f1-technical

[raven dock]

The amount of heat from the engine and brakes? Wasted energy without an Mgu-H

[eager sigil]

like lmp1 cars had 8mj of energy and needed mgu-h and yet f1 has the gall to push 9mj of energy and not have mgu-h

[raven dock]

Wasn't it 7mj before, for f1?

[eager sigil]

it was FOUR MJ max deployment

before 2026

[raven dock]

Jesus

That'd fit better without an MGU-H

[eager sigil]

and now they expect cars to get 8.5mj solely from braking

[raven dock]

But no, let's let the (ma)FIA strip it OFF AND INCREASE THE ENERGY

[eager sigil]

good idea fia!

[raven dock]

Engine braking is going to be vital

But wait, what do they do knowing there's going to be a ton of heat from that too?????

[eager sigil]

hm... if only there was a thing that could capture the heat from the exhaust and turn it into energy...

[raven dock]

Indeed...

[eager sigil]

i wonder if we have something like that...

[raven dock]

You'd think they would at least add a motor-spool for the turbo, to really lean into the hybrid

[eager sigil]

yeah, and to make race starts more exciting...

[raven dock]

But no

I tried the electric spool trick, and it spools up in accordance with the throttle opening

[eager sigil]

if only there was something to keep the turbo at optimal rpm at all times and cash in the extra rpm to make more energy

[raven dock]

It is a near instant response, and it makes the cars harder to drive

[raven dock]

Hmm, maybe we should invent something like that?

At this point I might as well bin off on trying to get into aerodynamics, and just somehow become the person that designs the regulations

These cars are so poorly made

[eager sigil]

knowing how advanced f1 is, they probably would have already made something like that...

[raven dock]

Energy is wasted on hazard lights, when it could be going through the engine

[eager sigil]

i wouldnt say wasted because

yk

visibility stops crashes and less crashes means less deaths

and also better racin

but certainly the fia could manage the new pus better

[raven dock]

Better racing, assuming they don't still consume power when the lights are off

If it was up to me, I'd go for a 90 degree V4 Engine, higher revs, 18:1 compression, MGU-H and K, 6MJ output, 10MJ harvesting, motor spool turbo, no fancy aero tricks and so on

Think 919 hybrid, but as an f1 engine

[eager sigil]

i think either 6mj or 10mj output and harvest and let the teams have any cyl config but limit them to a displacement

but i'm not really fond of uneven output/harvest

[raven dock]

Harvest is higher than output to then compensate for extra usage, like the turbo

[eager sigil]

the turbo uses energy??

mgu-h spins the turbo up and then exhausts keep it spooled right?

[raven dock]

It depends

[eager sigil]

and then mgu-h moderates turbo rpm

[tall wyvern]

You can’t possibly think you know more than the people who made the regulations

[raven dock]

I'm going off what people who have made the engines are saying

I'm just a student

[stray anvil]

side-mounted camera

Before black paint

[rustic elbow]

You two do realize that the Motor Generator Unit Heat was a bit of a misnomer and didn’t convert heat energy to electric energy but, just like the MGU-K, worked by converting kinetic energy to electric energy, right?

[stray anvil]

That's right

The MGU-H mainly handles exhaust energy

The MGU-H is a device that converts the kinetic energy of the exhaust flow into electrical energy (regeneration).

[tall wyvern]

No it isn’t

[tall wyvern]

But it did convert heat energy to electricity, what do you mean by this?

[rustic elbow]

I'm all ears, maybe my understanding of the MGU-H has been wrong.
Could you please, if you don't mind, explain (or link to an article/video/any other source about) how it converted thermal energy to electrical energy?

[tall wyvern]

It’s how a regular turbo works too - the gases expand in the turbine and exchange thermal energy for kinetic energy on the blades, and the MGU-H is just an over expanded turbo. Unless you mean the intermediate step of the kinetic energy in the blades, but then you could argue that coal power stations are actually converting kinetic energy to electrical energy instead of chemical energy to electrical which is obviously a misrepresentation. There’s an impulse part of the conversion too which is kinetic energy straight into the blades, but that’s half or less.

[rustic elbow]

Again, I don't see how an electric motor/generator can convert thermal energy to electrical energy.
You said it yourself, the exhaust gasses expand, impart energy onto the turbocharger/MGU-H/turbine assembly and the energy from that rotation can then be recovered.
And yes, the generator in a power plant converts kinetic energy into electrical energy. The chemical energy has previously been converted to thermal energy, the water gets heated, either to a boiling or supercritical state and that high pressure medium then gives off it's (kinetic) energy to the turbine(s), losing thermal energy in the process as well.

[tall wyvern]

Yes.. that’s.. what I said?

[tall wyvern]

Because the ‘thermal’ energy is the internal energy in the gas. When the gas is expanded it creates a pressure difference which exerts the force on the blades which spins the turbine by exchanging some of the internal energy in the gas for kinetic energy in the turbine. If it were purely an exchange of kinetic energy from the gas the recoverable energy would be far, far, far smaller because it would only be the difference in velocity at the exit vs inlet.

[rustic elbow]

Nothing is purely a single energy transfer, obviously. The fact remains though that a generator can’t extract energy from heat directly.

[granite tundra]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radioisotope_thermoelectric_generator

[rustic elbow]

And a thermocouple is a motor/generator now?

[granite tundra]

..you can use them as a generator, yes

[rustic elbow]

So, which part of a thermocouple is spinning and is attached to the crankshaft of an F1 car?

[granite tundra]

i dont care about that argument (even though beam wing is right)

i'm saying that "a generator can’t extract energy from heat directly." is wrong

[rustic elbow]

I‘m sorry, this is getting silly. We‘re talking about the F1 tech, not any kind of generator.
You got a point that I could have been more clear that I‘m not talking about any kind of generator, I simply thought this was obvious, considering the setting of the discussion.

[eager sigil]

yes. i do know that. by "heat" (which is in itself a misnomer on my part) i mean the exhaust flow

[eager sigil]

a generator CAN extract energy from heat directly but because of thermodynamics it's really inefficient

[eager sigil]

ARE YOU STICKING AN RTG IN A FORMULA ONE CAR

sorry about the pings

[rustic elbow]

Switching away from the heat/kinetic energy discussion:
Does a higher compression ratio lead to better/stronger engine braking and would stronger engine braking help with Recharge (to use the official 2026 terminology)?

[desert shell]

higher compression ratio = higher pumping losses on closed throttle

so stronger engine braking in a mechanical way

i don't think it could theoretically help with recharging the battery

recharging depends mainly on how the power limit and control maps is built in the MGU-K's electrical

[rustic elbow]

Thanks for confirming what I thought, I just wanted to make sure I‘m not going insane now that one F1/motorsports journalist keeps blabbering on about how much of an advantage that would be for Mercedes, especially since it “helps so much with energy recovery through engine braking.“

[rustic elbow]

From F1‘s new opening titles: This wouldn’t be legal, right?

[proud jewel]

I don’t care that argument

[tall wyvern]

What an oversight!

[timber forum]

Well technically I think it could be because it only has to be in 2 modes and activate in less than .4 secs

[rustic elbow]

Nope, I wish it was legal but that arrangement wouldn‘t maintain the geometric relationship between all parts of the RW flap

[timber forum]

Ah alright

[worn blaze]

im no expert
but I looked at the thermoelectric effect page from this article
it states this

doesnt that mean that thermoelectric phenomenon like seeback-peliter effects are also not direct

the heat difference creats a kinetic difference which then creats an electric difference ie voltage

or did I misunderstand something?

dont you kind of HAVE TO move particles in order to generate electricity

in almost any form

even if the charge carriers move very small distances

[stray anvil]

Radioisotope Thermoelectric Generator: A type of nuclear battery that generates electricity using the decay heat of radioactive materials and is used to power space probes and other vehicles.

---

RTG → A device that directly converts decay heat from radioactive materials into electricity
⚫︎Heat → Electricity

[stray anvil]

Seebeck effect → Direct conversion of thermal energy into electrical energy (voltage/current)
⚫︎Heat → Electricity

Peltier effect → The phenomenon of creating a temperature difference (absorption cooling/radiation heating) by passing an electric current
⚫︎Electricity → Heat (cold)

[worn blaze]

im not talking about f1

[worn blaze]

I dont understand your point?

[stray anvil]

Isn't this chat room the place to discuss F1 technicals?

[stray anvil]

I thought you talked about the seeback effect in relation to F1.

[worn blaze]

oh nah mb I was replying to the other guy who was talking about direct conversion

[stray anvil]

I see. I replied to you by mistake.😭😭(´°̥̥̥̥̥ω°̥̥̥̥̥｀)

[worn blaze]

its alr lmao

[plucky kettle]

how do teams change the angle of attack of the front and rear wing elements?

[forest axle]

anyone watching on multi veiwer, i am trying to do the team radio replays but it says luive timing not avaiable. anyone else have this isssurw?

[modern kelp]

What's the difference between this battery thing and ERS? or are they the same

[fast mantle]

i was but i didnt have any issues except for my bad wifi, i was able to use multiview for alonso and could hear his radio

[timber forum]

Same as Drs more or less

[timber forum]

Well batteries are bigger I think but the deployment now is using the battery so much now it's just a battery management

[rustic elbow]

On the front wing, teams like Ferrari, Haas and Williams use more or less the same kind of flap adjustment seen in previous year, while teams like Mercedes, Red Bull and McLaren switched to a more elegant solution in the nose.
The rear wing' AoA usually doesn't get adjusted at the track anymore but instead they have different wing for different load conditions. The most they might do is to play around with the gurney flap, either trimming that down, running a narrower one or removing it entirely.

[rustic elbow]

The battery is where the electrical energy is stored (hence why it's referred to as ES/Energy Store in the regs) and ERS (Energy Recovery System) is the whole thing together, so MGU-K, ES & CE (Control Electronics).

