The Nameless' General Feedback Thread

[misty charm]

made this thread due to seeing a lot of feedback on the thread about the new attack that was moreso about the fight in general so go ham here i guess

[woven niche]

Shall I just post the feedback I have from my own TNA thread in Forums

Like, a short summary

This was a trick question I will and you can't stop me

[misty charm]

do it

[fresh glacier]

Hello

Alright.. heres my idea
Leap/charge: Greg stops in place as the sound plays to telegraph it

[misty charm]

oh yeah this reminds me tree while you were fighting the boss it used the speedup attack at the same time it used leap so it just glided across the ground super fast towards you and hit you with both the leap attack and the true damage circles at the same time LOL

[fresh glacier]

Greg flight

[misty charm]

i do not think the boss should be able to use speedup while it uses leap or ground pound

[quasi idol]

bring back at least 3le per run and give new rewards to replace materials

[fresh glacier]

Tbh, idk if this is a issue for everyone else but the skulls are hard to see for me

[misty charm]

it does have like 3 le now from what i've seen and it can drop chestnut horses

[quasi idol]

hmm. i got 2.5 from my last run

[misty charm]

well even prior to the hotfix 1 nerf i dont think it was always 3+ le

i think i got 2 a decent amt of times

[quasi idol]

horses arent really a good reward for tna since most people doin it are gonna have a decent ws set

[misty charm]

can you think of anything else they can drop

sorry i'm not like trying to argue i'm genuinely asking cause i cant think of anything myself

[fresh glacier]

You can sell them

to clueless people

[woven niche]

Speed-Up + Purple Circle (Rush I think?)

The actual speed-up feels unneeded and is completely untelegraphed, often resulting in very cheap deaths combined with the purple circles that deal huge damage. I guess the speed-up is to make sure the circles get spread out, but it adds way too much danger to the attack. The purple circles themselves are fine because they incentivize tanks to actually PAY ATTENTION TO THE VIDEO GAME but at the moment with the way they work it doesn't threaten hypertanks enough and threatens people with lower raw HP more.

My ideas for this attack is to heavily telegraph the attack before it comes out considering how dangerous it is, or remove the speed-up. The extreme speed the boss gains can lead to a decent amount of cheap damage because the player isn't properly warned about the attack. Reduce the damage of the purple circles too, or turn them into max HP% damage. This way it'll stay a threat to all players equally and really keep tanks engaged instead of sitting in front of a wall for the entire fight.

[fresh glacier]

I swear the speed has been nerfed I barely notice it anymore

[misty charm]

it's
incredibly very super apparent

[quasi idol]

maybe ingredients if we cant have materials? or if item team have time make new gear(weapons/armor). cosmetics (very unlikely). ||mythics||

[fresh glacier]

yeah It should be but feels less apparent than before

[misty charm]

cosmetics would be neat but idk how realistic they would be

[woven niche]

Speed + Melee Damage buff (the one that happened towards the end of the beta)

I honestly have no idea if this got reverted yet because I haven't tested it personally but it really just makes it harder for close-range classes that face risk of getting hit directly by the boss, and requires good walk speed or mobility to outrun. Again, I do not know if this has been addressed, but if it hasn't, I would just revert these buffs because they boss was already fast and deadly enough.

[quasi idol]

mfw prices go down ||depends on drop rate but if they dont drop that often then its not very worth running for them||

[fresh glacier]

Imagine if rush would make greg sorta just turn slower

[misty charm]

i wish charms were more than just "take x% more damage for y utility" cause it'd open up a few more options

[quasi idol]

what would be really cool is if we can have tna based mounts. so like instead of generic horses we have bulb catchers as mounts or some other tna creature

[fresh glacier]

Me raiding lutho with the boys to steal the bulbs

[quasi idol]

me on the bulb catcher annoying new players in ragni

[fresh glacier]

Suggestion: remove the graspless attack and put that model on the skull attack instead

[quasi idol]

hands are cool tho

[fresh glacier]

Graspless basically is a worse version of skulls anyway, and is just annoying rn. Skulls are hard to see and look derpy, this would make them better and easier to see

[woven niche]

Damage Aura:

Pretty sure this still exists, I had to deal with it when I was soloing the last bit of HP the boss had. Just an odd attack that puts so much pressure onto melee players with no real way to avoid it besides simply having really cracked range with Whirlwind Strike or playing Archer. I think it should just get removed, since I don't feel like it provides much to the fight besides making it blatantly harder for melee players. The Rush attack at least serves to keep grounded players like tanks engaged, but this one just doesn't feel fair.

[fresh glacier]

yeah make the hands the models for the skull attack

[fresh glacier]

I think this is just while rush or somethin, I haven't really seen it

[woven niche]

The damage aura is when the boss gets like

Lava particles around it

[fresh glacier]

huh????

I have not once seen lava particles on greg ever

[misty charm]

it's hard to tell

[woven niche]

It rarely happens but it absolutely does sometimes and when it does it's annoying

[misty charm]

just know that it appears in final phase or around 4m hp mark

[woven niche]

Yeah, which is why it rarely appears

[fresh glacier]

hm, alright then

[misty charm]

if you're in spectator, you'll be able to see damage numbers in f5 and you can run into the boss

[woven niche]

90% of the time the boss dies before it ever gets to use the attack

[misty charm]

a bunch of -2000s will appear (if you're warrior or assassin or something)

if you're a different class then i guess it'll be more than -2000

[fast sky]

I've got a lot on my mind but rn one thing I find quite disgusting (before the new attack I haven't checked that out yet) is the charge-speedup combo, a charge can suddenly cover you in rings and instantly take you out if you are not aware and take it as a regular charge

It can happen at the start of chains to so it can be very lethal and sudden

Sure you can dodge charge most of the times but dying 1 out of 20 runs out of nowhere doesn't feel great

[fast sky]

This definitely does exist, can confirm

[woven niche]

Leap attack:

Essentially impossible to dodge unless you are at a large distance from the boss when it does the telegraph. That's basically all the reason this attack is so vicious and it feels very cheap to constantly get chipped down because the leap is so hard to avoid and covers so much distance.

I think the attack should be a threat and it's a large amount of the pressure in the fight, but it should be changed so all the classes can actually dodge it in most situations. One thing you could do is just reduce the hitbox, but I don't feel like that would really fix the main problem of the attack being harder to dodge the closer you are to the boss.

Highbread came up with an idea that the attack's damage should be "delayed", where the damage comes out around 1-2 seconds after the leap, so you get the time to move out of the way of the damage area no matter where you are when the boss does the leap. Basically, imagine the boss leaping, spawning the void holes, then like a second later the line explodes, similar to Psychomancer except on the boss rather than yourself. I think it would fit the boss a lot and still keep the stress of the attack apparent, but also become fair to dodge. Also fits the area-denial theme!

[fast sky]

Would the void hole be instantly created or same time as damage?

[woven niche]

I would say instantly created, so you know where the damage would occur

[fast sky]

I definitely support the change, after not playing mage I feel like it's quite unfair of an attack

I think it could be like a small cloud of particles resembling a tear in space which then rips open a void hole and deals damage

[fresh glacier]

What about leap just making greg stop in place when it's being telegraphed + smaller aoe

So you have some time to run away

[fast sky]

It's still a near precise tracking due to its melee AI

[misty charm]

also doesn't solve the issue where it's like a huge pain to completely dedicate 15 seconds of time purely to running away when he decided to use leap like 6 times in a row because why not

[fast sky]

Double charges can also lead to lots of unfair hits if he turns right near you

Also I've seen charges deal damage close to the walls now

[misty charm]

they always have done damage close to the walls, they just dont make void holes there

[uncut island]

Right uh
TNA rooms right now feels balanced (outside of bulb which can get really annoying and glitchy at times)
But the boss
ehhh.
I have a few complaints about it.
About the charge (charges to the targetted player and create multiple void holes below)/leap (leaps upwards and smash down, creating a large void hole) attacks:
I'm personally fine with how leap works right now, but sometimes I feel that the hitboxes are unnecessarily huge. I can be like 30 blocks away from the landing location and still take damage. It could be placebo, it could also be a miscalculation, but it just feels crappy to get hit by that.
Then to the charge attack. I really hate this one.
Right, I now can hear the sound effect of it and be more aware of it, but the thing is that I need to time it all by myself. When Greg starts charging, it's really fast and deals a enormous amount of damage. It's almost unavoidable when the timing is bad or when I'm close to Greg. I can time leap because of how Greg leaps upwards before I start taking damage, but there is absolutely nothing signifying that I WILL take damage outside of the indicator 3 seconds before the attack. Also because of how they can potentially chain up and fill the arena with void holes, makes the fight a bit of a staring contest on who's gonna stop/die first.
According to the players who have experienced Greg fight with the new spell, the newly-added attack makes the above issue even worse. You get less time to attack and a large portion of the fight is now converted into waiting.
also acrobat is quite weak enough why kill it with bmonk

[fast sky]

Huh never noticed that, but I don't think it reaches players using corner cheese, and making it do so instead of fixing the corner would be a very bad idea

[misty charm]

I can be like 30 blocks away from the landing location and still take damage.
iirc ground pound is like a 12 block radius

[fast sky]

I think that'd be almost twice as large as the created hole?

