monaco-gp

[toxic siren]

he has every god damn right to use the driving line

You guys are defending Lando doing a torpedo charge and getting covered off by max following the driving line

[cyan saffron]

No, he has to leave Lando space.

[ornate gate]

You can't just jut yourself into a corner and then demand the line.

[cyan saffron]

As they are wheel to wheel.

[ornate gate]

Lando had plenty of space.

[toxic siren]

They were not wheel to wheel, BVB

[remote knoll]

I'm not defending Lando doing a divebomb, I'm saying Max moved under braking

[toxic siren]

this

not wheel to wheel

Max is clearly ahead

[ornate gate]

Lando not using his space is part of the reason they crashed.

[fair night]

DOESNT MATTER

[toxic siren]

Max is still clearly ahead at the 50m

IT DOES FUCKING MATTER

[remote knoll]

Yes Lando dived

[toxic siren]

IT'S THE ONLY GOD DAMN THING THAT FUCKING MATTERS

LANDO TOOK A RISKY FUCKING MOVE AND HE GOT BLOCKED OFF BY MAX DOING A REGULAR TURN

AND YOU ARE ALL SHOCKED

AND AGHAST

[remote knoll]

Are we talking about the fact that Lando dived or Max moving under braking?

[toxic siren]

THAT MAX TURNED

[mossy axle]

Still arguing

Fun

[mossy cosmos]

Max

[cyan saffron]

Wait, what are we even talking about now, the crash, or something from the laps before?

[mossy cosmos]

Fr

[toxic siren]

Laps beforfe

[remote knoll]

You can't block off an overtake by using a regular line

[mossy axle]

I’m grabbing some popcorn

[ornate gate]

Oh

[mossy cosmos]

The incident

[mossy cosmos]

Same I'm getting mine

[toxic siren]

Jesus Christ

Yes you can

[remote knoll]

Not really

[toxic siren]

That is the proper way to block an overtake, actually

[fair night]

2 words

baku 2018

[remote knoll]

You defend which is going off your normal line

[ornate gate]

What about an incident from 6 years ago?

[toxic siren]

3 words: Six years ago

[remote knoll]

I don't see what that has to do with anything

different corner

[fair night]

does that matter?

[ornate gate]

Yes.

[fair night]

its a similar thing

[remote knoll]

different cars

[ornate gate]

Lmfao.

[fair night]

max moving under braking

[toxic siren]

Different cars and Max has changed massively since then

[remote knoll]

different incident

not the same

[ornate gate]

And different track.

[remote knoll]

different incident, different turn

[obtuse elm]

a more fair comparison is Austria 2018

[toxic siren]

Max actually turns late into the corner

[obtuse elm]

not Baku tbh

[toxic siren]

How can you say there is anything wrong with turning into a corner

he either turns or he goes off period.

[crude flame]

Max definitely does not take his normal line through Turn 3 on Lap 55

He moves over like half a car length to the right when he sees Lando going for the move

[mossy cosmos]

Here's a comparison if you wanna do, i apologize for my terrible lines i suck at art💀

[crude flame]

And turns in earlier but still somehow misses the apex (lol btw)

[remote knoll]

^

[fair night]

YES

[ornate gate]

Look how much space Lando had.

[remote knoll]

Look at his lap in qualifying

[toxic siren]

Because he turned late

[obtuse elm]

thank you

[toxic siren]

You are literally dead fucking wrong about turning in earlier

[obtuse elm]

its a reaction to Landos attack

[fair night]

no we are fucking not

[remote knoll]

We are not

He turned in early bro

Look at his quali lap

it's a perfect onboard

[toxic siren]

It doesn't matter if he turns in a little late or early because perfection is impossible

There will always be a tiny difference

[fair night]

omg

[toxic siren]

He follows a line

a continuous line into the Apex (which he misses)

[ornate gate]

Not like any of this even matters, Lando being a child cost them both in the end regardless.

[remote knoll]

This isn't about perfection

[toxic siren]

It is totally fucking within his right

to follow a line

[cyan saffron]

He missed the apex because he moved under braking and therefore didn't get the corner properly.

[toxic siren]

regardless of Norris deciding to divebomb

[remote knoll]

it's about how early he turns in because he is defending (late) against lando

[remote knoll]

I mean the contact was Max's fault aswell

[toxic siren]

Divebombing, which is allowed, but a huge fucking risk.

[ornate gate]

The situation was almost entirely Lando's.

[remote knoll]

?

[fair night]

no?

[cyan saffron]

Moving under braking, which isn't allowed, is also a huge risk.

[obtuse elm]

the lap 64 contact????

[ornate gate]

Lando decided to put himself into a closing space and not using the room in the kerb.

[toxic siren]

Okay, BVB

[obtuse elm]

you can see the move to the left so clearly????

[ornate gate]

That's gonna create an accident.

[toxic siren]

All of you guys

[obtuse elm]

it's just monza 2018

again

[ornate gate]

I'm not talking about the contact.

[fair night]

he moved left into him the fuck you mean?

[ornate gate]

I'm talking about the situation.

[mossy cosmos]

I forgot what happened there

[toxic siren]

As soon as you produce a document from the FIA that says Max turned under braking and therefore broke the rules, I'll agree with you.

[remote knoll]

Lando held his line

[toxic siren]

But because they haven't

[remote knoll]

and was significantly alongisde

[toxic siren]

I'm gonna stick with them

[fair night]

its a drivers agreement

[toxic siren]

Then it isn't official

and it's up to an honor system

and while Max would be a dick to break it

it isn't against the rules

[mossy cosmos]

Your favorite alpha furry is typing...

[ornate gate]

He put himself into a tight and closing space and got upset when there was contact. If he actually avoided it, nothing would've happened and he easily could've made a move later.

