JP+ Group Development Zone

[crisp stone]

Still a development after all ahahah

[nova bay]

Currently using a lot of 52 series, because in 1950s the steamers in Japan Set were ridiculously costly, and there are not decent diesel models, I had to electrify so much

[crisp stone]

Thats a long 52 series heheheh

[nova bay]

IIRC, it is as long as some commuter EMUs in Tokyo, 14-cars

Can I make a PR for these tweaks?

[crisp stone]

reducing the decay -5?

[nova bay]

I noticed you added "correct" cargo aging algorithms for new trains

[crisp stone]

Yep im happy with a PR 🙂

[nova bay]

Not really, you can decide decay factor, I am not sure for some indexes. What I want to do is tweak cargo aging

[crisp stone]

sure

ill probably do a parameter for decay factor, so probably better to leave it alone heh

[nova bay]

There is already a parameter

[crisp stone]

sorry, for reliablity decay

so confusing xd

[nova bay]

Also, why is 52 series with a "limited express" usage but a capacity of 65 per car?

[crisp stone]

human error

[crude phoenix]

Capacity is right, description is wrong

[nova bay]

I think there are not many Tokkyus at that time

[bleak karma]

What?

Plenty of mainline expresses in the 1950s

[nova bay]

Sorry

[bleak karma]

Although I guess it wasn't the 1961 timetable change that would define the express trains we know today

My bad

[nova bay]

What I have read is "many couldn't afford limited express fee, they preferred to use Kyukou (normal Express) service, before L-Tokkyu was a thing"

[nova bay]

@crisp stone PR was created 🙂

[crisp stone]

Nice one, danke 😄

[tidal perch]

Could be optimized?

[shrewd wren]

If you tell me how, I would consider optimising

[tidal perch]

First off is to replace those

spriteset(some_spriteset){some_template(offset)} // dummy
alternative_sprites(...) // actual sprites

with

spriteset(some_spriteset, ZOOM_LEVEL_NORMAL, BIT_DEPTH_32BPP) {} // simplified

I think

[tidal perch]

I got this from cont_koki50000.pnml

switch(FEAT_TRAINS, SELF, switch_koki_50000_base_loadstack, [
    STORE_TEMP((getbits(extra_callback_info1, 8, 8) < 7 ? CB_FLAG_MORE_SPRITES : 0) | PALETTE_USE_DEFAULT, 0x100),
    getbits(extra_callback_info1, 8, 8)
    ]) {
    0:  random_koki_50000_brown;
    1:  switch_conts_cargo_load_end;
    2:    switch_conts_cargo_load_middle;
    3:    switch_conts_cargo_load_middle;
    4:    switch_conts_cargo_load_end;
    5:  spriteset_koki_50000_handrail;
    6:  switch_taillights_8;
}

But I don't find a single LOAD_TEMP in the nml file

And I don't know why there is a STORE_TEMP here... I guess they don't have to appear simultaneously

[tidal perch]

The controller here is getbits(extra_callback_info1, 8, 8), while STORE_TEMP seems to do nothing...

Maybe STORE_TEMP controls the amount of sprites to show, and the latter getbits(...) controls which sprite to show?

[native warren]

The store to register 0x100 is to control sprite stacking and palettes https://newgrf-specs.tt-wiki.net/wiki/NML:Vehicles#Composing_vehicles_from_multiple_sprites

[tidal perch]

and ... | PALETTE_USE_DEFAULT... iirc PALETTE_USE_DEFAULT equals to 0, so it's fine to omit it.

[tidal perch]

Oh that explains

[crisp stone]

When did this wizardry become a thing

[tidal perch]

Since https://github.com/OpenTTD/nml/pull/314

It's never documented though.

[nova bay]

Just a fix - there is one line of redundant code in JP+ MU. Basically it has two lines of "cargo_age_period: 185;" Deleting one of the two lines won't cause anything.

[tidal perch]

I got tricked by this code 😄
the getbits... in (getbits(extra_callback_info1, 8, 8) < 7 ? CB_FLAG_MORE_SPRITES : 0) | PALETTE_USE_DEFAULT, 0x100) is for cargo subtype, so it's useless for purchase icon drawing 🙂

😄

[tidal perch]

🤓

(Wrong logo, of course)

[tidal perch]

https://github.com/WenSimEHRP/JPplusPrivate/tree/simplified_logo

[nova bay]

Before this translation, I always read "Eidan" as "Aidan", just like what Germans will do

[shrewd wren]

2x logos work only if interface size is >= 2x. For smaller sizes it just causes asymmetry and other unwanted pixel shifts

[tidal perch]

alternative_sprites

That way you could use

spriteset(some_sprite)...
alternative _sprites(some_sprites, ZOOM_LEVEL_IN_2X,...)

so that no matter the pixel size all graphics are still custom created instead of being zoomed by some unknown function.

[shrewd wren]

Still looks like this

alternative_sprites (logo_tokyo_metro, ZOOM_LEVEL_IN_2X, BIT_DEPTH_32BPP,"gfx/logos/tokyo_metro.png") { tmpl_logos(0, 0) }```

[tidal perch]

You have to set one to "zoom_level_normal"

[shrewd wren]

😅

[shrewd wren]

that's exactly what I did, and got this result

[tidal perch]

hmm

you sure you're using a no extrazoom template?

oh you have to also adjust the offset

[shrewd wren]

    [x, y, 32, 32, -95, -20]
}
template tmpl_logos(x,y) {
    [x, y, 12, 12, -60, -10]
}
spriteset (logo_tokyo_metro, ZOOM_LEVEL_IN_2X, BIT_DEPTH_32BPP,"gfx/logos/tokyo_metro.png") { tmpl_logos_ez(0, 0) }
alternative_sprites (logo_tokyo_metro, ZOOM_LEVEL_NORMAL, BIT_DEPTH_32BPP,"gfx/logos/tokyo_metro.png") { tmpl_logos(0, 0) }```

[tidal perch]

I think it's mostly because of the offset, so you'll have to adjust it via the sprites something (i forget its English name) menu
If that doesn't work maybe try to swap "alternative_sprites" and "spriteset?"

[shrewd wren]

It's already cropped in the sprite aligner
And I've tried both changing templates and 2x/NORMAL

It's always cropped or too large.
But in both situations everything works perfectly when interface size is set to 2x

[tidal perch]

@shrewd wren Turns out that it's just because of the offset.

All you'll have to do is to adjust the offset 😛

the y offset is -12, if that helps

The fact here is that all alternative sprites must also fit the purchase bar, or else it will expand, no matter the current sprite using.
It's reading some ghost sprites I think

[tidal perch]

/*
* HOW DOES A GRAPHIC STACK WORK
Sprite stacking was supported since openttd 1.7, and further expanded in openttd 13.
After v13 the game allows stacking up to 8 sprites.

The stack uses a switch statement to determine which sprite to draw.

A typical stack looks like this:

switch(FEAT_TRAINS, SELF, name, [                                   //* The switch statement
    STORE_TEMP(CB_FLAG_MORE_SPRITES | PALETTE_USE_DEFAULT, 0x100),  //* STORE_TEMP, where it marks to draw multiple sprites
    getbits(extra_callback_info1, 8, 8)                             //* indicates the sprite sequence
    ]) {
    0: s0;                      //* sprite 0
    1: s1;                      //* sprite 1
    2: s2;                      //* sprite 2
    more sprites...
}

the condition is STORE_TEMP(CB_FLAG_MORE_SPRITES | PALETTE_USE_DEFAULT, 0x100), where
0x100 is a special register that tells the game to draw multiple sprites,
and the part before the comma tells what palette to use, and if the sprites should be stacked.
More specifically, CB_FLAG_MORE_SPRITES tells the game to draw multiple sprites, and
PALETTE_USE_DEFAULT tells the game to use the default palette.

The last item of the array is getbits(extra_callback_info1, 8, 8), in which, the last item's
value is used to determine which sprite to draw. It ranges from 0 to 7, and the game will draw
the sprite that corresponds to the value. So, 0 will draw s0, 1 will draw s1, and so on.

s0, s1, s2, etc. could be spritesets, spritegroups, or switches.

Spritestacks could be used in many places, such as to show logos in the purchase menu, to reduce
producing same elements in similar graphics, and so on.

The condition, which is STORE_TEMP(...,0x100), could be modified to meet the needs of the stack.
For example, if you want a parameter to control the stack, you could modify it like this:
STORE_TEMP((param_show_logo == 1 ? (CB_FLAG_MORE_SPRITES | PALETTE_USE_DEFAULT) : PALETTE_USE_DEFAULT), 0x100)

*/

[tidal perch]

@crude phoenix
But as Yozora said the logos look awful under a lower resolution. Nonetheless that could be fixed afterwards

I used some gcc #defines here (just too powerful!), so if you were to directly merge my branch it will break your workflow.