[uncut island]

then that is a big miscalculation of mine
sometimes the range feels really shitty

[woven niche]

Raw true damage:

The amount of raw true damage this fight uses is worrying. Raw true damage is very problematic, in a situation similar to TCC. Raw true damage mainly exists to threaten people with lots of DR, but in the end raw true damage needs to be overtuned to pretty high values so it threatens tanks with lots of raw HP. However, this becomes problematic because then people on the average end of raw HP have to deal with damage that is balanced around having lots of raw HP, and it becomes a situation like TCC where all the mobs have huge damage to compensate for the crazy DR players can get (just this time it's with HP).

I think max HP% damage can genuinely be used anywhere raw true damage is used, because it fairly threatens tanks and glass equally and doesn't remove the threat of the attacks at all.

[woven niche]

To be fair 12 blocks is still really ridiculous

[fast sky]

Leaps wears you down a LOT if you use lower sustain builds

[woven niche]

It gets so confusing when players refer between Leap, Charge, and Ground Pound

Someone should really get Nicktree or Lumia in here

[uncut island]

somehow I just feel leap having way more range than 12 blocks. Does the middle of the hitbox start from the void hole created?

ok uh what do yall name the stuff anyways

[fast sky]

Well we can use earthshatter and rend the barrier for accurate names

[woven niche]

Earthshatter and Rend the Barrier is too convoluted though

[misty charm]

i call the ground pound attack the ground pound because he is pounding the ground

[fast sky]

Yeah sadly

[uncut island]

wtf is rend the barrier 😭

[misty charm]

i call the other one leap because he leaps but doesn't pound the ground

[fast sky]

I usually refer to RtB as charge and earthshatter as slam

[woven niche]

I call the huge charge Leap/Lunge, and Ground Pound just. Ground Pound

Rend the Barrier is the huge lunge the boss does

[uncut island]

I call the thing where he makes multiple void holes charge, and the funny jump-up-and-down-creating-a-hole-attack as leap
now I think the latter might be the ground pound yall are saying

[woven niche]

I mean, Charge/Leap/Lunge all work

[fast sky]

Also what do you guys think about the void hole hand attack?

[misty charm]

charge/leap/lunge all work for that one attack but ground pound is the only acceptable name for the ground pound

[woven niche]

I remember it being really annoying when playing Mage

[uncut island]

its bad when you have no mobility

[fast sky]

It just feels so weak most of the time, or maybe my builds have too much TWA def since it's purely elemental

[woven niche]

but as Battle Monk I almost never get hit by it

[misty charm]

the hand hurts

it hits about as hard as ground pound i think

[uncut island]

Battle Monk has no problem with it, aero charge does a lot to help
Boltslinger frenzy offers enough mobility to outrun the hand landing
Acolyte is a bit 🥴
I don't dodge shit as paladin anyways

[woven niche]

Lumia said the hand is supposed to exist to like, get people to call out the hand, but even then the hand itself is hard to avoid and also that really requires a VC. You absolutely cannot stop to call out the void hand if you're in the middle of dodging a huge combo

[fast sky]

The hand deals 4000 at the edge of hitbox, 10000 for closer hits. Ground pound is 7500

[uncut island]

presses T
YO BRO WATCH THE FUCK OUT THERE IS A VOID HOLE ABOv-
You have been slain
No soul points have been lost

[woven niche]

Yeah

[fast sky]

Each direct hit of charge is 8400 btw, 4200 if you get grazed

[misty charm]

i find the hand to be more of a like

[uncut island]

aeugh

[woven niche]

Geez that is huge

[misty charm]

make sure you're not nearby other players when you dodge it

[woven niche]

Me deliberately getting hit by the hand so I can build corruption:

[fast sky]

I jump into void holes and not charge to take fall damage for corruption

[uncut island]

I die for corruption

[fast sky]

It deals about half of your hp and you can take care of the greater one yourself within seconds

[fresh glacier]

void holes are annoying cause I keep charging into them

[fast sky]

But funny how charge is the most threatening attack disregarding funny rings

If you take 4 direct hits that's 32k

[uncut island]

oh yeah the rings
I can't see the fucking rings half the time

[fast sky]

I can feel it coming if he's grounded but when he wants to jasmine bloom you it sucks

[fresh glacier]

rings are the most obvious thing in the greg fight for me

Well, apart from graspless and greater ones

[fast sky]

Btw how does the new 💀 works regarding targeting?

Do they all focus down one player for each barrage?

[fresh glacier]

4 for each player is how its worded

[fast sky]

Ik the counts but say it spits out 16

Do all 16 goes on the same person?

[woven niche]

No

[fresh glacier]

No its 4 for each person alive

[woven niche]

4 target each player

[fresh glacier]

and 4 goes to each player

[fast sky]

That sounds incredibly disruptive on the entire team then from what I've heard about the speed and duration

I thought it would just force one person to be on the move

[misty charm]

the danger of the attack isn't so much that it's a direct threat

the danger comes from how immensely disruptive it is

[fast sky]

Yeah it sounds like it would overlap with other attacks in a bad way

[woven niche]

Yeah I think the skulls should just get reduced to like 1 or 2 per player, or only target one player

[misty charm]

and also due to the nature of how they charge at the player they can catch up to a bmonk charging straight forward so you have to somewhat strafe them

[fresh glacier]

Maybe 1 per player but more damage yeah

[fast sky]

If they all focus one player it would be nice imo

Forces attention at all time but not as disruptive

[woven niche]

16 targetting one player would be absolutely insane so I think it should just spawn 4 and all focus on one player

[fresh glacier]

Maybe just mob aggro rules or whatever

[fast sky]

If it doesn't last super long maybe it's not that bad

[fresh glacier]

They'll attack closest or something

[fast sky]

Or yeah same amount but each is more threatening

Do they murder facetankers?

[woven niche]

Ok but 16 would deal like 16k if all of the skulls hit wouldn't it

and 16 is a really laggy amount

[fresh glacier]

Imo make it 4 always but they target players based on closest or some other ai

[woven niche]

No they deal I think TWA damage

[hushed axle]

Favorite and least favorite spells?

[woven niche]

✤ 500 Neutral Damage
✦ 900 Thunder Damage
❋ 1530 Air Damage

[fresh glacier]

Fav: Ground slam
Least fav: charge

[misty charm]

ground pound is probably my favorite honestly since it's an active threat but isn't stupid like leap

[fast sky]

Uhh I like seedpods and slam (mage pov) and I despise purple rings

[hushed axle]

Also each player can get hit by 4 skulls max

[fast sky]

Slam feels great to dodge

[misty charm]

my least favorite is the speedup

if it had a warning it would not be my least favorite

[uncut island]

what is the speedup

[fast sky]

Speedup/rush/purple ring

[woven niche]

Least favorite right now is definitely the Rush (Purple circles), Leap is really annoying but I think it is an integral part of the fight and isn't as vicious as the Rush so it's not least favorite

Favorite is probably like, Ground Pound

[misty charm]

mf speeds up to like faster than CoW and spams 3k true damage rings

[woven niche]

Yeah I was just talking with BadName about a theoretical change

[fast sky]

I think it's fine that an attack this deadly have to exist but the way it is used right now is questionable

[fresh glacier]

Imagine if rush would make greg turn slower so you could dodge it

[hushed axle]

Here is mine:
Fav: Leap (I know it is hated but I really like it, yeah it's not perfect but it is still close to my heart and definitely spices the boss up a lot)
Least Fav: Bombs (They are pretty inconsequential and very easy to dodge, although in most scenarios unless you are in range of like all of them, dodging isn't even necessary.)

[hushed axle]

If you have a cool idea I'd love to hear it!

[woven niche]

Yeah, I think it is better to exist than not to exist but it should get a telegraph

[misty charm]

i mean dont get me wrong leap isn't completely awful but the way it's used and the way the hitboxes are is just

bleh

[hushed axle]

It does but it is just kinda inconsistent thanks to Minecraft's sound system.

[fast sky]

The purple ring attack you mean?

[fresh glacier]

Bombs are fine cause they don't add much fair but they aren't harmful or disruptive/annoying

[hushed axle]

where random sounds cut off for no reason (I tested this, it isn't even when sounds are spammed)

[woven niche]

The Rush has a telegraph? or are you confusing me talking about Leap

[fast sky]

I've only heard of the sound when the rings are being created

[hushed axle]

Oh I thought you meant the dash

[fast sky]

There's no prior warning to the speedup

Just having something for that would be incredible

[misty charm]

i've never had the leap/ground pound warning get cut off

[hushed axle]

It's a 1.12 thing iirc

[woven niche]

I have but you need to have a lot of archers

Also yeah it's a 1.12 thing

[misty charm]

hv u guys played super smash mobs (this is relevant i promise)

[fast sky]

Yeah I played on 1.18 and nothing got cut off

[fresh glacier]

I think speedup could have greg slow down then speed up

[woven niche]

Yeah

[hushed axle]

Yeah I grinded the shit out of that game when I was like 12

[fast sky]

But it does a lot in 1.12

[misty charm]

what if it was like, blaze firefly attack sound or something

[hushed axle]

Yeah that would kinda be cool

I think that was kind of the original idea for the spell.

[woven niche]

Also you should ask BadName, it is their idea I think

[fresh glacier]

which idea?

[hushed axle]

Firefly

[fresh glacier]

Ah

[woven niche]

Blaze Firefly attack sound would be kinda obnoxiously loud considering the leap is used a ton though

[hushed axle]

We don't have to use the same sound lol

[woven niche]

True

Also have you seen the idea to rework the Leap?

