when dk is doing like 15-16k dps overall and having 55% parry 24/7
#protection
zealous willow
crystal iris
Tbf it’s a fkn hard tank to play
chrome falcon
good pwarrs were also doing 15k dps
crystal iris
Compared to the others
ionic fern
when dk is doing like 15-16k dps overall and having 55% parry 24/7
We are also doing 15-16k and we don't rely on RNG parry for our DR.
👀
strong forum
BDK does slightly more dmg due to gavel
thorny stone
when dk is doing like 15-16k dps overall and having 55% parry 24/7
We are also doing 16k dps
zealous willow
i dont say we are bad , i said why we must act like its not good
thorny stone
Exactly
zealous willow
to get buff
strong forum
but we dont
chrome falcon
i mean we're not complaining
zealous willow
we must be happy that we are not in druid position forgoten 😄
strong forum
everyone who knows, says pwar doesnt need buffs
lofty widget
theres a differnece between a good buff and a necesarry buff
this one wasnt necesarry
chrome falcon
i mean this buff at least makes sense
lofty widget
ofc we'll take it
strong forum
its 99% of the community screaming about how bad pwar is
cuz they dont fucking know
thats why we get buffs
urban portal
the execute buff was just
Probably to keep parity with arms
chrome falcon
yeah it's just annoying to see that blizz's perception of us is also driven by community perception of us
crystal iris
I mean it doesn’t hurt to buff a class no one plays
strong forum
which is why it got buffed in the first place duru yes
urban portal
Think it’s the same execute
strong forum
extremely low participation
chrome falcon
it makes absolutely no sense for us to be the best execute dps in the game
urban portal
Like the same Spell Id or something
strong forum
yes
dawn canyon
if ur not tanking
strong forum
it is
crystal iris
Also it’s not that we’re bad, it’s just that it’s so much easier to obtain the same or better results with other tank specs
urban portal
And they are too lazy to have a prot execute
ionic fern
Tbf a lot of prot warriors have said that IP should have a higher cap. So it's a good thing. 👀
strong forum
^
ionic fern
Like..not just random shitty prot warriors
strong forum
this current IP buff was defo correct to do
chrome falcon
just for "i hate this fucking ability so much" reasons
waxen orbit
Yeah I’ve been saying this since day 1 of the expac lmao
ionic fern
Yeah.
crystal iris
I feel like IP is hard to balance though
strong forum
we've been calling for this since fucking BFA pre-patch
crystal iris
Since absorbs don’t scale like DR
crystal iris
Y’a and that’s great
chrome falcon
IP was pretty balanced for most of legion
and shield barrier was also balanced like, forever
crystal iris
But the 18k IP a won’t go as far in a 23 than it will in a 15 so it’s a fine line
waxen orbit
Yeah what? This buff is huge lmao
strong forum
and neither will it in 23s
the per-key-press IP will also increase by30%
thats HUGE value
waxen orbit
23s right now your IP doesn’t get consumed fully
waxen orbit
Melees can def break an IP in a 27 fort though that’s cope
strong forum
you need to take a 60k hit post mit, to break a max stacked IP in 1 hit
and a post mit 60k hit, doesnt exist outside of interruptible casts for us
waxen orbit
But it’s not like we’re ever using just a single IP
strong forum
exactly
urban portal
Melees can def break an IP in a 27 fort though that’s cope
Melees do like 12k with shield block up or something
strong forum
less
crystal iris
If we’re being honest though
waxen orbit
Melees do like 12k with shield block up or something
Yeah you taking like 8 at once on most pulls
urban portal
So it take a bit more than 1 swing
crystal iris
30% IP a buff isn’t what’s stopping people playing warrior
strong forum
its not, but itll help
waxen orbit
It’s community perception
urban portal
It’s the 79 apm
waxen orbit
And it being difficult
strong forum
reprisal is the biggest thing that turns people away
crystal iris
It’s reprisal / SB uptime and difficulty
strong forum
It’s the 79 apm
make that 85
urban portal
I just see 79 on st
strong forum
in keys i have up to 86cpm
strong forum
ya thats sims
waxen orbit
In keys your CPM is higher
strong forum
nah in pure ST cpm will be higher
crystal iris
In keys I feel like I’m playing the piano
strong forum
cuz you can focus harder
crystal iris
Feels like I’m gonna need to change my IP key
lofty widget
4 is best
strong forum
F
waxen orbit
Since Legion
strong forum
4 is shieldslam
waxen orbit
Nah bro that’s 1
lofty widget
1!! is SS
crystal iris
Mine is « q » nice and close. « E » for SB
strong forum
1 is a shit button to press
agile pumice
I thought you meant 4 CPM lmao
strong forum
why would you use your main button there
waxen orbit
Not with a numbered mouse
crystal iris
M’y 1 is charge haha
waxen orbit
crystal iris
3 for SS is the play
chrome falcon
daily reminder that the only thing that should be on 1 is your devastator icon
and if it's not
strong forum
imagine not using the thing specifically designed for fast presses
chrome falcon
you've not been playing long enough
thorny stone
If we were fucking OP (and thereby meta), I don't think we would be a popular tank either way.
agile pumice
I put shadowstrike on 1 in sub and it makes my hand ache cause I hit 1 with pinky
strong forum
and instead use a scuffed mouse which is alot less sturdy
waxen orbit
you've not been playing long enough
Nah that’s cope
I been playing 12 years bro get that passive icon off yo bars
chrome falcon
honestly i still can't bring myself to put anything on 1
crystal iris
Are they removing reprisal for dragon?
chrome falcon
but what is devastate comes back
lofty widget
how do you not have anything one 1
chrome falcon
how are we supposed to know that
strong forum
average melee hit in a 29 tyr halls is 8.4k
waxen orbit
Are they removing reprisal for dragon?
