remove % based damage from TNA

[mighty knot]

I really dont see how this is at all better?

[torn moth]

Oh, right
You showed it yesterday

[mighty knot]

like people didnt like the idea of damage res on him

[limber magnet]

Fix 0 watched by giving Greg 30 mil health

[mighty knot]

for doing damage

[dapper ocean]

cuz then its atleast possible for mega max parties to 0 watch even if its really hard and requires meta gear

[torn moth]

No, because regular parties would struggle to kill

[dapper ocean]

thats not fixing shit bro we do 20m dmg in 3 seconds

[mighty knot]

Ok ok

[torn moth]

However giving him some more elemental resistance...

[dapper ocean]

and this ^

[mighty knot]

lets bring back my OLD OLD sorta idea

a 1mill dps cap

on nameless

[dapper ocean]

ok but at a hp threshhold plrase

please

[lethal swan]

guys revolutionary constructive feedback: nerf player damage 🤯

[mighty knot]

no lmaoo

[lethal swan]

(why hasn't it been done already?)

[limber magnet]

Can't you 1 watch the guy with all 4 members doing 1m dps

[mighty knot]

this idea was literally what got people so mad at me

any dps cap or damge res added to nameless

[torn moth]

You said you don't have tools to do this
And workaround by giving him 80% resistance for 1s every time he loses 1 mil hp is apparently very jank

[mighty knot]

people really didnt like the idea at all

[mighty knot]

we kinda do now? maybe

very janky

im not doing it

[torn moth]

Perhaps people got too used to that

[mighty knot]

like the problem with 0 watching greg is it shouldn't be possible to do that much damage really, its a AT and class balance issue.

[dapper ocean]

wait this is just a bad idea bro whats the point of hsving teamates in boss if i literally do 1.2m dps by myself

[mighty knot]

exactly lol

[torn moth]

It's many small problems just stacked and creating one massive issue

[mighty knot]

uh teammates are there so u can snipe them with ne watched spell

[dapper ocean]

buff shaman and mage then

[dapper ocean]

ongg

[mighty knot]

all 4 players come together and kill themselves with 4 watched at once

[dapper ocean]

wait u should make the laser happen at different times for each player but at a consistent rate to create anarchy

[torn moth]

How about warrior and assasin is nerfed to prevent further powercreep

[dapper ocean]

assassin sure and idol maybe a bit but everything else is fine

[torn moth]

Which has become severe issue, making old content piss easy

[dapper ocean]

i mean tbh wynncraft is piss easy already, removing 0 watches will just make it more boring not any harder, so we need to give him danage resistance at health threshhold before first watch 👍

[torn moth]

It's definitely easier to just nerf few things instead of buffing a lot of them

[torn moth]

Elemental defences could be slightly buffed because major offenders usually are thunder air or water

Though grim might pop off so idk

[dapper ocean]

yeah grim only does a bit less than cata so elemental defenses wont change shit

[mighty knot]

damage res at health thresholds would piss people off just as much as when I suggested it before. I really dont see why its better. All you want to do is make doing 0 watched more prestigious

[dapper ocean]

plus many of the average damage mythics that do certain elemental damage will just do nothing

[dapper ocean]

yeah exactly but i promise more peiple will be pissed off at u banning 0 watches as a whole

[mighty knot]

and if ur point is people like doing 0 watched

and ur change would make it so like 50% of people cant

anymore

wont that just piss off 50% of people anyway?

cuz acording to you doing 0 watched is the most fun thing that everyone wants to do

[dapper ocean]

yeah but if u do this more people will create pro parties instead of dumbass fucking pfinder

[mighty knot]

in the end what I want is more people to actually fight the boss

dodge his spells deal with his attacks

[dapper ocean]

cuz the thing is, as top idol player i can currently queue pfinder with a 50% chance of 0 watching

[mighty knot]

not just kill him before he does anything

at all

[dapper ocean]

but if u do this change i will only be able to 0 watch wirh a rlly good party

[torn moth]

0 watcheds could be ever possible only with expensive consumables and a well organized teams

Anyways, gn

[dapper ocean]

well honestly thats not what the pro players that keep him at mid like doing, we prefer meta to be fun

[mighty knot]

oh but 0 watched is possible if u 1 hit greg

so like technically it is possible

[dapper ocean]

yea but i only know like 1 player rhat can even possibly do that so

[mighty knot]

well then that 1 guy can 0 watched greg

[dapper ocean]

might actually be the most braindead logic ever

[mighty knot]

its not logic

I just dont respect 0 watching

like i dont repsect walling

its abusing coding oversites

walling was abusing gregs hitbox to sit against the wall and not take damage from his damage box

