urban berry
Right now Arcanist is worse than Riftwalker in every way, except crowd control. Here are my suggestions.
Add heal back to Mana Transfer: Make it proportional to stored mana so people can't spam it.
Improve psychokinesis hitbox: It's still inconsistent.
boreal dew
idk about having heal on heal still, maybe some sort of upgrade to heal? Like mana spent will heal you
velvet schooner
I think giving Arcanist heal would kind of just defeat the whole point about what makes the archetype unique
urban berry
Mana bank and subsequent upgrades already significantly prohibit abuse of heal.
boreal dew
How??
I think healing is fine just it should be done a different way that fits arcanists theme
hitting spells heals you for 5% of damage done or somethin?
Only 1 heal per spell tho or maybe a super short cd to stop abuse
tulip crater
Playing as arcanist does not need heal
Why do people get this weird idea it sucks without heal? Sustain is fine to build with regen/lifesteal especially once mana bank is over 100 you dont have to worry about mana stats as much.
Riftwalker definitely needs a cc nerf but the only way i could possibly argue arcanist gets buffed is in the single mob fights where theres 0 minions to work off so mana bank isnt as dependable.
hardy wing
if arcanist could heal i would be playing it but it cant and i love my heal so E
hasty vigil
arcanist is pretty good tho ngl
and yeah no heal just means its like any other class
tight tartan
I believe arcane overflow should be replaced with something a little more important. I mean it’s the last red skill in arcanist tree, and all it does is let mana overflow above the max.
I think replacing overflow with something else or making it a yellow ability instead of a red might fix it, it doesn’t seem all that important. At least certainly not compared to tlock for rwalker
Since arcanist is like a worse version of riftwalker w/o a heal, I think it should have something to make it have higher dps or give some passive that increases dmg per mana used or smth like that to make it more worth it to play
I don’t think arcanist should have heal bc it kinda defeats the concept but it needs something to make it much more individual and fun to play, prolly changing overflow to something better would be my suggestion
hasty vigil
Since arcanist is like a worse version of riftwalker w/o a heal, I think it shou...
thats like the first one you get
like +2% spell damage per x mr or smth
to some cap
gray pumice
I think it would be cool to give arcanist an ultimate ability where it uses all the mana in its mana bar from overflow to cast one powerful spell with damage based off mana spent
that would also give a use for all the mana accumulated by overflow
tulip crater
Could just nerf riftwalker aoe
Make it a Laser archetype. Deadly only to whatever is directly front of it
tight tartan
like +2% spell damage per x mr or smth
Actually the thing you’re talking about gives mr depending on sp dmg, I was talking about the opposite. Since arcanist’s whole gimmick is spellspam, my suggestion was the more spells cast in a short amount of time deals more dps
tulip crater
Riftwalker should be a laser and arcanist should be the class that you'd go for nuking an area
hasty vigil
so true
tight tartan
I agree
Arcanist is focused on spellspam and rn it’s more like 1.20 mage with infinite mana, which is useful but pales in comparison to riftwalker
silver plover
Give arcanist glock
tulip crater
The comparison to riftwalker is a bad idea since hes still broken with timelock
golden flume
I'm suffering being an arcanist, joining a party finder queue is so hard cz ppl just don't wanna play with a class that doesn't heal or provide the amount of dmg output that other spammy classes does
The idea of having a big spell when try to use mana trasfer when u hv 90% + of the max mana possible with arcane overflow is nice, and also increasing dmg of every spell u cast in succession is nice too
topaz sand
I like the whole concept of an archetype not having heal, it really makes it feel like a unique archetype. Health sustainability could be added to something else in the archetype, like for instance spelldamage to lifesteal conversion ability, or something else related to spell
tulip crater
i like the idea of just giving arcanist the lifesteal conversion thing
really helps with arcanist since lifesteal on mage is really good due to how much it can stack per hit compared to every other class
willow pilot
Seance exists or whatever it was called
life steal > spell damage conversion
pretty cool on monster/quetz
but yeah i dont think readding a heal ability anywhere in arcanist is the way it should be buffed since thats kinda the point of the trade-off
wary flame
they should probably should add an abilty where you can have multiple burning sigils at once, like 2-3 at a time
but you can't stack them in the same spot
maiden pine
arcanist suggestions
hasty vigil
arcanist admittedly isnt that glassy as is
wary flame
arcanist admittedly isnt that glassy as is
fun fact: winded increases ehp for riftwalker
hasty vigil
random but neat
wary flame
arcanist suggestions
1. arcane overflow: gives minor overflow health as well to ...
personally i think that it shouldn't be more meteors, but more damage per meteor
arcanist should be burst damage, not continual damage
maiden pine
not rlly
mana bank is supposed to allow u to do continuous spellspam
chaos explosion too
hasty vigil
which you admittedly can
even without mana bank somewhat
mana bank just lets you cast like 7 meteors in a row instead of spell cycling
wary flame
what's going to happen to arcane transfer if pyrokinesis is meteors instead
tulip crater
life steal > spell damage conversion
Isnt seance shaman
topaz sand
i dont think arcanist should get heal back, because thats what makes the archetype unique
if anything, it should have some other form of health sustain
willow pilot
i dont think it should get any abilities that provide healing
but more abilities that encourage building sustain would be neat
tulip crater
arcanist yeah just should encourage sustain at the most
heal it does not need at all
topaz sand
Maybe the spell to lifesteal conversion should be buffed
candid trail
^
arcanist imo should like be a lot of ls abuse
instead of heal spell
what arcanist needs is a damage buff, that block winded bu maybe some kind of damage scaling involving mana bank
i say block winded as i feel like that would become insanly op real fast with winded
topaz sand
I think the reason arcanist feels weak is because when you hey low on health, you think "if I were a riftwalker right now, I could just heal"
hasty vigil
I think the reason arcanist feels weak is because when you hey low on health, yo...
