📚lore_discussion

[regal spire]

Weird are self sustaining, completely outside the influence of the world, and simply exist as concepts, whether choices, futures, past, whatever. They make zero sense because the concept of self-replicating and living through every conceivable concept is not comprehensible.

They’re just weird, magic lil mold spawns that live everything possible all at once, in unpredictable ways

[shut hornet]

The Weave.... my beloved

[dim plover]

So they are the physical manifestation of intangible concepts?

[quartz mist]

To wit- Orphion could not make light-based Weirds. Lari, channeling Orphion's power, could make light-based Weirds. Does that help?

[dim plover]

(That part I completely understand, actually)
But thanks for the clarification nonetheless

I’m more confused on what Weirds represent

[regal spire]

I think that’s just to explain how they think, though

[rotund gust]

yeah kinda. I got that part. Pure elements can’t produce weirds, using magic to channel elements can. it’s the rest that is incomphrensible

[dim plover]

Can Weirds “spawn?” Do Weirds canonically get killed by the player?

Or are they actually just entities with no beginning or end

[dim plover]

I think Selvut also clarified sometime ago that only primordial or cosmic magic can produce Weirds

[rotund gust]

something something semi-omniscience something something Wyrd

[dim plover]

In other words, Light, Dark, and certain cosmic sources

If we to assume that the Light and Dark realms existed at the beginning of the universe, then Corruption not having Weirds would make sense since the Realm of War didn’t

[rotund gust]

i mean, we see a bunch of other weird types though besides cosmic light and dark ones

[dim plover]

And hence isn’t primordial

[dim plover]

Good point

Not too sure about that one in that case

[rotund gust]

like the normal elements

[dim plover]

But yeah this

[rotund gust]

earth weird, fire weird, frost weird, ozone weird, whirl weird

[dim plover]

Selvut’s text has all this talk about fate but my mind can’t force itself to connect it to Weirds somehow, with what I’ve observed or been told about actual Weirds

It almost seems dissociated from each other to the point that it almost feels like it’s two different topics being attempted to mash themselves with each other

Maybe I need to read it again…

[regal spire]

I like to imagine it as if an expired piece of bread was just kind thrown into a damp environment. It offers it the perfect ecosystem for little critters, bacteria, fungus, etc to form. Weirds are essentially just that, spawning from an alternative source of magical potential, with the concept of infinite potential put into their minds—for added chaos

We’re shown that a majority of creatures around the world have more sentience than normal, so I wouldn’t be surprised if these abstract concepts being related to bacteria would have such incredibly complex potential

[dim plover]

What do you mean by potential here

[regal spire]

If their minds work in “every concept that is conceivable” sort of way, attributing the potential for decisions in the future, choices in the past, and potential for now would just mean they think with unlimited potential, all at once

They cycle through possibilities, rather than instinctual response to stimuli, which explains their unpredictable nature and impossibility to study them

[dim plover]

Alright

How does that translate to their behavior in the world though

[regal spire]

I need confirmation from Selvut, tbh, because this is what I got from reading it

[regal spire]

It’s unknown to us, ig, because it isn’t possible to actually study a concept like that. It translates by being unpredictable, illogically chaotic, and going against every known law of replication. They just create, and that can’t be studied, really, when they nonstop change all the time

The only consistent thing about them is their affiliation/origin with alternative magical sources and concepts, which isn’t even entirely consistent, since it seems that entirely unrelated weirds can seemingly match and replicate around each other

[dim plover]

Then what about this excerpt
Can you attempt to lay that one out

Or is that the same as to what you just talked about

[dim plover]

I didn’t really get the impression that individual Weirds can change, actually

[quartz mist]

they are very abstract

[dim plover]

Can a Weird’s general theme in-universe not be easily identifiable by its makeup

Is it only for gameplay convenience

[regal spire]

I saw that section on the light weirds spawning around earth weirds and connected it to being spawnable/changeable depending on its source

[dim plover]

Yeah

[shut hornet]

you could say theyre pretty... weird! badum tshhh seinfeld music begins playing

[regal spire]

That excerpt is incredibly abstract, because it seems to me to be connecting the notion of immaculate conception to the mental development we experience, whilst also trying to connect it to the limitless potentiality of our magical wells. We pull these experiences and thoughts from almost nothing, and we do the same sort of thing with the origin of magic, and its usage.

[quartz mist]

Weirds have a core makeup of their origin- light, dark, or cosmic. The way they present depends on the environment- for example, the Magnetized Weird is cored off the cosmic energy of the nearby meteor

[dim plover]

Ironically it would have been easier for me to interpret Weirds as random masses of fluctuating and pulsating inconsistencies of magic

But Selvut’s writeup makes two things clear:

1. Weirds can be individually separated and identified as individual entities
2. Weirds’ appearances are unique enough for them to be identifiable as being a Weird, whatever said visual characteristic that might be

(I know they’re limbless humanoids in-game but I meant like, in-universe)

[dim plover]

What does cosmic rock have any relation to magnetism

[regal spire]

It seems a bit complicated of an idea to tie to the origin of magic, since our mature development doesn’t come from something immaculate or without origin. It takes energy, time, and experience to be a different person than you were 5 years ago. For magic to have a similar connection—the Wyrd I guess—it needs to be based in an ever changing concept that pulls from the world to develop. Magic doesn’t really do that, and—tbh—neither do weirds. But, they technically do, if they hold the limitless potential of the decisions in their instincts.

[quartz mist]

that, and they can present based on the environment even from the merest hint. moisture in a cavern miles below the surface of a desert so dry even the air begs for water could result in, as an example, a Moisture Weird on the surface where it congeals

[shut hornet]

magic as a whole is something that needs to be explored a bit more

[dim plover]

And I assume whatever nonexistent godly force that decides what Weirds spawn where just has zero consistency?

[regal spire]

I don’t have a lot of perspective to pull from for this aspect of Wynn’s lore; this is all just inferred from what I’ve read around town

[dim plover]

(I’m not phrasing this as if there’s some actual godly force deciding where Weirds spawn, I meant like, figuratively)

[regal spire]

It’s easier, for me, to just think of them as mold spawn/bacteria attracted to magical potential

[dim plover]

If there isn’t a consistency to what aspect of the environment is favored when it comes to what kind of Weird shows up then I suppose that would make sense

[shut hornet]

the mysterious godly force is Selvut setting up the mob spawn regions for the weirds

[dim plover]

Yeah but that would imply that they would have to favor more recognizable sources rather than things that can exist in the region, no matter how small

[regal spire]

Then, to explain their thinking, they just hold the limitless potential of magic in their instincts, which is a sort of concept that transcends all possibilities of Wynn’s world

[dim plover]

But at the same time using this logic can’t nearly any type of Weird spawn anywhere?

Barring non-Earthly ones like the meteors

[regal spire]

That’s the thing about microbes, though, is that they do exist everywhere, even in environments specifically made to kill them. They survive off of basically nothing, and spawn from inconceivable origins. It just feels like the easiest concept to tie them to

[quartz mist]

Well, let me pull a quote from something you may have seen or read before that might help put things into perspective.

[dim plover]

If a water-based Weird can spawn miles away from even the barest source of liquid then can’t water-based Weirds spawn pretty much everywhere on Earth that matches Weird-spawning requirements?

[quartz mist]

"...and the universe said everything you need is within you

and the universe said you are stronger than you know

and the universe said you are the daylight

and the universe said you are the night

and the universe said the darkness you fight is within you

and the universe said the light you seek is within you

and the universe said you are not alone

and the universe said you are not separate from every other thing ..."

Does that help?

[regal spire]

Thank you, for that

[quartz mist]

Some of the meta concepts from the End poem are brilliant and fascinating.

[regal spire]

Notch was a Christian, if that helps

[shut hornet]

"was" i cant believe notch is Fucking Dead now

[regal spire]

Reminds me of Genesis, what they did with the end

[regal spire]

Might as well be, bros a bit of a hag

[shut hornet]

holy....

[dim plover]

I kinda don’t want to disappoint you by admitting that I gained zero helpful information from that

Asides from the implication that if the subject the poem is referring to can apply to Weirds then Weirds are just the universe

[regal spire]

Thank you for the laugh

[dim plover]

Maybe my mind just isn’t trained to understand deeper-meaninged literature

I tend to picture things in a bit more of a literal sense which heavily clashes with written works meant to be symbolic and flowery in language

[quartz mist]

Either way, the bit about Weirds being the way in which forces and magic taste of themselves, and feed back into themselves, was inspired(in retrospect, anyway) by that.

[shut hornet]

Are the Weirds Jesus?

[regal spire]

Yes, and they are Bartholomew, and they are Judas, and they are Abraham, and Magdalene, and

[dim plover]

Jesus Weird would be fire

Or Holy Weird
Whatever

[regal spire]

Jesus weird that just floats around with nails in its wrists

[quartz mist]

Energy of the universe flowing through itself, reacting, evolving, changing, in a microcosm of fate and destiny that is difficult to quantify, almost like the double-slit experiment, where observation changes the result.

[dim plover]

Technically that can apply to the Realm of Light, no?

[regal spire]

Lights not holy, it’s just bright

[dim plover]

where observation changes the result
Oh god now I have this thrown into the equation

Okay uh
Are there any examples of this happening (or implied to be happening)

[dim plover]

I mean NoL has some pretty angelic themes

[regal spire]

Route weird, found on trails and paths

[quartz mist]

that'd be more like the Trodden Weird or Pathfinder Weird

[shut hornet]

the double slit experiment sounds crazy until you learn what is meant by "observation" at which point you stop questioning if reality is a simulation

[rotund gust]

can we turn the whirl weird into a wine weird?

[shut hornet]

("observation" really just means interacting with the particle in any way so that it can be measured. not the act of literally seeing it)

[regal spire]

Honestly, going into the concept of god without the pretty cherubs and stupid commercialism of Christian values is so amazing

[dim plover]

I haven’t studied quantum stuff too much but if I understand it involves the idea of light being an actual physical thing right

[regal spire]

Not a Christian, but I love religion, especially when it’s got cool fanfics to follow

[dim plover]

And since photons (light) are needed for human observation then utilizing it changes the result of things small enough to get affected by the introduction of light

Is that it?

[regal spire]

Then apply that to everything about weirds, no matter the concept, and that’s basically how it works

[dim plover]

Seems like there’s no intangible concept that Weirds can’t embody

[regal spire]

I thought it would be more likely to find it somewhere snowy, maybe by a graveyard

[quartz mist]

Like I mentioned, Weirds are intentionally abstract, as they embody concepts of fate, destiny, simulation, panpsychism, and the idea of a living universe exploring itself by proxy.

[rotund gust]

it’s like he’s in some king of snowgrave

[dim plover]

What do you mean by “exploring itself”

[regal spire]

Well, when someone reaches adolescence, and a myriad of changes befall them, they may discover certain thoughts-

[quartz mist]

Have you personally experienced the process of a single cell breaking down glucose into usable energy?

Do you know what that feels like?

[rotund gust]

yeah i’m feeling it right now

[dim plover]

Oh my god I wasn’t even thinking about that

[quartz mist]

Can you understand the sensation of an electric pulse racing between neurons to create a thought through experience? Can you relate to that pulse of electricity, and not just the resultant emotion or thought that it sends to your conscious mind?

