protection

[strong forum]

Na, necro is more dmg

[mellow quartz]

It’s blizzard ‘approved’. Must be good.

[willow valley]

never leveled as a tank before but is prot fine for leveling? or better off leveling as dps?

[pallid isle]

How did they do on the raid tuning?

for pre-patch

[jagged pier]

literally any tank is fine to level and better as u dont get dazed on mounts

[mellow quartz]

I leveled on beta as prot with a fresh toon starting in 180 ilvl gear. Was perfectly fine.

[willow valley]

aight cool

im guessing you can also chain pull more

[mellow quartz]

Yup

[jagged pier]

my guess would be as its prepatch and its fated, raid are gunna be a joke

well even more of a joke

than last week

[urban bane]

Banner uptime seems even easier than before. Will be sad to lose it. RIP to a real one.

[jagged pier]

rep dead banner dying its a good time

[mortal brook]

hey just want to confirm before main swapping for dragonflight. with m+ season 1 in mind, is warrior really the tank that fits the Mechagnome Heritage Armor aesthetic the best?

[jagged pier]

no that would be paladin

[mortal brook]

they cant be mechagnomes, friend

[jagged pier]

unluck then

[mortal brook]

smh Stormforged

[jagged pier]

imagine playing mecha when u can be DID

[mortal brook]

tru, they are cuties

[pallid isle]

Since my memory is bad, in DF do we have higher SS reset chance w/ strategist (and kinda wild strikes/furious blows) than in 9.2? On target dummy it seemed like a lot more resets

[jagged pier]

you probably do yes

[smoky wolf]

If following the basic wowhead talent build but im running Reprisal what point do i swap out so that I can spec into intervene? Also feels weird not running Shockwave in M+....not strong enough to take over other choices? Seems a group stun would be worth it no?

[pallid isle]

opportunity cost @60 is too high

[urban bane]

yeah since shockwave is last tier there are so many other important things you want. Just use intimidating as an AoE stop if you need one.

Also if running reprisal you definitely will not need intervene to get 100% shield block uptime

[jagged pier]

u dont even need Rep for that

[urban bane]

ya legit

I was at like 20 seconds of shield block an entire dungeon without reprisal

[mellow bridge]

do we need to replace any conduits

[pallid isle]

if you have a talent that is the same effect, yes

brutal vitality, condensed anima sphere == pain and gain, ashen jug (UI is glitched in the soulbind setup and shows 0% but it still works fine) , inspiring presence (max conduit is slightly better), show of force, unnerving focus (talent is better by the numbers, but free up a point)

[sonic tangle]

Just go tauren, warstomp best stomp

[inland raft]

So how many people gonna be hopping on pwar train who dont normally play the class? The fair weather andies

[modern brook]

6,734

[vale plover]

Was playing gDruid ... Bliz forced me here.

[cobalt seal]

Lol

"Forced"

Nice joke

[inland raft]

Not op = forced

[grave crane]

I gotta go see if dratnos released a tank tier list otherwise how will I know which tank to swap to?

[plush tendon]

probably a lot, since this version of Prot War plays really well

[delicate thorn]

Hi I heard Prot War OP now meta meta how do you play it?

[plush tendon]

Even if it not the best best best, playstyle pretty good

worth at least a alt

[inland raft]

You make sure you turn your back to your enemies then complain on forums about dying

[delicate thorn]

https://tenor.com/view/ok-all-nice-gif-22927671

[vale plover]

🙂 haven't played prot since Ony, frankly stoked to have a solid reason to do it again.

[karmic stream]

guys anyone got some guide for talents/how to play prot?? i had 10-12k average now i have like 6 :(( pls help

[jagged pier]

dont know how something can be meta in pre patch where tuning means nothing, is it fun to play? yes, is it easier to play than it was in SL? yes. is it worth looking to play? yes

[plush tendon]

Also helps that warriors as a class are fun AF

[ebon wren]

I'm sure everyones taking avatar and im the one scrub taking shockwave, cuz I can't stand playstyle without it

[plush tendon]

everyone should have a warrior

[sturdy sable]

This is not the play man

[strong forum]

okay with just hitting 2 dummies and without a rage generation legendary

[inland raft]

I Havnt really looked into it both because coming off long vacation from game and this early in balance still can go anywhere but my understanding is vdh is the early favorite for meta isnt it?

[strong forum]

you can maintain banner for 3 minutes without troubles

[sturdy sable]

Always is

[plush tendon]

idk, havnt played it. Is it fun?

[icy flax]

Shockwave talent for the meme

Vdh is fun

[plush tendon]

Or are we entering SL season 1 where everyone was a VDH, but 75% of them had no idea what they were doing

[ebon wren]

banner going away anyway come DF

[inland raft]

Im a prot main since vanilla through thick and thin so just happy they looking solid

[sturdy sable]

This but also with pwar

[ebon wren]

I realllly want to use thunderous roar but just too long of a cd for me

[plush tendon]

Sort of have to wait till DF and you hit max

then you get all the buttons

[last crest]

i know it doesnt really matter now, but what should i focus on with the fated token ? weapon or soul

[spring umbra]

wtb dual shield ultimate capstone please

[sturdy sable]

2h+shield please

[modern brook]

Mog

[ebon wren]

really silly to buy gear that will be moot in a couple weeks

[modern brook]

Unironically it's a garuntees drop for any mog of your choice

Ows is goodbye in 3 weeks

Mog is forever

[last crest]

yeah, but i don´t care as my friends want to play even now and you can always farm mogs backwards

[sturdy sable]

You def want to get the sword from kt with a dinar

That thing never drops

[plush tendon]

TMOG

KT sword 100% a great choice

[sturdy sable]

Its what i used my last dinner on

[plush tendon]

same 😄

[modern brook]

Weapons and shield over trinkets yeah

[plush tendon]

Gavel, OWS, TMOG

[last crest]

also side question, why does the new UI keep removing spells from my bar and replacing them ?

[modern brook]

If you really care about performance and you have a weapon and a shield then sure go ows

But ows is not going to break a key by not having it

[strong forum]

https://i.imgur.com/zpiIlv8.jpeg

this build owns

[modern brook]

Because u are unlearned and relearning them

[strong forum]

2k more dps on 2 targets than outburst + indom

[modern brook]

Smh

Absolutely smh

[strong forum]

you wouldve picked some other shit

[modern brook]

I'm being gaslit into oblivion

[strong forum]

the other build is tankier than this one here

[modern brook]

smh just say good idea bull thats all I want

[last crest]

nono, i mean, when i reload :D

my mount gets replaced with kevin picklock for example xD

[modern brook]

Uhhh

To behonest anytime something weird like that happens i blame addons and am generally right at some point in that chain

[last crest]

it´s lowkey tilting

i´m without addons as of now, deleted everything as i setup UI

[modern brook]

unknown then, likely just a bug

cant say i've experienced it

[spring umbra]

needs more shields

[long snow]

its the reason i use the hidden artifact appearance on my VDH. closest to 2 shields I can find

[limber sky]

IS PROT WARIROR MELEE DMG BUG?