[mossy cosmos]

😭

[remote knoll]

Tbf it was the tiniest of contact and it shouldn't have put any of them out of contention for the win

[fair night]

it wasnt closing when he put himself there

[obtuse elm]

moved to the left

[remote knoll]

Max could've avoided it too

[obtuse elm]

causing a collision

[remote knoll]

by holding his line

[toxic siren]

mfw this guy still doesn't understand we aren't talking about the collison

[fair night]

well well well

[ornate gate]

💀

[remote knoll]

audi is now talking about the other incident

[toxic siren]

Which I have now said multiple times

[crude flame]

There is no heli angle for Lap 55 unfortunately so we have to work with what we got

Image 1 is L56 and image 2 is L55 - on L56 where he is not defending from Lando you can see he turns in way after the DRS line, but as you can see on L55 he has already moved over before he has even hit the DRS line

[ornate gate]

I'm not talking about the collision.

[obtuse elm]

ah that one
the stewards didn't do shit cause it didn't result in anything

[remote knoll]

Huh

[obtuse elm]

my fault

[ornate gate]

I'm talking about the situation.

Which I've said MULTIPLE TIMES.

[cosmic vapor]

leclerc :((

[fair night]

yes

[mossy cosmos]

"Another European classic" ahhh reply😭😭😭😭

[obtuse elm]

OK

[remote knoll]

the situation is the incident

[obtuse elm]

I corrected myself and apologized

[toxic siren]

it is unfortunate

[obtuse elm]

gosh

[remote knoll]

Max is at fault for lap 55 and 64

[mossy axle]

How do you have energy for this

[toxic siren]

and as you can see

[obtuse elm]

idk

[toxic siren]

it is one continuous movement

[ornate gate]

No. The situation isn't the contact. The contact is a result of the situation.

[remote knoll]

it doesn't take much energy lol

[toxic siren]

into the corner

[cosmic vapor]

leeecleerccc

[ornate gate]

I'm not talking about the contact, I never was.

[fair night]

he moved into landos breaking zone

[toxic siren]

Its not erratic

It's not going back and forth

[cosmic vapor]

what did the poor guy do to deserve this suffering

[obtuse elm]

you don't brake into the line of someone if that's their braking zone ☠️

[mossy axle]

patience maybe then

[remote knoll]

Yes lol

[toxic siren]

it's a continuous movement into the corner

[crude flame]

So what? That is still not allowed because he is moving under braking. It does not matter if it is "one continuous movement" or not.

[toxic siren]

which he overshoots

[mossy cosmos]

Mate we don't talk about leclerc stop

[obtuse elm]

I'd like to see the laps previous

[cosmic vapor]

?

[obtuse elm]

his regular line

[toxic siren]

okay

so if a driver is going side to side

trying to dive bomb

then it's the driver in front's responsibility to either A: let them pass

[cosmic vapor]

alright this arguing is kinda getting annoying

it’s a racing incident

[toxic siren]

or B: move out of the way

or C: crash

[obtuse elm]

nah im just reading atp

[hard talon]

Hello what is being discussed here?

[cosmic vapor]

the crash

[mossy cosmos]

Max Lando crash

[toxic siren]

No, not the crash.

Still not the crash.

Still lap 55.

[hard talon]

Oh it's my Vettel friend.

[mossy cosmos]

STILL?!

[cosmic vapor]

i’m suffering

[toxic siren]

9 laps before the crash

[mossy cosmos]

?

[fair night]

terra can we just stop

[hard talon]

Why buddy?

[fair night]

lets move on

[toxic siren]

sure

[obtuse elm]

whats crazy is you're discussing the most inconsequential part of the battle

[hard talon]

Long story.

[obtuse elm]

like it literally doesn't matter let's drop it

[cosmic vapor]

leclerc

[mossy cosmos]

Alright

[hard talon]

Ah, I understand. 🫂 There there.

[remote knoll]

Moving underbraking =/= turning into the corner

two different things

[hard talon]

All you need to know is Schumacher is a cry baby.

[obtuse elm]

???????????????????

[remote knoll]

what 💀

[crude flame]

Really the main responsibility of the driver in front is to always make sure they leave space for the other car and to not make any moves done to try and hinder the other car - so no, you do not have to just let them pass, move out of the way or crash.

[toxic siren]

Okay, so Slendis says you have to let an opponent through when they irresponsibly divebomb.

Got it, let me just note that down...

[fair night]

💀

[remote knoll]

Max could've gotten the switchback

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[fair night]

yeah

[toxic siren]

Max could have done a lot of things.

[remote knoll]

Lando's corner would've been compromised

[toxic siren]

Lando could have done a lot of things.

[fair night]

hes such great drievr

[toxic siren]

But they didn't do a lot of things.

[ornate gate]

Lando already shoved Max off once.

[mossy cosmos]

Uh ok

[toxic siren]

They only did what they did.

[fair night]

it was fair

[ornate gate]

No it wasn't 💀

[hard talon]

Same page, good. 😊

[remote knoll]

Oh yea let's talk about that incident

[ornate gate]

He pushed him off the track

[obtuse elm]

your name ☠️☠️☠️dudeee

[ornate gate]

He literally gave Max back the position

[fair night]

oh that one

i thought of a different one

[remote knoll]

yea same

[obtuse elm]

i thought we dropped this?

[remote knoll]

bro

[fair night]

same

[remote knoll]

let us discuss

smh

[cyan saffron]

If someone is divebombing, you can literally back out and do a switchback.

easy

[mossy cosmos]

I didn't know how to reply that's why i said this

[obtuse elm]

waste your energy 🔥🔥

[remote knoll]

Nothing justifies moving under braking

[remote knoll]

I'm not wasting energy

i'm enjoying this convo

thank you very much

[toxic siren]

I'm sure they are definitely thinking about that when a car is coming at them extremely quickly

[crude flame]

I mean yes all drivers in a battle have a responsibility to avoid a collision at any cost. So if you notice a driver going for an "irresponsible divebomb", which you worry might end up in a collision, it is also your responsibility to sensibly avoid that collision.

[toxic siren]

And he did

[cosmic vapor]

ITS A RACING INCIDENT

chill

[toxic siren]

There was no collision.

