Have a way for staff to find people who manipulate the market, and have it be against the rules

[hollow verge]

how would this even work? like should staff just make a giant list of “how much is every item worth” and hold the market to that standard? prices change due to new metas or new strats, it’s not always manipulation

if someone buys out every single one of an ingredient, they’re probably using it, and then whomever has more of that will probably price it higher

due to like

that’s how capitalism works?

like i have ~3 stacks of soul stones that i grinded. if i sold them now, i probably wouldn’t make as much as if i bought every cheaper one, then sold them all at the new lowest price

ok this probably needs a tldr

tldr: no good way to track, manipulation probably isn’t manipulation, we’re all insane, and capitalism sucks sometimes.

[hazy dune]

Sometimes

[tame tapir]

This is stupid

[patent wedge]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edict_on_Maximum_Prices

[hollow verge]

sir that didn’t work

[patent wedge]

yea it's literally just capitalism you can't really avoid market manipulation

[patent wedge]

that's the point i'm trying to make

[hollow verge]

oh i stoopid sorry lol

no tm access for a week

[hazy dune]

Basically more of a capitalism thing than anything

[hollow verge]

forced ironman

[red geode]

Tbf it is illegal irl but still

[hollow verge]

forced hunted for a week

[red geode]

With mythics dropping unlocked

[bleak wave]

🤨

[hazy dune]

I mean so is murder

[hollow verge]

but funny

yep!

[olive rover]

yeah uh

[bleak wave]

yeah uh we arent gonna do this

[hollow verge]

good

[olive rover]

this would be like, impossible to make work

[red geode]

I love market manipulation

[hazy dune]

And also questionable

[hollow verge]

never give me punishment privileges

[olive rover]

if it makes you feel any better, market manipulating usually just doesnt work

[red geode]

If you have some of the item they’re manipulating you can make money off of them

[olive rover]

like you have to constantly scrub the market and still sell all your items

[hazy dune]

Tol runes are a case I guess

[olive rover]

its you vs the whole server, you'll usually end up losing money as people undercut you and you have to keep buying

[red geode]

I’ve only really seen this work in hsb with useless & low demand items since people get tricked into buying them at ridiculous prices

[olive rover]

👆

[bleak wave]

in order to do it on anything actually worthwhile, you would need an incredible amount of capital

and you would need to constantly scrub the market like tealy said

and even then there still is 0 guarentee that itll work

people will notice that someone is attempting to manipulate it and then profit off of it themselves

[cosmic onyx]

while market fluctuations can be frustrating, like simulator prices for example, there is an easy way for you personally to combat it: buy stuff in advance or have a friend buy it for you. if you dont have friends go take a loan or something

noone else will solve this issue for you

[olive rover]

whoever is doing it is an idiot

[red geode]

You could profit off of it while also helping new players

Buy when it’s not being maniped and sell while it is

[olive rover]

find a brass band and throw on tm for 15 le

[red geode]

Free money

And if you do it enough they lose money and don’t do it again

[hollow verge]

or just sell it for like 10le so it gets instabought by the manipulator

then do that like 10 times

free money

[olive rover]

yeah

[bleak wave]

if someone cant buy it off tm

it is super easy to just

run a cave a few times

🤯

the trade market isnt a place that you HAVE to get items

there are a ton of other ways to get items

if they want it for a non expensive price then they can find it themselves or wait for the manipulation to stop

in dont care how lazy people are

if they are willing to spend money instead of getting it themselves thats their problem

i most definitely can

oh then we should make a merchant that gives everyone free le

because people are too lazy to get it themselves and we need to cater to them

:)

a market api will never exist

[opaque karma]

This is a free market issue, not a tm issue

[bleak wave]

we dont want wynn market to end up like hsb with all the market bots doing everything :)

[red geode]

Like average price over past week

[bleak wave]

there will definitely be market bots

if an api exists

[red geode]

But this runs into the problem of rolls on items

[bleak wave]

already exists

but item rolls are an issue yea

reminder that percents are a wynntils thing and not a vanilla thing

[blissful basin]

