#About Vanish change

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

karmic viper
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Vanish was really strong before the recent changelog, so it makes sense for it to be nerfed in a way where its not immune to all damage, even if the attack hits you.

My problem with the new change is that you also get put out of vanish when you take damage. This makes assassin (mainly shadestepper whos entire kit is based on being in vanish) much more annoying to play.

I dont really mind the dps loss from missing dmg from suprise strike + ambush for some backstabs that before the changelog would. This damage loss feels deserved since it makes sense that i do less damage if i get hit, which should be relatively punishing.

The problem is in the start of most bossfights, where the goal is to get your knives. Sometimes when i dash in to spin attack, i would lose vanish by getting hit by something, not getting my knives and the downtime for me to start doing damage goes up. Maybe this is just me not being used to the changes and with time I would probably stopped being hit more while in vanish, but it feels like an archtype that a lot of people already felt was a bit clunky and had a lot of downtime became even more annoying.

This change, in addition with the satsujin change that reset marks makes shade a lot of less fun to play in my opinion and it feels like there is a lot of downtime between doing dmg now.

I get that shadestepper did and still do a lot of dmg, but i dont enjoy the direction its being nerfed or changed.

twin vessel
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i did not read the post (sorry) but you're getting downvoted into oblivion for being nut

tall lantern
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I did not read the post (sorry) but you’re getting upvoted for being about buffing assassin

topaz atlas
#

let me say again that vanish has a grace period

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people that solely abused invincibility bug will just nonstop complain but i only played like vanish bug really didn’t exist so i’m having a blast with the bug fixed
it doesn’t impact me

uncut spear
#

hi i abused the invincbility bug

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this change is ASS and this class is DEAD to me, i hope they release more bugs

steel trench
topaz atlas
#

i’m glad they fixed the bug 😁 some critiques i have on shade are useless nodes and the fact that it can’t capitalize on the marked icd with what it’s given rn

uncut spear
#

why would you be glad they fixed the bug

cosmic kernel
#

the problem is this kinda forces vanish into being something you can only use near instantaneously, and strands you with substantial vulnerability at random

uncut spear
#

i actually enjoyed being invincible mind you

topaz atlas
#

because it brought in brainless shade players

karmic viper
#

me when i gatekeep archtypes 🥀

uncut spear
#

oh so you’re an elitist

topaz atlas
#

as i said let me enlighten you on the vanish grace period, it’s there for a reason

uncut spear
#

why do archtypes need to require thinking

cosmic kernel
#

imo you should take damage, and maybe also lose surprise strike, knife creation, and other such buffs from attacking in vanish, but not get forced out of vanish

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or something of that manner

topaz atlas
#

you can get knives during that grace period AND land one backstab after that

cosmic kernel
#

shade is just too vulnerable outside of vanish

uncut spear
#

this is why the only viable playstyle is spamming the silly ability that reduces vanish cd

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or heavy melee i guess

topaz atlas
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yeah clearly

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i’ve been having a blast on heavy spell but ok

uncut spear
#

i mean fair enough

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but thats more complicated

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and god pray for you if you use wind prison

topaz atlas
#

this bug fix just makes it so that, let me say this again, you should focus on when you cast vanish and capitalize on the grace period it provides

uncut spear
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idk if people still do that actually

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i don’t get what you mean by this tbh

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i just rrr and then rll

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or wait out an attack

topaz atlas
#

vanish has a 1s period after entering it of you not getting hit out of it

uncut spear
#

ah yes

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so you’re happy because now i have to care?

topaz atlas
#

it makes a braindead archetype not as braindead anymore

uncut spear
#

that’s fine i’ll find another braindead archetype to abuse if need be

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but i do like shade

steel trench
#

make dissolution longer to make up for the bugfix imo

topaz atlas
#

i still don’t understand why disso gets involved in this bug fix

steel trench
topaz atlas
#

yeah so what

steel trench
#

makes up for the loss of having full resistance in vanish

karmic viper
true latch
steel trench
karmic viper
#

nooo hes showing u he dont need resistance, hes above using petty means like that

cyan merlin
#

least disastrous peanuts thread

topaz atlas
#

disso doesn’t need to get buffed it already does a lot

steel trench
velvet holly
#

After playing 0hrs of shade I can confidently say that you don't need invulnerability

uncut spear
#

same with the guardian major id i swear it’s both placebo

karmic viper
steel trench
uncut spear
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yeah i’m not convinced buddy

steel trench
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0.5s without the aspect on is just, why

velvet holly
topaz atlas
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so you made a post after playing shade once after the fix