If God is real then yeah
lofty widget
literally easiest button to press
trail rune
devastate is unbound
pallid quiver
I'm pretty sure mine's still one 1, too
lofty widget
devastate is my execute bind atm and i dont plan to rebind that
chrome falcon
how do you not have anything one 1
i mean i put devastate on there then it got removed, but they didn't add a new button in its place, and i wasn't going to move a button onto 1 because what if devastate came back? then i'd have to get used to my old keybinds again
and they still haven't added a new core rotational ability so
but
crystal iris
Would I still get shit for wanting to play the wall in keys?
crystal iris
Saw someone using it in a 15 the other day
chrome falcon
rep is annoying but it is ridiculously powerful
strong forum
Would I still get shit for wanting to play the wall in keys?
100%
chrome falcon
yeah that was a 15
pallid quiver
You'd, at the very least, get shit for it here
lofty widget
i mean i put devastate on there then it got removed, but they didn't add a *new*...
perks of joining in late bfa i guess
crystal iris
Hahaha fine fine I’ll drop it
chrome falcon
i could do a 15 with no legendaries and no tier set
strong forum
reprisal is a key reason why pwar can exist at all
chrome falcon
you could do a 15 with no legendaries and no tier
crystal iris
I’m just a lazy tank
thorny stone
Would I still get shit for wanting to play the wall in keys?
You can do a 15 without a shield if you try.
strong forum
if you didnt have reprisal, youd need to play bolster, which means less block uptime, which means less avatar, less rage, less SW, less tierset
crystal iris
And I need to make a focus intervene macro
chrome falcon
perks of joining in late bfa i guess
you're screwed when they bring back devastate and heroic strike in dragonflight bud
hard vessel
How bad is it going to macro ip into revenge next patch? I mean we will have so much haste our rage Gen will explode or not?
pallid quiver
i couldn't do a 15 with no legendaries or gear because i'd get told pwar bad by the pugs and told to fuck off until i had three leggos and two tier sets
strong forum
dont macro abilities together
chrome falcon
just learn to press buttons faster
strong forum
unless its a specific different keybind
urban portal
Macro banner with ls 
strong forum
exclusively used to dump during LS + rav
chrome falcon
literally the only abilities i have macro'd are LS/banner/avatar for the pull on raid bosses
that's it
hard vessel
K thats what I thought
crystal iris
For raid y’a
chrome falcon
making revenge cost 55 rage will go extremely poorly for you
crystal iris
For keys you’d r’ have raid coming out your eyeballs
hard vessel
Just played warrior 1 key and then 1 dk key after 3 month break and holy shit dk is like holiday easy mode
chrome falcon
yep
strong forum
yep
crystal iris
So is pally so is brew
hard vessel
Yep
crystal iris
It’s my carry tank
hard vessel
But basic toolkit is kind giga easy to understand as pally
crystal iris
Can be tank DPS and healer at the same time
Like if people need A carry pally is my go to
Just the interrupts alone
hard vessel
Ye I kinda wish warriors had some kind of this special utility to carry your pugs
Besides 1 Mio aoe stops
waxen orbit
That would probably truck our class fantasy
crystal iris
How is necrotic with pwar? i know it’s good since we mitigate more but IP a being useless above 20 stacks is annoying
waxen orbit
We’re not exactly trained in any healing service
lofty widget
big dmg+invincible in low keys not enough?
waxen orbit
How is necrotic with pwar? i know it’s good since we mitigate more but IP a bein...
Necrotic still exists?
crystal iris
big dmg+invincible in low keys not enough?
More mob control would be nice
hard vessel
Some kind of knock back like Taifun
crystal iris
I want gag order
mighty valley
i forget about necrotic until the handful of packs with tons and tons of small fast attackers
waxen orbit
Hella easy to drop stacks and you can basically just tough out the high stacks with shield wall
mighty valley
then you might need to walk a few seconds to reset
crystal iris
Second pull of Nw is a nightmare
lofty widget
i reset my necrotic stacks in first pull gambit today with parry alone was sick
crystal iris
I hit 60 stacks instantly, cleanse and it jumps back to 50 few seconds later
strong forum
cuz thats 4 packs
crystal iris
My second pull is usually just the relic pack. Sometimes relic + the jumper patrol
crystal iris
20 seconds
Should
waxen orbit
crystal iris
If people played like they should prot would be wonderful
crystal iris
I try the third Goliath pull and have 4 ranged adds chain casting on me lol
thorny stone
My second pull is usually just the relic pack. Sometimes relic + the jumper patr...
Try to pick the 5 guys on the entrance, the non elite mobs where the spear is and the relic pull
Then second pull is boss+ the pack that is in the middle of the room
crystal iris
Try to pick the 5 guys on the entrance, the non elite mobs where the spear is an...
That’s 3 fleshcradters in 1 pull?
waxen orbit
You have Kyrian buff my brother in Christ
thorny stone
That’s 3 fleshcradters in 1 pull?
Not that, the entrance one are the ones that jump around, I don't know what they are called
crystal iris
You’re talking about first pull of the key?