[remote knoll]

We are all chill bro

[obtuse elm]

says the bro yelling

[remote knoll]

lmao

[cyan saffron]

[toxic siren]

It wasn't even that.

There was nothing brought up about it by the FIA

or in the race

[crude flame]

But there could have been because he moved in the braking zone after Lando had already committed to his line.

oop wrong reply but you get it

[cosmic vapor]

come on stuff like this happens

[remote knoll]

Moving underbraking isn't gonna help defend against a divebomb

[toxic siren]

And is this against the rules?

[crude flame]

Yes

[toxic siren]

Cause I've heard both it's against the rules and it is a drivers agreement

which one is it

Because it matters.

[crude flame]

It is in the ISC

[fair night]

is it a rule

[toxic siren]

Okay.

[remote knoll]

I'm pretty sure that is a rule in every series

[obtuse elm]

it decreases the space on the inside, giving the divebombing driver a worse line and a worse exit

[toxic siren]

So Max will be punished since all of you are so confident he broke the rules.

I'll wait for that.

[fair night]

bruh

[remote knoll]

my point is that moving underbraking will result in a crash

[obtuse elm]

it didn't amount to anything ☠️

[obtuse elm]

this is true

as we saw

[cyan saffron]

race directors and giving proper penalties

[remote knoll]

especially if it's a divebomb

it's even more dangerous than a divebomb

[cyan saffron]

Everyone who watched 2021 knows that's not reality.

[toxic siren]

A divebomb is inherently super dangerous

[remote knoll]

you're relying on the competency of the FIA

[toxic siren]

You are closing in on a car in front at extremely high speeds

[remote knoll]

I agree and so is moving underbraking

[toxic siren]

saying one is more dangerous than the other is just not true

They are both stupidly dangerous

[crude flame]

Eh debatable

[remote knoll]

But it is more dangerous

[cosmic vapor]

guys max got his 10 sec penalty like hamilton did stuff like this happens it’s racing let’s move on and focus on the next race

[crude flame]

Some of the greatest overtakes of all time would be considered "divebombs"

[fair night]

moving under braking is more dangerous

but both are dangerous

[toxic siren]

I couldn't agree more.

[ornate gate]

Does that make them any less dangerous?

[remote knoll]

imagine you have to change your line rapidly under braking, your rear is unstable

[toxic siren]

Divebombs, when done right

are sensational

absolutely beautiful to watch

[cyan saffron]

Moving under braking is more dangerous because it literally can cause airborne crashes.

[obtuse elm]

ricciardo Austin 2017

[toxic siren]

but that doesn't remove the danger

[obtuse elm]

goated

[cosmic vapor]

riccy + monza🙏

[ornate gate]

Divebombs are literally shoving yourself in a space to get past.

[mossy cosmos]

China 2018

[fair night]

yes

[obtuse elm]

monza 2015

[crude flame]

Divebombs are not inherently super dangerous

[cosmic vapor]

if you do them right

[toxic siren]

I mean, they are.

They are high risk, high reward.

It is dangerous to close in on a leading car at that speed.

[ornate gate]

They're lunges, often late, often requiring another driver to make evasive actions to avoid a crash.

[toxic siren]

There is no debate for that

[nocturne rover]

Piastrizzz

[cyan saffron]

Moving under braking though is high risk, no reward.

[toxic siren]

It just is

[obtuse elm]

closes the space for the driver behind + puts you in a better position

it is high risk, but it does have a reward

..if you don't crash

[remote knoll]

there is no reward because it's illegal

lol

[cyan saffron]

You can easily fuck up your own turn in into the corner though.

[cosmic vapor]

lmao

[cyan saffron]

this

[toxic siren]

Then Max should be punished.

[cosmic vapor]

he was given a penalty

[remote knoll]

you cant rely on the competency of the race directors

[cosmic vapor]

🤷‍♂️

[remote knoll]

for a different incident

not the one we are talking about

[cosmic vapor]

don’t worry if max moves an inch off the racing line in silverstone he’ll get the black flag

[remote knoll]

Just because someone didn't or did get a penalty doesn't mean it was okay or not okay

[cyan saffron]

Yes, he should but he didn't because race directors are incompetent as usual.

[remote knoll]

race directors are humans

they make mistakes

[toxic siren]

Or they just don't think it was moving under braking.

[fair night]

omfg

[ornate gate]

And the race director decided it wasn't anything to worry about.

[toxic siren]

Because although Slendis says it doesn't matter

[obtuse elm]

it doesn't matter in the end therefore no penalty

[toxic siren]

If it is one continuous movement into the corner

then you cannot differentiate if it was for blocking off or for the corner

there are too many variables

[mossy cosmos]

Ah yes, 2022

[toxic siren]

Drivers fuck up corners all the time

[ornate gate]

💀

[obtuse elm]

2022 LMAO

bottas in a merc

vettel in a ferrari

old aero regs

2022

[crude flame]

Are you arguing that Max did not move under braking or that moving under braking is not illegal

[remote knoll]

definitely 2008

[mossy cosmos]

Nah 2000

[toxic siren]

I'm arguing that you can't say this specific instance was moving under braking because he goes into the corner and doesn't shift trajectory

there is no zigging or zagging

not erratic movement

[cosmic vapor]

i miss leclerc vs verstappen

[toxic siren]

for this one instance.

Not for any other

[cosmic vapor]

not as much drama

just pure fights

[remote knoll]

you don't have to zig zag for it to be moving underbraking

[cosmic vapor]

when was the last time two drivers of equal skills took each other on

[toxic siren]

but you do have to do something that significantly differentiates from a regular turn in

otherwise, as I said, you cannot differentiate.

[cosmic vapor]

2021

[crude flame]

Per the rule there does not need to be any erratic movement just some sort of movement aimed at hindering another car

[toxic siren]

Therefore you can say "It was moving under braking"

or "it was just a bad turn"

[remote knoll]

sounds like a poor excuse

[toxic siren]

It's a horrible excuse.

But that's how it is.

Something has to be different.

And that's why it's rarely penalized.

[remote knoll]

so you still think Max was on a normal line?