[wheat shore]

damn gemini has taught me something today

[rustic elbow]

And this is why LLMs suck, there is so much wrong in there, it's incredible

LMH cars are only allowed to recover energy at the front axle, LMDh only at the rear. Neither of them can harvest at both axles at the same time, the last car to do that was the Toyota TS050 (LMP1).

Regarding the LiCo in quali it's not wrong, however they did have to use it in the more relevant LMP1 era.

[mint arch]

never use ai to learn something its total shit

[wheat shore]

good to know

[mint arch]

using ai in general is bad because it gets so much wrong

and has a very high impact on environment and etc

[wheat shore]

apparently another point is due to the restrictions of how much energy they are allowed to recover per lap right? I think it's around 4 MJ

I'm just trying to figure out the difference

[rustic elbow]

The maximum amount of energy they're allowed to recharge per lap changes from track to track and session to session. It also depends on the mode they're in, if Overtake is used, they're allowed an additional 0.5MJ per lap.
The base Recharge limits are 8.5MJ per lap in normal operation and 9MJ per lap with Overtake enabled.

The 4MJ you remember is the maximal allowed difference between the maximum and minimum state of charge any time the car is on track, say the car has 4.7MJ in the battery upon leaving the pit lane, the battery wouldn't be allowed to drop below 0.7MJ charge.

[hollow kettle]

can someone explain the mercedes 16:1 compression ratio loophole to me

[rustic elbow]

If I knew what exactly they are doing, I'd gladly try to explain it

The rumours say that they have a very small chamber that is connected to the cylinder via a tiny opening, so they achieve the 16:1 ratio when the engine is cold. Once the engine heats up and expands, that small aperture is said to close, effectively blocking that small chamber off and therefore the engine only uses the "real" compression ratio.
it should be noted that they're not massively tricking physics here, the advantage is smaller than the originally circulated 18:1.
Realistically they're said to achieve roughly 16.2:1 or 16.3:1 while others suffer a loss of compression ratio and are around 15.1-15.3:1 at operating temperature (no guarantees on the accuracy of the numbers but they're roughly in the ballpark).

[fading basin]

which races were cancelled? my dad told me bahrain and saudi arabia were cancelled for now, is that true?

are there any others?

also, if they’re cancelled, are they getting replaced with new circuits or will there just be a gap between race weekends?

[hardy talon]

its very likely but still not confirmed

there shouldnt be any issues with other races

maybe qatar and abu dhabi but thats much later

[rustic elbow]

The last we heard is that there would be a gap but there were no official comments on that matter yet.
Wrong channel though, there's not much technical about the potential cancellation of events

[mossy sonnet]

I don't understand the Aston Martin car design? Surely even Newey can't come up with something so great

[plucky kettle]

how much faster on the straights is the ferrari 180 wing compared to the normal wing?

[timber forum]

it was apparently 8-10 kph

[plucky kettle]

and how quicker is the merc on the straights compared to ferrari?

i do feel like if ferrari optimize their battery and software related things

along with the macarena wing

we can fight mercedes

[real patrol]

Were they aware of how the electrical system will bear against the heavy load of 50/50 split?

If they heavily degrades in just a single race why they allow on 2 of these things PER SEASON?

They were setting up all of these fantasy rules without being aware of how these new EXPERIMENTAL technologies last

And these things will cost you 10 place grid penalty for each replaced

I am looking forward to drivers taking 10 place grid penalty just to remain competitive

[plucky kettle]

are F1 teams allowed to use the aero rakes during free practice sessions or only in pre season testing?

[woven dome]

I think I previously saw rakes during a practice session.

According to some Williams post, they're limited in size of the rake during the race weekends.

https://www.williamsf1.com/articles/928b1850-b706-48a6-bdf6-4c6d444f4fe7/what-are-formula-1-aero-rakes

Post from 2023, so a bit dated

[barren vessel]

i’m not too technically versed in f1 but what could ferrari possibly do to “upgrade” that rotisserie wing from testing?

[timber forum]

Make it robust so it doesn't break

[mint arch]

is that why they didnt run it in australia?

or was there not enough of a performance benefit for it to be worth it?

[barren vessel]

in melbourne most of the straights are relatively short and the wing takes quite a while to rotate

so the performance benefit for them was pretty much 0 from what i've read

[plucky kettle]

unlesss theyve managed to make it very reliable i wouldnt use the macarena wing just yet

shanghai has 4 straight mode zones meaning the wing will open/close 8 times per lap

with 75 laps (gp+sprint) thats 600 times

and theres still fp1, sprint qualifying and race qualifying

i really hope ferrari has made the macarena rear wing very reliable and well functioning🙏🙏🙏🙏🧿🧿🧿🧿

[hidden rain]

The fact that they didn't use it at Australia, a rather power heavy track with a ton of AA zones shows that it probably doesn't have significant gains. I think the reduced downforce and added lift of the wing causes the rear to rise and the rake to increase causing added drag vs normal DRS.

You are also added a ton of weight to the car to overcome the forces involved in rotating the wing and making the rear wing draggier with the extra mechanisms required to rotate the car. You are also adding more weight very high up on the CoM.

There is also the parachute effect but thats offset by the parachute effect in the braking zones presumably.

I any case I think Mercedes advantage is a mirage. Most teams had massive software difficulties in qualifying leading to the gap we saw. Those will get ironed out very quickly and cheaply with the test data they have. I think the PU advantage that Mercedes has is really only in the MGU-K which will be less of an advantage in most races.

Theres also the compression ratio which I am tired of talking about atp because there is so much speculation. If true, Mercedes' engine will probably be worse than Ferarri's on raw horsepower after Monaco. Also on mediums at the start of the race, Mercedes was unable to build a gap which in theory should be easier without DRS.

On the other hand I will say tho that I think Mercedes' cornering speed disadvantage has been overstated. Mercedes and Ferarri were running different setups and different energy recovery modes. Looking at the data at the end of the hard stint, Mercedes was definitely controlling the pace of their cars. If this is going to be a two team fight, Ferarri is still well Ferarri and their in season development has been consistently mediocre. They threw a lot away on their development last year for this car and they are still clearly huanted by strategy.

[marble stirrup]

I felt that the strategy in isolation was better for Ferrari. Worth about 6 seconds for them over Merc. It was just everything else. It is entirely possible (and quite likely) that if Ferrari pitted at the same time they would not manage the tyres until the end. Ferrari usually gets hate for their strategy, but I think this time it wasn't a bad call.

[celest plaza]

they weren’t able to pull a gap because of overtake

the nature of overtake allows you to hang on even if you don’t have the fastest car

it’s similar to drs in austria, but it should work everywhere now

I think the engine drama is just that, drama.

Clearly the strength of merc is in their motor, not the ICE itself.

[storm wind]

Best ICE appears to be Ferrari, RBPT has decent electric power it seems

Audi is decent performance wise despite reliability issues

And Honda does not need to be mentioned

[hidden rain]

I think all the ICEs are the same pretty much

Even MGU-K most are the same

[plucky kettle]

could that little wing in leclerc's halo function like those spoiler-ish things seen on a few helmets?

how much would this affect overall in the car like speed, fuel, tyre deg, drag

maybe even engine temps since it does seem it could direct airflow to the airbox

[worn blaze]

Could it be to create less drag from the driver?

Since now I think the driver would be in a lower pressured zone

[distant sleet]

.

[radiant elm]

I am thinking of starting a project to bruteforce a race circuit for a proper racing line on irl tracks is there any programs anyone can think of that does this already

[half bough]

Yeah people already do this. It’s usually called optimal racing line or minimum lap time optimization. Stuff like TORCS or Speed Dreams has AI research around it, and a lot of GitHub projects try it with genetic algorithms or particle swarm. Pure brute force usually isn’t feasible because the search space gets huge, so most methods optimize a spline line using vehicle physics.

[modern kelp]

What's the difference between "boost" and "overtake"? (In the battery thing)

[crimson saffron]

Boost is to gain horse power and overtake is to pass some one like Drs whitin 1 second

[raven dock]

Call me an idiot, but what do I do if I'm having an inequal brake pressure in a car

The rear left brake is about 40 degrees hotter than the rear right

[thin shoal]

You already have a driver assigned for the Chinese Grand Prix, it is Liam Lawson.

[gentle rain]

Is there any engineer in here?

[thin shoal]

You already have a driver assigned for the Chinese Grand Prix, it is Fernando Alonso.

[rustic elbow]

Boost allows the driver to deploy the maximum allowed power (according to the graph below (Base - Standard)) from the MGU-K at a given speed, overriding the ramp-down for battery management, if that already started.
Overtake simply changes when the maximum deployable MGU-K power ramps down when the following car is within a predetermined time behind the leading car (so far it was 1s for both races we had).

[plucky kettle]

apart from building a new engine/waiting for the new fia compression ratio check, could ferrari do any upgrades to their power unit to have more power before miami? if so, what could they do?

for me it does still feel like ferrari has battery and software issues along with the less powerful engine

[ocean cedar]

I feel like the phrasing of overtake confuses me. It could totally be a me issue, but I feel like a different word/phrase may work better. Overtake sounds too similar to what DRS was doing to me. I know it's filling that void so it is similar, but to me it sounds like it is adding extra speed rather than extra threshold power over the lap.

Maybe I'm not making sense and just need to get used to the new phrase. But "boost" and "overtake" are too similar to me and I think that's what's leading to most of the confusion.

[rustic elbow]

In very short and simple: Boost lets you use full power at the push of a button whenever you want, Overtake lets you use that power up to a higher speed when you follow another car.

[modern kelp]

Why didn't both McLarens start in Shanghai? I mean, as far as i've heard from the race commentators yesterday they had some issues with the power unit (or something about the electrical thing). But what happened to that rocketship from last year in general? Why are they P5-P6?