Oh you skip the pack at the bottom of the stairs interesting
Was gonna say 2 vanguards 3 fleshcrafters sounds like death
crystal iris
Meh I like NW
lofty widget
NW is so carried
mighty valley
trains (derogatory)
crystal iris
Exactly it was easy but that kind of made it fun
agile pumice
Gonna pin this convo for 14.0 when nw comes back
crystal iris
As long as I don’t see spires again
lofty widget
RIP ToP tho, favourite dungeon...
mighty valley
nw is overall easy but sometimes people bully me into going kyrian for it
crystal iris
You guys make me wanna try a prot key now
mighty valley
so bad
mighty valley
i don't pug so i don't really play with meta people
just whoever in the guild is online
chrome falcon
tbf no amount of "woo i don't have to do [this bad dungeon] anymore
is gonna compensate
for mechagon and FUCKING GRIMRAIL DEPOT
crystal iris
What trinkets are we liking for S4?
chrome falcon
ows rdm aegis
lofty widget
someone speak up and admit you voted grimrail depot i dare you
train go choo tho 😦
crystal iris
RDM good?
lofty widget
RDM is insane
chrome falcon
rdm very good
you always wear ows and then aegis if you're scared, rdm if you're not
crystal iris
Wasn’t sure since I thought it worked a bit like codex
mighty valley
rdm sneaks by despite being very strong because it's in the same patch as aegis and ows
crystal iris
But if we aren’t supposed to take much damage compared to other tanks what’s it reflecting?
thorny stone
Something like this, I don't remember the exact route, I don't have my sub active atm
crystal iris
Was the codex logic i thought
chrome falcon
the difference is the RDM is flat
crystal iris
I should try this
mighty valley
it also actually has main stat
chrome falcon
no that's codex..
crystal iris
Ahh kk been a while
mighty valley
waxen orbit
nw is overall easy but sometimes people bully me into going kyrian for it
You’re the tank bro just tell them they go Kyrian or you leave and they sit in LFG looking for a rando for another 45 minutes
thorny stone
someone speak up and admit you voted grimrail depot i dare you
I did, i started playing on shadowlands an a friend told me to vote for it, that the train was a super good dungeon
crystal iris
It’s funny because I believe you guys, but just from the text you’d think that % is better than flat due to scaling
strong forum
it applies after IP
so its reduces already 80% reduced dmg by 10%
so thats 2% reduction
chrome falcon
mighty valley
You’re the tank bro just tell them they go Kyrian or you leave and they sit in L...
i'm too polite to my friends. and also want to do the dungeon as well
strong forum
RDM has mainstat, and does 400dps and hps
codex has stamina and does 300dps and 300 hps
crystal iris
Lol
strong forum
and thats a 239 rdm btw
a 304 rdm will do over 1k dps and 1k hps + have loads of str
crystal iris
I’m pumped
strong forum
itll go fucking crazy
crystal iris
Don’t think I’ll be able to buy it tho I main fury for raid
mighty valley
we're all going to be... so busted this patch
crystal iris
I’ll just pray
meager vine
Is Necrolord still the best for M+
chrome falcon
yes
crystal iris
I’ve gone 15 weeks no gavel I’m buying that shit right away
chrome falcon
one of my DKs did hc jailer+ 1 hc vault slot every week
and didn't get hc gavel until the week after we killed it on mythic
crystal iris
Although you don’t have to re-buy old items right? I already have dual Jaithys so I can just upgrade them?
chrome falcon
most of those hc jailer kills were with 5+ traders
no you need to have a season 4 version
lofty widget
Although you don’t have to re-buy old items right? I already have dual Jaithys s...
nope needs the "fated" tag to be upgradeable
mighty valley
the only exception is sylvanas bow
bold nimbus
Don’t think I’ll be able to buy it tho I main fury for raid
Atleast u gonna have ows
crystal iris
True
That shit killed me the other day LOL
Sapped me of my last 3k HP on fury
Alright time to go try a prot key
Oh can someone share intervene focus macro?
Currently I have charge and A mouseover intervene macro on the same macro
crystal iris
Well ideally one what works if I don’t have a focus
mighty valley
not a fan of focus target personally, i just mouseover raid frames
crystal iris
I tend to use a focus kick which is why I don’t have an Intervene one
crystal iris
not a fan of focus target personally, i just mouseover raid frames
That’s what I do currently
you guys are by far the most entertaining class disc btw
as annoying as you are
grave crane
I go for udualting maneuvers on the bottom right tbh but that could be preference
drifting fable
its better
waxen orbit
You absolutely should
chrome falcon
^
drifting fable
the left side is garbage in comparison
chrome falcon
undulating maneuvers makes you tankier
and inspiring presence is basically as good as condensed
inspiring presence can save a run
mighty valley
rally vs shockwave cd vs safeguard is basically a pref/dungeon call
i usually do inspiring... partially so i don't need to swap for raid
strong forum
inspiring presence can save a run
safeguard*
chrome falcon
nah i still don't agree with this
maybe if you're hard pushing and have someone who needs saving
lofty widget
safeguard is def the play for higher keys
chrome falcon
but if you're doing like a 23 and someone misses a stun on some stealthings or something
you're gonna want a group wide CD
for most people doing most keys IP is more likely to save a run
lofty widget
i think youll get more value on avg from safeguard in a coordinated group
chrome falcon
i just can't think of many situations where it's like
"this person is about to take a huge amount of unavoidable damage and i have enough warning that i can safeguard them"
i can think of plenty of situations where someone fucks up and everyone is about to get blasted
lofty widget
xav, beryllia, kul tharok, last boss soa
just to name a few
ive definitely saved my hunter plenty times with safeguard
chrome falcon
but again definitely in an organised group pushing very high i can see it
sick sentinel
i think youll get more value on avg from safeguard in a coordinated group
true, but the player doesn't really have to be aware your dr-ing them for it to work in a pug either
chrome falcon
what am i missing about soa where safeguard is good
lofty widget
last boss you get double debuff
chrome falcon
and like on xav, beryl and last boss soa a giant rally is still very useful
lofty widget
i mean its not huge there, but it helps cause that debuf trucks
sick sentinel
its just like, ah, im intervening you now and you don't die this time for some reason
lofty widget
and like on xav, beryl and last boss soa a giant rally is still very useful
yes but youll prob only get 1 good rally on those, whereas you can intervene every big dmg spike
on your squishiest dps/healer
crystal iris
I go for udualting maneuvers on the bottom right tbh but that could be preferenc...