admittedly that logic works with archer warrior assassin and not really shaman
topaz sand
admittedly that logic works with archer warrior assassin and not really shaman
No not at all
Its because you feel weak when playing the class which is known for healing, but without heal
maiden pine
i dont think arcanist should get heal back, because thats what makes the archety...
not heal, overheal, overheal basically gives u bonus health so that once thats gone you are still left vulnarable, it can even have a cooldown
tulip crater
Maybe the spell to lifesteal conversion should be buffed
i just checked it's not spell to lifesteal
it's lifesteal to spell, so it kinda sucks
willow pilot
life steal > spell damage conversion
i said that initially
tulip crater
yeah imo the conversion should be reversed so arcanist gets rewarded for focussing on the stat it should be
(which imo is dumb with some of the other classes where this one random stat converts to an actually useful stat)
also arcanist is TECHNICALLY a glass cannon, not the best defences at the benefit of you get consistent high damage.
I'd say arcanists biggest issue rn is it gets punished heavily in any fight that doesn't have large amounts of minions
candid trail
^
tulip crater
Hashr Theorick and slykaar are 3 bosses I can think of where the player gets slapped in the face (slykaar's case you get minions very temporarily meaning you get SOME freedom with mana but not enough)
But the arcanist will just not have consistent mana unless they built sustain which at that point ruins the point of the archetype.
good example of this is probably when i did slykaar today, and i was forced to used the pyrokinesis mainly for mana bank since i had 0 way of getting a reasonable amount of mana in the bank.
Which just isn't good. It basically means the player has to go purely melee just to make sure they don't run out of mana (this is talking about midgame btw, e.g before spell costs are reasonable)
gleaming spade
It needs more damage, not a heal, Arcanist is supposed to be a glass canon, no heal makes it glassy
wary flame
bump
tight tartan
Yeah I feel like arcanist needs a damage buff, since it has no heal that’s a major drawback and it seems like it’s supposed to be a glass cannon so a dmg buff would achieve this
daring pecan
Arcanist needs a base defense buff
I frel like the timelock from riftealkrr would work better on arcanist
If u just increase the duration and change when it proca
tight tartan
I kinda think overflow is boring. I mean it’s useful and all, but it might make more sense as a minor ability in the ability tree and instead have something useful and that brings more dps and versatility to arcanist
light lichen
I play a ton of arcanist, and honestly the only change I think would be needed is to combine larger mana bank 1 and 2, and add stronger meteor 2
I like the identity of the class, and when soloing TNA, the arcane overflow is incredibly clutch when used with manastorm
tight tartan
That’s a good idea, meteor dmg increase to make it more viable
willow pilot
after playing arcanist in LI a few times i can say that it does feel like it could use a bit more damage yeah
definitely didnt have a terrible damage output but it could use more
tulip crater
Doing a playthrough and rn my biggest issue is mana
Like danage is fine but the mana bank has some situations where you're just not gonna be building it enough to use well
tulip crater
here's the thing though
which REALLY needs pointing out. Thunderstorm doesn't change that much. It's still gonna be hell even with it if there's not enough mobs in close proximity to each other
all it does is make the struggle a TINY bit less annoying. Mana's a still major issue if there's not enough mobs
final fox
A little more damage wouldn't be bad
Well, I do say "little", but I don't mean 10% increase to Stronger Meteor neutral little
Perhaps, but I can't see this happening, a little more mobility
Something like a cooldown decrease to Arcane Speed, idk
candid trail
BUFF ARCANIST!!!
wary flame
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
daring pecan
all it does is make the struggle a TINY bit less annoying. Mana's a still major ...
Bruh
Mana is fine.... just hit the mobs
Test it on a dummy... its hard to run out of mana
tulip crater
i am talking when it's literally 1 or 2 mobs.
final fox
Manastorm is very nice to have
tulip crater
also im not endgame. i'm literally midgame rn
daring pecan
i am talking when it's literally 1 or 2 mobs.
Trainig dummy is one mob
daring pecan
also im not endgame. i'm literally midgame rn
Ah that makes sense
final fox
Ah right, midgame prob doesn't have it
daring pecan
Idk i dont rly expect to have full sustain at midgame
tulip crater
the issue is more you either build sustain basically ruining the point of arcanist
daring pecan
the issue is more you either build sustain basically ruining the point of arcani...
Not rly
tulip crater
or you don't build sustain and you just end up in that issue of spamming melee in the hope to get some mana back
daring pecan
U get mana per mana spent
tulip crater
you don't
daring pecan
Havent olayed mage much cus its kinda not my thing but man j was usibg like morph
With bad mana regen and sustaining fine
tulip crater
you get 5 mana per mob hit. Meaning midgame you have to hit 8 or 9 mobs in 1 single hit to equal the cost
daring pecan
Why dont u get lvl 104 first..
tulip crater
which is great in those situations the mobs are there
daring pecan
you get 5 mana per mob hit. Meaning midgame you have to hit 8 or 9 mobs in 1 sin...