[crude phoenix]

ooh interesting

it would be good to have the logos on the same side as the other JP+ sets

[tidal perch]

yeah

[crude phoenix]

I have them on the wrong side because of historical templating reasons, but those are easy to cut off

I'm really a fan of the angular JNR logo, I prefer it over the wheel even if it's less "official"

[tidal perch]

🤔

The original angular logo barely fits, but considering most trains atm are shorter maybe this could be applied.

well, EH10

[tidal perch]

well

The vehicle sprites will overlap the logo. Does that sound right to you?

btw I have to stretch the logo a bit

[crude phoenix]

That doesn't bother me, it already happens

I just wonder what it'll look like in JP+ MU

[tidal perch]

😄 Implemented the purchaser logo parameter in the wrong way

[tidal perch]

@shrewd wren

[shrewd wren]

You work too fast, I wanted to do this myself, but oh well, thank you

It's inverted now, but it's a matter of 0/1 to make it work as intended

[tidal perch]

🤯

[crude phoenix]

This will make @wild geode happy

[wild geode]

Yeah but the white space is still left 😛

Nah but seriously nice work WenSim

[tidal perch]

That could be fixed through adjusting the offset and omitting part of the transparent pixels 😄

[tidal perch]

well...

😄

[crude phoenix]

can't you move the engine over? There's a big gap to the right of it

Oh yeah I was going to add a parameter to disable the fake prototype variants

[tidal perch]

I think it looks better if everything is aligned; nonetheless if you really want the engine to be moved over... I could try to do that, but definately it would cost a lot of time

btw the gap between the vehicle and the edge of the menu now shrinks when logos are disabled

Still... that could be manually adjusted; it just takes time to do so.

[crude phoenix]

Oh, I thought it would be a quick thing to shift the purchase sprite template, but never mind then 🙂

[tidal perch]

because of historical reasons? The purchase sprites are aligned on the right side, and I would need to change them from right aligned to left aligned if I were to shrink the gap size

[crude phoenix]

Ah, makes sense

[tidal perch]

@crude phoenix Thanks to automation, I'm now finished all logo reimplementation. It's just that they are not quite accurate, often refers to the wrong company, and may need somebody to help fixing.

Never heard of Seibu running a metal transporting business

[crude phoenix]

Very nice

[tidal perch]

I wrote a python script for that 😄

I'll push it right now

[nova bay]

H100 Decmo When? 🙂
Not to force anything, but just curious. Too few trains for Hokkaido!

[crude phoenix]

I know there are a few Hokkaido trains in the works, not sure about that one specifically though

[nova bay]

So I am now drawing an H100 Myself 🙂 Not from scratch, but from the "similar" KiHa 41 sprite

[crude phoenix]

Maybe the KiHa E120 would be a better starting point

[crisp stone]

[crisp stone]

Yea, one of the new JR East KiHa's would be closer, you want a nice silver metal starting base

[nova bay]

Oh? Why is it legacy, though? I guess this is because of some perfectionism

[crisp stone]

The sprite design and style was changed, these were drawn to match JapanSet3 - they were also not 32bpp....and they didnt reverse and do fancy stuff that JP+ then later named JP+ MU would be able todo

But the english.lng came from there, thats all that is similar lol

Which is why the english.lng is old and awful and buggy and needs fixing and updating to look like other JP+ sets but its not high on the agenda when I spend all day looking at formations for JNR trains 😆

[nova bay]

Yes, sprite style difference could be found

[crisp stone]

Many years ago

I will, when I finish with the backlog of complex JNR trains with their 1000 formations and cab and middle and whatsits, get round to re-doing them into JP+

One day

.-

[crude phoenix]

Back when JP+ Engines was still Japanese Secret Engines 😉

[crisp stone]

Back when we had to run on a tredmill to power our internet!

Oh wait, me and you still do

[nova bay]

I think... OpenTTD has grown a lot since... covid, so many new things didn't become reality until 2020s, and the growth rate seems to be increasing... Well, contradicts economy in real life 🙂
And new miracles still happen every day, even if it is such an old game

[crisp stone]

Indeed!

But Covid did mean more time to develop. 😦

I do miss that!

[nova bay]

Drawing pixels for... the infinity-th try. It is only these pixels high, hard to show all features

[crisp stone]

Take your time

H100 is a funny one, strange angles and very shiny

[nova bay]

Seems Discord blurs pixel work...

[bleak glade]

you can still save the image and open it in something like paint dot net and it will not be blurry

[crude phoenix]

That's only the preview, if you copy or download the image it will work

[nova bay]

Oh

[bleak glade]

some things that preview the image will compress it tho and make it blurry

[nova bay]

To ensure, I zipped it (resend: fix incorrect colour between windows)

[crisp stone]

github issue that 😄

[languid prism]

I just sent a pull request for the 737 series and H100 series, but I only just noticed this forum. What a coincidence 😲 The grafix by John Franklin are also very precise, so I leave it up to you which one to use.
https://github.com/Tintinfan/JPplusMU/pull/149

[crude phoenix]

Good start on those graphics, but unfortunately they don't match the style of the rest of JP+. Especially the windows are featureless grey panels instead of the standard textured mauve

[languid prism]

Thank you for your comment. I will withdraw the pull request and use the graphic personally. I apologize for any disturbance.

[tidal perch]

Engines & wagons with complete reimplemented company logos

the balance of logos is now adjusted
Maybe I should also adjust the colours? The JRF logo seems quite dark, and maybe it could be lighter or I could sharpen its edges?

(won't be a problem when using New CC, though)

[crisp stone]

JRF logo seems alright, that JNR logo is realllllyyy huge 😆

[crisp stone]

No need to apologize. Learning to draw is hard even harder when you draw to someone else's style. I would say not to give up

[tidal perch]

What about this? 😄

[tidal perch]

Looks like Yozora found a way to effectively reduce sprite amounts...
https://github.com/Yozora3/JPplusPrivate/commit/20ef9f04372614cd2bbd90cc850a3402163088cc

I thought of this before, but never tried doing it myself 🙂

[shrewd wren]

It's been a while since I've actually drawn something...
Sotetsu 10000 series

[neon light]

shame they look like 11000s now

(this is an 11000, that ^^^ is a 10000)

not completely identical but near enough to use the same sprite

theyve also done the same to the 8000s

[shrewd wren]

1 step forward, 2 steps back

[neon light]

oh, and the 9000s

[shrewd wren]

The bottom headlights were indeed much better on the 10000, I like them, added 00s coolish look

[neon light]

yea i agree

much prefer bottom headlights

but for more of an 80s/90s vibe

[shrewd wren]

Keisei ae100 🙃

[neon light]

my beloved

flip up headlights

on a train

so cool

[shrewd wren]

They don't make cars trains like this anymore

[neon light]

they really should

is the ae100 in this set yet?

[crude phoenix]

AE100 is in TIAS and everything in TIAS is in JP+ Private now😉

[neon light]

ah lovely

[tidal perch]

@crude phoenix I'm almost done reimplementing the logos now, though some parts may be quite sketchy. Would you consider merging the pr I opened after I mark it as ready to review?

[nova bay]

4 pairs of doors? 😲 Such high amount of doors is hardly to be seen here even in metro system.

[tidal perch]

That's not a lot. If you want to you can make a train with no walls and countless doors, so that AC could be omitted and loading time is eliminated, with a cost of passengers being thrown on railroads and die.

[crude phoenix]

They even tried carriages with 6 doors per side once

[crude phoenix]

Sure, I'll take a closer look soon 🙂

[digital river]

most Beijing subway stock have them

[crude phoenix]

Hong Kong MTR has 5 pairs of doors too

[crisp stone]

Good old Saha204

[ember heron]

Five doors

Wow

[neon light]

thats 6 doors

not 5

[neon light]

most, if not all, shanghai metro stock has 5 doors per side on every coach

[tidal perch]

MaGlEv?

[neon light]

no thats 2 doors per side, and it isnt owned by the metro

[tidal perch]

Yeah i know that

I remember the price is something like 50 rmb

[neon light]

if i had the patience i would draw all of the shanghai metro stock

[tidal perch]

Any opinions on JP+ Stations?

Maybe I should resume now

[crisp stone]

The first step I started doing with JP+Stations was to get JapanSet Additions https://github.com/DemianWSE/JapaneseStationsAddons (which has no snow or people on the tiles) and the base JapanSet3 stuff coded and sorted with snow/people

However I have been very slow, because I spend 3 days on the formations of a single JNR emu then I'm busy again 😭

Then also to provide different building styles and stuff that some other people have drawn over the last few years for elevated stations; then some fake metro building stuff off JP+Buildings

lots todo to make JP+Stations

Auto-Build platforms, Fences and single-tile place everything for maximum customisation should be done too

Thought be damned I have no idea on autobuild platforms

[tidal perch]

#981523481122471957 message
Try this out 😄

[crisp stone]

That doesn't help this problem

This is a problem of JNR has 14 different was to create a 6,8,10 car express train

What are all 14 ways and how does that work 😛

Heads in the middle, pantographs here and there, green cars or not

Very annoying

[crisp stone]

But I will be doing this for "fake" pantograph end cars later

Aaaand that sortof thing is how I wanted to do stations as layers to make it easier for people to draw bits and add it in

[tidal perch]

I kinda wanted to make everything "smarter," so that players won't put a lot of effort to build a nice station. You can see what I've done in WINS and in CNS.