ty
stats?
This late in the season ive got a lot of similar rings and crap
sweet summit
ilvl>haste>vers>=crit>mastery
crystal iris
mastery that low eh? kk
sweet summit
it's the least best stat, and you get a lot from banner
crystal iris
ive got no vers stuff lol
cobalt seal
and?
crystal iris
do you guys have a haste you sort of like to cap out at?
crystal iris
base?
lofty widget
unbuffed yea
crystal iris
good god haha
sick sentinel
do you guys have a haste you sort of like to cap out at?
after 30% you lose 1 out of every 10 haste stat and then at 40 2/10
10% loss is bearable, 20% loss from being 40% and above isn't so much
dire sorrel
What are the go to trinkets for season 4?
cobalt seal
RDM/Aegis/OWS
dire sorrel
Thank you
cinder nova
Aegis is unnecessary
If you aren't playing like a smoothbrain it's really not required. OWS is the big obvious one that you'd be a dope not to get.
Honestly, I think the ideal set up is OWS + Faulty, but Faulty is such a rare pipe dream that you may not want to bank on it. If you can farm it, it's pretty destructive.
sweet summit
fcm is st tho
rdm would be better damage in m+
and sigil is better depending on fight length too
cinder nova
Well, pretty much every fight we haven't shifted to AOE so Faulty is going to be better than most stuff for raid encounters.
mighty valley
aegis is worth it for big silly m+ pulls in high keys, if you're not doing that don't worry
cinder nova
RDM is a no-brainer for M+
cinder nova
aegis is worth it for big silly m+ pulls in high keys, if you're not doing that ...
Not really. It's the same as heart. You're only using it if you're playing wrong.
Damage finishes keys as well.
ocean yoke
aegis also from big meme boss so probably not worth spending the tokens, drop wont be hard
cinder nova
^^^ It's really not worth targeting tbh.
Even like 27 Tyran DOS Broker is liveable w/o it.
cobalt seal
why we moving the goalpost?
cinder nova
We aren't. Aegis has always been generally an unnecessary trinket.
crystal iris
goddamn prot is just as tough as i remember
crystal iris
im pressing so many buttons
cobalt seal
We aren't. Aegis has always been generally an unnecessary trinket.
a immune for sure is unnecessary
crystal iris
being alive
cobalt seal
especially every 1.5m
cinder nova
It's not an immune and at the point where it can be actually worth using everyone else dying is the major issue, not you.
crystal iris
grouping the pull
chrome falcon
what are you keeping track of
cinder nova
It's absolutely a playing wrong issue if you think it's needed.
chrome falcon
really it's just sb uptime
yeah but no-one plays perfectly
so like
idk trinket's still good
crystal iris
IP, SB uptime, rage
chrome falcon
you wouldn't need a trinket that literally just instantly killed the whole dungeon when you pressed it
but what's your point
urban portal
Stupid shit is how you time keys
cobalt seal
It's a "don't do stupid shit" issue.
crystal iris
im still mashing IP to dump rage but it feels useless with necrotic
trail rune
SO TRUE BESTIE
sweet summit
:dand
sweet summit
too far gone
crystal iris
I mean its my first key back in a while but 15s should feel like a cakewalk
cinder nova
That's a completely false equivalence. People using security blankets doesn't make it useful even if they are doing high keys.
chrome falcon
we got people saying good things are bad because you can win without good things
cinder nova
Because there are better things.
crystal iris
I tried that big first pull of NW, got incapped for 8s and died
sweet summit
zerk rage it, or just kick/stun to begin with
mighty valley
if you can't find a use for 8 seconds of near invincibility, uncapped against infinite targets, i think you're not being very creative
crystal iris
Is necro still the play this week or@you go kyrian for vial?
cinder nova
Better, but not worth targeting.
novel ruin
Does someone have a decent picture of a damage breakdown from a key?
cinder nova
Leaning on aegis is legit a play issue.
cobalt seal
what
mighty valley
leaning on shield block is legit a play issue
cobalt seal
aegis is still a broken trinket lol
trail rune
Leaning on aegis is legit a play issue.
why wouldnt you use something in your toolkit to help you survive?
cobalt seal
are you this dense?
trail rune
or am i being dumb here
urban portal
Because you need to pull 30 mobs at a time to win mdi
urban portal
Because you need to pull 15 mobs at a time in a 27 fort to time the key
sweet summit
that's a mists
cinder nova
It's only good in M+ and does no damage. Survival stops being a real issue in high keys and we know damn well you can do high keys with double DPS trinkets just fine. Damage times keys, not people turtling.
novel ruin
Thank you Erga! Seems like Revenge spam took the place of Clap. Gonna be weird wiring my brain differently from BFA
crystal iris
Survival stops being an issue in high keys what ??
cinder nova
8s isn't gonna be the difference between dropping a big pull.
sweet summit
yep, very different from bfa 
sweet summit
but goddamn it's still fast as fuck and lots of fun
cobalt seal
It's only good in M+ and does no damage. Survival stops being a real issue in hi...
