen pilot]

Thoughts on embellishments ? is the Armor Spikes worth it?

[warm plinth]

It's alright

nothing special, but then none of the embellishments are

[waxen pilot]

If i put armor spikes in my craft, can i recraft the shield later to remove it? Sorry if these are really dumb questions

[cinder storm]

Yes

[strong forum]

Shield

[cinder storm]

Make sure you craft molten defender

The one that you can put stats in

[waxen pilot]

Alright will do, thanks a bunch ^^

[nimble laurel]

Will we always be limited to 2 embellishments?

[compact jackal]

51.2%

[cinder storm]

Maybe yes maybe no, too early to tell

[steady steppe]

should wait for vault before crafting incase u get shield correct?

[cinder storm]

Yes

[warm plinth]

yuge

[slow kindle]

ok Vault second boss, do i move him to small adds or just keep him in middle?

i keep in middle cose of frontal that can happen

[cinder storm]

You wait for cleave first then you move

[slow kindle]

cool

why wont DBM show any timers for dungeons?

[cinder storm]

Idk I use little big wigs

[slow kindle]

do i need to get big wings or is there something going on with settings?

ok thanks

[nimble laurel]

You need to download a separate dbm addon for the dungeons

[cinder storm]

Probably your settings, can also use the WA dungeon pack

[sacred geyser]

theres another dbm addon for df dungeons

[slow kindle]

i am using WA for dungeons, they do say when things are being cast, not when to expect them :0

thanks

[cinder storm]

He casts a frontal as soon as he sends a copy unless he goes to the other phase

[slow kindle]

Im 376 ilvl with 330 shield, done AV many times today how hard is it to land a shield :((((

[cinder storm]

You craft it

[slow kindle]

work orders?

[cinder storm]

Yup

[slow kindle]

damn

[cinder storm]

Molten defender the one you can use embellishments and put stats

[slow kindle]

i stayed away from crafting and all subsystems cose i dont have much time to play :/

thanks you

[cinder storm]

It's probably cheap now if you get a R1 and it's better than farming a dungeon

Just ask trade or guild chat

[cinder nova]

@strong forum Do you think bloodsurge or UF is more rage in keys

[unreal lily]

Can I spend all my valor tonight and then farm it again this week or can I only get 750 per week?

[cinder nova]

Valor is a season cap

It's like conq

You can only have X amount during Y part of the season until they lift the cap.

Historically.

[unreal lily]

That sucks. So you only earn about 8500 all season if it's a ten week season with the first week being 1500??

[cinder nova]

Only if they don't lift the cap.

[unreal lily]

Do they normally lift the cap? This is my first season

[cinder nova]

They usually lift the cap near the end tbh

[warm plinth]

It's going to be more than a 10 week season

Season 2 isn't going to be until sometime between spring/summer

[unreal lily]

O alright. It would be more fun if could spend it every week and earn more each week. The gear upgrades don't come super fast so would be nice to be able to gear a little quicker

[warm plinth]

If it was a 10 week season, you wouldn't even be able to create a full set of tier before the next season started.

Or if you could it'd be barely lol

[unreal lily]

O alright icy veins was saying it was 10 weeks. That's what I was going by. Not 100% sure if it's correct info

They said most seasons are 12 weeks and this has been shortened to 10

[warm plinth]

It's a 10 week affix rotation, not a 10 week season

[strong forum]

Easily blood surge lol

Like there's not even a comparison

[unreal lily]

Ahh alright that makes sense. I misread it. Thank you!!

[warm plinth]

I still love you

[unreal lily]

😘

[warm plinth]

this is the timeline, if anyone has not seen it

[unreal lily]

That definitely makes a lot more sense with the valor cap too with a weapon upgrade costing 1000 valor I was thinking that 10 weeks seems super short. One upgrade being more than 10% of the valor I was thinking

[warm plinth]

It's only 500 for our weapon. 1k is for 2h weapons

But yeah that would be kinda silly

[unreal lily]

Alright that's not so bad. At what point should I start upgrading gear? Right now I'm doing 10s and 11s should I use it on that gear or wait till I get a bit higher?

[woven trellis]

is spell block useful in NO?

[warm plinth]

really just depends on what level keys you think you'll end up doing

[cinder storm]

It depends on your goals

[warm plinth]

If 10/11 is your normal key level then you might as well start upgrading

[strong forum]

Not rly

[warm plinth]

If you generally go higher, wait til you get better pieces

[strong forum]

Notgud is like 99% physical

[cinder storm]

Notgud. Heh

[strong forum]

All the magic dmg in Notgud is avoidable with kicks or walking out of swirlies

[cinder storm]

I helped a friend farm that key, 10 runs straight... LET FLY got boring quickly

[unreal lily]

My goal is to get 20 on every dungeon. This is my first season so still learning. Thinking I'm on a decent pace to hit that. The highest I've done is a 12 so far

By the end of the season

[slim dove]

yeah wait till dps get smarter

shit gets easier by the week

[cinder storm]

You should consider posting a log, so you can see what you are doing wrong and where you can improve

[unreal lily]

Alright, I've been meaning to download the Warcraft logs companion app but haven't done I will do it tomorrow so I can post it up here

I think I play overly defensive though by overall dungeon dps is only about 21k and I'm doing smaller pulls. Just getting comfortable with tanking really. I've been having a lot of fun though so far.

[cinder nova]

spell block for high fort TJS?