[misty charm]

the speedup is not used a ton though

[fast sky]

So my idea is that denial of freedom is only targeted on one player instead of all and force them to be on the move instead of disrupting the entire party

[fresh glacier]

rush could have a cool chargeup tho

[woven niche]

OH the speed-up

[misty charm]

yeah

[hushed axle]

I don't think leap is gonna get reworked, it is just too important to the fight. (I think the most that could happen is it being nerfed)

[fresh glacier]

Like greg slows down and charges up energy then he goes to town and runs at extreme speed(not actaully just speed of it rn but funny word so sounds cooler)

[hushed axle]

although tbh I don't think I would support nerfing it too much (maybe hitbox but that's it)

[woven niche]

Well it's not really a total rework

[hushed axle]

What is the idea?

[fast sky]

My idea of speedup telegraph is that there's a rapidly increasing pitch of enderman teleport sounds (the same sound of rings being created) as a charge-up and a big sound when it actually starts

[fresh glacier]

It's just impossible to dodge unless you're far away and telegraph doesn't provide enough time to dodge it if you're close

[hushed axle]

Really depends on your setup

[fresh glacier]

No like, you can spam charge and you WONT dodge it, you will not take as much damage but you WILL get hit if you're close up or even relatively close

[misty charm]

the only way to consistently dodge leap is to just be far away and that completely butchers the pace of the fight imo

[hushed axle]

You could prob dodge it with Aerodynamics but honestly I don't think that is that much of a big issue, especially for the most defensive class in the game.

[misty charm]

you get clipped with aero

[fresh glacier]

Yeah but what about every other class who will get hit by it

[misty charm]

unless you've made a very good amount of distance

[fast sky]

when you are going for a big burst of damage after it just finished a chain but it starts going for another immediately it hurts a lot

[woven niche]

Basically, instead of the damage hitboxes coming out instantly, have them be delayed like 1 second after the void holes spawn so players have the ability to move out of the way of the area before they take massive damage, no matter where they are on the field

Right now Leap has the problem of being really inconsistent to dodge on classes like Warrior and Assassin, but a lot easier on Mage and Archer, and kinda depends on set-up as Shaman, so the idea is to make it possible to avoid consistently on Warrior and Assassin, but also kinda fit the theme of the boss and keep the stress of the fight.

[dense solstice]

discussion

[hushed axle]

The roar is essentially a warning to get away from the boss asap

[dense solstice]

i agree with highbread

[hushed axle]

Like I said I wouldn't be opposed to decreasing the hitbox but not too much

[dense solstice]

i have never fully escaped the roar charge

[fresh glacier]

As high said it kinda ruins the pace and it's still quite hard with that in mind

[fast sky]

most class doesn't have enough mobility to get to the safe range within the delay if they are very close when the roar sounds

[dense solstice]

in like 50 raids. also it spamming the attack is borign

[hushed axle]

Honestly think we could all agree that the fight would be insanely different if leap was changed too much (And I am guessing we all somewhat enjoy the current fight even with its issues)

[fast sky]

I can consistently get out as mage, get minimal damage taken as warrior and take a lot of damage as assassin

[woven niche]

Yeah but you don't get enough time to get away sometimes, even if you react really quickly, on warrior with Aero

[dense solstice]

you cant just go straight back though

[fresh glacier]

Yeah, but just a smaller hitbox or make the telegraph much earliear would make it much less bs and more fun

[dense solstice]

you need to like wait for it to start and just before it starts charging you go to the side

[fast sky]

it's just the large hitboxes rn if you are not changing how the attack works

[woven niche]

It would be a lot different and I think Leap is an integral part of the fight, but I think it can be changed to be more fair but still really stressful

[fresh glacier]

yeah, but that only works at a distance

[dense solstice]

use the time after roar to get distance

i can send a clip of acrobat dodging if you'd like when i go into this boss

[fresh glacier]

Yeah but once you get back he'll be using it already

[green zodiac]

Roar is probably only really dodgeable on archer because escape is funny

[fast sky]

mage

[woven niche]

It's easily dodgeable on Mage

[fast sky]

(teleport 12->16 too what happened)

[woven niche]

And realistic with Shaman if you have Blood Connection

[green zodiac]

Er I mean roar chain

[fresh glacier]

It's dodgeable at a distance so ranged classes have a huge advantage

[hushed axle]

If the telegraph is too early tho it feels really disconnected, but ye maybe this could make it better, I somewhat think the problem can be mostly fixed with a smaller hitbox

[green zodiac]

Also yeah tp buff is funny

[fresh glacier]

Maybe yeah

[dense solstice]

yea then u go again

[fast sky]

roar chain is very dodgeable as a mage spammer

[dense solstice]

yes i agree

[green zodiac]

It would be cool if roar’s hitboxes had more of that distance damage scaling too

[misty charm]

everything is very dodgeable as a mage spammer

[fast sky]

if you dont have enough mana to sustain that's the lack of mobility on your build

[misty charm]

like my build is mana steal and i can still easily escape literally everything in all situations

[fresh glacier]

I think maybe the accuracy being nerfed a bit too? Cause gotta consider it when hes chaining it too

[hushed axle]

I really liked the beta TNA where you didn't need a tank to feel like you can kick TNA's ass.

the bosses speed is the main factor in that imo

[fast sky]

I mean mage and archer can still take down the boss with style solo

[fresh glacier]

Nerfing the speed back would help yeah

[hushed axle]

Archer 😴

[misty charm]

the speed buff also directly made it more difficult to dodge leap

[fresh glacier]

Bosses shouldn't be much of a threat when they aren't using attacks imo

[fast sky]

frenzy balance

[woven niche]

A smaller hitbox would probably work yeah I am just worried that a smaller hitbox would still be really hard to dodge with unlucky positioning on assassin or warrior

[uncut island]

is there a list of greg's attacks

[fast sky]

wiki

[fresh glacier]

wiki isn't entirely accurate but yeah

[woven niche]

Or rather just not possible to dodge, like it is now, but I don't think that would be the case if there was a smaller hitbox unless you got into a really bad position

[fast sky]

but there's now denial of freedom, I haven't played with it yet so I'll add it after I do so

[uncut island]

aight

[woven niche]

Denial of Freedom (No More Rainbow)

[fast sky]

which isn't accurate? I wrote much of it so I could revise something there

[fresh glacier]

Oh havent checked it in a while, it was changed duh im dumb

[hushed axle]

Well positioning is often times the players fault, so I won't feel bad if they get hit in that instance

[fresh glacier]

Denial of freedom happens way too often at the last phase imo

It's on over 60% of the time it felt like

[fast sky]

there used to be misleading info on some attacks like "eyes cannot be evaded and must be taken by tanks" but I've removed those

[fresh glacier]

Yeah

[hushed axle]

It's just really because the spell has a long duration

[fresh glacier]

Yeah maybe, long duration attacks are kinda eh.

[woven niche]

Not really the players fault when they're playing a really low range class and have to be really close to the boss to even deal damage though, like it is definitely the fault of an archer or mage but on warrior or assassin it's kinda unavoidable to get into poor positions with the Leap if you have to be close all the time, and then the boss roars and don't get enough time to space yourself and move out of the way, at least currently. I don't know what it would be like with a smaller hitbox

[dense solstice]

it would be much better

[green zodiac]

Oh yeah how is denial of freedom btw

[woven niche]

Well yeah definitely, I just mean I don't know if you'd still get into those situations

[green zodiac]

Have not seen it yet

[fresh glacier]

Smaller aoe could mean less distance away to dodge = more time

[woven niche]

Yeah

[dense solstice]

sure you would but dodging with most classes is gonna be like actually possible

[fast sky]

oh denial of freedom was added to the wiki, neat. I haven't seen it yet, should I hop into it as mage (riftbender) or warrior (fallen monk)?

[hushed axle]

I am just worried that accounting for warrior would make the dash a joke for all other classes

[misty charm]

i dont really think you need to worry about that

[hushed axle]

What if the initial void hole hitboxes are smaller but the further ones are the same?

like the hitbox gets bigger the more voidholes spawn.

[misty charm]

that would be nice but i'd have to feel and experience it for myself

[green zodiac]

That would be cool

[fast sky]

sounds nice

[dense solstice]

that is cool

[fresh glacier]

Yeah

[woven niche]

That could work, yeah

[fresh glacier]

Btw thanks for listening

[dense solstice]

i have some more in depth feedback to put here when iu am not in tcc

[woven niche]

It makes sense, the main problem is really the initial hitboxes being really hard to avoid on warrior and assassin, but that would also keep it from becoming too easy on archer/mage

[fast sky]

(and any other classes except archer ig)

[fresh glacier]

Yeah so it would kinda balance out like that

[fast sky]

if you are too close as mage and he roars, teleporting once will bring you to a range where you'll get clipped by 4-5 direct hits, a second teleport in a different direction does make you take only 1-2 grazes though

(this is based on 12 blocks tp, i haven't tried 16)

[dense solstice]

ok good news i died. i think that the tna bossfight sometimes feels like a little bit of a slog with only mister gregory. in nol you have the arena changes and stuff and in tcc you have to like change strategies for the different parts of the boss but like

eeeh. idk. greg fight feels a little empty sometimes.

