Equilibrium should be nerfed. Its too powerful even for a Rare Card.

[barren bramble]

Nerf should sound like this:
"After gaining a Curse, obtain a Random Boon at 25% of its power."

[orchid fox]

could also be a % chance to get a boon

[barren bramble]

No, just nerf a chance of getting a Equilibrium then.

[orchid fox]

whar

[barren bramble]

Make it way rarer including my nerf.

[fossil pecan]

Remove equi, remove or nerf cleansing ritual and buff rewards or other stuff so lootruns are better overall

[woven fossil]

nerf equi and buff boons imo

[severe siren]

huh

in the last ~100 lootruns ive probably goten equilibrium no more than 3 times.. i think its rare enough as iti s

[barren bramble]

Idk, maybe im probably a lucky diсkhead....

[severe siren]

whats the point of nerfing something that makes the game more fun anyway

are you sure you arent a wynn dev in disguise

[barren bramble]

No, Equilibrium is not fun because the rest of your lootrun is a mindless purple-aqua spam.

[severe siren]

thats what makes it fun to me 😇

[upbeat island]

translation: "now that I have mythics, I don't want casual players to have them so that their price goes up"

[limpid sun]

no worries lr already is mindless spam

[severe siren]

if you want your gameplay to be difficult simply dont pick equilibrium when it pops up

thats a much easier way to make the game more fun to your own tastes instead of changing how it works for every player

[neat sorrel]

equi should be like 1 boon per every 3 curses or something

[sweet maple]

I think Equilibrium is too powerful at the moment, and it's disproportionately good compared to some of the other missions (like Statis or Materialism(?), which don't contribute a lot) but I don't know if making the boons really weak or making Equilibrium rarer is the right solution.

I'm not sure what the odds of Equilibrium appearing is, and I'm under the assumption that all the missions are the same rarity, but Equilibrium does not appear very often for me. Equilibrium also has the shortcoming that the boons you receive can be of a bad type (like Slowrunner) or give a really bad effect (like Weaken Enemy past 50%).

I think the best way to nerf it is bluethesniper's opinion, where it's a percent chance to gain a boon every time you get a curse. Equilibrium is already very random with the effects it grants, so adding even more chance to it would help to make it far more of a risk, where bad luck can ruin your stats. I think in a lot of other games to leave something up to a percent chance would be a bad idea, but considering how luck based Lootrunning is, it seems like the logical conclusion.

[severe siren]

or just keep it the same so people that enjoy it can have fun and people that find it boring because its broken can just not use it

as if lootruning cant be infuriating with all the rng involved alredy

[sweet maple]

I think Equilibrium is a lot of fun too 😭 I like stacking 6 curse beacons over and over for like 80 challenges, but it is a little bit too broken atm. And I do think the RNG in lootrunning can be frustrating, but it's kinda the point 🤷

[bold kettle]

imo it reminds me of the balancing in the binding of isaac: yes, it's insanely powerful, but it's also insanely rare, so it lets players have that occasional "god run"

isaac has a lot of quality 4 items that can singlehandedly win a run

equilibrium (and cleansing ritual for that matter) are both like that

and it's still "balanced" because of the rarities of obtaining such power

[severe siren]

i'd agree if the rng didnt exist in the dumbest ways posible

the simple rng of getting the right mission then getting decent requirements to complete it and then getting lucky to not go 10 challenges without blue or orange is part of what made me quit for so long

and with all this rng involved when people start suggesting things to make lootruning even harder im like 🥴

[sweet maple]

Yeah, beacons disappearing for no reason kinda sucks 💀 I usually stack vibrant aqua + vibrant orange beacons so I can get orange beacons throughout my run, because they become rarer as the run goes on

If I try to play a run past 50 challenges with no orange beacons I just get locked in green, purple, and yellow limbo 😭

[severe siren]

thats why i never lootrun past 50 challenges without equilibrium + critual combo

its simply unfun and stupid

[bold kettle]

in this case perhaps if beacon rng was less oppressive this would make non-god runs feel more fair

[fossil pecan]

In this case its so insanely overpowered that it invalidates all other strategies and orevents balance since if you, for example, made cruses buff mobs by less equilibrizn would be even more op

Plus it just fundamentally breaks lootruns balance since youre just incentivized to only go for curses, which you are already incentivized to do in a normal run but now its also the best way to buff yourself so theres legit 0 reason to do anything else especially with cleansing ritual, which in itself i see as somewhat problematic but not as much since its effect is capped (realistically itll remove like 80 curses during your entire run) and does not make the downside of taking curses irrelevant

[severe siren]

thats a good argument however

[severe siren]

.

