Warp and Slayer HPR Nerfs are wayy too harsh

[lost phoenix]

You read the title, now let me explain the reasons on why and what are the things that might have caused this, and the impact this will have

Why are Warp and Slayer nerfs harsh?

• These nerfs are NOT a blanket nerf, a lot of people might believe that these nerfs were a result of the blanket hpr changes that are occuring, you'd be wrong on this end however. Why is that? Well,
  for slayer
  Raw Health Regeneration: -270 -> -400
  and for warp
  Raw Health Regeneration: -450 -> -650
  This is much higher than the 25% maximum range we were given in the patch notes, in fact, this is a 48% nerf and a 44% nerf respectively to their health regen raw
  That is huge
• These changes make it impossible for a to cancel the health regen from warp and slayer. An argument could be made that the intended way to play these two items is to loose hp and not cancel at all, which is.... very disconnected from the actual player experience to say the least. The game becomes much more unfun and difficult when you are slowly loosing your hp every so often and have no way of gaining it back.
• Casual players are affected in a much much MUCH worse manner than a competitive player, it was already difficult for them to cancel out the hpr for warp and slayer, but with this change, it will be nigh impossible to use slayer and warp for a casual player in general, due to the extremely high investment that's gonna be needed (hpr tomes, good rolls on both, which is already extremely difficult, and ofcourse calcing the exact hpr is not easy for a casual player)
• Slayer in particular is not that deserved especially, power wise it was already not the strongest but it was a fun and popular option, this sort of just showed that popularity is a bigger factor in balance, which is not a good look in my opinion.

What could have caused this?

• I also want to discuss what could have caused this nerf to happen, and why that may or may not be a good thing
• Starting off with my main concern here, that is bias. This change feels like it's made out of dislike towardshpr cancel (warp, fatal, quetz) and overall makes it feel like that they targetted these items because they had a particular dislike against hpr cancelling meta. I have one thing to say about this, please do not mix personal dislikes into balance. Do not let your disdain for meta blind you please.
• So a reason that is used is that it's not intended for hpr cancel on warp or slayer to be easy, a simple and easy counter is, please stop using the top end of playerbase as your reference for what's easy and what's not, they have enough money and enough investment to be able to cancel hpr but a casual player does not. More importantly, a lot builds on wynnbuilders look like they can cancel the hpr of slayer and warp easily, but in actual practicality, it takes a lot of money investment and difficulty to do so, so no, cancelling the hpr of warp and slayer was not easy to begin with, so this just comes off as a very disconnected change overall.

What impacts will this have?

• For those who hate warp with a burning passion, it will stay. I am sorry to break it to you, but people will still find ways to play it, BUT it will become much less accessible for newer and more casual players to use it in combat, thus increasing the gap between the top end tryhard and a casual, five steps forward in reducing the gap, and then ten steps back.
• For slayer, it's done. Quetzalcoatl builds will switch to revenant and fatal builds loose 40% walk speed or 3k meteor damage, pick your poison (this does not combine well with the arcanist nerf, which was deserved but this isn't)
• Warps will be even more expensive now since the value of a high roll hpr will go up
• Warp and slayer were the qol options instead of the dmg meta options, all this has effectively done is reduce their qol, making it less incentive to play them.
• HPR tomes are gonna be even more essential now, making a new player experience even worse

So Tl;Dr -

• These changes are not a blanket nerf, they're an overnerf for warp and slayer
• This feels like a biased change, and biased balancing is not good. Also feels disconnected from the actual player experience
• This severely worsens the experience for a casual player
• This feels forced, in the sense that someone did not like these two items and want to force players not to play them.

What could be done?

• Reduce slayer (and potentially warp) hpr to be the same blanket change as every other hpr item

[shadow shard]

Warp should be nerfed more, slayer idc

[lost phoenix]

thanks for constructive response

[shadow shard]

I am helpful, your welcome!

[lost phoenix]

my main gripe honestly is how slayer is handled

[tough bloom]

gaia should be nerfed and warp buffed

[lost phoenix]

warp can be an expensive mythic and be more tryhard focused for all I care but slayer was a good item used by casual player and got really badly handled

[barren marlin]

Lowkey shoulda gotten a dmg nerf and called it a day

[lost phoenix]

making it less accessible to newer players was not the solution 🥀

[barren marlin]

The rich get richer ahh nerf

[normal geode]

Great thread very true

But they will not listen so ur just talking like this

https://tenor.com/view/speak-gif-9578947274896178319

[lost phoenix]

ty, this change feels like a net negative to the game, it's player experience and it's economy, and I feel like I should atleast spread awareness if feedback is mostly ignored

[sinful herald]

https://tenor.com/view/but-heres-the-kicker-cat-gif-26549137

Slayer really wasn't that problematic

[lost phoenix]

yeah, this really feels like a grudge against hpr cancelling an item with -hpr

[normal geode]

I mean yea it’s the same shit they did with fallen, where they did massive nerfs and then did a slap on the face at the end just to make sure it’s dead

[proud meteor]

slayer shouldve been -320 or -325 and warp shouldve been -550 imo

it would be a bit above the 10-20% but nothing crazy

[lost phoenix]

it should've been dealt a blanket nerf, not a personal nerf

[normal geode]

I also think it’s funny as fuck that they announced HPR “buffs” and then hid these changes away in some huge pastebin

Almost seems like they were tryna hide it to avoid backlash

[proud meteor]

and then didnt even include contrast changes 🔥

[normal geode]

Also they nerfed hpr tomes hard a couple months back and now buff every hpr item but dont revert tomes??

[olive blade]

it doesn't say anywhere it's a buff

[proud meteor]

tbf i understand that part they want tomes to be less powerful

but "tomes isnt an item" is kinda funny

[normal geode]

Idk man this sounds like a buff to me

[lost phoenix]

that's why I never phrased it like that in the initial message either yeah

called it "changes" instead

[olive blade]

it literally doesn't say buff anywhere in there that's your own interpretation of the word increase

[normal geode]

In what world does increase not mean buff in this context

[olive blade]

when you multiply all sources of hpr by X% you also increase negative hpr by that amount

[blissful grotto]

increase means the numbers go up that’s not an interpretation, in some cases here the numbers went down

[orchid gulch]

it doesn't say buff but it is kinda misleading

well said sugo btw!

[olive blade]

I can agree it can be misleading but claiming that it's stated as a buff is false

[blissful grotto]

it is

[lost phoenix]

ty, also let's not argue semantics and look at the core issue about slayer becoming nigh unusable for a casual player btw

[proud meteor]

yeah its not a buff its more of a this stat will be a bit more noticable

[normal geode]

99% of players would interpret it as a buff

[blissful grotto]

and increase implies its increased

[proud meteor]

but then warp and slayer just got nerfed so much more for no reason

not saying warp didnt need a nerf but this is a bit too much

[normal geode]

The IMs realllyy don’t like certain items and it shows

[cloud acorn]

me when the overperforming item is nerfed 🤯

[normal geode]

Yea bro slayer was overperforming so hard

[lost phoenix]

I would'nt go as far as saying slayer was overperforming when it's main usage were two builds

and was already pretty difficult to cancel out for a more casual player than someone who has a lot of money to throw

[orchid gulch]

YES, i hate the slayer nerf. it's -hpr was already quite terrible for casual players (who cannot afford a 80+ or 90+ hpr roll) making them go for other alts...

the devs struggle to understand that what is meta isn't something a random player can shit out of their pants easily access and play

[normal geode]

If they just nerfed slayer and warp but to a lesser scale it would’ve been fine

[lost phoenix]

^^^^ it's just the specific targetting that sorta was the ick for me

[proud meteor]

slayer is not overperforming and warp nerf was too harsh

[normal geode]

Slayer catching strays for no reason

[blissful grotto]

grandmother catching strays

[cloud acorn]

i actually have no idea how good both mythics were im just assuming thats why they got touched extra hard and got their downsides to be noticeable 😇

[tough bloom]

tbh slayer just got caught in the cross fire and warp just got stabed randomly

[proud meteor]

gma's nerf has 0 effect

hpr% cancelling is way better anyways

[blissful grotto]

real?

[lost phoenix]

gma nerf is irrelevant here it's hpr % cancelled not raw cancelled

[normal geode]

I think they’re gonna kill hpr% cancelling soon because it seems like it’d be something they’re against

[flat kraken]

It just hurts the small minority of gma raw cancel players ☹️

[abstract grove]

I want to argue against the "meta bias" thing here, cause it's a real tug-of-war between thoughts. IMs get asked so much to look at the meta when doing things including dismantling metas, but then as soon as metas are taken into account like this it's all hate and "bias" accusations

[orchid gulch]

personally, i don't mind the warp hpr nerf. . . i don't think it was ever meant to be an arcanist weapon and the -hpr will infact buff players when playing lightbender and having little effect w/rift

[proud meteor]

???????? it has -heff

it is the perfect arcanist weapon

[normal geode]

The problem is it feels like all u guys do is nerf the meta shit while not buffing the underperforming stuff, so it makes the playerbase unhappy

[abstract grove]

when they want to nerf something they get asked to do snall nerfs to see how it goes and then that happens and people complain about a persistent string of small nerfs

[cloud acorn]

underperfoming shit not buffed when this patch literally buffed exploding and hpr/ls(although not buffed as hard as warp got nerfed but stil)

[normal geode]

Ngl I’ve never seen anyone complain about small nerfs

[proud meteor]

theres a difference between people complaining and being wrong (small nerfs) and people complaining and being right (this case)

[abstract grove]

when people say to just rip the bandaid off and do it all at once and they do, people drop the item like a hot potato and complain the nerf was too sudden, too big

[proud meteor]

theres always going to be people complaining because they may just not understand how the game works

[barren marlin]

No hate gang this sounds like mental gymnastics

[proud meteor]

i think big nerfs are fine but history shows that theres almost never been compensation once its realised that the nerf was too much

[normal geode]

^^^^ this

[proud meteor]

cough cough bmonk

[sinful herald]

Because it is too big, even if the -200 hpr nerf came in small installments it would've been. It's not how many patches the nerfs came in it's just that the nerfs were too much

[tough bloom]

hows bmonk doing btw

[cloud acorn]

idol pre 2.1....