One thing I am definitely going to add in WINS ||JP+ WINS|| is smarter fake underground stations. Maybe elevated stations, too.

Maybe I should wrap up the things I didn't finish last year first.
#981523481122471957 message

Kinda lack of ideas, to be honest.

[nova bay]

Bug - 100 Series V Set 2cc sprite misalignment

[amber totem]

Cheers. Wrong template was being used for those sprites. Will be fixed in next release

[tidal perch]

btw I added more snow variations in the current version

[shrewd wren]

Made some changes to the train desc menu, now electric system gets its own property with much more details like Hz and voltage.
And also, metro trains received loading speed property

[tidal perch]

HELPER NEEDED

Thanks to YAGL, I can now decompile JP3 Tracks and modify it, including adding translations. Japanese would be the right language to add, and I would need a translator. I tend to make everything as easy as possible (splitting the files, merging Actions, writing comments, etc.) so it won't be too hard to add an extra language.

Repo:
https://github.com/WenSimEHRP/JPTracks-ReMod

[wild geode]

could you pick a different suffix please, reMOD is what I specifically call my forks/modifications

[tidal perch]

🙃 I'll go for weMOD then

[wild geode]

that's fine 🙂

[shrewd wren]

Sotetsu 9000 series

[crude phoenix]

That is so tetsu

[neon light]

You aren’t wrong

[crisp stone]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QauMxpUcaw

[signal estuary]

#1206389475639435264 message

Although it is not directly related to the JP+ series, I am releasing some of the Japanese aviation part of AWAS that I am developing on the JP+ channel.

[nova bay]

https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/国鉄50系客車#「ノロッコ号」向け改造
50 series variant? 🙂
70 passengers, 95 km/h, cargo_age_period 600

[raven folio]

Custom yunnels?

[tidal perch]

ahem, modified version of JP3 Tracks actually

and the set's tracks come with custom tunnels

[raven folio]

They have wide ballast. I like that

Ever thought of extra zoom versions?

I would really love that

[crude phoenix]

JP+ will never be extra zoom

but then this track set isn't technically part of JP+

[tidal perch]

yeah

[tidal perch]

This is technically doable, but it would be hard as this is not NML (neither NFO! but still hard)
I would have to change the GRF container version (if I am correct) and other stuff like adding extra flags to indicate "this is a 32bpp image" and "this is also a EZ sprite" etc.
So I may not do it, at least for now.

[raven folio]

understandable

[wild geode]

plus, someone has to draw the damn things

[tidal perch]

@amber totem IIRC there is a Shinkansen Tracks override option in JP+Shinkansen. Would you like it to be inplemented in jptracks wemod?

[amber totem]

Probably would help to first explain the 'story' a bit of why that's even there. I added the parameter to turn off the JapanSet Shinkansen, but when you remove them all, it deactivates the High Speed tracks from JapanSet, so I had to bring them into my set to have access to the tracks

Intention isn't to bundle tracks with the Shinkansen, adding them was was just a response to "Where have the tracks gone?"

Ideally wemod would have the Shinkansen tracks and they are there regardless of what is going on with the hide JapanSet Shinkansen parmeter

[tidal perch]

finally, some new tracks
I now understand why people would choose NML rather than NFO - what are those magic hexidecimal numbers for? 😄

And JPTracks has... efficient use of ids, meaning that id often gets overridden and this makes reusing hard

[crude phoenix]

JapanSet Tracks is from the era when there were only 16 railtypes, not 64

[tidal perch]

I mean action03s and action02s.
All action02s seems to have the same id, which is 0x0000. I don't know if this how it should be coded.

Speaking of limitations, 2^32 railtypes when? 🤯

[wild geode]

To be honest you might have an easier time if you take an existing GPL’d NML rail set as the base and rework that into a proper standalone set rather than try and hack a modification of the 10+ year old JP Tracks,

[tidal perch]

That's cheating 🙂

I use this experience to write a manual that I guess nobody will ever read

eh

[ember heron]

I will read it

[tidal perch]

it's in Chinese
So unless you read Chinese...

[tidal perch]

Tried to do some override, failed unfortunately

[tidal perch]

looks like that I can manually enforce a tracktype to appear by manually assigning an introduce date

[amber totem]

What kind of things are you aiming to do with wemod? I see the different fences, the wide full tile ballast

[tidal perch]

wide ballast, better fences, extra tracks, and translations

And I aim to also keep the original JP3 Tracks experience, so the extra tracks can be disabled

[crisp stone]

extra tracks? 🤔

Back in the day, we decided on something like this (the most important being AC, DC, Third Rail and LinMo)....well, interesting to compare to what you've got planned in Wenmod

---

Narrow 80Kmph (Non-Electric)
Narrow Urban 130Kmph (Non-Electric)
Narrow 130Kmph (Non-Electric)
Narrow 160Kmph (Non-Electric)

Narrow Urban 130Kmph (DC Electric)
Narrow 130Kmph (DC Electric)
Narrow 160Kmph (DC Electric)

Narrow Urban 130Kmph (AC Electric)
Narrow 130Kmph (AC Electric)
Narrow 160Kmph (AC Electric)

Standard 80Kmph (Non-Electric)
Standard Urban 130Kmph (Non-Electric)
Standard 130Kmph (Non-Electric)
Standard 160Kmph (Non-Electric)

Standard Urban 130Kmph (AC Electric)
Standard 130Kmph (AC Electric)
Standard 160Kmph (AC Electric)

Standard Urban 130Kmph (DC Electric)
Standard 130Kmph (DC Electric)
Standard 160Kmph (DC Electric)

Standard Urban 130Kmph (Third-Rail)
Standard 130Kmph (Third-Rail)
Standard Urban 130Kmph (LinMo)
Standard 130Kmph (LinMo)

Standard High-Speed 260Kmph (Electric)
Standard Modern High-Speed (Electric)

Dual-Gauge 130Kmph (Non-Electric)
Dual-Gauge 130Kmph (AC Electric)
Dual-Gauge 130Kmph (DC Electric)
Dual-Gauge 250Kmph (Electric)

Maglev Tracks

All Gauge All Tracktype All Electrication Underground Fake Tracks

Industrial Trackset + Nontrack Tiles

[tidal perch]

I'm not going to do AC/DC specifications, better leave that to JP+ Tracks.
Only dual gauge tracks, some additional shinkansen tracks, and trackless railtypes are going to be added.

[crisp stone]

Nice 🙂 so a proper upgrade to the orginal coded new?

[weary roost]

Scotch gauge for Keiō trains?

[bleak glade]

It seems currently the shinjuku line trains which run on scotch gauge are coded to run on standard gauge. But the Japanese Train Unnoffical Addon Set which has some Keio trains which are also scotch gauge are coded to run on narrow gauge.

[crude phoenix]

I think we decided that Scotch gauge isn't visually distinguishable from standard gauge at OTTD scale so it would be lumped together

this also saves a lot of railtype IDs that can be used for decorative types

[bleak glade]

yeah, for only 2 lines, that only run through each other, it isnt worth it. And i do agree that standard gauge is the better choice for scotch gauge than cape gauge as its closer in size and makes more sense gameplay wise too

[shrewd wren]

We decided to make 1372mm gauge as a track type, but visually same to the 1435, so things could be kept in finescale 🙃
Making 1372 would make much sense, especially since we are doing linmo

Personally I would reconsider standard gauge non electric tracks, or shall I say amount of those, as I'm not heard of any 1435 non electrified lines

And keio sooner or later will be incorporated in jp+private

[tidal perch]

oh no

from a personal perspective adding extra gauge means more chaos.
Two is fine, three is too much, especially in the case where there isn't much visual difference.

[crisp stone]

Well, I also supported 3 in the end, but I’m pretty sure that a nice little parameter can solve that…it’d be a shame not to have Keio on its own gauge in a multiplayer game after all; incompatible with everything

[bleak glade]

apart from that one Keio line built to the cape gauge because japan was a mess after WW2 :)

[crude phoenix]

Those need to be an option in case people add non-Japanese train sets, eg DPRK or HKTS

They'll disable themselves if no trains are available

[nova bay]

And 762mm... Lots of takushoku railways and kan'i railways in Hokkaido, but...

[tidal perch]

urgh, narrow and standard is already enough for me

[crude phoenix]

oof, old JapanSet graphics

why use JP+ Shinkansen but not JP+ Engines?

but it's nice to see new and improved dual gauge tracks

[bleak karma]

Something irks me about JapanSet dual gauge graphics, probably the rails being too fat (most oftenly a dual gauge system would consist of 3 rails not 4)

[tidal perch]

Then the rails will be asymmetric... Though it does match the more common case.

[royal nimbus]

Imo / \ should be three rail as that still allows the trains to be on top of the rails which I don't believe is possible in the | and - views

[crude phoenix]

I did those graphics that way so that the third rail wouldn't swap sides, because there was no other way to avoid that

[tidal perch]

One thing noticed is that -
Because weMOD didn't touch any important code of the original JP3 Tracks, I can now add it to the bottom of the GRF list of an existing game without breaking anything. Additionally, I also get access to the extra tracks.

