TNA Watched Worms

[rotund mountain]

note: this may be a personal issue as i play shaman and i stay in roughly the same area around my totem most of the time

anyways, why do the worms do all of my hp as damage in one hit sometimes?
is it normal? I'm playing a regular build (resonance) with 26k ehp. (half is from agility, but i have a reasonable amount of defense. no particularly large eledef deficiencies either.) is this a bug? is this intended for the worms to do more damage than the watched ray?

i understand that they're intended as a mechanic to increase the complexity and difficulty of watched, especially when there are builds that can outrun watched, but this seems excessive when they one-hit people and don't really affect their (presumed) target audience when they can avoid the worms more easily with their mobility. were they accidentally overtuned recently? (was this a thing before? i've played TNA before in 2.1 and it didn't seem this bad)

it'd be really nice if the damage was turned down a little or the mechanic was reworked somehow (they seem to do either nothing, most of my health or all of it) so that TNA feels a little nicer. maybe some kind of constant damage in range rather than random chunks or something?

and yes, i do understand that a lot of this is skill issue, but it's pretty hard to focus on dodging or staying away from worms when i'm in one place and the worms are everywhere (at least when party members are all alive). add on the greater ones (sometimes), void holes and the armless and i'm not going to be able to focus on everything at once.

(apologies if this came off as aggressive. i recently died multiple times to worms and it's kind of annoying.)

summary: are the worms in watched supposed to do this much damage? is this an ehp issue?

[livid belfry]

i think u may be getting hit by multiple projectiles at the same time (or it’s just overtuned tbh)

[fringe isle]

maybe try dodging

[livid belfry]

that also works!

[rotund mountain]

wow didn't think of that
thank you so much for the advice

[fringe isle]

[cedar crater]

i think the worms deal true damage%

i've had that happen too, it blows but it is what it is

[robust harness]

when youre doing watched try to plan out a route youre going to take for the whole event instead of just dodging each one, youre under no aubligation to be moving until the laser goes off so just standing still will let you take time to think.

typically i either go long ways along the side of the arena or rotate between one corner and the other, theres 6 watched beams per watched phase if that helps to plan out a bit, and worms despawn after about 1.5 beams time has passed so you can loop back to where you were pretty quickly

the worms are meant to be insanely punishing and probably arent gonna get changed but theres alot you can do to make them alot less daunting

[robust harness]

its just regular damage in high ammounts iirc, i just sit in it if im on guard lol

[rotund mountain]

might try that
i mostly just go around my totem usually but i guess worms mess that up
thanks for the advice

[ivory moth]

Me when I try to peacefully go in a circle, but three other samaritans moving at Mach speed put me in harms way as collateral damage to supplement their fun.

Like do people not realize the worms retreat back into the floor.

[cedar crater]

TNA would be so peaceful if warp players didn't exist

[robust harness]

rare based foxxochan take

[rotund mountain]

me after the warp player takes the light in light room
(instant death)

[robust harness]

watched + greg matching WS makes warp so aids to have on your team

[cedar crater]

😭

[livid belfry]

this is actually really good advice tbh

[ivory moth]

Tell everyone to just move in a circle

It’s not that hard yet these Wynncraft no-lifing ADHD diagnosed kids decide to ruin it for everyone.

[still pasture]

Use frog dance

[still pasture]

Yeah running in a circle works with like a good team but its kinda iffy with certain individuals

[ivory moth]

Well if you’re an archer maybe not

[cedar crater]

it's a bit more refined than that

you don't just move in a circle, the worms can be avoided in a triangle pattern

[ivory moth]

Yeah that’s what I mean

[still pasture]

Just stay as far away from your teammates as possible and your calm

[robust harness]

nah ppl who spam tna are really chill in watched, if you see someone waiting until 3rd beam to move they prolly know what theyre doing, its the people who just found out what tna is that make watched much harder

[cedar crater]

you dodge once and the worm starts spewing, you dodge twice and the first worm will have done it's entire attack cycle and retreat, allowing you to go to the same spot of your first watched dodge