[normal geode]

Wdym bro they slightly buffed thunderclap like twice

[fiery silo]

😬

[proud meteor]

its doing

[tough bloom]

died i suppose?

[blissful grotto]

the more hero nerfs the closer idol is to coming back trust

[normal geode]

https://tenor.com/view/dead-my-honest-reaction-damn-skull-skeleton-gif-15885937969029652188

[flat kraken]

Like 200k dps

It’s subjective

[barren marlin]

Slayer nerf lowkey tm

[cloud acorn]

might as well morph hive weapon

[normal geode]

Bmonk is not hitting 200k dps LOL

[abstract grove]

this just straight up isnt the case with so so so many different items- nerfs just get more player attention than buffs. the bias feels much more on the player side here

[barren marlin]

Was it really doing allat

[tough bloom]

also they just nerfed warp the patch before this

[reef condor]

id love to see that build

[lost phoenix]

that is sort of what the "meta bias" means, when people say look at meta when doing things, they generally don't mean dismantling but more so acknowledging, as in not to completely gut a meta build into being unusable, similar to what you said, about hot potato, basically the term "disconnected" stems from changes to meta or a better term would be "popular" items and builds that make it much much worse in comparison and does not feel like it was done carefully

[orchid gulch]

i see where you guys come from... however, a much better approch that will be much healthier for the game is to buff weak items such as grimtrap, nulli, and convergence to name a few.

i know many of them are not meant to be dps items, however the dps you lose is not worth it for the sustain/ehp you gain.

this should help the massive price differences in the economy as well...

[tough bloom]

nah morph theeye weapons is the way to go

[cloud acorn]

moroph the nothing my belvoed

[fiery silo]

HPR nerfs overall are more annoying thank actually meaningful... it's a bit of a shame to see the HPR be the main thing these nerfs focus on, let alone to the extent that they go with these nerfs

[flat kraken]

I was literally using everything on the monk tree, including flying kick to get that 😭

[tough bloom]

eyyy

[flat kraken]

And ssurge

[barren marlin]

Yeah

[proud meteor]

ok lets come back in 2 weeks and see if slayer and warp will get some compensation back

[lost phoenix]

all these hpr nerfs really do is make it harder for someone who's not the top 1% to make said builds

[barren marlin]

Coulda just reduced the dps ngl

[orchid gulch]

additionally, many times these "meta" items are not meta. for example, warp/hero don't outdps alts like bb/fatal but rather are just simply popular for the qol...

[lost phoenix]

this and rally change both

[normal geode]

They alrdy did, then did this change

[barren marlin]

I think my issue is this is a very big rich grt richer type ordeal

[barren marlin]

Again

[tough bloom]

at this point i think ill play morph the nothing to avoid nerfs

[proud meteor]

also for slayer, this was just an above average item, and only good for non meta builds so why was it nerfed so much?

[orchid gulch]

ya very true

[flat kraken]

That would’ve had a larger impact I think cuz rn u lose some spell dmg and str dex for some green opals lol

[normal geode]

Yeah like I was hoping there’d be some fallen compensation buffs this patch

[cloud acorn]

combat warp was never really meant to exist anyway but its here so might as well just let it happen by adding more -hpr and build into the identity of slightly bigger dmg stick with actually noticeaable -hpr -mr

reposting this from the other thread

[fiery silo]

for slayer they couldve reduced the HP or walk speed just so that there's less value for using it in areas that aren't the bigger stats

[tough bloom]

who added a 10 second timer lmao

[flat kraken]

Always been there

[tough bloom]

o im blind then

[barren marlin]

My main concern is you have to get a much better roll now

[lost phoenix]

what did slayer do bro I get warp but slayer is just catching a stray here 😭

[pastel rivet]

new meta is 4x ivory tusk accessories
these nerfs are light!

[barren marlin]

I.e the rich get richer type shir

[proud meteor]

slayer was fine

[flat kraken]

Surely the contrast buffs can cover tho

[fiery silo]

i agree but if it has to be nerfed then that's how i think it'd be best

[barren marlin]

Im like robin hood ykwim

[flat kraken]

If not just slap on more green opals 💀

[barren marlin]

The unknown contrast buffs

[steady hollow]

Warp nerf might be understable but Slayer nerf is kinda questionable

[tough bloom]

its gonna need 100% roll on -hpr to it to be good (not die every 2 seconds)

[cloud acorn]

they decided to make its downside more noticeable instead of being cancellable with tomes i sucrose
idk if it was desrved havent built anyhting ina while

[barren marlin]

Also dont say crafted because again, THE RICH GET RICHER

[proud meteor]

well it shouldve just been the 10-20% hpr change along with everything else

[crude drift]

saw ct member say 140 iirc

[proud meteor]

i can tell you rn that big of a nerf was not deserved

[fiery silo]

slayer did nothing wrong, it just enabled cool builds to exist.

hardly any, if any at all, of the slayer build that exist rn are breaking any barriers

[tough bloom]

also that contrast nerf

[lost phoenix]

which brings me to this point I said

"An argument could be made that the intended way to play these two items is to loose hp and not cancel at all, which is.... very disconnected from the actual player experience to say the least. The game becomes much more unfun and difficult when you are slowly loosing your hp every so often and have no way of gaining it back."

[proud meteor]

140 hpr 200 ls

[abstract grove]

not really a great example here. you're operating under the assumption that a reversion is necessary before even feeling how the changes will be, and so that full reversion is necessary or otherwise power increases are needed when the point was to make them weaker... I'm not an IM anymore so i cant speak for all the logic but i feel like while the reaction is understandable it's also super overblown- the immediate conspiracizing isnt a good look on anyone

[barren marlin]

Lol ???

[flat kraken]

Icl I haven’t seen uncrafted warp in a very long time

[barren marlin]

Thats it

[pastel rivet]

the downside was using slayer

[twin whale]

i think its chill for warp to get nerfed, even touch hpr im fine, but like -160 for max hpr is fucked

[barren marlin]

I have a ton

[orchid gulch]

i def see how this could create tension between players/devs, and the main reason these nerfs get more attention are because they break builds. these buffs that are added are quite small and don't affect the game much to get noticed.

also yall nerf shit like the dmg ignis bruh ;-;

[barren marlin]

Especially in pfinder

[tough bloom]

meet me

[fiery silo]

in terms of smaller changes like HPR, there isn't really much of a need to feel things out when it comes to making changes on them.

[proud meteor]

now you will because how else do you cancel hpr

[twin whale]

hpr ring

[steady hollow]

Ngl, Champion hiding armor is actually working

[proud meteor]

its very easy to just put all the new changes into custom wynnbuilder items and see the new numbers

[barren marlin]

The system is against the poor!

[lost phoenix]

btw this is extremely true

[fiery silo]

it's incredibly easy to tell how much the Warp and SLayer HPR changes will affect builds

[cloud acorn]

i meant that im assuming they want you to build some hpr alongside tomes to cancell it if u want besides being able to ignore the downside by using hpr tomes
thats mroe of just an item identity/design issue i guess

[steady hollow]

Showing off builds probably a bad thing nowsaday

[proud meteor]

yeah the best use of slayer was on like fucking riftwalker

[twin whale]

the fix to warp's new hpr issue is using crafted, which ct's are not a fan of

[barren marlin]

Maybe this can be fixed by reducing the hpr range?

[proud meteor]

cant believe my quetz rw got nerfed more (in the past few patches) than warp arca did 😭

[flat kraken]

U need like 3-4 more opals in crafts now so either u switch to Uncrafted for spend a few stx recrafting everything…

☹️

[lost phoenix]

and this, these sorts of changes are another reason why people gatekeep and prevent popularity, cuz

Slayer was not that strong, it enabled cool builds but it was not the peak nor the best, yet it became popular and here we are.

[fiery silo]

it allows a lot of builds to sustain better and it makes them super unique in their way of being built. seeing it get nerfed in terms of its buildability via forced into building more HPR is so lame

[orchid gulch]

this also sucks with nerfs :(

[blissful grotto]

no

[reef condor]

uncrafted isnt gonna work anymore

[young jolt]

guys should i buy a trance now or wait until the patch happens

[barren marlin]

Ill buy you one dw

[twin whale]

uncrafted warp is basically just gonna be aquamarine

[blissful grotto]

warp arca can’t even get 35 winded anymore that’s like a third of the dps gone or something

[tough bloom]

you should get it from a anni drop lul

[orchid gulch]

YES THIS IS SO TRUE...
GATEKEEPING CULTURE IS BECAUSE PLAYERS ARE AFRAID MAN ;-;

[twin whale]

for a really good warp too

[young jolt]

i still dont have cache after playing for 10 months bro help

[flat kraken]

Skikibidibladnir and aquamarine are probably going to be buffed enough for it to work

[lost phoenix]

might wanna delete this before someone connects the dot and this leads to harassment btw

[crude drift]

i think it got nerfed this patch overall ngl
havent done proper math just basic maths and thought it over

[barren marlin]

Skriptz got his today u suck

[young jolt]

who is skriptz?

[cloud acorn]

???????????

[barren marlin]

Idk who is he

[gilded niche]

I should really check how many arcanist builds had slayer
because if there was one item that I felt like I saw more often than not...

[lost phoenix]

delete the screenshot bro it's gonna end up badly..

[cloud acorn]

i may be sleep deprivfed but i dont see how that is harassment..

[olive blade]

wgat

[fiery silo]

i very rarely share my builds because i just dont want them to get nerfed in this massive wave of harmless builds being destroyed by collateral to kill other builds

[barren marlin]

This is a classic case of the rich get richer and now uncrafted players are suffering

[tough bloom]

how is that message gonna lead to harrasment?

[lost phoenix]

it's not, but it can lead to it

[flat kraken]

Indeed

[cloud acorn]

????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

[normal geode]

Some fatal and a couple quetz builds had it, that’s it

[twin whale]

i just dont think ct's realize how much people absolutely hate playing with -hpr

[lost phoenix]

it shows who is behind the warp changes. I dont think it's a good idea to show that....