[last crest]

just wondering, did we win or lose on 60/70 talent builds ?

as in, do we do deal more dmg and are we tankier ?

[long snow]

i think we ended up pretty decent imo

[modern brook]

70 point talents builds i'd estimate are roughly 10 points better than 60 point talent builds

[delicate thorn]

we deal more damage than less and are softer and tankier at the same time

[shell valve]

non-Newtonian tank

[dense urchin]

winning

[last crest]

also, does anyone have UI and Banner weakauras that they could share? wago down

[shell valve]

Is Juggernaut conduit useless now? It's showing 0.0% extra crit strike chance.

[stable cradle]

You playing something other than necro?

[strong forum]

nope

[shell valve]

Is that with seismic?

[modern brook]

yeah

you can tell because he didnt take seismic in the class tree

[severe hatch]

Banner is trivially easy to keep up in pre patch in M+, hard to justify any other covenant imho

[strong forum]

yes

[deft vortex]

Lovingprot warrior in prepatch so far

Feels great already even with missing full talent build

[last crest]

we play the same way + keeping up rend right ?

[urban portal]

Yea

[deft vortex]

More thunder clapping now

[severe hatch]

Tclap will handle Rend for you, take Rend off of your bars

It's basically a passive talent

[elder bay]

anyone taking shockwave build?

[last crest]

what did i miss ?

about tclap and rend

[severe hatch]

Tclap applies Rend directly, it's no longer speeading

[deft vortex]

If you talent into blood and thunder. Thunderclap now auto applies rend to 5 targets

But you have to have rend talented still

[severe hatch]

^ better explanation

[last crest]

i see

[spring umbra]

can you reset the prof knowledge point trees? anyone know by any chance

[last crest]

also, any idea how to import profile to plater? >.<

[deft vortex]

It's a big quality of life improvement for prot

[severe hatch]

Really helps on fresh M+ pulls

[last crest]

now to get UI WA and i´m set to try it out

[granite nest]

Is this raid or M+?

[drifting quest]

Is the only reason to stance dance to simply increase your damage during low damage periods?

[strong forum]

go to player > profile > import

[strong forum]

m+

raid builds are in the pins

or well, all my builds are

[granite nest]

Ty

[shell valve]

Is there a reason to run Sidearm over Barbaric Training if you're running seismic?

[urban portal]

Sidearm is mid

[last crest]

thankss

[ebon wren]

ive found sidearm to be minimal damage, I dropped it

maybe combined with talents that speedup auto attacks

[urban portal]

Still mid

It’s just passive damage

[severe hatch]

I would never run Sidearm over Barb Training, but perhaps over some other utility. It's low value either way

[shell valve]

That'd be Battering Ram, are there any else?

[severe hatch]

Yeah there's an auto attack speed node above Thunderous Roar

[shell valve]

ah wild strikes, yeah

10 sec sec

[frank hemlock]

sims arent working as of yet, correct?

its giving me an error "unable to create action: dragon_roar"

[shell valve]

yup, it's thunderous roar now

[urban portal]

They need to fix some stuff

[ebon geyser]

RIP DF channel

[urban portal]

But I don’t think anyone updated the apl

[shell valve]

It's day 2, it's fine

[patent osprey]

@strong forum why in the m+ build for skyhold do you take bolster when we already have a 100% uptime with Enduring + HR?

I thought for sure ud be a bounding stride boy xD

[south zealot]

i personally dont think u need enduring

[urban portal]

1 min cdr?

Funny with unnerving focus?

[devout pecan]

so i think sidearm is a nice passive, dmg talent, i run it in a +15 lower kara, it dealt like 578k overall

[plush tendon]

is that a lot?

[mellow quartz]

With or without reprisal?

[plush tendon]

I dont number well

[patent osprey]

Guess yeah its just so u can LS more with the unnerving conduit

we have so much rage gen, LS doesnt seem necessary xD

[runic nimbus]

Does signet of tormented kings legendary not work anymore?

[mellow quartz]

Cause in beta with just HR and ED you won’t have 100% uptime without SC and bulwark

[devout pecan]

with reprisal

[south zealot]

with reprisal and heavy repercussions i have 100% uptime

without even using intervene

[runic nimbus]

i tested in raid and in oribos, never got a proc of signet

[south zealot]

not sure

[runic nimbus]

reprisal works i think

[mellow quartz]

Nome has bolster cause his build is without SC and without reprisal afaik

[south zealot]

SC?

[mellow quartz]

Shield charge

Bulwark talent with shield charge gives shield block

Reprisal talent with no min range

[south zealot]

i dont use shield charge either

[devout pecan]

so what i mean, Sidearm dealt 578k dmg and Tough as Nails dealt 845 in this +15 Keys, its round about 1,4mill dmg for doing literally nothing than autohit and block xD

[south zealot]

but i do use reprisal

[south zealot]

yeah its free damage

[south zealot]

nomer is using shield charge on his stream rn

so maybe diff build

[mellow quartz]

The builds in pins are without having reprisal as your leggo.

[ebon wren]

are we actually supposed to use battle stance as tanks

[mellow quartz]

So bolster to cover the sb uptime

[south zealot]

if you dont need defensive stance then yes

because more damage = better

[dusky canopy]

Just look at it like you are always in defensive stance and you toggle battle when you don’t feel threatened

[ebon wren]

guess I just feel what key level I can use battle for

maybe just bosses this week, i try it. I'm taking like 0 damage anyway

I mean, defensive on bosses

[open gazelle]

i only switch battle jstance for execute phase but thats just me you do you

[mellow quartz]

D vs B stance for keys is abt 2 key level difference in damage intake.

If you can survive you always go bstance

[patent osprey]

With HR + ED, even without reprisal is 100% uptime

[mellow quartz]

Oh is that with haste affix?

Or on dummies as well

You have gabs on SB uptime on beta at abt 20% haste if you go with HR+ED only.

Can see if you take haste affix in keys in prepatch that it would be much better obviously

[patent osprey]

On target dummy its 100% uptime as well

at least with my gear

^.^

[mellow quartz]

What’s your haste at?

[patent osprey]

41.64% base

[mellow quartz]

Ok yeah then maybe lol

[mighty valley]

I'm dropping bolster today for sure, LS back on banner rage gen duty

[mellow quartz]

Keep in mind going between packs where you can’t use SS to extend SB might cause actual downtime for SB vs a dummy you can hit all the time.

