More Missions

[pure gale]

you know you can just. disconnect mid lr and come back and continue. right

[rancid cypress]

The problem is ppl hate nerfs majority of time ppl would just perfer under powdered things get buffed

Yan the amount of effort you put into trying to make personal attack, atleast to me, it’s very embarrassing

[edgy sinew]

thoughts on this?

[pure gale]

,

[edgy sinew]

I like the dgrey beacon interaction too

[rancid cypress]

Yes let me take 3 days to do 1 lr cause I have 45 mins of free time during the week days….

[edgy sinew]

And potential combos with new missions

[rancid cypress]

Fr sometimes ppl are just busy and it would be nice to do a shorter run while it not being like 20x less effective time wise than committing to the “3 day long rng check”

[edgy sinew]

rng check ends on 4th mission

[pure gale]

so you think you should be given good rewards just because you take longer to complete a lr than most

[rancid cypress]

Fr I couldn’t imagine having a job and trying to pay rent and also trying to have a hobby, sounds insane to me

[rancid cypress]

Confused by this take?

[pure gale]

if short runs were designed to reward people in your scenario, nobody would do long runs anymore and instead just do short runs cause you get a payout faster

[rancid cypress]

Allowing short runs to be ok/good does what to making long runs bad some how? How?

[edgy sinew]

short runs are ok now tho with quick sac stacks

[pure gale]

its also just a faster way to get end reward pulls than completing challenges normally

[rancid cypress]

I mean this is also if you get the rng check of getting mission that go with short runs too? It’s not like ur getting missions to support short runs every single time liek ur not getting equalib every time

[pure gale]

you have to do 4 challenges before this rng check comes by

youll have to wait like 2 minutes after ending the lr probably to start again

way faster than actually investing time and effort into a lr

[rancid cypress]

I’m confused again I think this would be better over vc, there’s a lot of nuance that take too long to type out

You think your getting to mission 4 before the 10 min timer? Like by then ur around challange 20-30 which is like 30 min ish. I’m just confused by your definition of short run

Yan I think you can’t understand anything besides the surface level conversation happening

Yes put another troll face it shows how sophisticated you are

[pure gale]

strategy:

• set 10 minute timer
• start lr
• do 4 challenges
• take the free 50 pulls if u get it
• go do a few purple beacons until the 10 minute timer ends
• end lr
• repeat

[rancid cypress]

Sam I’m just confused at what you might be defining as short run and as to meta

[pure gale]

is it really that hard to understand

[rancid cypress]

By this shouldn’t meta be set 10 min timer start lr get equalib then reset?

[little sun]

5 epulls per min is meh

[pure gale]

forgot what equilibrium does ngl

[rancid cypress]

It is cause ppl aren’t souly reseting runs based of equalib why would they for some shitty 50 pull run?

[pure gale]

because its faster and easier than actually playing the game

[rancid cypress]

Sam I’m sorry about I’m starting to think you don’t lr very often

[pure gale]

i dont lr at all i just have common sense lol

[rancid cypress]

Why are y’all treating this mission like it’s a 100% guarantee

I’m very confused by how you guy are arguing ur points

Ur creating strawman that don’t reflect the actual system then use that as reason for ur arguments

[edgy sinew]

because if you dont roll it you can end the run with mostly no consequences

[rancid cypress]

Consequence is wasting time?

This why I say vc im so confused by wtf y’all r talking about, ur saying if ur don’t get ur “short run mission” first ur just gonna reset and end the run, isn’t that the same logic for equalib

I’m confused cause I wanna think y’all have some sort of point but I think Yan is just a idiot yapping about something

Idek

Anyways I’m outa here for now. Scroll back 4-5 days if u wanna see the ppl who wanted more love to short runs. I just agreed with them long lootruns shouldn’t be obvious 100x better than any other strategy

^ This is what a toddler throwing a tantrum looks like. I think that’s like almost 20+ reactions now. Jeez

Say it’s a troll if you want, it’s kinda just embarrassing imo

Ur this mad cause I said flat mission reward are better for short runs and scaling is better for long runs

[edgy sinew]

flat is shit design 👍

[rancid cypress]

I mean that doesn’t make the basic fact of game design and like math that flat is better for shorter runs and scaling is better for longer runs, y’all are like arguing with math.

Like “shit” or not that doesn’t change how the math works?

[edgy sinew]

How does that fact relate to the convo lol

[vale tartan]

are you even engaged in the conversation

buuns is arguing that flat rewards are better for short runs while scaling rewards are better for long runs, which is true

i don’t see how that doesn’t relate to the conversation

[rancid cypress]

Idk I’ve attracted the trolls u prob won’t get an actual conversation out of them

[vale tartan]

🤷‍♂️

why not lmao

[rancid cypress]

Exactly

[vale tartan]

there shouldn’t be one way to lootrun

[rancid cypress]

Wow almost as if I was saying that exact thing ely

So there should only be 1 single way to lr?

[vale tartan]

who said it would be easy to do short runs

i’d assume they would be just as balanced as long runs, just a different playstyle

[rancid cypress]

Why?

Why is time the only investment

Perfect

Ya didn’t see that 1

[edgy sinew]

Not at any point was that the case :)

[spiral plaza]

now I can't even do short run? great

[pastel crypt]

idk make it like short runs take like an hour, and then longer more valuable runs take like 2+

[vale tartan]

ok ok IMO short runs should be as good as long runs, just they shouldn’t be piss easy for the same rewards

like as long as they are fairly balanced it seems fine

kinda

[rancid cypress]

I was just saying a way to buff short runs while not breaking long runs y’all went crazy

[edgy sinew]

I don't have anything against short runs if they have some actually fun payoffs and not "get 50 pulls instantly"

[vale tartan]

exactly

[spiral plaza]

flat rewards with short time requirement always bad design

[rancid cypress]

Thus flat values that don’t scale…..

Like holy fuck I wanna shoot myself in the head

Because I don’t want to lring for 3+ hours maybe I just want to do a quick little one

[vale tartan]

yeah agreed there

not everyone has the time to spend 3 hours lring every day

[rancid cypress]

Yan I’ve been on Wynn since 2016

[spiral plaza]

yeah let's quit wynn good method

[rancid cypress]

Yan you were me 2 years ago when I was saying replaying another class for 20+ hours wasn’t “that bad” if you lost a quira item

Just ppl value with time is very different from one another

[edgy sinew]

Well, you can separate long runs into short sessions but even ignoring that, if a flat reward with no gimmick is strong enough, you just always take it and end quickly to get high pull/min

[spiral plaza]

also why i have to do a stupidly long single run for 3hours instead of 3hours of 20-40mins short run?

[rancid cypress]

Yan ur literally me from 2 years ago omfg

[edgy sinew]

And once it doesnt give good pull/min you just hate seeing it offered

[rancid cypress]

Cause the stat race is annoying to restarts again and again and again even if you get lucky with rng of missions

Restarting more = interaction with more rng

Yan im not talking to you

[rancid cypress]

Reply to this

On mobile so it’s hold

[spiral plaza]

i mean why i have to do it instead of i can choose?

[rancid cypress]

?

[edgy sinew]

But if it is something like "do a mission -> do something risky/inevitably too hard for a while to get a juicy reward", then it is much more fun

[spiral plaza]

idk who's talking about nerf short run

[edgy sinew]

And it scales with your progress and your further decisions

[rancid cypress]

Yan and notice want to “nerf” short runs. Me and ely want them to be an option in the meta

[spiral plaza]

why?

[edgy sinew]

Ofc, instead of making good fun missions for short runs, we should throw shit at eachother for an hour

[rancid cypress]

^

[spiral plaza]

u can get more epulls in average time with short run compare to long run

at least it is at this patch

unless u got a perfect gb in long run (which is nearly impossible)

[rancid cypress]

(I’m leaving but plz come up with more short lr mission plz)

[edgy sinew]

btw this is at least the second time you suggest a flat pull mission and start a holywar

[spiral plaza]

when did the war start?

i mean which mission

[edgy sinew]

a

b

[spiral plaza]

imo flat reward should not give u equal to the amount of vaqua vdgrey (or even should not exist)

i just wake up and see this thread burning

it is fine they can still see it

[rancid cypress]

It’s almost like every time you start this war cause ppl don’t understand you can’t have scaling missions for short runs

Leaving fr just don’t flame me instantly as I leave plz

[spiral plaza]

this is cool

[edgy sinew]

"can’t have scaling missions for short runs" my ass

[mellow sequoia]

i aint reading allat

tldr please

why

[spiral plaza]

that's not even viable anymore

btw this 50 flat pulls concept is not the first time he's talking about it

[edgy sinew]

oops i deleted instead of reply lol

[rancid cypress]

Bru 50 flat pull is just a number omg it would be 8 flat pull it’s the same concept

Y’all really can only think at a 3rd grade level I swear

[edgy sinew]

Disaster Struck - Purple beacons give double the pulls. At the end of each challenge, curses become 20% stronger permanently.
||new mission|| ||repost cuz i deleted||

[spiral plaza]

can u make a good looking number first next time?

