I think it was a cool idea to have party cooldown, not coz it was OP, but because it gives room for a skilled player 
#protection
storm shell
radiant magnet
by itself, was a fine ability. combined with CDR from Anger Management, became too much of a combo
it wasnt that you could do it. it was that you could do it every 30s
rich helm
i know there will be lots of tuning till DF, but which tank u think will be meta in S1?
median tulip
It's the kind of thing that would have to be a standalone ability
rich helm
kinda true
radiant magnet
tanks are reasonably balanced atm. meta isnt going to be set by current tuning. it's more likely to be set by The Personalities. some streamer or RFW pushing what they like best
jagged pier
meta not set by that at all, prot warrior was used in the WF sire kill yet, everyyone still thought it was shit
even tho obviosuly it could clear all content
rich helm
i mean the used it not cuz he was good 😄
waxen orbit
Not the greatest example but sentiment is right ye
Most people in here are not going to be pushing at a level where meta is even considered so just zug zug
jagged pier
doesnt matter if it was good or not did it show it could clear the content
i.e perfectly fine
yes
median tulip
Streamers who don't play and have no idea how to play Warrior will always set us lower.
rich helm
i know, but tell that those ppl who arent gonna inv in a +15 if ur not a meta class
jagged pier
and tbf the guy playing the warrior was playing it wrong as well
waxen orbit
Meta doesn't matter for mythic raid even
jagged pier
i know, but tell that those ppl who arent gonna inv in a +15 if ur not a meta cl...
ive never not been invited to a 15
when ive applied
median tulip
i know, but tell that those ppl who arent gonna inv in a +15 if ur not a meta cl...
Get a guild, run +20s with your guildies. GG Job Done
radiant magnet
it's more about that herd FOTM mentality. they need a 'best'. if the tuning is balanced, they still need a 'best'. if they cant get it from comparing classes, they'll get it from logs and streams
rich helm
it's more about that herd FOTM mentality. they need a 'best'. if the tuning is...
ye thats it
waxen orbit
it's more about that herd FOTM mentality. they need a 'best'. if the tuning is...
We call those degens and redditors
jagged pier
okay but that doesnt stop them being dumb
waxen orbit
We don't listen to those kinds around here
median tulip
The kind of people who think they need an all-meta party comp to complete a +15 are the kind of people that I don't want to run a +15 with
jagged pier
ppl literally have made tier lists in beta with a few hours on each spec, that is not enough time to understand everything and all the new stuff @strong forum has spent around 50 hours on prot figuring stuff out and I bet he still doesnt know it all yet
waxen orbit
The kind of people who think they need an all-meta party comp to complete a +15 ...
The type of people who thought you needed an all meta comp for anything south of a 27 this entire expac are the type of people I don't want to run a single key with kekw
jagged pier
so how ppl can believe teir lists and stuff atm is beyond me
median tulip
As the quote goes "One day I will be come rich and famous by inventing a device that allows me to stab people in the face over the internet"
radiant magnet
you had people making tiers lists months ago when every single tank and talent was either broken or untuned
lusty spade
ppl want confirmation for what they dream up will be op and what they want to suck
jagged pier
like high ranked tanks are playing the classes wrong like completely wrong atm all the Theorycrafters see it and tell ppl that but no the streamer whos spent 3 mins on the class is right instead of the crafter whos spent hours and hours
lusty spade
so they can already start calling their friends meta slaves for wanting to try out warlock for a tier or some shit like that
waxen orbit
Any sort of rating people come up with right now
Is going to be bullshit
Like
A week
Flat
lusty spade
and blame the community for never getting invited into a +5
raven hatch
I wanted to push 30 keys last season, but couldn't but it wasn't necessarily because I was a prot warrior, however it was related to dps not being good/meta enough. Correct me if i'm wrong but I didn't see a single top prot warrior not playing with a full/mostly meta comp in high keys, you just couldn't do it without survival/lock/rogue pumping and bringing all the utility going with them
raven hatch
i played with mm hunter / demo lock / ele shaman / rdruid, and they just couldn't deliver the damage needed to time anything above 27s
lusty spade
go figure records are set with meta comps
jagged pier
literally highest content is where meta matters
so top 50 guilds in raid progress
and top key pushers
thats it
lusty spade
but most people struggle to do 15s
waxen orbit
i played with mm hunter / demo lock / ele shaman / rdruid, and they just couldn'...
Ye, 27 is p much the cutoff of meta beginning to matter
raven hatch
yeah, but that's where I want to be, top key pushing
jagged pier
most ppl doing keys struggle to do 15
waxen orbit
but most people struggle to do 15s
Most people also struggle to remember their left and right if you ask them unprepared
radiant magnet
issue is people stare at meta so long they're blinded to anything else
jagged pier
most of the player base dont even do m+
median tulip
You gotta remember that over half of the playerbase never even sets foot in a Mythic Zero
waxen orbit
You gotta remember that over half of the playerbase drinks glue
Including me
I fucking love that shit
lusty spade
my guess is people like to find any other reason for sucking at the game than the way they play and i know it cuz i was it, not that i am some crazy player rn but i've gone past that at least.
median tulip
People often like to blame other people for them sucking at the game
waxen orbit
Fairly true about 7/10 times
radiant magnet
thats part of it, but it's also the fotm mentality. it takes more than reading a wowhead guide to play a class well. you dont get that practice and skill from swapping toons every time meta seems to shift
jagged pier
ppl refuse to believe they are bad, you see it all the time in here. 'I'm playing perfectly but im still dying' we look at a log and they arent playing closely to correctly, then we tell them and they argue and refuse to believe they are wrong
median tulip
The one that sticks in my mind is a run where I was on my shaman with a DK tank, and the DK blamed me for not healing him, while running around with a permanently full blue bar
waxen orbit
What level was the key
median tulip
A +15
waxen orbit
And the BDK needed heals?
waxen orbit
My brother in Christ I tanked +18s on a BDK at 230 ilvl with one lego and 1 piece tier
lusty spade
back in legion when i started taking the game somewhat seriously the first thing i did was to look at a dps tier list and pick a spec and i'd blame anything but myself for general sucking at the game xd
waxen orbit
And timed them
waxen orbit
Esp a BDK in SL
strong forum
Idk in what situation brew is in now
waxen orbit
strong forum
But tanks are hugely powerful now
lusty spade
i saw bdk on beta solo bosses in +15s
waxen orbit
That’s sort of always just been blood’s specialty
median tulip
I did always enjoy doing +15s and having healers go "I thought Warriors were supposed to need lots of heals" while I spammed the shit outta banner and IP
radiant magnet
I'm still expecting a mass dungeon tune on beta
strong forum
But if played well, pretty much every tank is close to immortal
Bdk obv still more than others cuz it's bdk
They're literally designed to work like that
lusty spade
i played healer for a while and i think it's crazy how much healing you need to pump into most tanks and then you get that guy that knows what he's doing and it's like playing a different game
median tulip
I'm not actually reactivating my account until the 15th
median tulip
i played healer for a while and i think it's crazy how much healing you need to ...
