#Combos

1 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

shadow dagger
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If Stroll were replaced with Hadjar this would have been way closer

austere jewel
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Senna and Alonso are valued above Vettel and Verstappen

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One driver shouldn't have the power to change everything

karmic egret
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im taking stroll over bortoleto anyway

thorny kelp
karmic egret
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no id just rather have the driver with podium finishes and a pole position

thorny kelp
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You prefer a guy that won one trophy 5 years ago over a promising rookie

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Why not i guess

karmic egret
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well im assuming its the drivers in their primes not right now

austere jewel
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A washed up Vettel beat Stroll for 2 consecutive seasons

thorny kelp
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Stroll got beat by all of his teammates

austere jewel
thorny kelp
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I forgot about him

karmic egret
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bortoleto has also been beaten by all of his teammates

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so not really sure what that is proving

thorny kelp
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💀

austere jewel
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Bortoleto has only had one teammate and is still a rookie

thorny kelp
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  • Won F3 in 2023
  • Won F2 in 2024
  • Currently beating Hulkenberg in qualifying
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What are you talking about 😭

karmic egret
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that wasn’t your point with stroll tho

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you said stroll has been beaten by all of his teammates

thorny kelp
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Because it's true for Stroll

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Not for Bortoleto

karmic egret
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right now, bortoleto has been outscored by all his teammates as well

thorny kelp
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Because he has one teammate

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And a half season

karmic egret
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what so bortoleto is ahead of hulkenberg now

thorny kelp
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Please turn on your brain 😭

austere jewel
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Bortoleto is equalling on pace with 1

thorny kelp
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Bortoleto may have less points he's still making a decent rookie season

karmic egret
thorny kelp
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Perez always beat him

austere jewel
thorny kelp
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Points and qualifying

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Washed Massa beat him too

austere jewel
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Washed Massa nearly won a race

karmic egret
thorny kelp
austere jewel
thorny kelp
karmic egret
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being a rookie is completely irrelevant to the conversation

thorny kelp
austere jewel
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He's doing very well as a rookie compared to Hulkenberg with 15 years of experience

thorny kelp
karmic egret
austere jewel
thorny kelp
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And Perez still beat him

karmic egret
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we are talking about primes

austere jewel
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If you're going to judge two drivers on different stages of their career then go on

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You're using Stroll's best season against Bortoleto's only season

thorny kelp
austere jewel
karmic egret
austere jewel
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Look above your message

karmic egret
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Its not a rookie competition

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Its a drivers in their primes h2h

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You can fault op for putting bortoleto in the question if you want

austere jewel
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Bortoleto hasn't reached his prime, what the hell are you talking about?

karmic egret
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im aware

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but look at the context of the debate

austere jewel
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The context is about overall profile

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If it was about primes I would specify

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Should be common sense I fear

karmic egret
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so what is there that i can take from bortoletos overall profile that would make me think he’s a better driver than stroll

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isn’t stroll also beating him this year anyway

austere jewel
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Bortoleto is yet to do that

thorny kelp
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Stroll got 0-15 in qualifying against Alonso

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🐐

karmic egret
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🕊️

thorny kelp
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Be objective for god sake 😂

austere jewel
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Easy to say when Alonso got 2 DNF's out of sheer lack of luck

thorny kelp
austere jewel
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Alonso was on track for P5 at Monaco

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And his engine broke down

thorny kelp
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Yes

karmic egret
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what

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no he wasn’t

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p7

thorny kelp
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It's still points 😉

austere jewel
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P5 or P6, something like that