[rancid cypress]

Broken with equalib or ant cleanses syngerize extremely broken for long runs

[spiral plaza]

because u gave a range (30-50)

[rancid cypress]

Danny I don’t know what number is big enought to matter but small enought to not be broke I’m just a single person I think it would take more balance that 1 persons opinion

[mellow sequoia]

aint the benefit of short runs the shorter amnt of time they take

[rancid cypress]

Yes are we gonna make that the only benefit tho? It leaves short runs in this boring neglected category of style of running

[spiral plaza]

more accurately they can get decent epulls in very short time

[rancid cypress]

^ and consist sacrificing cause it’s a common mission you see like 98% of the time

[mellow sequoia]

time is money

[rancid cypress]

Elaborate plz

[spiral plaza]

if u revert dgrey to 2.0.3 short run will be stupidly op

[edgy sinew]

revert it to release 2.0.3

where it didnt spawn after 10th chal

[spiral plaza]

tbh who will benefit from this?

[edgy sinew]

noone but it will be funny

[floral spade]

except for people wheelchairs. There are no ramps in wynncraft

all increases and decreases in elevation have steps

[spiral plaza]

dgrey : i am not useless because i can ruin ur day with rng

[edgy sinew]

How were the wynncraft pyramids built

[rancid cypress]

Plz explain what u mean this is kinda vague

[spiral plaza]

i am sorry but tealy will never explain when he dont fking care about u

[mellow sequoia]

the more time i invest, the more money i should get

[rancid cypress]

Fr

Time is the only investment into lring? Let me afk then?

[mellow sequoia]

afk isnt time you're investing goofball

[spiral plaza]

afk is 0 time investment so u get 0 reward totally fair

[edgy sinew]

lootstand

[rancid cypress]

So then my “slow runner” idea is something ur talking about

[spiral plaza]

what is that

[mellow sequoia]

god bless the economy

[edgy sinew]

Can we all mark new missions with some searchable tag btw

[rancid cypress]

Mission “slow runner” For x amount of time taken to do a lr convert into y pulls maybe 1 min = 1 pull maybe 3 min= 1 pull

[spiral plaza]

no u should record every mission idea u made

[mellow sequoia]

so afk farming

[edgy sinew]

oh true actually, let me make a private google doc with missions

[spiral plaza]

that's why it is not a good idea i already told u

[edgy sinew]

and not share it with anyone so my missions cannot be stolen

[rancid cypress]

More Time= more reward tho

[spiral plaza]

more time U SPENT

[rancid cypress]

? Like

[edgy sinew]

You dont spend time that you are afking

[rancid cypress]

How else do you recommend implementing that direct equation then?

Tealy wants time to equal reward while not promoting afking, how does that work exactly

[edgy sinew]

challenge completed = 1 pull

[rancid cypress]

That promotes speedrunning not time?

That’s a different equation

[mellow sequoia]

if i wanted to ghost yall i wouldn't have made all the feedback threads i have

[rancid cypress]

Then why is there a challange cap?

[edgy sinew]

because CT hate fun

[spiral plaza]

because we have ritual equili and gb in beta

[rancid cypress]

This is why I can’t take what some of y’all say seriously

[spiral plaza]

tbh they probably can remove the cap now (and add it back with new mission )

[mellow sequoia]

its like exposure therapy. after reading #1019649786799996980 for 6 months ill probably be like immune to cancer and stuff

[spiral plaza]

tbh i probably only take u seriously for 10% of the time

[edgy sinew]

Challenge cap just means you need to interact with different missions

[rancid cypress]

Tealy I’m trying to fundamentally understand the direction of lring. I’m not trying to be a shit head or asshole I just want to see what direction y’all r taking cause it seems to be going in different directions sometimes

[mellow sequoia]

long term investment

[rancid cypress]

Imagine there are soft caps for a reason that scale to ridiculous rates

[edgy sinew]

You cant take 4 missions and spend your whole wynn playtime with 4 select missions

[mellow sequoia]

ima be real i dont really like the challenge cap iirc it was a salted thing

[spiral plaza]

what if u have 4000 lb 2000lq

[rancid cypress]

I asked in the sense y’all r saying the “point” is to do challanges, or is the point to spend more time lring?

[spiral plaza]

tbh they can remove it after all these gb nerf

[edgy sinew]

I think challenge cap is justifiable even though i don't enjoy it

[mellow sequoia]

im not lootrun god (yet) im just tryna be a bridge between community and ct for lootrunning and the economy in general

[rancid cypress]

I rlly dislike the challange cap

[edgy sinew]

the point is effort is rewarded

[rancid cypress]

Who cares?

[spiral plaza]

btw is it possible to get mythic box every chest with certain lb/lq ?

[edgy sinew]

Be it mechanical effort, strategic or whatever else

[mellow sequoia]

i kinda get the cap cause like, once you got 200 boons, what can stop you? Its like exponential growth

why start a new lootrun ever when you can roll the dice a few times and become god

[spiral plaza]

as long as it is not exponential growth in reward like gb i think it is ok

[rancid cypress]

Imagine that’s just highlighting the problems with boon and scaling and everything in general already?

[mellow sequoia]

guaranteed mythics, easy street

[edgy sinew]

time spent actively engaging with content

[mellow sequoia]

yeah id like to remove cap and have increasing base scaling after a certain point

[rancid cypress]

Imo that’s the result of a bad system at the core not cause the system is flawed at the outer edges

[mellow sequoia]

no amnt of boons can save you

[rancid cypress]

Agree

[mellow sequoia]

no

[edgy sinew]

what about some sort of eхponent in baseline scaling

I think my ideas about that got buried in hero beta chat tho

[rancid cypress]

Plz explain more then. I genuinely think the way curses and scaling is fundamentally flawed currently and shows to the extreme when you get to extreme number to challenges

[edgy sinew]

appears once in 2 challs moment

[mellow sequoia]

hows it "fundamentally flawed" rather than just need a change like my suggestion

[spiral plaza]

because we probably dont need that at that moment (who the fk know they will add the cap just a day before to live)

[rancid cypress]

Mobs get stronger at a linear rate where the player relys on rng to scale at and extremely expensial rate at semi random times

[mellow sequoia]

so hows that fundamentally flawed...?

[edgy sinew]

I think that is a bad solution

[mellow sequoia]

you know what that word means right

[rancid cypress]

Because player scaling and mob scaling is fundamentally random instead of being tied to each other?

[mellow sequoia]

just make scaling exponential

[rancid cypress]

Would prefer that change imo

[edgy sinew]

Lootrun ranks should teach a beginner how to Lr

[mellow sequoia]

if they were tied to eachother then why would you ever get buffs

[spiral plaza]

if my lr xp is stored i will be max level in 1 sec

[edgy sinew]

they shouldnt just gatekeep for no reason

[spiral plaza]

i do want more lr rank tho

[edgy sinew]

I want lr ranks to count towards total level tome

[spiral plaza]

maybe 5% more of natural vibrant

[rancid cypress]

Tbh not sure, I’ve always struggled understanding the game design around when y’all give buffs. I still don’t understand why raid buffs are a think tbh

[edgy sinew]

Btw @mellow sequoia what about making first mission choice out of more than 3 options?

[mellow sequoia]

why

[spiral plaza]

too much dev time!!

[edgy sinew]

Like, even if it is a 10% chance for an eхtra option like vibrant

[rancid cypress]

Is there every gonna be a reason to v Aqua v grey or just kinda have the be usless for like no reason

[edgy sinew]

Because more missions and 3 options is very low?

[rancid cypress]

^

Especially when 2 of them are high roller and redemption

[edgy sinew]

getting 4 bad mission choices is so much less likely than 3

[spiral plaza]

plz give more choices after all this new missions release

[rancid cypress]

^

Mission rrs if there are enough in the pool

[mellow sequoia]

"More because i want more"

[rancid cypress]

Yes

[spiral plaza]

give us more "controllable" rng

[mellow sequoia]

can yall imagine something with me

[rancid cypress]

?

[mellow sequoia]

did you guys play btb during the spirit's festival?

[edgy sinew]

Yes

[rancid cypress]

Yes

[mellow sequoia]

why do you think you only got a choice of 3 spirits?

[edgy sinew]

because there were like 5 or 6

[rancid cypress]

Cause of limited amount of spirits in the pool

[spiral plaza]

because we dont have 100 spirits

[mellow sequoia]

but why not just let you choose from all of them?

[rancid cypress]

Cause there will be no variants from what ppl would like

[edgy sinew]

Because same spirit not fun

[spiral plaza]

increase 1-2 choices is not all of them tealy

[edgy sinew]

But imagine you had 2 choices

[mellow sequoia]

this

[rancid cypress]

But why do you think ppl main certain characters in fighting games?

[edgy sinew]

That is also not particularly fun?

[spiral plaza]

just set smth like every mission into 5 choices instead of increase the maximum choices

or atleast revert the grey nerf in beta?

[mellow sequoia]

do you think people will "main" certain lootrun missions? (Besides like materialism)

[rancid cypress]

Yes

[spiral plaza]

everyone main equili

[rancid cypress]

Given the choice ppl would definitely have preferred routes of running

[mellow sequoia]

yeah cause its best

[edgy sinew]

Psycho

[spiral plaza]

tealy why are u talking like we only getting 5 more new missions

[mellow sequoia]

basically, my point is that less control for the player is sometimes a good thing for longevity

[rancid cypress]

I also agree with this^

[mellow sequoia]

so i dont see a good reason to increase mission choice

[spiral plaza]

that's why only GAMBA accepted in wynn

[edgy sinew]

Yeah, but if we have say 30 missions, it is more likely that you will reset bad first roll of 3 fairly commonly

[spiral plaza]

why not nerf mission choices to only 2choices or even no choices? it will be fun

[rancid cypress]

I think it comes with the amount of missions added, if y’all added 200+ missions some how some extra choice would be nice, but if y’all add 3 new mission getting +10 mission choices would be absurd I agree

[edgy sinew]

While a bad first roll of 4 is a much less likely occurance

[mellow sequoia]

yeah i agree

[edgy sinew]

And fishing for 1-4 missions isnt that much easier with 4 choices vs 3

[spiral plaza]

that's why we demand more choices?