[wild geode]

Nice side effect

[frozen prawn]

Ello

I have ideas about JP+ trams

so

I think this normal scale trains thing can be added on trams
Enoden

Keihan Keishin Line systems

Including

Keihan 800 series

[crisp stone]

I think these are better off as trains tbh

And that there is a tracktype

"rail on road"

[frozen prawn]

👀

[crisp stone]

Cause it is rather segregated even if its on the road

[frozen prawn]

Car can go on it?

[shrewd wren]

Isn't Keihan Keishin continues to Kyoto Tozai line? that's rails not trams for sure

[crisp stone]

nah

it'd be visual enjoyment

[frozen prawn]

yeah, so that is why I will suggest Kyoto Tozai line trains next

[shrewd wren]

I would consider Enoden as trams but only if there were diagonal trams/roads

[frozen prawn]

[bleak karma]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/bc/Fukutetsu_200_019.JPG

[crisp stone]

eeekkk yea now these are more trammy

[bleak karma]

https://m.mintetsu.or.jp/corporates/img/photo/133_ech_photo007.jpg

[crisp stone]

What is a tram? What is a train?

What is the meaning of life?

[crisp stone]

Some say 42, I say 211

[crude phoenix]

Street running could be done something like this, but better looking

[frozen prawn]

Oh how about this
Since you have suspension monorail
What if you let monorail also use as tram scale

[frozen prawn]

[crisp stone]

I cant remember why, but last I talked to susmon person they said it wont work

[crude phoenix]

That would require a tramtype that isn't allowed to be built over roads, but it is something we want to do at some point

[crisp stone]

But I think it should be attempted

[shrewd wren]

We still need to decide the fate of rubber-tyred systems 🙃

[crisp stone]

oh dear

[frozen prawn]

Why not both

[crude phoenix]

I wanted to do those as a tramtype as well

[frozen prawn]

[shrewd wren]

Sapporo is patiently waiting in my list and feeling lonely without a touch

[frozen prawn]

U see seee

[bleak karma]

#developer-updates message

[frozen prawn]

bro put London underground on both scale

[shrewd wren]

Made as trains? Can't say for sure looking at the preview

[frozen prawn]

Yeah
I means

If you want to build an dual rail underground rail

the best opinion is tram line

Or else you will meet hardcore at big city

[shrewd wren]

well with an option to disable penalties it'll be just 6 tiles including tunnels,
but for a more compact systems, especially RT, monorails and other movers that often located above the roads, tram sounds like the solution, at least for me

So to finallize, enoden/keihan as well as tracked metros will remain as trains (sorry)
People movers are considered as trams for now

[crude phoenix]

It's not possible for tramtypes to be elevated above roads though

suspended monorail is an exception because the track is the catenary and it gets drawn above the train

[nova bay]

So straddle type monorail can only be implemented as trains. hmm.

[crude phoenix]

It could be implemented as a tramtype, but not above roads

that's why we need a flag to disallow a tramtype from being built on roads

[shrewd wren]

Wouldn't be making monorails as elevated a solid solution?
I can only see only an offset problem here

For the systems I'm aware of, they are mostly elevated and overground

[crude phoenix]

As a tramtype? It would still need the flag as it wouldn't work above roads

and crossing roads becomes problematic

[shrewd wren]

But why disabling above roads tho?

[crude phoenix]

because any road vehicles would drive on top of the monorail tracks

[shrewd wren]

Ahh that's the problem, right, what about making tracks as catenary here as well?

Oh trains will be overlapped

[crude phoenix]

That only works for suspended monorail because the track is above the train

[shrewd wren]

right ye, well quite a shitty situation I have to say

[crude phoenix]

Yeah that's why I wanted to make them ground level, and leave it up to the player to put them on bridges

there could also be a fake foundation that makes it look elevated when it's not, maybe as a waypoint

[tidal perch]

Why not 39

[digital river]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/477434889508093952/931358230674817044/unknown.png?ex=667973b1&is=66782231&hm=dd76ce61574932060457d7270fa58e57586aa58b0bcbc52a6ab972e2322ddc71&

[frozen prawn]

That is Enoden

?

[shrewd wren]

Sotetsu 7000/New 7000 series

[tidal perch]

Did you used greenscreen?

[shrewd wren]

Yup, due to sprite stacking shenanigans
Would like to have a greenscreen track

[tidal perch]

there is a trick I haven't mentioned yet

I have a greenscreen 1.1 version that is not yet on Bananas
But I forgot the difference between 1.0 and 1.1

nvm seems like that feature is also present in 1.0

there are greenscreen stations

[shrewd wren]

Oh it's in the stations, got it. Thank you

[tidal perch]

no problem 🙂

[tidal perch]

also don't forget to adjust sprite resolution

[tidal perch]

see the difference between 1x and 4x here

[shrewd wren]

I'll completely cut everything apart from the trains on a releaser, so it won't be a problem

[nova bay]

There is a new set "Hokkaido Trainset" available on bananas

hmm... I will say a good try, but mismatch JP+ style

[tidal perch]

purchase icon offset not quite right eh

[royal nimbus]

Something tells me they'll be too narrow in the depot aswell

[shrewd wren]

Sotetsu 6000 and New 6000 series

[haughty monolith]

Is that a cyclist in front of the enoden?

[tidal perch]

Does this look good to you guys?

[wild geode]

Not sure on the utility of multiple pavement styles but it looks terrific

Fences are great on the stations and the tracks

[late snow]

the yellow

uh idk about the yellow

[crude phoenix]

The dark asphalt looks good, the yellow not so much

[late snow]

If you wish to simulate dirt platforms, i suggest copying something like auz or that one set which i forgot the name off

[wild geode]

I don't think it's supposed to be dirt

[royal nimbus]

It would be nice if the overpass didn't cover the whole platform for Islands

[tidal perch]

I don't know whether it's dirt or not actually. I have it named "platform style 2" in my source code
And I got lazy (also to reduce realsprites) so the two alternative platform styles are basically the concrete one recoloured using personalized indexes.

[tidal perch]

And I'm gonna do a reldred switch to allow disabling all fences 😈

[shrewd wren]

I hope there will be an option for station fences only

I mean the ones on the platforms themselves

[tidal perch]

hmm

but the purchase menu looks horrible

[rain ingot]

What are the huts supposed to be?

[tidal perch]

station facilities e.g. restrooms

[rain ingot]

Can you provide a photo?

Of this irl

[tidal perch]

I don't have a reference

[rain ingot]

Ah

[tidal perch]

something like this I think

[rain ingot]

It feel very short compared to the overpass

[tidal perch]

the hut you mean?

[rain ingot]

Yes

[tidal perch]

This?

[royal nimbus]

No, if it behaved like the Dutch one and was centered so that you could walk around it

[shrewd wren]

Sotetsu 5000 (II), 5100 and 5000 series

[digital river]

🤔

[bleak glade]

ironically the 7000 from last week as close to irl as could be imo, and on the left is the 5000 (II) and 7000 on the right, nearly identical front

[shrewd wren]

Oops used the wrong headlight overlay in the constructor 😅
fixed now

[bleak glade]

yeah that makes sense, looks great!

[shrewd wren]

Thank you!

[tidal perch]

*grabbing train components from the superstore

[shrewd wren]

I'm getting js react vibes here

[tidal perch]

What's your opinion on the fence style?

candidates

[shrewd wren]

That's what I've meant by only platform fences. As for the style I like the black one

second from the bottom is also good for urban style sound proofed stations

[wild geode]

I like the middle two

Maybe by construction year?

[tidal perch]

no, awful

i'd rather have it controlled by a station random bit

[shrewd wren]

Does random bit work for the whole station or for every placed tile?

[tidal perch]

ah, there are two for stations, one for the tile and one for the whole station

[shrewd wren]

Hmm this could work then

[bleak glade]

another vote for the middle 2 👍

[tidal perch]

I think I may do a parameter to allow switching between fence styles

[wild geode]

If I had to pick one I’d say this one

Unless you can find a way to roughly guesstimate what is a more ‘rural’ station and what is more modern ‘urban’ station and choose accordingly.

Maybe for a Shinkansen station or something

[bleak karma]

Left feels more like a rural station with wooden fences, second one feels properly urban, the third one has also some rural feel to it, and the right most? I have no idea what it is but it stands out too much

Try using fences from Auz set, they might fit better

[wild geode]

If the last one is CC instead then it could look quite nice depending what colour scheme you go for.

2nd one as it stands would work quite well with the Korean track set, that has some really nice sound barriers with their tracks.

