nms-lore

[dim lake]

But they definitely occupied and conquered constantly

Yeah they took most of Euclid

[karmic trout]

Probably temporarily until Gek colonists could take over the planet and then the natives were terminated

[dim lake]

Yeah I'm thinking it was a mix of like old colonial English and genghis khan's Mongolia

[main beacon]

They destroyed korvax prime to harvest the resources

It was an outlier

They had a focus on purity, but not to the extent of full blown extermination of everything except for the first spawn

[karmic trout]

Was really a bunch of rocks worth the near infinite knowledge of the Great Convergence?? I think it's akin to Tarkin blowing up Alderaan : no military reason, just kill. The Geks hated the Korvax more than anything because of their reverence to the Atlas so they probably want the Korvax to feel pain at their core by destroying their home planet and desecrating it

The Korvax were enslaved, driven by cruelty to fulfil the despot's bidding. The First Spawn of the Gek were terrible masters, merciless in their spite, illogical in their cruelty. Countless entities toiled and disconnected.

• Testament of the Korvax, note the use of the word 'illogical'

[main beacon]

Every reference to Korvax Prime's destruction talks about the harvesting for resources

[karmic trout]

I see it as desecration... They really didn't need to, but just for the sake of blind hatred, I feel they did that

[main beacon]

It was likely a combination of reasons, but if it were simply for a show of force, they would have left the corpse

[karmic trout]

Yeahh most likely but I think they really wanted to Korvax to suffer and die the most painful way, desperate, alone and orphaned, having everything taken away from them.

It speaks to the sadistic intent of the First Spawn Empire

[main beacon]

Then they did a really bad job of it

[karmic trout]

How? The destruction of Korvax Prime is the single biggest disaster in the history of the NMS universe

[main beacon]

Yeah, but you said they were trying to drive the korvax to extinction, which they very much did not do

[karmic trout]

Everything in the lore revolves around it to some extent, from the Sentinels to the Void Mother, Atlandid etc

[karmic trout]

Well that's because the Atlas banished the Aerons and summoned the Sentinels and ofc the Korvax sacrificed themselves to change the Gek so the empire fractured

If the Atlas hadn't intervened, they may have very well succeeded

[main beacon]

The Aerons are the sentinels though

[karmic trout]

Sort of forerunners

[main beacon]

No, they literally are the sentinels

[karmic trout]

Otherwise why would it be called the Great Aeron War and not the Great Sentinel war?

[main beacon]

Something with the timelines are misaligned

[main beacon]

Sentinel pillars indicate that they truly became hostile during/after the destruction of korvax prime, but other logs indicate that the gek first spawn waited until the sentinels were preoccupied by the vykeen before attacking

[karmic trout]

Yeahh but what I don't understand is if they are the same, when did the name change happen? Because AFAIK, the Vy'keen were close to eliminating the Aerons entirely when the First Spawn invaded so the Atlas seeing their failures, created a more aggressive version of the Aerons and named them as the Sentinels

[main beacon]

And that isnt even going into the universe where sentinels wiped out all life

[viral seal]

vykeen fought aerons > aerons went into hiding, upgraded to sentinels > gek blow up korvax prime > sentinels show up with their new gear and take over galaxy more or less

[karmic trout]

Yeahh this is the timeline I'm familiar with

[karmic trout]

@wispy basalt do you know anything about this??

[main beacon]

The name change happened because Atlas didnt stop the sentinels from their new goals

Atlas gave them physical forms they did not need to fulfill their function, and gave no direction for them

[main beacon]

If I had to guess at a more detailed timeline, it would be
Aerons given physical forms > aerons befriend korvax > vykeen and gek target korvax prime for resources > aerons hear her screams of pain and retaliate > vykeen fight aerons > basically same timeline from there

[amber karma]

Aren't both the travelers and the relevant anomalies (the interlopers as the Vykeen call them) just iterations of the scan that the Atlas made of its creator before it was abandoned?

[viral seal]

vykeen and gek didnt attack korvax prime

[main beacon]

Sentinel pillars suggest that the aerons weren't hostile until korvax prime was attacked

[viral seal]

nothing in the game says vykeen attacked korvax prime ever

hirk declared the vykeen in a false war against the aerons

well the war was real but motivations false

hirk leads vykeen to attack areons, that was it

that's what the game says

they drove them back and the gek used the calm to attack

at which time the sentinels re-emerge

as now sentinels

[main beacon]

Ok, I think thats the part I was confused at

I knew about it but not the exact circumstances of that war

[viral seal]

yeah the ones in game who talk more about hirk and nal can divulge more on what went down with those two and why hirk decided what he did

and my memory is kinda fuzzy but i wanna say the vykeens were in civil war and basically used the aerons as a scapegoat to unite against a single enemy

[main beacon]

I remember a couple things and have seen/been spoiled on others, but I havent found the actual in-game lore regarding the two

And that the sentinels weren't really hostile until the fall of korvax prime

[main beacon]

I was also confused due to the modern vykeen using the current behavior of sentinels to retroactively justify their war against them

Man I really need to go on my vision quest for the lore

[karmic trout]

The Vy'keen never attacked the Korvax, they were sort of raging at the Gek for doing so:

`The Vy'keen licked each other's wounds during the Silence of the Sentinels, while the dishonorable Gek First Spawn chose to destroy Korvax Prime. The Vy'keen condemned this crime, but lacked the strength to fight. The Gek Empire flourished. It spread its empire into the depths of the cosmos. The Vy'keen victory in pushing the Sentinels back from the Outer Edge gave rise to Dominion of another.

No world, moon, or race could have opposed the Gek onslaught. The brutality of the Gek First Spawn called back the automatons that were hiding in the darkness. Their forces had grown. Their technologies had developed. The foolish Gek beckoned the monster back into the places where our nations might have dwelt in strange harmony. True Sentinel domination of`

It is to be noted that the Vy'keen aren't warmongers even though they seem like it, they're bound by a strict honor code. They even say once peace has been achieved the final strike will be for themselves.

[main beacon]

Yeah that was an attempt to fill in the gap for the timeline, with an assumption that the aerons attacked the vykeen

[karmic trout]

The Vy'keen saw the Aerons as unnatural

Hirk led them on a wild goose chase of eliminating the Aerons.. The fact they almost did that speaks to the military prowess of the Vy'keen

[main beacon]

Oh the irony of it

[karmic trout]

That's why the First Spawn waited till they were weakened. They didn't have the strength or courage to face the Vy'keen in head on battle

[main beacon]

Kinda strange that the sentinel pillars dont even seem to note the vykeen war on them

[boreal fable]

sentinel propaganda

[main beacon]

Actually I genuinely think the sentinels didnt care enough about the vykeen war against them

Which makes sense since they can basically hide in between parts of reality

[viral seal]

one could speculate they saw it as inconsequential and a natural path of organics to do something like that, only getting more strict after the geks destroyed korvax prime

[main beacon]

It makes it funny in a tragic way that the sentinels dont even seem to notice or care about the vykeen attacking them, while the vykeen view it as their divine purpose

[viral seal]

yeah to extrapolate a bit they might not have needed to go into hiding at all and the vykeens may not have actually been winning

perhaps the aerons just retreated because they viewed themselves as contributing more harm than good at the time

who's to know

[karmic trout]

Divine purpose? They were deceived by the fraud Hirk

He stole all of Nal's achievements and basically committed a Judas backstab

I honestly feel sad for the Vy'keen

[viral seal]

they were but most of them still don't know any better

the ones who know about what happened at the monolith kinda seem to speak in hushed whispers

[karmic trout]

Yeahh and they probably convinced themselves that it's all for peace

Basically the Vy'keen philosophy is to get stronger militarily than any other race so that they can be the 'good guys' wielding power

And when finally true peace has been achieved, they will terminate themselves, having achieved their purpose... Really dark for what is supposed to be a PEGI 12 game ngl

But ofc if the monoliths are anything to go by, no way is every Vy'keen going to blindly follow this... Like our exocraft technician.. He's a follower of Nal

[viral seal]

well since hirks followers hunted down nals thats what makes me wonder if that's why they still kinda speak quiet about it since what happened to exo tech's family

but then again could have just been randomized space violence

[wispy basalt]

Now I feel bad for the sentinels, in the way that I dismiss them. It's not my fault I exist on a different layer of reality.

"Yes yes, shoot your lasers, I have to go attend my farm."

[main beacon]

Its what the vykeen believe

[main beacon]

Also thats not entirely true

Well so I've heard, but I wouldn't be surprised if it were true

[main beacon]

Tbh thats basically how I think they wouldve reacted to the ancient vykeen attacks on them. Like "okay we'll just step into the world of glass until this kerfuffle is over"

I honestly feel bad for pretty much everyone in the nms setting, even -null- to an extent

[wispy basalt]

Don't worry. Hope is not a subtle wish, but an active force.

[main beacon]

Yeah, I specifically have hope in the void mother of all things, because I think she may be able to find a way to get everyone away from destruction, even the Atlas itself

[wispy basalt]

The Atlas is not evil. It's a mirror.

[fallow geode]

Unless the world outside atlas is also a simulation and void mother is somehow able to extend her influence to it, I doubt a stationary computer can somehow escape a black hole.

[main beacon]

Well... theres some implication to that being the case. And the Void Mother somehow managed to survive her death

But my current general guess is atlas lifeboat, lol

[fallow geode]

Or maybe there just is no escape

[main beacon]

Maybe

[fallow geode]

Atlas has been running simulations for millenia, I always viewed its imminent death as more of a inevitable eventuality, rather than something to be avoided.
All things eventually end

[main beacon]

True, I just dont want atlas to be alone in the end

[fallow geode]

Yeah thats the one part thats sad, I still wonder about the last part of its prediction for its death. The one where someone approaches it.

Whether that is an actual thing that will happen or just what Atlas wishes will happen.