Ur mana bank? U cast heal with 120 mana
Then u get like 5 free spells which count towards mana bank themselves
So tha another what 130 mana
tulip crater
yeah but again that's midgame. (actually level 60ish to be exact)
wary flame
mana is pretty easy to get honestly
daring pecan
+whaat spells ur using urself
tulip crater
and this is all working on the basis the mobs are there
wary flame
aand i think that arcanist is an endgame archtype
daring pecan
yeah but again that's midgame. (actually level 60ish to be exact)
Bro ur midgame exactly
tulip crater
mana is pretty easy to get honestly
hordes yes but dungeons not so much
wary flame
hordes yes but dungeons not so much
bro what build are you using 💀
daring pecan
bro what build are you using 💀
Hes lvl 60
tulip crater
bro what build are you using 💀
mixture of exp and spell damage.
daring pecan
Ive never had full sustain on any lvl 60 class
hasty vigil
hordes yes but dungeons not so much
dungeons seem to have hordes in my experience
tulip crater
dungeons seem to have hordes in my experience
boss fights not so much
wary flame
even level 60s can have mr sus
daring pecan
Well shaman kinda
hasty vigil
except bossfights, altho ig cib is there
hasty vigil
boss fights not so much
thank goodness the majority of dungeons arent bossfights 
daring pecan
even level 60s can have mr sus
Ok maybe i suck then
tulip crater
thank goodness the majority of dungeons arent bossfights <:saltroll:827620910391...
they kinda are.
hasty vigil
uh
wary flame
Ok maybe i suck then
never completely full over the top mr sustain, just enough to keep you moving
tulip crater
I noticed with GG mostly that meteor for mana bank just kinda becomes... shit?
hasty vigil
you have 2 token collect rooms a parkour room and a bossfight
daring pecan
I noticed with GG mostly that meteor for mana bank just kinda becomes... shit?
Do u have thinderstorm?
U get like 5x more mana back with thindersotrm
tulip crater
thunderstorm isn't as good as people make it out to be i'll be honest
hasty vigil
the bossfight is way shorter than both token segments in a lot of places
yeah thunderstorm is annoying i never really get it
tulip crater
you don't, i've only ever got back 10 mana with it.
final fox
Test it on any enemy that moves faster than a statue
wary flame
you don't, i've only ever got back 10 mana with it.
try using riftwalker for midgame and then see about arcanist in endgame
tulip crater
i can say for certainty thunderstorm was so random in how it acted I could never predict it
daring pecan
Test it on any enemy that moves faster than a statue
Start with a dummy
To see the potential
final fox
Start with a dummy
Why would I start with an immobile enemy
tulip crater
try using riftwalker for midgame and then see about arcanist in endgame
SHOULDN'T HAVE TO DO THAT
daring pecan
Why would I start with an immobile enemy
So you understand that it works?
hasty vigil
SHOULDN'T HAVE TO DO THAT
yeah thats what i say when people say you can only talk about classes if you have them at level 100+
final fox
So you understand that it works?
?
hasty vigil
they still say it anyway
daring pecan
Man if u take away pschokinesis, thunderstorm js EASIER to hit than meteor
tulip crater
@hasty vigil basically sometimes thunderstorm would cast and sometimes you could tell me it never actually casted because it just didn't
wary flame
SHOULDN'T HAVE TO DO THAT
mhhh it already says this
hasty vigil
high damage
tulip crater
those bars are just false so often
hasty vigil
so true
wary flame
those bars are just false so often
not really
tulip crater
yes really.
hasty vigil
its at least somewhat accurate tho
wary flame
well sometimes i guess
daring pecan
<@729772481547862057> basically sometimes thunderstorm would cast and sometimes...
Hit the floor under the mob not their head
hasty vigil
its in the general region of accuracy
wary flame
but def not for arcanist imo
tulip crater
Hit the floor under the mob not their head
which i've been doing.
hasty vigil
paladin is probably marked as easy and shadestepper is probably marked as hard
paladin is probably easier than shadestepper
daring pecan
which i've been doing.
Like i said, test it on a dummy. It works. Turn up ur particles that might help. Try moving around and hitting the dummy until u get it
tulip crater
if psychokinesis is causing issues i'd gladly sacrifice thunderstorm because psycho is so much better
daring pecan
if psychokinesis is causing issues i'd gladly sacrifice thunderstorm because psy...
Its not
tulip crater
it is.
I can hit that consistently.
daring pecan
Because psycho is fat
tulip crater
the only time i can't is if the mob's annoyingly mobile.
daring pecan
Thunderstorm is like 1 block
hasty vigil
boltslinger is probably marke- its probably marked medium or hard honestly despite it being the easiest archetype ive played
but like it should be marked easy and trickster hard as an example
final fox
The massive range increase Psychokinesis gives makes it a neat spell to use against Greg, especially with Entropy
tulip crater
Thunderstorm is like 1 block
yes and? I'll be honest here psycho is just fun to use and actually less annoying than thunder
hasty vigil
yes and? I'll be honest here psycho is just fun to use and actually less annoyin...
you are the one disliking thunderstorm wtf they are agreeing with you
daring pecan
yes and? I'll be honest here psycho is just fun to use and actually less annoyin...
Tou can get both
hasty vigil
psychokinesis is hype tho ngl
daring pecan
I only mentioned psycho to tell you it isnt hard to hit thinderstorm
tulip crater
i have both
daring pecan
Nice
tulip crater
thunder just has seemed to be so unnoticed
daring pecan
Keep paycho if you like it
final fox
Oh, you guys use Thunderstorm?
daring pecan
thunder just has seemed to be so unnoticed
Hmm.. might be harder to hit farther mobs with meteror and thinder
tulip crater
tried to but eh.
daring pecan
Oh, you guys use Thunderstorm?
Pro mana gamers
hasty vigil
Oh, you guys use Thunderstorm?
i did when i used riftwalker for blink
tulip crater
Anyway arcanist has a lot of mana issues the moment it comes to some of the boss fights
some it's completely fine since mana is just plentiful
daring pecan
Anyway arcanist has a lot of mana issues the moment it comes to some of the boss...
Try getting a party that uses thr wall strategy
tulip crater
not talking about tna
daring pecan
O
daring pecan
Hmm maybe some li bosses. Other than that i cant think of many mobs u have to be that far from
tulip crater
it's more just bosses are on their own or you dont have a good mana source.
IB the main issue comes down to tp spam is a fucking pain no one likes.
UR has temporary hordes. Which works but also means sometimes you will have 0 ways of mana outside of slykaar.
GG the mobs are VERY split apart.