Truth. Running both my Priest and my Shaman, I've seen tanks that I can basically ignore, and tanks that I have to constantly heal dump.
lusty spade
it's hard to like judge a tanks skill, like dps have logs and healers don't let people die
lone eagle
Have to admit, prepatch prot warr feeling pretty great
Just knocked out a 21 Streets, 22 Upper, 24 ID, 25 WS and 26 Grimrail on my ~277-283 warr (got some gear during the keys)
started with a 226 neck, 233 helm and 233 legs
jagged pier
welcome to pre patch where tuning doesnt exist
lone eagle
Feels amazingly sturdy
jagged pier
well yes partly tuning tho
lone eagle
Damage feels pretty meh though. I've tried weaving in more battle stances but
jagged pier
cause in m raid testing things did hurt a bit
lone eagle
Still not great at actively stance dancing
lone eagle
Medivh definitely felt like it deserved d-stance lol
lone eagle
Tru
lone eagle
Yeah, cleared the back half of Sepulcher tonight on my monk
and LoD hurt like hell
Kintessa was smackin' the shit out of me
Plan to bring the warrior into Sepulcher next week
gusty perch
Weird question that I don't know if anyone can help me with. I left SL season 1 in part because pugging m+ was a total nightmare back then. It was the only m+ season I played since early legion.
I recently watched Yumy's video where he reacts to OneAzeroth's m+ depeleted keys recap YouTube video. And a really common theme in the comments was that s1 SL m+ was super overtuned and that it was really unfair to tanks. This made me raise an eyebrow because I was under the assumption that was just how the game was. I didn't have experience with any other season.
So my question is this: Was SL s1 really overtuned for tanks? Did it get way easier to tank after that? I remember it being a fucking nightmare to get KSM as a bm because all the mobs hit so fucking hard and you basically had to hard kite every single pack. I'm starting to suspect that that season was an outlier, and tanks are really supposed to be able to actually tank more.
When they announced the DF m+ changes it kind of made me not want to come back because I remember sl season 1 already being so hard to pug. But if DF season 1 is closer to the other seasons then I could see it actually being OK.
lone eagle
I don't know if "overtuned for tanks" is the phrase I'd use
strong forum
SL s1 was tank apocalypse
lone eagle
but basically it was tuned such that kiting was incredibly important
strong forum
Tanking has never been worse
lone eagle
It was pretty rough if you weren't a VDH
jagged pier
i mean 226 ilvl was pretty low for SL1 tbh and that was max gear
strong forum
Cuz vdh was meta cuz they could run away the best
jagged pier
but i dont push so i felt fine puggin my like 18s or whatever
runic tundra
tanking SL1 was glorified running for your life simulator
pop all cd's, pray you can generate enough threat for the entire pull in 8 seconds then run like mad
gusty perch
Ok that is really, really interesting. So I guess my next question would be, is DF season 1 looking to be like sl s1 again? Or does it look like it's going to be more like the other seasons? Because I have ZERO interest in playing again if it's gonna be like sl s1.
strong forum
Df s1 is tank heaven
lone eagle
DF looks to be much more stand and deliver
runic tundra
on beta tanks are the least likely to die in pulls tbh
strong forum
Df looks nothing like SL
lone eagle
You are beefy, you pull sizeably and most of your life is your own responsibility
strong forum
Tanks are infinitely stronger
jagged pier
well they have made all tank easier to play and made their defensives better, basically because they want more ppl to tank
gusty perch
thank goodness. seriously. man i just let out a huge sigh of relief. not even kidding.
lone eagle
Healers are really there to keep the group up and fill in the gaps when CDs are down and/or you've fucked up, depending on the specific tank spec
Rather than babysit tanks
runic tundra
they also removed necro inspiring because they finally acknowledged that tanks are expected to control the route, the pulls, the pacing while tracking dps and healer cd's and having even more stuff to deal with was kinda bull
lone eagle
So far what I've done on DF beta, it feels much closer to WoD era tanking than Legion onwards where they removed tank independence
gusty perch
When I read the DF m+ changes I thought i was taking crazy pills. Because they're making the scaling harder and making you go above 15. And the last I remembered, from s1, was getting to just a fucking 15 was a god damn hellish nightmare. It sounds like it's a lot easier now.
runic tundra
s1 also had to have % perfect routing to not get slapped by random prides early on
lone eagle
I really enjoyed season 1 tbh
runic tundra
which was brutal if someone ass pulled and you had to bust out the math to not get pride mid pack
lone eagle
But there were definitely a few egregious spots
Remember how brutal the packs after 1st boss in Plaguefall were?
gusty perch
So I shouldn't panic? DF s1 looks to be much more reasonable?
lone eagle
Little soldiers hit way harder than they should have
radiant magnet
DF s1 is entirely different. good different/
pending any idiotic tuning by blizz of course, but should be fine
strong forum
DF so far, tanking wise, looks great
strong forum
Vdh
lone eagle
VDH probably
onyx vessel
Yeah
lone eagle
Prot Warr disgusting in keys
onyx vessel
Even tho pwarr 
strong forum
Pwar is great, but vdh is better
onyx vessel
lone eagle
at 70 pwar picks up a lot of value talents. VDH has most of their good shit right now
onyx vessel
Vdh gets spooned cuz pwarr is chad in df
gusty perch
You want to be #2 though right? cuz then you still get parties pretty easily but blizz is less likely to nerf you 🧐
lone eagle
Brew does phenomenal damage atm
strong forum
Vdh also gets to play frailty + fiery brand build rn
lone eagle
But feels pretty squishy in Sepulcher
onyx vessel
Glass cannon
lone eagle
atleast on LoD
jagged pier
tbh there shouldnt be much or any nerfs, all tanks are even pretty much in terms of survivability
lone eagle
Jailer is very Brew favored
jagged pier
they just need to fix some bugs and buff druid damage
onyx vessel
Or take a pwarr and watch him take 0 dmg
lone eagle
honestly Brew handles Jailer better now than it did before due to Diffuse giving them an extra CD for p2
gusty perch
I really appreciate all your time in answering my questions. You really made me feel better. Thanks.
opal python
whats the usual uptime on banner on st?
onyx vessel
Prot warrior still handles jailor better
opal python
perma on st too?
onyx vessel
Brew has stagger
strong forum
whats the usual uptime on banner on st?