[regal spire]

The closest we have to experiencing that is when our brains don’t instinctually turn off the intense, agonizing pain that digestion would be. It would be like experiencing millions of ants crawling through your body nonstop, eating and chewing every little nerve you could ever connect to. It would be so overwhelming that your brain would likely suffer a thousand seizures before we could even get a second worth of knowledge

[quartz mist]

Do you know what it feels like for a muscle to contract and expand, from the point of view of the muscle?

Do you think something as massive as the universe could understand how the water inside it flows? How energy transfers through it? How people and creatures react and busy themselves about their daily lives?

From the perspective of the water, the energy, the people, the creatures?

I don't think you do really understand that, cause it's too weird for anyone to fully comprehend. Weirds are that comprehension.

@dim plover Does that help?

[dim plover]

Hi back

[rotund gust]

so, weirds are a form of cosmic horror in a way

[dim plover]

Sorry I was eating, one moment

[rotund gust]

the comprehension of the incomprehensible

[quartz mist]

If you want to interpret it like that, sure. I like to view it more positively.

[rotund gust]

mhm

[dim plover]

I’m not saying this because you said I wouldn’t understand it, but that analogy was probably the closest I’ve come to understanding some of the less literal parts of the Weird text

Like, I can sort of get it in an ignorant sort of sense

Ignorant as in, I get it, but not in the way that someone who has experienced it firsthand would get, and understanding that barrier of ignorance exists

[quartz mist]

After all, if you can comprehend it, suddenly it isn't so incomprehensible. And the universe is such a massive all-encompassing thing that if anything could maintain its composure in the face of alien and strange information, that would be it.

Joyous discovery and experimentation, not terrified realization.

The universe is, and it proves itself by examining itself and coming to comprehend.

We just get to see it doing that, and interact with its noodling around.

[dreamy jackal]

Do you view them more as sentient benign tumors (like they disparate from the collective "universe" and are just a concept exploring itself) or is it like your cells becoming sentient and conveying their experiences to your mind (in this case that'd be the universes mind i guess?) (basically do they share a collective consciousness or are they each individually conscious)

[dim plover]

Oh I kinda fell into the same trap of forgetting that this is connected to Weirds somehow

Dammit

[regal spire]

The incomprehensible nature of cosmic horror isn’t actually what brings about the horrifying revelation. It’s the fact that comprehending it means that whatever their brain had available for instinctual comprehension was completely replaced by cosmic understanding, which—as a concept—is too encompassing for our brains to physically store it. Even in a positive light, looking to the unity that encompasses the entire universe as almost a single entity (god), comprehending that truly would be the very end of your mind.

(Unless, of course, the people in this concept do not have human brains)

It isn’t a harrowing realization, it’s all bits of humanity being completely rewritten and replaced by this cosmic understanding, and being left with nothing but base instincts

[dim plover]

In beginning to finally understand its meaning I inadvertently severed my mental connection of it to Weirds solely because of how much I’ve been pulling the string connecting them

Like tugging the concept towards understanding, which is in the direct opposite direction of where Weirds are

Upon nearly reaching comprehension I broke the string

(This is a roundabout way to request you to tie whatever you said back to Weirds)

(Pls and Thx)

[dim plover]

Are they though

[quartz mist]

More the former than the latter.

[dim plover]

Weirds are more like, failing to comprehend the enormity what they represent rather than failing to comprehend the Weirds’ existence

I assume

To paraphrase the funny Scout meme, I feel like people in-universe comprehend those Weirds pretty well

[quartz mist]

Embodiments viewed through the lens of something much greater than us, that we do our best with via our own viewpoints.

[dim plover]

Less of what the Weirds mean and more that they’re a thing and they’re here and they do things

[regal spire]

Weird things

Xavier Renegade Angel

[dim plover]

To break off-topic for a little bit, the concept of embodiments of concepts in fiction always intrigued me solely because if the embodiment is a character you’re pretty much always forced to give it even a tiny bit of personality

Even giving it a physical design already makes the character a logically not true embodiment

But you kinda have to do that since a true embodiment can’t logically make sense to exist

[regal spire]

Embodiments have a significantly more interesting concept behind them if they’re less the personified version of a concept, and more the only concept our human minds can perceive

[dim plover]

That makes sense

Anyways back to Weirds

I made a quest to understand Weirds some years back and I am determined to struggle through it

||I promised myself to make fanmade content of Weirds and I will not accept anything less than an accurate depiction of what Weirds really mean in canon||

TLDR; I accept the challenge I imposed on myself

[quartz mist]

Yep. The way we see and understand fire is very different from the way the universe understands fire. Weirds are fire from the way the universe understands it- we just do our best with a less varied, less refined sensorium.

Like, y'know shrimp colors?

[regal spire]

Shrimp colors, man

[quartz mist]

Weirds are that with more than just colors.

[dim plover]

it’s funny you say that, I was eating shrimp

[regal spire]

What color could they possibly need to see more than me

[dim plover]

Anyways does this mean that Weirds are (and this was already alluded to earlier in the conversation I think), in a sense, disconnected from everything else in the universe?

If they are, as I understand it, a physical, visual, human-perceptible version of how the universe views its own concepts,

Nevermind halfway through writing the above I got the sense that I botched it
One moment

[quartz mist]

Understanding a Water Weird means recognizing higher-order concepts of water that humans can't really interact with- examining a 4d object from a 3d plane. We can see and understand parts of it, then observing it one way bucks everything we came to understand because we just physically do not have the sensorium required to understand it as it is- but trying sure will lead to breakthroughs!

[dim plover]

Oh wait I might be close

And Weirds are, I suppose putting it metaphorically, the universe forcing its own vision in front of us?

A water Weird forming is like the universe’s eyeball being placed between our own eyes and water, so that we see through it in the sense the universe does (albeit the best we can comprehend what we’re seeing)?

[quartz mist]

Not exactly, but kind of. It's very abstract so that's the answer you'll get about a lot of stuff

[dim plover]

It’s a step for me, I’ll take it

[quartz mist]

So you can see how this would drive ingame scientists absolutely bonkers trying to figure it out, in a much more mundane sense than the meteors do, right?

[regal spire]

Isn’t it just what we can comprehend, as humans, the universe’s nature/influence as an incomprehensible being

[dim plover]

Surprised they can even derive all this from just observing Weirds

Not sure how that happens tbh

[regal spire]

Weird, ain’t it

[quartz mist]

Like, it drives them nuts in the sense that they'd pore over the details and make and throw out hundreds of hypotheses on what they are, why they are, how they are, hair-pulling levels of incomprehensibility that they nevertheless try and figure out over time, rather than driving them nuts in the sense that exposure make go cuckoo

[dim plover]

I suppose

It’s something that cannot study further with their existing tools, I assume

Not some creature you can sedate, put on an operating bed and poke and prod as if Weirds are even anything remotely related to life as we know it

[quartz mist]

Not for lack of trying

[dim plover]

But yeah I can see this one happening

[regal spire]

Does it not affect us similarly because we’re so cosmically and morally dense that no perspectives beyond killing could breach our heads?

Are we too stupid to be really effected by cosmic magic? I never actually knew the answer to that

[dim plover]

We have fourth wall armor

The human character in-game is getting obliterated with several different poisons and toxins and cosmic ailments as we trudge though hostile environments and magically-dense valleys but it’s ok because us the player are controlling their movements with a keyboard in a higher reality

(The player is not their own person they’re just a vessel we project our personality into trust me)

[regal spire]

We’re a genetically perfected, magically resilient super soldier sent to Wynn as an experimental warrior for Fruman expansion into a, subsequent, world wide expansion against every province—gavel atp

That’s why we have no memories, because we were literally built for this

[dim plover]

Sorry I was referencing the neverending Deltarune arguments on Kris Wynncraft’s player probably isn’t actually an existing character

I dunno, maybe Fruma might break that
Part of me doesn’t want Wynncraft’s player to be its own character in-lore

[potent yoke]

can you eat a french fry weird

[dim plover]

Eat it by the side

[regal spire]

If it does, though, I feel like that’s the only reasonable way to take it, based on the progression of the story

[quartz mist]

From a gameplay perspective you don't go crazy from cosmic magic cause we have no good way to represent that as an ingame effect and doing so would recontextualize, and therefore force us to essentially redo, the whole game. If you want a lore reason, it happens slowly over time and you don't have enough cumulative exposure or something.

[vapid peak]

Yeah, I can definitely see why scholars have mostly just given up and decided that "by nature they defy any sort of ground rules, we call it a weird because it's weird asf"

[dim plover]

Years back I made a boss concept against a cosmic horror that utilized a sanity meter

Exposure to attacks, proximity to cosmic horror enemies and other dangers lowers it, holding shift makes the player close their eyes and convince themselves everything is fine and everything will be okay to slowly increase it

[regal spire]

Love the potential for ideas with that. A sort of exposure meter that doesn’t really go down, but does grow with consistent exposure to the cosmic entities

[dim plover]

(This isn’t like, an existing thing I made it’s just an idea)

(I might use it in the future though)

[regal spire]

A quest that forced us into an insanity induced state from too many meteors would be fun (??? Could have done that well by showcasing our consistent exposure to the meteors effecting our ability to comprehend the computer in the quest start location)

[vapid peak]

I shudder to think of the implications if that were applied to corruption

Anni would be even harder to fend off than it already is

[dim plover]

Make us hallucinate or smth that would be fitting

||That or make us really like mushrooms||

(They heal triple the strongest health potion)

[dim plover]

I wasn’t actually aware that Annie coming back constantly was like, a canon thing

I was really surprised

[vagrant mason]

can we add labubus to wynncraft

[quartz mist]

But in terms of the Weirds, they drive scientists crazy in the sense that if you ask them the right question about Weirds they'll either break down crying or punch you in the face, both out of equal amounts of exasperation.

[vagrant mason]

to the lore

[dim plover]

I wonder if Weirds have a concept art

I guess their point-in-time makeup might be too inconsistent to make art of

[quartz mist]

They didn't when I made them, but a couple people in the team drew up ideas. Don't think I can share them though

[dim plover]

I imagine scientists in-universe trying to draw up sketches of these things

[vapid peak]

Yeah, I was also pretty surprised when I learned that devils are beings of pure, unadulterated corruption.

