Fuck your ragebait

[hard verge]

I don't like you

[ivory hemlock]

I knew someone would do this

for me Max has not reached Goat status yet

[hard verge]

Jim Clark over Max Verstappen is diabolical

You are well aware of what you're doing

Clark is NOT EVEN TOP 10

[shut ginkgo]

But for many he has, and you should have included him

[devout crystal]

Ragebait used to be beliveable

[shut ginkgo]

Fr

[cyan lotus]

lance stroll is the true goat

[sharp wasp]

Bro you deadass know nothing about F1

Jim clark is goated

Still has the most grand slams

Won by 2 mins with a broken gearbox

won every race by a lot

[devout crystal]

U can have 10 options on a poll and this guy only chose 7

Max could have been on this list either way

[hard verge]

People are dense

[sharp wasp]

won touring the Nz and Aussie series and F1

AT THE SAME TIME!

[rose wasp]

ts ragebait

[hard verge]

And Nigel won IndyCar on his first try

[sharp wasp]

You Max fans are a different breed alright

[hard verge]

Farming shitter series counts for nothing

[rose wasp]

id say jim clark over max

[sharp wasp]

Bro since when was Nigel apart of this convo

[rose wasp]

[cyan lotus]

mansell > senna

[rose wasp]

Clark is the goat of all f1 imo

[sharp wasp]

Honestly Lando fans have more braincells than max fans lol

Max fans are just DTS fans lol

[hard verge]

These fuckers drove in an era where cars were 5s+ apart, broke ever other race, and you're grandpa could've been racing after working all week in a factory

[rose wasp]

lmao you're right mostly max's fanbase are childrens who just watch 2023 max

[hard verge]

Raikkonen and Alonso are 10x better than Clark

[sharp wasp]

Ppl hate Lando for no reason too like just be happy that someone else won

[hard verge]

Lando is alright. Kinda like a Button. Lucked into the best car and didn't choke as hard as their teammate

[sharp wasp]

Both of those drivers are good yes but why are you bringing in random drivers and talking about max here

talk about your driver

[hard verge]

Because who's arguing Max is worse than Raikkonen lmao

[cyan lotus]

prime stroll will destroy prime verstappen

[rose wasp]

i agree with ts

[hard verge]

Prime Stroll is genuinely top 3 on the grid

[sharp wasp]

You are a very smart induvial

[rose wasp]

i think you need to watch how goated jim clark is

[hard verge]

Anyway no surprise the Lawshit fans are here talking out their asses

Goodnight

[devout crystal]

Hey man dont diss lawson

I agree max should be on the poll but Lawson low key goated

[rose wasp]

bro clearly lawson didnt do anything wrong

[sharp wasp]

Fr

[devout crystal]

Also is clark the guy where senna said he was the most naturally talented driver on the grid?

[sharp wasp]

Lawson is out here representing NZ

[rose wasp]

(except where people who argues lawson stealing the 2nd red bull seat but thats marko's choice)

[hard verge]

Yes

[rose wasp]

reall

[sharp wasp]

Im happy Lawson got kicked out early otherwise he would not be on the grid

[hard verge]

Clark is probably better than Senna

[rose wasp]

yeah

[hard verge]

Senna is the most overrated driver in the history of all motorsports

[sharp wasp]

Senna is good but overated AF

[devout crystal]

Wouldn't it be great if Clark was on the list with max verstappen using the other 3 options so we could see what other people thought?

[sharp wasp]

Senna would be like rated as high as prost mabye is he never died

[devout crystal]

@ivory hemlock

[sharp wasp]

Prost, Fangio, Clark are all underated

[hard verge]

I think Fangio is fairly rated, just rarely talked about

[devout crystal]

Idk about fangio and Clark just becuase its so hard with the older generation, their competition was no where near as high as modern day

[hard verge]

He drove in the easiest era

Anyway yeah Russell is a better driver than half the list in here

For another fun take

[ivory hemlock]

I feel Max fans saying Max has 5 titles is alot like the Lewis 8 titles

so Max fans are just hypocrites at this point

[hard verge]

Both fanbases have valid arguments

[ivory hemlock]

Yes lewis deserved Abu Dhabi Max deserved 2021

I really hope Max fans see the light and not shit on a driver just because

[hard verge]