[normal geode]

They don’t play the game so they wouldn’t know

[twin whale]

lootrunning arcanist -hpr is fucking hell, and its not like warp is good enough damage to show for that

[tough bloom]

just ||aaa|| it

[fiery silo]

i used it on bbath for upperbash, was rly fun

[flat kraken]

Quetz has the revenant build so it’s less impacted

[young jolt]

are the nerfs that bad tho

[orchid gulch]

very much an issue. i agree

[swift prism]

Shit like remanent of the ruined rings already cost like 1 stx total 🔥

[flat kraken]

It’s mostly just needing to recraft ur accessories in crafted warp

[barren marlin]

They are making the rich richer this is so sad

[flat kraken]

To add a few more green opals ☹️

[normal geode]

He asked abt arcanist

[lost phoenix]

yes.

[barren marlin]

All the poor wynn player cannot play warp anymore

[fiery silo]

ah

[proud meteor]

the only reason you would run slayer is if you couldnt afford an arca warp

[young jolt]

i mean surely it cant be worse than pot fallen right?

[lost phoenix]

warp is whatever you can fix it with crafteds, but slayer...

[barren marlin]

Nah nun worse than that

[proud meteor]

so you had to use slayer fatal/quetz

[fiery silo]

that was as brutal as it could get

[twin whale]

id rather warp get a damage nerf than a hpr nerf

[barren marlin]

Nothing will top insane potion crutch gameplay loop

[barren marlin]

Ong

[flat kraken]

Sparkling plate for fatal and just swap to rev on quetz 🤷‍♂️

[lost phoenix]

-40 ws
-slayer

[barren marlin]

How much is revenant unid

[lost phoenix]

remember what selvut said earlier, hot potato with items

[orchid gulch]

why kill slayer entirely then?

[flat kraken]

Idk

[fiery silo]

sacrificing a chestplate to compensate for not having negative HPR kills any build

[gilded niche]

aries echoes abyss imbued revenant quetza
only the finest

[barren marlin]

The rich get richer

[twin whale]

also ill say it these threads will do absolutelt nothing, we are all here just to complain

[pastel rivet]

these are lookin pretty good rn

[orchid gulch]

anyway speaking of buy my rev

[fiery silo]

-30 str 🤮

[normal geode]

Yep

[barren marlin]

They never do anything

[young jolt]

whats the best hpr roll you can get on warp after the changes

[flat kraken]

Based on what u showed me today 5k meteor doesn’t seem that bad

[twin whale]

i dont think i've seen ct's back down on a change

[barren marlin]

Idfk

[flat kraken]

There’s probably a work around

[normal geode]

The only good IM is linny, she actually listens to feedback

[steady hollow]

Previously, I don't mind about showing/sharing people knowledge of class building for newer players. Now, I can't show to anyone because it'll become popular and the nerf hammer will dangle on my head then I have to start over again.

[proud meteor]

-455

[flat kraken]

Sparkling is just the first idea

[barren marlin]

There

[proud meteor]

and slayer is -280

[lost phoenix]

my condolences, another one to the tryhard gatekeeping pit

[steady hollow]

I never want to use Crafteds for the same reason, because you have to recraft nearly 70-80% of the build

[fiery silo]

its 7k meteor which is literally about 15% of my damage from a single chestplate swap. i made that build to do high damage. im not neutering my build just to make it work.

[proud meteor]

what are you supposed to run this with

[orchid gulch]

whats the worst

[tough bloom]

we try to yap until the devs/ims decide to make a change for the better

[steady hollow]

Investment down to the drain. 🌊

[proud meteor]

-845

[lost phoenix]

making my life in finding and updating the best builds harder.... one nerf at a time

[twin whale]

also with slayer, what was that about? I thought fatal slayer was like 5 people doing dps in annie

[orchid gulch]

GG

[proud meteor]

eotl fatal???

[barren marlin]

They should reduce the range tbh

[twin whale]

why was it hit so bady, i thought no one used it

[proud meteor]

thats jsut not how rolls work

[barren marlin]

Wdym

[normal geode]

Someone on the item team hates hpr cancelling

[twin whale]

they cant make the range smaller

[proud meteor]

you cant just change the roll ranges

[barren marlin]

Oh idfk fucking increase the minimum

[proud meteor]

roll ranges are set to 0.3 to 1.3 times for positive stats and 0.7 to 1.3 times for negative stats

[twin whale]

just know that these changes are ALL zeer

[fiery silo]

its quite good in raids from my experience

[proud meteor]

not possible

[barren marlin]

Holy poo

[lost phoenix]

Slayer imo, wasn't overpowered strong but rather fun and popular

[proud meteor]

its a good warp replacement if you cant afford it

[barren marlin]

The system was built for the rich

[normal geode]

Slayer wasn’t even that popular ima be real

[steady hollow]

Maybe, just maybe.

[young jolt]

i mean like green opal is getting buffed so like doesnt it kinda yknow cancel out ?

[proud meteor]

yeah its only somewhat popular because its fatal/quetz slayer is cheaper than warp

[abstract grove]

again with the conspiracizing and catastrophizing. I get it isn't fun to have your stuff nerfed but all this just makes it harder to get meaningful feedback and for IMs to have an accurate picture of whats going on. i get the anger but this kind of thing is only gonna make things tougher for everyone

[normal geode]

The buff is like 15%

[lost phoenix]

the uncrafted builds are doomed tho, but yeah fair point

[orchid gulch]

i really don't like zeer and how he handles feedback but we can't put all the blame on him ;-;

[proud meteor]

every other hpr change was 10-20% but for some reason slayer and warp were 50%

[barren marlin]

Uncrafted doom

[proud meteor]

so no the compensation is not even close

[normal geode]

Ppl are mad because there’s been dozens of changes like this and every time people complain and then there’s no resolution

[fiery silo]

is there a place where we can talk in a more individual enviroment?

[twin whale]

the downsides to epoch being 14k ehp, worse ehp and dmg than laby, and the upside is...... uhh....

BUFF EPOCH!!!!

[lost phoenix]

@abstract grove p sure ppl are using this as reference instead of "conspiracy" btw

[barren marlin]

Now if there were better uncrafted hpr options

[cloud acorn]

????? look closer

[orchid gulch]

you're 100% right, but people will be angry and with your position it's something you need to learn to deal with. us the players are NOT right for being angry but... not much can be done

[normal geode]

I knew someone was gonna be unfunny and post that

[flat kraken]

Resolution is right there 🤯

[proud meteor]

could we have an im who worked on these items and then maybe sugo can sum up the good points

[cloud acorn]

me!

[proud meteor]

@lost phoenix summary time

[steady hollow]

Are we making puns now

[lost phoenix]

everything is in the original message already 😭

[barren marlin]

Bro alrwady typed all that out

[twin whale]

okay some changes were good

[fallow turret]

chat what the fuck happened here

[cyan storm]

@grok is this true

[steady hollow]

Start with reading, it helps

[twin whale]

@wind spear is this true

[young jolt]

is the uncrafted build just going to be aquamarine, timerift, elder oak roots, moontower then ?

[tough bloom]

we are about to see morph warp (you cant use it)

[proud meteor]

maybe ephemeral skibidi instead

[lost phoenix]

I think the best approach would've been to give slayer atleast the same blanket nerf as everything else

[normal geode]

Moon pool yang vortex bracer contrast

[orchid gulch]

might need like (cheap) crafted hpr rings

[cloud acorn]

morph fatal hunted buid linny flower reference????

[tough bloom]

🤯

[twin whale]

i think warp dps shouldve been just nerfed

[young jolt]

oh so this nerf kinda only hits the crafted build then ig?

[twin whale]

instead of hrp

[edgy obsidian]

we tried, but players ourselves dont have an accurate picture of why items are getting nerfed or buffed. this hpr patch came out of nowhere, and theres no explaination AT ALL on the change notes of why they decide to do this, i dont expect a writen out note on why every singel item and ingredient gets changed, but an overall plan or explaination goes a long way

[gaunt orbit]

yoo warp is now a lightbender weapon

[barren marlin]

No bro

[steady hollow]

I thought that was done in previous patch?

[normal geode]

They just nerfed that so it’s fine, also warp was less dps then quetz but quetz could get almost the same ws

[orchid gulch]

i see where your coming from, but i disagree. warp was never dps meta. devs just want shit nerfed cause it's popular

[barren marlin]

Uncrafted loses way more

[young jolt]

but why tho

[lost phoenix]

added to the tldr

[barren marlin]

Tou gotta change up a lot

[proud meteor]

they can do it again

[young jolt]

whatsis tou

[barren marlin]

Also anyone who is running uncrafted deffo doesnt have yod rolls

[barren marlin]

You*****

[young jolt]

ohhhh

[tough bloom]

yeah and now hpr :D

[steady hollow]

The god roll:

[orchid gulch]

did you just roll that

[barren marlin]

we gotta see the non mythic hpr buffs but contrast only went up 30 so 💀

[tough bloom]

the wynncraft gameplay
items get nerfed
complain
no one cares
nerfed again :D

[lost phoenix]

want a funny hpr% cancel warp build

[barren marlin]

Im sorry for your loss

[waxen sable]

lets nerf everything so people will actually quit wynn 🔥

[tough bloom]

we bouta see -600 hpr in the next patch

[crude drift]

my warp has blue hpr%

[young jolt]

wheres the etw has fallen gif

[crude drift]

do i run hpr% cancel now?

[barren marlin]

They have to

[tough bloom]

what is health

[twin whale]

yeah actually will it just be easier to cancel hpr% rather than hpr raw now

[barren marlin]

2.0 did catastrophic damage

[lost phoenix]

god I hope not

[proud meteor]

possibly

[unreal tiger]

yeahhhh this felt kinda... bad

[normal geode]

U need minimum 240% hpr so no

[twin whale]

chat run those numbers!

[crude drift]

doubt

[tough bloom]

someone get the max hpr% pieces

[flat kraken]

Everyone needs to play boreal warp now

[crude drift]

its fine i dont like playing arca anyway

[twin whale]

the warp ring people are selling fast!!

