Why The Emeralds Nerf From Raids?

[ocean hazel]

So i mean...

Aspects...?

[wild ibex]

aspects?? tomes???

[ocean hazel]

Also guild xp and guild leaderboard

[jovial hamlet]

this doesnt really matter

[ocean hazel]

Say this to seq that pays their raiders 50-60stx

[jovial hamlet]

what if someone has max.........

[jovial hamlet]

ah yes one guild makes sense

[ocean hazel]

Once you are max you are done imo
It's like proffing, once you get max level what do you wanna do?

[wild ibex]

no one's forcing nbd to raid lmfao

[jovial hamlet]

idk maybe get more emeralds...

[small yew]

ma bad ill quit 👋

[wild ibex]

theres more content and raids aitn js grind u can do them for fun

[jovial hamlet]

if u find other things fun other than raiding then u do u, but i enjoy raiding the most

[ocean hazel]

So,

1. If you have maxed out all aspects, you should have at least a nw of 300stx
2. Once you have that much nw, if you really want to grind even more money there are better ways then raiding

[wild ibex]

k then raid for fun

[ocean hazel]

Raiding should be done for fun, aspects and tomes

[jovial hamlet]

u dont make 300stx from raiding ;-;

[small yew]

if i made 300stx from maxing aspects i would have 300stx 😭

[ocean hazel]

nw not stx

[jovial hamlet]

what is thtis guy talking about

[wild ibex]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/262010576295821312/1028927418800545864/caption.gif

[small yew]

yes net

[ocean hazel]

It takes how much times to get all aspects, of all rarities to max level?

8-10 months of raiding non-stop? Does anyone even reached that point?

[small yew]

time is a very bad way to determine this just look at runs

[brave gull]

What the

[small yew]

and yes people are already done

[jovial hamlet]

its rng based

[ocean hazel]

Then we can calculate how many stx they have done if we know how much they raided

[small yew]

i myself am missing like 2 shaman aspects that are massively useless and dont appear in raid pools i play so i dont bother getting them!!!

[small yew]

yes that is currently being done but rough estimate around 100-125 lol

[ocean hazel]

I dont think it's that bad
The more trials and the more you get to avg

[small yew]

and then you deduct the price of tol

and uh oh -25 to -30stx ish

[ocean hazel]

100-125stx??? That feels too little

[small yew]

yes exactly it is very little stop nerfing our rates thanku

oh this is only raw btw im not counting powders or corks ig

[jovial hamlet]

if ive calculated correctly from all the raids ive done i dontt think i even have past 150stx nw

[ocean hazel]

@umbral stirrup I'm calling you because 100-125stx from getting all aspects feels too little

[small yew]

who wants to go through a few hundred screenshots of raid reward chests and calculate the average profit including items with me !!!!!

le is much easier to tally and if ur spamming raids in a bad week your raw / hr is doomed

[umbral stirrup]

i got about 200 stx profit from raids at best

[ocean hazel]

That alr feels more fair

[umbral stirrup]

including item drops

and obviously deducting tol rune cost

[ocean hazel]

Also including graid rewards?

[small yew]

graid gives 10% more

it is 3 (three) reward pulls

[ocean hazel]

and the 16 ebs your guild obtains

[small yew]

and idek how that works does that just get items deleted if u drop alot of tomes

[umbral stirrup]

the le from graid is negligible and i did all aspects before the graid changes iirc

[small yew]

split between 4 people wow 4 eb per run game changing D:

[frigid wren]

Maybe this shouldn't be the point 😔

I have a family of 5 to feed

[umbral stirrup]

but looking at my financial situation in the past few months (i do keep track of my le usage in my head), 200 stx seems about right as an upper estimate from all the raids done

[wild ibex]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/862008572133376041/1059833234139127928/test.gif

[ocean hazel]

said this, we have a source that says 200stx from getting all aspects to maxed

[small yew]

it depends on the person

[umbral stirrup]

and about 150 stx is raw le ig?

[small yew]

wise definitely has overflow on a good few aspects idk if he was focussing them at the start

600k tcc score and a decent bit of other raids

[ocean hazel]

and once you have 200stx
If you need even more stx you will not do graids
If you do graids is for fun

[umbral stirrup]

yeah well i definitely have to overflow lol, the last few weeks of raiding is literally just waiting for a certain aspect to appear in pool and shoot them down one by one

[mortal basin]

200stx(including items)

[small yew]

itd prob take around 2k runs to max aspects

[jovial hamlet]

bro u have to remember that this a rng based game ;-;

[ocean hazel]

Flip a coin 100000 times

[umbral stirrup]

var(x bar) = var(x) / n

[ocean hazel]

tell to me, how close are we gonna on the ratio head/tails

[small yew]

and the amt of money you make depends on the LE pool so if ur really active its more like flipping a coin about 10 times

and if 4 of those happen to be the last 4 tna pools uh oh you are now in poverty congrats

[wild ibex]

holy yap

[small yew]

2 1 1 was a crime i made like 2.5le a run that week D:

[ocean hazel]