100%
opal python
yh aight ty
jagged pier
jagged pier
perma on st too?
yes
onyx vessel
I know why will i fix it unlikely
Dont really care
15s are easy
Why push
Skill issue 
ebon wren
feel like banner is not pug friendly. im low % also
opal python
nah just smthn we gotta get good with yh
i haven't played prot since bfa
new to banner myself
ebon wren
well, pug healers may need breaks for mana etc,.. banner ticking down...
jagged pier
they can drink u can pull
u arent going to die while they drink
espically now drink is front loaded
jagged pier
Maybe its not cant actually remeber maybe it gets faster over time.... regardless just because a healer is drinking doesnt mean u have to stop
You arent or shouldnt die in the seconds it takes for a healer to drink
gusty perch
Is banner going to be in DF or is that gone?
jagged pier
its gone
gusty perch
Don't hate me but I'm glad lol
jolly granite
Gonna miss it especially right now where it it’s easy to keep up
lone eagle
I didn't like banner in s3/s4
but mostly because I really didn't like Reprisal
minmaxing it felt really janky and annoying
cool to do the first couple times then just annoying after and kind of camera fucky
Now that we don't need Reprisal to use banner properly, it feels pretty great
rough sonnet
strong forum
There are 4 builds pinned for m+
limber sky
There are 4 builds pinned for m+
Can you share?
jagged pier
there shared in the pins
snow furnace
hey all, couple of questions for anyone that can help me:
- is rend worth casting if I apply it via blood and thunder?
- is slam / whirlwind worth casting over revenge?
jagged pier
no and no
dusky mica
group wall already chopped 😦
jagged pier
we've been saying for weeks its gunna happen
snow furnace
thanks Jakey
lilac bloom
i just got 20 mythic confounding thing.. now i'm just choosing what to upgrade.. my gear at the moment is like this https://raider.io/characters/us/frostmourne/Greystormz?utm_source=addon
strong forum
^
lilac bloom
i have a choice of devastated world shard, old warriors soul, ruined crest lordaron
jagged pier
so u have ows
lilac bloom
yah i do
lilac bloom
my current trinket was the highest ilevel
lilac bloom
should i upgrade it then
lilac bloom
it is fated item
jagged pier
so u cna only upgrade ows out of what u listed
lilac bloom
i have 3 choices of whati want to max
jagged pier
well tbh i think ows kinda fallen off now as we dont need the haste, think scars RDM and aegis are all better now tbh
was running RDM and scars last night
lilac bloom
i do have aegis
RDM is that from jailer trinket scars?
oh wait
ok defensive matrix
yah i see alot of ppl running that
both at max 304 ilevel
strong forum
Ilvl on trinkets isn't all that important
It's better to have the correct trinkets at an alright ilvl
Anything between 291 and 311 is perfectly fine
lilac bloom
how about the rest of my gear like weapon and shield
strong forum
Aegis would even be amazing at 265
lilac bloom
or should i invest on the tier piece
lilac bloom
yah thats true
i'm just confused of what i should upgrade
was thinking ows then haste not relevant
strong forum
Ows, and if you can, get your hands on rdm
sharp abyss
Yea my prot atm is giga scuffes
I think im using soleahs at 298 and the cheat death from cn at normal
Been thinking of putting on mythic scars though since all i have is dps trinks
lone eagle
currently using a 288 eye of command and 288 stun grenade lmao
Gonna have to grind hard this week to have passable trinkets for when I bring him into raid next week
sharp abyss
I was a fury main the past 2 tiers just enjoyed messing around with prot especially with how good it looks in df
oblique garnet
@strong forum Do you get this buff even if you dont use thunderous roar ? so its active at all times as long as you have this talent?
jagged pier
yes
oblique garnet
That is epic
oblique garnet
Ye just wasnt sure if it was applied after or before using TR
So we get 5 more talent points while we level on class tree and another 5 on spec tree right?
strong forum
So we get 5 more talent points while we level on class tree and another 5 on spe...
Yes
oblique garnet
Class tree kinda easy but spec tree has so many choices 
radiant magnet
Spec tree is nice tho. You end up with enough flexibility to take some of those side talents if you need it. Boss does X ability, you can shift a point into a talent that counters and not feel entirely gimped
sage sun
Ows, and if you can, get your hands on rdm
what is rdm?
tender tendon
Reactive Defense Matrix
sage sun
thx
gleaming oracle
Im using wowhead build and doin kinda crap damage😆 please advice fellows, i have read the guides and try and do what it says😇
onyx vessel
Hit buttons more
gleaming oracle
I be spamming!!😆
jagged pier
i dont even know what the wowhead build is
but your probably playing wrong tbh
but can tell without logs
onyx vessel
gleaming oracle
Will log when i get home and bring🙏
oblique garnet
Ows, and if you can, get your hands on rdm
Also pretty good dam now
strong forum
Oh yeah truuu
Well
You do lose around 4% of raw dmg by just losing str
And since we have even more Str modifiers now
Sack needs to do alot of dam
jagged pier
rdm also is like 22k
strong forum
Ya matrix is fucking nutty now
mint imp
which lego should i use? Wowhead says Reprisal and here you say The Wall or Seismic Reverberation?
strong forum
You can play reprisal, it's still very strong, but any legendary will be good
lone eagle
Did 15k overall in a 26 grimrail at 281 on my pwar
oblique garnet
Idk i just go zugzug
lone eagle
But think I empowered Thunderclap too much by accident
Need better trinkets and to adjust some ui elements to better track Seeing red or w/e
sick sentinel
hello sorry if thats answered already but are conduits streamlined now or is it just a visual glitch my juggernaut even conduit says 0% even tho im not talented into it
wondering if it does anything
lone eagle
Visual glitch
sick sentinel
so you should still aim for higher conduits ?
lone eagle
Yes
sick sentinel
Thank you sir thats all have a nice day
lone eagle
If you use it you'll see the buff itself is correct
For some reason the conduit tooltips in the soulbind ui are very bizarre
sick sentinel
yea like my banner shows on all ranks that it gives 10% strength but on the buff it says 16% for now
i just resubbed yesterday so im still on the grind
rich helm
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/reports/rYvBAgDnmGTLt2W7#fight=8&type=damage-done
why did u do so much more than the other warr? and jesus VDH busted xD
sick sentinel
built diffy
lone eagle
It's important to note the gap should close a bit at 70
Currently DH basically gets everything it wants at 60 with Kyrian replacing a few talent points
strong forum
yea like my banner shows on all ranks that it gives 10% strength but on the buff...