[fossil pecan]

Thats a bad argument, so

[severe siren]

at the end of the day its a pve gamemode, i dont see whats wrong with having overpowered features that can be fun

[fossil pecan]

.

[analog bear]

💩

[severe siren]

if you enjoy struggling holding for dear life cycling blues reds and purples (if you even get them lmao) then simply ignore equilibrium and critual

[fossil pecan]

Well, what if lootruns were buffed in general but equi was nerfed so its still as good as it is now but not as much better as everything else for example

[severe siren]

sure i can live with that

but a flat out nerf that only makes the gamemode more unfun il never agree with

[fossil pecan]

Because current situation is just
Have a miserable time or
Get a rng check and remove the challenge

[barren bramble]

https://tenor.com/ru/view/пошёл-нахуй-трансформеры-gif-27519661

[severe siren]

sounds about right

[analog bear]

epic embed failure

[barren bramble]

https://tenor.com/view/disintegrating-funny-thanos-gif-22399978

[true vale]

its almost like the gamemode itself is unfun and the only way to make it fun is to remove the difficulty so you can do something else while lr in the background

within the context of lootrunning as a game it needs to be nerfed, the true issue is that the gameplay of lootrunning as a whole is dogshit and needs to be made fun so that nerfing equilibrium wouldnt ruin lootrunning

[severe siren]

yeah i agree with that

[true vale]

they really dug themselves a big hole with all the mission stuff

[gritty olive]

Equi most boring boon, tho that is partially because 30+ curses lootruns are a clusterfuck with no tactical gameplay

[severe siren]

ngl i dont believe "tactical gameplay" is a possible concept in wynncraft

with or without 30 curses

[gritty olive]

Depends on the build i supposr

[ornate patio]

you rarely ever see equilibrium, i think its fair to have a "free win" every once in a while, i dont recall seeing it once within my last 50 runs

[royal ivy]

equilibrium should be nerfed, anything that makes it less likely to have a 2hr lootrun tbh
maybe every 2 curses get 1 boon

hot take but god runs get boring and I'd rather do 6 meh runs than 1 god run

[ornate patio]

so why have equilibrium nerfed then?

i dont even think its worth doing long runs with equilibrium, you can finish in like... what 1hour 45minutes, and what do you get? 300 pulls + 3rr = 900 pulls

you can get 250 pulls in a 16 minute run, i really dont think long runs are worth the time

unless you have nothing else to do than playing wynncraft all day

[severe siren]

thats not a hot take, thats just your opinion

[royal ivy]

cuz equalizer results in those long runs

that being said, boons are the great equalizer, builds that can't lootrun get evened out by boons and can more easily do roll content

so maybe nerf the 100 challenge limit again, tho like i said it's a hot take

[severe siren]

and my opinion is that god runs are more fun, everyone thinks differently

[royal ivy]

that's what a take is lol

[severe siren]

yeah but it certainly isnt hot if half the people here want equilibrium nerfed

[royal ivy]

7 downvotes, 3 up

not really

[ornate patio]

but without equilibrium long runs are literally not worth it

you spend way too much time, you would gain more pulls through short runs

[severe siren]

yeah thats cuz some people that want equilibrium nerfed dont want just equilibrium nerfed so they arent agreeing with the post

example

[royal ivy]

ah, fair enough

in any case, yeah it's just my opinion that i find long runs boring, ik not everybody is the same way

ik it's exciting to get an early rainbow and just go 100/100 for many ppl i just get exhausted after doing that for a while, everything starts to feel like I'm running the motions

[severe siren]

it would be exhausting if it didnt happen once in a blue moon for me

[limpid sun]

other strategies still can work just not as good

as long as the game isnt balanced around the woah way op stuff

like how morph is a build that exists and is pretty decent, but is in no way a "woah 931k dps insane" build or smth along those lines

[fossil pecan]

it is though
it has to be
unless they just ignored equi god runs when considering mythic rates

[viral eagle]

would be fine with equilibrium nerf if some of the other missions got buffs
the problem is that without either equilibrium or cleansing ritual you effectively can't get a long run, and even if you do it won't be worth it since you won't be able to keep taking purples

[gritty olive]

I think adjusting overinflated values on both boons and curses would allow equilibrium be nerfed/completely removed without making long runs obsolete

Some boons being 400%+ more damage is just wild, balancing feels so off

[fossil pecan]

yeah, i found it really funny when they "nerfed" damage values on boons (was in aptch notes i think) so some boons are like 7% spell damage max 14x but others are still like 10 * 30 or whatever