[hardy talon]

being constructors champions they do have the least time on the wind tunnel but i highly doubt thats the only thing

[stray anvil]

Rob Marshall is not an aerodynamic designer, but he is a specialist in mechanical design (such as chassis structure and suspension) to maximize aerodynamic performance.

Therefore, I suspect he might be good with ground effect cars but not so good with hybrids.

This year, it's more important to maximize the performance of the power unit and energy recovery than to maximize aerodynamic performance.

[stray anvil]

• Boost Mode

This function itself existed before 2025.
Drivers could manually adjust the deployment (release) of the Energy Recovery System (ERS).

In 2026, this was officially defined and named the "Boost Button."

Purpose: Defense and offense

◉ Defensive Pattern: When being chased by a car behind, use boost to pull away.

◉ Offensive Pattern: When wanting to catch up to a car in front, use boost to accelerate at the corner exit and pull alongside on the straight.

⋅.˳˳.⋅ॱ˙˙ॱ⋅.˳˳.⋅ॱ˙˙ॱᐧ.˳˳.⋅⋅.˳˳.⋅ॱ⋅.˳˳.⋅ॱ˙˙ॱ⋅.˳˳.⋅ॱ˙˙ॱᐧ.˳˳.⋅⋅.˳˳.⋅ॱ

・Overtake Mode
A new feature for 2026

Purpose: Overtaking on straightaways

[stray anvil]

"Overtake Mode" and "Boost Mode" are additional power modes that use the same battery energy (MGU-K).
Since both use boost, people don't notice the difference, right?
🔆The difference is whether or not an additional 0.5mJ of regeneration is possible.

◉ Overtake Mode: Allows for an additional 0.5 MJ of regeneration.
◉ Boost Mode: No additional regeneration is available.

✨

Normally, the amount of energy that can be regenerated per lap is limited to a maximum of 8.5 MJ.
(This regeneration limit varies from circuit to circuit and may be changed in qualifying and sprint qualifying sessions if the FIA ​​deems it necessary.)

◉ Overtake Mode: An additional 0.5 MJ is added, bringing the total maximum usable per lap to 9 MJ.
◉Boost mode: Charge is reduced from the normal 8.5MJ by the amount of boost used.

[rustic elbow]

No, the 0.5 MJ additional Recharge in Overtake is not the only difference.

[stray anvil]

The additional 0.5 MJ charge in overtake mode is indeed true.

[rustic elbow]

I never said anything to the contrary, your text, which honestly reads as if it was written by an LLM, just omits important aspects of what Overtake allows the driver to do and presents it as if the 0.5 MJ were the only difference between the two modes.

[stray anvil]

I'm not a native English speaker so my writing may sound unnatural.
I don’t copy and paste LLM.
I sometimes use a translation app to translate my own writing into English.

Therefore, I'm not good at expressing myself or communicating effectively.

˚✩∗*ﾟ⋆｡˚✩ Sorry if I made you all feel uncomfortable.

[rustic elbow]

No, not at all uncomfortable, just a bit confused maybe.
I got a bit hung up on the 0.5 MJ (which I in turn forgot to mention in my replies to the original question tbf).

[ocean cedar]

Anyone know of somewhere I can find the characteristics of each circuit? I'm looking for information like top speed, number of corners, track length, stuff like that.

[rustic elbow]

racingcircuits.info for the track length and so on
There won’t be a good resource for top speeds, as that greatly depends on the cars and the specific circumstances (i.e. at many tracks we‘ll see higher top speeds this year, so any speeds you might find could be far away from what the 2026 cars can achieve).

[ocean cedar]

Thanks! Was just looking for rough estimates anyways. Just want to see if the information will help me tell who may have advantages at specific circuits throughout the year.

[ocean cedar]

Is active aero controlled by the drivers or the car?

[raven dock]

The car i think

I could be entirely wrong, I'm too lazy to research

But in theory it makes sense for it to be the car

[ocean cedar]

Yeah, thatd be way too much to keep track of over a lap. I know they do a ton, but not changing the mode 6 times over a lap

[raven dock]

Plus specific to each zone

Where on the wheel would there be space for that

[ocean cedar]

oh yeah, no way you could do that

[rustic elbow]

The active aero is driver activated, so yes, for every Straight (Line) Mode zone, the driver presses the SLM button.
Apparently they are allowed to arm the system prior to the activation line, so they don't necessarily have to press it the exact moment they cross it, like they had to with DRS. Unfortunately I do not know how far in advance the system can be armed.

[ocean cedar]

Wow. Fascinating. We need the buttons on the wheel guy to ask the question again. "Do you prefer more buttons or less?"

[rustic elbow]

It's not specific to each zone. The active aero has exactly two positions between it can be switched, which also has to happen within 400ms, so relatively quickly, to avoid exploiting the change between the modes (which Mercedes arguably already started doing in China, as their front wing SLM deactivated slower than the regs allow at the end of the longer straights (they apparently said they had some sort of failure, lets see how quickly it deactivates in future races).

[rustic elbow]

In Mercedes' case: the yellow button in the top left corner, where the DRS button always was

[sick plover]

Ferrari is faster in slow stuff, while mercedes in faster sections no?

Read a few articles and my teany tiny brain is thinking of ferrari destruction in monaco and a mercedes engine masterclass in monza

pls correct me if im wrong, idk if i want to live anymore

[timber forum]

Mercedes is faster in straight than Ferrari

But Ferrari is faster in all types of corners

[calm mirage]

particularly in the lower speed corners

[raven dock]

So, is it actually tuned for each corner then, because I'm hearing that it both is and isn't

[rustic elbow]

No, it‘s not.

Corner Mode has one position and Straight mode has one position.
Those can individually be tuned to the desired load but that‘s it.

You can slightly alter the activation/deactivation speed of the active aero, as you do have the 400 ms window but you can’t tune the two end positions per corner.

[cloud mural]

Any good videos going in depth with the new regulations?

[topaz lion]

really? all corners?

[topaz lion]

i saw an onboard where george pressed the sm button before the back straight in china out of the corner but not entirely sure

[topaz lion]

man the boost button i think is just hidden out of view

below mark

that's where the overtake button used to be

anyway, i learnt how f1 teams compute pressure drag by integration

pretty interesting

and if drag coefficient of an f1 car is 0.9, how much will it be in straightline mode? 0.4-0.6?

[timber forum]

I would say that yeah

I need to see some data again but from what I saw yeah

[topaz lion]

i thought it would be low speed only. and mercs were faster than hadjar everywhere in melbourne

low speed, mid speed, high speed, straights

[tall wyvern]

Not low speed

Not sure how much I trust the hadjar numbers though because it’s so much higher, and it’s the same in China.

[celest plaza]

you can ‘preload it’

[stray anvil]

it’s just my guess…..
in the case of this year’s regulation in those low corners, it’s difficult we know whether the car is slow or they drive slow down intentionaly for charging.

✨
⚫︎The Lift & Coast or ⚫︎The charge mode setting that converts the ICE's engine energy into electrical energy using the Mgu-k and stores it in the ES.
They might lower the gear for charging intentionaly depending on the situation.

[worn blaze]

Do they calculate the value through testing with a model which doesn't have the drs on
Or whatever it's called now

High df configuration

[wintry pollen]

Why was the MGUH deemed more expensive and complex than MGUK?

[late gate]

Will active aero be allowed in wet conditions because last year DRS was disabled due to rear instability but this year both the front and the rear wing are low drag/low downforce

[rustic elbow]

Yes but only the front wing SLM will be allowed to be activated, most zones will start a few meters later and SLM zones through curves will be removed entirely, see the circuit maps below for reference:

[barren vessel]

can anyone explain what this new controversy is surrounding merc’s front wing? i’ve seen it making the rounds online

[spring void]

they can now change angle for straights vs corners but they’re supposed to switch really quickly and in a more controlled way
people noticed on mercs car that the front wing doesn’t always move at a consistent speed. like sometimes it looks normal, but other times it kinda transitions slower so the theory is they might be using a loophole where part of the wing moves first (so that it passes the FIA tests), and then the rest finishes moving slightly later on track. if that’s true, it could give them better speed on straights and smoother balance into corners
nothing’s been confirmed illegal yet though. Ferrari basically just asked the FIA to look into it so rn it’s more like “suspicious and clever if true” than proven cheating lol

[zinc island]

Yeah I believe it closes up to 0.8s seconds instead of 0.4s or smth is what they are saying (updated ty)

[rustic elbow]

(up to) 0.8s instead of 0.4s

[zinc island]

Yeahh thanks I knew it was smth 0.8 lol

[desert shell]

ended up being McLaren asking

[spring void]

ohh ok I was misinformed than 😓

[desert shell]

no worries! i was informed ferrari first but legal documents showed mclaren

[sudden robin]

is merc illegal

[zinc island]

Cleared by FIA nope

[rustic elbow]

Kind of. If the wing malfunction (it's the official explanation, so we'll go with that for now) had been spotted earlier, the car would have likely failed scrutineering but now it's too late for that. Essentially, they got lucky.

For this weekend it is/has to be fixed, so everything should be fine.

[gleaming mortar]

Could the way the floor of the McLaren is designed help it with its good pace? Im tryna compare the RB and the McLaren

Also, whats scrutineering…

[outer orchid]

Scrutinizing is when they check the cars and make sure they're within regulations

[gleaming mortar]

Thank you

[storm wind]

No, but it will likely lose pace compared to others in august with a new engine compression rule

They will also probably have a new rule to force merc to change their front wing

[torn field]

the TD will be put in place in june

apparently their front wing was a technical error

[storm wind]

Ah ok

[torn field]

dont know how much of that I wanna believe

[storm wind]

I believe they lost lap time because of the wing though

[torn field]

maybe a little bit, but theoretically would be more intended to regulate the balance of the car under braking smoother when the active aero closes

[gleaming mortar]

Agreed

[hidden rain]

i don't buy that merc has an engine compression trick

[hasty briar]

Hey everyone, hope you're all doing well, I'm a student studying electrical engineering and I have an assignment where I need to interview a practicing engineer outside my field. I was wondering if anyone would be open to a quick interview, it shouldn't take more than 10 minutes and I can work around your schedule completely🙏 please let me know if you're down for letting me interview If anyone's down to help me out, please just drop me a message

[stuck birch]

RB22 upgrades

[worn blaze]

DM?

