Industrial Revolution 3

[spiral creek]

Dreadlock will fix it

[patent depot]

whats wierd is that I disabled it.. played on my own a bit, added gizmos keys and added autodrive back in.. and it seemed to work. though i think possibly theres a wierd tech tree thing.. the keys don't unlock and possibly autodrive(?) until you have automobilism which I don't have yet. Just have the one wheel car and the uh... whatever the slow not-tank is.

[bitter mortar]

What do you need that mod for?

You should post a screenshot and the code, otherwise noone can say what happened

[patent depot]

will do if it happens again. I'd swear I'd seen something about a possible issue but couln't find it.

Its interesting not knowing whats around the next corner. I just got Green science online. Mall wise I'm automating belts and regular steam inserters + most of the copper/tin/bronze intermediates and using the "inventory transfer" feature (neat mechanic) and hand crafting the final steps to make miners/assemblers etc. Forrestry's seem pretty slow, I've got about 8 chunks being "farmed" and the production rate isn't great.

Love having the early/slow bots.

Is steam powered coal crushing a net reduction in polution for smelter fuel? Like it looks like the reason to use crushed coal is less polution.. but you have to burn some of that crushed coal to make steam to crush coal to have lower polution fuel..

[spiral creek]

Usually developers think about that

[sturdy flicker]

This is really weird, like, I have the ingredients to make charcoal kilns, but no number shows up for it, however for other things, even if I don't have the ingredents directly, it will show a count

[maiden ferry]

i noticed that too on the kilns. i think it's some sort of a bug?

[patent depot]

me three..

What are you folks using the one way valves for? Are they circuit controllable?

Also whats a bronze telescope for?

will try the telescope...

radar?

ah yes radar

[patent depot]

and it uses a LOT of steam!

[narrow cliff]

If, say, a chain takes water as an ingredient and also water as a byproduct, I would put a top-up valve out of the offshore pump and a one-way valve out of the byproduct water output. The one-way is probably just me being paranoid and not understanding fluid mechanics though.

[patent depot]

I get top up valve would replace a circuit controlled pump for the looping scenario.

Am I going to regret turning wood chips (output from crushing rubber wood to make rubber) into charcoal? I see ethanol in the future but not there yet

[worldly portal]

If you're talking about energy value, then iirc charcoal and ethanol are equivalent

[patent depot]

more like polution maybe.. jsut wondering if there was a "stockpile this for later" thing here

[worldly portal]

They are also equivalent in pollution

But ethanol will eventually become quite a bit more valuable

Once you unlock a certain technology

That being a new ethanol-based recipe for plastic

Meanwhile charcoal never gains any notable uses, as far as I'm aware at least

[sturdy flicker]

shame that. Also its kinda annoying you need a whole extra kind of oven just to make charcoal.
Though I can understand its because it impossible to tell if the wood you are belting should be used as fuel or the thing that is becoming charcoal.

[hexed turret]

I don't remember perfectly, but I think I never had to shoot a chest with any of the secondary ores, OR resort to use merely crushed (but not washed) ore. But yeah, those two would be the solutions I'd use. Probably the latter because wasting a bit of raw ore isn't a big deal at all in Factorio.

[hexed turret]

What I do is:

1. Set up a buffer chest for the secondary material, e.g. lead
2. If the buffer has < 100 ore, use hot washing
3. Else (it has >= 100), then use cold washing (100 sounds low, but you get this ore free and you can always get more than you need, plus the belt acts as additional buffer)
4. Your buffer chest might get full despite that (especially earlier in the game when you're using less), if so then just add a few more buffer chests.
5. If all of them are full and you don't want to keep adding, then instead, make the primary ingots (e.g. copper) from crushed ore instead of washing the crushed ore. The way to set this up is with a splitter, with an input priority set to the washed ore.

Upsides:

• You will always have ore to smelt for the primary resource
• You will reasonably always have ore for the secondary resource too
  Downside:
• Sometimes you will smelt crushed instead of washed ore for the primary resource, which has a lower yield per mined ore.
  Mitigations to the downside:
• You could just not care. You're potentially (and infrequently) wasting 1) mining drills' work, 2) ore patch capacity. 1) is super cheap; 2) is really overrated. There's not really need to look beyond this point.
• If you add a larger buffer, you spend more space and electricity (for the loaders), but you'll less often have a full buffer
• You could also manually destroy some of the buffer chests (it's ok, they contain free resources), but that action is not automatable.

there's a little of that in IR3 tbh... you are in the end better off venting a lot of gas byproducts; the final-tier mining drill is worse than the iron-tier one.

[hexed turret]

tbh I think it would make sense to cheat to add like 3 small and 5 large copper frames into your inventory, otherwise you're just grinding. I don't know of another solution though

[hexed turret]

same actually, sounds more like a vanilla bug than a IR3 bug

[patent depot]

saw the same thing.. kilns / and i think stone furnaces too. Something to do with being able to hand craft the stone bricks I bet

[worldly portal]

Sometimes being the sussy imposter is unavoidable, and you just have to vent 😔

Still mad that they added practically nothing for CO2 and it really is just pollution juice and nothing more

Advanced forestries don’t use nearly enough

[willow bronze]

https://www.reddit.com/r/factorio/comments/1cl1sje/first_time_playing_industrial_revolution_this_is/

look how cute

[sturdy flicker]

[patent depot]

Oy, trying to set up Iron mall... large frames are iron beam hungry... and those beams GOBBLE iron

version 1 I was belting large frames but filling that belt would take a LOT of iron

[sturdy flicker]

If you're still belting stuff:
beams, reinforced plates, pistons, and motors of each material are useful to belt.

All other intermediates can be made with mini-assemblers from ingots either directly at the assembler making the thing you need or in a large block at the beginning of the mini-mall.

All those other pseudo end-intermediates like small/large frames should be made in close proximity to whatever directly needs them since you need them for literally nothing else

Pistons, beams, motors and reinf-plates on the other hand are often used in sciences/analysis packs.

[patent depot]

science factory is independent of mall but yea.. frames made VERY close to all that need is a plan... bot mall looks to be a long ways down the tree.

[sturdy flicker]

You can pseudo-logistic-bot mall by using slot-filtered Logistic Storage boxes.

1. Set up a bot delivery mall with filtered and slot-restricted yellow-boxes.
2. Cover with a dense network of isolated roboports and fill to the brim with construction bots.
3. Deliver a bunch of materials to sacrificial normal storage boxes via train/belt within the construction-reach of the bot mall.
4. Regularly, manually-mark the sacrificial boxes for deconstruction. Reconstruct the boxes afterwards.

Watch as the con-bots distribute stuff to where there is space. For additional points, set up some circuit-based alerts to tell you which material is too low amongst the boxes, easy to do by connecting it to a single roboport.

This makes it easy to mark specific sacrifical boxes.

---

As for the mall output, you could have each of the items simply output onto a common delivery belt that moves the things outside of the range of the isolation-gap, and then into a common passive-provider chest.
Further wiring and an inverted-item-count CC can limit when the individual mall->common output outserters are active.

[patent depot]

Is there a mod that can sort filtered inventory slots?

[sturdy flicker]

jesus, its barely moduled with speed but an adv. assembler making Beacons needs almost 135 chromed rods a second

[worldly portal]

😭😭😭

[sturdy flicker]

beautiful

[proven fractal]

Oh my 😳

[worldly portal]

Beaconed builds in IR3 are such a strange sight

[patent depot]

Poluted steam = ??? Geothermal heat source ... make steam and poluted water

yea... looks like it

seems like the refining/fluids/gasses here is a BIG leap in complexity

[worldly portal]

What do you mean exactly, air separation or oil processing?

[patent depot]

One big change I like from K2SE is how each tech levels stuff seems independent. Like an advanced motor is made from steel inputs rather than being made of some steel bits + an iron motor which is made of a bronze moter which is made of a copper motor

[patent depot]

Kind of both

[worldly portal]

The scrapping mechanic is what enables that, I think it was a great decision

[patent depot]

well.. at least the scraping mechanic makes up for the "waste"

Playing with biters on here but expansion turned down low (but not off) and its taking some work to stay ahead of the cloud with clearing. automating wall supply and maintenance before having logistics bots might be tricky...

[worldly portal]

With oil processing it almost feels like it takes one step down in complexity, just because light oil is so extremely useless you know to immediately crack it and do nothing else with it 😭😭😭
But then it takes several steps up just because of sour gas

[patent depot]

mmm ok Logi bots arent that far off.. but the T2 (vanilla looking) roboports are into chrome

Do you end up with sour gas/sulfur overflow generally?

🙂

[worldly portal]

There are situations where it’s actually the opposite, you need more sour gas than you need primary oil products 😭😭😭

But it depends on how you go through research

The plastic demand really ramps up once you reach blue circuits, so at that point it should balance out

[patent depot]

with biters on I'll be doing military

plastic needs petroleum

Is there a power stage between Coal/steam and Nuclear?

[worldly portal]

Only solar, like in vanilla

[patent depot]

no gas plant?

[worldly portal]

But there are also petrochem generators I guess

[patent depot]

right

those might get interesting.. runs great while you have an imbalance generating extra natural gas

The "fossil gas" vs "natural gas" is a head scratch

[worldly portal]

Fossil gas is a mixed resource

You can separate it into natural gas, nitrogen and helium

[patent depot]

as, to some degree all natural gas is

but I suppose the idea is to force harvesting the "natural" natural gas rather than the refinery output methane

[worldly portal]

It’s a pretty ok source of helium, I think

[patent depot]

which wouldnt have the byproducts

I think most helium we use for baloons in North America came from a gas field in texas

[worldly portal]

Actually iirc fossil gas is a relatively new feature, the mod used to just have natural gas fissures

Then they were changed into this current state

Personally I like it much better this way, even if it bumps them back up the tech tree a bit

[patent depot]

Could you source helium from refinery produced natural gas before?

[worldly portal]

You can only get helium from air separation or fossil gas

I don’t think any other method existed before

You can get hydrogen from oil stuff though

[patent depot]

ah they had to do air seperation before

[worldly portal]

You might still do some, it’s pretty much a free byproduct while you’re getting oxygen or nitrogen

[patent depot]

"free"

ah seperating to get something else and get this as byproduct

Liquid Natural gs.. just for fuelcells?

[worldly portal]

It’s mostly just a novelty, yes

[patent depot]

for vehicles/equipment grid

Can all the gasses be trained around?

[worldly portal]

Yes

I’m pretty sure fluid wagon can take any fluid

[patent depot]

should be really inefficient 😛

unless you liquify!