[toxic siren]

I think he was on a fucked up line

but he was on a line

That means he's following a trajectory that is predictable and not dangerous

as long as he doesn't deviate

If it was so slam dunk moving under braking then we wouldn't be having this conversation.

It would be penalized and done.

[hard talon]

Zhou and Verstappen. Shame it wasn't equal machinery or Zhou would've won. :((

I can't spell

[crude flame]

I think you have kind of misinterpreted what moving under braking is because it is not just someone doing something "unpredictable" or "erratic" - it is as simple as someone making some sort of abnormal movement during the braking phase aimed at hindering another car.

[toxic siren]

You can think that, but I'm not.

I know well what it is, Slendis.

[crude flame]

And you could definitely argue that Max made an abnormal and/or reactionary movement in the braking phase to hinder Lando

[toxic siren]

You can.

And you can also argue that because nothing changed in the turn after he started turning that it was just a shitty line

That's the core problem.

[obtuse elm]

watch this
he literally juts to the right AFTER lando does

[snow swan]

Chat we almost had another Netherlands vs Austria

Sad that turkey eliminated them

[remote knoll]

da hell is a "jut"

[toxic siren]

And follows a single line

[toxic siren]

a mini zig

[obtuse elm]

nope, he zigs to the right abruptly

[crude flame]

Literally makes no difference if the movement to the right was made in reaction to Lando trying for a move and then trying to hinder him.

[snow swan]

Focus George Focus

[obtuse elm]

real

[toxic siren]

Okay, Slendis. Then I'll see Max penalized.

[crude flame]

🤦‍♂️

[obtuse elm]

😭😭😭

[toxic siren]

You can all mention me when it happens.

[obtuse elm]

you trust the FIA on this?

unreal

[toxic siren]

I mean, you all act like it's clear cut.

[crude flame]

Setting the bar so low

[obtuse elm]

it doesn't change anything cause they took each other out

[toxic siren]

That it can only be moving under braking.

Nothing else.

[remote knoll]

It kinda is

[toxic siren]

Then the penalty will come.

[obtuse elm]

if you WATCH THIS CLIP you'll see he abruptly moves right

[toxic siren]

Until then, I'm just gonna stop talking about it.

[obtuse elm]

there's no way

[toxic siren]

Not worth it.

[remote knoll]

He goes wide on the exit, why? Because he changed his trajectory after braking

you cannot move when you brake because you lose braking performance causing you to shift off of your preferred line

[crude flame]

You are also making it seem like it is clear cut that he did not move under braking 🤷

I am not trying to make it seem clear cut that he did indeed move under braking I am just providing evidence for on what basis you could argue he did

Then I have no idea what the others are doing or think about the incident I will leave that to them

[remote knoll]

Have y'all tried that Oreo icecream?

shit is good

[ornate gate]

The what?

[remote knoll]

i'll send a pic

[crude flame]

I don't eat ice cream

[remote knoll]

why not

[obtuse elm]

here you go

[crude flame]

I don't want to

[ornate gate]

This angle just makes it look more like Max followed a single line

[remote knoll]

fair enough

[ornate gate]

Nah

[obtuse elm]

there's no way you can't see the jerk to the right

[ornate gate]

Never had those

[obtuse elm]

anyway

[coarse obsidian]

Nice and I eat ice cream. Thank you Vertex.

[remote knoll]

yw

[remote knoll]

should try them

[ornate gate]

Which is just a turn in for a corner

[remote knoll]

you might like them

[ornate gate]

Maybe

I have these italian ice things in my deep freeze

[obtuse elm]

I watched the lap before, he turns later on the lap before

[mossy axle]

I am very curious

[remote knoll]

You don't dart like that to turn into a slow corner

[ornate gate]

They're good af

[remote knoll]

send pic

[ornate gate]

I'm also making a basque cheesecake today

[remote knoll]

please try it

[ornate gate]

These

[remote knoll]

oh yeah luigi's

had those before

🔥

[ornate gate]

So good

[brisk lodge]

英俊

[wooden kettle]

omg yum

[remote knoll]

send proof

cuz idk what that is

[ornate gate]

Hopefully will

Unless I fuck it up

[wooden kettle]

i never get to eat basque cheesecake but it always looks so tasty

[ornate gate]

It's my first time making one

[ornate gate]

They look like this

[remote knoll]

oh shit

[wooden kettle]

benejehe i want some

[remote knoll]

looks delicious

[ornate gate]

Although that's the first image off google

So mine is never going to be perfect

[wooden kettle]

if it cracks just cover in whipped cream and berries or smth

thats what i do

[remote knoll]

so you made one but never had one?

[wooden kettle]

no, ive made other pies and cakes

[remote knoll]

oh

[wooden kettle]

same concept

[remote knoll]

fair enough

[wooden kettle]

like on pumpkin pie if i have spare crust, i just make a little leaf design and bake it separately and put it on if there’s a crack

[fair night]

your discord account is nearly 10 years old

holy shit

[wooden kettle]

like this

[fair night]

i was 9 when it was created 💀

[remote knoll]

bros never seen an account from 2015

[fair night]

yeah but not often

[remote knoll]

noob

[wooden kettle]

I had just started community college when it was created 💀

[remote knoll]

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[wooden kettle]

bruh making me feel old as fuck

[remote knoll]

you are

[sand compass]

people that were born in 2011 can now legally be on discord

[wooden kettle]

STOP IM ONLY 26 SJBDJSDHSLEBD

[remote knoll]

You are nearly 10 years older than me

[wooden kettle]

FUCK

[remote knoll]

🥶

lmao

👴

[wooden kettle]

bro 🫠

[shrewd flare]

So. Since RB pit stop crew gonna be practicing 24/7. By how many seconds is max winning this next GP?