[edgy sinew]

Tldr it would be a good QoL without major consequences

[spiral plaza]

arent u guys adding tons of new missions?

[mellow sequoia]

it'll come down to how many new missions we add, which im not sure of as of rn

[rancid cypress]

I do agree with notice tho, the first mission at challange 4 feels really unimpactful cause 2/3 mission are high roller and redemption 80% of the time

[spiral plaza]

ok i got scammed

[edgy sinew]

Also, will we get equil nerf or no

[mellow sequoia]

FUCK EQUIL

[edgy sinew]

Pog

[mellow sequoia]

im just gonna remove equil 💯

[spiral plaza]

base on what tealy always say, if there's a nerf for equili it will be a rng nerf

[rancid cypress]

Do it

[edgy sinew]

It will be a boon nerf because surely that makes equil worse

[spiral plaza]

that's not an equili nerf anymore

that's a lr nerf

it should be smth like 1 boon every 2 curses

it always work with ritual

[edgy sinew]

It should be independent of how much curses you get at the same time IMO

[spiral plaza]

so infinite purple spam

[edgy sinew]

because then you can do fun choices like "do i aqua stack to get pulls or get boons"

[spiral plaza]

if u dont aquastack u only lose 1 pulls every challenge (from 4 to 3)

[edgy sinew]

You also lose dgrey powerspike

[spiral plaza]

take dgrey later

i dont like equili into aqua dgrey immediately anyway

imagine full resis with 18 curses

[edgy sinew]

1 boon per 2 curses is basically the same play pattern on the other hand

But what if it is per 3 curses

[spiral plaza]

how to make per 3 curses?

[edgy sinew]

Like bbeat, just wait until you get 3rd?

[spiral plaza]

u mean nerf it in value directly?

[edgy sinew]

basically I suggest that it should be a bigger number nerf if they do it your way

[spiral plaza]

it probably will become a trash

[edgy sinew]

Who knows

[spiral plaza]

unless we have new missions that can synergize good with it

from 1:1 to 1:3 is a huge nerf

[edgy sinew]

Orphion's Grace if it gets buffed

[spiral plaza]

100% more power!!

[edgy sinew]

Also opens doors to like smooth hp regen

and that bumps it up in power again allegedly

Cleansing greed is kinda mid

[spiral plaza]

are u talking nerfed equili?

so u always have 0 curse

i rather take orphion because u need curses for some boons

[edgy sinew]

Would critual even be worth over ult sac

[spiral plaza]

or inner peace

[edgy sinew]

or like highroller

[spiral plaza]

u want free challenge

[edgy sinew]

but is it worth losing a 3х eff pull multiplier

then grace is better

just double (hopefully) LB LQ

[spiral plaza]

that's how yygamer get 0 boxes with 4000 lb lq

a player

[edgy sinew]

One of the beta runners yeah?

[spiral plaza]

yeah

but idk if they have materialism

[edgy sinew]

Materialism is kinda a big gamechanger for lblq runs

[spiral plaza]

i did a materialism with like 1000lb/lq and end up getting my first box at challenge 90+

btw u can get that much of lb/lq because of clockworker bug and it is fixed

so idk if u still want to do it with only equili now

[edgy sinew]

idk

[spiral plaza]

u probably get only 1/5 of the lb/lq with only equili

[edgy sinew]

final thought 2:5 equil

specifically so it is a pain to count

[spiral plaza]

i dont like this number

[edgy sinew]

good

[spiral plaza]

delete equili

[edgy sinew]

W idea

[rancid cypress]

Tbh I don’t give much weight to ppl crying about lq and lb. During my 10 hr run I got like 8000% loot bonus and like 3000% lq I found 2 mythics over 1800 flying chest which are suppose to already have buffed loot. It’s just 1 sample size but I think the soft cap do their job pretty well

[spiral plaza]

then get more lb/lq

u can get more lb/lq with the clockworker bug in beta although it is fixed in live

some people can get 3 boxes in a single run in live

how about do it again in a single day

[edgy sinew]

a mythic per 5h w/o considering end loot

how much does forgery give again, one per 17h with a constant rune/key investment?

[spiral plaza]

u can get one mythic per 17h with forgery?

[edgy sinew]

I think so

Idk forge numbers are complicated

[spiral plaza]

yeah i have 2000dry with disco last time

[edgy sinew]

I got a disco like 1 good run after switching to disco lol

good run meaning fishing for rainbow on 1 and getting a run going

[rancid cypress]

Ya I don’t see that rate as super bad if ur at thousands of lb and lq while also purposefully getting extra good chests. Idk might be a bad take but that seems decently balanced to me

[pure gale]

i was a supporter of endless lootruns but challenges ended up invalidating the difficulty scaling so a cap was added

[spiral plaza]

invalidating the difficulty sacling?

[pure gale]

equilibrium..

[spiral plaza]

the mobs actually become hard after challenge 300

if u keep getting purple

actually why u guys nerf the whole lr when only one mission break the law(maybe 2 with gb)

[vale tartan]

like tealy suggested, it’s possible that mob stats start to scale much higher after ~100 challenges rather than just cutting you off after 110-112

i think that a soft cap like this would be less restrictive than the current challenge cap

[spiral plaza]

u can even just nerf equili...

[vale tartan]

ok hear me out

a: equilibrium always matches curses and boons, so taking away a curse will also take away a boon

or b: equilibrium can only add one boon at a time

[spiral plaza]

i dont think A can solve the problem

[vale tartan]

yeah i think it’s still pretty op

[spiral plaza]

u scale faster than the mob for early run for 1:1 curse boon (1-300 smth challenge)

[vale tartan]

hmm

would B help with that?

[spiral plaza]

it can help but people will switch to infinite purple spam instead of aqua purple

[vale tartan]

true

what if equilibrium gives half the boon’s effect

[spiral plaza]

u only lose 25% of the pulls with B

[pure gale]

suggestion: remove equilibrium entirely

[vale tartan]

yeah was thinking the same thing

[spiral plaza]

not a bad idea tbh

[vale tartan]

seems really hard to balance ngl

[spiral plaza]

a mission that indirectly give u more rewards and only curses as downside (and u can even scale faster than the curse when not tons of boons and the curse can feed ritual WTF)

[vale tartan]

yeahhhh

what if it always makes you get 2x the curses

wouldn’t really fit the name though…

[spiral plaza]

it just turns into forced work with inner peace or orphion

[vale tartan]

oh yeah

remove equilibrium

[spiral plaza]

force u to get even more rng

the only cons of equili is rare

[vale tartan]

equilibrium: every mission you get is backup beat and every beacon you get is blue

[spiral plaza]

wtf is that

[vale tartan]

no idea

anyway

[vale tartan]

needs more cons

gotta go rip, cya

[spiral plaza]

it is probably a redesign already if u can give it cons

[modest crescent]

i would probably never lootrun again

[spiral plaza]

wait what? u still lring?

[modest crescent]

only when there is a shiny mythic wand i dont alredy have

but without equilibrium idk if even that would make me want to go through this nightmare

[modest crescent]

long runs without equilibrium would be like playing dark souls 3 max difficulty without armor on mobile

[spiral plaza]

alternative solution : dont do long run

[modest crescent]

https://tenor.com/view/phobiamp3-kitty-furios-cat-angry-gif-26396978

[modest crescent]

except in dark souls you can actualy use skill to benefit, in here its just stat check stat check stat check

[sharp echo]

oh my god YES lootrun challenges is just "do you have enough stats for it" which is so stupid

which is why making mythics a lot common is a good thing for the game now: because it's more stats

there's the lootrun anticamps which is supposed to add some mechanical whatever in lootruns but nooo, se ones just made lootrunning even more stat-checky bc they don't work as intended

I do agree that having mythic items be chase items is stupid bc there will inevitably be too many mythics in game and that would make them worthless

but like, this is just power creep happening

[astral turtle]

add a higher rarity of weapons and make mythics more common

surely this wont break the game

[sharp echo]

now that's just some sort of "rarity creep"

[astral turtle]

surely

[sharp echo]

mythics are supposed to be insanely specialized. incredibly strong in one aspect but useless otherwise

but spellbound happened and now you can deal damage with any spell with any weapon and now warp can solo greg every time

[pastel crypt]

more items like sims and insulators will be a good thing imo, they will always be used and worth someones time, thats probably something for forgery aswell to make them played more

[sharp echo]

sims and insulators are good chase items bc they're consumables. mythic weapons and armor aren't

also is it just me or does the corkian simulator look like a dog

but yes spellbound broke the game but like, we gotta agree that the game is better with spellbound than without

the tree just needs to be rebalanced with item balancing, which apparently isn't how it works rn

[modest crescent]

for sure, spellbound made mage actualy fun to play

[sharp echo]

which is the stupidest thing

[modest crescent]

idk if i agree with this tho

some items like cata/divzer/warp have that gimmick but a lot of the mythics were versatile even before 2.0

[sharp echo]

I think it's just a good way to make mythics incredibly strong without making them define the meta

like, I want players to thrive even without touching a single mythic ever

[modest crescent]

they can tho? wdym

the only content that cant be done without mythics is guild wars and that is dead as fuck anyway