?????
mighty valley
8s of lock/sv hunter uncapped damage is a lot
trail rune
cobalt seal
8s isn't gonna be the difference between dropping a big pull.
yes it does
novel ruin
but goddamn it's still fast as fuck and lots of fun
Difference between Wall and Represal for keys? Pretty much Wall when you need the extra DR in high keys?
crystal iris
80k DPS x 3 ppl x 8s is 2mil damage
urban portal
Never wall
mighty valley
reprisal always
sweet summit
reprisal is miles ahead
you play AM anyway, and the abundance of rage gives you shield wall on a ~1.5min cd
strong forum
never wall
novel ruin
Alrighty. What’s the lowdown on Revenge Vs Clap?
strong forum
revenge is spender, TC is generator
sweet summit
revenge to spend rage, tc to generate
strong forum
you wanna TC in ST on CD
in aoe you have more leeway in using revenge more often
but you dont wanna entirely forego using TC
novel ruin
And in avatar, are we still weaving Clap + global + clap, etc
mighty valley
no
sweet summit
no you play ravager
mighty valley
don't use OF
chrome falcon
uh oh
mighty valley
or whatever it's called
chrome falcon
we have an UF runner
strong forum
unstoppable force, you dont use it
crystal iris
I want so badly to be good at prot lol. My pally and mw breeze through 20s
mighty valley
they've just woken up from a BFA coma, it makes sense
velvet escarp
What are the best trinkets for prot if you don’t raid?
strong forum
soleahs aaaaaand
urban portal
Whatever goes crazy in new dungeon
strong forum
i guess sack in s4?
novel ruin
Is ravager send on CD unless super cap on rage during Banner?
cobalt seal
What are the best trinkets for prot if you don’t raid?
consider raiding
chrome falcon
ravager is like
novel ruin
It does damage now? 😮
chrome falcon
3 revengers
sweet summit
yessir
velvet escarp
I mean I have access to them technally but I haven’t done raids this xpac so I doubt people want me to learn fights lol
strong forum
ravager does 8% of my dmg in keys despite being a 45sec CD
novel ruin
Does it apply wounds?
sweet summit
nej
chrome falcon
does it say it applies wounds?
velvet escarp
Unless I sneak into pugs as fury and try and get them as a dps
cobalt seal
I mean I have access to them technally but I haven’t done raids this xpac so I d...
good idea
chrome falcon
you would need to be very smooth in the head to not be able to do HC pugs in season 4
so don't worry
just do them
velvet escarp
I’ll get as much ilvl as I can before raids then and do some pugs
velvet escarp
I’m casually looking for a guild as well but seems like everyone is pst which is difficult with work
Est*
novel ruin
Thanks Nom and Erga.
sweet summit
gl adjusting
strong forum
?
novel ruin
I saw Cold Steel was datamined so had to bring the warrior outta retirement.
urban portal
The 2nd boss is way too hard
In relation to the rest
In a pug
Not that they are actually hard
sweet summit
CSHB and OF 
strong forum
?
urban portal
But one person can wipe the raid
sweet summit
surely good 
trail rune
was huntsman hard on heroic?
strong forum
no
sweet summit
no
strong forum
you just killed it
urban portal
Yeah some funny guy dots the shade
strong forum
boss does nothing
urban portal
In a pug
toxic pewter
I never did sanctum before
chrome falcon
huntsman was absurdly hard on heroic week 1 with no gear
sweet summit
huh?
chrome falcon
but no not anymore
sweet summit
was it?
chrome falcon
i mean it was pretty absurd for a heroic boss
urban portal
Like cn in general was very easy in a pug
strong forum
we're fully geared with 4p 2l
toxic pewter
How many bosses does sod have
sweet summit
i only remember sure being rough 
strong forum
everythign is gonna fall over
trail rune
tbh my brain is so fried i cant remember any of sod or cn anymore except for the fact my guild took 500+ wipes on mythic sire
urban portal
Yw
cursive prawn
sweet summit
ya ur mentally ill salt
chrome falcon
yes "huntsman hard" is definitely what i said
novel ruin
Everyone was like 40ilvl below heroic at start of expansion
trail rune
chrome falcon
they literally fucking nerfed the boss like 24 hours after release lads
for a second boss on heroic
strong forum
huntsman was only hard if you couldnt kill adds
urban portal
@sick sentinel I can’t believe huntsman is so cringe in hearthstone
chrome falcon
it was what i would call "absurd"
strong forum
and if your healers were afk
urban portal
It’s just animal companion
sweet summit
so true oomfie
trail rune
delete hunters tbh
trail rune
thats me on 2nd boss in mists on my druid
"oh no the vulpin got broken"
hibernate spam
cinder nova
Fear spam, poly spam works too, iirc.
