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#📚lore_discussion
fallow thistle
paper wyvern
Yeah canonically other players are just radom wynn soldiers you picked up on the street
clear scaffold
really the only canon wynn soldiers on your journey are you and whoever you're friends with on your journey
paper wyvern
So yes the player did go to cinfras and then ask for anyone who had experience in parasite removal and killing gods
clear scaffold
i still think it's canon the player is the only one who survives every time
fallow thistle
So yes the player did go to cinfras and then ask for anyone who had experience i...
Weakest Persona protagonist:
clear scaffold
(unless it's you and your friends then you got other survivors
lavish knot
Some mercs would be less surprise about the bs the player deals with
clear scaffold
TNA really needs a quest associated with it
hybrid gazelle
but tBH personally
I feel like player soloing is not too impossible
but then again I am fan of Half life series
where a fucking guy solo eldritch entity with a shotgun
and crowbar
fallow thistle
TNA really needs a quest associated with it
Generally I'd love more lore for the silent expanse.
paper wyvern
TNA
The end of ajf aledar asks the player to grab soldiers to help with EO
So presumably they end up getting stuck in tna along the way
clear scaffold
Wouldn't surprise me if the player did that but lost them all in TNA
and just soloed EO after
paper wyvern
(tna really needs a quest)
lone charm
I think I would consider only parts of raid canon
paper wyvern
I mean the raids are cannon, it's just doing them multiple times isnt
fallow thistle
The end of ajf aledar asks the player to grab soldiers to help with EO
But then again, how the hell would we even get soldiers there. We lost quite the powerful party just coming into the silent expanse.
clear scaffold
But then again, how the hell would we even get soldiers there. We lost quite the...
powerful?
lone charm
The multiple people - Pretend you are carrying them
Only the first run is cannon
The decay is dieing as slowly as it spreas
clear scaffold
i saw three idiots die to pure stupidity
clear scaffold
I will defend lucio
that was pure bad luck
but elephba and aledar was stupidity
lone charm
Aledar say elphaba is a powerful warrior - She dies to a small insect
clear scaffold
and chases after her liver
lone charm
but elephba and aledar was stupidity
I mean he literally whacked his head into a cliff
clear scaffold
lucio's the only one of the three where i could make the argument that was less stupidity and he was going to die
paper wyvern
imo the only reason you dont go back for more help after ajb and go straight into ajf is because aledar knows he wont survive long enough and wants his death to at least open the outlook
clear scaffold
the obsessor cancelling a spell defintely made it clear he was just going to be a target till he or it died
lone charm
the obsessor cancelling a spell defintely made it clear he was just going to be ...
True
But it was still partially his fault, we told him not to go closer
paper wyvern
also the reason why you are actually able to bring people to tna/eo is that the player character isnt an idiot and also knows the dangers
lone charm
It was obviously not a real miner
clear scaffold
But it was still partially his fault, we told him not to go closer
to be fair... i don't think there's been an enemy that can immobilise you.
like that instantly.
clear scaffold
even if i didn't believe it was a real miner i would expect to survive a close combat encounter or at least have a chance
lone charm
crystallines remants immobilize you
Really? How does that actually work all I know is that it froze me and killed me
paper wyvern
Really? How does that actually work all I know is that it froze me and killed me
if you kill a crystaline it starts the immobilization
lone charm
if you kill a crystaline it starts the immobilization
Ohhh, even if you are solo?
clear scaffold
I still love the idea the player went for backup for EO. Got side tracked with TNA and lost everyone so soloed the eye
paper wyvern
Ohhh, even if you are solo?
if your solo it immobilizes you but you are instantly released with a bunhc of damage
lone charm
if your solo it immobilizes you but you are instantly released with a bunhc of d...
Okay
edgy loom
I'm making a little player 2nd sovereign collage
anyone knows who this was talking about?
who is invested in our continued survival
lone charm
I would say orphion
Feels like the only person who has that amount of leverage with death
paper wyvern
beyond the grave is post rol level wise
edgy loom
I would say orphion
so it's not confirmed hm
I wonder if that someone could be watching us
lone charm
beyond the grave is post rol level wise
So?
edgy loom
am I on crack or is it plausible
lone charm
so orphion is in good health enough to send a letter to death to ask
Ah, sorry I thought you were saying that as a point against
Mb
edgy loom
about the fruma arg, didn't we get to see text from the queen?
idk if it was fake but I saw her reply floating around
there was this one
and then there was a reply from the queen
lavish knot
If the player isn't the second, at the very least, second is still highly invested with the player
clear scaffold
i'd say just treat that beyond the grave quest as non-canon
death as a character sure should be canon
lone charm
The player being the second also changes the tone of the story to much
clear scaffold
but interested in the continued survival thing eh
paper wyvern
If the player isn't the second, at the very least, second is still highly invest...
the second isnt about the player thats what to end with is about
lone charm
but interested in the continued survival thing eh
I was just about to say I think that part was the most canon lol
clear scaffold
there's people interested but the entire talking to death about it
edgy loom
slightly looks better
lavish knot
Fire
dry aspen
If the player isn't the second, at the very least, second is still highly invest...
watch as Tasim is the second sovreign lolol
would be the funniest stuff ever
lavish knot
watch as Tasim is the second sovreign lolol
Higly unlikely unless he's running away from the guards and hides in a random ass hut in RtP
dry aspen
yeah, I was just kidding around, would give me a good laugh if it was true
lavish knot
I don't mind it if they forshadowed it early on tho
edgy loom
btw the 1st sovereign is just the queen right
paper wyvern
I would assume so but we dont actually know
edgy loom
Auburn Forest
Industrial District
Mistwoods
Highlands
Aelumia Citadel
The Wastelands
mossy badge
Names
edgy loom
Auburn Forest - Zhiraok
Industrial District - Soosu
Mistwoods - Gikyo
Highlands - Majin
Aelumia Citadel
The Wastelands
Aelumia Citadel - The domain of the Crown's authority and power. Each of Fruma's regions rest in the shadow of Aelumia Citadel, a constant reminder of its rule. Within its walls reside the province's most valued citizens, guarded by the best and strongest of the Fruman Wings: the Gendarme.
Each sovereign watches over a region
so it makes sense that the Queen would be the 1st Sovereign of the Aelumia Citadel
edgy loom
Some1 watching over the wastelands tho?
that'd be the 2nd
cerulean osprey
we don't know
mossy badge
Oh right
cerulean osprey
since wastelands aren't out yet
mossy badge
Maybe
edgy loom
funny how the wastelands is the region we know the least, just as the 2nd is the sovereign we know the least
paper wyvern
wastelands isnt even gonna be in fruma update lmao
hybrid gazelle
The queen being soverign just strange
because then it like
reduadunt
so I highly dbout the queen is a soverign
cause that not only mean for some reaosn the queen apply the role that suppose to be extension of her self
on herself??
but also implication that soverign can become the queen in the event of her death
edgy loom
I don't think it's that crazy
hybrid gazelle
which then would not make Fruma a monarchy
edgy loom
the citadel is already where she resides
she already has representatives in 5 other regions
lavish knot
The Queen would be the head of the sovereign
edgy loom
she can take care of one + the rest of the kingdom
clear scaffold
i will point out sovereign's are more likely her commanders.