[worldly portal]

They made high pressure canisters for liquid gases but they didn’t think about fluid wagons 😭😭😭

I mean I’m actually not 100% sure you can, I’ve never seen anyone do it…

But even vanilla lets you put hot steam on a train and keep its temperature

[patent depot]

lol

[worldly portal]

So I guess it’s not a stretch, by factorio logic

[patent depot]

yea... have to afk here, thanks for the info

[hexed turret]

I don't think it's particularly good, however it's great to be able to experience both this and the alternative

[patent depot]

K2 has a scrapping mechanic too but because most low tier items are inputs to higher tier it's generally not worth bothering

[hexed turret]

Scrap is a bit useless because ore is already basically free

Would be good if scrap was e.g. 4 times faster to smelt.

[sturdy flicker]

A "99% Perfect" build

when everything is fine....except the inside has no space for power

[sturdy flicker]

shit, I'm an idiot. sulfur needs to be added too

[sturdy flicker]

settled on this

[willow bronze]

perfection? eh?

I will break it in no time

[hexed turret]

Lmao that's what happens when I try to make a build

[willow bronze]

all I want is some Lasers...nope - before you get lazors you have to make at least 10 differend products

[worldly portal]

Except for beam lasers, these are all things you should have lying around in the mall already (or their ingredients, like for turret frames)

But yeah I declare it a

Gas actually consumed instead of looped around? Cringe

[willow bronze]

V.1 its so ugly. but its..... its just ugly

[patent depot]

Ok.. Hot washing vs cold washing.. hot gives more of the secondary ore. Why would you use cold washing???

Same washing plant.. same power consumption... it just that hot is farther down the research tree??

[bitter mortar]

You may need to balance out ores sometime

[patent depot]

Oof.. so you end up putting both lines... one for when you need the alt ore and the other when bursting with it?

No option to wash and not recover the alt

[bitter mortar]

Dunno I didn't play that far

[patent depot]

Cant do any washing until I get red circuits so I guess I do a gimp gold refinery first

[worldly portal]

Nope, ore washing makes the balancing puzzle mandatory

[willow bronze]

yes, while researching it will consume more from the second ore. so there is no need for balancing, only a bypass for the ore is needed.

[sturdy flicker]

thats just called ore crushing and being okay with having on avg. 1.5x the yield xD

[worldly portal]

Arc furnace users though… 😭😭😭

[hexed turret]

Not necessarily, I put a circuit condition on the boiler so it only heats the water if my buffer chest with the secondary ore is nearly empty.

And I put a splitter with priority so that if no washed primary ore is making it through, then crushed primary ore is used instead.

This way the same set of crushers are used for all 3 recipes.

[patent depot]

Ah I didn't catch from the UI that the water temp was deciding factor between hot and cold rather than a recipe.

[patent depot]

Do Forrestries with no live trees still consume polution?

And.. Do forrestries with live trees but that are backed up and not producing wood still consume polution?

[patent depot]

whoa... I just noticed that train wagons are 80 slots!

Is that IR3 standard?

[spiral creek]

I think so

Hover a wagon and show the mods that affect it

[worldly portal]

Really good question actually I want to know this one too 😭

[hexed turret]

No, pollution consumption scales with number of trees

And it seems to me that they consume more pollution than what the tooltip says, because the trees generated by them also consume pollution

[patent depot]

the trees in their chunk consume polution

the ok I got steel & steel science running now lets get red circuits going is a gigantic leap.. especially with biters on as the cloud starts to grow significantly. My son asks about once every 30 minutes if I have hydrogen going yet because he wants to make an airship! Had to up my turret creep game.. now doing turret blocks with BP and clockwork construction bots AND explosive rockets in hand to reach out to hit them.. this feels reasonable combat wise... I'd played a lot of K2SE and used the anti-material rifle for sniping nests/worms from a turret protected spot, hadnt used rocket launcher as a personal weapon much. Biters at 77% evolution currently

Don't want to do full "walls" until I can repair/build them with bots & roboports automatically

Also... unloading trains with yellow inserters is comedy... guess I should use loaders

Cybersyn thinks the train is stuck

Fueling the train with steam canisters is neat

Have to say though.. without the inventory transfer mechanic I'd have gone nuts without logistics bots this long

[worldly portal]

Ngl I keep forgetting airships exist

Imo they’re kind of a nothing feature

But they do have some undeniable cool factor, and they are extremely fitting to the mod’s aesthetic

[willow bronze]

how do they work? they are so complicated

cool spider bros doing some of the logistics

[willow bronze]

note about forestry: I have one for normal trees and one for rubber trees. the normal wood get converted to charcoal and burned, so there is always demand. the rubber on the other hand is on demand and not being constantly consumed. With some high pollution the rubber trees died almost entirely. my guess is that the wood needs to be consumed, so new trees can regrow and not destroy the entire tree farm.

[worldly portal]

Plastic 2 sounds like it would be a godsend in this situation

Gives you a basically endless sink for wood, lets you save on oil at the same time, and lets you ignore rubber trees and make synthetic rubber out of regular wood

Though, with less oil production also comes less sour gas production, so could it ever create a situation where you don’t have enough sour gas to make the acid for ethanol?

Worst case scenario you just burn petroleum for power, I guess

[patent depot]

Was thinking of setting up airship logistics for wall supplies

Do Forrestries ACTUALLY make new trees? or just produce wood based on what trees are already present?

Semes like the trees you can make in IR3 (tree "bed") don't count but the dectorio trees do.

[worldly portal]

Trees in forestry chunks are borh created and harvested, and the harvested ones turn into the wood output

It works something like that, iirc

But over time the number is generally increased up to a point where it reaches balance

[patent depot]

So new trees spawn around a forrestry, eventually creating a dense forrest there?

ah.. possibly not to "impassable tree obstacle" level forest

probably up to the minimum number of trees to light all the green lights on the forrestry

[patent depot]

Do you folks do much with the robotowers? or is that a quick pitstop before the big ones

[willow bronze]

they have its use, as they are only 2x2. good to squeeze in a dense build

[sturdy flicker]

I use them in the end game almost exclusively.
I'm using a few "cheat" mods such as Nuclear Robots, which negates the need to have more charging ports, but the real use of the 2x2 ports is their 2x2 footprint.

I can fit those in places that would be visally rather macabre with the 4x4 ports.

[hexed turret]

airships are quite useful actually, if you want to transport something from point A to point B and there isn't room for belts, they're great at it and their fuel is really cheap

though I'm not sure if there's a way to make them pause..... but that's not really an issue with fuel so cheap

I think their bandwidth is pretty high too.

the basic usage guide is: don't use the same station as both pickup and dropoff (unless you're using a filter for the operations that come last); use inventory filters on the airship if you want to transport mutliple different item types

[meager burrow]

Bots Bots Bots!

Logistic robots are available from the start. Adds a new tier of "steam-powered" robots for the early game, and several new tiers for later.

Author

Zoryn

Downloads

297

[willow bronze]

adds a Variety of bots from the start

IR3 compatible.

easy mode for IR3. should have startet with this mod

[spiral creek]

Why’s there five green ones

[willow bronze]

nuclear powered, seems like they dont need to be charged.

[sturdy flicker]

Yeah, but like....even amongst the nuclear powered ones there's 5 different kinds

For different nuclear fuels? Different stats?

[willow bronze]

they eat the previous bots, good to get rid of the old bots but have all same stats

[spiral creek]

What do they do that’s different

[sturdy flicker]

It's interesting, the mod author stated how impossible it was to create a building that accepts steam, but behaves as a roboport.

The heavy roller basically just gets around this by letting you use its equipment grid.
Funnily enough, one could still fenagle a steam-powered inserter that inserts and removes the copper steam-canisters from said heavy-roller from/to a belt, and essentially you use it as a "roboport".

If you deliver ammo on the other half of the steam-canister delivery belt and fill the heavy roller with enough repair packs, you essentially have an early game repair-tower.

[sturdy flicker]

Though, without logistics storage chests, construction around the base would be an issue

[willow bronze]

first roboport needs also no power. neat. but also has a huge AoE

[sturdy flicker]

steam powered logistics chests xDdd

I really have no leg to stand on though, me and my unipipes is just as cheaty

[hexed turret]

I'm not a fan of the whole "steam cell" thing.

Steam is meant to be produced under high pressure, then the thing using it is stealing the pressure. You can't exactly store that in a container I think

[willow bronze]

having fun with unipipes eh? I forgot we had those

[sturdy flicker]

somebody needs to watch Steamboy

[sturdy flicker]

Yeah, so I finally managed to come up with a system that keeps a "float" of at least 5k water and up to 20k in a fluid tank.
The in/out unipipes are in an endless loop, and take out as much as they take in. Should for whatever reason the unipipe internal storage fill up too much
(WHICH BTW YOU CAN'T READ WITH CIRCUITS WHICH STARTED THIS WHOLE MESS AGGGGHHH ) then the tank will fill past 20k

This triggers a latch to enable the pump leading to the boilers + vents until the count hits 5k again.
Any lower than 5k and the offshore pump inlet is enabled.

So now recipes such as sulfur -> sulfuric acid can reliably offload and draw water from uni-pipe storage, without there ever being too much or too little water.

This is important for setups that produce or require water independently from each other, at different times, asynchronously from each other.

---

Apropos, see how the outlet pipe from sulfur is empty, but the inlet pipe for sulfuric acid is full.

[willow bronze]

having fun with liquids huh? try Exotic Industries. tripples the Oil difficulty

[sturdy flicker]

more steps is just more steps at this point. Unipipes take the frustration/fun out of routing fluids

[willow bronze]

so the whole setup is to get rid of excess water?

[sturdy flicker]

Pretty much, or to be more specific, maintain a certain amount of water.

You don't want too little and you don't want too much.

But that goes for all fluid intermediates you want to always need space to store, but wouldn't want to vent completely.

sour gas, carbon dioxide, etc.

[sturdy flicker]

Trivial to control if the internal levels could could be read. Perhaps the mod author will update it soon.

Nope valves don't apply here.

Do those even have a "top up" mode?

[willow bronze]

yeeees

[sturdy flicker]

lemme guess, Shift-F or something. must have missed that.

[willow bronze]

yeeees²

[sturdy flicker]

hach.... thats why they can connect with wires....

[willow bronze]

shift E

thats why my oil brick works so well

[sturdy flicker]

Wait, how....does one even configure the specifics of the top-up/overflow ranges?