[fresh glacier]

greg needs some friends he is sad

I think gameplaywise he doesn't need it, but yeah it does feel a lil empty

[fast sky]

btw is the CT aware of the barrier corner/edges incidents?

[woven niche]

Personally I feel like the fight gets noticeably harder the longer it goes on so it stays engaging, but the huge combos of leaps and ground pounds do get a bit too long to a point where it starts slogging

[fresh glacier]

btw, what about giving the new attack the graspless models instead? since imo they're a little hard to see/goofy

[hushed axle]

Ehhh, at this point I think adding other mobs (other than the greater ones) would make the fight too messy. Also we decided before hand that we would try to make the nameless use a little minions as possible.

[fresh glacier]

Yeah, but "minion" esque attacks do make it feel livelier, like the eyes

[hardy whale]

deusphage said something like that one time. Plus it literally buffs fallen in the fight, also deusphage said that.

[hushed axle]

tru tru but I think it's fine atm

[fresh glacier]

Yeah, skulls will be here too

[fast sky]

eyes are cool

[fresh glacier]

Imo skulls are too goofy and blend in too well, idk

[hardy whale]

greg children

[dense solstice]

what if you made more arena restricting effects

nah i think the real issue is tcc

[fresh glacier]

Having a head or some other model that isn't almost all black would be better maybe

[fresh glacier]

Void holes

[hushed axle]

Yeah I will see, but I think the sound indicator for them charging is enough to know when to move

[woven niche]

I think the skulls are kinda creepy ngl, I think it's just a bit goofy because we have the emote

[hushed axle]

New attack makes the entire arena a void hole

[fresh glacier]

Idk since my only run with em had the whole arena as swiss cheese also a ton of lag

But maybe give them a particle trail of white?

[uncut island]

mmm ok ive kinda just read all the spells and i forgot what is sunder

[hardy whale]

My General TNA feedback:

[dense solstice]

[fast sky]

4 dragon breath projectiles, 1 front 1 back and 1 on each sides

[hardy whale]

[hushed axle]

What are your thoughts on using the edge to make the nameless not spawn void holes. Yeah you can say it is an oversight but I actually like how it makes the fight safer but also reduces the player's mobility a bit by putting them up against the wall.

[fast sky]

it's used repeatedly but only hurts on direct hits

[hardy whale]

also the edge wont spawn the skull heads to jsyk

[uncut island]

oooh that
i thought it was just a regular attack like melee that is being used at all times

[fresh glacier]

yeah kinda goofy lol

[hushed axle]

hmmmm, it should

[dense solstice]

nah the issue is using the barriers to keep him away

[fast sky]

i think being on the edge normally is fine since you are very threatened by rush, but using barriers to get him stuck is just horrible

[hardy whale]

😔

[dense solstice]

like you can stick greg on one of the inclines or whatnot

[woven niche]

I think it's good because if void holes spawned near the edge it would start to become way too stressful

The problem is that Greg sometimes gets straight-up stuck on the barriers

[dense solstice]

and then he will just not hit you. lol.

[hardy whale]

root of all tna evil

[fresh glacier]

Tbh just make barrier wall flat maybe

[hushed axle]

Yeah I am not talking about using the barriers to immobilize him

I thought that was fixed for a while

[dense solstice]

ok yea

[fast sky]

most players who doesn't abuse barriers usually get taken out by speedup rings which is fair

[dense solstice]

also whenever people powder spec on me, it tags me for hunted and deals damage

[hushed axle]

[fast sky]

or at least they will lose the second chance to the rings, then dies when it is used again. but yes barriers are still there and I don't get it

[hardy whale]

Also another piece of TNA feedback

[dense solstice]

like i cannot play my hardcore characters

[fresh glacier]

dukun these nuts

[dense solstice]

because i am afraid people will powder spec and kill me

[uncut island]

so ig speedup is the attack that release funny purple rings?

[fast sky]

yup

[hardy whale]

https://tenor.com/view/jacc-jacc-so-cool-scared-black-kid-black-gif-19028879

[hushed axle]

Originally the arena was a perfect rectangle but then people complained so it was changed. Maybe the best option is inbetween a perfect rectangle and what we have now?

[hushed axle]

which ones?

[fast sky]

I think any inclines in the arena edge will still be abusable

[uncut island]

its either a perfect rectangle or like what it is now

[hushed axle]

idk, maybe not if they are in the corners

[uncut island]

as long as there are blocks to stuck greg in people are gonna use it

[fresh glacier]

Personally the inclines on the walls do not change anything at all but just make me get stuck on them and die every so often

and allow people to abuse them

[dense solstice]

i think what we have now is cool but the issue is just his pathfinding lol

[fast sky]

yeah inclines would be fine if he can unstuck himself

[fresh glacier]

Oops not inclines

Like just variations in the walls, instead of em being flat

[fast sky]

but if that doesn't work there's a funny idea of having a 1 block gap from the edge of arena and barrier which you can fall into but not the boss

[dense solstice]

HAHA

[fast sky]

if you do fall its the same effect as falling into a void hole

[uncut island]

(why)

[dense solstice]

wait omg thats funny as hell and a good idea

[uncut island]

goddamn nice one

[fast sky]

now there's no walls to hug

[dense solstice]

so far all of them! in the raid

[uncut island]

imagine people still trying the wall hugging strat but instead spawns 371984731 greater ones on the edge of the arena

[dense solstice]

courage and quake are most noticeable though

[hushed axle]

only in the raid? Weird

[dense solstice]

i have not tried outside of it but i will soon

it is preventing me from doing hardcore raids which is kinda sad

[hardy whale]

what if the little one and the greater one held hands during the greg fight? 😳

wait that doesn't look right now that I think about it-

[fresh glacier]

The parent is taking the child

[hushed axle]

lol

[hardy whale]

" DONT TALK TO ME OR MY SON EVER AGAIN "

[fresh glacier]

on a walk

[dense solstice]

just happened in tcc

oh speaking of tcc the boss just doesnt exist

[hushed axle]

oh

yeah the other 3 raids are kind of strange rn

in terms of their bugs

[dense solstice]

also also it would be nice if the storyline ended after the raid so i could scroll without classing ☺️

[hushed axle]

I will look into it

[dense solstice]

👍

please especially look into the hunted tagging with powder specials though it is a massive pain

im not sure why it happens to just me (ironman?)

[hushed axle]

Very strange

[blazing shale]

Is it just me or is greg really difficult to see with the night sky

[misty charm]

rather than that i've just noticed that the lighting is really bad in some parts of the arena

[dense solstice]

idk lol

[hushed axle]

It's only from other players right?

@dense solstice

[dense solstice]

yes

want a recording? hang on

[hushed axle]

Ye that would be cool

[dense solstice]

any powder spec btw. quake just oneshots me

[hushed axle]

I will show the devs

[dense solstice]

ty 👍

[fresh glacier]

also yeah greg arena lighting kinda sucks

[nimble patio]

i think we should remove all telegraphs

[fresh glacier]

SO TRUE

[nimble patio]

havent really seen anyone else bring this up but tna kind of has an absurd amount of tier 3 amplifiers and powders for no reason

i dont really care how it's affected the market and prices but the fact they've dipped so much shows how absolutely crazy the amount you get is

it seems problematic because how are future raids gonna balance their rewards, are there gonna be mf 30 of each in every reward chest

powders are a bit different but it is surprising that there was no new tier 4 amplifier

even tier 3s are frankly 99% of the time placebo at best

[uncut island]

I've gotten 6 corkamp 3s in a single raid. I think I got a stack from the little tna runs I've had, and like 2 and a bit more corkamp 2s.

[misty charm]

i'm fine with the amp 3 rates because amps suck anyway but the powder rates definitely are really

[nimble patio]

tcc honestly shouldnt have even had as good of rates as it did

[uncut island]

at this point I'm basically using corkamp 2/3s on rares and they're still not depleting

[nimble patio]

this probably sounds really hypocritical because i always talk about bringing back dernic mats and not caring how it affected market price but trust me i really dont care about powder/amp prices its more just that you get so many it makes balancing rewards a bit difficult

amps suck so much anyways i think tier 4s wouldve been a good solution for tna

[uncut island]

t4s moment

[nimble patio]

oh yeah anyways bring back dernic mats :)

[fast sky]

alright tried a run (which had a barrier cheese sadly), but on the topic I think the heads are definitely spammed a LOT more than I expected

it looks kinda cool but I expected each barrage to be more threatening and not used as frequently

I don't like how it is casted rapidly in combo with other spells though, that sounds hard to manage legit

[nimble patio]

was speedup changed at all

[fast sky]

don't think so

i still saw it just happen

[uncut island]

proffers dying of cringe

[nimble patio]

good

[nimble patio]

was the nameless' speed reduced this patch

i only did 2 runs but he felt slower could just be imagining things though i unno

[fresh glacier]

Yeah same

[normal sluice]

no :)

[buoyant quail]

They were removed from the TNA reward pool?

[astral thistle]

probably

now garbage accessories fill your inventory

[astral thistle]

make it so that greg will hit itself if it stay in the blast radius of his watch attack

[native crow]

one shots

[native crow]

bruh did the nerf the rewards again

[fresh glacier]

Just bad luck pretty sure

[native crow]

[native crow]

u were right!