Over a ton of trials you will always get closer and closer to the avg
Dont try to talk about rng

[jovial hamlet]

raid more 👍

[ocean hazel]

because i have enough of people talking about rng from lootruns

[umbral stirrup]

also the actual amount of raids you do for max aspect is too hard to measure

cuz the longer you span the less overflow you will get due to being able to select best pools, so like people who rush raids will definitely have more runs when they max everything while the ones who take like a year to max all aspects will have less runs

[small yew]

the average depends on the lootpool which changes every week, not raid, so you arent flipping that coin 10000 times

[umbral stirrup]

i did roughly 3k runs for max aspects cuz i have to suffer through overflow a lot but even then i felt like the pool rng i got was already really good

[leaden current]

Why do you have HERO rank in here get CHAMPION noob!

[small yew]

^ hero

[lusty wind]

yeetusfetus

[ocean hazel]

So, i think we cleared up everything and you dont have enything more to say

• You do raids for aspects and tomes
• Once you have all aspects maxed out, if you need more money you will have enough nw to make really good money and you will do graids for funs

[mortal basin]

☝️🤓 but the more you raid the more you get close to the average

[jovial hamlet]

☝️🤓 but the more you raid the more you get close to the average

[small yew]

gg discussion no more

[lusty wind]

☝️🤓 but the more you raid the more you get close to the average

[umbral stirrup]

yeah theres no reason to actually do raids for le if you only want le

raids are for aspects and then after finishing aspects you would just do raids for fun rather than caring about the le cuz you have better ways to make le (cough cough market manip) at that point

[jovial hamlet]

options what if people just want to raid for le?

[wild ibex]

graid

[umbral stirrup]

still it should be clear enough that inflation was severe ever since 2.1 started and raids are one of the main contributer to this (in fact the eco entered a weird state of inflated items but slow sale)

hence a le nerf is indeed, justified, economically.

[mortal basin]

im raiding for le because lootrunning is boring

[wild ibex]

^^

[jovial hamlet]

chrono inflated ummean

[small yew]

anyways tldr the raiders dont want to make even less money cus we are all poor but want to buy better rolls for our stupidly expensive raid builds ahem steamjet fucking walkers

[wild ibex]

can you read

[ocean hazel]

If you need money, there are better ways to grind money then graids
Ing grinding makes 1+stx per hour, and some spots even 2-3stx per hour

[jovial hamlet]

go raid

[wild ibex]

womp womp

[leaden current]

Oh this wa dude below has champion in-game i don't

[small yew]

but thats not raiding anymore

[ocean hazel]

Or just flip/manip items

[jovial hamlet]

again options bro, sure maybe other ppl would prefer that but i myself prefer raiding and some others too

[ocean hazel]

Once i'm max level on prof, if i prof more it's not for money but because i enjoy prof

[small yew]

yk guys we could just ask for more cork 3s in pool instead of reverting LE nerf

[lusty wind]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/361194799744679947/1194475235253162045/image0.gif

[umbral stirrup]

the money from raids is fundamentally different compared to the money from most other activities because raids are a direct injection of money supply while other activities are just producing goods to trade for existing le in circulation

[wild ibex]

yeah selvut explained it yesterday

[leaden current]

Good job

[small yew]

or give us like horses back or something

[umbral stirrup]

since raids are the main money supply in this economy, in the long run the raid le nerf should not change the real profit rates from raids if we change our unit to products instead of le

[lusty wind]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/580230785391656979/1322463898716209202/HAHAHA.gif

[jovial hamlet]

HAHHAHAHA

[small yew]

but like saying that oh you should raid for fun is like telling the people who enjoy lring to lr for fun once they have 500stx

[leaden current]

💀

[ocean hazel]

If i want to put myself in pain to prof for money even after max level, it's my fault
You have decided to do a less-efficent activity even if you have better options

[small yew]

i want HORSES wise
HORSES

replace all the LE drops with HORSES ill gamble all the horses

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/262010576295821312/1321707995603927082/horse.gif?=&width=1474&height=1404

[ocean hazel]

I want horses in the new minigame :(
I want white horse to the moooon

[umbral stirrup]

horses being back into the drop table would be cool cuz cheaper horses benefit new players if anything

while it wouldnt cause adverse effects to the entire economy like what the overabundance of le did to the current eco

[small yew]

im so smart problem solved
horses :DDDDD

[ocean hazel]

fr, horses back to raids would be cool

[jovial hamlet]

https://tenor.com/view/nerd-at-computer-gif-26710836

[umbral stirrup]

raid le is certainly something that needs to be fine tuned as it acts as a constant stream of money supply injection but nerfing it would for sure be good for the economy for now (however, the nerf must not be overtuned, and i hope it isnt, otherwise the eco will suffer in a different manner)

[ocean hazel]

Also, a reminder we talking about 15%

[small yew]

if its 15% it shouldnt be too overtuned

itd be nice if they had some numbers on how much LE was coming in and from what sources, and where it was going out