[bleak karma]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1203749909250056312/1203764838006915192/overpass_stations.png

Here are some overpass stations that I attempted to draw

[tidal perch]

let' me wrap up the code and make an initial release first, then we talk about overpass stations

[tidal perch]

implemented, except not quite working

ok working now

[shrewd wren]

JP+ PC お知らせ info
Sotetsu update released #developer-updates message

[rain ingot]

Very nice

[tidal perch]

Oh wait I haven't submitted the translation yet 🙃

[shrewd wren]

There's a plenty of time until next release 😜

[tidal perch]

I tried to deploy the same platfrom passenger mechanic as in Japan Set, but it seems like that it's more complexed than simply having PASS: spritegroup and MAIL: spritegroup written in the graphics chunk and using DEFAULT(some_random_number) in the spritelayouts. I think it used some random number generator. Maybe the original authors used code from NewStations or somewhere?

[tidal perch]

time to read some NFO

[nova bay]

pure white sprite?

[tidal perch]

yes absolutely

[tidal perch]

cargo? 😛

Still have to do some randomization. Maybe recolouring based on current date and tile random bit?

[wild geode]

ayyyyye you got it 😃

Personally, I like it when pax stations only show passengers, and cargo tiles only show cargo, not sure how youd handle that though

[tidal perch]

I don't
I'll add a new cargo dedicated platform type

[crude phoenix]

I don't think containerised cargo on a high passenger platform makes sense

Old style piece goods/break bulk would be great though

especially since old JP stations used to have these goods sheds

[wild geode]

God we need those sheds back

those were great

been a big fan of your chips fork that has them

[tidal perch]

Man I wish there is a NFO translator that translates NFO to NML

[rain ingot]

These containers feel a lot smaller than what would go onto trains

[tidal perch]

🤔 I got those sprites from jplw

And, urgh, Japanese railway containers are in general smaller than standard containers

[rain ingot]

They don't really match with the container we see on the train right there in the screenshot

[crude phoenix]

There aren't any containers on the train, that's the brake van

Oh nvm I just saw the one container behind the loco

[rain ingot]

Ye

[crude phoenix]

But yeah I did 99 different container variations, ranging from extremely rare to extremely common

the dark red one on the train is the most common kind, but the pink one with the blue swoosh was actually a unigue prototoype and is designed to show up rather rarely on JP+ container wagons

I did make JP+ Cargo Stations, but it's a simple CHIPS reskin and it doesn't support containers changing by era like the trainset does https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/692413660840198195/1200660104706523146/image.png?ex=6684d4dc&is=6683835c&hm=db85ad589a6610958fa2176c3fff801b9577e7770f8c9890465f8b700a16034e&=&format=webp&quality=lossless

[wild geode]

one JP+ stations to rule them all?

[crude phoenix]

Yeah the plan is to roll JP+ Cargo Stations into the main JP+ stations, when that gets made eventually possibly

[rain ingot]

Isn't there a limit to the total amount of station tiles?

[crude phoenix]

Oh yeah, it would probably still have to be separate GRFs

but it would be on the same modular codebase

[wild geode]

I thought those limits got raised recently?

same as objects

[crude phoenix]

the current JP+ Cargo Stations is based on CHIPS which is in NFO so what I can do with it is very limited

[wild geode]

Well I think WenSim is on the money with what hes working on

Those auto fences, auto platform material changing, etc

[tidal perch]

There is a total limit of 65535 station tiles which I don't think any station set would be able to use all of them

[tidal perch]

Yeah originally it was 255

[tidal perch]

Tbf the station facilities are easy to code. The difficult ones are the platforms.

And I just thought of an edge case that could break the whole id system...

[rain ingot]

Ah

Yes I'm an old boomer

It was 255 last I worked on stations

[frozen prawn]

Brother hear me out

You guys really should consider put station building manually

or else this

Try as AUZ

put the building depend on which direction of the block you click

[rain ingot]

That's not possible

[frozen prawn]

So AUZ is like

he have a large database of different direction

[rain ingot]

That just picks one at random

I'd prefer not having to do the random scrolling too much

[late snow]

Auz is a mess

[crude phoenix]

Random objects are annoying, no more of them please

[late snow]

Great art, terrible sorting

[crude phoenix]

Station platforms need both sides because sometimes you want to do island platforms, sometimes normal ones

[frozen prawn]

Indeed

[shrewd wren]

Oh there will never be enough words in the world to describe how much I hate random placement

[tidal perch]

Rather have the building's direction based on it's nearby tiles, just like old JP3 modular buildings

[tidal perch]

ok I think I get it now
how the cargo waiting works

each station tile randomly choose a sprite group when new cargo arrives

[frozen prawn]

Please explan this

Why a Mini shinansen is more expensive then a Normal shinkansen

Now I know My train is a block longer

[tidal perch]

basically I copied this from ISR 😛

[wild geode]

People! And fences!

Even got track ends with signs

That really is very impressive

[tidal perch]

I mean, now platform waiting cargo has much better randomization

[wild geode]

That’s awesome

[tidal perch]

not quite original JP3 style, more like ISR

because I copied that bit of code from ISR

[frozen prawn]

Finally chat won't fall off from platform 🗣️🗣️🗣️🔥🔥🔥

PSD WHEN 🗣️🗣️🗣️🔥🔥🔥

[tidal perch]

what psd? you mean the sprite file?

[frozen prawn]

platform screen door

like Korea one

[tidal perch]

next time try not to use those strange initials please

Im not a professional

but yeah they are planned

[tidal perch]

is this better?

[wild geode]

are they the two seperate platforms? cargo and passenger?

The dense passengers look good

[tidal perch]

no, they are one and the cargosprite is determined by tile randombit 😛

[wild geode]

yeah not what i'd probably want

maybe with different sprites for mail bags or something

I'd usually have cargo on entirely seperate platforms, hence why a seperate tile for waiting cargo and waiting pax would be what I'd want

[tidal perch]

yeah that would make more sense

[wild geode]

but having the same platform doing both would be a bit weird

but, in a cargo platform, having the various waiting cargos be randomized would be absolutely awesome

so yeah the idea absolutely has merit

[bleak karma]

I would personally separate passenger stations from cargo stations

They look weird together

[tidal perch]

that's just a demo of how I can randomize cargo sprites. Nobody would really want to put passengers and cargo on the same platform

[wild geode]

oh good 🙂

randomized cargo sprites good 🙂

[tidal perch]

yeah and I wrote it like this
(current_date % 16) ^ tile_random_bit
so it changes through time

[wild geode]

oooh

[rain ingot]

I would personally want the specific cargo types on platforms to be set manually

I don't want logs, barrels and boxes randomly mixed

[rain ingot]

This is cool

[wild geode]

I dunno, I probably wouldn't build a station that would get into that problem to begin with

but barrels and boxes wouldnt bother me too much

[rain ingot]

I can't guarantee that I wouldn't

[wild geode]

or the brown boxes and the white\blue ones you see in chips

[tidal perch]

No. I meant that there will be multiple sprites for one type of cargo

[rain ingot]

Ooh

This is good

[wild geode]

Yeah, I wouldnt have minded mixed cargo, but yeah, thats neat

[tidal perch]

I should do this in the station set

authentic Shandong green onion
Super tender not spicy 5kg in total
(Chinese "斤" = 500 grams)

[shrewd wren]

Drunk drawn Odakyu 5000 II, 4000 II, 3000 II, 2000 II, 1000, 8000 and 9000 Types

[digital river]

make seibu 8000

[neon light]

all seibu

is all tobu in the pack

[shrewd wren]

I believe Odakyu transfered some of the 8000 to Seibu
And yes, all Tobu is in the pack

[neon light]

ah nice

[tidal perch]

it's working, except it's not working

I'm going to write another spritelayout for platform buffers

[wild geode]

oooooh

[stone crescent]

Very good!
The buffer stop at the end of the track, do you plan to make a version that is also installed at the end of the track without a platform?

[tidal perch]

ahem what do you mean?

[crisp stone]

Empty tile with just the buffer 😉

[tidal perch]

hmm I think I already done that

[tidal perch]

darn

ok it's even buggier now. 😠

I put a nice little cheat here

[tidal perch]

...and here you go!

oh just forgot I need to hack another procedure

[stone crescent]

Oh! You made it!
Do you intend to make this type?

https://www.e-katomodels2.com/shop/g/g20-064/

[tidal perch]

nah, that sprite is copied from Japanese stations, not the Japan Set 3 one

I could've copy the JP3 one, but this one looks better - even if it's not that realistic

[stone crescent]

Oh I see..!

[tidal perch]

@stone crescent I also made them available as waypoints
(oh, and we have waypoint classification now, hurray!)

[stone crescent]

This is very helpful. Thank you!!!!!

[tidal perch]

I just thought of another way of implementing this thing.
My original plan is to separate two platforms (front and back). But because this is a barrier tile no trains will actually use it.
Regular platform tiles in WINS reads nearby tile information and processes 4 bits, 2 for each platform. I could simply grab the 4 bit information and assign a unique pre-combined sprite for each value - meaning 16 sprites in total.
Snowsprites and cargosprites are also needed - they can be reused, just that I would have to set bounding boxes for them.
This is the current best solution I can think of.

