Banish The Beyond Feedback Thread

[spring needle]

give us feedback on Banish The Beyond (Spirits Festival Minigame) ty 🙂

[vast shell]

great minigame

[last fractal]

very fun so far

gets a 🐝 /10 from me

[tired wedge]

Had a game where someone left during the selection phase. It ended the game, but than restarted it without teleporting us. After changing the world it didn't remove the game items

overall when i can play the game, it's a lot of fun

[vast shell]

uhh

when there is one well left the killer can just camp there

idk if thats supposed to happen but its a big issue honestly

[spring needle]

7 wells spawn, survivors only need to complete 5 of them

[vast shell]

ah

[hearty heron]

the one that can tp to lockers seems to not have the thing that goes through walls for me

as in, it just kept the normal attack in that other mode

• after jumping and rightclicking while in the mode i could walk normally again but could still instantly switch back to the coal to tp

[ocean marsh]

it only works while in a locker

did i forget to update the item lore

[vast shell]

how does the escape beacon work

[ocean marsh]

if a survivor right clicks it, they instantly escape and the game ends

it only appears when theres 1 survivor alive

[vast shell]

how does it look

[hearty heron]

dont htink so but i also might just have missed it

[ocean marsh]

it doesnt say it on the item lore

my bad, will fix

[hearty heron]

also, does the cursed mask legit require 32 stacks of the tokens?
because that seem like really excessively high

[ocean marsh]

might be. i'll see about reducing it if it looks that way

when i made the cost i was working under the assumption of 8 essence per game

[hearty heron]

tbf game length can vary a lot

[ocean marsh]

yea

we'll see

[ocean marsh]

btw, i fully intend to do balance changes as needed for this game (because itll probably be needed...) so if anyone has any thoughts, send them here

[vast shell]

make the game work please

[ocean marsh]

yea working on it

[vast shell]

i dont want the void to consume me every 2 minutes

[ocean marsh]

its less the game being broken and more the servers as a whole being broken

[vast shell]

also for some reason movement spells have a problem

[steel willow]

idk if it has been said, but in The Woods you literally cant exit towards the east

[ocean marsh]

yea known issue

that one might not be fixed for a bit since we'd need to push the map again, which is a process

[quaint sentinel]

This seems way more fun than the others if im honest
Spirit seems a bit strong tho, excpecially wanderer wich i used to win a game in 30 seconds

[ocean marsh]

...30 seconds?\

[quaint sentinel]

Yep

[ocean marsh]

you killed 4 people in 30 seconds?

how on earth

[quaint sentinel]

3 grouped up

[ocean marsh]

wanderer has sound cues that survivors need to use to Not Die

so if people arent using sounds, uh

rip

[quaint sentinel]

Oh that may have been it

Afaik only 1 of them plays with sounds

[ocean marsh]

this game kinda relies on sounds a lot

[quaint sentinel]

Yeai noticed

[rough otter]

no way theres one of these now great

i dont have to make my own and then yell to frozenearth or notafish or whoever about not being able to post threads 😄

[mental pelican]

might just need some balancing

nerf sprit's walk speed and make the normal ones easier to get new abilities

otherwise it has very cool designs

[tired wedge]

Idk if it's just that i haven't played enough games with it

[hearty heron]

wynntils party coordnate tracking is kinda funny with this

also, idk how possible that is, but would it be possible to not get fatigue when you start climbing ladders/sprint down stairs? kinda annoying

[mental pelican]

checking map to see where is the sprit actually helps me to surive

that is actually kinda good for both parties

[hearty heron]

i just disabled it in config but still funny

[mental pelican]

if they balance the roles, i will disable them

[tired wedge]

but the ability that let's the spirit tp to the other side of the map via the closets and the one that lets them be invis are too op

[ocean marsh]

Yeah this definitely sucks. we tried our best but couldnt end up fixing it because minecraft just doesnt have anything good to detect jumps

[tired wedge]

the closets needs to have a range limit imo

[ocean marsh]

im gonna let things sit for a while

...not a while. a day, maybe

each spirit is strong in their own ways

the taken makes a fairly distinct noise when they teleport, which should be enough to know theyre nearby

[hearty heron]

yo uhh, its not working

[ocean marsh]

?

[mental pelican]

the missing chunk incident

[hearty heron]

it doesnt tp into playable area

[ocean marsh]

looking into it

[hearty heron]

so were just stuck there, cant even attack

[ocean marsh]

i know

[tired wedge]

Yeah but being able to tp to the entire side of the map is too op imo

[ocean marsh]

gonna be broken on a few new worlds for a bit

getting a fix pushed asap

[hearty heron]

so it still works on some older worlds rn?

[ocean marsh]

idk

if any are up from when chunks were broken

[tired wedge]

btw if u get that and /lobby to another world that has a game progressing, you can smuggle 2 sets of items out of the mini game

[ocean marsh]

wild

[spring needle]

takens mobility is entirely dependent on random locker spawns, as well as the lockers rotation for their vision. its very easy to miss people when looking out of lockers and get a spirit well taken out from under you

[azure yoke]

Game doesn't work at all for me.

I've attempted... five, six, times, and none of them have worked.

[ocean marsh]

yeah, known issue

we're trying to patch it asap

[azure yoke]

Game is completely wack, far as I can tell, just found the game items hanging out in the overworld.

And chunks are disappearing from the antechamber.

[ocean marsh]

well thats people throwing them out

[azure yoke]

yeah

i feel like, if i were the devs, i'd extend the festival by a day to cope with this
because "whoops, game was broken"
but also you probably have delicate timing

what's the current plan?

[ocean marsh]

fixing it as soon as we can

[radiant galleon]

joining thread

[hearty heron]

we didnt even get the trinkets during festival of the bonfire 😩

[rustic widget]

Wrong thread sorry but seems the most related, is there a place I can see all the new skins added from the event

[radiant galleon]

wrong thread

[rustic widget]

Plz answer still

[radiant galleon]

[indigo thunder]

what is going on

[quaint sand]

It’s a nice mini game, one of the spirits that use the panic concept is clearly the panic zealots revenge

[indigo thunder]

do u need to bring a weapon in this game?

[ocean marsh]

no

[indigo thunder]

oh shit the unable to /class is real

[ocean marsh]

WC47 45 48 and 46 should be working

from what ive been told

[indigo thunder]

ok i am stuck here now

[indigo thunder]

but pfinder sent u to random wc...

[ocean marsh]

i know

im aware

im doing my best

[quaint sand]

Your doing all you can and that’s what matters at the end

[indigo thunder]

so u need to find a party urself atm?

[ocean marsh]

if you relog itll send you out of there

[indigo thunder]

no i am still there

i guess i need to /kill

[spring needle]

that'd be best for now

[indigo thunder]

finally

[spring needle]

would love to hear your feedback once you get in a game

swag best of luck

[indigo thunder]

uhhhh

[spring needle]

spirit disconnected

[indigo thunder]

i think the spirit dc is because of some bug

[spring needle]

womp

[indigo thunder]

the game cant start so he/she dc to end the game

[ocean marsh]

any of these worlds should be working

[indigo thunder]

now i need to find my party member

[hearty heron]

lemme just hop on the yt world rq

[ocean marsh]

yeah youre the third person to make that joke

[hearty heron]

glad to see im that original

[indigo thunder]

i guess i need to do some lr first...

i guess i need to heal someone in lr

[hearty heron]

i just selected 2 first perks lol

[ocean marsh]

awesome

[hearty heron]

but game also didnt start so i think it was still an old server

[azure yoke]

Is the glitch with the minigame world-specific?

[ocean marsh]

yea

[hearty heron]

i love vanilla gameplay

[civic token]

what worlds r good

[civic token]

olk i jsut played a game on w2 that shi was pretty fun

anywayhs time to takea bio test

[honest forge]

@spring needle I’ve noticed a weird bug where you can just camp the gate as spirit and win

[ocean marsh]

fixed for next map push

which is either today or tomorrow

[indigo thunder]

camping killer!!

violated the survivor rule book

[spring needle]

WHAT

CAMPING KILLER 🤬🤬

[indigo thunder]

camping killer have 0 marks in rank

[civic token]

also dont send pfinder to worlds that are playing a game 😔

[indigo thunder]

is that how the bug happen?