[rancid cypress]

Remove mythics from the game

[sharp echo]

what I mean is, I don't like mythics being generally usable for most situations bc it ends up making most content feel like they need to be harderwhen they already are hard

making mythics more common is a good solution, sure, but it's still just allowing power creep to waltz in and do its thing

[modest crescent]

i dont think i get this

how is content hard? mythics are obviously better at everything than legendary/rare items but legendary rare items can still get the job done

mythics should be better, thats why they used to be a super rare item

[sharp echo]

in theory you can break a rock with a toothpick but it's not how you're gonna break one is it

you know what I fucking mean

[modest crescent]

so basicaly you want legendaries to be as good as mythics..? i dont see how thats a good thing

[sharp echo]

when the fuck did I say this

[modest crescent]

yep litteraly everything besides guild waring is accesible without mythics

[sharp echo]

I said specialize mythics, not nerf them

[modest crescent]

elaborate on that please

how would you specialize warp in particular for example

[sharp echo]

honestly idk

I can think of abso tho

[modest crescent]

abso is very much specialized for guild wars

[sharp echo]

abso needs to deal less damage

[edgy sinew]

Remove dps from it

[modest crescent]

that just makes it useless
for all content
litteraly all of it

[sharp echo]

why is warp dps unreasonably high compared to other mage weapons anyway

[edgy sinew]

That makes it a movement ouffhand

[modest crescent]

because it has huge drawbacks

[modest crescent]

with 130 agi req sure il totaly use that ever

idk i would never want to build so much agi on quetz build when i can just 100 str 100 dext slap with bete noire 🔥

[edgy sinew]

Just make a twa cwand (in a perfect world)

[sharp echo]

uh yeah I think it's drawbacks is enough for it to make it having ludicrous amounts of walk speed and insane tp cost reduction reasonable

[spiral plaza]

90% of the mage mythics are trash

[modest crescent]

fatal quetzal and monster arent tho

fatal and quetzal can both out dps warp and monster is cool for solo waring

[spiral plaza]

monster is only for war

[modest crescent]

they should but its too late for that, as tealy said its gona take years to fix them most likely

assuming salted even tries to fix the issue

[spiral plaza]

hopefully fruma mythics value wont be broken

[modest crescent]

fruma mythics alredy suck cuz they dont have a warp

[spiral plaza]

it is impossible to drain mythics so only one way

[modest crescent]

wynn could benefit from proper cosmetic chase items, unlike the bs we have right now
titles as well

[spiral plaza]

so reverse the mythic rate nerf when this is out?

too much dev time

if they telling me they have new mythic consume system and not reverting the rate i will buy all the cheap mythics in market

[sharp echo]

honestly I lowkey like making mythics "consumable" somehow

[spiral plaza]

it might broke the economy again

[sharp echo]

they're consumables meaning it's hard to have a surplus of them if they're rare

compared to mythic items rn, which is just gonna build up in amount overtime

rn the only way I see mythics being "consumed" is by having it have 3 rerolls which is funny

make it a good one, man

I believe in you

[edgy sinew]

Anyway missions
Salvation in Desperation - While not above the time limit, starting and ending challenges without getting extra time gives an additional end reward pull.
||New mission||

[sharp echo]

I see that and I raise you:

new mission: you no longer have a time limit

[edgy sinew]

That actually removes a combo with stasis

[sharp echo]

really? how?

[edgy sinew]

Because stasis on white challenges will not give time because you don't spend it, giving 1 pull a challenge

[sharp echo]

yeah. having there be no time limit would make white challenges give time again bc they can give time past 15 mins

which is crazy for clockworker boons, and perhaps other mission-related stuff

[edgy sinew]

Clockworker would need to be uncapped though

[sharp echo]

oh it's capped?

[edgy sinew]

Yup

[sharp echo]

dang

well the mission would at least synergize well with other time-related missions

[sharp echo]

this is a great mission idea btw. your mission ideas are really cool

[floral spade]

[sharp echo]

fine. it just increases it to like 20 mins

[edgy sinew]

thanks

[old shard]

Someone's probably already proposed this but how about the new Mission Speedrunner: Receive 1 additional pull per challenge completed. The lootrun timer is now capped to 90s maximum. (90s is an arbitrary number I picked but yeah)

[astral turtle]

90s is way too little time to get anything done

[edgy sinew]

it was suggested alr but yeah, nice and straightforward idea

[astral turtle]

but yea can be changed

[edgy sinew]

90s is enough if you are not on red

And you can use green beacons to go overcap

[old shard]

somewhere in the range if 90-120 seconds sounds quite balanced. it just means you would have to pick locations to go to wisely based on how long you know they will take to complete.

[edgy sinew]

2 minutes is very lenient imo

[old shard]

2 minutes but you cant go over cap with green beacons

[edgy sinew]

Maybe remove green beacons and make red give 50% time instead of 0% with that

[old shard]

seems a little overcomplicated imo, maybe something like (green beacons effectiveness is halved)

[edgy sinew]

Yeah, sure

4 effects in one mission would be quite a mess indeed

[old shard]

One other suggestion I have is that I think a big part of the reason long runs are so easy with equilibrium is because health regen is so busted. Its way too easy to get enough raw health regen that every time you regen you go straight to full health. My suggestion on how to fix this is to set a cap on the percentage of your max health that can be healed each time the healing happens for example 20%.

[edgy sinew]

Just remove equilibrium 🔥

Power Overwhelming - Gain a random boon for each blue beacon picked in a row after first. Blue beacon challenges no longer grant end reward pulls.
||new mission||

This might be busted but we all know the "gain boons 0/2" trolling

[old shard]

not as busted as equilibrium 🤷‍♂️

[vale tartan]

mission idea - choose two boons when choosing a blue beacon. blue beacons no longer grant end reward pulls

might’ve been suggested before idk

[rocky herald]

I have heard that idea numerous times before
(even from myself!)

[vale tartan]

rip

[edgy sinew]

Suggested that but without downsides

[rocky herald]

blue mission that gives you Libra from TBoI
buffs are now distributed through most of your main stats

[old shard]

tbf with the literal thousands of messages in this thread there is going to be repeats.

[edgy sinew]

Does anyone know how to use words i kinda forgot

What would be the best wording for a mission that sets your max challenge to +20 of whatever challenge you are on

[old shard]

nah there are already plenty of ways to increase the challenge cap (white beacons, red beacons and cleansing ritual) and if the purpose of this mission is to increase the challenge cap from what the ct members are saying in this thread it already sounds like they're trying to remove it they just need to balance it to make infinite runs not viable

[edgy sinew]

No, you misunderstood

[old shard]

oh, you mean a mission that limits your max challenges

[edgy sinew]

Tight Schedule - Gain or lose challenges until you have exactly 20 more left. No more extra challenges can be gained, but I cannot make a satisfactory payoff that would not feel out of place or boring.

I thought like, convert all extra challenges you would get into pulls but the numbers are crazy

[spiral plaza]

wait so u have infinite challenge from that?

[spiral plaza]

red beacon short run

[edgy sinew]

Where did you find infinite in here my man

[spiral plaza]

oh it is a one time effect?

[edgy sinew]

It kills your run once you play 20 challenges regardless if you got it on 5 or 100

Maybe i should add "immediately" at the beginning

[spiral plaza]

i thought it is gain or lose chllaneges every challenge

[edgy sinew]

Nah why would it be exactly 20 then lol

[spiral plaza]

idk

maybe some synergy with other missions

[edgy sinew]

Anyway if you have any ideas that aren't "completing challenges gives X more pulls" plz share

Consuming Mediocrity - all non-grey beacons are dark grey.
||New mission, i guess||

[spiral plaza]

wait wtf is this

[edgy sinew]

It is all grey

Good lucky with getting good mission requirements and synergies

[spiral plaza]

cant wait to play the new missions in beta

[rocky herald]

rainbow beacon
cleansing ritual
equilibrium
mediocrity

[edgy sinew]

Surely equilibrium will not be nerfed

[spiral plaza]

yeah it will not be nerfed it will be REMOVED

[edgy sinew]

Also not even that good without ult sac

Or some alternative of equal value

[rocky herald]

anyway....
Expulsive Void: +1 Sacrifice, every 20 pulls scrapped will transfer one of your boons into your next run.

[spiral plaza]

u can get ult sac with that tho

although u need 4 exact missions which is insane rng

[edgy sinew]

This run for sure!!

And you need Mediocrity last or highroll the reqs on each mission after it

[spiral plaza]

why u need to high roll the objective?

[edgy sinew]

Actually equilibrium solves the boon req issue

[spiral plaza]

the only requirement is u need to get equili and rainbow before it

probably dont even need to get rainbow but rainbow double the pulls

[edgy sinew]

~2600 eff pulls with daily rr

[spiral plaza]

wait how u calculate that

[edgy sinew]

Very rough estimate?

[spiral plaza]

nvm i forgot to calculate the base pulls when not rr yet

[rocky herald]

Assuming the optimal turnout, where you get Mediocrity, Equal, Cleansing Ritual and Ultimate Sacrifice, you can get somewhere close to 5-600 pulls, then with 6 total rolls after that

[edgy sinew]

Why 6?

[rocky herald]

wait. I'm silly and assumed high roller was there.
it's 4 rolls

[edgy sinew]

Yeah, and a sac

You can get upwards of 640 pulls probably if you giga highroll

[rocky herald]

buuns about to return to complain about how there's too many tomes in the rewards chest

[spiral plaza]

givemethetome !!!!