Wire connection doesn't do much

[willow bronze]

overflow is if >80% = work

top up is if <80% = work

no need to set up anything

[sturdy flicker]

Overflow: >80% of source pipe.
Top-Up is <80% of destination pipe.
In either case valves only work if source > destination, otherwise becomes ==

Ok, seems to be somewhat straightforward. Saves me a latch or pump at least

[willow bronze]

heh ^^'

thats how the chrome setup also work on the server

polutet water treatment =-

[hexed turret]

yeah, I went through my entire first playthrough without noticing this

[willow bronze]

so I top it up with a pump

[hexed turret]

had to use pumps with circuits

it was one of the first times I used circuits

[willow bronze]

I'm the nerd, that is why I read all the manuals

[hexed turret]

I did actually read all the manual too, but I must have forgotten about that

Or possibly didn't understand it and hadn't unlocked valves yet

[sturdy flicker]

akagi noises intensify

Jokes aside, I could have sworn I had the mini-editor mode mod installed.

Got a taste of it in Vita's server, was good

[loud smelt]

The valves got updated in December, they had only 1 function before then

[hexed turret]

ah, I did this before December. An excellent update!

[loud smelt]

Is it better to use heavy oil or Bitumen to make graphitic coke?

[hexed turret]

Using Bitumen is more effective than first breaking Bitumen into petrochemicals, and then using them to make the graphitic coke.

However, you could also use the bitumen for flooring (but 140% movespeed compared to refined concrete's 150%, so I don't make it);
or you could break it into petrochemicals for the sake of simplicity.

[sturdy flicker]

Yeah, I try to use bitumen first for whatever needs the solid bitumen first, and any overflow is turned into bitumen-crude

[patent depot]

oh my the airship interface is .... complicated

[willow bronze]

Magic number 4

Trivial: I see always some similarities in my calculations. And those similarities are the magic number 4 in assemblers to reach uptime for all the smaller assemblers. to get a even number without rounding, you know.

[hexed turret]

It's simple if you're content with moving just a few specific items from A and dropping them off to B

Well, its main example use is with just one item type

[loud smelt]

What does everyone do with their 4 module slots on machines that don't take productivity? I'm post Rocket now and have access to nuclear power, so efficiency modules don't seem that necessary anymore?

[sturdy flicker]

Efficiency in early game, with speed modules as long as it stays at -80% energy.
Gradually replace with speed as power production becomes a non-issue.

[patent depot]

efficiency modules always seemed more about less polution than less power

though both cut polution I guess

[worldly portal]

IR3 makes modules a binary choice between "build less factory but more power" and "build less power but the same amount of factory"

[willow bronze]

the scrapyard: is so tiny in my maps

[patent depot]

Playing with dectorio mod... I'm done eveything up to the end of purple tech but I can't find the Traffic Bollards in the tech tree or make them.

any ideas?

[patent depot]

Ok I can see it with FNEI and Factory planner. FP sais there is no recipie for this item. FNEI sais it takes 2 plastic and one iron plate.

Probably should be enabled by Plastics tech

[spiral creek]

I didn’t know it was compatible

[patent depot]

I saw a mod list of someone setting up a multiplayer

I'm doing IR3 + dectorio + gizmos car keys + autodrive

[willow bronze]

we had that talk about Autodrive crashing the server?

[patent depot]

happened the first time but it was fine after that... so... wierd

[willow bronze]

GCK soflocked me yesterday, did not like the uniwheel and Blueprints sandboxes

[patent depot]

Whats GCK?

[spiral creek]

Gizmos car keys

[patent depot]

Hey... what do I put on the bus... liquid or gaseous Helium?

similarly in general for other gasses going forwards...

Do you folks end up with a giant italian engieering disaster of a mall?

[spiral creek]

I would recommend against using a fluid bus since there’s so many fluids. Better to pipe them with underground’s to where they’re needed

[sturdy flicker]

Also, some gases simply need to be in a loop of:
Assembler row -> gaseous nitrogen -> cryogen row -> liquid nitrogen -> (back to) Assembler row

What you can bus are air-filters. Those can be belted, and are useful everywhere on your base you need compressed air -> specific liquid gas

[worldly portal]

I wonder, how feasible is it to fill an entire base's coke supply solely off the coke from petrol cracking

Assuming we have access to the space science coke-free steel recipe, of course, because steel is the biggest coke sink

2.6 coke per 60 petrol would then have to satisfy: black science, air filters, artillery shells, and silicon (which uses very little)
Did I miss anything?

I mean worst case scenario we can up petrol production and then crack excess natural gas before venting it, but that's super wasteful

[worldly portal]

I just noticed that this casually dropped yesterday and nobody said anything 😳

This is huge

Finally, blast furnaces are no longer doodoo

[willow bronze]

Blast furnaces gain a 20% productivity bonus.

[worldly portal]

Equivalent to a fully T3 moduled electric furnace, and you get them before T3 modules

[gray escarp]

Yoo sick

[worldly portal]

Probably cheaper to build too, though I don't really have a solid grasp on module costs in IR3 so I may be wrong

Arc furnaces still win in the end (as they should), but there is actually one thing blast furnaces can do and arc furnaces can't

Silicon

So if you wanted you could keep using them for silicon even into the endgame

Worth it? Probably not. Possible? Yes.

[sturdy flicker]

Blast furnaces are not cheaper to build.

They're squarely an end game burner furnace, requiring 12 chromed beams, 30 chromed plates, and 30 silicon carbide bricks, which themselves require a bi of an annoying silica and graphite/graphitic coke chain.

The reason they're getting a productivity bonus is because they don't accept any modules, essentially Deadlock added in a missing redeeming factor, because speed is replaceable with just "more of the slower thing".

Without that, Blasts are just really complicated, requiring burner fuel and piped in air.

Its like if you wanted to make a really advanced T3 burner furnace in Vanilla, while keeping the 2x2 footprint.

But you do get them before T3 modules, that is true

Finally, one should add that Blast Furnaces only do:

• copper (ore/crushed/pure)
• iron (ore/crushed/pure)
• steel (iron ingot)
• silicon (silica)

no gold/lead/tin/platinum/chromium...

[worldly portal]

I know all this, I'm saying I'm happy that they're now no longer objectively worse than the basic electric furnace despite being expensive and high-tech

Due to their lack of productivity modules up until now

Now they nicely fit into their place in the tech tree by offering a pretty good productivity boost to their limited set of recipes, that you have no other way to reach yet (and speed too but like you said that doesn't matter too much)

Also I don't really see the coke requirement as a particularly big deal, because half of what they can smelt already required coke as an input anyway

[willow bronze]

thats the most forbidden build I made so far.

its fun, to squeeze the most into a square

[spiral creek]

Why is it panning like that and have this edm music over it

You should glam up the video

Put sparkles and gifs on there

[patent depot]

Wait a second... this from the screensaver... are these in the mod?

[worldly portal]

Yes

It's all one building with different recipes

[patent depot]

seems like a pneumatic delivery system to deliver intermediates

[worldly portal]

Close...

It's molten metal casting

[sturdy flicker]

Yeah thats actually kinda cool tbf.
In that regard, they're kinda like a lategame "pipe-powered" entity like the steam/copper age at the game start

[patent depot]

ah the bits on the end are casters

[worldly portal]

This is literally my first time getting a good look at the model, that's how rarely used it is 😭😭😭

[patent depot]

suspect weaving pipes for the casters will be about as much "fun" as steam pipe in early game

[willow bronze]

I've looked at it in the sadbox, they are so pretty

[worldly portal]

They're basically a furnace given that "advanced" treatment

The gold/brass/whatever plating with cool patterns

[patent depot]

yea the tip tier furnace

about to set up mall making all the advanced machines

Going to get requester chests just in time to not need them...

[worldly portal]

Unlike SE, with IR3 I understand locking requesters further back, because IR3 is designed a lot around its crazy building recipes

IR3 spaghetti malls are special works of art

[patent depot]

The actual science/production builds are quite reasonable

It's the mall that is utter itallian engineering madness

[worldly portal]

IR3 early game, when your power grid is also spaghetti

[patent depot]

Into the chrom stuff now.. I think maybe if I trashed the whole thing and started over I could maybe make it a bit less meh but probably deluding myself

oh yea..even the Medium Steel poles were quite late

[patent depot]

no polution at all eh 😛

[loud smelt]

furnaces are offset by 1 tile. The productivity change has messed with the gas vent symmetry.

[willow bronze]

what pollution?

[patent depot]

HA! Forrestries right in town eh?

[willow bronze]

spend some time to redesigne the tree farm

[patent depot]

Conversion to solar power really helped with my cloud

though... I need to fix it so it doesn't burn coal at night and relies on the accumulators

either the coal inserters or the water pumps.. which to mess with this time?

[willow bronze]

I must say, the petrochem gens are the most dirtiest

[worldly portal]

But they do give you the option to use ethanol, which has a pretty good pollution reduction

[willow bronze]

spend some time to learn something about the petrol

came up with this beauty

fits into a half square and pollution control

[worldly portal]

High octane fuel for power generation?

Interesting

I know ethanol has the biggest pollution reduction, but I wonder if high octane maybe has a better pollution/energy ratio because of its higher fuel value

I could try to do the maths on that...

Oh, nevermind, it turns out I was misremembering and high octane fuel doesn't have a pollution reduction at all

[willow bronze]

having ethanol is nice, but I also need to get rid of LPG

[worldly portal]

Actually, this topic reminded me

What's the point of hydrogen cells?

Like, what niche do they fill

High octane is a better vehicle fuel, portable fission is better for powering equipment

Is there even a way to plug them into your power grid?

[loud smelt]

Helium Airship only takes hydrogen cells not high octane

Heavy picket also

[sturdy flicker]

I love these "carbon-neutral" setups

[sturdy flicker]

your top picks for EuroVision SongContest? 😄

[sturdy flicker]

highest tier non-polluting non-electricity "battery" you can fuel and recharge without chance of battery loss for trains aswell

[sturdy flicker]

just fill a tank up with hydrogen and send hydrogen to a liquid fuel generator, I think?

[willow bronze]

but wait, there is more eye candy

[sturdy flicker]

One issue I've found with using these damn uni-pipes, they seem to involve the target-hitbox of a normal assembler, so if you put an inserter next to them, they don't actually target the things you want them to.

As indicated by the silly little "+"

[willow bronze]

mod author mention, that this is an actual hidden building

[worldly portal]

I'm pretty sure those do not accept hydrogen

[sturdy flicker]

yeah, I didn't really fact check that

[bitter mortar]

My forestries were 2x2 chunks
So I had a small square of forestries and trees in the middle and everything else was free

[patent depot]

Is there a reason to use "Air" pipes?