[ocean hazel]

they prob do have but not share

[small yew]

like the numbers the skyblock admins had that were (hopefully) definitive enough to shut everybody up

[mortal basin]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/262010576295821312/1321707116351848498/monumentofhorse.gif

[ocean hazel]

I remember salted sending some graphs for making people shut the heck out of them about the lr update generating more mythics compared to old lrs

[umbral stirrup]

honestly one shouldnt treat this raid le nerf as a nerf to raids, but rather a monetary policy

if you see it in this perspective, you would understand why its undoubtedly a good change especially when the new endgame content may generate more money supply

[ocean hazel]

In theory the new minigame should allow new players to grind le easier

[latent reef]

I would like to remind you that I indeed can roll 8 le per run with 3 (2 le drops)

that means I lost 3 le just like that kekw

[ocean hazel]

new players have been suffering hard grinding money
Because pfinder is a pain, they usually fail a tn

[latent reef]

How much money tho 🤔🤔

[ocean hazel]

Tealy said that is slightly lower then a full raid group

[small yew]

i feel like this discussion has derailed alot

[latent reef]

The discussion already ended tbf

[warm void]

woah this is wynncraft, not a fcking vanillacraft xd

[ocean hazel]

I mean, my final statement i think ended the discussion

[wild ibex]

@void ermine @void ermine fuck both of yall

[latent reef]

That’s crazy

[small yew]

there hasnt really been much of an argument cus two sides are making two different points

the raiders want to keep their money from raids
other people are telling them to do something else for money (but uh oh they dont want to 🤯 )

[undone imp]

it is very much not vanilla don't worry

[small yew]

anyways im going to bed there better be horses in the tna pool when i wake up 👿

[ocean hazel]

And me saying that, if you decide to do something suboptimal it's your fault

[small yew]

yeah we know its suboptimal but why make it worse 😭😭

[jovial hamlet]

?? exactly

[ocean hazel]

It's still good enough \o/

[small yew]

once again like nerfing ignis (why)

[wild ibex]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/866453187421929562/1249092621431734272/caption.gif

[jovial hamlet]

ignis nerf is such comedy

[warm void]

from words cts said, its vanilla w additional resourcepack

[umbral stirrup]

raid le has clearly been overtuned lol and this is NOT healthy for the economy, nerfing le from raids also help with equality, and in the long run the purchasing power you gain from raids should be around the same as rn

[ocean hazel]

the hp nerf i still dont understand
The fire damage i understand

[small yew]

oh but ignis is still good enough guys

[jovial hamlet]

ignis so op guys!

[small yew]

me wnat compensiaton me wnat horse ✅ ✅

[ocean hazel]

considering it gives also aspects and tomes
If you do raids after having all aspects maxed out, is not for money and if you do it's your decision and your fault

[undone imp]

Well it isn't

[ocean hazel]

We all want horses

[devout topaz]

cuz they gave a bit too much raw

[small yew]

hello linny can we have some other items in raid like 🐴 🥺

[devout topaz]

it is what it is

[wild ibex]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/866453187421929562/1249430215223148544/caption.gif

[devout topaz]

i wisjh

[ocean hazel]

🐴

[jovial hamlet]

ignis nerf (it is what it is)

[warm void]

it is...

[distant shale]

This caption but add “nerfs ur le an hour”

[umbral stirrup]

we definitely need horses from somewhere, horses rn just aint it 😭

[mortal basin]

i don't think we are getting anything with this attitude lmao

[wild ibex]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/262010576295821312/1249162358920712203/F.gif

[devout topaz]

this thread looks so cancerous to read through lmfao

[ocean hazel]

I love how everyone is in war about ems getting nerfed
But we all unite for 🐴 and ignis

[undone imp]

all of wynncraft is just vanilla with a texture pack then

[distant shale]

I kinda want to level a new MC account to raid just to run completely fine builds that aren’t meta and see how it goes

[ocean hazel]

This is the definition of community

[distant shale]

There’s no way it’s as bad as people say or you’d hear more people mention removal

[umbral stirrup]

your game knowledge and skill matters more than the build itself anyway

[small yew]

^

[devout topaz]

agree

[distant shale]

True!!

[devout topaz]

u can run tcc in like cosmic set cluster if you really want

[ocean hazel]

It's not that bad
When i raid i run non-meta builds and it's fun

The problem is that we are somewhat skilled confronted to new players

[distant shale]

Guys don’t tell the raid groups but I don’t know how to do tree and I beta tested that shit 😭

[umbral stirrup]

one other side of class building is not to minmax efficiency but rather making a build that even new players can run effortlessly and effectively, those are the builds that will actually get popular

[mortal basin]

yeah but don't run champion with bob mythic at your first time raiding

[wild ibex]

just grab tree lr path

[devout topaz]

its ok i used the wynntils lr path for the first 8 months after tna release

[warm void]

so u can do spell/abilities in vanilla? how to do that?