So she wouldn't be a sovereign
hybrid gazelle
yeah extactly
clear scaffold
she'd just be leading them
hybrid gazelle
she being soverign would not make any lick of sense
if she is a soverign then that imply other soverign can ascend to her position
which would not be monarchy
clear scaffold
now whether she watches VERY closely over them or she just lets them do their own thing is a better question
edgy loom
so where's the 1st sovereign teaser
hybrid gazelle
we dont know
also
the number on soverign is not canon
it's just marketting thing
lavish knot
There's no first sovereign
edgy loom
that's kinda why I think the queen fits
hybrid gazelle
so the number can be left out
clear scaffold
wouldn't surprise me if she's just like "they're loyal enough i don't care"
hybrid gazelle
We dont know yet, they might exist or they do not
edgy loom
the number on soverign is not canon
was this also confirmed by some dev
edgy loom
jfc
hybrid gazelle
there is no sixth or fifth
edgy loom
so the 2nd isn't any more powerful than the 6th?
even though they even have increasing levels?
hybrid gazelle
increasing level is just gameplay thing
the character need to have higher number than the last so keep up with the player
as it been discussed to death
mossy badge
Aint the order based on when they got their role
hybrid gazelle
no
edgy loom
the character need to have higher number than the last so keep up with the playe...
this is with cows and zombies at the start of the game
the sovereigns are over lvl 120
mossy badge
So 6th being the latest is just
edgy loom
it's purely aesthetic
mossy badge
Happens to be
hybrid gazelle
it for gameplay sake
edgy loom
yeah but let's say you have the 6 sovereigns in a room
and you can see one has higher lvl than the other
hybrid gazelle
So 6th being the latest is just
6th is purely for marketting
still does not matter
again
edgy loom
surely that has to mean something
hybrid gazelle
level is in game thing
even then if 6 soverigns in the room as dialogue npc
the level wont show
it only shown on boss fight
edgy loom
edgy loom
majin even changes his due to his ego
hybrid gazelle
it's in order to show when you fight them in level
this one likely just a joke to reflect the character
it likely subtle nod to his character
edgy loom
yeah ofc
hybrid gazelle
even then level is just gameplay
there is no number to dictate people strength
it work like real life
edgy loom
it's not like lvls are completely arbitrary though
I'm pretty sure there have been plenty of lvl 999 characters to show they were unbeatable
I get that in the grand scheme of things they dont mean anything
but sometimes they're put with purpose
hybrid gazelle
Yes because it's gameplay way to show that the player unable to beat those character at the current point
sometime level can be use to convey a story or the tone but in the end
they are not main way to dictate or consider in the actual universe
when a boss have lvl 999
it's telling players in the gameplay that this fight is not meant to be winnable
or the player is out match
but the actual boss fight where they are fightable could lvl 200 or whatever
in summary levels can be use as subtle way for story telling but they should not be use as concrete
clear scaffold
actually they should probably, they give you an idea on who's stronger just from the idea alone
if you want to compare strengths you can tend to go off levels just to give you an approximation on what the game says is stronger
edgy loom
like, orphion is lvl 150
and yet ofc he isnt weaker than any of the sovereigns
one can understand that, you fight them at different points of the game
hybrid gazelle
yeah but the problem is
edgy loom
but the sovereigns are all... so close
clear scaffold
to be fair you are fighting a weakened orphion
hybrid gazelle
the problem to that kind of logic
potent latch
Dullahan begging lari to fight the parasite for 200 years vs the player eavesdropping on a conversation (Lari's magic marks you for death!)
clear scaffold
you're fighting the equivalent of a zombie when it comes to orphion
hybrid gazelle
You would imply this random ass bandit would solo goliath
potent latch
(ik there was a lot more to it but i think it was funny that it took like a week for us to do what dullahan couldn't in 200 years)
clear scaffold
a well armed bandit probably could
hybrid gazelle
You cant be telling me
that a bandit is more properly geared
than a guard of a kingdom
that literally wear full armor
clear scaffold
didn't that guard literally get snuck up on
hybrid gazelle
and probably have more experience in fighting these undead
edgy loom
I think I explained it
hybrid gazelle
yes
edgy loom
you fight them at different points in the game
and these guy's levels can match your own
hybrid gazelle
even then we got like other goliaths
Levels are gamepaly exclusive thing
simple as
you can use them as evidence but never use them as primary evidence
edgy loom
but the sovereigns
- are all in the same general range
- their levels are artificial, they're all above the player's
hybrid gazelle
they are pretty much secondary or lower
because then you broguht up a lot of issue
edgy loom
you can use them as evidence but never use them as primary evidence
the thing is that the lvls already coincide with the fact they're numbered, then we also have the rookie (Zhiraok) being both the 6st and the one with lowest lvl
it kinda paints a story
and the general is the one with higher lvl
clear scaffold
lowest level sovereign is the newbie and probably not doing much combat wise
dry aspen
the thing is that the lvls already coincide with the fact they're numbered, then...
probably the level progression is to show that you go up the ranks as the update said that you sort of need to talk to the sovreigns in order to have an audience with the queen I think
you go from the lowest to the highest as they sort of send you to the next rung of the ladder I suppose
candid cliff
my favorite soldier interaction is that secret discovery with bak'al
where he murders them brutally
but before that they coordinate on a few zombies which is so cool
edgy loom
The skins revealed some names huh
what are you talking about
mossy badge
Weapon skins in the fruma bundles named after leaves members
flat sandal
we currently don't have any openings, but we are planning to cast some NPCs around the time Fruma releases
acoustic ledge
I'm really interested in voicing some crazy npcs
flat sandal
Go for it! As long as you have a functioning mic, pretty much anyone can audition for anything
We're always looking for new people to cast when auditions are open
slim belfry
somehow did not realize until now that sharpshooter nodes refer to mael like twain's arc, phantom ray, and ghostly trigger
lone charm
Yeah
slim belfry
feel like I failed as I am both a sharpshooter and like mael out of the twains 🫠
quartz mist
yeah this is an important point about story stuff- sometimes you just gotta move the story along. in that instance, I didn't see a good or feasibly workable alternate solution for an orc ingratiating himself with the player to get them to quit killing for a while- something within the bounds of both system and story. i at least attempted to have it make sense by having you get ganged up on by four of them at once and attacked repeatedly- it wasn't a one-off tap on the head
hybrid gazelle
Yeah thst like the best thing you could do to get the story going
Also player being this untouchable god also make the story boring and less stake
And a moment to humble the player also just allow player to stay grounded and kick high on ego
I dare to even say wynncraft did not humble player enough
slender copper
Also player being this untouchable god also make the story boring and less stake
I keep on forgetting that the player technically does all of this on their first try and doesn't die 12 times to complete one quest lol.
hybrid gazelle
yeah lol
also due to technological limitation
many fight in the game have you fight alone
this reuslt in pretty convey the player pretty much solo everything
slender copper
this reuslt in pretty convey the player pretty much solo everything
I mean Beyond the Grave proves that it isn't going to be first try without dying, but still... a solo nonetheless.
hybrid gazelle
yeah BoG
slender copper
But then, technically everyone (the npcs) sees it as a first time thing so... yeah-
torpid merlin
A butterfly effect caused by the player caused the scales to tip
slender copper
Now I'm starting to see why a lot of Wynncraft players want the [player] to get a canonical beat down in Fruma... one that the [player] can't reset/get up easily from.
lyric laurel
are the cows from fruma?
lyric laurel
I just did the cowfusion quest, and it suggested them needing a ship, being exiles, and not being from gavel
so like, either they are aliens, or are like fruma or smth
candid cliff
yeah this is an important point about story stuff- sometimes you just gotta move...