Conduit tooltips are bugged
lone eagle
Thunderous Roar, Shield Charge and Ravager will be pretty giga
sick sentinel
yea were missing alot of juice
strong forum
I'm opting to play shield charge + ravager rn, cuz I like the burst dmg
And the rotation is pretty stale without them
sick sentinel
i kinda miss shockwave now wtb 1 more point
rich helm
what do you take away instead
jagged pier
rotation kind of sucks cause u take outburst and its broken
lone eagle
That'll probably help me too
strong forum
what do you take away instead
I play the "no shield spec" build from pins
I don't have indom or outburst
strong forum
Yeah you lose a good chunk of self healing playing that build
lone eagle
Having to do calculus to shield slam empower without tclapping 1 stack earlier
strong forum
Just make your TC a diff colour when you're at 7 stacks of seeing red
And voila
You now know that you shouldn't press TC
lone eagle
True, more talking about the slight delay on tclapping you have to do sometimes to insure you can get the empower on the shield slam
strong forum
It do be like that
jagged pier
yep
lone eagle
Might be partially a problem with my 19% haste though
Farming Mechagon rings and clearing all 3 raids tomorrow for OWS
Best prot warr race animations and mog wise
GO
jagged pier
DID
lone eagle
Currently HMT but thinking about going Draenai
lone eagle
Love me some male Draenai built like fridges
Shame Lightforged racial ignores damage amps
strong forum
All racials do
lone eagle
They ignore self damage amps but not amps on target
So monk WoO works with vulpera racial for example
Very sad though that monks can't be LFD 😦
oblique garnet
Wth
craggy pilot
Mind dming me the WA export?
just go into the Outburst child WA, and change the Trigger Aura Name from Outburst => Violent Outburst
what is there even to do in Prepatch?
oblique garnet
Nothing
craggy pilot
does it make a big diff to gear for lvling?
oblique garnet
meme around trying different shit in keys
strong forum
Just fucking around
oblique garnet
Well yeah ofc the gear helps leveling
spiral compass
violent outburst at max stacks should be consumed with thunder clap for aoe and shield slam form ST or always shield slam? sorry if stupid question
craggy pilot
always ST
jagged pier
not at all anymore
craggy pilot
or i dunno if they changed alot of the rage gen, but with Tier it was always ST
craggy pilot
ye but the rage which gives Revenges?
lone eagle
Is there a target count ballpark?
craggy pilot
Revenge is worse and TC is better?
jagged pier
@strong forum might know the target where u change i have no clue
strong forum
6+ outside of avatar
4+ during avatar
jagged pier
there u go
lone eagle
Good to know, ty
craggy pilot
because of UF?
strong forum
Si
craggy pilot
+6 lol
spiral compass
perfect thank you @strong forum
craggy pilot
so if u go Imovable Object its always +6?
strong forum
Yes
lone eagle
Is that accounting for an extra Revenge worth of rage from shield slam?
jagged pier
si
tropic gorge
Played my warrior last night. I'm loving infinite shield block, and the massive armor and Dr I gained
lone eagle
I know that complicates it a bit
jagged pier
Is that accounting for an extra Revenge worth of rage from shield slam?
it will
its why u never used it on TC in the past
because it was never worth cause of the revenge casts
i would presume
jagged pier
well u still get a decent chunk with HR and the wall tbh
craggy pilot
It's only +100% rage now instead of 200%
ah
strong forum
But since in large target situations you get flooded with rage from bloodsurge
I don't take it into the equation
strong forum
Yes, so do i
oblique garnet
Nice nome you have improved your wasted rage
strong forum
I'm sub 1% of rage overcapping now
strong forum
<a:LETSGOOO:770741530805796874> Nice nome you have improved your wasted rage
I've come to the conclusion that it's not very much avoidable in SL if you go for max dam
As nobody had me beaten who wasted less rage
oblique garnet
I mean im also losing to nome
cobalt seal
oblique garnet
But im also the only one who has less rage wasted than nome
cobalt seal
well
primal rain
If I rend, I don't need to put it on my bars, right?
cobalt seal
point still stands
primal rain
Would the other specs play Thunderclap?
oblique garnet
No clue wrong channel for that
strong forum
Arms does
craggy pilot
how do i get class colored party/raid frames?
and how do i get different layouts for 25 / 40 man raid
royal oriole
Search Class in the options
Display class colors willl pop up
Layouts you need to go to edit ui and click the frame
It will allow you to select the size, scale and direction
craggy pilot
ye but when i swap from 25 to 40 it moves
i cant have different width for 25 and 40
royal oriole
Ah yeah not yet 😦
stray knoll
Boys is prot owning in prepatch?
royal oriole
Make a new profile completely but it won’t automatically update you can just swap profiles
Worst tank atm
Jk we rock
stray knoll
😛
royal oriole
laughs at prot pally and bear
mellow quartz
You will have a much lower rage generation in DF than you currently have in prepatch.
oblique garnet
Not really
median tulip
Once you get to 70 you should have some additional Rage generator tools
mellow quartz
Not really
Extra talents don’t really make up for loss of banner.
strong forum
Losing banner is significant
mellow quartz
Playing keys on live vs beta feels quite different
strong forum
Rage gen will be absolutely lower
mellow quartz
Rage wise
strong forum
Like rn banner makes up for 25% of my rage gen over an entire key
We're just flat out gonna lose that
With barely any more income of other rage sources
mellow quartz
Losing 80% haste etc will have a big feel difference also
Just lower haste in general at start of expac and no more shrouded buff.
quartz brook
Hello guys, what covenant should I use in pre-patch for prot warr?
mellow quartz
Necrolord
median tulip
Necro is best, or Kyrian if you CBA learning how to play around banner (which I wouldn't entirely blame you for right now, with how little time there is left)
quartz brook
Thank you guys, I am new to prot warr and I wanna try to learn it properly 🙂
median tulip
Thank you guys, I am new to prot warr and I wanna try to learn it properly 🙂
Anger Management is key; spend more rage to generate more rage. The key to Protection Warrior is to get too angry to die.
blazing marten
Hey guys im looking for a Tank spec for df.