And the spritelayout would be something like
...CUSTOM(MACRO, LOAD_TEMP(MACRO_1) << 2 | LOAD_TEMP(MACRO_2) * pos) and pos is either 1 or 2, depending on the direction

A normal platform would use 12 sprites. 16 if including snow. Also several recoloursprites.
The buffer tile would use 32 sprites, 64 if including snow...

oof

[tidal perch]

I thought I'm overusing macros

[tidal perch]

heh

[ember heron]

May I steal your code? I am dumdum

[tidal perch]

Code is available under gpl2, feel free to steal anything 😄

[wild geode]

believe me I will do that later 😛

I am sitting on a bunch of sprites

[magic ridge]

Maybe I'll do that too someday 👀

[tidal perch]

trying to optimize my buffers... currently they are not quite compatible with shelters.

it has a special case so I cannot simply use the template I used on other platforms

[wild geode]

My only concern with that stuff it's heavily dependent on track set, but given you're doing tracks as well

¯_(ツ)_/¯

Looks nice, but

[tidal perch]

yeah it's also dependent on the baseset if no newtracks are used

I plan to do a track detecting function tho

(only compatible with JPtracks)

[wild geode]

Yeah, it's definitely good to set your scope of what you'll support. Maybe find a way to hide those particular station tiles if a compatible track type isn't loaded.

Otherwise you'll get a lot of dumb support queries.

[rain ingot]

Why doesn't this work with SMITS?

[tidal perch]

I guess you know the answer

[wild geode]

why doesn't it work with dprk tracks remod

😛

[tidal perch]

It doesn't even work with vanilla tracks

[wild geode]

good, to hell with vanilla tracks

[crude phoenix]

JP+ Bridges doesn't work with vanilla tracks either, it's fine 🙂

[odd verge]

wait you mean i'm not going to be able to use your stations with iron horse

[crude phoenix]

You can disable IH's railtypes and use a different track set with it

or you can just use IH's railtypes and either ignore the graphical mismatch or avoid using those tiles

[odd verge]

oh phew

[tidal perch]

Peter said negative xyz offsets are out of NML's scope (correct me if I am wrong) but the range restriction can be bypassed using an variable. This can be used to create e.g. overlapping stations and bridge stations. They will be very buggy though.

basically something like this, but way more automatic
#add-on-development message

[tidal perch]

that's interesting

heh, the platform is only valid for three tiles

I thought setting bounding boxes correctly would solve the problem

[tidal perch]

oh no I can't understand my own code

[bleak karma]

that happens too often

[tidal perch]

what the hell...

I broke everything using a temp storage...

heh, directly accessing station variables results sprites being hidden, weird

anyways, rails now detect nearby tracks, and can automatically place buffers

[crude phoenix]

Nice, I wonder how it looks when combined with industrial trackset

[tidal perch]

WINS 0.1 alpha released. Feel free to play around, do experiments, or just ruin the whole set by using some undefined behaviour.
https://github.com/WenSimEHRP/jppluswins/releases/tag/0.1

[tidal perch]

I have a bad idea

tile class, slope type, and rail continuation can be used for the activator of underground eyecandy rail yards

[haughty monolith]

Will the cool aspects of the WIP Japanese station expansion be included?

Interesting there don't seem to be any screenshots of it on the forums

nvm, there is, just very hidden

i want these like so bad

hah, the one on the forums is surprisingly 'complete' already, it's just not on bananas

[tidal perch]

Yep. It even has passenger waiting sprites. I just couldn't find the final version, maybe somewhere in the author's drives.

[wild geode]

Which one has passenger waiting? The one I was playing with didn’t 😦

(Jp stations add on that is)

[tidal perch]

I'm not sure if implementing these is a very good idea. To be honest, I like it, but I don't think it should be in WINS.

[tidal perch]

There are some screenshots at the end of the thread. As I said, I couldn't find grf files that contains the waiting sprites.

[wild geode]

Gotcha

[haughty monolith]

personally, this is really the only thing i am looking forward to in a(ny) new version of the japanese stations really

[tidal perch]

This one for instance

[wild geode]

Yeah go be honest I build on slopes a lot so it’s something I’d enjoy too, I do appreciate it’s easier said than done.

[haughty monolith]

why should it not be?

[tidal perch]

Short answer is that it would make automation harder, and may require a lot of effort to code.

[haughty monolith]

oh i see

[wild geode]

Yeah you’ve already got a lot on your plate with just what you’ve bitten off

Auto surfaces, fences, etc

[haughty monolith]

i don't like the fact the guy has been gone for a while, since i guess all that is needed is these to be put on the bananas.

personally i really do not care for automation. just give me a big list of tiles.

[tidal perch]

That is really not something initially planned. I may be able to code it and add a special flag for it, but the quality might be bad

[haughty monolith]

oh no, don't worry about it, i don´t expect this to be an automated thing (ever)

[tidal perch]

😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠😡😠

Hoho is that spam? 😛

Automation is really the core of WINS

[wild geode]

DamienWSE? From what I understood he was remaking the add on from scratch to support snow and waiting passengers, and it never got finished. I have a feeling he never got further than just bare tiles, so the last download version is probably accurate.

It would be nice if everyone just put their stuff on GitHub but oh well, guess I’m no better in that regard, I’m sitting on a lot of unreleased stuff

[haughty monolith]

yeah, well, the problem isn't functionality i guess; it achives what i want, it's just not on bananas so not really an option for most multiplayer hosts.

the last one seems to have the source file too

[haughty monolith]

then it's not a thing for me, so feel free to disregard my ideas.

i bonsai my stuff anyway, so picking the individual station parts is not much of a bother to me. actually, it is a preference over tiles that try to adapt.

[tidal perch]

Extra platform decals are planned, but eh, decals won't bring up many problems e.g. what if the stairs leads to nowhere, should I not display it or draw another sprite? etc. etc.

Even automatic platform screen doors are easier to do than the stairs

[haughty monolith]

once again, i come into this with the mindset of picking every single tile of the station out of a larger pallet and not an automated format.

if there is an option for maybe such tiles to work in harmony, why not?

actually, @tidal perch how much of a bother would it be for there to be single picker tiles among the automated tiles?

so, you have the stairs variant as a static tile, with the others around being the adaptive kind.

[tidal perch]

Adding an extra flag and that's it

[haughty monolith]

in that case it would be nice if these were to be considered to be implemented as such, if not in an extra upload to clearly differentiate their functioning.

[tidal perch]

I can give you an example here:
I have a station tile that includes two platforms, four fences, two buffers, and different types of waiting cargo, each has three states.
Each platform has three variations, that is 3*3,
There are four fences, that is 3^2*2^4
Two buffers, 3^2*2^6, that's already 576 variants. I'm not even including the cargo sprites and platform materials.
It's obviously unrealistic to include that many variants just for a single station tile.

[haughty monolith]

i mean the opposite

for a single station tile that functions like a 'normal' one to not break the rest if they are build around it

so that one station tile with one variation to not (totally) break other station tiles build around it

[tidal perch]

That's... Easy to do somehow

[haughty monolith]

Would be worth for these type of niche decorative aspects of stations imo. Since they definitely are not worth the sanity of all the potential variations just for a single tile.

[crisp stone]

His stuff is on GitHub and I have all the tiles 👀

[crisp stone]

I also do, I usually get annoyed with automatic placements generally…because I like to have lots of variation as I go along

But being able to place the single tiles onto automated ones would be ideal

It would be a shame to loose all the interesting little detail station tiles

[bleak karma]

I think picking individual tiles is fine, GaryG's Auz set does that, and is probably the most used station set at the moment

But I don't really mind what you end up doing :D

[crisp stone]

Aye, nice automated station plops are going to change things and be nice to have too

[bleak karma]

Also can I make a request to be able to use platforms with both white lines and yellow tactile paving in the same era?

[crisp stone]

There is a case for both types of station set methods

[tidal perch]

😈
Should not be too hard to do

[bleak karma]

You might get overwhelmed with platform variations though

• concrete/tarmac/gravel
• no lines/white lines/yellow tactile paving
• with/without platform doors

[tidal perch]

Heh that would be 54 station tiles just as the influencers

Or maybr I can be evil and let the variation be decided by random bits.

😄

[bleak karma]

Though some are mutually exclusive, like you won't have gravel platforms with platform side doors

[tidal perch]

Door height also counts I think

[bleak glade]

also some platform side doors are actually just lifting ropes :)

although those arnt too common and dont actually need to be added for the ammount of work it would take haha

[plush cliff]

apologize for the intrusion, but is there something that I am missing to make the platforms not look like this?

[tidal perch]

Are you using 14?

[plush cliff]

Oh no, i am using JGR's patch

[tidal perch]

Which version are you using then?

[plush cliff]

JGRPP-0.56.2

[tidal perch]

Ah that explains

Upgrade your game version. This bug only occurs in <= 13 versions. I don't know the jgrpp equivalent though.