trail rune
ofc
fear is a bit sketchy
but it works
love it when it gets feared and runs directly into the group
cinder nova
I mean smashing fear over and over on a lock - especially demo is hardly a sin if it's near.
alpine shard
huh?
first day of heroic the dot did like 3x the damage it did after it got nerfed or something
dawn canyon
ever hexed the non inspired guy?
trail rune
dawn canyon
i have
chrome falcon
only like 300 guilds killed huntsman in the first 2 days
dawn canyon
chrome falcon
it was v weird
mortal brook
bad news, the pally has holy shield and the dot is ticking so you cant reapply a cc
chrome falcon
that's fucked up
alpine shard
Resolved an issue that caused Sinseeker's damage over time to scale too aggressively with raid size on all difficulties.
in a 30 man raid the dot was almost unhealable
velvet escarp
As someone who is trying to get into tanking would it be better to just put suffer as dps at the start of the season to learn dungeons? Or should I just host my own “learning” tank keys
mortal brook
sure
chrome falcon
dps need to know literally nothing about a key
compared to a tank
tanks need to know what every mob does
dawn canyon
As someone who is trying to get into tanking would it be better to just put suff...
learn em
velvet escarp
Ya but I figured I’d get a feel of the dungeon and how a more experienced tank pulls at least
dawn canyon
right now is when everyone has no clue whats going on
chrome falcon
nope
trail rune
right now is when everyone has no clue whats going on
this
there will be 2 dungeons where people know whats going on
chrome falcon
playing tank is going to make you a better tank than playing dps
pretty basic logic i think
velvet escarp
Ya that makes sense
I’ll just host my own and make it clear it’s learning groups for the time being
trail rune
hold w win eventually 
sweet summit
letting me die is what you do in taza 
velvet escarp
Since I’m not really trying to push gear this season anyway
As much as learn my class for the next xpac
trail rune
letting me die is what you do in taza <:medge:869468644743200829>
problem?
dawn canyon
you will get the gear dont worry
crystal iris
So you guys seriously tanking 27s on prot?
alpine shard
tanking 27s on anything sounds pretty easy
crystal iris
Oh y’a walk in the park
cinder nova
You uh... hero titling regularly?
trail rune
tanking 27s on anything sounds pretty easy
so true
waxen orbit
tanking 27s on anything sounds pretty easy
Incoming bear druids tilting
waxen orbit
No it does you just got a lot of bears who think because they’re nerfed now they can’t, because it’s not as free
alpine shard
pretty sure any top100 tank could log onto their bear and time a bunch of 27+ keys without issue
waxen orbit
pretty sure any top100 tank could log onto their bear and time a bunch of 27+ ke...
💯
Bear druids madge that good tanks can time higher keys on their garage door opener rotation spec
alpine shard
the main reason you dont see certain specs at higher keylevels is because the people good enough to do those keylevels in the first place are playing with meta specs
waxen orbit
alpine shard
and the people that keep playing the off-meta stuff just dont have a group
waxen orbit
Actually right on the money
waxen orbit
I’m a boomer in WoW terms bro I’m loyal to prot
mighty valley
aren't you like 7 years old
alpine shard
ofcourse when i say anything can tank a 27 pretty easily i dont mean anybody can pick up a bear and do 27 keys np, but the limiting factor is the player's skill and not the tuning of the spec
sand drum
went Brew for like +10s with 230 gear (fresh ding) and play style MEGA slow :C how do ppl not go brrrrrrrrr with buttons as Pwar :c wonder how other tanks are, played Gdruid but just so boring :/
dawn canyon
They never tried war
alpine shard
doesnt brew have a pretty high apm too?
dawn canyon
Yep
sand drum
monks ? might just be me being 🐒 🍺 then :C
alpine shard
ah nvm brew is kinda upper middle of the pack with apm
sand drum
then go 🐻 :> even worse :C swipe + trash boud to mouswheel up/down :>
IF on somewhat ez button to press
dawn canyon
Bear with PI during incarn must be hella funny for a day
Then back to crippling depression outside of incarn
waxen orbit
Brew is unironically very easy to play
Not sure why there’s such a growing misconception that it’s one of the difficult ones
Factual
Well I’d say the very very high CPM ones are because of the physical element on your wrist and hands
If you don’t have dexterity in your hand joints I imagine it fucking sucks
mighty valley
it's mostly just a content knowledge pile + keeping up focus and awareness of surroundings while pressing buttons
waxen orbit
TL;DR, if you’re autistic that’s an added affix
cinder nova
Yep.
waxen orbit
This is a good way to put it
One of the best arms warriors I know was an unholy in Nath and then a feral in sanctum
Top parsed on all three
It boils down to just understanding the game
cinder nova
I think some people are better at some things than others, though. The optimization on catweaving or owlweaving is more than my brain can handle.
But I did stance dancing fine in WOTLK 3s
No idea why
waxen orbit
I’d agree with that
If you can weave as a restodruid while efficiently keeping your group up well into the higher register, you can probably play any spec in M+ and be good
Minus BM because uh…
Yeah, BM
trail rune
bm 
cinder nova
I liked the raid awareness of Prot Paladin with BoP and LoH awareness just saving raiders from themselves lol
But Warrior is too fun
waxen orbit
I'm def playing prot paladin in WOTLK Classic though
Was a warrior in regular classic but goddamn does ret/prot build look fun for Ulduar
waxen orbit
I think it may have been
It's been like 4 years since I played on a Wrath private server
cinder nova
Pretty casual tank rotation tbh
Tanking then was chill af
Way more involved now than then
It was def cap + hit cap > stam into the sun
waxen orbit
Yeah there was that talent that transferred stam into prim stat yeah?