[devout topaz]

like not a real lr path i would record my own path lol

[distant shale]

I probably would have learned it if it wasn’t broken until like two days before beta

[ocean hazel]

lb was kinda good because allowed new people a really easy to pick-up build

[small yew]

cumhero will always be the best of both worlds and my favorite creation

[umbral stirrup]

i still dont know how to light properly after 4k+ tna runs and every time i take light i just murder everyone

[distant shale]

It used to spawn the mobs out of bounds and we had to run commands to go to next room

[undone imp]

I have no idea what you're even arguing anymore lmao

[devout topaz]

their fault 4 being slow 😼

[umbral stirrup]

fr

[distant shale]

I just read their entire argument idk either

[small yew]

oh yeah 600 tcc runs in sm1 told me if i have particles on the platform warns me before it pierces my ass

[jovial hamlet]

itts ok ez solo the lgiht room >B)

[mortal basin]

light room is now idiot proof how🤯

[small yew]

most 🤯 moment

[ocean hazel]

Me neither nw

[umbral stirrup]

anyway my point is you dont need to actually understand everything to play raids effectively

[distant shale]

Consensus: bad argument, sentenced to no walkspeed ID

[ocean hazel]

Please give us grappling hook
and i will be so happy

[distant shale]

I feel if it’s not there, it will probably be added later

[mortal basin]

me when I commit the olinus tree cycle 🔥🔥🔥
(the raid failed)

[small yew]

🐴 🏇 🎠 🐎

[ocean hazel]

Grappling hook is one of the funniest movement spells in the game
But it can never be used

because there is always something better

raids? No, there are no walls in boss rooms
Lootruns? Escape is just way better and who tf uses archer (only t307 does)

[warm void]

according to cts, everything is disabled, including addtional walkspeed and jh, so u just do in the void by running around w default speed, just like in normal vanilla. How is that much different?

[distant shale]

Grapple Hook was S tier when it was added

The problem was a single nerf
No longer can go through barriers

[devout topaz]

it died as soon as it couldnt shoot through barriers

[umbral stirrup]

theres custom movement

[devout topaz]

yep exactly LMAO

[devout topaz]

maybe play the content first before spending an hour telling people about it,,,

[mortal basin]

uhh there are cosmetics lmao

[short sequoia]

Why was this even done

[devout topaz]

blanket change that affected alot of stuff

[distant shale]

I’m ngl I feel this so should be undone, I remember we had a cool compilation of it being used and there was no stupid out of bounds trick

The closest was getting on top of SE intro spikes but like, WHO CARES

[umbral stirrup]

if its just walking around like in vanilla minecraft then yeah everyone would quit wynn but obviously it has more depth than that

[devout topaz]

ive brought it up both liek right after it happened and recently so. maybe

but yea there wasnt really any issues w it going thru barriers

[solid oasis]

Thanks

[undone imp]

Oh they only went through barriers? I thought they could grapple onto barriers

[devout topaz]

nah

you still had to hit smth

[undone imp]

damn okay

weird then

[fresh cosmos]

someone tldr me the 1245 msgs

[devout topaz]

hoes mad

[short sequoia]

any emerald reduction = undeserved / raids ruined

[fresh cosmos]

how much is it getting reduced

how many percents lower is the reward on average

[timber oak]

about 15%, I believe

[fresh cosmos]

and people got this mad over 15% thats crazy

[limber owl]

tbh it could have been 1% and people would have gotten mad still

[robust sorrel]

oh its just 15%? damn here i thought yall we're gonna go drag it back into its ass like how severe those lootrun nerfs got it

tho might I ask, who specifically is crying over making 8 le average through raids

[jovial hamlet]

8le avg per raid is nott realistic

[wise sphinx]

So warp abd idol spam

[tribal roost]

Sometimes, it's not 15%.
https://discord.com/channels/143852930036924417/1307117227572596817

[wise sphinx]

Nvm doom

[void ermine]

is it gonna be locked again after max tier of the rank bs

like lootrun/raid grandmaster

[ocean hazel]

Locking these things behind a rank allows players to learn slowly

[tribal roost]

And sometimes, experienced players that start a new class finds it stupid af to do it all over again

Imagine you have to watch Lari cleaning up her mess 5 times (5 classes).

[earnest orchid]

5x times of lari screentime is an absolute win

[robust sorrel]

could you explain why without mentioning any other lategame money making method?

[queen star]

16->18 hours of constantly being in a raid party 2 hours more is a considerable difference

[ocean hazel]

it's 15% more

[queen star]

https://tenor.com/view/hog-exploding-exploding-hog-funny-idiot-gif-13702011850125732811

[devout topaz]

mfw the 15% rewards nerf nerfs the rewards by 15% and makes it take 15% longer to get the same amount of money

💵🕊️

[queen star]

yeah damn he got me i never thought of it like that whaaat whod have thunk 15% less money means 15% more time to get the money

[ocean hazel]

🔥

People always overreact when their money making method get nerfed, even if there are good reasons for

That's what i understood from this thread

[queen star]

me when i hyper generalize to make passive aggressive and reductive statements about my ideological opponent

https://tenor.com/view/arguing-arguing-with-me-pointless-meme-mike-o'hearn-gif-10976090569355842553