I don't like it
but there's much worse "player gets knocked out"
so you did an okay job regardless
and the quest is also before all the crazy stuff happens
Or most of it, at least
quartz mist
and it is stated that, albeit with the help of Orc Catapult, those guards did overpower iron golems
hybrid gazelle
TBH I can see orcs able to put up a fight against golems
dim plover
yeah this is an important point about story stuff- sometimes you just gotta move...
There were only two guards actually
Did the quest twice last week
quartz mist
There were only two guards actually
there's four. two are right in front of you, two leap down from the towers to surround you from behind
dim plover
Oh
Probably never noticed that that’s cool
Btw it would be pretty funny (and plothole-closing) if the game actually does acknowledge one time on why or how the player gets so easily knocked out from a swift swipe to the back of the head as a legitimate in-universe weakness
Makes the thing a running gag rather than a “how on earth did I get knocked out so easily”
lyric laurel
Yo, what does the quest "mixed feelings" imply?
hybrid gazelle
there is patriot
lyric laurel
felt like the last bit of dialouge had some pretty important stuff
hybrid gazelle
that literally it
there like uhh
patriot who know what going on in the world and uhh
yeah they never relevant again beside very few mention
also get mad at Wynn for fighting a war they never started but like I guess that in line for people who is ultranationalist
lyric laurel
He seems like he knows some shit, nods to the prelude to annialation world event, nods to fruma and our memory loss
hybrid gazelle
oh no this is wAYYYY before annie
or even it conception
but he probably know about war of the realm
so like
weird okay
but then again this is like era of wynncraft lore where people just know or do out of their ass so
dont worry baout it these guys hold no important later on
lyric laurel
Ok, so everytime we die, we have a gameshow with Mr.Death himself, then beat whatever kills us
ok
unique hill
yep
edgy loom
And a moment to humble the player also just allow player to stay grounded and ki...
the "humbling" comes from killing gods solo and then learning the wynn team made a one off statement in outside material about them only using 0.1% power xd
the player def has to be more than just a normal recruit though
after being granted access to the fallen factory we solo'd it
as the royal report confirms, we were able to fully solve corkus's mech problem
if it was so easy then the corkians would've gotten another random soldier to go deal with it
hybrid gazelle
sure whatever that is
edgy loom
in lore what did the Eye even do
was his job just to guard the dern portal
holy hell
glass acorn
Btw it would be pretty funny (and plothole-closing) if the game actually does ac...
ik what you mean but personally i just thought they got hit in that soft spot just at the base of the skull, that spots like a great weakness for practically anyone if you hit it properly
hybrid gazelle
yeah espically when you get it by surpirse
which mean you unprepare to take a hit
it make a huge different whenever if you expect to get hit or not
glass acorn
most good helms would cover it, but we're also just kind of roaming vagabonds rather then properly supplied so we might just be getting badly designed hats lol
edgy loom
it'd be cool if we actually got knocked out when fighting gods instead of randos for quest progression
hybrid gazelle
most knockout part serve a narrative purpose to get player into situation otherwise they normally would not be
being knock out in most "gods" fight in wynncraft just ruinning the pace and tension
edgy loom
I think that one corkian quest where we take the rage potionTM did it best
hybrid gazelle
you were drugged yes
hybrid gazelle
that still drugged
like
that is like still drugged
you were trick into drinking substance
edgy loom
no, wynncraft is good boys and girls
hybrid gazelle
ok
edgy loom
just like nemract whiskey is actually the potion of drunkeness
there is no alcohol in our glorious wynncraft
dim plover
just like nemract whiskey is actually the potion of drunkeness
It’s not called that anymore lol
glass acorn
after the eldrich outlook opened, we shouldve gotten a quest keepsake that was the dagger and it just has a description of "Look what we did"
glass acorn
ol seaskippers a bit senile
edgy loom
anything else is propaganda
slim belfry
a potion is in itself a drug because it's a medicine which is also a drug
simple as that
glass acorn
alcohol really do just be the shorter name for potion of drunkness anyway
slim belfry
yeah same thing really
lone charm
What a lot of people don't realise, is that irl alcohol is actually a drug
chilly tulip
Do you think that we’ll learn what allows humans to use magic with Fruma quests, or do yall think it will be something that can just happen with people
hybrid gazelle
we alreayd learn of this with the Twain
some human just happen to be able to use magic instinctly
as if they are born with talent for it
fruma likely similar case
edgy loom
doesnt the order of the grook talk about each species' magical prowess
some species just naturally can use mana
hybrid gazelle
doesnt the order of the grook talk about each species' magical prowess
yes but twain library also say that some individual despite being spieces of lower innate
can be born with higher magic innate than other of their kind
aka the twain
that like
plain ingot
IIRC all humans can do magic just fine, they just tend to have a "lock" that keeps the power from being used. The Villagers then came and taught humans how to unlock those capabilities. (And some people, such as the Twains, did not need to do that "unlocking" stuff.)
hybrid gazelle
literally what make the twain speciaal
hybrid gazelle
IIRC all humans can do magic just fine, they just tend to have a "lock" that kee...
this lock pretty much
being uneducated LOL
abstract fiber
Now I'm starting to see why a lot of Wynncraft players want the [player] to get ...
I so want this to happen in Fruma at some point (like 10% of health, 10% of mana for like an entire quest or something, decreased movement speed too idk?)
clear scaffold
was his job just to guard the dern portal
pretty much
He keeps an eye on the main passage (EO) and the side passage (fantastic voyage)
formal bridge
what happens if orphion dies
It mainly depends on if the entire realm of light could die, since they're one and the same. Dern is certainly trying with all it's breaking space and reality stuff, so if nothing else that could happen and leave Orphion in many broken pieces
lone charm
was his job just to guard the dern portal
No, his job was actually to watch the entirety of Wynn, and spread the darkness to drain hope to spread the dern beasts influence actually
glass acorn
beating orphion was chill like we were fighting him under the control of a parasite, not him actually wanting to kill us, but its still super funny how we just go and poke out the eye of basically a god
regal walrus
Canonically I imagine we can weaken him
Like we curse him with light so he is at least stoppable
glass acorn
either that or maybe buff ourselves to his level somehow
tribal crystal
question what does the talking mushroom say being inside the bank feels like? (aka inside an ender chest)
lavish knot
From where?
dim plover
How strong is the dern beast
Isn’t Dern Beast literally god
Or like, one of the two legitimate gods in the game
shut mist
orphion is also a god
hybrid gazelle
It hard to gauge power for realm beasts
Because of the lack of feat and understanding of what realms beast is
While what we know is that they are manifestation of their own respective force
The full extend of their power still unknown
lavish knot
We fought Orphion while he was controlled, prolly tried his best to hold back
hybrid gazelle
Tbh wish they explore realm beasts feel more like eldritch god
Rather thst being present now
dry aspen
what if the dern raid comes out and it's just nol but e v i l
and the dern beast is Orphion but black instead of white
hybrid gazelle
I highly doubt we going to fight Dern beast in raid consider how narratively important Dern beast is
That gameplay focus content like raid will lessen space for narrative flexibility when you defeat seemingly final antagonist of the story
I think ct already learn how trying to have an ending to a storyline being raid devalue the story
So I highly doubt they will do it to Dern beast o fall character
dry aspen
I highly doubt we going to fight Dern beast in raid consider how narratively imp...
