nms-the-future

[full stag]

would be dope

[soft stream]

Not sure specifically about this idea - but I do like the idea of objectives that expire. So you have to complete the objectives, but within the timeframe. I recall there used to be (still are?) some missions like this. Always felt more exciting.

[chrome schooner]

oh that'd be cool

@scenic furnace how are wind turbines related to the void?

(since it was said to continue in here :P)

[rotund stratus]

I feel like either towns or the void idea are likely candidates for frontiers

[scenic furnace]

not related

wormholes could be

but not wind turbines

[rotund stratus]

Not exactly sure what other big features it could be. I'm sure station ownership will be part of it to a degree

[scenic furnace]

that was just part of the text datamines for base parts

[chrome schooner]

ah gotcha

yeah something with that space station control for sure 😛

[scenic furnace]

they probably wanted to have a wind based generator but couldn't get it right for whatever reason

[soft stream]

Most likely a game balancing decision. If it only worked in storms, it's pretty unpredictable. Otherwise, they would need persistent winds on planets. Not that I would be against that idea.

[rotund stratus]

I'd just assume they would make the wind value increase with height, and boost power generation in storms

[soft stream]

Given Sean's reference to "a missing piece of sci-fi fantasy", I see that as being some kind of antagonist or good vs. evil battle. I can't think of many Sci-Fi series where something like this doesn't exist (Empire, First Order, Klingons, The Borg, Cylons, Reapers, etc). We have the Atlas and Sentinels, but they are mostly more benevolent. We need a true good vs. evil struggle to really lift the sci-fi tempo here I think.

[soft stream]

If water is indeed getting an update, then fluid mechanics could be on the table. Wind power and Hydro come to mind. Might be nice additions to the existing Power generation mechanics?

Perhaps even deep-sea sources of power?

Hydro-pressure and underwater gases.

Volcanic power sources.

[scenic furnace]

my idea was that they would always generate some power - very little on calm planets, and decent on extreme planets (since extreme planets are visually very windy), and when a storm would occur it would generate a lot more which would again be quite powerful for base builds on extreme planets

[soft stream]

Could definitely be an interesting mechanic, especially if you expand it to fluid mechanics so waterfalls, waves and other fluid mechanics type behaviours could be incorporated. Heat / gas / steam from volcanoes another option, too. Maybe even lightning rods?

[gloomy hazel]

There should be ships that can only float on water ⛵

[restive basin]

blackhole stations

[prisma cradle]

i wish playstation had better dialogue

like why cant i just type ffs.

[tawdry tendon]

All i want is a inventory filter system 🥲

[gloomy hazel]

Atlas ship

Please

You can get it doing a mission for the atlas

[lime furnace]

Would be cool to pilot your freighter/frigates! Do some missions, mine and stuff

[prime narwhal]

Now that's what I like to hear. Don't forget ship interiors for frigates.

[lime furnace]

Yess, as well

Missions like, would be cool if we actually could do the expeditions ourselves

With the same chance for rewards as it is now, to make it like, it's not gonna take for example 24h which are the longest ones but idk 1/2h

[prime narwhal]

Well in addition to frigates that are flyable, I'd like to see either npc crews or multicrew functionality (like someone can hop on a turret, maybe someone needs to run around repairing stuff) with multicrew missions.

[lime furnace]

That's also cool, very cool. I'm also thinking how would that be to run combat patrols

Some similar system like is in Warframe's railjack (not advertising rn) that's what offline means

[soft stream]

Question: If Frontiers brings with it a combat update and a threat or threats to peace in the No Man's Sky universe - would you want to fight on the "good" side (to save the Atlas, and free systems), or the "bad" side (to destroy the Atlas, and conquer systems)?

[visual cloak]

i wonder if HG would even give us a choice

[soft stream]

I sure hope they do. While it would be interesting to just fight against the antagonist, the community demand for better combat and PvP would only really be possible if there was some kind of objective. Some players will naturally want to side with the "bad guys" because they perceive it as more fun. Others will be happy to see the threat eradicated. Giving players choice about that would only be a positive thing, I think. I'm not huge on PvP myself, but the idea of better combat and missions that further a larger objective (instead of more simple fetch/destroy missions that have been done to death already) would be kind of cool. Protecting a convoy, delivering a consignment, retrieving data from behind enemy lines, doing recon on enemy installations, defending a system under threat - all would make really interesting story arcs and gameplay for those who want to participate. Best of all, in such a large universe, you could also completely avoid this aspect if you wanted to. And for those who really want a passive experience, just turning off PvP will be all they need ... and they can simply watch from the sidelines - still a cool spectacle.

[supple warren]

I would prefer a less Manichean, good/bad, approach to any such combat, especially considering that going down that route would be something of a departure from the more interesting shades of gray we currently have

Like if there were improvements to combat such that one was compelled to align with groups, I'd prefer that none of them read as clearly good or evil, and that if anything perhaps they'd use some of the generated groups you do missions for currently that otherwise don't have any real presence

[soft stream]

So, do you mean having the ability to create, join and align with various factions (player created or AI), for example, rather than just one big threat?

[supple warren]

I'm thinking more that you join/align with generated groups, yeah

Since they already have them if you look at who is requesting help in the station mission boards

[soft stream]

Hmmm. Perhaps both ideas make sense? I do like the idea of the galaxy / universe being more diverse than just one "big threat" ... but at the same time, I feel some players will find that easier to process - and give HG a canvas to tell more unified stories at a community level. I do hope we will get some form of true factions in Frontiers ... instead of the relatively insipid version we have today with races and guilds. What might be interesting is to combine the two, and have factions either "for" or "against" the primary threat? I realise that is a bit more "good vs evil", but perhaps there is more nuance than that?

[supple warren]

tbh I'm not interested in stories on a community level. I don't participate in the in-game communities atm because technically speaking multiplayer makes the game less reliable & can reduce performance.

Until they can improve their network/multiplayer situation more, I don't think building content atop it is worthwhile. Doing so without network/multiplayer improvements essentially invites people to see the worst side of the game on a technical level, without accounting for community behavior in any way

In terms of gameplay I think keeping any factions implemented in the gray allows each to maintain a better set of more compelling missions & narratives than if one were to try to pigeonhole them into good/evil.

Not to mention the good/evil approach could lead to community division and toxicity

[soft stream]

Yeah. I hear ya. Which is why I suspect we might get something simpler rather than more nuanced. An encroaching force we can “push back” as a community, rather than a more nuanced and richer approach like you’re suggesting.

But we can still hope 😀

[supple warren]

i mean tbh we technically already had said encroaching force during weekend missions and it just ended on a cliffhanger that to this day has yet to be resolved, so...It's possible they may resume that in a new mission chain, maybe

[soft stream]

Yeah. But that’s mostly window dressing. No new mechanics or content. Same old missions we’ve done before. Probably why they ditched it. Engagement probably wasn’t there. What this game needs is new mechanics and reasons to play. Not just recycling the same old stuff. I was kind of hoping Expeditions was the platform for that, but so far it’s been “do the same stuff again, and get pretty things”.

[supple warren]

I'm kind of split on this front tbh, because in many ways I definitely agree, but the problem comes about that they've been introducing new mechanics & sort of abandoning them as they go

Like extractors are essentially higher yield, more reliable Autonomous Mining Units/Atmosphere Harvesters, instead of...Y'know, making those work reliably, increasing their yield, and creating remote transfer capabilities to dump overflow into storage

Similarly, we had medium/large refiners prior to Beyond, yet Beyond didn't introduce a means to feed extractor output/depots into them

We've also had star system economy types since Atlas Rises, yet Next's frigates didn't offer any means to set trade frigates on trade routes along them, nor did Beyond enable one to tell frigates to load up on resources from designated bases with extractors/depots to run through systems selling resources

Oh and to be clear, these are all things I think would be wise to implement in the future as a way of improving existing features

[soft stream]

Totally agree. They tend to introduce things and move on, rather than refining the idea. Living Ships. Exotics. Exo Mechs. Frigates. Derelicts. PvP. It certainly does feel as though there isn’t a coherent vision in place. More of a make it up as you go kind of thing. Which I guess suits the business model. Release new stuff, create buzz, sell units. Repeat. Not much profit in revisiting old ground I guess.

[balmy cove]

More buildings for player bases, e.g. Hangar which would have a roof or front opening, local area forcefield to create large safe areas, etc...

[calm pulsar]

id love forcefields

[prisma cradle]

bad side because being a villain is fun.

😈

[soft stream]

We already have shields in our ships and our exosuit, and the personal forcefield for the Multitool. What do you think they should add specifically?

[soft stream]

How did I know you were going to say that? 😉

[calm pulsar]

basically what Inferno699 described: A placable forcefield that protects an area from the climate

[prisma cradle]

because you used the force... @soft stream

[soft stream]

I find your lack of faith disturbing, admiral... 😄

[calm pulsar]

Have you heard the tale of Darth Sean the Hypeful?

[prisma cradle]

y'know what would be really cool though.

being able to start factions and colonise star systems.

and build the galactic empire.

[calm pulsar]

to add to this:
power cost could scale with the size of the field, and how harsh the climate of the planet is

[prisma cradle]

It'd be nice to find destroyed planets that are in multiple huge pieces.

It'd be very interesting.

[soft stream]

So kind of like a glass box, but protected by a forcefield instead of a structure?

[soft stream]

Hanging around in Alderaan places...

[calm pulsar]

kinda, yeah
its a nice alternative to glass boxes for those who want to build outside bases

[soft stream]

Cool, yeah. I also think it would be good to be able to spawn a biome where you place a base computer, so you could create a kind of sub-biome on a planet.

[calm pulsar]

terraforming would be so cool

[soft stream]

Not quite terraforming, more or less creating a kind of terrarium of sorts for a different biome type. Nothing planet-wide, just localised. An oasis in the desert for example.

Maybe it riffs on your forcefield idea, in that it has a giant forcefield dome over it?

[calm pulsar]

yeah that would be great
maybe as a second tier of field?
You could pick the cheaper, normal one if you want to keep the current biome, or upgrade it if you want to turn it into a different biome.

Terraforming an area seems like it'd need more technology than just the field alone so a second tier makes sense to me.

[balmy cove]

Maybe not purchase the fields but be unlocked at the anomaly for maybe 20 salvaged data per tier

You you could need multiple to make the shields area bigger

For domes

But it would have a max hight

[weak meadow]

No mans sky rtx?

You have dlss now so why not ray tracing

[odd horizon]

Guess update will drop today.
https://steamdb.info/app/275850/history/?changeid=12430336

[gloomy hazel]

Are you in the 31st?

[odd horizon]

Yeah.

UTC+3:00.

[gloomy hazel]

UTC -8

I think NMS would be great with multiple crew ships, since you teleport in and out I imagine it wouldn't be too hard to have a crew capacity stat, and just let non driving players see in 3rd person. Would be fun then to add transport missions to take NPCS to different systems and drop them off at trading posts, or stations

Players could still summon their ships, so nobody would get stranded

Only problem is you can't summon on a space station, if they added that it'd work out perfectly

I mean, I guess everyone can just get on someone's freighter....

dang it

[sharp maple]

Nothing is going to happen

[soft stream]

Not with that attitude it won't 😄

[gloomy hazel]

Patch Notes:

• Nothing

[frank dagger]

space trucking

[humble nest]

why not? :(

[odd horizon]

steamcontrollerconfigdetails/2589987438/controller_type: controller_switch_pro

[visual cloak]

footprints on terrain when?

[gloomy hazel]

Mech can so I don't know why we can't. 😤

[visual cloak]

wait really?

[gloomy hazel]

Yeah. Mech leaves footprints.

[visual cloak]

Wat da fub

[gloomy hazel]

🤷

[visual cloak]

how have i not noticed this or forgotten about it completely

[gloomy hazel]

Hello

[strange tiger]

I wonder why they're focusing on controller configs suddenly

[visual cloak]

wow that’s so cool! so no excuse to add to player footsteps

[halcyon portal]

probably steam have changed something in steamkit with the release of the handheld approaching

[cedar briar]

Or there's a new controller map like exomechs did

[strange tiger]

That does seem plausible now that I think about it...

[strange tiger]

Wait did the branches receive a new control config like this time back then?

[halcyon portal]

roamer update confirmed

[drowsy scarab]

So what are our best guesses for what's going to be in this update?