[ocean hazel]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1025425782836834384/1318076907543203870/caption.gif

[queen star]

"people always need to be contrarians when a majority holds an opinion, even if there are good reasons for it"

this is how goofy you sound rn

[fresh cosmos]

you'd be shocked to find out the person in that gif running away from the totem is actually wackolo

[queen star]

aint no fanfic like a wackolo fanfic

[ocean hazel]

There are a ton of good thesis above man about why this is a good change, you can look at them up

But now i can say that i understand how CT has felt when there was the mythic base dps nerf

[queen star]

youre rage baiting cause if youd read it you would have seen i responded to it and participated in the discussion lol

[ocean hazel]

No i'm not, there are a lot of good reasonings above, idk if you were one of the people i talked with

What can i say, provide some good things we can talk about why this is a bad thing and then we can reason \o/
Economically it makes sense, it's not too big as a nerf (only 15%), we are also adding a new way to generete raw le in the economy

I hope we all agree that hyperinflation is not good

[coarse mulch]

Shouldnt affect nol tho 🤷

Digging it further into the ground

The average raider doesnt even make that much money from raiding even from pfinder i dont really think its needed

[mellow hill]

Chat any ragebaiters

[worldly sparrow]

fitting given what the caption is based off of!

[pure solstice]

also idk who told ppl that raids where 4 mins at pfinder, with guildmates is usually 5-6 mins (plus 30-45 seconds from in between and also the preparation makes it almost 15-45 seconds), so no, the one who told ppl that, and also, this is an average of a guildraid with 3 gambits.

[wild ibex]

that aint no graid avg

[pure solstice]

7 mins for 3.5 le, makes up to 0.5 le per minute or 30 le per hour, guildraid with 3 gambits

yes, is the average, i can make a compilation if you dont believe it

[fresh cosmos]

graid or normal?

[pure solstice]

graid

[wild ibex]

i dont wanna see no damn compilation

[pure solstice]

3 gambits

[dusky spear]

get one person with a decent build and ur shaving 2+mins off that run

[pure solstice]

yeah sure, because everyplayer in the game has good builds and good skills

not everyone is top 5 tna players

this is the average

[dusky spear]

ofc not, with 4 good builds itd be way faster still

the nerf is mostly targeted towards good parties i guess

[pure solstice]

the oposite

the nerf affects mostly bad-average players/builds

and even good players

[wild ibex]

this is a minor nerf lmfao

[pure solstice]

the only ones with a positive effect is excelent players or otp, sinces it increase the LE farming gap from skilled players

is like nerfing/buffing in games because in competitive games there are characters/builds that proplayers uses, it doesn't reflect on the whole community or the average player

[wild ibex]

this is good for the economy

[pure solstice]

and this just agravates more that issue, good players from good/bigger guilds won't notice that much change, smaller guilds or the average player will have less LE making

[wild ibex]

the one time we get a good change n yall always complainin lmfao

[pure solstice]

the opposite, guilds like DUDE/AVO will still gain almost the same, while smaller guilds won't gain as much since they don't have that much skilled players

[dusky spear]

everyones gaining 15% or whatever less than they do now man

[pure solstice]

making a bigger bridge between skilled and non-skilled players

[wild ibex]

ok? get better then

[pure solstice]

not the case, i just said and example

[undone imp]

please note that the nerf will change literally nothing about the emeralds in this chest

[dusky spear]

??

[wild ibex]

🤯

[undone imp]

the reduction of emeralds in question is just reducing the 2le reward slots to 1le

that's it

[pure solstice]

then is not doing "literally" nothing

wording matters

[dense kelp]

The chest you showed had no 2le slots tho

[undone imp]

nothing about the rewards you posted would change

[dense kelp]

So nothing changes in that chest, as said

[undone imp]

they would be the exact same pre and post nerf

[pure solstice]

not the case, since the slot is downgraded, thats not how stadistics works

[undone imp]

which slot

[undone imp]

I am like 80% sure that 2le and 1le slots have the same chance to be rewarded in chests

[dusky spear]

man you didnt roll any 2le in that chest. so nothing would change

[pure solstice]

is like eliminating mythic aspects and just because i didn't got mythics "nothing about the rewards you posted would change"

[dense kelp]

But that would be true

[pure solstice]

bruh

[undone imp]

the 2le slots aren't being removed. They're being changed to 1le slots

there are still the same amount of high le slots with the same chance (probably)

[pure solstice]

so, less AVERAGE rewards right?

[undone imp]

Correct

[pure solstice]

then is less rewards, basic stadistics.

[undone imp]

My guy. I was referring to your specific rewards in your screenshot

nothing about them will change

[pure solstice]

i was refering to the average that i would get with graid 3 gambits

[undone imp]

that is all I'm saying

[pure solstice]

and refering to the importance of that 2 le for that

[drowsy harness]

holy shit

[dusky spear]

Yea ur average will be 15% or so lower is the number ct(?) have said on average as will everyone elses

[drowsy harness]

this is painful to read

[pure solstice]

8 LE?

8 LE per normal raid without gambits, right

[wild ibex]

word

[tight owl]

Word?