[dapper ocean]

ok but my argument is that u make 0 watching a part of the fame instead of an unintended skip

[torn moth]

I fully agree
0 watched should've been gone the moment that it was discovered

[mighty knot]

if it was discovered in beta

it woulda been removed

[dapper ocean]

and u could do that with the damage resistance thing i mentioned, but its ur raid ig u can do what u think makes the game better

[mighty knot]

I could make it so u can 0 phase change or 0 spell every boss

just make it so u can kill the eye before phase changes

or give every boss 1 hp

to make it fun to speedrun

[dapper ocean]

but theres no community like the tna raiding community :(

[mighty knot]

frankly I wish i never made tna sometimes

every god damn change to this raid is just met with bullshit

people 5 months ago threatened to quit and said staff were so dumb when I removed walling

shit is fine

and yall are like lol those guys were so dumb

why should i see you as any different?

[dapper ocean]

ong bro delete it rn

[mighty knot]

na I cant

I just wish I didnt make it

[dapper ocean]

i get that u think 0 watching isnt how the boss should be played, but i dont see whats wrong with making it a prestige only the top players can do

cuz that way 0 watches wont happen in normal parties with normal players doing the boss normally

theres rhe competitive scene in tna and the normal pfinder scene yk what i mean

[mighty knot]

and why is making killing greg harder a bad thing?

it still would take the insane skill to 1 watch him

instead of 3

[dapper ocean]

ur not making it harder though..

ur legit just forcing an afk phase for pro speedrunners, not making the boss harder

[mighty knot]

I am making people whos builds are super glass cannon focused have to deal with spells

u were told

watched is changed

to be much much much much harder

its gone from a sleeper phase meant to be a "break" in the fight to a rage state

[dapper ocean]

can u tell me how? cuz watch phase for me as an idol player is legit fly and survive

and i have 0 hp the entire boss fight so

[mighty knot]

lazers are faster, target all players, each lazer spawns a void hole, out of that void hole a mob spawns that shoots like 7 projectiles out the top of it like a volcano that then fall down and land on the arena

4 of those each lazer

6 lazers

it becomes a bullet hell

I do think possible flying around might be too easy

I am thinking of ways to deal with that

[dapper ocean]

oh well if ur making watch phase harder i guess its fine

[mighty knot]

like if ur a glass cannon

[knotty zenith]

mage meta 🔥

[mighty knot]

u really need to not take any damage

and there will be a fuck ton of projectiles to dodge

like my worry is it will be too hard more than anything else

the watched was made to be a break stage when the balance of the game had it so like

doing greg would take 10 minutes

and the watched was a break

[dapper ocean]

did u ever think of forxe watching at 25% maybe?

[mighty knot]

but clearly the meta has changed and I want the watched to be a bullet hell rage state

I mean waht would be the difference?

its 1 watched either way

[dapper ocean]

cuz idol support with +110% damage would not be very useful in the first 25% of health

cuz idol support would kinda be fucked if u make it 75%

[mighty knot]

but if u want to avoid a second watched

u need as much dps as u can get

rn the way it works is when the watched is done

[dapper ocean]

wait do u know how idol works?

[mighty knot]

there will be a 7 second cooldown

before it lets another happen

I might down that to like 5 or something

or less

[dapper ocean]

curse + armour breaker + warscream + ssac is +110% damage

and idol uses all of them right before he spawns for support on the team

and if 75% watch force happens you only buff ur team +110% damagae for 25% of his health cuz amour breaker has a cooldown

[mighty knot]

well then save it for the last 75%

[dapper ocean]

no as i said armour breaker has a cooldown

[knotty zenith]

don't you just want to remove this 1hp type of stuff from tna? that is what it seems like

[mighty knot]

no being a glass cannon is fine

I dont dislike glass cannon playstyle

[dapper ocean]

i think low hp -> high damage is fine

[mighty knot]

its just there is no punishment for being a glass cannon when greg cant even attack u

I like glass cannon playstyles

greg was made for that

[knotty zenith]

will i be able to use agi on the bullet hell stuff?