[amber hare]

Roamer

[halcyon portal]

!patchnotes

ohh, this isn't the hype channel

[drowsy scarab]

Gave me a near heart attack. I thought it was released.

[halcyon portal]

Sorry!

[nocturne kraken]

Realized we have nothing with this body type. Any large bodied herbivores either have wide asses and a shuffle, or cow bodies and tiny faces

[visual cloak]

that cover is basically unused concept art

pretty much everything in it would be really cool additions to the game

[rotund stratus]

Yeah

Hopefully one day

[visual cloak]

something I don't really need but would be interesting down the line: I wonder how much creative freedom they have with their new cloud tech?

[supple warren]

are you thinking what i'm thinking

procedural cloud formations

sit back and see things in the clouds

[visual cloak]

also yes

but i wonder if they'd be able to add unique cloud formations into the new tech

the second image, we had a bug after NEXT that generated clouds very close to those

[rotund stratus]

I'd be very interested to see it, especially now the cloud tech is nearly spot on. I'd imagine it'll basically be tweaking noise maps, so I bet it would be possible to have wispy clouds etc

Or swirly

[visual cloak]

damn if i was Sean I'd task an employee just to work on more cloud formations

[soft stream]

Ship customisation. If we don’t get it for the five year anniversary, it’s never happening. And that would make me sad.

[visual cloak]

even if we don’t get it now, i think it’s bound to come later

pretty sure there’s datamined stuff to support it

[soft stream]

That’s the problem. It has been talked about and even experimented with for years. If there ever was a time to do it, it’s now. Failing that, it’s much more of a long shot. Sean has talked explicitly in an early interview about the “joy” of waiting for your perfect ship to come in. I think that’s true for some, but I can see a way both can be supported. Add a “U” class upgrade option, scrap ships for parts. Then you could be a “classic” or “custom” collector. Everybody would be happy.

[visual cloak]

there’s just so much they can do in each update, i think it’s not that crazy that it hasn’t made it in yet

even though it’s had minor tweaks like shop upgrading

i like your idea though

[soft stream]

It’s definitely a top 3 request from the community, but has also been controversial because of the purists. I think my idea strikes the balance.

[visual cloak]

one way or another, they’re gonna meet in the middle. the rng will still be present

[soft stream]

Yeah. But the purists won’t have it. I get it. They love ship hunting. It’s just not for everyone.

[supple warren]

i would like prebuilt ships as mission rewards and such, same with multitools, and add more opportunities to scavenge damaged multitools

[visual cloak]

yuh

[supple warren]

maybe i'm an outlier regarding the station/Nexus mission rewards, but the odd product/commodity/crafting piece & currency doesn't do much for me

Actual equipment, e.g. starships & multitools, alongside upgrade modules, would make me more inclined to take on station/Nexus missions.

This is especially the case given that the station/Nexus missions as they are now only have the rewards going for them imo.

[soft stream]

I want to see persistent RNG expeditions with big rewards every month. Including date stamped badges / decals you can collect and showcase. Then, tie the nexus missions to that. The smaller rewards aren’t great, but if I’m grinding for that sweet weekly phase reward that lets me flex, I’m all in. Then, HG can simply drop new cosmetics and RNG items every month. I’d take that over ship customisation any day of the week.

I love my golden vector.

And yes I’m advocating time limited exclusives. That’s what’s missing right now with the QS missions. No real urgency.

In fact if they didn’t want to time stamp the decals, just make them exclusive and time locked. Players who consistently do the missions end up having the most enviable collection.

The easiest way to implement this would be to have some QS items disappear from the shop at the end of the month.

[supple warren]

ergh

it's already annoying enough that they're trying to influence folks into playing daily/weekly with that stuff imo

The folks that those systems are effective for are the folks that aren't necessarily satisfied with the game's other systems imo, which is why they need that dripfeed to compel them to play daily/weekly

It feels like sort of a stand-in for other systems HG may not want to implement to keep that set of folks entertained, maybe? Or they just aren't sure how they might want to implement yet, hard to say

[gloomy hazel]

Nah, It's just a different reward cycle. Not everyone can feel accomplished moving through a huge list of possible tasks and need a smaller subset that has a defined end

[supple warren]

i can understand that, but then you have station missions for that as well

[gloomy hazel]

My main reason I like the expeditions is I start over, so my other progress doesn't make things too easy

[supple warren]

And the non-quicksilver related Nexus missions can work to that end for MP folks

I feel like the quicksilver-driven stuff creates a distinct subset within the subset you're describing

[gloomy hazel]

Those missions have a unique reward, but not a unique problem, I think the expeditions so far have been interesting because it generally forced me to do things I didn't experience as often. Like looking for red planets or abandoned systems

Also everyone in the expedition starting around the same time, and seeing people at those check points was a lot of fun, even though sometimes they were buggy

[supple warren]

I should probably clarify a bit, with what I've said in the past few comments, I was saying with the quicksilver missions in focus more than anything to do with the Expeditions

[gloomy hazel]

OH

You're saying quick silver is drip feeding?

[supple warren]

With Expeditions I'd honestly just like the ability to launch them offline and have them proc-gen rather than curated and only releasing every so many months

Yeah, the quicksilver setup is basically a dripfeed of cosmetics

[gloomy hazel]

I'd like something like that too, but It'd suck if it ended up like the mission boards

Yeah I wish quicksilver was more interesting to get

Quicksilver is definitely a slow mode for content

[supple warren]

It entices a different set of folks than those that are looking for short tasks with a defined end like the Expedition phases or station/Nexus non-QS missions

That's what I was trying to say earlier

[gloomy hazel]

I've been trying to get all the quicksilver items without cheesing the RNG, and it's not that fun

Hmm yeah if expeditions were procedural, and just gave quick silver items as rewards you could share across all you saves, I'd be really into that

[supple warren]

I think a minor improvement could be to make it so that the exotic/weird collectible base decor items could be sold to the QS vendor for QS

It'd still be a grind/farming affair, but would at least be a little more freeform compared to the missions

[gloomy hazel]

And hopefully less on a timer, expedition milestones might take a while, but if you complete it you could just start another expedition

Although, I do appreciate hand stitched content. The first 2 expeditions did actually feel special.

Tough to know what would actually be fun for myself without experiencing it. Since I did enjoy them, when weekend missions had a story that was another instance of interesting content. And now I'm not sure if weekends are anything more than just more quick silver

[soft stream]

I’m warming to the idea of expeditions without timed rewards. So, over time there is a large catalogue of unique rewards for completing specific quest lines. That would be the right balance I think, as long as there were always new expeditions available. To be clear though, the rewards would be unique cosmetics, ships, multi tools and upgrades like we had in Expeditions. Not just more Activated Indium or QS.

The idea being that players who play these quest lines get to showcase their achievements and talk about them with others. And there’s always enough for people to chase and be in the “first” group, with other players having more and more to do and collect over time.

[supple warren]

yeah, i can see where you're coming from with that. It's sorta the "easier" route compared to what i'd prefer of the game having more systems interactions to generate experiences for people to talk about with each other

[soft stream]

People could always complete missions / expeditions together. And I agree, the main thing this game needs is new mechanics. There are only so many fetch / destroy quests you can do before it feels samey. I want to see more story elements like escorting a convoy, defending a space station, eliminating a target, acquiring intel. But all of it as part of a broader story arc that puts the fate of the universe in your / our hands. A bigger purpose.

[supple warren]

yeah, you're still thinkin' more curated, which i'd also like to see to a degree, but ultimately i'd like more systems-driven encounters/experiences

[gloomy hazel]

The sweep scanner was a good example of how to make an incremental improvement to a lot of things. Sometimes making things use a new mechanic to accomplish a similar task can improve the overall gameplay

I know the rescue missions are a chore though, and you interact with the sweep a lot there

Although those missions actually do move quickly with more people

[supple warren]

Not an issue with the target sweep tho

It's just the design of that particular mission type is bleh

[gloomy hazel]

Yeah, the main issue is the random chance of getting a signal

[supple warren]

Check x amount of buried tech modules where it could be anywhere from 2 to ???

[gloomy hazel]

I'd prefer to have to look further for those modules but when I find one, I get the signal

[supple warren]

Would at least like that type to have the find the authenticator objective or repair specific part, as you tend to find outside of missions

[gloomy hazel]

Or just turn the mission into a drop pod style thnig, where I have to bring back resources to fix the ship

[supple warren]

right

I think having it to where the objective could be either would be a little better

[gloomy hazel]

Yeah

Another idea would be to send us to factories to retrieve parts to fix the ship, corrupted sentinels could be around the buildings

[soft stream]

Could still be procedural. Just the rewards would be hand-crafted - although even these could be simply configurations of what's already in game a lot of the time (specific ships with bumped stats and custom textures, for example). Adding some uniqueness to the rewards would make them more interesting. As would adding some uniqueness to the mission storylines. Right now it feels like "do the same things as you would normally ... for Quicksilver!"

[supple warren]

well the missions are technically proc-gen, right? yet the samey problem still emerges, in part because of how simple their designs are (likely to better work with being generated) & because that's kind of just how missions tend to work that aren't curated mission chains

When I say more systems driven, I mean like, you have something that's aggressive, e.g. pirates, something that's neutral, e.g. traders, and something in-between, e.g. Sentinels, and you let each of those interact based on those properties.

Pirates attacking traders, which might themselves have distinct responses based on the type of alien they are, like Korvax might try to evade giving you an opportunity to save them, Vy'keen might defend themselves and even get annoyed if you try to help them, and Gek might dump their cargo to try to pay the pirates off.

In those first two scenarios, depending on the success or failure of the traders under attack, you might come across Sentinels hunting down the Pirates & Vy'keen traders, who you know would take insult to the Sentinels' intervention and 'cause they just hate Sentinels.

[soft stream]

Oh yeah. I'd be down for that! That's exactly what I want. That and ship customisations.

[nocturne kraken]

It’s specific but there’s so many freighter parts we desperately need available to us

Those beds build into the walls? PLEASE

[soft stream]

I want an airlock and EVA gear for our freighters, with associated missions to conduct external repairs in low gravity. Perhaps an exocraft / exoskeleton style movable work platform?

[soft stream]

Furthering this idea, some Exosuit and MT upgrades for EVA / external activity might be enough - no need for an exocraft, perhaps? Conduct repairs or install equipment on your freighter, frigates, ship or space station (!) in low gravity / low atmosphere situations. Also protects against damage in space. Adds the ability to land and explore / mine on asteroids - if you dare!

This would add new mission types ... which is a sorely needed feature.

You could even have missions to repair NPC freighters and frigates after combat sequences as a way to earn additional rewards. Land on the freighter after defeating the pirates, and the captain asks for your help to repair a damaged engine, which requires a certain amount of rare resources and the suitable exosuit and multi-tool upgrades to facilitate external repairs.

Perhaps those rare resources require you to fly into the asteroid field and locate the resources, mine them and return (in your ship) to the freighter before repairs can begin. This would be pretty awesome!

To make the mission more challenging / interesting, you first have to travel to the engine and find out what's wrong. The game then asks you to craft some parts (similar to how ship repairs are done now) from resources ... and if you don't have them, or don't know the recipe, you have to go and discover it first before you can achieve the reward

But, I still think a kind of EVA exocraft might be fun to drive around in space - and make for a different pacing / experience to flying in your ship. Also another thing to unlock ... which would add some more reward for the grind, and perhaps even a mission (similar to Starbirth or Dreams of the Deep) to unlock it. I imagine it would be somewhat similar to the Nautilon, but only works in space, and has robotic arms you can operate - so it's sort of a cross between the Exo Mech and the Nautilon.