[cinder storm]

Depending on your ilvl 21k is low, but it's ok if you are learning, can be a lot better, on those keys 12 and under most of the dps I've seen are like....really bad so pulling big might not be a good idea of you are learning

[unreal lily]

My ilvl is 385 right now. Think I'm spending too much rage on ignore pain and not using revenge enough. I gotta get the logs set up though for some critiques

[cinder storm]

Only use IP if you are going to cap or waste most of the time, and revenge like it's no one's business along with shield slam

We are so tank y right now that even if you misplay here and there on regular pulls without shield block, you'll have enough time to react

[unreal lily]

Alright, I use shield slam and thunderclap whenever they are available but definitely don't revenge enough. I'll start spamming it more and see if my dps increases a bit. How much do you think I should be pulling at ilvl 385?

[cinder storm]

If you use b stance, anywhere between 25k-29k roughly

It also depends on dungeons and pull size and if you are using avatar and things properly

[unreal lily]

Alright I usually just stay in defensive the whole time. Definitely playing conservatively. I still hit the timer to upgrade two key levels don't normally get three though

[nimble laurel]

Use defensive stance like a defense cool down

Otherwise be in battle stance

[sick sentinel]

highly contextual, changes based on dungeon key level group ilvl cd ready state and more

[cinder storm]

Or stay in b stance until you learn firsthand what hurts and what doesn't

[unreal lily]

Alright thank you guys for the tips. I'm going to set up Warcraft logs tomorrow and get the companion app so I can post here. I appreciate all the help!

[fading tide]

I can plus 2 academy but I can’t tile vaults. Fun week

[nimble laurel]

What's going on in your vault runs?

[fading tide]

Dps aggro the welps causing deaths and time lost. Then someone just ends up leaving

[cinder storm]

Take the first three lashers to the other three with the tree, pull the other for to the room where the tree was, jump to boss arena avoiding whelp

[old sinew]

this

[cinder storm]

It sucks but we often have to think for them and pull in certain spots to bait dps

[old sinew]

well its also just pragmatic - you can use LOS check to get them all stacked so you can use mass interrupts on their casts

[stark fox]

any tips for 2nd boss or 3rd boss TJS?

[cinder storm]

Swap at 6 stacks, stand on sides so you don't aoe other boss, drop superiority to gain inferiority

3rd boss, SR fire cast, healer can dispel every other, lust green phase, rotate CDs and healer should break the shield on you

[cinder nova]

You should be able to SR every fire cast.

[cinder storm]

Yeah, if you SR before the boss does the cast you should, if you are like me you'd press it right before the cast

[leaden river]

sophic vs wafting devotion enchant for m+

[sick sentinel]

wafting devotion sounds okay but im not sure

[cinder nova]

Pretty sure if you're going devotions, go frost.

It's cleave.

[hollow violet]

Frozen Devotion for AoE DPS. Sophic Devotion for a general all around choice.

[fading tide]

About to tank nukhold for the first time. Am I in for a nightmare?

[amber moth]

No, I enjoy tanking it

[hollow violet]

Yeah I like it as well tbh

[amber moth]

Just, for the first boss, watch out for the pats. Also, if you're doing it for M+, on the third boss, once you clear the area out, start the boss summoning and then get another pack while you wait

How realistic/reasonable is it to use subcreation's top gear/key rankings for my gear goal?

[nimble laurel]

Kill all the mobs in the first area of NO

[fading tide]

Yea I’m gonna be doing a plus 11

[nimble laurel]

Gear goal = BiS? I wouldn't use it right now. Plenty of top players don't have all the best gear.

[stark fox]

so I'm still struggling with the 3rd boss in TJS. I'm just getting trucked during the jade phase. Not sure if it's a gear issue or bad cd usages.

[amber moth]

Then still recommend Wowhead's complete list and Icy-veins 'this list of stuff is good'?

[amber moth]

3rd boss is the pandalady? Are you being hit by the lines and her AOE?

[stark fox]

just dying to the dot from the jade strike

[nimble laurel]

You can also sim. It really depends on what you have access to. For example, if you aren't going to be downing the last 3 bosses in mythic raid any time soon, it's better to find alternative pieces elsewhere.

[warped holly]

Is there a way to sim the different embellishments?

rn I'm running lariat only, want to figure out which is best between belt/head/weapon

[stark fox]

does spell block work on any jade strike?

[warped holly]

you wish lol

but ye looking at the highest io tanks on rio, I'm seeing an even mix of belt and weapon, no heads but that may be because it overlaps with the highest ilvl tier slot

[toxic geyser]

is there a weird bug with decoration of flame atm? Feels like theres a 15-30 sec period after it comes off CD where I can't hit it

[warped holly]

I'm using it rn, haven't experienced that

[warped holly]

in case anyone else sees this, check pins. should have before I asked.

[zinc spruce]

hey whats good general use talents

for leveling n stuff

and dungeon que

[orchid mural]

eternal = ?

[warm plinth]

external

[warm plinth]

You can use the M+ build in the pins

will work just fine for general use

[rugged mural]

Anyone have a reference for where Spell Block is good?

[warm plinth]

Uh, TJS, Halls, and I forget the other one

[toxic pewter]

Rlp

[warm plinth]

That's the one

Halls should only be needed on fairly high tyrannical though

like 15+

[toxic pewter]

Apparently next reset we get that quest if we do four mythic dungeons we get a heroic raid loot piece

[rugged mural]

Any raid bosses?