[spiral creek]

Yes

To deliver air

[patent depot]

but are they better than standard pipes?

[spiral creek]

It will say it on the pipe

How much air does it hold

[patent depot]

I get that you can use Air pipes to transport compressed air.. but just wondering if its an esthetics thing to use them or if there is some compelling reason like higher throughput or some such

[spiral creek]

They are probably just there so you can see the animated air

[patent depot]

Same as regur pipe.. I suspect its for esthetics

[patent depot]

OMG... the "mirrored" recipies for air seperation... I made a build thinking the recipies offered a choice .. more oxytgen or more nitrogen and to balance them.. Nope!! just mirrored to swap the outputs around to make the build look better!

[willow bronze]

so today I made the Math about the Liquid fuel.
Ethanol:

• eats more wood (12 tree farm) -432 p/m
• 50% pollution reduction (48,75 p/m)
• 5 MW Power (6,25 petrochem)

Octan:

• 6 Tree Farms (-216 p/m)
• 10 MW Power (12,5Petrochem x 800kw)
• 187 p/m generation

[willow bronze]

Charcoal:

• 24 bronze tree Farm / 12 electric (-864 p/m)(-432 p/m)
• 41,25 pollution generation by boiler
• 4,9 MW Power (5,5 x 900kw)

size comp. what 10 MW in solar looks like

[willow bronze]

update by my observation: the Octan fuel Burns at a rate of 1,3 i/s and not as I assumed with 2 i/s. I observed, that the generation is higher then the consumtion. even Rate Calc could not tell me that. RateCals shows me that is should be negativ and satisfied with 12,5 petrochem Gens. but with a Calculation of 1,3 it increases the number of the Generators up to 19,2. That means the total possible generation would be 15,3 MW for Octan. but 1,3 is a rounded number, so doing the backward calulation: (1500 octan/60sec) * 600kj/800 = 18,75 Gens. which is exactly 15MW. science is fun

but of course, it has a higher burn value, means longer lasting, means lower item consumption

[sturdy flicker]

You can't even use them to be "seperate" pipes since they'll both connect with each other.

but they do have that aesthetic quality to them I suppose

[patent depot]

Nothing wrong with a bit of aesthetics 😛

[patent depot]

I wish there were controllable valves.. on/off but don't need pumping. Interesting that the valves do have circuit connections but just to read contents

[sturdy flicker]

As @willow bronze showed me, you can use the alt-modes of one-way valves to do:

• auto topping up (if source more than destination && destination less than 80% full)
• auto overflow (if source more than destination && source more than 80% full)

Shift-E

[patent depot]

Yea that solves a number of the usual use cases for circuit controlled pumps. Particularly the top up

[sturdy flicker]

Also its a bit of shame it isn't offered for more things.

In a perfect game, Factorio would offer the choice of being able to choose where to put the in/outputs on a personal-player basis, as long as you satisfy the minimum number of I/O needed, ie. you can't just leave out water on cracking.

[patent depot]

I beleive thats coming in the expansion

FFF somethingarother

[willow bronze]

yeah, well I have played once a small pollution facility mod, this is where I learned to top up and whatever in vanilla

[patent depot]

Lots of things in SE require "topup" where you get x% of a particular input back as output and easiest way to manage is to connect both in and out feeds from the plant to a tank you keep at >5k fluid

basically topup but I usually do it more like 20%

Wheeee blue circuits online

First run...

Now I get to find out how much power my base needs when its ALL running for the first time in a long time... and how much polution

Are nuclear ratios reactors/exchangers/turbine same as vanilla?

[patent depot]

Oh cute.. my nearest, only, and tiny uranium patch is at the edge of the revealed map! I like how this mechanic drives expansion. I guess its time to ACTUALLY make walls now that I have logistics chests to make it not painful to set up a wall supply cargo station. For scale... the solar fields are a 96x96 block size

Tanks with the Autodrive mod's repair function that uses bots and repair packs from inventory seems a bit OP.. probably due to the stronger than vanilla repair packs in IR3

[willow bronze]

about same map size now, still haven't found uran

[patent depot]

Not sure what the mechanic is... possibly its smart enough to only spawn them at the very edge of discovered area

Are your blocks totally bot driven?

[willow bronze]

yes, 80% bot rest is belts inside the chunk

[patent depot]

I meant between chunks... interesting

what is your science production rate?

[willow bronze]

no research so far, preparing for yellow science

[patent depot]

Ah you are JUST behind me

MMM advanced forrestry is a whole new game... need lots of Carbon Dioxide input... however if I do any blast furnace smelting I suspect I'll be swimming in the stuff

Hmm is it actully the same ploution consumption for electric and advanced forrestry? Just Perhaps you get more trees and it disposes C02 for you?

and gives oxygen

Ahhh and you NEED oxygen for blast furnacing

[worldly portal]

Fun little thing I noticed one day: One coke gasification plant (without productivity) lines up perfectly with one advanced forestry

In terms of CO2 output and input per second

Not sure when exactly this would be useful, but it's there

Maybe I should check the CO2 production of sulfur instead

[willow bronze]

explosives are still so nice to have

[quaint pollen]

Just installed some high octane turbines, ready to roll out the infrastructure for purple science.
(I exhausted all blue science tech while experimenting with secondary ore stuff...)

[willow bronze]

prepare for a good pollution cloud.

[sturdy flicker]

Slowly transitioning into using Linked Chests too. Decided I'd make a "physical blueprint book"

Along with a slowly but steadily growing linked-chest mapping-library

[quaint pollen]

Not a biter person sorry 😅 , I either play on peaceful or non expansive outside of vanilla.

Been playing all IR1 2 and 3.0 like that.

Nowadays I don't have that much free time, but this mod is still a delicacy.

[sturdy flicker]

Its very cute

[gray escarp]

it do be looking cute

[willow bronze]

starting designing now? ooh

[willow bronze]

what linked chest is that? the one from the linked pipe dude does not work together with ir3. so, Logistic bots are not cheaty, needs power and robotower for range. but I also had this idea to play with linked chest offline.

[willow bronze]

you are cute.

[patent depot]

Looking into some walls... my lord the reinforced steel wall is expensive

I should just build wooden barricade! swimming in wood

[willow bronze]

heh! build a palisade with wood chest

[meager burrow]

Small Nightvision Revived

Changes the grid size of the 2x2 Nightvision goggles to 1x1.

Author

kreeg

Downloads

1055

[willow bronze]

mod recommendation

[patent depot]

The chain link fence is dectorio.. the wood one might be?

[willow bronze]

oh faisty you are ahead you said. do you have diamond running already?

[patent depot]

yep

that was pretty easy

[willow bronze]

do I have realy find 16 diamonds?

[patent depot]

Having trouble finding them?

[willow bronze]

I have 5, maybe other player who visited the server got some

[patent depot]

My son tells me ruby spawn on gold patches. The other early ore patches get diamonds

go explore some new patches.. you'll find them fairly quick

ALSO yea.. you need to spend your initial seed diamonds on a diamond grinder wheel

[willow bronze]

[patent depot]

lol have fun

[willow bronze]

yeah Im surrounded by Soviets

[patent depot]

Remember that they spawn ON the ore patches

if you have visitors that did some exploration they may have them in their inventory 😦

do you have "FactorySearch"?

[willow bronze]

no

[patent depot]

OH you should get that

you might find a bunch of diamonds are sitting in a wood chest in your mall somewhere

or some other random spot

[willow bronze]

I rebuild 80% of the base 2 days ago, so everything should be in 3 big logistic chest by now

[patent depot]

you playing with a large chest mod?

[willow bronze]

this one

[patent depot]

Whats that?

Familiar with AAI and K2 big storages.. and Long Warehouse

[willow bronze]

thats the aai I think

[patent depot]

These look kind of beatup though

6x6 = how many slots?

[willow bronze]

500, but I made it smaller in the setting. standard should be 1000 I think

[patent depot]

Theres a line over 500 where the UPS hit ramps up somehow... Earendel caps at 512 IIRC.. Long Warehouse caps at 540

[patent depot]

right and vanilla plus is the default

I'd love if vanilla could properly support non square containers

Having long warehouses that are the length of your trains is very nice

[willow bronze]

you have a server you said?

hmm, looking at factory planer, I dont need actually diamonds

[patent depot]

FP lies about catalists 😛

Crush one diamond... combine with graphite in a cubic press.. get 2 diamonds

Do your ruby build at the same time... its VERY similar except needing scilica AND pure chromium

[willow bronze]

ruby is running

but I was surprised by the crusher T3

[patent depot]

its a cute bootstrap requirement

Cant boot up with ONE diamond like you can with rubyt

[sturdy flicker]

Nah, nothing like that. Factorio vanilla has its own linked chest entity, that the Unipipe actually exploits to barrel a fluid token (not the fluid itself) in order to store and distribute the fluids like the chests.

Also, I've gotten around the mistargeting-issue of inserters and unipipes. If you build the unipipes last, they don't conflict.

Its an extra step, but by no means insurmountable

[tranquil ember]

Did I get extremely unlucky with my gold spawn?

[sturdy flicker]

narrows eyes

copper has like...all the things, iron comes in second place, then steel, but everything else is so spotty.

[sturdy flicker]

Whats anyone's particular opinion to namespacing each material like this?

There's usually no more than 16 material-specific intermediaries, so giving each 8-16 dedicated slots and leaving the unused ones empty (within reason) so I can begin a new set on its own "round" byte seems to work nicely

[tranquil ember]

Sorry, it's at the bottom right of the screenie, and my base/spawn is the more obvious structure.That's the nearest gold that I can see and it's only a 400k node

[willow bronze]

yes, thats normal,gold is far away.

haven't even found uran yet (me). because its endgame material and even further

[tranquil ember]

It seems strange as it is minable in red/green science I'm already at blue/black and still haven't gotten any gold D:

Interestingly my uranium is closer than gold

or at least nto that far

[sturdy flicker]

Yeah, some stuff like gold and uranium will be in tiny nodes at the beginning.

Once you set up a large train network, or god forbid a cityblock, you'll be tripping over them

[tranquil ember]

idk about that my evolution is at 82% right now

Trying to get at least purple/gold science going before I havber to deal with behmes

[sturdy flicker]

Here, my cityblock is 11x12 blocks @ 7x7 chunks each, so...about 80 chunks wide/tall

even so, gold isn't exactly everywhere in huuuge patches, but its...around.

[tranquil ember]

Is most of that just solar panels?