Ima say 10

[ornate gate]

-30

[mortal yoke]

Hello, I am new to F1 and I would like to know at least the basics of this, could you help me? please

[fair night]

11 years older than me 😭

[sand compass]

#formula-faq

[shrewd flare]

Ok mr legit. Who’s winning in your books

[remote knoll]

damn you're young

[mortal yoke]

Thanks

[fair night]

im only 17

[sand compass]

He’s not winning

[remote knoll]

bro cannot math

[shrewd flare]

Why’s that

[fair night]

oh 💀

[ornate gate]

Probably Lando, unless he is all willy nilly with his car again

[fair night]

9 years

[remote knoll]

LOL

[ornate gate]

The McLaren is easily the fastest car

[wooden kettle]

ive been online since i was 10. never thought i’d see this day come.

[fair night]

im tired ok

[remote knoll]

😭

[fair night]

9* sorry

[shrewd flare]

So what happened in Austria? (Pre lap 60)

[fair night]

but still

[wooden kettle]

all good lmao

[shrewd flare]

Why could max get 7 seconds ahead

[ornate gate]

Something like that

[remote knoll]

he is fast

[shrewd flare]

Yes

[wooden kettle]

he’s fast, more experience, lives and breathes racing imo

[remote knoll]

true

[sand compass]

the monza/bahrain curse is gonna start happening where no driver can repeat a win to save their life

[wooden kettle]

dude literally does sim racing in between actual races. like huh?

[shrewd flare]

😂😂😂

I don’t see lando winning against max unless RB/max fuck up on strategy or something

[hushed olive]

MAX VS LANDO In 4 DAYS

[remote knoll]

I would too unfortunately I'm missing the F1 part

[wooden kettle]

fair.

[shrewd flare]

Just imagining that a good pit stop would’ve seen Austria gp won by max is insane

[hushed olive]

max lost mainly cuz rb did a sauber in the last pit stop

[shrewd flare]

Indeed

[remote knoll]

Damn i forgot about that shit pitstop

[wooden kettle]

actually yeah that last pit was…

[remote knoll]

Redbull has pitstops like that once every blue moon

[shrewd flare]

Also Norris somehow doesn’t know how a breaking point works. But ok

[remote knoll]

last one i can remember was Cota 2022

10 second stop for verstappen

[shrewd flare]

100 meter line, Norris was like 2 cars further behind max. And he thinks he got a right to a racing line

[remote knoll]

?

what lap are you talking about

[shrewd flare]

Incident lap

Incident turn

[remote knoll]

brother

what lap

[shrewd flare]

64

[remote knoll]

oh that was Max's fault tho

[hushed olive]

if that race happened today he would have lost cuz of the insane in equality on the grid rn

[remote knoll]

maybe

[hushed olive]

But the rb was Ahead of everyone in the last half of 2022

[sand compass]

he almost lost

but there was a mercedes behind him instead of a ferrari

so he won

[remote knoll]

tbf the merc was fast that weekend

compared to it's other performances with the W13

[sand compass]

AMR was really quick too

[remote knoll]

yea

[ornate gate]

💀

[shrewd flare]

It’s insane to think that both of George wins have been by max taking out the fastest driver in the race😂

[sand compass]

Vettel lead a lap and lance was running in the top 5 for a bit

[hushed olive]

prob hamilton's best race of 2022

[remote knoll]

the rest is history 😭

[hushed olive]

before he almost killed alonso

[ornate gate]

Remember when people thought AMR and Alonso would do great things

[sand compass]

that was lance

[remote knoll]

was Lewis faster than George in Brazil?

[shrewd flare]

100%

[hushed olive]

im taliking about lance not seb

[remote knoll]

well until 2024 happened 💀

[remote knoll]

hmm i don't remember that

[hushed olive]

2022 mercedes ended good the season considering how bad the car was in the first races

[remote knoll]

Lewis was faster in the second half of 2022 tho

so makes sense

[hushed olive]

fr he finished 2nd in almost every race of the last half of 2022

[remote knoll]

Race winning car unlike the w14 and almost the 15 smh

[hushed olive]

the 2022 mercedes reminds me alot of the 2009 mclaren

[remote knoll]

ehh

let's give it the rest of the season first

the beginning was horrible

but the W13 only got so many points in the first 4 races because of the redbull failing

[hushed olive]

literally i saw people telling that they will never get a podium in this season and see what happened

[remote knoll]

easy to judge a car at the beginning

[sand compass]

Maturing is realizing that Steiner was a terrible team principal

[hushed olive]

oh now that i think 14 has to be the worst

15 has alot of potential

[remote knoll]

I was too new of a fan to know how bad Steiner was

[hushed olive]

people just liked him cuz of the memes

i never saw someone calling him a good team principal

[remote knoll]

at least he was funny

you can't be unfunny and bad at your job

😬

[cyan saffron]

That's possible.

[hushed olive]

fr i renember ham getting lapped in imola

and finishing like p9 in jeddah

[remote knoll]

does anyone come to mind?

[cyan saffron]

not a F1 team principal but Trevor Carlin

[remote knoll]

is he like the founder of rodin carlin?

[mossy axle]

Doubt we have it here, seems American

[remote knoll]

oh yea

[mossy axle]

We have this though

: (

[remote knoll]

:(

[mossy axle]

Not worth the effort fixing it

[remote knoll]

fix it 😡

[remote knoll]

oh

close enough

[cyan saffron]

epic avif fail

[mossy axle]

Almost the first time for me

I am a failure

[toxic siren]

Can you get me this rule for future reference?

I've tried to find it and have come up with nothing.

[remote knoll]

Terra, as a professional racing driver with a few years of experience with ton of wheel to wheel racing. Trust me.

[mossy axle]

Vertex has the most wheel knowledge

[toxic siren]

Ooh

More than one change of direction to defend a position is not permitted.

It's good Max only moved once.

[earnest vessel]

New Williams livery for British GP

[mossy axle]

GO GO

[remote knoll]

So you admit he did move underbraking?

[toxic siren]

I admit that he made a single move.

And that even if it were moving under braking, which I can't say 100%

[earnest vessel]

I admit he crashed and fucked up end of conversation

Goodnight

[toxic siren]

I don't see anything in the rules that bans that.