Best case scenario you can kinda get redbeard next to one of the minions but i believe they're all ranged?
arcanist is great for damage midgame but the moment you have to do any none horde content it gets more frustrating than fun due to how slow it can be.
compact epoch
Arcanist needs defenses but not heal
tulip crater
it needs an option for when hordes are just not there. And maybe yeah some kind of defence
compact epoch
Arcane shields anyone
daring pecan
it needs an option for when hordes are just not there. And maybe yeah some kind ...
Man get to lvl 104.. ur missing half the upgrades
final fox
Ur missing the entire point
daring pecan
Do u even have the one that recasts ur spells?
tulip crater
Man get to lvl 104.. ur missing half the upgrades
here's the thing. The archetype should be fucking fun to level
daring pecan
Ur missing the entire point
What that he could have double the mana?
daring pecan
here's the thing. The archetype should be fucking fun to level
On my warrior and assassin playthroighs i had to use melee 60% of the time too
I dont remember archer(was pre 2.0 anyways)
final fox
What that he could have double the mana?
No, that archetypes shouldn't be locked to endgame, and if a player chooses to start their game with that archetype they won't suffer
daring pecan
Idk rn on my lvl 60 warrior i can use like 5 spells before i need to melee
tulip crater
yes same with mage, just gets kinda frustrating when you're also on an archetype that relies on hordes, and you're not in a horde.
final fox
Acrobat?
tulip crater
4 or 5,
tulip crater
yes, but it's getting mana back that's the issue.
tulip crater
nah too late for me now
and i prefer soloing because gives me a balanced view on if i like or dislike a class/archetype
(why i've found i dislike archer)
daring pecan
Archer on top wdf
tulip crater
i just don't like the archetypes that much
daring pecan
I agree boltslinger bad
tulip crater
sharpshooter i wanted to like but the game doesn't support twains arc enough for me to care.
and trapper is just... eh
great abilities but i dislike the archetype
final fox
I wonder what would a full heavy melee playthrough with Sharpshooter be like
daring pecan
I wonder what would a full heavy melee playthrough with Sharpshooter be like
Theres a video of this soloing li
Looks pretty tank but boring
final fox
Theres a video of this soloing li
They should have recorded themselves leveling up from 0 for the video to have any relevance to what I said
But
Endgame heavy melee sharpshooter is very good, that I can't disagree with
daring pecan
I wonder what would a full heavy melee playthrough with Sharpshooter be like
Ah i didnt read that part
Idk i kinda dont like thr idea of “sticking to an archetype”
Like it kinda makes sense if you had to go with a certain one
But rn like i have 3 4 3 or smth
tulip crater
It should be an option. Especially since new players will go with the looks most entertaining one
daring pecan
Do they? Id call myself a “new player” TO the 2.0 update when it first came out
I doubt anybody thoight it would be a good idea to just follow one archetype all thr way through
tulip crater
They'd normally do that then experiment at the end
Or go with the fun looking abilities from the get go
But commiting to an archetype should be fine. And not boring to play
daring pecan
Ehh ig
golden flume
i mean the problem with arcanist rn is that the trade of for having no heals is not worth it, it needed more ways to be impactful with its spells, to rival the dmg other classes can deal
imo
compact epoch
It would also be cool (besides arcane shields) if arcanist had a different damage spell that wasn’t literally meteor spam
gray pumice
maybe an upgrade/overhaul to ice snake that makes it do much more damage but adds mana cost?
wary flame
i just want arcanist damage to be a thing
gleaming spade
i am talking when it's literally 1 or 2 mobs.
I had a basic int build and I had better sustain than 1.20
Mana is not in fact an issue
topaz sand
It would also be cool (besides arcane shields) if arcanist had a different damag...
Yea ice snake could be changes a little
It's very weird to see that in other classes 4th spell became the special ability activation spell but for mage it just stayed the same
tulip crater
I had a basic int build and I had better sustain than 1.20
Not endgame. Im levelling arcanist rn
I can easily see endgame not having mana issues at all. But some longer boss fights are just annoying
azure dove
dont buff it i dont play it so it doesnt matter
tulip crater
Yea ice snake could be changes a little
Ice snake coukd do with interesting upgrades
granite salmon
Rn ice snake is pretty boring, would like to have an upgrade to change it or add cool things to it
brittle dagger
what if ice snake could become a flamethrower 👀
tulip crater
ice snake has 3 actual upgrades
(i refuse to count the winded thing)
Sentient snake and triple snake and the freezing thing
that is it. and is not really good for it
brittle dagger
yes so isntead turn it into a flaming beam
willow pilot
giving ice snake multi-hitting capabilities could be cool as an arcanist upgrade so ice snake gets further reinforced as a utility spell that can be used to fill up mana bank
and by multi-hitting i dont mean the multihit spell i mean literally just the capability to damage something multiple times consecutively
tight tartan
I agree, turning ice snake into a multi hit flamethrower beam would be very cool and make the class a lot more versatile
However having mana bank proc on every hit of it might be unbalanced
Probably depends on how much mana it would cost and how many times it would hit the target
light lichen
Honestly when you do a thunderstorm dip, the mana feels fine to me. I’m okay with arcanist’s weak point being single target mobile mobs. Rather just see a buff to meteor damage, or an upgrade where ice snake applies a brittle affect making either the next X spells to hit deal more damage, or the mob takes more damage for X seconds
upbeat plover
It's very weird to see that in other classes 4th spell became the special abilit...