[candid cloud]

Some PvP like cod be nice could have big walls in middle to fly around to run into other teams and risk the spacecraft you own in a hardcore mode or have time limit mode with most kills win and unlock achievements. but yes I understand it's a big risk but I'd love to go search n buy/upgrade a spaceship to risk in a fight .10 quicksilver a win be dope lol

[rotund stratus]

My main QoL idea is a fast start/ option to skip the tutorial

Just repair your ship, get a hyper drive and go

Unlocked after you play through the tutorial once

Or have the tutorial be opt in

[visual cloak]

@supple warren so exciting I can't wait to reveal a settlement with a map instead of exploring to find one

[visual cloak]

oh I am sure you can

but the fact that you don't have to go find it is...meh

[unkempt shell]

until they give us a better system for discovering stuff whilst exploring places, i don't mind this as a stopgap. still think they should ditch the charts entirely though

[toxic slate]

my main criticism so far with what was shown is that it's still just the three races. I love the idea of frontier towns in theory, but wanted them to be a point for exploration, not turn it into Animal Crossing. to have the towns populated with procedural aliens and procedural lore about who they are, what they're doing there, etc. so maybe this is something they can build on with this new system

[copper dawn]

I wonder why there aren´t already procedural sentient aliens? And it isn´t just problem of this game, but there is one similar game, which also has only three species of pre-made sentient aliens. Why is everybody scared to make this thing procedural? 😦

[signal flume]

It looks like Frontiers might be a stepping stone for bigger things in mind, since I saw a tweet that stated there were about 100,000 changes made to the engine

[copper dawn]

They implemented there procedural interiors of buildings. So I bet it is.

[rich relic]

but you can explore to find one if you want?

like, there are multiple ways to skin a cat lol

[toxic slate]

i would imagine so, same way you can stumble across a portal

but I suspect the other person was more or less saying that everyone will take the path of least resistance. but those people probably don't like wandering around on planets anyway

[visual cloak]

agreed

[visual cloak]

yeah i know, my point is, the cartographer feature is not fun and is poorly implemented and does not support a fun exploration experience.

[rich relic]

then dont use it and search for one?

[visual cloak]

you're missing the point.

[rich relic]

complaining about an option, when you are not forced to use that option, really comes across as complaining for the sake of complaining

[rigid spruce]

^ yeah now that we have npcs that we can get a little closer to it could open a new floodgate to different types of companions, eventually probably different looking settlements and possibly themes

[visual cloak]

they implemented this feature years ago, and now it could be expanded upon, but it hasn't been and remains shallow.

[unkempt shell]

it's the only viable method to find them. butting your head into a wall for potentially hours to find a place is no better

[rich relic]

that has nothing to do with your initial statement, now your shifting a goalpost

[visual cloak]

i'm reenforcing my statement

[rich relic]

thats how i find archive buildings, i got no issue with it

[visual cloak]

I and others here have talked a lot about the cartographer system in this discord

[rich relic]

except its not, your initial complaint was about using a chart rather than exploring and finding one organically, now you are saying its the chart system isnt fleshed out enough

that is goal post shifting

[unkempt shell]

it's a simple desire for a better system than either walking aimlessly or having to use RNG consumables you can only purchase in space, imo

[visual cloak]

doesn't even deserve its own booth in the space station

[visual cloak]

it's both.

[unkempt shell]

honestly even just bringing back ambient markers for unexplored POI's to your standard HUD would be an insanely helpful re-addition that it makes me wonder why it was ever removed

now you have to glue your face to your analysis visor to find anything

[rich relic]

your complaint here said nothing about the chart system not being fleshed out, it was entirely about not exploring to find one, of which you have the option?

[visual cloak]

I've felt it's been an issue since it was implemented #no-mans-sky message

funny the only time you've ever tried talking to me is to disagree.

move on, eva

I would love to use the cartographer, personally, if it was fun to use

[hot flame]

She is entitled to her opinion, same as you

[visual cloak]

imagine maps in nms

yeah gleam, i know, i just have a problem with people who never communicate with you, and the first time they do they argue with you.

[unkempt shell]

the next expedition is called cartographers, isn't it? and we still have no map system 🥲

i feel like sean is baiting me personally at this point

[rich relic]

thats from a year ago, and is entirely different discussion though than you litterally opening up here today about not finding one organically? you said nothing about wanting the cartographer improved until i mentioned you can find one organically

[visual cloak]

I never said you couldn't go find one organically

i even said you probably could to someone else in another channel

or in here

#nms-the-future message

but the reason I tagged Leon is because they know what i mean

as we've discussed it before

just to give you some context

[strange tiger]

Already have massive ideas for settlements lol.
Basic base building (technology etc) such as letting you place turrets for helping in new harder sentinel raids, power supplies and networks to manages, redirecting power in emergencies, catastrophic events in rare occasions. There's SO much HG can do with this, I'm seriously excited!

[visual cloak]

i like your ideas. there needs to be more of a sense of danger and the possibility of structures getting damaged as well as npcs getting injured.

[supple warren]

so looks like i need to re-request timer changes and base portability

[toxic slate]

I got faked out by the patch notes when I read "can now move base". ...... [parts more easily] lol

[visual cloak]

🙂

[hardy canopy]

guys best idea ever

fixing the problem with terrain manipulation where it regrows/regenerates

[gloomy plume]

Just struck me, if settlements are part of the temporary spawn in layer, like your base, that means they can spawn in complex scenarios temporarily into the game, like bug hives, pirate bases and such, which have npcs to interact with temporarily

That means they have the means for complex missions that can be spawned in with complex sets of npcs

to fight or interact with

Dude, this is awesome!

[prime narwhal]

I feel like they could have done that already with previous tech though, and the POI system.

Idk, i'm not impressed with this at all. The new visual effects and basebuilding are great, but the settlements? Idk. They just feel like more restrictive freighters.

Honestly makes me worried about the future updates. Like say they introduce station owning, great, what does that mean? Time blocked expansions and missions to generate passive wealth that a large portion of us don't need? Cool I guess.

Idk, this update has left a sour taste in my mouth for the future of this game. There's so much potential and it always gets resorted to time gated mechanics.

And don't take my worries the wrong way. If you're enjoying it, by all means, keep enjoying it.

I just personally have no interest in time locked mechanics, and feel like there was a real lack of creativity in terms of how we interact with settlements. The settlements themselves are decent looking, but idk. Just has me worried

[unkempt shell]

Idk, this update has left a sour taste in my mouth for the future of this game. There's so much potential and it always gets resorted to time gated mechanics.
i agree with everything you've said, but i don't necessarily think this is indicative of a sudden turn in direction for this game. updates like origins/companions/prisms in just this past year alone have been great steps, and whilst i have my own issues with the gameplay as it stands that may never be fixed, i have full faith in hg to keep putting in great changes to the game as a whole

though, to add to your own points, i really feel this is the biggest dud of a headline feature we've gotten in the past five years. it feels so underdeveloped and non-integrated with even itself, nevermind the rest of the game, and offers very little new gameplay opportunities or even base building options outside of the new parts. disappointing for the 5th anniversary/yearly major update, but that's the way it goes sometimes

[prime narwhal]

That's a fair point I guess my worry is for new features outside of the things they are good at, like visuals and exploration (including variety and things of that nature).

Is this really the major update for the year? It's update 3.6, maybe we will get another toward December as the big 4.0?

Like I said, if they do introduce station owning, I'm genuinely worried

The potential for the economic gameplay of stations, trading, etc could be a lot of fun, but time gates would totally ruin it.

[tawdry tendon]

Its not a major update

[unkempt shell]

Is this really the major update for the year? It's update 3.6, maybe we will get another toward December as the big 4.0?
i would personally guess so. before beyond, major updates never got a full version number increase (atlas rises was 1.3, next 1.5), and only major patches get artwork updates (atlas rises/next/beyond/origins/and now frontiers)

Like I said, if they do introduce station owning, I'm genuinely worried
a few of us here have become sadly all too cynical, and assumed from the get-go that station owning would be pretty similar to what we got with these settlements. i hate the cynicism, but hg seem to really struggle to put interesting gameplay opportunities to things

[unkempt shell]

i really think it is, though. it's got the artwork, and the multiple weeks of hype

no babby "this is a small update" patch gets artwork and multiple weeks of hype

[tawdry tendon]

It this is a major update i go cry in a corner

[unkempt shell]

i think we all feel the same 🥲

[toxic slate]

i doubt we will get 4.0 this year

[unkempt shell]

but i have no doubt this was a ton of work behind the scenes. that's a lot of base parts, and making these settlements alone probably wasn't easily done

[tawdry tendon]

It adds nothing for me :/

Hope you all have fun

[unkempt shell]

but the actual content was pretty garbage*
*to some please don't hurt me

[toxic slate]

the weirdest part to me is there doesn't seem to be any story to go along with these towns. why are they suddenly springing up? what caused the races to suddenly go against Sentinel wishes? etc

[unkempt shell]

it is a shame to me that they undoubtedly went all hands on deck for this, but either didn't have the direction from the start to make it really game changing, or couldn't see a grander vision through

[tawdry tendon]

I hope the next major update is a update only for polishing of all the adden features

[prime narwhal]

Yeah, I didn't even think we would be getting this, so when I saw what it was I was pretty excited, I figured I'd be interacting and doing things for the settlement, but the game literally tells you "talk to the citizens (which does nothing) or go explore" so a new feature that I want to spend time with is forcing me to go do other things? Come on lol

[tawdry tendon]

I was socked that you cant speak to the people

I mean the alians in the space station can do more
Thats just ...

[toxic slate]

tbh i don't think they are "all hands on deck" for the game in general these days, since a big portion of the team is working on their next title. we're lucky to even get updates to NMS at this point

[unkempt shell]

the weirdest part to me is there doesn't seem to be any story to go along with these towns. why are they suddenly springing up? what caused the races to suddenly go against Sentinel wishes? etc

exactly, they could've done more to flesh these out for us. even a mini questline a la base terminals would've been cool

new feature that I want to spend time with is forcing me to go do other things?

it really is pretty silly that this is all we've got

[tawdry tendon]

True

[unkempt shell]

i do mean in the context of hg's nms team alone. it's not gonna be big. artists would've been working on settlements and base parts. coders would've been working on getting the damn things to function

it would've been a ton of work for a small team within a small team

but what they did with it just... wasn't incredibly inspiring

that's the worst part, for me

[toxic slate]

yeah a ton of effort went into it, no doubt

[prime narwhal]

Yeah I don't want to bash HG too hard and insult them, I appreciate the effort and free updates, but I also won't pretend that I enjoy this update

And it does have me concerned for future content

[unkempt shell]

somehow think a merger of companions and prisms would've gone down better than this for the big patch!

i do think they should consider doing bigger, less frequent updates more actually. if this year we got a big next-style patch, and it has companions/prisms/expeditions/frontiers in it, that would've been a banger

it would probably all be better integrated too

[toxic slate]

eh, see I did not like companions or care about them at all. so that was a nothing feature for me. they're never going to please everyone bc we all want different things from the game

[unkempt shell]

but hg seem happy with these smaller-more-often patches going off of what sean said

[unkempt shell]

that's fair. i like it because it's just more incentive to actually go out and explore. all of companion's featureset requires you to be planetside, paying attention to what you discover

it has very little timers, you can adopt anything, and it never asks you to go back to an anchor point in-universe. you just free explore and get to enjoy it all

but that's my preference talking

[toxic slate]

i do wish the settlements had been exploration focused POIs. interesting new cultures, aliens, ruins, puzzles to solve. animal crossing was definitely not an idea I had submitted to zendesk lol

[unkempt shell]

frontiers is all timers, takes place in one spot in the entire universe, and rewards you with money rather than experiences

[tawdry tendon]

Waterline is still not fixed
I need mods on xbox :(

Money for what

[unkempt shell]

alright i need to stop posting, my internet is dying, lmao. thanks for the discussions guys and gals! enjoy (or don't) the patch

[gloomy plume]

In response to offline, up tell now all the small settlements are hard baked into the proc gen.

Essentially they can't change unless the proc gen did

These new settlements are traditional and additional

Essentially it's a block of code related to base building. This opens the way for complex points of interest which aren't linked to proc gen

Complex temporary features weren't really possible until this code.

However that being said how they did settlements...meh

[prime narwhal]

What about Desolations?

[gloomy plume]

Similar internally. Different code base

Hehe still that was step 1

Your totally right

Ack gota go breaks over

Frankly I'll just leave and say. If they don't make random poi mods will

[gloomy plume]

Bah, only have a few seconds.

My big worry is how they use Points of interest. If they tie them all into timed activities and currency generators, I think they have a servere lack of understanding of gameplay loops

the possibilties are of course nearly endless

POI can simply be for beauty. A giant tree with leaves you can jump on and make them glow. Perhaps the tree is being attacked by bugs and you can defend it, opening up a opportunity for lore or a mission.