[mighty knot]

I like kiting and jumping on top of him flying around and speeding around him

I just think killing him before he does anything is a problem

[dapper ocean]

@mighty knot what do u think about 25% forced watch

[mighty knot]

I still dont see why it matters when you can just change ur playstyle and buff order

decide what u want before and after watched

[dapper ocean]

idol is meta for support

and 75% health removes the buffs from being as usefull

[mighty knot]

u mean wil agi dodge?

[knotty zenith]

yeah

[mighty knot]

yea

[dapper ocean]

and i think support classes are a rlly good part of tna

[knotty zenith]

that support class being warrior xd

[dapper ocean]

but makijg watch phase so early will remove most of those buffs

[knotty zenith]

because ragnarokkr overrules everything xd

[mighty knot]

I really dont see how that is the case?

[dapper ocean]

and i dont see much problem with 25% forced watch

[mighty knot]

like u can choose to buff for the last 75%

or save some for 25 and some for 75

figure out the order that gives u the best dps

[dapper ocean]

no bro armour breaker has a 15s cooldown

and armour breaker is legit 30% damage boost to everyone

[dapper ocean]

im just saying stacking all buffs at once instead of using them separately makes it like a dps phase for everyone, and i dont see any problem with 25% watch phase

i gtg but make sure u keep team griefing in watch phase

[mighty knot]

I will keep team griefing for the beta push

and we will see how well people like it

I am sure they wont and when they do I will take it away

[rose garden]

average content pipeline 🙄

[twin hound]

Can't idol just not use curse + armor breaker until after the first watched, since the 25% should be pretty fast even without buffs

[dapper ocean]

armour breaker guaranteed is not going to last a full waych phase

[twin hound]

I mean instead of using armor breaker the instant the boss spawns you use it after first watched instead

[dapper ocean]

yeah its not gonna last till then is what i said

oh I don't think you understand how ab works, once you take the damage and ab is available, you have 15s until it "wears off" and won't work on your uppercut

therefore waiting for after the first watch phase the ab would have worn off already and wont proc

[twin hound]

can you not take damage during watched by fall damage or something predicatable tho

[dapper ocean]

nope

u can't take fall damage during boss fight

[twin hound]

void holes?

[dapper ocean]

voidholes will kill you

idol players go down to 1 hp and then take fall damage for the armour breaker

fall damage doesn't kill you, it can only do a % of ur current health

[twin hound]

yeah but what if they dont go to 1hp at the start

[dapper ocean]

so there's no way to get ab in boss unless u have 300 ping and uppercut 7 times in a row

[dapper ocean]

then u don't have max corrupt

the 1hp is for 100 corrupt

[twin hound]

yeah so idol dps will be a bit less but i thought its main purpose was as a buffer class anyway

and to hold aggro

[dapper ocean]

ok but like by ur logic ur just supposed to afk during the first dps phase and only damage after the watch phase?

by afk I mean do no damage with 0 corrupt

cuz the moment u go into a voidhole you get armour breaker and have 15s to use it

• idol is also a dps (I've done 3m dps on a combat dummy)

and like 1.2m dps on greg with showmydps mod

[twin hound]

yeah it kinda sucks for idol dps but tbh the point was just that buffs will still work with forced watch at 75% hp

[dapper ocean]

no it fucks armour breaker on idol in boss so that's why I was asking for a 25% hp force instead

cuz 75% force honestly makes no sense

like why is greg getting mad and shit after losing a fourth of his health

[twin hound]

i agree it doesnt make much sense and tbh i dont really care but imo its not a bad thing that you have to sacrifice dps for the best support class in the game

its just kinda fucked that the best support class is fallen tbh

[winged ivy]

[twin hound]

also i understand that ct are volunteers and limited, but these changes would be much better recieved if they were discussed / made the moment 0 watching was discovered

[lethal swan]

yes yes yes yes yes yes 😭

[mighty knot]

remove AT, remove item IDs

go back to 2015

just damage and health and nothing more

[mighty knot]

the problem is 0 watched was discovered after release

[lethal swan]

i think it could be beneficial to form a team to work on the AT

[mighty knot]

and editing it after release is an issue

and I had only learned of 0 watched months after it become common place

[lethal swan]

a task force 🤓

[mighty knot]

I moved on to working on other projects

only in november did I come back to trying to tweak nameless becuase of bug reports in the rooms did 0 watched, walling, and genearlly updating the nameless come into my workload