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your credibility is just getting lower and lower

karmic viper
#

eerm

uncut spear
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gatekeeping having an opinion 🔥

modern fractal
#

Why are you pregnant

cyan merlin
#

🐘 💨

uncut spear
jovial belfry
#

opinions can be wrong not every opinion is worth considering

uncut spear
#

yeah like people from aeq

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i guess

steel trench
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my opinion is they keep nerfing assassin into the ground and atp only trickster is good unless you have private build #3927516 that is hyperglass and dies if tcc decides to breathe on you slightly wrong

jovial belfry
#

mb i didn’t mean to join aeq

uncut spear
#

wait did you??

karmic viper
uncut spear
#

i did NOT know that i just hate aeq

jovial belfry
#

yes i am real aeq memba

steel trench
#

on like, two daggers maybe

velvet holly
topaz atlas
#

trickster is just hella overtuned idk why it didn’t get any nerfs

jovial belfry
#

weathered nirvana oblivion grimtrap flameshot

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not a bad lineup

topaz atlas
#

also maybe consider the dt that trickster has rn

steel trench
jovial belfry
#

inferno maybe

topaz atlas
#

it has better burst potential which is weird

steel trench
#

and then theres acrobat...... assassin has 1.5 archetypes

true latch
#

acros dps is like fine

velvet holly
#

He's not a knower

topaz atlas
#

acrobat has decent dps considering that it’s flying, what

steel trench
#

(sorry i fucking loved pirouette it was so fucking fun and then they removed it)

karmic viper
#

guys i have good news, i tried out shade in tna and it seems to be pretty op?

topaz atlas
#

it’s like exactly, if not slightly better with the added burst potential

true latch
#

"did they actually make it decent" chat please present educated opinions

topaz atlas
#

it’s fused in another node

steel trench
steel trench
velvet holly
#

Are you playing it properly

steel trench
#

I would assume I was !

topaz atlas
karmic viper
steel trench
true latch
#

pirouette was lwk just the i dont know how to hover crutch

topaz atlas
#

it’s like exactly the same thing considering how you have to play acro now

true latch
#

only ever actually used if you were cheesing smth ngl

steel trench
#

or having fun*

karmic viper
#

is it cool to gatekeep archtypes now or

jovial belfry
#

yea

karmic viper
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why did 2 ppl like that spawn in my thread 😭

jovial belfry
#

don’t touch fallen that’s my pookie

steel trench
#

ye full on ritualist is actually the best archetype in the game but i wont say the tech

topaz atlas
#

i’m not gatekeeping i quite literally told you how to deal with current vanish

karmic viper
steel trench
jovial belfry
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you are gatekeeping fun by suggesting we should not revert one of the single most broken bugs in the game

modern fractal
jovial belfry
#

check your privilege

topaz atlas
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and i also explained it more down in the thread

karmic viper
#

you are gatekeeping assassins by saying you dont want braindead assassins

true latch
karmic viper
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only peaople that match your standard are allowed to play it

jovial belfry
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YOU!! are gatekeeping it by saying you like the change

steel trench
jovial belfry
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you are singlehandedly keeping them from unfixing the bug balls chopper

steel trench
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i can enter vanish and get hit out instantly so idk man

topaz atlas
#

like be fr do you just purposely ignore all the crucial details i said

karmic viper
#

yes

jovial belfry
steel trench
#

i did not ask this

topaz atlas
jovial belfry
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😭 it’s just dissolution timing that’s why i’m asking

steel trench
karmic viper
#

lowkey shade needs a nerf, wat we thinking

jovial belfry
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low key that was aura though that was awesome

steel trench
modern fractal
jovial belfry
wintry pewter
#

Actual question but does dissolution reduce the hit that takes you out of vanish or only any hits after for its duration?

topaz atlas
true latch
jovial belfry
topaz atlas
#

you’re just ignorant ig

true latch
#

brother not 5 messages earlier

jovial belfry
#

pretty good tbh

#

considering how fast spell spam shade plays it’s not bad

wintry pewter
jovial belfry
#

yes

wintry pewter
#

Or just any hits 0.5s after

jovial belfry
#

oh wait uhhh actually idk

steel trench
# true latch

why is that so bright
also its easy to miss messages when quite a few people are typing idk why you need to be rude about it

jovial belfry
topaz atlas
#

lol

wintry pewter
jovial belfry
#

actually i don’t think it does

topaz atlas
karmic viper
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what if we give vanish damage immunity when falling off platforms in tcc, meet in the middle you know

jovial belfry
topaz atlas
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it also has anti kb so you can theoretically just ignore most shit

jovial belfry
#

i actually don’t think it does i’ve been one shot in vanish when i otherwise should have lived