Points of interest have existed in space simply as a visual means of telling lore.

However, making them a interactive enviromnet on a planet would be amazing.

Planetary features could be anything from geothermal vents, massive trees , complex forest cells, hives, nests, lava tubes, geoliths

Really giving some planets unique flavor

the issue is, a infinite number of planets lol

youd need billions of poi

[odd horizon]

I hope HG will allow basebuilding in settlements.

Like you buy area for small/medium/large house and can build inside such area.

[opal viper]

Ship parts peaceable and moveable within limits of their natural positions. Ship faction part crafting recipes. Random rare ship part crafting recipes. Paint job station or ability to color ship as we can the ground/water vehicles.
-dreams

[prime narwhal]

Personally, I don't really want ship building of any kind. At most, I'd like color and decal customization, with MAYBE minor cosmetic parts to attach, and maybe more modules having a visual change on the ship. Other than that, I like ships how they are, I'd just like more variation and another class of ship with interiors that are flyable.

Oh and more cockpit stuff

dangly dice, air freshners, etc lol

[vale dome]

This discussion has already been beaten to the ground here numerous times, but full ship customization would be a great addition imo if done in a way that complements exploration rather than take away from it

I'm personally not a huge fan of how ships are acquired in this game at all, it doesn't feel engaging, I don't feel connected to a ship when I buy it from an NPC at all, if that makes sense

I'd like to see a system where I can scrap different ships down for individual parts/schematics that I can then use on other ships, provided I have enough resources

This would encompass things like individual parts like engines and wings but also paintjobs and the like

[prime narwhal]

I'd like to have to hunt down ships to unlock customization optins when scraping them, but I do not want ship building

But, I also come from old school space games so

[vale dome]

Personally, the most attached I've been to a ship was one that I repaired after I found it crashed on a planet

I felt like I actually earned that ship, however I was disappointed that I could never give it a proper paintjob, as the ship still had all the burn marks on it

And that's my main issue, ship customization is non-existent beyond storage augmentations and for a game that revolves so much around player freedom and customization, ships feel completely undercooked

[prime narwhal]

see to me repairing a ship is a totally headache lol

id rather just buy one so i dont have to fix up everything

but, thats more of an issue with how we repair them

[vale dome]

Yeah, repairs can be tedious considering they're a huge grind most of the time

[prime narwhal]

yeah

[vale dome]

Still, I feel zero engagement when it comes to ships right now. I want to see a system where I can make a ship really my own, from the wing shapes to the paintjob, maybe even add a custom emblem to it or let me customize the internal first person HUD

Ship hunting would still be a thing since you still had to hunt down ships for individual parts, but it wouldn't be the only means of acquiring the perfect ship

[prime narwhal]

Yeah I agree with those features

I'd like to see those

I've played a few games though where you can fully build a ship block by block

and I did not enjoy it as much

[unkempt shell]

see, i want to feel more connected to what i see and own in nms, and equipment is such an integral part of the gameplay that i really want it to shine.
even something simple, like a more engaging way to upgrade the abilities of a ship in a meaningful way, along with some degree of visual flair, would go a long way in making your ship feel like your ship
my fondest memory of playing racing games like gran turismo or need for speed come from taking a beater of a car and making it into something special and uniquely my own. doubly so in need for speed, as even in the ps2 era games that i played back in the day, you had a wealth of customisation options. you could take the slowest vw golf, make it look ridiculous, and have it beat a porsche. and my decked out vw would be different from another's. i felt connected to it in a way that stacking generic upgrade modules and renaming my starship can never achieve

that's why a lot of people love finding a cool ship that's crashed and repairing/upgrading it into something good. you've gone on a journey with it

[toxic slate]

another update where the day length has not been increased. I guess I need to file another zendesk ticket. you would think settlements would give enough reason to have proper days, especially with all these building timers counting down real hours.

[supple warren]

you'd also think they'd recognize people might get more engrossed in the settlements if they were related to in-game time, and you could simply rest or pulse or something to advance the time and continue working with your settlement folks

[toxic slate]

yeah, there's kind of a weird meta disconnect with the use of time in the game

and if there were actual hours-long days and nights, that would lead into residents having their own habits and routines at different times of day. that's kind of a basic sim feature that i'm surprised isn't in

[supple warren]

yeah, there's kind of a weird meta disconnect with the use of time in the game
This has been one of my other frustrations with the realtime stuff. There's so much sci-fi stuff they could do, and even allude to in different interactions, with time manipulation or even just different lengths of day for different planets, as you've often suggested, that it's a bit of a bummer

[toxic slate]

Definitely. I mean they had time manipulation in one of the pre-release trailers

[supple warren]

Like it would be great to have temporal fields that one can pass objects through to see how they change through slower/faster rates of time

for instance if you were to slow a pet's maturation down you might be able to take the opportunity to intervene in certain developmental phases and further alter them, or you could simply accelerate the process but it also alter the end result

similar ideas with crops, you could let them mature normally, or you could slow the process to try to modify and increase the yield or have the fruits, for lack of a better word, carry another resource, or some other more mad science kinda ideas like splicing in some predatory behaviors to draw in & harvest fauna

similar idea with accelerating the process afterward, but it might offset the chances of those modifications succeeding

[toxic slate]

those are definitely interesting. you could also take a more exploratory bent and actually turn back time at procedural ruins to conduct investigations

[supple warren]

ah yeah, imagine a new survey option for temporal anomalies or something like that, which on location & analysis reveal approximate reconstructions of past events by, say, having holographic "ghosts" of the previous inhabitants or event phenomena appear

But also you could potentially harness the temporal anomaly or whatever with another device to attempt to actually revert the area to its past form, including inhabitants, for full accuracy

[toxic slate]

No Man's Murder, a new procedural murder investigation thriller from Hello Games

[supple warren]

HG: "So we just got around to playing Tacoma and wanted to make a mini-version to dot our universe"

[long bobcat]

i hope the next update adds the ability to make custom starships and Space Stations...

[toxic slate]

i never played Tacoma, but seems like something cool to add to the derelicts as well. though it would be hard to take any dramatic scene seriously that features Vykeen or Gek, they are just such goofy aliens

[supple warren]

More seriously, I would genuinely feel more engaged with egg sequencing, frigate expeditions, & I suspect settlements, though I'm still unclear just how timer-laden they are, if I could play with them in shorter sessions.

I know I can play with them as-is in the sense of initiating things with them, but when I say play with them I mean be able to see results in the same play session. That doesn't mean complete everything to do with them in a single play session either, but have a better sense of having done anything at all with them other than wind them up

[toxic slate]

I said this in the main channel earlier, but the main reason I think people are chafing against the timers on the settlements is that there's not really much gameplay to be had otherwise.

the game systems seem focused on unlocking items instead of the residents themselves and their actions. it feels incredibly gamified instead of an attempt to feel like a convincing town. I think Animal Crossing, despite their own timer mechanics, feels like a town. you start to care for those individuals. they all have their own personalities, daily habits, etc. NMS townspeople are rudimentary at best

[supple warren]

I suspect another part to that is the fact that they're more visually represented compared to, say, the frigate expeditions

Otherwise, you'd expect the same irritation with frigate expeditions, since there's also not much gameplay to be had with frigates otherwise

There's also the aforementioned disconnect made even more explicit with these settlements, where with your own bases you can build stuff more or less instantly so long as you have the resources on hand, whereas for some reason construction takes literal hours(?) in settlements

[soft stream]

What I was hoping to see in FRONTIERS, I'm now calling "CATACLYSM". This would be my ultimate update for No Man's Sky. Who else would love this?

[wheat acorn]

The thing that jumps out to me first and foremost is what does "Improved Variety" refer to? It's sort of vague but I don't think many people would argue more cool stuff to see is a bad thing. I just want that expanded on more because I see a lot of people say "more variety" but they don't really have concepts for what that looks like. What kinds of crazy plants or planet types? Cookie planets (example)?

[soft stream]

Honestly, just three things would - I think - make a huge difference. Scale of objects, Colour palettes, and Resource distribution. Many of the assets we have now could be scaled up or down to create a great deal more variety: Towering trees, or smaller versions of the Toxic Plants as two examples. Shifting the colour palettes on the assets would also help a lot. Sure, the biomes are "different", but the assets always seem to have the same colours. And finally, not knowing where to get your sodium when you arrive would add some mystery. Instead of those yellow plants, perhaps sodium resides in rocks on this planet? Or maybe Oxygen can only be extracted from certain plants? Of course, a greater range of assets would never hurt ... I think it would be great if every new release added (say) 50 or so new fauna or flora items to keep discovery fresh. Oh, and finally, adding seasons - so you can go back to a planet and its biome has changed to a different season (hot, cold, wet) would be super cool ... along with colour variations. A lot to ask for, I know - but you asked 🙂

[wheat acorn]

I'm all for the resource thing especially; but I'm also well aware a lot of complaints would be leveled if you couldn't find all resources on all planets

Also as for the proposed large assets; they can cause performance issues on weaker systems but mostly I'm game because I almost always used to download Redmas' Fantasy in the old days and a lot of it was just colour, random assets on random worlds, and large crazy things!

[supple warren]

if improved variety also involved more systems-driven interactions like we've talked about before i'd be down, tho i dunno about improved visuals because that could mean a lot of stuff, and not entirely sure what is meant by shareable discoveries

[slate ridge]

I just want more shit to do in the endgame by myself or with friends = (

[soft stream]

That's what has always puzzled me. If mods can do it, why can't HG? And with the ability to stream assets in the game engine, I'm sure they could figure the performance stuff out - especially now they have the advantage of multiple rounds of tuning, DLSS and other magic. Sigh.

[wheat acorn]

So its not just that massive jungle type places break the asset limit and start appearing and disappearing at random which didn't look great

[soft stream]

Improved Visuals for me kind of goes in hand with Fluid Mechanics. Better water. Waves, waterfalls, that kind of thing. I didn't mention it above, but I also think there's room for them to make a subtle change to storms such that you hear the approach of rolling thunder, for example. Shareable discoveries is putting an "Archivist Terminal" in your base, where visiting players can purchase POI maps that take them to things you've discovered. Another reason to visit other player bases, and a unique way to find things to travel to. I'd also add to this a set of Holoprojector base parts that project holograms of your chosen discovery. They come in different sizes as a means for decorating your base. It might show flora, fauna, ruins or other things you've found. Players could interact with these and see images you've captured, and also purchase a map to take them there to discover it for themselves.

[soft stream]

Exactly why I included EVA missions, multicrew frigates, invaders, habitable platforms, ship customisation. There's a lot of detail behind all this for me - for example, scavenging ships for parts to upgrade your ship, taking on dangerous escort, recon or defence missions, adding wind, hydro and lightning rod power, collecting resources from gas planets and atmospheres. The list goes on.

[slate ridge]

Also better combat and multiplayer space clan system

[soft stream]

Also worth mentioning is the idea I got from @supple warren about having ongoing expeditions that can be started and completed any time.

[slate ridge]

True

[soft stream]

Exactly. Joinable Factions. Intense Combat.

[slate ridge]

More events and points of interests

And with clans there should be leaderboard system too

Clan missions

Also there should be more ranged hostile mobs*

[soft stream]

Yep. Agree. Totally. Factions can rate based on the D&D matrix of Chaotic Evil to Legal Good, or somewhere in between. And your alliances matter.

[slate ridge]

True, stuff like that can make the game be more enjoyable with friends

Also they should add boss type animals

[soft stream]

Completely. I'd like to see the combat element become more than just "kill the sentinels". We need combat that matters. That affects your ranking with factions. That surprises you with unexpected challenges. On planet. In space. Missions that require you to escort a freighter through a dangerous region in space (multiple systems), or defend a space station from the hostile invaders, or recover some data from behind enemy lines. And all of these impact on the ongoing standing of your faction, and ultimately the fate of the entire universe. It wouldn't HAVE to be PvP, but I think that would add spice to the recipe. Turning PvP off should limit your alliances to "peaceful" factions that can't be attacked by other players, and can't attack other players. That way, people could still participate in the fun without feeling threatened by trolls. Not to mention a personalised ban list you can maintain.

[slate ridge]

Honestly i think pve would be more suitable with nms but at the same time i dont mind the game being like sea of thieves

There should be more combat missions. Also im glad that with this update u can defend settlements.