[ivory moth]

Yes

[rustic crater]

Tbh I feel like worms either do no damage or just one shot you on most glassy builds

Like hana cbomb i didnt even notice the worms

Divzer, just one shot you or kill your horizontal velocity and u get hit with another beam

But also I am self admittedly a watched gremlin

[robust harness]

most glassy builds are running agility lmfao

[rustic crater]

Oh true agi/clones are prolly whats causing that

[balmy bay]

psa: those who run around during watched, only the last beam hits you, so stop running during the first two and putting holes everywhere, this is known as watched terrorism and nobody likes terrorism

[fringe isle]

I do know some people who love terrorism

[balmy bay]

also the worms disappear after 3 watched beams so you can double back

make voidhole triangle in corner to take up least map space

[sturdy quail]

TNA itself is iffy with certain individuals

[hazy parcel]

My honest reaction when someone makes holes around the obelisks in graids

[balmy bay]

u gotta defend the obelisks

make sure those etw pilled tryhards dont dare go near them

[balmy bay]

🌾

[lavish roost]

The div players remain silence cause they were all eaten by the worms

[balmy bay]

the div players remain silent because they went extinct

[ivory moth]

Is Div even worth playing

Not from a fun perspective but from a meta perspective.

[cedar crater]

nah not really

if you're gonna blow money into builds just play easy fallen and win

you'll be a better glass cannon than divzer will ever be

[sullen tiger]

but
but
divzer boltslinger
my 3hp divzer et boltslinger

[cedar crater]

actually since you're here mardek, can you explain the flying boltslinger tech

i attempted it but arrow storm only kept me stuck in the air, not actually pushing me up

[sullen tiger]

jump into air
arrowstorm while looking down
escape
repeat

[sullen tiger]

maybe a symptom of the recoil removal on ground

idk i haven't done bolt much lately i'll try it again later

actually no wait i remember why i don't play bolt it's because they removed recoil ):< get someone else to try it

[cedar crater]

how come removed?? isn't like, windstorm supposed to give recoil as well as arrow hurricane

it should work as normal, only that it is no longer a thing that halts your movement when grounded

[robust harness]

recoil is only removed on the ground you can still do this in the air when elusive isnt active

[agile pike]

Fallen is not easy

Just bcuz its good doesnt mean its an easy playstyle

[sullen tiger]

yes i know but the removal of ground recoil completely ruins bolt for me
i basically relied on it
i've got a whole text wall i can forward iyw

wait. nope. i'm derailing a thread again. cutting this conversation off here. can continue in dms.

i think watched worms do actually probably do a little too much damage

[robust harness]

forward in dms if u want lol

[robust harness]

i think they kinda need to be unreasonable to force you away from standing in the same corner, if it was just a chunk or a dot youd kinda be able to just ignore them alot

[robust harness]

divzer can hit consistantly the damage BP tcrack does in burst its kinda insane how strong it is tbh, fallen has way better qol tho

[ivory moth]

oh

Well they normally don't do damage.

Because your DPS is normally 0 when you're dead

[robust harness]

real, ask leafish if ur actually curious abt div hes the goat on it

[ivory moth]

I have one with high raw spell and crappy steal

[rustic crater]

Raw spell is basically cosmetic, ms is the only stat that matters lol

[ivory moth]

yeah that's why

[rustic crater]

And tbh divzers damage feels fine in boss I think its room qol is just awful

And like fallen is easier to play anyways and does more damage so from a meta perspective id just play fallen

[robust harness]

pretty much unusable lmfao

[rustic crater]

But divzer is very fun

[robust harness]

yeah

never seen a really good div player get outdamaged in boss

[ivory moth]

Spatial Awareness ++++

[rustic crater]

Tbh divzer is usually super low on the damage leaderboards too cuz it sucks at damage farming

[wintry solstice]

that means divzer dmg is almost all legit

[rustic crater]

True

[ivory moth]