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like perfectly lining up with my hp sort of hits

steel trench
wintry pewter
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That would be a nice change if it isnt already a thing

topaz atlas
#

well maybe it’s because there’s this weird thing where disso sometimes doesn’t work, i’ve noticed it not show up as a buff multiple times

karmic viper
steel trench
#

ts

wintry pewter
shrewd drift
#

Its okay panda ill listen to you

steel trench
topaz atlas
jovial belfry
karmic viper
#

what if to compensate for vanish, satsujin did 300% instead

topaz atlas
#

also disso gives resistance after you exit vanish too

shrewd drift
#

🩷

shell yarrow
#

where's the mute roll giver button when you nee- actually wait did this guy seriously make a post that ISN'T trolling for once?

heavy pawn
karmic viper
wintry pewter
topaz atlas
#

i’m making vanish last as long as disso now so you KNOW when disso actually works

shrewd drift
heavy pawn
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if only vanish gave some movement buff

jovial belfry
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if only vanish lobotomized enemies and made them forget who to target

karmic viper
crisp axle
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wasnt that guy saying hp didnt matter caus they could dodge everything in the anamnesis one

heavy pawn
topaz atlas
#

what if they bring pack the lingering strength effect after leaving vanish 🤔

heavy pawn
jovial belfry
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they should make vanish consume marks

steel trench
#

bring back roving assassin bug

topaz atlas
heavy pawn
#

geniuses in chat

true latch
topaz atlas
#

man i really wanna see new shade abilities i legit have like 4 free ap

karmic viper
topaz atlas
jovial belfry
#

uh oh neuron activation

true latch
jovial belfry
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yeah and something being a stupid debuff resource is just winded 😭

topaz atlas
#

yeah shade just sucks rn because of how marks work

shell yarrow
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ok so he's still being an unreasonable mess, he's just being less so this time around

wary notch
#

the world's strongest bugfix

jovial belfry
#

ct crucified

true latch
#

maybe shade and rift are the same archetype

steel trench
#

💡

jovial belfry
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mana refund.. resource stacks on 4 consumed by 1.. amping damage based on resource mechanic.. griefed by an additional one..?! welcome back riftwalker

topaz atlas
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what if we made shade apply marks on themselves if they do damage with their smoke bomb so that it’s not aids anymore
now you and the mobs take more damage, the ultimate glass cannon archetype 💡

shrewd drift
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what if your marks could recast your spells and you could consume them to stack multiple instances of smoke bomb and we called it smokestack

karmic viper
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also something i forgot to mention in the thread, why do you lock the playstyle behind t2 shade aspect, i cant even grind for it this week since its not in rotation 😭

jovial belfry
#

why did smoke stack become the popular name i feel like chain smoker was a better name

shrewd drift
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well we can call this one chainsmoker for you

steel trench
#

What if you could have clones that always copied your spells and there was 9 clones and you and instead of shooting 1 smoke bomb we shot 3 per clone and player and instead of calling it smoke bombing we call it cherry bomb playstyle

true latch
topaz atlas
jovial belfry
#

thanks fluffy miko

steel trench
shrewd drift
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youre welcome panda monium

jovial belfry
shrewd drift
#

ritu too

jovial belfry
#

flameshot hilt as a budget build does not exist because ppl who need it don’t have aspects

karmic viper
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im 3/4 😢

topaz atlas
#

yeah i kinda dislike how shade is locked behind 4 aspects for it to be usable

jovial belfry
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don’t say that then there will be a lot of shade players if it’s not gated behind aspects

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you would lose so much aura

shrewd drift
topaz atlas
#

there’s like other aspects i would like to try out but then i would tank a dps loss

karmic viper
shrewd drift
#

Alot

topaz atlas
karmic viper
jovial belfry
#

tailor swif reputation

shrewd drift
wintry pewter
karmic viper
#

why ppl hating on nexstargaze tho, most of his posts makes sense

shrewd drift
#

💀

wintry pewter
#

For summoner arguably just lvl 1 is fine

vale canyon
warm vale
#

i cant rly compare him with nex

jovial belfry
#

you don’t need aco or ritualist arguably it’s just nice to have

true latch
warm vale
#

they are like two skyscrapers in this channel's lore

jovial belfry
#

shade is like unplayable without at least shade t2

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and knives/marks aspect

shrewd drift
wintry pewter
karmic viper
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i think aspects are to punishing for new players in general, needs to be removed

jovial belfry
wintry pewter
#

Ritu is QOL if maxed

jovial belfry
#

stacking 5 knives with 6 marks is like genuinely so horrendous

paper ember
jovial belfry
#

you can at least get away with no aspects on aco

shrewd drift
warm vale
#

it still kind of bothers me that its so goddamn ass to play without t1 mythic

im fine with locking some damage behind aspects but completely disrupting the core playstyle is terrible

karmic viper
wintry pewter
karmic viper
#

wat archtype is less impactfull than acolyte

wintry pewter
#

Compared to other archetypes

karmic viper
#

i feel like other classes needs it more tho

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acolyte aspect is only like qol i think?