[drowsy harness]

no, 15%

[dusky spear]

Good faith i think

[pure solstice]

so, 15% of 8 LE per normal raid without gambits, right

[drowsy harness]

is english your first language

[wild ibex]

😭

[pure solstice]

nope

[tight owl]

What's your first language I'm curious

[pure solstice]

spanish

[drowsy harness]

i see. basically 2 LE pulls were changed to now give 1 LE instead. this, when compared to all other emerald drops, will result in about a 15% decrease in LE generated on average

[wild ibex]

mamaguevo

[drowsy harness]

this has nothing to do with the 8 le figure that was said earlier

[pure solstice]

and what is the amount of LE generated on average?

[undone imp]

the average amount is roughly 15% lower

[drowsy harness]

it looks like it can vary quite a bit depending on your party

[pure solstice]

what is the estimated range for lowest average (normal raid 0 gambits) and higher (graid 3 gambits)?

[drowsy harness]

if youre expecting a specific number i dont have it, im just telling you what the change is

[pure solstice]

like im sure that was tested

no, im looking for a range

[drowsy harness]

and you want that range to include numbers, right

[pure solstice]

an estimation

[drowsy harness]

ah okay. it looks like LE from a raid can range from a little to a lot

[pure solstice]

so reduce the variation by testing, if you do more raids you can get less deviation

[drowsy harness]

you want less variance between 0 gambit raids and 3 gambit graids?

[pure solstice]

no, i want to know the variance in lets just say n=50 in 0 gambit raids and another case of n= 50 in 3 gambit graids

2 cases of distribution

[drowsy harness]

.

[pure solstice]

thats not one specific number, is a distribution

[wild ibex]

😭

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/262010576295821312/1249162358920712203/F.gif

[drowsy harness]

ah okay ill rephrase:
i am not going to give you any numbers, I dont have the data on hand and I dont really care to give you internal data that you will probably ignore anyways

[dusky spear]

if everyone gets 15% less money on average per run it doesnt matter what the current average is. everyone will just get 15% less than they currently do

[drowsy harness]

yeah that also, idek why you want this info unless you're just trying to frame it as if we didnt do any testing or as if CT don't know the actual LE generation from raids

[pure solstice]

i do care about the average, because is not the same 15% of 2-5 le on 80% cases than 15% of 8-12 le on 20% cases

[drowsy harness]

i think you also just fundamentally dont understand how any of the reward systems work

and are ignoring multiple people who are explaining it to you

[pure solstice]

yeah im ignoring that since i don't have the data besides that 15%, i want to know something that i haven't got from the others.

[drowsy harness]

genius

[sand cloud]

lexnt ran expected value befoee and after the nerf for 33 pulls

[pure solstice]

where i could find this?

[mental schooner]

it's hard to get a perfect number because the emerald stack sizes in a given raid's pool vary week to week

[sand cloud]

#1322328427092775033 message

[mental schooner]

but previously a guild raid averaged something like 4.5 le, and with the patch it's 3.9

[pure solstice]

you can get a distribution from that

[mental schooner]

respectfulluy

im not going to do that

[sand cloud]

do u know the chance of 2le being in the pool now that its getting removed?

[mental schooner]

0

[sand cloud]

like atm

[mental schooner]

or do you mean currently

uhh

[pure solstice]

why not?

[mental schooner]

i'm sure i could go and look up exactly how i would go about doing that, but it would take me time and effort that i just don't think are worth it

[pure solstice]

i mean is really easy, just make those events repeat a number of times (n)

[mental schooner]

available stacks are 4x 1 le and 4x 2 le, it picks 3-5 of those per week

[pure solstice]

and there, even someone external at my guild did it with n=20

[drowsy harness]

lex, this player has demanded you do a task. as a CT you are obligated to do it. now stop giving us attitude and get to it

[sand cloud]

thanks

[pure solstice]

i did not demand anything, im just asking why we cannot have that data

[drowsy harness]

yeah and lex said they dont want to

[pure solstice]

mmm i don't get it

[drowsy harness]

i wish you the best of luck in life

[frigid wren]

It sorta is.

[lofty knoll]

if u want to calculate the normal distribution pirate a statistics textbook and make the calculation urself. this does not require testing

if u do it hats off to u otherwise u dont sound like you know what ur talking about

[small yew]

are the odds public?

[serene needle]

Then, I mean this in the most genuine way possible, you need to quit playing the game. It's unhealthy for you at this point, if that's where you derive your self-worth from. Like...you need to speak with someone and re-assess your priorities. I don't mean this as an insult, I mean this as someone genuinely concerned and worried.

[drowsy harness]

🔥

[serene needle]

If it is to that point it is becoming an obsession. And as someone who's worked on and with the game since 2013 I very much know what I mean when I say that. I've taken breaks for exactly that purpose before, to avoid having that happen.

To keep it as just a hobby to sink myself into on occasion, rather than something all-consuming.