[ocean marsh]

yeah, its a bug that it does that. theres something in place to prevent it but its not working

[ocean marsh]

no, its unrelated

i think the game-not-starting bug should be fully fixed on the newest worlds

[civic token]

😔

it onlyu sending us to w25 w48 and w47

[tulip drum]

Wynntils just breaks this entire mini game
figured out that some people don't play fairly and just use the map to track people down easily or avoid the killer easily

[civic token]

invis perk for the spirit is brokey

as in its pretty op

[indigo thunder]

most op killer perk : wynntils

[civic token]

also ghosts shoudl eb able to help in some way other then jsut telling the players where the spirit is i feel, but idk might be too brokey
also when a spirit destroys a barricade can survivors not place a barricade thereanymroe??

also also how is score gained? is it just from acrtivting the wells?

[ocean marsh]

most things you can do give score

powering wells, healing or reviving other players, stunning the spirit with a blockade

[civic token]

also what ar alll the spirits

[spring needle]

Wanderer, Terror, Taken, Vermin, Keeper

[safe junco]

you can disable it from tracking you through these options

or just not use wynntils

[indigo plume]

we might need to put a msg at the start of the minigame telling you to turn that shit off

[tulip drum]

Yeah cause I experienced this while being a survivor, wasn't fun

[quaint sentinel]

You wont see me as spirit :)

[pearl spoke]

if 2 players die and the spirit camps 3 spirit wells it’s game over

some of the spirit wells are really really close to each other

[civic token]

lsot shield thig brokey, and the invis thing is brokey(as in really good)

the invis spirit thing *

i cant tell if the particles are sprint particles or invis assassin

also they can jsut camp bodies

doesnt ecven trigger heartbeat 💀

[safe junco]

thats kinda the point...?

[civic token]

yeah but its kinda brokey

[safe junco]

it has lighter particles than the sprit particles

and there is the uncloaking time

[civic token]

uncloaking time is around same time as revive time

so they can just camp u lo

they can jsut kill one person and then wait for somene tor evive them and then kill that person

[safe junco]

the timer doesnt tick down while the killer is nearby

so you can kinda just

leave them

until the killer goes away

[civic token]

i think it does

[safe junco]

it doesnt

[ocean marsh]

revive is 2s, uncloak is 3s

and the grave timer doesnt go down while spirit's within like 10 blocks or something

[civic token]

icic

[mental pelican]

then i shall use hacks /j

[civic token]

i was gunan sa lone soldier is broken and then i realized how the injrued mechanic worked 💀

[civic token]

also i think the rat spirit is bugged cuz whenever i try to make a hole i get stuck in it and have t shift jump out

[ocean marsh]

yea known issue

[civic token]

oki

[indigo thunder]

wtf why the killer can hit me in a weird angle

[ocean marsh]

player hitboxes are intentionally big because of lag and funkiness with how the attacks work

its better to let the killer hit you from a weird angle than have attacks seemingly miss when they shouldnt

[indigo thunder]

what does this mean

[ocean marsh]

check your tome of attunement

[civic token]

also i think the spirit camping bodies still decreases timer

cuz my fren said that his timer weas decreeasing when he was being camped(he is dumb tho)

[indigo thunder]

also what does jump do

[civic token]

jumping barricades>?

[ocean marsh]

slows you and disables jump for a second

[indigo thunder]

but why should u jump?

[civic token]

the spirit cant

[indigo thunder]

is it like a kind of dead hard?

[ocean marsh]

its there to prevent sprint jumping

you shouldnt be jumping at all

but its the only way we can prevent it

[indigo thunder]

ok i thought u can use it to dodge

[civic token]

ye me friend is camping my body rn and the timer is going down

[ocean marsh]

weird

ill look into that

[indigo thunder]

camping is op

[ocean marsh]

not sure why it would have broken

[indigo thunder]

wtf

the word stuck

[ocean marsh]

rrright

im aware of that one

itll clear when the game ends

[indigo thunder]

huh?

i dont think i chose this

[civic token]

if u take too long then

it chooses for u

[indigo thunder]

i think i clicked it

[mental pelican]

the downed player can move around via boats

[indigo thunder]

huh?

[mental pelican]

same when they are charging up soul wells

[ocean marsh]

yea ive been told

[ocean marsh]

what does the woods say

[indigo thunder]

LOL
real dbd mechanics

[indigo thunder]

it can be full?

[ocean marsh]

yea theres 2 maps

each is its own instance and when both are active, you cant join a game on that world

[indigo thunder]

oh my god my teammate get in the locker in the first second

[mental pelican]

struggle mechanic is real

[indigo thunder]

i think my teammate is afking in a locker

[ocean marsh]

unfortunate

theyre going to get very little score and rewards

[indigo thunder]

ok maybe not

[mental pelican]

i got 0 bc i keep stalling the spirit

very funny tho

[ocean marsh]

if you stun them you get score

[indigo thunder]

bruh why the escape beacon can spawn in the corner of map

i run around the whole map and finally found it in the corner

then i watched the spirit destroyed it

[mental pelican]

this is bugged

the travel mechanic is broken

[indigo thunder]

i dont know how to use that

[mental pelican]

right click, then there is a cooldown of placing it

[indigo thunder]

the dbd portal is already hard for me and now i need to use them in wynn

[mental pelican]

so true

[indigo thunder]

wtf...

[ocean marsh]

hitbox is big

[mental pelican]

the panic zealot cosplay hits hard

[indigo thunder]

how dbd feels like when it has world chat

[mental pelican]

me opening map so i can find them

[civic token]

wtf stop exposing me....

[wanton oracle]

lmfao

[indigo thunder]

can u revive with this if u are the last survivor in game?

[spare glen]

Nah

[indigo thunder]

so u cant bm the killer?

[spare glen]

Bruh I play with 4 perks in dbd

Meanwhile this…

[indigo thunder]

and killer has 0 perk

[spare glen]

Do you agree that survivors need to be buffed

[indigo thunder]

probably

survivor is not good without voice chat

[spare glen]

I’ll type in a bit playing rn

[indigo thunder]

no matter in dbd or this

[spare glen]

Yea this is no swf (don’t forget about some players not having wynntils)

[indigo thunder]

what can wynntils do?

[spare glen]

If you don’t have it

[spring needle]

some people are cheating using wynntils to track other players

[indigo thunder]

yeah i click their head and there's waypoint on them

[spring needle]

its pretty lame

[indigo thunder]

but only for teammate?

i cant even delete the waypoint of my teammate and it kind of annoying me

[spring needle]

simply play vanilla

the intended experience

[indigo thunder]

nah i cant play wynn without wynntils

[spare glen]

A team of survivors all having wynntils versus not having it makes a difference lol

[indigo thunder]

i dont even care about my teammate position because i dont like to play survivor

[spare glen]

Ok I’m having a bad hunter rn what kind of luck is this

[indigo thunder]

bad hunter?

[spare glen]

Like the hunter is pretty bad

[indigo thunder]

what is hunter

[spare glen]

I mean killer sorry

[indigo thunder]

huntress?

[spring needle]

spirit...

[indigo thunder]

oh ok u should definitely call them killer

[spare glen]

How tf can someone as spirit not win lmao

Because we just had a 3 survivor win game

[indigo thunder]

i just lose to 3 survivor

[spring needle]

not everyone is good at spirit

danny thats cause i stomped you lmfao

[spare glen]

Ok maybe survivors shld have the kindred perk available by default

[indigo thunder]

when u and the target have different ping u need to stand on their block to hit them

so i can never hit tealy

[spring needle]

na i just juke you B)

so i get broken ankles value

[spare glen]

ok spirit game

Imma pick huntress and see

[indigo thunder]

i know u doing smth like 360 but i cant hit u in further distance

it is easy to get 360 in the same block

also u dont have hitbox with other player in minecraft so u cant block them with ur body

[spare glen]

Bruh I’m stuck because of an ability

Vermin’s burrow is a lil janky

[indigo thunder]

did u stuck in the hole?