I think market manipulating is fine

[bleak wave]

market manipulating is fine

[blissful basin]

Like for common items you can find some pretty fast

And most items are niche enough that a manipulation won’t matter

Scrap is the only notably manipulated item since people are just too lazy to go to ragni weapon merchant

[red geode]

You have to be rich to pull it off and it has a decent chance of backfiring

[blissful basin]

Which is fine tbh pay ems or pay with your time

[tame tapir]

High demand items should be allowed to cost a lot even if it's some low level exp thing

"Ruining for newer players" youre acting as if it's a human right to have the most optimal level gear at hand

[terse crater]

🗣️

[unborn creek]

This is very anticapitalist!!

[zenith shadow]

omg no way buying 2 unID'd OKRs for 5le and relisting them for 8 should def be bannable omg

[unborn creek]

They should decriminalize market manipulation irl since it is very anti capitalist

[grand karma]

??

[polar turtle]

Bruh, the only thing I do in the game is market manipulation, how dare you take away my fun

[dusty raft]

How is that market manipulation? You just sold something you got legitimately

[polar turtle]

It is like playing with stocks. Since the loot running update, you can gamble if an item is going to be offered in the next weeks chests, so you can buy low when it is really common and sell high once it isn’t offered in the chests. And for the people who scalp the market, I see them as a source of a quick buck when you want to sell a whole bunch, but don’t want to wait for stuff to sell

[olive rover]

based but silly ngl

[polar turtle]

I loved it when people try to manipulate common item’s because it is a great way to earn a whole bunch of money

[olive rover]

i cant wait to buy a bunch of items and then get warned for attempting to market manipulate

mods would never do it

i do appreciate you looking out for the little man who has the chance to get scalped, but this is really not as much of an issue in reality as you may think imo

and its an issue we couldnt and honestly shouldnt try to fix thru moderation

[mild anchor]

awesome, time to sell my stock for 4 le each ty for the heads up

you can see average sale price in the buy menu, if youre paying 30 le for something which normally sells for 30 eb youre the sucker

[limber tinsel]

Market manipulation is such an indepth topic that 99% of the time you would either be too harsh or too weak on the rules.

Would you ban people who make threads about buffs that get a positive reaction from the item team?
Would you ban the item team for posting the changelog early?
Would you ban youtubers for making videos on good builds / items? (Yes this effects the price)

I get your intentions, but a lot of things manipulate the market.

[bleak wave]

excuse me but i think we should absolutely do all of this (i want to pad my ban stats)

[limber tinsel]

banning you for saying you would ban market manipulators (it would reduce the chance of it happening)

[bleak wave]

damn

thats a fair point D:

[sullen marsh]

The magic of an open market

[mild anchor]

we should ban all yts

[limber tinsel]

We need to ban the thread maker because maybe someone saw this and took down their market manipulation based items which then influenced the overall cost

[hushed hamlet]

Communist market where prices are fixed when?

[cosmic onyx]

here

[polar turtle]

Remove market tax when /s

[turbid forge]

how are we even defining market manipulation here

the way op seems to describe it, is as if the mere act of interacting with the market is market manipulation

[white atlas]

Excuse me I would like to con making 5stx of LE a week without playing the game tyvm

[white atlas]

It does but u won't make more money than just lootrunning or grinding TNA/selling mythics in the first place

[tame tapir]

He means when theres 1 guy insta buying an item below a certain price and then sells it himself for a set higher price

[white atlas]

Then just pay slightly higher for the item

[turbid forge]

thats called resale and is perfectly legal irl

depending on how it is done, you could call it resale, dropshipping, market flipping or in the worst of cases, scalping. but it definitely does not fall under "market manipulation"

[tame tapir]

Then idk what OP is referring to

[haughty beacon]

If its worth 32eb then the market will readjust

if the supply cant keep up with the demand then the real value of the item seems to not be 32eb

[rocky parcel]

nah

[olive rover]

i mean yeah its possible to do, its just its not frequently for profit that is worth the capital investment

would be better to lootrun lmao

[cosmic onyx]