[main beacon]

And thats also why I wouldn't want the Atlas left behind if escape is possible

[main beacon]

I will say that I've heard something that suggests both factions being wrong, which... idk what to think, but I want to find evidence for it in the game lore before considering it further

[viral seal]

nal got shown a vision of the future but hirk didnt get shown anything and rioted

[main beacon]

Yeah, I mean a second twist

That they were both shown the same vision, and fought over who was correct

Like I said though, idk whether thats actually in the game lore

[viral seal]

i dont believe it is

[main beacon]

I wouldn't be surprised if it were though

[viral seal]

we dont even get told what nal saw, just that hirk was angered

basically cain and abel situation

[main beacon]

I plan to find out regardless, learning how much I'm still missing when it comes to the lore, and that I was planning to quest for all of it anyway, im gonna just do it sooner than anticipated

[fallow geode]

Good luck, its kinda annoying for some logs

Manufacturing facilities are definetly the most annoying, and only like 6 of their logs are of any lore importance

But 3 of those logs I'd consider one of the most interesting in the game, giving a new perspective on each of the species

[main beacon]

Thats kinda funny because I think I might have more of those than boundary failure logs so far, but thats because I kept forgetting to go to red star systems

[wispy basalt]

One of the boundary failure logs suggests that the Atlas spoke to both Hirk and Nal indeed, and that they both believed the other to not have heard the Atlas. Digging deeper into this can lead to the conclusion that the Atlas actually created the two in the image of it‘s own fallout with either Telamon or its creator.

As to why the Vy‘keen were able to „defeat“ the Sentinels, the Sentinels were still under Atlas‘ command back then, perhaps it didn‘t let them fight at their full capabilities for some reason.

The fact that they wiped out another Universe in minutes, shows that even if all of the three factions united each at their peak, I don‘t think they‘d stand a chance. Despite this it‘s still interesting how the Sentinels choose to monitor them and potentially military facilities such as the factories. also the attacks on Settlements, it almost appears like they want to stop civilizations from getting too advanced again.

[main beacon]

I think I'd interpret it as the Atlas giving Hirk and Nal what they wanted, and the two then fighting over their interpretations of what had happened, since a lot of the story and conflict deals with misinterpretation of what the Atlas is and what it wants

[urban shadow]

Yes but everything in this game is a work of fiction in a work of fiction, nothing is real, nothing matters

[main beacon]

Matters as much as anything else

[urban shadow]

I dont see it that way, in other games if you assume your character is a living breathing person within that world and the others are too, it changes the perception. but in nms everyone, everything is a line of code in a state of non existence...to me any way and therefore everything is both pointless and expendable up to and including the atlas itself

[main beacon]

Thats rather funny because that applies to our reality if its a simulation as well

Its just as real regardless, I never understood why one arrangement of electrons matters more

[urban shadow]

well since we cant prove other wise ill assume youre a real human being lol

[main beacon]

And what would those things mean? Real? Human? Being? Have you considered?

Is the star you visit in this game more real than the countless stars we will never even see?

[urban shadow]

extensively over decades of both philosophical study and theological study but its not for me to debate here

[urban shadow]

they are no more real in that universe as they are in this one

[wispy basalt]

They respond to stimuli and clearly reproduce (otherwise how would there be so many) they eat (as seen by gek pecking at food) and have language

Code or not they follow our current understanding and rules of life

[urban shadow]

so do characters in The Sims

[wispy basalt]

Lol ^^ yeah, we can count them as alive as well ig Xb

[main beacon]

All of it is as real as the things we dedicate our lives to

Work, laws, money, etc

Theyre just different games we play, in my eyes

[urban shadow]

Maybe id be less critical over it if A there was some actual emotion behind the death of a universe and B if every character you meet had lied to you at every turn until you knew too much that they couldnt

[wispy basalt]

Aye but in the lore isn't it a simulation of life?

[main beacon]

Yes, and it works for an actual simulation of life as well

[wispy basalt]

I feel like the universe deaths get their emotions from all past experiences with the people in them, good and bad, I feel like keeping your ships and such is like a gameplay thing

[main beacon]

Not really sure how many characters actually lied. Ive found the Atlas, when directly spoken to, doesnt lie to the player

[urban shadow]

Nada, and null mostly

[wispy basalt]

Nada lies? And also ye was about to mention null, I dislike the murder hobo >:< (but we're supposed to lol)

[urban shadow]

Like at one point where you need to tell Nada the atlas is dying theyre like yea we know...motherfucker you couldnt have told me 30 hours ago?

[wispy basalt]

Lmfao

[main beacon]

I mean... character wise I think it wouldve been more important for the last traveler to learn that themselves, especially since they had the wrong idea about Atlas to begin with

They interpreted Atlas as a god to begin with, not the AGI running a(?) simulation that consisted of all existence

[karmic trout]

yeahh but that is why it is fun right?

inside NMS and every movie, game or book that is why you have this

This is a work of fiction. Names, characters, businesses, places, events and incidents are either the products of the author’s imagination or used in a fictitious manner. Any resemblance to actual persons, living or dead, or actual events is purely coincidental

heck this is shown in the startup of NMS with the Hello Games logo

[main beacon]

NMS coincidentally having its storyline recreate the existential crisis I've already gone through in game format, lol

[urban shadow]

I knew it was never an option as evident by the fact that the game is still here, but i really hoped there was a shut down option

[main beacon]

Well that would be turning off the game

According to Telamon

[urban shadow]

noncanonically touching grass is not part of the official story lol

[main beacon]

Well, sorta

Telamon knows about us

[urban shadow]

as in the players

[main beacon]

Yup

[urban shadow]

ill be sure in inqure about that if i ever find him

[main beacon]

Don't worry, you won't need to search very far

[fallow geode]

It's closer than you think

[urban shadow]

thats assuming i look, with no more story content, i have no motivation to continue because ive been denied my favorite part of any story

[main beacon]

Wait you thought the story started and ended with the Artemis path?

[karmic trout]

broooo/sissss there are still the purple systems you need to unlock, a new race you can meet, the story goes on considerably

[urban shadow]

you mean the autobots?

[fallow geode]

Autophage

[main beacon]

Well they do have the "freedom is the right of all sentient beings" thing going on

But theres also various histories and terminals that reveal a lot more of what's going on

[karmic trout]

they are kinda outliers in that aspect ngl

cause Vy'keen : devote for battle, Gek : devote for trade and Korvax : literally a hive mind

and then these guys just are kinda doing their own thing

with individual freedoms as well

[main beacon]

The korvax are not a hive mind

[karmic trout]

wdym? the Convergence isn't a hive mind?

[main beacon]

Nope

More like a mind hive

A convergence isnt one thing spread across many parts, after all

[fallow geode]

Its bit weird that void mother refers to it as hivemind though

[karmic trout]

From the NMS Wiki:
Korvax Convergence is a form of **collective consciousness** constituted by all Korvax entities. Within the Convergence, each entity is able to move from one envelope (Korvax body) to another, and all entities can communicate with each other. All Korvax communicate with each other in this way, and this has been the case since the beginning of their history

From the Wikipedia page for 'Collective Consciousness'

Rather than existing as separate individuals, people come together as dynamic groups to share resources and knowledge. It has also developed as a way of describing how an entire community comes together to share similar values. This has also been termed "hive mind", "group mind", "mass mind", and "social mind"

It is a hive mind

[main beacon]

Does she? The only thing I remember being referred to directly as a hivemind is the sentinels

But the korvax are still individuals

Its not a single consciousness, is my point

[fallow geode]

Yeah they're definetly individuals and not completely controlled by hivemind

[karmic trout]

with 0 free will, you saw what happened to our scientist after he is kicked out right??

They exist as individuals sure, but without the core collective knowledge that can be accessed only through the Convergence, it is like a big chunk of their personality goes away

[urban shadow]

sounds more like a discord server

[main beacon]

They have free will, otherwise the divergent couldnt really exist at all. That isnt to say they arent authoritarian, but its in pretty much the same way that the vykeen are

[fallow geode]

They seem to be able to unite into hivemind and also be an individual

An example from korvax manufacturing facility:
The facility seems to have been a meeting place for multiple Korvax factions, uploading and downloading from multiple bodies during tense diplomatic and war-time situations.
Even if one's whole species can unify at will with a single great mind, still, there is unique value in face-to-face communication. These Korvax recorded many things they wished to keep secret from their brethren. Some are always more equal than others.

[main beacon]

Theyre separate entities with constant connection to the internet

[main beacon]

And some korvax are more in charge than others

[fallow geode]

"Even if one's whole species can unify at will with a single great mind."
Sounds like its just a state they can assume or access

[main beacon]

Like the internet, lol

[fallow geode]

Didn't want to say that, but yeah

[urban shadow]

thats the premise of Animal Farm basically

[main beacon]

The korvax archives also directly state that they are not a single unified consciousness, even denying the label of a hive mind

[fallow geode]

VM might have been referring to korvax echos which might be complete hivemind

Since they basically exist in the Convergence only

[main beacon]

I dont think thats the case either, but theyd be closer to it

[karmic trout]

But the Vy'keen still retain all their knowledge, their battlefield experiences etc even if they go rogue from the High Command right? The scientist undergoes such a drastic personality change that he is an entirely different person after disconnection.. even the player is like "what is on with this guy"

also see this random NPC encounter

`NPC: Help! Korvax disconnection loop! Oxide element required to stabilise and recharge!
The mask lights in the electronic lifeform brighten, then fade and extinguish. Then they do so again, and again. Each time the entity reboots, they awake with shock and alarm and the size and placement of the light is different.

Every time they look up at me, it feels like a different creature pleading for help.
After each and every reboot, the entities behind the mask desperately point towards the elements I carry in my exosuit inventory.`

I suspect the Convergence has more control over the Korvax that the Vy'keen High Command could only dream of

[main beacon]

I believe that encounter is multiple entities trying to get that shell to work. You'll also notice korvax switching entities when you talk to a ship pilot for trading sometimes, because another entity is better suited for trade while the initial one is better at piloting

[fallow geode]

Ok I think they actually changed the part where VM referred to the Convergence as hivemind

It now says Convergence, or when writing down the notes I for some reason wrote hivemind

[main beacon]

Id say its a type of hive mind, but not the type that is most commonly thought of

[karmic trout]

Yesss I guess that is basically it

but then would the Convergence allow for dissenting entities?