[patent osprey]

just from all the keys i did last night

[mellow quartz]

Probably minor though with that haste

[patent osprey]

never had an issue with no bolster

[mellow quartz]

In keys you still take haste right so have like 80%+?

[patent osprey]

In JY I had a 60 second banner XD so I could run from King to Gunker without dropping it lol

it was great

[urban portal]

What can you take if you drop booster

Bolster

[severe hatch]

Yeah theoretically you could probably cast Banner once at start of dungeon and never have to recast

[jagged pier]

nome just had a 2 min banner

[patent osprey]

well if ur following the guide in skyhold, tough as nails for me was doing about 5.5% of my overall

[jagged pier]

yep

it pumps

[patent osprey]

depending on dungeon ranging from 4.5 - 5.5% so thatd be a good substitute over bolster

But if you like LS at 2 min, its good, but u dont really need the rage gen in aoe atm

[jagged pier]

i mean u dont need bolster

[copper talon]

Can someone link me WA string, wago is down 😦

[patent osprey]

Wonder when wowhead calc will update the warrior tree

[mortal brook]

for what

[patent osprey]

cause Barbaric training is in teh wrong spot

[mellow quartz]

Use the beta calc

[strong forum]

https://i.imgur.com/KniLrPX.png

get memed on

[copper talon]

For prot warr

[mellow quartz]

It’s correct

[patent osprey]

Nom just likes the pain of doing 5 tank keys @_@

[jagged pier]

its not painful

its really easy tbh

[mellow quartz]

How much is zap bots?

[severe hatch]

Which key was it

[strong forum]

4k dps from zap bots

[patent osprey]

U linked a JY -_-

da heck

[strong forum]

rest is pure skill

[patent osprey]

and grease bot

[strong forum]

gobbamak

totallyn ot padding on gobbamak

[mellow quartz]

Like how he didn’t mention it was JY himself 🙂

[patent osprey]

Didnt even 3 chest Monka

[keen loom]

Are we still running Reprisal leggo?

[severe hatch]

Warrior needs buffs yep

[jagged pier]

https://tenor.com/view/no-bugs-bunny-nope-gif-14359850

[keen loom]

Wall then?

[patent osprey]

Seismic or wall

[jagged pier]

in raid probably

seismic in keys

[strong forum]

technically reprisal is huge still

[keen loom]

Seismic in what slot?

[patent osprey]

Nope reprisal is dead, leave it dead, never bring it back

Don't dare say its name

[severe hatch]

Reprise reprisal Plka, do not resist the call

[patent osprey]

even if its good for the free revenge, i refuse to put it on the rest of pre patch

degenerate gameplay

[strong forum]

its good because of rage gen

[mellow quartz]

Doesn’t make it feel better

[keen loom]

Lol no 291 base item for legendary available on AH

[mellow quartz]

If you take the wall does Will still work also in prepatch?

[grave crane]

Reprisal is good cause it’s the only leggo I have and i refuse to make another

[mellow quartz]

Cause seismic as a talent instead of pain and gain and then running wall and will is nice.

[vernal vale]

It's amonth and my cheap ass doesn't want to buy legendary base items that die in a few weeks. So I'm stuck riding reprisal or nothing.

[mighty valley]

i'm surprised people are saying legendaries are expensive with the AH merge

i slapped together a couple for 10k each

[mellow quartz]

Doesn’t cover armor?

[vernal vale]

@patent osprey you use plater have you been having issues mine was fucked all to hell last night.

[ornate thunder]

they jacked up the price on a few slots

[vernal vale]

Not expensive just a waste of gold

[mighty valley]

oh it's just materials and stuff? i see

[mellow quartz]

Yeah

[patent osprey]

plater works fine for me

[mighty valley]

that does make it easy for dedicated people to spike prices if they wanted

[mellow quartz]

Plater has been working on beta for weeks and also fine in prepatch.

ElvUI even works now.

[vernal vale]

Damn, I gotta figure out why mine was throwing an error every second last night

[mellow quartz]

Make sure it’s updated

[vernal vale]

If we had more than a month I wouldn't bat an eye at 10k gold. I ride around on my longboy because I don't have an issue with gold.

[vernal vale]

Yeah, it's updated. Must be something to do with my settings for the add on.

[uncut vale]

anyone got a good weakaura?

[mellow quartz]

I have many

[uncut vale]

like a ui one

for main abilities

[mellow quartz]

@strong forum has his on wago under prot warrior

Mine is heavily changed from Alfanars

[hazy sluice]

Ist there a Race that has any noticable racials beneficial for m+ tanking? Horde

[mellow quartz]

Horde no. Only thing that’s impactful is dwarf.

[mighty valley]

They're all very close, pick based on vibes

Vulpera nose for trouble does more than you think

[hazy sluice]

K thx

[south zealot]

i play troll

more haste op

[indigo lotus]

Big diff between kyrian and necro?

[last yew]

High mountain has an additional charge which is always nice

[south zealot]

yewsa

yes

[indigo lotus]

Necro is the way?

[south zealot]

yes

[indigo lotus]

tyty

[graceful cobalt]

we play with leggy or not? becouse got 304 back and legs

[south zealot]

yes use legendaries

[mighty valley]

Play leggy on feet

Or cloak depending on what you want

[graceful cobalt]

repisal i have on feet but didn´t know where the unit

got 298 belt but 304 cloak

[mighty valley]

Yeah Unity will do a lot more than a bit more ilvl

You can craft it wherever though

[graceful cobalt]

yeah i took belt for unit

what build we choos for m+

[severe hatch]

Pins

[jolly inlet]

Is stance dancing going to be impactful in df ?

[mellow quartz]

If you are not dying be in bstance. If a pull is hard change to dstance and the back after.

It’s off the gcd and has a 3s cd.

[signal sequoia]

Can you make a macro that just swaps your stance

Maybe a cast sequence?

[sleek echo]

check pins 🙂

[signal sequoia]

Oop

[median niche]

is necro better dps as prot?

[raven hatch]

this impenetrable will shit is insane

37% uptime in a GD on wall for my entire party

I timed it for every breath on last boss too

[signal sequoia]

Are you playing the wall as a legendary?