I know, but I always have these funny thoughts like "what if big climactic thing is really stupid and lame" and I laugh to myself over it
dim plover
I think ct already learn how trying to have an ending to a storyline being raid...
Gotta be honest I really didn’t think that they would make the palace a raid
Unless the Queen does get dealt with at the end of the quest and the palace raid is like, what, a post-death lockdown protocol or smth
?
hybrid gazelle
Idk it called wartorn palace so
hybrid gazelle
Yes
It best to assume raid to only happen once
Similar tot hat of a dungeon
Idk why raid has to be repeatable for some people when dungeon clearly don’t follow the logic
Like raid is an exception I guess???
Like sometime shit in game repeatable for content
I literally do not understand where the confusion of raid being repeatablele lore wise come from
It never was the case for dungeon so why raid of all thing?
Try to case this big event as “repeatable” is just devalue the story
And even more so make future story tellling more difficult to tell
Because then you was like
“Oh man I wonder what Tcc is awaken yet”
Like bro you are in fruma
Gavel already gone by then
slim belfry
there's also post raid dialogue too
hybrid gazelle
Yeah
slim belfry
tcc being the example again
hybrid gazelle
We literally post Tcc
Where everyone pack their thing and gojng to their respective home
slim belfry
I felt like a good person being told that I helped calm the colossus 😁
need more moments like that
hybrid gazelle
It just really weird all of the sudden tbh
I feel like some people make the lore more complicated than it need to be
Literally some shit just one and done
Boom thst it
hybrid gazelle
what does that even mean
mossy badge
He will tell u all the lore
mossy badge
what does that even mean
cyan raven
Where is da hubert
hybrid gazelle
Fruma
mossy badge
In fruma
cyan raven
Boy im still level... 14~16 on all my accs, still in delta
mossy badge
Just play the game bro
hybrid gazelle
then keep going
mossy badge
Do the quests and fucking READ
hybrid gazelle
just play the game at taht point
warm flicker
Honestly I love how Gikyo is portrayed as uncannily as possible, looks like a Mandela catalogue villain
mossy badge
I wanna read without having to play tho😭
hybrid gazelle
Honestly I love how Gikyo is portrayed as uncannily as possible, looks like a Ma...
average jerma
cyan raven
Son im crine
Java on mobile 💪
mossy badge
Atp just play it on ur smart fridge
cyan raven
Also W pfp btw
mossy badge
Thanks
cyan raven
I beat... whats it called, witherhead? Level 15 boss, as level 8 assassin
mossy badge
Do u not have a pc?
cyan raven
Put some respect on ma name
cyan raven
Do u not have a pc?
Hmm? Well yes but no, parents n all that
mossy badge
Hmm? Well yes but no, parents n all that
RIP
cyan raven
THE F-
So
I can send emojis from other servers
I can send gif and images
But cant react
mossy badge
Haha
cyan raven
Absolute Permissions
mossy badge
Nons can't react in wynncord 🔥 🔥
cyan raven
Wdym nons?
mossy badge
No rank
cyan raven
I see...
mossy badge
cyan raven
How does one get a rank the non money way?
mossy badge
How does one get a rank the non money way?
U'd have to.... play the game 🙀
mossy badge
Anyway if u wanna read without playing, there's the wiki ig
cyan raven
-_^?
Got the link?
mossy badge
Just imagine ur doing the quest with ur creativity or smth 😭 🙏
mossy badge
-_^?
Got the link?
hybrid gazelle
cyan raven
https://wynncraft.wiki.gg/
"Heart emoji react" or smthn
edgy loom
it really was a decision to put so much emphasis on the golem factory and it being a needed sacrifice only for golems to not do anything ever
frank iris
wym ?
edgy loom
wym ?
supposedly the flesh golems were a needed sacrifice to protect the people from like the corruption and decay
but in game we never see golems do anything
we don't even HEAR about golems doing anything
other than just being told "they are needed"
edgy loom
so does any human guard
frank iris
And defend cities
edgy loom
maybe if they showed up in world events lol
frank iris
Again saves better trained humans for the war effort ig
glass acorn
it'd be good to get more visual telling but you can easily infer that golems can do more then a normal guard without any training or need to be paid for it
paper wyvern
yeah the point of golems is it saves the required manpower and they work 24/7
frank iris
And they're made of metal
edgy loom
it'd be good to get more visual telling but you can easily infer that golems can...
yeah in-game a golem guard is literally the same as a human guard
frank iris
Like permanently armor clad
glass acorn
and they cannot revolt like a normal human does, atleast for the majority of the time
frank iris
yeah in-game a golem guard is literally the same as a human guard
And no refreshments breaks and such
And I think they're kinda dlow
glass acorn
in game the golems still are superior, by the fact we're told of so many humans dying in battle, meanwhile two golems keep ragnis front door constantly defended
frank iris
Slow
edgy loom
we see a total of 0 golems in stuff like hunter's calling
when we're actively laying siege to wynn
hybrid gazelle
the golems lack of relevancy is mostly due to the writers
frank iris
Ah yes
hybrid gazelle
back then the writers did not realize how cool it is to have a fucking giant machine
in your estting
frank iris
But that one mission
glass acorn
eh, easy to say the golems were already destroyed or dealing with threat elsewhere
we dont see a full scale siege in hunter's calling, just what-ifs
edgy loom
actually
it's really funny how the first golem we actually see in the story
the one in tunnel trouble
frank iris
Plus wynn is suffering from the war effort I think
edgy loom
immediately gets destroyed by a rookie recruit
frank iris
immediately gets destroyed by a rookie recruit
Orilly malfuntioning
Cus a farmer got it
glass acorn
the mc is not an ordinary recruit
frank iris
Or maybe a toned down version
hybrid gazelle
anyway gonna post it here because the topic is relevant
edgy loom
the mc is not an ordinary recruit
at lvl 6 we are
frank iris
And
hybrid gazelle
also the golem in tunnel trouble is bootleg golems
I complain about tit and then changed it
glass acorn
no we're not, we certainly get stronger later, but no we're already above a normal recruit
edgy loom
also the golem in tunnel trouble is bootleg golems
what's the difference
frank iris
That account stand a chance
hybrid gazelle
the bootleg fucking suck
frank iris
what's the difference
It's weak
hybrid gazelle
so yeah there is that
glass acorn
bootleg = less quality control in production, like it does irl
edgy loom
so like, gavel golems are real
hybrid gazelle
no
edgy loom
wynn golems are bootleg
frank iris
No
edgy loom
uhh
frank iris
Civilian golem are
frank iris
Not the military ones
hybrid gazelle
also anti-air
edgy loom
does it say "bootleg golem" on the golem's nametag
glass acorn
the governments can afford proper golems, civillians cannot so they buy bootlegs or old models
frank iris
I mean the ond the guy bought
hybrid gazelle
does it say "bootleg golem" on the golem's nametag
no
you only know this by talking to CT
frank iris
the governments can afford proper golems, civillians cannot so they buy bootlegs...