[warm plinth]

Heroic grieftorch prayge

[warm plinth]

I haven't heard of any raid bosses where it's necessary but I have not done the raid.

[toxic pewter]

Yah I’m prob gonna do that quest before opening vault

[slim dove]

oh joy do 4 keys before i get to do my favorite part of the week

[toxic pewter]

Lol yeah

[warm plinth]

or can just do like 4x AA on M0 lol

[slim dove]

but im gonna do keys anyways so..

slam 4 cos 11s

still dont get whetstone

[warm plinth]

Just get it first try 4Head

I'm still hunting the ring though

[toxic pewter]

Is that ring actually pretty good or what

Seems good

[slim dove]

oh i got that 2nd run

[warm plinth]

It's our BiS ring only because it doesn't lose budget for the effect

and it has great stats

[toxic pewter]

Right interesting yeah I need that one

[slim dove]

also got thunderous downpour first key of the season

[warm plinth]

The effect itself is pretty minor for us

[slim dove]

[warm plinth]

But free dam is free dam

[toxic pewter]

Ya

[limpid pawn]

it's funny when I explain to dps that they need to actually use personals to survive higher keys

like they have never participated in keys that 1 shot mechanically and it shows

[warm plinth]

Clearly didn't play legion M+

😂

[slim dove]

clearly didnt do DHT +20 on tyrannical

[warm plinth]

lol

So many 1-shots in that dungeon

Even trash had 1-shots on fort (the bears)

[slim dove]

was simple

vdh tank, rdruid, rogue rogue rogue

[warm plinth]

😂

Yeah rdruid was important to clear roots on tree boss

[slim dove]

night elf also stopped the channel on xavius

🙂

[limpid pawn]

yes but i mean...

like unavoidable aoe mechanics specifically from tyrannical bosses

[warm plinth]

Honestly those are trash mechanics anyway

[limpid pawn]

hit a fucking defensive each time, and ration your defensives for each one

like how hard is that

[warm plinth]

Unavoidable mechanics that do that much damage are stupid and unfun

[cinder storm]

Didn't ply legion but everyone says dk was the go to tank

[zinc spruce]

it was

[warm plinth]

It was, yeah

[slim dove]

yeah it was past s1

[zinc spruce]

legion blood was insane

[limpid pawn]

yes, but it's funny to see dps just focus on dps without any kind of utilization of defensives

[warm plinth]

yeah for sure

[slim dove]

s1 vdh was goated imo

[limpid pawn]

like it is so obvious they have never tanked, and also never done higher keys properly

[cinder storm]

What made dk broken at the time?

[slim dove]

gotta ZOOM through maw keys as fast as possible

[warm plinth]

I miss watching Shakib do vdh keys 😢

[warm plinth]

completely self-sustaining, 25% group leech on 1 min CD

[limpid pawn]

the literal #1 skill that basically allows you to do higher keys is the utilization of defensives/personals

[zinc spruce]

the pulls on legion were extremely fun in m+

[limpid pawn]

like look at what happened in shadowlands prepatch when prot war had group shield wall every 40 seconds lol

we literally could carry horrible players to like +27--> +30 keys sometimes

because we are literally doing their defensive work for them

[warm plinth]

I'm assuming you meant Dragonflight pre-patch?

I'm convinced they only took that talent out because prot warrior would literally be mandatory at some level of keys

That talent was so fuckin strong

[limpid pawn]

yeah dragnoflight prepatch

it was grotesquely strong and it was because you could carry the entire group despite poor play from the group members

and/or healers

a giga tank that knew their timings could literally save deaths

[cinder storm]

Pair it with priest to reduce cds

Something my friends who played legion miss is how MDI was so diverse

[tired forge]

anyone know if i need to be in dps loot spec to have a chance to roll on whispering incarnate?

like will it think its offspec if i am prot

[warm plinth]

look it up in the dungeon guide, set loot spec to prot, see if it's there

[slim dove]

icon is on everyones loot table iirc

[warm plinth]

(set loot spec in the dungeon journal)

[tired forge]

itsther

[warm plinth]

So it'll let you need main spec if you're prot loot spec

But like Varughh said, pretty sure that's one of the everyone trinkets

[tired forge]

ya

[warm plinth]

But that'll tell you how to check in the future

[tired forge]

thanks

[pallid quiver]

game sucks, tier dropped every time and i lost every roll

[warm plinth]

fucking rip

You want a kiss to help you feel better

[slim dove]

8/8 normal twice, 6/8 heroic

won 0 rolls

[cinder storm]

Yes

[slim dove]

lost 2 grief torches

and 3 all totems

[warm plinth]

noooo

[pallid quiver]

I won every single loot drop I could use that wasn't tier

[warm plinth]

not the grief-torch and totem pepehands

[pallid quiver]

no totems or grief torches or anything

[livid helm]

is court of stars last boss maelstorm hitting pretty hard this week?

[pallid quiver]

but i did get a ring that activates on fire damage

[warm plinth]

It's bugged @livid helm so yes

[cinder storm]

Really?

[warm plinth]

Yeah

[livid helm]

@warm plinth thanks, we just double healed it on a 14

[warm plinth]

The clones hit like twice as hard as the boss even if you're not in melee range of them

[livid helm]

yeah, its like... not 7 yards lol

we stacked the images and mael still hit like a truck

[cinder storm]

That explains a lot

[glossy bobcat]

Is there a list for all Spells that can be reflected of all m+ bosses?