[regal spire]

The most human response to having an idea, but having zero way to articulately express the concept without going in circles, so you grab your hair or start ticking 😔

The major difference being that you’ve still got no concrete answer, so you can’t even articulately communicate your theory 😭

[quartz mist]

Yep. Just utterly infuriating to research due to lack of comprehensibility, but equally as enticing to research for the same reasons because comprehending that would be SUCH A BREAKTHROUGH(and then years later someone else has a breakthrough that disproves your breakthrough and you rip up your notebook into shreds and eat them out of righteous fury)

[dim plover]

“Oh god what is that nebulous mess of parts”

“What the hell is this creature of indeterministic proportions”

“How on earth is a pencil drawing capable of portraying a nightmarish, pulsating cloud of inconsistency”

“Jesus, this shouldn’t even exist on paper”

||“Why does this one look like a rice ball”||

[thick pivot]

🍙

[dim plover]

🍙

[quartz mist]

"thats clearly a jelly filled donut, CARL"

[regal spire]

Nothing beats a jelly filled donut

[vapid peak]

If there are uncorrupted things around, it'll try to destroy it. If there are corrupted undead, it'll destroy it. If there are other devils, they will fight to the death. And if it's all alone it will just start mutilating itself

[dim plover]

The corruption doesn’t seem very self-sustaining

[vapid peak]

It's inherently anti-life, yes

[dim plover]

(I predict the devil population will go extinct by 2028)

[vapid peak]

Only if the war of the realms ends

[regal spire]

Considering a bit of snow can slow em to statues, almost, I’d expect them to be gone by winter

[dim plover]

The secret to winning over the Realm of War is to let it gameend themselves

I still want to know what happens if we try to flood the Roots of Corruption

[vapid peak]

Also this one specifically was supposed to have an animation where it heated the mace its holding by gouging it into its stomach and ripping it back out
https://wynncraft.wiki.gg/wiki/File:RisingSol.png

Unfortunately corruption prioritizes non-corrupteds

[dim plover]

The roots are completely surrounded by a moat directly connected to the ocean

Dig some trenches and flood the basin

Why is the corruption sun-themed

I figured it was like, hellish

[vapid peak]

I think it is- it just uses the sun as a theme a lot because it's hot asf

[dim plover]

Again

Flood the damn thing
Cool it down

See what happens

That or go back in time and bring and ice drake here or smth that’ll do it

[vapid peak]

Also curious but I have a feeling the ocean is gonna drain before the basin is filled up

We have no idea how large the realm of war is

[regal spire]

Why there hasn’t been some kind of volunteer water nymph firefighters service yet is beyond me

Theorick didn’t think about that 🧌

[dim plover]

The biggest plot twist is that if we finally enter the Realm of War and everything within it is ice-themed

It got so hot that the universe integer-overflowed itself and made it ice cold

[regal spire]

The realm of war being like the aftermath of a volcanic eruption has potential

[vapid peak]

I think it's been stated that entering the Realm of War would straight up kill you, so quickly that you wouldn't be able to see it from the 4th wall

[regal spire]

Instead of it being incredibly hot all the time, it’s just singed by the demons and cultivated by the lava that flows around their… whatever

[vapid peak]

In Madeline's words.

[rotund gust]

and my goat theorick came out pretty fine all things considered

just a bit of corruption

[vapid peak]

Yeah honestly Theorick even coming back is genuinely impressive

Anybody else would have died on the spot and been raised as a powerful undead

[rotund gust]

i mean, bak’al came back missing half his face and evil, corrupted of worlds came back as a mindless destruction monster. Theorick just kinda became a bit more evil than he was before, and even then he could stave it off long enough to make ice barrows

[regal spire]

Are there cultural dishes affiliated with Wynn?

[rotund gust]

yahya mushroom soup

[wispy bay]

voidroot stew

[vapid peak]

Wait, did Bak'al do that? There's quite a bit of old lore about him that I'm not sure is canon anymore

[rotund gust]

i don’t know if it got removed, but i thought it was canon he went in after CoW but before Theorick

[shut hornet]

the water would probably go into the portal, and what happens on that side is unclear

if its anything like the nether though it probably all evaporates

[rotund gust]

wiki lists fate of the fallen as the source

[vapid peak]

[shut hornet]

basically what im saying is the portal would act as one of those holes they put at the tops of sink basins to stop them from overflowing

[regal spire]

Nether mentioned. Club this CT with hammers

[shut hornet]

i will point out its unclear if the corrupter of worlds is a corrupted human or something that came from the realm of war itself, there are conflicting narratives on it in the temple of the legends quest. one character asserts one truth, while another (rayshyroth) gives a different idea.

i think kelight asserts that its a corrupted human while rayshyroth says it could be either or

[hybrid gazelle]

Corrupter of worlds? More like fraud of worlds

Bro did barely anything in the timeline

[rotund gust]

mmm, so we have 2 confirmed people who went in and came out, and 1 who may or may not have gone in but definitely came out

[regal spire]

Corrupter of of towns, maybe, bit of a stretch for worlds

[rotund gust]

corrupter of small villages

[hybrid gazelle]

Annie folded cow like laundry and put it on free labor to make Annie lunch

[dim plover]

Oh my god you cannot believe the coincidence that just happened

I just went to the washroom and while washing my hands my focus goes to exactly what you just described on the sink

And I was like “huh I haven’t thought about this thing for years” and then thought about other random stuff like “I guess it makes sense that the hole is slightly larger than the faucet’s water diameter” and “I wonder what happens if the space behind the hole is smaller than usual”

And then I came back, opened Discord and was met with this
What are the odds

[rotund gust]

i still can’t believe theoricks plan was “hrm, the last guy to go in the portal became the biggest threat to the province, but maybe if im badass enough it’ll be fine”

i can freeze whatever’s on the other side

imagine theorick just saw annihilation and immediately noped out

[dim plover]

Pre-update Garoth, more like

Bro when he sees “it”, according to his dialogue

[rotund gust]

pre update garoth did not have nearly enough aura to be going into the portal

turned him into a dinosaur somehow

someone pushed him in we never learned who that was, maybe bak’al

[wispy bay]

bro was doing a little trolling

[dim plover]

Annihilation actually pushed him in

Because of the cutscene silhouette we were made to believe the pushing force was human-sized

[wispy bay]

Nah it was the juggler just being silly

[dim plover]

When in reality Annie actually sneaked past him out of the portal and then went up behind him and did a little push tee hee hee

[wispy bay]

https://tenor.com/view/donald-duck-tip-toe-sneak-gif-14828116

[dim plover]

Btw with all the theories about Annihilation’s lower half I haven’t seen anyone that suggested what I did for Annihilation

One of my ideas was me suggesting that the Annie we see is not an upper half, but just a single limb of a greater gargantuan monstrosity

It’s not an earthly being, who says this alien monstrosity’s appendages have to look like claws or legs or tentacles or whatever

What if Annie is equivalent to like, one of our hands
And said monster is poking it through and pulling it back

[wispy bay]

He’s just dipping his fingies into the portal

[dim plover]

Why can’t we shrink the portal so Annie can’t fit though

Or goad Annie into accidentally destroying the portal frame due to its large size

[wispy bay]

It’s not like a nether portal where u can just break the frame and close the portal

[rotund gust]

what if we dig around the war portal, lift it up out of the ground, transport it to either gavel or through the silent expanse, and throw it in one of the other portals

make it orphion or dern beasties problem

[wispy bay]

I think of it more like a rift in space where u can’t move it?

[regal spire]

Dern spoilers bfore Fruma?

Wynn excavation finally comes in handy

[shut hornet]

what if we added dern in fruma and its rol sized and has like nothing going on and actually fruma is the final update

u guys wouldnt see that coming

[rotund gust]

so… if dern was exactly like RoL?

[regal spire]

Id unironically get kinda depressed

[rotund gust]

dern is just RoL but there’s one olm inside who’s just a chill guy

[hybrid gazelle]

jut wanna show off this piece of the Taproot because i am proud of how I redesign it

[rotund gust]

who needs eaten dern theory

[hybrid gazelle]

this probably will not fucking work in minecraft but whatever

I just love flower making light projection and stuff
aasgain probably wont work in minecraft but whatever

with lack of info what Orphion actually is in canon wyncnraft IJ ust gonna go my own take in rewrite where Orphion is this abstract being that represent many abstract concept

such as stagnation, inaction, truth, bliss, and more

[dim plover]

Would explain how they’re going to get away with not adding the level 110 gathering material (Dernic) to Fruma

(They do)

[shut hornet]

honestly dont put it past us with the new model tech

we can do some pretty cool looking shit now

[regal spire]

Have Orphion live as the embodiment of the entire flora and fauna, ecosystem and all. (Not as how it is now). Be walking through the realm, where simply touching the ground can influence the way it changes in front of you, preparing for something unfamiliar. Seeing orphion up close would morph the world into the most feasible perspective possible, maybe changing and shifting into grander concepts, until you notice the parasite, which shifts it into some kind of caged animal

[shut hornet]

the light forest ultimate discovery is the first cutscene i've made and i think the visual style pretty much carries it

[dim plover]

Can you describe this

I don’t think I understand

[dim plover]

I heard it was updated recently
Can you link a video of the new version? I want to see what has changed

[hybrid gazelle]

the flower act as light projector

[shut hornet]

it was updated in 2.1 since it used old models

[dim plover]

As in like, a flower lighting up and forming a hologram in front of it?

[shut hornet]

the dialogue was changed a bit because the old dialogue was.. honestly, pretty meaningless, and we had better ideas for it

[hybrid gazelle]

yes

[dim plover]

Ah that
I mean, Wynncraft can probably fake doing that to a pre-set surface

[regal spire]

For your first, it’s actually really well done. The ending of it is quite cinematic

[dim plover]

Can you link the cutscene nonetheless

[hybrid gazelle]

"THE PARASITE EMERGE AMONG THE CHOAS OF THE EQUINOX"

[regal spire]

I do really miss the eye opening, whilst pushing us into darkness and screaming, though

[shut hornet]

i would link a video but i dont know where to find one

[rotund gust]

it’s so good

[hybrid gazelle]

if that possible then awesome

I think the Light should do weird thing with its influence cause flower light projection could be so cool

[shut hornet]

i wish olinus would upload wynn videos with the full un-dubbed un-altered cutscenes

would make it so easy to find stuff like that. nobody ever uploads them to youtube

i cant even find a video of the new rymek luke boss to show people besides one guy's run of it where he spends like half the fight cheesing the mechanics

[vagrant mason]

i love rymek luke

[rotund gust]

rymek luke went from a forgetable boss with decent drops to easily the best part of the desert/mesa region in one update

[dim plover]

Deadeye model when

I am a big fan of specific items having special default models

Make Deadeye player weapon match Rymek Luke’s gun

[hybrid gazelle]

I always take Rymek Luke as a few person who manage to reverse engineer corkian tech and made it into his dead eye which is a prototype

I think Rymek and Corkus should close tie with Corkian tech being smuggle into Rymek

it would have been also perfect excuse to give rymek bandits a gun to fit with wild west theming

[regal spire]

Only thing I can say against it is that it can demotivate players from using other bows at that level range, because the models too dope lmao

[hybrid gazelle]

the item itself is not even that exciting which is a shame

it would be so cool if we get fable of bow that have ammo system
like maybe increase main attack by a lot but it use ammo system that require reload after some shooting

and then introduce new bow that can drop from Corkus WE that use the same major id but more fit with higher level

[dim plover]

Would that be an actually valid concern though

[plain ingot]

I hope there's still some leftovers from the original one I made? 👉 👈

[raw badge]

Not gonna lie, how would we enter Fruma is the thing? Would it be like All Roads to Peace where we defeat Arrai-Veretal in a 1v1 duel, but of course to a limit, so she isn't dead (this would be kinda reasonable since the Queen would want to see if we're worthy) but idk myself

Infliltrating would possibly involve a splinter group as per Relos' Secret Library (since most of the Corkians are ex-Fruman and developed their own magic, but they are rather questionable folks) but that could possibly involve a possible coup d'etat which would be a more chaotic approach, but I do feel like Tasim would have his downfall, but maybe this would be A Journey Beyond/Further but to home? I dunno

[wispy bay]

I think it’s gonna be like a journey beyond but with tasim

[warm flicker]

theres this interesting line on the nameless anomaly's trivia wiki page:
"The arena of the Nameless has Ancient Wynnic carved into the stone. The three lines read "I WANT OUT.", "IT'S HERE.", and "OUT LIE IN.""
is the nameless anomaly... trying to flee from somewhere, or someone? And its attempts at escaping had the byproduct of creating the void holes?