[spring needle]

known, lex is working on a fix 👍

[spare glen]

Somehow got out after some attempts but good to know

[spare glen]

Yea stepbr

[indigo thunder]

[spare glen]

Yea just don’t use wynntils if you wanna play this without feeling unfair

[azure yoke]

oh huh that's

bleh

[azure yoke]

Are the Spirits intended to represent major characters? I can see Taken as Aledar, Terror as Panic Zealot, and Vermin as the Colossal Rat, but what about Wanderer and Keeper, especially since Wanderer apparently has no attached dialogue?

[indigo thunder]

[tulip drum]

Smh, forgot to put panic zealot and colossal rat in with the shadowed figures

[vagrant fog]

The colossal rat one is really glitchy with the burrows

[wet river]

Surly wynntils dont allows for some silly stuff

also the colossal Rat burrows just get u stuck (not sure if its always or just sometimes)

[mental pelican]

there is a archer / ranged that is using a mael’s skin

[azure yoke]

So the Keeper would be Mael, then, which makes sense.

That leaves the Wanderer. No dialogue for hints as to their identity.

[mental pelican]

i think it is the guy from memory paranoia

not memory paranoia

hollow serenity

[vast shell]

[low wedge]

So played first game. And it's ok? I was more confused on how to use score

side note it really needs to be sorted with the jump fatigue, it's causing too many problems with me randomly suddenly getting slowness

[weak pike]

I like the game made, super fun. The graveyard map is a bit flat thou and i do wish their was more to it (like tunnels/connected basements) but overall it's really well made and fun!

[hearty heron]

Wouldnt just an absurdly high level of jump boost also work to prevent jumping?

[low wedge]

issue is that just causes an infinite speed boost

since mojang's coding basically goes "still jumping so 30% speed"

[last fractal]

bruh I just got stuck after tping to a snare

[pearl spoke]

me sprinting off stairs causing jump fatigue

[last fractal]

ok it just tps me underground every single time

[low wedge]

ok terror, it sucks.

Like genuinely, snares shouldn't be that easy to avoid

taken is cool because you can patrol well

but also get caught out since people are gonna avoid lockers

[vivid quail]

played a few games, heres some feedback from me:

• the game feels too easy for survivors, there are several times where a party of randoms has escaped with 0 deaths and so far no spirit wins
• the barricade jumping is a bit odd, sometimes it just doesnt work and you'll have to move back to be able to do it
• the ranged spirit weapon appears to be a little too op on the woods map ngl, since it's pretty open
• perhaps it could be better if the 100% spirit wells were not given glow to the spirit, but maybe that's intentional to make it a little harder for the spirit
• maybe could be worth adding some prevention mechanisms against camping, especially when reaching the final spirit well as there's no reason for the spirit to do anything but camp the spot, which can get very frustrating to play against

other than that, really nice though :) perhaps some QA issues, but i like the idea of it and it's definitely a breath of fresh air

[low wedge]

Actually there's 2 final spirit wells

I kept having to jump places as taken because of that fact

[vivid quail]

oh and one extra point, the barricade speed boost may need a little nerf but to be fair the 60s cooldown makes it balanced better. i just think the 5 seconds of speed boost is usually good enough to completely lose the spirit and more

the one where you get 5sec speed 3 for jumping over a barricade (parkour, i think)

[mental pelican]

yall can win as survivors?

[vivid quail]

yeah? ive played 5 games (the server crashed mid way through one lol) and won as survivors every time

twice with all 4, one with 3, one with 2 i think and one with 1 survivor left and that was all with randoms not like a specific party

[mental pelican]

there is soul escape if the game is too long and it counters the spirits camping

[low wedge]

yeah i kept winning

[vivid quail]

fair ig, but idk this does also mean that the ppl being camped are unable to play the game for that whole time which sucks from a player perspective i suppose lol

[low wedge]

i won once as a killer i think it really depends on the killer and map

ok so i think invisible guy is slightly too op?

like holy hell speed boost is a bad idea. Playing as him my only issue was literally checking lockers would of been impossible

[last fractal]

terror is bad but fun to play ngl, too bad literally everyone chooses the invis guy

[low wedge]

i enjoyed terror a lot

but found it to have the issue of, why are the snares so obvious

in DBD the snares were spottable but not "broadcasting location"

[pearl spoke]

panic zealot was always mid even in item form

[pearl spoke]

it’s replicate the actual boss fight the boss does the same exact thing

[low wedge]

Yeah doesn't make it good

Like to me they should just go the DBD route, very subtle but noticeable if you look

[pearl spoke]

yes huge radius indicator is not good

might be a bit too obvious

[low wedge]

remove the indicator keep the item

[pearl spoke]

keep the dernic gem sprite without the ring

[low wedge]

people might notice it when badly placed, but if you put it somewhere good, people will walk in to it unless they're scanning the ground

i.e any slightly dark map is great for it

so far played invis taken and terror.
Invis is by far the dumbest because of the speed, it's beatable but god it's really dumb.
Taken is honestly the most balanced since it's easy to counter but punishing if you don't pay ANY attention to the nearby lockers afterwards.
And terror is just... yeah needs to be made so it's not as obvious.
Also can the game please inform the player that to destroy the stuff as a killer you need to hold nothing?

it genuinely threw me off so much when i couldn't destroy anything due to the weapon.

[low wedge]

but yeah just checked guide, there's 7 spirit wells in total

so unless the guy gets lucky and their right next to each other, it's not gonna be possible to camp them out

[mental pelican]

you can go invis and if you leave invis, there is a sound cue that alerts it, ngl they should add that it also affects your heartbeat

[ocean marsh]

re: needing to hold nothing- this is a bug that's been annoying me for a bit. i havent been able to figure out how to fix it

[low wedge]

yeah i found the sound cue didn't matter because if the survivor was fixing a gen they had to wait a second to escape meaning i had so much time.

[low wedge]

yeah i'd say for now tell the player in some way "hold nothing" because rn it was causing me just to not be able to do anything

[ocean marsh]

👍

[vivid quail]

yeah but when you get to the last one then the spirit can just camp the ladt one that you need to fix no? or am i just stupid here

[low wedge]

nah there's only 5 to do

[vivid quail]

oh so theres two extra

[low wedge]

yeah

[vivid quail]

riiight didn't realise, mb

[low wedge]

So can't really camp them, can patrol them but that's it really

[ocean marsh]

it does suck but it's not really possible to make it work better than it does due to minecraft limitations. we need it there to combat sprint jumping but no matter what there are gonna be false positives

[low wedge]

yeah it's just annoying when you go via stairs

[ocean marsh]

fair

ill see what i can do but no promises

[low wedge]

also im noticing something triggers it without falling?

like idk what but it just suddenly happens

[ocean marsh]

minecraft's jump detection is really strange

and barely works

its awesome

[low wedge]

btw, surprised there's not a self heal perk with a LONG cooldown

[hearty heron]

its hitbox is already significantly larger then the raidus tho

[low wedge]

And? the only time it's usable is in a chase really which it doesn't work well in

Because if they're not in a chase, they'll see it, and go around it.

[hearty heron]

actually, i just realized that that would be one more reason to actually remove the ring lol

and the problem i see currently is that theres an indication but the indication is smaller than what it actually is -> you might feel safe but then trigger it

also, if possible i think it would be nice if all particle effect cosmetic were disabled by default because i dont htink some people realize those give htem away over half the map

[low wedge]

Btw should probably point out to anyone who plays the game, just remove wynntils for it

[hearty heron]

jsut disable hades?