[warm plinth]

In the pins

There's also a weakaura

[fathom goblet]

What makes shield slam proc ?

[warm plinth]

Revenge, devastator

[fathom goblet]

So should I always maintain ignore pain and shield block up ?

[warm plinth]

Shield Block, yes. IP should just be used as a rage dump when revenge isn't enough to keep you from overcapping rage, unless you need some extra mitigation for something

[pallid quiver]

thunder clap and execute, too

[weary python]

Remember don't pick an item tomorrow from your vault until you complete the Dragonflight dungeon weekly.

[warm plinth]

You're not my dad!

❤️

[wooden widget]

The what? Why?

[slim dove]

the weekly quest will be to do 4 mythic dungeons

[wooden widget]

Oh! That’s back

[slim dove]

it will reward a box that contains 1 piece of random heroic raid loot.

[wooden widget]

Cool ty

[slim dove]

so dont open vault until you do that gamba first 🙂

[wooden widget]

Ugh that’s gonna be hard but yeah good call

[weary python]

Someone is going to open vault get an item, then do the weekly and get the same/ similar item and be very sadge

[still tendon]

is consensus on embellishment gear the same as the pinned msg still?

[warm plinth]

Yes

[weary python]

I need to get better at managing violent outburst and optimizing it.

[warm plinth]

Keep in mind that embellishments are not the most important thing for crafted gear. You'd still want to make a weapon or a shield if you have a low ilevel one even if you don't embellish it

(I only say that because embellishments can be expensive)

[still tendon]

I have a decent shield but im also the only shield receiver in my raid so, i should prob just wait

might make a lariat

[warm plinth]

we get another spark this coming reset too

[sick sentinel]

How come some top tanks are still wearing the Chain of Scorched bones neck with 3 sockets over the Elemental Lariat? i looked at 20 tanks and almost half did not have the "best neck out currently". Why is that?

[sweet urchin]

question about lariat. read a wowhead comment that says you want your 3 gems to be different elements so the procs dont get overlapped, then i read a new comment saying you can no longer have multiple elemental buffs up at the same time. so do we socket all 3 of the same gem now? i havent even crafted my neck yet so im trying to figure it out before i do

[warm plinth]

They likely prioritized a high ilevel shield/weapon over the lariat, which is the right call

[warm plinth]

You can't overlap procs anymore; that's outdated information. You can socket all the same gem (or two of the same and one main stat/haste)

[keen star]

why is shield that important? big str budget or something? mine is 402 so I wasn't thinking about crafting a 418 one at all

[warm plinth]

It's your single largest defensive impact

It's your main source of block value

[keen star]

ah defensive, I'm not sure I need that

[tired forge]

does 3rd boss of temple hit like as truck

[keen star]

raiding's all about damage

[tired forge]

or am i fucknig up lol

[sweet urchin]

ok thanks

[warm plinth]

I mean 402 shield isn't exactly low

[warm plinth]

It does indeed hit like a truck

[tired forge]

ok lol

[warm plinth]

Good dungeon to run Spell Block in

[tired forge]

ok so i was about to ask if that was spell or physical

i assume cant reflect it?

[warm plinth]

You can't. And you can only block (with spell block) the initial portion of it

[tired forge]

but 20% DR would work?

[warm plinth]

So it's still gonna hurt

Yes, 20% DR will work ofc

[tired forge]

damn i wasnt doing that lol

[warm plinth]

There's nothing that the magic mitigation doesn't work on as long as it's magic damage

[tired forge]

that would have helped

[warm plinth]

It's just straight damage reduction

[tired forge]

i guess i meant i didnt know it was magic lol

ya

[sick sentinel]

this doesnt make sense, some tanks are 2700 with 405 necks while other have 418 lariat with 2700 too?

[keen star]

1st boss of the raid already drops a 415 shield so I'll just wait for that to drop

[keen star]

it's super early into the expansion, currently the rating is more about time commitment, and Lariats are about how much gold they wanted to spend

[warm plinth]

It's almost like what necklace you have has no impact on how high you can push

[warm plinth]

I would probably do the same if I already had a 402

[sick sentinel]

https://raider.io/characters/us/blackrock/Wmx#season=season-df-1

[warm plinth]

Yeah he has shield and leggings made

So he wouldn't have a spark for lariat

until this reset coming up

[sick sentinel]

yeah i need the leggs tbh

the neck is not important for me i already have a 2 socket haste vers 405

[warm plinth]

I would not go for the leggings personally

[sick sentinel]

do i go for neck?

for the strength?

[warm plinth]

Also lariat is literally the best necklace you can get for the entire season

Necklace doesn't have strength

[sick sentinel]

the gem

for it

proc

[warm plinth]

You can't proc strength

Main stat gem doesn't have an element.

Lariat only procs elemental gems

[sick sentinel]

okay so should i try to get the legs that proc 239 haste

or shield

[still tendon]

is shield of hearth not great?

[warm plinth]

What ilevel is your shield?

[sick sentinel]

392

gash check PM

[warm plinth]

It's fine but it has some drawbacks. You can't remove the embellishment, which isn't particularly great. And you can't choose the stats on it.

You're better off going for the molten defender shield

[still tendon]

did most people

ok

[sweet urchin]

so embellishments i want are lariat and armor spikes im assuming? looking at wowhead guide

[warm plinth]

Those are fine, sure

Other than lariat, the rest of the embellishments are very close together so you can choose what you'd like. The only one I would outright avoid is the leggings

Well, and the shield of the hearth

[hexed crescent]

Guide here said that neck and bracers are your best bet long term, and thats what i did, guess thats not true anymore?