[fiery silo]

let's not abuse meta too much now

[lost phoenix]

HGIH KEY

[tough bloom]

next nerf
BOREAL

[barren marlin]

Warp bigmac

[tough bloom]

SCREW WARP ECONEMY (its dead anwyays)

[lost phoenix]

holyshit

[twin whale]

atleast epoch got buffed with exploding

[lost phoenix]

yee

[flat kraken]

How’s the panic selling going

[crude drift]

im gonna run epoch notg now

[twin whale]

im tired of people saying epoch is bad

[pastel rivet]

all you gotta do is swap off warp right before the -hpr procs
you don’t gotta cancel hpr out with this tech!

[steady hollow]

Still bad, ngl

[tough bloom]

time to run spell epoch

[fiery silo]

warp has exploding guys it's okay, that will compensate the nerf

[lost phoenix]

this is so true!

[crude drift]

ok but idc

[barren marlin]

Tstack warp nog

[steady hollow]

The worm has thunder def

[flat kraken]

This is the kinda stuff you saw in 2.1 beta

[tough bloom]

its not? its just bad with tstack, trust me spell is wayyy better

[barren marlin]

Nah its real bad bro

[twin whale]

i rolled this fucker im proud

[barren marlin]

Dont nerf it please

[pastel rivet]

can we remove hpr% from warp so we can use nethers scar

[barren marlin]

Bad spell cost rr

[twin whale]

if epoch ever gets nerfed hard im duping so many stx

[lost phoenix]

keep cooking 🔥

[flat kraken]

Ok!

[twin whale]

so TRUE why is hpr % there

[flat kraken]

I’ll ban u immediately when epoch gets a lifesteal nerf

[orchid gulch]

bro stop wynn team doesn't know what a joke is ;-;

[steady hollow]

GMA can cancel hpr without Nether's Scar and it deals more damage than the current build we're seeing there

[pastel rivet]

it was there for people that went to positive hpr (it won’t matter with this upcoming patch anymore)

[twin whale]

id actually kms if lifesteal gets nerfed on epoch

[steady hollow]

But I think gatekeeping is good for the sake of builders!

[barren marlin]

Lol it would unironically be better for me

[flat kraken]

Cooked

Ye go touch some grass while banned

Good for health

[tough bloom]

next patch

main atk nerf
ls nerf

[barren marlin]

Nah hidden epoch strats

Unironically the best weapon in this game

[flat kraken]

Epoch lifesteal got nerfed in terms of proportional life steal to other lifesteal items

This patch

[twin whale]

uhh my number didnt go down!

[barren marlin]

Why didnt bows get an ls increase tho

[twin whale]

next patch is a laby buff

[flat kraken]

They were already good enough for ls

[twin whale]

as soon as tealy banks buy 20 labys

[flat kraken]

So bows didn’t get buff

[barren marlin]

Is it really tho

[tough bloom]

at this point we are gonna get a peferect warp before we get a warp buff

[twin whale]

i dont even think ls is real healing

[barren marlin]

Ls when no tier drop

[flat kraken]

Divzer!

[pastel rivet]

we are now giving epoch -ls to reduce the uptime of players attacking constantly

[twin whale]

id have to crash out

[normal geode]

New hpr% cancel warp build just dropped 🔥 🔥 🔥 🔥 🔥 https://wynnbuilder.github.io/builder?v=17#10_0690pxCR-19667CO6I66669i910QjCR-19C9C4H4H4H4H9m91CR-19C9C4H4H4H4H9m91CR-19C9C4H4H4H4H9c91CR-19C9C4H4H4H4H9n910R10Y0X1u-a2b1g00001007lU0z0z0+0+0+0+0-1T2Y2Y2Z2Z1g1glVpyDcrN
WynnBuilder build:

Blue Mask
Time Rift
CR-19667CO6I66669i91
Moontower
CR-19C9C4H4H4H4H9m91
CR-19C9C4H4H4H4H9m91
CR-19C9C4H4H4H4H9c91
CR-19C9C4H4H4H4H9n91
Warp [a6a6a6]
(Has Tomes)

[twin whale]

ive been using tstack epoch since forever

[lost phoenix]

holey moley

[vital knoll]

Thanks for your feedback!!! Stay tuned for the next biweekly ingredient rework

[twin whale]

15k meteors goes HARD!

[normal geode]

The ims want HPR cancel warp to be mid damage…

[short moth]

Lmao

Im actualy kms with this one

[normal geode]

How will link carry in tna now

[vital knoll]

Imma be fr tho, I could care less for minor nerfs for my stuff, but I feel bad for all the casual players who keep getting fucking railed every 2 weeks at this point. It’s getting hard to help new players and explain to them that every 2 weeks we need to switch things since the nerfs keep coming. When is this going to end

[steady hollow]

As an endgame player, my duty is gatekeeping builds so it won't get popular enough to deserve a nerf anymore

✍️ 🔥

[proud meteor]

personally i dont like this argument, of course meta builds are going to be nerfed and thats the price you pay for playing the best builds in the game

[swift prism]

At this rate tna would be just forced glue cuse all ws builds got thier dmg gutted and qol oblitirated

[proud meteor]

in this specific case though yes the nerfs were too much

[steady hollow]

Not really, I do have backups

[vital knoll]

At this point more than meta builds are getting hurt on the biweekly

[steady hollow]

Some are, interesting

[orchid gulch]

shit this might be meta... 1 guard 3 fatals type shit

[proud meteor]

the funniest thing is the meta will probably be the exact same

[swift prism]

It already is...

[proud meteor]

its just gonna be slower

[normal geode]

But they shouldn’t be nerfed into unviability (fallen) or nerfed so hard that you need to recraft expensive hpr crafteds to make it usable (arca)

[lost phoenix]

3 shadesteppers*

[tough bloom]

do i hear statue :DD

[proud meteor]

rn the meta is 1 lb 3 warp arca

[proud meteor]

yeah of course these nerfs were too much its just the argument in general doesnt really make sesne for me

[lost phoenix]

shadesteppers, you're next. (upcoming -2nd cost change blanket nerf guys)

[steady hollow]

1 moving pots + winded slave and 3 meteor throwers.

[normal geode]

Shade and laby are next

[twin whale]

i like playing fun builds, and warp is fun. however there is a point where a build is not viable to play, even if its fun. warp is becoming that

[vital knoll]

No lunatic mask is next

[silk thicket]

do ppl still play laby tf

[carmine perch]

whats the tldr on the reason behind the nerfs anyways

[proud meteor]

yes

[steady hollow]

Ye, but it requires a good team to play

[normal geode]

Oh ya true lunatic mask prob getting deleted with 0 shaman compensation buffs

[short moth]

Next Patch they remove classes

[proud meteor]

they havent given any

[tough bloom]

its now not fun and not viable imo (after nerf)

[steady hollow]

Or shit dps is real, laby doesn't work with randos

[orchid gulch]

bro do NOT give them ideas

[carmine perch]

halarious

[swift prism]

If they dodge next nerf wave we can all collectivly start joking that they used vamish so the IM wont see em being good

[short moth]

Why would they need to give any they just do what they want

[short moth]

Ahhhhhhhhh

[woven blaze]

azeotrope -5 to -2

[twin whale]

no im actually for winded getting nerfed

[ripe sandal]

arcanist deserved it anyway lmao

[pastel rivet]

it’s ok they will give slayer more attack tiers to promote tstack hybrid sunstar with ls that cancels out slayer hpr

[young jolt]

@proud meteor

[normal geode]

Terminateds only 100+ class is an assassin, I think shade is probably safe

[carmine perch]

https://tenor.com/view/dog-dog-staring-at-sun-cute-dog-dog-closed-eyes-dog-staring-at-sunset-gif-10310895250239531072

[fiery silo]

winded leeching was dumb yeha

[short moth]

Its fine with the winded nerfs but they dont have to kill Warp 😭

[proud meteor]

except that it still exists

[lost phoenix]

winded nerf was good

[twin whale]

yeah i hate how 1 or 2 winded guys can just increase everone else's dps immensely

[barren marlin]

Every arcanist player blame this guy

[twin whale]

but hpr on top of that is crazy

[lost phoenix]

AT did a good job this patch, it's the other balancing side of things that is a problem right now

[tough bloom]

tree is good items not so much

[barren marlin]

77 more ls on bloodbath 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥

[proud meteor]

items would be good too if warp and slayer didnt get fucked

[normal geode]

No fallen buffs, they did not do a good job

[tough bloom]

true

[slim idol]

laughs in boreal gotv disco warp

[barren marlin]

Wdym dude bloodbath got 77ls

[tough bloom]

-# if warp gets nerfed again i am quiting

[steady hollow]

At least Tstack can be viable after this patch

[fiery silo]

op for when fallen LS synergy comes around 😎

[carmine perch]

WAIT

[short moth]

You have to define what was good this patch they probs think everything was good

[tough bloom]

nah we gotta run tdrop warp

[barren marlin]

Facts bro

[carmine perch]

I SOLD MY EPOCH A MONTH AGO FUCK

[barren marlin]

That 77 ls gonna carry bbath

[carmine perch]

cuz i have no hope on tstack bro

[normal geode]

How did shade dodge nerfs this patch btw, that shit is ridiculous

[fiery silo]

real

[young jolt]

[tough bloom]

wasnt people shouting buff shade or something?

[lost phoenix]

Everything in AT side of things except bsorrow was good in my opinion

The Trance mID was a fumble this time (cuz it was bad to begin with so reverting it wasn't the best idea) and this hpr change was what caused the item side of things to not be the best

other than these everything else was good

[twin whale]

yeah its also 14k ehp

[barren marlin]

Bro

[young jolt]

[swift prism]

It used vanish to avoid being seen by the IM

[normal geode]

Sharp rework coming soon, epoch and laby will die

[proud meteor]

idk about epoch but laby yeah

[tough bloom]

im getting a 2nd archer for epoch lul

[normal geode]

Max focus is gonna be 3 now and tstack support is moving to bolt, epoch will die

[lost phoenix]

alr then

twilight gilded cloak
+2 atk speed -> -2 atk speed

We believe this is more in theme of heavy hybrid.

