community-update-classes

[muted sandal]

This is like 50% of why I haven't bothered buying a single COD game

[pure zinc]

What would be smart is to have a toggle where customization of others is set to default

Ok your side

[quaint dune]

thatd be nice

[vagrant pebble]

They won't ever do that

[quaint dune]

like, the basic camo skins worked fine for bf4

[vagrant pebble]

They want to sell skins, people who buy skins are walking advertisement

[quaint dune]

nothing wrong with going back to that

id rather spend money on DLC map packs than see those types of skins in my battlefield game ngl

idk about you lot

[gentle wedge]

for all the cosmetics they sell they really havent gone overboard even in 2042 compared to other games so you know

theres some precedent

[weary horizon]

Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t counter strike’s cosmetics only for weapons and knives? If it is, then I think that’s the only cosmetic that I am fine with the new bf game

[muted sandal]

Doesn't matter what we think. The entire industry thinks otherwise.

[quaint dune]

yh

and operators

[modern prism]

Problem there; you have 2 different player bases

[quaint dune]

thats true

[pure zinc]

Tbf barely any games have that toggle

[quaint dune]

i just dont like seeing those types of skins in a realistic military shooter

[muted sandal]

CS skins are also for player models, and they're resellable so they're actually valuable

[tired cipher]

We will never get DLC Map packs again, thanks season passes 😄

[quaint dune]

like that one mackay skin that made bro look like anakin skywalker, a burnt bald man

with yellow eyes

i hate it

[modern prism]

True, hell let loose handled that pretty well. Probably you might take a look

[quaint dune]

just give me miltary fatigues and camo

[wispy carbon]

Map packs just aren’t a smart way to monetise anymore

[quaint dune]

thats true but id prefer that over the cosmetics

[tired cipher]

same

[muted sandal]

I reckon we all do

[quaint dune]

like vehicle skins idm, but skins that arent realistic in the setting just ruin the game

surely they can make skins they can sell that are realistically designed

[weary horizon]

Oh thanks, I thought it was only weapons, but at the same time I don’t know why but I just can’t remember seeing other player models in cs

[quaint dune]

just anything other than some of the skins we got in 2042

[quaint dune]

depends

if you watch pro play they all have a gentlemens agreement to use default operator skins

[tired cipher]

They are called agents, came out in csgo during operation . Now in cs2 ct and t use same model for every map so hard to tell

[quaint dune]

but in match making almost everyone uses a different operator/agent skin

i just like the basic style

doesnt ruin my immersion

[tired cipher]

It’s fine because the contrast of the model is extremely visible on screen

everything is designed really well in Cs and around visibility

hopefully ea takes some notes

[quaint dune]

yhh its just some of the darker designed agent skins blend really well in some maps

like skins that have grey on them and grey tints blend really well on overpass

[tired cipher]

I felt this in csgo but not in cs2

[quaint dune]

in cs2 i feel its more noticeable with all the shadows yk

but thats just me

[tired cipher]

Everything is just so bright in new cs

Old one was so dark and grim

[quaint dune]

i prefer csgo still but im just salty cos they ruined bhopping

xD

[tired cipher]

what you see is what you get 🤓

[quaint dune]

lmao

classic

but yh

[marble jacinth]

👍

[quaint dune]

im excited to see what they do with this new battlefield :)

hopefully they actually listen to us for once

[tired cipher]

Hope they run playtest monthly so we can keep giving feedback

[quaint dune]

yuh

i am curious to know if/when they plan to start doing public open playtests

probably not if i had to guess

[marble orchid]

After Stodeh's latest video I'm worried!

[quaint dune]

uh

[weary horizon]

is it true that there was a pole about weapons and classes? And the majority do not care about classes? I can’t find it

[quaint dune]

idk but i know a lot the early hate on 2042 was also because there was no classes

so do with that what you will

but i cant believe battlefield fans would say "we dont care about classes" since thats part of the battlefield identity

[weary horizon]

What about for locking weapons to classes, I just saw I video where the pole was leaning towards people not caring about it

[patent cosmos]

because now a days people have strayed away from all that and mostly just picks the class with the stronger weapon considered meta anyways

so either way it doesnt really matter

[quaint dune]

locking some guns to classes and others not being locked seems like a good idea to me

example, supports not having access to snipers

or maybe assault and supports

[weary horizon]

But I think an actual pole on other platforms would actually give a better response, since I haven’t seen any

[quaint dune]

but also having PDW weapons be accessable to scouts, engineers and maybe assaults

and having LMGs locked souly to support

[weary horizon]

Probably something like bf4 would be perfect

[quaint dune]

yh exactly

carbines and PDWs accessable to p much every class

[patent cosmos]

i like the way they are doing it, more focused on gadget based and you choose whatever gun you want

[quaint dune]

cos imo the bf4 class system was perfection

[weary horizon]

So basically repeating 2042’s mistake, which I skipped because I disliked their direction

[quaint dune]

i didnt mind 2042 later in its life cycle, but there was so many things wrong

the art style wasnt battlefield and neither was the customization

[patent cosmos]

no, def nothing like bf2042, they had operators with different abilities. This is just one set gadgets just everyone gets to choose their weapon

[quaint dune]

literally just port bf4s classes system 1:1 into the new one

and jobs done

[hidden vector]

I prefer truly locked guns

[ancient heath]

Imo movement should be more like bfv but with appropriate pacing, particularly the sliding

[quaint dune]

i mean yh but for some guns it doesnt make sense

[light quarry]

the thing with polls is, if you ask if people care or not and the majority doesnt care it gives a skewed view of 'the people dont want it', if they dont care than having weapons lock is fine to them too. People often put the wrong answers as options on polls that results in a skewed result or interpretation of the results.

[quaint dune]

like PDWs for example

[ancient heath]

Felt vry fluent

[quaint dune]

or carbines

doesnt make sense to lock those to 1 class

but with LMGs it does

and snipers it does

yk

there genuinely wasnt anything wrong with the bf4 system

[hidden vector]

Why not

[quaint dune]

wdym

[hidden vector]

Why does it not make sense to lock those guns to classes

[weary horizon]

I think just some universal weapons would be fine but not all of them, then what’s stopping me from not choosing a (the awful idea of having support/medic) support class with a sniper rifle and camping at base while have unlimited ammo and med kits

[quaint dune]

aight bare with cos im bad at explaining things

[undone tapir]

The bf4 system is great, bf1 and bfv are to restricted in my opinion

[quaint dune]

PDWs are primarily SMGs, it makes sense for scouts/engineers/assaults to have access to those weapons

[hidden vector]

Why

[quaint dune]

snipers are more specialized weapons so it makes sense to have those locked to the scout/recon class

[quaint dune]

cos thats realistic

xD

[hidden vector]

Realistic in what sense

[quaint dune]

ig you didnt read what i wrote

[hidden vector]

Like SMGs/PDWs are just as specialized as snipers. snipers are great at long range and suck close range. SMGs are great at close range and suck at long range

[quaint dune]

yh but SMGs are more widely used

snipers are more specially trained, youre not gonna have the rank and file infantry soldier using a sniper really are you

[ancient heath]

Ar are usually the most versatile weapon so it should stick to the anti-infantry class or assault, don’t want every class to be anti-infantry

[quaint dune]

theyll be specially trained snipers

having an engineer using a sniper rifle makes 0 sense what so ever

[weary horizon]

Smgs/shotguns/dmrs are good options for universal weapons, they could lock carbines for engineers, snipers for recons, lmgs for support, and assault rifles for assault

[quaint dune]

^

[hidden vector]

I mean I agree with this, but not from a realism standpoint

[quaint dune]

that is realistic tho

youre not gonna see engineers in warfare carrying sniper rifles

its 2 skill sets

[hidden vector]

Sure, but that's not the main reason I'd want engineers to not have snipers, it is a game after all. in a milsim, it would absolutely come down to realism

[quaint dune]

and in the world of battlefield, engineers are are the best anti vehicle infantry so if theyre sat at the back of the map with snipers they cant do their job

[hidden vector]