wintry pewter
#

Maybe its just my bias speaking

shrewd drift
wintry pewter
#

The only shaman mythic i think is fully QOL is ritu

static prism
shrewd drift
#

hi pookie

karmic viper
#

i dont play much aco so maybe there is thats why im asking

shrewd drift
#

yes 😭

BA56B94A-C379-4FBB-83F6-3A64244FE3F9.png
wintry pewter
#

Aura speed is also cool

static prism
#

NGL I don't like totem range

shell yarrow
#

the fact the exsanguination aspect does both max bp and max bleeding duration is pretty interesting
not complaining at all though

warm vale
#

and why is that i wonder

static prism
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On aco anyways

I'm too reliant on teleporting without ECall

slow seal
wintry pewter
#

Then it will let you do blood connection easier

static prism
#

It's flying that it becomes rough

wintry pewter
#

Hold backwards in midair same thing

static prism
#

I like flying in NotG/open world

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Either way I mean, is the vanish change really that bad?

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I thought invulnerability in Vanish was a myth, cause I've had moments where I'm in vanish and an enemy who already locked onto me just chomped HP off of me anyways

karmic viper
#

unplayable 😢

static prism
#

This is ragebait right?

wintry pewter
#

🥀

wintry pewter
slow seal
#

have you ever looked at ritualist

static prism
#

Even when I play on weathered I do not rely on vanish to stay invulnerable, I just use movement spell to dodge watched

wintry pewter
#

You can charge awakened in 1-2 seconds with a lower

slow seal
#

or by qol do u mean non-dps increase

wintry pewter
#

Yes

slow seal
#

bc having longer awakened duration and faster charge time is still a dps increase

karmic viper
slow seal
#

significantly less downtime

wintry pewter
#

I used pbomber while grinding all ritualist aspects its not that terrible

static prism
#

I don't think this fix affected me in any way

slow seal
#

anyway wtv i get wym

wintry pewter
#

Its better with it but acolyte felt worse

slow seal
#

Oh yea for sure

karmic viper
#

can we put +5 winded cap on arcanist mythic as well pls 😎

warm vale
wintry pewter
slow seal
#

Yah

karmic viper
slow seal
#

Yea kinda

#

Wynn team comp meta (or lack thereof)

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Do dmg or be useless 🗣️

true latch
karmic viper
#

if i do less than 25%dmg in raid i feel useless, and when i do 26%dmg in raid i feel like my team is useless

slow seal
true latch
#

i did a whole 1m in notg yesterday

slow seal
#

Goat

cyan merlin
slow seal
karmic viper
# cyan merlin rr

ok now that you are here, fix vanish and make satsu +400% instead pls and ty

cyan merlin
karmic viper
#

wat?!

wintry pewter
karmic viper
#

holy optimal

slow seal
#

Idk there are like no instances where you are better off playing support to increase teammate dmg than just being dps yourself

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other than glue

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for killing bosses anyway

karmic viper
#

what if all paladin aspects just get nuked, thoughts?

cyan merlin
#

any content just dies

slow seal
#

I mean im not saying that i think thats good or i want to play like that, just if you want to optimize content that is how the meta is

wintry pewter
#

I just play a different shaman archetype in raids each day

slow seal
#

and i dont really think thats ideal

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but oh well

karmic viper
slow seal
#

Nope

karmic viper
#

whattt

slow seal
#

assuming you dont need a healer

cyan merlin
slow seal
#

which you really dont for bosses in this game dodging attacks is not hard

cyan merlin
#

aco does like 5 different things at once

slow seal
#

Yah idk

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i guess theres no fully support archetypes, but i suppose that is more a cause and not an effect

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of dps meta

cyan merlin
#

i dont think a full support archetype will fit in this game very well at all

wintry pewter
#

Acolyte is a pretty good support archetype

cyan merlin
#

especially since a goal of making an archetype is to allow it to at least clear content on its own

wintry pewter
#

Whats “full support” in your definition?

karmic viper
cyan merlin
#

albeit slower or faster depending on what the archetype does

wintry pewter
slow seal
cyan merlin
#

checks out

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unfortunately other parts of the game do exist and have to be considered

slow seal
static prism
#

That's just paladin

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It barely manages 100k a room

slow seal
#

Yea and thats either being glue or being useless

static prism
#

I love being useless in Wynncraft! /j

wintry pewter
slow seal
#

I suppose that would fit in, but if you are pointing to trickster then trickster in its current state is absolutely not a support archetype

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a primarily support* archetype, at least in how its used in raids

wintry pewter
#

Support for me is buff/debuff, heal, and CC

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Acolyte has allat so i think its well designed

slow seal
#

Yeah and then abso also just does 300k

wintry pewter
#

Yeah

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Well its more like 250k-300k depends on your auras hit

slow seal
#

which i think is a bit silly to be a full support archetype with decent dps, but i suppose what i want for fully support archetypes wont fit the game anyway