[fiery silo]

yeah at changes were solid this patch

[barren marlin]

This is false guys everybody go home

[pastel rivet]

when will we nerf aco

[lost phoenix]

aco did get a nerf whar

[normal geode]

They massively nerfed aco this patch

[lost phoenix]

but its mostly fine

[fallen socket]

my beloved sorrow qwq

[barren marlin]

Laby is on the clock

[short moth]

Im just mad bc of warp grrrrrr

[proud meteor]

and tentacles speeed too

[normal geode]

Nah the complete removal of blood from sorrow is kinda ridiculous, it should’ve just been reduced from .5 -> .25

[pastel rivet]

aco nerf is not enough i’m testing it on beta rn

[normal geode]

?

[short moth]

I think they should Just start to Nerf acro again

[carmine perch]

crafted tstack:

[cloud acorn]

clearly the solution is to hop on pz cstack after warp nerf!

[tough bloom]

if it was the same nerf as every other item then sure, but no.

[ripe sandal]

usually i don't get this argument because a lot of people bring up SP nerfs making gear pop off but i feel like that hasn't happened in a while since cumu changes and rainbow nerfs -- but this change is legit demoralizing because these items were both heavily reliant on external, expensive factors like crafted warp rings or specific builds / guild tomes / whatever that aren't easy to come by

i get the whole response of "oh you haven't tested it out" but warp is nigh unplayable without hpr cancelling it, it's mediocre on lbender and rift is -- i don't think these were smart changes. warp i'm more okay with because you can just recraft your rings and lose some spell damage on them but slayer wasn't something that i felt was too overtuned. it was great in non-meta builds and currently none of the builds that used it are super good (rest in peace fallen, may you rise again [but weaker] one of these days) and whacking the QoL stats instead of other parameters you can mess around with -- base dps and other rolls besides mainstats like how slayer has walk speed as well that could be tuned -- comes off the wrong way

[tough bloom]

https://tenor.com/view/wynncraft-wynncraft-dern-dern-realm-of-darkness-hunter-gif-24302067

[fiery silo]

agreed. aside from the 3rd cost, HPR was like the worst stat they couldve made more potent on slayer. super annoying change that makes builds a lot worse in a really annoying way

[ripe sandal]

i mean i guess fatal arca was decent with slayer but also you lost winded leeching this update sooooo

[fiery silo]

having negative HPR is super unfun

[ripe sandal]

just run slayer rift fatal 🤯

[barren marlin]

What if they added someone who played the game into the im team ??!!??

[steady hollow]

Unlike Warp, you can't technically off-hand it

[fiery silo]

exactly

[young jolt]

me

[steady hollow]

You should wear it all the time

[fiery silo]

in raids and lootruns your gear is locked too

[barren marlin]

Id quit the game

[young jolt]

WTF?

[vital knoll]

Completely agree, I’m against these changes as well but I’m just trying to get people to understand how people less involved in this community feel with these biweekly slashes of most things

It’s just never ending, and I’m sick of explaining to multiple people every 2 weeks that their build they just made got nuked and it’s time to restart

[fiery silo]

HPR on gear should be handled a lot differently than HPR on Weapons

[tough bloom]

at this point

[fiery silo]

making HPR too brutal on a piece of gear will drive people off from ever using it

[tough bloom]

run morph to not be nerfed

[short moth]

It will happen

[brittle crest]

I feel like slayers were already nerfed when they nerfed hpr tomes why did they nerf them again

[vital knoll]

I mean everyone in here reading it is pretty invested in Wynn, but I’ve had many personal friends or other ppl who joined my guild and wanted to get back into the game, only to turn away after getting cucked multiple times

[swift prism]

Didnt that set also got repeatedly nerfed?

[tough bloom]

yes

[barren marlin]

That shit got nerfed already

[brittle crest]

Only the individual pieces it’s still the same when you use the whole set

[barren marlin]

Morph should be better ngl

[tough bloom]

fuck it

local naked man punches eltrich being and surives

[vital knoll]

If they wanna keep nerfing we probably need to slow the rollout to give some breathing time for more casual players

[short moth]

"Morph offers way too many benefits for new Players without coming with any downsides thats why we removed it"

[steady hollow]

I can't take more morph users in TNA

[tough bloom]

lmao

[barren marlin]

Too many pfinder morph noobs doing 45 damage

[waxen sable]

they shouldnt get back to the game, its a bad idea

[swift prism]

I cant take it anymorph

[barren marlin]

Why do they always have bobs mythic weapons too???,

[proud meteor]

if youre gonna run meta builds everytime then dont be surprised that they get nerfed

[tough bloom]

its not even the eye weapons

[proud meteor]

bro wait until you see master hive weapons

[vital knoll]

These people aren’t running meta builds every time, they are running archetypes that get completely reworked or gear that pops off lol

[fiery silo]

meta builds arent even the ones getting nerfed atp 😭

[barren marlin]

They arent even tho

[swift prism]

Its mythic, therefor good! (Ignore the fact its legendary and lvl 75)

[proud meteor]

honestly underrated

[barren marlin]

Casuals get hit harder from these nerfs than trynards

[vital knoll]

It’s not like everyone is playing hero fallen crafted, people with standard builds still feel the pain

[fiery silo]

real

[tough bloom]

i throw up every time i see it running with morph💀

[barren marlin]

Its like reverse epic games

[lost phoenix]

I love how collectively everyone agreed to this thread tho no matter their stance on the dps meta, I wonder how the feedback here will be responded tho (whether it will be considered or not)

[proud meteor]

nah master hive weapons are pretty decent

[warped folio]

bottom line

[vital knoll]

This is the exact issue. At this point they are nerfing things so much only the meta is viable, and the more new and casual players are SCREWED

[young jolt]

top line

[warped folio]

they claim to have "tweaked hpr on everything" EXCEPT hpr tomes (???)

[barren marlin]

They are so buns 💀💀

[proud meteor]

think of them as qol mythics without hte qol or dps mythics without the dps

[tough bloom]

id say master hive armour has more value tbh

[silk thicket]

“All items” ig tomes arent items

[lost phoenix]

prowess

[proud meteor]

their bases are similar to mythics

[steady hollow]

Contrast in most builds:

[barren marlin]

Unironcally the casual 4 raids a day players get cooked more than tryhards

[waxen sable]

They even nerfed toxo, what else you guys expecting from them 💀

[ripe sandal]

a humongous 8 mr

[barren marlin]

Target audience getting fucked over 💀💀🙏🙏🙏

[warped folio]

lol?

[tough bloom]

I FORGOT ABOUT CONTRAST NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
-# public exution coming soon (jk no ban)

[young jolt]

merch are you lowkey crashing out ?

[barren marlin]

Not worth to use over the armor peices

[barren marlin]

No nothing i play got shit on

[lost phoenix]

im curious why ppl dont use master hive weapons with morph tbh

[barren marlin]

Im an advocate for the poor

[tough bloom]

what do u play?

[proud meteor]

eh hive armour pieces kinda fell off its more prowess and contrast

[cloud acorn]

the people using morph cant beat qira

[barren marlin]

No

[tough bloom]

we are going to nerf it

[young jolt]

https://tenor.com/view/lebron-james-lebron-screaming-lebron-lebron-james-screaming-gif-5629213437781461656

[barren marlin]

Yeah keep pot crutching buddy

[warped folio]

i beat qira on fallen morph convergence

[swift prism]

Quira too hard for them (i misspelled it for comidic effects)

[lost phoenix]

this is me too

[cloud acorn]

truebut hive armor pieces are better than hive weapons

[proud meteor]

i beat qira using morph singu

[barren marlin]

Type shii

[cloud acorn]

if you are using morph mythic weapon u are not true morp user...

[tough bloom]

as a warp main i got shitted on

[proud meteor]

yeah (also kinda becasue therearent mythic armour pieces

[young jolt]

https://tenor.com/view/gulp-gulper-cat-gif-27523728

[tough bloom]

morph freedom

[cloud acorn]

true morp users are using the most foul lvl 75 legendaries u can think of fr

[barren marlin]

Im a freedom fighter i fight for all yall

[warped folio]

38:3 surely they do something right......?

[young jolt]

[vital knoll]

I only got buffs as a summoner main lol, but I’m just feeling bad for all the members of my guild now needing to make new builds for the umpteenth million time. It’s hard for people starting to recover from these changes every 2 weeks

[ripe sandal]

i do feel that there is a disturbing lack of "bridge" between uninformed gearslap and an actually good or hell even half decent legendary build lol

[brittle crest]

Don’t tell ct but I think sstar tstack is gonna do 500k after Friday

[woven blaze]

its over

[cloud acorn]

there have been higher ratios that havent been added(class symbol icon thing got like 300 upvotes and like 2 downvotes and nothing happened besides salted asking to use the symbols and never implementing them)
😔

[karmic swift]

buff freedom

[warped folio]

damn i love me a content team that listens to their players

[cloud acorn]

this is a sign to use the most egregious offmeta builds and get unaffected by nerfs and buffeed by random item buffs

[vital knoll]

They will nerf hpr tomes again since they have too much stat budget

[karmic swift]

hi @warped folio

[warped folio]

yo

[ripe sandal]

like the gap between mythic and nonmythic is not cavernous at the very top end of legendary and a reasonable middle ground of mythic builds

[cloud acorn]

gurt

[short moth]

fr

[patent knoll]

DO THEY EVEN PLAY A SINGLE GAME??

