battlefield-labs-discussion

[agile star]

randoms help eachother all the time

[weak obsidian]

hm... I don't see how unlocked weapons conflict with this idea of teamwork.

[agile star]

its not the locked weapons its the dumb solution they came up with

[covert nest]

I wish I could see a more focused talk about the gadgets themselves and balancing over just the weapons.

[agile star]

the minor buffs doesnt help enough as it should

[glad trench]

How do those minor buffs decentivize teamplay

[cedar flax]

Going a bit far with saying "all the time." I have encountered some great random lobbies, and a lot of really bad ones.

I will never forget "it is not like we are not trying to get the objective," when the entire team was next to a close objective and me and three others hopped into a vehicle and capped the long which the team then lost.

A bit of a tangent that, but random Medics barely revive, people stay in vehicles they have no business in not repairing, etc..

[weak obsidian]

I mean some classes like recon have field upgrade lines that focus on the signature weapon lol

[agile star]

They don't do enough to incentivize teamplay

[weak obsidian]

if the opinion has no objective basis then yeah lol

[agile star]

having high optic scopes be only for recon was a good example

[glad trench]

pathfinder recon marks enemies when it shoots them

how does that not promote teamplay

[minor linden]

Imo class identity is a far greater argument for locked weapons than teamwork

Even though gadgets are the main identity of the classes, weapons have always given each class a unique gunplay identity. It's why recon is mostly seen as the sniping class and Assault is mostly seen as the AR class.

Idrc too much though, as unlocked weapons won't kill the game

[agile star]

Just because its something you do not like doesn't mean its not a basis, insult are not a good way to argue

[weak obsidian]

It'd be less tiring if people just admitted that class locked weapons is just for vibes instead of trying to make up a bs gameplay reason

[weak obsidian]

people are just upset at the idea of a recon carrying a LMG

[mossy marten]

and people crying for BF4 style weapon locks which is just unlocked weapons with extra steps

[glad trench]

bf4, pretty much every universal weapon class had higher total kills than the pdws

class identity has always been a lukewarm take since everyone also says "just use bf4 system"

[minor linden]

Tbf, LMG with the mark on hit or mark when scoped would be pretty annoying

That can be argued as an issue with recon's balancing instead of weapon balancing tho

[agile star]

it does

we need more like that, Im not saying locking guns is a solution

[weak obsidian]

afaik it only works with snipers

[minor linden]

Imo BF4 has one of the worse class systems

HL is my favorite

[agile star]

i was trying to listen to what people had to say but everyone jumped to insults are arguing

[minor linden]

It is only seen as good because the other parts of the game are good

[minor linden]

I hope so. The marked on scope should be removed anyways tho. Getting free spots without paying any attention isn't good

[agile star]

playing to the strengths of the class is the main argument, having a weapon lock is good becasue it defines the class roles and allows for players to play to the strengths of the class. Having another system that encourages that could help a lot but minor buffs are not enough.

[minor linden]

At least the spot when you hit someone requires you to shoot and show where you are

[weak obsidian]

at least it's not like the BF4 target detector

[agile star]

If you see a medic, and support on your squad you usually knew what role you should play to help them out, now those players could be doing anything they want and you have no idea how best to help them

[glad trench]

how is there any difference to class role if an engineer uses an ar/smg/lmg

[weak obsidian]

the problem with a locked system is when people play classes exclusively for the weapon

3 and 4 assault moment

[agile star]

If a engineers is using a close quarters weapon you could assist them by being long range

[agile star]

Yes thats why im trying to hear your solutions

[glad trench]

or the engineer could not go into sightlines where he'd be at a disadvantage

[agile star]

Most maps are like funnels that balance all of them

[minor linden]

That's kinda part of the balancing of assault

You get good all-around guns but bad gadgets

[glad trench]

BFV, good guns and good gadgets lmao

[weak obsidian]

wish assaults signature gadget was the ladder tbh

[agile star]

throughout a match you are likely to be in a spot that disadvantages you based on what weapon you have and having a teammate with a weapon for that situation is good

[minor linden]

Having a tactical ladder could be funny lol

[weak obsidian]

just lock sniper rifles, any other weapon class performs pretty similiarly

[agile star]

If you dont know how to help a player who isnt playing to their role that puts you at a disadvantage

[agile star]

LMG's and MG's are not similar to AR's

[glad trench]

again, this level of teamwork literally doesn't exist outside of coordinated groups

[weak obsidian]

they're kinda just big assault rifles with worse spread

[agile star]

It does, I use it all the time its what sets BF apart from other shooters

[glad trench]

no random is seeing their smg using engineer cross a field and be like "hmm Ineed to snipe for him"

[weak obsidian]

not to mention there are LMGs like the M27 which are basically ARs

[agile star]

Any player that is not extremly new to the game will know how to help out the team

[rugged seal]

and they wont be sniping lol

[minor linden]

Lock ARs to assault too. Assault is already the pushing/gunfight class, so you may as well give them their classic weapon

[agile star]

If tanks are steamrolling your team you are going to go assault to destroy them, just like hundreds of other situations

[rugged seal]

.

[agile star]

both arguments are valid, because in BF1 early on it was just assault with hellreigal

[glad trench]

ya and how does open weapons change that

[agile star]

And if you dont lock the gun a player wants to use behind a class they are more likely to help the team out

[agile star]

because the player is less likely to play to the classes strengths and fill the role they picked

[weak obsidian]

idm that

[agile star]

i see both sides but i mainly think they are doing it to sell skins

[weak obsidian]

I'm just confused about the existence of carbines in 6

[glad trench]

If my team is getting steamrolled by vehicles, I'm switching to engineer regardless of locked/open weapon system

[agile star]

and make the game accessible and easier for new players

[glad trench]

in open, I now get to use the gun I want rather than be stuck with some gimpy pdw

[agile star]

im going to go eat, i see both sides but i wanted to find a cool solution

[tepid plinth]

There’s a fair bit of nuance surrounding it

[minor linden]

Idrc cause I'm going to probably use the right guns for each class anyways. each class has different effective ranges

[glad trench]

I'm just gonna ape the meta guns

[minor linden]

Who could've guessed that

[tepid plinth]

Whatever fits the map best :)

[glad trench]

hey man, someone has to make these hysterical people's fantasies become reality

[minor linden]

It'd be interesting if they added per-map loadouts

Wouldn't change all that much from the 4 loadouts per class, but it'd be neat

Especially if you could set your skin with your loadout

[weak obsidian]

adaptive camo but good

[novel wyvern]

Anyone get the chance to fill out the Battlefield Community Survey that was created by a Battlefield fan?

[covert nest]

A computerised adaptive camo for the gun would be cool

You know its fake but the aesthetic is there.

[novel wyvern]

It's not meant to be a Survey from the developers. It's just a community based survey. Great statistics so far. Shows what the community wants.

[covert nest]

Im not speaking about that.

[glad trench]

no it shows what the people active on reddit want

and right now, that beehive is active with pissed off "bf fans" that haven't touched the franchise in years

[novel wyvern]

It's a public survey that can be published anywhere. Not specifically for Reddit. Want more statistics share it on multiple platforms.

[covert nest]

Is this like the curve where both ends dont care but the middle are creating a mess

Im gonna blow my own horn. Fuck it.
I am a very good player. Locked or unlocked it won't stop me from farming nerds.

[glad trench]

apes stick together... apes strong

[covert nest]

Either way the system goes it wont change much for me because I'm gonna make people cry.

[rugged seal]

judging by the playtime of people who have been here wanting locked weapons, they will play the game about 30 hours total anyways

[glad trench]

dice needs to come out and only invite people to labs that have atleast 150 hours of 2042 playtime

[ocean badger]

That would defeat the goal of attracting new players to the franchise

[glad trench]

new players to the franchise aren't the ones signing up for labs

[zenith trout]

Uhm no

They should only invite people who have up close to 1000 hours played on each battlefield game.

[covert nest]

Yeah no.

[novel wyvern]

There are a lot of Battlefield fans still playing on older Battlefield titles like Battlefield 4.

[zenith trout]

Yeah yes.

[glad trench]

so?

[zenith trout]

Majority of battlefield fans are playing Battlefield 1

[covert nest]

Elitists like you are why newcomers dont stay in battlefield.

Bf4, 5 and 1 are still played pretty regularly.

God I wish I could play in US servers and farm.

[novel wyvern]

The majority of players that play a modern Battlefield game are playing on Battlefield 4.

[zenith trout]

Have you seen the gameplay from the playtesters? It’s like they never played an FPS game in their life.

[covert nest]

The average battlefield player.

[novel wyvern]

This is a good suggestion. I figured that's what they did for those that signed up. 🤷‍♂️

[zenith trout]

I’m talking about a battlefield game that is still played popularity wise, that goes to BF1.

[zenith trout]

😂

[ocean badger]

quite a few are

[zenith trout]

A lot of them are

[ocean badger]

a lot of people signed up for labs

[weak obsidian]

that's just the median battlefield player

[zenith trout]

Yes but a lot of people who are playtesting the game is quite frankly new to the franchise.

[covert nest]

I will directly answer what was said though.

Yes I have. From shitass to deadass players. The whole point of the tests is to gauge how players of most skill brackets will behave.

Even if they dont post something their data is collected and used by developers to see how they are influencing the game.

[zenith trout]

Yeah, unlocked weapons is what the battlefield community asked for.

[covert nest]

Do you understanding this process of game testing?

This isnt just about unlocked weapons but ok

how are omni crates affected development.
how is assault working within this system.
is armour a good idea

Like there are lots of things I cant even bring up they are testing.

[zenith trout]

Yes I do but the leaked gameplay from playtester that I’ve seen is straight donkey ass

[covert nest]

Because its too numerous and uh yeah.

[novel wyvern]

I would wager money on this. 💸

[covert nest]

So one playtester or amongst the lot that have leaked are bad players?

Like ok?

[zenith trout]

Because those are the ones who are giving feedback and DICE is listening to them

[covert nest]

They're not the only ones.

