#Serious

1 messages · Page 7 of 1

marble relic
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Apparently the internet is working better than expected, some people in Ukraine bought the dishes months ago just to mess around with them and after Musk said the internet was on there they tried em out again and they surprisingly worked

glass wyvern
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That’s pretty cool

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@wild phoenix

IMG_3676.jpg
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For anyone that isn’t familiar with the statue on Royal Exchange Square in Glasgow; this statue has had a cone placed on the head of the man on horseback for decades. Even when it gets taken away it gets put back; so much so that the council now leave it there as it’s become famous. The fact it’s been painted this way is a sign of respect and support.

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The sunflowers are a fantastic touch.

grave brook
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what are u talking about? what corporate state sponsored terrorism? how leaving the country (and the market) addresses it? which sanctions are being crippled by retail goods companies staying?

wild phoenix
jagged birch
# grave brook what are u talking about? what corporate state sponsored terrorism? how leaving ...

When I say state sponsored terrorism, I'm not talking about things like barrel bombing civilians being supported by the government, but rather hacking foreign nations critical infrastructure and/or protecting those that do by refusing to see them to any sort of justice. Espionage is one thing. I fully support espionage for the purpose of intelligence gathering. Taking down services and destroying servers is another issue entirely and it's an abuse of network access.

Are you asking how stripping a country of access to global markets including corporations like coca cola can impact that nation states capacity to support actions aimed at manipulating and destroying foreign infrastructure? It's not particularly complex and boils down to turning the screws to remove the influence of Russia in all global markets, including retail industries that amount to a significant portion of Russias GDP.

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Make no mistake. What Putin is doing right now could very well collapse the entire Russian economy and splinter the federation at a time when the people are rioting and the very thing they are claiming justifies this war (defeating nazis) is running rampant in the motherland.

timber delta
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yep they're still posting that sort of propaganda on state sponsored news outlets according to my friend

jagged birch
timber delta
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the last line you wrote

jagged birch
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ah

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Yeah.

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I was part of a meme discord once that was absolutely full to the brim with meme edgelords. It didn't start that way and I quit it as it got toxic beyond belief, but some memes really started to get traction and stay.

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Memes started with pro-putin, then pro war, then antisemetic, and always enraged by japanese anime

timber delta
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I've had enough of meme shit I've done all that years ago and almost needed therapy

jagged birch
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The number of memes of russians killing anime characters is insane

timber delta
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I'm more uncomfortable about the people who started to post the ukranians=pig memes again

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but I'm not in those circles so meh

jagged birch
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I look at memes as a subculture trying to push a narrative that reflects their particular attitude toward one thing or another and I know they're at surface level supposed to be jokes, but it's always the ones that get traction that get perverted into some sort of propaganda

timber delta
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it really does depend on the circle of people you're in, too

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another server I'm active in also has some edgelords who post war memes but they're so far either glorifying the heros who died protecting the country or making fun of putin

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or making fun of white girls dancing with "no war" caption

jagged birch
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I thought it would stop at short pictures with little messages but now the nationalist propaganda is being pushed into movies with redubs being done and pushed out labelling characters in the video for particular nations (usually the victim) getting "what they deserve".

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Usually some dub of a nation flag on the forehead of a character being violently oppressed on video

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It's fucked up fantasy shit

bold moss
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@dawn quartz Please be considerate of the people being directly affected by the ongoing events and avoid posting memes, jokes, even news delivered in a joking manner.

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To address the Thread more generally:

I understand levity is a way to cope with stressful situations, but let's consider those losing their homes, livelihoods, family and friends; some of whom may be members on this server - they sure as hell aren't laughing.

We've been quite lenient and have delivered plenty of warnings. As difficult as moderating a Thread might be (what with Discord's lack of settings on them), we can still remove your ability to post here.

If it gets any worse, we may consider shutting the Thread down altogether. So, for the last time, discuss the ongoing crisis freely but tone down on jokes, memes and the like. Thank you.

timber delta
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We were discussing memes in a more introspective way because there's a worrying amount of pro Russian propaganda being shared as "jokes", it was anything but levity

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Stuff like that influences people even if they say it doesn't and we should be on the lookout of these

bold moss
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Not what I was referring to.

timber delta
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Ok good to know

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I thought the edit was directed at the above convo

bold moss
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No, just at the Thread in general.

timber delta
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👍

grave brook
# jagged birch When I say state sponsored terrorism, I'm not talking about things like barrel b...

hacking/destroying foreign infrastructure? just like in our talk about ua nazis:

  1. please be more specific
  2. any country probably supports that in some way if it benefits said country's interests
    And again, how leaving the country addresses that? pepsi fleeing not to get hacked?

Also, im pretty sure stripping access to global markets and stopping operations within the country are quite different cases. But yea, leaving thousands of people unemployed is a great addition to sanctions, i give u that. Oh, its again much more against people.
And i still dont see in ur reasoning an "issue larger" than millions of people being stripped of QoL, economically strangled and discriminated around the world.

glass wyvern
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How is the general sentiment going in Russia right now, @grave brook, are more and more people taking to the streets or are people generally sitting and hoping/waiting for it all to pass?

grave brook
jagged birch
grave brook
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we have a saying, the most persistent things are temporary things
and of cource we dont have any employment insurance

glass wyvern
jagged birch
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Why would a country not have employment insurance? That sounds insane...Do you pay taxes?

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I mean is it required?

grave brook
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it definetely does

grave brook
glass wyvern
grave brook
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ye they will pay for like 2 months

glass wyvern
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Let’s hope shit has been sorted by then

jagged birch
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employment insurance, sometimes called unemployee insurance is a payment system by the government for people who are not employed that have lost their jobs for reasons beyond their control to help cover their costs until they can get a new one.

jagged birch
grave brook
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regarding "temporary", as i see this situation, those leaves are reputational things
so noone will come back in near future, for their own brand safety, until Russia is no longer isolated, which will be 100% much more than 2 months

grave brook
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its like 100$/month

jagged birch
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Ridiculous? That's crazy. In Canada it is 80% of your normal wages

grave brook
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haha

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not everything is as bright as in first world countries

glass wyvern
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Yeah so the restaurants close and they pay the staff and the charities side of it remains open to provide aid

jagged birch
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Russia is a first world country

grave brook
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no its not

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(especially now)

jagged birch
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Oh you're right

glass wyvern
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Paper is different from reality. Russia in the cities is first world but in the country has some horrific poverty and is practically third world

jagged birch
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Russia is a second world country according to definition.

grave brook
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Moscow is first world

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St. Petersburg is kinda first world

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other regions.. ye just as u say

jagged birch
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It is hard to believe after so many years that Russia isn't more economically stable.

glass wyvern
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It’s sad that the people in the country that in many cases probably don’t watch TV or anything any way will be more impacted by this and they won’t have a clue what’s happened. That is pretty sad

grave brook
grave brook
jagged birch
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I kind of expected with the fall of the soviet union for Russia to bounce back with the same fervor as Japan did

glass wyvern
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And those that don’t care for TV etc

grave brook
glass wyvern
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They could have if it wasn’t for leaders like Putin in my opinion. Corruption was rife and embezzlement of public funds etc billions in public funds

grave brook
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i can say that almost the poorest families have at least TV and they watch it a lot, since there is not much else to do

timber delta
jagged birch
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With the US cutting off Russian oil imports, I wonder if the Russian government will start using the supply at cost instead and prep to reinforce oil and gas costs within the country so that at least they don't have to freeze because they aren't able to afford heat.

viscid zephyr
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No, Putin doesn't care about his people.

glass wyvern
jagged birch
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To me it only makes sense to cut the price tag of these products for local distribution.

grave brook
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ye we wont freeze we will just starve to death and die from lack of medicine

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well i personally wont

jagged birch
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I doubt it.

grave brook
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but lots of people will, im not exxagerating

jagged birch
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Has India stopped exporting meds to Russia?

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India has the largest generic distribution line on earth

grave brook
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india has a lot, but it doesnt have everything

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also fun fact about sanctions

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the most impacted people by them are not people supporting milop

quiet oyster
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They are designed to hurt the general population.

jagged birch
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To force the government to change its priorities

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Or the people to choose a new government

grave brook
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the general population watches TV instead of using internet (so supports the milop), dont pay for international services, dont go abroad and dont buy Coke bcoz they cant afford it

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they will only be impacted by everything getting 2x expensive

jagged birch
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That is because the government is limiting information sharing.