Oh also just cuz ik yall will like this. I am changing the CTF room at some point. Im gunna make the orange guy always spawn after he is killed instead of needing to wait for him to respawn

but he will be harder and spawn further away locations so u need to search him out

but no more waiting for him to spawn

[lethal swan]

👀👀👀👀
||👀👀👀||

[mighty knot]

lmao took u a few trys

[lethal swan]

capture the flag

[dapper ocean]

@mighty knot can you fix stacking in tree

[lethal swan]

😢

[mighty knot]

idk what that is

[dapper ocean]

when you enter a soul into the altar while the doors are open in the tree, it opens the doors but doesn't let the person in tree go in

[mighty knot]

so the doors inside the tree are open

u go onto the altar and it opens them again but not really

and the person cant leave through the open doors?

inside the tree

[dapper ocean]

yea and it glitches it and u have to wait

[mighty knot]

I think I already probably know the issue

my guess is the OG script has a countdown to remove a data and that countdown is timed for when the doors close, but when u repon the doors durring that countdown it messes up the timing

[dapper ocean]

so the person in the tree can't go inside the doors after a stack until the doors close and you put a soul back in

[mighty knot]

I'll take a look at it

[dapper ocean]

alr

[dapper ocean]

and is ctf the bulb room?

[mighty knot]

yes

I call it ctf cuz I had to idea of what if capture the flag but v mobs

[lethal swan]

am i stupid wtf is bulb room

oh wait is that with the guys trying to steal ur stuff

that makes sense to be ctf

[dapper ocean]

wait ok why tf are there 3 different places you can put the bulb

why not just one bro

[lethal swan]

lol

[mighty knot]

what do u mean?

why are there 3 bulbs to protect?

[dapper ocean]

yea

[mighty knot]

just to make it easier

so if u loose one you dont just loose the raids

[dapper ocean]

just do 1 and if it's taken respawn it with 0 bulbs in it

cuz so many dumbass players putting them into different ones and it's just annoying

[mighty knot]

wait what?

OOOH

I misunderstood what u meant

[sonic jolt]

Self proclaimed pro player after being faced with a challenge harder than pressing a few of the same buttons for 5 seconds

Imagine if in an actual competitive game the roster of pro players quit after patches instead of adapting

[rich magnet]

Couldn't you instead use fall damage initially to land yourself somewhere between like 40-49% corrupted, then tank a watched after getting Greg to 75% so that you go into the rest of the fight with 90-99% corrupted and a charged armor breaker?
Between not having ssac and half of corrupteds effect, you'll of course be doing less for the first part, but you wouldn't be a total potato relative to max boosted damage then you can unleash the full torrent of buffs in the second part

[sonic jolt]

Based, finally constructive feedbavk will be filled with threads praising ct for their bravery and craftiness

[mighty knot]

true everyone will love it 100%

if everyone hates it I will be pointing fingers at who told me to do it

[sonic jolt]

Ct so modest they dont even take credit for the idea

[mighty knot]

lol

[sonic jolt]

Heart eyes emoji

[inland hull]

making bulb room more boring is insane

dying would be the only way to fail bulb room skull emoji

[rich magnet]

Well bulb keepers are apparently being made stronger so that might happen

[inland hull]

idk i think bulb room is pretty straightforward, probably the most of all rooms

players always have the capacity to sabotage their team, in bulb room this is the least significant

[rich magnet]

Bulb room is definitely one of the easiest in the raid (berry room is competition)

[lethal swan]

i dont like either of the 3rd rooms

[inland hull]

in berry room your team is the real enemy

[lethal swan]

the void door one is close to being good, but having to wait for the last guy is so boring

it should be more like: get the 4 things, then once you do, a strong enemy (like the guy from the light room) spawns and u all gotta kill it

[inland hull]

bulb room needs to be more consistent in length as compared to vm room imo
the previously mentioned idea of spawning a bulb keeper upon a bulb keeper's death would make it last 3 seconds

[rich magnet]

I think void matter room would be less boring if getting the void matters didn't take way less time than it takes for the first enemy to spawn
I'd you actually had to spend several waves still gathering the rest, it would be a lot more engaging
Idk how to make that happen though

[lethal swan]

cuz rn the guy that spawns has high hp but isnt even dangerous
the miniboss from the light room, while not dangerous because it dies in .5 seconds because player damage, it does have some pretty dangerous spells (mostly knocking you away from ur light-holding teammate, causing u to take a lot of that darkness dmg)