[fresh glacier]

Its like the exact same amount of ascessories

Me when I cant count

[nimble patio]

give me an actually good reason why

[astral thistle]

that's not bad luck, you still get a tome or charm, I do tna 4 times yesterday and it only give 1 fabled tome

[open vapor]

profs exist

[nimble patio]

_ _

still looking

[open vapor]

cope

[nimble patio]

ngl bringing up profs is the cope

[open vapor]

giving mats in raids at all was a huge mistake

[nimble patio]

when people bring up prof economy to me regarding tna mats it literally confirms to me that people are just subjecting to outrage mentality because they also don’t bring up how tcc ruined sky economy which was equal to dernic

(if not even higher demand and more important at the time)

[open vapor]

truely

[nimble patio]

🤷‍♂️

still gonna keep looking for good reason

[normal sluice]

ive given you my reasoning, you just dont think its good and i do

tcc giving sky mats was also a mistake but its far too late to do anything about that

[nimble patio]

that’s the same reasoning boomers use to not cancel student debt

[normal sluice]

what

[true geyser]

i love skeletron from terraria

[hardy whale]

What he's saying is that greg is a boomer and he used to not cancel student debt to students at the Order Of The Grook University, the debt was paid off by dernic mats apparently which is why the Dern room exists at the school. 🤷

[nimble patio]

ok the nameless absolutely did get a speed reduction this hotfix

[hardy whale]

he's been eating too much, he's gotta tone down on his eating and go on a diet.

[nimble patio]

post buff tna chest

[nimble patio]

i know i criticized its speed increase during the end of beta and i still stand by that but idk if its just me and it totally can just be my mind fucking with me since its been so long but it feels even slower than how it was prior to the buff

could maybe use a bit of a speed increase again

[real flicker]

can we make acrobat not get fucked by the skulls

[native crow]

i like the new greg speed

[nimble patio]

new attack just feels like a ton of visual clutter in an already hard to see arena

[native crow]

i mean fast speed he funnier and more ferocious

[nimble patio]

hes slower now

[hardy whale]

thats kinda the point of the spell, I expected it more to be a gravitational pull since its the void after all 🤷

[native crow]

whats the exact speed now?
before they buffed him from 0.7 to 1 in speed

[nimble patio]

i have no idea

[real flicker]

let’s just fuck one of the weakest archetypes even more

[native crow]

good idea

[hardy whale]

doesn't just fuck over acrobat ya'know, plus also yes fuck that class cause its funny.

[real flicker]

yeah but acrobat is one of the hardest hit classes so

[nimble patio]

i think my main problem with the attack other than excessive visual clutter is that they gain speed at any height above the ground

even when i just use a normal haul i end up getting hit by them

[real flicker]

mfw I try to escape with archer but all that does is make the angry calcium bois fly faster

[nimble patio]

it's pretty obnoxious

[native crow]

anyone know which spells can oneshot

[nimble patio]

here we go again

[native crow]

pardon?

[grave hawk]

my acrobat actually useless after half hp

[real flicker]

my acrobat actually useless
fixed for you

[nimble patio]

ok after playing more around it

holy fuck these skulls are so absurdly deadly on shaman

visual clutter aside while they do low damage individually they can very easily clump onto any one player and it becomes super hard to deal with without good walk speed or a good movement spell

of which haul is not and blood connection doesnt help eithe since no matter how high you are above the ground they get faster

so basically: you're fucked on shaman

[native crow]

i can fly

[nimble patio]

yeah this is fucking me over on shaman hard

ugh

[real flicker]

so whats the play now

[green zodiac]

Well I just saw the spell for the first time and huh

It is definitely not what I expected

It is exactly just FLYING [Heads]!

And they charge faster in the air

So yeah

[placid loom]

Whoever added the skulls and thought it'd be okay for the boss to be able to spam them left and right should really never touch bosses again

4 or 8 skulls? Okay, I can live with that. But not 16 or 20

[hardy whale]

Each player gets hit by 4 skulls

[placid loom]

Did you read the previous message?

I said he can spam it, meaning those 4 can easily become dozens

[hardy whale]

The skulls will charge several times before vanishing, doing so far more frequently if the player is airborne than if they were moving on the ground. Each skull can hit a player multiple times, and multiple skulls can hit a player at once.

[placid loom]

so what's your point

[hardy whale]

I don’t have a point, I was just saying Greg skulls normally hit four times per person, and that the spell is spammed more if someone’s airborne

[placid loom]

Iirc they charge five times if the person is on the ground, and seven if they are airborne

[hardy whale]

well yeah, the spells an airborne punishing tool. I just preferred Greg forcing players to be on the ground because of a gravitation pull spell downwards than the skulls.

[nimble patio]

you should stop saying whenever a bad change is made to the nameless that the person responsible should never touch bosses again

that being said I don’t really like the current state of the skulls either

[fresh glacier]

they should lower the amount, and reduce the frequency

[placid loom]

Can't deny I was talking purely out of frustration, because a relatively chill fight took on a complete 180 after a phase change, with the skulls being created with no end and the boss spamming his charge too at the same time. The fact that escaping Greg via Teleport spam, but consequently becoming airborne (even being 2 blocks above ground), triggered the skulls into full charge mode did not help either.

[fresh glacier]

Oh yeah also raise the height threshold

[placid loom]

I can't tell if they even tested properly their own shit boss or just gave it to us to suffer like this was some beta

[grave hawk]

idk what counterplay there is if the skulls have 100% uptime which they have like every other run

[nimble patio]

ive yet to experience constant spellspam of the attack so my main frustrations with it are how it speeds up pretty much whenever you're off the ground ever and the visual and audio clutter

[fast sky]

I've seen it being used twice or even 3 times at once very often in middle of charge chains

[placid loom]

I was stuck solo as an Arcanist from 14m hp

Took him down to 7m before the skulls and charge spam simply overwhelmed my mana regen and Manastorm

But it went so sloooowly that I got to be punched around a lot

Ah yeah, also his purple rings to watch out for

Besides the millions of void holes scattered around and his hands

[nimble patio]

this also may be a bit of a subjective thing but i really dislike the idea of using lots of spaced s to represent the attack because they're difficult to follow and see in the constantly night time arena

(why is it constantly night time specifically in the arena)

(i understand it's thematic or whatever but man is it annoying)

also does lumia know about this forum thing

her being in this thread would be nice

[fresh glacier]

I want the to be changed to graspless model and graspless attack not to be used in the last phase

Since its basically a better version anyway, and its a more obvious(and better imo) model

[hardy whale]

If you were to replace skull spell with something else that does the same job, would it be like a gravitation spell that pushes you down more? Or like what Daktota said

[placid loom]

Silly gimmick: a raging storm 5-6 blocks above ground that damages players inside it, and appears halfway during the battle

[fresh glacier]

I think it should be more challenging in the air but you aren't punished and unable to do anything about it

[hardy whale]

https://tenor.com/view/hole-black-hole-abstract-spinning-gif-15770141

Gravity manipulation

[placid loom]

Yeah, and then Greg would start spamming that too, and people would get slammed into void holes 24/7

[green zodiac]

I think that it is very funny that you have run away from the skulls

But using your movement spell to do so will put you in the air on most classes

[fresh glacier]

I think the height that counts as being in thr air should be lowered

So it only does it if youre like, idk above his head height

[green zodiac]

And literally acrobats can just go pound sand

[placid loom]

"Acrobat, you're hereby punished for existing."

[hardy whale]

Greg best moments

[uncut island]

hello
i just did a tna with acrobat
and i can officially announce as an unofficial guy that acrobat is motherfucking dead

[native crow]

guys trickster didnt exist in tna

[uncut island]

what is trickster

[native crow]

idk

it was all just a dream

[fresh glacier]

Well acrobat will be useful for the start and middle

Then acro doesnt exist for the last phases

[uncut island]

moment

[native crow]

is this the spell that makes acro suck in tna?

[fresh glacier]

Isn't that easily dodgeable??

[fresh glacier]

Nope its the skull one,

[native crow]

whats it called?

[fresh glacier]

Theres some fancy name but I call it

[native crow]

can i have the fancy name so i can look it up on the wiki pls

[fresh glacier]

I forgor

[sterile imp]

Is there a possibility so that blinding eyes have some kind of a nametag above them? It is really hard to spot them amongst the chaos of the fight

[fresh glacier]

give them graspless model

[sterile imp]

Freedom of denial i think (?)

[fresh glacier]

Yep

[sterile imp]

or denial of freedom 👀

[sterile imp]

btw where can you see its stats ?