[regal spire]

Honestly, no, I just thought it was funny

[soft radish]

Nah but side topic here because I don't know if I'm interrupting an existing conversation or not

Are we just gonna ignore the fact that when the forgery combined the runes they just created a pocket dimension essentially?

[exotic bough]

arent there several pocket dimensions in the game? (dramele's trash dimension, tls, that old mage place, other places gawrick can tp you to, slykaars dimension)

[soft radish]

That would mean that pocket dimensions are relatively easy to construct then

Outside of the realm of light and dern, which are the primary dimensions, there appear to be several sub dimensions that virtually any experienced mage can create on a whim

[hybrid gazelle]

Light and Dern are more relam that on influence plane

while pocket dimension would be different

I would associate these pocket space with cosmic magic

because it literally magic about controling space and time LOL

[regal spire]

I like to think of it with consideration for our magical prowess, like how assassins can vanish into thin air. If we take into account the—old idea, maybe retconned—concept that assassins have studied the ability to look for gaps in between the fabric of reality, where the particles lined just right, and being able to cut through it to drape yourself in that fabric

I’d imagine this concept could be applied to rune magic, which is capable of incredible, incomprehensible power. If we, as simple conduits to magical potential, can do so much with what we’re offered, imagine the possibilities with something like Runes.

[cloud phoenix]

where do the runes come from?

[regal spire]

I’d imagine they were forged by an ancient civilization, likely the one that managed the colossi

We don’t actually have a lot of info from more than 5000 years ago; there’s so much potential for what the ancient civilizations of Gavel, Wynn, and Fruma hold

[rotund gust]

i already don’t use other bows might aswell lean into it

[rotund gust]

given the sixth sovereign trailer shows players walking up the fruman gate to the sixth sovereign I assume it’ll have something to do with them

[regal spire]

My theory stays with us being messengers sent from Wynn, after uncovering the expanse. The sovereign’s have been recently revealed to have begun diplomatic alliance with Wynn around 900AP, which would add to the possibility that the Fruma and Wynn alliance would have a significant level of inside intelligence, perhaps aided and improved by our own efforts to unite the world against Dern to turn the table against both corruption, and Dern’s power

[warm flicker]

oh boy do i have a headcanon document for u. This is my interpretation of the world before 0 AP, tho im sure @hybrid gazelle has an even more in-depth timeline

[eternal helm]

HOLY SHIT

THE LORE DISCUSSION PAGE!?!?!?!

[regal spire]

I think the time valley canon is a bit out of order, since the SD implies that the Olm originated within Time Valley, first, before going to the expanse, which they then escaped by fleeing to Dernel

I don’t know how much is implied ingame that they presided within the expanse, first, but, it seems they were significantly more prominent within time valley, much before the expanse

[cloud phoenix]

timeless ruin sd implies they were most strong in time valley and then moved their population to se no?

[regal spire]

That’s what I thought

But the document seems to imply they went to time valley after they presided within the expanse

[cloud phoenix]

i wish there was more time valley sd's 😭

[warm flicker]

Never thought of it that way. I assumed they started in SE, expanded to time valley and conducted experiments there, and when the big disaster happened they retreated to SE, not knowing it was already destroyed

[exotic bough]

i do agree that the equinox/the elves being stupid did cause the colossi to start destroying gavel, but i dont think light was the main reason it did so. they couldve also started destroying the canyons bc of the corruption's or the parasite's presence

[regal spire]

It is more likely that the reverse is true, having established colonies within SE after realizing how much is at stake with the collapse of time valley

[wispy bay]

I do wonder what the expanse looked like before, since the olm says “the only hope is the expanse” when wynn is a big place with a lot of other nice places to settle

[exotic bough]

i think ponr shows us what the eyeball forest looked like pre-dernification. the light probably preserved the memory of the se as "just another part of wynn"

[regal spire]

I have a feeling that the light obelisk isn’t revealing what Lutho actually looked like back then

[lean ether]

this is a really cool point

although it definitely isn't what lutho looked like once the miners came there because by that point Dark had already pushed the Olm out of SE and drove them to collapse

[exotic bough]

i feel like it does, especially since the light forest in gavel is super vibrant and bright. iirc the non-eyeball forest is just oak trees without any other colors aside from green and brown

[lean ether]

I'm not certain on how old that line is, it might be pre-1.19 but in any case the SE was probably not called "Silent Expanse" by the Olm

[cloud phoenix]

theres been implications over time that the silent expanse was always kinda dark

[exotic bough]

i think the dialogue was redone in 1.20

[lean ether]

cause like, the silence only came because the olm had left

shiiit fr? then what the fuck was going on there

I'd honestly always imagined that the Olm civilization stretched throughout the entire southern Wynn from the jungle to the SE

[cloud phoenix]

we know that the ponr version of lutho is by the light so it would come with no darkness

heres where you can get into the eaten dern theory

[regal spire]

From its general position of the mountains, and its border to Nesaak, which has always had attributes of a tundra, it wouldn’t be as bright as it is, especially with the more light forest esq trees that can be seen.

[cloud phoenix]

i dont know if the guy who made it is online rn but to sum it up

its basically trying to say that the land of dern was once an actual part of the wynn continent, but then was absorbed into the realm of darkness by an entity that either is similar to TNA or is TNA

[regal spire]

It would be significantly rockier and have much darker, taller trees. What we were shown looked like a mix between Wynn plains—a plains—and the light forest, which mimics the more deciduous and angiosperms we get with fruiting, changing trees

[cloud phoenix]

explaining the usage of different terminolgy with dern and the realm of darkness

[lean ether]

ok this is kinda cool

shit I gotta get a readup on all the realm lore and shizz

I don't remember how this physicality-influcence stuff worked

[cloud phoenix]

im not sure of the evidence or implications cause i cant find the og message rn but ill try to find it rn

[lean ether]

50 lines of dialogue in RoL IV here I come

[cloud phoenix]

do you have it rn?

[lean ether]

feed me lore treeman

[lean ether]

eaten dern theory dispenser

[rotund gust]

i’m working on it

[lean ether]

🔥

[rotund gust]

i’m looking for item lore to support it rn. I don’t know any good ways to search like… all items for key words in item lore

[lean ether]

yeah also you gotta filter for like uhhh the items that are canon and those that aren't

the elder days of twilight bridge of the divide lore were so ass 💔

who remember this shit and the twilight theories

[regal spire]

Lamest theories, tbh

Twilight has its place, but not within wynns established lore. Just makes everything we know really convoluted and silly

[lean ether]

pre-1.20 lorework fed me so many terms that don't even have anything to do with the game and don't appear at all

[rotund gust]

i spent a few hours running around in game looking for eaten dern evidence though (accidentally found evidence for the theory someone brought up a few days ago about orphion conquering gavel along the way)

[lean ether]

what the fuck were the farnians about who came up with that

[rotund gust]

can’t really do that right now though seeing as maintenance

[lean ether]

is the website also on maintenance?

[rotund gust]

no but api on the item search wasn’t working. i mean you can’t search key words in item lore with it anyway, but i can’t just scour items and hope i catch ine

[tame sundial]

https://wynnbuilder.github.io/items_adv/?f=lore%3F%3D"element"&s=
if you want to search item lores you can use this

[rotund gust]

incredible

[lean ether]

holy shit

[exotic bough]

https://forums.wynncraft.com/threads/gavel-lore-rework.295429/

[lean ether]

nether mention in 2025

[lean ether]

oh god it was from us

but like farnians had to be older

wasn't it from like some ancient document fool or someone wrote about like 15 gavellian gods or something

[hybrid gazelle]

A CT was mauled for this 💔

[shut hornet]

i kept the general idea of an orphion silhouette scene and i also kept the cool shots in cinfras and efilim

[lean ether]

so ollie the optometrist stayed?

[shut hornet]

yes

[lean ether]

🔥

[rich estuary]

is there anything on "Takan's Brother" that the Shadow Spears Leader mentioned? the wiki doesn't seem to indicate anything and to me that seems like a really obvious plot hook

[shut hornet]

i really like the way those scenes look with the heads moving for talking and all but theres a good reason why we dont do it all the time

[plain ingot]

I think I used a program made by one of the CT that tracked your motion and turned into script movements though it can be janky when putting it into cutscenes

[shut hornet]

yeah

the problem with it is it just spams the same function over and over and over again so its just really unwieldly

script 1 moment

[plain ingot]

sure was something

[hybrid gazelle]

Admiral Ageis mention execution on Takan's brother once but overall it just some side plot point that probably over when Takan dies

[regal spire]

Just started thinking about Norse Mythology and Resonance’s lore

That an ancient society of druids could commit so heavily to connecting their magic—and themselves—to the well of the worlds magic, only to have their bodies morphed into the world’s lifestream

Like a world tree, splitting veins, blood into the heart of the world, giving way to the very mind of it

[rotund gust]

ok so after searching a bunch of words i only found like one item lore i can use :/

[rich estuary]

oh i see, the implication is that the execution of Takan's brother caused him to pull the move he did? which is why this like is here:
Admiral Amerigo: ...No. There is nothing that I can recall that would motivate such an attack. Will that be all?

i didn't see the mention of the execution and i thought he was gonna be another quest

[hybrid gazelle]

Yeah admiral Aegies involve in approval of Takan's brother execution

[regal spire]

I wonder what the first thing an ocean update would offer

Deep sea diving? An old civilization? MWE Boss? Raid into the body of a kraken?

Maybe some added mage island lore, to go with the new ocean. Something to do with how they calmed it, like there being set anchors around the ocean that calm the tides, with whatever antagonist of the ocean—a kraken or leviathan—is disrupting

[hybrid gazelle]

I rather not have anymore ancient civilization unless it’s same one that we introduced lol

Ocean update likely refine a lot of lore and remake some area like mage island

I have firm believe that mage island need a new purpose because literally its existence is redundant and make no sense considering how magic majorly accept in the world

Dead island tbh I felt like could be turn into somewhere else

The whole dead shtick kinda do not work when there zombie running around like yeah dude you ain’t special we got whole ass province about that

Ice island is fine most of the time it just lore need to be refine

Regular island idfk, is there record of goblins manage to cross the ocean? Like why there are no orcs with them, like do they jsut diss their bigger cousins?

Also why human specifically? Like why not villager a spieces thst they would be familiar with

[regal spire]

Dead island was, essentially, the SE before we had SE. It’s the most simplistic version of the concept of darkness having spread to something. I think their intent for depiction was outweighed by the rest of the world’s ambition, completely undermining what Dead Island’s impact was.