It could be players like me giving dice direct feedback.

And I am the methiest of the monkeys

[minor linden]

A majority of leaks are made by bad players because good players prefer to continue playing labs over being banned for giving the community 5 more minutes of stuff we've already seen

[novel wyvern]

Let's get along with everyone. We love the series just like the rest of us here.

🎵Why can't we be friends, why can't we be friends.🎵

[covert nest]

I remember the comments for the dumbass that leaked it.
"Of course the dogwater player would be the one to break their NDA"

[zenith trout]

🎵Because of EA, because of DICE.🎵

[covert nest]

Like yes there is a correlation between bad players and not being able to read NDA's!

But that is its own issue entirely LOL

[novel wyvern]

Throws down C4 and runs away. 💣

[zenith trout]

I love this franchise with my heart, I’ve been playing battlefield since BC2 and the last good battlefield game was BF1. I just want a traditional battlefield game like BF3/4/1 again.

[glad trench]

still waiting for someone to explain how BFV wasn't traditional

[weak obsidian]

it has girls 😱

[short basalt]

r u ragebaiting

[zenith trout]

No

The gameplay I’ve seen from many people is horse ass

[short basalt]

ah so js ragebait, got it

[zenith trout]

Cope harder I guess

[short basalt]

im glad u got sub Saharan desert rat IQ

[zenith trout]

I’m done talking to you have a good night

[tall urchin]

I don't trust anyone that says shit like "BF1 was the last good game"

[zenith trout]

Those are facts buddy

If you don’t like them don’t say anything

[tall urchin]

BF1 has the worst gameplay of the series, just say you're a bot tourist.

[zenith trout]

I’ve been playing battlefield since BC2 lil bro get in check

[weak obsidian]

BF1 is Battlefront in disguise...

[tall urchin]

So just a bot with bad taste then.

[zenith trout]

What’s your first battlefield game?

[tall urchin]

1942

[zenith trout]

Very ironic

[weak obsidian]

what does that even mean

[tall urchin]

It means they have no understanding of the word.

[zenith trout]

You called me a bot with bad taste because my first bf game was BC2

You’re delusional af

[tall urchin]

Actually what I said was you were a bot with bad taste because you said BF1 was the last good game. You're so illiterate you must be in the BF labs tests.

[zenith trout]

Yes I’m in the bf labs test

[pulsar shard]

BF1 is the best, the reviews and the sold copies speak for themselves , you either like it or not @zenith trout is right

[weak obsidian]

did you have a stroke typing that out

[glad trench]

crazy what a working game at launch will do for reviews

[zenith trout]

Ok?

[weak obsidian]

not to mention the whole le future cod is bad shtick at the time

[zenith trout]

Exactly

[weak obsidian]

best reviews and copies sold doesn't equate to objectively best

[zenith trout]

Obviously but you can’t disagree that it is the last good battlefield game

[weak obsidian]

if we're talking about the "mainstream" consesus then yeah probably

[cedar flax]

I need to try BF1 again and see if the menu actually works. First time I tried it I enjoyed it, second time I selected an option and the menu disappeared with no indicators of even queuing.

[proud pawn]

Can we just get a medic class that is separate from support?

[versed token]

Nope

[last sphinx]

No sweaty, we gotta reinvent the wheel 💅

Also now that the stim pen does not heal, is there ever a reason to run assault over support for infantry gameplay?

Support can heal and resupply and assault can... run faster and hear footsteps louder (something that you can do anyway by EQing your headset)

If you want assault to be the aggressive infantry killing machine, there needs to be a way for them to heal the damage taken in one gunfight before moving to the next.

As it stands, the only time you should use assault over support is when you are playing with a support friend who can heal you between gunfights. Even then, the benefits are marginal at best (with stim temporarily increasing movement speed and footsteps sounds)

The stim provides flash resistance, but I imagine looking away from flash grenade (like in BF4) will be better than using your stim pen anyway

[covert nest]

There are two things I would do for assault to help them be a bit more teamplay orientated but god damn it's rough.

[last sphinx]

I think the solution is pretty simple. Give them heals or ammo and remove one of those from support

[covert nest]

I honestly do think making them medic again would just incur a positive loop. Though it might drive me away from the class cause uhhh Assault rifles and bandages just feels too cheesy.

But that's my view if it were to happen.

[last sphinx]

Everyone will have assault rifles tho

Since we're doing unlocked classes

[covert nest]

Oh true but I was thinking actually how unlocked weapon classes hurts assault.

[last sphinx]

I do think changing assault to medic is the play here

[covert nest]

Uh my train of logic is that if anyone can use an assault rifle why should I pick assault, And assault does not seem very appealing.

[last sphinx]

With unlocked classes it balances them

[last sphinx]

Exactly. My solution is that people should play assault for the heals and revives

[covert nest]

Yeah keep in mind I am pro unlocked weapons but I'm just stating I may as well use an assault rifle on engie and do something.

I would like to experience ammo assault.

[last sphinx]

True but then you won't be able to engage in gunfights in quick succession without being at a health disadvantage

[covert nest]

Well yeah but my point is that as Engie I am at least applying presure to vehicles + Flak jacket.

[last sphinx]

Doing ammo assault and medic support is the same as doing medic assault and ammo support tho

[covert nest]

What am I doing as assault, Slaughtering everything? Which is cool and all but I am not leaving ammo crates everywhere.

[last sphinx]

With the names flipped

[covert nest]

Well yeah I am just speaking out of personal discontent. I don't know why but I really hate unlimited heals.

I loved heal on kill and the med pen from 2042 because it meant I had to earn my shit.

And my stocks were limited therefore I had to play with some semblance of thought. But again this is just a personal tangent.

[last sphinx]

Fair enough

[covert nest]

Ammo assault might be more negative anyways cause unlimited 40 mils unless balanced LMAO.

[last sphinx]

Honestly give assault med packs, defibs, and smoke/stun grenade launchers

No 40 mm HE

[covert nest]

Omni crates I think are a bad idea because they are a pain in the ass to balance. If assault had minor things like a 1.1x multiplier objective bonus to the squad (That can go to 4.5 to 5x if all squadmates are in) and adrenaline pen being used a substitute for squad revives (Slower than defibs but faster than by hand) then I would be for it.

[last sphinx]

Like score benefit?

I don't think score should be used as a balance tool. No one cares about it

[covert nest]

No like reinforcement. You have a slight bit more power over a single person capturing a point and when all your squadmates are on it it overpowers the squad.

We had something called the tactical toolkit in hardline which actually did that.
It was broken at its launch but got tuned into something way more managable.

[last sphinx]

The problem I have with this is that it makes it so that solo players are always better off running support instead of assault

[covert nest]

https://battlefield.fandom.com/wiki/Tactical_Tool_Kit

I do hope we get a heal on kill perk for assault that at least alleviates its issues.

[last sphinx]

I think with unlocked weapons, a medic, ammo, engineer, recon system is perfect

[last sphinx]

This would be useful yeah

[covert nest]

Unlocked weapons I believe benefits engineer and recon the most.

[last sphinx]

I think it benefits support the most

[covert nest]

ehhhh depends what iteration.

[last sphinx]

They have ammo, heals, and the best weapons available

[covert nest]

I agree, But goddamn did I love battle rifle support from hardline.

I loved flooding areas with tear gas and just taking out people with a single shot to the head. If not a 2HK LOL

I can't believe I am having a good faithed conversation about classes.

The state of this fucking community lmao

[last sphinx]

I really want to know who at Dice thought combining ammo and heals was a good idea

[covert nest]

Comments asides. Assault to me would be more appealing if it meant more objective reinforcement, reviving people with its adrenaline pen and heal on kill to at least keep it going. The universally increased handling and all is cool but I feel like without synergies it will just be viewed as the "other" class.

Synergies like class synergies. Omni crates could even benefit more from bandages and gain increased healing and or faster resupply times. Those would be huge for it as you could control it in a certain direction.

Engie and Recon are pretty much set as much as I do not like the passive spotting perk for recon (and I hope that gets changed)

[last sphinx]

I'm fundamentally opposed to forcing high amount of teamwork in battlefield. It just makes it so that my fun depends on the competency of my teammates

And, contrary to popular belief, most battlefield players play the game solo most of the time

[covert nest]

I'm fundementally opposed to forcing high amount of teamwork.
Thank fuck this is not battlefield 5 with its attrition system lmao.

[last sphinx]

That is exactly what I was thinking of

[covert nest]

I agree with you. But I do think people who go out of their should be rewarded for their efforts.

[last sphinx]

I agree. And they already are

A good squad can consistently win most games

[covert nest]

It is why the little things I have proposed are helpful to the larger picture. As they are passive actions.

[last sphinx]

Agreed

[covert nest]

In your opinion how would you expand on objective reinforcement and using the adrenaline pen to squad revive faster?

[last sphinx]

Hmmm so let's assume we make assault the medic

I then think that the class gadget should be a defib that works exactly like bf4 (i.e. no animation to revive)

[covert nest]

When I was talking to Alex, The previous weapon developer for 2042. I learned that the changes you do have to be extremely thoughtful and clear in how you achieve them.

It is an easily slippery slope. So SO easy.

Yeahhhhh a class gadget defib sure. I would be up for making the crate a forced gadget because then everyone will be giving it out.

[last sphinx]

Well here's how I'm approaching it. What do I think bf4 did wrong with it's class system?

[covert nest]

Oh for sure I am keeping that in mind.

[last sphinx]

For me the answer is the following:

1. Giving a class the most versatile weapons and healing

2. Not forcing the defib and ammo crate to assault and support

1 is solved by unlocked weapons

2 is solved by the signature gadget system in labs

So for me, this system is perfect.

[covert nest]

Do you like the foundation that is set?

[last sphinx]

For bf4 or labs?

[covert nest]

Err, Labs.

[feral garden]

2 is solved with the revive gameplay loops of Labs also.