[sturdy flicker]

yup ^^

[tranquil ember]

I haven't put any down in ir3 so not sure how the icon looks

ahh

My power plant is interesting

and by that I mean it's mostly boilers and some petrochems

[sturdy flicker]

5.5GW of solar, and 1.8GW of Nuclear to bolster accus thru the night.

[tranquil ember]

My friends just do whatever they want so I'm letting them handle all the oil stuffs. I doubt we'll ever get as organized as that screenshot is

[sturdy flicker]

I mean...if you consider this "organized"...

Even Vita's carbon-neutral pods look nicer

Tbf, alligning power lines and rails with the chunk grid goes a long way.

Once I complete the chest-linking, even the rails will be obsolete

* sad noises *

[tranquil ember]

The teleporters?

Or robots

[sturdy flicker]

yeah teleporter boxes

[tranquil ember]

You know. I didn't think about it but those really will just take over for everything. No more airships/trains

Did you find that you used airships? I'm tempted to make them to crash them into biter nests

[willow bronze]

would be nice if they would explode

or what I wish

[tranquil ember]

The game does say they explode violently on destruction

[willow bronze]

yeah no shit, my smelting area is like a pollution sponge

[sturdy flicker]

KIROV REPORTING

But seriously, goddamn it would be pretty awesome to load droppable explosives from them.

Like, worms and spitters can still target them, but you can choose to use hydrogen or helium airships if you want explosive sacrificial airships or faster, tougher airships.

[sturdy flicker]

unf, pretty

[sturdy flicker]

Man, these are so fun to try and solve

Basically, the challenge is to fit the entity, unipipes and linked chests with filtered bulk-inserters into a 4x4 space, including power, since it will be surrounded by beacons

[spiral creek]

None of these are 4x4

What does it mean

[sturdy flicker]

oops, 6x6 sorry

[spiral creek]

How are those pipes just chilling inside a beacon

[sturdy flicker]

Basically, I want to eventually make a very modular setup of beacons where I can plonk down a thing to make stuff, and eventually make a perfect 1000k a second

[sturdy flicker]

unipipes. Its a fluid version of linked chests

[spiral creek]

Oh are you cheating

[sturdy flicker]

Modding

Either way, making each individual recipe config has been quite a fun activity, its like in Opus Magnum where you focus on the steps to get to the solution, rather than having to think about the scaling of said solution concurrently.

[worldly portal]

I am completely flabbergasted

I did the math today comparing the two graphitic coke recipes

And it looks like 10 heavy oil is actually perfectly equivalent to one bitumen

In terms of how much plastic can eventually be made from it

Without productivity, at least

I think bitumen may actually get an additional productivity step

The ratios in this mod are so extremely clean for some reason, I almost feel bad for using productivity modules 😭😭😭

For example, the ratio of crude oil to plastic is 10:1 (but if you also process the bitumen then it’s 120:13 )

[sturdy flicker]

Deadlock must have felt like god, sitting back after coding and recoding this, and on the 700th day he sat back...

...and saw that it was

good

ⁿᵒ ʷᵃᶦᵗ ˢʰᶦᵗ ᵗʰᵉ ᵇˡᵃˢᵗ ᶠᵘʳⁿ⁻

[worldly portal]

Nice pixels

[proven fractal]

enhance

[sturdy flicker]

Starting to convert my washer/smelter columns into linked-chest 12-beacon blocks.

Almost a bit sad, I spent so long on those, especially iron and gold, since various minerals are required in mineral form, to make it all look nice and unified.

For reference, the 3 city block column, consisting of two ore-crusher/washer blocks and one smelting block, has around 1300 beacons and 480 smelters.

On the other hand, a new single city block has over 2000 beacons, and outperforms the old smelting arrays in terms of throughput, simply by how fast it can work and instantaneous ingredient/product storage access.

And since the 3-block colum was dedicated to a single ore type, I'll be building 3 of the new blocks, per.

[hushed hawk]

Hi

[willow bronze]

everyday a new one appear

[sturdy flicker]

I believe this is one the most popular threads under #modded-chat , so I'm not surprised. But curious considering SE and A/B/Py collectively have a larger player base, yet don't have a dedicated thread of their own.

Ah, ok, SE has two threads 😄

[hazy zodiac]

and SE has their own mega popular discord channel

[sturdy flicker]

true! perhaps there's a super secret IR3 discord out there somewhere?

[willow bronze]

never played SE, not hyped, not intended

there is this dlc thingy, that will be enough for me

[sturdy flicker]

@willow bronze on your server I remember you had a kind of remote-camera mod. Mostly used to cinematically follow an entity, such as a single item on a belt, used in the core vanilla engine to focus on a train within the train GUI window.

Do you know what it (the mod) was called again, and if it could be used to open a small viewport window of a spot on the map, like a Picture-In-Picture window?

[sturdy flicker]

Also, these are the icons the analysis pack graphic update added

[maiden ferry]

pretty packs. makes more sense than vanilla.

[willow bronze]

hue hue hue

[meager burrow]

Item Cam

Follow an item around your base, like in the Factorio trailer.

Author

DaveMcW

Downloads

523

[willow bronze]

but there is no PiP

[willow bronze]

for PiP there is

[meager burrow]

Implant Camera

This mod adds an Implant Camera. Craft it, throw it on a player, vehicle, unit or ground to install the camera and watch if from distance.

Author

MFerrari

Downloads

6171

[sturdy flicker]

oooh perfect

[sturdy flicker]

[loud smelt]

Just realised metal casts aren't affected by beacons... Are Arc furnaces viable for high SPM bases?

[sturdy flicker]

High spm bases usually try to reduce UPS overhead wherever possible, but I don't know if the solid-ingredient distribution tree is more taxing than the same for fluids.

Either system would have its own pros/cons in terms of design-compressability and step-abstraction (where you centralize/offsite certain pre-steps, such as making plates from ingots or directly casting them).

You can try to put everything together in such a way that it direct-inserts from production entity to production entity and reduce superfluous transport, but you may not be able to get "perfect" speed bonusing out of it.

--
Bear in mind that mini-assemblers can make, eg. Rivets, but casters cannot.

Casters however, can make gears from molten metals, wheras mini assemblers require plates first.

Most likely you'll have to test each goal-product design out, case by case, and then scale it.

[sturdy flicker]

unf

[sturdy flicker]

Also, one other fun thing with slowly changing everything over to unipipes and linked chests, every so often a train-supplied part of my factory goes dark, causes something in the chain to not be built and I get to hunt for it again

[sturdy flicker]

May god have mercy on my soul

[willow bronze]

why is there trains

[sturdy flicker]

Good question!

artillery? maybe?

Ugggh, why aren't Supermagnets modulable, nor affected by beacons. I hope they have some better future use.

[sturdy flicker]

I love these nice long vertical sections for small-assembler intermediaries

[willow bronze]

I'm lacking motivation to play this in the endgame somehow

[spiral creek]

Then don’t

[sturdy flicker]

do what I do, make the base pretty or mod it to hell and back

Also, the programmer calc makes it a cinch to do program in the concat-addressing

All I have to do is punch in the binary result in the checkboxes, and then check the result link-number matches the decimal number

which, of course it always does, but its still really neat

[sturdy flicker]

I believe it was mark watney that said "I'm going to have to science the shit out of this"

[worldly portal]

Deadlock's weird productivity rules claim another victim 😭😭😭

According to factoriolab at least, alloy furnace alloying recipes accept productivity modules, but arc furnace alloying recipes don't

Steel is just barely saved by the hydrogen recipe

So instead of mixing molten metals, you should actually cast the ingots and then put those into regular furnaces

[sturdy flicker]

you guys are prodding furnaces? 😅
Still, damn, rather nuanced this all is

[worldly portal]

What else is there to prod 😭

[quaint pollen]

Not much lol

[patent depot]

Wait a second.... Do "tree bed" trees count for forrestries?

[quaint pollen]

They do, hover the mouse on the forestry to see the highlighted trees taken into account.

[patent depot]

yea I'd thought I tested that before and it didnt work.. then tried with dectorio trees which did work

I think the issue at the time was that the "tree bed" trees are a 3x3 entity and you can't slam down quite as many... the dectorio arent aligned with blocks so you can spam them at a silly density

Not sure a full chunk of tree bed trees would max out a forrestry... but I suppose you could spam down a couple of tree beds and it would spawn trees to fill the quota

[quaint pollen]

There's enough room for max out a chunk with tree beds by filling around half the chunk. I wonder if decotorio messes with tree beds given the different tree types and even the rubber trees.

[hexed turret]

Productivity increase for furnaces is good, now I wish we get a buff for the last tier miners because they're currently inferior to the previous tier

[worldly portal]

Wait, really?

In what way

[hexed turret]

They take up more space, so the ratio of space taken to mining speed is inferior.

I would be mining more ore per second if I tiled the patches with iron miners than if I did with last tier miners

[worldly portal]

No way 😭😭😭

How did he let that happen

[proven fractal]

It goes from 5x5 to 7x7 and doubles in speed though?

[hexed turret]

Speed goes from 2.5 to 3.75 IIRC

[worldly portal]

Speed goes from 2.5 to 3.75

[proven fractal]

Oh then yeah it's not as good per area

[hexed turret]

And even if speed went to 10, you'd probably gain nothing from upgrading to them, since the previous miners are already decent, and those have really high costs. They need a bigger buff to be actually worthwhile

[proven fractal]

2.5/25 vs 3.75/49

Them being 7 wide tiles nicely with direct train mining

[hexed turret]

Tbh I'd just remove them from the game. Or give them +50% productivity.

[proven fractal]

So if it was 5 instead of 3.75 it would be a very slight improvement

Probably deserves some other benefit like the Space Age BMD mining yield

[hexed turret]

give them +50% productivity and cut their pollution by a factor of 5x

[worldly portal]

Or just give them more module slots, that would make them worth it to me

[hexed turret]

yeah, even their module slots right now are the same as the previous drill

[proven fractal]

4 module slots and 50% less resource drain like the BMD would be pretty good

[hexed turret]

huge costs to make one

[proven fractal]

It is more than a Vulcanus mining drill!
It would be pretty weak if the only use of the Big mining drill was to just get Tungsten, so it is also a direct upgrade from the normal mining drill in several ways:

Much larger mining area of 13x13 tiles (+4 tiles from the drill edge) which is very convenient when placing them in irregular areas like around lava.
Harvests faster, with a speed of 2.5/s compared to 0.5/s of the electric mining drill - almost double speed per occupied tile.
4 module slots, so you can insert three Efficiency modules and one Speed module to keep -80% pollution while boosting their speed.