[low wedge]

i'll check thought that was just for you tho

ok it's everyone, but yeah that needs to be disabled

noticed a couple people using that feature for obvious reasons.

[last fractal]

played my first game as the locker guy, it was so fun

prob my fav spirit

[earnest wharf]

disable totems in the gamemode

[hearty heron]

mob totems?

[earnest wharf]

some people use them to hide inside the model

yeah

[low wedge]

i feel like that's noticeable though

[hearty heron]

let them waste their totems lol

[earnest wharf]

yeah it is but i'd say it'd confuse new people

[ocean marsh]

i might not be able to, but ill look into it

[low wedge]

nah i saw a totem and immediately went "really?"

[earnest wharf]

yeah same but some newer people might be confused

[ocean marsh]

does anyone have feedback about perks? anything too strong or too weak?

[spring needle]

what

terror is like one of the strongest spirits

[low wedge]

is terror the snare one? if so not really

might be getting them mixed up

[spring needle]

yeah, it is. you can like totally lock down games with it

[low wedge]

eh. I've found it's only worked if the well placement is actually horrible

[spring needle]

could I ask how you are using your snares

[low wedge]

i was only him once

but i noticed a lot of the snares just never really came up outside of chases

or at one point i was literally triggering them on purpose just to try and get him away from the open exit gate

[spring needle]

terror is best when you set up snares and force people to run through them

its area denial

[low wedge]

Ehh i found wanderer was so much better solely due to how you could effectively kickstart a chase with 0 downside since they had to focus on wells and exiting took enough you can keep a chase

[last fractal]

taken is pretty damn op, being able to tp into pretty much every important place

[low wedge]

taken i'd say ends up suffering the moment anyone gets very weird with lockers

since if someone notices a locker you effectively go from less of a threat to more of an annoyance with patrol routes.

it's not bad but i'd say it's well balanced

[earnest wharf]

head on (i cant remember the perk name so im using the dbd ones) is a little weak ngl. should be like 3.5 - 4

[spring needle]

surprise strike

[low wedge]

so something i've noticed, why is the burrow stupidly hard to destroy?

[spring needle]

because its permanent

vermin has limited number of burrows. once one is destroyed they are permanently down one

[low wedge]

why not give it a health bar then?

since rn it's just abusrdly long to destroy and you're REALLY hoping it's on the other side of the map and not caring if it gets destroyed

i get it, it's a resource but it should not take multiple seconds to get through 1 square alone and reset if you run for it

[spring needle]

if it save dprogress it'd be basically impossible to preserve them

[low wedge]

not really, keep the amount of time and it'll still be hell

[spring needle]

i disagree, but thank you for your feedback

[low wedge]

ok finally tried seeker, surprisingly balanced

the only thing i could suggest, if searching an empty locker can that just count as restocking?

[earnest wharf]

also whatever the spirit clone is called (the spirit as in the killer from dbd) i think there should be a slight speed boost after decloaking similar to dbd

[ocean marsh]

so, the restock time is functionally 4 seconds and thats intentionsl

it just takes 2s of that as searching time

[low wedge]

ooh. so it's the same time no matter what?

[ocean marsh]

yea

[earnest wharf]

also also there should be an indicator for the healing. it's kinda confusing since it says "SHIFT to stop healing" both when you're healing and being healed

maybe like "SHIFT to cancel healing" and "SHIFT to cancel being healed"

[ocean marsh]

good idea

[earnest wharf]

same with being revived. there's no indication while you're being revived and a lot of the time and i feel it would be nice to be able to see other survivors (like in dbd) when you're downed

[ocean marsh]

hm

making players glow only for some people and not others is actually very hard

an indicator while youre being revived would be good to add, yes

[earnest wharf]

i think also cancelling the death timer while being revived would be nice too

[vivid quail]

i killed one person and it instantly game ended us all LOL

[ocean marsh]

i thought i already did this

[ocean marsh]

was everyone else down

[vivid quail]

nope

[ocean marsh]

weird

[vivid quail]

the very start of the game, first time i downed anyone, just after they were in a locker

and it game ended every single player

[ocean marsh]

my best guess is data didnt reset from last game? thats very strange

[vivid quail]

this was our first game together

[ocean marsh]

yea i just mean

the lobby

not your specific party

[vivid quail]

ah, maybe

[mental pelican]

is it possible to farm essences

bc you can stage a spirit that injure everyone and survivors can heal each other

[ocean marsh]

score from a lot of actions has diminishing returns

[earnest wharf]

there should be score from looping the killer ong

i swear i've had games where i'm just juicing the killer to the max and i get like 3 fucking shards 😭

[ocean marsh]

yeahhh but its a bit hard to detect if youre being chased

[earnest wharf]

i mean i think the workaround would just be within x amount of blocks of the killer

[ocean marsh]

best idea i had was giving score if they miss an attack within a few blocks

[earnest wharf]

or like if you've been in the killers LOS within the past 5 seconds and you're within like 15 blocks

pretty sure dbd counts you in chase if you've been in LOS within the past few seconds and you're sprinting

[ocean marsh]

line of sight is... i think a little resource intensive for us to track constantly

ill see what i can do

[low wedge]

i'd say dodging should count

[ocean marsh]

cause i do agree you should get score for keeping the spirit busy

[earnest wharf]

dodging should as well

[earnest wharf]

just do a raycast between the player and the spirit and see if there's a wall

[ocean marsh]

no yeah thats how you do it

but youd need to do that constantly

[earnest wharf]

idrk how tools work but from a programmatic perspective it'd be checking if there's a wall, then checking if the spirit is facing towards the player's general direction

[earnest wharf]

you could just loop it every second ngl

[ocean marsh]

we'll see

i'm gonna be doing some minigame changes today, if i have time i'll look into it

[earnest wharf]

these are exact conditions for chase in dbd

dbd wiki 😍

[mental pelican]

holy shit it js so much cleaner than wynncrsft fa*dom wiki

[earnest wharf]

it's on fandom.

[mental pelican]

💀

[earnest wharf]

most wikis run on MediaWiki

[low wedge]

also probably slightly op but i feel like narnia should let you pick the locker

[indigo plume]

its annoying when narnia teleports you to the locker right next to you but the randomness is also kinda the point

[polar blade]

he has a limited amount but destroying them usually isnt a viable option because of the time it takes and the fact that it marks you

[indigo plume]

i think narnia should instead tp you to narnia as soon as you enter the locker and you are safe from the spirit there and can go on an adventure

[polar blade]

they could either get some lower hp or remove the ability for the vermin to teleport to burrows being actively destroyed

[indigo plume]

imo vermin shouldnt be able to tp to burrows that are breaking but the player breaking it should still glow and the process of breaking the burrow should take ages

[spring needle]

ive found it to be pretty viable. breaking a burrow gives the spirit a choice. consider doing what they're doing (might be chasing a survivor, guarding a well, etc), or keep their burrow

[polar blade]

youre doing two things at once by both protecting your burrow and hunting a player

[spring needle]

they very rarely can do both. they must drow what they're doing to guard it. this gives your team time to recoup / save them if they are being chased

the player destroying the burrow gets time to get away, and it'd just be restarting a whole chase

[polar blade]

not like it takes much for the vermin to catch up post teleport

idk i wouldnt really ever consider trying to break a burrow against a good vermin unless its literally right next to a well

[low wedge]

Wouldn't the issue be in the time it takes to destroy the burrow you could either injure/kill the survivor unless they manage to escape then just tp back anyway?

[spring needle]

unless you kill the other survivor directly next to another burrow, not usually

since you can only move between them

[low wedge]

Yeah but wouldn't that be much easier when you're on the jungle map and everything's wide open?

[polar blade]

havent really read up much but im just gonna assume garvan is on the chopping block and rightfully so

[low wedge]

hallway map sure i could see that becoming a problem?

[ocean marsh]

garvan's on the chopping block but we haven't agreed exactly how he'll be nerfed

[low wedge]

the speed i'd say is the biggest issue. I think he's also indirectly buffed by the delay in cancelling well?