If you're also being sincere there, you've passed that point and really need to dial it back a few ticks to get some balance back into your life. Like...make new friends or reconnect with other ones that don't do Wynn stuff. Take a break.

[frigid wren]

I was joking but there are people like this lol

I have a job and social life (unheard of)

[serene needle]

Then that message goes genuinely out to those people.

[frigid wren]

If my self worth was tied to how much LE I earned an hour I wouldn't have any

Negative even

[devout topaz]

monster war build tna made me tilt so hard

[worldly sparrow]

i hate seeing war builds in raids so much

literally just people leeching off of others doing the raid for them like at least try to contribute

[green tinsel]

depends on what war build tho

if u have a damage war build u can contribute plenty

(just don’t die)

[worldly sparrow]

i mean i guess depends on the raid

like divzer in nol is AWFUL

[devout topaz]

bolt nol seems miserable

just play divzer trapper

[worldly sparrow]

GENIUS

[frigid wren]

Esp when it was the only thing surviving Greg day 1 that wasn't your morph slider or something

Yep

[devout topaz]

hey the 6x spin attack vanish cycle nirv build was peak day 1 building

[frigid wren]

[worldly sparrow]

wdym 6x spin vanish cycle…

[small yew]

https://tenor.com/view/fish-spin-confetti-fishy-spinning-gif-2147613004635078456

[devout topaz]

thats me

the fisj.

[edgy fossil]

wahoo

[frigid wren]

@ocean hazel I see you...

[ocean hazel]

:) its 3:30am pls send help

[distant shale]

this is funny out of context

[elfin bluff]

My self worth is tied to how many godly warps I have. I have 2 self worth. 2 stands for 2% of an average human

[umbral stirrup]

are you implying that 1% of your self worth got utterly destroyed by the IMs

[coarse ore]

Starting to make more sense when im changes hurts peoples wallets

[tight owl]

15% of 100 is not the same as 15% of 200, but they're both still 15%. You're being intentionally dumb here, I can't think otherwise. If you need exact numbers then do 50 raids without gambits and 50 raids with 🤷‍♂️

[native latch]

yall please chill

i understand nerfs to emerald rates seem bad

but do remember that

• a new emerald grindspot is being added
• profs make more
• at least it isn't 50% :D

[serene needle]

Part of the complaints is people assuming we were adding Outer Void specifically to assuage the nerf when that isn't the case. It's true that it's an alternate method but it was always meant as an alternative.

Not a replacement, or anything

[worldly sparrow]

1. what if i dislike the content in the new emerald grindspot? what if the money is worse?
2. profs are insanely boring and should not be an acceptable replacement to raids
3. this isnt something to be grateful for 💀

[wild ibex]

https://tenor.com/view/angry-baby-baby-crying-crying-baby-gif-25803638

[tight owl]

• I can't comment on content that isn't released yet, but I'm sure it'll be fun either way!
• We should not EVER be encouraging profs in its current state 💀
• "it could have been worse" is a poor reason

I'm not too miffed about it either way tho, as someone else already said it was to tweak the numbers to make the game have a more healthy direction, but I still have my complaints as it feels random imo. I've never heard anyone say raids were OP for money farming

[coarse ore]

i already spoke this elsewhere but like, instead of straight up announcing this if you reduced the rates of 2le appearing in raid pools silently(not 0 but to the point it spawns like 0 or 1 usually) i was quite confident we wouldnt notice for quite a while...

[native latch]

i meant chill out as in stop yelling at ct for poorly timed coincidences

[worldly sparrow]

coincidences? what coincidences

[native latch]

new emerald spot being released at the same time as raid le nerf

stuff got done at the right time and this is how stuff worked

not related at all

[worldly sparrow]

didnt you just use that as an argument to justify raid le being nerfed?

[native latch]

no im telling yall to chill out

im not saying good or bad

just please

no bash ct skull in

[worldly sparrow]

[native latch]

points were

• reason to be excited for update
• the best em generation system in the game currently is completely unrelated to raids OR lring
• humor

sorry for confusion

[prisma pier]

The I in IM stands for insecurities

[jovial hamlet]

lol no point arguing xD, think they've already made up their mind anyways..... Give back horses please 🐴 B)

[arctic sparrow]

playing the game
just chatting

[undone imp]

What

[coarse ore]

i am increasing my chatta count

[arctic sparrow]

Referring to the person in the screen not giving any constructive feedback at all, while posting 2 words messages only to ragebait when they do not even raid

it's okay to be silly, i just feel like that at least in a feedback post they could try to express an opinion if they even have one yk

[slender prairie]

Average WFA foundation:
Join ETW organization

[small yew]

etwff foundation

the second f stands for fallen 😍

[slender prairie]

Oh and right pls remove 8 eb set from all pools pls ty

[coarse ore]

wish granted, now 9eb

[umbral stirrup]

wish granted, now 7eb

[mental schooner]

yeah ok i can consider doing this

[steel cedar]

that's why i have them blocked

everyone should

[distant shale]

What the hell lex, nerfing emeralds further?? 🤯🤯🤯

[elfin bluff]

its literally buffing xd

[worldly sparrow]

genius!