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That isn't because the sanctions don't work.

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For those who know, they are in the streets

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They aren't infront of the tv

grave brook
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i didnt mean it in a way "sanctions work or not", they ofc do work, its just a "fun" fact about the most suffering side is globalized Russians who dont like milop

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btw today is the last day for me to buy VPN, Visa and MC shutdown tomorrow xD

jagged birch
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I hope that India continues to supply what I would consider critical supplies (medicine) and isn't pushed to restrict people already suffering with life threatening conditions by sanctions from countries largely considered haves.

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Will the bank still honor visa requests for payment?

grave brook
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within Russia? probably

jagged birch
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Could bankroll the credit card and just never pay it. What are they going to do? They're the ones who broke the contract by not doing business

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I mean...I don't recommend doing that.

grave brook
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credit cards are not common in Russia anyway, i personally dont even have one

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mostly debet cards

jagged birch
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So you watch the news. Any good news in Russia?

grave brook
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none

jagged birch
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Ugh. I hate that about the news in general.

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Always bad news.

timber delta
grave brook
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well, tbh there were no good news even before all that happened

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xD

jagged birch
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We have good news, but it's so few and far between that it might as well not exist

timber delta
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That's what I assume our PM talked about with Putin "for 50 minutes"

grave brook
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ye BRICS is Russia's last hope

jagged birch
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I wonder by what percentage Brazil owes its economic success to coffee.

grave brook
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i heard that its a lot

jagged birch
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Aren't they the worlds largest exporter?

grave brook
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they are

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or maybe close second to Colombia

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at least we still get to drink coffee xD

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(i hate it tho)

jagged birch
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I have coffee almost every day.

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I get my coffee from Guatemala

old basin
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I've never had Coffee

jagged birch
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What are the staples in Russia now that everything costs a fortune? I hear Russia does potatoes pretty well.

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Ugh...Don't say Vodka

grave brook
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i dont really know tbh

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btw im not sure we even export vodka

jagged birch
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Oh Russia does.

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All of the stores here have shelved the russian vodka imports and refuse to sell them.

grave brook
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i was sure stuff like Smirnoff is not even Russian

jagged birch
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I'm sure it's not

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That's made in America

grave brook
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as for other exports, its mostly oil/gas, military stuff, metal and chemical industry

quiet oyster
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Smirnoff is a brand of vodka owned and produced by the British company Diageo. The Smirnoff brand began with a vodka distillery founded in Moscow by Pyotr Arsenievich Smirnov.

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Russia owned, Britain stole it.

glass wyvern
jagged birch
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British? I thought it was American...Might be another brand that sounded russian.

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I drink zero alcohol

glass wyvern
quiet oyster
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Hahaha yeah, sure.

jagged birch
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No judgement. You get your drink on.

grave brook
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i hope export Stolichnaya is better than Russian Stolichnaya

glass wyvern
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It’s a decent vodka over here in Western and Central Europe

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Be weird if the Russian stuff was awful

grave brook
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oh its a common thing ever since USSR

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the same company producing stuff for export and for domestic

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and export being much higher quality

jagged birch
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Potatoes are always cheap here

grave brook
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hmm lemme check how much is potato now

glass wyvern
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That is pretty crappy, sorry to hear that

grave brook
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(i dont cook and always order deliveries)

jagged birch
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Do restaurants there still do their own deliveries?

grave brook
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yes

jagged birch
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Here all the restaurants use third party delivery services. It's annoying.

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I mean convenient

grave brook
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but they mostly partner with delivery aggragators

jagged birch
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I hate them. You can't complain because they don't care.

glass wyvern
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It’s a mixture over here for delivery by restaurant or by third party. Depends on proximity

jagged birch
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All they do is refund or discount and never solve the problem

grave brook
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in Russia is mostly aggregators

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and complaining to them is super effective

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xD

grave brook
jagged birch
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Here, you complain - They give you discount or no charge. I don't want a discount. I want my food.

grave brook
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dont they re-send ur order?

jagged birch
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No.

grave brook
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interesting

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but if u got refund u can do it urself in a few clicks

jagged birch
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You have to re-order yourself and while yes you got free food, you have to pay for delivery again.

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The service fees are not included in discounts

grave brook
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but what else can be done in this situation then?

jagged birch
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That's the thing. If it happened rarely, I'd say yes...mistakes happen...

glass wyvern
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Also you’re back of the queue again

grave brook
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they cant swing a magical wand and make the food appear in front of u the very ssecond u asked

jagged birch
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But it happens more than it does not so you go with no dinner or eat dinner super late

grave brook
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is it often for u guys there?

glass wyvern
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For me here in Czech Republic, nope. Not often there are problems on the orders

jagged birch
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Every second order for me...the delivery services are horrible. Everyone works for the delivery company and none of them are qualified.

grave brook
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for me smth is messed up maybe once in a few weeks, and any order is max 1h long

quiet oyster
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For me here in the UK, no problems either.
Likes of Deliveroo and whatever haven't gained pace outside of London. Still direct delivery from restaurant.

jagged birch
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Correction, half are qualified; otherwise every order would be wrong

grave brook
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and i order very often

jagged birch
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Order services in this neck of Canada are basically run by run off companies like Uber Eats

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Think taxi but food

glass wyvern
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What county you in, Ditto?

viscid zephyr
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He lives down the road from Nate

glass wyvern
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I get the feeling Gleam is slagging of the size of the UK lol

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It’s all one big “village” type thing haha

jagged birch
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So he lives on mulberry street.

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Speaking of streets...Are the corridors being honored today?

quiet oyster
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Apparently yes, so far.

jagged birch
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Policeman killed, 2 more persons wounded as Russian troops opened fire during evacuation from Demydiv
https://t.me/ukrpravda_news/9471

Telegram
УП. Стрічка

🤬 Під час евакуації населення з Демидова на Київщині окупанти відкрили вогонь, внаслідок чого вбито поліцейського, та поранено ще двох осіб поранено

glass wyvern
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Seems so for the most part

quiet oyster
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Russia killed the power to Chernobyl so there's approximately 48 hours until cooling stops.

jagged birch
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That's not good.

quiet oyster
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Which is exactly what everyone said would happen.

jagged birch
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That's very not good.

glass wyvern
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I think largely they are being upheld but you always get a couple gung-ho assholes in all militaries

jagged birch
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That's cataclysmically not good

glass wyvern
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They do realise that this starts killing their own people also, right…

jagged birch
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The run off will flow right into the region south of moscow. If they don't, they will soon

quiet oyster
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https://twitter.com/DmytroKuleba/status/1501531157510426625
The only electrical grid supplying the Chornobyl NPP and all its nuclear facilities occupied by Russian army is damaged. CNPP lost all electric supply. I call on the international community to urgently demand Russia to cease fire and allow repair units to restore power supply 1/2

Reserve diesel generators have a 48-hour capacity to power the Chornobyl NPP. After that, cooling systems of the storage facility for spent nuclear fuel will stop, making radiation leaks imminent. Putin’s barbaric war puts entire Europe in danger. He must stop it immediately! 2/2

jagged birch
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I don't think your average soldier knows how deadly radiation is.

viscid zephyr
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They may find out.

jagged birch
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Or pervasive

viscid zephyr
quiet oyster
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Official government.

jagged birch
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It's not like the radioactive isotopes hint to you they're hurting you. By the time you know you're being hurt by radiation, you're likely a dead man walking

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Checking global weather sat

quiet oyster
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When Chernobyl popped before, a lot of the radiation for "first on scene" was 100% deadly within 60 minutes of being dosed.

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Being dosed, I'm sorry for lack of correct word usage but my brain is lacking the correct wording.

jagged birch
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Exposed...saturated...

quiet oyster
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Yes, much better.

glass wyvern
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I hope they get it reconnected. The question is going to be what happened and if it was deliberate then is it viewed as a wider attack outside the borders of Ukraine.

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This might escalate things to pretty bad scenarios

quiet oyster
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"Dirty Bomb" has been the setup for a few days via Russia journalists/media.

jagged birch
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Wind direction is going toward Crimea for now, but in 2 days it will be going into Tula.

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18 kt

glass wyvern
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Back when it happened in 86 other parts of central to Eastern Europe got a decent dose

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My wife being from Slovakia told me all about it and how they found it.

jagged birch
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This time of year the wind carries it high. Have to check upper atmosphere for radioactive fallout.

glass wyvern
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Best get my iodine tablets soon… 1000 clicks ain’t that far for this sort of shit

jagged birch
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I forget...maybe you know, what isotope is in chernobyl?