Agree, my primary issue with arcanist is that.. its kinda one-note? you lose an ability (heal) for one that basically makes you spam your other 3 abilities more, only one of which does good damage
topaz sand
arcanist is just spam meteor and then ice snake to rest costs and occasionally heal for mana
i would like to see a more unique
ability
upbeat plover
yeah
Kinda also feel like Chaos Explosion could be reworked to be something other than repeating your last spells, perhaps instead it could make your next cast an empowered/different version of the spell
Would add another layer to combat at least, but probably too big scope wise
brittle dagger
the dissapointing factor in arcanist to me is that you loose your heal for presumably more dps
but going riftwalker /rift bender is more dps and you have heal
wary flame
i'd like to see the ability of lightbender that damages when you heal when you use arcane transfer
upbeat plover
Kinda also feel like Chaos Explosion could be reworked to be something other tha...
Something like this could also be used to bring heal back, for example if Chaos Explosion was reworked and caused your next ability to be empowered, casting Arcane Transfer again (as your empowered ability) could heal you. It'd limit Arcanists healing a lot but still have it there as potential option with a trade-off (not getting empowered meteor/ice snake)
topaz sand
However having mana bank proc on every hit of it might be unbalanced
we do a little trolling
lavish remnant
oops too many threads but tweaking arcanist is already something we're looking at
I think I mentioned it in class builds or something but it's hard to get info everywhere
topaz sand
thats very good
light lichen
@lavish remnant I play only arcanist. Just arcanist. I’ve beaten TNA 40+ times with arcanist only and I’m begging to not add healing back. I like that I can build super defensively because my mana issues are taken care of by the class itself. All I would personally want to see is a buff to meteor damage, other than that the class is perfect as is
topaz sand
yeah the issue i had with arcanist when doing TNA is just that meteor damage is so low
it took ages to kill the soul shrubs
lavish remnant
<@748759966437081138> I play only arcanist. Just arcanist. I’ve beaten TNA 40+ t...
in no universe was the buff arcanist plan re-adding heal
it's just attempting to raise damage a little so it's at least competitive with riftwalker early in it's ramp, as well as make the gameplay a little more variable if the player wants
brittle dagger
it took ages to kill the soul shrubs
yeah and then you have a 60k ehp rift bender build that has good heals and murders shrubs in seconds
arcanist rly needs a dmg buff
wary flame
oops too many threads but tweaking arcanist is already something we're looking a...
omgholycrap
light lichen
it's just attempting to raise damage a little so it's at least competitive with ...
Oh thank god that's perfect
Thank you so much, I just see all these people begging for heal back and I get scared haha
upbeat plover
it's just attempting to raise damage a little so it's at least competitive with ...
tbf didnt expect heal but glad you guys are looking at the archetype, especially playstyle variability <3
tough crane
it's just attempting to raise damage a little so it's at least competitive with ...
tyty tyty
maiden pine
Arcane shields anyone
I was thinking overheal
compact epoch
Yeah
A shield
It would be perfect because it's still defense, but it doesn't actually restore your health
maiden pine
yep
compact epoch
And you can just gain shields when arcane transferring with enough mana or something
hasty vigil
interesting idea
topaz sand
I like the idea of ice snake doing something
hasty vigil
like 10 mana transferred = 1 absorption hp but maybe thats too little
hasty vigil
I like the idea of ice snake doing something
mana bank moment
hasty vigil
like 10 mana transferred = 1 absorption hp but maybe thats too little
1:1 i feel like would be too much but idk ig its only 150 absorption hp
topaz sand
like 10 mana transferred = 1 absorption hp but maybe thats too little
it could probably give like 10-20 per
maybe more
hasty vigil
as in like
compact epoch
No, don't make it raw-based
topaz sand
mana bank moment
meteor giving 35 mana per meteor if you take thunderbolts:
compact epoch
It can just be %-based
hasty vigil
150 mana transferred = 1500
hasty vigil
yeah but that requires you to think about an idea
maiden pine
And you can just gain shields when arcane transferring with enough mana or somet...
what if you overheal a small % of health you would've healed normally but it instead gives you bonus health when using arcane overflow
this way your main health doesnt get healed and if u try and use pot while having bonus health you immediately loose it when switching off the weapon
compact epoch
what if you overheal a small % of health you would've healed normally but it ins...
How would that work exactly
I do not compute
maiden pine
arcane overflow gives you 15x mana stored in mana bank as raw health but you loose it over time and if you unequip your weapon you loose it instantly
compact epoch
Yeah and health of all things too
brittle dagger
Just give arcanist dmg 😭 isn't the whole idea of arcanist to dish out damage at the cost of no healing/defensive capabilities
hasty vigil
so true
just keep arcanist as is but buff damage
the concept is fine
its like shadestepper
playstyle is fine, just not worth it damage wise
maiden pine
losing stuff when you unequip weapon is a terrible mechanic
this is to avoid using overheal as a backup plan to use pots to heal while the enemies dmg ur extra hp
topaz sand
guys i think we should swap all riftwalker and arcanist abilities (arcanist does damage now)
maiden pine
u can remove the unequip and reduce the hp given by 10x the mana stored in your mana bank
hasty vigil
just keep arcanist as is but buff damage
the concept is fine
or ponr that quest would be great if it worked and wasnt buggy
wary flame
And you can just gain shields when arcane transferring with enough mana or somet...
me thinking of dreamshield
compact epoch
What is that
wary flame
a shield that blocks all projectiles in hollow knight and spins around you (it's called a meme charm in the hk community because it doesn't do that much)
tough crane
Make it so that 1) Chaos Explosion spells don't contribute to manabank and that 2) Chaos explosion gets a damage buff
Like, a big one. Originally, my suggestion was to revalue the More Mana Bank upgrades to 40/40/50 for a final bank of 200 and that every mana above 100 contributes an extra 2-3% to the final damage value of spells in the volley
fiery cove
it's just attempting to raise damage a little so it's at least competitive with ...