[iron oyster]

Erm

Aerodynamics n stuff

[hidden rain]

this is just on verstappens car I think

hadjar has the old spec

[hollow kettle]

Didnt know that was legal to have different cars

[uneven lily]

Does anyone feel that the new regulations have made things less safe? Bearmans closing speed on Colapinto was ridiculous due to the harvesting.

[timber forum]

It happens a lot of times

Like when a driver crashes the car he loses the upgrades

Because they only had 1 spec for him

And he gets the old version

[tall wyvern]

Here’s Japan. Take everything with a grain of salt because public data is pretty poor. It’s more a fun exercise.

[zinc island]

They can only transfer so many upgrades, and want to test if the upgrades actually work before giving it to both drivers

[ocean cedar]

Ive been looking for this kind of data. Thanks for sharing!

[slim warren]

Lap 19 (IMG 1) vs Lap 20 (IMG 2).
Ollie Bearman - Grey, Franco Colapinto - Blue.
Looking at speed data.

From this raw speed data it seems that Ollie Bearman's computer malfunctioned and assumed that they were at the next corner and deployed the battery. Drivers are usually not deploying at this point in the lap. An additional piece to the puzzle in my opinion. Doesn't detract from the fact that Franco seemed to move unneccessarily to the left during the corner which left Ollie no space to pass on the outside.

I can't find battery deploymement telemetry anywhere, I don't think that's been made public yet

[worn blaze]

It sort of looked like he was moving aside to let Ollie through

[slim warren]

You should rewatch it

[worn blaze]

It still in a way looks like Franco shifted back to bearmens side then realised he was there and tried to go back

[abstract stone]

Electrodrome :D

[fossil cove]

What's the best setup for Mario Kart worlds open world race?

[quick jetty]

.

[queen gate]

Pls tell this is not true

Pls no mate no

[orchid cipher]

It’s not true it was a gag for April 1st

[queen gate]

Ty god

[cerulean beacon]

btw what do yall think of my suggestion to the fia? (this post is already up btw)

[covert juniper]

Why are duracell aa batteries better then redbulls battery?

Swear redbull is made for giving energy.

[tranquil osprey]

https://giphy.com/gifs/son-jjk-oEPyO83kEnoyfwmewB

[rapid nimbus]

HIGURUUMAAAA

[primal viper]

Pls be fake pls 🙏

Random photo from my gallery

[ashen thunder]

has there even been a fast car that handles so bad the driver has to fight it

[zinc island]

Ferrari uh

I think 2014? Idk..When Alonso drove for Ferrari really

[mint arch]

<@&781898349006684170>

[topaz lion]

didn't ollie use boost?

[topaz lion]

i don't have CAD i need an approximate value for sm

[tall wyvern]

The car gets mapped in straight line mode and cornering mode

It’s the same model just with the wings open

[covert knoll]

Im backk

[hybrid radish]

Has anyone heard about any news about what technical changes from the teams we might see for Miami??

[thin ore]

aston

[barren vessel]

only team that i know of that is bringing major upgrades is ferrari

mostly to reduce drag and close the straight line speed gap to merc

[glass oasis]

https://x.com/ScarbsTech/status/2045787818711032207?s=20

Craig Scarborough (@ScarbsTech)

The @FIAWEC kicks off today with the #Imola6h.
@Michelin_Sport bring their new tyres for the #LMH category. Made with 50% recyclables. The 'tread' pattern is superficial
#WECtech

X · Apr 19, 2026, 8:53 AM

not f1 but can someone explain how this works?

[timber forum]

How what works

[urban quarry]

Im pretty sure its just dark magic

The pattern (and the fact it almost immediately wears off) somehow allows the tyres to warm up quicker

Also I’m pretty sure it’s partially just to show off the reusable materials they used

[rustic elbow]

The pattern doesn’t allow the tyres to warm up quicker, it’s all down to the compound and the tyre‘s construction.
It‘s basically only there for marketing purposes (“it looks cool“).

[urban quarry]

Ah close enough

Was right about the second part

[primal patrol]

what stopped the FIA from adding a front axle generator to these cars? was it just weight related problems?

since that could fix most of the battery related issues with these cars

it doesn't even have to be a motor like the MGUK

[rustic elbow]

Ferrari, Mercedes, Honda & RBPT

[left geode]

Audi has great knowledge about it with their LMP1 and Formula E experiences

[timber forum]

It's different to f1

[urban quarry]

everyone who's name doesnt start with an "A", and ends with an "udi"

[calm mirage]

whether its a generator or motor there will still be some resistence on each axle and the resistence at each wheel can be variably adjusted the same way how introducing a motor allows the motor effect to actually happen at each wheel and teams can adjust torque at each wheel that way too and yeah the audi expertise factor also plays a role becuase of their pevious LMP1 programme

[amber kraken]

The new upgrades for the RB22

https://x.com/carlosegea_1/status/2047013628235112608

Carlos Egea 🇪🇸 (@carlosegea_1)

Red Bull new aero package upgrade:
- New front wing: Visible endplate canard that sheds a clockwise vortex to help manage the mid-tyre wake.
- Reworked sidepod geometry.
- New halo wing sheds vorticity to mitigate cockpit losses.
- New rear wing opening system.

X · Apr 22, 2026, 6:04 PM

[tall wyvern]

The bodywork is definitely interesting

[zinc island]

Definitely

Introducing

Smth a bit different?

[timber forum]

Jesus Christ that's aggressive

[zinc island]

Is it?

[deft zodiac]

Max is so cooked this year in f1 but absolutely cooking in nls

[timber forum]

Uh neither actually

[barren vessel]

haha i love that we’re still getting bigfoot image quality

the sidepod looks very interesting

[radiant field]

https://tenor.com/view/taraterrorful-tara-terrorful-cute-cute-cat-cat-gif-15748890713877222049

[stuck birch]

Double macarena, double the trouble

[north lantern]

anyone able to give a quick answer? is Ti‑6Al‑4V a good alloy for race engines?

[prisma kindle]

https://tenor.com/view/ferrari-mclaren-f1-charles-leclerc-drift-gif-6252954183257355602

[valid glade]

Short answer is yes

But has a low melting point

On what do u plan to use it

[pastel sierra]

Hi everyone!

Subject: Team radio clips unavailable via the end-point of F1

I've been working on a personal project and wanted access to the team radio clips of all the drivers for the project.
I was able to find and access them via the https://livetiming.formula1.com/static/ endpoint which gives team radio clips from 2018 to 2025.

For audio clips prior to 2018, when tried to access it like this: https://livetiming.formula1.com/static/2017/2017-05-28_Monaco_Grand_Prix/2017-05-28_Race/TeamRadio.jsonStream, it returns access denied.
Similarly, for the Ausie GP of 2026: https://livetiming.formula1.com/static/2026/2026-03-08_Australian_Grand_Prix/2026-03-08_Race/TeamRadio.jsonStream

Another way of doing it is fetching the YT video posted by F1 and clipping it into parts and including it but that would take a lot of work and secondly those personally edited clips would need to be stored on a personal CDN server to be accessed by other users. This may/may not lead to F1 putting a copyright strike on this (depends on fate).

I primarily wanted to get the team radio clips for 2026 (prior-2018 is not particularly necessary). Thus, wanted to know if it is available/can be accessed elsewhere for 2026 data. Or has this endpoint been moved behind a paywall or will be posted after some races or the end of this season.

[subtle dome]

In some very specific parts, yeah. Intake valves, connecting rods, etc. It can't be used in parts that rub against another, as the surface tends to stick. It also doesn't sustain high temperatures very well.

A connecting rod is the best example of where to use titanium, it doesn't rub against anything, it's not exposed to much heat, and it really badly needs to be lightweight.

[north lantern]

alright cheers

im a massive idiot needed the alloy for an engine block and submitted an assignment whilst almost passing out from exhaustion 😭 😭

aka im failing that thing

spent a crisp 1hr looking for engine block alloys and couldnt find anything but that without clear reasoning on why to use that alloy

[subtle dome]

It's not good for an engine block. Too much heat and friction. In engine blocks aluminum is king and will probably be forever.

[barren vessel]

upgraded sf-26

i'm no aerodynamicist at all so if someone could explain this it would be a big help

[torn trout]

i tried to find an image in a similar angle to try and find any differences

better one even

https://fixupx.com/Qvist_Designs/status/2048079240755568981

Qvist Designs (@Qvist_Designs)

Here you can see the new parts much clearer in diffuser including
︀︀- Vertical wing on sidewall (similar to mercedes)
︀︀- Compleatly reshaped diffuser fence
︀︀- Tail wing / diffuser extension looks to be changed but unclear how
︀︀
︀︀You can even see the new winglet on the front endplate

Quoting CL16 inside 🇲🇨 (@CL16_inside)
︀
🔴 EXCL : Some INCREDIBLE PICS of the SF-26 EVO ON TRACK AT MONZA!!!!
︀︀
︀︀(You can see that they reworked the FTM. You can also see the appearance of a vertical element on the footplate. New bargeboard. New RW…)
︀︀
︀︀(📸 Leonardo Boschi)

**💬 1 🔁 10 ❤️ 157 👁️ 10.0K **

FixupX · Apr 25, 2026, 4:38 PM

[zinc island]

Sidepods lookk just a bit tiny much diff maybe just me

[subtle dome]

All of these things together just looks like they were having trouble getting enough inflow into the rear-end. Adding vertical elements, especially at the front, hints that either (1) the car was too sensitive to something like yaw angle (car's direction in relation to air) or ride height or (2) they found that overall the vortices were not stable enough to be maintained throughout the car and were dissipating before then more than what they otherwise could impede.