[plush cliff]

Ah alright

[tidal perch]

I'm at Haneda now 🙂

[plush cliff]

Ah nice, safe trip and thanks for the fix

[tidal perch]

I should've adde a version check

[tidal perch]

Given the fact that I'm travelling to China I think I may quit discord for a month or so. Bye fellas.
||I actually can buy VPN service, but eh, they have an eye on me!||

[ember heron]

Hope you meet JF

[nova bay]

We have a QQ (one of the main messengers in China) group. It is Chinese-language-only though

[tidal perch]

terrible bug again

[haughty monolith]

Hmm, why does it feel like your station menu is different to mine.

[tidal perch]

wdym?

[tidal perch]

oh I know why. I'm using the nightly version which comes with a different station menu

[haughty monolith]

Oh, that does make sense.

[tidal perch]

@wild geode does this platform look good to you?

[crude phoenix]

I'm not reldred, but yes

[tidal perch]

what about this one

😄 recoloursprite magic

recolour_sprite {
    1  : 65 ;  2  : 65 ;  6  : 65 ;  11 : 65 ;
    12 : 66 ;  13 : 66 ;  14 : 66 ;  15 : 66 ;
    16 : 3  ;  17 : 3  ;  18 : 3  ;  19 : 3  ;
    20 : 4  ;  21 : 4  ;  22 : 4  ;  23 : 4  ;
    24 : 5  ;  25 : 5  ;  26 : 7  ;  27 : 7  ;
    28 : 8  ;  29 : 8  ;  30 : 8  ;  31 : 8  ;
    32 : 9  ;  33 : 9  ;  34 : 9  ;  35 : 10 ;
}
recolour_sprite {
    1  : 36 ;  2  : 37 ;  6  : 35 ;  11 : 38 ;
    12 : 37 ;  13 : 36 ;  14 : 38 ;  15 : 35 ;
    16 : 107;  17 : 106;  18 : 104;  19 : 0  ;
    20 : 109;  21 : 108;  22 : 106;  23 : 105;
    24 : 106;  25 : 0  ;  26 : 37 ;  27 : 36 ;
    28 : 36 ;  29 : 37 ;  30 : 38 ;  31 : 35 ;
    32 : 37 ;  33 : 35 ;  34 : 36 ;  35 : 38 ;
}

one last feature and no more python today

[tidal perch]

I think I can blend 30 sprites together

[wild geode]

I'm reldred, and yes!

2nd one not so much

[tidal perch]

second one is blended sprite

of course it would look bad

[tidal perch]

heh, I think I can still increase the efficiency of this script

[wild geode]

Those platforms in the middle are a lot nicer than the old brownish ones on the platform ends. Very very nice.

[bleak glade]

yeah they have a great texture to them that works well with the roof too

[amber totem]

Would be interesting to see what they look like with JPSet Urban Tracks

[tidal perch]

uh oh, ran out of indexed colours

[tidal perch]

this isn't really a good idea

😡 why isn't there 16bpp or 12bpp

Either modes there are much more indexes to play with

[wild geode]

first one looked better than that one anyway

[wild geode]

this is very good, I like this. almost feels like the fence needs to look more 'rustic' with this platform though

[tidal perch]

Yeah fences looks too modern

[wild geode]

not sure if there's tricks you can do easily there

you're already doing a lot of advanced wizardry

but fence changing on the surface change would be cool if it can be done

[tidal perch]

Maybe I can make it binded with the platform type
So wooden platforms gets old and rusty fences and tile platforms gets modern fences.

[wild geode]

that would be lovely 🥰

[tidal perch]

the typhoon is scary

[wild geode]

oh yeah, big one hit Philippines recently, lots of our carriers are in emergency mode atm coz all their call centres and support desks are in the phillipines

[tidal perch]

I'm in southern Zhejiang. Few days ago I thought Gaemi would directly strike my city... But it didn't, first hit Taiwan then head towards Fujian

[wild geode]

Oooh yeah, I see

[nova bay]

heavy rain here

[wild geode]

reminds me of my very first grf I managed to get to compile:

[tidal perch]

😄

who likes transparent platforms?

[wild geode]

getting there

[nova bay]

We finally found where your forum avatar comes from 😛

[wild geode]

Pfft, it’s old lore

It’s a crop of a screenshot I posted in the project generic stations thread about 20yrs ago

Anybody who cares to go looking that far back can find it easily

Missing sprites, etc looked different in TTDPatch back in the day

[buoyant swan]

is there any plans for a JP+ track set? japanset tracks is feeling real dated now

a lot of people will use japanset tracks compatible industrial tracks for a full ballast stand in

and not having any "urban" shinkansen tracks is always kinda meh

[shrewd wren]

It is planned, but no actual development work has been done yet

[tidal perch]

Not quite sure but maybe JPTracks weMOD is something you would need.

[buoyant swan]

Does that exist?

[tidal perch]

it does, it's just uncompleted
see https://github.com/wensimehrp/jptracks-wemod

and it's not a GRF of the JP+ set, more of an experimental project for learnng NFO

[buoyant swan]

I'll check it out! I can't use it for the JGR servers unless it's on nanners though

[crude phoenix]

A sneak peek into the future of JP+ Engines

[wild geode]

https://tenor.com/view/acdc-lightning-gif-acdc-acdc-white-lightning-gif-12034088

[tidal perch]

woah AC engines and DC engines are separated?

🤷

[crude phoenix]

That was the plan all along, and it's finally happening

[buoyant swan]

so excite

[crisp stone]

My AC looks a little sad 🥺 👉 👈

[crude phoenix]

Needs moar Hokkaido

[crisp stone]

I do love me some Hokkaido

[nova bay]

Current is finally coming! 😄

[shrewd wren]

Why stop at currents 😉

[mossy night]

What about voltage too?

[shrewd wren]

Sounds like overkill. We have settled on leaving this for players to decide. Description of every train should have voltages, as well as frequencies

[tidal perch]

Are there any eyecandy tracks?

[nova bay]

where is dual-gauge?

[nova bay]

where is my H100 🥺

[crisp stone]

Note to self, do that before we get that next release

[nova bay]

Thanks

[crude phoenix]

We already decided it's not beneficial to differentiate voltages and frequencies. It would add too many railtypes and fragment the vehicle selection too much

[royal nimbus]

The string for urban scotch seems wrong it doesn't have dc

I would also personally swap the colours of AC and DC to match xussr and sets

[crude phoenix]

No, in Japan DC is blue and AC is red

this matches the colours on the locomotives

[shrewd wren]

There is and will be more

[royal nimbus]

That makes sense then

[shrewd wren]

Dual gauge is for a bit later

[digital river]

simutrans lite

[shrewd wren]

It's 31st of August, should have been a JP+ Private update today with a nice chibi Miku drawing on the releaser, but I've got something else to share.
JP+ Tracks, alpha test version is now public!
[GitHub]
Please feel free to check this out, share your wishes, ideas or simply complain about how this is non-ttd palette set
It still needs polishing here and there, but I'll try to patch it as fast as possible to make a release on bananas

[royal nimbus]

standard gauge electrified tracks don't seem to allow wagons on them

except ac dc

nvm those are also wrong

[nova bay]

all tracks have the same price

[crude phoenix]

There's still a lot that needs to be done I'm sure

[nova bay]

Load China Set: Trains.
Standard Gauge (AC/DC) allows all electric and non-electric trains.
Standard Gauge (AC) only allows electric trains and no wagons.
Standard Gauge (DC) disallows all trains and wagons.
Maybe, this doesn't matter in Japan Set Family because there is no standard gauge non-electric trains.

[shrewd wren]

This should be compatible with any train set. I'll look into labels, they quite hard to get right

[bleak glade]

It seems that AC/DC trains can be bought on either current type in existing and new games

[late snow]

I believe jake is still editing this

[wild geode]

I don't think the AC/DC update for JP+ engines is out yet

there's been some commits on github

[late snow]

JP+ people are doing things

[royal nimbus]

yeah narrow guage doesn't currently use the standard labels to map so they use japanset fallbacks

[crisp stone]

It's not ready lads, Jake is still frying

[bleak glade]

ahh cool, saw the screenshot from yesterday and wasnt sure if it had been put into the initial release

:)

[wild geode]

it's an alpha release that isn't on bananas yet. enjoy the pretty graphics, let the cooks, cook.

[late snow]

sliced bread

[tidal perch]

The tracks look nice 🤪

[crude phoenix]

If you want to try the AC/DC version of JP+ Engines, get it from Github. Just be warned that there's been some big changes so if you load it into an existing game, everything will break 🙂 https://github.com/EmperorJake/JPengines/tree/acdc

[tidal perch]

@crude phoenix Have you looked into the modular purchase icons yet?

[crude phoenix]

I'll take a look, I just updated my NML to support the new random flip feature

[late snow]

preview of what the urban scape would look like (thx to kale for the urbanscape)

what some of the rural landscape would look like

[tidal perch]

Looks more like A-Tourism or Simutrans now

[crude phoenix]

Looks good, is there anything that still needs to be done?

[tidal perch]

Not many on the code. I think all you need to do is to adjust the templates so that the icon aligns with other JP+ sets

[crude phoenix]

Just a heads up, I'm working on the acdc branch now, there's new engines being added as well

[late snow]

yep this looks nice

[tidal perch]

🤔 well

[crude phoenix]

Just added some new liveries to the DE10, there are over 30 refit options now

[crisp stone]

🍞

🤔

[crude phoenix]

bread train

something for AC lines?