Support can drag/revive all players (Revive is a bit slower). Also has the option of defib for faster revives

[last sphinx]

Anyone can drag players

[feral garden]

this frees up the class gadget to be the crate

[covert nest]

Support by itself revives quicker yeah? No defib support.

[feral garden]

Only support can drag and revive all dragged players

[covert nest]

OH I thought it was a squad revive thing alright. That's interesting.

[last sphinx]

I think defibs are superior to dragging revives (as in, if I have a defib I will use that 90% of the time)

[feral garden]

You can drag and slowly revive squad players as non support, but not revive players outside your squad

[last sphinx]

I'm fine with this but I'd like to see the quick and straightforward revive you had in bf4 with defibs make a comeback

[feral garden]

Its also there, but optional, as the defib is a chosen gadget.

[last sphinx]

Currently you are a sitting (or crawling) duck while reviving, even with support

[feral garden]

But even if you choose to not take a defib, you can stil be a good medic

[last sphinx]

Fair enough

[feral garden]

TBH, a good reviving medic will run smokes, also support have deployable cover to further assist here

[last sphinx]

I think we are approaching it from different perspectives

I'm trying to fix what I think were problems with bf4's system

You are trying to build a good system from scratch

I don't think one is necessarily better

[covert nest]

It's why in a lot of ways I considered Irish becoming a medic a buff to him because well, Shield for covered revives.

[last sphinx]

But I personally find bf4's system to be the most fluid and least sluggish out of all games

[feral garden]

BF4s is the one ive enjoyed the most. Mainly cos its basically unlocked weapons 😄

[covert nest]

Haha

[feral garden]

Weapons outside of ARs and carbines were just too weak in BF4. Maps not made in a way that really lended to the way PDWs/LMGs worked

[last sphinx]

Also, one change I would like to see that isn't a big deal, reduce how long people can get revived for and make it so that they can't skip it. Like how it was in bf4

I hate it in BFV or 2042 when you run to revive someone but the idiot just gives up

I also don't like it when people wait over a minute hoping for a revive instead of respawning

[covert nest]

GOd imagine smg assault in bf4. That would ahve been fun.

[last sphinx]

Give it a 15 second unskippa ble window and call it a day

[feral garden]

I think its mostly fine TBH. the downed state system is mostly good as is. I dont think they need to reinvent it.

What I would like is a longer time to deploy after death, to give a bit more meaning to a kill/death

[last sphinx]

It just feels incredibly inconsistent and makes me not want to play medic

Like idk if the guy I'm running to will just give up

Whereas in bf4, there is a clear indication that I will get the revive

[feral garden]

I dunno, I also dont want to be forced to shit there for 15 seconds after death. I think that will put a lot of people off

[last sphinx]

How long was it in bf4?

I just checked it's 15 second. It worked perfectly tbh

No problems with it personally

[feral garden]

Didnt BF4 also have accept/deny revive lol

[tepid plinth]

It’s so painful when that happens

[last sphinx]

yes, but your dopamine was not tied to it.

[tepid plinth]

Like sure if they wanted to Change their loadout, fair enough. But when you are seeking people to revive and the dot just vanishes it’s so annoying

[last sphinx]

allow them to deny being revived still

but let me see them rise when i get to them and zap em

[feral garden]

A better change would be to make holding on for revive the default state after getting killed. Im completely fine with how revives are in 2042. You just need to accept that some players dont want to be revived.

[last sphinx]

it just makes it inconsistent

if i see someone die i am running over to them

[covert nest]

Hey Bsod what do you think of the assault pen being used to revive?

[feral garden]

On an assault class you mean, and in the context of the next game?

[covert nest]

This for bf6.

[last sphinx]

is there an associated animation or is it like the defib?

[covert nest]

In theory yes.

[feral garden]

Na, the stim pen shouldnt revive. Revives are too strong to have on multiple classes, as an all player revive option

[covert nest]

I bring it up because I genuinely think it's a good idea.

[last sphinx]

I would like it if it was like the defib. Not with an animation

[versed token]

2042 uses the medpen in the animation for squad revs

[covert nest]

Well wait the context in full is using the pen to squad revive faster, Slower than defibs faster than by hand.

[last sphinx]

Assault should ideally be focused on combat so getting into an animation in the thick of it is probably not very cohesive

[feral garden]

If 50% of the classes can revive all players, it will be a nightmare to play

[covert nest]

This isn't like blueberry revive I should make it clear LOL

[last sphinx]

I think a quick stab to revive would be better

[covert nest]

Bf5 style

[last sphinx]

like bf1

[feral garden]

Assault as it is, shouldnt be able to revive any faster than any other non support class player IMO.

[last sphinx]

would you support removing assault and splitting support into ammo and medic?

a la bf4

[versed token]

I'd say it's too late to do that now

[rotund viper]

I like the idea of 5 classes (Assault, Recon/Scout, Medic, Engineer, and Support)

[last sphinx]

not if i have something to say about it. And I do. How do I ping David Sirloin?

[covert nest]

Uhhhh I would just advise against doing so.

[feral garden]

How revive in next game seems to work so far is...

Non support: Can only revive squad. Revive is done by interacting with a downed player. If you move while reviving, you drag the player, but revive slower. The slower you move, the faster the revive (this is true for support also)

Support: Non defib revive is the same as above, but revive is much faster(even when dragging). Defib is also an option for a full HP revive. Defib needs to be charged as in past games.

[rotund viper]

The class with medic abilities should be able to revive any friendly I feel

[last sphinx]

they can

[feral garden]

Im fine with whatever class system they implement. Maps and gunplay, gadget and vehicle balance is far more important to me than class make up, or the locked/unlocked weapons stuff.

[rotund viper]

I meant to reply to BSoD

[last sphinx]

As far as gunplay goes, it's looking a bit Joever tbh

[feral garden]

Asl long as gadgets remain class locked, they can do as they wish. My one complaint is I want the assault to be less lone wolf also, as they alude to in the latest blog

[rotund viper]

What’s wrong with gunplay?

[last sphinx]

Ttk is way too fast, visual recoil, aim point is decentered from screen. The last point is the biggest one for me

[feral garden]

Gunplay looks fine to me. Anyone I see commenting on it says its good. You just have some serial complainers on reddit, who over analyse videos.

[rotund viper]

:(

[last sphinx]

I don't listen to Reddit. This is based on my observations

[rotund viper]

I thought I heard it was slower than 2042 though?

[feral garden]

Gunplay cant be judged unless you play it yourself TBH.

[versed token]

Visual recoil is actually tied to the recoil of the guns so you can't really call it strictly visual anymore

[last sphinx]

You also need to realize that the effects of these changes aren't really felt by average or even above average players

[feral garden]

No amount of watching videos will tell you anything

[covert nest]

I hope what I've seen I hope what I saw was a misinterpretation.

[feral garden]

Its like judging how a football feels to kick, by watching another player kick it.

[covert nest]

But when I get my hands on the game I'll actually feel what it's like. But GOD I can't wait until I get my hands on the ACE and the Tavor.

[feral garden]

Id rather people not alude to having played, or break their NDAs TBH. Ruins talks like these

[rotund viper]

I wanna try the L85. Also I hope they have the MP443.

[last sphinx]

Tbf, bf4 had visual recoil for like a year and then they removed it

[covert nest]

Not gonna lie I did word what I said poorly and alluded about being in which isn't the case much earlier LMAO.

[last sphinx]

Maybe they will do the same thing with the new game

[covert nest]

I hope the gunplay will be fun.

[last sphinx]

Get the "iMmERSiOn" idiots to buy the game and then change the mechanics to actually be good after they've moved on to the next game

[last sphinx]

Me too man. Me too

BF4 gunplay, once you get the hang of spread, is so so satisfying

The game doesn't lie to you with any visual recoil bs

The aim is always centered to the screen.

You can microburst people at pretty good ranges if you're good enough

[versed token]

And then you get supressed

[feral garden]

Ill wait til its in a more complete state, and to get hands on to judge.

[rotund viper]

I can see why you don’t like visual recoil but I personally think it’s neat, maybe they could make it a toggleable setting to satisfy both.

[last sphinx]

True but that's not game breaking personally. Especially once you reduce the suppression effect by using a cfg file

[last sphinx]

That would be great. I have no problem with this

[feral garden]

So admitting to cheating too lol

[last sphinx]

Cfg file is not cheating

[feral garden]

It absolutely is lol

[last sphinx]

No it isn't wtf

[rotund viper]

A toggleable setting for suppression would also be nice. I’m fine with a slight disadvantage for a more cinematic experience as long as it doesn’t effect others

[feral garden]

I suppose removing all foliage via config file isnt cheating either!! /s

[last sphinx]

It's literally a setting in game but it can only be accessed by using a cfg file

[covert nest]

Reminds me when you could modify deadzones on console bf4 before they encrypted players save files.

[last sphinx]

You can't do that with cfg file

[rotund viper]

I don’t really mess around with cfg.

[feral garden]

You can

[covert nest]

It's how people played their lighting on bf5 and 2042 so their machiens can handle it better.

[feral garden]

Removing something which gives you a competitive advantage, which isnt otherwise available through in game means is always cheating in my eyes

[last sphinx]

I will dm you my username. Report me for cheating

[versed token]

I remember when people used to remove all foliage and lighting in bf5 cause the visibility was so bad

[covert nest]

Or even modify the CPU core usage amount.

Yeah I remember that.

[last sphinx]

Is using fractional sensitivity also cheating then?

[feral garden]

No, but removeing supression affect is. Come on dude

[last sphinx]

Because you can't set that in game. You have to use cfg file

[last sphinx]

It doesn't remove it entirely. It suppresses it a bit 😅

[feral garden]

Yeah, back pedals when caught out

[rotund viper]

I’m not sure but I kinda think it’s not cheating because anyone can easily do it without installing hacks and it’s not really a bug. (They would’ve patched it) it’s sounds like a more hidden settings menu

[last sphinx]

@feral garden is removing motion blur also cheating?