Would you recommend prot if you are not a die hard warri player?
Like is the spec in a good spot
median tulip
Hey guys im looking for a Tank spec for df.
Would you recommend prot if you are...
You should play whichever tanks playstyle you enjoy most
median tulip
Easy to Learn; Hard to Master
jagged pier
i dont think its really that hard to master now ither
blazing marten
Do you think it runs smooth? Or does it feel clunky? And normaly my Focus is on m+
covert nova
I mean Im mostly just a door knob and I feel comfortable playing it
Its smooth to me, a lot of the stuff feeds into each other
median tulip
Do you think it runs smooth? Or does it feel clunky? And normaly my Focus is on ...
The point with Protection Warrior is that we are the kings of mitigation; we simply take less damage than everyone else. The playstyle has a high APM (Actions Per Minute) because we run through our off-GCD defensives pretty rapidly to dump Rage, and through our on-GCD Rage builders rapidly to gain it. The underlying strategy for Warrior is to always be using your abilities to generate Rage, and spending Rage makes your abilities come around faster (this is Anger Management).
covert nova
its like "fuck you im to angry and busy to die"
median tulip
If you're worried about Carpal Tunnel Syndrome don't play Protection Warrior, is the only caveat
mellow quartz
Like the movie ‘Crank’
primal crypt
If you're worried about Carpal Tunnel Syndrome don't play Protection Warrior, is...
I legit wear a wrist brace lmao
drifting magnet
really bummed about unbreakable will
median tulip
I legit wear a wrist brace lmao
saaaaaame
drifting magnet
have been having lots of fun saving teammates with a charge of wall
median tulip
really bummed about unbreakable will
it was broken AF bro, let it go
covert nova
Least its not as spastic in DF as it is in SL
drifting magnet
yeah, just seemed different than your average "take less damage" spell
median tulip
If the DPS are taking damage that's a Them Problem. Or Possibly a Healer Problem.
drifting magnet
probably too busted but was interesting and fun
mellow quartz
No one is arguing it wasn’t busted. That was also why they removed it lol
median tulip
It's going to take me a while not to hit Intervene every 30s
covert nova
lol right
urban bane
yeah I keep mousing over party members reflexively to intervene them
median tulip
I used to have a macro that would intervene focus target, and just set the biggest melee DPS as focus
usually my Fury Warrior friend
royal oriole
What legendary are you guys running now a days?
fluid shard
Right now i feel like damage intake is so low, i mostly use last stand liberally to save myself a few SB gcd and do more dam
urban bane
ah i just like using focus stops/interrupts too much to use it like that
steel cove
15 gambino with some of the homies alts, so funny at the minute hey
mellow quartz
Did you hit IP once by yourself?
sacred flare
How is protection in prepatch have not played yet on vacation
mellow quartz
Looks like some mad rage overcapping
mellow quartz
That IP usage is more questionable than codex lol
steel cove
brah
mellow quartz
You spend rage to get CDR on your abilities to do more damage
steel cove
That IP usage is terrifying hey
mellow quartz
Not that ‘it’s a 15 I didn’t need IP’
strong forum
IP is not a button to press "when you need it"
You press IP to prevent overcapping rage to make use of it
sacred flare
And it lower avatar cd
oblique garnet
This is how healing breakdown should look
sacred flare
It still does that right
steel cove
hell yeah
sacred flare
Also ip also reduces half of melee dame take bby 50 right
fast nacelle
Any good Talent trees? For raiding an m+. i‘ not really happy about what I found
vale bloom
@oblique garnet how much leech do you have?
oblique garnet
17%
mellow quartz
Any good Talent trees? For raiding an m+. i‘ not really happy about what I found
Pins have 5
sacred flare
You basically also get 5% from talent trees
oblique garnet
10%
mellow quartz
10
sacred flare
Even better
steel cove
going to adjust the IP usage here
mellow quartz
Just always hit IP if you would otherwise overcap
sacred flare
Is IP on the gcd
sacred flare
So don't worry about other things just press it
mellow quartz
Don’t worry abt IP max and not going over that. Completely irrelevant.
mellow quartz
So don't worry about other things just press it
Press it always if you would cap rage otherwise.
Don’t just press it so your sit at 0 rage all the time.
sacred flare
Yea don't do that
regal thicket
So don't worry about other things just press it
No SBlock?
open gazelle
Pwar now feels like old blood dk like mop days blood dk, literally can’t die and we have so much absorb and self healing now, I feel like I can solo raid bosses
mellow quartz
Do harder content
royal oriole
How often do you guys use slam now a days?
jagged pier
u dont
steel cove
15 streets, maybe overfocused on the IP
jagged pier
I dont know what your doing but its all kinda of wrong
probably not gening rage
if u could log please that would be great
steel cove
royal oriole
Oo not going shockwave/
steel cove
yeah not enough ss too much ip
jagged pier
i was getting that much damage out of SS in 1 raid encounter
steel cove
not enough rev
steel cove
go necro?
cobalt seal
15 streets, maybe overfocused on the IP
Find a less shitty trinket also
steel cove
i have tried and yet i cannot
jagged pier
do lfr
cobalt seal
1.6% dmg
jagged pier
all wings in all raids
cobalt seal
Is hilarious bad
steel cove
saving last dinar for JZ prevention
tired forge
wait hol up, I just came back and hate LFR, what is this doing lfr and buying trinkets?
steel cove
RDM best yeah?
strong forum
That's my dmg breakdown from GD27
I don't even play outburst, if I did. SS would be even higher
tropic magnet
Looking at your logs, your uptime on CB was 91% and you didn't really spam IP either
I think I'm spamming IP too much haha
mellow quartz
Define to much
tropic magnet
Like, I had way more IP casts then Revenge
mellow quartz
Do you spam it so you don’t have rage to use on revenge and sb?
You wanna IP so that you don’t overcap rage. You cannot spend enough rage by just hitting revenge.