My reasoning comes down to keeping classes unique and keeping things balanced, gameplay stuff, not real life stuff

[quaint dune]

if you have snipers on all classes theyll all play the same way

[weary horizon]

But I do hope that they don’t bring full auto pistols anymore, I’m still having ptsd from the amount of times I died from a g18 in bf4, I still get killed by it to this day
It just makes every sidearm useless compared to it

[quaint dune]

which defeats the purpose

[ancient heath]

Especially support that playstyle is literally counterintuitive

[quaint dune]

like there is genuinely ZERO complaints you can bring to the bf4 system

[hidden vector]

I mean, I'm with you, I want classes to have guns locked

Sure there are

[quaint dune]

personal complaints maybe

but the wider perspective wont share those same complaints

[light quarry]

all complaints are personal, its a personal oppinion after all

[quaint dune]

the 2042 system had guns accessible to most classes/types and 95% of people didnt like that

[hidden vector]

Me included

What harm comes from locking carbines, shotguns, and DMRs to 3 different classes

And I dont ask that like I don't believe there is any harm, I'm actually trying to think of what harm could be done, some examples

[quaint dune]

hmm

well first is shotguns

if we're giving guns/gun types to specific classes based on purpose

itd only make sense for assaults to have shotguns

or maybe supports like it was in bf4

[hidden vector]

My personal class setup has Assault with shotguns

[quaint dune]

yh exactly

[hidden vector]

So we agree there

[quaint dune]

shotguns imo have always belonged to assault

cos its cqc

[limber warren]

They got it wrong with 2042.
They had it right with BF2/3/4

[quaint dune]

where assault thrives

[quaint dune]

this

[weary horizon]

For the love of god pls no frag rounds

[quaint dune]

LOL

[light quarry]

m26 dart anyone?

[quaint dune]

xdd

[limber warren]

Darts were great!

[quaint dune]

airbursts nty

keep those out pls

they were so annoying

[light quarry]

hehehe

[quaint dune]

it never worked for me but always 1 shot me when anyone else used it

[weary horizon]

How about a new weapon class, the battle rifles, like the G3, m27 that could be universal instead of dmrs

[hidden vector]

Assault - SMGs, PDWs, shotguns, medic abilities
Engineer - ARs, mid-range semi-autos
Recon - Snipers, high powered DMRs
Support - LMGs, high caliber battle rifles, carbines

ARs/Battle rifles separated, DMRs/mid-range semi autos separated

[quaint dune]

yes only thing id change with that is give assault access to ARs

cos yk

Assault class

Assault rifles

kinda in the name XD

[hidden vector]

I mean, that's just getting caught up in the name

[quaint dune]

ig but assault rifles have always been used by the assault class

thatd tilt almost everyone by removing that

same with engineers losing access to SMGs

[hidden vector]

Why, they can still use those guns

Are they locked into using assault?

[quaint dune]

but assault has always had access to ARs

why change that xD

[ancient heath]

It’s in the name lol

[hidden vector]

Why not

[pure spruce]

Should be like this:

Assault = AR also let this class to be able to carry Medkit/Medpouch with defil
Engineer = Carbine
Support = LMG and this class only carry Ammobag/Ammopouch
Recon = SR
While the unrestricted would be PDW, Shotgun, DMR.

[quaint dune]

cos thats literally what battlefield has always had

why change what works

[hidden vector]

Has it worked though?

[quaint dune]

they did that with 2042 and look where that got us

[hidden vector]

ARs are always the best guns, I think they need to be balanced

[quaint dune]

bf2, 3, 4

[ancient heath]

So put it exclusively in assault lol

[quaint dune]

^

[pure spruce]

Carbine can compete with AR though atleast in BF4

[marble parrot]

YES YES YES

[ancient heath]

For the assault class to assault lol

[marble parrot]

Should be like this:

Assault = AR also let this class to be able to carry Medkit/Medpouch with defil
Engineer = Carbine
Support = LMG and this class only carry Ammobag/Ammopouch
Recon = SR
While the unrestricted would be PDW, Shotgun, DMR.

[quaint dune]

thats what carbines are for

[hidden vector]

In bF3 and 4 they are the best guns, everyone uses them

[marble parrot]

Should be like this:

Assault = AR also let this class to be able to carry Medkit/Medpouch with defil
Engineer = Carbine
Support = LMG and this class only carry Ammobag/Ammopouch
Recon = SR
While the unrestricted would be PDW, Shotgun, DMR.

[hidden vector]

Getting caught up in the name of the class, so how about I just rename it to Medic

[weary horizon]

Support - ammo pouch and C4

[hidden vector]

Medic - SMGs, PDWs, shotguns, medic abilities
Engineer - ARs, mid-range semi-autos
Recon - Snipers, high powered DMRs
Support - LMGs, high caliber battle rifles, carbines

[pure spruce]

nah, it always been Assault

[hidden vector]

Now it's fine apparentlyt

[marble parrot]

SAME AS BAD COMPANY 2

[quaint dune]

its rly not tho

assault class has ALWAYS had access to ARs

[pure spruce]

That's why it's called Assault

[quaint dune]

in almost every class based FPS assault will have access to ARs

[hidden vector]

It's called medic now, I just renamed it

It's not assault any more

This is a different class

[quaint dune]

balance ARs by making them Assault class exclusive

thats why carbines exist

give other classes carbines

[hidden vector]

No, balance ARs by not making them better than everything else

[quaint dune]

bro idk about you but i find shotguns way more unbalanced than ARs

those things 1 shot from 60m away

[hidden vector]

Shotguns are USELESS after a certain range, ARs are good at most ranges, apples and oranges

[pure spruce]

idk why people still think AR are OP while there is Carbine that can compete the AEK/M416/ACE23

[quaint dune]

AEK my beloved

[hidden vector]

Yeah, carbines should be balanced as well

[quaint dune]

ARs are argueably the most balanced gun type in the game

[weary horizon]

But the medic is assault in 3 and 4, where you could just not carry a med pack and defib, just grenade launchers

[pure spruce]

That's why Carbine are like everyones class.

[quaint dune]

if you disagree it might genuinely be a skill issue

[hidden vector]

SMGs should be better at close range, and carbines should be on par with ARs at close range, but ARs beat both at mid-range. It starts with making sure ARs don't have any close range buffs like in past games such as faster deploy speeds, faster ADS speeds, and more accurate hipfire. I'd even consider having ARs do slightly less damage in extreme close range, with their damage peaking at close to mid-range, then dropping off after mid-range. SMGs excel at close range, ARs at mid range, carbines are just ok at close and medium range.

[quaint dune]

cos ive never died to an AR and thought "that gun is so broken they need to nerf ARs"

[pure spruce]

Operation Locker and Metro be like

[quaint dune]

oh youre speaking love language

lalalala

[gray nimbus]

Will battlefield fix the classes so that weapons are more specialized for each class or is EA absolutely determined to ruin this game because of micro transactions ?

[hidden vector]

They want skins to be able to be used for every class

So the latter

[quaint dune]

and this is why we get games that suck

[raven galleon]

Doesn't make sense

[hidden vector]

ikr

[limber warren]

I hate nerfs in general. Slight buffs should be the rule, unless you’re the Vex Mythoclast and could melt at all ranges in D1

[raven galleon]

No I mean it's not as profitable

[hidden vector]

It makes money though, apparently. otherwise they wouldnt do it

[quaint dune]

some guns do end up needing nerfs

but most the time its not needed

[hidden vector]

They wouldn't do it if it wasn't more profitable

[raven galleon]

Whales will buy skins on class locked weapons, thus buy more skins and spend more

not like your regular player is dishing out money on skins

[quaint dune]

cos a good battlefield game will make more money than skins on a bad battlefield

thats what their logic should be

[hidden vector]

I agree with this, but that requires more hard work. They prefer less work to make their profit

[quaint dune]

a good battlefield with no micro transactions will make way more money than cosmetics and microtransactions on a bad battlefield will

[weary horizon]

You know what needs to be nerfed and focused on? Splash damage from lavs and helicopters

[pure spruce]

You guys buy skins in BF? What in the Battlefield is that??