[keen star]

or I could valor a shield if I drop one 402, I still have no idea what to spend valor on since I didn't drop the ring of melandrus after 25 runs

[warm plinth]

those are fine

[warm plinth]

Yeah that's not a bad idea either tbh. 402 is probably where I'd start considering valor upgrades myself

[hexed crescent]

Is the ring of melandrus best thing to spend valor on?

[warm plinth]

It's a good thing to spend valor on but I would make sure you're starting with a higher ilevel version

As always, weapon and shield will be best to upgrade if you have dungeon ones

If you're spending valor now, you want it to be on high impact pieces. Save the low impact stuff for later on when the cap is higher or you're starting with higher ilevel stuff

[sweet urchin]

last question on the subject of crafted gear, will embellishment outweigh ilvl upgrade? since max ilvl from crafted seems to be 418, would armor spikes be better than a 421 piece from a 20 vault

[flat jackal]

For those that want to parse in raid but mostly focus on m+, would frozen devotion be the play for enchants?

[warm plinth]

No, like damage-wise probably but you would still take the ilevel on a shield.

[sweet urchin]

lets say some random slot though like feet or cloak or whatever

not wep/shield i mean

[warm plinth]

It might be better for DPS depending on the embellishment if it's that small of an ilevel upgrade

But it will be worse for survival

You can sim it if you want to be sure

[keen star]

that's what I did but I didn't do any research to confirm that it's not a bad idea

[frosty verge]

hey folks. is there a verified formula on how block value is calculated? what's the relation between "X block" on the shield and % I see in the tooltip?

[sweet urchin]

alright thanks again

[warm plinth]

Block = Block rating / (block rating + k)

[keen star]

I just checked Naowh's armory during Raszageth prog and he had Frozen devotion so I was like Perfect, an enchant for both M+ and raid

[warm plinth]

K is a value that Blizzard assigns different difficulties of content

The higher the content the bigger the k value. M+ is the same K value for all keys.

[frosty verge]

"Block" you mean % of damage that is blocked? "Block rating" is what, exactly?

[warm plinth]

Block rating is the block on your shield

the stat

I don't know if anyone has bothered figuring out the k values for this tier yet

I'm sure someone has but it hasn't been posted in here yet

[frosty verge]

Ah gotcha

Thanks

Do you happen to know if there a good article on the subject or something?

[warm plinth]

Hmm there's an old article from Shadowlands that I can dig up for you that goes over how it works

But it's not really something you have to think about. Just basically means higher ilevel shield = better

And you'll block more damage in easier content

[mellow quartz]

https://tanknotes.com/resources/armor-block

[warm plinth]

Just to clarify, the k values listed in that article are not current.

[flat jackal]

How many % of your overall does it usually do in keys

[frosty verge]

Thanks folks, appreciate the replies

[warm plinth]

https://www.wowhead.com/news/changes-to-mythic-scaling-on-the-8-3-ptr-base-season-4-scaling-k-value-dungeon-301907 this is the wowhead article about it

I guess it's from BFA, not SL

[keen star]

I can't remember but it's significant, maybe 3%? we can try to look at some public m+ logs

[ionic fern]

Of course.

[ionic fern]

In my HoV 18 it did 3%, around 1k DPS.

[flat jackal]

was it an r3?

I can't justify 100k for 1k dps @.@

[warm plinth]

100k wtf

[keen star]

afaik the enchant prices are fucked by full time wow economy andies flipping and sniping the mats

[ionic fern]

r2

[warm plinth]

@ionic fern hi ily

[ionic fern]

Goood morning

[warm plinth]

did you have a good christmas

[ionic fern]

Jeah.

Went fast.

Now back to work. 😦

[warm plinth]

[tawdry dove]

Question: is it possible to make a macro that puts me into defensive stance whenever I taunt?

but does not take me out of it if im already in it

[keen star]

it's something like adding the line /cast [stance:2]Defensive Stance

[ionic fern]

But..

Why?

[keen star]

but imo it's a bad idea because a lot of the time you don't need defensive stance

[tawdry dove]

for raid I was thinking it would be good

[keen star]

like in m+ or non-heavy hitting bosses

[tawdry dove]

oh

ive been using dstance for anytime i have aggro in raid

[oak ivy]

I taunt NO 2nd boss to get the spell reflect

[keen star]

it's just that a lot of the time we're completely chilling and taking no damage with just shield block and ignore pain, so might as well stay in Battle stance and do more damage

[tawdry dove]

yea i see what u mean, idk if im ready for that yet tho

sounds scary

[pallid quiver]

i refuse the press defense stance in raid

i'm already behind enough in gear smh, how can i get 95% parses if i cripple myself more?

[lone eagle]

so shield slam IP macro

[tawdry dove]

should i not be using it?