[rocky herald]

now, if I could get a run where I don't have to cope about having awful stats at challenge 15

[spiral plaza]

is that technically possible?

[rocky herald]

I mean, maybe if it just gave random boons like A Very Certain Purple Mission

I suppose your previous boons aren't preserved information

[edgy sinew]

Greed is Good - enemies scale thrice as fast, curses are thrice as strong, missions grant twice the rerolls.
||New mission||

Thoughts? yes sacri yes op ong

[spiral plaza]

good mission to finish the run

[edgy sinew]

Did they fix the time gained mission req yet?

[rocky herald]

keep /kill spamming

[spiral plaza]

idk last time i lr it is not fixed but that's a long time ago

[edgy sinew]

Well assuming it is or will be fixed, it would be hard to stall a mission completion for long without drawbacks

[sharp echo]

maybe it would make you not lose time anymore?

[sharp echo]

that is so felt

[modern peak]

;3

[gaunt junco]

some missions should be removed before adding anything new

adding more missions without removing the existing ones will just make good missions even harder to get which is already too rare

[austere chasm]

This is a wonderful idea and also missions need balancing but its a process. instead of saying "omg bad idea the game is bad missions are already too rng" fix the underlying issue of rng by fixing it. Its like going to the doctor when ur back hurts and the doctor gives u some cream to put on there. like thats fixing the symptoms but not the cause of the issue... The cause of this issue is the gui size and buttons and I have presented a wonderful solution to this problem here: #1175205389982240939

[gaunt junco]

holy fucking shit

the root of the issue with too many missions and some of them being too rare is the size of the buttons!

how did we not figure this out earlier

thanks for enlightening us, o almighty

[austere chasm]

with smaller buttons you can put more selections inside the gui smartie pants

[gaunt junco]

surely you realize that if ct wanted more missions per grey beacon they would make the buttons smaller right?

ofc i am blind, ct faced an impenetrable issue of shrinking the buttons, so they were forced to make less missions per grey beacon
how unfortunate

[austere chasm]

kind of, the amount of missions caused them to reduce the size of the pools so that way you would get more variety, but surely if this suggestion comes to fruition they would know to increase the selections.

right now, its either a god run, or a shit run, and theres an obvious distinction. with more missions it should add the needed variety to make the run decent throughout so its not ALL ABOUT THE END chest

[gaunt junco]

you're so delusional
runs are easily done without equilibrium, and other missions are pretty common

equilibrium does make them way more effective but variety is already there

non-equilibrium runs are VIABLE

but if they add more missions the "god runs" will become even rarer and people will be forced to do the viable ones

[austere chasm]

bruh im not even gonna reply to you anymore all im hearing is i dont want more rng and i dont wanna change the gui is all im hearing

[gaunt junco]

I do want them to change the gui if that leads them to make more mission options, but the gui is NOT the thing that keeps them from doing it

[austere chasm]

your like one of the guys who holds everyone back in congress because u want to waste taxpayers money.

[gaunt junco]

if its not about end chest, then what is it about? materialism? sure, that type of runs is there

[gaunt junco]

stop throwing in unneccessary and unrelated shit

[austere chasm]

equalibrium stack is the god run, dont you want another type of god run to go for besides that?

[gaunt junco]

there will never be 2 god runs, something will always stay meta and something wont

moreover, if they double the amount of missions and theoretically make an equal alternative for equilibrium, the chance of getting a god run will stay the same

[austere chasm]

well heres the thing, flying chest stack would be the other type of god run if the old loot quality system persisted. Im talking about the 80% -> 40% change pre 2.0 that ruined lq stack. If lq was still 80 the other type of god run in my opinion would be the flying chest run, but it is simply worse.

[gaunt junco]

Perhaps buffing flying chests is an option, but the issue is that nowadays every mythic is worthless and the only thing that truly gives profit is shinies

and even if people don't have so much money that 5stx mythics are worthless for them, they will still choose end reward chest to at least have a chance for shiny

assuming there's a good shiny ofc

[austere chasm]

thats fair to want the end chest, i always go for that type of run. Thats why balancing the way to get those pulls and rrs is important besides just getting equalibrium/40 or equalibrium cleansing/100 which i dont mind doing all the way through but id rather get the /40 one with redemption or some other mission when it comes out.

cleansing is objectively worse right now because it takes more time to get there which is why im advocating for more variety.

[gaunt junco]

equilibrium is so rare that when people drop it, they're usually forced to do 100 challenges, and forcing 2h runs is wrong

[austere chasm]

you see, id rather do a 40 run and maybe get a mythic or sacrifice the pulls for possibly a gambling beast next time 😄

[gaunt junco]

if equilibrium was more common, shorter runs would be an option to save time

[gaunt junco]

100 challenges with 2 sac and equilibrium
200 pulls for next run to do it with GB

eventho some people do short runs, its just not optimal and doing 100 challenges is far better when you drop the right missions

because you cant rely on getting the same missions next run if you end your current one early

[austere chasm]

thats if ur rerolling shithics for the shiny and most people arent caring to do that. most people take the mythic when they get one. dont you want more options in your run to get to that point?

[gaunt junco]

nah, barely anyone takes all mythics nowadays unless they're super new to lr

most mythics are 1-2stx which is literally nothing

5stx+ mythics are decent, but thats still not very worth it assuming there's 1 such mythic in pool

so the only real profit is shiny

[austere chasm]

i was hoping and coping for epoch this time but looks like im waiting longer.

[gaunt junco]

the prop hat in question:

[austere chasm]

are you lootrunning this week if so what camp

[gaunt junco]

I don't have much time or will to play wynn lately, but I'm gonna do some rodo/se

for once we get good shinies with good counters and 2 at the same time

wars won abso and mobs cata is worth rerolling every mythic for

except like idol in se and freedom in rodo

[real nexus]

If new missions will have synergies with many others then mission bloat won't be unfun

[austere chasm]

more missions means /3 -> /4 grey beacon.

[real nexus]

It means that?

[austere chasm]

nope, i just wanted to see your reaction to it.

[real nexus]

Eh, I barely lootrun now anyways

[edgy sinew]

Black and white thinking

[hasty depot]

aight here's my take on a new mission + some art because i felt like it (art was just for fun i am not demanding it gets interpreted into the game)

Diminishment (Purple tier/rarity maybe?)
Purple Beacons grant an additional +1 End Reward Pull. All non-Purple Beacons give you +1 Curse when completed.

the idea is re-adding a mission that grants more pulls somewhat directly. The +1 End Reward Pull you get from purple beacons is affected by vibrant, aqua, etc, so it effectively gives a lot more pulls with proper setup when grabbing purples. To balance this, it has a downside of giving you more curses with basically every challenge completed. The downside was created with synergy in mind, allowing you to abuse Equilibrium or Inner Peace to mitigate the downside

forgive me if it is horribly balanced im just a casual that lootruns with heavy hybrid paladin guardian

[pure gale]

the brainrot is getting to me

[hasty depot]

the brainrot...

art i made is meant to depict a souped up beacon (since it buffs purple) with spikes & souls representing danger (more curses)

[heavy flint]

Oh I didn’t know those were spikes

I thought they were like, part of the shockwave effect or stylistic impact effect

[hasty depot]

i mean they're both spikes & a part of the shockwave effect at the same time

[vale tartan]

this is cool as hell wow

you must’ve put a lot of thought into it

[spiral plaza]

that's perfectly balanced

u dont need to think around equili when trying to balance smth because equili is not balanced

[dull sonnet]

What about: for every boon you gain, gain +2 curses

Crash the server with equi do its balanced

[spiral plaza]

equili rework : every time u gain a boon, gain a curse

[edgy sinew]

Every time you get a curse, get a curse

[dull sonnet]

everytime you, you

[hasty depot]

yeah i can understand that, i didnt intend to specifically balance it around equilibrium its just a byproduct of it giving you more curses

[dull sonnet]

Remove curses to nerf equi

[austere chasm]

here is my idea for a new mission:
[Recollection]
Gain one additional grey beacon during your lootrun, but your time limit gets cut in half.
Every time you complete a challenge theres a 1% chance to gain +1 end reward reroll.

...

It's so balanced that even your grandma could use it as a jojo stand

[mellow sequoia]

% chances suck

also this just seems like a mission reroll but you get half the time

[mellow sequoia]

@dull sonnet @austere chasm @hasty depot @ anyone else

any ideas for missions like gb? in that they reward you big time but basically end your run

[rocky herald]

hmmm
Mob Scaling increases by (some outlandishly detrimental number), challenges completed here add an extra 2% to your sacrifices.