[quaint dune]

some times

depends on the price of said skin

and if it actually looks good

on 2042 i bought the guns that had camo meshing on them

cos they looked good

[pure spruce]

Well sadly i'm still playing and stuck with BF4 for almost 9 years. And atleast the skins are obtainable thru the Battlepacks

[quaint dune]

yk the ghillie guns

[hidden vector]

I have never done this, not with real money

[hidden vector]

DId you ever give BFV a shot? The gameplay is pretty good

[quaint dune]

bfv was a decent game but it was just left to die by the devs

when they first released the pacific update the game was at its peak

[hidden vector]

WWII really is the ideal setting for a Battlefield game

[quaint dune]

but then they ruined it with some more updates

and it never recovered

[muted sandal]

You could already buy SPECACT skins in BC2 BTW...

[quaint dune]

the gunplay in bfv was solid enough and the maps werent terrible

[hidden vector]

It went too far into the unknown battles idea, and not having the Eastern front is absolutely unacceptable for a WWII game'

[quaint dune]

thats true

[gray nimbus]

At least there are locked weapons in bfv , this new one is without a doubt going to be awful

[weary horizon]

I wouldn’t call laser accurate weapons solid, when the majority where using the stg

[hidden vector]

BFV has the closest to perfect weapon set up in my mind

[quaint dune]

no but i mean the feel of the guns

they felt good

not saying it was actually good yk

[muted sandal]

BFV had great gunplay

[quaint dune]

but they felt good

[limber warren]

BF1 is still my favorite BF to this day. The atmosphere has been unmatched. The hectic warfare due to map design were a chefs kiss for me. I wish they could’ve moved that feeling to the later releases :/

[quaint dune]

the sturmgewher or however you say it was my favourite gun till they nerfed the ttk

[bleak stratus]

i dont think this class weapon unlock a good idea

[quaint dune]

THIS

the only BF game that can compete with BF3 or 4 is BF1

that game is a masterpiece

[muted sandal]

Thinking accurate weapons is a downside is some backwards thinking

[quaint dune]

i mean not entirely

[pure spruce]

yeah BF1 have the best ambience and music.

[gray nimbus]

It’s not, EA wants to ruin this game

[hidden vector]

It's still the best gun in the game

[quaint dune]

but having laser beam weapons in WWII is a bit weird

yk

[pure spruce]

i played that game too but only like a short time.

since it's hard to find an Asia/Oceania server.

[quaint dune]

but i also like having guns that arent impossible to use

[muted sandal]

They weren't laser beams tho

[quaint dune]

some of them were

[hidden vector]

Good thing about BFV is that nearly every gun has a use, there aren't really "bad" guns, maybe the AT rifle guns

[muted sandal]

You still had to control them to be accurate

[quaint dune]

there was some p cheeks guns in bfv

[hidden vector]

Which ones

[quaint dune]

lets not be lying now

[ancient heath]

Movement was amazing

[quaint dune]

i cant remember names since its been years

but if i look at a gun list i can tell you

[hidden vector]

List me the guns you were using incorrectly 😉

[limber warren]

I also miss the commander role from BF2. Artillery barrages, ammo crates, UAVs, Humvee drops for squads on the outskirts. Was a great mechanic they never brought back

[muted sandal]

Once the pacific update dropped, and when they began messing with TTK a lot of previously niche guns became irrelevant

[quaint dune]

commander mode in bf4 was good

[quaint dune]

xD

[weary horizon]

Stg, Bren, Lewis gun etc etc

[quaint dune]

oh yh the bren

the bren gun was one of them

that gun was useless asf

stg was good tho

i liked the stg

[muted sandal]

there's like 3 of em :p

[hidden vector]

All 3 of those guns are like mid-tier

[limber warren]

It was decent but not the same. Also being able to go lone wolf and C4 the artillery guns was awesome

[bleak stratus]

i cant imagine it play very well with that visual is the way we can confirm who we need to kill first without that visual we get to much confused and people who cant handle that big a challange would always go with the tools to see better aka cheats and we might aswell try to limit that in bf games but hey thats just my thoughts in on the matter

[hidden vector]

Bren gun has no recoil and super fast reload

[quaint dune]

it was also super weak

[hidden vector]

Lewis has 8000 bullets and great for mid-range

[quaint dune]

xD

[hidden vector]

Hit the head

It has no recoil

[unique meteor]

Is there a specific place to leave feedback from last weekend's playtest?

or is this the place to do it?

[muted sandal]

lol just shoot them

[hidden vector]

The STG is like A-tier as well

[weary horizon]

Fg-42 where the last bullet is a guaranteed headshot

[hidden vector]

FG-42 is S-tier

It's just the sturm with 10 less rounds (Sturm is OP tier)

[quaint dune]

i loved the sturm

[hidden vector]

OP

[quaint dune]

xD

[ionic burrow]

I really hope we get weapon restrictions, I don't understand what they are doing. What is the point in havingf classes if everyone can use whatever weapon they want to

[quaint dune]

till they fucked the TTK

[hidden vector]

It's still OP

[quaint dune]

well yh it would be

they reverted the TTK nerf

and put it back to how it was

xD

[hidden vector]

Sturm, M2, ZK are all OP

[quaint dune]

but when they nerfed the TTK the sturm was useless

[muted sandal]

FYI a bunch of you are on different platforms so the gunplay was completely different for each of you

[raven galleon]

What is the point of playing any other class if you can just play Assault with 2 main weps and stims

[quaint dune]

yup

i played on ps4

at the time at least

didnt rly play it on pc much cos the game was p much dead

[hidden vector]

PC is just a completely different game from console

[weary horizon]

The bar was slept on, but was op

[hidden vector]

BAR is A-tier

A notch below the FG

[quaint dune]

we've already gone over this yh

im personally hoping they use the bf4 system again

[hidden vector]

I prefer truly locked guns

[weary horizon]

This !

[muted sandal]

I prefer fully open

[quaint dune]

banned

shadow realmed

[weary horizon]

Nope

[hidden vector]

Sicko

[muted sandal]

[quaint dune]

i refuse to allow supports to sit at the back of the map with snipers

while also being allowed to never run out of ammo

no

[ancient heath]

I refuse to allow another class to use ars

[muted sandal]

Pff same useless rabble either way, Recon or not

[hidden vector]

"So sick of these snipers over here, I'm gonna take them out with my heli." They have stingers

[quaint dune]

XD

[weary horizon]

Unless friendly fire is allowed, then yes

[quaint dune]

LOL

[quaint dune]

THIIIIIIS

just make every lobby hardcore mode

[raven galleon]

Is engineer being able to have 2 rocket launchers with a total of 12 ammo intended or not?

[muted sandal]

Probably not

[quaint dune]

we wont know what they intend to do till we get further along the development cycle

[raven galleon]

Yeah that's what I thought, just hope it won't be an oversight kek

[quaint dune]

xD

[ancient heath]

Heard assault can easily kill a tank too lol

[quaint dune]

idk about that

[ionic burrow]

I was trying, but couldn't pull it off

[quaint dune]

i choose not to go near tanks

cos they anger me

[raven galleon]

Assault being able to switch to the 2nd main weapon while ADS'ing and start firing it in a span of a second, dice pls fix

[weary horizon]

2 main weapons?? What?!

[hidden vector]

"Ah, this guy's pushing my sniper's nest, shotgun time"

[quaint dune]

bros got that overkill cod perk

xD

[raven galleon]

Yh whenever ammo is on the low end just press 3 and instantly full magdump into 5 enemies mid corridor

[quaint dune]

uhm

[muted sandal]

"Remember, switching to your 100rd LMG is faster than reloading!"