[soft stream]

Initially I thought that as well. But the idea of being able to war with different factions is really attractive to me (and I'm no COD freak - I loathe FPS and BR games as a rule). That said, it would be possible for player factions to only war with AI factions ... but I still think some people will want to align themselves to the "Invaders", whereas others will want to be on the side of "good". Some have said that things are never that simple, and I tend to agree ... which is why having many factions rather than just a single hostile invader would be cool.

[slate ridge]

Also more random structures in planets would be really good, imagine walking and clearing through an ancient gek dungeon.

[soft stream]

Yeah, that's kind of what I've referred to as "Procedural Fortresses". The idea here is that the Invaders or factions establish random settlements on planet, and you have to attack and take them down in the war effort. But having more of a dungeon-crawl element to this would be great to. First, take down the external defences, then make your way inside to recover the intel, for example. Battling your way through until your mission objectives are complete ... although, reinforcements arrive just as you're about to leave to keep things exciting! 😄

[slate ridge]

Speaking of factions it would also be great that there is a galaxy map and it would show all the systems that a clan has discovered or claimed

The map would change in size depending on the area discovered

[soft stream]

Totally. I think that could be one of the main mechanics of the game. And honestly what I thought Frontiers might bring. The idea that you could formalise the establishment of "Frontiers" of allied travellers, and even have Invaders you need to take down.

[slate ridge]

And it would be cooler if your faction can be dedicated to a specific race like the faction consists of primarily geks or something

Give it an rpg element

[soft stream]

I'd like to see them take this WAY further. Like we can discover new exotic races that are added over time. Those races have their own complex societies and objectives, and you can choose whether to be an ally, enemy or mercenary relative to their kind. Having a much wider variety of lifeforms (not just humanoid) would really take this up a notch too.

[slate ridge]

Speaking of races, the vykeen needs a visual rework. They look so weird. It would be cooler if they had a humanoid body but that leans more to a alien, almost like the covenant in halo. That and make the armor different for every race, like the korvax having advanced tech suits while vykeens have more armor plated spiked armor.

[soft stream]

Honestly, I'd rather they invested more in many of the traveller types they have added. And that we could see more of their home races and worlds. That would be where I would start anyway. From there, they could add more visages / heads. And perhaps once you've done some missions for them, you can "become" one of them through the appearance customiser by having a special reward.

[slate ridge]

I like that idea, there should be exclusive cosmetics unlocked by doing missions for race types. Would be cooler if they did the same thing on expeditions so that there is more exclusive things to get outside of the main expedition quest.

Also the most important thing, ship customization

[soft stream]

That's true. But that's what your scanner is for! Sodium and O2 show up there, so no big deal. So does H2. So, even though the resource is still there, you need your scanner to find the type of object that contains it. It would force you to adjust your thinking on different planets, instead of always just looking for yellow, blue or red plants. It would make every planet feel like a fresher challenge.

[slate ridge]

So far the only way to customize ships is upgrading storage and class. Honestly they should make it where you can change ship parts (wings, cockpit) with all the possible variants, however you can only unlock parts through researching them or doing missions. That and coloring

And decals too

Adding to that, they should make it where u can find the blueprints for ship parts on crashed freighters

Would make crashed freighters more valuable to loot

[soft stream]

I've got quite a lot of thoughts on this. In short though, I see the argument that some people like ship hunting. So, to keep the balance I'd like to see it work like this: You can upgrade any S class ship except Living Ship or Exotic to a "U" class. This unlocks the ability to customise your ship. That mechanic is essentially already there in the game. Then, you hunt ships to find the parts you want and scrap them ... but you don't get all the parts every time. These parts are like Technology modules you can install in U class ships (and are marked as U class for easy reference) - so "Wing Assembly" or "Tail Fins", for example - and detailed with the ship it came from. You can then install ONE of each module type in your Technology slots (another incentive to upgrade slots). Adding more than one simply overloads the technology slots of that type, similar to how Jetpack and other upgrades work now. So, basically we have almost everything we need ALREADY IN THE GAME. As for colours, that's also been done with Exocraft, Frieghters and your suit ... so presumably not that difficult to add to ships. And because U class ships would be obviously customised, players who want to keep a "Classic" feel can keep their S class ships. The stats for U class would be identical to S class, so no loss for them other than the lack of ability to change the visuals. Also worth noting, you can only use the same TYPE of ship parts to upgrade ... so you can't add Hauler wings to a Fighter for example. And lastly, HG should add a library of new parts from the concept drawings as available for purchase from the ship merchant. Similarly with Decals, these could be earned as rewards perhaps?

[soft stream]

Interesting idea and addition to the ideas I shared above. I like it.

[slate ridge]

Very interesting, the ship hunting is a very good idea. On the actual customization I was thinking more like having a space hangar and customization the ship almost like how you would customize the appearance of your pet. But upgrading through technology slots is not a bad idea. I can imagine the technology tab with the already installed part models of your ship and you can basically switch them out. Again I can aready imagine them in expeditions.

[soft stream]

What drives me a little nuts about this is that the necessary parts to make this a reality are largely already in place. We all know the ship RNG is a combination of different attributes that combine ... so why not expose those as "selectable" parts through technology modules that override the core ship? For the sake of simplicity, I had seen this as something you add, rather than replace in your ship ... so the "base" ship components are not visible in the technology slots. I really want it to be simple for them to implement, and it's astonishing to me they haven't done it yet. The idea of having a separate class of ship is to preserve the ship hunting element, which I know Sean has mentioned he personally enjoys (back in an early interview). But there is so much demand for customisation, that having a way for these things to coexist is so crucial.

Also, having a "hurdle" to get U class would be good. To go from A to S is 50K nanites, so perhaps the U class should be 100K. That way, you'd have to grind a bit to earn it.

[slate ridge]

Yeah i was about to say i loved the idea of having a higher class for customization. A thing to add though is to make U class ships attainable only through the s class meaning they never spawn. This would like you said make ship hunting an element in the game.

[soft stream]

Exactly. You have to find a ship you love, grind it up to S, then grind it to U. You then have to ship hunt for the parts you want and scrap them. Then hope you got the parts you wanted in the RNG. A lot to get through, making it feel worth it.

[slate ridge]

Because if you already get a u class off the start theres almost no work to put in it other than the parts anf that would make it boring

[soft stream]

Players could also become "merchants" of different parts - so they can keep hunting and scrapping ships to make upgrades available to other players who need/want them.

[soft stream]

Exactly. It's endgame stuff. It also means that you can't just "luck out" and get a U class you like. But you still have to find something you can see being an S to U conversion.

[slate ridge]

Speaking of merchants they should implement a space flea market system where players can sell anything to other players. Think of it like escape from tarkovs flea market.

Would have to rework some existing money making methods tho

[soft stream]

Another thing that would add to this would be owning multiple freighters. Up to 6. At any one time, you nominate a freighter as your command HQ via a new terminal, and you can switch it at any time. Doing that makes the ships on the freighter the ones you can summon. This lets you scavenge more ships over time, and own a larger fleet ... which would make this a better / longer cycle.

[soft stream]

Player to player trading could definitely use a boost. I like the way Roblox does it (my kids play). You basically put up an offer, the other player does too and you agree or decline the trade as a result. Very easy to use and intuitive.

[slate ridge]

This would be a good idea for freighter battles

[soft stream]

Yeah, that's part of it also. The idea you could assemble more of an armada would make these battles more intense. To do this, they would have to increase the number of player freighters in a system. Ideally, I'd like to see them up it to at least 32.

[soft stream]

How this could work in No Man's Sky is you could approach another player and in the menu currently used to "Invite to Group" could be an option to "Offer Trade". You could then place items from your inventory into a "trade cache". The other player could view what you've offered and do the same. Then you see a screen that compares the two and you can accept or decline. If you both accept, the trade occurs. If not, the trade is over.

All this could be done at the Nexus, or on planet. But perhaps a certain part of the Nexus could be designated as "Looking for Trades" like you suggest.

A "Trading Hall" for example?

[slate ridge]

Yeah its almost like trading in steam.Well, wonderful idea sharing we had cant wait to share more here later ima go to bed cus its late and i gotta wake up for college in the morning.

[soft stream]

All good friend. Rest well. Thanks for the stimulating discourse. 👍

[slate ridge]

Anytime it was a good talk. Gn!

[subtle radish]

MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAN

Good job NMS, we finally got cities / towns

Cool stuff I literlaly asked for it a bit ago

^ this one

very cool
next give us enemy variety, O or give us unique bodies (like 4 armed alien template?! or 4 legged? or FLOATING BODY?!)
that'd be cool stuff, thank you for what you've done since the release, you really pulled it through ❤️

[soft stream]

Ok. Cool. Cities are done. Now can we move on to the stuff that matters? https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/776758962380079114/882853678304874526/unknown.png

[subtle radish]

These are good too

[rigid spruce]

Unless that’s 4.0 that would get divided up a bunch, plus are visual enhancements good enough atm?

The new effects are pretty 🤌

[soft stream]

You’re probably right. Might be too much for a single update. The biggest missing visual enhancement for me is the water shader.

[rigid spruce]

True that’d also be pretty nice though I can already sense my ps4 taking off lol

[frank dagger]

Does the game look better now

Any visual improvements in this update

I feel like they didn't list every change or addition

[gloomy hazel]

I would really love if you were able to choose which contextual building part to build. It opens up more building opportunities and would make it easier to build larger structures.

[subtle radish]

I wish that settlement structures that you build had a list that tells you what it needs to build, because I'm not too big of a fan waiting 2 hours for my market to make the walls with silica, then 2 hours to make the roof for some ferrite, and now suddenly I need 2 quantum computers to finish it off - those 4 hours waiting I could have spent getting them computers

[dense sand]

A audio and music update would be cool

[timid summit]

That’s the bytebeat update. It’s pretty cool

[dense sand]

I think they added some music on frontiers

[dense sand]

oh yeah can I download other player's bytebeat music?

[timid summit]

I think you can..

[reef harness]

Yeah combat needs love real bad

[gleaming quest]

It would be cool if there was a bytebeat jukebox in the Nexus that collects all uploaded music, so you can just go there to get more music instead of going to countless bases.

[north stump]

Adding our own space station would be pretty cool especially if you could dock freighters

[queen thicket]

Is it possible to add NFTs and stuff like that???

[arctic cradle]

Just real quick, where is that list from?

[balmy cove]

Purchasable soundtrack pls

[gleaming quest]

They're all sold out, but you could probably find the cds/vinyls used

[balmy cove]

Really

Purchasable soundtracks on steam

[gleaming quest]

The soundtrack is on spotify

[slate ridge]

Yeah its called donda

[gleaming quest]

It would be cool if they released all the additional music they added to the game though

[visual cloak]

i agree

looking forward to 6 year anniversary Origins part 2 who’s with me

[supple warren]

I think the portable/field tech like save points & signal boosters should maybe use the old quick menu interface, whereas the basebuilding stuff should definitely use the new interface

Maybe not though, but definitely bring back the autonomous mining unit & atmosphere harvester for nomadic play

[spare breach]

Fixed an issue that prevented the Automated Mining Unit and other similar parts from being placeable or availabe to research.

from experimental today

maybe it was a bug that they weren't available?

[supple warren]

haha thanks! i suspect i may see a number of pings concerning this

and yeah, it looks as though they forgot they were used in a specialist mission 😅

on a different note:
Settlements should have more going on even if you're not the overseer, they're even more lifeless than the other inhabited points of interest when you're not managing them

[supple warren]

Jumping about a bit more, I think they should add a version of the overseer administration console to freighters, say a captain's administration console, and just limit the decisions to disputes among crew.

Add a little more flavor to freighter bases that way

[soft stream]

It’s my wish list. I put it together for a bit of fun and speculation after I saw the list of features in Frontiers. Which ones are your favourites?

[spare breach]

Yeah that would be awesome. Probably gonna add that. For example, having them grow on their own without owning them or having serious setbacks. And when you find a settlement that is already very upgraded you can make it hard to own it. Stuff like that

[toxic slate]

It’s a small thing but I’m surprised at this point we still can’t see weather effects from inside buildings

[brave plinth]

interesting....