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since you are locked to a class on a character

wintry pewter
#

Also you only get this dps at full uptime if you’re standing still or have sufficient blood rite

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You lose enough from having to reposition

slow seal
#

Ic

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Idk im js womping bout theoreticals

wintry pewter
#

We’re stuck with the ass blood generation where when i have to follow greg jump im without beam for like seconds

slow seal
#

shatter spaunchbob shatter spaunchbob shatter spaunchbob shatter spaunchbob shatter spaunchbob

wintry pewter
#

I am often just there for the buffing/debuffing and healing while sorrow is down lol

cyan merlin
jovial belfry
#

probably not tbh

static prism
#

I wanted it to be more than that

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But I had to build it myself

It did not go well

wintry pewter
jovial belfry
#

nrly

wintry pewter
#

Is there mor full paladin options?

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I dont play warrior

jovial belfry
#

i mean we aren’t getting true full paladin bpact paladin is pretty good in general though

cyan merlin
#

fuck ass pressure emboldening tree

static prism
#

I tried to justify going full paladin equipped with Idol

And proceeded to regret that decision when I didn't want to clear LI or Qira again

#

...or buy mythics I don't make enough to afford

jovial belfry
#

i think upperscream paladin is back

wintry pewter
#

Yeah kinda just seems like paladin is just guard or do a diff archetype

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From the outside looking in

valid cedar
#

most constructive and civil nut thread...
anyway idk, I agree with dorrie on making dissolution less reliant on aspects to be good by extending it's base duration

jovial belfry
#

nah paladin can be really good

cyan merlin
jovial belfry
#

that’s why there’s not a lot of builds for it but it doesn’t mean it’s bad

karmic viper
jovial belfry
#

like mantles is single-handedly one of the most op defensive abilities in the game

wintry pewter
jovial belfry
#

paladin itself has super good synergy with fallen

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cleansing breeze mantles ssurge + enraged blow

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no corrupt we have things like bpact + rejuv skin + trumpet

cyan merlin
jovial belfry
#

it’s just like… you play with 10 second downtime and the damage is lower

heavy pawn
#

i love mantles

jovial belfry
karmic viper
#

What if axe kick and ssurge changed places, would that save fallen?

cyan merlin
jovial belfry
#

look at that tree it’s so stupid 😭

wintry pewter
jovial belfry
#

mantles is just so stupid they need to shoot it lowkenuinely

heavy pawn
#

i will mantles on surf!!

cyan merlin
heavy pawn
#

i will mantles of everthing

wintry pewter
jovial belfry
cyan merlin
jovial belfry
#

low key mantles needs like half its value at base and stronger mantles should give extra dr

cyan merlin
jovial belfry
#

also fallen tree needs real upgrades that feel good to take

cyan merlin
#

they need to make you not virtually invincible for 3 hits

jovial belfry
#

but but but they get consumed from any attack!!

heavy pawn
cyan merlin
#

WOW!

heavy pawn
#

not mantles

#

provoke

#

:3

jovial belfry
#

sry we not that degenerate in this household

uncut spear
jovial belfry
#

goodbye nia war team part 2

heavy pawn
true latch
#

also gives you half the reqs for emboldening cry which is kinda slept on ngl

knotty hull
#

I do agree that the change has made vanishing a bit more tight than I (think) was intended
Just a thought but maybe taking damage should instead of immediately unvanishing you cause you to unvanish in (insert number) seconds

velvet holly
#

i dont like that

knotty hull
#

That’s fine, just one thought on how it could be evaluated

Could additionally just lengthen the window where you can’t immediately get knocked out of it

cyan merlin
#

a big part of shade's gameplay should be getting good at utilizing vanish properly. i think people complaining about it are mostly deriving from the fact that it was so easy to use previous to this bug fix

#

satsu is in a really ridiculous state at the moment so making the class any easier to play doesn't really feel justified imo

sullen onyx
#

vanish bug was really stupid and the increased difficulty of having to play without it shouldve been what it was like before and makes the dmg a bit more justified

#

but also new satsu is really silly and this archetype is miserable to play if theres multiple shade

true latch
unique stag
#

is weathered still good or did the fix kinda ruin it

cyan merlin
unique stag
#

is there any reason to run it over other options? how well does it perform on trick?