[polar blade]

you could either reduce the usability of invis by adding a duration to each invis and or a cooldown after uncloaking

or also just reduce the speed invis grants

[ocean marsh]

yeah im thinking of adding a cooldown after uncloaking

[low wedge]

like i noticed i'd hear him, cancel the well and it'd take me a second to actually start running

[ocean marsh]

& we'll probably not let him damage wells while cloaked

[spring needle]

💀

[polar blade]

the speed especially just makes him a freerunner for checking around the map

[spring needle]

what exactly is the thing thats op about him

[low wedge]

His speed.

[ocean marsh]

i think the speed is the big thing of the spirit

so im a little wary about nerfing it heavily

[polar blade]

bit of both in the invis and speed

[low wedge]

lose a chase? oh i'll just go invis and find them again, they're not gonna hide from something that fast and they can't see

[indigo plume]

you cant escape him if he chooses to chase you

[spring needle]

i have escaped garvan many many many times

[low wedge]

Probably wasn't that good then.

[polar blade]

not all garvan players are created equal

[indigo plume]

*if he chooses to chase you

[spring needle]

i have wasted their time so much as they chase me invis. when they decloak ill just stun them and make distance again

[low wedge]

The only times i manage to escape him are silent lockers and a LOT of confusing routes

[polar blade]

i dont think using invis to explicitly chase is good it's moreso that it's an insane scouting tool

[low wedge]

You can easily get the drop on someone even if they're being alert doing a well

[polar blade]

way easier to check every well around the map with garvan than any other killer

[ocean marsh]

at some point in testing we kept garvan's slowness for like a second after decloak finished

but ended up removing that before release

[spring needle]

this was god awful

you essentially just couldnt trust your decloak timer

[polar blade]

think just adding a duration/cooldown would be enough imo

[spring needle]

cooldown maybe, duration def not imo

[ocean marsh]

i'd prefer a cooldown than a duration

[low wedge]

duration causes that issue of suddenly decloaking and the player getting annoyed over it

[ocean marsh]

oh, actually, here's a question

[low wedge]

a cooldown just means you gotta use it semi smart but are free to do whatever without feeling cheated

[spring needle]

same reason i dont want decloak on damaging well, being forced out of cloak sucks

[ocean marsh]

what do y'all think about garvan's ability to destroy blockades while cloaked

[polar blade]

then dont destroy a well while cloaked it's that simple

[spring needle]

id rather just have you not be able to damage wells while cloaked if the issue is people not being able to out-power it

[ocean marsh]

i'm considering increasing the time it takes to destroy a blockade while you're cloaked but if it's not an issue i won't do that

[polar blade]

i mean either way is fine, just being able to destroy wells while cloaked is very silly

[low wedge]

Sure

i'd say as long as there's a punishment for doing it while cloaked it's fine

[spring needle]

clearing the map is one of garvans strengths. i think id rather add like a bonus stun time while cloaked

so if you're being harassed by a cloaked spirit you can try and bait them into a blockade for a 2x stun

and then get away

[polar blade]

im not sure that really solves any of the complaints with garvan

[ocean marsh]

i think thats an alternative to my proposal here

[spring needle]

not being able to escape?

[ocean marsh]

it'd be in addition to the other changes

which are not allowing damaging wells while cloaked, and adding a cooldown

[spring needle]

id rather not over-nerf

[polar blade]

being able to do so much while keeping no detection and speed is silly

[low wedge]

Just nerf him in ways that gives the player a choice of decloaking to annoy the survivors, or keeping cloak on but can't interfere that much.

I.e he can't destroy a well without being uncloaked.
And barricades just take much longer while cloaked.
And searching should be impossible while cloaked.

[ocean marsh]

searching is impossible when cloaked already

[polar blade]

keeper (i think hes the crossbow spirit?) feels kind of weak atm

[spring needle]

how about

• cannot damage wells while cloaked
• stun time from blockades is doubled while cloaked

[vivid quail]

keeper is op on big map

[low wedge]

i know, i just meant the various interactions

[vivid quail]

bad on house

[polar blade]

yeah hes pretty solid on the crypt not so good in bunker

[ocean marsh]

terror's kind of the opposite

[spring needle]

lex can i float my idea for keeper here

[ocean marsh]

very good on bunker, not as good in woods

ok

sure

[spring needle]

keeper can place Mirrors (5 max). When the keeper shoots a mirror, it will reflect the arrow in whatever direction the mirror is facing (mirror is set in same direction keeper is looking while placing) and extends the range of the arrow back to maximum (32 blocks)
this allows keeper to set up trickshots in advance and will benefit them most in bunker map, where they are currently weakest

[polar blade]

sounds very situational

i guess it's fine

[mental pelican]

and also cannot check lockers while cloaked

[ocean marsh]

already cant

[mental pelican]

what

[polar blade]

honestly the spirits are mostly pretty balanced my only real complaint with the minigame atm is garvan and thats about it

[vivid quail]

is there any way to tell what map ur on during perks, if so then i can see the keeper being fine since its just up to u to choose properly

[spring needle]

yeah i wanted something that wasnt like a big buff but helped where it was needed and extended the skill ceiling more

[vivid quail]

feels kinda weak to me personally

[polar blade]

...garvan?

[spring needle]

could set them on corners and stuff so when people turn them you can shoot the mirror to nail them

[indigo plume]

sounds so useless

[mental pelican]

garvan is wanderer isnt it?

[indigo plume]

you need actual skill to make proper use of that

[spring needle]

thats the point

[vivid quail]

no clue what this means im just talking from the experience of having no one win as spirit and most times winning with 3-4 survivors left

[indigo plume]

and youve seen pfinder havent you

[spring needle]

then dont choose keeper! or just dont use the mirrors

[indigo plume]

well is it really worth adding something for only the best players

[mental pelican]

tbh ranged attacks is the most beneficial rn, not its special abilities

[spring needle]

yes

[empty valley]

unrelated but if you grab lost soldier while dead it dont work

[ocean marsh]

yep known bug

gonna fix today

[empty valley]

ah

[polar blade]

idk i really hate to say skill issue but it really does just sound like youre playing with bad spirits

i suppose keeper and zealot both being really good on one map and weak on the other is fine

[mental pelican]

wanderer can literally camp while invis, and then uninvis to down all of them

[polar blade]

i guess one last thing is that the perk where all blockades and lockers glow is fucking useless

[hearty heron]

Not really

[mental pelican]

lockers glow is actually kinda useful

[polar blade]

right

[hearty heron]

Information stuffs usefulness always depends on your skill so i guess it varies but the one thing i does always help with is showing activated/broken blockades

[low wedge]

nah i find it useful

[civic token]

if u arre REALLY alert u can see them uninvis and it tkars 3 secodns for it|
and survivors revive in 2

[polar blade]

idk even after just a couple games of playing i lost any usefulness i had for it as it's super easy to remember where blockades are and if anything it becomes a downside when looking for graves

[civic token]

good for leanring map ig idk

[low wedge]

It's pretty good if you go a more locker/block based

[polar blade]

i dont think that makes it good

[hearty heron]

Lockers are random i think

[civic token]

i don thtink so

[polar blade]

yeah and you can just remember where they are...

[mental pelican]

me when players turns off sound cues

[cunning hare]

i think rat shouldnt be able to put holes at spirit wells

[spring needle]

set locations, % chances to spawn each

[civic token]

also assaassin has particles when they invis so its not the worst, def will catch u offguard if u dont see em

[mental pelican]

me when peopl turn on pets

me when people get time dial

[civic token]

bru te game tells u to turn on sound! also particles appear i think

[polar blade]

trust me guys, playing with 3 yeti pets IS optimal

[low wedge]

as someone who struggles at remembering small details, yeah not gonna happen

[mental pelican]

you forgot people cant read

[polar blade]

the yetis will scare away the spirit

[civic token]

me when people play with skyraider parrot

[civic token]

womp womp the visual cue is enughyf or me, if the survivors dont have either on then reading comprehension issue

[spring needle]

little known mechanic: The Vermin loses its heartbeat for 5s after exiting a burrow. its more effective to hide the burrow a bit away from a well and then use it to ambush people rather than have it out in the open and give them a headstart to run when you go to it

[ocean marsh]

eh cant really remember where they are cause tiles are randomly loaded each game

[mental pelican]

me when people literally said "My location is at []"

[hearty heron]

?