It's kinda funny how much better the Space Age BMD is compared to the regular mining drill, then this super expensive advanced drill in IR3 is pretty much worse than it's predecessor.

[hexed turret]

yeah, IR3 kinda sucks at some of the gameplay design

[proven fractal]

Like how weird the balance of the advanced forestry stuff is

idk it's been a while but i never felt incentivised to use them with how annoying they are

Like I have to set up all this fertiliser and CO2 infrastructure for... 2x wood production.

I don't think it even eats any more polution iirc

[worldly portal]

I've tried to give them a shot, but wood to plastic uses way more CO2 than sour gas. To make all that CO2, you would generate much more sour gas as a byproduct than the wood to ethanol conversion can consume

[hexed turret]

yeah the ratios aren't right and I hated how in my first IR3 playthrough, I stored all of that CO2 only to find out that I can't ever use it

[worldly portal]

There's a point where you kind of have to accept that CO2 is just pollution juice and nothing more

[worldly portal]

By the way, how exactly do tree beds work when it comes to pollution?

Do they absorb any at all, or are they just there for forestry and decoration purposes

[proven fractal]

I'm pretty sure they still count as an actual tree

might be wrong though

[worldly portal]

I wonder if it would be theoretically possible to make enough wood to constantly rebuild a wall of tree beds faster than it can die

As long as the wall is thick enough, you can put all the necessary wood production behind it with no risk of it being damaged

[limber ocean]

Debug settings for pollution on map grid shows better absorption as you place more tree beds so yeah, they work like normal trees

Forestries effect doesn't show tho

[willow bronze]

I hate this

[sturdy flicker]

those fucked me up too so bad.

I still feel Graphene is the bigger sinner, with its one-way Helium gas I/O. Like, not even a nice helpful two-way fluid exchange I/O.

Even tried stacking them in a long sequence, but due to the input only ever accepting up to 40 helium, despite its output buffering nearly 240, this would cause a "ripple" of production as the delta of 40-fluid snaked its way down the stack.

Looked pretty cool at night though.

[willow bronze]

yeah this sucker

it works like traffic jam

can not say it was fun to invent this. but it works. this is pure evil at this point

[hexed turret]

Yeah in my previous playthrough I had trouble with this and it never got completely reliable

It was really annoying...

I guess one way to be sure is to input from one lane, and output to a different one, and in the middle joining them have a half-full tank

But I like to think we don't have to resort to that

[maiden moth]

it is one of "closed circle production", just pump in enough liquids to start and then it does not require additional liquid inputs

[hexed turret]

That's the theory, and for some reason in practice this ends with both machines that have excess, and machines that have a deficit

[spiral creek]

Try keeping a tank buffer of fluid

Keep them all at excess

[maiden moth]

Nah, smth is just messed up. If both machines has "output full" - too much of liquid in the pipes,
starving - too low
without modules all recepies are pefect

[gray escarp]

I've seen someone posting their entire BP for blue circuit

behold

it's beautiful

[willow bronze]

oi!

gimme

but I think, it will not fit into 4 squares

[gray escarp]

i cant tell

¯_(ツ)_/¯

i've just accepted my spaghetti instead

[willow bronze]

took me a lot overcoming to build this.

is a real shitshow

[spiral creek]

Prozessoreinheit that word is awesome

The way that German words end

[willow bronze]

about that, my built is also a close build. the input pump is hocked up with the one way valve, and will fill up to 50%. the reason why I did not remove it, is because it is build in a square, and suppose to be coppy-pastaable

its a good training to build in narrow space. perfect exercise for Space-age™️

[patent depot]

Dectorio doesnt give rubber trees or not that I found. but you can make an utterly inpenetrable wall of trees very close packed ... looks very unnatural.

[wind forge]

I've come to join the IR3 chat

Just wanted to complain about tin and lead specifically and how underutilised it feels compared to the other metals

[proven fractal]

They mostly exsit to be alloyed with copper

[wind forge]

My frustration is mostly with how to balance the ore washing step

In theory I could probably have it all go through a buffer to monitor production levels and turn on/off water heating to adjust tin:lead ratios as necessary

[proven fractal]

That is probably what you should do, yes

[wind forge]

In practice I'd have to calculate some desired ratio at the endgame science levels and that's kind of a pain as I transition to a baby megabase

[proven fractal]

You can use the same washers for both, just change change which water you pump into the setup

[wind forge]

Yep, I do that right now but manually toggle the setup with alarms to let me know when one is low

The buffers are big enough that I can let them clear and build up and only have to adjust them once every couple hours if at all

[proven fractal]

You should connect the alarm to the pumps

[wind forge]

Hahah

[proven fractal]

Then it wouldn't be manual

[wind forge]

Right but right now my alarm is "lead is empty" rather than some ratio being calculated

Or tin or whatever metal exists today

One thing I wouldn't do in hindsight is throw forestries everywhere because I overvalued minimising pollution

[proven fractal]

There is probably some theoretical perfect balance between the two in an endgame setup, but it's way easier to just turn on hot washing when pure lead mineral is below ~1000 or so

[wind forge]

Agreed

I'm doing some train->train megabase and it's definitely a lot more complicated in IR3 than vanilla

[proven fractal]

Yeah unless you're using cybersyn/ltn for stop priorities it gets messy

Will be way better in 2.0

[wind forge]

Don't know if you guys wanna see some blueprints but I feel like sharing them so hey, if there's a place it'd be here

Here's dirty water cleaning, everyone's favourite way to introduce their builds

Red circuits

Ethanol for plastic and as a wood sink

I like this wood -> ethanol -> plastic chain

It gives me a way to eat all my excess CO2 by dumping it in the advanced forestries, and then this becomes power when plastic backs up

I have no clue how net positive/negative it is on power/pollution but it seems to do at the very least better than the other possible fuel sources

That's all for now, not going to spam too much

[worldly portal]

It also helps with excess sulfur

It uses very little for the recipe itself (1 sour gas per 10 ethanol, even less with productivity), but the bigger impact is being able to make some plastic without going through the whole oil chain

And making more sulfur with each cracking step

[hexed turret]

what happened was that some of the machines had "output full", whereas other machines had insufficient helium.

when I continue my current playthrough, I'll run into the same thing again and I'll see whether that happens again

[maiden moth]

it can be avoided by keeping machines inputs/outputs independent from each other

[willow bronze]

so Friday facts are out. awesome, I love the new biomes, so hyped. anyways, its the day of the Facts

here are some facts after 200h+

[sturdy flicker]

Do you have to update those manually, or are those somehow updated from a counter?

[willow bronze]

in a game of automation ö.ö

[sturdy flicker]

Also, not sure the "themed" colored text for the fluids looks all that useful, contrast-ratio wise But thats the UI/UX Fullstack dev in me talking

[sturdy flicker]

I ask because there isn't a vanilla way of retreiving statistical or circuitry data and wirelessly transmitting them easily.

[willow bronze]

holo signs get the infos from the statistic panel. so its automated

[sturdy flicker]

Ah, more power to you then

[patent depot]

"free" oxygen for your arc furnaces too.

[wind forge]

Came up with this really fun idea for train -> train builds

High capacity batteries just a demonstration item but the idea of doublestacking miniassemblers is there

[worldly portal]

Very proud of this one

[willow bronze]

it has a circle and an arrow and another circle

[sturdy flicker]

"its got what revolutionary chips crave....yeah its got electrolytes"

[willow bronze]

hello there! its time to spread some democracy and expand

[hexed turret]

time to negotiate with the locals, right?

diplomacy mission

[willow bronze]

it was a good tip with the hot/cold water to control the amount which metal you want.

pumps are hocked up with the nobel metal box, so I can controll the amount in the box. good for gold, in my case

[hazy zodiac]

Anyone plays without LTN/Cybersun? I wonder how hard/annoying it is to deal with byproducts that needs high priority emptying

Like products (stone and sulphur if remember right) from ore washing

Actually i could try to use the flying ships for high priority stuff and then just use priority splitters. Ships seems to be new thing from when i last time played

[willow bronze]

airships is a extra mod. i'm using spidertrons instead of airships. getting rid of the byproducts is also easy, as you said, just splitter in your existing system.

[hazy zodiac]

yeah but that requires additional train stop, those ships seems to be pretty compact so they fit better. With the train mod that i used in my mega base there was no need for additional stations since i could just use the priority system for train pickup stops

[patent depot]

I didnt add IR3 Deep Space Mioning when I started... is that basically equivalent to SE's core mining kindof?

This was a pretty fun first run... lots of pauses in research where it too longer to get the next stuff set up than it took to do the research. Spagetti belt malls take time to make...

Still going though... doing some end game research and experimenting with a few things.... set up airship supplies of batteries and nuclear shells to island outposts to keep... the law mowed.

Seemed like to this point I was always bottlenecked one one thing or another but with stepwise conversion to arc furnace smelting and in particular a shift to Coke ratehr than hydrogen to the steel furnaces and some cleverness in how I make Coke I FINALLY got my refinery to be solidly stable.

Also gave up on the notion that the refinery should be able to fulfill the whole sour gas needs for explosives production.... and went out to develop the sour gas fissures a bit farther out that had better production rates

I could have made my bus a bit wider though... ran into some limits there... so started playing with the stackers which i'd avoided. I'd always thoght of them as cheaty when people add them to Vanilla or SE where they aren't naturaly part of the base game/main mod and you get to dodge around solving certain logistical challenges or make it easier... but they are in IR3.

One thing I didnt get into was direct molten casting of anything other than ingots

Putting molten steel on the main bus might get spicy

I'm finding that with Arc smelting and Prod3 that the ore reguirements are really low

[patent depot]

This.... does not seem to help! maybe if there were upgraded long inserters

[hexed turret]

Idk, it lets you launch space probes and place ore teleporters, so the ore teleporters are an unlimited source of all ores plus space ice (which turns into some gas, I forgot which one), their speed depends on how many space miners you've launched already. Space miners are very expensive.

[worldly portal]

Space ice turns into natural gas

Which can be turned into ethanol, then plastic

Or into hydrogen and CO2

Also believe it or not space mining does not give you all ores, only the 4 metals

No stone, coal, or uranium
That means you can get infinite free gold but no stone or coke 😭😭😭

[sturdy flicker]

Were Vita and I the only ones that added/enabled IR3's Powered Loaders?

They're invaluable for also mass-inserting from belts into entities, from which you can then transfer using bulk-inserters between entities, ie. mini-assembler to assembler.