[short moth]

No

[swift prism]

No

[tough bloom]

shame there isnt any

[brittle crest]

Apparently an hpr buff according to ct is just increasing the hpr number

[steady hollow]

I mean, if the maker doesn't even want to use their products, you know there's a reason behind it. It could be harmful or it's just not their taste (but people lovin it)

[proud meteor]

it wasnt an hpr buff

[brittle crest]

They said hpr is increased across the board and ig it translates to just increasing the hpr value

[vital knoll]

Just hpr% cancel warp aaaaaa comment

[topaz quest]

me when i put numbers into a calculator with a % modifier abnd forget what happens when bigger numbers get multiplied

[proud meteor]

well yeah its an increase to make it slightly more impactful but not necessarily a buff

[warped folio]

good luck w that one bro

[cloud acorn]

WARP NSCAR real not fake

[vital knoll]

On gobb

[brittle crest]

I mean if this is the case why aren’t they buffing hpr tomes

[short moth]

hpr is nerfed on all good Things and buffed on worse

[ember spear]

Perhaps consider that development time takes a long time

[brittle crest]

Since they are just increasing hpr values it would make sense for them to increase hpr tomes but that’s beyond them

[topaz quest]

tgis gotta be bait

[vital knoll]

Yes they spent all the dev time nerfing them by 20% a month ago

[brittle crest]

They literally just nerfed hpr tomes

[cloud acorn]

they prob want to encourage people to use hpr/ls gear instead of just relying on tomes

[short moth]

Most of cts dont RAID so they dont even have those

[crude drift]

they wanna nerf them more

[brittle crest]

We are already relying on hpr gear on warp at least

[warped folio]

like honestly if they just reverted hpr tome nerf id be fine with it all

[ember spear]

Patience is the key to prosperity

[cloud acorn]

for more builds/ in general or whatever
they r just making it a bit mroe accessible cuz not a lot of builds use ls/hpr besides cancelling it

[brittle crest]

https://tenor.com/view/ragebait-rage-bait-lol-lmao-gif-3554026694133497645

[vital knoll]

Lmao

[wary hemlock]

nah dont make them change this i wanna quit the game anyways

[patent knoll]

The recent few patches just made the game more boring and annoying, idk what they expected but now only few people play each raids and matchmaking is MUCH more painful
Makin every bosses more powerful and more complicated(attack pattern) is easier way to make people enjoy the raid healthier

[normal rose]

I am already using that gear they just keep nerfing it

[brittle crest]

Yeah if they increased positive hpr the same amount they increase negative hpr it would all cancel out in the end and there would be no issue

[ember spear]

Slow and steady wins the race

[cloud acorn]

real
contradt gets 140 hpr

[brittle crest]

Is contrast hpr even being touched

[warped folio]

yes

[ripe sandal]

up to 140

[steady hollow]

30 more hpr\

[brittle crest]

That’s fine ig

[topaz quest]

🤯

[brittle crest]

Just revert hpr tome nerf thanks

[barren marlin]

Im ngl

[barren marlin]

People already struggle with base raids it actually amazes me

[topaz quest]

really op item should nerf it again methinks

[warped folio]

lifesteal to 200 too

[barren marlin]

People are so dogshit icl

[steady hollow]

Well, they need time to learn

[warped folio]

alot of people just refuse to for some reason

[topaz quest]

that 25 hopr coukd be used to offset the nearly 700 warp is gonna have now 👍

[steady hollow]

I mean ye, those are only one I hated the most

[topaz quest]

biiiiig

[barren marlin]

Nah bro i be queuing into these people a lot they clearly play a lot

[ripe sandal]

u right

[barren marlin]

They just suck so much ass its crazy

[vital knoll]

Man can they just stop touching contrast. It’s been changed like 5 times recently,
Hp nerf, hpr nerf, ls and hpr buff, 2 poison reworks

[normal rose]

Where's the downside I can't have an item without a downside

[barren marlin]

Fr

[topaz quest]

its the same item?

[ripe sandal]

(i got rid of the flavor stats)

[brittle crest]

Mr nerf

[swift prism]

Some ppl legit played tna since 2.0 and still never go to tree cuse they dont know its layout...

[barren marlin]

Just give it 80 hpr now

[normal rose]

Gear should not just give stats I think everything must also have a downside

[pastel rivet]

contrast is too op now, give it -10 sp

[steady hollow]

The current problem with raid is the challenge room can be failed even you're the last one standing

[warped folio]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1240662452652347452/1366835966144151652/attachment.gif

[barren marlin]

Wdym bro 2100 poison dude!!!

[lost phoenix]

the black catalyst special

[brittle crest]

Yeah because some of them require 2 people

[vital knoll]

I just feel so bad for people who don’t play every day and just come back every 2 weeks to their builds popping off, all trees redone, and playstyles ruined. Can we just stop hurting the casuals with all the nerfs lol

[barren marlin]

Yeah

[wary hemlock]

actually playing the game with wynntils is too op, please make it so that whenever you log on with wynntils add +200 ms to your game instance

[steady hollow]

Lot of my raids failed due to all party members died rather than my own

[brittle crest]

That’s just normal proxy behavior wdym

[steady hollow]

So I think it's just purely bad luck + bad system combined

[wary hemlock]

oh so the nerf already went through

[vital knoll]

Yes

[ripe sandal]

i fixed the item so it has accurate numbers is that better

[barren marlin]

Whats even left now

[brittle crest]

The biggest takeaway from changelogs is play trickshade while it lasts

[lost phoenix]

change 140 to 3.5 tomes then

[barren marlin]

The great dps purge has almost concluded

[vital knoll]

Summoner buff! We celebrate the small wins

[lost phoenix]

the ability tree team has popped off this patch

[pastel rivet]

the only thing that will fix the meta is to exclusively make positive hpr gatekept behind defense items

[lost phoenix]

great work from them honestly, and if we ignore the aco change it's overall a great patch for ability tree

[vital knoll]

I would slightly disagree. They made good changes but they also didn’t work on a lot of glaring issues

[barren marlin]

Yes more wfa no ETW

[ripe sandal]

i got it

[brittle crest]

Yeah like generalist breaking when you turn on the node

[swift prism]

That plus laby and epoch untill the focus change of sharo rework...

[lost phoenix]

they'll get to it eventually, they can't fix everything at once now can they, and they didnt make any negative or detrimental changes unlike this change either ignoring the sorrow change

[brittle crest]

When trickshade gets deleted war dps goes back to divzer bombstack

[vital knoll]

Yes but it’s sad we got to the point where we celebrate no fuck ups over good changes

[ripe sandal]

(i am tapped out on the meta class building scene... does any meta build that didn't use warp or slayer use contrast?)

[lost phoenix]

it is what it is, better to celebrate good things whether it's good changes or no fuck ups, both is equally good

[warped folio]

https://wynnbuilder.github.io/builder?v=17#10_0690px01vCI-10000FGood Leggings0200401030520M01010T010o0U010o0V010o0W010o0X010o0i0202MAA0j0202MAA0k0300NS1ba0w0300NS1ba0z0202MAA0QjCR-1CTCT9i9i9i9i9m91CR-1CTCT9i9i9i9i9m91CR-1CT6w9i9i5mCT9c9101ECI-100008Contrast0230560G0208D0M0201a0j010880m02038380t010CC0v020XcXc0z0202C2C02FCI-100004Warp025040103057090530-600C07125-1450F50M0201Z0S0201z0W010P0i023442C0j013wV0q0200R1r0s0200F110t0200s3g0z023DD77120105K1D0231Q6524013dL10101u0A2P1g1000FU1000FU01000FU1007lU0z0z0+0+0+0+0-1T2Y2Y2Z2Z2a2alVpyDc+B
WynnBuilder build:

Blue Mask
Time Rift
Good Leggings
Moontower
CR-1CTCT9i9i9i9i9m91
CR-1CTCT9i9i9i9i9m91
CR-1CT6w9i9i5mCT9c91
Contrast
Warp [a6a6a6]

[barren marlin]

Epoch is bad

[fresh ridge]

good leggings

[lost phoenix]

-hpr sry bro unusable

[warped folio]

u right 1s

[vital knoll]

While I agree I think there’s been a lot of fuck ups recently so it would be nice to see some fixes pushed to higher priority but I agree we take what we can at this point

[barren marlin]

I think its time for another ignis nerf

[young jolt]

HAHAHA

[brittle crest]

I think we need another immo nerf

[swift prism]

Good fixes are delayed due to fruma dev time 🔥 ✍️

[lost phoenix]

nah another heavy melee major id

[warped folio]

@lost phoenix there its fixed

[barren marlin]

Another mythic powder major id 🔥🔥

[brittle crest]

I think we need another powder special major id on a shit ass mythic

[warped folio]

Guys lets add plague to toxoplasmosis

[brittle crest]

I think archangel needs a wind prison major id

[barren marlin]

Also make it have to wait 4 months for atree support

[barren marlin]

Facts bro

[brittle crest]

Give abso a courage major id but keep it at 0 powder slots

[lost phoenix]

but yeah fallen builds (which are already gutted cuz rally)

mostly loose slight mana sustain and dmg uptime, it's mostly the arcanist builds that are the problem rn due to this change

[vital knoll]

Also whatever happened to the “moving the power back to the items”, it seems like the items are getting nerfed more than the trees and neither are seeing buffs

[swift prism]

I like how 2 of the downvotes are coming from the CT...

[ripe sandal]

i actually can't believe fallen didn't get a single change

never mind vehement 🔥🔥🔥

[normal rose]

It's fine guys boltslinger is getting bouncing bomb compensation soon

[steady hollow]

Archangel is the name of the weapon so here is it

Resurrection: Powder special now can resurrect dying teammates.

[brittle crest]

Beetown is a mod

[proud meteor]

what about 2.2 tomes for ls

[barren marlin]

Fallen nerf hurt casuals harder than sweats unironically

[ripe sandal]

no ls is a flavor stat

[swift prism]

Literaly killed last change due to rally nerg

[proud meteor]

wind unprison

[proud meteor]

seance

[ripe sandal]

true

[brittle crest]

Yeah so it’s a flavor stat on anything other than arca

[normal rose]

Ok buddy that's on the chopping block next

[lost phoenix]

@normal rosehow do u get those custom tags btw like the blud tag

[steady hollow]

Fallen tstack is soon

[proud meteor]

you have one too what

[warped folio]

new meta

[barren marlin]

Bro you literally have one

[lost phoenix]

yea mine is from a public server, im wondering how the private servers get it

[proud meteor]

discord is just slowly rolling them out to random servers

[lost phoenix]

ah okay

[barren marlin]

Its actually not bad rn

[warped folio]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/262010576295821312/1249162358920712203/F.gif

[brittle crest]

Warp getting a wind prison major id to make up for the hpr nerf!!

[barren marlin]

Its decent

[proud meteor]

wind prison now lasts for 2 hits instead of 1 but only for yourself

[vital knoll]

Yes the casuals are the ones hurting and leaving the most. This current update cycle is just pummeling them. Fine, keep nerfing stuff but make some buffs to casual type builds, they are hurting way more than ppl with aspects, mythics, etc

[brittle crest]

Bmonk is casual and it’s not bad just does no damage

[viral turtle]

my crafted lq hpr bracelet is not gonna hold up after this patch anymore man i’m gonna actually have to get hpr tomes for my warp lr build now

cooked

[young jolt]

the canyon calls for aid, will you answer wynncrafter?