[past raptor]

equi is already rare enough

I get it barely once every 10 runs, probably less than that

[neat sorrel]

yeah making it even more uncommon would just make even more runs without it feel shit in comparison

[gritty olive]

If runs without equi feel like shit that is all the more reason to have it out of the picture and balance lootruns without it

[fossil pecan]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

[neat sorrel]

yeah nerf it to be more equal to other missions or buff a lot of other missions

[fossil pecan]

if equi took pulls away in exchange for boons it might be more balanced
like, you still get an easy af run but its not also mroe rewarding than hard runs

actually, now that i think about it its also kinda funny how the best buff you can get is ltierally jsut removing any challenge while giving you increased rewards
balance
something like allowing you to get more rewards but also being challenging is way more engagin (see: ult sac, gambling beast)

[gritty olive]

Nah, its already barely worth doing

[fossil pecan]

equi?

[gritty olive]

Yeah, its mind numbing, and its easier to farm stuff like corkians with short runs

Only time i do equi is to get a high sacrifice chain going when target farming a mythic

[fossil pecan]

ok fair, but its just bad game design to require the player to choose between fun/interesting gameplay or mechanically rewarding gameplay

[gritty olive]

Ye

[ornate patio]

i dont understand that statement

and ngl, i think lootruns are boring af no matter how "challenging" they are, so its nice to sometimes have an option to get it over with faster

[woven fossil]

are people downvoting this because they think equi is balanced or because they dont like the proposed solution?

[true vale]

i have no idea lol

[bitter escarp]

i dont think a random boon is worth a curse

[true vale]

it is

[past raptor]

Equi is the sole reason god runs are possible.

[severe siren]

I'm down voting because lootruns are only fun when I have equilibrium and critical and nerfing equilibrium will only make the miserable experience even worse

Especially if equi is made rarer

[woven fossil]

thats fair but i feel like god runs shouldnt completely depend on getting 1 mission

like non equi runs should still be "good enough" for ppl who cant be bothered to reset runs for hrs imo

[ornate raptor]

Look at the whines about how rare and mandatory equil is, surely it makes the game more fun
Especially fun is the equil endgame of rinse and repeat aqua purple

The suggested nerf is too much but it is basically a given that it needs a nerf to make LR environment more healthy (including more design space for new missions)

[severe siren]

Well that would require more than just nerfing equi to be a reality

[woven fossil]

yep

[ornate raptor]

Short runs are better or at least equal in terms of profit, no need to be pissy

[severe siren]

If short runs are better than what's the issue with equilibrium being op?

Just let me turn my brain off and play my inefficient runs 💤

[ornate raptor]

Design space, sacrifice stacking

[severe siren]

You said short runs are better so what's the problem with sacrafices

[ornate raptor]

Better or equal*

[severe siren]

Close enough

[ornate raptor]

Not really, and it is in part based on RNG independence

There is also the question of "do the devs want the best way to play long runs to be an absolutely mindless loop" which is, I remind you, different from "do the devs want a way to play mindless long runs to exist and be decently viable compared to alternatives"

[neat sorrel]

gambling beast gets more effective pulls than equi btw

its just also very rare and requires a mission that you can stack till like 80 challenges into your lr

• its a lot less brainless than equi anyway

[bitter escarp]

i had no idea what makes equi so good

i really dont want to cop a curse just to recieve something like life steal every challenge

[past raptor]

You can get at most 1 boon every challenge by picking blues. With rainbow beacon, alternating aqua and purple will give you 6 boons every other challenge, or 3 boons every challenge. It's random, yes, but most boons are very useful.

[bitter escarp]

ok ill pick it next time i get it

[past raptor]

After 10-20 challenges, you'll have at least one of every boon you need to survive and deal damage. After that it's a breeze

[bitter escarp]

i like the one that gives flying chest every challenge

[past raptor]

Make sure you pick cleansing ritual as well, as every challenge you complete, you'll lose one curse, and gain a new challenge that'll give you time.

[past raptor]

Materialism is also good

[rancid cove]

my ass usually has a single element that the game just refuses to give me skillpoints for xd

1k def skill points 0 agi

[past raptor]

For me it's always def 😔

[somber glacier]

i did not enjoy this opinion

[fossil pecan]

at least your ehp is real

[storm plank]

materialism + equilibrium + cleansing ritual + orphions grace + charm of the stone

yet to try getting a run like this but it sounds like an absolute mythic printing machine

even better with a disco-based build

[fossil pecan]

if oyu dont get equi you can do the same run, just get less curses more blue beacons

[past raptor]

Fuck is charm of the stone

[past raptor]

tcc charm?