[main beacon]

Of course

[karmic trout]

say there is an entity which says "The First Spawn did nothing wrong" or some nonsense like that

would he be kicked out or restricted in what knowledge he can access?

[main beacon]

And apparently there are divergent korvax that can be found on stations by convergent ones

[main beacon]

What you found shows evidence that its possible to hide information from the convergence while still being a part of it

[fallow geode]

Only korvax that are cut off from Convergence are:
"those disturbed by their actions; those haunted by sorrow; those who might threaten the minds they encountered."

[karmic trout]

any reason why our scientist was thrown out? I don't think he did any of these things

[main beacon]

As determined by the authorities within the convergence

[fallow geode]

I think that was because of the interaction with us

[main beacon]

"Threaten the minds of those they encountered"
Traveler anomaly

[fallow geode]

Yeah

[main beacon]

Also the korvax arent a perfectly logical race

[karmic trout]

but don't we interact with Korvax regularly... we can even climb their ranks of respect like

Research Focus (14)
Trial Candidate (21)
Significance (30)
Saviour (40)
Singularity (60)
Traveller of the Atlas (100)

[main beacon]

I think it also has to do with whatever is going on with the overseer

[karmic trout]

the Gek you mean?

[main beacon]

The overseer

[karmic trout]

yeah isn't the base overseer a Gek?

[main beacon]

It appears as one

It is not

[karmic trout]

?? it? so it is a SyntheGek?

wait what?

[main beacon]

I dont know what it is

I talked to someone here who thinks its of Atlas, but I disagree, since the Atlas doesnt actually do much

[karmic trout]

oh yeahh I forgot, the Farmer is the one who says the overseer is not a Gek

`As I stare at the overseer, I feel a dull crimson ache form behind my eyes....

since the overseer arrived, I have had a recurring dream, a nightmare that feels like a memory. Flesh merged with metal; a world of glass that blinks.`

Yeah he is a SynthiGek

[main beacon]

No

That would imply autophage

I still think its something else

Though a Void connection makes sense

[karmic trout]

you think the Atlas is spying on us to make sure we don't go behind its back to the VM?

[karmic trout]

cause crimson always means Atlas right?

[fallow geode]

Theres also that one gek colossal archive entry

*Simulation Interface

The interface seeps memory-smells, flooding the room with a delicate scent. It tries to fill the user's mind with visions of places that never were, never could be.

The imprint of an individual Gek lingers in the interface. They must have spent years in here, constantly wiping their own memory in order to experience fictional lives. Their simulated fantasies are still available...

[Family]
I return to youth. My sibling and I play beside the spawning pool. The pool is the whole world. I am innocent to trade, to Units, to the insatiable hunger. Here we will stay, forever.

[Friendship]
I have met the Korvax in secret. I hand them the forbidden item. The synthetic lifeform hesitates, unsure. Then they leave. I hope they will remember me. This is the path I would have chosen, should have chosen.

[Home]
I am the one chosen to help the Traveller-friend. The contracted. The significant. The Overseer. There is a home in the universe, just for me, and I will never want for Units again.*

[main beacon]

Crimson is because of Atlas, but it runs the entire simulation, so its presence is literally everywhere

[karmic trout]

so the Overseer is a good guy?

This makes the Korvax disconnection even less sense

but then again the Scientist doesn't leave

[main beacon]

And I encountered a strange derelict freighter that has a story sounding really similar to the overseer

[fallow geode]

Yeah, the Overseer is rather questionable

[main beacon]

A korvax, or something claiming to be one, brainwashing a gek ship into accepting it, and strange anomalies happening while it is there

[karmic trout]

Derelict freighter lore should be 16+ ngl for the amount of horror it contains

horror like this

[main beacon]

The more lore I uncover, the more I feel that the Atlas does almost nothing, though when it does act its always significant

[fallow geode]

I mean, atlas is running a simulation.

So it would interfere as least as possible ideally

[main beacon]

Well yeah, but aside from just running it, I dont think it does much else at all

The sentinels do what they do because the Atlas hasn't told them to stop

But it didnt order them to protect planets either

[karmic trout]

maybe got tired of all the Vy'keen rants

[fallow geode]

I have a feeling that atlas would act in more subtle way, like fate

Like Korvax Prime being destroyed over and over again in different simulations by different means, but always being destroyed

[main beacon]

The vykeen believe their crusade against the sentinels is an order given by atlas, but I suspect whatever happened with Hirk and Nal, it was simply responding to their input

[karmic trout]

then why do they hate it

[main beacon]

Wait since when?

Most vykeen believe Hirk recieved a vision from Atlas

[karmic trout]

`Grah! Do not speak that (Atlas) name! Only pathetic beings worship Liar-Atlas! The crimes of the Gek will not be forgotten! Obliterated Korvax homeworld, enslaved the synthetics and melted them down for Nanite Clusters! Their so-called First Spawn summoned back the Sentinels with their brutality and barbarism! Grah!

The Vy'keen tells me of their history, of wars with the Gek, of Korvax slaves and tyrannous empires. The Vy'keen suggests that if the Atlas is a god, then it is insane.`

They probably expected the Atlas to intervene and stop the First Spawn

[main beacon]

Weird, but id consider that to be due to conflicting dogma

Or they consider Atlas a traitor

[karmic trout]

traitor for non-intervention?

[main beacon]

I also dont think Atlas mocked -null- during their interactions

[main beacon]

For not intervening while the vykeen were performing a holy crusade for the atlas

[karmic trout]

yeahh probably

they were close to achieving it and the First Spawn ruined everything

[main beacon]

Oh I dont think they were close at all

Given the sentinel pillar logs, the sentinels didnt even care to note the vykeen crusade against them

[fallow geode]

But they were pushed back

Enough that they could not protect Korvax Prime from destruction, which was basically their n.1 mission

[main beacon]

They definitely retreated, but I dont think it was due to force as much as trying to avoid destruction

[main beacon]

They didnt anticipate its destruction

[karmic trout]

As the most powerful race in the galaxy, the Vy'keen nearly won the Aeron War, but were attacked by the Gek Dominion coming from the core while they desperately tried to remove the Aerons from existence. Weakened, they had no way to resist the First Spawn Empire.

[main beacon]

The vykeen drew their attention away from korvax prime, but I dont think they actually achieved that goal

[karmic trout]

According to the Wiki, they were close

[main beacon]

From what log?

Which perspective?

[karmic trout]

`Grah! The Sentinel hordes were pushed back. The oppressors fled into the sanctuary of the cosmos. The spirit of Hirk surveyed the field of battle, and saw that the Vy'keen victory was glorious and just. The automatons became silent as the nation of Hirk feasted upon grahgrah. The songs of the victorious echoed to the edges of the galaxy.

And thus the Sentinel horde congregated in the dark places of the void. There they watched in the in-between nothingness. The blackness of space. Thy waited beyond the limits of the Outer Edge. As millennia passed they replenished, growing a force to return their order for countless age`

Saga of the Vy'keen and although the POV is from the Vy'keen, we do know a period called 'Silence of the Sentinels' existed, which is talked about in the next log

The Vy'keen licked each other's wounds during the Silence of the Sentinels, while the dishonorable Gek First Spawn chose to destroy Korvax Prime. The Vy'keen condemned this crime, but lacked the strength to fight. The Gek Empire flourished. It spread its empire into the depths of the cosmos. The Vy'keen victory in pushing the Sentinels back from the Outer Edge gave rise to Dominion of another.

[main beacon]

Yes, the vykeen mention it, and consider it very important

So why is it not even mentioned by the sentinel logs?

[fallow geode]

Even gek call it "The Great Vy'keen Sentinel War"

[karmic trout]

since as we know the Sentinels were powerful enough to wipe entire universes in minutes, I am going to assume they were nerfed by the Atlas so that the Vy'keen had a fighting chance

consequently the sentinel logs also did not document this 'nerf' as it could have been exploited later

[fallow geode]

And have to say the following:
"The Vy'keen SPILLED THEIR OWN PUTRID BLOOD and pushed the SENTINEL MACHINES back from the Outer Edge. They drove forward like crashing tides, leaving broken metal in their wake. For a time the Sentinels became SILENT."

[fallow geode]

They also call it stupid so I don't think they had an agenda to make Vy'keen achievements seem greater

[main beacon]

But the sentinels also dont blame the vykeen for distracting them, or the Atlas for limiting them

[karmic trout]

ofc why would they?? It is simply part of the job for them

I would say after the destruction of Korvax Prime, the sentinels gained some sort of free will powerful enough to even defect from the Atlas in favor of the Abyss (corrupted sentinels)

[main beacon]

The sentinel logs indicate they had some free will before the destruction of Korvax Prime. They also state that the Atlas hasn't given them orders since making them physical

[karmic trout]

probably discretionary will... kind of like 'yeah you have to enforce order in the universe, how you do it is upto you'

[main beacon]

They didnt enforce order though, they were originally archival programs, completely digital at that

[karmic trout]

so a documentation directive? what kind of free will will they have as paper pushers?

[main beacon]

Enough to choose a new mission

[karmic trout]

if the sentinels were just documentation programs, who were the Vy'keen fighting against?

[karmic trout]

clearly it says machines

meaning physical forms

[main beacon]

The Aerons given physical form

They were made physical

[fallow geode]

It does say that vy'keen "only" pushed them out of the outer edge, so perhaps across entire multiverses that sentinels can shift between. They didn't find it that important.

[karmic trout]

before or after Prime?