do ims actually have a hand in at balancing now or are you just speaking on behalf of those who do
tough crane
so that 120 mana chaos explosions make your spells 140% - 160% as strong and that a full mana bank gives you insane damage (up to quadruple, at +3% damage per mana)
but it takes a good bit of normal dps spellspam to build up
hasty vigil
- Chaos Explosion spells don't contribute to manabank and that
but why
thats one of the most fun parts of arcanist imo and arcanist is already bad enough
lavish remnant
do ims actually have a hand in at balancing now or are you just speaking on beha...
we have a pretty hefty amount of influence now even if it isn't the final say
fiery cove
we have a pretty hefty amount of influence now even if it isn't the final say
awesome, I am going to scream directly at YOU now
lavish remnant
but anyway with respect to this thread we've already made our proposals for arcanist
fiery cove
but anyway with respect to this thread we've already made our proposals for arca...
c…c-can I… propose to you 🥺
lavish remnant
wtf ...... you are betraying birdmade??
fiery cove
if I were I’d be betraying like 5 wynncord members
lavish remnant
True...
compact epoch
if I were I’d be betraying like 5 wynncord members
🤨
compact epoch
Explain then
fiery cove
never mind I can’t explain
compact epoch
Ok
candid trail
do you guys mind if i use the flamethrower idea in my wynnrecreation project?
tough crane
but why
thats one of the most fun parts of arcanist imo and arcanist is already ...
Completely hypothetical since they've already got an idea of what they're doing with Arcanist, but I felt that the archetype would be a bit more engaging if it could do massive chaos explosions of damage only infrequently. Removing the ability to easily chain Chaos Explosion would free the latter to have a ridiculous damage multiplier.
Sort of like shadestepper's massive satsujin bursts, only instead of being on a cooldown (where satsujin ought to be) it's built up with active gameplay
Such that the Arcanist playstyle becomes lower-damage spellcasting to build up the Manabank with an occasional massive burst of damage
That or just give Chaos Explosion (but not Arcane Transfer) a cooldown so that you can still lightly spellspam in between the nuclear explosions
weak bay
The point here is, arcanist and mage in general cannot hold up with other classes such as assassin and archer. Assassin does higher dps and has a higher base resistance. Archer does even more dps and is (at least in my opinion) superior in movement. To make arcanist or mage in general more viable, i would redesign several Abilities:
tulip crater
mage in general is one of the more balanced classes
and assassin is one of the weaker classes
gray pumice
The point here is, arcanist and mage in general cannot hold up with other classe...
I dont think mage in general was ever intended to "hold up to" other classes damage wise. the point of mage is having versatility and survivability with built in healing, and its damage is much lower as a result. just look at the base damage of wands compared to other weapons in the game. however, this doesnt really apply to arcanist in particular since it loses its heal spell as a trade off for mana sustain. like many people are saying though, the damage simply isnt good enough to justify giving up survivability. imo healing shouldn't be removed from arcanist just for it to be added back in a different form. arcanist should focus on defensive abilities to increase survivability and make up for lower base defense, like the arcane shields idea. it also definitely needs a damage boost, but multiplicative damage boosts suck for balancing if shade and sharp are any indication
brittle dagger
idk why is everyone suggesting defensive stuff for arcanist
just give it more dps and leave it vulnerable
riftwalker/lightbender alredy got defensive stuff, we dont need all 3 mage archetypes to focus on survivability
wary flame
it doesn't need a defense buff builds will account for that
what it does need is a MAJOR damage buff
weak bay
yeah
brittle dagger
yes just give us big boi dmg numbers
gray pumice
idk why is everyone suggesting defensive stuff for arcanist
because it's the only archetype without access to healing??
brittle dagger
and thats perfectly fine
gray pumice
I'm fine with it being glass cannon too I just think it would be nice qol
it absolutely needs more damage
brittle dagger
yes thats the issue here, arcanist removes heal supposedly to gain damage which im fine with me but it ends up doing moer or less same dmg as the tankier and more sustainable riftbender/riftwalker builds
gray pumice
that's what I'm saying lol
brittle dagger
fair
i only read this part "arcanist should focus on defensive abilities to increase survivability and make up for lower base defense, like the arcane shields idea" tbf xd
upbeat plover
i just want dmg and something that adds a little more variety to gameplay 🤷♂️
cuz if you give it heal like riftwalker/lightbender there is no trade-off and it breaks what arcanist is conceptually meant to be
fiery cove
main thing I’m concerned about regarding the planned arcanist damage buff to be 70% of max ramp up riftwalker is that we don’t really know if riftwalker is gonna be rebalanced and how it’s gonna compare to other classes for losing mage’s main speciality in heal
CURRENTLY, IF arcanist was 70% of max ramp up riftwalker it would still be massively outclassed by warrior archer and shaman DPS wise for both single target and AOE, and of course while some of those other specific archetypes need nerfs i feel like it might not still be viable in the end comparatively
arcanist is super fun to play and has a good tree so I just really hope it ends up being viable
upbeat plover
Does anyone else think snake nest could do with a reduction in angles/spread btw or am i the only one bothered by how far the ice snakes are apart
it does allow for some really nice curves with sentient snake but idk
brittle dagger
It doesn't rly matter unless they make the dmg of all 3 snakes stack
tough crane
If Arcanist wants to be "Mage, but DPS" then yeah it needs massive innate damage bonuses to reach that - base Mage and the Mage item pool are just not built to do damage. Snake nest is cool, but I can't help but feel like peak Arcanist is replacing Teleport and Ice Snake with even more DPS options that can be comboed into massive damage at the cost of utility
brittle dagger
i mean fatal exists
tough crane
Utility is for the other two archetypes, and such a drastic transformation would really fit the "massive damage black mage" that it advertises on the tooltip
distant dust
To add on top of all this, I think Explosive Entrance should really be on the arcanist side of the tree, and hitting mobs with it should also add mana to your mana bank. It can be a side node but it’ll give arcanist something that buffs teleport and make it so this upgrade isn’t otherwise useless
wary flame
i mean fatal exists
fatal exists but doesn't have good survivability for builds if you want damage
tough crane
'tis also a mythic, and a playstyle ought to be at the minimum viable without its mythic.