[lethal swan]

agreed

like if the 4 tasks took a lot longer, there'd actually be some strategy of "oh well we cant all go do the tasks at the same time cuz otherwise the void door will take damage"

but that's not the case

[inland hull]

or just spawn the mobs quicker

[lethal swan]

yeah

[rich magnet]

Spawning everything quicker would be a bit overwhelming to some builds though

[lethal swan]

im curious how many of TNA's problems would be fixed merely by cutting down player damage a ton

[inland hull]

maybe to war guardians sure lol

[rich magnet]

Non-etw bolt vs increasing that spawn rate = pain

[inland hull]

i mean starting to spawn the mobs being quicker, not intervals between mob spawns

at the very start of the room

[rich magnet]

Oh like that yea I'd like that

Remove most of the 10s grace period or whatever it is

[inland hull]

idk the problem with bulb room is having shit to do between bulb keeper spawns

[dapper ocean]

ok but i dont think anyone has ever failed bulb room through losing all 3 bulbs

and its not fun when someone adds a bulb to another one and u have to wait ages for the next

[inland hull]

yea id say the room needs a rework more than what could happen by working with the current system

[dapper ocean]

its not about people trolling more about dumbass players

[inland hull]

i mean yea

[rich magnet]

What if we made bulb catchers have more hp so it's harder for one player to solo defend it

[inland hull]

happens in every other room, idk why bulb room should be too different

[dapper ocean]

idk its just an easy fix so

[inland hull]

too easy, def need to reevaluate what the goal was with bulb room

[dapper ocean]

id even say just remove the other two and fail the raid if u lose the single one

since its rlly not that hard to kill a bulb catcher

[dapper ocean]

but it still just doesnt make sense for greg to go into his "agro mode" after taking a fourth of his health

[rich magnet]

Taking 1/4th would feel like a rather significant benchmark when you aren't speedkilling him
If Greg is supposed to be this "super high health enemy that takes a while to bog down", getting through 1/4th becomes more significant

[dapper ocean]

ok but were talking about the force watch not just a regular watch

if 1/4 of his health being gone is significant ur probably not 1 watching no?

[inland hull]

forcing watch any later in greg fight than 75% would be functionally the same as what we have now imo

[dapper ocean]

im talking about parties that have the ability to one watch, and it just seems weird that greg goes into his "strongest mode" at the beginning of the fight

[rich magnet]

I guess it stops making sense if that's the damage being dealt

[dapper ocean]

yeah and thats like most parties i can legit 1 watch solo

[rich magnet]

But we can't make 2 possible times easily, and maybe it could be viewed as a panic mode from Greg instead because you're killing him so fast

[dapper ocean]

bro what

in terms of bosses they usually try their hardest and become the strongest towards the end dont they?

[rich magnet]

If Greg's hp gets nuked immediately, he should start panicking, should he not?

[dapper ocean]

seems kinda dumb for him to go invincible sniper mode when he has 75% of his health left like hes lowkey chilling

[mighty knot]

im making it so they always spawn

as in no waiting between bulb keepers

and also gunna be buffing them up

[inland hull]

but then bulb room lasts 10 seconds

[dapper ocean]

yea

[inland hull]

as compared to 2.5 min vm room

[dapper ocean]

u shouldnt make it insta spawn right after tbh

[rich magnet]

Didn't lumi say they'd be spawning anywhere in the room? The full room is quite big

[dapper ocean]

the better alternative would be waiting like 10 seconds after one dies to spawn another

[dapper ocean]

still hella fast

[rich magnet]

Fair enough yea

[dapper ocean]

i say u remove all rng in bulb room and spawn 10s after the room starts and 10s after each one dies

[inland hull]

even then its lasting 1m at best

[dapper ocean]

ok but anymore than 10s and its kinda afk room again

[inland hull]

if despairing crawler dies in like 2 seconds im not sure how much harder bulb keepers could be

[mighty knot]

i mean

that could work

[dapper ocean]

maybe make the bulb require 6 instead of 3 no?