[quaint dune]

🕯️

[hidden vector]

Dang, I've fired all 8 of my shotgun shots, good thing I have a 2nd shotgun

[quaint dune]

akimbo shotguns would go crazy

xdd

[hidden vector]

The enemy: "I count 6 shots."
Me: "I count 2 guns"

[quaint dune]

akimbo model 87s

[raven galleon]

literally... If they gonna let Assault keep the 2nd main gun, then make it switch for bit longer

[quaint dune]

idk about the 2nd main gun yk

[hidden vector]

Talkin bout sniping a guy across the map with these

[quaint dune]

XD

[ancient heath]

Ye maybe don’t do that

[hidden vector]

"Ah, that LMG stopped spraying from his window, I can push now" Guy pulls out a 2nd LMG with 200 rounds

[raven galleon]

Also no penality of any sort for having a second gun

[ancient heath]

Must rly hate attrition lol

[hidden vector]

"Ha, what's this Engineer gonna do, he's 150m away!" Bolt action round enters through my forehead and leaves through my occipital lobe

This is why I don't want shotguns/carbines/DMRs unlocked. I can go from an AR, to a sniper, to a carbine, to a DMR, all ranges covered

[pure zinc]

Hey you just broke the nda

[quaint dune]

xdd

[unique meteor]

Why?

[pure zinc]

Nda

You signed an nda

[unique meteor]

Oh sorry!

[pure zinc]

You can't disclose anything or talk about anything you played lol

[unique meteor]

Where do i leave the feedback?

[rapid marlin]

For your earlier question

T0TALfps — 08:30
The purpose was to stress test, versus provide feedback

There will be ample opportunities in the future to do so!

[unique meteor]

I thought this was the official channe;

[pure zinc]

Well there's a survey they sent you via email

[rapid marlin]

nah this is public info only

[quaint dune]

you still havent deleted the messages

xD

[unique meteor]

I didnt get it

[pure zinc]

And you aren't in the battlefield labs discord as those are people who were invited to labs and not this test specifically

[hidden vector]

Check ur junk

[gray nimbus]

Not sure why people are screaming nda on this feedback ; you’re not revealing anything except what we already know

[pure zinc]

Ayo

💀

LMAO

[hidden vector]

Pause

[pure zinc]

That looked Hella wrong

💀😭😭😭

[hidden vector]

I mean, it's still good advice, cancer and all

[pure zinc]

Cancer?

[hidden vector]

I hardly knew'er?

[unique meteor]

So devs dont eally want user feedbackon this test?

[rapid marlin]

nope

[gray nimbus]

No they aren’t looking for feedback : ea games told them how to make the game and they’re just bullshitting everyone

[rapid marlin]

You can discuss what they said in their classes blog just not what they've actually done.

[hidden vector]

The feedback responses probably goes into their junk, and they aint checkin their junk

[unique meteor]

Also, why make a specific discord channel for this community update if we cant discuss the thing they want to test

dumb

[pure zinc]

This wasnt exaclty for feedback, it was more for server testing to see if it can handle more people

Im assuming soon they will take off nda and make labs big

[quaint dune]

ffs

XD

[unique meteor]

No email in junk

[gray nimbus]

Because they aren’t looking for feedback they don’t care it’s just a stress test the only feedback they need is from some accountant at ea games telling them what makes the most money

[elder nimbus]

Are we allowed to discuss Class Feedback here for Labs? Because it is very much not clear. The survey was not helpful.

[pure zinc]

Its just to talk about classes that they discussed

Information that isnt leaked

[hidden vector]

I mean, you can still discuss publicly accessible info

[elder nimbus]

Where do I see the information that isn't leaked? LMFAO

[unique meteor]

I mean, I didnt divulge anything that wasnt in that post, but OK

[rapid marlin]

https://discord.com/channels/140933721929940992/1374763710169616525

blogs at the top of that

[pure zinc]

That's why this whole nda shit is so stupid, they need to stop with it. The cat is out of the bag and they need to make the tests big

[hidden vector]

Yeah, their junk is already hangin out, like we can see it

[pure zinc]

💀

[gray nimbus]

The best way to provide feedback is to come up with a way that they can make money through micro transactions , what’s a creative way to incorporate weapon skins in a way that keeps weapons locked

[quaint dune]

aw hell nah

chats becomin freaky

[pure zinc]

They didn't do none class locked for micro transactions

People who say that just say that to say it

There's no proof really

Battlefreak

[gray nimbus]

yeah but this is ea games we’re talking about here

[elder nimbus]

Thanks. Alright then I think the choice to not lock weapons to classes is a death knell for this game. Strict roles are what make Battlefield - Battlefield. Additionally the idea of "training" or "perks" some might call is pretty disgusting in a Battlefield game. I want to be able to identify an opposing player by their weapon and instantly know their capabilities. As it stands that is impossible.

[pure zinc]

Doesn't really do much

Majority dont even play their class

They just play for the gun

AR

Its the majority

Only like 8-10 people actually play their class

[elder nimbus]

2042's hardcore mode where classes are weapon locked proves otherwise.

[pure zinc]

It doesnt change much

[elder nimbus]

So does the entire history of the game.

[pure zinc]

That's hardcore though

People don't play their classes majority wise

[hidden vector]

You can't force players to play their intended role, but you can nudge them in that direction. One way to do that is to lock weapons

[pure zinc]

They play for the gun

So ARS

[elder nimbus]

People don't because they aren't forced to.

[pure zinc]

Well

[elder nimbus]

Obviously

[pure zinc]

You think no class locked will kill the game

When that barely does anything

Battlefield 4 restrictions were so light

All classes had carbines

[hidden vector]

I don't think it will kill the game, EA will make less money but that's on them

[gray nimbus]

It’s definitely going to kill the game the vast vast vast majority of players don’t want it

[pure zinc]

Only 1 class locked guns class per class

[pure zinc]

No it won't

You are blowing out of proportions

It won't change much

[gray nimbus]

Yeah it will look at twitter

[elder nimbus]

Bad Company 2 & 3 did a lot to encentivize players to use their class. Class based actions should reward more points. It should be clearer that revives restore tickets. If you want to be top on the leaderboard it should be because you've contributed more to your role than just kills.

[pure zinc]

People dont fucking play the classes much anyways

And this is better sorta

[elder nimbus]

There is already a game for that dude, it is called COD.

[gray nimbus]

I completely disagree .

[elder nimbus]

I don't want Battlefield to be COD

[pure zinc]

People will stop choosing a class specifically for the gun and it makes it easier to choose a class you want to play for the class as there isnt class locked

[elder nimbus]

I don't want perks and free weapon picks.

[pure zinc]

Not everything is cod, drop the cod ptsd schizophrenia

[hidden vector]

Also, why they gotta name my soldier, why cant my soldier just be me

[pure zinc]

Im talking about none hardcore

They dont

[elder nimbus]

Nameless soldiers, class bound weapons, no perks/skills. Your gadget and gun defines your character.

This is what Battlefield is.

[pure zinc]

Majority is usually people just using ARS and dont play the gadgets or help the team with them

[elder nimbus]

Because they aren't forced to.

[pure zinc]

Perks/skills is the same system as battlefield 4 perks

💀

[hidden vector]

BF4's class system wasn't ideal

[pure zinc]

You say gun defines class yet only 1 gun class is locked per class

That's nothing

There are carbines on every class

[hidden vector]

Who mentioned BF4

[pure zinc]

Not much of a difference

[elder nimbus]

If the only way to get an AR is by playing Assault then they'll play the greedy class, Assault. People who want to play as a team will fill roles and you'll know that the Medic playing a Medic is going to heal you or resupply you, not yeet into the front lines and die.

[weary horizon]

Bf4 perks didn’t make a difference, and no one actually notices them

[elder nimbus]

As it is now I'm wasting time running up to medics who only went support to heal and ammo themselves.

[gray nimbus]

You’re never going to change your mind, but the game is going to suck without locked weapons. If they want a battle royal mode with no classes fine but a regular conquest mode without classes will be terrible

[pure zinc]

So you admit that its mot the games problem but the players

Like I said

No class locked doesnt change much

[elder nimbus]

Indeed

The game will not catch on without weapons locked to class.