[raven hatch]

100% shield block

nah, impenetrable will, gives whole party 25% dr on every avatar snd shield wall

and something weird happens with the avatar one, it gives them two will buffs so they have 2x 25% dr

for 4 sec

then for the remaining 4 sec they have another 25% dr

[mellow quartz]

It will be 20% next build

[raven hatch]

just did a 26 workshop and vent jents was a joke

[mellow quartz]

Was fixed on beta already

[raven hatch]

still strong tbh

[mellow quartz]

Yup

[raven hatch]

being able to stopp my team getting oneshot on every gigazap, and every vent jents

and wallling them on the aoe from the robots too

gardener was funny too, much harder to time wall for fails, but when I did it managed to save like 2 deaths

but thats just my team being bad

[jagged pier]

dont get too attached to it

[raven hatch]

haha nah I won't. but it's fun for prepatch keys at least

[mellow quartz]

@jagged pier is a doomsayer

[jagged pier]

we can give the party it every 30 secs

it will get nerfed

no other tank provides anything close to that for m+

[mellow quartz]

Imagine m+ being balanced.

[raven hatch]

ive heard DH tanks are doing insane damage but i've seen no evidence of it

[mellow quartz]

As long as it’s not ‘to broken’ in raid it might slip by.

[signal sequoia]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/907084504911446067/1034882409822421052/unknown.png

[raven hatch]

ooof was that overall though?

[mellow quartz]

Won’t have venthyr in DF 🙂

[raven hatch]

actually yeah 42 mil that looks overall, what key?

[signal sequoia]

Yes, as evidenced by the 43 mil total damage

[mellow quartz]

Ravenous frenzy and higher incarn uptime is good for bear. Who knew.

[signal sequoia]

3 chested 22 ambit

[raven hatch]

haha crazy

[mellow quartz]

Also wtf are these details names

[jagged pier]

called nicknames

get on it

[ebon wren]

im still about same damage as before-patch. must be doing something wrong

[raven hatch]

are we supposed to be much higher?

[graceful cobalt]

we also took repisal/wall as legendary? or only the unit?

[jagged pier]

should br higher yer

as u should be running siesmic in keys now

[raven hatch]

not running the leggo but running the talent

i do more damage but its not insane

[ebon wren]

really, run seismic eh

not reprisal still?

[jagged pier]

u do not need repisal ever again

your talents cover block

[raven hatch]

defo dont need reprisal

i have 100% blockuptime without it

[jagged pier]

i mean its still good for rage gen

[raven hatch]

it goes up to 30k seconds

[royal mesa]

Do we know how this interacts with a pack of enemies? Does the buff to Ravager stack and also refresh timer on proc?

[raven hatch]

30 seconds*

[ebon wren]

SERVER SHUTDOWN

[graceful cobalt]

na i mean the crafted

[lusty grotto]

[jagged pier]

it will stack till next rav as far as i know

so big pull

use rav

next rav will be giga

[lusty grotto]

my pins emoji wasted 😢

[royal mesa]

Scrolled right past it, mb!

[ebon wren]

but battle-scarred looks ridiculous. rav instead?

man im all wrong

[jagged pier]

theres 5 builds in the pins

[ebon wren]

k catchin up

[mellow quartz]

If you need BSV you need it. If you don’t you don’t. In prepatch it’s hard to get though.

[jagged pier]

yes BSV is good but its only good in niche content, i.e if your are going to die so basically early m+ prog and maybe high keys

u will not need BSV for your weekly 20

[ebon wren]

if there's a sleep puddle ill find it, BSV saved me at least a couple times in grimrail

[jagged pier]

but they are easily avoidable

[ebon wren]

tell my warrior that heh

[jagged pier]

its good in content where a missed interrupt will kill u

[ebon wren]

definitely using it as a crutch, which I shouldn't do

[sharp bone]

which skill should i spec out of to go intervene for reprisal?

[sick sentinel]

is wrenching impact still in the talent tree?

I can't seem to find it

[strong forum]

its not

and you can drop the 5% stam to get it

[sick sentinel]

oh

[sharp bone]

tyvm

[strong forum]

you can also drop sideram for intervene

[south zealot]

server sadge

[south zealot]

pain and gain

i personally dont use intervene even with reprisal

btw does anyone know what the NA server shutdown is about

[oak echo]

was looking at the pinned m+ build. is thunderlord/booming voice really not that great? i had those over punish and focused vigor and the synergy sounded nice for demo shout uptime

[sick sentinel]

So wrenching impact was removed?

[lavish oracle]

I hope they just remove the IO interaction and leave unbreakable will intact, itd be a shame if they gutted the whole ability

[mellow quartz]

It’s great but hard to get in prepatch

[jagged pier]

so vigor and punish are 2 of our strongest talents

dropping them for kinda okay talents

is a bit meh

[oak echo]

fair. was undervaluing punish i suppose

[jagged pier]

most of your damage is SS

because u have 100% uptime on block

[mellow quartz]

And most damage that actually matters is ST damage

The higher your ST the faster your keys will go.

[oak echo]

makes sense. so what are the final 5 points gonna look like? shield charge, EA, Rav and 2 more?

[mellow quartz]

Murlocs and a giant. Doesn’t mean anything if you did 100k dps but giant is at 30% when all the smallies are dead.

[jagged pier]

well those build will be posted later but they were in the DF channel thats now dead

[oak echo]

sounds good. getting ahead of myself lol. but thanks that helps

[patent osprey]

well punish is only a 10% SS upgrade

and in big aoe like gambit

u wont really be hitting it other than bosses

[tropic magnet]

So on the target dummies in Necrolord town, I was able to keep Banner up with the Seismic Lego for almost the full two minutes without reprisal/shield charge/ravager. That should be pretty pretty normal yea?

[lusty grotto]

yes

easy uptime on keys

[tropic magnet]

I lost it with like 5 seconds left and wasn't sure if maybe I did something wrong

[lusty grotto]

rage gen is so ridiculous now that you wont need to worry much about it

[tropic magnet]

Ye

[lusty grotto]

right so its pretty normal, but even better in an actual key

[tropic magnet]

Yea, I imagine so for sure. Definitely some times the Rage Regen was bad.

Cool beans

[mellow quartz]

Imo you should be focusing giants and large hp mobs vs just revenge spamming for overall unless most of the mobs are around the same hp.

[south zealot]

L + ratio + always pad

[uneven mason]

leveling as prot as soon as I could queue for dungeons, right now, no heirlooms

[south zealot]

can someone ping me when NA is back up

[uneven mason]

(╯°□°）╯︵ ┻━┻

[patent osprey]

nah, some DPS are doing too much now, if ur not aoeing, ur gonna lose aggro

[ebon wren]

eh, you want to target the low health mobs for execution tho

[mellow quartz]

The 3 stacks from punish is nice also.