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strontium-90?

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holy shit

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caesium 137, iodine 131, strontium 90 among others

glass wyvern
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Various ones yeah

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Was just checking as I couldn’t remember the numbers involved

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Ukraine has requested a ceasefire around the site to restore power

jagged birch
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Strontium has a half life of 29 years...It should be burned off by now no?

glass wyvern
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Hopefully Russia agrees

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There’s still decay happening in the core so it’s still producing new isotopes regularly

jagged birch
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f

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uck

glass wyvern
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Yep

grave brook
jagged birch
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This is a death sentence

glass wyvern
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Did Zaporizhzhia also get its line cut?!

grave brook
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in the end, that NPP was not damaged, and the radiation levels did not go up

glass wyvern
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Ahh ok you mean the fire

grave brook
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and UA gov was also STOP FIRE LET REPAIR TEAMS IN

glass wyvern
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That was an administrative building and not the reactor coffins though I understood

grave brook
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exactly

jagged birch
viscid zephyr
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International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) said in a statement Tuesday that it was no longer in touch with remote data transmission from safeguard monitoring systems installed at the decommissioned plant.

jagged birch
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Russian military are on the ground at Chernobyl

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They can confirm first hand

glass wyvern
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Honestly they just need to set up a 10 mile perimeter and agree it’s a no boom boom zone and everyone leaves those areas who are not nuclear power workers

grave brook
fierce garden
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that just makes sense in my mind, not sure why it hasn't been done yet

glass wyvern
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Yeah

fierce garden
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"no bombing here"

glass wyvern
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I mean surely even the Russian military don’t want to have lethal doses of radiation here so just make an agreement

fierce garden
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no bombing anywhere, but, you know

glass wyvern
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Well yeah of course

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Hopefully they get it restored soon enough

jagged birch
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This is Ukraine

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She is taking pictures of inside of the warzone and publishing them from her instagram

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Living in a bomb shelter

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Sorry I meant tik tok apparently she put most of the content there

fierce garden
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2M+ people, now refugees, have managed to get away, many more still in ukrainian territory. this, this whole situation, makes me so sad.

jagged birch
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Kremlin: The United States is de facto waging an economic war against Russia
https://t.me/rian_ru/152262
uh. So are the rest of the G7 nations.

Telegram
РИА Новости

Песков: США де-факто ведут экономическую войну против России

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US should respond, no...It's an economic operation.

civic swift
jagged birch
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Gotta create a narrative so they can promote xenophobia against the US

civic swift
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Something happens with no usual explanation? It’s because of the US apparently

jagged birch
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Oh they are fucked if Microsoft updates do not work in Russia

civic swift
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Yeah lmao

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Don’t most governments use windows? lol

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I mean

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Most EVERYONE uses windows

jagged birch
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Hackers love it when people don't update the one software component tied to their CPU with holes that need to be fixed every month

civic swift
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Hackers love that

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And combined with hackers not liking Russia atm

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Means bad time

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Stealing classified documents time

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lol

jagged birch
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I do not want the classified documents Russia might have.

civic swift
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I mean, they might be interesting

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And undoubtedly contain at least a few human rights violations

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Hell, unclassified documents from the US government have those

jagged birch
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Like what, that the Tunguska event wasn't an exploding meteor but a nuke test?

civic swift
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Wasn’t that in like the 1910s tho?

jagged birch
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True

civic swift
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1908

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Apparently

jagged birch
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Russia discovered nuclear power so early

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I mean...no

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I can't think of anything they might have

civic swift
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Nah if they had something like nukes so early we would have known

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Probably wouldn’t keep something like that hidden

jagged birch
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Even if we were to discover that Putin's entire career is built on the back of criminal syndicates within the russian mob that legitimized their organizations by switching from selling human organs to oil, it wouldn't make any difference

civic swift
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Yeah, not like foreign governments could do much about it

glass wyvern
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Probably a windows front end on PCs but there will be a lot of Linux back end on the server infrastructure I’d imagine.

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In other news:

IMG_8632.png
jagged birch
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Still worthy of concern.

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Responses from Twitter are not pulling punches

glass wyvern
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Oh it’s definitely still a concern. The more you fuck about with the stability of nuclear materials the more you open to the risk of them fucking you over

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I’d far prefer it for power to be restored to the cooling system and everyone gets the hell out of the vicinity and a new and refreshed team of plant workers go in and take over to give the guys a break as they need it

jagged birch
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I don't know if I will feel the same later about the situation, but at this time I'm hoping this shit stops so that humanitarian efforts can start.

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Not just in Ukraine.

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Russia is going to be suffering worse and worse as the months pass

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It's not like sanctions can just be turned back off and voila, all fixed

glass wyvern
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Yep indeed

jagged birch
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It's already a struggle wrestling with the xenophobes in Canada hating on Russians who have nothing to do with this. The longer this goes on, the deeper they dig their heels in.

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My nephews friend is russian and is getting bullied.

glass wyvern
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That’s not cool, he doesn’t deserve that at all. Not his fault

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I’ve been very clear from the start that this is not about Russia but about a select group of Russians. I have Russian friends also and so it’s been at the forefront of my mind.

jagged birch
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It's not his fault but he ends up wearing the shame of the legacy because people will look for every opportunity to justify and sate their hatred and fear.

glass wyvern
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It’s to easy for people to go “fucking bastard <insert nationality here>” and tar them all with the same shit brush

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Which never works.

civic swift
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I just wish people could get along

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But nope

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Not how it works

jagged birch
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People are people.

civic swift
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Exactly

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Some things never have and never will change

glass wyvern
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Unfortunate but true

civic swift
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Yup

glass wyvern
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It’s absurd to base like or dislike on nationality alone. I’ve met plenty of arseholes from my own country also

civic swift
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Isn’t a place in the world that doesn’t have both assholes and good people

glass wyvern
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Exactamundo

bold moss
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China is sending humanitarian aid to Ukraine

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So, for those afearing China was siding with Russia.. think they realised it wasn't gonna be a good idea

jagged birch
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China already took some pretty big hits with the economic barb pulling under the last administration. They probably weren't aware how many countries are willing to bleed their own economy to stop this. Question though becomes, how far do they think they can go with the Uyghurs before they suffer the same fate

civic swift
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Well, now it’s pretty safe to say Russia really has no allies in this ordeal

finite sail
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maybe some middle eastern countries?

civic swift
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Kinda doubt it tbh

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I mean

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At the least

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The Taliban is against them

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But then again

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The Taliban hated Russia anyways

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But also then again

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Why do we still call them “The Taliban” when they’re really just the government of Afghanistan now?

finite sail
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because they still call themselves that maybe?

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not sure

civic swift
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The name of the state is “The Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan”

glass wyvern
#

China should really do more than just send humanitarian aid. They should be using their relationship with Putin to get him to stop. I know they have offered to mediate but they can take a firmer stance I’m sure. Unless they do have hidden agendas.

glass wyvern
#

Interesting to see division here

IMG_8635.png
#

If we keep pulling on the thread then how far will the sweater unravel

finite sail
#

i really hope Ukrainian army pulls a W from this (if actually possible not sure how accurate my view is), but I would be lying if I wasn't concerned about what Putin might do when unraveled and backed into a corner.

glass wyvern
#

That’s the worry

jagged birch
#

Donald Trump is a fucking moron on levels that make morons look brilliant. He thinks the US should pretend to be China and bomb Russia.

#

I just keep returning in my mind to that Alexander Pope poem...

#

A little learning is a dangerous thing. Drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring: There shallow draughts intoxicate the brain, And drinking largely sobers us again.