[hearty heron]

Tiles=floor?

[mental pelican]

it doesnt have visual cues for uninvis afaik

[cunning hare]

but you can camp last 3 wells when there is less than 3 survivors

[polar blade]

im not convinced its a good perk but whatever its just one perk out of like 20

[hearty heron]

Turn on sound

[spring needle]

i mean yeah but the game is basically over anyways then

if there are only 2 people left and you're still in spirit well phase

[ocean marsh]

tiles are like. predefined 14x14 or 9x9 spots of the map that randomly load a structure and rotation each game

and some of the objects in said tiles also are randomly selected

[polar blade]

but yeah pretty good and well balanced gamemode only really complaint i have is garvan being a bit too strong

[ocean marsh]

bunker has less of them

[spring needle]

bunker itself is a tile

[mental pelican]

i turn off my 170-250bpm breakcore for this stupid ah game

[vivid quail]

cloak of shadows appears to be bugged. i activated it, everything highlighted, couldnt teleport to any lockers

[gentle tulip]

oh wow even dbd tile mechanic is implemented

[polar blade]

its kind of buggy

[hearty heron]

Dont play the game mode based around sound cues then??

[polar blade]

vermin burrows too also just dont work sometimes

[ocean marsh]

hmm. thats a bit strange. ill have to look into that

[mental pelican]

i play this game for the trinkets

[ocean marsh]

yea im aware of burrows

[mental pelican]

and debugging

[ocean marsh]

the game heavily relies on sound cues

[cunning hare]

on other spirit you can try to juke them while the other guy does the spirit well but on vermin you cant cuz he can just wait at wells and tp to other ones

[vivid quail]

it worked the first time i did it, but then the 2nd time it just didnt work and ended up with me losing the game

[ocean marsh]

if you're not using sounds, you're inherently at a disadvantage

[hearty heron]

Then get together with 4 pther people and farm the gamemode

[civic token]

is vermin fixed?

[polar blade]

no trust me do NOT play with sounds they are a disadvantage

[ocean marsh]

not yet

[mental pelican]

they are doing tna all day

[vivid quail]

true

[ocean marsh]

going to push a bunch of fixes/balance tweaks today

[polar blade]

or just blast music into your ears

i am normal and can be trusted

[hearty heron]

Uhh just buy 4 alts or smth idk

[indigo plume]

@polar blade any beyond banisher

[ocean marsh]

does anyone have any perks they'd like me to take a look at

[cunning hare]

play without a monitor 100% win rate

[gentle tulip]

survivor syndrome seems extremely mid for being triggered when its basicly over

[mental pelican]

so true..

[civic token]

also i think a small annoying thin about the panic zealot spirit is that their traps can be activated by invincible players who just got revived, and that they cant place a snare right next to a body when thjey put a snare there earlier(might be a bit op but can u make it so u can repair snares like 10 seconds after they activated?)

[low wedge]

yeah survivor seems kinda... weak?

[civic token]

escape welll inq uestion: but ye if u die 2nd to ladt or smth its useless lo

[ocean marsh]

on my list already ye

[spring needle]

imo survivor syndrome is fine for its use-case

[polar blade]

i just did a bunch of games after you left and I’m gonna head out for a bit soon so unless you’re awake in like…6 or 7 hours then can’t lol

[spring needle]

which is: this match is basically over, my team sucks, im not confident im gonna find the escape beacon, im gonna try to slip out a gate

only buff i think it should get is just fully removing sprint marks while you're the last alive

[gentle tulip]

healing streak is a good perk but unfortunately

[ocean marsh]

what i'm thinking is to make the escape beacon glow if you're within like 16 blocks of it

[civic token]

hmmmm

[cunning hare]

Did you guys found a way to nerf garvan?

[ocean marsh]

for survivor syndrome

[gentle tulip]

public lobbies have such difficulty healing, you'll be extremely lucky to get off two heals before being downed

[spring needle]

i like this too

[civic token]

i think its balanced engh with audio cues cuz it takes 3 serconds to uncloak

[spring needle]

but in that case should get rid of sprint mark stuff

[civic token]

o ye the perk where dodgin an attack will make giv u speed is kinda wack with the big hitboxes

[low wedge]

it's kinda too good cause of it

[cunning hare]

still you can easily abush people and pick them off one by one

[gentle tulip]

that's more so a problem with players being unaware of how healing works though rather

[civic token]

unless u plaing with a dogshit spirit(u dont need the perk anywayas) its kinda hard to utilize i think

[civic token]

work together 🤯 also 3 seconds is more than enugh time to gtfo out

as long as survivors arrent dumb and try to revive 2 dead bodies right in front of spirit u chilling

[spare glen]

Overall survivor is definitely weaker than spirit, however 3+ good survivors can turn that around (just like how it is in dbd)

[civic token]

ye i thought it meant healing a dead player not injured 💀
would be cool if it was clearer in chat when u were injured and could be healed

[gentle tulip]

like i think it could already do a lot just have a title or something if an injured player is sneaking nearby

[spare glen]

That would be helpful fr

[gentle tulip]

RC with cleanser to heal

[spring needle]

it says at top of screen + blood particles

[civic token]

also is the bug where survivor dead body timer ticks down when spirit is camping getting fixed 😔

[ocean marsh]

looking into it

[cunning hare]

i still think there should at least be a 5 sec couldown for the ability after making yourself visible

[gentle tulip]

btw is it intentional

[civic token]

i am blind(other players are probably more blind than me)
i turn particles down tho

[gentle tulip]

that the game ends if everyone is downed even though revival can still happen through perks

[civic token]

i mean it takes a couple seconds to go invis again anyways
its bad for people who dont know the game beforehand tho

[ocean marsh]

yes

otherwise, the game would be dragged on since the spirit could still just camp those people

[cunning hare]

it takes like half a sec to go invis

[civic token]

o
errhh 3 second to uncloak

[spare glen]

It’s about 3s in dbd and I think it’s fair, but I definitely don’t understand why the invis killer can break barricades while being invis, shouldn’t be allowed to do so

[gentle tulip]

i've had 2 scenarios where survivors could have pulled something off because far apart and reviving at the same time

[ocean marsh]

planned wanderer changes:

• can no longer damage spirit wells while cloaked
• breaking a blockade takes ~40% longer while cloaked
• there's a cooldown on recloaking after you've uncloaked

[gentle tulip]

but i guess in general it's pretty much game over

[civic token]

yipee

[gentle tulip]

feels a little frustrating but oh well.