In aoe at least.
tropic magnet
I was focused on keeping up Banner without Reprisal, but think I went a bit over board
cobalt seal
Banner rn is a non mechanic
mellow quartz
Banner keeps itself up unless you spend ages between packs.
cobalt seal
The aoe helps for the st
tropic magnet
Yea, I didn't do much Prot in SL so I wanted to give Banner the good ol' college try now but I definitely think I IPed way, way too much
tropic magnet
You can see there what I'm talking about. Still learning but, you can see my Revenge dam was ass cause I was IPing way too much. Definitely don't need to do that after review.
steel cove
That's my dmg breakdown from GD27
which build are you running here
tropic magnet
brother how?
As I said above, still learning again + IP spam too much
oblique garnet
<@143839248422928384> u own
Nah im washed
strong forum
which build are you running here
The "Max m+ dmg" build from the pins, but it's on the squishier side, I recommend one of the first 2 builds linked for beginners
steel cove
The "Max m+ dmg" build from the pins, but it's on the squishier side, I recommen...
Hell yeah will check it out, mines scuffed
mellow quartz
Are you even tanking in your keys nome with 5 tanks?
open gazelle
@strong forum you went with a 1.5 min cd ravager instead of outburst why?? Ss outburst hits so hard and gives good rage and if you were aoe focused you could just outburst more thunderclaps that slap hard? What’s the argument for ravager? I saw the cd got increased and I said meh nvm
jagged pier
its less damage overall
minor helm
Nah im washed
I’m nopers’ing u u just can’t see it unless you wanted to add it or whatever 👉👈
open gazelle
Yeah but outburst provides more survivability with the constant extra rage gen imo
jagged pier
u dont need the rage gen in aoe at all
open gazelle
Not like we need it now but we will in the future
open gazelle
Later on I’m saying will you change up in DF?
strong forum
Are you even tanking in your keys nome with 5 tanks?
A couple mobs sometimes
Aggro is pretty shared between each of us
Depending on who has CDs
strong forum
Later on I’m saying will you change up in DF?
Well duh, in DF you'll have alot more points available
That's when I get the remaining points in the middle
open gazelle
I don’t like ravager in this pre patch is all my argument is
strong forum
Think about the build like this
open gazelle
I like middle more
strong forum
You sacrifice 3 defensive talents and 1 offensive talent
To get 3 offensive talents and 1 meh talent
open gazelle
We’ll I guess I plan on running +30s and up so I went more defensive
strong forum
You are squishier with that build, 100%, but it's pseudo df and I wanna have more buttons
It's just a build that's playable and fun, not recommended for actual keys obv
In normal keys I'd play the seismic build
mellow quartz
I would not necessarily say go with what nome is using as you will be tanking 100% of the time in keys and he is tanking 20% of the time.
open gazelle
Everyone picking revenged cost extra rage does more dam talent or no?
mellow quartz
But if you don’t die then go max dam
strong forum
Everyone picking revenged cost extra rage does more dam talent or no?
Yes
open gazelle
Okay just making sure
median tulip
Everyone picking revenged cost extra rage does more dam talent or no?
Barbaric Training. And yes.
dusky canopy
Warrior chads
oblique garnet
I hate it on any smaller pulls ngl
dusky canopy
Finally tried the new talent system last night on live servers
It feels great
Love shield charge
south gyro
So is the consensus that Honed Reflexes is underwhelming? Based on the number of SS resets I was getting last night, hard to see much value from a 1 sec cd reduction.
median tulip
So is the consensus that Honed Reflexes is underwhelming? Based on the number o...
Yeah, unless the pummel CDR is useful for some explicit purpose I can't see it being worthwhile
slow token
May need to go back bear after warrior nerfs
median tulip
May need to go back bear after warrior nerfs
slow token
😂
crystal mauve
Hello everyone! I’m working on my banner uptime, can you get 100% on the single target dummy? Do you need reprisal for that?
jagged pier
yes and no will be hardish tho
strong forum
So is the consensus that Honed Reflexes is underwhelming? Based on the number o...
Yes it is underwhelming, if you can manage to snipe SS almost perfectly you get roughly 1 more SS per minute
But in that it's better/equal to sidearm
crystal mauve
yes and no will be hardish tho
Thanks! Gotta work on it then. I’ve noticed that there is no rage generated when I Shield Charge. I assume that had been reported by many already?
tropic magnet
why would SC generate rage?
jagged pier
meh 🤷
lusty grotto
Thanks! Gotta work on it then. I’ve noticed that there is no rage generated when...
strange, it was generating rage for me last night
tropic magnet
strange, it was generating rage for me last night
Just tested, received 20 rage on dummy
crystal mauve
Weird, I'll report it on my end then... Maybe there is a conflict with something if I have a different setup somehow
lusty grotto
@strong forum your DF WA's SB tracker load was set to outburst -- also i dont know if marok's ip tracker is supposed to only show numbers or both numbers and the ip icon but its only showing numbers
mellow quartz
Weird, I'll report it on my end then... Maybe there is a conflict with something...
Take another talent instead and then retake it.
lusty grotto
Weird, I'll report it on my end then... Maybe there is a conflict with something...
did you recently swap specs?
crystal mauve
@mellow quartz will try when I get home, thanks for the tip.
@lusty grotto yes a few times, maybe it's similar to the unity bug...?
lethal plume
/PTR
lusty grotto
i dont think there is a bug with spec swapping, but i know someone mentioned that talent issues were solved by spec swapping in beta
lusty grotto
jagged pier
sullen jungle
Hmm wonder if Aegis is even worth it now
lusty grotto
probably not, unless youre doing 40s lmaooo
i guess i could mention a few mage bosses in tyrannical coughmedivhcough
lyric elm
Makes sense if it would give rage, now you use Charge for rage and then use this point blank
lusty grotto
huh
mellow quartz
I have a feeling people are going to get sad when DF starts after having played prepatch war with banner and shrouded haste buffs 🙂
strong forum
<@192743144276623360> your DF WA's SB tracker load was set to outburst -- also ...
Yes I updated SB, and IP is supposed to only display as text
bold furnace
I'm gonna try Necro tonight. I've been playing kyrian just bc I was so new before the patch
steel mist
hmm it seems the guardian discord is having a convo about pwar being shit at taking Magicdamage
mellow quartz
hmm it seems the guardian discord is having a convo about pwar being shit at tak...