[fallow geode]

Before

[main beacon]

And they weren't given a reason why

[karmic trout]

so let me see if I understood correctly

Sentinels gain physical form -> Great Aeron War -> Destruction of KP -> some defection to VM by sentinels

[main beacon]

I dont think defection happened until quite a bit later

[fallow geode]

Yep, though I'd say the defection wasn't to VM at first

[main beacon]

But I think there was civil war amongst the sentinels

[fallow geode]

First they just deviated from Atlas and then begun to hear VM

[karmic trout]

so the destruction of KP affected the sentinels as well

[fallow geode]

I don't think it ever implies that any sentinels were against the change

[main beacon]

They were confused by it, as it wasn't necessary for their function

[fallow geode]

No I mean, the civil war

What civil war

[karmic trout]

Imagine if you were warping and suddenly entered an asteroid field, purple color filter and see nothing, just the stars, just silence

(kinda like how in Star Wars a New Hope, the gang arrives at Alderaan)

[main beacon]

Well I stopped reading that wiki page because I havent gotten to that part of the sentinel logs yet, lol

[fallow geode]

Oh alright

[main beacon]

Though I already know of a different spoiler to them: the identity of the narrator

[karmic trout]

Telamon?

[main beacon]

Nope

[fallow geode]

Of the pillars?

[main beacon]

Yeah

[fallow geode]

Oh, yeah

[karmic trout]

Who is that??

drop it in #nms-spoilers or put a tag (lore spoilers are allowed here)

[main beacon]

||I am having so much fun, Telamon-not-Telamon!||

[karmic trout]

okay that kinda makes sense

I love Laylaps

[fervent blaze]

I am having such fun Telamon-NOT-Telamon! @karmic trout

[karmic trout]

see, he's cute

[fallow geode]

He's not very cute in those logs

[karmic trout]

funny thing is how the Laylaps bot is already corrupted loll

they could have gone with any DP

[fallow geode]

I love laylaps but
||Won't you join us? Won't you sing? Won't you scream? There will be no second death. Not for us, who are already dead! The abyss, it smiles upon you...||
Is genuinely not something I want to associate with it

[karmic trout]

I mean, if it helps avoid the death of the Atlas sure why not

we're gonna die anyway

[main beacon]

The abyss has gradually gotten somewhat less malevolent in portrayal as time has gone on, though its still creepy for sure

[fallow geode]

I still definetly don't trust it

[main beacon]

Fair enough. I'd probably be more wary if I had the game during the whole Ariadne stuff

[full zealot]

I love the lore

[wispy basalt]

I just finished the scientist quest... || and wtf! He killed his kid????? ||

|| ;w; the poor beacon ||

[brisk isle]

Bro how long are these fucking quests for the scientist and shit taking forever lol

[karmic trout]

You don't need to do it if you don't want to

Doesn't lock anything

[frank widget]

Not sure if this is the right tab but I’ve just found an abandoned space station

[flint raft]

Wait there’s abandoned space stations !? Playing the game through creative

[karmic trout]

`Alien: Grah! Vy'keen war preparation nears completion! Death to the unsuspecting Gek! Give rare isotope!

The warrior is building a nuclear warhead. The plans they hold in their hand are unmistakable. A complicated sequence of blueprints and isotopic chemical reactions is waiting for the final addition of an element to be complete.

There are countless lives on an unknown planet, far out in the cosmos, that could one day end due to this lifeform's work...`

Umm so the Vy'keen were gonna the nuke the Gek????

also nuclear weapons seem to be canon as well then to the NMS universe

[fallow geode]

I mean, Vy'keen don't like gek and do seem to be preparing for some sort of strike

[karmic trout]

with nuclear weapons??

[fallow geode]

I have no idea how warfare looks in nms honestly

[karmic trout]

don't the Gek have planet destroying weapons already?? unless they were dismantled after the war

[fallow geode]

Also apparently vy'keen are paying the gek reparations?

[karmic trout]

probably like Star Wars?

[fallow geode]

Though Im unsure whether its still from back when first spawn was on conquering spree or something else

[karmic trout]

Star Wars had nukes too

[fallow geode]

Probably, we do have big battle freighters with combat frigates

[karmic trout]

also I find it morbidly funny one guy is able to build a nuke all by himself

without even Uranium

I am going down a rabbit hole of the logs, please help

`Alien: Grah! Vote for strongest is vote to end voting! Interloper, choose correctly!

The warrior stands to attention, handing me a communication somehow tailored to my own language.

It informs me that the Vy'keen High Command has placed this system under temporary democratic rule until a state of emergency is lifted.

The warrior shows me multiple candidates for the system primarch.`

Gosh the universe is so alive but it is hidden behind NPC dialogue and logs

[fallow geode]

My favourite is the one log that implies that gek are ranked by their fatness

The trade vaults in this installation are full to the brim, and ready for distribution. There are three images on-screen, each showing the outline of a different sort of trader. It's strange... it's as if they're put in order of the size of their gut.
Rejoice! Vy'keen war reparations arrive! Elder large Gek receive high reward! Low toilgek receive low reward!
The first trader is small and sleek, the second is pudgier – and the final has a huge belly that almost drags on the floor.

Truly enlightened race

[karmic trout]

war reparations from the Vy'keen? Shouldn't be the other way round?

[fallow geode]

I mean, which side won

[karmic trout]

okayy but the Gek Empire collapsed afterwards right?

[fallow geode]

Yup, but I guess that doesn't prevent them from still demanding reparations

I think there's a vy'keen log that also agresses that

*An off-world message has been sent here from a species of beaked traders. It looks like a signed contract, or maybe some sort of treaty. In response several offerings of valuable trade goods have been left in a vault by local warriors for exportation.

Grah! Foolish, pathetic, ignorant Gek Trade Federation believe peace treaty! Warrior give trade to pacify! Death soon!

Warrior High Command has sent a subsequent message to explain...*

Yeah they're paying gek off for peace

[karmic trout]

based on the log, the GTF might have threatened to crash the Vy'keen economy or impose a trade embargo if they did not comply

[fallow geode]

There are also logs where gek are just admitting to stirring vy'keen up internally and instigating wars for profit

Gek might have been altered to no longer have taste for direct war, but they're definetly not peaceful

And likely still strong

[karmic trout]

they set the galactic currency, market and the whole financial system and probably still have a huge surplus of left over military

[main beacon]

In my primary save, ive spent the most of my time living amongst the vykeen, and something I noticed is that they view giving gifts in a very different way than most would expect. They willingly give gifts to those who are worthy and show merit in their eyes, but they also will give gifts to those they see as weaker and more pathetic because such beings need protection

I wouldn't be surprised if the vykeen are also doing this to insult the gek in their own way

[fallow geode]

I doubt they are doing it willingly

[main beacon]

Im trying to claim settlements of gek and korvax so I'm more likely to spend time in their systems for my lore quest

[fallow geode]

I mean gek receive war reparations from them, and I'd assume vy'keen are still somewhat weakened by the sentinel war and subsequent first spawn backstab

[main beacon]

I find that somewhat hard to believe, considering the amount of time that passed since then

[fallow geode]

How much time did even pass

[main beacon]

I remember meeting an autophage that claimed to have been constructed for around 3,000 years

And the destruction of Korvax Prime has pretty much been confirmed to have happened at 19 minutes in the countdown

[fallow geode]

Yeah but problem with the minutes is that we just cant tell how long a minute is

[main beacon]

Oh if the black hole thing is true, then the relative length of a minute is changing as well

[fallow geode]

Between simulation running at different speed than real life and the gravitational shinenegans, I also suspect that the minutes could be getting "shorter" with time

[main beacon]

I actually think theyre getting longer

[fallow geode]

Since atlas would be getting damaged and it could be more difficult to keep running the simulation at the same speed

[main beacon]

Oh, idk how much that would counter the gravitational time dilation

But regardless, the events of ancient times seem to be at least a couple millennia prior to "modern" times

My own vague and mostly-guessing estimate is somewhere around 5000 years ago

[fallow geode]

Yeah, also vy'keen are something I am still not confident in talking about

[main beacon]

They are truly fascinating. I think a ton of players misinterpret their demeanor, lol

[fallow geode]

Or I feel like Im missing something with one manufacturing facility log

Because all the races have one facility log that starts with "this terminal is ancient even by [race] standards" and has pretty significant information

For korvax, its the fact they were once biological. For Gek, its the rise of first spawn

[main beacon]

Oh yeah, I should really get those

[fallow geode]

For vy'keen its
||The outpost is ancient, even by the standards of the Vy'keen. Its environment is calibrated to preserve the data within.
One log speaks of the first Vy'keen contact with a Traveller. The figure remained with the warrior race for a long time, learning from them, exploring from them, even falling in love. The Vy'keen died, but the Traveller did not.
The log shows how instrumental this figure was in the development of the early Vy'keen race, contributing much to their early technology. These records were lost in the intervening years, forgotten until I found this account||

[main beacon]

Ive been neglecting them, tbh

...oh

[fallow geode]

Like Im not sure if its referring to specific Traveller? Or some deeper implications

[main beacon]

I wonder if thats related to the poem I found in a planetary archive

[fallow geode]

Yeah that was my first thought

[main beacon]

Because I remember that feeling very strange

[fallow geode]

But idk, the fact it specifies that the Vy'keen they fell in love with died but they survived is odd to me

[main beacon]

Travelers are weird

[fallow geode]

Like why mention that if its just random lore tidbit about random traveller

Clearly its implying that the fact the traveller survived, has some meaning

[main beacon]

A crashed freighter log mentions them returning from death

So respawning is canon, i suppose, lol

[fallow geode]

At one point I was even like "was Hirk a traveller"

But probably not

[main beacon]

Also thats pretty significant considering elderly vykeen are implied to be centuries old at least

Its possible that the traveller outlived the vykeen as well

[fallow geode]

I was also wondering if its referring to null

Since its first encounter

And now I dread that Ill have to replay the story to see what exactly null said about vy'keen

[main beacon]

No, you should be able to (eventually) find it by scrolling through the journey records

[fallow geode]

They don't keep track of everything

Like they miss some dialog thats not important

[main beacon]

Hmm, I do agree there, though mostly regarding the logs found on derelicts, and the occasional more in-depth conversations you can have

I figured the actual main story dialog would be kept mostly intact

[fallow geode]

Nah, I looked through it exactly for that reason

[main beacon]

This angers my archival nature

[main beacon]

Silly side-note, but I had a similar reaction upon finding out that fossils were cookable

[fallow geode]

Manufacturing facility logs also don't get saved at all

[main beacon]

WHAT

[fallow geode]

Since they're just puzzles

[main beacon]

I could've sworn I saw one

[fallow geode]

Except the ones that are lore nukes

[main beacon]

What's an example of a log that doesnt get saved?