They're going to need more extra stuff around the car to make the diffusers functional enough as the floors are far simpler when compared to last year. The fact that they increased the center of the diffuser makes it very likely to me that they're having problems with yaw angle specifically, that is, downforce disturbance when the car is cornering and air is coming at an angle.

[torn trout]

oh wow

thanks for the explanation

[tall wyvern]

Holy speculation

[thick bramble]

@chevrolet my car goes kaboom

[zinc island]

Guys, Redbulls doesnt fully rotate. It just makes a Bigger gap with the i (i cannot spell this word) in the middle. Anyone wants more like details. I recommend these videos. Probably more sources, yeah.

https://youtu.be/yUG31Z0bq2U?si=gh797XNNHNYaABu5

https://youtube.com/shorts/gjz3VYVRVgo?si=WMyNFKE0y22qzJNj

In short redbull = Upsidesown
Ferrari= SpiNny wooo

For anyone confused about the two

[storm wind]

Is there a way for drivers to not deploy as much battery so they dont lose it all and super clip?

Im sure there is but if there is it probably isnt optimal or else teams would be doing it

[junior dune]

The side is different

[timber forum]

Nop

[heady elm]

F1 unchained 🔥 🔥
He's one of like 3 f1 youtubers i follow i rly like his vids

Actually, does anyone have any other reccs for f1 youtubers that are more on the tech side? I follow him and chainbear

[zinc island]

LawVS is the only real bearable guy I can sit through LOL

[heady elm]

(sry somehow missed this) oooh i have seen his vids a couple times, thanks for the rec!

[zinc island]

100% recommend! He speaks like you’re kind of there and is known for his attic and ladder 🤣. Very nice to watch

Info + Fun great combo

[cerulean rapids]

where can I look up the regulation changes inbetween Japan and Miami? I've heard they'll change something

[zinc island]

Any youtuber who covers F1

Or the official F1 releases

[short ether]

P1 with matt and tommy! They are freakin best

[radiant field]

https://vxtwitter.com/aperta/status/2049070061470494724?s=46

Enzo (@Aperta)

So apparently they've been working on this wing since the middle of last year wtf

It's not a copy of Ferraris at all and apparently more elaborate?

QRT: Aperta
Come home to see the RB22 has that macarena wing.

They've changed so much on the car with this upgrade. This shit better work

vxTwitter / fixvx · Apr 28, 2026, 10:15 AM

this is funny

[zinc island]

Yeah Its not like Ferraris wing theyres doesnt fully rotate like Ferrari just makes a bigger gap nth crazy
Idk whats funnylol

[radiant field]

it’s a year older design not a copy that’s funny

[zinc island]

Inseety

[rustic elbow]

it doesn't "just make a bigger gap"

it appears to rotate the other way compared to Ferraris (and all other DRS/SLM wings so far)

[zinc island]

I just simplified it for everyone ik

All n all its different to Ferrari’s that what what I was saying

[urban quarry]

actuator in the middle is interesting considering the ferrari spinning wing doesnt have it there

they better use ts, pierre gasly aint ready

[zinc island]

Word I was lookin for LOL yeah its interesting

[urban quarry]

whats also interesting is the fact that when the flat rotates, it ends up higher than the rear wing endplates, which im not 100% sure is legal tbh

very excited to see how it ends up tho

[zinc island]

Probably is since when Ferraris rotates it kind of does as well, I think the main thing is just if it closes and opens in time without being slow

[urban quarry]

Yeah true

Although it does look like a massive difference

The gap it makes is so much bigger

[timber forum]

Thing is it looks even less reliable then the Ferrari one

[zinc island]

Looks like the chair you get at the family cookout Vs the Family gathering

[timber forum]

True

[urban quarry]

Yeah tbf with the way it looks in the open position it seems like it’s a 50% chance of it flying off

[timber forum]

True

[rich flare]

so

[timber forum]

Yeah it's not gonna finish a whole race

Structure looks and probably is way too fragile

[zinc island]

Probably test it on track 😂

Nothing to lose

[urban quarry]

I mean you won’t know unless you try

Sidepods look really interesting as well, basically a new car atp

[urban quarry]

Although tbf I do think having the actuator in the middle provides some stability, opposed to the Ferrari which is holding on for dear life on the sides

[tall wyvern]

The red bull bodywork is very mental

From plan view

[tall wyvern]

So ridiculous

[urban quarry]

thats so hot

has pierre washed cooked for the first time since 2023?

[tall wyvern]

It’s a very.. creative reading of the rules that is gonna get protested very hard

[urban quarry]

looks like alpine 2023 (or 22 not sure)

[barren vessel]

that looks beautiful

reminds me of aston 2023

[urban quarry]

I seems everyone but Aston and Mercedes have basically brought a new car

[urban quarry]

Turns out Haas and Audi also barely brought any upgrades

[sick plover]

Does anyone know why some teams opt not to have both vertical and horizontal outwash and upwash some air from the FWEP? I'm making a 2026 car as a personal project and I really want to sort out air distribution before the front wheel.

[sick plover]

Very unrefined and basic endplate design but I wanna ask why this isnt seen more often--- 1 hori and verti element on the fwep

[plucky kettle]

so turns out red bull made the wing i thought of lol

[ocean cedar]

<@&781898349006684170> ^^^^

[rustic elbow]

And I‘m surprised they did it this way, for the aforementioned reasons.
I‘m still waiting for better photos of the wing, especially the hinge area.

[iron scarab]

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article/former-f1-driver-and-paralympian-alex-zanardi-passes-away-aged-59.5ZkbE4nhnJnG43M4J6aHXq. 😢 rip to bro 😢

[thick verge]

`“I feel like a V10…if I ask any of the manufacturers who are in F1 now if they produce any cars with a V10, an era that many of the cars had, but now, no,” he said.

“The most popular and easiest to work with is the V8. You get the sound, less complexity, lightweight.`

can someone explain how 2 more cylinders adds such complexity and weight?

quoted MBS from: https://www.motorsportweek.com/2026/05/03/fia-confirms-timeline-for-f1-return-to-v8-power/

[radiant elm]

The halo in crashes like Gasly’s today in Miami does not impact it much at all am I correct in saying that

While it will have effect it just isn’t a major saving point

[rustic elbow]

Correct, it doesn’t impact the survivability in such incidents much, if at all (it does usually impact the ground though )

[radiant elm]

Ok good cause I was saying that it was then I relised that I am house going off the fact that anti roll hoop was amazing before and halo may touch ground but the driver head wouldn’t

[timber forum]

Halo didn't do anything for gasly's crash

Only thing was the anti rollbar if I'm right

At the top of the air intake

[barren vessel]

yeah the roll hoop did its job perfectly in that crash

[zinc island]

The Tyres being more secured as well compared to old cars.
In older cars Tyres wouldve exploded and fleww off

[plucky kettle]

is aduo coming after monaco or before canada?

ive read on a few places that the fia changed the first aduo check from monaco to miami due to the cancellation of saudi and bahrain

but lately idk if its miami or monaco

[waxen flume]

What’s the difference between having an extended endplate vs non extended rear plate (just not a long end plate) ?

[rustic elbow]

Can you show examples of both?
I‘m not entirely sure what you’re referring to.

[waxen flume]

Like non extended is

And extend might look like

And also why do some end plates curve/taper in

[rustic elbow]

In the case of F1: regulations
No team would have created a rear wing like that if they didn’t have to.

As far as the other two go, I‘ll let someone with actual aero knowledge answer that.

[zinc island]

😭im dead

[waxen flume]

Is there a reason why an end plate would be that long ?

[zinc island]

No damn clue but theres different endplate designs for different outcomes which each ever design the designer thinks is better. Or the best. Dunno how to rlly explain it

[sick plover]

-An extended endplate helps keep airflow from forming vortexes when being propelled up

without an endplate, airflow can spill out the sides which creates vortexes

this then induces drag as well

[waxen flume]

Yeah but look at the 2 end plates I sent. Ones longer than the other

I’m asking what’s the difference between those 2

[sick plover]

1 is a normal, more conventional rwep design

2 probably is large due to the incoming wake of the nose(prolly) or perhaps thetr are more than two rear wings or a very steep one in between the end plate, requiring more guidance from the rwep to work properly and generate downforce

take for instance this very similar design,

the slope is very steep, which therefore needs more guidance from a vertical element so the air is pushed upwards more directly, rather than spilling out to the sides

[winter kettle]

hey is anyone on here in the f1 industry and would be open to answer some questions about college and working in f1? (i'm starting to apply for college soon)

[tall wyvern]

I’m a current F1 aerodynamicist. If you want aero do an aerospace degree and try to do a student placement (but not the end of the world if you don’t, I didn’t). Do extracurricular things. Learn CAD.

[gray linden]

Basically ground effect side pods

[winter kettle]

thank you !!

[quasi aspen]

@tall wyvern does taping the panel gaps really make a car more effecient? just about to try that with the current prices

[gray linden]

From a technical standpoint. Which f1 car would you consider one of the greatest

From any era

[zinc island]

Ez
F2004
Ih wait

Technical

Safety wise technology probably later cars like Modern 2010+.

HMmmMm

Brawn Gp car
Might suck later on
But
Rare beauty

[floral kite]

W11, FW14B, MP4-1, P34

[faint grotto]

Hey Folks, I wonder if I could get a bit of feedback I have been working lately on my side project https://formula-telemetry.com

[mighty lagoon]

Js bought this chat

Finally

[misty olive]

W11

[misty olive]

What's the difference between Aerodynamacist and Aerodynamic Engineer?