#

Fired at first sight with what the Muse imparts,
In fearless youth we tempt the heights of Arts;
While from the bounded level of our mind
Short views we take, nor see the lengths behind,
But, more advanced, behold the strange surprise
New distance scenes of endless science rise!
So pleased at first the towering Alps we try,
Mount o'er the vales, and seem to tread the sky;
The eternal snows appear already past,
And the first clouds and mountains seem the last;
But those attained, we tremble to survey
The growing labours of the lengthened way;
The increasing prospect tires our wandering eyes,
Hills peep o'er hills, and Alps on Alps arise!

glass wyvern
#

If this is true then this is two instances of the Russian MoD setting up Putin for a fall today alone.

jagged birch
#

Might be a move toward mutiny

glass wyvern
#

I think we might be seeing the cracks appearing here

jagged birch
#

By undermining him in the information though they could be signing a death warrant

#

It's a crime to spread disinformation and putin wouldn't break the law

#

I had trouble writing that with a straight face.

glass wyvern
#

I’m curious what will come next. But seriously that attack on the maternity hospital today was fucking disgusting. The people responsible need to be cast asunder into the abyss

#

Women in labour trapped under rubble…

#

Utterly fucking depraved and abhorrent

jagged birch
#

What will happen is likely a court martial for the ministry of defense and a retraction by the ministry of defense that replaces him

#

Failing that, if the evidence is irreputable, the ministry of defense will be a scape goat

glass wyvern
#

Sergey Shogyu is the guy that was touted a few days ago as possibly leading a coup. He’s the head of their MoD

jagged birch
#

Putin will blame him for the use of weapons he had no idea were being used

glass wyvern
#

Depends if he kills Putin first

jagged birch
#

He will assure his people that the criminals in the russian army will pay

glass wyvern
#

I mean I’m speculating on a massive level here so I’ll keep the noise down for now but I just find it somewhat interesting we have seen a couple of instances today alone where there may be some cracks appearing

jagged birch
#

I'm a little pessimistic. Putin has escaped blame for over 20 years for atrocity after atrocity

#

He has an excuse/explanation for everything. He was trained to.

#

He doesn't do anything without an argument on how he can get away with it.

#

Man probably won't even take a shit without having two escape routes.

#

Putin has basically taken his training as a KGB agent and perverted the foundation of intelligence training to manipulate politics.

glass wyvern
#

I think this time there is something different

jagged birch
#

There are FBI and CIA officers in America who could easily become president if they were willing to drop their moral compass.

glass wyvern
#

There are standards at play here where he has been careful to abide by specific things in the past, he’s lost those rules he set himself previously in this conflict. Something here seems to be a bitterness, a resentment to something on an emotional level and he’s making mistakes

#

Prior to this he’s never showed emotion and now he has in this on server also levels and several degrees

jagged birch
#

You think the current russian MoD has grounds, even support for attacking the president? I doubt it. Best case scenario, he's testing the waters to see if there's any traction on dethroning Putin...and I don't think there is.

glass wyvern
#

He’s (Putin) a chess player, that in its self doesn’t mean anything per se but as he’s actually a pretty good chess player I bet it means he knows how to keep in check of himself in specific scenarios. He is an intelligent man and is calculated, but we are missing that here. This, to me, shows one of two things: 1. There’s a chance the rumours of illness are true and he’s lost it for too much faith in his own propaganda machine; like he forgot it was bogus and suddenly sees it as gospel…
2. Something tells him he’s on his way out anyway and he’s willing to take everyone with him and this is a calculated move with sound faculty of mind

jagged birch
#

If he can't be Lenin, he'll be Gorbachev

glass wyvern
#

To answer your question, there’s been people in the past in government that wanted Putin out of power but they never had enough support… this war and these sanctions might have turned enough heads to garner such support. Furthermore, the abusive sentiment that Putin is visibly handing out now against his closest personnel due to his frustrations are turning even more against him. There’s breaking points and then there’s breaking points. Even the most devout of yes men can find that point at which enough is, as they say, enough.

jagged birch
#

Hard to believe Gorbachev is still alive

#

He's 91 years old

finite sail
glass wyvern
finite sail
#

unhinged pootin is bad news

glass wyvern
#

He was relatively level minded and was open to discuss

#

Not necessarily the best leader but at least he wasn’t a dictatorial crack pot

jagged birch
#

I wonder comparatively how much more money Russia lost in the economic collapse Gorbachev oversaw vs Putin

glass wyvern
#

Considering this isn’t over yet I suspect this will top what Gorbachev was around in office for

jagged birch
#

I suspect you are right

glass wyvern
#

For the sake of the people in Russia that want nothing to do with this I wish I was wrong but I don’t see it unfortunately

jagged birch
#

I wonder if it would be considered in poor taste to do a "Who wore it better" meme in the memes channel with Gorbachev Vs Putin on Collapse of the Soviet Empire dunce caps

finite sail
#

the russians goin crazy for mcdonalds atm

jagged birch
#

The last two presidents of the russian empire both carried the nation into collapse

#

They need to fix their term limits. There is clear evidence of A) Abuse and B) Failure

glass wyvern
# finite sail the russians goin crazy for mcdonalds atm

I actually really don’t like McDonald’s but I think if I was told I might never get it again or at least they couldn’t confirm if I’d have another in five years or so then I’d probably go “yep ok, one last one just in case”

jagged birch
#

McDonalds is a good cheap meal when you're dirt poor and hungry

#

Buy burgers from the discount menu

glass wyvern
#

I’m not slagging it off or anything; just saying I personally don’t like it

#

I prefer Burger King but even then I don’t like that much lol

jagged birch
#

I don't have a nearby McDonalds

glass wyvern
#

I used to like Wimpy as a kid

bold moss
glass wyvern
#

Sorry Code if the cough is aimed at the poor choice of topic

#

We are discussing the queue in Russia for McDonald’s right now

jagged birch
#

The russian situation on the availability of McDonalds is...

#

suspect

#

I'd need more info

glass wyvern
#

It’s semi-(tenuous I agree)-relevant

jagged birch
#

I can't imagine anyone would be outraged

#

I was watching some of the footage of destruction in Ukraine....

#

McDonalds being closed in Russia didn't even come to mind

finite sail
#

McDonalds closing all 800 stores in Russia leading to a cheeseburger bank run is on topicish

glass wyvern
#

I’ve watched too much of that, I almost feel like I’m becoming desensitised to that and it’s concerning me

finite sail
#

yeah just saw video of the bombed maternity ward

glass wyvern
#

I saw that earlier

#

The crater in the middle of what used to be the courtyard is tragic

finite sail
#

not gunna go looking for images of the childrens hospital they leveled

glass wyvern
#

I don’t want anyone to truly risk their lives but I would like to believe that Russian people will continue to stand up to this internally

finite sail
#

seen so many pics of dead ppl recently, social media during a major war kinda weird

glass wyvern
#

I think that is honestly one of the key factors here

jagged birch
#

Russia will send to OPCW information on coming provocations with chemical weapons in Ukraine - Russian envoy
https://t.me/rian_ru/152367

Telegram
РИА Новости

РФ направит документы в ОЗХО и распространит информацию среди всех членов организации о возможной провокации Киева с химоружием на Украине - Шульгин

glass wyvern
#

Bigger than western sanctions almost

#

I heard that chemical weapons were likely

jagged birch
#

Note: Coming

#

Meaning Russia is preparing to use chemical weapons on Ukraine

finite sail
#

or claim ukraine used it on them?

glass wyvern
#

Yes the British MoD brought this up earlier

jagged birch
#

It says coming

finite sail
#

my russian is a lil nonexistent, just inferring based on the tldr there

glass wyvern
#

Basically they are saying that they are to inform their members of staff that they might use chemical weapons in Kyiv to force them to concede

finite sail
#

oh.

glass wyvern
#

Yeah

jagged birch
#

reminds me of that asshole who wants to play but never wants to lose

glass wyvern
#

Cunts

jagged birch
#

Like something out of a system of a down song

glass wyvern
#

Excuse my language but there’s not a better word for such behaviour

finite sail
#

we talkin about a bloody war, think its ok to say cunts

jagged birch
#

It's not. Cunts are nicer.

#

Its insulting to cunts

finite sail
#

fucking war criminals man

glass wyvern
#

As we say… cunts are useful

#

It’s horrific

jagged birch
#

Monsters

finite sail
#

you remember that video of the aftermath of that chemical weapon attack in uhhh.. syria i think? within the past few years

#

haunting

jagged birch
#

The barrel bombs?

glass wyvern
#

Yes I believe that was Russia also wasn’t it?