Ya what is said
glass acorn
im agreeing with you 47 dw
frank iris
you only know this by talking to CT
CT?
hybrid gazelle
Content Team
edgy loom
this game's lore is held by thoughts and prayers
frank iris
Oh
hybrid gazelle
I have like
entire project about rewriting golems
that reiterate itself very year
awesome
edgy loom
just join the lore team for the love of god 🙏
hybrid gazelle
no
glass acorn
i mean its not hard to infer bootlegs when theres a whole quest about how expensive they are to make
frank iris
Ok tru
hybrid gazelle
except it not that expensive
edgy loom
i mean its not hard to infer bootlegs when theres a whole quest about how expens...
which the farmer promptly says the golem was extremely expensive
hybrid gazelle
if a priest from poor area can afford it as his personal bodyguard
frank iris
except it not that expensive
For a farmer it is
glass acorn
Olum is bankrupted by needing golems, and yes its expensive to a farmer
hybrid gazelle
yes the oglem pretty cheap
frank iris
if a priest from poor area can afford it as his personal bodyguard
Again they are broken golems
hybrid gazelle
Even nesaak can afford golems
edgy loom
that one farmer in the gert quest also had a golem
glass acorn
tractors are expensive to farmers, they buy one for it to last, so hes shocked when its broken
hybrid gazelle
Again they are broken golems
Never mention to be borken
frank iris
That are blessed or smth
hybrid gazelle
it still functional like you can hear it speak even LOL
Nemract can also buy one
Golems are cheap
glass acorn
golems are cheap for whole towns, expensive for individuals
frank iris
Ya
hybrid gazelle
Broken golem probably more from battle broken
hybrid gazelle
golems are cheap for whole towns, expensive for individuals
Nemract and Nessak even then would be unable to afford golems
due to the shipping price
edgy loom
but generally my complaint with the golems is that after you choose to report and stop the factory NOTHING changes
glass acorn
we dont know what shipping price is so we cant judge that, also Nemract is Wynns only port- theyre not going to be super rich but they aint super poor
frank iris
but generally my complaint with the golems is that after you choose to report an...
Prolly overlooked
hybrid gazelle
Nemract at best can affrod 1 golem
frank iris
Cus war effort
hybrid gazelle
we dont know what shipping price is so we cant judge that, also Nemract is Wynns...
Okay let's take account
in order golem to reach place like Nesaak
frank iris
Nemract at best can affrod 1 golem
I doubt the towns pay for it out of their own pockets
edgy loom
the ct aint thinking of all ts
frank iris
in order golem to reach place like Nesaak
River
hybrid gazelle
and we using airship as method of travel here
glass acorn
Wynn is also a kingdom yeah, so Ragni will help FUND THEM to keep them from losing more to the war
frank iris
Nah the river
hybrid gazelle
River
Do you think a small boats that fit in a river can carry golems?
in a batch
like 2-3
frank iris
Maybe q at a time ?
glass acorn
do you think the king of ragni wont fund defenses for important towns? Nessak is important for food, Nemract for trade
hybrid gazelle
That assume King of Ragni pay for everything yes
frank iris
Yes exactly
frank iris
That assume King of Ragni pay for everything yes
Government
hybrid gazelle
but nothing mention so far so it best to assume each settlement pay for hteir own thing
frank iris
Pays gir it
glass acorn
that is how kingdoms usually work, the royals will fund defenses to maintain themselves
youre assuming against the political setting of the game
hybrid gazelle
Government
Wynn province so far shown to be different cities in alliance with each other
so this government here
is not really the same as villager
glass acorn
its a monarchy
hybrid gazelle
King Ragni only mention to ruled Ragni
frank iris
Again I think the alliance will fund
edgy loom
wait wait wait
hybrid gazelle
and not Wynn
edgy loom
why is a villager king of ragni
frank iris
The alliance of cities fund
hybrid gazelle
Ragni king is adopted
edgy loom
so THAT is why he has an adoptive father
glass acorn
thats his title yes, but kingdoms are MULTIPLE CITIES not singular ones
frank iris
The golem of important towns
edgy loom
still, pretty weird to have him as the first npc the player sees
when stepping into wynn
frank iris
Prolly cus ya
glass acorn
and adopted relatives can have royal titles if theyre the heir
edgy loom
I wish the whole human/villager thing was established just a tad more clearly
hybrid gazelle
He only refered as King of Ragin
and Detlas feel like it refer as its own thing
frank iris
Yes
hybrid gazelle
so as Almuj having mayor
hybrid gazelle
Troms have their own king as well
hybrid gazelle
so far Ragni king only refer with Ragni
frank iris
Cus detlas loses it's port if nemract falls
hybrid gazelle
What even there in the ocean for Wynn to gain from it
paper wyvern
also the villagers seem to have some sort of central governemnt based off eltom lore
frank iris
Ocean travel is cheaper than air travel
frank iris
Again detlas soldiers in nemract
hybrid gazelle
mostly trade likely come from Cinfras
frank iris
not entire trade
Most trade
hybrid gazelle
because it's important
edgy loom
the lore team willed it into existence
hybrid gazelle
and wynncraft is shit at it
edgy loom
after learning what I've learned there's no way they've given these things any thoughts 🙏
hybrid gazelle
It's extremely funny that wynncraft has a premise where the player is a recruit
but it clearly shown that none of the writers even know how millitary structure work
so it came out as wynn province just careless or incompetent
frank iris
so it came out as wynn province just careless or incompetent
Or maybe exhausted
From a long war
edgy loom
the reworked early game does have us follow more orders from superiors so ig that's something
frank iris
Eh idk
paper wyvern
yeah wynn province just doesnt seem to have much in the way of government
sure the individual cities have some but thats it
hybrid gazelle
exhaustion is not a good excuse when you somehow let group of recruits who known to lost their memories to wander their own
and possibly to their death
candid cliff
do you have the trash disguise trashie
hybrid gazelle
without proper adjustment
frank iris
and possibly to their death
I think these are special recruits ?
edgy loom
without proper adjustment
I feel like this stuff could be reasonably solved with a single quest
hybrid gazelle
That even concerning
Fruman recruits are people who recently lose their memeory of their home
frank iris
As in
hybrid gazelle
and likely lose the memories of their entire personal history
it 100% disorientated for them
edgy loom
ehh
hybrid gazelle
and to suddenly shove into this new entirel land that they never familar to
edgy loom
memory wipes are wack
hybrid gazelle
proper adjustment is required
frank iris
Maybe they didn't care enough ?