[tall wyvern]

Same thing

[mighty lagoon]

Can someone help me with the rb techic im stuck

There is a gap here

And I think their shouldn’t be

[heady elm]

Where the hell has the light grey part come from?

The white piece w the hollow x is near nothing in the instruction booklet but it's in between two pieces in your pic

[misty olive]

Can i ask questions too lol
1.Do you draw things to make the design of the aero part and then later materialize it to test if it's feasible?

2.Is this job stressful?

I mean I'm going to engineering so I'm just exploring things

[tall wyvern]

The aerodynamicists draw stuff for CFD, but always trying to keep stuff physically possible. Then model designers take the bits that the aeros release and make them into real parts, then the full scale designers and composite designers make those into real car parts eventually, for the bits that make it onto the car.

In other words, the designers set rules the aeros are supposed to follow so that parts won’t break etc.

[tall wyvern]

In my opinion it’s more exciting than stressful in the sense that you are tested all the time so it doesn’t feel like busywork you get stressed over so much as a challenge you are competing for

[misty olive]

So like u give the drawing to the modellers right?

So I have to be good in sketching for Aerodynamacist? 😭

[tall wyvern]

You draw everything yourself in CAD, or get a surfacer to do it for you, then what you draw goes to CFD. If the results are interesting then it goes to a model designer who uses your CAD and adds in stuff like wiring, sensors, bars for strength etc. then those parts go in the wind tunnel. Eventually all the best bits go onto the real car.

[misty olive]

What's cad and cfd

[misty olive]

Sounds interesting

I have a last doubt for ya
Now u can't shift from F1 Aero to Airplane Aero right?

Cuz u have to relearn everything

The parts are different from an aeroplane

[finite marten]

[woeful beacon]

anyone here a software dev and looking into the ERS systems? I've been working on a project since the start of the season now and have made alot of progress, was curious to see if anyone else has looked into it

[warped plaza]

No, not me

Did that help

[woeful beacon]

🙁

didnt expect too many tbh haha def v niche topic

[charred niche]

Noob question what's the ERS system

I am a dev btw

[woeful beacon]

Energy Recovery System, but more specifically im talking the deploy/harvest of the battery

[charred niche]

What have you found so far?

[woeful beacon]

i've tried alot so far, too many to detail rn unless u really want to know;
what i'm doing rn is extracting every bit of f1tv graphics data overlaying it ontop of telemetry and then seeing what that gives me

I think with throttle telemetry + speed trace + good priors you may be able to reconstruct using an NN or something, but still very difficult

the big question for me is wether you can take previous races data to analyze a new race with no label data

so far i have trained a model in australia that is able to predict battery SoC within 8%, but not sure it will work on different tracks

thus why im extracting more data rn

[charred niche]

A lot of that sounds foreign to me, but keep up the work. Would love to see some infographics someday.

[analog ridge]

CAD stands for computer aided design
It's what engineers use to make models of stuff in computers before you manufacture them
CFD is computational fluid dynamics
It's simulation of fluid in software
It's useful because there's certain things you can't test in wind tunnels due to scale

You don't have to be good at sketches but it's not a bad habit to draw from time to time
Helps in brainstorming from my experience

[analog ridge]

The people who work in F1 aerodynamics and aerospace go through the same education
Though a lot of people take mechanical engineering because it's more broader
But you can absolutely shift between ground vehicle aero and aircraft
Though highly specific roles like F1 aren't as open to that
The physics stays the same, how you apply it changes very vastly

F1 deals with low speed aerodynamics
While aircraft deal with low speeds to much faster regimes

Id say knowing both aircraft and motorsports aerodynamics is pretty helpful
A lot of concepts are used by both

[plain tree]

U have any tips for CAD? Cuz I will be having it at school next year

Kindly asking

Good Sir

[analog ridge]

I personally use onshape but its not hard at all
You just look up a certain thing you wanna do and 90% of the time there will be an old guy on YouTube who made a tutorial that's 2 minutes long on it

It's hard to give advice on it because it's really simple to use and there's so much to do that it's better to just learn on your own on the fly

[nimble marten]

i had autocad in my first year of uni and it's very fking easy dont worry

[plain tree]

Oh ok

I'm in 3rd grade high school in Poland (idk which grade it is in the US or UK system) and I will be having it in 4th grade

[sick plover]

Why do teams run horizontal elements on their FW end plates that seem to be pretty mild when deflecting the air?
My diagram is what I think airflow would sorta look like... I'm making an f1 car myself and I cannot for the life of me figure out why teams use the designs they use. I tried using a very upwashy element, like a small extension of the front wing basically that generates downforce + upwashes the air to the top of the tyre, but I'm feeling skeptical about my design. I need advice!

Eg. Aston martin having a very mild winglet that goes down only slightly

[sick plover]

Is it to keep airflow energized because theres no point in deflecting or?

[nimble marten]

i could be wrong but it looks like that's for the brakes to cool down

/avoid suspension arms to reduce drag

[analog ridge]

Btw have you used any CFD software

[analog ridge]

Idk eaither tbh, it's weird because that would probably generate lift instead of df
Maybe it was mainly to direct air
Btw in your diagram the air would follow the curve/camber of the airfoil more closely
Hitting the tyre lower than where you drew it

I've seen aston martin front wings where the airfoil is inverted
That'd create df and upwash but idk whyd they want the opposite in this case (this is australia if I'm correct?)

[sick plover]

I have in the past but i got lazzy in cleaning geometry so id have to spend hours making sure my chanes to the geometry works fine enough that i am able to simulate on simscale for example.

[sick plover]

This picture is from the lates (as of posting) video from F1 Unchained talking about the new upgrades coming into montreal.

https://youtu.be/k_cyjX-T1ho?si=3XIidMpvAiLM8jPr
timestamp is 2:26 if you wanna see the full picture.

[sick plover]

RN I feel that this type of design is a balance between downwashing and keeping air energized enough...

i will experiment with different designs tho..

RN my next few steps in development will be adapting this piece and adding more vertical outwashing elements (Like the merc canada fwep upgrade) but in a much more bold fashion

[analog ridge]

That's nice

[cosmic escarp]

What the name for this

[timber forum]

Halo ?

[cosmic escarp]

The thing on top of the halo

[sick plover]

Halo winglet

it doesnt really have a name but

its mainly used to streamline airflow

Around the driver's head

[leaden ledge]

I think this goes in technical

Did the upgrades redbull install really make that big of a difference in canadian gp?

So far it seems like they are keeping up/outpacing the ferrari in the race atleasy

It might be too early to say but current rankings have got me curious

[analog ridge]

They seem to have bumped performance a bit

But I can't be completely sure

[leaden ledge]

I guess the end of the gp will really tell then

[analog ridge]

Yeah

[leaden ledge]

Now that the race is over i have a question for our techys

What happened to the rb during the race?

In the beginning it seemed quite fast i mean verstappen was pulling away from lewis and hadjar was keeping up with leclerc

Then in the second half hadjar got speedmogged and slowly hamilton caught upto verstappen

I heard verstappen complaining on the radio about cold tires but is that the cars fault or is that not his fault to not drive in a way to heat them up?

[plucky kettle]

ive been trying to spot this out on every weekend but cant seem to figure it out

are these regulations's rear wings still changeable (for example they would have a high angle for monaco and the skinniest angle possible for monza) or its just a default one

[zinc island]

Redbull def has improved, they had issues with bouncing at the beginning.
But fixed, they def have pace but they in my opinion seem to struggle defending it. Maybe just me.

But i think hadjar wasnt gonna catch lewis either way. charles had active aero and was able to pull away from Isack isack struggled to stay within that zone

[fleet parrot]

@smoky lynx

[smoky lynx]

.mute 1508410839093481492 parlay scam

[paper wing]

Member "1508410839093481492" not found

[smoky lynx]

Honey pot i assume

[fleet parrot]

Weird that the message stayed

[analog ridge]

Afaik it should probably still be changeable

[agile karma]

still changeable but teams have a lot less incentive because active aero strips all the drag down the straights

[ashen thunder]

what is porpoising

[plain tree]

basically as car goes faster the ground effect gets stronger and pushes the car down more but at some point the car starts touching the ground which breaks the stream of air that caused downforce which makes the car go back up and the cycle goes again which makes the car "jump" on the straights

[plain tree]

watch some 2022 footage, focus on the straights and you'll see it

<@&781898349006684170>

[sick plover]

Making an F1 Car for fun and I need to know if my design is legal. The blue object is an S-Duct, with the purple organic-looking segments attaching to the engine cover (green) so that it directs airflow down to help keep air going down more attached. Is this engine cover design legal?

Another view

Not sure why F1 teams do not add the highlighted components;I also need to know if the highlighted parts are legal...

[obsidian abyss]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ty4HQkr46ng

[short ether]

Can I trust this??

[reef pine]

its the race

[short ether]

i'd ask our resident technician TooLow but he's not here

@granite tundra

actually he is.

[obsidian abyss]

Yes, the race is formed by former autosport journalists mainly.

[short ether]

Oh ok

[granite tundra]

i'd say that's a pretty reasonable analysis tbh

the one thing i'm iffy about is them supposedly using the wastegate exhaust to feed into the airflow downstream of the diffuser

i'm personally not convinced it would converge in any meaningful way, and like they said, the wastegates are only in sporadic operation so i doubt that was the main reason why the exhausts were relocated

it's a pretty sound explanation though, the fundamentals are all correct

[mortal citrus]

yes

[solar palm]

if you get a pitlane start when will you have to start accelerating the car?