#

They used chemical weapons in Syria for sure

finite sail
#

i just remember a video of someone walking through a bomb shelter or large basement and it was just bodies, families huddle together, all dead

jagged birch
#

In Syria the government was dropping barrels of chemicals on areas they thought "rebels" were hiding, resulting in hundreds of civilians being sent to medical clinics where they'd die thanks to their lungs having been destroyed

#

Like breathing in chlorine

#

I don't remember what the bombs were made of

glass wyvern
#

Likely worse than chlorine

jagged birch
#

Assuredly

glass wyvern
#

If it was chlorine the. The WW1 knowledge, urinate in a cloth and strap it to your face, would have saved a good proportion

grave brook
#

Ehm

#

W/e

jagged birch
#

Nod if you're okay

grave brook
#

Im okay

#

It just gives me a really weird feeling

#

Seeing how u already jumped to conclusions

glass wyvern
#

It’s not jumping to conclusions

#

It’s discussion

#

Please interject and help the discussion

jagged birch
#

My mind can be changed.

grave brook
#

What we have here is a message about russia sendinga note to OPCW

#

More specifically, 80 tonn of ammonia

finite sail
grave brook
#

And u instantly, without any doubt, say, ah russia gonna use it themselves

#

Not a second of doubt in ur minds

jagged birch
#

It's not the first time they've sent intelligence to the OPCW on chemical weapons. They did this in Syria too...alleging the rebels were using chemical weapons...and it wasn't. It was the Syrian government

glass wyvern
#

Actually what I said was that intelligence reports had suggested it was likely

grave brook
#

So was is syrian government or russia

glass wyvern
#

But that it was confirmed

#

What I then said was that Russia used chemical weapons in Syria for a fact

grave brook
#

May i have a link

jagged birch
#

https://www.hrw.org/report/2020/10/15/targeting-life-idlib/syrian-and-russian-strikes-civilian-infrastructure

Human Rights Watch
"Targeting Life in Idlib"

Summary In April 2019, the Syrian government and its ally, Russia, launched a major military offensive to retake Idlib governorate and surrounding areas in northwest Syria— one of the last areas controlled by anti-government armed groups. Over the next 11 months, the Syrian-Russian alliance showed callous disregard for the lives of the roughly 3...

#

Now, before you argue it was Syria exclusively and Russia was a whistle blower - remember who supported Syria before, during and after the deaths of thousands of civilians and nearly 5000 barrel bombs dropped

#

It was not a one-off incident.

grave brook
#

Sry was checking the source, looks like its us-controlled propaganda resource tbh

#

I was reading about Ghouta inciden5

#

The one investigated by UN

jagged birch
#

Uh. What makes you think human rights watch is us controlled propaganda?

glass wyvern
#

This one?

grave brook
jagged birch
#

It's not going to matter what evidence is provided if evidence is dismissed on the grounds that it is just propaganda.

timber delta
#

Even if a news site is state funded, it's hard to just deny facts unless there's evidence for the opposite

glass wyvern
#

It’s true for sure

grave brook
#

Does OPCW have a site?

glass wyvern
#

By true I mean what Sohail says

finite sail
#

site seems like a multinational collaboration to me https://www.hrw.org/contact-us

Human Rights Watch
Contact Us

General Information New York Amsterdam Beirut Berlin Brussels Chicago Geneva Johannesburg London Los Angeles Nairobi Paris

glass wyvern
jagged birch
#

If it's any consolation: Human rights watch is a non-profit NGO, so whatever propaganda they are selling, they're doing a shitty job of it, because under US laws their funding and operations are transparent and easily tracked.

glass wyvern
#

@grave brook ^^

grave brook
#

Ty

glass wyvern
#

No probs

grave brook
#

Is there a transparent funding in US?

finite sail
#

freedom of information act

jagged birch
#

Is that a joke?

finite sail
#

so yeah

grave brook
#

Its hard for me to imagine bcoz im not us citizen xD

jagged birch
#

Oh

glass wyvern
#

I can understand that

#

It’s hard to know if you haven’t experienced it

grave brook
#

Ok i found references to UN reports

finite sail
#

hmm yes the UN, very trustworthy

grave brook
#

Much better than guardian xD

finite sail
#

well, yes that is very true

jagged birch
#

I am pretty sure The Guardian is a conservative mouth piece.

glass wyvern
#

To be fair the guardian is actually pretty unbiased and I say that with reasonable confidence of being Scottish and it being unbiased on the Scottish independence thing

jagged birch
#

It spits out whatever the conservative agenda of the day is.

grave brook
#

Why i am so opposite about it, is bcoz if Russia did really use chem weapons, the international community would go insane
Not like nowadays, but comparable

glass wyvern
#

So when it’s something so close to home and they speak the truth then it gives me confidence for their greater scheme if things

jagged birch
#

The international community did go insane.

grave brook
#

Did it?

jagged birch
#

There were outcries all over the world.

grave brook
#

And no sanctions?

jagged birch
#

Yes there were

grave brook
#

Hmm did i miss them

jagged birch
#

Knowing how Putin was dismissing sanctions then as posturing, probably.

#

Donald Trump was actively trying to remove sanctions on Russia at the same time as more were being added

finite sail
#

maybe a bit of a wash at the time then

glass wyvern
#

The sanctions also weren’t particularly strong and I don’t think they would have been felt low down

grave brook
#

Dunno, using chem weapons sounds like serious shit, quite close to starting a... milop

glass wyvern
#

But I suspect that they were not publicised as they could be offset easy enough

jagged birch
#

Ultimately Russia has been eating sanctions for almost a decade now and stands as the most sanctioned country on the history of the planet.

grave brook
#

Maybe

glass wyvern
#

Probably more than a decade to be fair

grave brook
#

Still hard to believe than smth like chem weapons sanctions can be hid, but i'll mark that as possible

jagged birch
#

You do know your media is state owned and censored, right?

grave brook
#

Sure lol

jagged birch
#

I don't know how you could find it hard to believe

glass wyvern
#

I couldn’t say for a fact as I don’t live in Russia man. What was the independent Russian news outlet that just had to shut? The one with the Nobel prize winner

#

Dohzd or something I think?

grave brook
#

Bcoz in my vision it has some explicit effect, and this effect is hard to hide

jagged birch
#

I used to read RT on the side to compare it to other media outlets like the BBC, ABC, CTV and CNN...The narratives are wild

grave brook
jagged birch
#

Aljazeera in there too

#

I like Aljazeera for middle eastern stories, generally...a lot of different sources

glass wyvern
#

I wonder if they covered it

jagged birch
#

Aljazeera covering Syria?

#

or RT?

dawn quartz
#

The fog of war is thick, and the aid/attention various countries get isn't consistent at all.

glass wyvern
jagged birch
#

The russian state owned media doesn't try to lie or anything. They just hide enough to avoid being accusatory

glass wyvern
#

Independent Russian outlet forced to close recently due to the new laws

jagged birch
#

It's a part of a disinformation strategy

#

US Politics does it all the time

glass wyvern
#

Dozhd is generally against the state to be fair from what I know

grave brook
#

well Dozhd was hard anti-Putin

glass wyvern
#

See

#

Lol

jagged birch
#

Haven't read Dozhd

grave brook
#

its like guardian but in Russian

#

xD

glass wyvern
#

Their founder was a Nobel peace prize winner

#

So you like Dozhd, Lum1nus?

grave brook
#

nah they were shady aswell, but on the other side

#

i like Meduza

glass wyvern
#

It’s hard to find a decent middle ground in media to be fair

grave brook
#

yep Meduza is kinda like it

#

also Lenta is okay, but i suspect its kinda state-sponsored

glass wyvern
#

They just had to close as well right?

#

Meduza I mean

grave brook
#

no they didnt but they are being strangled for a long time

jagged birch
#

Middle grounds are pointless. Everyone is coloring in their own shade of bullshit. Best to grab as much of it as you can from multiple sources and compare

glass wyvern
#

Ahh ok

jagged birch
#

and anyone that says everything is a lie, are liars trying to sell you lies

glass wyvern
grave brook
#

^

dawn quartz
glass wyvern
#

True

grave brook
#

true

#

btw, were there any reports about US bombing civils in Syria or smth of the kind?

jagged birch
#

Journalism is struggling. It isn't dead. People just need to stop making it obscenely fat with the shits of faux news

#

Do not milk the faux news

dawn quartz
#

We've bombed many civilians the world over tbh

wild phoenix
#

Britain has also had it's hand in plenty

jagged birch
#

missiles*

glass wyvern
#

Yeah Britain isn’t innocent by a long shot

#

No country really is along the way. Just that some of the bigger powers are far worse than others

grave brook
#

well so the journalism is not as dead in ur countries then, as it is in mine xD

wild phoenix
#

Surprised nobody stopped them selling Coca Cola here

jagged birch
#

US drones killed so many civilians in Iraq the US military changed the definition of combatant to lower their civilian death count

dawn quartz
#

But that being said, I am free to express my disgust about things my government does.

wild phoenix
#

Kinda feels like we have a double standard

jagged birch
#

They were arguing that kids with guns were in the fight so combatants included anyone 12 or older that could carry a weapon

wild phoenix
#

Well it's always felt that way

#

Along with things like Windrush

#

Hard to not see my government as cretins

jagged birch
#

Speaking of Dozhd. I looked it up....