[south zealot]

monk outlaw and aff are pretty good from what ive seen

[patent osprey]

WW, DH have really big burst, but typically its fine

[uneven mason]

Thus far, it's great fun, although there are 2 very big points that stick out to me

[patent osprey]

Just saying u dont NEED punish

[mellow quartz]

Ok, not sure how out of wack things are right now in prepatch 🙂

[south zealot]

maybe the DHs ive seen suck balls

bc they doing like 18k overall

[uneven mason]

I had to use the heirloom shield until 27 when I got a shield drop

[patent osprey]

Monk and DHs doing like 40k+ overalls

[uneven mason]

So for people who want to prot from the gate - you have no options for equipment

[patent osprey]

Just highest Ilvl stuff basically

[mellow quartz]

Did a random pug on beta with Dabnel on his WW. Talk abt a class that blasts. 80k overall in a HOV.

Wonder if ret pally blasts in prepatch

[mortal brook]

if you keep the things in their consecration

[mellow quartz]

Ok so always pull out of consecration, got it.

[sick sentinel]

ehy guys sorry for my noob question, what leggos should i buy as new level 60 and considering the prepatch talents?

[modern brook]

Unity + seismic/wall/reprisal

You can also just save your gold and not have a 2nd legendary

[sick sentinel]

ty so much ❤️

[modern brook]

And obviously if you use wall/siemsic you just move the corresponding talent point inthe tree to anything else

[sick sentinel]

oh yeah thanks i will check, not a lot used to pwar, but wanna learn 😄

[mellow quartz]

If you wanna watch degen stuff watch @strong forum and his group.

[onyx vessel]

[sudden palm]

Guys anyone else having issue with /wa not showing weakaura's window? It doesn't do anything for me

[sick sentinel]

lol 25 street in 5 tanks loool

[mellow quartz]

Have you updated the addon?

[sudden palm]

I believe I did thru courseforge

I'll do it again

[mellow quartz]

Make sure it’s updated and try again. Maybe you have to many lua errors from other stuff it’s blocking it.

[sudden palm]

Gotcha; thank you for helping :) How can I check out the luas?

[opal python]

i haven't played the sl prot much, but how can i get better uptime on banner?

[modern brook]

The wa action waits for combat to drop

There's a lot of issues with dummies mot dropping combat right now

[modern brook]

Spend more rage

[opal python]

like i pop it along with avatar and just making sure just pressing whatever the fk i can, revenge ip for rage consuming

hm yh

[oak echo]

install buggrabber and bugsack. just mute the sounds from bugsack lol. but it'll show you in the minimap icon which addons are throwing errors

[opal python]

so using revenge on single target too just to keep it going yh?

[sudden palm]

Thank you!

[opal python]

over lets say ip unless i dont have ip, but yh just revenge rly

i can think for spending rage on st

outside of exec

[modern brook]

You should be revenging in st even without banner

It's your major rage spender

Obviously execute in execute but otherwise your goal with the rotation should be to just Gen and spend rage as fast as you can

[opal python]

yh

[modern brook]

While maintaining shieldblock up time

[opal python]

kinda been playing loads of beta and spamming revenge is not super a thing there

it is

but rn it feels like i need to way more

[severe hatch]

Pax you're talking like you're not constantly flooded with rage. I'd question whether your talent build is the issue

[opal python]

build is fine, just banner uptime feels a bit questionable but then again im not used to sl and necro

[sick sentinel]

Make sure you have all the WA components checked in the add-ons page. I know that was finicky for me on beta.

[severe hatch]

Biggest issue in my life is not overcapping rage

[opal python]

but i can make sure im maximizing the uptime

[severe hatch]

I could see some issues in pure ST maybe?

[opal python]

thats what im running rn

as im not dying (24% leech) so dropped indomitable

[onyx briar]

My covenant abilities aren't in my spell book anymore. What's up with that?

[opal python]

but im also consdidering bloodborne will see

[severe hatch]

Yep build is fine for sure

[opal python]

rn mitigation is rly not an issue (doing 24-28s)

[severe hatch]

Are you ever overcapping on rage?

[opal python]

hm yh :/

thats bad

[severe hatch]

That's your issue

[devout pecan]

is anybody running Fueled by Violence Conduit? doesnt seem to be working, the heal isnt shown in details?

[opal python]

but also sooo many elvui errors and lag lately

[lusty grotto]

bloodborne is bad

[opal python]

make it awkward sometimes

[severe hatch]

You want to spam IP to prevent overcapping

Should fix your banner uptime once you do that

[opal python]

but i think just making sure im spamming revenge/ip as much will be ok

hm yh

banner seems strong, just not used to it :P

was playing prot back in bfa, then beta

[opal python]

i mean not rly

[lusty grotto]

it is

[opal python]

at 70 im running this

[lusty grotto]

its 1.5% increase

[opal python]

1 point only

yh

its not huge

[lusty grotto]

youre losing throughput elsewhere

[severe hatch]

Good to practice now, you'll still want to prio spending rage in DF. Even without banner the playstyle is still rewarded via Anger Management CDR

[opal python]

dont get me wrong

its not massive increase

[tired forge]

should i prioritize revenge spam or IP?

[lusty grotto]

no im getting you wrong

because its a waste talent

that can be elsewhere

[opal python]

but that 1 point is fine i could drop that and maybe

if i rly wanna dump into dmg, i guess dance?

but higher keys prob go party shield wall

[cold kiln]

I think revenge vs IP is a matter of survivability, if you are fine and not dying you spam dps. If you are struggling to stay alive use IP

[opal python]

for df

[modern brook]

The 1 point is used at lvl 70 when you have 5 more to fuck with

It's 100% not worth it at current level

You don't get access to roar or words

[severe hatch]

Imo Bloodborne should be made a 1 point talent and it'd be competitive

[modern brook]

Its increase on rend is negligible when everyone's bursting for 100k

[modern brook]

It's fine as is

Just not at level 60

When you don't have access to the major tools and cooldowns that make it worth while

[granite nest]

We don't actively press Rend, correct? It just applies from B&T Thunder Clap? Therefore, I can YEET this from my bars?

[modern brook]

Yeahp

[severe hatch]

Yep

[granite nest]

🙏 Ty

[devout pecan]

what legendarys are you guys running?

[runic sparrow]

seems like reprisal is still the only one that really makes sense

[jagged pier]

no

wall for raid

[bold furnace]

I tried seismic last night

[jagged pier]

siesmic for m+

[modern brook]

Wall seismic also exist yeah

[runic sparrow]

why wall instead of just taking talent?

[bold furnace]

It was pretty bonkers

[jagged pier]

well u dont need to take the talent

and u have enough block

from talents u have to take

and u have enough rage gen for banner

[runic sparrow]

what do you take over wall in talents then?

yeah banner is stupid easy to maintain rn

[jagged pier]

[bold furnace]

[urban portal]

You would rather have seismic leggo and wall talent

Than other way around

[exotic summit]

Hello everyone, so still haste/vers ?

[runic sparrow]

yeah i disagree with most of those talent choices, but to each their own.