Or was it spellpower
waxen orbit
You think Preg pal will be worth playing?
warm plinth
Brew is unironically very easy to play
Brew is more difficult relatively, under normal circumstances. Just not when they have 4pc carrying them.
waxen orbit
Right but that would be old brew, then
Because ain't no way people are still playing without tier on week 29
warm plinth
No, but in the past, that's why people have said brew is harder, because it normally is. Just not this tier.
sick sentinel
Brew is more difficult relatively, under normal circumstances. Just not when th...
beyblades is my experience so far
spinning top or ballerina more like
warm plinth
😂
warm plinth
I had a really cool lagspike on my monk yesterday. I mean the lagspike wasn't cool but it lasted like 30 seconds, and I was leaving like ghosts of me SCKing behind me
Just random spinning monks everywhere
warm plinth
Yeah I didn't take as much advantage of the leveling buff as I thought I would
I did two toons though
grave crane
I did one pally lol that’s about all I can take leveling. And do you regularly get lag spikes? Shit happens to me a decent amount
warm plinth
Nah I normally never do, but it was a doozy
I'm making decent progress though, leveling buff or no.
crystal iris
I’ll try to log my@next run
My experience with pwar is everything is fine 100% HP until all the sudden I’m 10%
grave crane
Your SB may be going down then. You want to charge and intervene weave your keep it going
chrome falcon
yep that sounds like bad mob control or dropping sb
crystal iris
Probably. I get caught up trying to kick or stun or bring a mob in
Also I hate demo shout being in the gcd so I don’t hit it as often as I should be
grave crane
I tend to change the mob I want to kick on pull like the shadow core mob in dos or the harvester in mists then bring them to whatever I want
grave crane
For single target and banner uptime demo shout one is good. For just straight revenge damage BSC can be taken
strong forum
pretty much everyone defaults to BV
crystal iris
Oh really?
crystal iris
Oh ok I’ve been locking in bsc
grave crane
The longer you have banner up the longer you have 21% more strength and 400 extra mastery. Booming voice facilitates that easier since it’s on demand 40 rage and 25% damage amp
chilly brook
pretty much everyone defaults to BV
I haven’t actually touched BV in keys yet still hit 84%
grave crane
Built different
strong forum
you can run BSC
i did for weeks
but BV is just more comfy
and for my group comp the boss dmg is more important
i ran PF24 last week with BSC
but i did 1k less dps than with BV
blazing condor
chilly brook
Nom just bill dipperly
strong forum
today i fucking blasted
waxen orbit
I haven’t actually touched BV in keys yet still hit 84%
Try 100% with BV
minor helm
strong forum
did 15-16k every key
waxen orbit
chilly brook
Try 100% with BV
Prolly never gonna happen tbh
waxen orbit
You can do it I believe in you g
strong forum
ya pwar is gonna go hard in s4
chilly brook
It might happen with some of these dungeons in s4
chilly brook
But a lot of these dungys rn have some forced downtime
strong forum
shockbots go brr
waxen orbit
You can hit 100% uptime on banner rn with most of these dungeons if you just play like a spastic
strong forum
yea
chilly brook
I've done it on Mists with the dookie mazes
That’s on your healer actually doing their job lol
waxen orbit
chilly brook
During maze it’s all about the group
Tbh I do like BV anyways
So I should mess with it
I just wish they’d put demoralizing shout off the gcd
chilly brook
Heavily considering playing outlaw in s4 tbh
velvet escarp
I think main issue with m+ tanking will be even in DF like what will be better than BDK there kit looks insane going into xpac
With self healing and utility
I just HATE deathknight, runes are ass
chrome falcon
we're still missing multiple tank trees but go nuts
still don't know any tier sets
and utility is literally not relevant in keys
for tanks
chilly brook
With self healing and utility
No one cares about utility
chilly brook
If they did paladin would be meta every single m+ season
cinder nova
I'm still biting my nails on PWarr talents
velvet escarp
Is brez not as important as I think it is then in high keys?
mighty valley
you can get bres from whoever though, yeah
urban portal
Who cares
chilly brook
Is brez not as important as I think it is then in high keys?
Engi, lock, Druid, dk dps….
mighty valley
dk bres is even slightly worse than others
urban portal
Dk util has not changed from 9.0 to 9.2
Unless you tell me there’s some secret grip/bres build
chilly brook
It’s not like DK hasn’t had all this “utility” all of the whole xpac
They just weren’t good until 9.2 lol
Well
By not good I mean not broken
strong forum
If dk lost gavel they wouldn't be R1 tank anymore
mighty valley
i mean, people will pick bdk highly in 10.0 regardless of power i'm sure, because public opinion takes time to change
strong forum
So the utility thing is big copium
strong forum
i mean, people will pick bdk highly in 10.0 regardless of power i'm sure, becaus...