[storm plank]

ye

[past raptor]

Orphiona grace is 50% better boons right

[storm plank]

ye

[past raptor]

I assume that's for boosted lb + lq

[storm plank]

so 1.5x boon lb and lq

[true vale]

lootrunning with charm of the stone wtf 😭

if it works it works ig

[storm plank]

genuinely a good strat with a green damage taken ID

[frank sigil]

charm of the stone …

[storm plank]

the loot ID has very low variance (it's like 24-35)

[frank sigil]

Ok that’s based I will try it.

[storm plank]

the dmg taken is 21-91

it's unusable unless you get a really good dmg taken roll

[frank sigil]

charm is kinda crazy since isn’t it applied after all lb ?

[storm plank]

i heard that it is

[fossil pecan]

you know, you could like, test it

[storm plank]

very difficult to measure tbh

[rancid cove]

charm sounds like a bad idea to use in lootruns tbh

doesnt it scale all the way through the run

[fossil pecan]

loot and damage though

[storm plank]

my build is very tanky to begin with anyway

[rancid cove]

ohhhhh like that

[storm plank]

77k ehp on an archer

[neat sorrel]

yeah but like lb is softcapped on chests

[rancid cove]

so the lb is a multiplier on normal lb?

[neat sorrel]

so with disco + lb weapon i doubt its much better on chests

[fossil pecan]

flying chests too?

[rancid cove]

i never realized that

[neat sorrel]

presumably

[storm plank]

idk tbh, i heard that it is

[rancid cove]

that is based af

[storm plank]

but I've never actually seen any confirmation on how it works

[neat sorrel]

if you wanna test just get a lb set and make sure that with the multiplicative bonus you reach 567% lb

then kill mobs and see if you get guaranteed t0 drop

[storm plank]

that's for ings tho

[fossil pecan]

yeah but if its multiplicative for ings its for chests too

[storm plank]

I'm thinking of loot chests

[neat sorrel]

oh you mean testing the softcap

[fossil pecan]

or do you mean if it games softcap?

[storm plank]

ye

if it's just a straight up ~1.3x loot chest loot multi

[fossil pecan]

thats a good question
but ti would at least help you to know whther its multiplicative to begin with
and if it is youd need to sample a lot of maxed loot chests of the same tier with the same build but on one version you use something with 26 lb and on one you use charm

[frank sigil]

or ask ct.

genuinely also what could help is for aqua boosted blues to be able to pick 2 boons from pool and for vaqua blues to be able to pick 3 boons from pool. blues and v blues will scale the pool size

[orchid fox]

u dont?!?!

[true vale]

nuh uh

itd be cool tho since i use disco but like

[orchid fox]

i got 5 mythics 1 lr with singu build uwu

[true vale]

thats +8 effective lb isnt it 😭

[orchid fox]

its multiplicative

[true vale]

yeah

still softcapped on chests tho so isnt 5lb=1lb

or 4 or smth

[orchid fox]

idk man its free loot bonus 😸

[true vale]

not wrong it makes it better

[gaunt shoal]

or purple and blue beacons are merged into one
that could work too ig?

[orchid fox]

whar?

[gaunt shoal]

If you pick purple beacon you get effects of blue (choose boon) and vice versa

[viral eagle]

so you can't get boons without getting curses

sounds annoying

[woven fossil]

what does this change? no one gets blues if they have equi

[viral eagle]

the thing that makes equilibrium op is the fact that boons are way stronger than curses

[barren bramble]

I came up with more interesting solution:
You cant take the other Purple Cards when you already got the one.

If you took Equilibrium, you can't acquire Cleansing Ritual and Inner Peace.
If you took Cleansing Ritual, you can't acquire Inner Peace and Equilibrium.
If you took Inner Peace, you can't acquire Cleansing Ritual and Equilibrium.

[woven fossil]

this sounds like a LOT of people would just stop lootrunning

[barren bramble]

Yeah because they like braindead purple beacon spam more than using a little grain of skill.

[woven fossil]

cant get equi and cleansing ritual -> less pulls -> stop lootrunning -> tna or quit

[barren bramble]

Yet with these changes you can still increase your pulls with ease, just use this tactic:
Inner Peace / Equilibrium / Orphion's Grace + High Roller + Ult. Sac + Redemption.

[severe siren]

The thing is neither strategy requires skill, one just requires more attention

[true vale]

.

just make the game good its so easy 🚎

[severe siren]

Real

[ornate raptor]

funnily enough it is better

[analog bear]

Cry about it

[barren bramble]

Соси пиьску 😭