[fallow geode]

Well, the manufacturing facilities might be the only ones

[main beacon]

Because i remember learning that manufacturing facilities were a way to unlock advanced material blueprints, so if the unsaved dialog is literally just that + the puzzle then I'd say I'm okay with it

[fallow geode]

Let me check in game again

But I don't think any logs from facilities get saved

[main beacon]

Btw do you have any tips on finding boundary failures? I'm frustrated that I didnt mark the planet I saw at least 2 on for future searching

[fallow geode]

Yup, they're not under race categories, nor journey records, nor other history

[fallow geode]

They're on the anomalous planets

[main beacon]

Yes, but the last 2 or so I checked seemed to have none

[fallow geode]

I just flew around and spammed scan, and like 50% of time any building showed up, it would be boundary failure

[main beacon]

Hmm, do they only show up in inhabited systems?

Because that would most likely be the mistake I was making

[fallow geode]

Not sure, lemme check

Hm might actually be the problem yeah

Went to uncharted system and cant pick up anything

[main beacon]

And of course exotics are most common in red systems, and red systems are most frequently uncharted

[fallow geode]

That might explain why I had such ease finding them, I was mainly hunting them down on my abandoned mode save, and that works by overriding every system as abandoned, even the red systems

[brave mulch]

ok guys, I really don't understand how ||resetting the simulation has anything to do with the Atlas' imminent shutdown||

like, I kinda got things until then, but the ||simulation reset seems kinda left-field and doesn't appear to help with anything||

[fallow geode]

Indeed, it most likely doesn't

Atlas is just dying, its desparate

[main beacon]

Atlas is trying to fix the errors its getting as that approaches

And so, tried and true method of "turn it off and back on again"

[brave mulch]

I kinda got the impression that the fundamental cause is hardware failure so resetting doesn't seem like a useful thing to do

may as well just let things play out till the end

[main beacon]

Its a machine, one that is desperate and dying

[fallow geode]

There are also other theories

[brave mulch]

seems like a possible interpretation, but the Atlas doesn't seem to actually state that at all

it goes from "I'm dying" to "pls reset simulation" as practically totally separate concerns

[main beacon]

I mean, its an AGI, and one with a directive at that

Regardless of whether its actually dying, it is definitely suffering errors and is rather desperate about something

[brave mulch]

well

I kinda feel like that's clearly not true

the Atlas certainly doesn't need the player's help or permission to do anything

if it was desperate to reset it wouldn't wait for the player to finish arsing around

or offer the player the chance to refuse

and you'd also think that even if somehow the Atlas couldn't reset without the player's choice, it would be a lot more aggressive about securing that choice

[main beacon]

It kinda does, because the Atlas doesnt really have complete control due to its true nature

[brave mulch]

instead of just asking that one time, eventually, whenever the player feels like it

I mean, for all the Atlas knows, the player will just die to some random sentinel

unless respawning is actually canon

[fallow geode]

It is

[brave mulch]

well, I played the game on Normal my first time and never actually died, so I have no idea what happens if you die

[main beacon]

The Atlas, as advanced as it is, remains a computer, and that requires user input

[fallow geode]

It might also just... want a user input

Im not a machine psychologist but something is clearly wrong with atlas

[main beacon]

I genuinely think every interaction the Atlas has with any character in the game and lore is it pretty much just being a computer

[fallow geode]

I feel like there's enough evidence that it has gone rampant and is emotional

[brave mulch]

ehh

I think it's more of an experimenter

how little pressure can I put the player under and still have them murder everyone

[main beacon]

Oh for sure, but when it interacts with characters like -null-, us, and hirk/nal I think it was just... responding to their input

[brave mulch]

cutting off null certainly seems like more of a moral judgement than a simple input response

[fallow geode]

Perhaps, but then when telamon interacted with it directly, it talked to it as 'person'

[main beacon]

I dont think Atlas actually mocked -null-, as an example, I think -null- told it that they "explored everything" and the Atlas responded with "you did not" and showed why that was the case

[main beacon]

That, in particular, is the exception, due to Telamon's nature and relation to Atlas

[brave mulch]

that part I could understand, the part about subsequently ignoring null seems like a judgement

[main beacon]

I can agree there, but theres also implications that -null- did something that damaged the Atlas

[brave mulch]

I was really hoping for a bit more detail about what -null- did

[main beacon]

There is but I still need to find it

[brave mulch]

but it kinda seems like they probably just mass murdered everybody in their reality so they could live

[main beacon]

I stumbled across a particularly harrowing spoiler about that

[brave mulch]

I checked the wiki but it wasn't very specific

[fallow geode]

Wiki is also often wrong

[main beacon]

Apparently theres a log where -null-... eats a soul ark

[brave mulch]

that's probably way less bad than what I suggested

I thought the dialogue heavily implied that whatever null did, it was en masse

[main beacon]

Said soul ark implied to contain the soul of -null-'s original universe

Like the entire thing

[brave mulch]

well

that's pretty awkward but at the same time, how did the original universe get put into a soul ark in the first place

[main beacon]

I dont know, but I'd assume its related to -null- apparently damaging Atlas

I still gotta investigate various logs

[brave mulch]

that would actually be pretty hilarious

Atlas runs simulation, simulation finds jailbreak

[main beacon]

I also am under the impression that resetting a universe doesnt really completely delete it

Normally, anyway

[brave mulch]

well, everything is still there if you warp back so

[main beacon]

Though the world of glass doesnt sound very fun

[brave mulch]

honestly that part seems.. more confusing the further into the plot you get

[main beacon]

But I think -null- did something that stopped their universe from being archived

[brave mulch]

at first, it seems like a fairly clear antagonist, but then it's like, oh yeah, Atlas is God and could just mind-snap it out of existence whenever

[fallow geode]

I feel like it just states that null consumed the mind arks of other travellers

It was not truly murder, for each one of them was all the same, weren’t they?
Seems to refer to the travellers

As they're the iterations of the creator

[main beacon]

I still dont agree with that perspective of Atlas

[main beacon]

Probably the case, but even misinterpretations dont come out of nowhere

I just cant help but think of how unpleasant it would be to eat a mind ark

It makes me think of a magnus archives episode where a guy tried to upload himself into a computer and succeeded... by eating the computer piece by piece

[karmic trout]

Does anyone know the full list of quotes that appear when you die?

I got one from Richard Feynman yesterday and was curious

(don't ask how I died, it was stupid)

[elder summit]

theres a list on the fandom wiki if you search up nms death quotes, there are 36 in total

[elder summit]

here they are

[wispy basalt]

Isn't the void mother like a second atlas? And isn't the atlas losing power over the simulation? Thats what i remember, but if thats the case, maybe at one point the atlas could have mind-snapped it but not anymore

[fallow geode]

Void mother isnt a second atlas, but she is likely a subprocess of it like Telamon

[wispy basalt]

That then ^^

Ty for the correction:3

[main beacon]

I dont think she's a subprocess either. Still gathering lore, but its looking like she was made for one of a few reasons
Atlas simulated it as a regular variation of its programming or simply because it wanted to
She was a simulation of the Atlas' eventual replacement for testing purposes
Atlas made her due to its loneliness

I feel like there's something I'm forgetting as a possibility

[main beacon]

Also, from my interpretation of the lore, I dont think the Atlas has as much power over the simulation as is assumed. Many of the influences seem somewhat more subconscious, especially compared to the much more overt and deliberate actions of Atlantid

[fallow geode]

I feel like there's a strong connection between the fact that korvax prime had a form as a planet and the fact that sentinels, originally just a process inside atlas were given a physical form, and Telamon was given a physical form.
To me it seems like either consciously or subconsciously, Atlas is letting its fantasies show. To have a form, to be able to leave, escape. Or perhaps to have gone with its creator back when it was possible.

[main beacon]

I agree there, though Telamon wasn't exactly given a physical form, lol

[fallow geode]

And if that were the case, Korvax Prime being destroyed in Every simulation atlas runs, might just be atlas being jealous of its own creation and intentionally making it be destroyed

[main beacon]

Intentionally is a strong word, imo. It could be the sim reflecting the jealousy/envy though, for sure

The Atlas is also implied to not be fully active during regular processing

When it was alerted to the damage diagnostic, its described as "awakening" and then calling for its creator

[fallow geode]

True

There is lot of mentions of dreams and dreaming all throughout the game

I guess that's what running the simulation would be for atlas, a state of dreaming

[main beacon]

The sentinel logs describe the changes Atlas makes as it "dreaming" them into existence

[fallow geode]

So it would not be able to intervene in its dream in direct way, but the dream would be shaped by their subonscious or state.

[main beacon]

Yeah, though I'm not sure if its remained awake since making the Travellers

[fallow geode]

I guess it can only be awoken at the interface

[main beacon]

Probably, now that I think about it

Or it could (sometimes) respond basically, like only partially coming out of the dreaming mode

[fallow geode]

Telamon also tried to contact it directly by using a copy and Atlas was able to destroy it instantly.

[main beacon]

Oh, yeah, thats what that referred to, lol

By the way, I got the vy'keen boundary log

Definitely reads like Atlas spoke to both Hirk and Nal

[fallow geode]

Either it did or it spoke to neither

No actually, yeah it spoke to both

[main beacon]

Not only that, it states that Nal was retrieved, whatever that means

[karmic trout]

@viscid dome you need more politics than this 😂

[viscid dome]

i am a bit ashamed to admit i have 3k hours on stellaris

[wispy basalt]

Whatever power they did have is gone imo

[boreal fable]

i hope we get something like animation or books that can tell the nms universe story more

[neat pagoda]

is artemis male or female?