hybrid gazelle
Then that too fucking incompetent for Ragni and that does not seems like the narrative they going for
Wynn so far protray as heroic
having them do not care about its recruit is odd
frank iris
Just hit themagical Truman up when they need
hybrid gazelle
consider these fruman recruits liekly need help to intregate themselves to wynn society
edgy loom
wynn can be pretty hands off with it, basically just say "go off into the world, if you have any problem talk to us, check up every once in a while and help where you can. if you're lost ask us"
hybrid gazelle
again does not seems to fit the narrative they going for Wynn
edgy loom
hey if it works it works
hybrid gazelle
Wynn so far protray as heroic province that try to survive by any mean corruptiojn
they use golems because they did not know
frank iris
More like doing their best to survive
hybrid gazelle
nobody know what golems are made off
frank iris
Ya
glass acorn
ehh it kind of lands on the line of whats good to play and whats good for story, we do have Some structure now but it makes sense we're not going into super-structured existence
hybrid gazelle
they try their best to survive
and to have them do not care about recruits who btw
edgy loom
it kinda works. sometimes
hybrid gazelle
it kinda feel unfitting for htem to not care
frank iris
Not acc provide
hybrid gazelle
but again
frank iris
I doubt they got the resources
edgy loom
but I think CT do aware of this issue
nah
hybrid gazelle
they just do not have the time
frank iris
Alr imma go
hybrid gazelle
they have plan
frank iris
I'll stick to #questions
edgy loom
they have plan
learning the darkness element thing was not canon from the day it was added is something
hybrid gazelle
It just a simple mistake during the time the team was unskilled and inexperience
that was long time ago
people can learn
people can grow
hence Fruma
edgy loom
I consider silent expanse the beginning of the new lore
so I was lowkey surprised they need to rewrite the entire questline
edgy loom
hmmm hope is the last to die
hybrid gazelle
ok
frank iris
Lol uh
edgy loom
I'll be satisfied if fruma has hype moments and aura
hybrid gazelle
sad
edgy loom
bob's zombie stuff ig
bob's tears
then in the tomb quest you hear his cries or smth like that
lavish knot
Time's tough for him
hybrid gazelle
trying to write lore summary but have to go through new direction
lavish knot
👀
whole river
I feel like it isn’t complicated at all if you do most of the ingame content and some secret discoveries
There will be lore holes but overall it’s easy to obtain the info and you don’t have to grind two hours to get an armor set that will tell you two sentences about chuck the local conscript
whole river
I was mainly just setting up a dark souls slander joke ngl
hybrid gazelle
I see
lavish knot
How far are you on this btw?
lavish knot
Awesome!
ornate imp
trying to write lore summary but have to go through new direction
Understandable.
hybrid gazelle
I should use that actually
worldly raft
<@&268142859327242242>
lavish knot
Working of something I hope gets done before beta
What else should I add on the board
royal yarrow
What is the lore for corrupted dungeons?
gloomy bison
What about Qira? She seems to be connected to the decay somehow, or to the Silent Expanse. I have a feeling the Silent Expanse/Realm of Dark is gonna be connected to Fruma.
regal spire
What is the lore for corrupted dungeons?
Alternate universe spurred from a rift in space time
Or something idk
royal yarrow
Ok
lavish knot
What is the lore for corrupted dungeons?
its a timespace anomly
royal yarrow
Thanks
lavish knot
What about Qira? She seems to be connected to the decay somehow, or to the Silen...
Qira does not feel too relevant to be included
But Se/RoD would have some kind of involvement considering SE questline is required to progress
whole river
What about Qira? She seems to be connected to the decay somehow, or to the Silen...
Does she? I know they asked her to solve it but it seems she’s entirely unrelated to it unless there’s some hidden dialogue I missed
gloomy bison
She looks kinda like a human that's been corrupted by darkness. Her power level is up there with some of the dark realm boss creatures. The hive biome is the end, same as for the Realm of Light and Silent Expanse (May not mean anything, but could be a clue?). She's very mysterious but iirc Yansur said she's preparing for some kind of big war, potentially one that involves Fruma?
whole river
I assumed the war she means is the war between the realms since that’s really the only major war so far
but the decay is more related to the parasite, she was instead simply told to solve it but she didn’t want to. For whatever reason ig she doesn’t want smoke from the actual top tiers
lavish knot
Even if Qira would eventually do something big, I doubt that time would be in Fruma
quartz mist
but generally my complaint with the golems is that after you choose to report an...
what is it that you think should happen then, what should go actively changing
ornate imp
a follow up post story npc that explains what happened to the factory, different dialogues depending on the ending and stuff
thats the most i can think of tbh
whole river
In a way it kinda makes sense nothings happened
Without the golems the world is cooked. Even with the decay gone there’s still creatures they gotta defend against. Also I imagine the government just framed the scientist as a rogue scapegoat
clear scaffold
Without the golems the world is cooked. Even with the decay gone there’s still c...
actually the world isn't
the issue i have with the golems really comes down to they don't change much outside of making lives easier
if bak'al decides to go after wynn again the golems might buy time but it'd still be a mass slaughter
really the scientist says all of that without realising this all happened well after the main threats in the corruption stopped being a threat
slim belfry
still think recruits are more valuable because I doubt the golems could've taken down anni
the best solution is conscription
edgy loom
what is it that you think should happen then, what should go actively changing
remove golems from the villagers, say they broke down and couldnt get replacements, put humans there. get dead bodies laying around, rough up the city. put npcs there that talk about it
I don't think you need to physically alter the world that much to convey this
it'd be great if we actually got some golem quests too, and depending on your choice in iron heart 2 you'd get a different version
this is best case scenario stuff
a single npc after the quest is the bare minimum
in an ideal world our choice there would reflect in other quests, from one line changes to entirely different interactions
glass acorn
What about Qira? She seems to be connected to the decay somehow, or to the Silen...
the realm of dark should defo be connected to Fruma- The elves opened all three wells when opening the light portal, and the dark portal is where Fruma is, unless theres more landmass behind fruma
glass acorn
are we sure thats the portal and not just a symptom of it being open? it seems way too close to the war portal
and thatd mean we'd already found the dern beast in the anomoly we find there
slim belfry
are we sure thats the portal and not just a symptom of it being open? it seems w...
the eye of the dern beast guards it and the nameless anomaly came from it evident from the void spaces around it
glass acorn
the eye guarding it actually goes against that being the true dark portal! as the eye is what allows the dern beast to see into Wynn, and so the dark portal cannot be there- the expanse is part of Wynn that was corrupted by the realm of dark after it awoke
we see the portals actively influence the areas even without being open- like the light forest
makes me wonder what sorcery the sovereigns / monarch managed that kept fruma looking so lush >.> since other places the dern beast actively touched (the expanse and the dark forest) are so decayed
sacred saffron
I think that John gluk was the real fruma all along
edgy loom
actually kinda crazy we straight up are orphion's servant
we were lari's replacement
and now she's gone too
then we also killed 2/3 of the dern beast's servants, including taking its eye
we'd totally mog bob I dont wanna hear it
quartz mist
remove golems from the villagers, say they broke down and couldnt get replacemen...