[severe hatch]

It's pre-patch, you do you boo

Maybe test out both yours and the recommended to see how they compare in the real world

[lusty grotto]

where are people getting this vers shit?

[south zealot]

true gamers use rerisal

reprisal

[lusty grotto]

i swear to god

who keeps recommending vers?

[severe hatch]

It's turning the frogs gay

[south zealot]

haste vers and haste crit are both good

[lusty grotto]

because i guarantee its nobody in this disc

[south zealot]

why are u so upset

[mighty valley]

vers has its advantages in like... truly cutting edge keys

everywhere else it's ilvl > haste> whatever

crit is fun

[lofty widget]

yall ignoring vers is also good for dmg?

[south zealot]

vers does damage as well

crit is better for damage but vers is still good

[sick sentinel]

I've never seen someone so angry about someone saying the word vers

[lusty grotto]

its good for the key level you 're at Chimmi

[sick sentinel]

Like the boogie man

OOooooOooOooo

[lusty grotto]

the rest of us dont need it

[sick sentinel]

Vers

[lofty widget]

im also using crit haste but still

[mighty valley]

we've been dealing with two years of "how much vers do i need to tank a +7" so it can be a source of irritation

[urban portal]

It’s just another stat

[lofty widget]

not a bad stat

[urban portal]

Flip a coin

Heads vers tails crit

[modern brook]

4

[mighty valley]

lmao good luck surviving without at least 6

[lusty grotto]

👆

[sick sentinel]

Only two years?

Lol

[south zealot]

na is back up

[jagged pier]

at least 0%

[south zealot]

idk if its been said here

[modern brook]

i meant 4 years

[lusty grotto]

more than that

[sick sentinel]

Someone forgot about the TD v Versatile battle of S4 BfA

[lusty grotto]

vers was only prime when we just did corruption

[weary idol]

servers are up

[sick sentinel]

LOG IN

[modern brook]

verse stacking was vom tbh

[lusty grotto]

and that was 100% solved by "you do low keys then go TD" otherwise go versatile

[mighty valley]

i don't want to log in there's vers on there

i'm scared

[south zealot]

wtf

my ui was reset to default

[modern brook]

you were the issue

[severe hatch]

Blizz doesn't want to straight up tell you to quit, but they'd like to strongly suggest it

[mighty valley]

now that content creators are calling us meta i'm bracing for new levels of "how much vers i need" and "what's a good ip uptime"

[lusty grotto]

its just BFA s2 all over again

history repeats itself

but yes that's gonna happen

[modern brook]

bfa s2 had 👢 🍵 👏 which was fun to type to make up for it

[lusty grotto]

we'll have us chads that parsed high as fuck on zul going like "now?"

and some of them will be upset about it

[smoky dock]

Next few weeks will be interesting warriors are amazing but the nerf bat will be annoying

[sick sentinel]

Memes aside, Llarold has Vers #2 among secondaries maybe read your own specs WH guide before raging. @lusty grotto

[smoky dock]

Lots of tank classes will see few nerfs

[sick sentinel]

That's where they get it from

[smoky dock]

Probably dmg though not surviving

[exotic summit]

wowhead

[modern brook]

its pre patch

[lusty grotto]

i dont read WH, cause mwahi does icy veins not wowhead

[modern brook]

they're not nerfing anything

[jagged pier]

omg please its pre patch

the tuning is fucked

[sick sentinel]

Doesn't change my statement

[jagged pier]

why do ppl forget this every expansion

[lusty grotto]

it doesnt, but the WH guide never mattered

[sick sentinel]

You asked the dumb question not me

[smoky dock]

Lol wasn’t exactly talking about pre patch I’m on beta I just see tanks blasting shit

[strong forum]

why would prot be nerfed

[lusty grotto]

why are you so upset

[strong forum]

as of right now i dont think we're that much better than any particular tank

[jagged pier]

prots been nerfed the most times out of all tanks so far

[lusty grotto]

ty for letting me know that WH is still terrible though

[severe hatch]

Can't we all just get along

[jagged pier]

also this

[sick sentinel]

Says the guy that raged about someone saying the words Vers

[jagged pier]

they fix the bugs

[strong forum]

i think

[smoky dock]

@jagged pier Good point

[oak echo]

weird the IV guide also has vers listed 2nd along with crit, which is what everyone here is saying too

[strong forum]

new stat prio is ilvl > haste > crit >= vers > mastery

imo

[smoky dock]

How I see it is either tank is great at surviving or great and dmg lol and prot warrior is both

[strong forum]

i had 81% uptime on wild strikes

[wild hemlock]

yo nome do we need healers lololol

[severe hatch]

Just avoid Mastery and you're good YEP

[strong forum]

not a single tank needs a healer rn i think

until quite high keys

[wild hemlock]

i was memeing

[strong forum]

maybe monk does

[smoky dock]

Monks I think

[wild hemlock]

remember a few months ago discord lost their minds when u said that

[smoky dock]

Druids maybe?

[urban portal]

Wouldn’t mastery be better now that we have more block uptime

[smoky dock]

Didn’t test them much tho

[strong forum]

no, mastery is not good at all

our block is already overkill

[wild hemlock]

actually i dont remember if it was u or jakey

[strong forum]

mastery got worse

[sick sentinel]

Nim just proving he hasn't read either guide and just wants to throw things around.

[strong forum]

nim is out for blood today

[lusty grotto]

free real estate in this guys mind

[sick sentinel]

Lol

[severe hatch]

You go from not dying to a blocked hit to... not dying to a blocked hit with more Mastery

[lusty grotto]

im just living the dream

[sick sentinel]

Implying I have a mind

[south zealot]

USE CRIT OR VERS IT DOESNT MATTER

[smoky dock]

I don’t want to scroll up lol why are we talking about verse so much?

[sick sentinel]

Jokes on you buddy

[severe hatch]

I'm hungry for ravioli now

[south zealot]

missives

[wild hemlock]

WE DONT NEED HEALRS

[smoky dock]

Ohh 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[oak echo]

because some people just like to watch the world burn

[smoky dock]

Thank you

Just rocking haste and vers stacking crit would be entertaining

[sick sentinel]

[strong forum]

these are my stats rn

[sand drum]

Nom, just did a 19 streets with 7,8K dps feels like I played normal (atleast towards end of dung)

[sand drum]

low or what do you think

[strong forum]

ya 7.8k is quite low

[wild hemlock]

yeah

[strong forum]

i did 17k in the streets 25

[strong forum]

my highest pre-DF was already 18.7k in streets

[south zealot]

nome has hella crit lmaoo

[strong forum]

i even gemmed vers

cuz it simmed higher

[south zealot]

grimrail 21 (21.7k overall)

[strong forum]

bit low on the SS there

thats my 22.6k on grimrail 25

[south zealot]

tru

i use all my outbursts on thunderlcap

thunderclap

[strong forum]

yeah nah

[sand drum]

didnt play avatar tc cd :C

[strong forum]

only use it on thunderclap on 4+ targets

[south zealot]

ravager hmm

[strong forum]

otherwise on SS

[strong forum]

ya im playing the "no shield spec" build

[south zealot]

oh its 4 targets

i was even doing it on 2 or 3 targets

[strong forum]

dont do that nop

[lofty widget]

are you all forgoing SS to TC d uring ava with UF?