#

This came up

#

They prob resigned because of the new laws

dawn quartz
jagged birch
#

CNN pulled reporting out of russia too

glass wyvern
#

But Lum1nus, please don’t consider me against Russian people. My comments earlier were not about jumping to conclusions so much as that Russian military tactics have startled me somewhat against their closest neighbour in that many of the Slavic tribes that founded modern Russia originated from Ukraine. I find this war particularly alarming for the brutality that appears to be prevailing against those that you may for all intents and purposes consider as almost family (or actual family in many cases, such as those in Kharkiv). I’m sorry if it felt like I was being anti Russian

#

I am most definitely anti Putin though

#

That dude is a dick of the highest order

jagged birch
#

I have a problem with Putin too.

#

Putin on the ritz

dawn quartz
jagged birch
#

Err fritz

#

The man is broken

finite sail
jagged birch
#

Russia is going to need serious international aid when this war is over.

glass wyvern
jagged birch
#

No matter what happens, the economy in russia won't just eat these sanctions this time

#

Oil will not buy bread

#

I'm afraid for Russia's humanitarian crisis looming

glass wyvern
#

I have images of Germany and the mark being so worthless that people were pushing their money in wheelbarrows and even a wheelbarrow full wouldn’t buy a loaf of bread

#

That I find scary also in todays society in any country

finite sail
#

like Venezuela currently

glass wyvern
#

Yeah

grave brook
#

dw guys i understand it all
i just love my country no matter what and it still stings a bit even if i understand that u mean only those in charge
tho i dont wanna strip u of ur rights to express what u feel how u feel, so plz dont be considerate of me next time xD

jagged birch
#

The thing about currency comparisons...They don't mean shit when you're talking about buying power

glass wyvern
#

No it’s ok man, I think for us in the west it is hard also to understand the true censorship you might experience and the propaganda you are made to swallow quite blatantly

#

So please excuse some of our ignorance also

jagged birch
#

Buying power is determined by how much the currency carries within its own borders.

finite sail
jagged birch
#

Oh for sure

grave brook
#

buying anime figures from Japan hurts like hell, i gotta say xD

jagged birch
#

I'm talking about economic stability, not vacation money

#

A country can float with a horrible currency in comparison to another country if their economy is stable

finite sail
glass wyvern
#

For what it’s worth, Lum1nus, you seem to me to be a good person and I can totally understand you can be defensive of your nation. You may not be in support of the current regime but you can still be proud to be Russian and I will never try to take that away from you. I appreciate the cordial manner in which you have approached discussions here and asked for proper sources. Thank you for engaging in the dialogue

jagged birch
#

One of the huge draws of tourism is currency exchange to help float economies where the economy is not stable

quiet oyster
#

For what it's worth, a super large majority have no issue with Russia or Russians in general. Just have issue with your stupid government.

glass wyvern
#

Please also be assured that not all of us in the west are monsters and most of us are made to swallow a reasonable amount of bullshit also. I’m sure I speak for many when I say that we, for the most part, want to have a life and an existence where none of this shit happens and everyone gets on and furthers humanity. Sadly that doesn’t happen and it falls to our generations and the next to help try and get us those steps closer each time

jagged birch
#

Also, holy shit a russian that likes japanese anime

#

Trend setter right there

#

He's clearly not one of the kind who advocate for war

quiet oyster
#

👀

jagged birch
#

*is?

glass wyvern
#

dark web still exists for those that accept it

grave brook
#

did they? then was

glass wyvern
#

Speaking of which. Twitter is setting up on Onion/Tor so Russians can still access

quiet oyster
#

👌

grave brook
#

i just bought 3yrs of VPN today

glass wyvern
#

Good man

quiet oyster
#

BBC News got an onion site setup to keep information moving through Russia.

#

Nice to see others even considering it.

jagged birch
#

Part of my hiding strategy is to remain in plain sight

grave brook
#

ironically enough, i couldnt access some of ru resources after it xD

glass wyvern
#

Lum1nus, if you need help finding sources / news whatever from western media then ask us and we can help our best to get you information

grave brook
#

ty

glass wyvern
#

I feel bad for you that you have to experience such censorship

#

This is 2022 ffs not 1022

quiet oyster
#

😔

jagged birch
#

In Canada we have a spy agency called CSIS. Nobody really talks about them. They don't go knocking on your door. They don't advertise themselves. They're an intelligence gathering body in charge of identifying threats to national security. There's really no hiding from them in Canada.

dawn quartz
#

Yes, I feel fortunate that I can freely look at say Al Jazeera for another perspective.
It's similar to book burning, all this internet censorship

jagged birch
#

If CSIS wants you, CSIS got you already. You just don't know it.

glass wyvern
jagged birch
#

Al jazeera from what perspective?

glass wyvern
#

I believe he just means as an example of his freedom to view an alternative source

jagged birch
#

ah

glass wyvern
#

He has the option

jagged birch
#

Just gotta be careful.

glass wyvern
#

Fact finding is always a question of balance in all honesty

dawn quartz
jagged birch
#

Might even be worth while to not link sources and to use words like milop to avoid exposing him to some packet sniffing blood hound in russia weeding out dissidents

glass wyvern
dawn quartz
glass wyvern
#

Indeed

glass wyvern
#

@grave brook what VPN you using?

grave brook
#

I should be ok, dw
If it worked like that i better just quit discord and twitter at all xD

grave brook
glass wyvern
#

Proton are pretty good on freedoms. Same with any others in Switzerland

#

Ok PIA are ok, I used to use them also

jagged birch
#

I wonder how smart russian network infrastructure is.

#

In Canada the police found they could spy on network traffic using stingray.

#

I'm sure with state owning so much of the infrastructure in Russia, they'd have even more power.

#

VPN has limits.

#

It might stop some stranger in a strange land from nailing you

#

it won't stop your IP

#

They don't need your IP. They probably have your hardware code

glass wyvern
#

Following that the link will likely be through some Tor bridge I suspect

#

Whatever happens I think we need to help our Russian friends get information other than TASS etc

#

Ways will be found but they always take a bit of time to implement

verbal shadow
#

Starting to think we're going to have to move this Serious thread to an age restricted channel. Especially if folks here are going to continue bringing up age sensitive matters. If anyone has any questions or concerns about this, feel free to ping me or DM with concerns, questions, or suggestions. Thank you.

In the meantime, please everyone be mindful that hentai and porn aren't really all that relevant to the conversation of what's going on in Ukraine, the main purpose for the temporary creation of this thread. Thank you.

glass wyvern
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Whatever needs to be done to protect members while still allowing a good level of discussion I think

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You tell me and I’ll abide by it of course

grave brook
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Sorry for that

glass wyvern
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I would like to thank the mod team though for allowing this thread in the first instance and allowing us a place to discuss these issues that are affecting every one of us in one way or another

jagged birch
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Over policing will push intelligence under ground and splinter consumer support for government oversight

glass wyvern
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Indeed, they probably hope not many of the younger generations realise this to be honest as they are the ones that will oppose the regime the strongest

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Don’t underestimate the ability of a government to belittle the average intelligence of its nation in times of war

sleek river
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Like i2p is peer to peer , don't Really know it's aspects that much

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Tor is famous , but the government still can see you connecting to it

quiet oyster
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TOR is the perfect example of how it works.
Exit nodes setup on random computers/servers, you connect "through" multiple nodes to access the website you want to be visiting.
The website you visit is unknown, only information that can be retrieved is an exit node being used to access TOR network.

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Unless the inner website itself is breached, as has been happening recently with some of the more popular websites.