[hasty depot]

ill see if i can think of one later yeah

[astral turtle]

+2 sacrifices and +4 rerolls for the timer to tick down 5x as fast?

idk how stupid that is

[hasty depot]

could maybe work if stasis didnt exist

[pastel crypt]

broken imo, you can just grab it for easy 2x redemption and 2x high roller and end

[vale tartan]

challenges no longer grant a time bonus, and the timer goes down twice as fast as normal. all beacons grant +1 end reward pulls (+2 if vibrant/aqua)

.

also, a grandmaster perk could be a daily mission reroll? or maybe just 1 every lootrun idk

[austere chasm]

make gambling beast chance based and dont have it end your run. example: 10% chance to remove the time and add the rr

[rocky herald]

how many times are we going to bring up that rng doesn't make fun missions

[austere chasm]

its already unbalanced and tealy is trying to make it more balanced

[austere chasm]

and wdym by this since rng is already a big part of lr

[rocky herald]

and it has been brought up many times
people do not like that aspect of lootrunning

[austere chasm]

i would agree with you on that point but taking out rng from lootrunning would require a complete overhaul and in the short term they can just sprinkle in a tiny bit of rng for now in order to spice it up

think about it this way. some things are too op to add to the mission without rng. A lot of mechanics in games require rng or they would be too broken otherwise.

rng can add fun or take it away depending on what we are talking about

[rocky herald]

I understand RNG is a large component in about all video games, but I can't say that it's fun playing TBoI where I've gotten nothing but range up's and The Bean for items

Luck shouldn't have to be a crutch to balance things, and if it is, it just becomes frustrating to work with

[austere chasm]

@mellow sequoia i dont like it that certain missions make green and red beacons inaccessable

it really shouldnt be like that imo

ultimate sacrifice = go for green/red to start losing boons, take any others keep your run in tact

its just redemption but you have to get a good white beacon which is dumb.

also you guys should buff vibrant aqua vibrant yellow to (8) flying chests

this change would end up balancing the final chest with the chests during the run pretty nicely.

as in 50% chance to get a mythic during your run / 50% chance to get a mythic at the end. (i dont know mythic chances this is just a guestimate)

[sharp echo]

mission idea: your lootrun will end within the next three challenges. gain +1 end reward reroll for completing those challenges

[rocky herald]

regrettably, you can't just declare that vaqua > vyellow should give 8 chests instead of 6, regardless of how useful that buff would be, since it
-doesn't work out mathematically
-would make it inconsistent with other vaqua interactions

[sharp echo]

mission idea: completing a challenge will consume 5 challenges and grant you +10 more pulls

[austere chasm]

mate its already hella inconsistent aqua wdyem

[sharp echo]

I'm cookin up stuff

[rocky herald]

vibrant yellow gives 2 chests
vibrant aqua boosts the effect by 200% (which is 3x effect)
2 chests x3 effectiveness = 6 chests

[austere chasm]

the math with vibrant missions doesnt work out either

[sharp echo]

mission idea: completing a challenge will consume all of your current boons and grant you +1 pull for each boon consumed

or more pulls if equi doesn't exist lol

[austere chasm]

they have already shown they dont care about the math

[sharp echo]

equi is objectively bad game design, remove it

[austere chasm]

remove or change it either one

[rocky herald]

blue and gray missions make no sense
every other beacon makes complete sense with vibrant and aqua effects?

[sharp echo]

yeah, equi in its current state is just bad in general

bad for the game, and for thinking up mission stuff cuz anything involving curses just makes it stupid stronger

[vale tartan]

remove equil

[austere chasm]

remove equil

[sharp echo]

or maybe something like,

mission idea: completing a challenge will remove 1 challenge and grant +3 pulls

[rocky herald]

What I do note is that Equilibrium is the only mission that gives enough power to go for proper long runs
I really think there needs to be better options for gaining lots of buffs
(gain a damage up when you complete a challenge fast )

[vale tartan]

just not boons because they fuck up new ideas

[sharp echo]

a proper long run can be supported by making mission appearance consistent throughout the lootrun

[austere chasm]

remove equil or make another mission thats equal to equal

[vale tartan]

PLEASEEEEE I NEED THIS

[sharp echo]

IKRRRR

[rocky herald]

continuously I find you two in an echo chamber with eachother

[sharp echo]

missions should have a challenge limit, and make grays appear for every n amount of challenges

[austere chasm]

also make it so the boons dont get rarer when u have a mission to get 4 boons

[vale tartan]

and make orange appearance consistent

[austere chasm]

it usually takes me like 30 challanges for it whenever that happens

[sharp echo]

this way you're always looking forward to something instead of speedrunning 4 missions within the first 20 fucking challenges

[vale tartan]

exactlyyyyy

missions should be consistent because right now it is rng + rng, if they were consistent it would be less rng

not to mention that there would be no need for a cap if they appear after a set amount of challenges

[austere chasm]

make it so gray doesnt stop appearing how about you do the missions at your own fucking pace

[rocky herald]

anyway my take is that we need more buffs
fishing for equilibrium is rather stale
add more variety to what kind of God Runs you can get

[wet rain]

Get +1000 pulls, +1000 rerolls, and +1000 sacrifices if you get a curse lose 100 challenges
Now equilibrium is worse... Maybe probably :clueless:

[vale tartan]

this could also open up new possibilities for missions that lower the amount of challenges needed for more mission choices

[sharp echo]

honestly I'm iffy with the idea of missions affecting other missions instead of the lootrun itself

[rancid cypress]

Finnally got around to lring again. I just think we need more mission that syngerize with reds, mission to make the time from white specifically be special again in some way, have more than 1 actual syngery for green. And as tealy said it. More mission that will just kinda quickly end your run but to a decent reward. I personally also would wish for more ways for shorter runs to be relevant/meta but I don’t know how implementing that would work since I create a holy war any time I mention flat pull rewards. Plz be creative for some ideas for the other colors cause I have the brainpower of a snail so I can’t think of much

[sharp echo]

mission idea: when you would gain a challenge, gain +2 pulls instead

[vale tartan]

had similar thoughts, but i can’t think of a good reason not to

[rocky herald]

and about those run-ending missions
Egg Basket- """Donate""" some (don't ask me how many.) of your boons to the enemies. The next challenge you successfully beat will end your lootrun and award you doubled pulls from the chest.

[vale tartan]

90 possible pulls from one challenge??

i mean it would require lots of rng but yeah sounds cool

[rancid cypress]

Also please add a tag to mission ideas you think are good it makes to much easier to search, ping them later 👍

[rocky herald]

vaqua
vred
+36 pulls with no penalty

[sharp echo]

fine nerf it

[austere chasm]

ct pay attention to what this dude is cookin

[sharp echo]

it would end your run if you don't stack a heck ton of reds beforehand

[austere chasm]

@mellow sequoia he speaks the wizartry

[vale tartan]

why is this so unexpected

yet i am not surprised at all

[sharp echo]

you can also have it be like:

mission idea: when you would add +1 min to your timer, gain +1 pull instead

[austere chasm]

this is just afk simulator timer -> 13 minutes [+2 minutes] repeat... i dont wanna play afk simulator.

[sharp echo]

bro it means you can no longer add to your timer

[rocky herald]

*Instead

[rancid cypress]

Idk I’m a monkey. I hope y’all can come up mission requirements. I’m semi tired of it being “get 3 cursed” “open 10 chests” I say some say add requirements like “do 3 slay object” go through 2 spelunk caves, having everything be souly based on beacon colors feels like the waste of an opportunity to add more variety. Could be dumb tho idk

[austere chasm]

oh so it ends ur run

[sharp echo]

yep

[rocky herald]

that's part of the point.

[sharp echo]

ik people here shit on you for no reason but you should use more confident language

you got good points, dude. speak yo mind

[rancid cypress]

Eh idk much rather have a far to small ego than one that is much too large

[rocky herald]

mmm
here's a silly mission idea
Gain 4x health. You can no longer recovery any health, but completed challenges award 1 end reward reroll. Dying will auto-end your run.

[sharp echo]

it's not about ego it's about self-worth

[austere chasm]

thats actually silly enough for them to code into the game

[sharp echo]

rip on lifesteal/heal builds

[rocky herald]

oh, right, lightbender and acolyte exist

[rancid cypress]

Actually some more of you die 1 time but get super buff missions might be fun

[sharp echo]

mission idea: every challenge will grant +50% more pulls. dying will end your run

[austere chasm]

how about a mission that combines red and green beacons into one beacon

[sharp echo]

that would be white

[rocky herald]

mini white beacon that stops enemy scaling

[sharp echo]

maybe. you can have like a

mission idea:
add +3 more white beacons to your beacon pool. you will no longer receive red or green beacons

[austere chasm]

better yet [RGB] red, green, and blue beacons get combined into a single beacon

[sharp echo]

let's think of more run-ending missions

[rancid cypress]

How would you add more blue beacon synergy, only things I could think would be like. Get +1 extra choice when choosing boons so basically 2x ur choices of boon effectively and When choosing a boon also receive +2 random boons so it’s 3x effect boon but without player choice.

[rocky herald]

materalism but for blue beacons, or something

[rancid cypress]

I really like how blues feel for challange 1-20 but then if you don’t get “good” boons after that they feel very “usless” to me

[sharp echo]

allowing players to get 2 boons per blue beacon is highly requested, yes

as a mission reward*

[rocky herald]

or perhaps
maybe
Add a lot more options to blue beacon selection as a mission buff

[rancid cypress]

I also wonder how do you add these semi mid mission rewards that people “want” but wouldn’t want enought to take a slot away from equalib or GB

[sharp echo]

honestly yeah. it's not easy for boons to keep up with the enemy buff per challenge

which does add some value to green beacons, ig

[rancid cypress]

I wish I could make like a “pack” of commons where you get like 3 “mid/shitty” mission so you get value without taking away 3/4 of your slots

[austere chasm]

i really like the idea of golden missions after challenge 30 make a new category called gold where all the very op missions preside.

[vale tartan]

also what if equil was limited to giving you only one boon at once

[rocky herald]

I can't help but feel like I've heard this a few times before...
hum hum hum

[vale tartan]

cough

[sharp echo]

yeah that's been suggested a lot of times

[rocky herald]

Probably not a terrible idea really, and would make it more consistent with Ultimate Sacrifice, which can only take away 1 boon at a time if you have it with Gambling Beast
(fun fact!)