[ocean marsh]

yea theres a few edge cases where it could have worked out

[cunning hare]

lets go

[civic token]

i think revives are brokey enugh to work like that anyways
also would be a bit confusing to kill everyone and then game not over for ne players

[spare glen]

However keep in mind that you can see killer pov in terms of a very obvious red light, plus the dbd counterpart killer actually knocks a bell to warn players that they are uncloaking so it’s even more obvious

[gentle tulip]

btw is there any way to make dropping blockades more consistent?

sometimes they react to rc immediately sometimes it takes like 10 clicks, the hitbox feels wildly inconsistent

[ocean marsh]

uhhh

it's

that happens when youre right up against the barrier wall

and there's very little i can do to fix that

[spare glen]

That’s just Minecraft being janky (more like every interaction here has been janky so far)

[gentle tulip]

having worked similiar things, it needn't be janky.

but cahnging it now would probably be too difficult

[ocean marsh]

we don't have the exact tools you'd have in other mc plugin dev

[spare glen]

Who can deal with wynnlagTM anw lol

[gentle tulip]

yeah i am aware

[earnest wharf]

add any means necessary for maximum looping trollage

[spare glen]

Honestly given how much the gamemode has copied from dbd you can just copy more perks if you want to add new ones

[ocean marsh]

idk what this is

i'm not super interested in adding more perks

[cunning hare]

add lootruning to this gamemode

[ocean marsh]

i have a list of a few that i didnt have time for, which i might add if i feel like it

[gentle tulip]

it lets you pick up a dropped blockade and return it to an active state

[earnest wharf]

you hold E to lift the pallet back up and it takes like 5 seconds to lift

[gentle tulip]

also after taking a good look over perks

i finally remember the one i had on my mind ironwood blockade

at first i thought it was pretty cool but a lot of blockades you can just walk around
30% isn't crazy long extra time from breaking it and having to be injured to get it is kinda SADasfdsgsf

[earnest wharf]

also i feel that suprise strike shouldn't have a cd if you don't stun anything

[ocean marsh]

it doesnt

[spare glen]

It doesn’t have one if you didn’t stun

[ocean marsh]

it only activates the cooldown if you get a stun

[earnest wharf]

i had a cooldown like twice after getting out

with no stun

[ocean marsh]

well it still has the 5s timer

it doesnt activate the however long cooldown until you can survivor strike again

[spare glen]

The map is pretty small so you don’t actually have that many spots to loop

It’s hard to transit to another site most of the time

[earnest wharf]

no i mean it said "Suprise Strike is no longer on cooldown" or whatever the message is

[ocean marsh]

oh, weird

[earnest wharf]

also sometimes the jump fatigue is super weird

[ocean marsh]

i'll have to look into that. i'm sure it only runs the cooldown if it successfully stunned though, so not sure what the cause is

yeaaa jump fatigue's always gonna be weird

minecraft limitations

[spare glen]

Jump fatigue is straight up being annoying

[earnest wharf]

you'll be walking down a staircase and suddenly be hit by it and lose all momentum

[spare glen]

Especially with staircases

[ocean marsh]

it sucks cause minecraft's jump detection is absolutely awful

but we need the jump fatigue to prevent sprint jumping

[earnest wharf]

why not just apply the same anti-jump measures as when you actually jump?

[spare glen]

Because +30% speed or sth like that

[hearty heron]

Put all players in boats/on pigs (peak gameplay)

[earnest wharf]

like when you jump, it gives high jump boost (which prevents jumping) so why not just permanently give that instead of having jump fatigue

[ocean marsh]

oh

you can spam jump to go super fast

when you have that high jump height

[earnest wharf]

fair

[spare glen]

also I’m just assuming that the wynntils exploit cannot and will not be fixed lol (like how do you even prevent it other than not using the mod)

[ocean marsh]

you can opt out of it

[earnest wharf]

you can turn it off in settings in the Hades tab afaik

[ocean marsh]

and it doesnt show your loc to anyone

[hearty heron]

Disable it in settings . . .

[spare glen]

Yes I alrdy did that

[ocean marsh]

thats p much all we can do

just say to disable it

[earnest wharf]

yeah so it won't show for others. not sure if you can disable others on yours though

[hearty heron]

You can

[spare glen]

Yea I’d expect that, just can’t expect all my teammates to know that esp. if I’m playing survivor

[earnest wharf]

i wouldn't know i use the superior 1.12.2 version 😁

[hearty heron]

[cunning hare]

your balls will explode on 25th october 2027

[spare glen]

Realistically if your teammates don’t understand why they should disable wynntils map (and how to do that) they’re not gonna have time to disable that before the spirit starts x-raying and gain advantage from the map locations lol

[earnest wharf]

looking forward to it 😼

[cunning hare]

its a doubleedge sword cuz you can also see the spirit

[spare glen]

Theoretically double edge but realistically not, because this isn’t dbd and you can’t swf, hence other players won’t be able to know where the spirit is even if you know it, typing is not going to happen in a chase + the spirit is in the same party

[cunning hare]

nerf shadestepper

[cunning hare]

but you can alert other players by your action if they see that youre running away from a well if they arent brain dead they will know the spirit is coming

[spare glen]

No offence but half of the time survivor teammates are braindead / new to the gamemode

[cunning hare]

for that problem only time is a solution

[spare glen]

And that your teammates prolly don’t even know that you’re coming if they’re not aware, might be looking at somewhere else (again dbd has rlly smooth and user-friendly third-person pov, whereas in Minecraft f5 is crappy esp. when you’re physically next to a ton of blocks)

like, your pov will be zoomed in at times depending on your surroundings

[cunning hare]

there is a 3d person viev mod which is nearly identical to dbd one

[spare glen]

Lol having to use a mod to compensate for a disadvantage

[cunning hare]

skill issue

[spare glen]

Also one important difference between this gamemode and dbd is that spirits can immediately reduce survivor hp by downing them, whereas in dbd killers must carry downed survivors to hooks, during which other survivors can help take a hit to buy more time for their teammates to escape, or stunning the killer by dropping barricades on them / flashlight blind

[low wedge]

actually i'd argue rn the mod makes it harder in chase

[cunning hare]

lexnt said he wanted to add hooks but it would be too complicated

[empty valley]

wtf

[ocean marsh]

she*

[cunning hare]

sorry

[ocean marsh]

idk if i'd say i wanted to add hooks

but it was something i considered and decided not to do

[mental pelican]

too much dev time

i mean it kinda does tbh

[cunning hare]

in #🌎wynncraft

[low wedge]

probably also would make it WAY too easy to camp

[spare glen]

Not having hooks definitely made survivors somewhat worse + having 1 perk only at the beginning (some are so situational lol)

[low wedge]

i also kinda dislike how you only get to pick between 3 perks?

[spare glen]

If all your teammates are familiar with the gamemode tho 4 good survivors can still win relatively easily

[low wedge]

i'd rather have more options per choice

[cunning hare]

choosing perks in lobby would be nice

[spare glen]

I mean it’s unrealistic to make huge updates for the gamemode now, maybe for next year tho

[low wedge]

like maybe 5.
Because let's be honest, at max you're gonna have 3 perks by the end

MAYBE 4 if you are VERY hard carrying

[spare glen]

And you prolly won’t be using them 70% of the time

[low wedge]

debatable, parkour broken ankles and silent locker are used a lot xD

[spare glen]

1 full generator gives 100 points and you need 150 for a perk

[civic token]

i think theres a cap on 4
i got to 450 and dint gain anymore

[low wedge]

and you might be reviving people, you also get points for stunning

[civic token]

o wait i suck at math 3 extra

[spare glen]

So you need to solo 2 gens + loop the spirit for like a minute / revive 2 teammates to have 3 perks

[civic token]

i think completing a well gives points as well

[ocean marsh]

an intentional decision for the game was to not have any meta progression outside of the game

[spare glen]

Honestly if you’re doing that you’re alrdy hard carrying

[ocean marsh]

yea completing a well gives like +25 to everyone nearby i think

[low wedge]

eh i will be honest, i've done it just by annoying the killer a lot.

[spare glen]

I think it’s more like certain perks are underwhelming

[ocean marsh]

mm strange. there shouldnt be anything stopping you

[ocean marsh]

if you have a list id be glad to take a look at them

[low wedge]

i'd say have more perks available at the start though

[spare glen]

Bad killer (I’ll take those anytime tho)

[ocean marsh]

hm

5 perk options in your initial selection could be good

ill consider that

[civic token]

im like 90% i didnt gain anymroe after 450 but i havent carried that hard since then so ill try to replicate eventually

[low wedge]

nah, it's just the hitboxes are weird.

[spare glen]

Very annoying combined with lag

[low wedge]

so jumping makes it hard to hit, combined that with being inconsistent with barricades and you become an unpredictable menace

[spare glen]

They don’t even know how to do 360 yet my hits can miss 3-5 times in a row due to freezes

[low wedge]

because the killer has to make the choice to risk the barricade or take a slightly weirder path in some cases.

