playing shade sucks in a team

[late ruin]

shadestepper just feels like it wasnt made for teamplay

-nightcloak knife and harvester are kinda just useless if other people kill the mobs you were aiming to harvest
-knightcloak knife can also hinder your other teammates who are playing shade by taking marks off the boss just before they're about to backstab/quake not only wasting their suprise strike and their vanish cooldown, but also possibly their satujin
-it can be hard to catch up to bosses when your teammates have aggro (which is quite common since vanish exists) making it hard to gain powder special charge or land bombs on the boss (especially without wasting vanish for movement)
-the point above also applies to teammates moving enemies (or minibosses like the notg encroaching tunneler) without cci around
-not having sticky bomb (trickster ability) makes it essentially impossible to apply more than 2 marks with a single bomb on moving bosses, and even with sticky bomb i find its enemy sticking hitbox quite small and hard to miss especially with higher ping
-teammates stealing kills disables silent killer
-minor nitpick but its hard to see the range on smoke bombs in the particle clusterfuck that team fights tend to be

obviously not all of these problems are easily solved but i would like to know if it'd be possible to
-give mana to the latest shade to mark an enemy if someone without marked unlocked kills it
-let shades activate knightcloak knife from enemies that died in the last few seconds (the marked particle effect lingers on their bodies for a bit anyways)
-maybe slow marked enemies a bit? i know choke bomb exists and this would be more of a buff than a "fix" but just putting it out there
-increase the hitbox of sticky bomb

also i've heard satujin cooldown isnt per player, so a teammate could satujin the enemy and disable your final ability however i didnt put that in the post since i couldnt actually confirm it myself

[solar vortex]

slay hell yeah

@late ruin whhat do you think about this

sticky bomb increases the bomb projectile speed and range, but reduces overall damage

[late ruin]

i'd be down for that since bombs dont actually go too far

they go like 15 blocks away at best but thats not a lot on moving bosses

[solar vortex]

yee, the issue with sticky bomb is that you need to be sniffing the enemy to land them

but a bigger hitbox would be cool (and a model too, remove armor stands)

[late ruin]

its not an armor stand its a floating item but yeah

[solar vortex]

oh

still

Shade shouldn't remove the makrs of other players tho for real

[mental reef]

marks problem is an overall problem for archetypes that use a similar system for that, so until they find a solution for this system, it probably won’t get fixed
majority of these points just revolve around a system that needs to differentiate application abilities

there’s already a good amount of sources that increase smoke bomb aoe (aspect and better smoke bomb) and better smoke bomb alone has a huge range

and even if it doesn’t land, fatal spin exists and it now applies 2 marks every cast

[late ruin]

i didnt mean the smoke aoe i meant the hitbox of the projectile so its easier to hit enemies with it. but fair

[mental reef]

ig if you mean that then yeah i’d want that

also it isn’t that hard to catch up to bosses with just pure shadow travel

if you have like 30-40ws it makes it even better

[fluid dragon]

Sticky can be a bit of a pain to land on small mobs and there's a few times where it feels like the bomb should stick but it just doesn't lol so increasing the hitbox would be nice

[mental reef]

would it be annoying or good if a mob walks over a smoke bomb on the ground and it sticks onto them

[late ruin]

i'd fw that but itd i feel like they would add that as an upgrade later down

[fluid dragon]

Hmm not sure id have to play it to form an opinion

Also ngl wish better smoke was just base smoke bc base smoke kinda feels awful lol

Better smoke feels basically mandatory especially with sticky

[late ruin]

feels fine with sticky to me but without it yeah you really need it

[mental reef]

i played without better and it felt fine but it’s because i’m used to it

[fluid dragon]

Also speaking of smoke please do something about black hole 🙏

[mental reef]

make that shit into a major id

[fluid dragon]

It is so aggressively mid and not worth 2 ap

[late ruin]

and ugly

[mental reef]

if black hole periodically pulled in enemies then maybe

[spark aspen]

the kill thing is actually a really good point, now im thinking how it would work out if "on kill" abilities werent just triggered by you directly killing stuff but also by you getting "kill credit" on a mob (which already exists in respects to drops, its like dealing 1/5 of the damage)

bc it seems like itd just improve team gameplay and would be less hard to implement than a seperate system that gives on kill effects when, like, someone in your party kills something close to you (which in my mind is like the other option roughly)

[queen raft]

i agree with shade being whack against smaller mobs and mostly just rooms since u cant rlly set up at all but i dont have any issues with bosses, especially disagree with the sticky bomb thing it's very easy to hit greg/orphion and even parasite is not the most difficult but yeah it's rlly bad on minibosses that get flung around everywhere

well i do have an issue with bosses which is windy feet overriding shadow travel speed which makes it horrible to play tna with a boltslinger

but aside from that shadow travel lets you keep up just fine

maybe not on hmelee tho since you cant just refresh vanish

[lilac dock]

i believe the cooldown is per player?