Great
lusty grotto
Yes I updated SB, and IP is supposed to only display as text
nice ty! is there a way i could show the icon though on that implementation? i couldnt find how
mellow quartz
People thinking pwar is bad is good for us
bold furnace
hmm it seems the guardian discord is having a convo about pwar being shit at tak...
That discord is big sad
lusty grotto
i mean it has been true for years
lusty grotto
but at least we have some more tools to deal with it now
lyric elm
And brew needs nerf eh
strong forum
nice ty! is there a way i could show the icon though on that implementation? i c...
All I did was turn the icon alpha to 0
sullen jungle
So OWS with RDM is the way to go for Prot? 😄
lusty grotto
All I did was turn the icon alpha to 0 <:keks:936231610850897992>
ok ill try that 👍
strong forum
So OWS with RDM is the way to go for Prot? 😄
Ya rdm is huge now
jagged pier
SCARS and RDM
orchid frigate
SCARS and RDM
lusty grotto
orchid frigate
RDM btw?
steel mist
is pwar rising in populatiry 😮
orchid frigate
are you asking what it means or what
yes
jagged pier
<a:keksquad:766690598635044895>
?
orchid frigate
aah reactive defense...
lusty grotto
Reactive Defense Matrix
pallid isle
Reactive Defense Matrix
orchid frigate
i dont have it 😢
oblique garnet
Sack is also a good m+ option as its doing 6% of my overall
crimson furnace
SCARS and RDM
what are thosee???
jagged pier
trinkets
orchid frigate
bought shard for my last dinar 😦
lusty grotto
ok so fish for it in all difficulties then
LFR and the up with heroic or mythic tokens or w/e
lofty widget
is the AJ conduit tooltip bugged
pallid isle
yes it is
oblique garnet
is the AJ conduit tooltip bugged
Yes
jagged pier
yes
lusty grotto
yes tooltip bug
lofty widget
okok
bold furnace
Scars?
oblique garnet
Fueled by violence TALENT does not work atm
oblique garnet
Fueled by violence TALENT does not work atm
jagged pier
Fueled by violence TALENT does not work atm
is that because u have the conduit in?
median tulip
Fueled by violence TALENT does not work atm
Don't we take Brutal Vitality anyway?
jagged pier
not if u have the conduit
oblique garnet
is that because u have the conduit in?
Nah
mellow quartz
Optimizing gear with 1 month left is a bit try hard now if you don’t have the items already 🙂
mellow quartz
Does it work on beta?
oblique garnet
Dunno havent played pwarr at all on beta
hardy snow
does juggernaut talent combines with ashen juggernaut conduit? In theory these are two different things, but talent supposed to replace conduit in future
uneven mason
and its pointless anyway execute hits like a wet noddle
I was noticing this
Overall I feel very "wet noodle" while leveling as prot
Near unkillable, but damage is lacking in a serious way, some DPS can pull off of a warrior even pumping revenge
lusty grotto
kinda seems like its a gearing issue whenever someone says that
hardy snow
dmg during leveling scales in a weird way, so its pointless to care about it
weary idol
Are you changing stances to get more DPS?
jagged pier
i sit in battle stance
inland raft
is prot execute being shit intended or no?
uneven mason
kinda seems like its a gearing issue whenever someone says that
I thought that was the case so I swapped to full looms with gems etc and dh, fdk and destro locks can yank mobs
That's doubling down on ae talents
lusty grotto
yeah i guess that's just leveling exp
i ran keys with enh shamen and locks that were destroying meters last night and they didnt pull threat once
dusky canopy
Definitely a bummer to be excute nerfed since it’s one of our strengths but I’m fine with it as long as we keep 100% block and blast the aoes
uneven mason
Yeah like from a tank perspective I have yet to die
That inudes soloing bosses after the party dies
inland raft
i just wondered cuz not actually playing currently and have just seen people complaining about it, makes sense though
uneven mason
It's probably intended
lusty grotto
but it shouldn't be as impactful as people make it seem, including yourself
uneven mason
"execute nerf - brought to you by Death knight tears"
dusky canopy
Yeah but banner execute was pumping
dusky canopy
Shame
keen loom
Seismic or The wall for Necro keys. Have OWS and SCARS
uneven mason
Seismic or The wall for Necro keys. Have OWS and SCARS
Seismic
keen loom
Swap OWS for RDM?
bold furnace
"execute nerf - brought to you by Death knight tears"
😂
pallid yarrow
There any good shield charge / charge macros? Or doesn’t work?
balmy canyon
Should be able to do it as a modifier key macro if you really want it on a single button
pallid yarrow
But I’m lazy 🤣
coarse flower
is there a good one button charge/intercept macro?
lusty grotto
its better if you use SC to put giga dmg on packs
pallid yarrow
Ya I’ll just do a modifier I suppose
lusty grotto
instead of charging just for charging
strong forum
If you macro them together
lusty grotto
since it can be done on melee range
strong forum
You only get the benefit of 1 spell
But use both
If you charge-shield charge, you put shield charge on CD but didn gain rage or do any dmg
pallid yarrow
Good point
strong forum
You can't get TR rn
uneven mason
is there a good reason i shouldnt take TR over stormbolt?
Ranged interrupt
jovial locust
funny boss fight 😄
strong forum
You only get 5 points below 3rd gate
jovial locust
group died and just stood there 100% hp for 4 mi n
uneven mason
group died and just stood there 100% hp for 4 mi n
This has been my experience several times
strong forum
Looks like gobbamak
smoky pike
What happend with the lvl70 builds from beta channels?
jovial locust
feels like bfa prot again
mellow quartz
heads up NA servers are down btw
Again? 3 days in a row….
radiant magnet
blizz being blizz
uneven mason
feels like bfa prot again
I have very different memory of BFA
lusty grotto
jovial locust
I have very different memory of BFA
wdym never being able to die as prot warrior and doing same dps as dps ? 😄
remeber at end i put on 50% td could do 200k as tank in dungeon
uneven mason
I was prot in 8.0
lyric elm
group died and just stood there 100% hp for 4 mi n
yea, healing is just to keep the group alive lol
lusty grotto
not even close
strong forum
But df pwar is vastly superior
uneven mason
I also enjoy chewing salted glass shards
strong forum
In every way
jovial locust
Bfa pwar was not as tanky as df pwar is
played prot war whole bfa and we were crazy tanky then aswell
not as now but we were
just saying gameplay wise feels fun again
lusty grotto
what key level were you running?