[austere chasm]

@mellow sequoia theres a lot of good stuff in here get off red dead redemption and read through all of this

[mellow sequoia]

no im hunting wolves

[rocky herald]

godspeed

[vale tartan]

priorities

[mellow sequoia]

ping me w the good stuff

[sharp echo]

mission idea: "Red Dead Redemption" when dying on a red beacon challenge, gain the Redemption mission

yw tealy

[vale tartan]

LMFAO

[rocky herald]

say, what qualifies as The Good Stuff

[mellow sequoia]

ideas that have been thought about from multiple angles

[rancid cypress]

Tealy

[austere chasm]

what buuns said and also removing equalibrium / changing it

[rancid cypress]

Thoughts?

[rancid cypress]

X2 thoughts

[rancid cypress]

Maybe x3 thoughts

[sharp echo]

don't mind if I

#1171931570261729311 message

#1171931570261729311 message

#1171931570261729311 message

#1171931570261729311 message

#1171931570261729311 message

#1171931570261729311 message

@mellow sequoia

idk if you've seen this one

#1171931570261729311 message

[rocky herald]

https://discordapp.com/channels/143852930036924417/1171931570261729311/1172294190948941854
still quite happy with these ones

[mellow sequoia]

ill check those out in a bit, currently skinning wolves in panther country

[sharp echo]

happy skinning

[mellow sequoia]

could get 1 shot any second

this is the kind of danger wynn needs honestly

[sharp echo]

lmfao

maybe add skinning wolves to the game too

[vale tartan]

yeah and cougars will randomly jump up and kill you instantly

[sharp echo]

I'll be real I've never seen a single rdr gameplay in my entire life

[vale tartan]

me either

[rocky herald]

add Dad's Home+ to wynn
the real challenge

[mellow sequoia]

out hunting

[rancid cypress]

Semi off topic but truthfully the “best parts” of Wynn for my were early levels when mobility is limited mobs 2-3 shot you but over a period of 30sec -1 min 30, it creates a much better flow for combat than in end game where QoL of 200% walk speed is nice but just fundamentally ruins any type of slow combat game design. The extreme pace of Wynn of very fun don’t get me wrong but it leads to burn out for me in ways I didn’t feel way playing monumenta, when dealing with issues in monumenta I really enjoyed how they continued to design combat in a way to promoted that slowerish game play. Rambling but idk how I’d adjust Wynn to have meaningful scary combat that isn’t just oh I didn’t react to the .01 sec animation and now this charge/explosion is just gonna eat me

[mellow sequoia]

yeah

[floral spade]

Echo chamber binding of Isaac

[mellow sequoia]

sometimes i play games like rdr2 where i gotta set bait, hide in some bushes, stealth towards an animal, check it with my binoculers, see its of perfect quality, get my rifle aim, and get a headshot

[floral spade]

echo chamber + endless nameless + virgo/luck foot/PHD combo 🙏

[mellow sequoia]

and like thats so time consuming but getting the perfect pelt is so satisfying

thats just something we could never add to wynn

[floral spade]

yeah let's not add endangered animal hunting to Wynn

[rancid cypress]

Let me set bait for purple rare mobs and hunt them

[mellow sequoia]

i didnt say endangered

[floral spade]

Wolves are endangered

[sharp echo]

beautiful screenshot

[rocky herald]

new mission
beacons reactivate their effects on the next 2 challenges

[mellow sequoia]

not in 1899

[floral spade]

The myth of them being monstrous or hostile is entirely untrue

[mellow sequoia]

theres plenty i run into em every time i cross Mt Shann

idk madeline these guys come at me first

[floral spade]

WELL DONT CAUSE THEIR ENDANGERMENT LIKE PEOPLE DID IRL

[mellow sequoia]

thankfully these wolves do not have a sniper rifle like i do

[floral spade]

then rdr2 falls victim to the myth

[rancid cypress]

Mission thread < hunting wolves

[mellow sequoia]

dont worry madeline ive got the wolf pelts i need

[floral spade]

Wolves irl will almost always leave you alone

[mellow sequoia]

now im hunting a bison 🙂

[floral spade]

Or just like.

[sharp echo]

honestly yeah making fights stretch out for longer in general is fun, but imagine that happening constantly while trying to get from one place to another

[floral spade]

I can't find the gif but

[sharp echo]

I think longer fights is best reserved for places with an objective, like caves

[rancid cypress]

Agree, replaying classes/content awful but first time around would be kinda cool imo

[floral spade]

There's this huge wolf that just sat next to this woman and was totally chill

[rancid cypress]

Games that “scare me” end ip leaving a huge impression on me

[floral spade]

https://tenor.com/view/wolf-gif-8911441

[floral spade]

FOUND IT

[sharp echo]

that's fair yeah. I personally like a good challenge

[floral spade]

least pettable wolf

[sharp echo]

I have a wolf hat

[floral spade]

https://youtube.com/shorts/A3gbtEAe8u8?si=kifTtWHPEYDfx9V3

ferocious beast eats car

[mellow sequoia]

gotcha

[floral spade]

wolf discussion is on topic because

wolf

[rocky herald]

this
this just isn't right at all
why are they feeling so blue

[mellow sequoia]

its this

[sharp echo]

it looks like a rabbit

[real nexus]

Make old red beacon as a mission reward (after great buff though)

[hasty depot]

Crimson Hourglass (Red Tier)
Red Beacons grant an additional +2 End Reward Pulls when completed, instead of +2 Challenges. For every Red Beacon you complete, reduce your Timer's cap by -3 Minutes.

since tealy suggested a "run-ender" mission and there was some red beacon discourse i came up with this. While this mission won't immediately end your run like GBeast, you can instead choose to continue your run normally or go for reds and get a bunch of pulls. Keep in mind the +2 pulls from reds can be aqua/vibrant boosted for a lot of free pulls, OPTIMALLY this mission gives you 60 overall pulls (i think) efficiently with proper setup. This could be totally unbalanced but im not so sure about these kinds of things, tweak the numbers as you please

[real nexus]

It's just timesaver which also is run ender

Red beacon is effectively + 2 end reward pulls just takes more time

Has to be at least 3

[hasty depot]

yeah i tried to differentiate it from GBeast which really forces your run to end, this just turns reds into an efficient pull-grab while taking a chunk of your timer

[real nexus]

Gambling beast but for sacrifices

[hasty depot]

the idea was it being efficient, quick, easy, which is why its effectively the same pulls roughly

but it could totally be more or less that was just my thought process

[real nexus]

Each challenge rewards you with +2 flying chests and chest items have +50% chance to be 1 rarity tier higher. You can no longer get time from challenges and green beacons give half of the time

[modest crescent]

wont that just inflate mythics like crazy?

[real nexus]

Chance could be tweaked ig

And because this is kinda like run ender effect has to be strong I think

Maybe it's little too strong, perhaps 25% or 20% is better

The idea of it is to make run ender challenge for lb lq builds

[edgy sinew]

Arch Enemy - For the rest of the lootrun, if a beacon would appear under an arch on a pathway, move it to a different spot and make it stronger as if buffed by an aqua beacon.
||New mission||

[dull sonnet]

I feel like consuming remaining challenges might be interesting so:
You cannot gain any challenges. Everytime you complete a challenge reduce your challenge count by 1 (+1 for each challenge) and gain 2 pulls per consumed challenge OR gain like 6 pulls every time regardless of how many challenges are consumed.
(First option does seem like it would be too strong to me but thats the general idea).

Or you could allow gaining challenges but consume 2+2 or sth, idk what exactly would work best

[edgy sinew]

I'd make so you still can get challenges if it consumes an ever increasing N of them

Just like you can get time with gbeast

[dull sonnet]

Yeah bjt then it feels a bit too similar to gb

[sharp echo]

that would defo require some dev time. i don't think ct has an internal tracker of which challenges are under archways

[sharp echo]

I don't think that's inherently a bad thing. as long as the difference in value between time and challenges is being accounted for when thinking of the rewards

like, how much time would you need to lose to have it be somewhat equivalent to losing one challenge? how much would this mission accelerate your rate of losing challenges, and what would that be equivalent to in gb's rate of --1min per challenge?

like, say you lose -1 challenge per completed challenge, and that number increases by -1 the more you complete challenges. would that be worth, say, +1 end reward reroll per completed challenge? would that be too much or too little?

[edgy sinew]

CT don't know where they placed challenges?