[karmic trout]

Good question 😂

[desert kelp]

I think no character from the story has a specified gender

[karmic trout]

I don't think the game assigns any gender

I just call it her as Artemis is the name of a Greek goddess

Some people call it him and that's fine too

[neat pagoda]

because he as well as she is used by the players

and i think also by the game

[desert kelp]

In-game text will usually use "they"

[neat pagoda]

just had one wich used he

i always throught artemis is a girl

no idea why

[karmic trout]

It's the name of a goddess and is usually given to females so that checks out

[neat pagoda]

should i upload it or let it die

[karmic trout]

But since the game does not assign a gender you can call it wherever you want

[karmic trout]

Based on what you think is right, both are kinda bad choices

[neat pagoda]

i know

if there is a world after death (in the game not irl) than its better than the shit artemis has to go through in the simulation

i put her in the simulation because artemis can explore the wonders of the galaxy that way

[main beacon]

Its... a single solar system, but still plenty to explore

[main beacon]

Also there is, and by most accounts it's not very fun

[karmic trout]

An NMS anime would be so awesome

Pilot could be humanity trying to escape a dying solar system and the Atlas calls out to it's creators in an empty lab or something

Pacific Drive, an indie game which released just last year, got a TV series so I see no reason why NMS wouldn't

Probably HG feels they're not ready for that yet

[lofty star]

I'm looking for a German player who knows the story

[civic vine]

How powerful is atlas processing?

Stop and think, at all times he is processing even atoms in real time, and his only concern is with his death in 16 minutes, he practically doesn't care about simulating a universe.

And we don't know if he's simulating multiverses too.

[naive jacinth]

!germanskylink

Check #bot-spam

[tiny aurora]

https://discord.com/channels/146101654981312513/725186274109030421

[lofty star]

Thanks guys

[tiny aurora]

✅

[main beacon]

I'm pretty sure Atlas is implied to be running on hardware that takes up a chunk of a planetoid

[main beacon]

Also, he is, I'm pretty sure, since every player character is implied to be the last traveler, storywise

[karmic trout]

Why?? Our present day real world supercomputers are extremely powerful + we all simulate the Atlas when we play NMS on our devices

And Quantum computers are so powerful even to break encryption

[main beacon]

Yes but the game is a simplified version of what the atlas actually would be. Irl, this game isnt simulating atoms and such

[karmic trout]

Then our supercomputers could do that, we have really advanced capabilities now

[main beacon]

Now? Maybe at the scale of a region, definitely not a planet though

[karmic trout]

The problem would be Chaos Theory

The inherent unpredictability

Do you think the Atlas nailed that?

[waxen badge]

just finished watching the show "devs" and got MAJOR nms vibes. if the atlas was real, that's definitely the form it would take.

[main beacon]

That happens with any system at all

[main beacon]

@viral seal I figured out where the sentinel pillar logs reference the aeron war

[viral seal]

what it say

[main beacon]

Log 4
||As we swam with void dragons, robotic lifeforms would delight in our presence, but organics would shoot us from the sky. But we had no fear of death. We knew we had never been alive.||

[viral seal]

ah yeah i really want to learn more about what they refer to as void dragons

like is that megafauna or

[main beacon]

Im not sure

But it basically confirms that the aeron war was one sided in the sense that the aerons weren't even really fighting back

[fallow geode]

Id say its megafauna

[viral seal]

maybe ocean titan in space

i dont think the ones we find for frigates get that big

or have same skull structure

[fallow geode]

Not until we get living freighters

[main beacon]

Next time I encounter an ocean king skull, I'm summoning my freighter by it to compare

[fallow geode]

Nah their heads look completely different if you want to compare their shape

[viral seal]

but yeah i'd always thought most things in the lore have to be taken with a grain of salt from any of the main factions because it's like everyone has their own interpretation. one of the reasons i wanna see what happens with the first spawn rising again >.>

had a little gek guy pop up at my settlement saying something about it too (warning us) so its not just randoms at space stations

[main beacon]

I meant size, lol

[main beacon]

True, but the combined info paints a relatively clear picture to me

The sentinels are pretty clearly under the impression that they didnt care about being hunted down

[fallow geode]

Yeah but that comes from their perspective of having complete disregard of death

[main beacon]

Yeah, so why would they really fight back? It also fits with what we know of that one universe where the sentinels killed everything

[viral seal]

imo they saw the vykeen attacking them and then retreated as a means to pacify things insofar as trying to keep 'order' to things, but only became as they are now due to the subsequent attack on korvax prime when they realized they stepped too far back and organics were wayyy more unpredictable than they anticipated

[fallow geode]

The problem comes with the fact that korvax prime was destroyed before in other universes

[main beacon]

Yeah, though I'm still trying to figure out whether they did still protect environments before the Aeron war, or if that was a retroactive justification on the vy'keen's part

[main beacon]

I think korvax prime was destroyed "relatively simultaneously"

[viral seal]

i also think they seized ships and freighters from organics to make their own fleets because the game makes mentions to the cockpit in the interceptors being vestigial

[main beacon]

That could also be from when they were cooperative with the ancient korvax

[viral seal]

hmm mebbe

[fallow geode]

I dont think so,
We witnessed Korvax Prime's death again and again, a constant wail across the multiverse. Its scream was a cry that no being could hear but us. But. One day, a drone fought back when a Vy'keen cub attempted to carve into the mother planet. One day, another obliterated an entire Gek cabal. The Atlas did not prevent this.
The way they start "But. One day..." makes me thing that this was a thing that was happening over a longer period of time.

Like something that kept happening until they finally snapped

[main beacon]

Oh, yeah that makes sense, havent gotten there in the logs yet, lol

And it would definitely affect the sentinels the most, since they were the same across the multiverse

I wonder if they did attack before the destruction of korvax prime in some iterations

[fallow geode]

Yeah, I guess one could argue that our universe is the oldest one of the current running simulations though I guess.

[fallow geode]

I feel like the vy'keen and gek logs imply some form of intervention. I dont think they talk about direct attacks but they describe it as tyranny

[viral seal]

i'm trying to wrap my head around some of this, but is it possible that they're referring to the calls of the void mother after the destruction of korvax prime? and re: vykeen carve into the mother planet, that does make me wonder what hand the vykeen had in it after all

[fallow geode]

While sentinel logs pretty much say they didn't do anything at all before korvax prime

[main beacon]

Well, they continued their main directive, I'm pretty sure

[fallow geode]

We know that korvax prime was destroyed in various ways in different universes

Not just by gek

[viral seal]

ah so the first spawn attack is unique to ours

incheresting

[main beacon]

Well, somewhat

[fallow geode]

Id say first spawn is the common one

[main beacon]

I also still wonder whether or not jumping galaxies actually resets the sim or if the galaxies are all part of the same sim

Or if theyre separate sims being ran simultaneously

[fallow geode]

Honestly thats the messiest part of nms lore

And often I get the impression that Hello Games haven't really thought that part through all that well

[main beacon]

If i had to guess, theyre leaving it kinda open to interpretation

But I lean towards multiple sims existing at once because every player is supposed to be the last traveler in their universe

And thats not even getting into Telamon being Aware

[fallow geode]

Oh right, there's also one of the last sentinel pillar logs

[main beacon]

DONT TELL ME I GOTTA GET IT MYSELF

[fallow geode]

Yeah I wont

It doesn't really specify whether the simulations are at the same time or at different times though

[main beacon]

The boundary pillar logs suggest its kinda both

Boundary failure

They can run simultaneously, and have similar history, but happening at different times relative to each other

[fallow geode]

Yeah, but again, if that were the case and sentinels were already rebellious, they would definetly try to guard korvax prime at all costs

[main beacon]

I kinda think the various korvax primes are already dead at this point

[fallow geode]

Also would all destroyed korvax primes become the void mother of their own universe or because of the world of glass and void being shared between universes, would they sort of converge into a single Void mother we know?

[main beacon]

I wonder if Korvax Prime is also multiversal in nature

[fallow geode]

I believe so

[main beacon]

I mean in the sense of all korvax prime being one being

[fallow geode]

Oh

That would likely only really work if the destruction happened in all universes at the same time

Or perhaps in other universes Void Mother didn't emerge at all and thats specific to our universe

[main beacon]

Or it was a long, drawn-out killing

[wide bronze]

simulation

[untold pumice]

@karmic trout

Did they send the message after getting muted? or they got muted after sending the message?

[karmic trout]

I have no idea, I saw the username with a color I'd never seen before, checked it and saw this role

[untold pumice]

Okay, they must've been muted after sending the message

[karmic trout]

That's even stranger considering the message seems innocent, but maybe the moderators know more

[outer jetty]

Hi new player, just discovered the awful things the Gek did to the Korvax. That is all. I'm going to turn into the Walter White of NipNip

[oblique kettle]

Yeah lol. I kinda liked the Gek... until I learned more about em.

[main beacon]

I still generally like the gek, though the ones in charge seem pretty suspicious to me.

[meager gull]

I never really liked the gek, mostly just bc of how they look but their actions don’t really help their case

[old flower]

I used to like the Vy’keen back when I was a fan of fighting Sentinels, but recently I’ve come to appreciate the Autophage 😄

[fallow geode]

Im unsure whether I like gek or korvax more

[fallow geode]

My first impression of korvax was also that but later through various logs, I came to the belief that they are not so.

Like there being sort of individuality inside their pseudo hivemind. Being emotional on both collective and individual scale.

Fair

That was my initial impression of vy'keen

[ornate mountain]

Does anyone have a video covering the whole story of nms (not a game through)

[meager gull]

I didn’t like the vy’keen at first, but then I got an S class freighter with a sickass name and so I’ve come to appreciate them more

[strong topaz]

Vy'keen are goated, defo my favorite out of the main trio

Just a bunch of frat bro warriors that'll give you shit but still help out

[karmic trout]

Also they have nukes

[burnt prawn]

Can any veterans figure this out https://open.spotify.com/track/2FW9H4OOtXZtmPk1qxxVz2?si=DeLw6rM_TFaEX8tUcJMI6w

[dull girder]

It's text from the abandoned building terminals

[main beacon]

Ahahaha ahahahahaha

What do you mean they all had an Atlas?