strong forum
We were alright, but most people confuse bfa with vers stacking s4
lyric elm
just saying gameplay wise feels fun again
It plays more like a dps spec imo, lots of buttons to press off the gcd
uneven mason
8.0 prot did a ton of damage but was difficult af to play well
marble cipher
We were alright, but most people confuse bfa with vers stacking s4
or twilight dev lottery 🤷♂️
jovial locust
8.0 prot did a ton of damage but was difficult af to play well
mate before they nerfed clap that was fun
lusty grotto
if you were running TD you werent running high enough keys
uneven mason
You either didn't miss a CD or rage bank or you died
strong forum
The main thing about bfa was easy to play, and dungeons where 90% dmg was pure melee dmg and spell reflect abuse
And obv dmg output
marble cipher
No, you didn't run high enough keys then (with TD), but you had a TD set laying around for the drunken friday nights where you just wanna laugh 😄
vital sinew
corruption brrrrrrrrrr
strong forum
I ran TD until 25s
lusty grotto
ah yes of course
strong forum
Fuck vers
jovial locust
No, you didn't run high enough keys then (with TD), but you had a TD set laying ...
exactly
strong forum
I wanna work for my surv, not be given it to me
jovial locust
but thing is bfa tanking was a lot easier due to op as trinkets aswell
every tier we had some insanse tank trinket
strong forum
Eh?
Like sure, urchin and edict was nice
Nzoth trinket was bonkers
But besides that, SL offered better trinkets in sod
Rdm and aegis are disgustingly strong
Aegis is so strong it'll be good for all of DF btw
They have to destroy this trinket with DF launch
jovial locust
shell urchin edict prism eye
all decent trinkets
but i just didnt like designs of sl trinekts 😄
vital sinew
the self harm stuff from vault is gonna be juicy
lusty grotto
alright lets see what they did
pretty sure they might have merged the nerfs in
oh nope
coral agate
I just imported my first prot build and it removed everything from my action bars 😦 is that normal? PRetty sure it dident do that when i imported fury builds yesterday
potent radish
I found an ignore pain WA and this is one of the options. Doesn't IP only scale with attack power and vers? I don't understand the point of this option
lusty grotto
outburst and fueled still bugged
its weird but outburst is going into seeing red at 6 stacks
mellow quartz
wow they added 2min to the AA timer and 4min to the AV timer
strong forum
I found an ignore pain WA and this is one of the options. Doesn't IP only scale ...
IP caps at 30% max HP
This wa scans the tooltip of ignore pain and knows how much 1 cast of IP does
With this you can set up when it should change colour
mellow quartz
worrying about overcapping IP max atm is just kinda pointless
potent radish
The only thing that changes the value on the tooltip is your AP and vers though right?
strong forum
Yes
The point of this option is, it changes colour based on how close you are to IP cap
rare flare
if your IP gives you 30k, but you are 10k away from cap, it will change to alert you
strong forum
Or you can set it up to only change colour when 50% of 1 IP cast would be "wasted"
And not 80/100/20% or however much
potent radish
Ah I see
Maybe IP scales better with more gear but right now IP is only a 10k absorb and 28k max on my warrior
So I'm not really having a problem with wasted casts
strong forum
Don't pay attention to ot
uneven mason
Maybe IP scales better with more gear but right now IP is only a 10k absorb and ...
Press when needed don't overthink it, it's not stagger or optimizing deathstike
strong forum
Press when needed and press when about to overcap rage
It's a rage dump, use it as such
uneven mason
Which is a need
strong forum
Ya but people treat it as a defensive
Not as a rage dump
Just look at fotm reroll tanks who perma sit on 100% rage
uneven mason
Although ae tanking you can lay on the IP button non stop and still cap rage at times
uneven mason
Just look at fotm reroll tanks who perma sit on 100% rage
It's like runic power right 
potent radish
Should I be going for 100% uptime on it?
uneven mason
Should I be going for 100% uptime on it?
Stop thinking about it
Just press
As long as you're not starving yourself out of block
patent osprey
Its over guys. Please all BDKs that rerolled prot, we just got nerfed, time to jump ship quickly to VDH before its too late!
T_T
patent osprey
Quickly! Here is the link to the VDH Discord: https://discord.gg/zGGkNGC
remote briar
I just checked the pins, did reprisal go bye bye in M+
lusty grotto
remote briar
lol what a time for me to speak up
oblique garnet
<@143839248422928384> u own
lusty grotto
<a:keksquad:766690598635044895>
y no enh shaman
lone eagle
But it doesn't apply to me because I came from Brew
lusty grotto
eww gross
uneven mason
I wish we'd get a little nerf
lusty grotto
except for the beer of course
uneven mason
One that can be blown out of proportion
patent osprey
we lost AOE shield wall, its all over
slow token
How do i do more damage as prot!
uneven mason
So we can scare the fotm away
jagged pier
should all re roll guardian druid tbh
uneven mason
How do i do more damage as prot!
Pull bigger
lone eagle
It's okay I wasn't taking AoE shield wall anyways
lusty grotto
👆
lone eagle
I'd just tell them I was taking it
oblique garnet
Im only taking it atm so i can use the wall legendary
spiral compass
is there a set rotation for prot warrior or more of a priority list
lone eagle
"Oh yeah, giving you shield wall"
patent osprey
AOE Shield wall was so good T_T
lusty grotto
you should have seen last night plka
jagged pier
Im only taking it atm so i can use the wall legendary
dont take ither and use your talent point somewhere else
lusty grotto
people were malding
patent osprey
It was gonna make us Mandatory for high m+
lusty grotto
"OH NO MY REROLL"
patent osprey
now people have options 😦
jagged pier
tbh this isnt new nome has been saying for weeks dont get attached to it
uneven mason
is there a set rotation for prot warrior or more of a priority list
Ss for rage, tc for bleed, revenge for slap
jagged pier
it was always going to go
lusty grotto
"why did i level this warrior to 40, shame on me"
oblique garnet
I mean it was gonna be mandatory for raiding aswell
2x prot warriors
With aoe wall
jagged pier
only half the raid tho
oblique garnet
Yeah doesnt matter its 40% dr on low cd
patent osprey
4 Prot warriors
jagged pier
Yeah doesnt matter its 40% dr on low cd
25%
spiral compass
@uneven mason ty
oblique garnet
Well yeah i guess but still
uneven mason
only half the raid tho
They'll bring 2 more to DPS in bstance just for the wall