[sharp echo]

I said an internal tracker. like, the ct knows yes, but the code doesn't

(well technically it does, it just don't know if it's under an archway 🤓)

[edgy sinew]

You just add challenge names/ids check

[sharp echo]

i imagine that would require dev time yes

[edgy sinew]

Any mission would lol

[sharp echo]

uh no. they probs already have a "program" to make these missions without any extra coding

something as extendable as missions can't be hardcoded every time, that's a huge hassle long-term

sure you can add tags to the challenges to add details like if they're under an archway. it would require a change in the said program though, not only to allow said tags to exist, but to have them be read

and that needs dev time

[edgy sinew]

Or a simpler solution: don't place challenges in the middle of pathways

[sharp echo]

now that doesn't require dev time

y tho

[vale tartan]

still seems like a lot of work for one mission idk

[sharp echo]

oh as a mission reward, definitely. as a change in the lootrun itself, no

well, relatively no. would still require a bit of time though

[edgy sinew]

It is a joke about challenges having bad placements occasionally, you don't need to dig too deep

I appreciate that you do, ofc, but it is a silly mission that is there if CT want silly (but viable) missions

Nothing Ventured - You cannot gain more curses than you had upon completion of this mission. Every time you complete a challenge, increase that limit by 1.
||New mission||

[mellow sequoia]

https://tenor.com/view/milly-cat-silly-tongue-cute-gif-12994441737894535490

this cat is nearly as silly as you

[edgy sinew]

https://tenor.com/view/just-being-silly-seally-silly-seal-ponsuke-gif-12847036985823875646

[sharp echo]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-angry-meme-aggression-confusion-gif-22568593

y'all being so silly rn

[rancid cypress]

Tealy can you “confirm/share” any ideas that are “pretty likely” to be added

[pure gale]

no

[rancid cypress]

Thanks tealy

[mellow sequoia]

i cant

• i wouldn't anyway cause i dont want yall to expect anything i cant promise

[rancid cypress]

Kk, Ngl this do be the reason I wish the big cow man did more interview stuff

[sharp echo]

you're kinda asking for leaks, man

[rancid cypress]

Semi/ also kinda want to know what direction they are ok with for lring. Most of my mission ideas seem to be “too op” having some “leaks” might help with the direction of new ideas but it doesn’t matter that much I mostly am just curious/want a reason to look forward to lring again

[floral spade]

[rocky herald]

I still wonder why revealing exact odds for mythic rates and mission appearance is bad or leaking
surely there's more value in knowing exactly what to expect, and being able balance that with more insight

[sharp echo]

you can look at the other suggestions

[hasty depot]

the direction i took with my two mission ideas was first and foremost, missions that directly give you more pulls under X condition. there arent any missions that do that currently and the only instance of this was old cleansing ritual

my thought process was theorizing a role that current missions dont fulfill, and one of those roles was missions that directly increase your end reward pulls

[rancid cypress]

How do you make lring “harder” that isn’t “go faster” or “mobs are stronger”?

[hasty depot]

hmm

[spiral plaza]

add parkour in challenges (i can never finish these challenges)

[modern peak]

troll tower

[rocky herald]

Ovine Spire in Sky Lootrun:

Sky Mushroom in Sky Lootrun:

[spiral plaza]

mage: tp

[real nexus]

Honest idol reaction:

[mellow sequoia]

god bless

[pure gale]

mission where u get +5 more missions (balanced)

[rancid cypress]

?

[dull sonnet]

mission where you get +5 rerolls and +50 pulls but also cant log into wynn for a week

[mellow sequoia]

thanks

[spiral plaza]

good mission

[real nexus]

peak design

[edgy sinew]

i had this written for over a week and forgot to send xdd
Well, repurposing silli into not silly:
Special Deal - For the rest of the lootrun, Aqua beacons have doubled effect on <colour> beacons.

Favouritism - For the rest of the lootrun, <colour> beacons are always under the effect of an [additional instance of] Aqua beacon.

Both come in 5 mission and beacon colours

[stiff pagoda]

so my idea here is to help making lootbonus longruns better without making end rewards go crazy (so that you have an option for longruns that just farms flying chests) the idea being that you can farm mythic & a bunch of ingredients while lootrunning for flying chests

• after opening a flying chest, add a challenge
• after finishing a challenge, sacrifice an end reward to gain 2 flying chests

to make another option for longruns other than equilibrium :

• after adding x min on your timer (maybe 3 ?), gain a random boon

also, if you add more missions, do you mind upgrading the base grey beacon to 4 so that it doesn't feel just more random missions but also a little bit more consistant (so less frustrating) ?

ps : I do not know how broken all that is, if anyone finds the idea good and has enough experience to say what amount it should be please do

[sharp echo]

goodness gracious a necropost

[stiff pagoda]

a ct made a link from here https://discord.com/channels/143852930036924417/1210427810334777384
that's why

[little sun]

do yall really want Salted to see this? oh crap i did it too

Hi Salted! Can I just ask, if I (hypothetically) discovered a dupe and (hypothetically) duped 23stx to make up for a trade market bug would you ban me? 🥺

[stiff pagoda]

hwar

what are you cooking rn

[little sun]

my turn to post a link
#1210427810334777384 message

[stiff pagoda]

oh

well whatever this is constructive feedback

[real nexus]

Small pack:
Get 2 pulls
Get 2 challenges
Remove 2 random curses
Spawn 2 flying chests
Next 2 challenges won't increase mobs' stats
Add 3 minutes to your timer
Get a boon
Get a beacon reroll
Get a chest reroll

<placeholder>
Add 2 gray beacons spawn. You get random mission from them

[vale tartan]

this one’s cool imo

[hasty depot]

yeah random mission sounds funny (im assuming random mission means it just auto-picks a random mission for you)

[vale tartan]

would be extra funny if it was gb

[real nexus]

You just pick gray beacon and auto picks for you

[real nexus]

Old school runner:
During intermission, you have 125% loot bonus and 50% loot quality when opening chests

(idk how if that condition is specifically possible but on the other hand I didn't want to be abused on mobs)

alternatively, also considering if it was too weak:
During intermission, chests contain significantly more items
Gain additionally 25% loot bonus and 10% loot quality

[austere chasm]

Minesweeper: after closing the final flying chest of a yellow beacon, open a minesweeper gui where u can uncover items, epulls, rerolls, or lootrun side quests.

[vale tartan]

wat

[modern peak]

what is wynnik cookin fr

[real nexus]

3rd iteration:
After every 3rd opened chest during intermission, spawn a flying chest
Gain extra 30% loot bonus and 15% loot quality

[mellow sequoia]

Any more ideas?

[rocky herald]

it has been 6 months
I do not remember the last time I've lootran....

[austere chasm]

tealy bro are you actually gonna fix lootrunning please refer to this complaint i made

One sec lemme get the link

[mellow sequoia]

best i can

[austere chasm]

https://discord.com/channels/143852930036924417/1282604891675820062 its mainly the rainbow slope chance issue and the blue beacon issue i want to be fixed ❤️

blue beacons for some reason get super rare during the middle of the run

and especially rare during boon mission

maybe we can fix these two things and lootruns are saved

[rocky herald]

though just because you asked
Boon choices are locked to your current lowest stat (in context)

for every time I recall not finding health or damage when I really needed it...

though the fault would be that there's quite a lot of stats and I'm not sure I want to throw away boons getting loot bonus when I don't really care about it

[real nexus]

Careful planner (assuming that it can break the caps on them)

• 2 permanent beacon choice
• 2 mission choice
• 2 boon choice

Chaos:
Get effect of 2 random missions

Tiny house:

• 3 pulls
• remove 3 random curses
• add 5 minutes to your timer
• 3 challenges
• 3 beacon rerolls
• 3 random boons
• 3 flying chests
• for next 3 challenges mob stats don't increase and all beacon choices are vibrant
• boon choice (out of 5)

[mellow sequoia]

this is like, insanely busted and uninteresting imo

[mellow sequoia]

waaaaaaayyyy too much shit and also not at all what missions are meant to do

[modern peak]

what if we had a mission where we had to power 5 objects called spirit wells while being chased by a player that would try and kill us

[real nexus]

is having more choice that busted? and I don't mean extra beacons, just more options
also what about one mission being two random ones

[real nexus]

immortal snail kek

[modern peak]

they forogr

[real nexus]

oh this might be goofy one
Looming consequence
one great empower or something like that
Summon a slowly moving orb which chase you. Touching it will immediately end the run with 10% less rewards (applied after sacrifices).
Orb will move much faster when it's not looked at

[modern peak]

monumenta reference?

[mellow sequoia]

Yeah super busted. Thats a perm orange beacon + a free mission reroll + perm boon aqua (if i understood you correctly)

i wish there was an easy way to jump to the OP in threads, i outlined some design guidelines from salted for how we want missions to work

[real nexus]

ask mod for pin

[real nexus]

exception only confirms the rule kek

[real nexus]

It was originally 1 of each but for some reason I thought it would be too weak xD

just because like, aqua blue isn't your premiere usage of aqua...

I just thought more about it being nice QoL to runs and making easier to setup other parts of lootrun

probably it's that type of a mission, which would be really, really good early and bad later

[mellow sequoia]

if anyone has more mission ideas following these criteria, i'd love to hear them!

[rocky herald]

hello again chat

[vale tartan]

holy old thread

[little sun]

I have a few ideas for new annihilation attacks

[real nexus]

Wassup

[real nexus]

Poker chip
45% chance of beacons having no effect
45% chance of beacons having double effect
10% chance of beacons having 5x of its normal effect

[real nexus]

Eh, probably not that
Too extreme rng which probably might not be fun

"You can no longer gain pulls
For the rest of the game for every pull you would get normally, spawn 1-2 flying chests instead
Rerolls and sacrifices give you extra loot bonus and loot quality instead"

[modest crescent]

like cleansing ritual but u sacrafice 1 boon for 3 challenges instead

[real nexus]

Is it me or it doesn't feel synergistic in general?

[modest crescent]

idk i just said random words that came to mind

[mellow sequoia]

https://tenor.com/view/thousand-yard-stare-cat-gif-10000743455859339871

[little sun]

I got a new mission idea!

"Travel 2000 blocks"

[heavy flint]

Here’s an idea

“Travel x blocks between challenges”

As in, the game only counts the straight-line distance between challenges you pick

So you’re basically semi-encouraged to take challenges that spawn further away