[hybrid gazelle]

I think dead island work better if it just mysterious island thst literally void of life

[regal spire]

Now, it’s just a shell of a concept—and a kind of silly one at that

[hybrid gazelle]

Like there is no quest in there, Therr is no mobs in there, just quiet overgrown island Witt no music

I think that work better as dead island

[regal spire]

What lonely islet WE should’ve been

[hybrid gazelle]

Also remove undead from the ocean

Straight up just I don’t care just remove them all and give us real pirate

Remove ghost ship

[regal spire]

Skien’s island had justification for it, though

[hybrid gazelle]

Skien had a reason I am talking about other case

Even then I prefer if skien is only corrupted undead Therr and that his actual boss

[regal spire]

Ghost ships another relic of the past, level 15 weaponsmith and woodworking ingredient

[hybrid gazelle]

If a random mf can become Goliath I don’t see why Skien fight have to be shadow of his former self

Also Ngl I don’t like skien lore to begin with because like

Cause how the fuck long did skien and his men stay in there to build such huge ass building on the island

[regal spire]

I like its dungeon concept, which—imo—is more of a fitting ocean dungeon than Galleons Graveyard

[hybrid gazelle]

Unless Troms is dumb enough to exile its entire army along with skien, Therr is no way they could have build shit like that

[quick needle]

Important and useless question: If Skien wanted to invade Selchar, would he be able to?

[hybrid gazelle]

No because he has no ship

[regal spire]

He’s got charge, it ain’t that far

[hybrid gazelle]

Galleon graveyard could be cool if jt play more into ocean lore and not another fucking undead shit

[quick needle]

seems close enough that he might be able to make his army swim across

[hybrid gazelle]

Imagine we have red beard as this pirate getting favor of demon of the ocean that is similar to Garaheth

[regal spire]

I’m fine with bloated corpses and storming an undead ship, but it doesn’t really feel like that. It feels like walking through a cave, when it should’ve been wading through the waters into the belly of the ship

[hybrid gazelle]

Wynncraft magic system literally create pentagram please expand on demon lore

[hybrid gazelle]

I don’t like random undead because it literally just make the setting confusing for 0 reason

Because like wow Therr is corrupted undead, There is Lazarus pit undead, and thetr like ocean undead

None of these related to one another at all and it such so ass befause it just make corrupted undead less special

[regal spire]

We don’t get a real reason as to why there are actually undead in Galleons graveyard. The corrupted version makes way more sense, but it isn’t super implied that there’s corruption reviving him down there

[hybrid gazelle]

No appearantly according to ct, he just too angry to die

[regal spire]

Boooo, laaaaame

[hybrid gazelle]

Which is like funny but still we could habe actual living people as antagonist

Because in wynncraft context that something unique

[wispy bay]

its like a classic undead cursed pirate guarding their booty

[hybrid gazelle]

Okay but does it really need to undermine existence of corrupted undead and over bloated tbe setting with unnncessery undead

[regal spire]

I want more puppet corpses, bloated with water and gas, controlled by magical anchors—maybe another place to put weirds.

[hybrid gazelle]

Now imagine this they literally could imagine undead to hint corruption invovle in narrative but no they can’t because being undead mean Jack shit in this setting

[regal spire]

If an ocean anchor was placed there to help calm the oceans, that could be a really fun concept for GG

[wispy bay]

I don't see it as a problem, the world has plenty of space for different types of magic, and sometimes its better to have a little mystery in the world

[regal spire]

Redbeard crashed into it, and the magical well erupting from the ocean inhabited his old ship, and we go from there

[vestal rivet]

I keep coming in and eavesdropping here
it is hilarious that every lore convo boils down to pulling your hair out

[wispy bay]

it doesn't undermine the existence of corrupted undead

[hybrid gazelle]

You literally do not get it, this is just having undead for the sake of it even then that imply you though out these different type of magic first

[regal spire]

We’ve only got a few concepts for undead: corruption revivals, and necromancy (a bit of a stretch on necromancy being category for the Lazarus fountain)

[hybrid gazelle]

And don’t get me that little mystery bullshit befause these are just random shit that came out of random shit pile

Randomly come up with mystery does not make it good

Look at story “fear of the darkness “ prove thst

You know what make a good mystery? The one that actually intrigued people and not “wow we adding another undead into the setting but this one is more fucking boring since we did 0 unique spin on it”

Even tho we literally could have pirates that utilize existing concept in the setting

Like idk corkian pirates thst using rail gun and shit that could been more interesting than the undead shit we get

Or like gavelian pirates thst use magic

Like magical pirates that shit sound cool

[hybrid gazelle]

I think corruption should be the definitive necromancy of wynncraft setting

Because the more you bloated the setting with similar concept, you just devalue the one that is actually intresting

[vestal rivet]

I also think the existence of other zombies outside of the corruption is odd

[hybrid gazelle]

It is because it just make corruption less special

Corrupted undead represent the anti-life of corruption and how it reanimate corpse to further its destruction

Non corrupted undead just exist because the writers is creative bankrupt

Like at least corrupted undead have unique spin in reason lore

[regal spire]

There’s quite a bit of necromancy at work, though, and necromancy seems to fall into category of many different forms of life magic. Revivals in the Lazarus pit, Golems in flesh crafting, skeletons risen through soul binding magic, etc

[hybrid gazelle]

I don’t really like Lazarus pit

Golem is people still alive

Soul magic is poorly world builds

[regal spire]

Corruption is unique in its way to spread like a disease, and though its manipulation of the undead is a byproduct, I don’t think it’s the same kind of necromancy we’re familiar with, so it has its niche

[quick needle]

if you had to be exiled to an island, what would be the 5 best islands to choose from?

Selchar is pretty safe

[hybrid gazelle]

You could literally undead mages use corruption like magic as a way to revive more undead as part of the horse

Lazarus pit work better if it literally bind your soul to the plane

But I still have to work on that

Because I working on rewrite Lazarus pit and it’s property

[regal spire]

We don’t really have any origins or complicated concepts behind this part of the lore. It just kind of does, and we don’t really know why yet

[hybrid gazelle]

Yes thst why I rewrite stuff for my project

A lot of thing in wynncraft just made with no consideration or surface level at best

And it not even good mystery kind of thing like I said

People love making it sound like mystery is a get out of jail free card to excuse literally everything

[regal spire]

It’s a byproduct of having so many ideas, but neither the time nor money to implement them

[hybrid gazelle]

I hardly think it any of those and it just they did not really push through wynncraft as setting thst much

Befause look if there any idea in there, you would see it

But there is none, it just generic and mostly cliche like look at Gavel

[regal spire]

Gavel was built on simple concepts; look at the man it hailed from

[hybrid gazelle]

Yes I am fucking aware

You are talking to a guy that been research and writing doc about this goddam setting, I am aware

[regal spire]

Lmao, anyone who can look at a concept and say “no, I can’t use this because it’s controversial” does not think like an artist

Which is super ironic, because the guy made an entire career out of being creative in a block game

[hybrid gazelle]

Wynncraft just have problem where it like

It could possibly be the most boring fantasy setting ever? But that mostly before 2.1 where the great start turning

Because the problem is like look at elves for example
You would think they push the idea of them worship the light harder but not really?

Aldorei look boring like there not much religion stuff going on

Not even temple or Orphion statue, it just weird

It felt like prime example of sometime wynncraft just lack direction

[regal spire]

Too many ideas, not enough consistency, time, or money. I hope to see it all come to fruition, because it has so much potential

[hybrid gazelle]

It will I thjnk

I thjnk wynncraft learning and try to fix itself rn but like stuff like gavel probably won’t reach its full potential

I like dragon lore

I think dragon in wynncraft is pretty intresting but the info is very hard to gather

[regal spire]

Gavel’s entire concept has potential to be developed, but it’s gonna need 2-3 more gavel reborn until the simplistic, disconnected idea behind its original development can be erased and improved

[hybrid gazelle]

Gavel being the high fantasy province but easily the most boring conceptually is so ironic

[regal spire]

Gavel was made for content, not story, which is a horrible path to take when you want a present story

It’s like making a continuity out of Mario, where you need the intent of a story before prioritizing the entire game. It’s why, despite how fun the content is, the story is always lacking.

It’s why something like Mario galaxy is amazing, whilst galaxy 2 feels lacking, despite its air of potential

[hybrid gazelle]

Literally the reason why I start wartorn project is to show how Wynncraft could be as a setting

That can be utilize in dnd-like stuff or its own video game

If think get more update or idea being fully expand morr

[regal spire]

I don’t really talk about it, but I hope to join CT one day, because Wynn has quite literally left such a core impact on my development, my interest in games. I don’t really play much else, beyond what I’m attached to with memories, and my life has no path to ever put something like artistic direction, blockbench animating, or general coding into anything more than a brief hobby, but I hope to see that decision finally reach potential

[hybrid gazelle]

Sure

[cloud phoenix]

i mean fruma has high potential from what trailers and other quests implications

[regal spire]

I remember when I learned how to animate armorstands, and how to create custom mobs with them when I was 13. Entirely inspired by the wonder Wynn offered me

[hybrid gazelle]

I talk about world building wise but so far Fruma look promising

[regal spire]

Hope to see more trailers of it

Kinda getting tired of dissecting the sovereigns walk cycle

[hybrid gazelle]

I really want more expansion on demon lore Becuase what is therr could allow wynncraft to create their own spin of demon in their setting

I have whole home brew lore about how 5 elements habe their own arch demons like garaheth

And they are this primordial wild elemental magic that one can make deal with to enchance their own magical power for a price

[regal spire]

Air demon sounds wicked

[hybrid gazelle]

Because due to the law of exchange in wynncraft universe

If you made a pact with demons, you directly draw power from the demons

Each arch demon emerge when each element first came to exist in the world

[vapid moon]

lore

[hybrid gazelle]

Lesser demons appear and often lure by powerful souls

So just image demons in my homebrew as taxmen, thst why soul magic is dangerous to use

In my home brew, soul magic is management of consuming soul to empower your but also try to paid off demons to avoid them trying to take your by force

Using soul of other to empower your own too far will result in powerful demon being lured by you with no soul to exchange to it

[rotund gust]

lore

[quick needle]

How do cities in Wynn dispose of their municipal waste? Detlas doesn't have a dump, but it has a large population, so the refuse must go... somewhere?

Most medieval cities of that size dumped their garbage in the streets, but Detlas' streets are surprisingly clean, meaning they must be dumping their trash somewhere else. Any idea where?

[hybrid gazelle]

I mean I highly doubt they want to go into thst full detail lol

[quick needle]

Might also just dump everything in the river and make it Nemract's problem

[rotund gust]

nemract is kinda… swampy for lack of a better word. Compared to all the other wynn cities atleast. Maybe it’s cause it’s so polluted

[quick needle]

Or perhaps they throw all the trash in the portal

Perhaps Annie just comes out to complain about all the crap Detlas keeps throwing in her home.