[south zealot]

on 1 i would always do SS

[south zealot]

absolutely

[strong forum]

nah, only on 4+ during avatar

[south zealot]

in aoe

[strong forum]

outside of avatar on 6

[lofty widget]

only did 1 key so far and thats my breakdown

[strong forum]

needs more revenge

[lofty widget]

feels like i had no time to revenge

[south zealot]

in aoe i just spam revenge then tclap

[lofty widget]

cause ava was up all the time it felt and had to get ss on cd as well

[strong forum]

ya in large enoguh targetcount you fore-go SS

and just send revenge/tc

[lofty widget]

makes more sense

[south zealot]

51k crits 😩

crazy world where thunderclap doubles execute crits

[mighty valley]

with rend spreading a lot more of our damage goes way up with pull size

[lusty grotto]

and will go higher on fort weeks

[south zealot]

@strong forum does your no shield spec build do more damage

[lusty grotto]

because rend just lasts longer

[south zealot]

or is it very similar

[mighty valley]

annoying that our first week of play with these talents is inspiring, so we have to think about pulls at least a little bit

[south zealot]

more rend and deep wounds for more rage gen as well which is more outburst

if you use it

[cold kiln]

how did you get a 51k crit?

[lusty grotto]

outburst

[south zealot]

all in avatar with banner up

can do more if u pop a strength pot

[modern brook]

he estimated earlier today its about 2k overall ahead

[south zealot]

ah didnt see

interesting might have to try it out

[modern brook]

it was way earlier today

like 5 hours ago

[cold kiln]

Is outburst a talent now?

[lusty grotto]

so lets see if they fixed the outburst TC at 7 thing

[south zealot]

yes

[severe hatch]

Pls update when you test, that shit was so annoying. Stuck at work rn

[strong forum]

havent tested other builds

but id assume so yeah

[brittle vine]

i don't know if anyone else has had this but i was using Impenetrable Wall but the group was getting the buff from Unbreakable Will, anyone else had that bug?

[strong forum]

heard about it yet

[south zealot]

a lot squishier tho right

[south zealot]

heard about it but havent seen it happen

[modern brook]

you still maintain 100% shieldblock uptime due to taking champions bulwark

so not "alot" squishier

[brittle vine]

some friends and I did a M2 to just see shigs, and a mate noticed it

[south zealot]

tclap at 7 still removes ur stacks

of seething rage or whatever its called

seeing red*

[oak echo]

do we track outburst stacks in any meaningful way to min/max or just let it do its thing since you tclap and SS so often anyways

[south zealot]

yeah but the block value seems rough to lose

[modern brook]

K value hasnt increased

[jagged pier]

yes its worth because sometimes u want it on SS and sometimes u want it on TC and u want to track it atm as at 7 stacks a TC will consume it

[modern brook]

to my knowledge at least

[south zealot]

you could also just use heavy repercussions ONLY for shield block

and not play enduring defenses

[strong forum]

absolutely

if you dont min-max outburst you lose so much dmg

[south zealot]

especially in single target and huge aoe

in like 3-6 targets its not a huge deal but u should still try to optimize it

but if youre pulling like 25 murlocs and you use it on shield slam you lost big dam

[tardy sequoia]

for raid is it better reprisal or seismic?

[strong forum]

reprisal

seismic does nothing in raid

[modern brook]

seismic doesnt proc unless theres 3+ targets

so

[chrome falcon]

i feel like the answer to that is pretty simple depending on the fight

there are like maybe 3 or 4 fights where seismic can pump

but the overwhelming majority don't have 3+ sustained targets

[modern brook]

maybe its got some value in mote cheesing but yeah reprisal or the wall would be your go tos

[tardy sequoia]

maybe reprisal is still better than the wall in ST

[onyx briar]

How does one manage 100% sb uptime?

[pallid isle]

easily

[graceful wadi]

m+ build not having ravager sounds awful

[jagged pier]

https://tenor.com/view/no-bugs-bunny-nope-gif-14359850

[severe hatch]

The truth hurts sometimes

[urban portal]

Reprisal indirectly got nerfed

Due to bsc nerf

[strong forum]

well

[urban portal]

But you didn’t take bsc in raid

So yeah

[strong forum]

technically speaking

reprisal is better in raid

cuz it opens up block talents to be used for more dmg

[jagged pier]

not from what ive seen nome

im literally raiding right now

[strong forum]

hm

[odd tree]

it feels weird at first. i kept pressing my hotkey and then dps would steal agroe

[fervent kestrel]

Reprisal feels so clunky to play with. Like, we already have enough to manage and look for, I personally don't like adding more with that

[jagged pier]

like u dont need bolster

[strong forum]

https://www.wowhead.com/beta/talent-calc/warrior/protection/DAPAVRUUUkUREQlBAQBEMVUVEVERFVRQFDUBA

i think you could play this

with reprisal

[odd tree]

we're all used to it by now. i found myself trying to intervene to melee in keys when i 1) didn't have intervene, 2) was running seismic anyway

[mighty valley]

yeah, using seismic in keys and i feel like i'm being lazy

despite still having a billion cpm

[odd tree]

hardwired into my gameplay

[bleak scroll]

Did they nerf the proc rate of Bloodsurge?

[jagged pier]

i dunno looseing outburst is kinda huge

[strong forum]

it is

but you gain ravager

and more rage gen in general

ravager is 5% dmg alone

[south zealot]

heavy reprecussions talent

thats basically all you need

[jagged pier]

i dunno like SS is 35-40% of my damage on ST

loosing outburst is a huge part of that

[onyx briar]

Ah ok, ss extending sb

[south zealot]

any use in juggernaut on tyran keys?

[strong forum]

well yeah i know that SS is that much of your dmg

[south zealot]

or is punish just more damage overall

[strong forum]

but you spend 4 talent points to get outburst

[jagged pier]

ill try it but i highly doubt its more

[strong forum]

when sc+ battering ram (also more SS reset)+ ravager if 4 points to get 3 dmg talents

[jagged pier]

maybe the same

[south zealot]

but booming voiceeee

[modern brook]

punish is a damage increase for 100% of the fight, rather than 20% of the fight

punish will be more damage

[south zealot]

booming voice with thunderlord is sexy

[south zealot]

massacre op

[modern brook]

even with massacre, i dont think punish loses to aj lmao

[south zealot]

probably not

[bright veldt]

when I use thunder clap, it applies rend is this supposed to be or a bug?