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Government can't see what you're visiting at all, just the IP of the node you connect to.

sleek river
quiet oyster
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Already happening right now without any of that.

sleek river
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I'd set up a landline across the border

quiet oyster
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Can be intercepted using a wire and crocodile clip.

sleek river
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yeah

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But do it secretly

finite sail
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thats a long cable to somehow put in secretly

glass wyvern
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If this be true then it’s clearly not a negotiation

IMG_8639.png
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I mean you need to concede some elements to call it a negotiation rather than a series of non-negotiable demands

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I hope this is wrongly reported otherwise these discussions are a waste of time and are simply face showing activities that are not in good faith

dawn quartz
finite sail
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oh nooo... no more ladas

jagged birch
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Also probably to try and stem the hemorrhaging of Russias international reputation and slow down any international response to their aggression

dawn quartz
sleek geyser
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Anyway

glass wyvern
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@grave brook, from reports I read today there will be conscription in Russia along with martial law starting this weekend. Stay safe bro. I hope you aren’t forced into anything you don’t want to do.

grave brook
# glass wyvern <@210695091365478400>, from reports I read today there will be conscription in R...

thank you for your concern
but it looks like its a just a bill about new procedure of luring people to the recruitment offices passed the 2nd reading (and this bill passed 1st reading like several years ago).
Currently, when a man finishes school (or university), a recruitment office must send him an invitation to the military assessment comitee, with reception signature.
With the new law (which is likely to become a law), a man is obliged to come to the recruitment office on his own, without signing the invitation.

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So basically the change is ppl now cant dodge the military service by just avoiding recruitment agents and not signing the invitation

glass wyvern
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Understood. I hope it’s not more than that man. Strange times are upon us so I wanted to express my solidarity at least

grave brook
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thank you ❤️
in any case, i passed all these procedures after finishing uni, and i cannot be conscripted in any circumstances

glass wyvern
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Ok, good. Be safe regardless of the outcome

jagged birch
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Whoa

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I don't know how true this is but holy shit if it is

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Biden will announce on Friday the US, along with the G7 & EU will be calling to revoke most favored nation trade status for Russia, per as source familiar

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Looks like Ukraine knows what's up with Russia's chemical weapons false flag.

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US defense officials have identified Chinese intelligence helping Russia push a chemical weapons narrative.

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For those unfamiliar, the limits to the kind of sanctions that can be imposed on Russia have largely been structured around their status as a most favored nation in trade.

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Revoking that status opens the flood gates on a lot more harmful tariffs

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I don't think it will be revoked, honestly.

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The WTO specifically says no member country may discriminate between trade partners when granted the status.

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Getting everyone to agree to discrimination does not skirt this rule.

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It could lead to Russia getting flooded with foreign goods at market prices designed to destroy the local economy and drive up reliance on foreign markets

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The United Nations Security Council will convene on Friday at Russia's request, diplomats said, to discuss Moscow's claims, presented without evidence, of U.S. "biological activities" in Ukraine, a move Washington described as gaslighting

sleek river
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@sick sleet no more sugar for me

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And salt

finite sail
sleek river
finite sail
sleek river
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Np

bright barn
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@orchid valve come in here

dawn quartz
sleek river
jagged birch
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Basically the US is forcing Russia to make the move necessary to justify an escalation

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Calling on Russias bluff

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While at the same time...

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Hiding from the consequences by not being in Europe

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Like one of those kids that shoves other kids into fights and promises to back them up if things get dicey

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Not so sure based on Polands recent comments that they'll even bother taking the bait

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Last I heard they were sending shit to Germany, instead of Ukraine

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Comments something to the effect of "Giving this to Ukraine needs to come from NATO"

sleek river
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@glass wyvern no sugar and salt for me

glass wyvern
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I saw man. Sorry bro. Can you order from abroad?

sleek river
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I'm stuck without sweet tea

glass wyvern
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You able to get honey?

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Just as good and better for you in fact

sleek river
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But what about salt lol

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How am I gonna enjoy cucumber

glass wyvern
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Use honey for your tea for sure then. Salt… hmm… is it just sea salt that’s hard to get, like can you get rock salt easy enough? Because other than that my only suggestion would be, if you live near the ocean, to get some water from it and leave it to evaporate and collect the salt… will take a long time to gather enough mind you but if you’re desperate

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Other choose would be to pair it with something salty like preserved fish or such

sleek river
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Y'all eat rocks?

glass wyvern
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Salt from underground caves where the mineral was deposited centuries ago. Not taken directly from the oceans

sleek river
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Ah so , dwarf salt

glass wyvern
glass wyvern
grave brook
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Yikes

jagged birch
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Can you honestly be surprised they're telling the victims of war crimes that it's okay to be angry and call for violence against their oppressors in social media?

grave brook
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There is no context justifying official allowance of hate speech and calls for violence man

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And trust me, i understand ukrainian peoples anger and sadness very well as i talk to them directly

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But shit shit should not exist in what we call civilized world

jagged birch
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What hate speech?

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"As a result of the Russian invasion of Ukraine we have temporarily made allowances for forms of political expression that would normally violate our rules like violent speech such as 'death to the Russian invaders.' We still won't allow credible calls for violence against Russian civilians,"

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It's political expression, not hate speech

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Just like it's military operation, not war.

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The moment russia admits to what they're doing is wrong, they can sit at the table where people consider civility

dawn quartz
jagged birch
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It wouldn't matter if Musk had said anything

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The US would not allow one of their own to be abandoned in space.

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Flat out.

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That Russia would threaten this action will only compromise Russias ability to get back into global discussion on space exploration and further isolate the nation when it comes to discussing how to handle the future of space exploration

grave brook
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It's political expression, not hate speech
so slogans with "death" are political and not hate, amirite? also its "asinine" (c) to think that its only allowed towards russian army and not russians as a nation
just like it's military operation, not war
given the context, this statement actually counters your point, not mine
The moment russia admits to what they're doing is wrong, they can sit at the table where people consider civility
basically "our principles are not worth shit, we will act like scum if we feel like it"

jagged birch
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Realistically, even when Russia invaded Georgia, nobody threatened Russians in space.

grave brook
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it feels surreal that i even have to actually argue about this being absolutely inappropriate and unacceptable

jagged birch
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Nobody is going to censor a victim of war crimes who is screaming at their oppressors that they're not being politically correct enough.

dawn quartz
grave brook
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thats the very definition of hate speech and thats the very reason why hate speech is not acceptable under any circumstances, because it spreads hate (duh)

grave brook
jagged birch
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Explain

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Are you alleging that Russia is a victim of hate speech because people are calling for the death of Russians invading Ukraine?

grave brook
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it sure is a victim of hate, regardless of the context

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this is not my point tho

jagged birch
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Now you're obfuscating

grave brook
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dude are u saying im wrong?

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im not wrong

dawn quartz
jagged birch
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Context matters.

grave brook
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u say hate is justifiable

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i say it isnt

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dats it

jagged birch
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I didn't say hate is justifiable. I said political speech is.

grave brook
jagged birch
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The russians are calling it hate speech. Nobody else is.

grave brook
grave brook
dawn quartz
grave brook
finite sail
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yeah i read that facebook was allowing people to say shit like "death to russians" which aint cool

dawn quartz
jagged birch
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Russians in general is wrong.

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Russians in context is a whole other matter

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Death to invaders

grave brook
grave brook
jagged birch
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How is it not appropriate to show hatred in response to war?

dawn quartz
finite sail
jagged birch
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Lets not get it twisted. This isn't broadstrokes attacking all russians

glass wyvern
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When I read it I also thought it was a bit much to allow death calls to Russia as a whole.. if it was like “putin is a fucking cunt and needs executing” then I could get it. Also maybe “the Russian government and Duma etc” but generalising the nation is a little too far. That said, they maybe don’t feel it’s possible in a short time to try and educate between the difference or implement some cut off somehow. What they are doing is monitoring it daily and are reacting accordingly so I don’t expect it to last for long either way.

jagged birch
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Imagine the war in vietnam but you aren't allowed to be angry at soldiers or war.

finite sail
# grave brook huh

i think they mean that saying a statement that's more general like "death to Russians" is wrong as it implies all Russian people, but making a similar statement with context that they mean the Russian leaders who cause atrocities could be viewed a little differently.

jagged birch
grave brook
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should Yemen and Vietnam and Somalia be allowed to say "death to americans" then?

dawn quartz
jagged birch
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It isn't generalizing

glass wyvern
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People should be mature enough to know the difference between the entire race and the ones in power making the decisions

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But… it’s hard to be rational in such times

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I get that

grave brook
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based on ur reasoning

dawn quartz
grave brook
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i see

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well i think they dont

jagged birch
dawn quartz
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My eyes are wide open as someone from an illegally overthrown sovereign nation

glass wyvern
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And yes they should if it’s current context and it’s to create equality

finite sail
dawn quartz
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I would support their free speech in fact

finite sail
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its the american way

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second amendment i think

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first?