[versed token]

It's not in the ingame settings menu for a reason

[feral garden]

Its still cheating, dont know what you want me to say lol

[last sphinx]

You need to do that from cfg files and it gives you an advantage

[rotund viper]

I don’t get why they wouldn’t patch the cfg file modifiying.

I don’t really know much about cfg, never tried it.

[last sphinx]

Because they couldn't be bothered to make half the settings available in game

[covert nest]

Maybe they should make CFG stuff more accessible and give people more control over their game. But it's definitely a good question why they still allow it.

[last sphinx]

I agree

[feral garden]

*Because supression is an ingame method of balance, and they didnt want players disabling it

[last sphinx]

You do realize that it doesn't negate suppression right

[covert nest]

Then it shouldn't been patchable through CFG. That's all I'm going to say.

[feral garden]

So why did you disable it, do gain an advantage, no?

[last sphinx]

It just removes the visual blur. The accuracy penalties are still the same

[feral garden]

So yes, cheating

[covert nest]

I don't disagree nor agree, I think it's an oddity.

[last sphinx]

Because I don't want to see Vaseline smeared over my screen

[last sphinx]

Report me. Please I beg

[feral garden]

Yes, as you prefer to have an advantage ofever others players playing fairly.

You can just admit it and stop this charade

[last sphinx]

I also have a super lightweight mouse with high polling rate and I play at 240 hz. Both give me advantages

[feral garden]

Why would I report you, stop being so stupid lol

[last sphinx]

Because you know that the wider player base disagrees with you

[feral garden]

Why is the cheater the salty one here like

[last sphinx]

Is turning the brightness all the way on zavod night map also cheating, Mr Punk buster?

[feral garden]

Removing supression affect is cheating 👍

[last sphinx]

"Source? I made it the fuck up"

[covert nest]

Can we just move on.

[feral garden]

My source is plain logic

[versed token]

Max brightness washes out the screen, it's a disadvantage if anything

[last sphinx]

My source is EA knows about it and doesn't ban people for it. Nor do any third party cheat detectors

[last sphinx]

Not if you have an oled

[covert nest]

I'm no longer a mod but I am advising you people to at least move on. I doubt the actual mods care about fights though which is kind a funny.

I would like to get an OLED monitor but they are super pricey.

Maybe if I win the lottery I can get a 6090 and a 4K OLED lmao.

[last sphinx]

They can clear up if cfg files are allowed. If they say they aren't, I will delete it rn

[versed token]

Yes even on an oled

[last sphinx]

Definitely worth it imo. I would recommend it

@feral garden I just realized that you can actually do everything with a cfg by opening up the game, pressing `, and inputting the cfg settings manually

So yeah you can actually remove suppression effect in-game

[feral garden]

I wonder if DICE choose to decouble aim point from screen center to stop people using screen overlays on center as a form of cheating the system

[last sphinx]

All cfg does is automate the commands to run every time you start the game

[feral garden]

Youre not going to change my mind, ive stopped, so can you

[covert nest]

Not gonna lie those monitor crosshairs are pretty fucking annoying.

[last sphinx]

That would be like getting your hair cut by decapitation

[covert nest]

I wouldn't use them anyways but goddamn it's like this big red bloody cross and it's like GO AWAY.

[last sphinx]

It adds more problems than it solves

https://youtu.be/1TUMhCkNpfg?si=2Gy5LrMkHVXxLCoz

You're introducing all of these issues just to prevent people from using custom crosshairs

[fluid drift]

BF6 is going to make 2042 look like a success isn't it? Why didn't these morons learn from the hero ability garbage ruining 2042? Literally CC CV BF3 and you're done

[feral garden]

Enders has been on record to say the gunplay is good. So ill ignore this video for now

[last sphinx]

Enders hasn't played the game yet (you can ask him on his discord)

He has also stated that he did not expect them to make aim centered

[versed token]

I bet untying it is to convey recoil better

And not be like Bf1

[last sphinx]

Having it tied already does that

Having it centered plus no visual recoil is the most accurate (like bf4)

[versed token]

No because the visual doesn't line up with actual recoil

[last sphinx]

Yes it does. Your camera moves in the direction of the recoil

[versed token]

It doesn't just recoil straight up

[last sphinx]

Nope

[covert nest]

Hero shooter in bf6.
Care to substantiate?

[last sphinx]

If your gun has left recoil, the camera will move to the left

[versed token]

Not in bf1

[last sphinx]

In bf4

Also in BF1, but it's harder to see because of visual recoil (you can test this by using an external crosshair overlay)

The only difference between BF1 and bf4 is that 1 has visual recoil

But the camera itself moves the same way (i.e. always in the direction of recoil)

[versed token]

Bf4 also has it, it's just very awkward

[tepid plinth]

Nah, if crosshairs were screen centred it would be like having the monitor crosshair on anyway.

In general I’ve always took decoupling to be another short delay after a flick before you’ll be shooting accurately. In games like Arma where it’s really high, it’s so you flick, read the sway pattern or crosshair position and then adjust. I just see it as a means to prevent pixel perfect 90 degree flicks and slightly extend fights by even a nanosecond

[last sphinx]

Has what?

[versed token]

Visual "recoil" but it just floaty dunno how else to say it

[last sphinx]

Use an external crosshair, go into bf4 test range, and full auto. You will see that the red dot stays dead center always

[versed token]

The dot is the sight itself isn't

[last sphinx]

Oh I see what you mean. The frame of the red dot sight (i.e. the black edges) do indeed move a little

But the red dot itself is dead center

[versed token]

That's the bf4 way to convey visual recoil

[last sphinx]

I mean sure, but there is a big difference between bf4's system and bf1. I guess technically that is visual recoil too though so I stand corrected

[versed token]

and it does get worse if you're supressed and or moving if i remember correctly

[last sphinx]

Maybe I honestly don't pay attention to the frame of my sight. I just look at the red dot (or rather the target)

And that is always centered

[last sphinx]

This video is a good comparison

[versed token]

I've watched it before dw

Anyways it's only a huge issue in bf5 because of the surrounding mechanics of recoil in that game

[feral garden]

Yes, the randomness of the recoil is by far the worst part of BFV, which make's screen center decouple seem worse than it was IMO

[last sphinx]

Having the aim be decentered also prevents mastery of tracking moving targets because the reticle changes position relative to screen center randomly. So instead of looking at the path of the target, you have to constantly switch back and forth between the position of the target and the position of the reticle relative to screen center after every shot fired. For full auto weapons this is impossible to reliably do because the time between successive bullets is less than the human reaction time

[feral garden]

If bullets go where you aim, this is a non issue for me

[last sphinx]

It's a non-issue for most battlefield players because they can't track moving targets to begin with lol

But yeah, once you actually develop some fine motor skills, it reduces the skill gap

Which is why I'm against it completely

@feral garden do you consider using in built monitor reticles or drawing an x on tape and taping it to screen center also cheating?

[feral garden]

Yes, because it is.

[last sphinx]

Lmao okay that just tells me to disregard your opinions (not that you had many good ones anyway)

[feral garden]

Sorry for thinking that doing something to gain an unfair advantage, which is not something inside fo a game is cheating.

cheaters gonna cheat

[last sphinx]

Again, by that logic using Nvidia or AMD adrenaline to increase sharpness is also cheating

[feral garden]

Is it a massive advantage, no

Is it as bad as using scripts, macros, or aimbots, no

Is it cheating, yes

[last sphinx]

"Cheating is when people optimize their game setup"

Is using frame gen with a 800 hz monitor cheating as well?

[feral garden]

Using an overlay to gain advantage in gameplay, which counters intentional gameplay balance, is not "Optimizing your setup"

Neither is disabling supression affect via config file or console command

[last sphinx]

Lol how does it give an advantage? You're replacing a red dot with a red cross or something

[feral garden]

Are you deliberately playing dumb, so as to make me explain how it gives you an advantage?

[last sphinx]

Enlighten me

[feral garden]

thats a yes.

[last sphinx]

Do you have any arguments why it gives an unfair advantage or will you just continue being a smart ass 🤓

[last sphinx]

Console commands are literally in game tho. Your entirs argument was that it can't be turned off in-game

Which it can

Does it give a slight advantage? Hell yes. And everyone should be using it. Just as how everyone should be disabling post processing, maximizing fps, turning off depth of field

You can't turn it off from the settings tab directly, but using console commands in game is permitted by EA, Dice, and pretty much any game studio

[feral garden]

https://tenor.com/view/cc-gif-12825662841762387753

[last sphinx]

Having sub 10 kills/game players like you give feedback for labs is going to back fire spectacularly for this game

[feral garden]

There is no need to go straight to insults. 👍

My stats arent the best, far from the worst. Feel free to post yours tho

Heres mine: https://battlefieldtracker.com/bf2042/profile/origin/BSoD_Gaming/overview

[versed token]

Smh my head how dare you not be top 0.1%

[feral garden]

https://tenor.com/view/shame-bell-game-of-thrones-walk-of-atonement-cersei-lannister-gif-16635977892557113898

[last sphinx]

My guy you started off by calling me a cheater

[feral garden]

For cheating

[last sphinx]

Yeah and I'm calling you out for being incorrect. Your stats are above average though so good job refuting my attempt at an insult

[feral garden]

Post yours

[last sphinx]

DM'd

Hope it helps 🙏

[versed token]

Should've used #stats smh

[weak obsidian]

he's trying to hide them ...

[last sphinx]

I can dm you if you'd like

[weak obsidian]

you can use the bot in #stats

[feral garden]

I guess you just stopped playing BF after 4

[last sphinx]

I did but that was on Xbox. I made the switch to PC about two years ago and by that point I was pretty much playing bf4 only

[feral garden]

Post your account which you play on now then

[last sphinx]

I do have some BFV play time tho.