noble tapir
#

no reason to run it on trick over other weapons

cyan merlin
sullen onyx
true latch
#

trick is the burst archetype what makes weathered nuts is the free sustain u get from major id

sullen onyx
#

on shade weathered is like the easier qol option

unique stag
cyan merlin
#

nop

unique stag
#

seems like theres still no reason to use weathered

#

big shame

cyan merlin
#

weathered is nice for qol on shade

sullen onyx
#

its the weapon i see people use the most on shade in pf

cyan merlin
#

its not bad by any means

true latch
#

ppl play weathered for the same reason they play hero

#

but ig theres no reason to use hero cuz its not the highest dps option for fallen bmonk or paladin

cyan merlin
true latch
sullen onyx
true latch
#

ill stick to hana

cyan merlin
#

-# oops

true latch
unique stag
cyan merlin
#

hana's jasmine damage is comically high

warm vale
#

hana is funnily alive

unique stag
#

thats good to hear

cyan merlin
#

that's about where it ends though. not nearly as horrible as it was a while ago

warm vale
#

id say if u dont like cata's mosquito playstyle hana is great

unique stag
#

I haven't seriously played ass for a few years but seems like there's a lot of changes

cyan merlin
#

you'd be correct

unique stag
#

acro feel good to play now?

cyan merlin
#

eh

honest moth
#

It's alright

warm vale
#

it has a way to go still

cyan merlin
#

its still a shit ton of effort for not crazy damage in return

honest moth
#

Hana's JB damage looks good though

unique stag
#

awesome sauce

warm vale
#

its pretty fun just doesnt feel rewarding enough

cyan merlin
unique stag
#

and shade got slowed down w more burst right

cyan merlin
warm vale
#

and got treated with riftwalker esque antissocial synergy

honest moth
#

I hope the MID plays around that as its gimmick

cyan merlin
#

shade needs a lot of work lol

sullen onyx
cyan merlin
#

Trickster.

sullen onyx
#

It's almost as if sustained damage is healthier than a single hit nuke

topaz atlas
honest moth
#

200% multihit damage really is something huh

warm vale
#

satsu is the nuclear blast and trickster was the inner blast radius in the seconds that follow

cyan merlin
#

satsu's damage is so unreasonably excessive lol

#

like i dont think the numbers were tested very well for that imma be completely real

honest moth
#

Well, hey, it fits the burst identity now!

warm vale
#

when is a high number ever properly tested

honest moth
#

It was always the vision.

true latch
#

i mean lets be honest for shade to be heavier and competitive that needs to do more damage for it to be worth it

honest moth
#

I'm thinking they may move it towards heavy spell

cyan merlin
warm vale
#

it would work if the rest did less dps

true latch
#

yeah if shade takes like 4s to do a 1m damage hit thats still like burger dps

cyan merlin
karmic viper
#

i just do satsujin at 4 marks since the time for it to get to 9 marks is not worth waiting for

warm vale
#

🥀

cyan merlin
#

did not know that previously lol

warm vale
#

private build not sharing moment

karmic viper
#

its not rewarding at all to do 9 marks satsu for dps

sullen onyx
honest moth
unique stag
honest moth
#

It was as planned as usual?

cyan merlin
honest moth
#

You guys should shush because they'll add more dr to parasite

warm vale
#

adding the dr to the wrong part of the fight 😭

sullen onyx
cyan merlin
honest moth
#

Don't knives also contribute to the damage

warm vale
#

well yea they're a big part of it

honest moth
#

Yeah so the dr still applies in time

warm vale
#

thats why your damage isnt instant 1 tick

topaz atlas
#

no dr applies before knives actually get the hit i think

#

unless dr doesn’t instantly apply because of some goofy code idk

sullen onyx
#

Satsus downside (aside from removing marks) is it having a 15 (10 with aspect) CD except this isn't a real downside in two of the raids because there's phase transitions and it's possible for the first satsu to do half of the phases health

topaz atlas
#

“Removed Satsujin Cooldown on the mythic aspect, replaced it with Death Magnet radius”

cyan merlin
#

i dont really like satsu eating marks

karmic viper
#

🤯

#

gameplay loop if you dont have ragni ball

#

put marks -> get knives -> put marks -> satusjin -> put marks -> cycle backstab

cyan merlin
#

too much mark application

karmic viper
#

it takes 10 seconds to proc satsujin at 4 marks

#

unless spin attack

topaz atlas
#

satsu should be a global cd and make it so that sandbagging reduces it 🥰

cyan merlin
#

satsu is still mad clunky with how it activates too right

#

or did they change stuff i forgot

topaz atlas
#

idk satsu needs a lot of work because it’s also kinda tilting that your satsu procs without some of the major damage applications

cyan merlin
#

that answers that

topaz atlas
sullen onyx
cyan merlin
#

yeah thats unfavourably clunky

topaz atlas
#

that too

karmic viper
#

wind powder auxetic capacitor cata, thoughts?