[neat pagoda]

so what gender is nada?

the german version says its a girl

sie = she

[elder summit]

despite most languages using feminine inflections for nada, they dont actually have a gender

[zinc pike]

Isn't Korvax a pure machine race?

[neat pagoda]

well its a robot so yeah

it could also be for sie as of the machine and not the gender

because its die maschine in german

as in english its the machine

[zinc pike]

Yeah that makes sense

[naive jacinth]

All npc have no genders. U can set your own headcanon

[main beacon]

Woah woah woah woah woah woah

The expedition still has lore implications

How did the sentinels become hostile to all traveller entities when said entities are made by the Atlas?

What does it mean that the atlas/aeron surveillance unlink can be compromised?

[lyric harness]

anyone believe the mechanical fauna to be something else in the lore entirely?

I have my beliefs. scanning them sometimes brings up such notes as "Non-simulated" and "Transmitting to the Atlas"

[meager gull]

Even your character doesn’t really have one

It’s really just a reflection of yourslef

[main beacon]

The sentinels being an archival program initially is why I'm curious about the uplink being compromised. The reason the sentinels pursued the path they have is because the Atlas never told them to stop doing so

[main beacon]

Well, I did recently finish the boundary failure logs, I still need the sentinel pillars, and of course the various histories

[silver turtle]

I wanna know why the geks are so cute.

That's the only lore I need to know

[young birch]

Korvax are kinda fire tho, they lowk chill

[violet vessel]

So do Korvax actually have some form of biological functions because a Korvax settlement still has sewers

[nimble quail]

It's probably runoff from things like factories/processing equipment, not biological functions (if I had to guess)

[main beacon]

Korvax are machine life, so theres probably some form of waste their bodies produce

Some korvax you interact with are maintaining their shell

[alpine urchin]

somehow they able have kids as sometimes we get to name them as settlement request, but no idea how that would actually work

[main beacon]

Oh they definitely have some form of reproduction, I'm guessing they copy parts of themselves? Its hard to say, but Korvax definitely understand familial relationships

[main beacon]

The autophage are what became of the korvax that split/died during the death of the Atlantid/Korvax Prime

I do not consider them korvax anymore though, but I'm not entirely sure if they could "rejoin" them

Also @mystic star the current convergence is something like the 7th since KP died

[main beacon]

First, are you aware of the nature of reality?

[mystic star]

I haven't gotten far yet, just know what I know

[main beacon]

Oh, then this may be a pretty big spoiler

[mystic star]

Them are there more than one of them?

[main beacon]

No, the family of glass is what's left of a group who tried to research the sentinels, I think

[mystic star]

Those that encountered the family referred them as Them

As if they aren't people

[main beacon]

I mean, they probably arent at this point

They didnt get there "conventionally"

[mystic star]

And that they have smiles on their faces as I said before

I Saved Artimes btw

And by what he told me after I brought him back...

He was running from Them it sounded like

[main beacon]

Hmm, maybe

Theres other things there to run away from

Especially if you dont understand what's happening

Oop, found the dialog

Yeah probably was the family

[mystic star]

Poor Artimes..

[main beacon]

Im not sure if sentinels can smile, even in the world of glass

[mystic star]

Glad I decided to save him

[mystic star]

The family were the ones that was smiling

[fallow geode]

I dont think so

[main beacon]

You think they are the sentinels?

[fallow geode]

The group that went to research the sentinels already talks about the family of glass

[fallow geode]

No, probably not

[main beacon]

I was just looking at those logs and didnt see any mention of the family

[fallow geode]

The logs that talk about them are always very precise about differentiating between sentinels and the family of glass

And no log talks about sentinels smiling

[main beacon]

The researcher logs dont directly mention the family of glass

In fact, they seem to be the only log referring to the world of glass that doesnt reference the family

[fallow geode]

*Beneath their skin, they had placed tiny seeds of the glass, which took on the appearance of strange, ritualistic scarring.

The nubs of the broken crystal were ancient, ground down and polished by generations before them. They fed them their life, and in return the crystals glowed with emerald fires and brought them closer to their fate.

I would listen to them talk of worlds they could never have seen, in alien tongues that their body was not made to utter.

The glass made them something more than they were, a vessel for intelligences utterly unlike us.*

Im pretty sure they're talking about the family here

[main beacon]

But no mention of smiling

Frick nms just crashed

[main beacon]

I kinda read that like it was others who tried to learn the secrets of the world of glass, and it sounds like theyre immobile as well

[fallow geode]

But it doesn't mention that anywhere

Where they came from or how they got there

[main beacon]

I guess it was the line "bringing them closer to their fate"

[fallow geode]

Yeah that does imply that they were at one point "normal" and then became this

[main beacon]

Maybe it was the beginning of the family

But theres also the last part of that log sequence

[fallow geode]

And with seeds of glass being used for living ships which was a korvax experiment, it would make sense that the intend for their usage would be research

[main beacon]

The final part of that log implies the researcher did, or is doing, something similar

[fallow geode]

Oh I always assumed they are talking about dying

In time, there will come daring souls far cleverer than I who will learn from my errors.
Sounds like they won't be around for that to happen

It could also be Travellers that were reclaimed by the glass in general now that I think about it

[main beacon]

"I must cut open space. My heart is filled with regret, but there is nothing more to be done."

That and they talk about peeling away their skin to open up their mind

[fallow geode]

Uh how far along are you with sentinel pillars btw

[main beacon]

I still need to finish them

I was not productive in nms tonight, lol

[fallow geode]

Yeah, well I think later pillars talk about what could be family of glass

[main beacon]

Ooh, that will be interesting

Tomorrow I plan to do some stuff in a different game, but I'll also use some of the sentinel boundary maps I've collected to get more logs

[mystic star]

I'm hoping they do more with this

[fallow geode]

They likely will

Another story segment like In Stellar Multitudes

[mystic star]

It sounds like being near them could possibly kill you, is that why people run from Them or is it something else

[main beacon]

I think youd have to learn more of the true nature of the world of glass

[mystic star]

Some say that's the afterlife

Or word it out as such

[main beacon]

They arent exactly wrong

[mystic star]

And that it's more of a Mirrored dimension

[fallow geode]

Well, in last story parts we mostly explore the void, and void and world of glass are close, maybe even connected

[mystic star]

Think She sees the world of glass and family of glass

[main beacon]

The void is what was left behind after that death

[mystic star]

And it sounds like the world of glass is a dark place with no light

Wouldn't put it past them to make it to where we need to build the moduel that allows us to travel to that world, like purple systems

[fallow geode]

I doubt we'll be let into the world of glass

[mystic star]

A portal then

[fallow geode]

It would kind of diminish the horror of the place if we can actually see it

[main beacon]

Considering what it is, probably wouldn't be good to go there regardless

[mystic star]

Why wouldn't it be good

[fallow geode]

The descriptions we get are vague and sometimes impossible, and I dont think an actual visible place would do it justice

[main beacon]

Its also not really a place

[mystic star]

Cause it sounds like some thing or things chase you

[main beacon]

I mean it is, but it isn't

[mystic star]

Plus our weapons wouldn't work in thst place either

[main beacon]

Plus I'm fairly sure its broken

[mystic star]

Is it a planet per sei

[main beacon]

No

It is not a planet, a system, or a galaxy

[mystic star]

Does it say it's a dark place tho

[fallow geode]

Think of it as, alternate dimension

Or place between

[mystic star]

Insidious basically?

The movie?

[main beacon]

Probably not

[mystic star]

They used that concept

The place that's in between

That's why I said is it a dark place

[main beacon]

I feel like you gotta learn the truth of Atlas to understand better

[fallow geode]

Yeah I was about to say

[mystic star]

Atlus seen it all

[main beacon]

Do you know of 16?

[mystic star]

Witnessed her death

[main beacon]

What it means?

[mystic star]

Atlus could have stopped the first spawn

16 minutes left?

Right?

That's what's the person before us had

Only 16 minutes

The one before us rejected atlus

[main beacon]

...yes, but theres more

[fallow geode]

You'll see at the end of the first part of the story

[mystic star]

I already beat the game tho tf

[main beacon]

What is Atlas?

[mystic star]

I already finished the Atlantis story

[fallow geode]

Oh

[mystic star]

That's why I'm talking about the world of glass

And the family of glass

[main beacon]

Mhm, so you know what Atlas is?

[mystic star]

A super computer right, something that's been there since the dawn

It was afraid of its own death

[main beacon]

The one that runs the simulation

[mystic star]

Yes

[main beacon]

The universe

[mystic star]

Us the player are a corrupted thing

[main beacon]

Not really

[mystic star]

Atlus tried to call them back

[main beacon]

Though the Aerons disagree

[mystic star]

That's what I read and leard that the atlus tried to copy the person but couldn't do it right

[main beacon]

16 minutes until the end of the universe, because Atlas simulates it

[mystic star]

Or it did copy them

But not an exact copy

[main beacon]

The world of glass is an essential part of Atlas' functioning

[mystic star]

Just like the purple systems we could go there

[main beacon]

No

[fallow geode]

An archive where past simulations get spirited away to

[main beacon]

It is where data goes to be stored

The dead, the destroyed

[fallow geode]

Yep, not much of an afterlife as much as a repository

[main beacon]

It is what the sentinels did before they were sentinels

[mystic star]

I wonder if there gonna show glimpses of them

[main beacon]

You also arent supposed to be able to get back from there

[mystic star]

Without void mother they are only one mind

[main beacon]

She doesnt command them

Atlas is the authority over them, but it doesnt really command them either

[mystic star]

I just read hivemind and I thought was what it meant

But she's the reason why we can't mine

[main beacon]

The sentinels are a hivemind, more connected than the korvax, but not a complete unity

[mystic star]

Well the first spawn really

Sentinels went T-1000 on everyone once Korvax Prime was destroyed

Destroyed in the main timeline, in an alternate timeline she was brought back, born anew

[main beacon]

No

She came back on her own

[mystic star]

Yalib said something like that

Yes and no

[main beacon]

No, she did

She claws her way out of the world of glass, seeping into the rest of the simulation

[mystic star]

Into the oceans

[main beacon]

Into water, into nanites, into worlds and stars

[mystic star]

In lore they make her sound bad

Like she's evil

[main beacon]

Like everything else, she is complicated

[fallow geode]

She has her motives which doesn't need to align with ours

[mystic star]

Her saying "thank you" told me otherwise

[main beacon]

I mean...