My favorite thought process for this was to eliminate the races where one driver had disproportionately bad luck. When you did that for '21, Max was by far the more deserving champ. I think if you did the same for '25, he'd again be deserving

[ivory hemlock]

Its so dumb hating on a human being with feelings just because you didnt get who you wanted to win

[hard verge]

Agreed hate is dumb

[ivory hemlock]

Max did make mistakes in 2025 so did Lando and Oscar tho

[hard verge]

Yes

Lando has the huge advantage of the engine failure in this process

[ivory hemlock]

Leclerc is also Max level good but he is just cursed with bad luck

[hard verge]

Charles makes a billion mistakes, I don't think he's on Max's level

[ivory hemlock]

But I also feel if Lando never got the engine failure Oscar could have become champ I felt Oscar was way to comfortable with that lead but if the point gap was close Oscar could feel the pressure and deliver

Charles and Ferrari could have won 2022 so easily

and that whats hurts knowing charles and Ferrari could have done it but alas this year will be our year

[gentle fable]

if you and @hard verge really think clark had no competition, you are correct lmao, he really didn't it seems
but
did he not race against the likes of jackie stewart, graham hill, john surtees, jack brabham, jochen rindt, and denny hulme? 6 drivers who won 11 world championships between them? not to mention dan gurney, chris amon, lorenzo bandini, bruce mclaren, richie ginther, etc.

and clark dominated every time his car decided to work, evidenced by the fact that removing the 46 races (from 72 starts) in which he had a documented mechanical problem that either caused him to retire or slowed him down dramatically you get a total of 26. he won 25 races, so that means legitimately he only lost on pure pace to another driver once in his f1 career which is absurd
he still has 2 more grand slams than any other driver in history, hamilton and verstappen have had plenty of opportunity to beat that in dominant cars with far more race starts but they haven't

if clark had won the 1962 south african gp, 1964 mexican gp and 1967 french gp all of which he retired from with a car issue in a comfortable lead he would be a 5-time champion just like fangio, and there was definitely plenty more unfortunately never to be shown by the time he died after winning the opening round of 1968

oh, and I'm fairly sure every single one of his competitors praised him as the greatest of them all, not to mention fangio and senna asw

oh and the 60s was the "easiest era" yeah right, 170kph average in glorified coffins on wheels on the old nurburgring nordschleife is a very easy and safe task, trust

idk man it's your guys' opinions so I won't judge but rating him outside of the top 10 is lowk diabolical to me

all this don't even matter anyways, hamilton is clearly the goat according to recency bias, please enjoy my jim clark "shit driver" rant if you bother to read it at all

[devout crystal]

That grandslam one is probably the best argument, i think Clark is probably one of the best of his generation but i find it hard for him to be the goat just because of how sports progress and Imo the next generation is always better than the previous one because of advancements in sports science and stuff like that. Also whilst the older drivers were much braver than the current ones in getting into the death traps that was f1 back in the day bravey does not equal skill.

[gentle fable]

that's fair to consider yeah, I just think being the best driver of all time does not mean you are the greatest driver of all time, but some people do use them interchangeably
and I guess the bravery part is kinda right, ofc modern drivers still have to be pretty brave but safety has just made everything look like nothing today (see bortoleto at brazil last year), that crash easily would have been fatal even 30 years ago so imagine 60, that's when the implications start to shine through every little crack as even one mistake back then could cost your life, so you had to have a completely different mindset but yeah that doesn't directly tie into talent
regardless of that I'm astounded by clark's racing profile in general, like how was he able to win multiple times with an ailing car for example

[ivory hemlock]

Fangio is also underated so much its not even funny

fangio won titles in multiple cars and won 5/8 seasons he did

Prost could also be a 7 or 8 time champ if it was not for bad luck

https://youtu.be/0zqeTYuXUig?si=jEYXxLCvPcq5kMaB

just watch this

[gentle fable]

pretty sure that hes the only one to be a multiple title winner and win more than 50% of the seasons he raced in

[ivory hemlock]

Makes it even better that he was a sheep farmer in scotland too

[gentle fable]

yuhhhhhh he was very humble

[ivory hemlock]

yea Max is good I cannot lie but IMO he is no where close to the level of clark....Yet

I have scotish roots too so thats a plus too lol

Clark could have won 1968 onwards if it was not for that tragic day

[gentle fable]