It is a death knell

[bleak stratus]

bf3-bf4 are alive and well becouse of its class system and its serverbrowser

[elder nimbus]

Not everything needs to be COD

[pure zinc]

Thing is a lot of what you are saying is subjective and isnt exaclty objective truth

[pure zinc]

Cod didnt create everything, stop bringing up that game so fucking much

😭

Swear

Yall talk about cod more then battlefield

[hidden vector]

It doesn't change selfish players being selfish, but it affects other things. There is more to this discussion than everyone selecting one gun or people not playing their role

[fiery rune]

this is the dumbest shit i think i've ever read

[elder nimbus]

Literally everyone on Twitter, Reddit and 4chan agrees that classes should be weapon locked. EA should listen to the FANS of Battlefield. What they say will be how it goes. Word of mouth and community sentiment is what makes or breaks a multiplayer shooter in today's market.

[pure zinc]

You are blowing things out of proportions

[elder nimbus]

You might have big openeing sales by ignoring them but the game will die immediately without your most passionate hardcore fans support.

[pure zinc]

Battlefield 4 class locked and no class locked isnt even that far apart LMAO

Every class has a carbine

😭😭😭

Only 1 is locked per class

That is nothing lmao

Classic battlefield fan Stockholm syndrome

[hidden vector]

BF4's weapon system wasn't ideal. There seems to be this assumption that if you want locked weapons, you want BF4.

[bleak stratus]

dont forget we didnt pay premium for the game and premium for dlc's

[elder nimbus]

We have something like 5000 games releasing every year. The ones that succeed are the ones closest to their community.

[pure zinc]

No class locked makes it where people will stop choosing a class for the gun and choose a class only for the gadgets

[polar holly]

i dont actually want DICE to listen to what the fans want bc the fans dont know whats good and whats not. If 2042 was less of a failure people wouldnt care about weapons being for every class

[fiery rune]

the fans don't even know what they want

[pure zinc]

Lol

[elder nimbus]

We have too many hero shooters, too many non-class focused shooters. Battlefield was unique. Why take away what makes it unique?

What makes it unique is what makes it appealing

[polar holly]

there is a lot more to bf than class locked weapons

[hidden vector]

I mean, that's what I think. I don't like that carbines, DMRs, and shotguns are unlocked

[pure zinc]

Brother 1 gun class being locked doesnt change much, chill tf out 💀

[gray nimbus]

You guys defending unlocked weapons should work for blizzard “You guys think you do but you don’t” lol

[pure zinc]

4s was so negligible

💀😭

[elder nimbus]

Classes with strong identities is what makes Battlefield work. We've seen what happens when it isn't, you get 2042.

[pure zinc]

Acting like 2 gun classes were locked per class

[fiery rune]

it was so appealing i hated playing battlefield games

[pure zinc]

And no class locked doesnt do much. The classes aren't defined by the guns and are defined by their gadgets😭💀

[hidden vector]

When did @elder nimbus ever mention BF4, I'm so lost

[elder nimbus]

Then there are thousands of other games to play if you don't like locked weapons LMFAO

Go play those games.

[elder nimbus]

I said 3 and Bad Company.

[pure zinc]

Battlefield and other games aren't the same

You act like this 1 thing makes a big difference when it doesnt

💀

[elder nimbus]

It is

It does

[pure zinc]

Nope

[hidden vector]

It does

[elder nimbus]

Why do you want DICE to fail yet again?

[pure zinc]

When did I say that

Im not the one blowing things out of proportions

[elder nimbus]

Battleblock Theater succeeded where 2042 failed, why do you think that is?

[weary horizon]

Tbf, weapons and classes in bf4 were and still is the perfect battlefield experience

[gray nimbus]

You said that by defending unlocked classes , the game is going to fail because of that

[pure zinc]

You want battlefield 4s class locked? That was negligible in the first place lmao and no class locked is barely any difference

[hidden vector]

Disagree, I can switch from a Sniper, to a shotgun, to a DMR, to a carbine all in one class

[pure zinc]

You dont know the future though

You put your feelings over objective truth

[elder nimbus]

Bad Company 1/2 & BF3 were peak Battlefield.

[pure zinc]

You dont know the future

[elder nimbus]

I want those games.

With a faster TTK

[gray nimbus]

I have common sense that’s good enough

[pure zinc]

@wind oyster

[pure zinc]

Me to

[fiery rune]

SO PLAY THEM. they still exist! you can play them right now!

[elder nimbus]

We don't need to know the future. All you have to do is look at the fans and the history of the franchise. Games that deviated from the formula failed.

End of story.

[weary horizon]

Yes, and they are called universal weapons for a reason, its the same argument if you pick a class for the gadget

[gray nimbus]

Not according to every social media outlet you don’t you’re in the vast vast minority

[hidden vector]

I don't want universal guns

[pure zinc]

Yeah no

People say the game will die becuase of this when it doesnt change anything really compared to battlefield 4s class locked guns

[gray nimbus]

Ok well when the game bombs you’ll see

[weary horizon]

If I want a spawn beacon but I want to be aggressive I’ll do recon with a dmr or carbine, it just works, and I’m not op

[pure zinc]

Keep dreaming

[elder nimbus]

The game will fail if it ships with perks and unbound weapons.

[pure zinc]

Why dont you play your favorite game that you bring up 24/7 COD?

[elder nimbus]

Gauranteed.

[pure zinc]

Since battlefield fans seem to love talking about that game

[pure zinc]

Perks were in battlefield 4

💀

You unlocked the perks as you played

[hidden vector]

BF4 still not mentioned

[pure zinc]

Its no different

Holy shit

[elder nimbus]

They're illiterate.

[hidden vector]

BF4 class system was not ideal. I don't want that

[fiery rune]

a lot of people want that

[hidden vector]

I don't want BF4 weapon setup

[weary horizon]

They were barely noticeable, and they don’t make a difference in terms of gameplay, and after all these years, I even forget that they exist

[pure zinc]

Well they are making them more noticeable for the classes to be more unique

Which isnt a bad thing

[mystic escarp]

i like how bf1 did classes

[hidden vector]

@pure zinc be like "why do you love BF4 so much, it has the things you say you don't want" we're over here never mentioning BF4

[pure zinc]

The perks compliment the class

Just like they did in 4s

[cinder osprey]

Bf1 was goated

[pure zinc]

I mentioned it becuase these are features in 4

[hidden vector]

And?

[pure zinc]

A critically acclaimed battlefield game

💀

[quaint dune]

argueably the best in the series

[hidden vector]

It's almost like the weapon setup is just on aspect of the game

[pure zinc]

If you dont want battlefield 4 then do you want 3, BC 2/1, hardline, V?

[ionic burrow]

BF3 was peak, BF4 was pretty solid though. I think having the class locked weapons could be a difference maker when it comes to the Battle Roayale mode as well

[hidden vector]

I want V or 1

[pure zinc]

Ok

[weary horizon]

And was praised by everyone, and it had classes and locked weapons, and actually brought more players to the franchise because of its system

[pure zinc]

Well people want different things

There isnt black or white

[cinder osprey]

Honestly, i would love another hardline battlefield

[quaint dune]

wasnt hardline the worst performing one before 2042

[pure zinc]

Hardline wasnt trash really though

[hidden vector]

I mean, this is exactly my point. You keep bringing up BF4 like the people you're talking to keep using it as an example of what to do in terms of classes. Bitvar and I haven't done that

[pure zinc]

It was underrated

[quaint dune]

cant rly comment as i never played it

[weary horizon]

Hardline was underrated, and honestly was fun and balanced

[cinder osprey]

Idk and i really dont care. I enjoyed the crap out of it

[elder nimbus]

True that

[quaint dune]

but i just ask based on what ive seen and heard

[pure zinc]

Yeah but they complain about features that were in past battlefield games (excluding 2042)

[hidden vector]

I can like BF4 and not like some of its features

[pure zinc]

Battlefield fans have different wants

[elder nimbus]

BF1 had other issues that made it struggle. Mostly the PR departments intense hatred for its fans. But core mechanics wise and gameplay design it was great.

[quaint dune]

yhyh thats fine, but it wouldnt make sense for EA to do another one for one the worst performing games theyve made you get me?