[uncut island]

this one btw

[uncut island]

and i think all the spells and stuff are on the wiki

[native crow]

wiki

https://wynncraft.fandom.com/wiki/The_Nameless_Anomaly_(Raid)

[fresh glacier]

I would say make the skulls deal more damage but make them easier to dodge, so it punishes afk tankers more and isn't as disrupting

[fresh glacier]

Alternatively or also make barrier walls flat to remove getting geg stuck as a cheese

[astral thistle]

I never see anyone afk tank because you still have to cast spells and move around

[fresh glacier]

It happens so much, mainly they get greg stuck and stand back a lil and afk

[fast sky]

move around
I don't think they do that

I've also noticed that blinds resets aggro very consistently but I wonder how that works vs provoke and stuff

[hushed axle]

Yeah I think this is what I want to change them to

[hushed axle]

not sure though

[nimble patio]

that sounds fine

although they already deal a pretty crazy amount of damage when they all target one player

the problem with the skulls is how hard they are to track and that most builds need to use a movement spell to dodge them anyways

and nearly every single movement spell brings you off the ground anyways 💀

[hushed axle]

Yeah I will probably decrease the length they track for

Also gonna make it so you have to be around 7 blocks (or around something like this) off the ground for it to do the extra tracking

so it's more about "Stay Low" rather than "Don't use movement spells"

[nimble patio]

yes please raise the height that they speed up at that would instantly solve like 80% of the issues with the attack lol

[nimble patio]

also nick if you know what’s the speed value that the nameless has now

[hushed axle]

it was decreased by 0.05

[nimble patio]

seriously only that much

it feels like it was decreased a lot more than that

[misty charm]

out of curiosity what is it at currently

[hushed axle]

It just detects if the player is above the ground

[uncut island]

man

[misty charm]

me when i jump

[uncut island]

does it go funny crazy charge mode when you jump off the ground

[hushed axle]

Yeah but it only checks twice

[misty charm]

huh

[hushed axle]

Basically it only checks if you are above the ground as soon as it would charge

[uncut island]

M A N.

[misty charm]

wew

[hardy whale]

Denial of Freedom

[hardy whale]

That was a special boss fight gimmick that would’ve had the chance to send you to another room where you had to fight a mini boss before returning to the main fight itself; it’s a shell of its former self. 😔

[hushed axle]

Here are the changes being made to the skulls: Decreasing tracking and how much it is used, making it so you must be 7 blocks above the ground for it to do extra tracking, and increasing damage.

[uncut island]

is it still 4 per player

[hushed axle]

yes

[uncut island]

aaah crap.

[hushed axle]

but they only charge 3 times if you are not above 7 blocks from the ground and 5 if you are above 7 blocks

[uncut island]

o
ok yeah that's somewhat better

[hardy whale]

Me purposely going above 7 blocks to trigger the spell

[uncut island]

suicide mission

[fast sky]

is the cast frequency decreased as well?

[green zodiac]

Nope, have fun when greg casts it 3 times in a row

[fast sky]

I feel like it's used super often but people say it only occurs when you stay in the fight for too long

3x heads + charge barrages

[hushed axle]

yep

[nimble patio]

I think we should make the s constantly be sped up, increase the cast rate, make them deal more damage, have more spawn at once, and make them invisible

do u guys agree

[green zodiac]

[fast sky]

it should be used during watched phase too

[hushed axle]

Gonna make it 5 blocks instead of 7 actually

[misty charm]

5 blocks is better
7 is a bit too high

[misty charm]

also lowkey but i dont think the sound of the skulls should be audible from everywhere because if i want to escape from them i'm looking away to use my movement spell and it's hard to judge how close or far they are when they're the same volume regardless of where i am

just a small nitpick though

[astral thistle]

Skull sucks, it deal so much damage against non airborne dps units

[hardy whale]

I don’t feel much by the skulls, airborne or not with not many ele defs

[digital sentinel]

the pink skull move is what gets me more (blinding eyes, which doesn't happen often anyway) but the black skulls? I just charge away from them(they hit 3-4 times but not too bad, playing attack paladin)

though I do have 2k fire 1k water and 500 earth def

honestly blinding eyes should be 25-50% faster to stop people from attempting to wallhug

[nimble patio]

how would them being faster stop wallhugging

like, they’re motionless

[digital sentinel]

doesn't it not deal good damage

[nimble patio]

🥴

[digital sentinel]

I meant the pink heads that follow you around

[nimble patio]

yes I know

[hushed axle]

The eyes you mean

[digital sentinel]

people can't really tank that from what i've seen they just move out of the way

[fast sky]

FA guards easily take big clusters

[digital sentinel]

decently sure some can with a hyper guard

[woven niche]

I think that the purple circles should just deal %max HP damage if you want to stop the wallhugging problem

[fast sky]

purple rings do kill guards if they bath in the entire thing

[woven niche]

Yeah

[fast sky]

rn it's the barrier that keeps them from that

[woven niche]

Make them deal 100% max hp damage it will be FUNNY

[nimble patio]

they would simply move to another corner if they did that

to be honest I think unironically the only way to stop wallhugging is to make the wall/edge a hazard 🥴

[digital sentinel]

touching the wall void holes you

[fast sky]

you won't fix wall hugging without making edges unusable yeah

[nimble patio]

full tank paladins are simply too tanky

[woven niche]

However still do replace all the raw true damage with %max HP :)

[nimble patio]

you can’t really kill them by buffing spells that won’t also fuck over everyone else

[fast sky]

you can but that'd require slapping % true damage on everything which is disgusting design wise

[digital sentinel]

speaking of which falling in a void hole summons a little/greater one and not really much else? does falling in deal damage because I haven't been feeling it

[woven niche]

They deal damage sometimes

[digital sentinel]

it's just a tp which could be deadly in certain cases but otherwise it's a reposition

[nimble patio]

it is random whether they deal damage and spawn a little one and I don’t really know why

it honestly might be because the game is still thinking to send us to the scrapped punishment room

[woven niche]

It is supposed to deal damage however the void holes are very buggy and do not work very well

[nimble patio]

what if we added the tcc mouth true damage to stop wallhuggers 🤯

[woven niche]

Boss should get damage aura near the walls that deals 20% max HP damage every half second 🤯

[nimble patio]

it would also be incredibly funny if you could fall off

[woven niche]

That would be hilarious

[dull berry]

Remove barriers and every time Greg falls off u just lose the raid

[woven niche]

Reverse TCC 🤯

[misty charm]

"the skulls aren't bad just build hypertank"

[digital sentinel]

though I ain’t using hypertank
pure defense but still it damages enough to have to not be in that general vicinity

[astral thistle]

Yea, not everyone use guardian. And you deal no damage, if you are the only one alive, it's gonna take forever

There's an ability that allow you to gain mana while been hit

[nimble patio]

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa why is the stupid speedup attack untelegraphed and why do the purple rings it spawns deal so much damage and reach 50 blocks into the air

why is everything in this boss so anti shaman

[fresh glacier]

The rings don't have upward hitboxes pretty sure

[nimble patio]

why would i lie about that

[fresh glacier]

Idk, last time I remember being able to go over em

[nimble patio]

ok well. they do

[fresh glacier]

Despair

Ooh image if instead they could be like laser geyser sorta things

[uncut island]

give some bright particles around em when speedup so I can know when to get my mfing arse outta there
(and get fucked by denial of freedom)

[astral thistle]

Greg hate airborne player

[fresh glacier]

There's a extremely loud sound

[uncut island]

and ig I can't hear it.

[astral thistle]

Too many thing happened at the same time

But if lag resistance player don't stand still, dps player will lose quite a bit of dps and have higher risk of failing the raid

[fast sky]

hello,

[astral thistle]

He scared

[fast sky]

don't think its a big issue though but it happened when everyone died during watched

[astral thistle]

See? He is hiding from players

i don't think forcing lag resistant player moving around or stand still will make any difference, just a matter of time

If you are the only player alive

[fast sky]

can we get a speedup attack indicator please? I rolled acro a few times and most of my deaths are when I briefly land to be greeted by the rings and it just feels unfair

[muted roost]

does this happen every time greg happens to glitch out of the arena in some way?

[fast sky]

.

[hardy whale]

He doesn’t feel like getting beaten up today.

[hardy whale]

Armless

[fast sky]

I saw that name too but couldn't find the entity

[hardy whale]

my theory is that its the hand/arm that comes down from the void hole

[native crow]

he died

[nimble patio]

was the change to the s already pushed? they feel a lot more manageable now or maybe im just crazy and got better at avoiding them

maybe a bit too easy to just ignore now but they dont make me want to die anymore on shaman

[hushed axle]

No they haven't been pushed yet

[nimble patio]

placebo then ig

[nimble patio]

this might be far too late to say but one thing I haven’t seen many people bring up is how similar tna and nol are element wise

it kind of makes sense thematically since they’re essentially light and dark respectively but I just find it a bit lame that the majority of both raids are twa

i know there’s only 5 elements to work with which makes it kind of limiting but orphion has ta defenses and the nameless has twa defenses

[misty charm]

good riddance

[fresh glacier]

Wait what no more rush fully? Or just no more speed when it happens, also where is it from

[misty charm]

https://forums.wynncraft.com/threads/tna-boss-fight-feedback-thread.303020/#post-3556073

[fresh glacier]

Only nerfs..

I hope this doesn't lead to Greg being too easy

What bout the change where charge hitbox is smaller at the start, will that still be changed?

Eh, might be worrying too much

[misty charm]

it's really just nerfing the really egregious stuff that should have been nerfed anyway

[fresh glacier]

Yeah fair but I think it should've been given a telegraph instead maybe

[green zodiac]

Yeah it seems harsh but is probably just going to be fine for people that aren't god gamers to complete

[fast sky]

So now it's just ring but Greg doesn't trample you anymore right?

[green zodiac]

No

The speedup and the rings are the same spell

[fast sky]

Or rings are just gone?

[misty charm]

we'll just have to see when it gets pushed

[fast sky]

I don't know if I like this, the attack needed to be there but it doesn't have the best implementation

[misty charm]

i interpreted it as the speed buff being gone

[fast sky]

It's the only thing legit tanks have to pay attention to

Same thought

[fresh glacier]

Yeah, lumia said about true damage after and that's one of the only sources of it pretty sure

[misty charm]

eyes

[fresh glacier]

Ah

[green zodiac]

Eyes, overhead void hole

[fast sky]

Also the thing about double damage isn't that just the nameless just stacking multiple charges at once?