[spare glen]

The path is usually better

[low wedge]

nah, because the issue is it gives the survivour chance to backtrack

[spare glen]

Because the maps aren’t very big, spending time to destroy barricades is usually not worth it unless it’s the important ones

[low wedge]

you'd actually be surprised with the bunker

some barricades can COMPLETELY cut you off, like a decent amount do that.

[spare glen]

Both maps feel small to me, but I’m comparing with dbd so yea

[spare glen]

If more players start getting better and stop panic dropping planks in advance it’ll be harder for spirits

[low wedge]

they are, but bunker's case a barricade can pretty much mean you are not catching that person unless they get lost

[spare glen]

For now, ppl are still panicking

[low wedge]

yeah panic dropping causes so many problems.

[spare glen]

Also I don’t have confidence in stunning spirits due to lag

[low wedge]

i've found it's VERY lenient on it

[spare glen]

Hit box is huge tho so yea

[low wedge]

like not stupid lenient but you got enough time to do it lenient

[ocean marsh]

blockade stun hitbox is big because it's kind of hard to pull off without getting hit

[spare glen]

When the music stops playing smoothly you know you’re fked

[low wedge]

yeah that heartbeat stopping then going at 50 times speed tells me "oh no"

[hearty heron]

What 360?

[low wedge]

I honestly think any speed 3 skill and silent locker is a dangerous combo though

because it just means the killer now has to check EVERY locker you might of gone in after the trail ends.

[ocean marsh]

i might need to raise the cooldown on some of the speed perks

[low wedge]

Parkour is fine i will say

actually scratch that, parkour should be higher

i'll check the cooldowns now but parkour should have a higher cooldown than the other 2 due to the ease to use

[ocean marsh]

its 60 rn

[spare glen]

It refers to a survivor trying to spin in a circle in quick succession when they predict that the killer is going to launch the melee hit. Because of melee hits having relatively narrow register, a quick spin might allow you to dodge the melee hit. It’s a dbd thingy and it’s not exactly easy to pull off here in this game mode

[ocean marsh]

might bump that to 90

[low wedge]

yeah was thinking 90

[cunning hare]

i think 75 would be better

[low wedge]

because parkour's so easy to use

[spare glen]

Speed 3 is pretty good

[low wedge]

speed 3 is less the issue and it's more, the lack of difficulty in some cases

[spare glen]

That and injured soldier or whatever that gives you 5 lives + self-revive

[ocean marsh]

lone soldier is very funny

[civic token]

good if teamates r ass

[low wedge]

i just dislike lone soldier since i dont want to be a permanent 1 hit

[ocean marsh]

entirely fair

[spare glen]

Because most players don’t heal others, 5hp is very rewarding

[ocean marsh]

it's not for everyone

but it's funny and solid enough

[civic token]

do u have 2 revives or wha

[ocean marsh]

you can auto revive 30s after being dropped

[low wedge]

side note does fight and flight have a cooldown?

[ocean marsh]

uhh

[low wedge]

or is that use whenever you want?

[ocean marsh]

looks like no

[civic token]

yeah but can u do it infinitley/5 times or is there a limtied amnt of times u cna use it

[ocean marsh]

well

you can only be in grave state 4 times

[low wedge]

i assumed it was use until you actual die

[spare glen]

The last one you just die

[cunning hare]

if spirit isnt brain dead it wont fall for this trick twice

[civic token]

oki i thought it was liek the other revive one and could onl ybe used lmited numebr of times
am a bit goofy

[spare glen]

So 4 in total, realistically tho if you’re down it’s entirely possible that your other teammates won’t save you

[low wedge]

tbf, it might not remember who actually has the perk

[ocean marsh]

yea no lone soldier has no limit on revives besides how often you get dropped

[civic token]

it shows u ave 5 hp in chat tho

[ocean marsh]

not done yet is 1 use\

indeed

[low wedge]

and i will be honest, there have been times i've just hid around a corner and flipped it in front of their face.

[ocean marsh]

lone soldier is. it makes you permanently injured (so 1 hit from spirit and you drop)

but in exchange you get +2 max health (5 total)

and you can revive yourself

[spare glen]

Just get good (fr)

and lone soldier will be rewarding

If you’re not confident with looping the spirit lone soldier is prolly not as good

[cunning hare]

lone soldier is high risk high reward

[low wedge]

lone soldier alone to me sucks

[spare glen]

Countermeasure is prolly underrated but I get it everytime

[low wedge]

it's only good if you can get some perks to back it up

Countermeasure I like solely because it means I can adapt on the fly.

[spare glen]

Yea esp. when I’m not that familiar with the maps still

[low wedge]

If I'm using various locker/barricade perks it basically means I have a lot more control than the spirit most of the time

silent locker is REALLY good, especially in bunker

[cunning hare]

lone soldier is for people that are capable of dogging the spirit while not reallying on teamates

[spare glen]

Locker is better in this gamemode despite them simply being how they are in dbd because spirits take 2-3 seconds to search

In dbd it’s like less than a second to search

If you have surprised strike it’s a guarantee stun

[low wedge]

yeah fair. and surprised strike is just fun to use

tactical retreat can also be REALLY good with other perks

[spare glen]

The kind of teammates I want every game

[cunning hare]

mentally destroying killer is always fun

[low wedge]

tactical retreat and blood rush are basically a way to say to the killer "not allowed to kill me"

[spare glen]

If the killer is good tho killer wins most of the time on the graveyard map

[low wedge]

imagine you had a friend with healing streak as well

[spare glen]

Because it’s easy to patrol once 3/5 wells are finished

[cunning hare]

also many barricades there dont make sense

[spare glen]

That map is not as limiting as bunker and it’s easy to patrol between 3-4 gens

[low wedge]

i'd say bunker is more balanced for both sides

[spare glen]

Those barricades do nothing at all lol

[low wedge]

outside of keeper. Who i feel bad for

all the barricades do is act as free speed boosts for parkour

[spare glen]

If you get the perk that is

[low wedge]

yeah

[spare glen]

Bunker is giving me “the game” dbd map vibes

[cunning hare]

there is only few barricades on graveyard that actually can stop killer for more than half a sec

[low wedge]

bunker on the other hand, most barricades become a problem for the killer

[spare glen]

You’d better off running instead of trying to loop there

[low wedge]

there's only a few that do nothing

[spare glen]

Because bunker is composed of multiple “rooms” but there are more than one barricade connecting between rooms

Usually 2-3, so destroying one doesn’t make that room easier for the killer at all

And there are like 7-8 areas in total

[cunning hare]

but the barricade inside underground passage on top

[low wedge]

i also enjoy the double locker area next to ladder

[cunning hare]

but it rarely spawns there

[low wedge]

like, no killer searches those lockers because it's so out of sight.

[spare glen]

People usually ignore that lmao which I’m happy about

[low wedge]

it's out of their main vision both ways xD

me and someone else kept jumping in and out of those lockers and somehow never got caught

[spare glen]

Prolly deaf

[low wedge]

nah we both had silent

[spare glen]

Sound cue is important in dbd but it’s prolly not being valued as much here

[low wedge]

it was just funny cause we'd stop our trails before getting there

[spare glen]

I mean

Black particles are how trails look here versus bloody footsteps in dbd

If they change footstep particles to bright red it could be a lot more different

[low wedge]

Yeah, i will say though the killer did always find our trails, they never worked out where we went though since we could of gone ahead or in to the room

and since the room isn't exactly obvious, we'd watch them run past. Either way, fun to just sneak in to lockers

[spare glen]

The lockers here taking so much time to search thru is actually significant

[low wedge]

makes it actually balanced

[hearty heron]

Btw do you guys play with normal lighting? I had wynntils gammabright on for most games before i realized it and it does seem a bit more balanced without

[low wedge]

i will say one funny trick to do though, hit it with your weapon.

if you hit the locker with your weapon the person normally jumps out thinking you're about to search