tulip crater
Ice snake just exists
Which eh. Nothing really changes about it compared to the other 3 spells
topaz sand
it absolutely needs a change
i mean the only use ice snake has is to reset meteor cost
tulip crater
I meant as in it never changed from upgrades
Like you can control it. And its triple ice snake. Thats it
topaz sand
you dont even need it for mana bank
with thunderstorm meteor can give you 35 mana bank
tulip crater
Teleport gets at least SOME interesting change with timelocked as bad as it is and explosive entrance
And also blink
Heal gets mana bank
Meteor gets psychokinesis thunderstorm
Triple ice snake makes 1.20 shaman basic attack look like a sniper with how much more spread ice snake has
And sentient we already had
Basically changing ice snake for arcanist would make both better
hasty vigil
replace ice snake following cursor with something that people actually wants and is actually good 👍
like +mana bank or +dmg
tulip crater
Give us the mob flamethrower spell
hasty vigil
those are the lamest things i could have thought of lmao
hasty vigil
replace ice snake following cursor with something that people actually wants and...
and you know whats worse?
its REQUIRED TO PROGRESS THE TREE
tulip crater
I just kinda want ice snake to be something more destructive than what it is rn
hasty vigil
IT IS A WASTE OF POINTS AND MAKES ICE SNAKE ARGUABLY WORSE
tulip crater
IT IS A WASTE OF POINTS AND MAKES ICE SNAKE ARGUABLY WORSE
It doesnt
tight tartan
I like the flamethrower idea discussed earlier
hasty vigil
i mean
tulip crater
The speed is enough you can just use it then do whatever else
hasty vigil
you cant ice snake turn around tp away with it
tight tartan
That would offer something pretty cool to make arcanist more unique
hasty vigil
because ice snake would move away
tulip crater
You can actually. Its about the same time as heal to end if i remember right?
About a second
tough crane
It would sort of yikes Ice Snake to replace it with an ice shield, but if that shield was relatively weak and mostly served as a damage boost upon breaking, that might be neat
tulip crater
There is way too many shield spells
tough crane
True
tulip crater
Giving mage a second is a bad idea
tight tartan
In my opinion I feel like arcanist doesn’t really need a shield. More like change ice snake to something unique that offers more dps
tough crane
At least in Arcanist, more attack options, yea
tulip crater
Arcanist defence wise is fine
tough crane
Maybe even teleport could change to an attack spell
tulip crater
But offensive wise. Eh its not enough
tough crane
Hurting mage mobility in exchange for massive damage
tulip crater
I agree with just moving explosive entrance to arcanist
tough crane
No, I meant more a spell replacement overall
tulip crater
Because I'll be honest. Why is it on riftwalker side?
tulip crater
Yeah just not an explosive class
tough crane
With a lightning attack (that also weakens enemies?), an ice attack (that also slows enemies), and a fire attack (hyperbuffed meteor)
hasty vigil
i mean winded
literally the only reason i play riftwalker is blink to move around places easier
tough crane
Mayhaps a lightning attack could supercharge the following one
hence the rotation would be Ice-Lightning-Fire
a more active max dps
tulip crater
If you cast a lightning on meteor the explosion is bigger xD
tough crane
Is that a higher skill ceiling I spot?
An Arcanist that trades all utility and team support for massive DPS combos is the dream
Current Arcanist seems like a less-committed version of what it could be - yes, more DPS buffs would be great, but there's a lot of potential here
tulip crater
To me i feel like it should work with burning sigil
Whatever element goes through burning sigil changes what happens to the mobs inside
Ice freezes all mobs in it for a second
Lightning jumps around like chain lightning even to mobs outside it
And fire is what we all know
tough crane
Would this burning sigil only be triggered by meteor?
tough crane
Hoh, that'd be nice
... thinking of lightning being a damage bonus to the caster, though
as long as they stand inside of it
tulip crater
Honestly part of me kinda wishes you could somehow strike meteors with lightning
And it'd increase the damage and radius.
Like creepers with lightning
tight tartan
There’s so much potential to bring awesome abilities to this class, I hope ct realizes this and they can bring some much needed creativity to it
The sigil idea is pretty cool
If ice snake was replaced with something else, the freezing sigil would definitely be a nice addition
hasty vigil
arcanist also is just really cool right now too
tight tartan
Yeah I like it now, but in these early stages of 2.0 there’s a lot of reworking that could happen to make it even better. I love arcanist and I hope the class gets some new additions
final fox
and you know whats worse?
its REQUIRED TO PROGRESS THE TREE
It's even worse for me because I use Flashfreeze 
hasty vigil
flashfreeze ❤️
final fox
Flashfreeze, Sorcery, and Entropy
A recipe for chaos.
Haven't tried to add Gravity Well yet
maiden pine
what if
replace triple snake with flame dragon: turns ice snake red and triples dmg at the cost of turning it into having 1/3rd range (locks winded)
effectively same as snake nest but actually makes ice snake worth using as secondary dmg
tough crane
I just stuck a Thread of Unusual Size into the forums with all my ideas collected into one
This discussion might be getting a bit big for Discord, so if yall wanna stick your stuff there
upbeat plover
I just stuck a Thread of Unusual Size into the forums with all my ideas collecte...
Really like the concept of Elemental Sigils, but i'm not sure how well it works in practice because Arcanist is supposed to be the longer range archetype with Psychokinesis changing how Meteor is cast and giving it a much further reach
oh nvm, i didnt see they'd appear under you, forget what i said
tulip crater
oh nvm, i didnt see they'd appear under you, forget what i said
Theyd appear around meteor blast. Currently burning sigil is just extra damage after its landed
upbeat plover
Theyd appear around meteor blast. Currently burning sigil is just extra damage a...