[south zealot]

wait my execute as prot has a cd

[strong forum]

intended

[blazing condor]

its supposed to be like that

[ionic fern]

"Thunder and Blood" talent on the class tree.

[lusty grotto]

read the talent

[modern brook]

improved execute is what gets rid of the cd, and is apparently not in the tree

[blazing condor]

i know the old talent that did this was named Blood and Thunder why switch it up like that

[bright veldt]

can't even find that talent

[lusty grotto]

QoL

[ionic fern]

Below TC.

[blazing condor]

oh nvm

[south zealot]

wait so

[bright veldt]

but it says IF YOU HAVE REND not that it applies rend. I didn't have rend on any target at all. Weird that when I search for the talent it doesn't come up..

[severe hatch]

Found the alliance player

[south zealot]

execute was made EVEN worse

wtf

[lusty grotto]

read again

[south zealot]

if you have rend as an ability

[lusty grotto]

slowly

[blazing condor]

Wait so Rend doesnt even have to be applied?

to then spread

[grave crane]

It says it affects with rend 5 targets

[severe hatch]

Correct

[blazing condor]

weirdge

[lusty grotto]

it doesnt say "if a mob has rend applied"

[fervent kestrel]

Correct. It applies Rend if you have Rent talented

[bright veldt]

oh

[vivid orchid]

this current build has so many bugs in it that have already been fixed on beta also

[blazing condor]

so you wont even have rend on your bars in that case?

[lusty grotto]

we should put up a pin for this cause its coming up so much

[bright veldt]

thought it was like the old talent back in tbc or where they had it

[lusty grotto]

no you dont need to use rend or have it on bars

[lusty grotto]

wrath

[blazing condor]

idk about that design

[sick sentinel]

Immersion

[blazing condor]

weird to spec into an ability to not use it

[sick sentinel]

It's staying on my bars

[bright veldt]

well thanks 🙂 I will remove it cause then it makes no sense having it

[sick sentinel]

How else would I complain about button bloat if I don't!

[blazing condor]

⛵

[south zealot]

dude execute is so shit

[lusty grotto]

but you are using it, with TC

[sick sentinel]

Boat

Whoops

[mighty valley]

Boat

[blazing condor]

you are not pressing the ability in itself - it is just used for you through another ability

is what i mean

[sick sentinel]

Any button boaters?

[vivid orchid]

so b&t used to need you to use rend in earlier builds, and now they changed the talent to not - suffice to say they quite simply ran out of dev time to implement a clean solution. thus we have rend sit in our spellbook not pressed

[knotty stump]

HIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

HNOIP

[lusty grotto]

sure but why is that a problem

[mighty valley]

i think it's clean now. don't need to press another button. genius

[vivid orchid]

it is clean

[knotty stump]

BJ

[blazing condor]

i just personally think it's weird to design it that way. but just opinion

[fervent merlin]

what legendary do we use now instead of the reprisal incase u dont wanna play or etc, i know wall but thts lazy option and boring

[blazing condor]

seismic

[lusty grotto]

and we had WW in our spellbook during all of SL and still didnt use it

[mighty valley]

seismic reverb for aoe dmg

[lusty grotto]

so 🤷

[mighty valley]

wall is fine for raiding, just frees up a talent point

[fervent merlin]

do u talent into siesmic even if u have the leggo?

[lusty grotto]

not to mention hamstring

[mighty valley]

no

[vivid orchid]

the reason can be argued twofold though - 1: we need the extra dot to trigger bloodsurge more often, and 2: they would have to give us another talent point to prevent us from taking another capstone or something later (forced talent allocation restriction)

[blazing condor]

WW and Hamstring had no use

but it'd be weird to have hamstring if you had an ability that made every mob within 10 yards get hamstring applied

[lusty grotto]

i dont understand why we're even discussing this

[blazing condor]

you telling me there's better ways to spend an evening?

[vivid orchid]

this exact discussion occured 12 years ago

btw

[blazing condor]

back in the day it was Deep Wounds that spread though at least so you still had rend

at least that was the case in cata idk about earlier

[lusty grotto]

im well aware

im a vanilla baby

[sick sentinel]

Well baby is right

Gottem

[lusty grotto]

or as its called now a "boomer"

[mighty valley]

vanilla old man

i was in the beta for vanilla 👴

[lusty grotto]

haha

[sick sentinel]

I was the beta for vanilla

Check mate

[blazing condor]

my mom invented blizzard

so

[lusty grotto]

you want old screenies?

[blazing condor]

no

[sick sentinel]

And I've been... Nevermind.

[lusty grotto]

to answer the weird design comment

it was a quality of life change

it was suggested to not have to use rend

because like it has been mentioned, it adds to button bloat

it is an improvement and there's not much else to look into

[blazing condor]

i mean i get it, and it's much better than having more buttons to press. If it didn't exist you'd just macro rend into charge or something anyway

so don't get me wrong

[bright veldt]

is it just me who thinks defensive stance just sounds broken? Have we lost other defensives so we just get it back with the 20% DR?

[mighty valley]

part of the goal of the new talent system was to have a better leveling experience, and from that point of view, it'll seem totally fine

[blazing condor]

i just principally don't like it

[mighty valley]

"oh cool. there's a combo i can take that casts this thing for free. neato"

[mighty valley]

yes, during beta they nerfed some of our passive defense, so dstance seems sort of like the "standard"

it's hard to tell right now though since all tanks are kinda immortal gods

[chilly canyon]

hey, no shock wave? oO

[bright veldt]

only time will tell then 🙂

[bold wave]

ahh man my complete UI is fucked up 😄 the errors get me into 20-30 fps lagspikes 😄 straight alt + f4. ill wait 2-3 days till everything is fixed 😄

[humble sierra]

anyone have a general ideal of what talents we using for raid and mythic+,

[fervent kestrel]

Icy-Veins and Wowhead are updated with guides on current talent builds

[lusty grotto]

read pins

[humble sierra]

I seen those but something don't seem right with the raid an mythic+ talents. seems like they are backwards

[sick sentinel]

That's an update stuff angle.

[grave crane]

We’ll try your own build out and see how it feels?

[south zealot]

this 7/8 stack bug is so annoying bro

[bold wave]

yee cant update everything. some addons still miss updates etc. currently no time for a complete fix on this.

[lusty grotto]

tweet it @orchid steeplecraftDevs

rip that guy

[mighty valley]

the worst part of prepatch is not being able to use orgrimmar training dummies

basically unplayable game

[south zealot]

i can