[brittle crest]

I only play this game to gamble atp

[barren marlin]

Olux needs more help

[proud meteor]

which then translates into 4 tomes !

[young jolt]

who is olux?

[ripe sandal]

we figured it out guys

[viral turtle]

avg wynncraft endgame experience

[ripe sandal]

this canyon neeeeeeds a hero

[brittle crest]

1300 tna comp burnout

[lunar portal]

i would just share 1 thing
i have a roughly -821 hpr warp
-821+46x3（nice roll tome）+140（contrast）+191（nice hpr roll aquamarine）+200（potential hpr crafted legging）=-152
life is good enough

[young jolt]

oh.. who will be the shepherd to lead the lost souls out of the canyon?

[barren marlin]

Honestly i hope they make sure that people arent able to make 5 billion dps builds with whatever while they are actively nerfing shit

[swift prism]

Multiplie that by ur -hpr% bro

[brittle crest]

That is so cooked

[barren marlin]

The grand city of olux, deep in the murky forests of gavel!

[ripe sandal]

probably m_. i_________ g____

[swift prism]

If you have -40% hpr thats now -150 x 1.4

[carmine perch]

how much is 1 tome?

[young jolt]

46 i think

[carmine perch]

ah thank you

[brittle crest]

Warp is like 280-140 btw

[swift prism]

Aware

[young jolt]

[brittle crest]

So it’s 3.8x to 2.4x

[swift prism]

Selv is typing oh no

[abstract grove]

I mean the stuff like "weird how they hid it in a pastebin like they didnt want us to know" "wynn CT insider trading?" "i bet one guy just has it out for some player with a warp"

[lost phoenix]

okay those claims are silly I agree

[abstract grove]

woulda responded earlier but I only just got home

[lost phoenix]

but some silly claims shouldnt downplay the actual feedback keep in mind

[warped folio]

could you guys look into reverting the hpr tome nerf? it doesn't really make sense for it to remain untouched especially after a nerf when "every hpr item got tweaked"

[swift prism]

This.

[abstract grove]

backreading rn

[warped folio]

anyway thats a tldr

[lost phoenix]

(not reverting, reducing) u can go back to the original message for the summary if u want

[warped folio]

when i say revert the hpr tome nerf i mean back to the max of 59 per

that would make the other nerfs (which I understand for the mostpart) more bearable

[normal rose]

While I appreciate it it would also be helpful if actual ims acknowledge the concerns too

[proud meteor]

(base 45 for reference)

[warped folio]

yea overlooking a 54:3 constructive feedback thread wont be a good look 😭

[young jolt]

[warped folio]

[abstract grove]

maybe if I were still an IM

[warped folio]

or well you could pass on the word, it'd be more effective coming from another CT anyway

[abstract grove]

tbh that's another thing that people are putting way too much attention onto, that tomes were excluded from the buff

or, rather, the polarization really

[warped folio]

its deserved attention imo

[abstract grove]

nah I just mean the mockery of "huh guess tomes arent items huh" as if nuance is a thing that doesn't exist

[warped folio]

we're actively trying to lighten the hit

[proud meteor]

i wouldnt mind tomes not getting buffed if warp and slayer got half reverted

[warped folio]

just want the base reverted to 45

[lost phoenix]

because those were the primary way to cancel slayer hpr, and the slayer nerf would've been less impactful if those were buffed (and hit would've been lightened)

[abstract grove]

.

[proud meteor]

tbf slayer would still be kinda cooked evne with hpr tomes reverted

[warped folio]

no ones mocking anything rn we just straight up asking you if you can revert it

[lost phoenix]

please ignore the mockery and all that it's usually just reactionary stuff and not the core of the feedback

[abstract grove]

it's tricky when it's such a high volume. drowns out the reasonable people

[lost phoenix]

overall not productive to do this

[lunar spoke]

alas, the reactionary stuff tends to drown out any valuable stuff

[proud meteor]

thats probably my bad

[cloud acorn]

evil yum

[lost phoenix]

yeah, that's fair

[warped folio]

Yea but we sortof came to a consensus

[lost phoenix]

but that's why I put everything at the start yeah

[nova walrus]

i would like u guys to know that we have been reading this thread but its real hard with how much was said

[warped folio]

I understand the winded nerfs and all that, but we recomennding somehting reasonable to lighten the hit

[cloud acorn]

demure anmd mindful carlos

[warped folio]

the uproar was bound to happen no? idk what you expected after ap atch like that in all fairness

[nova walrus]

its like that salted speech bubble about memes making shit hard to read but with shitty comments instead

[ember spear]

Grok, make this chat studio jiggly

[nova walrus]

the thing is, theres a lot of valid stuff in here

[lost phoenix]

you can find the common consensus at the start in the original message, with a tldr and a proposed solution btw cuz I know that memes and shitposts can drown out feebdack

[abstract grove]

anyway, my thought on tomes is this- items weren't built with tomes in mind. tomes were an extra addition afterwards, and while using them to patch is well and good, some things really weren't factored in with the tome values- warp, etc. I think raising those, at least on paper, in reaction to tomes is a fine idea

[nova walrus]

but i just wish i could get to it in a way that doesnt feel like straight shit

i mean im not ur dad u guys can do what u want but it does make it hard

[abstract grove]

so if something was specifically changed to escape from tomes, buffing tomes to make it so you can cancel it again feels...kinda silly?

[warped folio]

father carlos

[carmine perch]

Grok, can you fact check everything in this thread

[cloud acorn]

dr carlos

Please address carlos appropoeeityleyrvley!

[lost phoenix]

. @nova walrus

[nova walrus]

sugo i know, and i read it

[lost phoenix]

oh alr

[nova walrus]

but i do still want to keep up with stuff

so i lurk a lot

[lost phoenix]

fair enough yeah, was worried about the point that was brought up about memes drowning out feedback

[warped folio]

Yea but you also have to consider that tomes are to an extent needed for like a good chunk of all builds out there (whether it be to function in the first place i.e guild tomes) or make the build MUCH more comfortable (e.g heff tomes on stuff like lightbender/acolyte) so I think its fair play to factor them in

At the end of the day, considering how much the hpr numbers on other stuff (especially mythics) got tweaked its not too farfetched to ask for a hpr tome nerf revert back to 45 base, as it was at that level for a long time without much of an issue

[ripe sandal]

yeah those claims are ridiculous -- doesn't change the fact that slayer didn't deserve a massive bigger-than-baseline change. warp is already gated by being insane roll hell on one of its key usability stats. not in a sense that "oh my water damage on stardew rolled bad it's not good for its key purpose :((" but rather in a sense that "a low roll on this item renders it unusable without sacrificing key aspects of other pieces of gear". meta hpr cancel warp builds aren't really possible without at least an >80% roll on hpr. and like sure you could try WFA warp but that'll do less damage than a wet tissue so not sure why this would be applicable

i think slayer could have done with a nerf, but nerfing its QoL aspect when it's used in very few cases (fatal, quetz, hero [upper scream gone until further notice]) instead of other spots like its massive walk speed bonus that really doesn't have any purpose being on an item with a very strong main stat like -3rd cost% on an element combo with already a lot of WS in random places and especially on good items with good damage and other stats. after the hpr tome nerfs, slayer saw periodic usage but cancelling its hpr was still of great importance but ultimately dampens the power of the item beyond what i would deem super reasonable

i understand the above-baseline changes to warp and slayer since they overperform in ways that are hard to nail down, but the winded change was already 95, if not 100% of the way there to making warp less problematic

[vital knoll]

Also to add, the tomes were nerfed specifically to not allow full cancel with old warp and slayer values, now that their values polarized more, it makes more sense to polarize hpr tomes alongside, not back to full counter but similar to now

[normal rose]

Tomes have been in the game for years at this point the reasoning that "stuff hasn't been balanced around them" just doesn't make sense anymore cause it obviously has been

[warped folio]

^

Then again, you guys gave warp a massive hit so it definitely isn't too much to ask to make the HPR more bearable to build around considering our damage was just halved

[ripe sandal]

nerfing -hpr values does effectively nerf the item and dampen its power (whether directly or through other items being required for a build that wouldn't normally be used for damage-centric builds), but it also raises the price floor for the item and its surrounding pieces

[lost phoenix]

it's never usually changes in a vaccum but combined that make nerfs hit like a truck sometimes (for example fallen nerfs)

[vital knoll]

And then these nerfs compound and hurt the average player more than the minmax meta players, which is leading to this negative loop for the general audience

[warped folio]

tldr;tldr
warp slayer big hit
hpr number big change for all item but not tome
tome = very important!!!!
revert tome hpr to 45 base!!!!!
happy days!!!!!!!!!

[cloud acorn]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/262010576295821312/1292946049056510093/augh.gif

[nova walrus]

what a rollercoaster man

[warped folio]

yeah but you sortof get where we're coming from right

[young jolt]

is this the endtimes of wynncraft

[nova walrus]

there are good points in here yea

[cloud acorn]

no just hop on pz cstck 200k peak dps 🥀

[nova walrus]

just please i beg stop drowning it with everything else 😭

[young jolt]

yeah im looking up a guide on how to play monumenta right now

[warped folio]

define everything else

[cloud acorn]

NO hop o megido abyss instead

[warped folio]

ive been pretty straight forward with my points

[nova walrus]

not u personally just like this thread

[cloud acorn]

me

[warped folio]

ah yeah just dont scroll up then lol

[abstract grove]

warp and slayer were made before tomes. maybe the stuff since tome rebalances has been made around it, idk- but we didn't change the HPR baselines when HPR tomes were added, or anything like that, not while I was in the team

[warped folio]

Yea but u gotta accept the fact that tomes NOW are a massive part of builds and should be factored in very closely with items

[normal geode]

why do most of the people making item changes not even play the game on main server

[nova walrus]

this is what i mean by everything else

[ripe sandal]

lmao top 10 least productive comments

[normal geode]

i dont wanna post playtime screenshots out of fear of getting banned for harassment and i understand they prob play on the test server a bit, but like some of them have 0 hours played on the main server in the past month; shouldnt playing the game you balance be a requirement?