[sturdy flicker]

Yeah, there's times one has either annoyingly too much or too little sour gas, but you always want sour gas from refinery sources used up first.

[hexed turret]

Fissures are free resources.

You can also put speed modules in the derrick, and surround it with beacons, for more free resources.

[patent depot]

Loaders are great... especially in combination with the stackers.

One thing I just noticed... Artillery range repeating tech doesn't require Explosives Analysis Pack... basically military tech. Would think it would.

[patent depot]

Good point. I was used to the more vanilla mechanic where you can make as little or as much sulfur as you want and figured these vents were an "extra" but it seems the rate of Sour Gas production byproduct from refining is balanced so you don't end up with a surplus so you kind of need to get gas from the vent to top up. Which makes a lot of sense .... I was going to say, the lack of void mechanic... but I suppose gas vent might work?

[hexed turret]

yeah there's no problem with harvesting all of the sour gas that you can, and then venting the extra, if you play without pollution and biters

[patent depot]

The various balancing/ tuning mechanics in IR3 were good challenges. It's hard to get something like the refinery/petrochemical complex right the first time. That said nobody builds the perfect refinery in vanilla their first run...

[hexed turret]

I wish the campaign / tutorials taught the really simple trick of wiring a red wire from a storage tank a pump. And then the trick of wiring it to from a chest to a belt. Finally, from a chest/tank to power pole, to another power pole.

This is all you need for IR3. (Plus priorities on splitters)

[patent depot]

Top up/overflow valves cover some of that too

I think vanilla goes out of its way to say you don't NEED circuits

[hexed turret]

it does, but it could have taught you circuits with such little effort

[hexed turret]

yeah, when I first played IR3 they didn't exist in the mod, and I ended up using a power switch instead, because the tutorials didn't tell me that I could just use a pump with a wire.

[willow bronze]

I love to initiate the arty all at once the first time

[sturdy flicker]

Freudenwerfer

is it btw maybe a typo? ie. Friedenwerfer ie. Peacelauncher?

[willow bronze]

Raketenwerfer, Flammenwerfer, Granatenwerfer, Freudenwerfer

[patent depot]

Always fun when you get the next tier of artillery range

[patent depot]

Whee fun cutscene using the Transmat

[spiral creek]

Freudenwarfer launches your parents

[sturdy flicker]

so cleeeeaaan

I know I've posted my Mixed-Resource Address Hasher & Binary Encoder a million times, but this time I've really made the effort to keep it small and clean of wires with respect to how they overlap/cover entities.

[sturdy flicker]

Been finally able to slim down the spread of the factory.

[hexed turret]

IMO gas furnaces are underwhelming. Their only upsides are that they have half the energy cost compared to using max efficiency modules on a furnace and then burning the natural gas with petrochem generators, and that they save you the space from burning the natural gas (petrochem generators are bulky!).
Edit: Ugh I just noticed they're exactly as efficient as an efficiency moduled furnace. They're even worse than what I thought.

I'm not even gonna build them this playthrough.

The downsides are:

• they are expensive (silicon carbide bricks; complex to automate recipe like everything else in IR3, then it's one more building to have in the inventory)
• I'd need to pipe in natural gas everywhere
• (!) I'll need to make sure that natural gas never runs out - this is the deal breaker for me - doing this extra balancing

I think they can be a fun addition to the game if they had something like a built-in productivity bonus, or at least if they were faster!

power is already not an issue, I could just build more steam engines or burn some petrochemicals...

[quaint pollen]

They ... uhh, work in blackout situations ?
Even in the case of a blackout, who in their right mind would use burner/steam inserters...

[hexed turret]

you can avoid blackouts though, I just have a chest full of coke and a buzzer that rings when it's less than 95% full

and you can run out of natural gas, so you get a new type of blackout now

[hexed turret]

they save you just 1/16 of a petrochem generator per gas furnace.
And they're inferior in every way once you get nuclear power (aka free infinite power)

if they consumed 10-15 kW, they'd be interesting enough for them to be worth existing!

though I still won't use them

[sturdy flicker]

All, and I do mean all, of my natural gas goes into making hydrogen, just for Rocket launches.
I'm not even kidding. That, and gasifying coke, no other way to make hydrogen worth a damn because we cant use the electroplater/chemplant to split water.

[hexed turret]

... I wouldn't put water in an electroplater if I were you :P

[sturdy flicker]

is that like an easter egg, can that actually be done in game and make it explode? that would be really fun tbh.

Like that time i discovered accidentally putting a hydrogen/hydrazine canister into a furnace in Astroneer.
Still salty about that.

[hexed turret]

There's no Easter egg, my brain just told me that it's water + electric thing. It's in its name tbh

[worldly portal]

It's a way for the rocket recipe to involve more oil processing

I like that they hit a balance between realism and gameplay

Vanilla is on the gameplay end of the spectrum, while making rocket fuel out of water would be the realism end

[proven fractal]

I mean making hydrogen from natural gas is significantly more realistic that through electrolysis, almost all hydrogen today is made through steam reforming.

(Electrolysis would also be pretty boring for Factorio)

[worldly portal]

Well, even better, I guess

[hexed turret]

It's present in a few other mods (AngelBob, Nullius, pY), and it's alright.

[sturdy flicker]

When I look at how spamming beacons is discouraged, I reckon something similar could work for Electrolysis.

• Could be made very power hungry. In comparison, Field-Aligned Electrum Crystals (ingredient for beacons) need 120s in an un-moduleable Supermagnet @ 2MW, so 240MJ per.
• Some sort of sacrificial Graphite Electrode or other resource could be needed, perhaps even outputting a kind of scrap you need to deal with.

[sturdy flicker]

holy hell xDD

it looks like they need 3, but unipipes only have the typical 2x1 pump length

and I was tearing my hair out with such iterations:

[hexed turret]

Damn, Marsh slowed down his video upload of his IR3 playthrough. I wanted to play along with him, and now I've been waiting for a while xD my savegame has purple science automated

[sturdy flicker]

I got a weird question, how does one enable the fuel manager in individual vehicles such as the spidertron to use remotely?

Ah, enter, Ctrl-G, then exit.

dear god, DoshDoshingtons idea to use spidertrons as mobile roboports is OP af. They have their own radar, so you can properly clear out peninsula-shaped base you want to deconstruct without having to resort to removing the tip of it piecemeal

[quaint pollen]

I am not a biter afficionado, but trying some IR early game with them made me wonder...
Just how much shotgun shells are economical compared to bullets. 10 shots is either too much for a shell pack, or 10 bullets is too little for a mag.

[sturdy flicker]

So I made this nifty little thing. Goals were:

• reduce superfluous clicking (setting the resource filter)
• show the current count of the thing I'm filtering for in logistics and linked-storage inventory.
• everything in a compact, but maximum 2cell height.

All this contraption does in the end is transfer stuff slowly from logistic storage into linked-chest storage, and count how much of it is left in total.

I now just have to copy-paste over the Linked-Chest.

• This sends a signal type and its count to the a signal-filter, which takes in the whole swath from logistics storage (the roboport).
• The result is just the type and count from logistics storage of the thing we're filtering for. This is sent to to the requester to request that amount..
  More importantly, it also anonymised to ▫️ , which every Nixie tube setup needs.
• Every nixietube group can now be set to ▫️ >= -2.1G, and it just shows the count.

[fervent stream]

What are the items that are displaying numbers?

[sturdy flicker]

the Nixie Tubes?

[fervent stream]

I don't know I've only messed with the basics of circuitry and LTN - I haven't really dug into the rest for IR3

I set up a little oil cracking display but it just uses lamps based off of preset thresholds

[wind forge]

Nixie tubes are a separate mod

[fervent stream]

Each lamp is 100k

[fervent stream]

Ah gotcha 😔

I'll have to check it out

[spiral creek]

I don’t like to store excess like that lol

[fervent stream]

I don't like needing it and not having it

[wind forge]

Don’t see you storing CO2

[fervent stream]

Venting that, too easy to make so I'm not worried about it

As soon as I need it, I'll set up like 1 chemical plant and have all I need

[wind forge]

CO2 sink was my big motivation to set up advanced forestries

I have yet to design a build for it that fits with my DI train playthrough but that can wait for after my holiday

[fervent stream]

I dug around and I couldn't find anything to spend it on outside of forestries, but those seemed like a hassle and a half to set up. I'm making rubber through ethanol and if I need wood I just do a sweep with some robots and I'm set for a long while

[wind forge]

Yeah, it definitely needs more uses

[fervent stream]

You do bring up a good point though it's probably time I set up wood automation so I could probably funnel the CO2 over that way and then set up vents to degass the rest

[wind forge]

Pollution is really a negligible factor in this overhaul with how accessible efficiency modules are, and the various pollution-reducing mechanisms, but it’s nice to just be “optimal” when you can and this is a relatively simple one to do

[hexed turret]

CO2 is bait, you end up venting most/all

[sturdy flicker]

why would you say something so controversial and yet so brave

[fervent stream]

Anyone have a resource I can dive into to look at arc furnaces and molten metal working?

Haven't gotten to that point yet but I want to play with it in my head and theory craft some stuff

[worldly portal]

Factoriolab can do IR3, that's one I know

[spiral creek]

Use the blueprint sand box

[worldly portal]

Use the blueprints and box

[fervent stream]

Looking at it rn, there doesnt seem to be a point for arc furnaces?

[worldly portal]

The mineral melting recipes give you more metal per ore, 3 ingots per mineral instead of 2

[fervent stream]

like for storage - why would I melt things and hold them as liquid?

[wind forge]

Well if nothing else they’re bigger and so can receive more beacons too

Yes, the liquid storage is a big issue too, it makes fluid trains less “good” for transporting metals

But that’s more because normal trains are buffed than bad ratios

[worldly portal]

Why would you want to transport them molten

I don't think that was ever the point

[fervent stream]

I would have thought molten would store better

[worldly portal]

You melt it and then pretty much immediately cast it

[fervent stream]

Idk why I thought that, just that it seemed like the next step

[wind forge]

Same reason you ship ingots instead of gears

It’s simpler to just have one thing on the network

[fervent stream]

So the process should be ore > wash > melt > ingot?