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second is guns

grave brook
finite sail
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i need to refersh myself on my constitutional rights

glass wyvern
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But… let me say again… I have nothing against Russia as a nation for the most part. It’s the few fuckers at the top that make me feel a rise in blood temperature. But then I can argue similarly for some of my leaders in the UK. Most politicians are assholes, just that some are more assholeish compared to others

jagged birch
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According to the article linked, they are monitoring for any expansion of the political expression that targets individuals or is outside of the context of the invasion which would then make them prohibited

dawn quartz
finite sail
dawn quartz
finite sail
glass wyvern
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Yep

finite sail
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well Zelensky seems ok for now

jagged birch
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Telling a victim that they should be gagged for being mean in text messages about the people killing them is like gagging a rape victim for defamation against a rapist

finite sail
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but i dont know enough about Ukrainian politics tbh

glass wyvern
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I would say that Canada and NZ seem to have some grounded politicians but then I don’t know enough to say for certain

grave brook
glass wyvern
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I may be way off and I may be violating sever rules so let’s not divulge more

finite sail
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idk, been hearing more negative stuff about Trudeau more recently

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not sure about Canada

grave brook
finite sail
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theyve also been uncovering a bunch of mass burial sites at schools in Canada

grave brook
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O_o

finite sail
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not super recent graves but

grave brook
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like, schools were build on the old graveyards?

jagged birch
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Yes. Canada had a bout 100 years long of children being taken from their native parents by catholic schools and forced into re-education

glass wyvern
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Lum1nus, while you are here… I know you can’t speak against Putin and such but what about Nebenzya…? Are you allowed to call him an asshole?

grave brook
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whos he

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😮

finite sail
jagged birch
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The re-education schools apparently often had corporal punishment that resulted in the deaths of children

glass wyvern
jagged birch
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For 100 years

finite sail
grave brook
finite sail
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thousands of graves have been found

jagged birch
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The last residential school closed in 1996

finite sail
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(not at thousands of sites)

glass wyvern
finite sail
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very very fucked up

jagged birch
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So from 1896-1996, thousands of children were ostensibly taken from their native parents, "re-educated" and spit back into society as catholics or killed and disappeared into a fog of war that was this entire residential school system.

finite sail
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i have Native American heritage which is rather conflicting as an American, as similar atrocities happened

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to the indigenous ppl

grave brook
# glass wyvern Russia’s main UN guy

oh, no idea about what he says tbh. never watched any of his speeches in UN. Its the chunky bald dude in glasses, right?
I can say that i had respect towards Lavrov, he was a really wise and decent man... but now hes saying absolute cringe

jagged birch
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Since the last school was closed, only one prime minister has stepped forward to see any justice for the natives that have suffered here.

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Justin Trudeau.

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I don't agree with a lot of his shpiel, but in trying to find redemption for this history, I do.

glass wyvern
dawn quartz
glass wyvern
jagged birch
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Has the Security Council already convened to discuss these proofs Russia claims to have of plots by the US and Ukraine to use Chemical Weapons?

glass wyvern
grave brook
glass wyvern
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It happened about three hours ago or so

jagged birch
glass wyvern
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Or worse

jagged birch
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Did they end up providing even any evidence or was it conjecture?

glass wyvern
glass wyvern
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I’ll take a look

grave brook
glass wyvern
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No from what I see it was unaccompanied by evidence

glass wyvern
jagged birch
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What is a ukrainian missile? Do they even manufacture missiles?

finite sail
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US apparently just shipped a whole bunch of Patriots so, i think they have some

glass wyvern
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Not sure if manufacturing, quite likely to be honest as they also used to have part of the Soviet space programme

grave brook
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i meant belonging to UA army
not sure if they manufacture smth on their own, prob bought from Russia earlier and got from US and Poland later

finite sail
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prob more missiles used by ukraine that were provided to them by allies

glass wyvern
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But they are also obtaining ones from Russian abandoned posts, western shipments and purchases prior to the war

grave brook
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yep

dawn quartz
jagged birch
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What evidence do you have that missile was fired by Ukraine?

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Dmytro Kuleba says it was Russia.

glass wyvern
finite sail
jagged birch
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https://twitter.com/DmytroKuleba/status/1497463617767227395?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1497463617767227395|twgr^|twcon^s1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.abc.net.au%2Fnews%2F2022-02-26%2Ffrightening-moment-a-missile-hit-a-residential-building-in-kyiv%2F100864932

Dmytro Kuleba (@DmytroKuleba)

Kyiv, our splendid, peaceful city, survived another night under attacks by Russian ground forces, missiles. One of them has hit a residential apartment in Kyiv. I demand the world: fully isolate Russia, expel ambassadors, oil embargo, ruin its economy. Stop Russian war criminals! https://t.co/c3ia46Ctjq

Likes

70326

Retweets

21415

Twitter ·
glass wyvern
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I think maybe different one

dawn quartz
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Yeah, he was never quite the same.
🙁

finite sail
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i have a buddy who lost friends in afghanistan, he himself was in a humvee when it was hit by an IED

glass wyvern
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I think it’s one in Kharkiv

finite sail
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hes not a fan of loud noises these days

glass wyvern
finite sail
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war will change anyone

jagged birch
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Child abuse changes you. I have a very short fuse when I see it.

glass wyvern
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This is the one I was thinking

finite sail
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and not for the better

glass wyvern
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But I might be wrong

jagged birch
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I don't think thats kyiv

glass wyvern
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No it’s Kharkiv as I said ^^

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I don’t think it was Kyiv that they claimed UA fired on themselves I think it was Kharkiv or maybe elsewhere

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As of yet there hasn’t been a lot of fighting directly in Kyiv

grave brook
jagged birch
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Trying to find any news of russians claiming ukraine firing on themselves to find source doc

dawn quartz
glass wyvern
grave brook
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yes

glass wyvern
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My bad if it was, sorry

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Ok Mumbles you had the right one

grave brook
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the aqcuaintance of mine has actually a flat in this house on that height but in the opposite side

glass wyvern
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Shit

grave brook
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they were not there at the time

glass wyvern
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Thank fuck for that

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I have a friend in Kyiv also. I’ve offered him a place to live outside of Ukraine for him and his family but he says they will stay as they don’t want to leave. I can understand that to be honest. But I fear soon I won’t hear from him again.

grave brook
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i heard also the whole pre-story about that shot, it was actually not a miss, it was an emergency shot from a damaged system to prevent explosion or smth like that, and sadly it hit the living area of Kyiv
not sure about it tho

jagged birch
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So the weapon malfunctioned?

glass wyvern
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I mean it is a fact that despite all our technology there are accidents and mistakes made during fighting. We cannot pretend to be infallible

grave brook
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kinda

jagged birch
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I can't see a politician pushing the russians hit Kyiv narrative if they knew it was a weapons malfunction

grave brook
jagged birch
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...Yes and that would blow up in their face.

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There are satellites watching

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Easy to disprove

glass wyvern
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Satellites cannot watch these things at this level over an entire city or country

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Honest

grave brook
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^

glass wyvern
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Very hard

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As much as we have some very sophisticated technology up there it ain’t this good sadly

grave brook
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at this point every photo of some destroyed structure is used

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this house just looks too damn horrible

glass wyvern
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I have worked on satellites for over a decade now and I have worked specifically on satellite imagery and radar technology etc

grave brook
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it doesnt actually make a difference what hit that house

glass wyvern
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This level of detail would not be possible to achieve over a wide radius

grave brook
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but this is an example for everyone to remember than UA gov is not innocent and honest sheeps, and their words should not be always taken at face value

glass wyvern
grave brook
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yep

glass wyvern
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Basically I mean, they have bigger fish to fry

jagged birch
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If it was a weapons malfunction, I don't think that politician knew it at the time of opening his mouth. It's too easy to disprove.

grave brook
glass wyvern
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And for that I can it blame them to be honest

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It’s a necessary strategy most of the time

grave brook
glass wyvern
glass wyvern
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Again not direct insult aimed at you man, just that I do have to facepalm regularly at the moment lol

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Lol yeah

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If only it were April 1st

jagged birch
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Looks like the convoy has been moving around