I found one with 90% life steal that's like 1.5 stacks

[rustic crater]

Ls is also cosmetic at a point

[ivory moth]

Oh shit I mean mana steal

[rustic crater]

Tbh 30+ ms on divzer is usable

anything less and its a stretch and chain will usually make up for ur undersustain if u have a bad ms roll

[ivory moth]

It's funny how raw spell is a cosmetic apparently

[wintry solstice]

i mean ls is more relevant now compared to 2.0 for divzer

[rustic crater]

I mean difference between min roll spell damage max roll spell damage is like 15% sd ish

its just not noticeable because of how much td and sd normal divzer builds slap

[ivory moth]

Time to buy a Div

[agile pike]

Tbh divzer is easier than fallen.

[ivory moth]

3 stx

Wrong place, but eh I kinda wanna try this out

[sullen tiger]

unusable, you say

[agile pike]

Yea mana steal matters alot

Imean if u cycle like a snail probably mana steal wont matter as much.

[rustic crater]

I think even like 6 cps no aspect storm bomb melee cycle doesn’t sustain with less than 30 ms on divzer

on standard emage build

[robust harness]

yeah most good div builds are tight with rolls and swapping out a damage item for another ms to compensate will be a massive dps hit, even on low cps cycles its really hard to sustain

[hidden obsidian]

No chance

[robust harness]

bros going too far here

fallen bps down to oneshot territory, divzer is in oneshot territory perma

[rustic crater]

Fallen also either has to have 40 agi or 60 def

[hidden obsidian]

offhand catamaran doesnt even compare to divzer imo

[ivory moth]

And Divzer probaably needs to get closer than Fallen

[robust harness]

about the same tbh

[rustic crater]

Thats debatable, I think ga range is like 5 blocks without panoptes

[ivory moth]

Eh I'll just use the arrow storm spread reduction aspect

[agile pike]

I play both quite a bit, divzer seems easier idk just imo

[robust harness]

doesnt do much lol

[rustic crater]

Divzer has a higher skill floor, fallen has a higher skill ceiling prolly

[ivory moth]

Sustain Fallen > Burst Fallen in difficulty imo

[robust harness]

they have an identical gameplan in boss

u just stay in a similar sweetspot and get ur damage

[sullen tiger]

selvut harwrol.gif

[robust harness]

only diff is fallen isnt perma in oneshot range

[ivory moth]

Fallen is also chill during invincibility stages

[robust harness]

unusable is being used insanely hyperbolically here

[rustic crater]

Tbh a lot of the skills from divzer carried over to fallen in a weird way

[robust harness]

exactly

[ivory moth]

Like extremely chill

[rustic crater]

Cycle and kiting is exactly the same hilariously

[ivory moth]

Is the spread reduction aspect mandatory

[rustic crater]

I think it actually does nothing

I think bolt grape bouncing + arrows is mandatory

[robust harness]

literally lmfao

[agile pike]

Arent u techniclaly are? You have to be somewhat close to do peak dmg

[rustic crater]

last is personal preference between shrapnel or frenzy (i prefer frenzy)

Shrapnel makes ur mana a lot better tho

Elusive is an honorable mention but i find its not as good after recoil changes

[ivory moth]

Yeah but the aspects kind of made this a non issue

[robust harness]

hero will always have agi and the alka/tcrack build is gonna have enouigh to tank weak hits like bulb bombs or a melee

[ivory moth]

They have to build defense and agi to bring a healing offhand anyway

Soooo
Nyct Deli CWG Emage

[rustic crater]

ye

[ivory moth]

Does it contain crafted

[rustic crater]

u can play crafted

accs are pretty cheap iirc

i still use 1 naval stone 3 tree sap accs

[agile pike]

Jst dont get hit🤭

[still pasture]

You could always play with crabs too

[robust harness]

if youre not getting hit on either one how is fallen harder?

[ivory moth]

Playing with crabs instead of warchief...