[lone eagle]

shield slam first or IP first

[pallid quiver]

It's like a defensive cd

[lone eagle]

I felt like it worked better when I had Shield Slam first

[pallid quiver]

You use it if you need it to reduce damage/survive something

[pallid quiver]

It's an IP macro with Shield Slam on it

[warm plinth]

IP first

[pallid quiver]

Not a shield slam macro

[warm plinth]

You sohuld be using it instead of IP

[pallid quiver]

It helps you snipe random SS resets when going to press IP is the main use

[warm plinth]

The whole point of it is to dump rage before you shield slam so you don't overcap

when you get resets

[keen star]

if SS is first doesn't it prevent the IP cast every time SS is on cooldown?

i thought macros just stop whenever they reach a gcd ability that's not ready

[ocean bloom]

the macro casts IP and tries to cast SS

[keen star]

yea I was just wondering how SS first could have worked better for Malakkar

[ocean bloom]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

you use it in place of IP not inplace of SS

[keen star]

is it that helpful? I feel like I'm pretty good at mashing IP to not overcap and rarely missing SS resets

like what if I SS when I wanted to TC on big aoe

with violent outburst

[ionic fern]

Then pay attention to your Seeing Red stacks.

[pallid quiver]

when you're at the target counts where you'd want to do that, you're generally only casting Revenge and TC, anyhow

Though sometimes it'll just get eaten by IP macro

Can all be avoided by

yeah that

[keen star]

maybe with a 4-set it wouldn't be a big deal, but it sounds so jank sometimes being unable to dump rage on IP until TC cooldown ends

I can't wait to get a 4-set and not have to cast IP on AoE ever

[silver jungle]

that IP macro

/cast ignore pain
/cast shield slam

that it ?

[ionic fern]

Yes.

[ionic fern]

You still will tho...

It's a rage dump.

[keen star]

I meant not having to refresh the duration

dumping is fine

[pallid quiver]

it's still 100% a dump in big aoe, anyhow, due to bloodsurge

you get enough rage back that the uptime is maintained simply by keeping your rage from capping

[honest portal]

Hi guys noob question here, getting wrecked by consuming stomp the first boss of av +14

Is it a dps issue that they cannot down the slimes fast enough?

[keen star]

I think the boss consumes any remaining trees no?

[ionic fern]

Correct.

[honest portal]

We got all the trees but everyone died to consuming stomp

[keen star]

so the whole group didn't break all trees using 1 tank frontal and then the sparkling circles around everyone

[honest portal]

Possible that some trres were up?that’s what we’re saying ya

[ionic fern]

On a +17 it hit me like 157k

Which is w/e.

🤷

[tulip kelp]

Anyone know when you can change loot spec in a mythic? Does it have to be ebfore you put in key?

[ionic fern]

Keep in mind that it's magical.

[honest portal]

The rest of the party are dying

[ionic fern]

Defensives.

[honest portal]

I’m always left

[keen star]

I think before the loot chest spawns

[tulip kelp]

Cool so can fix it mid dungeon, thats good to know

[keen star]

so before you finish the last boss / 100% trash

[ionic fern]

My group took around 200-250k per smash.

Healer just tops everyone before it happens.

And/or they use defensives.

That's about it.

All you can do is be sure to eliminate all the trees.

[keen star]

hey guys I'm looking at the "100% SB uptime" and "top parsing" Raid builds, the first one is self-explanatory, but should I also try to have 100% SB uptime with the second build that's running ITF without bolster? or do I save SB for when I have aggro?

[honest portal]

Noted thanks

[keen star]

I'm inspecting wcl rankings and some guys had like 60% shield block uptime which sounds wrong since it boosts SS damage by 30%

[ionic fern]

Depends on the damage intake.
Defensively speaking, you should aim to have 100% blocked hits when actively tanking.
Offensively speaking, SB increases your SS damage by 30% so you want to have it up as much as possible regardless if tanking.

[keen star]

so the ITF build isn't like guaranteed 100% SB uptime for free, and I still need to think to make sure I have it on during tanking

man there's so many different builds for pure ST like Terros

the rank 3 warrior on Terros had a 60% SB uptime

but still 95% melees blocked

[ionic fern]

Effective vs overall up-time.

[keen star]

overall

I'll probably just keep it simple with either HR or Bolster because it seems like parsing this early is just about gear and not messing up the rotation

so I can have risk-free 100% uptime

[ionic fern]

Idk, i did all 99's while being like ~10 ilvl below everyone else.

😂

[keen star]

I meant mythic terros

trying to prepare but everyone is running a different build

[ionic fern]

Jeah, but my statement about parsing still stands.

HR+ED is a solid choice.

[keen star]

I'm thinking about simming ITF + bolster vs HR + tough as nails

ED I'd never take off

[flat sorrel]

Should I pick Ilvl over stats?

[ionic fern]

This is what i ran.

[ionic fern]

Depending on the slot, more than likely yes.

[keen star]

on M terros?

[ionic fern]

We're a 2 day guild so not yet on Terros.
But generally that was what was simming highest for me.

[flat sorrel]

It was a haste mastery chest +7 ilvl over haste vers chest

[ionic fern]

Ilvl.

[flat sorrel]

Ty

[ionic fern]

For progressing run the HR+ED build. It's solid, especially when still learning the fight.

As you progress further and familiarise yourself with the damage intake/spikes you can swap talents around.

[keen star]

yea I would probably never run anything that's not 100% SB uptime because I'd need time to unlearn all the button mashing from M+ with HR

[keen star]

also 2-day, we're going to try terros for the first time tonight

while I was on bear we progged M eranogg and council both in 5 pulls with the insane bear damage and AoE healing

then week 2 we took 13 pulls to reclear primal council when I was on prot war and the co-tank kept dying without my bear passively healing him for 1.3M over the whole fight

[ionic fern]

Sounds like a l2p issue.