[vestal rivet]

The lava in/near the roots probably makes an excellent garbage disposal point

[rotund gust]

next annie fight has a slightly brown recolor

[rustic nexus]

minecraft rules apply, they just dump everything into a 1x1x1 of lava
but honestly I doubt they'd really want to depict that

we have enough sewers and sewage in the game, I don't think we need trash and landfills

[quick needle]

I mean... if sewers gave birth to a dungeon boss, a landfill would probably give birth to something worse

[rustic nexus]

fruma could maybe depict it but idk

[quick needle]

(but this question on the whole is a hypothetical that obviously doesn't need actual depiction, it is just considering the question within the context of the world as is)

Personally, the idea of dumping everything in the portal is hilarious

[rustic nexus]

given how there's rats all over every town, and some even have roaches, it's likely that yeah, it is thrown around towns and on streets, it's just not depicted

[regal spire]

They burn it, wash it, and use it to regrow the land destroyed in attacks

[rotund gust]

accurate to medieval europe

[quick needle]

What is the most effective fuel source in Wynn? If I want to heat metal to the hottest point possible, how would I go about doing it?

[regal spire]

Fire magic

Probably lava, though, since they’ve been proved to be able to harness it

[hybrid gazelle]

I like the idea elemental magic in wynncraft are like element bending so you can use it for various of purpose

[hybrid gazelle]

I would not call fire magic a rearouce because I feel like it make more sense if fire magic being use to manipulate fire element

Rather than actually tangible thing that can be use as resource

Because my way of explaining elemental magic is that they are this intangible invisible force that one can bend and manipulate assigned elements

I probably need better way to explain it tbh

To this day I still try to find a way to streamline and make magic system easier to understand

[rustic nexus]

it's funny how from one quest we get a scene of a character using an element that's present to cast magic, and a few stages later they just summon a ton of said element out of thin air
(Olon in Aldorei's Secret 2)

like to open the old elven cemetery he uses water from the nearby running river alongside a spell from the player
but then when being chased from the guards, he can just summon a wall of water out of nowhere ????

[regal spire]

Elven plumbing system

[rotund gust]

i love how general and wynncraft channels are going insane, meanwhile this channel is remaining it’s “5 people active at any given time” self

[quartz mist]

tbh I think it's a good thing. it isnt like it's an exclusive club, it just shows that some people really have some passion

[rotund gust]

the lore channel remains a civil discussion board while the world around descends in wynnsanity

[exotic bough]

Can almost certainly guarantee there’ll be a lot more activity and more regulars here when fruma drops

[rotund gust]

oh yeah probably. Or at the very least the people who drop in occasionally will be more active

[rustic nexus]

because lore doesn't require you to be constantly grinding raids and lootruns to fuel your gambling addiction

[rotund gust]

so true. It does require us to read item lore though which is its own type of insanity

i spent like an hour yesterday searching for item lore for eaten dern that is not sane behavior

[exotic bough]

Btw on that note I also added categories for armor, weapons, and accessories that have item lore on the wiki if any of yall wanna look through that

[rotund gust]

incredible

[hidden dove]

@cobalt crest can i get lore on you

[cobalt crest]

im 5 2 female asian wynncrafter 55kg

[rotund gust]

😭

[wraith shale]

I would say water

Assuming the elemental magic is somewhat like avatar, water would probably be the most effective energy producer

you could say thunder, but thunder is also yknow... the sound. If we just say electricity sure yeah, but that would be coming from another person, not necessarily an autonomous system

But with water you could make bigger systems to produce more energy

Idk what Im on tbh Im sleep deprived

[lean ether]

engineer?

[cobalt crest]

house wife

[lean ether]

🔥

[rotund gust]

lore

[lean ether]

bob is DEAD and he is NEVER coming back we will find his rotting CORPSE on the other SIDE of the dern PORTAL

[rotund gust]

https://tenor.com/view/thanos-beanos-grape-man-raisin-nuh-uh-gif-814874865599321096

[warm flicker]

Had a crackpot theory about Theorick’s ice magic. It’s known that water magic can slow down the corruption process. It is also strange how Theorick is the only known person to wield ice magic, other than the ice dragon from the molten heights. Either ice magic is an incredibly difficult magic to master, or Theorick is doing something else. My theory is that Theorick’s magic isn’t ice at all, he is instead using such a massive amount of water magic that any spell which produces water actually produces ice due to sheer pressure. It is possible to turn water into ice with enough pressure, and considering the magical prowess of Theorick he may just be able to do this. Ice magic as we know it may not be a thing, maybe the only way to make ice is to use a lot of water magic and use pressure to turn it into ice

[dim plover]

(Realistically I figured that Theorick’s ice could stave off corruption because corruption back them was still the nether rather than some influential realmic force)

Then again I just learned earlier this year that Realm influence goes both ways (doing stuff in the physical plane affects the realms rather than just the realms affecting the physical plane) so maybe it has some merit to it

[cloud phoenix]

where is this said?

or do you just mean smth like the decays effect on rol

prob that im just stupid lol

[exotic bough]

isnt ice less dense than water

so the amount of water needed to create ice with pressure would be enormous

so much so that all of the nesaak forest wouldve been covered in 4m of snow from theorick doing a small ice wall spell

im too lazy to do the math for that so dont quote me on that

[rotund gust]

doesn’t grookwarts say that ice magic is like a fusion of water and air? or something in that vein

ok exactly not exactly a fusion but their connected

[dim plover]

Madeline, but she was clarifying that this is the case using actual stuff that happens in-game because I was confused

More specifically the mini parasites in Gavel

Because I was under the impression that it’s only status of the Realms reflecting onto the status of their influence in the physical plane

Like light in Gavel dying off as the Realm of Light continues to get leeched via Orphion’s parasite

But turns out that killing parasites in the physical plane and stopping the spread of Decay in said physical plane is reflected back onto the Realms as well

Or, the way I discovered that I was questioning this, the fact that Parasites leeching light magic in Gavel and causing the Decay is actually directly hurting Orphion all the way in the Realm of Light

TLDR; I thought it was a one-way influence

[rotund gust]

yeah with the way RoL 4 explains things i always assumed it was a 3 way reflection between Realm Beast and Province

[quartz mist]

thunder as an element encapsulates lightning and electricity

[rotund gust]

if orphion is hurt the realm of light and gavel are both affected, if gavel got nuked orphion and the realm of light would be effected and if the realm of light got fully darkened orphion and gavel would be effected. Atleast that’s how i inferred it

[quartz mist]

this happens in a lot(though not all) of media where thunder is used as a shorthand for the lightning associated with it as well

[rotund gust]

electricity is a mouthful when trying to succinctly talk about elements, and it shares a first letter with earth so to abbreviated you’d have to do Ea and El

thunder is a lot easier

[quartz mist]

yeah

[dim plover]

I think it’s easier to just picture the Realm Beasts as the Realms themselves

Like, if you imagine them as the same thing just two different body parts then you got the general idea

Unless I’m misinterpreting Wynncraft Realm Beasts

[clever pumice]

Is there a realm beast for the realm that the provinces are in?

not exactly sure what the "normal" realm is called

[dim plover]

I always thought that the Realm Beasts were like the Realms projecting a form so that they can speak to us

[dim plover]

Which Realm

[clever pumice]

our realm, the physical realm; where we play 99% of the game

[dim plover]

Oh

We don’t live in a realm

It’s more like just
The physical world

Physicality
Physical Plane, whatever

[tame nymph]

or the more fun answer, YOU

[dim plover]

The realms make up the plane of influence

@clever pumice Does this help

[clever pumice]

it does

thanks

[gray tendon]

if the realm of light aligns with gavel in the physical plane, the realm of war aligns with wynn, and the realm of darkness aligns with the silent expanse, what does the ocean align with?

[unique hill]

Pepsi Man

[kind fog]

Realm of jeff

[azure wren]

I wonder if the delayed updates are canon

[rotund gust]

I mean yes, but then also if the realms are also reflections of the provinces and vice verse, then all 3 are each other

orphion is the realm of light as much as he is gavel, since when he get munched on by the parasite both are drained and darkened

[dim plover]

I think it’s more of that the realms are the reflections of their influences on the province rather than the provinces themselves

There isn’t really anything stating that influence can’t spread to other provinces

[rotund gust]

cough the silent expanse cough

dark is spreading by into other provinces like that so you could be right yeah

i’m still of the opinion that the silent expanse is part of wynn, regardless of eaten dern or not

[warm flicker]

ressurecting this old conversation, id like to explain why I think the Olmic civilization began in SE and then expanded to time valley. First, the ruins of Time Valley - outside of the Temple of Time - are not as expansive as those of the SE city. There are a few ruined buildings scattered around the valley - including a castle/fort - but it does not have any of the institutional buildings the SE city has. Second, the Olm in the Time Valley SD does mention the Silent Expanse as the Olm's last hope. I had interpreted this to mean that, outside of Time Valley, the only other place inhabited by the Olm was the Silent Expanse, and the Time Valley Olm were desperately for the only place they knew was safe - the Silent Expanse. I would personally find it weird for the Olm to mention a land to flee to that their civilization did not colonize.
In my opinion, Time Valley is too small in size compared to the Olmic city to be where they originated, and the SD Olm seemed to imply evacuation to the Silent Expanse since that was where a major Olmic population center was

[dim plover]

Is it really a part of the Wynn Province if no one in the Wynn Province even knows that chunk of land exists

Like, can a land be territory if you don’t know that the land is even there

Wynn isn’t exactly the entire continent so they can’t just go “I declare this whole landmass is Wynn” like, Fruma’s there

[rotund gust]

i mean, if llevigar succeeded from gavel would it still be a mirror of the realm of light?

[dim plover]

It isn’t part of the Realm of Light what

[warm flicker]

Silent Expanse, geographically, is part of Wynn. In every other way its virtually its own separate province

[dim plover]

Wdym by geographically

Because it’s connected by land and only separated by a mountain mass?

[warm flicker]

basically this

[dim plover]

Then what does that make Fruma

[warm flicker]

plus historically it was directly connected to Wynn before getting Dern-ified

[dim plover]

Connected?

[rotund gust]

the mountains separating it are barely tall enough to be snowcapped, without barriers it would be really easy to get there from rymek, and its entrances are intentially closed off. Dernal wouldn’t be part of wynn either since it’s arguably less connected to the rest of wynn than the SE

[dim plover]

Wdym by succeeded

[warm flicker]

seceeded i think is the right word

[dim plover]

Oh

[rotund gust]

my point is like, just because no living knows it’s part of wynn, doesn’t mean it’s not

[dim plover]

What
But why would it automatically just become a part of Wynn just because it’s connected to it

Is it just Wynn until someone says it isn’t? Like Fruma?

[rotund gust]

my point is like, we consider dernal part of wynn even though it’s just as if not more disconnected from everything else than the SE

[dim plover]

Dernal is a part of Wynn because Wynn recognizes it as a part of Wynn

[warm flicker]

oh heres a quote from the wynncraft website:
Explore the desolated area that once belonged to the Wynn province. Now completely controlled by the realm of Dern, this land of lost civilisations and forgotten mines are infested by the most vile creatures darkness can offer.