[pure zinc]

Ok

[hidden vector]

I loved BF4 for the most part, but there were things I really didn't like about it. One being how the weapons were sorted. Vehicles are also nuts, maps aren't amazing

[pure zinc]

Every battlefield isnt perfect

[hidden vector]

True'

[quaint dune]

rah bros insulting bf4 maps

[pure zinc]

Ofc some are good and better then others

[quaint dune]

(i jk i jk)

some bf4 maps sucked ass

[whole forge]

thats heresay

[hidden vector]

I didn't say they were bad, some were great, but for the most part they were just ok, some were bad

[quaint dune]

nah bro some were shit

lmfao

floodzone can burn

hated that map

or whatever it was called

[whole forge]

just swim ez

[quaint dune]

i liked it for TDM and shit but for conquest it sucked

[pure zinc]

Battlefield swim

Jk

[weary horizon]

Nah, I’ll stay at the rooftops

[quaint dune]

but imo bf4 had the best overall maps in the franchise

[hidden vector]

In the end, I think if they go universal guns it won't kill the game but it won't be as good as it could be. if they go locked weapons, they gotta go all the way. No guns are universal

[quaint dune]

nobody wants universal guns, and if you do, youre lying to yourself

to quote blizzard. you may think you do but you dont

[fiery rune]

all guns are universal that's why i can shoot all of them irl

[pure zinc]

Some people do

I couldn't care really

Both have its pros and cons

[quaint dune]

yh that is true

[hidden vector]

Typically, from what I've seen, those that want universal guns wouldn't be too upset if they ended up locked. Now on the other hand, those that want locked weapons, it makes a big difference for them if they go with universal. The smart thing to do is to go locked

[elder nimbus]

Indeed

[fiery rune]

i won't play the game if guns are locked

[elder nimbus]

Same

[hidden vector]

OMG

[quaint dune]

i hope they lock some guns behind challenges like in bf4

[pure zinc]

Pros: People stop playing class for gun and play it only for the gadgets.

Increases people using the class they want to use as their favorite gun class is on every class so its easier to choose any class you want.

[elder nimbus]

I will NOT play if the weapons are not locked and if they don't get rid of the perks. I've waited this long for a proper Battlefield and I can keep waiting.

[hidden vector]

Cons: universal guns makes those classes less defined, it allows for strange combinations that go against a class's intended role, it reduces the need for teamplay, it creates more unpredictable encounters with enemies leading to higher RNG, etc. etc.

[weary horizon]

I’m willing to compromise and agree, if that’s what it takes to please everyone

[pure zinc]

Its like both class locked guns and none have pros and cons in my eyes and either or I dont care

[elder nimbus]

Same with my clan of buddies that still play old Battlefield games. We'll skip it. 100-ish may not be that much of a sales loss but from what I see online it is going to be a similar sentiment among the core audience.

[pure zinc]

Go against the classes role yet every class had carbines which aren't too different from ARs in past games

[ancient heath]

Supports shouldn’t be using snipers lmao

[hidden vector]

The Pros and cons of locked guns are more in line with what Battlefield is as a series

[ancient heath]

At all

[quaint dune]

TRUEEEEEEE

[hidden vector]

No, I don't want all classes to have carbines

[pure zinc]

Ok

See

Different people want different things

[quaint dune]

well in bf4 didnt engineers have PDWs instead of carbines?

[pure zinc]

Its not black and white

[elder nimbus]

You don't like having an unlimited ammo sniper perched up on the top of the map with infinite heals? Say it ain't so! LMFAO

[weary horizon]

However, there should two main weapon types to each class, example support - lmgs and battle rifles
Engineers - carbines and smgs

[pure zinc]

They had PDW and carbine

[quaint dune]

or was it PDWs instead of ARs

[quaint dune]

that was it

knew it was one of em

[hidden vector]

Right. I still prefer BF4's system over universal, but by no means do I really like BF4's system. I prefer truly locked classes

[wind oyster]

hi

[pure zinc]

Snipers don't make a noticeable impact matches ever really

[fiery rune]

why do players prefer having fewer choices available

[quaint dune]

true but they are annoyingh

xD

[wind oyster]

theres no real reason

[elder nimbus]

For low shooting skill players, a critical audience in a Battlefield game who typically fill support roles, it does matter.

[pure zinc]

Yeah

[quaint dune]

cos its not battlefield

[wind oyster]

let them have fewer options it doesnt matter

[elder nimbus]

They are the people who will be picked off instead of healing/repairing.

[wind oyster]

they will still play like garbage regardless

[quaint dune]

battlefield has never given you access to every weapon on every class

not till 2042

and that game was shit

[elder nimbus]

Tru

[pure zinc]

Also playing as a sniper in conquest sorta nerfs the team

You could be going for the obj and but you can't as you not having a primary that isnt a sniper cuts off CQB a lot

[quaint dune]

why change formulas that work

it tilts me when devs change smth that has proven to work for years

[dusk ether]

Snipers could do this anyway by trading a death for a full resupply

[white temple]

What about strategic conquest?

[fiery rune]

so you associate a change with a game that wasn't successful for reasons unrelated to the change

[pure zinc]

Still

[quaint dune]

2042 was unsuccessful for many reasons

[weary horizon]

But that sniper could place a spawn beacon on objectives to help their team, as well as tugs

[pure zinc]

Using your secondary nerfs you sorta

[dusk ether]

Oh pizzacat it’s been ages since I last saw you in here

[pure zinc]

Well yeah but they aren't making an impact as much as someone with an assualt rifle

[quaint dune]

the over all gameplay was not good, there was no classes at the start, the games performance was bad and many other reasons

[pure zinc]

Anything other then sniper

[white temple]

2042 was terrible

[quaint dune]

^

[pure zinc]

Yeah

[fiery rune]

they took away my clip posting privilege :(

[pure zinc]

Its just decent now

[quaint dune]

2042 had a few moments where it could be fun but overall was a complete failure

[pure zinc]

The least battlefieldy battlefield game

[quaint dune]

lmao

but hey

[white temple]

Nah its still like a on the worser end mid

[quaint dune]

we got some decent games out of 2042s failure

[dusk ether]

Same, now it’s just regulars, and you can’t get regular

[quaint dune]

and 2042 failing also sent people back to bf1 and 4

so thats a dub

[weary horizon]

I think that you haven’t seen the tenacity of those recons and their beacons in bf4s siege of Shanghai map at the A objective

[hidden vector]

Yeah, I hesitate taking any inspiration from 2042. I don't think the game failed just because of the class system, but it was a big part I think. Class identity is important in Battlefield, universal guns take away from that. The classes become less unique, switching from class to class doesn't feel like a big change when you can just use the same primary with both.

[white temple]

5 still has a good playerbase which is good

[quaint dune]

LMFAO

[pure zinc]

Im talking more about like majority wise

[quaint dune]

when i last played it i couldnt get a lobby

[pure zinc]

In general not just 1 map and 1 match

[quaint dune]

and the 2 lobbies i got had 4 cheaters in

so i uninstalled again xD

[white temple]

Has about 5 lobbies constantly

[pure zinc]

I play on console lol

[quaint dune]

thats not a good playerbase bro

5 lobbies is not good

[pure zinc]

Battlefield 4 on console is so vanilla

[white temple]

For a should be dead game its good

[quaint dune]

ig yh

that being said

[white temple]

5 full lobbies of strategic conquest thats all i play

[quaint dune]

i need to resintall bf4 again

[white temple]

Theres more of tactical and stuff

[quaint dune]

finally got more storage

i thing i would like to see

for new bf

[hidden vector]

Yeah, I've never had an issue finding a BFV game on PC

[quaint dune]

is guns to be locked behind challenges

like in bf3

4*

[pure zinc]

Battlefield V: 11,959 24-hour peak

Battlefield 4: 2,446 24-hour peak

[quaint dune]

those challenges were fun

[quaint dune]

didnt bfv go f2p on steam for a while?