[feral garden]

Rank 7, so not much

[last sphinx]

I did. The one I sent you is my current one

I played a game on it a few hours ago

[feral garden]

Just doesnt seem like youve spent much time playin BF in the last decade

[crimson moss]

No clue what they were thinking when they did this with bf5

[last sphinx]

I mean... I told you that I made the switch to PC two years ago and have been playing bf4 exclusively pretty much since then

[feral garden]

Whats your xbox account ID then

[last sphinx]

One sec

[crimson moss]

The thing is is that bullets didnt go where you aimed, bullets went where your gun barrel was pointed towards

[feral garden]

Yeah, but that wasnt because of screen center decouple, it was because the spread to recoil system

[crimson moss]

It was both, the reason why gun barrel was everywhere was because of spread to recoil, the reason why it missed was because of decoupling it from center

If they didnt decouple it youd just have to fight against random recoil and weapon recoil patterns while aiming

[feral garden]

But even with a centralized dot (As demonstrated in the video above) your bullets didnt fire centrally, or where you were aiming. If bullets went where your sight reticle was, it would have been mostly fine.

[crimson moss]

And then yes youd be hitting where you aim because well the point that youre aiming with is actually accurate to aim with

[crimson moss]

? Yes because its decoupled from the screen center

Why would a center dot help in a game where you cant aim with screen center

[last sphinx]

The center of the screen was always the aim point (the line passing through the tip and the center of the aim cone)

[feral garden]

Im just saying that the screen de-center wasnt the reason it felt bad. It was because fo the recoil mechanics

[crimson moss]

It was both

[last sphinx]

Yep

[crimson moss]

You have to be an actual moron to decouple point of aim from screen center

[feral garden]

Its like 80% the recoil, 20% the de-centralization. But this will vary player to player. the above is for me

[crimson moss]

Imagine how badly bf4 would play or bf1 with decoupled aim center

[last sphinx]

Recoil to spread introduced erratic movements. Decoupled aim made it so that tracking moving targets something you couldn't really master

[versed token]

When you use single fire guns in 5 it doesn't feel bad though

[last sphinx]

Yes because you have time to react to the reticle changing position

[crimson moss]

Because semis dont spread that much so theres less spread to recoil conversion happening

[last sphinx]

With full auto weapons, you physically cannot react quick enough

Because human reaction time is at least 125 ms

[crimson moss]

Theres 2 recoil mechanics in bf5

So with semis you mostly are playing with just the weapon recoil pattern

[last sphinx]

Yep. There is the recoil that moves your camera and then there's recoil that moves the position of the reticle relative to the camera

[crimson moss]

Ye weapon pattern and random spread to recoil

Also semis were actually broken at one point in bf5

[feral garden]

I mean, the recoil is random. So even the flash couldnt react and adjust.

[crimson moss]

Yeah you really cant tell

[versed token]

Just develop future sight

[crimson moss]

You just have to predict where it recoils and pray

Like you can correct the control from initial point of fire but you cant like correct it the moment you start firing its not possible

[last sphinx]

Yep

Makes tracking really inconsistent

[crimson moss]

Id go as far to say that tracking wasnt as hard as actually hitting like headglitched targets or people behind cover

[last sphinx]

It's wasn't hard. It was inconsistent

[crimson moss]

Its pretty hard to hit headglitched targets with random recoil lol you cant really beam them down which just gives them enough time to react and counter play you

[last sphinx]

Like it would randomly decide to go right 3 times in a row, completely throwing of my tracking without giving a cue for me to adjust since I'd be focusing on the target instead of the red dot

[feral garden]

Its hard because its inconsistent.

[crimson moss]

Ye

[last sphinx]

When I say something is hard, I usually mean that it is difficult but it can be mastered

[feral garden]

You cant master random recoil tho

[crimson moss]

Random recoil isnt something you can master

[last sphinx]

Unless you have the reflexes of a cat, you can't for full auto weapons

Human reaction time is at least 125 ms

[feral garden]

You just have to adjust how to play to account for the randomness. Which is what really good players hated about it.

[crimson moss]

Its 200ms for average people in usual conditions im pretty sure

[last sphinx]

Time between shots is somewhere better 80 -- 107 ms

[last sphinx]

Yeah but my argument is that even the best of the best can't reliably counter it

[crimson moss]

Yeah

[last sphinx]

I'm not really sure what the point is here. Of course if you add mechanics that are impossible to get better at, then skill expression becomes more positional than mechanical

[crimson moss]

dude imagine though

bf5 movement, good visibility, bf4 gunplay with good maps and good vehicle/infantry balance

thats all they have to do and the game would be one of the best fps games

[last sphinx]

We can hope

[feral garden]

No real point being made, it was just another attempt to fudge with the gunplay to make the game have less of a skill ceiling (Same way Sweetspot did in BF1)

[last sphinx]

For me the gunplay is the biggest priority. Honestly, if the gunplay is bad, I hope the other aspects are also bad so bf4 stays populated for another 10 years lol

That's my biggest fear that it'll be good enough to get all the current bf4 players to switch but not good enough to keep me playing it beyond a few months

[versed token]

Bf4 will get shutdown in the next 10 years

[last sphinx]

NO I DON'T WANT THAT. BF4 SERVERS BEING SHUT DOWN. I WANT TO PLAY CONQUEST. FOR TEN YEARS AT LEAST

[crimson moss]

ngl ive been really curious to see if bf6 manages to "kill" bf4

which would be an amazing thing actually if they bring back og bf4 players

[last sphinx]

I have no problem with it doing so if it's genuinely a better (or even the same or heck even slightly worse)

[crimson moss]

which is a lost community since bf1 pretty much

[versed token]

There's no nostalgia for a new game so doubt it

[last sphinx]

Wdym?

[versed token]

There's nothing bringing back the older jaded players

[last sphinx]

I would disagree

If I'm being honest, the average player will probably be really attracted to the game. It nails the setting really well

I'm an older jaded player lol. If the game has good gunplay I'm in

[crimson moss]

its more of the larger competitive players that i think would be best to get back into the game

[last sphinx]

Battlefield community never felt competitive to me ever

[versed token]

Why the bf competitive scene is beyond dead

[feral garden]

This game needs to aim to be what BF3 was for Battlefield. AKA, a re-definition of what the franchise is/is going to be moving forward.

It will be closer to BF3, than BF3 was to BF2 tho

[last sphinx]

Like it's a casual fps game

[crimson moss]

because it gives publicity, not for purely competitive reasons

[last sphinx]

Not csgo or valorant

I'm going to be real with you chief. I don't think competitive battlefield is very interesting

[crimson moss]

a very large amount of people that were official battlefield pros through official tournaments made hella videos and had a good chunk of subscribers for a battlefield game

which would just hype the game even more and maybe help with longevity

[versed token]

It doesn't grab an audience outside the battlefield sphere though

[last sphinx]

Most publicity from battlefield was from YouTubers like Jackfrags, battlefield friends, Russian badger

[crimson moss]

• would be dope to have more good players again and it would probably help with bringing people out from caves

[last sphinx]

I strongly disagree on getting more players back. I genuinely don't think anyone cares about battlefield competitive

Or ever did

[crimson moss]

i didnt even talk about competitive battlefield

[last sphinx]

Oh my bad

[crimson moss]

the only people that cared was a very small portion of good players in battlefield though yes

or just a small chunk of people ingeneral

[last sphinx]

True. I think at it's core players play battlefield to have fun instead of win

[crimson moss]

1.9 mil views on eu vs us comp game from official dice battlefield

[last sphinx]

Like I don't care about winning or losing at all.

[crimson moss]

so it can go pretty big

[last sphinx]

It's all about having fun for me and I imagine most people

[crimson moss]

no one does in random games

[last sphinx]

Whereas in valorant or csgo repeatedly losing is unfun

[crimson moss]

theres just people that like to compare to other strong players and have fun playing against them

fnatic vs dexterity got 235k views

[last sphinx]

Gonna sleep now. Gn pickle

[crimson moss]

like its fairly big for a battlefield game id say

[covert nest]

That was pretty cool as much of a sweep it was.

Official acknowledgement on the competitive side. Though in retrospect getting over a dozen players on board would be quite the thing.

[kindred haven]

my favorite competitive gaming franchise is 100% battlefield

[merry ermine]

I do miss TWL

[crimson moss]

yeah comp scene was really cool to me aswell

[minor linden]

Idrc too much about the unlocked weapons, but there is one argument that I just don't understand for it: "Weapons don't define classes"

If weapons don't define classes, why did they add the class weapon incentives?

[glad trench]

They don’t define, they add some flavor

[leaden kraken]

I would argue the whole kit defines the class. Assault in BF1 is very different than BF4 or 2042.

[minor linden]

Agreed. Weapons don't fully define the class, but they are a part of it. There's a reason Recon is seen as the sniper class and not the reconnaissance class

[tall urchin]

I think it's because there are aspects that suit but do not define a role. Assault simply needs to be at the forefront of infantry combat and be self sufficient to a degree. So an assault rifle clearly does that well, but so would an SMG, or shotgun, or in very capable hands and low optic scopes even a bolt action.

So if you're accomplishing what the role sets out to do then the weapon means little, it's more how your play style works and why weapon freedom is important.

[minor linden]

Well yeah. That's why I'm not too against it. I will probably use the same weapons for each class no matter if it's a locked or unlocked system because certain gun types are better for certain roles

Some people might abuse "meta" weapons on every class, but meta weapons shouldn't exist in the first place

They're more of a gun balancing issue than a class balancing issue

[tall urchin]

Yeah, weapon balance is certainly always a topic but the last thing you want is people gravitating to a role just for the meta weapon because then you end up with awful role distribution.

It also doesn't muddy up the data either. If you see a large use of a class it becomes a question of: are people taking it for the role, the whole package, or the weapon? If everyone has access then problematic weapon balance becomes more evident

[inland glacier]

I personally like using the whole class than just the weapon but maybe that’s me.