[mental reef]

the cd is per player per mob

[late ruin]

good to know, i wasnt sure just thought itd be worth a mention

[rose onyx]

THIS this is so shit
esp on my hmlee buidl with like 2 ws :3

[mental reef]

sticky bomb is good on big hitboxes yes but it’s rather annoying against small hitboxes (2x1 models)

[lilac dock]

abilities that consume status effects off of mobs are generally annoying tbh

same thing with timelock

it makes multiple players of the same archetype have problems

the solution i think would be some way of making per-player status effects but from my understanding that is... tricky

[mental reef]

yeah, hence why we gotta wait for a global solution

[queen raft]

i think knives with multiple shades is fine tbh you have everybody sticky bombing

and also spinning for knives does apply 2 marks

and as long as u get one knife then you can keep yourself maxed

[mental reef]

i found a goofy glitch where when a mob has only 1 mark on it and you spin in vanish, it takes away that mark and applies 2 marks after that

(so basically you don’t even change the amount of marks a mob has)

[late ruin]

tbh that was more of a minor thing, my biggest problem is kill stealing on small weak mobs

[queen raft]

yes i agree with that

[late ruin]

the post turned out as more of "here's every nitpick i have with shade"

[lilac dock]

i think theyre mostly fair

[mental reef]

i get really tilted when i give a mob max marks and it gets killed by someone else

[queen raft]

try to get knives in nol tower or tna first room challenge impossible

0 hp mobs

[late ruin]

i go monkey mode when 3 max mark mobs im gonna use to get nkk get nuked by a careless fallen player 😭

[late ruin]

LITERALLY WHAT IW AS THINKING

[mental reef]

this is why shade is useless in my parties, they all die from mortars and bash screamers

[late ruin]

i was playing with 2 mortars and i literally just gave up on nkk in the whole raid

[rose onyx]

yeahh i wish at least harvested procced if i was nearby a marked mob that died 😔

[chrome crystal]

So what's the point of this thread

[rose onyx]

shade nitpicks type shi

[chrome crystal]

O

I c

[late ruin]

read the last like 5 lines

tldr: shade gets griefed in raids please change something 🥺

[queen raft]

tbf i think this is a room problem more than a shade problem

[solar vortex]

as cool as it is, it's not sustainable because of minecraft limitations

[queen raft]

nol tower mobs die in 2 sec it doesnt even matter if u get knives

tna mobs literally die to smokebomb 😭

[late ruin]

maybe

yeah like the lower half of my atree is literally getting wasted 😭

[rose onyx]

fr i jut use it to save a quake and then go do hw while waiitng in the room 😔

and sometimes i dont even get to charge a quake until like the last guy lo

[queen raft]

playing with shaman be like

[lilac dock]

this room needs more mobs tbh

[queen raft]

not more i think just stronger

[lilac dock]

maybe both

[queen raft]

cuz if you add more then aoe classes still one shot the room (shaman trap)

[rose onyx]

yes more of a challenge and smaller tower 🥺
or like reducd time between light spawns(tower jut feels so boring)

[lilac dock]

yeah i hear you on that

[late ruin]

molten monter type mob to actually make people do something

[lilac dock]

i hate the molten monsters

theyre so. janky

[late ruin]

im so derailing this thread but lex can you make the slime eggs in notg first room neutural so i can proc ms ls powder from them

those mobs also die in 2 seconds so i cant even charge quake with a shaman

[fresh juniper]

timelock my behated (eats all my dps when someone else uses it)

[fluid dragon]

+1

[spark aspen]

every li boss dies in one quake doesnt even matter if u get knives 😭 (though the dr can survive and they help for normal melees)

[queen raft]

i was talking spellshade mainly but yeah

[little vector]

Shade is more a solo-y class to me tbh, like it’s more selfish in general and it’s hard to work with others but works great on it’s lonesome. Problem with that concept though is that there’s literally team based things like raids if you want certain special rewards >_>