[pure zinc]

Not sure

[idle bay]

No

[white temple]

Just hope its not completely cod infected

[hidden vector]

I don't know if it was free, but it was under $5, I think all of them were (besides maybe 2042, idk)

[quaint dune]

yh

nah 2042 was also super cheap at one point

its when i got it XD

it was like 6 quid

[fiery rune]

ok actually i have a question for @hidden vector

in your ideal world, what weapon types are available for recon

[white temple]

2042 is £7 rn lmao still not worth it

[hidden vector]

Bolt actions, DMRs

[quaint dune]

lmfao

i think for 7 it could be worth

2042 can still be fun

but the game itself is not good

[white temple]

Fr

[hidden vector]

MAYBE 1 or two guns that are bit different than those two types

[quaint dune]

tbh

ill give this to 2042

[fiery rune]

could a recon not be more effective on the frontlines with an assault rifle?

[quaint dune]

the gunplay was good

the gunplay felt smooth and very responsive

[white temple]

Yh

[hidden vector]

They would be, yes

[quaint dune]

like the gunplay for 2042 was very battlefieldy

but the rest of the game wasnt

[fiery rune]

snipers and dmrs are very restraining to one specific play style

[hidden vector]

True

[ancient heath]

But you should 3d spot a a distance not close quarters

[white temple]

2042 was basically a run and gun game like cod

[fiery rune]

unless you put your motion detector up close to the action

[hidden vector]

The same way the a class with just SMGs is very restraining to one specific playstyle, they suck at anything except close range really

[quaint dune]

it was

and for the style they went with it worked ig

they didnt make it like a battlefield game

so that style worked

but thats not what we want in a battlefield game

if it was Call of Duty 2042

it wouldve been peak

[white temple]

I think they should have just wiped 2042 off of the face of the earth imo

[quaint dune]

nah

leave it up

[hidden vector]

Even with 2042 being free Im not interested

[quaint dune]

as a lesson and a reminder

[white temple]

Forgot about their whole general fanbase in 2042

The game only appealed to cod players and new battlefield players as in 2042 was their first bf game

[quaint dune]

yhh

[graceful orbit]

Real, 2042 suks ass

[dusk ether]

The movement shooter side of me likes 2042

[pure zinc]

One of my friends prefer 2042 over 4

💀

[weary horizon]

But thanks to 2042, it actually brought the fan base and cod fans together to hate on the game

[graceful orbit]

Get rid of him

[pure zinc]

LMAO

[dusk ether]

But it lacks much atmospheric intrigue so it’s basically just satisfaction through performance over experience

[pure zinc]

I guess they prefer cod games more of

Codish games

[dusk ether]

Better than all my friends playing nothing but league and war thunder

[fiery rune]

right. the main issue I always had with locked weapons was that even if I wanted to help my team with spotting gadgets and closer spawn points, I had a more difficult time engaging with enemies because I'm just not good with snipers and DMRs. That's ultimately why I see locked weapons as a negative vs a positive. The micro-game of battlefield always revolves around infantry combat with other players, but when you choose a class you're forced into a specific way of engaging this micro-game that may or may not be fun. The gadgets of battlefield have way more flexibility, but since the guns are what limit your ability to engage with the game, they effectively nerf your gadgets too, and impede your ability to play as effectively.

[graceful orbit]

Easy fix, every class gets m16a3

[dusk ether]

That’s where the nuance of it makes it hard to determine a better option. I for one love the game of playing to the weaknesses of a kit, outright avoiding fights if I’m at a disadvantage. Others don’t, like you mentioned

I for one still prefer locked but after hearing more people discuss it I’ve seen more perspectives for the other approach that I didn’t expect

[fiery rune]

The game is based around tickets and objectives, if you're not engaging with your team to drive those objectives, aren't you effectively hurting your team's chances for success?

[weary horizon]

That’s where it is fun, winning a gunfight is much more satisfying when you are at a disadvantage, also you do still have a pistol

[fiery rune]

a pistol is a close range dmr

with no damage

(i'm bad at pistols)

[weary horizon]

Not of its a full auto pistol

[fiery rune]

then it has even less damage!

[hidden vector]

I mean, I get that, but with all due respect, practicing and improving your game with snipers is the solution, not overhauling the entire class/weapon system. I get that you might not have fun with snipers as a recon, I'm the same way with playing Assault in BFV for the most part. It's not that I'm bad at it, I just don't like using their guns that much

[weary horizon]

G18 ptsd

[fiery rune]

PF51 my beloved (it fucking sucked but it was funny keltec gun)

[weary horizon]

It is literally the only thing I get killed by the most, other than tanks and lav splash damage

[fiery rune]

right, but improving with snipers isn't going to make engaging at closer ranges less of a tactical mistake

especially in a close quarters map

the guns still have well defined engagement ranges where they work best

[hidden vector]

This is part of that class's identity. It's what makes it more unique to other classes. It's good at long range, bad at close range. It's part of their role to countersnipe or pick of enemies that are dug-in or in windows, etc.

[pure zinc]

💀

Ts pmo 🥀🥀

[hidden vector]

If you can have snipers with any class, it's no longer a unique role of the recon to countersnipe or do those other things. anyone can do it. thus, the classes become less unique, less engaging imo

The difference between those classes becomes just the gadgets, which I may or may not use during my life (I'll almost certainly end up using my primary weapon)

[fiery rune]

but now you can't use your gadgets as effectively! a TUGs would help your team better placed on the frontlines, a spawn point would be better placed closer to the objective

a claymore is better placed where the enemy least expects it ;)

[hidden vector]

That's ok, your gadgets are only part of your kit, they don't define the entire class in a locked gun system

Your primary weapon is what you're primarily going to be using, it's in the name. That determines your range of engagement, how you move around the map, etc. more than gadgets do

Maybe anti-tank gadgets determine a bit more than others because you gravitate towards enemy vehicles

[fiery rune]

and now it sounds like we're talking past each other. i want to more effectively help my team with the gadgets i'm provided, but you don't want me to be able to more effectively help my team because class identity is more important than that. but that's just me misinterpreting it and getting emotional

[hidden vector]

A big portion of how you help your team is your primary weapon

[fiery rune]

i don't think that's strictly true

a medic's greatest impact is reviving

[hidden vector]

There are lives where I don't come across any downed players. I use my primary every single life typically

[fiery rune]

for assault that's probably true, but i don't think it's true for every class

[fiery rune]

right because that's how you engage with the micro-game

the moment to moment

as you zoom out, gadgets become the defining factor

[quaint dune]

pls no

XD

[hidden vector]

In a locked weapons system, you haaving access to certain primaries that other classes do not means that you are helping your team by doing the things with that gun that other classes cannot. I, as a Medic, cannot take out that sniper in the distance that is picking me off every time i try to cross this open area. My buddy is a Recon, and he has the ability to take him out with his sniper. As a Recon, I can't really hold this chokepoint against several enemies at once, but my buddy with the LMG can

So primaries can and do make up a significant portion of teamplay. A squad with multiple types of weapons is more versatile, they can handle different situations as opposed to just one or two, like if all 4 squad members only had snipers, they're SOL when moving into a close quarters environment

I like that kind of relationship between classes

I might see that all 3 of my squadmates are running recon, and so they probably all have snipers or at least long range weapons, so I'll decide to go Medic to have a closer range option and to be able to revive if needed. In a universal guns system, i have no idea what those 3 recons are using unless they tell me. I guess they could add in a feaure where you could see your squad mates' loadouts before spawning, idk

[ancient heath]

Each class is suppose to have their certain strengths and weaknesses, homogenising the weapons selection is doing the opposite.

[hidden vector]

This is where I'm at. People usually go on to say that the gadgets determine a class's role completely, or at least a lot more than primaries, which I disagree with.

[ancient heath]

Determining classes is supposed to include weapons aswell as the gadgets, throwables as well as their physical appearance, otherwise it’ll be kinda class based but also kinda not y’know.

[hidden vector]

You could differentiate classes from each other by gadgets and appearance, but yeah, without guns being part of the equation, the lines between classes become a bit more blurred, and the classes feel less unique from one another.