[jovial hamlet]

https://tenor.com/view/internet-south-park-s20e4-wieners-out-typing-gif-20669319

That guy is a professional

[fresh cosmos]

0 iq message

[small yew]

am i the only one who thinks of 🤯 as a sarcasm indicator

[green tinsel]

depends but yeah in the nagisa message it is likely just sarcasm

[small yew]

🤯

[green tinsel]

hard to tell tho cause he has been pretty goofy

[lucid wyvern]

based

[slender prairie]

That's right consider every single msg of his as sarcasm!

[distant shale]

It was a joke

[fresh cosmos]

oh

[distant shale]

Usually you can tell I’m joking because what I said is clearly something stupid followed by emojis

[outer cedar]

Every Wynncraft update sine the dawn of time has been "one step forward, two steps back"
"We buffed raid rewards to scale with your level!"
"We nerfed raid rewards!"
Why is this keep happening?

you guys really need to understand that context is everything
this is yet anothet time when a nerf just so happens to appear at the same time with a change

I' trying to belive you guys, but these conicidances happen way too often

[short sequoia]

What do you want us to say to this lol

Tealy has been trying his absolute best to get good number for this project, even made a poll to help get an idea of what to aim for.

He was sweating internally that people were gonna miscontrue this nerf as a result of his poll when he heard about it or bring it in connection with this. I think it really sucks that people just want to desperately headcannon bad intention here.

[elfin bluff]

"sweating internally" is crazy wording

[short sequoia]

as in sweating about it on our discord lol

[elfin bluff]

yea i figured but it sounds cursed

[distant shale]

“We made raids more inclusive”
“More people is more raw money so we need to balance it”

be real, I get criticism but balance happens

[distant shale]

Way too often as if it happens monthly and not like once every like 6-10 months

[outer cedar]

you guys need to work on the pr more. this isn't the first time I'm seeing concidentl release of updates

[distant shale]

** and are done when it’s bring offset somewhere else

Oh no after that message to Thglpxl you’re just silly I’m not gonna give any more serious responses lol

[short sequoia]

We... can't control coincidence?

Would you have been happier if lex had just shoved the nerf into the next patch or hotfix after the outer void?

Should we have waited <whatever time you would feel happy with here> to clear the air of any collusion

[dusky spear]

shouldve waited for next patch just for people to say the nerf is because people havent been doing the new content enough

[distant shale]

SO REAL

[lethal mountain]

This discrimination against Nerfs will not be tolerated anymore! Nerfs are good too. Buffs aren't always great and that preception needs to be changed!

Nerfs aren't bad!
Nerfs aren't bad!

[outer cedar]

honestly i wouldn't be happy, but I'm used to nerfs by now

[woeful sedge]

the wynncraft content team is ran by lizard people

[drowsy harness]

we nerfed raid LE because I personally dislike some of the top raiders and want to hurt them financially

[short sequoia]

this content was added as a personal spite project to the wynn community

[edgy fossil]

EVIL ct are EVIL and sick and twisted

[queen star]

you know what i didnt really agree with it at first but when you phrase it like that yeah those lb raiders have had it too good for too long 😤

[drowsy harness]

see guys we just have to be honest and the players will accept it

[small yew]

wtc

[queen star]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1302398709333491729/1316891322174541874/hashrbon.gif

[small yew]

wtf do NOT serach up wtc in gifs

i forgot it also stands for world trade center 😭

[queen star]

https://tenor.com/view/dog-smile-shyboos-smile-gif-24233810

[small yew]

https://tenor.com/view/explaining-gif-22499839

this thread ^

[elfin bluff]

evil plan to convert raiders to lootrunners...

[short sequoia]

our next scheme: abandon all wynn, outer void only

[worldly sparrow]

genius!

[outer cedar]

this but unironically

[elfin bluff]

funnily enough the change hurts average raiders more than it does top ones xd

[devout topaz]

who cares if it’s not a coincidence anyways

raids gave a bit too much raw. cope lol

tbh i think the rates for the new thing are a bit too good and will need nerfed post release but xd

[elfin bluff]

So you're telling me to farm the fuck out of it on release. Say less

[undone imp]

Bro whar

[tribal sequoia]

He's never happy with ct dw about it tbh

[outer cedar]

i am sometimes happy

[tribal sequoia]

The liar

[outer cedar]

I liked how the omnispective wandered got a bigger model

[slender prairie]

[edgy fossil]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1294813380464607384/1321680823438544957/quithorsingaround.gif

[devout topaz]

tbh you should do this with any new content it’s always disgusting op for 0 reason

but hey idk it gets people to interact i guess

[elfin bluff]

i will do it likely because everything else got kinda boring xd

[prisma pier]

abuse early abuse often

[ocean hazel]

Mmmh yes 50stx in 1 week

[elfin bluff]

surely its bettter

lootruns make triple that if you try hard enough

[ocean hazel]

I will for sure tryhard this new money making method the first week or two before it will get nerfed into oblivion