when the quest first came out we had the power to do precisely none of that
schematics are resource intensive as hell, especially, and even now with our more robust and active tools it'd be hellish to remove spawned guards from the areas. removing guards from cities makes them less safe, vulnerable on the mechanical side in ways players shouldnt have to deal with, and switching them out like that would be a capital-P, size 14
P r o c e s s
its tougher than youd think to do, and while i agree that stuff should be done, more world-changing events, more npcs talking about the results and consequences of quests, its time consuming, difficult to keep track of and maintain, and can be very difficult to work with as we write and rewrite the story
maybe when it was first conceived it was just A Cool Thing like a lot of gavel quests were but it isnt like we havent thought about it in eleven years
edgy loom
when the quest first came out we had the power to do precisely none of that
when the quest first came out frankly there was no problem with it. you decide if it's worth it to kidnap and torture people to become golems to potentially save lives. you could chalk the golem factory as a very minuscule part of wynncraft's defenses
then it was added to realm of light, where orphion makes us kill the mayor so golems can keep being produced. what 😭
this completely recontextualizes the quest... I'd never have guessed golems were so important. this inherently makes it much more needed to have actual consequences from choosing to close the factory down
also, these quests have been reworked. at least part 1 was. I believe during gavel reborn. I know for certain the technology to have npcs show up after quests and parts of the world slightly change was present here
edgy loom
schematics are resource intensive as hell, especially, and even now with our mor...
tbf I'm guessing off the shiny new features, like the fact raids can be scaled for each player and the inquisitor mob straight up can only be seen by one player. I have no idea how that works, but it works, it's there. I mentioned removing golems BUT adding humans, human guards. this would be an opportunity to showcase why the golems supposedly were better than guards
but either way, you've already said you do think this stuff should be implemented to some degree, so that's great to hear
oh and the golem thing also shows up in hunter's calling
quartz mist
-again schematics are respurce intensive and very fiddly, the tech exists but its super tough to use it at scale
-the inquisitor spawning is also a lot trickier than it might seem and required quite a lot of work to make smooth- swapping golems for human guards that youre implying should be less effective when you say its an opportunity to show why golems arr better- would, to my knowledge, require a lot more intensive work than the inquisitors as well as a shift away from their current spawning patterns
-i dunno if clientside mobs can work as guards on a mechanical basis, idk if they can react properly to hostile mobs
-yeah we kinda dont like that choice either. i said we should go with something else when i was called on to advise with that quest precisely because it would have this effect on the lore
and i had wanted to avoid that, as that hypothetical made-up scenario that orphion was putting forth for you has made it look so much more important than it really should be
it turns it into there being a Correct Choice
and it isnt very clear that that whole scenario by the taproot gate is effectively just a vision that orphion is sending you as a test
digital swan
remove golems from the villagers, say they broke down and couldnt get replacemen...
wouldn't golems have a pretty long lifespan
Like between then and like level 105 is what
I give it a few months?
golems wouldn't be inop in a few months I'm guessing and they probably have spares everywhere
almuj vault and wynnex bases have an absurd amount between them for one
Maybe they could add dialogue lines about the company shutting down or similar when talking to mayors or something
edgy loom
-again schematics are respurce intensive and very fiddly, the tech exists but it...
about the human guards, they'd work the same as the golems, what it would do IS allow npcs to mention the change from golems to humans. they can talk about how much more expensive it is to pay their salaries and how it's much less efficient, they have to work shifts, frequently get injured, etc. we could even get human npcs to tell us what it's like being a guard
digital swan
Maybe they could add dialogue lines about the company shutting down or similar w...
maybe around level 250-300 enough time will have passed for a golem guarding one of the smaller cities to be removed
probably in 1001 AP
and almost certainly Lexdale
edgy loom
and it isnt very clear that that whole scenario by the taproot gate is effective...
yeah but the test should still be based on a truth, right? that the golems are a necessary evil and we should put our morals aside to let them be procuded
quartz mist
in orphion's opinion anyway
edgy loom
wouldn't golems have a pretty long lifespan
the idea is that if shutting down the factory will cause more harm than good, we should kinda get to feel that
quartz mist
he's looking for someone who will go along with his intent
digital swan
the idea is that if shutting down the factory will cause more harm than good, we...
I mean it will, but like shutting down any factory, there's no way that will have instant effects
edgy loom
orphion's just a dummy hmm lore reveal
quartz mist
there are for sure better scenarios we could have used or come up with that wouldnt be showing a "correct" choice to a quest meant to have moral ambiguity
digital swan
I think it'd be best to compromise where like if you shut down the factory the guy from An Iron Heart I mentions like an inability to order a replacement
digital swan
kicking a orphion to save a baby
this is worth it
quartz mist
all that says is that that is the choice orphion would make, so if you make the same choice as him or he browbeats you into obedience, either way, then youre someone he can make use of
and therefore fit for what he needs
edgy loom
when I first played the quest I remember thinking about the fact we had to kill the mayor, not just incapacitate him or anything
like damn, those golems must be really fucking important xd
vestal rivet
basically
Orphion chose us because we were willing to murder and look past horrible acts for him :)
edgy loom
basically
Orphion chose us because we were willing to murder and look past horri...
I mean lari kinda set the bar low
glass acorn
the thing to consider is if Orphion values mortals as much as his domain, the golems were beating down monsters caused by the decay afterall werent they?
quartz mist
it just introduces too many bad questions and puts too much emphasis on something that shouldnt have gotten it
edgy loom
the thing to consider is if Orphion values mortals as much as his domain, the go...
this kinda turns into a philosophical debate, are the lives saved worth it at the cost of torturing others and keeping them as golems
glass acorn
yeah, and also considering the what-ifs for if golems never existed, like people migrating and how thatd change the world as a whole
edgy loom
golems are kinda like ai
they need to be trained on humans
and then steal other human jobs
like the lvl 5 ragni guard couldve taken that job
digital swan
worse than a killing machine
opaque remnant
When I did the quest I tried to kill Urelix and Orphion stuck me in a time-loop until I did what he wanted.
Personally, I think he’s as bad as Dern for condemning however many more people to a fate worse than death.
digital swan
When I did the quest I tried to kill Urelix and Orphion stuck me in a time-loop ...
it's even worse than that btw
the golems kill so many good soldiers every day, whenever we try to attack any city
it's like zero chance to corrupt the people inside
opaque remnant
the golems kill so many good soldiers every day, whenever we try to attack any c...
… huh?
slender copper
When I did the quest I tried to kill Urelix and Orphion stuck me in a time-loop ...
Yeah I definitely think that the Rol quest line should be revisited and redone. Really makes you think that both light and dark are bad when clearly the game wants light to be good and darkness to be bad while corruption is the chaos created by their clash.
slim belfry
the whole lutho thing makes the light is good situation even worse
really adds to if you think light is the best way to go
I get it though I can see the intent but at the same time I kinda agree with the eye on the issue
slender copper
really adds to if you think light is the best way to go
I understand that in the wiki it says that Light saves the soul but cannot save the body from Dern... but putting them in a simulation and making those outside want to join in... like...
glass acorn
makes sense in the way that we also were in the incredibly hostile environment, so the shard wants to save us from suffering too- without knowing we can just leave
slender copper
really adds to if you think light is the best way to go
Fruma does need the rol quests to be completed, so perhaps rol is also going to be reworked to better improve light's image.