[green zodiac]

Seed bombs

[fast sky]

It's unfair imo but it seems very intentional in spell chains

Bombs are true%

Only eyes and rings are true raw

I'll be very sad if the rings are removed instead of a proper telegraph being added

[fresh glacier]

Yea

[green zodiac]

Watched is true damage too

But yeah speedup does take another big threat out of the fight and players may just easily strafe or facetank greg even more so now

[fresh glacier]

Could we get lumia to see this thread maybe?

[green zodiac]

I think it would have been interesting if perhaps speedup got a telegraph, or it was used primarily when greg is far from whatever player he's targeting

[fresh glacier]

Yeah

[sudden trellis]

Free Donut > free champion rank

[green zodiac]

@jolly notch

Hi welcome to the thread

[fresh glacier]

Lol

[jolly notch]

hi

just to clarify when I mean removed the damage aura I mean the thing with lava particles at 25% hp

not the purple rings

[fresh glacier]

So just that Greg doesn't go faster anymore?

[jolly notch]

he doesn't get the speed up when doing the purple ring attack

[green zodiac]

Mmk

So just leaves the purple true damage rings behind him for a short time now

[fresh glacier]

Hmm, still think a telegraph or what frozen suggested could of been more interestin

Since it still has the challenge but isn't as bs

[fast sky]

Yeah I like the idea of a sudden lethal charge but it suddenly happening out of nowhere can be quite unfair

[jolly notch]

What was the suggestion?

[green zodiac]

Add a telegraph to the speedup or make it primarily trigger when greg is really far from the player he's targeting

[fresh glacier]

Greg only does it when the person he's targeting isn't extremely close, telegraph would be better imo

[fast sky]

Without a telegraph, even if the speed is removed there's some situation like shadestepper going in for a few backstabs but is suddenly destroyed by the rings

[hushed axle]

It would be really hard to do that second one

probably not possible with our current system

[green zodiac]

💀

[fresh glacier]

Telegraph probs then

[hardy whale]

oh it will, gotta get that free LE

[jolly notch]

ill add a better telegraph, making him only target people far away is impossible

[fresh glacier]

Will speed be back though? I think speed is fine if it has a telegraph, it's kinda fun/cool

[jolly notch]

maybe

if i do do that it will not be as fast

[green zodiac]

That is fine

[jolly notch]

so when the boss got the speedbost 2 things happened, 1 his speed got set to double, and 2 whenever he cast a circle he would get a little push forward to the next one, I have decided to only keep 1 of these speed boosts as I think both of them made it way too hard to get away, I'm not sure which to keep ,though I am leaning towards the pushes.

Also I checked and he does have a telegraph for that spell it's just a pain in the ass to see, I made it much easier to see, make more noise, and and also gave it a longer wait after the telegraph, before it waited .3 seconds to start lmao

[nimble patio]

oh that’s a shame don’t remove the speed up

i think the boss needs these strong attacks just give it an indicator so he can’t just kill you out of nowhere

[fast sky]

It's not removed.
Anyways I think the push on ring creation is cooler out of the two, I assume that's also responsible for keeping the boss airborne on its jasmine bloom combo.

[muted roost]

would the “doubled movement speed” speed boost be the one that’s gonna be removed?

[fresh glacier]

on rings yeah that would be nice, if it's not a lot rn buff it a little but if it's fine on it's own then yeah

[green zodiac]

0.3s tiny telegraph 🤯

[native crow]

dies instantly

[hardy whale]

proceeds to blame it on lack of telegraph ||(definitely in denial on their skill issue)||

[nimble patio]

if possible, could most of the tna rooms have auto teleports once the challenge is completed?

unfortunately sometimes some random guy goes afk and we're stuck waiting for them to come back to move on

tcc has auto teleports in some of its rooms so i dont know why tna doesnt unless it simply isnt possible

[jolly notch]

auto teleports are only done when they really make sense, like in the berry room it doesn't because it doesn't really have a good place to put a portal to teleport out

[nimble patio]

berry room not having one makes sense because the way you leave the room is once the challenge is completed

but for stuff like gather/tree/hold

[jolly notch]

I mean they could I guess, but I find them kinda jarring most of the time and not as interactive

I think they can make the game feel too much like it's playing yourself

[hushed axle]

I mean, wouldn't this be a problem even without the auto teleport.

[nimble patio]

wdym

[hushed axle]

some guy going afk

[jolly notch]

they will still be stuck in the buff room once they get teleported

[nimble patio]

yeah itd be a problem because theres a timer in buff room but still

[jolly notch]

I think doing this just because some people go afk is causing more problems and fixing a problem that is caused by one player being annoying

[hushed axle]

Either way I don't think we should account for random people going afk in raid rooms.

[nimble patio]

im not saying the auto teleports for these specific rooms needs to be quick but i just did a run where in tree room the last guy was afk for 6 minutes and sitting in the altar and having to still kill mobs jumping in is a bit annoying

[jolly notch]

oh you mean like that

[nimble patio]

ya

[jolly notch]

I guess it could be done but again it would be a pretty good amount of work for such a tiny thing that I personally don't really think is an issue

[nimble patio]

it's a rather small issue yeah just wondering if it was possible

if it takes a lot of work then just whatever i guess not the end of the world

[hushed axle]

yeah...

[nimble patio]

also im unsure if this is known/intended but it seems that only CIP/CIB/CUR/CGG keys are in the loot table

i wouldnt be totally opposed to make it so certain keys only drop from certain raids but every key drops from both nol/tcc so i find it a bit odd

[digital sentinel]

cur seems rarer than the other keys?

[nimble patio]

cur does seem to be the rarest of the ones available yeah

[misty charm]

when the SE raid doesnt drop EO keys

[hardy whale]

what an anomaly

[hushed axle]

When the anomaly is nameless

[hardy whale]

https://tenor.com/view/lilshpee-doug-walker-clapping-nostalgia-critic-hulk-gif-26577966

[nimble patio]

when the nameless is anomaly

[native crow]

the nameless ana-l

[hardy whale]

: Hey Aftershokke, these editable ain’t shi-

[native crow]

such garvan

[hardy whale]

Garvan: don’t come to the village tomorrow human.

🤓

[native crow]

im terrified

[nimble patio]

are the ethereal roots in hold room bugged? they seem to only ever spawn once at the beginning and never again

i like the idea of them and that they're what summons the lasers (this is what ive been told but im not sure) but they dont ever spawn and the lasers deal too little damage to be a threat

[digital sentinel]

I don't notice lasers even existing

and honestly didn't even know what they did until now

pretty sure they used to respawn

[misty charm]

double greg bug is back

i'd report it but i'm lazy as hell

[nimble patio]

back as if it ever left

[hardy whale]

I like the part of the raid where Greg says " Its Greggin time ", and kills all the human warriors by spawning a second greg.

[dense solstice]

also u can just stand onthe side and not get hit lol

[native crow]

why warriors, im classing classism

[hardy whale]

Not even referring to warrior archetype, referring to fighters

[native crow]

:O

i like the part when i said its raidin time and i raided

best part of tna

[uncut island]

did the s get changed?
like the detection of you being in the air and charging a few more times

[green zodiac]

They got nerfed yeah

[native crow]

ive never seen the skulls

[misty charm]

has the nerf been pushed yet though

[vast elm]

Is there a place to see all the changes to Tna it seems like Greg’s rules are changing every week now

[hardy whale]

community can't make up their mind up on greg sadly

[fresh glacier]

What were greg changes

[green zodiac]

Who knows

[hardy whale]

i predict hotfix #420 will bring tna boss theme

[vast elm]

Provoke nerf suck imo, fix the boss don’t nerf a class cause ur dumb. My 2 cents

[digital sentinel]

walls are void holes

[astral thistle]

taunt basically useless against greg

[astral thistle]

mobs have too much health

a soul shrub with 500k hp

3 teammates can't even stop mobs from damage void hole

[misty charm]

soul shrubs are punching bags anyway and i just recently did a run where the void hole took no damage

[astral thistle]

But non mythic team deal no damage

Main problem is 2 player die and lower the damage output

I'm mage but I'm too busy collecting void matter

[misty charm]

L

[native crow]

Shut

[native crow]

I did a 4m long Greg boss fight with a morph user and no mythics

Yeah there were 4m 30s before server restart

And we even got the loot and no wallhugging

[astral thistle]

Rare occurrence

[native crow]

True but yes

[fast sky]

so provoke nerf, I don't think I like it and I assume it's to fix what's going on in TNA. I don't think its the way to go if the boss and barrier is still the same since you don't need provoke to do so, and as a palamonk player it feels meh to not have control over aggro.

it does keep corner cheese somewhat in check i suppose

do we have any exact details on this?

Nerfed some of The Nameless Anomaly's boss spells
I haven't noticed the telegraph for purple rings yet, but I do feel charg void holes being smaller

[nimble patio]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/262012605445439488/1017996311179567124/Wynncraft_2022-09-09_23-12-15_Trim.mp4

[fresh glacier]

erm

[muted roost]

:doom:

[fresh glacier]

Hmm, imagine if there was like a white particle circle where the leap aoe would be

[fast sky]

my favorite tna clip

[astral thistle]

You don't have time to dodge that if you stay too close

[muted roost]

does that attack just do a large amount of damage it hits you?