topaz atlas
#

like at the very least i’d like an indicator for the cd

cyan merlin
topaz atlas
#

that would solve like most problems

cyan merlin
#

that totem tick is gonna do SO much damage

karmic viper
sullen onyx
# cyan merlin yeah thats unfavourably clunky

So unless you are counting or keeping track of the CD through something else the only ones you can be 100% sure are a satsu are the very first one and after intermissions like sun phase and watched

karmic viper
topaz atlas
#

do client side glowing effects work? or is that outside of wynns control

karmic viper
#

if u have smokebomb at all times

sullen onyx
#

Smoke bomb is 2 marks a second

topaz atlas
sullen onyx
#

Smoke ticks every .5 sec

karmic viper
topaz atlas
karmic viper
#

steal marks with spin first time it gets to 9 marks, and then next time its 9 marks you know its of cd

topaz atlas
#

remove the satsu cd from the aspect and make it so that for every mark you consume from satsu, reduces the cd for it at max 5s 😁
boom shade aspect is now less impactful

#

0.6s every mark then rounded down so exactly 5s

royal cobalt
#

Peanut is forever cursed in feedback threads

oak viper
#

I stand with pnut🫡

shy citrus
viral epoch
#

vanish honestly was wayyy too strong and now it's actually balanced, though I'll miss running at super speed around orphions arena

mild oar
#

bro is complaining that his bug abuse got nerfed, and saying that "oh no im taking damage while invisible" its literally called invisibility not invincibility get it right

karmic viper
#

Lets not start making things up

heavy pawn
#

😭 ✌️

karmic viper
#

Ok if u wna missunderstand what i mean purposfully

#

There is no point in talking to you

heavy pawn
#

how am i meant to make jokes when you write them for me

karmic viper
#

Im not complaining about taking damage in vanish

cyan merlin
karmic viper
#

Where I said, it makes sense ur not immune to damage

cyan merlin
#

im just saying its easy for peopel to interpret you complaining about taking damage in vanish from what beetown quoted and then you just say its purposefully misunderstanding the point

karmic viper
#

Pls read first sentance of my post

cyan merlin
#

you already dont have a great rep with your posts and sayign stuff like that does not help

topaz atlas
karmic viper
cyan merlin
#

Pls read first sentance of my post

karmic viper
#

Wat does it say

heavy pawn
#

the second sentence of ur post is basically saying remove the intended behaviour 😭

topaz atlas
#

main idea is that you get pushed out of vanish, not taking damage, he dgaf about the damage only the fact that a hit as small as 1 damage can kick you out of vanish

heavy pawn
#

like

#

its kinda crazy

#

how

cyan merlin
karmic viper
#

Like cf is all about

#

Or what?

cyan merlin
#

generally speaking vanish should be something skillful. getting hit should be punishing if youre already in a state where its really difficult to get hit in the first place and you have benefits off of what you do next

#

aside from bugs preventing intended behaviour, vanish has consistently worked this way for many years

heavy pawn
#

that too

topaz atlas
#

what if vanish was like sandbagging, where you need to take a certain amount of damage for you to get kicked out?

heavy pawn
#

the damage is 1 💡

cyan merlin
#

^

karmic viper
# heavy pawn that too

Can you explain what i did wrong tho, am I not supposed to give feedback on a mechanic even if its intended?

cyan merlin
#

vanish is strong enough as is. you dont have mob aggro permanently during it

karmic viper
#

What was crazy about it

wary notch
#

the concept of dodging an attack boggles the new era of wynn player

karmic viper
heavy pawn
#

its giving complaining about the bug fix

karmic viper
#

I say the buggfix make sense in the fact that you lose HP while damaged, lose dps cuz losing suprise strike, but already clunky playstyle got worse

cyan merlin
#

its fair to criticize shade for its... not great playstyle, but accusing vanish's properties as a culprit is not really the move imo

#

there are way more things than that that contribute to shade not feeling great

karmic viper
#

Yes, what you are comming with is arguments that I can follow and agree with

#

What beetown is doing is just saying the thread shouldnt exist

royal cobalt
karmic viper
#

I dont think he likes me 😖

#

@swift cape do you think beetowns behaviour in this thread was appropiate? Felt a bit toxic to me

spiral citrus
#

free peanutsyeah

karmic viper
shell yarrow
#

this post was surprisingly valid, at least in some part
you have garnered a reputation as a troll here, and you do be paying for that with this post lol

#

a sizeable chunk of people actively don't even want to give you a chance right now

royal cobalt
#

whatever he says and u dont like should be reported towards their superiors isntead of another mod 😭

karmic viper
#

I dont want to report him, but enderclaw is the one who handled my unmute and he did it good and respectfully