[dim plover]

Unless I’m wrong and Troms just regards Dernel as outside of Wynn territory idk

[rotund gust]

and fruma is bordered on all sides by Snowcapped mountains while the SE’s mountain border would be easily traversable if not for barrier blocks

[dim plover]

So the size of the mountains are a factor as to what a province’s borders are?

[warm flicker]

its confirmed by staff that SE was once part of wynn before getting dern-ified

[rotund gust]

yeah, it was part of wynn just because it got conquered doesn’t mean it isn’t geographically still part of wynn

[dim plover]

Then I guess it’s a part of Wynn

What does this mean for the province itself
Is it just getting plagued by two forces of influence

[rotund gust]

it being part of wynn isn’t really up for debate. whether it’s still part of the realm of war… ehhh?

[dim plover]

What

Okay wait when you say “part of the realm of war” you mean if the province has war influence, right?

[rotund gust]

yes

[dim plover]

In which case yes

The corruption spreading everywhere is like the major overarching plot Wynn has

[rotund gust]

Corruption is still in the SE under the lutho monument (i discovered this looking for eaten dern stuff) while it isn’t in the darkened areas of gavel, so presumably the SE is still linked to war somehow

[warm flicker]

i thought those were darkness shards? Would make sense since its smack in the middle of SE

[rotund gust]

I mean yes, but there’s also nether rack and fire, which aren’t really linked to darkness

[warm flicker]

really? Ill have to check once maintenance is over

[rotund gust]

hold on i’ll see if the wiki has a picture

ok there isn’t fire, but there’s definitely netherrack

[dim plover]

Yeah that’s corruption

[rotund gust]

corruption is supposedly a symptom of dark and light clashing, but it doesn’t present in the areas of gavel where dark and light clash, meaning it’s presumably still linked to war

[dim plover]

Light and dark clashing makes that, happens in the Lari vs Parasite cutscene as well

[dim plover]

Are there areas in Gavel where dark and light clash?

[rotund gust]

yeah happens in light dark cutscene, but there aren’t like, areas in the light forest dark forest border with natural corruption

idk i could be reading to much into it

too much theory brainrot

[warm flicker]

also remind me again what is this eaten dern stuff?

[rotund gust]

mmm it’s a theory i’m working on. I finally think i have all the evidence im just trying to figure out how i wanna present it

if i wanna just make a big essay or something about it. I would make a youtube video like a fnaf theory but i have no clue how to make videos

[dim plover]

You would add some life to the WynnTheory discord server

Want an invite?

[rotund gust]

boils down to: Dern was once a province like gavel and wynn, but isn’t anymore because it was pulled into the realm of dark. The silent expanse is the next darkest area in the real world, but it isn’t the natural mirror to dark, which is why it’s glitched text in RoL 4 among other things

[cloud phoenix]

thats a thing?

[rotund gust]

honestly, i feel like if the servers already kinda dead better to not drag away from the lore discussion channel here

[cloud phoenix]

you still gotta get a better name for it tho lol

[rotund gust]

Eaten dern is the working name. I have some others i’ve been playing with but the only viable ones are glitched darkness or glitched expanse

i’m reference to the glitch text in the RoL 4 cutscene being the crux of the theory

idk i really like the idea of making a fnaf theory style youtube video, but i’ll have to wait until college starts back up to do it so I’ll actually have free time and motivation to learn the new skills (summer motivation loss hits me hard)

[quartz mist]

qq what's dernal

[rotund gust]

dernal jungle?

[quartz mist]

there's no such place

[rotund gust]

mhm, me when i lie

[quartz mist]

i mean, we named a place dernel, after our original composer needlr

[rotund gust]

no i wasn’t trying to make it out to be like dark related

[quartz mist]

but I've never heard of this dernal place

[dim plover]

Oh I never noticed I was misspelling it

[quartz mist]

and we certainly never had a neadlr on our team

[rotund gust]

Oh

[cloud phoenix]

lmao

[rotund gust]

damn, me when i misspell and never realize

[quartz mist]

[dim plover]

Anyways you guys should rename Dernel to remove any unwanted association with Dern

[rotund gust]

i mean i’ve been mispronouncing kandon beda as kanon beda since i first read it, oh well

[dim plover]

I suggested Drenel, because it’s pronounced like the middle of the word Adrenaline

(And it retains the anagram)

[rotund gust]

also, i have other wynn theory ideas so if i do end up deciding to learn how to make youtube videos i could make more

it’s just a question of if i can come up with the motivation to learn how

[dim plover]

||Anyways I’m going to head towards Levtus Airbase so I can fly to Deltas to figure out the deal with the Lab down south that belongs to some guy called Ohm||

I ran out of common misspellings of Wynncraft names I tried

What else do people misspell in this game

[rotund gust]

lusuco, rodoroc, thesead i see mispelled a lot (hell i could be misspelling one)

[remote river]

Nesaak or is it Nessak

[rotund gust]

if you use voices of wynn it’s Kneesack

[remote river]

That’s how I say it

[rotund gust]

wretched pronunciation

[remote river]

Also why is there slow mode here?

[rotund gust]

neh-sahk (when the channel first opened it was hell, slow mode helped and it hasn’t gone away)

[unique jungle]

too much lore talk will leak into the real world, we have to be careful

[unique jungle]

same

[rotund gust]

you are both wretched and awful in the way you say made up words

[unique jungle]

thats literally just how its spelled

someone needs to make an alignment chart of nesaak pronounciation

[rotund gust]

ne-saak the double a makes an ahhhh noise, not an ae noise

[rotund gust]

i mean, are there any others

[unique jungle]

nessak
nessik

[rotund gust]

neh-sahk, or knee-sack

[cloud phoenix]

neh - sak >>>

[unique jungle]

nehsik would be chaotic evil for sure

[unique jungle]

ikr ahh like sack

[rotund gust]

“the snow city” is true neutral

[unique jungle]

"that one city in the snow" with a picture of lusoco

[rotund gust]

who cares about lusuco

[unique jungle]

i do 🙁

[rotund gust]

doesn’t even have a housing balloon, it’s only purpose is for the library and as a respawn point for ToA

[remote river]

Lusoco exists to make me mad when I die in Twain Manor

[unique jungle]

and pots

[rotund gust]

the pots and bank feel more like just restocking points for if you die ToA than anything

ong replace frostbite with a lusuco quest

kill two birds with one stone

[unique jungle]

lowkey

[rotund gust]

Knee-sick

[unique jungle]

gonna change neh-sik to nessik
little more cursed

[rotund gust]

Knee-sahk, Neh-sack

Neh-sack feels like the lawful good one

[unique jungle]

same thing just curseder

idk man what about knee

[rotund gust]

just knee?

[unique jungle]

LMAO real

[rotund gust]

remove the saak part altogether

[unique jungle]

chaotic 💯

[kindred cave]

hey guys
are those fire flowers in the corruption the light part of it

[rotund gust]

theorick city

which fire flowers

[kindred cave]

in the WE on roots, the immobile ones

[unique jungle]

im really trying to not put knee-sack in lawful good because of bias

[rotund gust]

Annihilation or the other one?

[unique jungle]

altho the - makes it have more of a break i feel like

[kindred cave]

the normal world event
forget the name
they have orange petals

[rotund gust]

kneesack can be like, chaotic good, but not lawful. Maybe neutral good

[kindred cave]

in a lava pit

[unique jungle]

yeah thats what i was thinking too

[dim plover]

I call it Knee-Suck

Always have since years back

[unique jungle]

or actually lawful neutral
nothing good about it its just how its spelled

[rotund gust]

i mean, the roots don’t really seem to have light or dark elements. more just a source in the center of their battle. If anything gavel and the silent expanse are the corrupted elements, with the roots being the center

[dim plover]

Because “saak” sounds like a prolonged pronunciation of suck

[rotund gust]

wait no there is the dark creature in a journey beyond aledar finds in the roots

[unique jungle]

https://tenor.com/view/wynncraft-theorick-twain-minecraft-meme-gif-21782692

[rotund gust]

the best wynncraft character

[kindred cave]

the spikes would be darkness

[unique jungle]

#theorick love club
#gale love club
#elpida love club (is it elpida? idk)

[rotund gust]

the spikes are corruption, not necessarily darkness.

Otherwise the spikes would be producing nightmare horrors, not undead and demons

[unique jungle]

#1015666989680836841 message

[rotund gust]

and i’m pretty sure corrupted village confirms that, although i could be very very wrong its been a minute

[unique jungle]

my grandmas cousin or something is named gale

[rotund gust]

yeah like in the set of dialogue from the quest

[warm flicker]

nah its pronounced nesa-ahk

[rotund gust]

the roots seem like a center point for the corruption, not the battle between light and dark itself. The battle is the whole rest of the province

[kindred cave]

ok fun fact
CT confirms those flowers are light element in corruption, that's why i asked

[rotund gust]

i mean they could be, i’m just saying the only dark element in the roots that i know of is the creature in a journey beyond

[dim plover]

@rotund gust btw have you joined WynnTheory yet

I sent an invite

[rotund gust]

i mean, what does that server provide this channel doesn’t

[dim plover]

They’re having a similar discussion there with more people

[dim plover]

(That server’s all about wynn lore)

(And, as the name suggests, theories)

[rotund gust]

mhm, idk i’m quite happy here. Gotta have someone here keeping this channel active

[exotic yew]

Jeese what are you talking about

[rotund gust]

Meth

the roots seem like almost pure corruption. There isn’t that many light or dark elements

[dim plover]

At least take a look lol

[exotic yew]

Light and dark was never an element

[pallid rain]

i guess Fruma queen and Qira are sisters

[exotic yew]

They're the same person
@dim plover quick, the gif

[rotund gust]

1. a journey beyond says they are. 2. i meant more elements as in like “features” not elements like the combat system

[dim plover]

evil and intimidating nameplate

[rotund gust]

there aren’t very many light or dark features in the roots. The flower in the world event i guess and the creature in a journey beyond

[warm flicker]

real

[dim plover]

If it helps there are CT in WynnTheory that can answer certain questions about the in-game given lore

[rotund gust]

purple the last message in the theory channel was in 2024 what kinda server did you invite me to

[warm flicker]

flower in the world event that is a light element? I bet im missing something here

[rotund gust]

i mean they do that here to

[dim plover]

And by CT I mean like 90% of it is Madeline

She’s like a master at this lore

[exotic yew]

1. AJB is a fucking joke.

[rotund gust]

someone else said that earlier that’s how the topic started.

[quartz mist]

also I say neh-sack

[dim plover]

(Madeline is not in this server)

[rotund gust]

the new lawful good pronunciation

[dim plover]

Your EO stream taught me that I was mispronouncing a whole lot of stuff for years

[exotic yew]

AJB also go against ROL4 lore

[rotund gust]

when

[exotic yew]

Which mind you, HAS A FUCKING GOD OF LIGHT GIVE YOU THE EXPOSITION

[unique jungle]

ajb is the first of the two quests right

[rotund gust]

all AJB tells us is that light and dark are hidden elements kinda like the other ones. that’s it

[exotic yew]

Yes, the one where you "purify" yourself by use "light element" items to get rid of darkness in you

[kindred cave]

( me. also)

[exotic yew]

Something except it is an influence, Not an element.