I like playing battlefield that way

I mean, pretty sure that’s how it’s supposed to be played but

[leaden kraken]

I personally never felt the need to use a meta in BF, I always just ran the stuff I wanted to or thought was most effective

[inland glacier]

I personally felt whatever I use in bfv was effective

And I think bf1

Despite the restrictive aspect

Oh well

Weird how we’re discussing this when it looks like to me they’re pretty dead set lol

[gritty mist]

Just make carbines and maybe ARs universal. Make them optimal for the majority of combat. This matches reality up to maybe 300 yards. DMRs, LMGs, PDWs, etc can all be the spice you add to classes.

I'm not that hung up on the class restrictions, it just feels weird when they act like there's no option besides all unlocked or all restricted.

Yeah. I feel like the team made their decision and is going to stick with it. Time will tell how the game is.

[inland glacier]

Dunno honestly

Prob better than 42 but that’s the lowest bar

[solar jackal]

Was there a test today?

[inland glacier]

Class restrictions was a cool aspect imo made battlefield a lil bit more unique, not to mention it helps to define a role.

[gritty mist]

42 was rough. I'm older now. I don't preorder a lot of games. It was like getting mugged by Santa.

I think it just adds design space.

[next gate]

ARs should definitely not be universal loll

[solar jackal]

Was there a test for labs at all today??

[leaden kraken]

I liked BF1 having exclusive pistols to each class too, especially the Repetierpistole M1912 for Support, Mars for the Scout, and C96 for the Medic

[solar jackal]

??

[inland glacier]

What bout the bf3 system maybe

[merry ermine]

I think that's just how folks are reading into it. The messaging is consistently that they're taking player feedback in a constant cycle during playtesting and making adjustments. It also matters how cohesively people are responding to whatever surveys or feedback options from playtesting as well. It's probably not helpful if someone plays the alpha and just responds with "lock the weapons!" or something 😄

[gritty mist]

I'd love to see it. I'm holding out hope. Lol.

[inland glacier]

They sidelined the hell out of the hot topic and basically doubled down what they’ve already said before I don’t feel good about that

[merry ermine]

But at the same time if you go back to the chat where they first announced their class philosophy, you mostly see people dogpiling on the phrase "class locked weapons" without defining that. There are a couple ways to interpret it, and few people ever make it clear what they're actually asking for. Previous BF have implemented it differently from one to the next.

Does class locked weapons mean "only this class has access to this type of weapon" ? Or does it mean "This class can only use this type of weapon" ?

[inland glacier]

I believe they’re mostly referring to bf4 that’s my intuition

Which is like the best medium I guess

[merry ermine]

Could very well be the case, I'm not taking a stance really on it. Honestly open to either approach. It's just that it's disappointing to see an immediate loss of faith in devs when the feedback being given is...ambiguous at best

Or hoping that people are giving better feedback after they play the alpha

[inland glacier]

I’m open to what has worked before and what has arguably been a fairly distinct battlefield aspect

Even if it’s not the most out there feature

People literally didn’t want it removed and was fine with it like..

[merry ermine]

For sure I could see the BF3 or 4 model working again. I just don't think unlocked weapons in 2042 can be taken as the singular biggest reason why there might be uneven class distribution, loss of teamwork, or anything else. It's really hard to take a feature like that in isolation apart from the rest of it.

I just mean to know whether it's a functional approach

[inland glacier]

It’s obv not the whole reason for its failure it’s an aspect of it

[glad trench]

People have been asking for open weapons since bad company at minimum (wasn’t on the bf2 forums etc) and BF4 was their solution to that at the time

[inland glacier]

Ok sure

[glad trench]

The whole class identity are the weapons saber rattling didn’t come until 2042 despite bf4 shitting all over class identity

[inland glacier]

Ok

[crimson moss]

bf1 is also a very different timeline

[minor linden]

No weapon type should be optimal for the majority of combat. If ARs are better than every other gun for a majority of combat, then why would you ever use any other gun type

[crimson moss]

its timeline is the pure reason to why they could make the classes they did

[crimson moss]

but they are

modern smgs can do what AR's do aswell to an extent

[gritty mist]

For specific use cases. an LMG would be the king, but it should take time to set up and get using. Ammo should be a problem. DMRs excel at ranges ARs and Carbines fail at. PDWs should excel at close range. You can make a niche for each.

[crimson moss]

very likely theres modern lmgs that are actually lighter than older AR's from like idk ww2+

[gritty mist]

Oh yeah, but you probably arent comparing modern ARs to their WW2 counterparts very effectively with very few exceptions.

[crimson moss]

its a timeline with some of the most versatile weapons

[minor linden]

It's a video game. Balancing trumps realism

Imo ARs should be the master-of-none type gun. Decently effective at most ranges, but less effective than guns that are more suited towards a specific range when used at that specific range

[crimson moss]

i mean they are just smaller, have more functions, better materials, lighter

[crimson moss]

i mean thats very likely the case lol

because we have insanely high rpm smgs

[gritty mist]

Sure. In the same way my Kia looks somewhat like a Model T if you squint your eyes.

[minor linden]

I don't doubt it is. I was just saying that they shouldn't be optimal like Ferris said earlier

[crimson moss]

they cant and wont be

but you cant make modern era guns like equal to bf1 weapon balance

thats why open weapon selection is also better because it just eliminates the need to rework the weapons in weird ways to make them play in a mindful way

like whats the point of weapon locking if smgs can do what ars do, AR's can do what smgs do and lmgs can do what the both of them can

[minor linden]

It'd probably make it easier, but I wouldn't say it completely eliminates the need

[inland glacier]

Think they’re not supposed to in terms of balancing but maybe I’m dumbb

Also only lmgs can suppress

[crimson moss]

they cant be

[crimson moss]

suppression shouldnt be a mechanic at all

[inland glacier]

Ok

[crimson moss]

visual suppression im okay with

[merry ermine]

Ok now don't get me started on suppression. I'll be that guy who says yes to suppression.

[inland glacier]

What I meant I mean I’m pretty sure that’s what they’re going with?? Lol

[crimson moss]

hurrdurr i miss so now you cant aim at me hurrdurr

🦧

[minor linden]

Adding another punishment to bad positioning when you're already being shot at is an interesting choice

[crimson moss]

its a punishment even if youre well positioned

what suppression is is a mechanic that allows bad players to readjust their point of aim and make it harder for the better players to outreact them

[merry ermine]

Why does it have to be taken in terms of 1:1 dueling as the only scenario to take into account? Cover fire is a real thing.

[crimson moss]

you can cover fire without the effect of suppression

[merry ermine]

Way less effectively

[crimson moss]

no ones going to peek into active fire

[merry ermine]

People do it all the time 😄 Head glitches make that trivially easy

[crimson moss]

unless its an ego peeker and you just get shat on but its fair game on them

yeah headglitches are pretty ass but it is what it is

[merry ermine]

And then there's the case of "I'm hitting you in the chest but that's okay your scope didn't move at all somehow so you got that HS still"

So punished for hitting, just not hitting quite well enough

[crimson moss]

thats why visual suppression would be better because then you get the clutter of suppression but you dont actually get fucked over by the game

[crimson moss]

idk what you mean by this

[merry ermine]

lack of something like aimpunch. Suppression helps fill that gap.

[crimson moss]

thats mechanical suppression

[crimson moss]

im so confused by this

youre hitting someone in the chest, their scope doesnt move and they get the headshot?

thats just outplayed by him having better reaction time and better aim why would you want to punish him for being better lol

you already have ttk thats like 200-300ms in most battlefield games

[inland glacier]

One’s a one shot the other not so much

[merry ermine]

He lines up a HS. I hit him in the chest but he still has the HS lined up somehow and it lands. Doesn't make sense.

[crimson moss]

why

[fair summit]

thats definition of ping differences

[merry ermine]

Because he hit the trigger after being hit in the chest?

[crimson moss]

and?

[merry ermine]

You try aiming after getting a .45 to the chest lol

[crimson moss]

he aimed you in the head and outreacted you

fair game

[glad trench]

[merry ermine]

You're missing my point. I didn't say he shot first. I said he had the shot lined up and fired after me while getting shot

[crimson moss]

oh i thought it was a battlefield server mb i mustve mixed it up with the milsim one

[crimson moss]

you realize that suppression happens only while you miss right

[merry ermine]

That's why I said aimpunch

[crimson moss]

ok so you want others to not be able to aim at you while you shoot at them

[merry ermine]

while they're getting shot

[crimson moss]

crazy mindset

[merry ermine]

not shot *at... actually shot

[crimson moss]

idk thats some insane skill issue if you feel like thats a necessary mechanic

how often do you get outplayed while shooting at someone damn

[merry ermine]

and again it gets taken as getting "outplayed" as opposed to laying down something like cover fire with an LMG

[crimson moss]

whats funnier is that the guy youre already hitting before he hits you is already in a disadvantage

but you need even more disadvantages to save yourself from fair outplays

[tall urchin]

If you've hit the initial shot and you're dying, then it's skill issue

Either your positioning was poor, your recoil control/spread control was poor, or the other person was simply better.

[crimson moss]

the other guy quite literally has to fixate aim on you or rotate his view entirely to make a shot on you

and within that duration you have more than enough time to kill someone

[inland glacier]

Kinda just sounds like bro got a lucky shot

[crimson moss]

if you hit all shots on someone within reasonable distances you will kill them within 200-300ms in most games

[crimson moss]

theres no luck involved in aiming

if you hit you hit if you miss you miss

a lucky shot would be like unintentionally shooting at someone or somewhere without even like trying to kill someone

but if youre intentionally aiming then theres no luck in that

[glad trench]

one could say every shot in bfV was a lucky shot

[crimson moss]

💀

[inland glacier]

Though suppression messes with ur aim for snipers

[crimson moss]

okay yeah bf5 might be an exception

[merry ermine]

What's the reason to take an LMG vs AR (assuming the LMGs have a larger spray cone and higher recoil numbers)? 2042 the LMGs were considered to be basically ARs with more ammo, so that's kind of a worst-case balance scenario. What's the best case for LMGs?