[warped folio]

ok then just dont ponder over the non productive comments

plenty of us in the last 5 ish minutes made many good points lol

[crude drift]

are u sure they are balance or just ct member

[nova walrus]

for sure and im taking those into account
still felt like mentioning it though

[ocean edge]

number changes aren't something that need to be "felt", you can already see from the build what stats you would get and buildcraft off of the changelog. IMs should really be doing that if they want to be taking popular builds into account

[normal geode]

i checked all the im/ats i know, also im not tryna flame just genuinely curious what the thought process is

[warped folio]

ok looking forward to it

[normal geode]

revert tome nerf inshallah

[warped folio]

yea thats what we argued for

[ripe sandal]

hot take mythics shouldn’t require 4 well-rolled mythic tomes and also a bunch of items to offset their downsides and make them not miserable to play.

warp wasn’t designed with tomes in mind but in that case its old design of “offhand that kills you while you hold it for shorts periods” sucks and should get looked at again. same with slayer except those would just be wearing “boots that kill you”

[karmic sphinx]

my godly slayer and godly hpr tome can't cancel -hpr anymore luckily I stopped playing

[proud meteor]

and also please make slayer 's hpr nerf in line with everything else it wasnot that good to warrant an extra nerf

[normal geode]

yea -400 is crazy

[barren marlin]

Facts

[proud meteor]

honestly id rather hpr tomes stay where they are and slayer go to like -320 and wapr go to like -550 or -600 to reduce the roll range

[barren marlin]

A lot of these nerfs just hurt casuals more

[sterile slate]

I think warp hpr should be -800

[lunar portal]

life when warp‘s hpr range are -600 while hpr tome can go like 55/59 or sth

[slim idol]

warp is never catching a break is it, first they buff the hpr hten they nerf it back all while reducing the base dps 😔

[lucid pawn]

If I may offer a thought on the Warp change:

If I'm not mistaken, it was said somewhere today that the point of the change was to make cancelling the -hpr take more effort, so that Warp builds have to decide between dealing with -hpr or being less effective in other aspects
I feel like this makes sense overall, but suffers from how mage's strongest archetype offensively is Arcanist
For Arcanist, since you take away the heal spell, you effectively don't get the option of dealing with the -hpr at all, since you have no means to reverse a slow and indefinite drain
The result is that this as a whole feels like a very harsh nerd to how people want to play Warp (i.e. damage-focused Arcanist)

[radiant ermine]

Nah why'd you delete that

[slim idol]

anyway i dont understand the trend of "oh people are enjoying these builds and making good use of them? lets make them unusable and force them to change their builds!" almost every patch

[burnt hare]

I think the warp hpr nerf is fine i outcrafted it

Green opals and voidstone samples got buffed, run 2 ph kelp 2 green opal 2 naval stone on 2 rings and then on the bracelet run 2 ph kelp 2 voidstone sample 2 naval stone

this cancels it out pretty easily, you can even run a ls tome

[kindred sundial]

Warp definitely deserved to be gutted considering how good its qol js

[swift briar]

casual players don't have the money to get good enough crafts to outcraft it

also their warp is not going to be as good

[kindred sundial]

Slayer nerf was wtf tho

[slim idol]

i mean i have a really good warp and even i gave up and went to boreal warp

i cant be asked to change my build every 2 weeks

[burnt hare]

Edited this, you can still run bmask warp!

also guys due to the winded changes just run 25 winded tree 🔥

[burnt hare]

This one hurts forreal

[normal geode]

can u send that tree

[proud meteor]

nah you either run 20 winded or 15

you need arca mythic on 20 winded tree

[burnt hare]

https://wynnbuilder.github.io/builder?v=17#10_0690pxCR-1CUCUC19F9t9w9i510Qj01ICI-10000KBuffed Opal Ring0270540M0201f0T01040U01040W01140X01140k010FF0z0201W1W01ICI-10000KBuffed Opal Ring0270540M0201f0T01040U01040W01140X01140k010FF0z0201W1W01ICI-10000KVoidstone Bracelet0270550M0201f0T01040U01040W01140X01140k010FF0m0201G1G0Ji01QCI-10000DNerfed Warp0250570C07179-2470F50M0201f0N20W010P0j013VV0t0203g3g0z023727212010KK0w0m1u-O2P1g1000FU1000FU1000FU1000FU00z0z0+0+0+0+0-1T2Y2Y2Z2Z2a2az-PCfzJ73
WynnBuilder build:

Blue Mask
Time Rift
CR-1CUCUC19F9t9w9i51
Moontower
Buffed Opal Ring
Buffed Opal Ring
Voidstone Bracelet
Contrast
Nerfed Warp []

[burnt hare]

Idk i ran rw last time

[wary hemlock]

prime time to quit

[slim idol]

arcanist with 20 winded tree? can you show me how that tree looks like

[swift briar]

The build is like this I assume?
https://wynnbuilder.github.io/builder?v=17#10_0690F+0uj0whCR-1CTCT6w6w9i9i9m91CR-1CTCT6w6w9i9i9m91CR-1CTCT6w6w9i9i9c91CR-1CTCT6w6w9i9i9n910R110170y0M261g000000z0z0+0+0+0+0-1T2Y2Y2Z2Z2a2a
WynnBuilder build:

Blue Mask
Far Cosmos
Anxiolytic
Violet-Shift
CR-1CTCT6w6w9i9i9m91
CR-1CTCT6w6w9i9i9m91
CR-1CTCT6w6w9i9i9c91
CR-1CTCT6w6w9i9i9n91
Warp []

[burnt hare]

Hell nah

[burnt hare]

@slim idol @swift briar

[vocal swift]

even if slayer and warp only got a 25% nerf like everything else it would still be way harder to cancel since hpr tomes aren't affected by the changes

They definitely overdid it imo

[cyan storm]

please dont do this

[cloud acorn]

chat hop on the aquamarine hpr cancel again shrimple as that return to your roots

[proud meteor]

psychokinesis over tstorm probably

[ripe sandal]

it also has low healing eff which is probably a bigger downside than you think and warp lbender was already tragic. warp rift just has like 0 mana sustain anyway even if it’s decent full crafted forcing new players further out

i mean sure you can craft around it which is cool but again it shouldn’t really have to rely on 3 crafted rings and also 3 good hpr tomes on an already very expensive item lol

[burnt hare]

Buffed contrast version!
https://wynnbuilder.github.io/builder?v=17#10_0690pxCR-1CUCUC19F9t9w9i510Qj01ICI-10000KBuffed Opal Ring0270540M0201f0T01040U01040W01140X01140k010FF0z0201W1W01ICI-10000KBuffed Opal Ring0270540M0201f0T01040U01040W01140X01140k010FF0z0201W1W01ICI-10000KVoidstone Bracelet0270550M0201f0T01040U01040W01140X01140k010FF0m0201G1G053CI-100008Contrast013SThe runes carved onto the gold beads strung along this simple necklace translate into various words meaning variance. It provides many abilities though unexplainable means.023056080HThe Qira Hive0G0208D0M0201a0j010880m02038380t010CC0v020XcXc0z0202C2C01QCI-10000DNerfed Warp0250570C07179-2470F50M0201f0N20W010P0j013VV0t0203g3g0z023727212010KK0z0j1u-O2P1g1000FU1000FU1000FU1000FU00z0z0+0+0+0+0-1T2Y2Y2Z2Z2a2az-PCfzJ73
WynnBuilder build:

Blue Mask
Time Rift
CR-1CUCUC19F9t9w9i51
Moontower
Buffed Opal Ring
Buffed Opal Ring
Voidstone Bracelet
Contrast
Nerfed Warp []

[proud meteor]

warp 25% nerf would be deserved at least but slayer shouldve been within 10-20%

[burnt hare]

I'll make some stuff

[normal geode]

i feel like just running 15 winded is better then this, bc it seems really jank to play and requires arca mythic

[hard bluff]

This honestly feels true at this point it feels like ct is just pushing less diverse builds and metas to the point that so many builds/archetypes feel not fun to play anymore. I have honestly raided and played the game less with all these constant nerfs and idk why ct is so scared of buffing weapons/archetypes that are bad like do they just hate fun.
sorry for the flame but its true at least bmonk buff came with this patch 🔥

[edgy obsidian]

it feels like you guys are reverting it back to the times where warp literally was only a tp funny meme stick, with 0 viability. its already so difficult to build warp as is without crafteds.

[burnt hare]

Maybe you're right, there's a lot to experiment with, I'll make a warp guide 🔥

[normal geode]

bmonk still gonna be worst archetype in the game even with the buff

[hard bluff]

very true sadly 😭
but at least its something

[normal geode]

just like always its not enough

[barren marlin]

Bmonk is better than rift

Actually i take that back

[normal geode]

nah with the gust change + this nerf rift is actually decent

[barren marlin]

Yeah its probably better now

[burnt hare]

Rift is cool

[warped folio]

it has been better

[slim idol]

is there a cooldown to how often gust can apply winded

[swift prism]

With all the melee items the IM adding every patch and the ls buff i legit think tstack and heavy melee is how the vision the game playing...

[hard bluff]

I mean yeah bmonk is still gonna be F- tier and near unplayable but at least its a step in the right direction so I applaud them for that

[normal geode]

baby steps with them ig

[proud meteor]

no

or if there is its below how fast you can cast snake

[slim idol]

neat

1 more buff to rift and nerf to arcanist and rift might rly take the throne for raids

[red lake]

kind of a hot take: i dont think they should balance weapons based on if they are viable if players use crafteds, imo weapons should be usable for casuals as well without crafteds

[proud meteor]

well you cant really have multiple rifts in raids otherwise it would be meta lol

i think maybe you could run 1 lb 1 rw 2 other dps

or just 1 rw 3 other dps

[barren marlin]

Truth nuke

[proud meteor]

casuals can use crafteds fine

what is stopping you

[barren marlin]

Money

[slim idol]

being casual

[proud meteor]

crafteds really arent that expensive

[slim idol]

but tbf if ur casual you shouldnt aproach warp in the first place