#

So I want to hear what he thinks 🥺

royal cobalt
viral epoch
#

it's kinda insane how you get unmuted and instantly go back to ragebaiting

royal cobalt
shell yarrow
#

granted I still think it's a questionable take...
scratch that, I actually agree with the main idea, but the way he's gone about it sucks hard

wintry pewter
viral epoch
#

the ability works how it always should have

shell yarrow
#

that is what I agree with

wintry pewter
shell yarrow
#

invuln bug should've been patched far sooner than it was lol

wintry pewter
#

Longer actually idk

wary notch
#

it was a very difficult thing to fix iirc

swift cape
#

prob not best to dwell on it if you are just honest

jovial belfry
#

beetown should die for his sins

shell yarrow
#

how do you crucify a bee

wary notch
#

carefully

jovial belfry
#

@heavy pawn /kill for your sins

karmic viper
viral epoch
#

the whole thing of you being unable to targeted is really strong since most area attacks are super avoidable

you used to be able to chill inside of the black hole with vanish which felt odd

wintry pewter
#

What about the rest of the bees in beetown?

swift cape
#

those who off topic
is there anything else to discuss

wintry pewter
#

Last

viral epoch
shell yarrow
shell yarrow
jovial belfry
#

it’s been around since like 1.20

#

definitely remember cheesing a lot with vanish back in the day

terse brook
#

is crucifying a bee on topic with "about vanish change" mmmm

viral epoch
#

lowkey the aggro system should have been totally reworked but anyway

shell yarrow
wintry pewter
viral epoch
shell yarrow
#

what english king was it again that was mentally ill to the point he crucified a rat in his bedroom

heavy pawn
#

i think we are being mightily off topic here

shell yarrow
#

half and half
half and half

wintry pewter
#

Last

shell yarrow
#

Vanish bug being patched was a good thing for the game overall

terse brook
#

idk this post seems alright, i am probably not gonna touch my ex fav archetype ever again but hmelee archer takes its place for now

slender horizon
#

if Peanuts got 32 likes, maybe hes onto something

topaz atlas
#

idk current vanish is fine because you’re not in a 5s state of “oh nothing can target me regardless of me taking damage” now which shouldn’t ever be the case
vanish should just be treated as something that you need to use as a tool to deal damage at the right moment.
it’s kind of insane to think that the consideration of vanish giving you basically a free deaggro mechanic where the only punishment is you just, taking damage in it but still having all mobs ignore you

#

oh also forgot to mention that vanish already has like a 1s grace period for you to like act fast without actually getting kicked out

#

which from actual experience is pretty nice

viral epoch
#

this bug being fixed is a good thing actually

shell yarrow
#

for the game yes
tell that to everyone who abused the bug to hell and back

royal cobalt
swift cape
#

hi mochi

royal cobalt
tall lantern
verbal basin
topaz atlas
#

that’s just not possible

viral epoch
#

it is

topaz atlas
#

enlighten me on how it is

viral epoch
#

it's how the effect works - attacks that were targeted on you before you vanish still occur, you used to be not hit from it but now you are

topaz atlas
#

if you got hit by an attack after casting vanish that was targeting you before vanish, you wouldn’t get kicked out of vanish because you still have a 1s period of you not being able to instantly be taken out of vanish

#

And also, you have shadow travel to dodge those attacks if those targeted attacks were to be over one second late on hitting you, you have plenty of time and speed to do so

viral epoch
topaz atlas
#

if you have nothing of value to say anymore then i suggest you don’t reply back

viral epoch
#

not all attacks are instant 😭

#

like tna skulls

topaz atlas
#

if you’re struggling on tna skulls then you have a different problem at hand

viral epoch
#

what

#

it's not about struggling, it's about the duration and targeting of the attack

if you're struggling to decern that... I don't know how to say this but you desperately need some self reflection

topaz atlas
#

And if you are complaining about how tna skulls target players, then god really needs to help you

viral epoch
#

Dude what is your issue

topaz atlas
viral epoch
#

You kinda have to because you're horrible at explanation

#

I don't know why you're upset vanish has been fixed - you just have to adapt and dodge now

topaz atlas
#

lol if you think i’m upset at vanish being fixed, you’re miles away from my points, i’m afraid

viral epoch
#

Then why are you upset about it, you're not very good at hiding your frustrations with the change

topaz atlas
#

my past messages in this thread will quickly debunk your recent claims, i will give you some time for you to digest them thoroughly and make sure that you clear your head of these misconceptions

#

until then, i won’t waste anymore time with you

viral epoch
#

At least you know when to back down I'll give you that

topaz atlas
#

Ignorance creates many unnecessary problems, and you are showing a great example of this

paper ember
viral epoch
#

I've asked you to stop

wintry pewter
#

Holy smokes the thread is still tied

split adder
#

in like tcc i do like only a portion of the dmg cus i need to constantly look back die more and i need to change places which takes away a lot of dmg almost halfing mine

#

no it is halfing my dmg more than that lol

topaz atlas
#

my face when a gamebreaking bug is fixed and i can’t abuse it anymore

#

🤪

void lily
#

ok but does dodging an attack count as not getting hit for vanish