[abstract pawn]

When you press the gas

[solar palm]

do you have to instantly go when its lights out

[abstract pawn]

No

Once everyone has gone past the pit exit line I believe

[solar palm]

ohhhh

ok

[granite tundra]

"cars may then join the race once the whole field has passed the end of the pit lane for the first time after the start."

so to use bahrain as an example, the pit exit lights will go green when the last car is past this point

[short ether]

I think it's best you watch Albon in China

His start was from the pits

iirc he had to start slow and the had to pick up speed

Like a standing start from the pits

But he was dead last there

That was probably his best drive in F1

[fierce coyote]

@abstract pawn join us in #formula-1

[silver ermine]

100% his best drive in f1 from last to 10th

[solid gazelle]

I saw that

[flint saffron]

e'

[short ether]

I'm still confused, '' how does the DAS system at Mercedes work? ''

if anyone knows just dm me

[dapper karma]

The DAS system is controlled by the driver either pulling or pushing the steering wheel, hence the name "dual-axis steering @short ether

[short ether]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U_uKHNJLSQs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=giWg44Uprb4
@short ether check these videos if you're interested

okay thanks a lot

[obsidian abyss]

I hope they ever make at echnical explanation of how the system works

[abstract pawn]

https://streamable.com/4xqlk0

Ted already explained it

[short ether]

whats a good f1 game for computer

[short ether]

f1 race stars

[versed inlet]

f1 2014 best f1 game of all time

/s

[versed inlet]

does williams even do steering wheel molds?

[cerulean beacon]

where is the drs button in the williams wheel?

[fallow zodiac]

they dont overtake

[solid bronze]

Too slow to activate

[short ether]

These car's are fuckin' computers LOL

[fallow zodiac]

"Sebastian told us, he had to start his car like a computer"

[compact saffron]

i would be confused

[shut bloom]

"Can you repeat the question?"

[abstract pawn]

On the back

[twin ridge]

I don't understand why they kept this design, I personally think as a driver it must be a bit information overload, the regular designs other manufacturers use seem a bit better especially because you could tell what button you're actually pressing

[paper wing]

Congrats @twin ridge, you're now on lap 5

[twin ridge]

thanks carlbot

[abstract pawn]

You can tell what button you are pressing on the Williams wheel too?

[twin ridge]

If you look at the steering wheel below it though, like all the buttons are spaced out and have a different design, so without looking at the steering wheel you can kind of tell what button you are pressing, whereas I don't think you could tell as easily with the williams steering wheel

maybe I'm wrong, I've never used a steering wheel like that tbf

[abstract pawn]

The picture he posted is Kubica's special wheel

Since he has a damaged right hand they put most buttons on the left

[zenith pumice]

Wheels are changed between drivers

Like each driver has a different wheel design

[abstract pawn]

It usually looksl ike that

[twin ridge]

Ahhh

[abstract pawn]

And how many buttons a wheel has will usually depend on the team and driver

[short ether]

the Williams wheel just looks so outdated

[cerulean beacon]

but the williams wheel is my fav wheel

[short ether]

They're the only ones who haven't put the screen on the wheel directly iirc

[viscid turret]

Didn't know they did that

Still mad respect for Kubica for still having driven F1 cars even after his crash

[abstract pawn]

IIRC he was barely even gripping the wheel with his right hand

Most of the time he was just resting it

[zenith pumice]

Mad

[viscid turret]

So he did everything with his left one, jeez

[short ether]

Mostly ye

[tacit bridge]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-dsEQKhJbE

[short ether]

why is shark fins in F1 2021 removed?

[obsidian abyss]

Shark fins in modern F1 were only used in 2017

[native tulip]

do drivers need to remember 'all of these' ? or most are just programmed before the race

[fallow zodiac]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRV4eOxQPAM

[native tulip]

that guy was just.. different

[fallow zodiac]

yea

[native tulip]

any normal examples? 😅

[fallow zodiac]

nope

not one i know of

[abstract pawn]

They need to remember most of those yes

Hulkenberg got like a whole book from Racing Point last year about the buttons and switches

That he had to read and study the night before he hopped into the car at Silverstone

[scarlet light]

Russell asked merc at sakhir about where buttons were on the wheel,

[fresh escarp]

Williams still no screen

[soft shadow]

I think that's an older wheel design, before the hybrid era

Wait no, judging from the buttons, I think that is Robert Kubica's steering wheel

[abstract pawn]

Yes, but the DRS is on the back.

[soft shadow]

I really think the render artist who did this could've added the screen separately on the Williams one

The traditional style screen display really fits Williams imo

[tacit bridge]

isnt the williams wheel very light compared to for example the merc

[abstract pawn]

It is said to be, yes

[soft shadow]

Well according to what laws of physics and technical engineering... without the electric components and the weight of the screen to the wheel, the steering wheel will give you more car feedback since it's gonna be lighter

[short ether]

me: can we get Hamilton in China 2007 at home?
mom: we already have Hamilton in China 2007 at home
Hamilton in China 2007 at home:

the incident when he was adjusting buttons on his steering wheel reminds me of myself playing F1 2020

[shy portal]

Red Bull and Alpha Tauri look exactly the same

[blazing saffron]

bruh Williams still sticking with a early 2010s-looking wheel

[soft shadow]

Whatchu expect from teams who are owned by the same company? insert spider man pointing meme

[abstract pawn]

Ferrari and Haas too

[shy portal]

They do but there are a couple differences, Red Bull and Alpha Tauri are exactly the same

[short ether]

Merc looks like a wide chicken

[soft shadow]

Well the HAAS has a higher hanging part so it's a bit different

[short ether]

the mercedes wheel always looked so cool

[grave fiber]

the haas wheel looks like a ferrari wheel

[digital terrace]

its looks like a dtm steering wheel

[obsidian abyss]

the williams wheel is the best

[wanton badger]

McLaren best

[obsidian abyss]

I think williams and red bull have the nicest ones

separate dashes are super nice

[wanton badger]

I dont like either of em

[zenith pumice]

I prefer the Mercedes wheel

[obsidian abyss]

best wheel is og force india

[zenith pumice]

Ah the silver

[wanton badger]

lovely

[obsidian abyss]

the front part was 3d printed at the time which was really cool

[digital terrace]

+1

[tight wharf]

the mclaren wheel has rgb on it lmao

because logitech

[abstract pawn]

[native tulip]

gamer wheel

[short ether]

that was a good wheel

williams need a new wheel

its too long

[abstract pawn]

It's as long as any other wheel lol

[tight wharf]

they need to attach screen to wheel

[abstract pawn]

They need to, or you want them to?

[short ether]

yh

[short ether]

it looks longer

on game and irl

[abstract pawn]

It is lighter and therefore it gives you a better feeling of the car, apparently..

[short ether]

rlly?

[tight wharf]

eh

they need every bit of advantage so it makes sense I guess

[abstract pawn]

Yes that is apparently why

[short ether]

its funny russell complains a lot

[short ether]

ohk

i like the merc wheel

not ferari

also alfa and red bull wheel kinda mad

[obsidian abyss]

In what year was the pit lane speed limiter first used?

Fairly certain the rule was a thing in 1994 but was that when they made the first speed limiter as well?

[blazing saffron]

pretty sure they brought it in at the 1994 Monaco Grand Prix after a pitlane incident at the San Marino GP

[tacit bridge]

something else happened in 1994 San Marino GP?

[upper ivy]

too many things

I think the pitlane incident was that someone lost a wheel and that wheel hit someone? similar to Webber 2013 at the Nürburgring

[obsidian abyss]

Yes but I'm talking about the car's speed limiter, not the regulation.

[blazing saffron]

oh

[granite flare]

renault said in 2019 that they were the only manufacturer of engines to get over 1000hp

[slate forge]

h

Hmm

[granite tundra]

hitting 1000hp is pretty reasonable

but them being the only team to do so?

[slate forge]

1000 hp with two engines

We got em

They used 2 engines to make 1k hp

IQ 100

[granite flare]

V12's

[slate forge]

lol

[midnight steppe]

v12 twin turbo double hybrids

[native tulip]

"required to"

is this true?

[jolly patrol]

Yes

And it's good

[abstract pawn]

I am not sure that second point is correct

Any driver who uses a set of tyres of differing specifications during the race may not complete more than three laps on this set before changing them for a set of tyres of the same specification. A penalty under Article 38.3(d) will be imposed on any driver who does not change tyres within three laps. For the avoidance of doubt, a set of tyres of differing specifications will not be considered when assessing the number of specifications used during the race.

I would assume that applies to using not your tires as well

[cerulean beacon]

https://youtu.be/UMwqR9M4SM8

[short ether]

Anyone here involved in F1 want to give me a job in the states? As an intern or laid job that can give me F1 experience

[dapper karma]

nope

[nocturne dock]

[carmine birch]

You should consider emailing teams

I think it’s on their website

[granite tundra]

that's not how it works

there are very few placement/graduate intake opportunities in teams, let alone in america

right now.. i'd say there are a grand total of 0 f1 team placements in america

[short ether]

what about Haas?

[granite tundra]

haas don't have a particularly big manufacturing/design presence in kannapolis

plus i've seen absolutely nothing from them in terms of internships/grad intakes

and if your tactic is to try and find a placement through discord.. you won't get anywhere

[viscid turret]

It's better to try something in like, actual American racing series

[granite tundra]

honestly as a designer/engineer, it would probably be more reasonable to relocate to europe and just go through an f1 intake

[paper wing]

Congrats @granite tundra, you're now on lap 20

[zinc shore]

aren’t most of them in UK

and i remember checking out some interns they hired

the common thing is they all did projects worth mentioning during their education as you might guess

aerodynamics and software engineering was the two areas that stayed in my mind from the job adverts of teams

[zinc shore]

also try doing a summer internship at rolls royce or companies like that

it’s in america, right?

it says the head quarters is in UK

[viscid turret]

Basically 70% of them yes

Only exceptions being Sauber/Alfa Romeo, AlphaTauri, and Ferrari

[short ether]

Who are all in Italy....