I can only find an apprent driver's agreement

which those last until they dont

[remote knoll]

"manoeuvres (why they spell it so weird) liable to hinder other drivers"

[toxic siren]

and that last part which says any move that hinders other drivers blah blah blah is prohibited.

But and this is important

[earnest vessel]

So for 4 years in this server you didn’t know the FIA rulebook says that moving under breaking at high speeds is dangerous 💀

[toxic siren]

that's a catch all statement that can be applied to almost any defense made by a driver in front

[toxic siren]

It doesn't say that.

Thats the damn issue.

Because it isn't clearly specified what is moving under braking, you can't apply a rule.

[remote knoll]

bruh

[toxic siren]

As I said earlier

remember

you have to differentiate

and if you can't, then you can't punish someone

[earnest vessel]

Also reality check

“The FIA has told drivers it will no longer tolerate moving under braking following Max Verstappen's defensive manoeuvre at the Japanese Grand Prix.

Verstappen has attracted criticism from several drivers this season for his tactic of moving across to defend position in the braking zone, something Kimi Raikkonen predicted will one day lead to a big accident. In Japan Verstappen did it again to defend position against Lewis Hamilton, forcing the world champion into evasive action.”

Statement from FIA 2016

[toxic siren]

In 2016

8 YEARS ago

Charlie Whiting also said the "Verstappen rule" was gone in 2017

[remote knoll]

If moving after already braking to defend against a driver behind you isn't considered moving underbraking then I don't know anymore.

[earnest vessel]

They don’t just remove rules, omg I’m so done with you, and like that blocked because you don’t know common F1 knowledge good day

[remote knoll]

bruh

why it gotta be like that

[toxic siren]

The problem is that so many things can be considered dangerous.

You could consider a divebomb dangerous and apply it there

You could say cutting a driver off on the straight is dangerous and apply it there.

You could say so much is dangerous and then it becomes a slippery slope.

F1 is inherently dangerous.

[remote knoll]

With that logic you can just excuse moving underbraking

[earnest vessel]

Article 27.4 FIA

Moving under breaking when another car is approaching

I’m sick of people doing no research

[toxic siren]

The drivers, teams, fans, organizers, and everything know that

[toxic siren]

Where?

[toxic siren]

As long as it is only a single move.

[remote knoll]

That isn't how that works

Moving underbraking is moving underbraking and it is prohibited

commonly know between any motorsport fan

and any driver

across any series

[earnest vessel]

Also another flashback to 4 years ago

[toxic siren]

There isn't a 27.4 anymore

I’m sick of people doing no research

[earnest vessel]

I think if the FIA says no it’s not allowed then that is that, arguing and being petty is embarrassing by you. And you can stay blocked. Bye now

[toxic siren]

Blocking me for proving that article doesn't exist anymore is insane

Here's the file.

Look for yourself.

[mossy cosmos]

Can we move on

[toxic siren]

And if you think I would for some reason modify a pdf and remove it

https://www.fia.com/regulation/category/110

Here's the source.

[mossy cosmos]

Terra

Stop

Can we just move on

Enough

[earnest vessel]

When they don’t know they moved some stuff around in the new print of the regulations

Also hello

[mossy cosmos]

Hello

[toxic siren]

I think it's important for people to know the rules they are quoting are old as shit.

[toxic siren]

Show. Me.

[mossy cosmos]

STOP

BOTH OF YOU

[toxic siren]

Bro, we are allowed to debate this.

[earnest vessel]

Don’t worry Martin I’m not reading their messages

[remote knoll]

fr

[mossy cosmos]

The debate is stupid now

[toxic siren]

It's an F1 server.

[remote knoll]

How is it stupid bruv

[toxic siren]

If it is a rule then it shouldn't be hard to find.

[earnest vessel]

@mossy cosmos

I’ve been out of this conversation for a bit

[mossy cosmos]

Ok

[remote knoll]

It's discord smh

the purpose of discord is to discuss things

[thin berry]

You can’t modify a PDF that is the point of a PDF

[remote knoll]

Huh?

oh mb

[fair night]

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGes5YHYj/ @toxic siren

[toxic siren]

You can.

[thin berry]

[toxic siren]

You just have use a PDF editing tool.

They are a pain in the ass.

[mossy cosmos]

This topic has been going for hours

Even days

Since it happened

Days

Bruh

You understand

[remote knoll]

Yes?

[mossy cosmos]

It's tiring at some point

[remote knoll]

I mean there are other channels

[toxic siren]

What?

I know what a divebomb is 💀

[fair night]

watch the tiktok

[toxic siren]

it's just pictures

[remote knoll]

An event that happened just a couple of days ago will be discussed for a while

[fair night]

read it

[remote knoll]

it's an F1 discord server

[toxic siren]

I have read it.

[remote knoll]

cmon

[fair night]

look at slide 5

[earnest vessel]

All I can tell is someone is trying to Defend Max so much they almost earned a spot on Judge Judy US

[toxic siren]

Are you sure you meant 5?

[obtuse elm]

are we still yapping abt this???

[earnest vessel]

Why are we starting other arguments about a different topic now

😭

[fair night]

idk why lol

[remote knoll]

this person isn't even alongside lmao

[spare heart]

the channel name has been changed to 'british gp' yet they're still unable to move on, jesus

[remote knoll]

bro thought he owned the corner

[toxic siren]

I think this tik tok is also just unreliable.

[obtuse elm]

☠️

[fair night]

fr lmao

[toxic siren]

I'd rather trust the FIA and what their sporting codes say.

[mossy cosmos]

Verstappen is at fault for the breaking Lando is at fault for being impatient and divebombing Verstappen, end of case

[spare heart]

like now it's very obvious and known that max is at fault, and i'm saying this as a person that loves max, just move on

[thin berry]

You guys weren’t around for AD21 were you

[earnest vessel]

Some people speak British Austrian I guess xD

[remote knoll]

We can talk about an incident for 30 years broski

[toxic siren]

And you'd know that the chat would otherwise die if we just stuck to Britain.