Im surprised you havent seen it

[toxic slate]

I’m talking mainly about rain

[tame ginkgo]

MULTICREW SHIPS

[balmy cove]

Yes

[soft stream]

On the list! 💥

[tame ginkgo]

That's yo personal list?

[tender folio]

Add fishing

[soft stream]

Mostly yes. I thought it would be fun to do it in the style of Sean’s update posts. 🤣 Honestly, I don’t expect much of it will ever happen in the game, but it’s fun to think about what might have been.

[soft stream]

And trapping

[tame ginkgo]

EVA means Extravehicular activity right?

[timid summit]

Yes

[soft stream]

Yep. I have a few concepts on that. Like upgrades for your suit to survive and navigate in space. Conducting external repairs on frigates and freighters. Building habitable platforms in space. Gathering rare resources. A lot of possibilities.

[prime narwhal]

I'd love EVA in game

but it'd probably be tied to a timer and only be able to be done once every 2 hours so

(yes im salty about Frontiers lol)

[soft stream]

LOL. Yeah, not a fan of timers. Feels like an excuse not to fill the gameplay loop. That's why things like external repair missions on Freighters would be cool. You'd first have to get the recipe for the Exosuit tech to do the mission without dying or floating off into space (I thought perhaps Solar Reflector Shield Upgrade, Low Gravity Jetpack Booster, and a Gravity Hook for your MT, for example). You'd also need to craft an Airlock Key with specific resources. Once you've done that, you'd have to get out to the freighter or frigate exterior in your Jetpack, or perhaps even a craftable EVA exocraft. You would get to explore the exterior of these craft close up, and to locate the problem. Once there, you might need to go back and get the right resources to craft the components for the repair. That would take up a lot of game time and be interesting and fun to play.

Added to this, I thought perhaps the EVA thing could be used with Habitable Platforms - essentially bases you can create ANYWHERE in space - either in Low Orbit or in between planets. You could do repairs and upgrades with that as well.

[prime narwhal]

The closest things we have to EVA are Derelicts and repairing busted Frigates -- both some of my favorite experiences in NMS.

[soft stream]

Yeah, the idea above kind of expands that a little. Perhaps you could even encounter derelict like creatures while doing the repairs and have to fight them off before you could repair?

And imagine how cool all this would be in VR!

[prime narwhal]

Yeah, like a ship got attacked when it warped back and has space scaries on it and you have to clear them out

[soft stream]

Exactly, or after a pirate battle where you save the freighter, the captain asks you to help with repairs.

[prime narwhal]

yeah

[soft stream]

Or perhaps some upgrades can only be done externally? And you have to actually install them there!

So many ways they could use this mechanic.

[prime narwhal]

After Frontiers, I want a space content and combat focused updates more than ever.

[soft stream]

Exactly why I put that list together. I had hoped Frontiers would be more combat and space stuff like I suggested ... but we got cities. Which is great, I guess 🤷‍♂️ Not my bag though. Especially with the timers people have been really unhappy about that.

[prime narwhal]

It's the timers, it's the lack of activities to do there, it's the lack of interaction with your settlers. it's like they saw the bare minimum you need to a 'colony management' mini game and went with that. I feel 0 connection to the settlements I've encountered at all. They're a pretty looking prop, that's about it. I hope they expand on it the future, because right now for me, they are a far less interesting freighter.

But yeah, it made me want combat and space content way more, and just more dynamic features.

[soft stream]

They don't have a great track record of expanding on new things. Living Ships. Exomechs. Freighters. Frigates. Honestly, it's starting to feel a bit like "No Man's Base" rather than "No Man's Sky"...

[prime narwhal]

Yeah, I just want more reasons to be out in space and stay there

rather than a planet

The silver lining for me is hopefully they can do some cool stuff with this new tech and use it to implement other cool features.

[soft stream]

Some are saying the fact that it's 3.6 and not 4.0 suggests they aren't done with 2021 yet and there could be (significantly) more to come. There's been some speculation on Twitter about it being the combat stuff ... but I'm over the speculation myself. I've been let down too many times with high expectations.

[prime narwhal]

Yeah I'm thinking we may possibly get a 4.0 update around December

[soft stream]

I'm not holding my breath. Have pretty much decided I've played the game for over 1,000 hours and that's good enough for me. Might wait and see what comes later, but not going to sink a lot more time into it.

[prime narwhal]

Yeah I'm pretty bummed out about it myself lol and I wasn't even really expecting anything, but when I found my first settlement, I got through the overseer building, and built the foundation for a market place or something, and then it told me it would take 2 hours for a roof. I said "oh come on" and logged off lol

and while I'll hope and advocate for dynamic, space, and combat features, I won't hold my breath

[soft stream]

Sadly I agree.

[gloomy hazel]

Dude ngl thats the dream update for all lol, would be dope if you could make it look like an actual update page! Improved variety yeeeaaaahhhh

Try posting it to the NMS subreddit lol, see what happens

[soft stream]

LOL. Nah. That place is way too toxic "wE dOn'T nEeD pVp! DoN't LiKe ThE uPdAtE? lEaVe!".

[prime narwhal]

I imagine a decent flow of contention and down votes, with something along the lines of

[gloomy hazel]

Good point

[prime narwhal]

"NmS iSnT aBOOT comBaT"

[soft stream]

But yet. What puzzles me is these are not new ideas. A couple of years ago, I ran a poll that got 1,500+ responses and these were key features people wanted.

[gloomy hazel]

I dont agree with that too, its kinda stupid

Like

Literally the 4 pillars are Explore Fight Trade Survive

What happened to trade and fight lmao

[prime narwhal]

We've gotten a plethora of building and exploration updates, ONE combat update, and arguably no significant trader/hauler content.

[soft stream]

Some real cry-babies though. They will flat out deny FIGHT needs any attention.

[prime narwhal]

And yet they say things like

"but combat update would make other people feel left out"

yet here I am, a non builder, feeling left out

[gloomy hazel]

Surviving is ez, exploration was improved with Origins but we are still missin alot in that category, like RIP lush planets with no trees and only grass, you will be missed

Yeah we dont need any !ore base building updates

We have enough

I am satisfied with the current iteration

[prime narwhal]

True, exploration and variation always can use more

BUT

Combat and Trade are the two pillars that are hurting the most

by far

[gloomy hazel]

Mhm

I play Apex Legends religiously

If NMS had half that I'd be so happy

Combat is a joy

Hell if wallrunning couod be a thing

moan

[prime narwhal]

That's a huge ask lol

[gloomy hazel]

People could make the coolest courses

Ikr

This is the future channel

Lol

[austere parcel]

I think one mega big update per year with expeditions sprinkled around is the way to go in the future, less bugs and more finished exciting stuff.. bugs are kinda ruining this update and it's kinda underwhelming either way

[gloomy hazel]

Kinda small for the hype we had for it lmao

Its was better graphics, aaaand settlements

[prime narwhal]

Even if it was without bugs I would not enjoy this update, and I didn't even have high hopes for it

[gloomy hazel]

What else was there

More waiting....

wooo.....

[austere parcel]

the new nebulas are cool xd

[gloomy hazel]

Why are there so many real time timers

[austere parcel]

that's all I like lmao

[gloomy hazel]

Oh def lmap

[prime narwhal]

Yeah the new visuals and stuff are cool, and I do like the new base building

but im not really a builder

[gloomy hazel]

My favorite addition from Next was rings lmao, so nebulas are dope

Watch hg fake us out be like "ok here's the real update lol"

[prime narwhal]

I only like base building when there's a reason to do it, like..

Factorio

love building in factorio

cus it all has a function

[gloomy hazel]

Surviving Mars player here lol

[prime narwhal]

I like functional bases that do stuff, not just cool set pieces

[gloomy hazel]

Im an okay builder, i like small cabins

yeah

[austere parcel]

ngl NMS updates recently have kinda lost their special feeling recently, because they're all super minor changes or just adding one specific new thing that nobody will use

[gloomy hazel]

Electricity is stupid tbh

Why did we need it

[prime narwhal]

Well I mean, nms typically follows a pattern of small updates and one huge one a year

[gloomy hazel]

We need new stuff like AR and Beyond

[prime narwhal]

And we all assumed this was the huge one

which, I don't think it is

at least I hope it isn't

[gloomy hazel]

A whole shitload of stuff worthy of a anniversary update

I hope so too

[austere parcel]

no time for a huge one of they're just making loads of smaller updates and doing expeditions ect on top

[gloomy hazel]

I hope and pray we get soke huge drop

sigh

[prime narwhal]

Well like I said, they always do a bunch of small updates and one big one

[gloomy hazel]

Welp if not hey settlements add some life

Kinda cool imo

[prime narwhal]

they usually have a portion of the team working on the big one throughout the year

[gloomy hazel]

Even as not a timesink but having your own town is dope

[austere parcel]

not really the earlier updates were all kinda huge

[prime narwhal]

Probably because it was stuff they were working on and didnt have time to add it to release.

[gloomy hazel]

They should go to the pillars and be like "Hey lets just up Trading, combat, survival needs, and exploration, really go to the roots"

[prime narwhal]

Fully agree

[gloomy hazel]

I would have been happy if the only planets were the ones in trailers

They were cool and had what we needed

But we have a whole universe

[prime narwhal]

I would also, maybe for like the last update they do, go back and look at everything and just add some more depth to all existing features, or like for the last year of updates. Or just do this before they stop supporting the game

[austere parcel]

yeah improve the core game, not add gimmicky side things that nobody will use after 1 time

[gloomy hazel]

now imagine if it all that had level of detail

[prime narwhal]

exactly what I mean

[gloomy hazel]

Yep

Thats the problem with current stuff

Living ships are cool, but whats different from normal ones besides harder you get upgrades

Exo Mechs are dope, but we font have enough combat to use them

My favorite updates recently were stuff like Companions and Origins, cause they added things that you would actually do

[prime narwhal]

The fact we still don't have wars and conflicts, with large fleet battles, is such a crime to me lol

[gloomy hazel]

Stuff that you would encounter without going onto a side wuest

We need more things that just happen when you play, rather than having to intentionally seek them out

[prime narwhal]

Yep

more dynamic content

[gloomy hazel]

Yeah

[austere parcel]

honestly all I want is better terrain generation, more variety, eyecandy, effects, phenomena, and more muussiiccc

[gloomy hazel]

Hey wait

We have a bytebeat library

Nd every planet has a proc gen music

[prime narwhal]

idk i just turn music off and play youtube stuff lol

[gloomy hazel]

Why cant we record that?

I wanna find a cool soundtrack on a planet and save it and share it

I like the stuff that adds more things for the community to share

[austere parcel]

the proc gen music is annoying because I've heard it all 1000x times over

[gloomy hazel]

Like new creatures and materials and music and guns

Yeah

It needs an improvement but i like it

[austere parcel]

yeah I like it too, that's what I meant by more music xd

more loops and stuff ig

[prime narwhal]

ship customization. please. even if its just colors.

and decals.

please.

[gloomy hazel]

Colors would be nice

[prime narwhal]

I dont want ship building

[gloomy hazel]

Heh decals yessss

[prime narwhal]

just

colors

lol

[gloomy hazel]

Ok enough wishing for now imma go vibe

Good convo tho

See ya around interlopers

[austere parcel]

modular ship customisation would be a great thing to get lost in

[prime narwhal]

yes thanks for venting with me lol

[austere parcel]

ciao

[gloomy hazel]

Lol cyall

[smoky pebble]

I mean, i would like more station types. Mabye some with different styles of interior

[austere parcel]

yeah I think space in general needs a huge variety update

very agreed

[gloomy hazel]

More space conflict kinda like Star Wars…. But like atleast like a fleet battle.. make your own faction!!!

[supple warren]

more space discovery like an exploration game or something

[gloomy hazel]

^

[novel furnace]

Space in the lore is supposed to be where most of civilization is, right? Maybe show some of that more.

[soft marsh]

Yeah I would loves decals and ability to create a custom decal

[soft marsh]

Yeah like military bases, pirate bases, research centers, mining facilities, Cult Sanctuaries, Shipyards, Gambling/Entertainment Centers, Business/Stock Exchange Centers, etc with both active, abandoned/ruined/infested versions. In short, more space POIs/locations

[soft stream]

How long would it hell be before someone drew a pen15 though? About 0.8sec. Doubt we will get custom decals for that reason. They might not be able to keep their ESRB rating with custom content like that.