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I believe it was before Hamilton overcut Hadjar

karmic egret
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it was p7

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hadjar was ahead of him

austere jewel
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Alright, still points though

karmic egret
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you can even give alonso points at australia and stroll would still be closer to alonso than bortoleto to hulkenberg

thorny kelp
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Why are you talking about Bortoleto again 😂

austere jewel
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Because Stroll has had more luck

karmic egret
austere jewel
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Points in China after double Ferrari DSQ

thorny kelp
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AM strategy in Silverstone

karmic egret
thorny kelp
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Mistakes happens

austere jewel
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Doesn't disprove the fact that Stroll got lucky

thorny kelp
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Lewis showed it this week-end 👀

austere jewel
thorny kelp
karmic egret
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lewis is completely irrelevant to the conversation

thorny kelp
karmic egret
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no im saying it because he genuinely has zero relevance to it

thorny kelp
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Still a fact than everyone can make mistakes

karmic egret
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yeah

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but when you’re analysing stroll you have to accept that one thing he has done very well this year is, in the races at least, not make mistakes

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unlike bortoleto for example

thorny kelp
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Yet 👀

austere jewel
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He's a rookie for God's sake

thorny kelp
austere jewel
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God forbid a driver isn't flawless in his first F1 season

karmic egret
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am i supposed to judge him based on his second season

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you can’t just assume a driver will improve, thats not how it works

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although he probably will

thorny kelp
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Making one or two mistakes doesn't mean your season is less good than another one lol

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Stroll isn't even top 15 best drivers in 2025

austere jewel
karmic egret
thorny kelp
karmic egret
thorny kelp
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Second best rookie in 2025

austere jewel
karmic egret
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the car has been roughly as fast as the aston across the season

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stroll has a far better and more experienced teammate

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and qualifying h2h alone cannot be a meaningful indicator of performance

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as points are scored on a sunday

thorny kelp
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Why do you even mention this then lol

karmic egret
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wdym

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thats a race h2h

thorny kelp
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Both count 🤷

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Stroll may have 2 more points than Fernando but Fernando still 15-0 him in qualifying

karmic egret
thorny kelp
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Depends on circumstances

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There's plenty examples

karmic egret
thorny kelp
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😂

karmic egret
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if you start 3 places behind your teammate but finish 3 places ahead you’ve had a better weekend

thorny kelp
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Okay i'll give you an example

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Gasly scored more points than Ocon in 2023, but only because in the whole season Ocon got plenty DNF than costed him 30 or 40 points

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Do you understand ? cheekytoto

karmic egret
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no because neither bortoleto nor hulkenberg have experienced a significant number of mechanical dnfs

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and dnfs aren’t even included in race h2h

thorny kelp
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I wasn't talking about Bortoleto ? 😭

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You don't even know what to say anymore lmao

karmic egret
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you just described something deliberately excluded from a data set as being a detriment to said data set

thorny kelp
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What I'm saying (since you obviously need to be told things 30 times before you understand) is that circumstances play a role. It's completely illogical to bring Bortoleto/Hulkenberg into this, and there's nothing shocking about a rookie having slightly fewer points than Hulk 🤷

karmic egret
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wdym slightly fewer

thorny kelp
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20 isn't a lot

karmic egret
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Hulkenberg has nearly triple his points total 😭

thorny kelp
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If Hulk had 3 points and Bortoleto 1 it would still be the triple

karmic egret
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yeah but it isn’t

thorny kelp
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Still, you talk as if it were the Perez/Max gap of 2024 😂

karmic egret
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its pretty close percentage wise

thorny kelp
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It's not shocking for a rookie 🤷

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Bortoleto outscored him in 3 of 5 last races

karmic egret
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same things true for stroll and alonso

thorny kelp
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Here we go again 😂

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I won't explain again

karmic egret
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ah so now context matters

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but it doesn’t with hulkenberg and bortoleto

thorny kelp
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What context ? 😭

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Hulk has more points because he's having a better season, that doesn't mean Bortoleto is bad

karmic egret
thorny kelp
austere jewel
karmic egret
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8-4 if you include australia

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vs 10-6 for hulkenberg vs bortoleto (including silverstone)

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pretty comparable h2h and alonso is obviously better than hulkenberg

austere jewel
karmic egret
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eh i think it matters when the dnf is self inflicted

upbeat plume
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Legendary battle in this thread fr

thorny kelp
frosty forge
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holy yap