[mossy cosmos]

Probably was worse than this

[fair night]

i was there but didnt talk

[toxic siren]

And neither violate FIA set rules.

[spare heart]

unfortunately not 😭 i'm new here this is my first season

[obtuse elm]

oh yeah ☠️☠️☠️☠️

[remote knoll]

He darts to the right and then stops steering.

[thin berry]

Consider yourself lucky 😭

[toxic siren]

Which is why neither the divebomb nor braking were penalized.

[earnest vessel]

Good angle, they started turning way before the corner actually came and switched line (while braking)

Nice

[spare heart]

this is a good season to start watching f1 though bc its wayyy more exciting than last season

[toxic siren]

Max stayed on one line after moving to defend

[earnest vessel]

While breaking, the end good night

[toxic siren]

Which is allowed by the ISC driving conduct guidelines

[earnest vessel]

Now stop

[spare heart]

5 different race winners, 4 different constructers, and also breaking many curses

[thin berry]

Oh for sure lmao after ‘21, 2022 and 2023 were terribly boring

[toxic siren]

Which isn't noted in the rules anywhere as a violation.

[obtuse elm]

the left clip is legit lap 55, it SHOWS his abrupt reaction to lando IN the braking zone
he's included lap 54 (right), as a comparison to his regular racing line
there's no way you can't see the moving under braking, if you can't ill refer you to specsavers

[mossy cosmos]

That move was cheeky ngl

[fair night]

https://youtu.be/ER4_6N86M_U?si=jrZYFdTflKtAdVrA @toxic siren watch this too

[spare heart]

yupp

anyways gtg, cya everyone

[toxic siren]

Even if it WAS moving under braking, that isn't against the rules.

[mossy cosmos]

Cya

[toxic siren]

The only rules there are

[earnest vessel]

You are a moderator here and you are embarrassing yourself with a pointless defence…. I’m don’t hate you but this topic is over now please 😭

[obtuse elm]

MOVING UNDER BRAKING IS LITERALLY A VIOLATION OF THE RULES???

[toxic siren]

SHOW ME

PLEASE

[remote knoll]

I cannot believe this.

[toxic siren]

FUCKING PROVE IT

PLEASE, GOD

FIND ME A SINGLE ARTICLE OR PARAGRAPH OR ANYTHING

HERE ARE THE TWO DOCUMENTS WITH DRIVING CONDUCT

[earnest vessel]

FIA has the rights to apply rules at their own discretion

[thin berry]

Alright alright let’s chill

[obtuse elm]

thank you for your time

[thin berry]

https://tenor.com/view/chill-zen-buddha-omm-spongebob-squarepants-gif-16137769

[toxic siren]

Thats 8 years ago

[earnest vessel]

I showed that already

[obtuse elm]

this was 4

[mossy cosmos]

That's your excuse?

[obtuse elm]

perfect

[toxic siren]

Whiting said they removed the Verstappen rule the year after.

[obtuse elm]

did she ignore it?

[thin berry]

Rules change in 8 years

[obtuse elm]

it shows it in the 2020 doc

[toxic siren]

This article doesn't exist anymore.

[fair night]

still moving uder braking

[obtuse elm]

so we've gone from he didn't move under braking to he did but "it's not in the rules"

[mossy cosmos]

Alright mb

[mossy cosmos]

Wow

[toxic siren]

I always said he made a single movement.

One.

[earnest vessel]

React if you think it’s ok for the FIA to enforce something in a race that’s very apparent and being abused

[toxic siren]

Which is allowed.

[earnest vessel]

It’s simple

Like track limits abuse it you are a gonner

[obtuse elm]

not under braking it isn't
it's allowed on the straight when you're not braking, but in this case he was braking

[toxic siren]

And I said very clearly, that you would have to differentiate something from a standard/compromised turn in, but still a turn, to say that

[toxic siren]

Show me the rule.

I've given everything you need to disprove me.

[earnest vessel]

He my @thin berry can you help and calm your mod a bit. We want to chill now please

[toxic siren]

https://www.espn.com/f1/story/_/id/18981853/why-verstappen-rule-dropped

[earnest vessel]

FIA put it back in last week after the race

Goodnight

[toxic siren]

It's all there.

[earnest vessel]

c:

[mossy cosmos]

💀

[toxic siren]

They put a different thing back which is what we have now

[earnest vessel]

Hey mate it’s well known that FIA if they see something abused it will be frowned upon… it’s just how it is

[cyan saffron]

Damn, even I wouldn't be that stubben defending Esteban.

[earnest vessel]

All those times with Hamilton

[toxic siren]

This is what we have now.

You could argue that 33.4 includes moving under braking

but that goes to the Stewards

and we all know how they do

[mossy cosmos]

Enof is enof

[remote knoll]

damn you beat me

[mossy cosmos]

Wake me up when the debate ends

[remote knoll]

im good

[toxic siren]

It is no debate anymore. I've given all the facts as written by the FIA and ISC

You can debate those as much as you want, but they are ultimately what guides the sport.

[obtuse elm]

33.4, legit right there, he moved erratically under braking into the straight path of Lando norris, who had to take evasive action
that is "erratically in a manner which could be deemed potentially dangerous"

he moved under braking dangerously, that's it

[toxic siren]

Thats up to the stewards to decide.

Not you.

Not me.

Not the news.

Not the teams.

[remote knoll]

The stewards are drunk and high

[cyan saffron]

this

[stiff bough]

Looks very calm here

[mossy cosmos]

FIA changed their rules last moment in AD21 so I'm not impressed if they changed it again

[stiff bough]

As is within their right :P

[toxic siren]

That has nothing to do with this.

[mossy cosmos]

Whatever

[remote knoll]

Are there rules against the stewards being intoxicated?

[toxic siren]

Within our current ruleset, what we have available, there is no defined rules against moving under braking.

[remote knoll]

because if not then i found the problem

[obtuse elm]

its gone from
"verstappen didn't move under braking"
to
"he did but it was one continuous motion"
to
"it's not up to me to decide, the Stewards didn't say anything"

come on.