[reef pine]

Sauber is technically Switzerland

[mint sand]

It's just a glorified sponsorship

it is still glorious Sauber underneath the Italian facade

[soft shadow]

Sauber is still Swiss based but Ferrari has lend them their facilites for testing their cars

[viscid turret]

Sauber is Switzerland yeah

[cerulean beacon]

but ferrari supplies alfa with their fiorano test track cuz alfa is powered by ferrari engines

[viscid turret]

And because Switzerland doesn't have any racing tracks

Well except Formula E tracks

Reason; all racing is banned. not kidding. you legally aren't allowed to host a race in Switzerland, has been that way since the 1964 Le Man's disaster

A few years ago racing with electric cars was allowed for Formula E, but no other racing is allowed

[short ether]

Hmmm i wonder why

(1955)

[wanton badger]

so do I

oh

[viscid turret]

Fuck 55

[short ether]

All my homies hate 1955

[obsidian abyss]

Hillclimbs are allowed i think

[viscid turret]

Yeah

[obsidian abyss]

I bet hammond knows that

[viscid turret]

Point to point racing with timing is allowed

[short ether]

So rallye?

[viscid turret]

Well that Hillclimb actually was in Croatia and not Switzerland

[short ether]

Nah can't be lol

[obsidian abyss]

Was it actually

[viscid turret]

Rally and hillclimbing is allowed

[short ether]

Imagine they banned Motorsports cause too dangerous but allowed group B

[obsidian abyss]

Lul

[viscid turret]

Nevermind it is in Switzerland @obsidian abyss

For some reason I had heard Croatia

But yeah. Hillclimbing and rally is allowed

[obsidian abyss]

The car Hammond was driving was from croatia

[short ether]

That's an interesting question I'll check online

[viscid turret]

AH that's why

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rallye_International_du_Valais

A rally in Switzerland

Drag racing also is allowed

Since it's point to point

[short ether]

Also there has been actual swiss f1 GPs in Switzerland, last being in 1954 since it was held in August, while le Mans was in july.

And then these weird swiss gps held in Dijon, France

[viscid turret]

Lol the Swiss Gps in Dijon were just because someone else held the French GP name and Dijon wanted a name so they picked the nation closest to them

a strategy a lot of tracks used like Imola with San Marino and Nürburgring with Luxembourg

[tacit bridge]

They should allowed motorsport in Switzerland again, the safety has been heavily improved since then.

[short ether]

they'd probably have to do another referendum to repel that of 1955

[short ether]

Wait technical channel?

Pog

[wanton badger]

[short ether]

They were the first to confirm they make 1,000hp, of which idk... Mercedes could be like 80hp up

[calm forum]

switzerland does have karting tracks

[waxen roost]

wait its all karting circuits here i thought it was f1

[heavy onyx]

i think mercedes had denied that at the time

[short ether]

Oh wow. Believable

[heavy onyx]

https://www.grandprix247.com/2019/07/31/if-renault-are-at-1000-hp-why-do-they-get-lapped/

[short ether]

THAT'S DOUBLE UNTRUSTED

[granite tundra]

also hitting 1000hp isn't particularly hard challenge

i'd be more surprised if there was any team in 2018-19 which wasn't hitting 1000hp in quali trim

iirc there was promotional media from merc back in 2016 putting their ICE at 750-780hp

which puts them very close to the 1000hp mark already

[short ether]

No that's 250 hp away from 1000hp LMAO

Nowhere close

[short ether]

their ICE

maybe you misread

[granite tundra]

yes.. 750 + 160

[native tulip]

cause their overall car is shit?

also if mercedes being the best engine has said to not cross 1000hp

idk if Renault can do it

[short ether]

Y'know I've said this everywhere else but... This tunnel profile confuses me

[reef pine]

here's skippe with his rant on why the placement of the tunnels is wrong

continue ahead

[short ether]

Well I... Get it more now than I used to, because the downforce on the rear is further back, which'd have more torque effect

But you have a whole ass tunnel

And you make the most downforce at the front

Bruh

Why does it confuse you

Because the point of a Venturi tunnel is to make the downforce either throughout it's length or after the bottleneck

But it seems the 2022 cars have the biggest expansion zone in the front

[granite tundra]

it does

you still see a low pressure region along the underside of the floor

[short ether]

Which seems like a bad idea because you want it more centralised towards the centre of mass, no?

[granite tundra]

without looking at the actual numbers, i don't think we can say whether or not that's the case

there might be a region of lower pressure towards the front of the floor, but it's happening over a small area of the floor

whereas the pressure downstream is higher, but seems to be a lot more consistent heading back towards the rear wheels

[short ether]

Yeah

[granite tundra]

plus you've also got the work from the diffuser at the opposite end

[short ether]

Is that not worrying?

Or like... Coz the front trays are spec for 2022

[granite tundra]

eh i couldn't really say

but it's following a similar pressure distribution to what we're seeing on the current cars

[short ether]

Is it? There's alot more on the rear on the currents

Unless this doesn't take into account the sealers... I... Idk

[granite tundra]

my understanding of that is that it's still work done by the diffuser

with the new one drawing the air further back and up

but idk what the actual numbers behind that sim is

also keep in mind the amount generated by the FW will be decreasing as well

so they could well be generating less pressure at the beginning of the floor in 2022, but the decrease in downforce from the FW will (possibly) help prevent the balance getting shifted out of whack

[short ether]

Right...

E

[viscid turret]

Well in any way, I'm sure Brawn and Co know more then us and that it works

[granite tundra]

actually there's an interesting point about the pressure on the rear of the current floor

because to me at least, that looks a little too messy to be all coming from the diffuser

[short ether]

Well we know there's alot of fins on the rear wheel hubs

[granite tundra]

yeah i think some of that is just going to be air from above spilling down

[upper ivy]

isn't the tunnel just supposed to imitate a reversed wing-shape?

[granite tundra]

ehh, not really

well, sort of i guess

you might be thinking of bernoulli's principle, which exhibits the same behavior for an airfoil as it does a sculpted car floor

i.e. accelerate one side of the floor/airfoil to generate an area of low pressure, which produces lift

[short ether]

... Negative lift, that is, before we get confused

[granite tundra]

yes

i.e. downforce

[short ether]

Which is what pretty much all previous executions of Ground effect have done bar... I mean even the BT46🅱️ technically

What's the role of the 3 find at the entrance of the tunnel

Fins

They're Vortex generators

Why do you want this?

With the aid of the slightly rounded floor edges, it creates a Vortex that spills into the tunnel, creating an air skirt

[granite tundra]

my understanding was that they were for sealing the floor

[short ether]

Which stops the air in the tunnel from spilling out

Afaik those vortex generators started with CART after the BLAT Gurney Eagles were beaned

[granite tundra]

potentially trying to tidy up some of the wake from the front wheels as well

but i'm not too sure about that

[short ether]

Ok

[granite tundra]

hm maybe

doesn't look like it'll do anything for the outwash, but it looks like it's feeding some of the inboard wake back towards the floor

[short ether]

No because they... This is the thing I actually dislike

They obviously know Outwash is worse

Yet they try everything to, keep that damn front wing 40m wide

[granite tundra]

actually yeah that's a bit of a misleading image

that's FW outwash there

[short ether]

It's so damn annoying

And... Well ugly, the front of a car shouldn't be the widest part

[granite tundra]

idk, maybe they've tried to keep it wide to help the wake coming off the top of the tyres?

potentially trying to get it to work in conjunction with the deflectors

[short ether]

Chief if you wanna bend down the winglets so they might as well not exist

Why make them exist?

[granite tundra]

the bright sight is that although actual maximum outwash width isn't changing, it drops off a lot more aggressively past the end of the car

[short ether]

Also fun fact, the rear tyres are getting thiccer still I think

Yet the fronts are getting a tad skinnier

[granite tundra]

diameter or width?

my theory is that they didn't have much option to make the FW smaller

considering they're putting more focus on it as an actual downforce generating device

[short ether]

Both

All four corners are going up to 725mm

[granite tundra]

maybe to help with balance issues like you said

[short ether]

From 660

The rear tyres I think are going to... Uh... I'll need to check

Coz the mounting widths won't be tread widths

[granite tundra]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/433229818092322826/773163387840102450/Screenshot_20201103-133428.jpg

ah i had this saved

i remember the diameters were changing, width.. i can't remember

[short ether]

Yeah so 725mm diameter tyres with 18" rims

[granite tundra]

yep

was the width changing as well?

[short ether]

... You've... Got the screenshot my gamer

[granite tundra]

that's a rim thing, not a tyre one in the regs

i didn't have actual width in front of me

[short ether]

The tyre mounting widths are like... Uhhh, gimmie a sec

[granite tundra]

yeah i found them lol

335.3 front, 429.3 rear

[short ether]

that's current tyres?

Current tyres are 305mm/405mm tread

Right so
Current Front: 305mm Tread, 348mm rim mounting width with a total width between 370-385 mm
Current rear: 405mm, 429mm, 455-470mm
2022 Fronts: 335mm mounting width, with a complete between 345-375
2022 Rears: 429/450-470

So I was wrong, the rears are staying about the same tread width wise, but the fronts are dropping to say 275-285

[soft shadow]

So we returning to the 70's style where the rears are huge as hell than the front?

[shy cave]

hey i wont complain

[fallow zodiac]

so we returning to these /s

[zenith pumice]

Lol

[shy cave]

that thick ass bro

[reef pine]

Step ladder

[short ether]

this version of the Ensign had even worse cooling than the one without these radiators on the nose

[fallow zodiac]

imagine some rich guy buys a load of these cars and makes it his staircase

[short ether]

No, we're not returning to these

Because all corners' diameters are going up

[fallow zodiac]

did u see the " /s"