[mighty knot]

just removing the randomness in its spawning

[dapper ocean]

honestly that would be a lot more engaging

[mighty knot]

6 could be cool

[inland hull]

that could work

[mighty knot]

I want to remove the waiting for it to spawn

I want to encourage more running around looking for him and fighting him

[dapper ocean]

yeah shit is boring as fuck

[inland hull]

no more rock

[dapper ocean]

if ur gonna spawn him anywhere on the map u should make like a warning that one spawned on the screen

[mighty knot]

yes

thats the plan

[dapper ocean]

ok bet

[rich magnet]

Btw lumi I think I should let you know since greg won't be teleporting to the middle anymore, afaik this thing where if everyone gets far enough away, the Sightseeing Interceptor can be despawned hasn't been fixed
(Don't question anything we were clearly fighting greg in a normal way and definitely weren't using 4 absos to survive while all in boats (purple circles ended the run))
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1097292424805621781/1175486907208192070/TNA_Watched_Bug.mp4?ex=6623fa7e&is=6611857e&hm=d46732ecae8c6958249316b20c7b89364b6d242c020c32bf621d68fc76d7d8ca&

[dapper ocean]

and yeah the rock should be removed if you want more engagement

[inland hull]

me w/ 0% walkspeed omw to steal the bulb on the other side of the map

[dapper ocean]

and also put barriers on the areas u can sit up top

[jolly cairn]

can you also please just make the despairing crawler spawn as early as wave 2 in the void matter room

or fuck it if you’re gonna make bulbs spawn quicker then why not just make the crawler spawn as early as end of wave 1 if all other ones are collecyed

[jolly cairn]

bigger issue is why the fuck armor breaker is on a dps archetype tbh but forced watched at 25/50 makes more sense yeah

[mighty knot]

that room is already being worked on by other people

[mighty knot]

that can be fixed easily

the guy despawning

[mighty knot]

no

I hate barriers so much

like ligit I almost murdered salted for adding barriers to lootrun events

I was building a nail bomb then calmed myself

lmao

[pulsar flare]

something like hittable vold hole
the mroe dmg u deal to the hole, the faster it spawn (like smoking in a bee hive to force the bees to come out)

[visual mountain]

same
its the worst way to go about it

[late ether]

maybe it would make the game more engaging than being a speedrun game with ridiculously short killtime for giggles

unaware players would just die watching because they think Gregg is too slow to pose harm

[late ether]

let there be difficulty with reason

[coarse wyvern]

In monumenta u can't kill the hardest boss in 10s

[late ether]

literally any game that does not allow ridiculous powercreep:

[coarse wyvern]

Fr

[late ether]

even hsb's endgame bosses have their own powercreep to counter the players' powercreep 😨

[coarse wyvern]

lol

[late ether]

just ignore the times when slayer bosses can be one tapped but they are lesser bosses compared to those endgame dungeon bosses which are equivalent to raid bosses in wynncraft?

at least those one taps take effort...

[coarse wyvern]

Iirc in like enderman slayer u can't just 1tap it

But anyway hsb sucks, monumenta not so compare to it

[winged ivy]

3 vs 0

Yea hsb is -10 out of 10

Wynncraft is around 8.5 out of 10

[coarse wyvern]

Tho real hard tna would prolly kill a few percent of the playerbase

[winged ivy]

Only those 0 watchers

[coarse wyvern]

The 100th player on tna leaderboard still has almost 2k completions, ig most of those players wouldn't have that if tna was actually hard

[late ether]

yea I regret playing that game

[winged ivy]

Me too, luckily I didn't play hsb dungeon

No balance at all

[late ether]

I liked dungeons
all I ever played was healler class
I was empowered
but the dwarven mines update which was supposed to be an improvement to mining absolutely broke my hope in the end

[winged ivy]

Wynncraft is better because this

[coarse wyvern]

[late ether]

real

[torn moth]

Greg should be made harder by reducing insane powercreep

[pulsar flare]

on gobb

make a giant gobb blow out from gerg body

[coarse wyvern]

🔥

https://youtu.be/iOnXTM3yy1s peak greg gameplay btw

[late ether]

imagine he just sheds his entire skeletal body and the core inside the ribcage jumps out

[coarse wyvern]

lol that would be cool, like the eye

[mighty knot]

EXACTLY

random invisable walls work in 3rd person games

or games with less movment cuz they feel less in your face

in a first person game with crazy movement they are literally in your face

and feel terrible

they should only be on the borders of the map and small nitches that u can only hit by trying to hit them

[mighty knot]

some other changes to nameless, he will stop for a short time then jump, instead of walking forward and jumping while walking

I think it will make dodging that attack more fair

[late ether]

thank you <3

[mighty knot]

Also also im straight up removing the eye attack that shoots an eye and if it hits u u get blindness. I feel its pretty outdated as its litearlly just shooting a mob and giving you blindness, and it's very unnecessary with some of the spell changes he is getting. Idk if there are any big blinding eye attack fans lol

I want more of his attacks to focus on shooting a thing from him to the player location, including in the air, the eye just is a mob that walks on the ground until it reaches the player, very borring imo

[late ether]

btw please make spawned enemies or minions despawn if gregg starts watching

people always die during that transition somehow

[rich magnet]

eyes can be a threat to uppercut surfing warrior using flying kick since you need to be careful not to land on a whole pile below you at once but otherwise they're pretty irrelevant in terms of being an actual threat
kind of glad to see them gone

[late ether]

wait what are eyes

the floating kamikaze units?
they are gone?