[soft stream]

Would love that!

[soft marsh]

Galactic commodity/stock exchange would add a new dimension in the economy/trading aspect of the game

[soft stream]

Player to player trading would be cool. I can see it working something like the way Roblox does it (my kids play it). You walk up to another player and say "Offer Trade" similar to how you "Invite to Group" now. If they accept the request, you both put items from your inventory into a "trade cache" and confirm. If both players accept the trade, the items are exchanged. If either declines, the offer can be revised or the player/s can choose to exit the trade.

[toxic slate]

We seriously need a companion mobile app to keep track of timers and settlement needs

I really really hate these timers though

[delicate willow]

can we expect more campaign content to be added in the future?

[calm pulsar]

No Man's Sky 4.0: FIFTEEN

• 15//15//15//15
• --kzzt--
• New base parts

imagine if sean just dropped notes like this for a story expansion

[soft stream]

No Mans Timers. Would be a funny troll app.

Maybe the guys at NMS Assistant can do it?

[supple warren]

i would much rather more folks request active gameplay alternatives for folks that want to interact with these features during their play session tbh

[soft stream]

Of course. All we want is a game you can - you know - actually play. Instead of one that says “come back and play later!”

[supple warren]

Also in this case in particular, the time taken with a settlement largely discourages trying out different settlements, because you're starting from scratch & would have to redo the timers

I'm not sure if that's intentional to try to encourage using multiple saves for different settlements or what the thinking there is, because it's weird to think they wouldn't want you to try a variety of settlements out in the same save...

[lilac crane]

Not sure how much that makes sense given how busted the economy is. The game also doesn’t seem to have many unique items to trade.

[spare breach]

I think all it means is that timers fill the emptiness. Patch it with timers so it feels long.

Maybe they will find a workaround later on or may add more stuff to do so timers wont be needed

[lilac crane]

I’m a veteran player. What would other players have to offer to trade that I can’t easily get myself?

[spare breach]

For a new player these timers wont feel too bad. But for someone who isnt new they do, cause this is all you wanna try, the update.

[soft stream]

Well, it's just an idea bro

[lilac crane]

The thing is, I want to be careful with trading or creating a playerwide economy. I want an economy that works well not just for me, but for the new players.

[prime narwhal]

Growing plants, freighter missions, egg incubation/laying, settlements, base computer archive blueprints and some other aspects of base building, living ships, and probably more I'm missing all have timers.

If it was just say, farming and eggs, you know it might be okay.

But it's like half of the new features

It's just really old

And I think even newer players will eventually come to realize it

[lilac crane]

The bandaid solution would be the ability to manipulate the timers. For example: Minecraft crops have hidden timers, but you can use bonemeal to grow them quickly.

So maybe we can create fertilizer for our agriculture?

I don't think our crops need their timers removed, they are fine. But farming needs some buffs.

[prime narwhal]

I just don't want anymore timers in future updates

There's more than there should be

Like,for example, everyone wants station owning. It could be cool, could add some depth to economy gameplay for trading people

But it will probably just be timers

Invite more vendors to your station? Timer

[lilac crane]

I agree.

Have you submitted your feedback to HG already?

[prime narwhal]

Yeah always do

But

Never seems to reach them lol or their interests don't align with mine

[lilac crane]

I'm not sure what the alternative to timers would be.

[prime narwhal]

Like I said, in certain instances it makes sense

Like farming or eggs

Fine

That's how farming works, whatever not a big deal

[lilac crane]

Resource costs can be there, but may result in too much disparity?

[prime narwhal]

But for building? You could easily have your settlers and you going out and collecting resources to build it together, even if it's just an animation of them walking around collecting stuff, it'd be WAY more immersive

I know some people have stock piles of resources so it wouldn't work for them but

Idk, I just imagined I'd be doing stuff along with my settlers

More frontiers-y things

At a bare minimum I was thinking it'd be like fallout settlements

But it's far worse imo. Settlers could have proc gen stories that they can tell you in the background, they can have quests and needs that need to be met, there's plenty of colony/management Sims to draw inspiration from

[lilac crane]

Settlers could have more personality yeah.

[visual cloak]

can we come upon procedurally generated settlements? instead of new ones we have to oversee and build?

if not, this update missed the mark

would actually be fun to explore planets and discover a vast array of settlements

i kinda wish the hypetrain never happened. They needed to put this content in the oven for a few more months. Woulda been a great holiday update

[prime narwhal]

I don't think so

As far as I know, every settlement is the same in the sense that you can become the overseer

I'd like the option to decline overseer, and then the settlement just becomes like a POI you can visit, like current trade hubs and stuff.

[visual cloak]

that would be cool! it starts evolving on its own

imagine coming back to it a year later to see how it’s grown

[prime narwhal]

yeah, just like how you don't own every fleet

Idk, this update is meh. I sincerely hope they expand on it in future updates.

[visual cloak]

usually.

i like the whole concept (besides the focus on the basebuilding stuff), just needs more time. I don’t think it was ready for release

[lilac crane]

So, the economy. AI had a few nerfs, but how about buffing all the other methods?

I think some form of automated crafting would raise the stasis method to be less of a hassle. Not sure if needed.

Nip Nip could use a massive buff, or a recipe for something even more valuable.

The "caches" could use a bit of a buff.

[prime narwhal]

Idk how they could make the economyinteresting lol

Like

Okay I could see they could add trading mini games, like maybe owning a shop, that periodically sells things, and you can expand trade routs to generate more income, and expand shops to different stations?

So you have to find stations where your shops you own can profit by selling the right economy goods

and maybe you can use fleet frigates that ship the goods and create supply routes

but in terms of the actual market and trading, idk

Most games have HORRIBLE economies, especially single player ones. They are usually quite easy to manipulate. The only games where I've seen pretty robust economies are Eve, Albion, and to some degree, Runescape

[lilac crane]

Eve suffers from being too efficient if anything.

[prime narwhal]

What qualifies as a good economy then?

NMS tried to make it interesting by assigning economy types to each system, but does anyone even interact with those, especially when there are options like scrap, relics, storms, and ore farming to make you billions fast? No one really 'trades'.

[lilac crane]

I have a few ideas on making economies interesting, but it requires a good economy first.

[prime narwhal]

The only single player game I could draw inspiration from

to make the economy good

that I've played

is X4 Foundations

[lilac crane]

I don't want to make too much information available, so lets make trading more personal and/or have a device for trading within a few clusters of each other.

[prime narwhal]

Can you elaborate on that?

You mean more localized economies?

[lilac crane]

More localized economies, yes.

[prime narwhal]

Yeah, that's a step in the right direction

But in order for that to work, you need more localized resources

In works in Albion because you physically need to ship the rare ores found in the north all the way down to the south, where they literally cannot get decent ore.

And there's high risk involved in that

but hauling is legitmately very profitable

but that's just one example

[lilac crane]

Not necessarily, but I have an idea.

I was thinking about procedural atoms. Procgen items that are unique per planet.

It could be a fuel that gives certain bonuses to the thing you use it for, depending on the item.

[prime narwhal]

that'd be a lot of items lol

[lilac crane]

Oh it definely would.

[prime narwhal]

Idk if that would work

Cus I mean realistically, the universe as we know it, is basically all made up of the same stuff

so types of metals on planet might be 'different' but they are still metals.

I think it'd be too much to keep track of

18quintillion unique items lol

and like I said

[sick knoll]

Let us take over a building without having to be the overseer, so that we can have a base in the settlement.

[lilac crane]

Hopefully the game doesn't crash lol.

If 18 Quin is too much, you have to do so per different area.

[prime narwhal]

the core issue with the economy is that no one really "trades" or hauls to make money, everyone goes for storm crystals, relics, scrap, or farms.

so even with those unique items

youre not fixing the core issue

And on top of that

the resources that are bought and sold aren't really used

they have no real value

the NPCs don't 'need' you to bring them metals so they can produce goods

the npcs you trade with outside of the galactic terminal don't use the carbon to build their base

know what I mean?

[gloomy hazel]

Trade and teleporting go together like marriage and ritual infanticide. These two things contradict each other at a fundamental level.

[prime narwhal]

Yeah, another good point

[gloomy hazel]

I don't think trade is ever gonna work in NMS

[prime narwhal]

even if unique resources existed, it doesn't matter, because you can instantly bring them anywhere

[lilac crane]

I don't see it that way.

[prime narwhal]

That's why I was saying to look at X4 for a decent single player economy game

The metals you mine

are actually used

to build ships

that the NPCs are building

so there is actual value to the people you are selling material to

[lilac crane]

But only you have them. Only you have access to them. Teleportation is only to known places.

Teleportation is irrelevant because trade is between individuals.

[prime narwhal]

Right, but okay there's 18quin unique items right? There aren't 18quin unique applications to the item

It would just make the issue with storm crystals, relics, etc. even worse

Arbitrary rare items that are valuable for the sake of being valuable

[lilac crane]

You are saying the demand side is broken?

[prime narwhal]

I'm saying there is no real supply and demand at all

[lilac crane]

The thing is, MMOs are designed in such a way that not everyone can do everything.

[prime narwhal]

Money simply exists in the game as a way to 'gate' progression

[prime narwhal]

NMS is designed so that everyone can do everything, though.

Which is why outside of adding 'economy' mini games and activites, a true robust economy won't work

in my opinion anyway

[lilac crane]

So you need more asymmetry.

[prime narwhal]

I think so, yes, and other factors. But it would require such a massive overhaul lol

[lilac crane]

TBH, star clusters need more difference between them anyway.

So we need to fix both supply and demand.

I don't think it can be too massive.

[prime narwhal]

In game economies are infamously hard to create and make them 'good'.

[lilac crane]

I suppose.

[prime narwhal]

Even Elite Dangerous struggled immensely with it, and they have an entire background simulation running to attempt it.

(and its still not very good)

[unkempt shell]

i really wouldn't mind if they just massively scaled back the "economy" side. other primarily singleplayer games have very simplistic economies where the primary driver of player engagement is resource scarcity: scarce money for scarce resources. nms doesn't operate on that kind of principle, resources and units are plentiful, and neither do i think it's set up to go full mmo-style complex markets...

i'd rather they just enhanced the survival aspects of the game by making certain resources discoverable/craftable on planet, but somewhat easier to purchase if you knew where to look, and nerfing all moneymaking methods so the player is never a multi billionaire, but i understand this isn't a very popular suggestion and that the game is even less setup to implement such changes.

(don't mean to intrude on your good convo, sorry. just my 2 pence)

[prime narwhal]

You're not intruding lol its an open discussion

but I like your points

[unkempt shell]

i rarely see this level of back and forth on discord! it's nice, didn't want to break your flow, haha

[prime narwhal]

I agree, a MMO-economy wouldn't work

[lilac crane]

ED is a "spoof" economy last time I checked. Not sure if the carriers did much to help that.

[prime narwhal]

Right that's what I mean

They try to simulate, say, factions needing resources

in the background

but it largely doesn't work

[lilac crane]

On the demand side, this game needs way more resource sinks than it actually has now.

[gloomy hazel]

And dial side the resource income a lot too

[lilac crane]

Also true.

AI needs to occur at much smaller quantities.

[gloomy hazel]

Like survival becomes trivial the second you reach your first station and buy a battery stack for pennies

[prime narwhal]

I found a relic worth like, 1.5 million in my first hour or so of playing on my new save, and just bought max stacks on the common resources (carbon, oxygen, ferrite), and haven't touched any resource gathering.

[gloomy hazel]

Yeah the cost benefit ratio is pretty absurd

[lilac crane]

I have automated farms for almost everything.

[prime narwhal]

Like I said, creating a balanced economy is super hard lol there's so many issues with it in NMS

and having a full open market with player influence wouldn't do much

I think the 'trading' aspect of the game should shift to trading oriented minigames/acitivites

but it would probably just end up as features that have timers 😢

[lilac crane]

I think base power could be a great resource sink if expanded upon.

[gloomy hazel]

I'm still surprised that nuclear power to use all this uranium isn't a thing

[lilac crane]

Exactly.

[sick knoll]

A Free market economy cannot be controlled, which is why Governments and Game companies, don't want it.