[rotund gust]

nothing says it can’t be both

[quartz mist]

the stuff about light and dark being elements or influences is something that CT has complained about being part of the lore since it was first suggested, and it's been said a lot that we eventually intend to change that

[exotic yew]

Why is Orphion not made of light elements then

[rotund gust]

“eventually” as of right now it’s still in game canon

[rotund gust]

cause their “hidden” elements i guess, and for gameplay reasons

[exotic yew]

Or why don't we have to go through the same thing that rid us of light influence to hurt creature from the light realm

[quartz mist]

the current ingame explanation was me attempting to hastily patch over the gigantic plot hole that that part of the quest tore in our lore

[rotund gust]

also they only say some dark creatures have the effect of not being able to be hurt

[quartz mist]

it's still a plot hole, just a smaller one

[rotund gust]

still, even if the element explanation in a journey beyond is a joke. The only dark creature we ever see in the roots is the one in ajb as far as i’m aware

[exotic yew]

What

[quartz mist]

but the whole deal is...dark and light clashing makes corruption, so common visual elements of both that are thenselves distinct from their "true" counterparts crop up in the corrupted basin- spikes and flowers

[exotic yew]

Ahahahahahah, ok riddle me this it says dernic beast and using dernic shard but you got them corrupted pearls

[quartz mist]

I think it's funnier to talk about the funny EO death messages

[exotic yew]

EO has a lot of plothole in itself

Don't get me started on that lol

[rotund gust]

i think your missing my point. My point is just the roots seem like almost all corruption. The ajb monster and the flowers are the exceptions

[exotic yew]

What are you talking about

[rotund gust]

it’s not like the roots have like giant light forest mushrooms next to eyeball trees from the SE. It’s almost all raw corruption with very few exceptions

[exotic yew]

And guess what is corruption

[rotund gust]

SOMEONE BROUGHT UP THE LIGHT FLOWERS AND I JUST WENT FROM THERE

[rotund gust]

the byproduct of the two clashing. Not the clash itself. Pretty sure there’s some item lore that says that i say it yesterday

[exotic yew]

They brought up light flowers as in corruption take aspect from both progenitor

[kindred cave]

the thing that rather disappoints me is that the setting is gray-black-superblack morality
nobody has any coherent philosophical stances you could argue for or against. there's absolutely no way to agree with the corruption because it is cartoonishly evil. darkness is such extreme body+mind horror that you can't accept its PoV. light is ostensibly evil but doesn't seem to do much bad, it's mostly ineffectual and helping it is good in the game's timeframe because it restores balance to the war of the realms

[rotund gust]

i mean, corruption is just supposed to be mindless chaos. I don’t think it’s supposed to be a side we root for

but yeah dark being evil and light not really doing any bad (that we see) really does diminish any nuance

[exotic yew]

If Light is evil then the game makes terrible job convincing us

That's what I'd say

[rotund gust]

i mean there’s a few hints at light conquering gavel the same way dark conquered the SE, but they are only hints and like alternate ways to interpretate things. And even if it did the lights influence isn’t all that bad

ex orphion referring to his “claim” light forest ultimate

[exotic yew]

Me when one words vs armmegdon from dern

[rotund gust]

not what i meant. Light could conquer like dark does, but even then there’s shown to be no downside to that actually happening while darks conquest is shown to be literally tearing parts of the world into the void

[exotic yew]

Well, I mean if they made Orphion twist villain I would actually clap

[cedar token]

Relax

[exotic yew]

No I will not, I'm on edge

Like FINALLY, THE MADE HIM INTERESTING

[rotund gust]

ong, give orphion something. His only layer of complexity is that “murder is ok if it’s for the right reasons, cause i’m not mortal i don’t have the same morals”

like ok? the player is mortal and they like murder too this adds nothing

[exotic yew]

Tbf there's a lot going on in that situation, also urelix is a scum I hate his gut

[rotund gust]

actually if i do make eaten dern video the next theory i have an idea for is Light conquest. cause like, gavel has a lot of stuff alluding to long forgotten wars, a war against light could’ve been a thing

[exotic yew]

Speaking of urelix makes me think of dullahan and forbidden prison

Mouth foaming

[hybrid gazelle]

Idk how fucking himself over contribute to his plan but he do him I guess

[exotic yew]

Yeah he just, stupid

[rotund gust]

me when i lock myself in my funny nexus to avoid all my problems while my domain crumbles around me

[hybrid gazelle]

Orphion and Phoenix prince fighting over who get to be the most stupid character

[exotic yew]

Orphion : is at wars
Also Orphion : does no offensive move

[warm flicker]

said this earlier to trashie, but the Light's conquest of Gavel is basically a battle of life for life's sake versus life for servitude, and servitude under the Light won

[exotic yew]

That is a headcanon

[rotund gust]

could always turn headcanon into theory if you gather enough evidence for it

[warm flicker]

the whole of Light vs Gavel thing is headcanon

[exotic yew]

Exactly

[hybrid gazelle]

Rol on their way to write gray morality to be the most profound lesson to ever exist but for some reason have the guy that lecture us about it to be a fucking idiot

[rotund gust]

there’s probably other things that could be read as light taking over gavel I haven’t really looked that far. But the light having such a grip over one specific area in the light forest, orphions light ult dialogue and all the past war equipment makes it atleast worth looking into. Could be a decent theory if there’s more evidence for it

[exotic yew]

But yeah if they're trying to convince us light is bad.They did horrible job

[warm flicker]

dont worry staff will rewrite ROL questline as soon as the date in the wynnverse changes to 1001 AP

[exotic yew]

Can they make lari less insufferable in the plot too

Give her a bit of justice please

[warm flicker]

not to mention the Light Forest - the place arguably most light-touched outside of the realm of light itself - isnt filled with goody two shoe mobs, everything there wants to kill u just as much as the things in the decay do

[rotund gust]

change everything else keep lari as is

[warm flicker]

nah make lari emo and edgy

[rotund gust]

i mean, ever region has hostile mobs regardless of realm affiliation idk about that

[warm flicker]

every region i can understand, but why the region that is influenced by supposedly the great good in the world? Shouldnt everything be at least neutral to our presence?

[cedar token]

Aren’t the mobs in rol only attacking because of the decay? Wouldn’t that mean they’re neutral before that

[rotund gust]

i mean light isn’t supposed to be good, just like.. a thing. Lari’s whole thing is that she’s under the misconception light = good, when light = neutral

[rotund gust]

probably? most of the mobs in past light forest during taproot are green name

but also that’s a vision orphion is showing is so it could be biased

[upper drum]

its said in rol 5 that like the sheep that attacks you isnt supposed to attack you
so ig its atleast naturally neutral/friendly
whereas se has no light invasion and everything is out for you

i get the idea of neither is really right
the game is just very bad at showing it

[rare fable]

Lore question : Can the Parasite be considered a "chonker", or perhaps instead, "a little fella"?

[quartz mist]

fairly sure it qualifies as "a fine boy" with the corollary that "boy" is merely the scientific term and not indicative of biology or mentality

[hushed comet]

im pretty sure the point was that orphion and by extension the light operates independently of the morals of wynncraft living societies

but is also the reason why the living environment like the people and plants and whatever are alive anyway

atleast thats what i gathered

so its pretty much the manifested concepts of life vs death and i guess corruption is like cancer or something

[warm flicker]

according to the llevigar archivist, in 900 AP a "Sovereign Selium" was sent to Ragni as an envoy to officially begin sending Fruman recruits to Wynn

[hybrid gazelle]

yeah that why I think 6th soveriegn thing mention in teaser is more of generational number, or IDK

but then again that implying sovereign is relatively new thing in Fruma so that not probably right

[rotund gust]

i mean, there could just be like 20 sovereigns and it’s just that their numbered in order of importance/appointment

[regal spire]

Kantyr

Also quiet observers, the ambient fireflies, and cockroaches are all either neutral or passive

[hybrid gazelle]

ROL as a whole just so weird but I gues it just made during the time where quality were very low bar

[mortal cave]

they did that with dulla already

[rotund gust]

and people love dulla, maybe it’ll work for lari too

[mortal cave]

I love dullahan

[static mortar]

make lari a goth and wynn players will lose gallons

[sullen prism]

dullahan > lari forever

[mortal cave]

Fr

[mortal cave]

Ermm

[quartz mist]

I should maybe write those letters

one of these days

[mortal cave]

I don’t think we should be doing that with lari

[quartz mist]

since rol 3 already took way too much time to get through the story beats it did, a lot about their whole Deal was cut, lari and dulla

at one point it was proposed to have a series of letters available to peruse post-quest from lari to him but i just didnt have the motivation to write them

yknow, to help elucidate on their relations

[mortal cave]

Remove the shipping

[exotic bough]

what letters

[quartz mist]

you dont even have to scroll up to see the explanation dude it's right there

[hybrid gazelle]

Wait so like do lari just slide the letter in between the door or what

[rotund gust]

just slides a piece of paper under the door and all it says is “stop murdering people please :(“

[dim plover]

Watched some Indiana Jones and the Dial of Destiny content again and that revived my interest in antikythera

Oh boy time to go on another funny hyper-analyze trip

[exotic bough]

thanks brainrotted intuition not working

[dim plover]

I sort of toyed with the idea of an anti origin story in the past (as in, sort of gave myself a challenge of making a fanmade origin story) and figured I could base it off the actual Antikythera Mechanism

God I wish I we knew more about Cerid

Or whatever his name is
The factory maker guy

[exotic bough]

cerid is his name yes

[dim plover]

Anyways if it were up to me, integral parts of what currently make up the Antikythera Supercomputer today would probably be like the real thing, found in the ocean

Although I feel like “technology that’s alien even to Corkus found in the ocean from no apprent source” feels a bit like a cheap copout

[exotic bough]

built from olmic technology

[dim plover]

And is just done for the sake of a reference to the source material

Actually wait who made Anti again

[exotic bough]

cerid

[dim plover]

Actually now that I think about it the realistic scenario is just whoever CT made the character just called them Antikythera solely because it was the world’s first analogue computer or whatever

Which is a cool reference

[dim plover]

As fun as that is I never really got the impression that Olmic tech is like, actual tech

Or rather Olm aesthetic doesn’t really feel like the machined-wiring kind and more like the runic kind

Advanced as hell and probably on-par, sure, just different aesthetic

That’s just a headcanon though

[exotic bough]

i think its implied in-game at least. if i had to guess fruma will go more in-depth on electromagic

[dim plover]

Antikythera might be one of the only characters in Wynncraft where I really failed to get a good proper grasp on their character probably because I’ve also been debating like,

If Anti claims that they were given direct instructions, that immediately makes them less human

In the sense of, which of their actions are forced via set instructions and which of them are part of their genuine personality

I don’t doubt that Anti has a character and personality of their own, even if simulated
Wynncraft’s fiction, robots can have that to a believable extent

_ _
Until then I’m probably just going to go with the assumption that Anti’s just following pre-set instructions like a human reading instructions and then doing them accordingly, rather than the instructions literally physically forcing them to act on it

[hybrid gazelle]

Antikythera is weird because sometime the text identify as the electromagic in the factory imply that it’s magical being