[thin berry]

For safety yes there must be

[stiff bough]

Listen buddy, everyone knows AD21 ties in with every dramatic moment. Did you even read the script? Jeez smh

[toxic siren]

They could include it under 33.4 if they wanted

but that's up to them to do

not us.

[remote knoll]

Overtaking rules have always been vague

[thin berry]

Also mb I didn’t see I was pinged

[toxic siren]

And that is good!

[thin berry]

How about we just discuss the possibility of alpine buying engine from uh

[toxic siren]

We don't want rules to be super tight or the sport would be hindered.

[thin berry]

Who was it last, Mercedes?

[remote knoll]

no because it allows drivers to do silly shit like silverstone 2022 or move underbraking and get away with it

[stiff bough]

They have the possibility of buying everyone’s engines now

[remote knoll]

she literally posted this

[toxic siren]

It also how's everything else we have.

[fair night]

thx for sending tricko

[toxic siren]

It was like the first thing I posted.

[obtuse elm]

it literally proves what max did is wrong

[toxic siren]

It doesn't mention braking.

[obtuse elm]

yh

[remote knoll]

damn i didnt even realize that was tricko

[toxic siren]

And hinder is up to the stewards discretion.

[earnest vessel]

We should bring Mazepin back and see if they change the rules again

[obtuse elm]

abnormal change of direction

[remote knoll]

I'm gonna become a steward then

and change the world

[obtuse elm]

I will once again refer to this

[remote knoll]

for my people

[obtuse elm]

hi vertex

[remote knoll]

hello

[toxic siren]

A single change of direction is allowed.

[remote knoll]

I wish I knew you were tricko so I could join terra's side and argue against you

[thin berry]

You’ll probably need more than that ngl

[remote knoll]

absolute baloney sauce

[earnest vessel]

They enforced moving under breaking in 2016 cause max abused it and was dangerous

Last week they could of had the same conclusion and added back the rule

[mossy axle]

Wouldn’t trust that

[toxic siren]

Probably.

[obtuse elm]

under braking it becomes more of a safety hazard in this specific instance
hence 33.4

[remote knoll]

whatever im done conversating

[toxic siren]

Well, they also removed it in 2017

[remote knoll]

you win

and i win

[cyan saffron]

win win situation

[earnest vessel]

It’s this simple really FIA do what they want

FUCK THE GOVERNMENT

[remote knoll]

I won first tho

just remember

[obtuse elm]

yep

[cyan saffron]

gg Vertex

[mossy axle]

You can’t win an argument

[obtuse elm]

ggs

[toxic siren]

No. That's what you think.

[obtuse elm]

?? ☠️

[remote knoll]

but if my mom says i did

[toxic siren]

It's not what the stewards necessarily decide.

[remote knoll]

then that's how it goes

[mossy axle]

Ok then maybe

[toxic siren]

Is it dangerous, perhaps.

[obtuse elm]

again

[earnest vessel]

They crashed of course it’s dangerous

[obtuse elm]

well it is, he should've been penalized tbf

[toxic siren]

So is divebombing, crossing over, and F1 in general.

[fair night]

bruh

[obtuse elm]

there is no way

[fair night]

aint no way

[toxic siren]

I'm still saying the same exact thing.

Same exact.

[mossy axle]

Go Tricko!

[toxic siren]

That he moved once.

[mossy axle]

Go Terra!

[remote knoll]

crossing over and moving underbraking is way more dangerous

[toxic siren]

That it was a continous movement.

[obtuse elm]

its gone from
"verstappen didn't move under braking"
to
"he did but it was one continuous motion"
to
"it's not up to me to decide, the Stewards didn't say anything"
to
"it was dangerous but so is the whole of f1"

????

[fair night]

insane

[toxic siren]

And because it was a continous movement, it was predictable

[obtuse elm]

way more

[lavish ore]

max moved multiple times leading up to turn 3 but we're not ready for that one yet

[earnest vessel]

GO MAZEPIN

[toxic siren]

and because it was predictable, it was safe.

[remote knoll]

so predictable that Lando had to change lines

[toxic siren]

He didn't.

[obtuse elm]

lando almost went into the back of him...cause it was under braking????

[toxic siren]

Not on 55.

[ornate gate]

This again?

[obtuse elm]

insane

[toxic siren]

Lando was going back and forth.

[mossy axle]

No

[remote knoll]

because of Max

[toxic siren]

They can't accept the rules of the sport.

[ornate gate]

What else is new

[toxic siren]

Perhapsm

[fair night]

thats cuz he was trying to avoid him?

[obtuse elm]

you can't accept the truth that lies in front of your eyes

[remote knoll]

the shitty rules made by a kindergarten class

[toxic siren]

But you would have to prove that.

[lavish ore]

on the overhead view it's pretty clear he moves slightly right before going left into lando

[obtuse elm]

because of your glasses of bias

[ornate gate]

Unreasonable Max hate reaches new levels every day

[toxic siren]

Thats one move.

[remote knoll]

we aren't hating Max bro

[obtuse elm]

everything we see right here is proving it

[fair night]

i dont hate max wtf

max is in the wrong

clearly

[obtuse elm]

victimize yourself. great.

[remote knoll]

lmao

[ornate gate]

I didn't victimize myself

[obtuse elm]

if George did the SAME THING I'd have the same reaction

[ornate gate]

I'm not Max Verstappen

[obtuse elm]

yes you did

[lavish ore]

going right then left in the braking zone of a right turn is one move?

[obtuse elm]

you victimized max then and max fans

👍

[ornate gate]

I didn't say shit about Max fans

Did you read?

[toxic siren]

I've sent documentation that proves you wrong and yet you guys still strut around like a duck on chessboard, breaking everything and shitty and being convinced your right.

[fair night]

we did too

[toxic siren]

33.4 doesn't defend you.

[toxic siren]

It can defend you.

In theory

[toxic siren]

I already sent that

it says nothing about moving under braking

[obtuse elm]

max hate
max fans support max
max hate also extends to max fans