[unkempt shell]

part of the trouble with the game and all it's new features that keep being added is hg see us all going "i'm rich pls give me stuff to spend it on", we get a new unit or resource dump for a bit, then it starts turning a massive profit and we're back to where we started.

[lilac crane]

Not everything to spend on has to turn a profit.

[unkempt shell]

i definitely agree, i want less units involved, not more! but how many features that end up being dumps do anything other than generate cash for us?

there's something flawed in this game's activity>reward loops that seems to make it boil down to money

[lilac crane]

I would love to have special decoration that requires millions of credits just to show others how rich I am.

Maybe a bit vain, but I'm rich.

[unkempt shell]

an oversized platinum blob statue

[lilac crane]

Sure.

I think making our bases and ships look better should work as an awesome credit sink.

[unkempt shell]

oh yeah, agreed. i'm big on the ship customisation idea!

idk though, credit sinks disinterest me in most games. i'd rather a different loop exist if you so wish it, especially considering most players are a portal code away from being in the hundreds of millions of units

[lilac crane]

Credit sinks are a necessary evil.

Unfortunately.

But they don't need to be things like maintenance costs.

[sick knoll]

Maybe need to have political campains to stay in office as a settlement overseer

[lilac crane]

I want more options for creating player hubs. I created a base a long time as a meeting point for players, but you can barely give them amenities.

I would pay millions to have space station amenities at my meeting point base.

[sick knoll]

Will there be settlement Citizenship ?

[lilac crane]

To me, I don't need more income than I already have. The town income wouldn't add much for me. I care more for resources such as dirt, which I probably already can pay for.

[spare breach]

They should nerf the value of resources such as activ indium and at the same time make new ways to spend them.

[toxic slate]

In my mind weapons (both ship and multitool) should just be buyable with credits. but weapons should also just become fully procedural, both in stats but more importantly in functionality

instead of a "Scatter Blaster", you might find a "Turog's Hand of Death" which fires a missile swarm with rainbow exhaust trails

[unkempt shell]

weapons should also just become fully procedural, both in stats but more importantly in functionality
this is what i hoped next's "procedural technology" actually meant when i was reading the notes for the first time. i thought with the addition of full multiplayer for people in a party, and this kind of system, you could happen upon really cool, unique techs with interesting characteristics and modifications, which you could then share the location of with others. instead you just grind nanites to buy generic, functionally-rng s-class mods with a one-click install process, providing marginal buffs to basic stats

[toxic slate]

to add to this idea, in line with true procedural factions, local factions or weapons makers should have their own array of procedural armaments. by doing work for them, business with them, you can start to become a favored customer at which point you gain access to their best and most dangerous gear. this would encourage more exploration to new systems, but also tie in with other gameplay systems to make it feel like a more cohesive society

[toxic slate]

yeah that's what I thought too, but we were bamboozled

[supple warren]

the simplest alternative is to make it so one can rest in-game to advance through them. Tried & true classic in open world games like NMS

[supple warren]

i was thinking about this, but even as a new player i feel like if i encountered these timers i would feel this growing despair that that's most of what the feature had going on after seeing a couple of them, and then i would just write the feature off because there's nothing else i could do to even influence the timers

[unkempt shell]

something like this is seemingly small but would offer a much more integrated gameplay experience than what we currently have for getting better gear. i really want to be able to earn cool things directly from exploring, instead of earning a currency as a middle step to then going to a generic vendor to buy stuff from

i bring it up a lot but the old tech system rewarding you with blueprints by looking around, fighting sentinels, or solving puzzles is so much more engaging for me than what we have now. extending the systems of old to items would be a real blessing, as well, imo

[toxic slate]

last night after work i hopped into my ship to "sleep" until my timer was finished and fell asleep in real life

[unkempt shell]

what an engaging gameplay experience! you were so engaged it even affected reality

[unkempt shell]

i restarted for next iirc, and the timers the base computer "mission" had basically made me never do that mission ever again. at least for that, you could earn all the real blueprints through other gameplay experiences, but still. the timers turned me off as a returning player on a new save. i hesitate to claim fresh players would ever look at timers as "okay" when, out of all the playerbase, they'd be most likely to want to see what the game can actually offer

[gloomy plume]

I ended up writing a design document last night for NMS. Entailing how to chain the missions in engaging ways, tying the story together

I was so far past drunk, I cant believe I could write

Yet, reading my notes, flip, my drunk me has good ideas!

This one idea for puzzle boxes is fucking brilliant

Essentially tie getting items to a series of complex puzzles, hidden on all the worlds of a system

Find the boxes, get the codes, find the ruin, unlock the box

The ruin has a series of potential puzzle methods

and the boxes are found in 12 different ways

What the hell, this is what I come up with drunk.. huh

So youd essentially explore systems to gear up, you get all the exploration experiences and you dont have to spend all your time just mining credits and nanites

[visual cloak]

Sorry Jahnri, your idea is too fun of an idea for HG

[gloomy plume]

Thats sorta what I was thinking...

I had a idea for a interactive forest

so much..

sheesh

[unkempt shell]

no fun allowed

[visual cloak]

NO FUN!!

what's an interactive forest?

[unkempt shell]

feel free to share all the ideas @gloomy plume ! we'd all like to hear them, i'm sure

[gloomy plume]

The interactive forest is essentially a idea I had for NMS. It entails having the same simulated environments, reefs, forests, plains and such. However, certain items in that world when interacted with, cause the world around it to react. Feed a bug to say a fly trap plant and the plants react, so on so forth

You layer in a reactive world, giving the world life

even if its not persay all that reward materially

It does make the world more real feeling

[visual cloak]

i do want everything on a planet to interact more with eachother

[gloomy plume]

Last night, I came up with over 200 ideas relating to that

[visual cloak]

wow

[indigo dawn]

I want to get friends to play nms with can yall provide that in next upd please

[gloomy plume]

Thats me drunk. I tend to go full creative mode

[visual cloak]

friends in next update lol

[indigo dawn]

listen

all my homies havent got good pc

[gloomy plume]

Awww

[indigo dawn]

I need a homie to play with

[supple warren]

alien companions when

[gloomy plume]

OOOOOH!

OH OH!

[indigo dawn]

in a party

together

[gloomy plume]

There was a bug in the station!

[indigo dawn]

please add this

[gloomy plume]

Did you guys see a holographic robot flying around since the update ?

[visual cloak]

if they implemented alien companions now, they'd stay at your base and wander on a pre-determined 10 foot path

[gloomy plume]

In the stations

Because I took pictures of these holographic things and my friends havent seen them yet

I want to know what the heck they are

[visual cloak]

in space station or the nexus?

[gloomy plume]

Space stations

These holographics things phase through walls and stuff

and fly around

I wana know what the hell they are

[visual cloak]

hmm

i haven't gotten a chance to play the update yet

[gloomy plume]

Usually they are a cube or sphere

[visual cloak]

not sure i want to tbh

[supple warren]

no they'd come along and chat your ear off as you direct them to do this or that, like fauna companions but with more direct request options

[gloomy plume]

I havent played for a year. So for me, its been a utter blast. I enjoy the core gameplay loop. The settlements sorta fit in with my playstyle.

[visual cloak]

oh true.

[gloomy plume]

Not to mention I found a home system I LOVE

[visual cloak]

wonder why fauna can follow you around but npcs cant

[gloomy plume]

good point zug

[visual cloak]

thank you

oh dang a year?

i really haven't played that much in the last year tbh

[chrome schooner]

Sooo

speculation for the spece station override?

[visual cloak]

maybe that'll be addressed in the expedition?

I am interested in playing the expedition.

[lilac crane]

Procgen weaponry would be awesome. The existing tech would be for if you want a safe approach.

[torn fractal]

For the new settlements. Have some sort of planner which allows you to select a building you'd like to place next, unlocking more as you progress and upon selection of building the camera zooms out with an overlooking angle to allow you to place selected building down

[vocal rock]

An addition to this:
Make it so each building has tiers, and can be individually upgraded up to S tier (starting from C tier). The more it's upgraded, the more furnished it gets and productivity increases. This would especially be useful since settlements are limited in space.

[balmy cove]

Hangar in which you can paint ships which you build and has a roof access for the ship to enter into

[visual cloak]

so for the 30 minutes i played becoming an overseer, it seems any npc additions/confrontations/ events (besides sentinels attacking) take you into your office to resolve it at the computer in there

this feature would be much cooler if we had to go to the actual confrontation in the town

allowing us to make it feel more lived in and real, and create more of a connection with the npcs

like imagine 2 VyKeen getting into a fist fight in an alley

or an electrician needing help on a roof

[toxic slate]

agreed, but the office terminal was probably done to make implementation faster

[unkempt shell]

when i'm playing through this new content, all i can think of are the frigates and their implementation. all the interesting text-based stuff happens in an abstract way (the command room), and the little physical interaction you do have with the frigates is monotonous and makes them feel oddly empty for such large vessels

i know, shame ye of little faith and all, but it makes me wonder if this was their plan for these settlements all along, and that any improvements are unlikely

[supple warren]

yeah, i don't want to jump the gun just yet on that front, so for now I'm just trying to give feedback for basic improvements to settlers like dialog options found with other aliens, better settlement feedback so you have a better sense of when events may arise & that settlers actually acknowledge your contributions at all, etc.

thinking somewhere between this should be a good point of interest without becoming overseer and an even better one by becoming overseer

right now it's a bad point of interest without becoming an overseer, and a rather mediocre one after becoming one.

[toxic slate]

you can't even learn words from them lol

[unkempt shell]

yeah, i don't want to jump the gun just yet on that front, so for now I'm just trying to give feedback for basic improvements

likewise. i really dislike being overly negative about these kinds of things. i've suggested a lot as well, and hopefully some of the points people raise here get through to hg. i guess i'm just both let down by the update and worried about the community getting burned by an air of false expectation. a lot of people think this isn't this year's major update for whatever reason, or that it's just a barebones implementation at worst - but hg don't always go back and revamp features.

right now it's a bad point of interest without becoming an overseer, and a rather mediocre one after becoming one.

yeah, really hope they make this stuff worthy of being a headline feature of a major update. though definitely more work, they somehow feel worse to me than the archives of origins did, and they weren't even the main event! i guess it's whatever, let's see what happens.

[toxic slate]

at least the Archives have some utility, and some nice little lore presents. well at least until the landing pads stopped working

[unkempt shell]

i'll probably keep the expedition save that i get when that rolls around and never do the settlement stuff. it's bad enough that i'm finding myself disinterested in it. it constantly pinging me like a giant tamagotchi is making it worse!

[unkempt shell]

agreed! the interactions are so barebones that even if they just pasted the regular npc interactions onto the settlement npcs, that'd be vastly better

[supple warren]

oh, are you on the latest experimental @unkempt shell?

[unkempt shell]

yeah, the settlement is a lot more active with the experimental installed

in a one hour play session i got a construction request, a settler dispute, and a sentinel attack. i just wanted to explore some red stars! had to keep warping "home" for it

[supple warren]

this is part of why, either here & my feedback to HG or just the feedback to HG, I suggested they allow the admin tasks to pile up for you to sort through & prioritize as you like

[toxic slate]

yeah I will give them the benefit of the doubt for now that they plan to add onto settlements, but the baseline gameplay design they felt was a good experience for players is not the best of starts. with frigate expeditions, they were disappointing but they were a side piece of gameplay. towns feel different because they're more tangible and always asking you to engage with them. but they don't give the player much in return for that engagement currently.

[supple warren]

my suspicion was that they initially set the settlement activity times to have longer intervals to avoid being annoying, but that's a weak solution to a problem they invented

You could make the requests & disputes cycle through on your desk or a request board or any number of classic solutions to village interactions

Instead of intermittently pinging you, "hi dispute to resolve urgent"

[unkempt shell]

the "urgent dispute" i had to solve was "who actually owns these shoes?"

[toxic slate]

just on the timers alone, they don't really align with the playing experience of what I assume are most players. most of us are working people and dip in and out, an hour here and there. well, when the town wants you build X item, you can only come back 8 hours later and it asks you for a step 2 before the item can be built, then you pop in 5 hours after that and get hit with step 3 of the same item...it becomes super frustrating. it feels like it was designed under the assumption that people are playing NMS for 6-8 hour sessions

[unkempt shell]

nms got me asking the philosophical questions