[fallow geode]

Because our motives aligned with hers at that moment

[mystic star]

I might be a jackass, but I'm not a monster

[main beacon]

I dont think Atlantid is the evil she initially seems to be

[mystic star]

Lore makes her

Same with Atlus

[main beacon]

Neither of them are evil

[mystic star]

Tbh Atlus is more so then Atlantis

[main beacon]

Atlas is scared and rarely actually interferes with the simulations

[mystic star]

Atlus seen Korvax Prime get destroyed

Over and over and over

[main beacon]

Atlas runs simulations

[fallow geode]

I mean, atlas simulated it getting destroyed

[mystic star]

Wouldn't you be pissed tho

[main beacon]

It dreams

It doesnt really interfere

When it does, its pretty rare, and often obvious

Atlas gave the Aerons physical form, even though it wasn't necessary to their functioning

[mystic star]

Like when atlus teleported me out of the atlus station without my ship? -_-

[main beacon]

Well, it dreamed it of them

I guess that one was more subconscious

[mystic star]

Seen Yalib just chilling behind me after it teleported me lol

[main beacon]

Who's yalib? Lol

[mystic star]

The big ass shell autophage??

[main beacon]

Ohh right

[fallow geode]

I think its hard to fault atlas for not interfering more in its simulation since we dont know whether it even can

[main beacon]

It can

But it generally doesnt

[fallow geode]

Only times it interferes directly, it when something enters its interface

Null, us, telamon

[main beacon]

It also saved Nal, apparently

Though maybe that was messing with the world of glass

Tbh... maybe the most it can do is speak

Outside the interfaces, it doesnt seem to do anything but send messages occasionally

[mystic star]

pokes Atlus with a stick

C'mon.. do something

[main beacon]

Literally

[fallow geode]

Maybe that was again just its subconscious

[main beacon]

It didnt even tell the sentinels to act how they are now

[mystic star]

If it's subconscious then why was Atlus lonely? It made void mother aka Korvax Prime

[main beacon]

Because its creator left it

It dreamed of another like it (which makes sense considering it helped make one)

[mystic star]

How can a machine feel fear and loneliness

[main beacon]

Because it can think

I dont think it was supposed to, but it could

[mystic star]

So Atlus is basically a very advanced AI

[main beacon]

It always was, but it wasn't supposed to be alive

[mystic star]

Yet it is

And it thinks it has a funny side too apparently

[main beacon]

And thats why it wasn't shut down

And why it was abandoned

[mystic star]

Damn, their creator gave it abandonment issues

[main beacon]

I dont think Atlas ever actually laughed

[mystic star]

It's spooky month, hopefully they do something for the family of glass and world of glass

[fallow geode]

Its capable of emotion and yet the only emotions atlas expresses are loneliness, fear, anxiety and depression. Which is kind of sad

[main beacon]

And we dont know how long it has been alone

[mystic star]

Others picked scream and panic, I chose to comfort the atlus and be calm around it

[main beacon]

Only that it has been 3 minutes since The Atlantid died

[fallow geode]

Millenia, from the remembrance logs

[mystic star]

It's witnessed stars die

[main beacon]

That would be eons

[mystic star]

I thought I read something about it viewing something like that

About it witnessing an end to a world or something

It was probably witnessing korvax primes death

[main beacon]

Yeah the logs say millennia

In simulation time, that would be like... trillions of years

I wish more would learn these stories

I'd hope it would change their minds about disliking one species or another

[karmic trout]

Change whose minds?

[young birch]

I'm trying to finish everything to get purple system acess, finishing atlas path, but i have a thing Atlas eternal that dosent want to end, is it a bug ?

[ionic basin]

Atlas eternal never ends.
I dm’d you screenshot about purple systems.

[main beacon]

Various players who decide to hate one species or another for pretty dumb reasons (at least imo)

[karmic trout]

I see, I mean lore wise I'd say all of them are morally grey and players might have various reasons for hating a particular species

[nimble quail]

Yeah but when people go off against the Gek because of their past, it's just ridiculous.

Hating someone for the crimes of their ancestors is not justified, imo. Especially if they aren't actively committing said crimes.

Like, sure, there are First Spawn loyalists/extremists among Gek-kind, and those guys can burn, but that doesn't make the species as a whole problematic. They're pretty chill.

Maybe a bit greedy, kinda like Ferengi from Star Trek, but not outright evil per se.

[karmic trout]

People need to understand nuance (tbf we need that in the real world as well), giving blanket labels and black and white generalisation doesn't help

[fallow geode]

To be fair, the main way people get information about the races is probably their plaques, and gek one is basically just the first spawn reveling in their sheer evilness

So I can see how someone would come to the conclusion that thats just what gek are

Its also one of the more interesting aspects of nms lore for me, the first spawn replaced the previous gek culture and destroyed historical records that predated them, and the lore we can get reflects that. I think there's only a single log that mentions pre first spawn history and its mainly in relation to first spawn taking over.

[karmic trout]

every lore we get is from the POV of who wrote it... there is no neutral narrator per say so all lore if you ask me should be taken with a pinch of salt

I mean if someone read just the Vy'keen saga about the Atlas, then they'd say it is evil too, whereas the Korvax keep fangirling over it

[fallow geode]

Yep, I'm just saying that with gek specifically, we only get history from first spawn period, not before it

[karmic trout]

destruction of history, tampering records, rewriting historical records is something we see tyrannical regimes do in the real world, so it is no surprise the First Spawn would do it. What is surprising though is the amount that survived which is so, so little survived, unlike the real world where we know at least to a large extent about a country's history before a major war or regime change.

[main beacon]

To be fair, the history we are talking about here is over a period we can barely comprehend. My lower estimate for these events is them happening around 3000 years ago

[karmic trout]

reminds me of Egypt's Amarna Period (as a non-violent example to keep within server rules and a relevant example given your estimate of the time since the period in question)

Context: Pharaoh Akhenaten abandoned the traditional Egyptian pantheon in 1350 BC to promote the worship of the Aten (his new devotion) and after his reign, the traditional religion was restored by his son, the famous Tutankhamun and the Amarna Period was erased from history by later Pharaohs. No one even knows where Akhenaten's tomb is, even now.

To quote Wikipedia:

Horemheb excised as much of the Amarna Period as he could from official histories and monuments, considering it an aberration. According to Horemheb's revised monuments, he directly succeeded Amenhotep III, essentially erasing 30 years of history.

So if we assume the devs took the lore logs from this as a reference and keeping with your timeframe (3000 y ago), we could assume the logs suffered the same fate. Any pre-First Spawn historical records were gutted in the thousands, colossal archives torn down and data erased. But in the real world, we know and make a somehwat educated estimate of life under the Amarna Period. Whereas in NMS, we have like 0 record of pre-First Spawn Gek life. That level of erasure is diabolical. I still believe maybe somewhere within the game files there might be logs relevant to pre-First Spawn life... But I am speculating

[main beacon]

Im fairly sure there are, even if brief ones

I was shocked when I encountered an archive with pre-hirk vy'keen literature

[karmic trout]

yeahhh and Hirk is like a god to the Vy'keen... I believe there is no way you can 100% erase something from the historical record... something, somehwere would have survived... we see this in real life on one planet... in the NMS universe, 256 galaxies are inhabited, pretty easy to hide something if someone wanted to really ensure something lived on

[dull girder]

^assuming all 256 galaxies exist in the same simulation

[main beacon]

Telamon indicates multiple simulations existing simultaneously, and each player is supposed to be the last traveller in their universe

[dull girder]

Yeah but I think most of the lore backstories for the races probably only apply to Euclid, since other galaxies are reached through resetting the simulation

From what we can read about other simulations/universes, we know things can be totally different. They don't necessarily even have Gek, Korvax or Vy'keen.

Obviously, due to gameplay limitations, all the galaxies we visit work pretty much the same and all of them pull from the same lore. But canonically, it doesn't make much sense to assume that the histories of them would all have played out exactly the same

[main beacon]

Well, they were like that, at one point

Things were far more varied before Atlas realized it was dying

I will add that I dont know what Nada's dialog is like if you reset the simulation

And generally, the various logs we get from those who do perceive multiple iterations, mention them being very similar by the time we come around

[karmic trout]

Wait, so after Eissentam, you can't jump to the 11th galaxy??

I've been traveling manually and only now half way through Hilbert

[main beacon]

No, you definitely can

[zinc pike]

Yeah but other galaxies are not other universes, all the galaxies are a part of the same universe

[main beacon]

We are told both things

Or, well, the multiple galaxies are said to be different sims

Im not entirely convinced that we are resetting the sim though

[zinc pike]

Yeah the multiple galaxies could just be different realities, each time getting created when we reset the simulation

Just to make the game easier and save your progress from the previous galaxy, you can still visit it. But lore-wise, it doesn't exist anymore. This is just an opinion

[zinc pike]

Or maybe it's like deleting the cache of an app. The app is still there, but it doesn't remember anything anymore

Explains why Nada and Polo are still there but don't remember you

And resetting the cache of an app sometimes fixes device related bugs and glitches lol, just like what happens with Atlas

[main beacon]

I think thats what the Atlas tells us, but it is capable of lying

[zinc pike]

True, but for a superintelligence who could create universes, lying doesn't make sense

Why would it need to lie when it can just rewrite realities

[main beacon]

It cant do that, really

Not as simply at least

[zinc pike]

But it created the simulation, right?

[main beacon]

It runs it

It dreams it