[keen star]

yes one pull he died to Opalfang melee 2 seconds after getting the Crush debuff and he blamed me for not taunting fast enough

[ionic fern]

Reasonable.

[keen star]

while his death was because his SB fell off 3 seconds earlier

[ionic fern]

Playing prot defensively is SOOOOOOOOOOOO easy right now tho.

....

[keen star]

yep it's pretty tilting having to backseat my cotank in every guild

[amber oasis]

Good morning lads, last night i watched nerftank's stream and i noticed he didnt use the defensive stance, he tanked 21 keys with battle stance, what is the reason of it? When you get the 4 set bonus, you can run with battle stance?

[keen star]

because for some reason it's taboo requiring the guild's tanks to parse well or not be shit at their class

[tawny kiln]

most of the content doesnt require defensive stance

[ionic fern]

The reason is that nothing hurts.

[tawny kiln]

so why not use battle stance and do more damage

[amber oasis]

hm

its true indeed

[tawny kiln]

you only need to be tanky enough to live

the rest can go into DPS

[amber oasis]

i see

[keen star]

defensive stance is still a useful button to press whenever you feel like you're taking dangerously high amounts of damage, but most of the time you're already taking no damage with just shield block and ignore pain

also for some boss mechanics it's smart to go into defensive stance like Hyrja's laser

[amber oasis]

thanks, now i can understand

[tulip kelp]

How do you get sockets on ring? Get lucky or use item to add it right?

[fast knot]

Treat it like a cooldown to mitigate damage but don't sit in there when you don't need to be

[prime robin]

Is the damage taken on details an adequate tool to measure how much tankier i am than another class? Im asking because warriors are tanky and i was taking about 2 million less dmg than the other tank on fights. But i wasnt sure if there should be a huge difference as a warrior tank over others. Hopefully that makes sense...

[amber oasis]

thats a great advice, thank you

[keen star]

not in raids, because that all depends on how much time each tank spent tanking the boss or what mechanics they did, also some tanks take more damage but then also heal themselves more. or someone might spend all resources on doing damage instead of mitigating while doing easy content and they're in no danger of dying

[ionic fern]

No.
Every tanks mitigation pattern is different.
Some take hits, but heal themselves back up after etc.

BDK's damage intake is miles higher than Warriors, doesn't mean they aren't as "tanky".

[prime robin]

Fair enough. Those are good points I wasn't considering.

[keen star]

I think better metric is when you go to warcraftlogs and check Damage taken > EHRPS (external healing received per second), or how much their healers had to heal them. but that's only if you were there and know if anything crazy happened during the fight, for example when someone had more tank debuff stacks than they should due to failed tank swaps

[amber oasis]

where can i find an advanced protection warrior's guide?

[keen star]

on wowhead

[amber oasis]

thanks

on raider.io, i see lots ot talent tree's variants

and i need more information about that

why you should pick into the fray, or bolster, or punish, when you need thunderlord or instigate

[keen star]

oh I'm having the same issue, so I'm just following the builds pinned in this channel, when you scroll down down a bit

since most of the time people here don't give a definitive answer, I assume it's just a case of "People who understand the talents change stuff around based on boss/situation"

[amber oasis]

thanks!

mainly i follow nerftank, because m+

but sometimes i dont understand his talent tree

for example, he dont use into the fray

[ionic fern]

HR/ED/Bolster are block increasing talents. HR/ED are the best of the 3.
If you take ITF you increase your damage output but decrease your SB up-time, hense you tend to take Bolster then (still not as good as HR).

Thunderlord de-syncs the BV window from your other cooldowns, this is the reason some people don't like it. On the other hand it increases the up-time on the 20% DR from Demo Shout.

Instigate vs Bloodsurge is just ST vs AoE.

[keen star]

I don't trust the streamers anymore

[ionic fern]

Top streamers are FOTM re-rollers (i don't blame them), that doesn't mean they know the class.

[keen star]

when you look closely at their rotation they're doing silly mistakes a lot of the time, and sometimes this makes them say that the class is bad and it's funny

[amber oasis]

thats a great answer mate, now i can understand it

[amber oasis]

omg

[ionic fern]

It's been shown time and time again that top r.io people are not playing the class most "effeciently", but they have great game/dungeon knowledge and also a full 5 man team who also knows the ins and outs of the dungeon/mechanics.

[keen star]

yes while not playing the class perfectly, they can perfectly rotate kicks and stuns and do some innovative pulls and other tricks

[ionic fern]

You can check how Plka/Sense play the class. 👀

Then you will see the difference.

[amber oasis]

thank you

i will check him

[ionic fern]

I think Plka streams more often but i'd say Sense is the best Prot we have.

👀

Asked Sense why he isn't r1 in r.io..he said "can't be bothered" a week later he sends me a screenshot of him being R1. 😂

[amber oasis]

[keen star]

I've been there too, doing keys to contend with R1 requires a lot of coordination and calling shots which isn't compatible with a shy person like me

idk why everyone wants the tank to be the leader :sadbear:

[amber oasis]

brutal vitality is good with 4 set piece?

[timid coyote]

imo tank should be doing strategy and pace setting for the dungeon but shouldn't be calling kicks, CD usage etc. I typically want my healer or a DPS to do that so I can not use too many brain globals on that

[amber oasis]

they can syncronize

[timid coyote]

but it depends on the people and the group dynamic

[ionic fern]

Yes.