1968 should have been a clean sweep considering his teammate graham hill won the title

[ivory hemlock]

fr

Prost, Clark, Fangio heak even lauda and sterwert are the horsemen of underated in F1

[gentle fable]

lol same, I might be biased but it's been crazy learning about him particularly, there's something about jim clark above pretty much all the other drivers

[ivory hemlock]

All the goat attention goes straight to Lewis Max Schumacher and Senna

even Alonso and Vettel too

[ivory hemlock]

Yea Him and Schumacher are my favoruite historical drivers

[gentle fable]

if you want to go underrated, let's talk about nelson piquet sr
3 time champion who gets no credit (probably because his personality is a bitch but still)

[ivory hemlock]

Oh yea so underated I forgot about him

[gentle fable]

able to compete with prost, mansell and senna consistently on raw pace

[ivory hemlock]

he is a racist so is it rlly bad that no one cares about him lol

Mansell is also underated I feel

All fans new and old mostly new just talk about the main 4 Max,Lewis,Micheal,and Senna

not fair to the others

[gentle fable]

lol yh, he doesn't deserve to be a part of the paddock past or present with what he has done/said in the past, but on the track he was one hell of a driver it seems

[ivory hemlock]

I rlly hope Lotus comes back to F1 unlikey tho

I feel lotus may never come back

[gentle fable]

yeah, would have been the second coming of stirling moss if not for the 92 williams machinery being absolute class of the field at last

[cyan lotus]

mansell is actually underrated tbh

[ivory hemlock]

and crazy to think lotus quit a long while back with little stints in the 90's and 2010's and are still in the top 6 best teams

[ivory hemlock]

Yea

[ivory hemlock]

Moss deserved a title too

Senna glaze piss's me off so much

[gentle fable]

colin chapman was responsible for too many f1 innovations

[ivory hemlock]

Because people are glazing senna my respect for him is getting lower

[gentle fable]

16 race wins in the 1950s and no title is crazy

[ivory hemlock]

I never rlly respected senna yk him being a bit of a perv and all that

[ivory hemlock]

Yea moss is like THE driver who deserved a title

[gentle fable]

he technically had one in 1958 until he advocated for his rival against an unfair punishment, ultimately reversing the decision but costing himself a title

[ivory hemlock]

Fuck Charles, Danny Ric, Massa

Moss deserved to win

[ivory hemlock]

and I think it was moss who purposfuly did not get enough points so I think ricochet could win the title because he died earlier on in the season sadly

[gentle fable]

also if you want an absolute gem of a driver that never gets mentioned, check out tom pryce
probably the best driver to never get a true shot in a good car and thus never get the spotlight, he's still most known for his tragic death at kyalami in 1977 rather than his absurd performances in shitboxes

[ivory hemlock]

Drivers would never even do that for a +1 postion outside the points but then again those drivers would never know F1 just took off

[ivory hemlock]

Heard of him

[gentle fable]

yeahhhh

[ivory hemlock]

Bruce McLaren does not get enough respect

same with Alesi

[gentle fable]

too real

and amon

and jack brabham

[ivory hemlock]

Alesi got 50 podiums and a handful of wins

[gentle fable]

winning a championship in a car you built would be crazy

[ivory hemlock]

2 and 3x champs never get respect apart from senna

[ivory hemlock]

fr

[gentle fable]

and alonso

[ivory hemlock]

Hulme also only NZ title winenr until 2026

COME ON LAWSON!

[cyan lotus]

not with red bull

[gentle fable]

world is not ready for lawson domination

[ivory hemlock]

The F1 brain washing with Senna and Max has gone to far

Mansell, Clark, Prost, Hulme, McLaren, Fangio a few out of the lot

[cyan lotus]

at least with max most if the new fans actually seen him live

but senna tho

[ivory hemlock]

I also find it funny how Max fans are mad and say Max is a 5x champ and they were mad in 2021 when LH44 fans said Lewis was a 8x champ

Some Max fans are such hypocrites

[gentle fable]

lowk if senna didnt die and retired like after 1996 or smth with 4 titles, I think he would be treated equals with prost

but the one who dies has to be the hero right

[ivory hemlock]

Max will be glazed 100x more than senna

If max is senna leve glazed now

[cyan lotus]

i seriously feel like max is just vettel 2.0 but yeah

[ivory hemlock]

imagine our kids generation

[gentle fable]

real lmao

like pack it up bro

[ivory hemlock]