[muted sandal]

That has been the case for a long time tho

[ancient heath]

I mean “assault” rifles should only be for the “assault” class right lol

[muted sandal]

I'm just glad I can play my fav gun(s) and class without having to sacrifice on either end

[hidden vector]

Not if the assault class doesn't exist 😉

[hidden vector]

Sometimes too much freedom is bad for a game

[muted sandal]

Yeah like in 2042 before classes, BF6 with unlocked primaries is very different

[hidden vector]

Potentially. There are pros and cons to both systems. I think the pros and cons to a locked gun system are more in line with the identity of the Battlefield series./

[muted sandal]

I agree on that front.

But I more or less stopped being a Battlefield purist after BF3. It was also very different from BF2 and "CODified" but ended up being amazing.

[ancient heath]

I just think the restriction makes the gameplay more unique idk

[muted sandal]

Even back then I rocked the MP7+Laser and M27 IAR as Support, which is essentially an AR

[ancient heath]

Perhaps more balanced

[hidden vector]

The most unique the classes have ever been from one another was in BF1 and BFV, where guns were locked entirely. It comes down to if you want the classes to feel more unique or less unique.

BF4 was the mushy middle, which I'm not really in favor of.

[modern wolf]

Please do not add open armor

[muted sandal]

Even in BFV I gravitated towards the FG-42 because it was more AR like hehe

[fiery rune]

Ahh, but if that case doesn't come up, you're now locked out of a set of gadgets. If you only need to hold a choke point and the enemy doesn't have a sniper, you don't really need a sniper either! If you're in closer ranges where snipers don't make sense, you really don't need a sniper. But you do want sniper gadgets... Because for some reason spawn beacons and spotting drones are specific to snipers. We'll never know why. I understand the required flexibility of having multiple people with different weapon types, but that doesn't necessarily require locked weapons. And it's still restrictive since it doesn't necessarily work in all points in the game state. Converse, you often do want gadgets at all points in the game state. That's likely why past games had the universal weapon categories. The devs recognized that locking specific classes to specific ranges limited their ability to provide for their team. You don't need scissors if nobody is playing paper, or paper isn't available. But scissors also place spawn points, and you still want players to be able to do that.

[hidden vector]

"The devs recognized that locking specific classes to specific ranges limited their ability to provide for their team."

This is ideal. I don't want a class to be good at every range, or to be good in all situations.

[ancient heath]

They literally shouldn’t be lol

Pretty sure Sirland said something like that

[hidden vector]

As far as Recon and the beacon goes, I've never used my beacon in the thick of things, I always have it on the edge of the battle, so players can safely spawn and I can safely defend it from a ranged position

[muted sandal]

I mained Carbine Recon in BF4, the beacon was my best squad mate...

[hidden vector]

Yeah, like to me this is kinda crazy. You have this very powerful ability to set your spawn point for you and your squad, but you can also have this really strong gun for close to mid-range combat. Or you could have a shotgun. It's balanced for the guy that is responsible for the best gadget to have a more limiting gun, they shouldn't have the best gadgets and some of the best guns, in my opinion. It also means that, if you don't feel overly useful with your bolt-action, you will feel really useful when using yur beacon and spotting abilities. It makes up for it

[pure zinc]

Wallhacks 😈😈

[ancient heath]

Think you can still suppress enemies if u miss in bfv.

[hidden vector]

Only as Support

[fiery rune]

That means you're relying solely on "hard teamwork". Which means if nobody is making use of those spots or that spawn then you are literally dead weight.

[hidden vector]

You can still make an impact with your sniper, but yeah, if nobody is using the beacon that sucks. Nothing you can really do about that. If you're playing as a squad the beacon will get used often

[fiery rune]

Unless you can't use a sniper. Let's be real, players that want to contribute to their team likely won't want to put themselves through the struggle of learning to use a sniper in a game based around killing infantry to reduce tickets and take objectives. I at least don't. Especially when snipers have limited uses in maps without long sightlines.

[hidden vector]

This is a problem that falls on that individual player. Not everyone is good at everything. Perhaps that particular player shouldn't be the Recon of the squad. I don't think we should overhaul the entire weapon system for that sort of personal reason. There is more at stake. The player will have to adapt. There are also DMRs, which are easier to use than snipers.

[wind oyster]

ah yes

gameplay that has never existed never will exist and never has been seen before

you just have teammates that spectate others play majority of the game

it doesnt exist

in those situations you just reposition and thats all you can do theres no real need for you to play into enemies and pray on your teammates to do something and thats regardless of the weapons

if they have an advantage with positioning then dont ego it

simple as

[hidden vector]

Many, many, many times have I been running with my squad as a Medic and spotted a sniper trying to pick me off, I ping them, say there's a sniper on ping, and my buddy who is sniping takes them out. so many times

Countless

[wind oyster]

i doubt that

maybe in some dreamland people actually do something in battlefield games

[ancient heath]

I could say the opposite happens but then we’d be in a “yuh huh nuh huh” situation so

[hidden vector]

People with decent squadmates, or that play with friends

[wind oyster]

go spectate any lobby, no one plays the game

you dont even need to spectate just play it yourself

[hidden vector]

Does anyone know what this guy is talking about

[wind oyster]

its an extreme rare occassion where people actively play their kits and actually get good kills

[hidden vector]

"no one plays the game" huh?

Happens ALL the time when I play with my friends or with players i've friended in game

Every single game

[wind oyster]

just afk games proning around they do nothing

just ingame spectators

[hidden vector]

So are we talking about prone players now?

[wind oyster]

looking at others holding angles or just looking at nothing

[hidden vector]

Im so confused lol

[wind oyster]

we are talking about how 99% of the playerbase is complete dogshit in the game and they wouldnt know what to do even if you shouted at them

meaning

kits do not matter

[patent cosmos]

lmao that is so facts

[wind oyster]

weapons they play do not matter

[hidden vector]

99% huh, so there's only 1 good player in every lobby, dang

[wind oyster]

meaning theres no teamplay

[wind oyster]

if that yes

[hidden vector]

Weapons do matter, there is teamplay

[wind oyster]

lol

alright man

sure

enjoy teamplay

worthless debate you seem clueless regardless

[hidden vector]

I mean, you can refute my claim just as easily as I can refute yours. It's just a matter of I think this and you think that

[ancient heath]

Absolutely based

Unprecedented

[patent cosmos]

idc class locks or no locks the gameplay will be based around a meta. Ik it will and ill die on that hill saying it doesnt matter what happens

imo ofc

[hidden vector]

What can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence.

[wind oyster]

i can statistically show to you that 99% of players are horrible at the game on top of this i can go into any random lobby and show people do completely nothing and or bad decisions the entire game

with there on a big maybe being 1-2 genuienlly good players that actually know what they are doing

[hidden vector]

No, you can't.

[wind oyster]

your dms are open?

i can send you some very mindblowing images rn

[hidden vector]

How do you define horrible

Like if you're consistently in the top 5 every round, you're still horrible by your definition, because you're in the bottom 99%

Stats

[wind oyster]

like 1kpm 1kd just afking and maybe planting 2-3 maybe trying to solo cap some worthless flag that he instantly dies on anyway and whatnot

[wind oyster]

scoreboard doesnt define whos good lol

[hidden vector]

So that's another thing we need to define, what makes a player good or horrible

More factors here

[wind oyster]

you can legit spam ammo crate the entire game, you do not need to kill anyone, you do not need to actually be actively near or on objectives

and youll end up in top 1

theres no skill in spamming ammo crates or heals

anyone can do that

[mighty zealot]

No you right you right

This kind of just how games go

[hidden vector]

If I go 30-5 every round and I'm 3rd best on the team every round (the players ahead of me go 38-5 and 42-5 every round) am I horrible?

[wind oyster]

a good player is a player that has good timing, is spacially aware, has good mouse control, knows movement mechanics, knows gunplay mechanics, has good positioning and plays around their team well

rotates and reads enemies well

[hidden vector]

Ok, so console players are all bad, continue

[wind oyster]

knows when to be passive and when to be aggressive

[wind oyster]

they are yes

[wind oyster]

thats just average

[hidden vector]

Lol, and the debate is over, all credibility lost

Have a good day