[amber oasis]

i will try out when i get the four piece, but fueled by violence is really good tho

[keen star]

sadly it kind of makes sense since the tank has quite literally the whole fight right under his nose and has the best overview of what caster mobs are active and what mobs need chain stunning or vortexing etc

[ionic fern]

🙅‍♀️

[keen star]

every time I read the icy-veins tanking guide I get pretty motivated because it's like a super long essay about how the tank's job is to be a literal gigachad

[ionic fern]

People actually reading?

What is this

[tawny kiln]

https://giphy.com/gifs/devopsreactions-I1U9DTjCqOF3i

[keen star]

no but a lot of tanks really should. especially the parts about being able to take criticism or moving the boss predictably (I will never be able to move Primal council predictably 🙈)

[ionic fern]

I should go read it.

😦

[keen star]

https://www.icy-veins.com/wow/tanking-guide

[ionic fern]

[fathom goblet]

I feel I’m getting less shield slam proc when I use more ignore pain

Is that correct ?

[ionic fern]

Well, IP does not reset SS.

So i guess you are technically correct.

[keen star]

Revenge does reset it yep

[fathom goblet]

Humm

[keen star]

who's that

[ionic fern]

🤷

[keen star]

but you made no edits

just reviewed

still nice flex lmao

[ionic fern]

Tbh, the majority of that guides credit goes to Sinzhu.

[fathom goblet]

Since I have devastate talented all my auto attacks also has a chance to reset shield slam right ?

[ionic fern]

Devastator

Yes.

If you are using Devastate i have a lot of questions.

[fathom goblet]

Also tunder clap

Thunder

[ionic fern]

Yes..that's what the tooltip says.

[fathom goblet]

About rage management

Do you always maintain rage higher than a certain lvl ?

[ionic fern]

Ideally above 30 for SB.

[fathom goblet]

Why do I get more rage when I facing multiple mobs than soloing one mob ?

[ionic fern]

I think the best place for you to start is reading a beginners guide.

All these questions are answered there.

It's because you get rage from being hit.

[fathom goblet]

Which one ?

Can you link me a good guide ?

[onyx pike]

U think BDK is overtaking Warrior for m+ soon? I play both and besides player error I feel better on BDK

[ionic fern]

Then play BDK.

[onyx pike]

I like warrior more

[ionic fern]

In the pins, WoWHead and IV should both be up to date.

[onyx pike]

But i also like meta-whoring

[ionic fern]

[fathom goblet]

I don’t think bdk will survive really high keys

[onyx pike]

Feels like missplaying a single global will kill you at 20s

[ionic fern]

Don't misplay.

[sick sentinel]

bdk?

not really

[ionic fern]

But i got no input on BDK, i don't play it.

[onyx pike]

For now I will just enjoy warrior meta

I will pick up an alt when I have my renowns all maxed

[warm plinth]

Perfectly balanced, as all things should be.

idk why the background did that but ok raider.io

[keen star]

surprised so many people still run bear

for a lot of people it's probably their last +20 keys before they reroll to prot

my last +20 bear key was last week

so I'm in that metric even though I'm never playing that bear character ever again

[old garnet]

Did they fix t4 bonus bug yet?

[warm plinth]

What bug 🤔

[keen star]

the bonus bug

[ionic fern]

Think he's confusing it with the BrV bug.

[old garnet]

IP not filling after reaching cap once

[warm plinth]

That's a Brutal Vitality bug, nothing to do with the 4-set

It does not seem to be fixed yet, in any case.

[old garnet]

Yeah, i confused..

[ionic fern]

I don't pay enough attention to my IP to notice it.

😦

[old garnet]

🤣

Doesn't seem to be too important.

[quick elk]

random complaint, why does thunderous roar make the same sound as shockwave . i cant count the number of times ive had to double take thinking, ive pressed the wrong bind 🙂

[ionic fern]

Complaint registered.
Suggested fix:
Turn off sound.

[warm plinth]

Playing without sound 🤢

[quick elk]

Playing without sound? what devilry is this

[keen star]

volvo janitor wasn't given the required resources

[ionic fern]

I play with music.

[warm plinth]

I can't play with music; it distracts me

[ionic fern]

I just blast "PEDAL TO THE METAL" while i hold W in dungeons.

[onyx matrix]

Death metal + m+20 = OH YEA!

[pallid quiver]

My favorite thing is when people in dungeons say I'm so good, best tank ever, I'm so smart, etc.

and all i do is hold w and mash button

[onyx matrix]

Hahaha

[ionic fern]

Yes. we know.

[pallid quiver]

i don't understand how people are playing prot so poorly when ive been pugging raids

i just don't understand

there's guides out there

there's shiny buttons

I think we're awkward for people who aren't used to the idea to play well, but like

What I've seen random prot wars do is like

you have to try to perform that poorly

like by having whirlwind on your bars in the first place

I've not stepped foot into Brood or Raz yet. I'm not doing those in pugs until we outgear the content somethin' fierce

that just sounds like a bad time i could spend doing almost anything else

H Dathea also seems like a rough time for pugs

but getting into heroic pugs as a tank is a pain atm so I don't worry about that 🙂

If there's a pug looking for tanks for heroic, it's not going well already, if not already a dead group

[visual musk]

Anyone else swap from bear to warrior lately ? Getting worked on high keys on my bear. Smodge

[bold turret]

I just got one shotted through wall on Hyrja 21...

[pallid quiver]

it always feels bad losing tier to the DPS who died 40 seconds into the pull and has been doing like 15k DPS while alive