[rich magnet]

the things that get spawned before watched (or randomly in the fight but thats harder to point out)

[late ether]

🎂
happy birthday everyone we're reborn

we're eating good when reworks are pushed out

[rich magnet]

the quantity of changes is very exciting, but of course we still have 0 hints at when 2.1 will happen

unless you want to count Selvut saying idol revert and stuff will most likely be with 2.1, implying a lack of anything else minor coming

[late ether]

what if basaltic traps simply attach to any surfaces and not just the ground

maybe I would not witness my bomb spell not placing a single trap in that one confined space

[rich magnet]

I think that would require some changes to how the detection of hitting a floor works because I've shot the underside of small platforms with bomb and had it place a trap on top

[late ether]

it also sucks that if any of your bomb arrows hit the walls instead of landing near a block with an open space above
it would lead to the failure of trap placement

[lethal swan]

immense W

[lethal swan]

HOLY SHIT I WILL VENMO U A BAJILLION DOLLARAS

GOATED

[lethal swan]

kamikaze i think more of the black skulls, is that what ur thinking of?

[torn moth]

Only thing that I wasn't fine with it is same as purple circles: stacking true damage which can lead to being one-shot
Blind itself was fine I think

Kinda reminds me of immortal snail

[winged ivy]

[pulsar flare]

that always kill me on warp

my skill issue

[torn moth]

oh, regarding good unskippable phases, that I forgot
the eye
and falling eyes

[mighty knot]

I dont like the falling eyes rn honestly

they fall so damn fast they are hard to dodge

[twin hound]

its better than the laser room imo as that one is incredibly easy even if you dont know that its the same pattern every time and so can spend half of it afk

[torn moth]

Didn't mean particularly balance and rather design
Short, intense

[left mesa]

Did the blue line telegraph already get fixed

suddenly it's starkingly obvious to me

[mighty knot]

no it did not

[jolly cairn]

@mighty knot did anything change with tna i swear im not trippin but aggro random swaps when it used to not and the boss is casting spells like charge when it didnt used to

[mighty knot]

no

none of TNAs files have been pushed

and if they had by mistake, the changes would be way more drastic than that

[jolly cairn]

maybe im just noticing things for the first time while soloing hmm

thanks, could also just be lag but idk it’s so weird I swear these things didn’t happen beofre

[mighty knot]

probably, I remade like half of the code of it backend wise and the spells are changed a lot, when it gets pushed charge will go in a straight line and not follow the player, he will stand still before casting, and more

this was based on player feedback in another thread, if it somehow got pushed it would be either broken cuz the new files didnt get pushed, or it would be totally different

[late ether]

I hope these changes set up standards for designing the behavior of other enemies

[inland hull]

https://medal.tv/games/minecraft/clips/2cCcmb6UH0do_X/d1337GtCHxgt?invite=cr-MSxLMnYsMzc0NjkzNDEs gregory 5/11 shadowpatch

[pulsar flare]

bro doing voidhole farming

[mighty knot]

oh na impossible, only nameless will be a good boss every other boss will be made worse

[mighty knot]

there straight up was not a shadow patch

if there was greg would just be outright broken

[inland hull]

fake (it was particularly laggy that day so that mightve done something)

[mighty knot]

idk what u are even trying to say changed

that he does charge more?

like imma be real, I did not touch his charge rate, I touched like everything else about his charge spell lmao, and totally changed the back end of how spells are called. if that got pushed greg would be broken or be so obviously differnt it wouldn't be a question if it got pushed.

when you don't kill greg in 3 seconds and realize he does attacks and combos 🤯

[inland hull]

nah i dont actually think the game was updated i just found it weird how more than a few people had the same issue that day

dont think its really anything

[jolly cairn]

servers have just been giga shit recently, not your fault 🤝

[mighty knot]

yee i'm aware, I'm gunna go to where the servers are hosted with a big magnet and threaten them to fix it or else