Earth breaker market in shambles

[limber tinsel]

Correct

not using the market is also market manipulation

Just doesn't matter though lmao

[silent stag]

Ahhhh hahaha stay mad stay broke

Maybe if you came up with an idea of how to go about it you might make some progress

[tame tapir]

His idea is to ban people who market manipulate

Which is stupid

[silent stag]

Bars 🔥

[silent stag]

Prob j butthurt bc he got licked 😂

Welcome to real life

You realize all items in the game don’t have to be obtained via market

You can just ……. Play the game 🤯

[tame tapir]

Me when i said this and got no response

[bleak wave]

bard put it correctly

[tame tapir]

The game is straight up better when you cant buy busted exp gear for less than an LE

[bleak wave]

same with xae

[tame tapir]

No it doesnt

[silent stag]

You don’t even know that

[tame tapir]

Youre making stuff up. Literally a non issue

New players not being allowed the most op gear on their first playthrough is not an issue

They should play the game the way its intended

[bleak wave]

like

[tame tapir]

Google ”loud minority”

[silent stag]

🤦‍♂️

[bleak wave]

realistically speaking there are no items that are so hard to get that you cant just get it yourself with minimal effort if its overpriced on market

except maybe like

azure blossom

but thats very rare so the price is justified

mythic prices are kept in check by the lootrunners and the current meta

[silent stag]

Sowwy fwog >.< I weewy didwnt mean to 👉👈🥺

[tame tapir]

Who is hostile

[bleak wave]

and if there are that few of them on market and demand is high

low supply + high demand = high price

[silent stag]

Frog how bout instead of recommending an idea like “have staff find the market manipulators” you set up a market infrastructure to where market manipulation is less incentivized

[tame tapir]

Communism

[silent stag]

Bro we playin mc which is owned my Microsoft this been some dictator ass shit for a while

[tame tapir]

Wynn’s not safe!

[turbid forge]

even if microsoft one day kills minecraft, we still have alternative authentication methods via mods/plugins

servers aren't just gonna die from something like that, unless the game's playerbase dies first

[zenith shadow]

as an ironman players I support communism

[unborn creek]

everyone please artificially inflate the price of absolution

i need to offload 2 of them 😭

[blissful basin]

Abso is either going to die or explode in price when the heal eff change happens

Hope for the increase

[unborn creek]

when shaman heal becomes capped, the heal eff of abso would become unnecessary

[dusty raft]

that's heal eff cap not heal cap?

[bleak wave]

from a numbers standpoint, it should do around 50% more healing than that % roll before

assuming heal doesnt get capped

[unborn creek]

heal is getting capped

unless selvut tries to gaslight us and say otherwise

[bleak wave]

#1217786412217401395 message

[blissful basin]

100% heal eff = 333% wd% so like 28% more

[bleak wave]

your math is wrong

260% water damage is 78% healing effectiveness

and the range on abso will be 30-130%

[blissful basin]

Wait what

[bleak wave]

260*.3 = 78

[blissful basin]

Thread said 100

[bleak wave]

yes

100

and then the range is .3 min and 1.3 max

[blissful basin]

A

[bleak wave]

for positive ids

[blissful basin]

What’s gonna happen to like fluid healing ap

[bleak wave]

fluid healing is still going to exist

from what ive been told at least

[blissful basin]

Healing efficiency should be nerfed imo

If wars are going to be a baseline you shouldn’t be able to solo heal for 100k 4.7x

[bleak wave]

wars arent going to be a baseline

[blissful basin]

Though wars generally need a lot of change

[bleak wave]

wars need a balance change

but imo best to just do that sometime after fruma

since thatll have level cap increase, new items, new crafteds, and probably a new overall war meta

[blissful basin]

Will there be wars inside the fruman walls

Chances are war meta will be the exact same just we will be able to drysnipe literally everything

Especially if we get more ability points

[bleak wave]

by war meta i mean items and atree

chances are its just gonna be better to use the new items and stuff

it definitely wont be the exact same

[blissful basin]

The player in general needs hard nerf