[glad trench]

LMGs tend to always have reduced spread when holding the trigger

[crimson moss]

lmgs have slowerfire rates dealing more damage and having higher damage over distance

[gritty mist]

Best case? I don't know. There's a lot of valid good options and "AR's but better" is not one of them. Lol.

[inland glacier]

Lmg creates cover/suppress fire

[crimson moss]

maybe some few exceptional guns like parabellum in bf1 that had 240ms ttk and like 360ms til 100m but it also had a lot of spread and visual recoil because of the fast rpm

[inland glacier]

That’s why they’ve a large ammo count

[glad trench]

avancys is stupid strong for multi kills, get that first kill, keep the trigger down and now you're mowing

[crimson moss]

but ingeneral AR that has more controllability, less spread, less recoil will almost always be much better in closer-medium ranges

lmg is more of a hybrid inbetween smg and ar

[merry ermine]

Well ARs are a whole other topic, they have this tendency to be way too effective at long range, making marksman rifles a bit less relevant

[crimson moss]

large amount of ammo but firerate of slower ar's

[inland glacier]

They’re suppose to be mid at every range

Not outstandish in any aspect

[crimson moss]

it doesnt matter how good a weapon is at the end of the day, a good player will play worse weapons better than bad players the best guns in the game

thats also another thing

people keep complaining about weapons but it just doesnt matter as much as they think it does

i could likely play sniper better in cqc than some assault with smgs

it makes it kind of irrelevant

[inland glacier]

Well that’s interesting

[merry ermine]

don't leave us hanging man

[feral garden]

Pros and cons. LMGs would reduce you sprint speed unless used with support, but have higher mags, more suppressing abilities and iirc their damage doesn't fall off as fast. So while they aren't a great choice for run and gun, they are good for position holding or lane suppression.

ARs are better for run and gunning I'd say. Based on how they're described. Especially if used with assault

[lilac sentinel]

BF3 and BF4 best games

[fresh lily]

BF1>BF4<BC2 idc what anyone says. Oh yea.. 2042 is dog💩

[lilac sentinel]

For me

[inland glacier]

Bf1 bf5 goated aswell

[tall urchin]

AK24 and M44 in 2042, my beloved

[leaden kraken]

My personal ranking from every Battlefield I've played:
BF1 > BFBC2 > BF4 > BF3 > BFV > 2042 > BFBC1 > 1943

I have played 2 and Hardline, but never played 2 online and barely touched HL.

Never got to play BFBC2 Vietnam before it got shut down unfortunately, I've been looking for a PC disc copy so I can get to experience it.

[minor linden]

HL is underrated. Imo it's the best game released under the BF title

It's not the best Battlefield tho

Wish we would've gotten HL 2 🙏

[wind flume]

I was unable to play for the time slot I was given. Is this not open at all times for whoever was given access?

[tall urchin]

HL definitely had its issues, but for a first attempt from an outside studio it was respectable

[last sphinx]

I genuinely can't take anyone who puts BF1 above BF3/4 seriously. Other than immersion, it does pretty much everything else worse than those games

It feels like judging an fps game for its artistic value instead of gameplay

[mossy marten]

Tru

[last sphinx]

Maybe it does infantry/vehicle balance better too but it's been a while since I played BF1 so I might be misremembering

[tall urchin]

Or listening to a "musician" just because they're attractive.

Unfortunately, the average person doesn't give a toss about substance.

[weak obsidian]

hype and aura moments

[leaden kraken]

To me BF1 just feels better. It feels more satisfying to shoot enemies and blow stuff up.

[zenith pollen]

class balance in this is going to be so terrible it's not even funny

[glad trench]

How so

[rugged seal]

[zenith pollen]

everyone is going to play support

[rugged seal]

i feel like last week it was assault that people said was going to only be played

[glad trench]

everyone doesn't play support in 2042

[zenith pollen]

not talking about 2042. but would you rather play the class that has both ammo and med combined into eachother, a defib plus the ability to use any other weapon, or assault?

[glad trench]

in 2042 I can play as a support that can heal/resupply and use any other weapon

[weak obsidian]

2042 has a similar class setup but people still end up playing engineer for most maps

[serene grove]

It has nothing similar in class setup

[glad trench]

falck can self heal and equip an ammo crate while using any gun

[weak obsidian]

could you explain?

[serene grove]

2042 didnt really have a class system at all it had an operator system. its honestly nearly identical to bf4 class setup rather than 2042

[glad trench]

have you played 2042 within the last 2.5 years?

[serene grove]

about 8 months ago was last time for me

[glad trench]

and it didn't have a class system with defined roles/gadgets?

[weak obsidian]

at launch yeah but they've kinda shoehorned a system in

[serene grove]

yes, it does have the class, but the roles are defined by operator, rather than more of the gadgets. bf6 is nearly identical to bf4 in class.

[glad trench]

the bf6 classes are the 2042 classes w/o the operators

[weak obsidian]

I mean the gadgets of the specialists are pretty similar to the class gadgets in BF6

[serene grove]

objectivly wrong, again, its nearly identical to bf4

[weak obsidian]

no way

[glad trench]

lmao this is bait

[serene grove]

I was referint to zeethos, not you

you, definitely are

[zenith pollen]

2042 shouldnt be considered

[weak obsidian]

how come

the BF6 class system is basically the 2042 system but refined

[glad trench]

so the medic being combined with the support (like in 2042) and assault being an anti infantry class is unlike 2042... while being nearly identical to BF4

[serene grove]

because bf6 plays closer to bf4

[glad trench]

[serene grove]

again, objecively wrong, its nearly identical to bf4. It is quite literally bf4 class system with 3 gadgets

[glad trench]

BF "community" never ceases to be the absolute dumbest. Everytime w/o fail

[weak obsidian]

well assault in 4 is medic + anti infantry combined

[serene grove]

okay, and medic makes more sense as support

[serene grove]

you're proof if you insist on your rage bait

[weak obsidian]

yeah sure but BF6's class setup resembles the later 2042 setup

[serene grove]

again it is quite literally class setup with 3 gadgets rather than 2. instead of 2042. if you want to compare it to a battlefield, compare it to the ones its actally like

[weak obsidian]

yeah but support in 4 didn't heal and revive

[glad trench]

which class had med bag/defib in BF4? which one has it in BF6?

2042 also had 3 "gadgets"

[serene grove]

point completely missed. yall can keep your ragebait, but doesnt mean your right, but if you want to compare it to previous games, make it an accurate comparision, and actually compare it to a similar battlefield

[minor linden]

6's system can't really be compared to any current game cause (iirc) medic + support has never been a combo before

[rugged seal]

it is in 2042....

[minor linden]

Is it? I thought assault was medic in 42?

[glad trench]

still incapable of pointing out how bf6 and bf4 class systems are "nearly identical" despite having different class configuration

[glad trench]

assault - sundance/mackay/zain/dozer

medic/support - falck, irish, angel

[rugged seal]

having there be one supply bag that gives both health and ammo hasn't been done but in 2042 both angel and falck can have loadouts that give health and ammo

[serene grove]

the entire argument is that, which is a definition of a logical fallacy.

[serene grove]

literally did, multiple times, youre just too caught up in trolling

i wasnt aware that bf6 has operators like you insist

[glad trench]

you're example is bf4 has two gadgets while bf6 has 3 gadgets despite the organization of those gadgets being switched

[glad trench]

you do know, if you stopped dragging your knuckles that those operators are organized into classes

[minor linden]

Ah. 42 does have a more similar class setup then

[serene grove]

literally just changed to make it make more sense. weapons, perk, 4 class setup, the biggest is no operators. gadgets

[serene grove]

if you actually used your brain, bf6 doesnt even have operators

[glad trench]

yup, this guy is a trogg, I'm just blocking him before I get banned

[serene grove]

ragebait at its finest

[glad trench]

like simple jack is a more rounded out human than you

[serene grove]

again, where are the operators in bf6? your entire argument is them moving 1 gadget to a different class to make more sense. again, make an accurate comparison. bf6 is nearly identical to the class system of bf4

[weak obsidian]

if you ignore operators having unique identites and not being tied to teams and look only at their gadgets then yeah it's pretty similar to 6

[glad trench]

too hard for him. never mind half of those specialist gadgets becoming gadgets in 6

[serene grove]

so if you completely ignore the biggest part of the class system its sorta similar if you squint

[weak obsidian]

I'm looking through this exclusively from a gameplay and mechanics standpoint

yeah of course the 6 system is more akin to non 2042 titles because no quirky operators

[serene grove]

which is nearly identical to bf4

[weak obsidian]

but only through a visual standpoint

[serene grove]

functionally, it more closely resembles bf4, Im talking about a gameplay standpoint

[weak obsidian]

well gameplay wise it is pretty similar to 2042

[mossy marten]

🤨

[serene grove]

no. functionally/ gameplay standpoint, the only difference is the 3rd, forced gadget.

[weak obsidian]

assault focuses on anti-infantry gadgets, engineer blows up vehicles, support revives, heals, gives ammo and recon spots and shit

[mossy marten]

Juju and Zeethos are right lol
2042 and BF2025/6 class systems are similar in what the roles are
Bf4 is different from both

[serene grove]

again, im talking a gameplay/functionality standpoint. your talking about class identy, which class identy standpoint, it still lacks the operators

[weak obsidian]

I'm talking about that...

just pretend the operators aren't there and only look at their gadgets and class they're in

it's pretty similar to what 2042 has

[serene grove]

you literally just said that you were. you quite literally brought up what the class identies were. im talking about how gameplay wise its more like bf4, youre talking about class identy, which kinda resembles bf2042, if you ignore the operators and operator gadgets. you are saying ignore one of the more important parts of the bf2042 class system to make your point

[weak obsidian]

I didn't say ignore operator gadgets lol

[glad trench]

dude is really getting hung up on the window dressing

[weak obsidian]

also class identity and role are kinda one in the same tbh

[serene grove]

you quite literally said ignore operators

[weak obsidian]

yeah but not their gadgets (the gameplay part)

just imagine it like picking a gadget ...