[jolly cairn]

you are so awesome

[torn moth]

I think whenever lag happens he can chain queue charges like maniac (like 3-4 charges in a row, sometimes even before first even happens, so he just sometimes turns mid charge) or something similar, idk if it's what that lad meant

[mighty knot]

thats just not true

he can always chain charges

he does spells in combos and the combos are based on % hp

at some lower % hp he has a lot of combos where he spams charge or jump 3 times in a row

and they can be picked multiple times in a row

the % is in 10% hp thresholds outside of early on where there is a 95% threshold

lag doesn't effect this. it just picks a random number between 1 and 10 or 1 and 5 and does that combo

unless lag makes it so it always picks the same random number which I highly doubt

he can sometimes if 1 combo stops start the next one a little too fast and charge twice, this issue has already been fixed and will come with greg 2 in 2.1 This has always been an issue you are just noticing it now

[torn moth]

Is that short delay intended though
Like queuing multiple charges in one second

[mighty knot]

it is not

[torn moth]

So he switches direction mid-air

[mighty knot]

well that is

cuz his target changed

mid air

currently he just keeps acting normal durring the charge

and can switch targets mid aid

air

in new greg that won't happen

[torn moth]

Great

[mighty knot]

new greg will be perfect, and there will be 7 FORCED watches >:)

[torn moth]

No I meant like sharp turns like doing L shaped charges

[mighty knot]

the charge doesnt make him look anywhere

he just charges the way he is facing

but his facing is based on his AI

and who he is tracking

new greg locks him into facing

1 way

until the charge ends

[torn moth]

Great

[mighty knot]

also charges and jumps will have a much better telegraph

better particles and he stands still before doing it

[torn moth]

I was just saying regarding to charge chain
If he starts new charge before finishing previous one he could do that

[mighty knot]

no

[torn moth]

Now it won't matter because new changes

[mighty knot]

well he cant do that rn anyway

its a target change

I cant control how a mob targets players

sadly

but yee wont mater in 2.1

[torn moth]

It could happen when you were solo so it might not be that

[mighty knot]

leme check something then

[torn moth]

Cuz he normally charges in straight line just has not straight facing

[mighty knot]

well

if he jumps over u

he will turn around to look back at u

or if he jumps to the side

same thing

but ye I checked nothing in the scripts makes him look anywhere

[torn moth]

I remember someone sent a clip with that hmm
Let me dig for it

[mighty knot]

it could be that timing happened where he did a second charge too fast mid air

and at the same time turned around to look at you

making it so he does a sharp turn

[torn moth]

Oh yeah, this is exactly what I meant from the start

He does one charge then instantly does another mid air

[mighty knot]

oh ye lol

cooldowns it seems got messed up durring beta

they were originally correct but then cooldowns in the scripts for the spells changed

but the ones in the spell caller script did not it seems

lol i fixed this months ago just gotta wait 😔

[torn moth]

I wonder if this made 1st charge prolonged making that both of them stacked

[mighty knot]

na it can't prolong the attack

the cooldowns are like ATTACK 3 sec ATTACK 3 sec ATTACK 2sec (end)

and if the same thing is called again

it will not have the proper cooldown

[late ether]

One must imagine a world where other enemies and bosses have decent telegraphs.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/262012380878340096/1234113279459201044/javaw_77cy0qWcc7.mp4?ex=6644a50e&is=6643538e&hm=d254b85b940fa399465390004ba6c9839d78fcfe6f4be904353389b534c250c1&
In this fight I cannot reliably see or hear cues for incoming attacks.
I have only now realized that I died to a charge attack.

My recording software messes up the audio volume somehow.

[mighty knot]

those are yml spells. Basically hard coded shit in the mob file. They were wynns OG spell system and we can now use script to do spells and add better telegraphs but they are janky cuz every script has to run on a player whereas yml spells can just be on the mob. So adding a better telegraph just isn't possible for yml spells. Raid bosses and dungeon bosses could prob get all script spells cuz they are contained and we can control the environment more

Nameless was the first boss we made that was fully meant to use script spells. iir it has 1 yml spell which is wave, but becuase that's its ONLY yml spell u always know what it is.

others raid and dungeon bosses have script spells but also have large yml spell combos still. Which we know are not super good at telegraphs, they are a 9 year old outdated system