[crisp stone]

It would be wouldn't it

it's all here

Jake you are going to voice chat force me into working on JP+MU

[crisp stone]

Drop me the graphics again please, think I probably lost them when I changed PC and failed to deal with my hard drive

ooo gcc really is fast

[late snow]

why is this train so chonk

[crude phoenix]

because it's a sleeper train chopped up and converted into a local train

[late snow]

ah

[crisp stone]

I hate it cause it is killing the KiHa 40

But it is good to have it in JP+MU 🙂

[tidal perch]

@shrewd wren 😎 had a great translating experience. I love how the strings are organized

[shrewd wren]

All because you've teached me how to do this 😜

[crisp stone]

I deleted 1900 lines of strings about an hour ago thanks to this

Very satisfying

[buoyant swan]

wow this... is so good haha

Im really stoked for this

[crisp stone]

I just noticed my 3 track mainline there

Shivers up my spine

[buoyant swan]

I mean it was really good lol

also wtf roads are these, I just noticed

[late snow]

The conversion fucked with the power supply at wagyu or whatever its called

[crisp stone]

have you got a copy of this save

I would like to have it

[buoyant swan]

wagyu beef power plant

[late snow]

Road also got fucked by pressing the upgrade button

[buoyant swan]

yeah I do let me see

[late snow]

Its in ker thread

[buoyant swan]

#1127319804752166982 message

[ember heron]

Like xussr

great

[crude phoenix]

JP+ Engines is finally getting a snowplough!

[tidal perch]

horse

[late snow]

Godaammm

[upper arrow]

Bloody hell that looks the business

[crude phoenix]

It's going... backwards?

[finite ore]

Is this a dynamic reverse, or a "build reversed"?

[crude phoenix]

It's just a variant at the moment

[finite ore]

nodnods

Might borrow this functionality for some locos maybe. Also considering adding "Shunting" variants for tank engines like in Sunshine, but that adds up pretty quick when you consider liveries

[nova bay]

just found such single kiha so cute

[tidal perch]

why... Are you using the old WINS, or WSJPS?

[nova bay]

You didn't upload the new ones to bananas 😛

[nova bay]

debug: the operator should be JR Hokkaido

[crisp stone]

Uuupppsi

Not used to modular strings yet

[tidal perch]

I guess you could use a script to batch amend strings?

[shrewd wren]

Today is the second JP+ Private Companies anniversary!
2 years ago, on this day, I've made the very first commit to the project.
Here's a small collage of releasers to rewind the history
||Progress has been slow for a while, as my life fucking me up atm||
High resolution image (Imgur)

[nova bay]

Any chance to have a +200ps variant for DD51…

[crude phoenix]

Sure why not

[pure mantle]

if I may make a slightly tounge in cheek suggestion, DMV wen? https://i0.wp.com/rayhaber.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/11/dunyanin-ilk-tren-busu-japonyada-hizmete-giriyor.jpg?fit=1780%2C1000&ssl=1

no I won't hide my shikoku bias

more seriously though, is there somewhere where I can just find a list of all the jp+ set github/links/projects?

it's a bit messy since they all seem to have different authors

besides just going to the ingame menu, that is (which doesn't include alpha/in development stuff)

[tidal perch]

Nope

[pure mantle]

😦

[tidal perch]

And dmv, ugh, not really I think

Tram-train is not possible, not to mention bus-train

So don't demand it to fully function

[pure mantle]

hence "tounge-in-cheek"

it's not a serious suggestion, just a silly little thing

[bleak karma]

Sure we can do it

[tidal perch]

But it will lack functionality

[bleak karma]

It will

[tidal perch]

oof

[pure mantle]

well, it depends on whether you want to make it a tram (so you can have the dual mode capability sort of, with special tram tracks that are just invisible to put everywhere) or a train (so it can go on tracks)

these names are going to get confusing

[tidal perch]

iirc the DMV is created to utilize existing abandoned tracks.

[pure mantle]

I think it was less abandoned and more unprofitable tbh

iirc

[bleak karma]

The dmv isn't very profitable either

[pure mantle]

the railways in shikoku are ridiculously unprofitable

like not a single line on the island makes any money at all

the numbers are operating ratios - the dmv one is the little black section on the coast on the right hand side, and the railway going up to it costs 11.8 times the amount it makes

which is really quite sad

but yeah, personally i'd prefer it as a tram type, but you can make it however you want (if at all)

I'm not expecting anything :p

[crude phoenix]

I think it should be like the hi-rail truck in HEQS, basically a separate train and road vehicle version

[crude phoenix]

I can put something together 🙂

[pure mantle]

thanks

it's a great project, wouldn't want to miss out on anything

[pure mantle]

yeah I guess that work

make sure the rail version is slightly tipped backwards though, to make it look even sillier

just like the real one

[bleak karma]

That might be difficult to show with little pixels

[pure mantle]

I can imagine

[bleak karma]

One day there someone might decide to develop a road vehicle set

[tidal perch]

A GitHub organization just like https://github.com/KoreanGRF or https://github.com/OpenTTD-China-Set ?

[crude phoenix]

I'm not sure if it's possible to merge projects made by different people like that without remaking the repos

[wild geode]

Pretty sure you can

I did an org for a bunch of work stuff.

But there’s other reasons an org might not be suitable. Might take some experimentation to see what works for you.

[tidal perch]

Nah only thing you need is to transfer ownership

And probably give some dudes write access to the repo

Maybe to the organization to

[wild geode]

You can also do granular repo access to org members

But the org admins are God

[tidal perch]

I think the original owner (if in organization) automatically gains write access to the transferred repo

[frozen prawn]

Chat

look

https://fxtwitter.com/muraaki__BNTK/status/1843107815294201998

8A

[crude phoenix]

I'll take it up with the other JP+ authors

[frozen prawn]

8A?

[frozen prawn]

You means 8A?

[tidal perch]

You mean CRH8A

[crude phoenix]

I was referring to the github org thing, but you sniped me 😛

[frozen prawn]

[crude phoenix]

I'm sure Kintetsu will make it into JP+ Private eventually, but there's a lot to do before then

[tidal perch]

am I an official JP+ author? certainly no

[frozen prawn]

[crude phoenix]

Some Kintetsu stuff is already in NATS

[frozen prawn]

Is this possible in

JP+

https://x.com/tateishi_ayame/status/1843124088748818832

トミーテック公式　広報：立石あやめ／鉄道むすめ (@tateishi_ayame) on X

■混合列車のお話
東北本線では1982年までED75けん引の客車・気動車の混合列車が運転されていました。盛岡7:11発539レは、途中の好摩駅で後ろ3両を切り離し、客車列車は沼宮内まで、気動車3両は花輪線927D大館行となりました。
TOMIXで再現してみてはいかがでしょうか？
https://t.co/bXVuunsRcw

Twitter · Oct 7, 2024, 3:00 AM

Kiha mix passenger cars

I remember uncouple is possible on openTTD

[raven folio]

no, except in one old patch

[frozen prawn]

💀

[raven folio]

i still hope it gets implemented in JGR

[crude phoenix]

Sure

[frozen prawn]

👀

[crude phoenix]

but only with the locomotive leading, the KiHa coupling restrictions would prevent it leading

[raven folio]

Ah, you didn't mean coupling ingame but when buying the train

sorry

[crisp stone]

We have one 🤭

We had one from around the time we talked about the wiki / website

[crude phoenix]

Ah, but none of the projects have been merged into it right?

[crude phoenix]

We figured it out now 🙂

[pure mantle]

I was going to suggest that too but I thought the ownership might be a problem

ooh I see it now

I also forgot to mention there's a button at the top right of discord threads now that let you return to the OP

which I think only got added recently

[crisp stone]

I should edit that

[pure mantle]

before that the only way to get up there was by scrolling forever so it's easy to forget

[crisp stone]

Indeed

https://github.com/OpenTTD-JPplus its getting there 😉

[pure mantle]

beautiful

[nova bay]

Wow

[nova bay]

Soya

[tidal perch]

That's English bro

[crisp stone]

On the Super Soya?

[late snow]

Wakkanai?

[nova bay]

Wakkanai is the north terminal of Soya Line

And this is just a... coincidence of different languages

At that time I was in a library café meaninglessly surfing about hokkaido trains on the internet, and the £1/500ml real milk was sold out, I had to buy the soya one (and it was £1.65/250ml), and then I found the coincidence

No, definitely not on the soya train. I am 9000km apart.

[nova bay]

is there something big about to happen?

[crisp stone]

I’d say so

[neon light]

much excite

[pure mantle]

I assume it's probably me missing something since I haven't done this before

[tidal perch]

Nope it's fine

If you don't see an error it's usually fine

[pure mantle]

but it's stuck in an infinite loop

that's the problem

I just keep pressing keys and it goes back a bit, and then spits out the same messages and gets stuck again