[agile pike]

Divzer just easier idk for me idk what to tell u

[ivory moth]

Not a true Fallen warrior

[robust harness]

crazy

[still pasture]

Its not the most optimal but you can plau pretty careless

[agile pike]

Ive played enough fallen to know 🤭

[still pasture]

But you cant put up tcrack numbers

[ivory moth]

no meta ings

Oh wait

[rustic crater]

uh lemme find it

https://hppeng-wynn.github.io/crafter/#19C9CA2A2A29i9m91

i do rings and necklace with static bracelet

[wanton nest]

feephi worm

[balmy bay]

play nych tesla cwg warchief like a real man

[ivory moth]

Tesla for the damage and mana sustain ig

[balmy bay]

warchief is also a bit more dmg

or tesla emage deli is kinda for qol

which imo just run the frenzy aspect if u want more walkspeed

tna has some insane sustain buffs and not a lot of hp so if u run chiefs tesla grab a sustain buff or kill it before you run out lol

[rustic crater]

Forget cwg play tsanc like a man

[ivory moth]

We playing at 2K ehp 🔥

(Does tsanc actually do more than cwg)

[hollow compass]

No

[ivory moth]

Mana steal helps ig

[balmy bay]

im not gonna lie psure the poison dmg from cwg makes it outclass thunder sanct

sounds like a fun idea lol

[rustic crater]

tsanc sp lets u run 4 cr accs is the main thing

its still pretty close tho

[ivory moth]

-3K ehp for a 3K dmg difference

[balmy bay]

which divz build r u using to be lacking sp

wait wtf crafted beats diastatic i forgot divz has like 100000 base
not worth cus u need perf roll tho

[rustic crater]

yeah its like 110% meme

(i play emage variant lol)

[robust harness]

sounds worth to me 👍

[pseudo harbor]

They deal true damage but they get blocked by Mantle funnily enough

Yes OP is getting hit by multiple projectiles and each one does true damage, that's why they insta die. Unfortunately it's a skill issue on your end though, as that's intended behavior. Shaman is the most annoying one to dodge with if you don't have frog leap or fast enough walk speed

[robust harness]

this is just not true 💀 like in the least toxic way possible you are straight up spreading misinformation agility, arrowshield, defense, clones, shaman stances all change the damage you take substantially, and guardian builds can just sit in them its just high regular damage, next time youre in tna go check for yourself

[pseudo harbor]

From my own experience playing across various classes the worm projectiles always did a set % of my maximum health. Unless that's changed, that's been my personal experience

[robust harness]

no sense arguing about it here, if i remember il get hit by a few and clip it to show u what i mean when im on later today

[pseudo harbor]

👍👍👍 from experience I thought each projectile did like 15% of your bar. It always did around that much to my health bar regardless of ele defenses, or max HP, so I'm just speaking from personal experience tbh

[hidden obsidian]

i dont know shit but i do know that each projectile does much more than 15%

[robust harness]

yeah real the actual damage formula is

if: on epoch damage = 10 million

[hidden obsidian]

i dont play epoch it feels like 70% 😭

[robust harness]

u main fallen right? youre just on 60 def for rots iirc

[hidden obsidian]

i play catamaran in tna and notg

[robust harness]

OH ok gg yeah it all makes sense now

[hidden obsidian]

still its def not true damage and i know it shouldnt be

[balmy bay]

it isnt

1 blob can 1 tap ive seen it happen a lot on lower ehp builds (divzer)

[ivory moth]

<player> was divided by zero

(Not a real death message, but it should be one if you are holding Divzer)

[robust harness]

@pseudo harbor first hit doesnt proc agility, second hit does https://medal.tv/games/minecraft/clips/jsOqDOps8BdYFxreH?invite=cr-MSxKTEMsMjMyMDQwMDQxLA

[pseudo harbor]

ahhhh I see

[sturdy quail]

i thought you hate warp players in TNA

[robust harness]

was in a 4 stack and i wanted to troll

poor guy on comms is getting griefed mid watched while i recorded lmfao