[astral thistle]

Yea

Well, no but you are archer

Probably 7000 damage

[fast sky]

7500 damage

[nimble patio]

speedup doesnt seem to exist anymore

as in, the actual speed up where he goes zoom

he can just randomly spawn purple circles now though it seems

[fresh glacier]

didnt lumia say they were gonna remove one of em but keep the other?

[muted roost]

yes

[nimble patio]

didnt know

[fast sky]

i dont see pushes nor speedup

but I think I got the sound telegraph now, it's like 1s prior to the attack and is a somewhat generic sound

[native crow]

BUFF GREG
NO NERF GREG
NO BUFF GREG
🤯
😡

rip CT

[fast sky]

i think the hitbox nerfs are very justified

[astral thistle]

greg deserve to be stuck because it has no brain

[nimble patio]

TRUE

[dense solstice]

that’s some bullshit wtf

[misty charm]

quake pro/dynamic fov issue

[hushed axle]

Here were the nerfs to The Nameless' Spells:
Denial of Freedom:

• Decreased amount of times the heads charge 5 -> 3 (and 7 -> 5 if you are in the air.
• Made it so you have to be 5 blocks above the ground to count as being "in the air".
• The Nameless should also use this spell less often.

Earthshatter:

• Hitboxes reduced.
• Spell does a bit more air damage.

Rend the Barrier:

• Initial damage hitboxes reduced.

The Void Howls:

• Removed the fast leaps that the Nameless did when casting this spell. (Speed still is increased)
• Added a longer delay between the damage starting and the sound cue.
• Changed the particles and noise cue for the spell.

[fast sky]

i miss the leaps, i prefer those to speedup personally

otherwise other changes are pretty nice

i've yet to find the particle cue for the void howls, and I find the sound cue hardly distinguishable from the void bleeds

[hushed axle]

Ground pound nerf was maybe a bit too much imo but yeah

[fast sky]

what's the radius for earthshatter now?

I could update the wiki with the new info if we get the numbers, unless that's already done I'll check rq

[hushed axle]

Used to be 12 for all damages but now it is 10 for neutral, 8 for water and thunder, and 3 for air.

[fast sky]

thats very interesting

does total damage increase from before if you are within 3?

[hushed axle]

also the air damage was buffed

[fast sky]

any chance we get the exact damage numbers?

[hushed axle]

Air damage went from 1.1k to 3.1k

the rest is the same

[fast sky]

alright thanks

[hushed axle]

I wonder if the paladin nerfs will affect the stalling problem.

[fast sky]

if you mean the barrier cheese people will likely turn to trickster soon as long as the corner is still available and get the boss stuck

[green zodiac]

Yeah it will just get replaced with lure cheese

As long as those barrier wall inlets exist then it'll be an issue

[hushed axle]

Oh well, hopefully trickster will be changed a lot before then

cause we all know it needs it.

[green zodiac]

[fast sky]

I think people will always abuse the cheese as long as the root of the problem is not gone

either pathfinding needs to be worked on somehow, or the barrier needs to be gone

[hushed axle]

probably the 2nd one

(also I still want the speed to be nerfed)

[fast sky]

I still like the idea of being able to fall off the edge (1 block gap so the nameless doesn't fall in) with the fall into void hole effect

[hushed axle]

ehhhhh

I prefer the rectangle idea

[green zodiac]

Rectangle is probably just going to be the likely solution

It's the easiest

Though don't change the cool block pattern design just add a solid rectangle outlining where the invisible barriers are

[fast sky]

yeah I suppose just perfect rectangle works

[green zodiac]

Though another idea I saw that came from a different feedback thread was to expand the arena size but make that expanded area deal damage like NoL's blood ruin

So luring greg to the wall just means stacking damage

While still actually having barriers in the arena so nothing falls off

[nimble patio]

pretty good changes

[native crow]

my teamates are dying to the heart of darkness

[hardy whale]

they end up without a pulse.

[native crow]

shocking change was soul shrub getting 600k hp

[scenic pasture]

get rid of the skulls

[buoyant quail]

Lads, prepare for trickster nerfs next patch

[buoyant quail]

They were nerfed now

[hardy whale]

The spells here to stay, best you’re getting are nerfs

[misty charm]

ground pound was arguably fine but i guess it does make sense for it to hurt more the closer you are to the center

oh yeah what's the radius of the leap thing now

[hushed axle]

4 for the first void hole, then 6 for the second, then 8 for the rest.

before it was 8 for all

[green zodiac]

Cool

[quasi idol]

day 1 morbillion of asking to barrier block off the parts of the arena that disable gregs abilities

[hushed axle]

I am somewhat thinking that I may have nerfed the skull spell a bit too much.

Is it still a threat? It is meant to be kind of a big deal.

[hardy whale]

Interesting when things get nerfed to oblivion and barely suit its purpose, ppl start to realize it’s lost it’s effectiveness due to evasiveness.

[hushed axle]

Yeah I think me nerfing it was a bit reactionary

[hardy whale]

“ Oh Greg, It’s 5PM! Time for your daily skill/stat edits! “

Greg:

[hushed axle]

but honestly balancing stuff with ability tree is hard

[hushed axle]

Greg post-nerf

[fast sky]

The new frequency is fine but maybe it could hurt a bit more

[hardy whale]

We should start talking about replacing Shepard w/ a third summon

[hushed axle]

We will be in an endless cycle of constantly buffing and nerfing him...

[nimble patio]

thats fine honestly

[fast sky]

Ig that's natural for mechanically challenging boss

[nimble patio]

i can see why it may be a bit annoying as a staff member who has to make those changes and is constantly hearing feedback to either buff or nerf

[hardy whale]

GREG: JUST KILL ME ALREADY!

Poobis: Look, I’m a villain. Not a monster

[nimble patio]

but that's just how it goes with an evolving meta i think

[hardy whale]

https://tenor.com/view/peter-griffin-forklift-boulevard-og-og-gif-18953497

[fast sky]

It's hard to know whether the boss is too easy/hard or the player is too good/bad

[nimble patio]

skulls are still actually somewhat lethal to me as a shaman with blood connection but they do feel a bit ignorable for most other classes now

[hushed axle]

also maybe just after release isn't the best time to gauge feedback

[hardy whale]

If that’s the case then we should start talking about why Shepard should be replaced with a third summon-

[placid loom]

Imo long exposure to difficult content also makes it slightly, but increasingly difficult to tell easy and hard apart, as the player improves

[nimble patio]

tbh i kinda just dislike that the attack uses greg skull models because trying to keep track of them compared to every other attack can be quite difficult, they blend in really easy with everything else

[fast sky]

This might be a weird take but I think the power level of healing and raw ehp here makes it very hard to balance the boss for everyone

[nimble patio]

you can probably make them more lethal

[fast sky]

You can't kill things like acolyte or mage easily without using an attack that's instantly lethal

But if you want to kill those reliably you are going to kill everyone else

[hardy whale]

Yeah, Greg’s attacks are more hellish the more ppl die

[fast sky]

Healing is so potent rn that if you cannot kill someone in like 5s they may already fully recover

[hushed axle]

Thoughts on the lunge hitbox changes?

[nimble patio]

i feel some of those issues are relegated to the power of the player instead of the boss

the great thing about 2.0 nerfing defense/agility ehp scaling is that old raids were balanced around the fact that super tanky builds were easy and mainstake and so they had to still be lethal to those builds which really just fucked over anything that relied on agility or low defensive sp in general

[fast sky]

I like that

[hushed axle]

hopefully the spell doesn't feel too different.

[fast sky]

And yeah I really think def/agi nerf was necessary

[hardy whale]

Still feels the same if you are too slow

[fast sky]

It's less cheap when you are too close during the roar now

[hushed axle]

Yeah that change was supposed to be QOL in how I still want the attack to be very deadly but less cheap for warriors and such

[nimble patio]

to be honest the lunge attack and ground pound still feel pretty obnoxiously large but that could just be my personal desire of wanting to try and consistently no hit the boss but after seeing the stats and changes so where the spells are only really lethal when you're super close, it's pretty fine in practice

it ends up just resulting in the spells for me a lot of the time just being unavoidable minute chip damage which isnt inherently bad

so long as you avoid the main damage of the spells by being too close

[fast sky]

There's a way to partially fix the inflated recovery problem but I think it's quite artificial: anti-healing mechanics

Let's say the nameless melee applies 2 seconds of wither effect (like vanish)

[hardy whale]

Guys and gals I have an idea for Greg, if we talk about the boss theme not being there in the fight, they surely have to add it in (actually don’t do this it’s a joke)

[fast sky]

Now no matter how tanky you are you will not facetank it forever

But as I said it will feel very artificial

[hushed axle]

Honestly I'd rather just wait for a potential ehp nerf before adding anything too drastic.

[nimble patio]

anti healing mechanics to me often feel like artificial difficulty and really only emerge as a result of player healing being too strong (which it is)

2.0 was meant to nerf heal but after so many players cried over it it was rebuffed to be arguably better than it was in 1.20 💀

[hushed axle]

but who knows

[fast sky]

Yeah healing is too strong and it's just a quick fix to that, I'd rather nerf healing instead