[serene grove]

which are defined by which operator you choose

we cant choose what the class gadget is in bf6, and they are more basic to what the class wouldve tradionally run in bf3/4, there is a massive diffence between haveing a class gadget, for example, be a scout scope, compared to a zipline

[glad trench]

remember kids when crying about DICE not listening to feedback... this is the type of person giving feedback

[weak obsidian]

uh... 2042 also has class gadgets....

[mossy marten]

But there is locked class gadgets in 2042....
Assault gets the stim
Engi gets torch
Support gets defibs
Recon gets spawn beacon (i think, i don't use it lol)

[serene grove]

you, who is trolling'

[glad trench]

ya it's the beacon

[mossy marten]

Then you choose specialist, which is one gagdet specific to them, and then a third gadget from a list

[weak obsidian]

choosing a specialist is like choosing a gadget!

[glad trench]

specialists are literally just a gadget with a lore page

[serene grove]

correct, which is how it is closer to bf4, rather than bf2042. I never said bf2042 didnt have class locked gadgets. but your saying if you ignore the operator gadgets thats how its similar

[mossy marten]

[serene grove]

and you cant choose the special class gadget in bf6

[weak obsidian]

2042 has a special class gadget that can't be changed out

4 doesn't have that

[serene grove]

meaning you can choose the 3rd gadget that kinda defines the class/role. you cant do that in bf6

[serene grove]

learn to read

[weak obsidian]

I'm not sure if you fully understand the 2042 system lol

[serene grove]

lol, in not sure you understand the 2042, or the 6 class system. you are saying ignore a major part of the class syste, and youll essentially get wht bf6 has. in which bf6 has the bf4 class system with a 3rd gadget you cant choose

[weak obsidian]

2042: class gadget, gadget 1 (specialist), gadget 2
BF6: class gadget, gadget 1, gadget 2

BF4: gadget 1, gadget 2

[serene grove]

you your saying you cant actually choose 2 gadgets from 1 list like you can in bf6 and bf4, such as, for egineer, a rocket launcher, and a mine. thank you for proving how its closer to bf4. as I have been saying, its bf4, but with a class gadget, that is basic

[weak obsidian]

not really... you get 3 gadgets in total in 2042 and 6

I don't know why it's so difficult for you to imagine the specialists as the first gadget you choose

[serene grove]

again, learn to read what I say. please and youll start to understand, and you literally proved me right

how are you gonna explain, in detail how im right, then say im wrong

[weak obsidian]

um clearly you don't understand how the systems work in these games...

[serene grove]

you dont know how to read, or anything about the class/gadget system so by your logic, that means I dont know?

[weak obsidian]

sounds like a you problem

get back to me when BF4 adds a locked class gadget

[serene grove]

you want me to teach you how to read?

[weak obsidian]

and when the BF4 support starts healing and reviving

[serene grove]

get back to me when bf6 adds specialist and specialist gadgets

and when you learn to read and how the system works

[weak obsidian]

Lis has a rocket launcher... BF6 has rocket launcher ....

[gritty mist]

I've been trying to send the boondocks gif where they throw a chair into the fight. They probably block it. You guys will have to imagine it.

[serene grove]

BF4 has rocket launcher, does that mean its the same system as bbf2042 by your logic?

[weak obsidian]

you don't get three gadgets in 4 so no

[serene grove]

thanks for proving my point

[weak obsidian]

you get 3 gadgets in 6 and 2042... very alike 😃

[serene grove]

you literally proved how im right, again. then say im wrong. trolling

[weak obsidian]

I think um... you're a bit slow pal... but that's okay.

[serene grove]

says the one who cant read

[weak obsidian]

don't worry there a lot of people in this community that are like you

[serene grove]

who actually know how the system works, unlike you?

[weak obsidian]

guy who last played 2042 8 months ago 👆

[serene grove]

yeah, cause I prefer bf4, which bf6 feels like a true successor of, and its the first time battlefield has actually felt like battlefield in over a decade

[weak obsidian]

it isn't unlikely that you've forgotten about some of the aspects of that games class system, which is fine of course
not many people in this community engage with 2042s systems in a fair and objective manner

[serene grove]

wow, I like a battlefield and play a battlefield that is actually similar. youve literally explained in detail, how it is similar to bf4s, and not 2042s. aty this point, you are the one who made a direct comparison as to how its more similar to bf4

[weak obsidian]

assault exclusively on anti-infantry and demolitions, support that heals and gives out ammo + unlocked weapons. BF6 is 2042 2...

[serene grove]

again, your only argument is it moved healing to a class that better fits. while you have explained in great detail how it is a nearly identical system to bf4. and proving you have no clue how any of the systems work

again, if you actually play them, youd see how bf6 is nearly identical to bf4 class system, but you admittingly dont know, and are trolling, based on the simple fact you explained how im right, and insist im not

[weak obsidian]

nearly identical

speed trying not to laugh.gif

[serene grove]

yes, which is what ive been saying, literally the whole time, why you have said multiple times, if you ignore a relatively important part, then youll get kinda similar

[weak obsidian]

I mean I would say the parts that are similar to BF4 are bad

fire support gadgets like the XM25 and mortar should be moved to assault

this could be all solved if we had 5 classes...

[serene grove]

5 classes would honestly be amazing, assault, recon, medic, support, engineer. assault acting as more of a grenadier role

[leaden kraken]

I was saying this the other day, I would like 5 more defined classes to avoid giving one too much responsibility

[serene grove]

I feel like its been a tpoic in the battlefield community for a very long time tbh, it would just make so much more sense

[sharp prawn]

Battlebit does a good job of balancing five classes

[autumn adder]

sounds like too much work for them, why think about 5 classes when you can just copy and paste weapon proficiencies from 20242

[covert nest]

Because they are going a different direction.

Copy and pasting isnt exactly the smart thing to do.

Different meta game yadda yadda

[solar jackal]

Does anyone know when the next playtest is?

[rugged seal]

no

[crimson moss]

so mad i never played it

people kept telling me that it was just a reskinned battlefield 4 but it just looked like a better battlefield 4 to me when i look back into it now

[crimson moss]

its definitely closer than previous games were but its far from being the same same

[crimson moss]

lol no

idk if youve barely played battlefield 4 or if you havent played it since release but its the furthest thing

assault is purely anti infantry with just explosive gadgets for infantry, engineer i guess would be the closest resemblance to bf4 engineer, support is ammo + heals and being able to revive + some explosive gadgets i imagine and well scout class really couldnt be any different

meanwhile in bf4 assault was a medic class with explosive gadgets, support was a class that gave ammo and had some explosive gadgets,

class perks are similar to bf4 as a mechanic but the perks arent the same

[deft basalt]

You haven't played BF4

[sturdy steeple]

Hi

[crimson moss]

hi

[sturdy steeple]

Played last week test yet?

[crimson moss]

no and even if i did i couldnt say because its an NDA break

[sturdy steeple]

O

[tough zinc]

not really, it looks like 2042, assault is only infantry focused then you have support that heals and gives ammo (bf4 had medic and support as different classes), engineer with anti vehicle role and the scout

it's a better version of the 2042 system

[misty anvil]

What Type Of Soldiers In Battlefield™ Labs?
For Assault, Medic, Scout And Support?

[tepid plinth]

Military ones? Not sure what you are asking

[zenith trout]

Regular, normal soldiers bro

[serene grove]

Just normal, unamed modern soldiers.
No sort of specialist or, at the time, customization apartment from they look like they physically represent their class

[serene grove]

How would people feel about something like bf4 commander returning?

[autumn adder]

Just dont. While I have nothing against it per se and it was a cool part of bf4, they have F'ed up so many things they have "tried" over the last few instalments I just dont want them focusing on extra stuff because it will probably sound great to them at first and then be left half arsed

[serene grove]

For release definitely need to focus on the actual game, I mean later down the road after they do some refinement to the game

[autumn adder]

While I dont know how bf4s development cycle looked like, I doubt its gonna be easy/effective to add such a feature without having accounted for it in core game design

Maybe it can come later but in that case it will probably just feel like an afterthought and thus probably not worth it either

[deft basalt]

Its not returning as far as i know

[glad trench]

Which was ironic because BF4 was called BF3.5 for pretty much the entirety of its supported lifespan

[serene grove]

I hit rank 100 twice, once around the time silk road came out on Xbox, once about a year and a half ago on PC

Also love how literally the only argument for saying its basically a clone of 2042 is them moving 2 gadgets. Ignoring everything else

[serene grove]

Bf3, bf4, bc2 all had similar systems, not the exact same.

And from what I remember, hardline had a similar structure, but I honestly haven't played hardline since release

[serene grove]

Only hit rank 100 twice, but hey, what do I know, I just am happy we are going back to a battlefield that actually feels like battlefield for the first time in over a decade

[glad trench]

BFV felt like a BF and from everyone I know who’s in the playtest this game plays much closer to BFV/2042 than BF4

People see modern military setting and immediately think they’re getting BF3/4 and it’s funny

[serene grove]

Ah yes, the troll again, who imma guess bfv was your first battlefield

One big thing, is they went back to a older battlefield style vehicle system, rather than the atrocious one from bf1, bfv, and 2042.
Especially 2042, being able to spawn vehicles anywhere

[crimson moss]

?

no one said that i think

but you were talking about it being very close to bf4

when its mechanically different and systematically different

[serene grove]

Multiple people have said that, and when comparing it to other battlefield titles, bf4 is the closest comparison.
Someone last night. I dont remember who even called it bf 2042 2

[crimson moss]

yeah calling it a 2042 clone is just very delusional

[crimson moss]

but this is pretty much flat out wrong aswell

[serene grove]

Yes, like all I said is its basically bf4 with a basic gadget that you cant change

[crimson moss]

but its mechanically and systematically different

[inland glacier]

But it’s pretty different which is why a lot of people want that instead