I definitely would start by removing the "test" that Orphion puts us in.
slim belfry
thinking not remove but changing the situation
what came to mind is something in wynn for example
glass acorn
can orphion even see into wynn directly? his portal and domain is tied to gavel, so despite the other flaws of the test- it being in gavel makes sense
slim belfry
if the dern beast can directly communicate with orphion and deliver the parasite to gavel I don't see why orphion couldn't
slender copper
thinking not remove but changing the situation
I can see replacing the Dr. Urelix and Mayor situation with something else in Gavel, yeah.
glass acorn
Dern sent a parasite yes, but cant even see into Wynn without splitting off a part of its own body into the eldrich outlook
so doubtful Orphion can see into Wynn either, not unless he tore something off of himself and sent it there
maybe the test hypothetical could focus more on the decay itself
slim belfry
Dern sent a parasite yes, but cant even see into Wynn without splitting off a pa...
oh right true
forgot that was the main reason
slender copper
Here I thought they just had multiple spare eyes and it wasn't a big deal lol-
glass acorn
they might have multiple eyes tbf but its still a lot of effort to have a bodypart seperated just to see into another region, and we dont even know if it can see all of Wynn or just the expanse its in
slim belfry
it can see at the very least detlas
edgy loom
Yeah I definitely think that the Rol quest line should be revisited and redone. ...
the thing is that the devs have made several statements about the light being just as bad as the dark
so it kinda feels like the light being presented as goody two shoes always is the wrong view, it sometimes being bad is how it should be
which still isn't necessarily conveyed well, the light is by far much more beneficial than the dark
the silent expanse was hostile to the people to the living there
then the light monolith came
it can straight up heal aledar
and it also offers protection to the people there
it's pretty macabre how it can take people into a fake happier version of their town, but it's still for their own if they were truly suffering
plus they can always leave, they simply don't want to
it's still effectively a good thing, but I like how it can hint at the light not being just pure good
candid cliff
and it also offers protection to the people there
to the "people"
the monolith is both cruel and good is how I see it
I like the soul trying to seperate from Aledar in AJF
It's a cool little addition
edgy loom
the monolith is both cruel and good is how I see it
it's an entire philosophical debate, to be hooked up to the "happiness machine"
still, the people are being made happy regardless
and what I think really seals the deal this is a good thing
is that they can leave whenever they want, they just don't want to
this is what the player does
and also, this might be an oversight
but even without entering the happy place realm the monolith still protects you
the npc in point of no return didnt choose to go to the realm but was still there, protected
aledar can also use the monolith to heal himself up
candid cliff
yeah but you have eldritch horrors right outside of your door
it's living in fear of what's out there
that's why she says it might just be easier to decide to lose her eyes
edgy loom
sure but that's not really the light's fault
I guess you could argue it's manipulative, the light is prying on your plight to get you to go to the happy place
the thing is that I don't see how light possibly benefits from making the people happy
sure, it's macabre, which makes it interesting, but it's straight up protection
opaque remnant
…does The Eye speak in Irish because… eyerish?
edgy loom
it's funny how being swallowed by the worm almost kills aledar
then the player willingly gets himself eaten and it's just fine lol
I always thought it was weird we got ejected from a random spike after leaving the worm
I just realized it's its tail lol
slender copper
the thing is that the devs have made several statements about the light being ju...
Oh really? Haven't really seen the comments by the devs so I can't really say for myself if it was intentional or not.
That's a different twist to what we usually see by other depictions, but it also works as well.
Orphion did say that he does not go by morals but what is nessesary, showing that not all of light's actions are nessesary "good". But I still feel like some improvement in Rol should be done, since even the third time going through it, it's just a confusing mess lol.
hybrid gazelle
ROL is kind of quest that the more you look into it
you question the decision of the writers take every turn
but making under crunch time and overwork CT likely lead to all of this becoming nonsense
at least it's stepping stones
opaque remnant
Orphion did say that he does not go by morals but what is nessesary, showing tha...
Seems like he means Necessary evil
hybrid gazelle
I odnt think we see Light ACTUALLY doing something necessery evil
he literally just tell Lari but never do it himself
Unless ghosting your follower for centuries is necessery evil which I mean sure man whatever get parasite to latch on you and suck your power out
edgy loom
Oh really? Haven't really seen the comments by the devs so I can't really say fo...
there are some interesting threads that go over this, like this one. the ct even comments sometimes https://forums.wynncraft.com/threads/moral-ambiguity-doesn’t-work-in-wynn.318748/
hybrid gazelle
The theme of moral ambiguity in wyncnraft is very shallow and unexplore
so it came out very prsentious and unsatisfying to the players because it feel more like the writers wanting to show smart to the players than actually offer the players an experience to explore these idea
Espically when everywhere in wynncraft world could be use to convey similar theme of moral ambiguity
the entire existence of fruman recruits are pretty much also moral ambuiguity
even removing the memory wiping process into the equation
does people from land far away and get dropped in wynn deserve to offer themselves to be soldier?
these topics never explore in wynn
and when wynn actually explore moral ambiguity like in ROL
it very shallow and outright pretty much comfirm what player already been doing which is
"kill everything"
because the quest never go out of its way to try to prove player is wrong or teach them any valuable lesson
it just tell
this is very akin to just teacher telling you a lesson so you kinda wanna fall asleep
edgy loom
it's like they weren't confident they could convey the notion that sometimes you have to let go of morals to do what's best
so they made lari
which takes holding onto "morals" to the extreme, to the point she's useless
she doesn't want to kill a random mindless parasite who will destroy the world
but she goes through "character development" and wants to instead kill bak'al, an actual person, with goals and motives
hold on why is there so much slime in the lore
we have skylaar who made slimes
and he got help from dern
his pocket dimension looks like a part of dern and it's full of slimes
then in the silent expanse there is the waste place
filled with slimes
we have that one quest where a slime pretends to be a general
now in fruma there is that one guy who morphs with slime particles
the wastelands might also have slime
toxic wastes/the wastelands
glass acorn
they just really like slime ig lol
candid cliff
I just realized it's its tail lol
poop
whole river
but she goes through "character development" and wants to instead kill bak'al, a...
Bakal and the parasite are the same, Bakal just has a sass factor. It’s not like he could choose to leave with the corruption hijacking any semblance of a person
whole river
Unless ghosting your follower for centuries is necessery evil which I mean sure ...
Been playing ROL back to back and once again if dullahan didn’t exist, lari’s whole issue makes a little more sense when the timeline is: she held back the first encounter and it flees -> bug gets lost for 600 years storing power -> lari spends those years trying to find it and stopping the decay -> finds him again but he catches lari off guard when they reunite and beats her before going for orphion next
Instead of there being two times where she’s holding back when a guy who can literally predict the future (something lari knows is true because she was alive for the other diviner) tells her if she does Gavel is cooked. Dullahan sucks by sheer virtue of just being someone who you can’t argue with yet Lari empties out her brain cells to not listen to her friend for centuries
lavish knot
Imo I think it benefits both Dulla and Lari if they actually meet up and deal with their conflict in part 3 and 4
whole river
I still think it doesn’t fix the issue of why lari still holds back the second encounter after she straight up sees the effects of the decay on gavel
opaque remnant
idk if I’m the only one who thinks this but I feel like whenever the Dern update comes out one of the quests will involve going over to Dullahan’s castle, and making him come help you rescue Lari.
I mean that’s gotta be it, right? Why else would we not go kill him?
opaque remnant
Also please tell me I’m not going crazy, Witherhead is Bob’s biological mother right?