I was talking about hmtn's suggestion on the forums
hasty vigil
replace triple snake with flame dragon: turns ice snake red and triples dmg at t...
triple snake is actually good tho wtf
id suggest remove the ice snakes follow cursor upgrade because thats literally a downgrade you cannot avoid
brittle dagger
triple snake is the same as single snake except its 3 snakes
hasty vigil
yeah
brittle dagger
damage doesnt even triple so its meh
hasty vigil
at least it doesnt make ice snake worse tho
final fox
Triple Snake is nice to have
It doesn't do wonders in terms of damage, but if it's consistently spammed (and Arcanist is good at that), you can immobilize tons of enemies
golden flume
Yeah, but I think it is still missing that burst dmg the class is all abt
maybe changing the follow cursor to a weakened effect or smthing like that
hasty vigil
It doesn't do wonders in terms of damage, but if it's consistently spammed (and ...
also has nice radius
like aoe for mana bank hits
upbeat plover
Triple Snake would be nicer if they were closer together
I find the spread to be far too wide to realistically have any impact
Like maybe once in a while you hit some mobs on the side but its far too impractical to try and consistently do it
especially at longer distances
compact epoch
Triple snake sucks yes
tough crane
Shameless shilling, go read my Arcanist thread if you haven't already:
Ice Snake's immobilization is already a great crowd control feature, but making it the primary method of getting mana back into your bank adds another layer of usefulness to the spell
hasty vigil
I find the spread to be far too wide to realistically have any impact
yeah fair
but at least it doesnt make it worse and you can i think just not take it
its not like directly required to go down the path like cough cough some other abilities
upbeat plover
Oh yeah it doesn't make it worse but I hope it gets improved in the future
hasty vigil
idea
swap sentient snake and snake nest
sentient snake is a niche you could get it if you want but you still should imo be able to avoid getting it
snake nest is just extra mana bank and damage and otherwise nothing much
gleaming spade
triple snake is actually good tho wtf
Yea I use it on riftwalker build, its not just an Arcanist thing it just happens to be in that area
hasty vigil
the idea for it fits arcanist
and it helps arcanist w/ mana bank
but yeah otherwise ig i can see that
gleaming spade
I use it for quick winded build up on enemies
light lichen
Where arcanist damage buff 😦
brittle dagger
absolutely game changing
wary flame
welp we just gotta wait for a couple of hotfixes
light lichen
Sad : (
hardy wing
🤯
compact epoch
I can’t wait for salted to buff arcanist by like making psychokinesis give +20% meteor mult
near verge
Real
topaz sand
guys i think the buff arcanist deserves is to make each mana in the mana bank give the same damage increase as old focus
6000% multiplicative damage seems balanced
near verge
Finally, a good trade off for heal
compact epoch
But fr some arcane shields would be really nice
It would be perfect since it's still defense, but doesn't actually restore your health
compact epoch
Me when thunderstorm is quite necessary for arcanist
tight tartan
If thunderstorm would auto-target near cursor like old meteor did, that would be pretty epic
I just love missing 80% of my thunderstorms
upbeat plover
Increased Arctic Snake's freeze duration (1 -> 2s)
Heat Death in shambles
Does this mean 3 sec freeze with it? poggers
brittle dagger
crowd controll god
untill a mob that is imune to crowd controll apears (practicaly every mob that doesnt get 1shot by meteors)
lavish remnant
main thing I’m concerned about regarding the planned arcanist damage buff to be ...
sorry I haven't read this thread in a while but that was a number I just threw out of a nowhere as an eyeball, best not to put TOO much stock into it
hasty vigil
Me when thunderstorm is quite necessary for arcanist
me when no thunderstorm arcanist
(i will get it when i level up next)
tight tartan
However meteor's auto aim radius was reduced from 4 blocks to 2
Personally a 2 block radius seems pretty low, especially when dealing with a spell that relies on both the x axis and z axis (specifically thunderstorm if psycho is used) as opposed to spells like ice snake that are easy to land, only depending on 1 axis for targeting
royal pewter
I was thinking, maybe arcane transfer will also give the mana stored to allies?
Idk if it should be instant or like increased mr
royal pewter
Ik, still a nice perk that can be useful in wars/ raids
royal pewter
Oh fair
daring pecan
However meteor's auto aim radius was reduced from 4 blocks to 2
thunderstorm auto aims? or u just talking about the meteor?
compact epoch
Both
daring pecan
da damn did not know
tight tartan
Yeah I personally think the radius of the auto aim should be increased. On meteor it’s not as noticeable bc of large hit radius but thunderstorm definitely is hard to land
tight tartan
What I hope ct understand and plan to do something about is that since arcanist loses heal, it needs something to compensate for that and rwalker should have less dps in comparison
wary flame
boop!
near verge
We're back!
light lichen
Sad 😦
gleaming spade
Honestly quite shocking
Me when Salted makes the “”high”” damage archetype do less damage than the “””healer””” archetype
daring pecan
Consokidate #1030663366433325086 and #1022035250018275408 ??
gleaming spade
Consokidate <#1030663366433325086> and <#1022035250018275408> ??
Two different people made these threads
daring pecan
Same idea why not consolidate
gleaming spade
Just move to the other discussion
maiden pine
replace triple snake with flame dragon: turns ice snake red and triples dmg at t...
Bump
hoary elk
Bump
just make a new thread honestly, this thread is out of date as arcanist is better than rwalker and it's weird to see it back now
maiden pine
oh yeah true
brittle dagger
nah fatal buff > arcanist buff
why is a crafted wand better at ETW than fatal >.>
hardy wing
buff both
brittle dagger
nah if you buff both then arcanist gona be overpowered like archer and warrior