And Max fans want 2023 again lol

When Max's engine shat itself in AUS 2024 I was crying

I was so happy someone else was gonna win

[ivory hemlock]

100%

[gentle fable]

and then the rest of the season happened

that was cinema

[ivory hemlock]

Prost is not respected enough out of the 4x champs

[gentle fable]

the racing was mid at most tracks, but the variety in results was cinema

[cyan lotus]

2024 is a top 10 season

[gentle fable]

basically same thing as 2010

[ivory hemlock]

PPL say 2025 was better than 2024 but 2024 you could not tell who was gonna win was is gonna be Carlos,Charles,Max,Lewis,George,Lando,Oscar

[gentle fable]

except without a title decider in the finale

[cyan lotus]

mclaren vs ferrari for the wcc

[gentle fable]

true that happened

[ivory hemlock]

Like Red bull cooked early on then McLaren and Mercs mid season cooking then Mclaren again then Ferrari towards the engine

then 2025 is like Lando Oscar or Max

[ivory hemlock]

2020 is so underated

Im so happy I got to see 2021 too also

[gentle fable]

lbh 2025 wasnt really a title fight until after singapore

[cyan lotus]

*lando vs oscar but max somehow joined the fight because red bull made a dope car and mclaren starts being mclaren

[ivory hemlock]

And I remeber in 2020 my first full year of watching F1 my dad would wake me for the races lol

[gentle fable]

before then it was basically the monza 2024 fuck your championship meme but from race 2 of the season for piastri

we ignore race 1

[ivory hemlock]

I remember heavy eyes at 1 am watching the Italian gp and Gasly winning lol so good

[cyan lotus]

piastri is hella overrated change my mind

[ivory hemlock]

And red bull but they needed a miracle

[ivory hemlock]

Facts

[cyan lotus]

i feel like he's more of a bottas/perez level driver but cooler

[ivory hemlock]

Gasly and geroge are so underated

the 2025 rookie whilst very good so overated

[gentle fable]

any driver who hits just below proper champion levels in a dominant car is considered overrated

just blown up last year because lando is also in that boat

except he actually became wdc

[ivory hemlock]

Yea

For me Lando is in the middle of the pack when it comes to WDC

[cyan lotus]

lando is just the button of the 2020s change my mind

[ivory hemlock]

Being a Perez fan in 2024 was so hard

[gentle fable]

it feels weird to describe him as a button but what else are you gonna use ig lol

[ivory hemlock]

Now people have decied "You know what since others like Perez now I like perez too"

75% of the F1 Fanbase are glory hunters

Albon is giving Mansell button vibes

Dont even get me started on Sainz

People just forget what happend in the first half of 2025

[gentle fable]

sainz feels like ricciardo regen lowkey

[ivory hemlock]

Sainz Leclerc Max fans I just hate for some reason lol

and Piastri fans

they are so cocky

[cyan lotus]

sainz fans are alright

[ivory hemlock]

Leclerc fan girls also bro

[gentle fable]

good enough to be a championship fighter, probably, but wasted most of his time in cars not always worthy of the top step of the podium and when done so (2024/2018) the circumstances hated on him

[ivory hemlock]

We were robbed of a 2022 title battle lets hope these regs give better racing

[cyan lotus]

thats leclerc, sainz isnt really championship worthy tbh

[ivory hemlock]

Yea but its crazy to think that there are Nando fans who think Nando will get his 3rd title this year lol

Looking at you Danoskill and Ricksf1addiciton

Just also wanna put it out there that Jim Clark won with a broken Gearbox one handed in the wet and won by over 5 minutes

[gentle fable]

surprisingly not his only win with a broken car, and though probably not as impressive, he also won a race with a lack of oil pressure
he shut the engine off on the corners and turned it on for the straights, so that he didn't starve the engine of oil when it moved to the side in a corner, still held the lead to the end somehow

[ivory hemlock]

And won by over a minute with a slipped disc

[shut ginkgo]

damn bruh 220 messages that started by the topic of not including max in a GOAT contest poll? (i didn't really read most of the chat after the beginning)
meanwhile max himself is probably chilling in his multimillion dollar home in monaco with his family and probably sim racing or smth

[vivid hull]

vroom