Bdk is always popular even when it's in a bad state
That won't change
urban portal
It’s fundamentally a reactive tank
chilly brook
It’s fundamentally a reactive tank
It’s not
urban portal
I think it’s rly cool
chilly brook
If you play blood reactively you’re gonna die
urban portal
Well not after all the borrowed power
chilly brook
Blood is proactive
chilly brook
Nothing about their kit has procs
DnD
strong forum
only "pressing DS after taking dmg" that's "reactive"
chilly brook
only "pressing DS after taking dmg" that's "reactive"
Which you need to proactively pool before the dam
grave crane
They’re proactive in they gotta pop DRw and hope to parry
chilly brook
Although rn it’s much less so with tier set
strong forum
Bdk doesn't have any planning going on anymore
urban portal
Yeah not anymore
strong forum
It's a very full send kinda spec
urban portal
Stuff like brew pal vdh is actually just playing your rotation
chilly brook
There is some decision making on brew
It’s a lot more interesting in SL than it has been
urban portal
Don’t you pop cb when it’s large
chilly brook
Nizzy can massively influence how you play if you’re trying to cheese for dam
chilly brook
Don’t you pop cb when it’s large
No not really
velvet escarp
Is warrior reactive?
urban portal
Yeah niz cheese is def funny
sweet summit
warrior has little to no reactive buttons
chilly brook
CB low key is best to hit on CD over pushing it only when it’s large
Usually more CB usages>large ones
But you also have to think about it too like it’s not just a hit and forget button, sometimes it’s better to delay by 10 seconds and save for something you know is coming
chilly brook
You also want to make sure the 8 second shield gets good usage
urban portal
But you can easily build it to large in like couple secs
chilly brook
In real keys yea
Real keys you’re almost always big shield
But prior to this season I felt like brew kinda plays very self sufficient as long as you have your tools for about 30-40 seconds of a pull
Then you have to get a little creative while the healer realizes “oh he’s taking damage”
But it’s way better than it was in prior versions, no longer lemme just spam purify and iron skin and sit there
urban portal
Yeah
chilly brook
CB is massively nice
urban portal
I can never get baited by brew too
chilly brook
Way closer to WoD
urban portal
On vdh I always think “maybe I can heal through this”
Then get meleed for 20k
And go bye bye
chilly brook
Also healing orb stacking and holding is pog
urban portal
An you even hold orbs
Since sck brings them in
And you are always spamming sck cuz of the ox conduit
chilly brook
And you are always spamming sck cuz of the ox conduit
Usually had 2 available anytime I needed them even with that
But I haven’t seriously played monk since s2
sand drum
:< casual 3K :c
chrome falcon
i hope you flamed that dude
slow nova
rofl
chrome falcon
that's an attack on all of us
slow nova
im pretty new to warr, but it feels tankier than a bdk for me
and I played dk all season
sand drum
started Pwar this season never played the class 😛
chrome falcon
that means you're either good at pwarr or bad at bdk
sand drum
XD
icy yarrow
nice bait you have right there sir
slow nova
that means you're either good at pwarr or bad at bdk
definitely not a big pusher as I didnt care much after 3k honestly, im more the raider guy 😄
sand drum
definitely not a big pusher as I didnt care much after 3k honestly, im more the ...
do both
bold nimbus
Hahahaha nice link
slow nova
im defo gonna play more pwarr than bdk in s4
I just hope for a good tree in DF honestly
sand drum
I just hope for a good tree in DF honestly
we all my friend we all
torpid fiber
but the nice men on titanforged podcast said prot warr is the worst
cursive tree
Dratnos sniffs blood dk panties
sick sentinel
finiding it very odd to play brew
grave crane
He rated pwarr as B tier and bear i think was c so hey were up there
mighty valley
i think the public opinion might sway a little
but it's garbage time patch so
oh well
torpid fiber
Prot warrior needs a dedicated pr team to sit in trade chat and sing the praises of the sword and board
mighty valley
i do enjoy being the underdog spec that's actually good
but i don't have to deal with LFG declines
chrome falcon
yeah my ideal position is "everyone thinks you're bad but you're secretly good"
doesn't happen often
"man matt you should reroll prot warrior su- hey why did you do 1.4 million damage with just execute on jailer"
cinder nova
"man matt you should reroll prot warrior su- hey why did you do 1.4 million dama...
Execute phase is always so fucking fun.
It's literally the Mythic Argus meme
chrome falcon
HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
pity jailer execute is so short now
on our last kill we got 2nd defile
and he was stood in it for the whole shield cast
cinder nova
Yeah, he's totally defanged.
chrome falcon
so i lost my whole sigil+pot+avatar+LS execute window
9k dps down from like 12k on our 2% wipe
cinder nova
Nothing makes me cry more than accidentally fatfingering my sigil and pot halfway through P2
cinder nova
I might just make a macro to click
The bonobo brain instinct to just press everything at the pull is so hard to resist
chrome falcon
fr
then i hit an 80k shield slam with 6 stacks pot and sigil
(and fucking died to threat when i hit a 72k one right after)
knotty trail
Hey lifelong brewmaster here but does anyone have a good prot warrior guide they can DM me. I am switching next season and I am going through logs and some guides but they are not giving the more deep information that I’m looking for. Like what takes prio for damage. How does the Necro banner rage build work. Thanks!
chrome falcon
Specify what you mean by "how does the necro banner rage build work"
You generate rage
And then you spend rage
Banner does not change the playstyle whatsoever
You still want to generate rage and spend rage for your tier set and anger management
knotty trail
Oh ok. That’s reassuring hahaha