[wind forge]

Like how in buses you ship iron down instead of gears/rods

[worldly portal]

Well, it's going to work that way with the foundry in Space Age, but the arc furnace has very different ratios that do not support it at all

[worldly portal]

Yes

[fervent stream]

I was picturing like whole blocks full of molten iron and steel and stuff lol

[worldly portal]

Though for lead and brass, you could cast directly to plates and gears respectively, because those are the only forms they are ever used in

But then you lose out on ingot stacking, so maybe not

[fervent stream]

Yeah - 25k molten iron in a 3x3 tank is 2500 in a 1x1 chest which doesnt even fill it up

[worldly portal]

Also one thing to note, don't do alloying in the arc furnace. For some strange reason, arc furnace alloying doesn't accept productivity modules while regular furnace alloying does

It's kind of weird and counterintuitive imo, almost comes off as an oversight or something

[fervent stream]

I read its cause there are loops that would net more material if it accepted prod modules

so 10 iron goes in 12 iron goes out

set up enough of those loops and you have infinite iron

[worldly portal]

But the regular alloy furnace recipes which have the exact same ratios do accept prod, that's the weird part to me

[fervent stream]

plus that the creator doesnt like the idea of prod modules in everything w/ speed beacons around them

oh

[worldly portal]

I thought it was because there were so many intermediates that it would be overpowered if every step had productivity

[fervent stream]

the number of intermediates is just a pita tbh

lol

[quaint pollen]

Thing is storage tank pumping directly into a fluid wagon loads it in a blink, so it would feel like more speedy throughput for less buffer capacity.

But I know the UPS woes as soon as fluids are in the table. ..

[fervent stream]

But is speed really important when you can transport 4x the amount in the same space through ingots?

smelting pure and scrap into ingots seems to be the only thing

[quaint pollen]

then cast the liquid immediately into ingots at the output of the furnaces.

[fervent stream]

Yeah

Was just disapointed I couldnt store huge amounts of molten ingredients

thought that would have been cool

[quaint pollen]

imo storage fluid tanks need a lil buff to catch up.

[wind forge]

Yeah bit of an oversight to buff solids but not fluids

[quaint pollen]

the visual show 3 tanks, so 75k to make it "almost 8k bars"

[wind forge]

Hopefully 2.0 gives some better inspiration to numbers

[fervent stream]

Looking through FNEI - it actually looks like molten metal's only purpose is to alloy or ingot

seems kind of redundant lol

Disappointed in this feature

[quaint pollen]

Casting machines can output plates and gears

wowee

imagine that, molten to red science

[fervent stream]

lol

Removes an inserter > 1x1 assy > inserter I suppose

but you cant put a module in the cast so you lose that productivity/speed

[quaint pollen]

you can't productify plates/gears anyways

[fervent stream]

I suppose it could make my bot area a bit more condensed

[quaint pollen]

can't can't

[fervent stream]

speed tho

[wind forge]

The alloying is definitely one area which could be fleshed out more

[fervent stream]

I need a scrapping area blueprint

[quaint pollen]

Yeah the difference between something modulable and non modulable is so big, like 1/5 energy consumption.

[wind forge]

Now its more a proof of concept than anything you’d jump to have

[wind forge]

Like, recycling?

[fervent stream]

yeah

[wind forge]

Just setup a requester into a recycler into a furnace into an active provider? Not sure what I’m missing there

[fervent stream]

Could work - I havent thought it through

I was thinking of a design of priority splitters to move the scrap to different areas to get smelted

[wind forge]

You just need an output for the non-metal outputs

[fervent stream]

using the airships to move stuff I want to recycle out maybe

I cant think of another purpose for them lmao

[wind forge]

That could definitely work but it seems your scrapping system is going to be very active and I’m wondering why

[fervent stream]

we've moved areas like twice now - everytime we get a new tier basically

the old bases are just sitting there

but I dont want to go through the hassle of sorting them

so robots to deconstruct, sends the stuff to the recycle plant and it get reincorperated into the base

would be cool to design - gonna look at it tommorow

[wind forge]

If you have robots you can just isolate the area to deconstruct and set up some requester chests

[fervent stream]

yeah but thats a hassle to set up the chests

I was thinking along the lines of one of the warehouses

just throw all the trash in there

and it belts over to the recycling plant

plus my bots are already busy enough

I have a set doing science, another set for my mall, and then like 10k construction rn for building stuff quick

All the intermediates - it felt like bots was the only way to actually do something productive

which is why I was disapointed in the metal, I thought it would be an alternative approach but it looks like its just a lil different but overall bots are still gonna have to be the way to go

[wind forge]

You can use yellow boxes to have construction bots put the stuff in front of the recyclers

Anything that can’t be recycled simply stays in the boxes

[wind forge]

I really disagree, it’s pretty viable to just have the intermediates produced on site

And then the argument boils down to how to get your stuff to your production area and we reduce the argument to bots vs belts (vs trains) again

[sturdy flicker]

Pipes have far better throughput than belts for equivalent items. With proper pumping, you could have a whole span of casteries making ingots, plates, rods and gears (no rivets tho, sadge ) en masse and train them to where they need to go.

---

If you directly make ingots from furnaces, you're limited to a base rate of 45/s per belt of I/O.

Not sure what the molten liquid:solid item ratio is, but you can pump at up to 12.000/s, which even at 100 liquid per ingot/gear is 120/s

[fervent stream]

So pipes for throughput and ingots for storage then?

[sturdy flicker]

cast ingots/gears/plates, etc, as the product you need to get to where they are needed

[fervent stream]

Cause theres gotta be some kind of storage just to help balance the need between primary/secondary ore

I don't want millions of the stuff but my ore washing setup cuts copper in 1/2 and then 1/2 again when nickle fills up

[sturdy flicker]

Oh, no, thats a different issue.

Primary and secondary ores are best handled by regulating the washer-water temperature.

[fervent stream]

Okay thats what ive been doing

[sturdy flicker]

But you're exploring an interesting solution to "sink" more primary ore and deliberately get less of the primary intermediate if you are low on secondary ore/intermediate. Nice.

[fervent stream]

The way I have my setup rn is a circut based system that reads both primary ingots and secondary ingots - if everything is being equally consumed then theres no issue - hot washing and getting 2 belts of ore in and 4 belts of Primary out/2 belts of secondary out.

If Secondary fills up
-- 1/2 way full - the system swaps from hot washing to cold washing
-- 3/4 full - System stops washing ore completely and switches to smelting crushed ore
-- >= 3/4 full AND primary is 1/2 full - system stops smelting crushed ore and swaps to smelting base ore
-- >= 3/4 full and Primary is >= 3/4 full - stops smelting all together

If Primary fills up but secondary isnt - the ore is still crushed and washed, Pure primary ore is stored in an ever expanding warehouse system and secondary ore is smelted and pushed into the bus

Very proud of the circutry tbh

OH also as soon as primary demand goes back up - it will reincorporate the stored pure ore into the smelting array so that the storage will dwindle back down but the secondary ingots are unaffected

[reef lark]

Blueprint String

Blueprint 1

(Modded features are shown as question marks)

[sturdy flicker]

I think you can skip the "smelting base ore" step as it doesn't contribute to having any more or less secondary, at least. All it does is prevent the primary 2/4 -> 3/4 full step from transitioning too quickly.

You're already stopping washing at that point, so it also doesn't affect your secondary ingot amount.

Huh, I just braided my primary and secondary ores on red and blue belts.

It lets me make the design a bit more compact, but I am aware blues only 50% faster than reds, not twice as fast.

[sturdy flicker]

Also smart to store the ore than the ingots, due to higher representative density before smelting.

[gray escarp]

Seems like Deadlock taking big inspiration from the SA expansion

https://mods.factorio.com/mod/IndustrialRevolution3Inspiration

I had a hunch when he added the rocket launcher to IR3 in a recent update

[wind forge]

Seems to emulate trigger techs? Won’t be able to check for a while but seems cool

[fervent stream]

So it just makes getting tech harder? It's not new stuff lol

I think I'll pass, Glad other people have a different challenge

[proven fractal]

Not really? It looks like it just adds trigger techs to streamline the tech tree.

[bitter mortar]

Its just makes techs unable to use before you have resources
Not like it was any different beforehand

[sturdy flicker]

How does that then technically work, do you just feed iron ingots into a lab to show you have iron to unlock steam generators? Or as soon as you produce the first ingot the tech unlocks?

[worldly portal]

Welcome back Special Projects addon

[worldly portal]

When you first obtain/produce them

[sturdy flicker]

OH LOL

I never realized until now that labs have limits on which sciences they accept.

The clockwork one only does R+G, the electric one does all except space science, and only the Quantum Lab does all 7

[hexed turret]

Yep, I wasn't totally excited to start using quantums due to their size

[quaint pollen]

they have more modules slot for those sweet

[hexed turret]

Hmmph... Fair enough

Totally fair design

[sturdy flicker]

Decided to start a ribbon world, with biters this time.
No gimmicks, no unipipes, no linked chests.

[hexed turret]

I'm noticing that the arc furnace doesn't have a recipe for smelting crushed ore, only washed ore

[wind forge]

Correct

[hexed turret]

But you're never guaranteed to get enough washed ore, because you can't void its byproduct

So what do you do? Do you set up a line of regular furnaces, smelting crushed ore, to be used as a backup?

[wind forge]

That’s one way to solve it

[hexed turret]

Isn't this the only automated way?

I'm also thinking I ought to use regular furnaces for the secondary ore because I actually don't want more of it. It's free and effectively unlimited.

[wind forge]

Essentially IR3 gives you 2 recipes for ore washing - they each give you a different amount of the “unique” product

[hexed turret]

Yeah but even with cold washing, sometimes you end up with too much byproduct

[wind forge]

The overhaul introduced the logistical challenge of balancing your production of the two ores, and as you brought up earlier, smelting only crushed and not washed ores to benefit it is one way to solve it

[wind forge]

Which stage of the game are you at?

[hexed turret]

I've beaten it once, now I'm thinking ahead for my current playthrough which is at purple science

[wind forge]

If you adopt it too early, you do have to stockpile some ores, but down the line I find the amount consumed in infinite research is between the two

Between the two recipes

So while you’re not fully using all the science packs you’ll have issue

(Specifically lead screw lead)

[hexed turret]

Hmm my factory also be producing something other than science, e.g. filling chests for mall

Or deep space miners

[wind forge]

Mall doesn’t/shouldnt consume enough to throw you off the ratio

What are deep space miners?

[hexed turret]

This stuff https://mods.factorio.com/mod/IndustrialRevolution3SpaceMining

I think it's neat in theory

Have used it very little, have only launched 1 or 2

[wind forge]

I’ve not heard of that

Might try it in my next IR3 playthrough

[sturdy flicker]

wheeeeeee~

[sturdy flicker]

Jesus, I'm no longer used to the game saving within a few hundred miliseconds any more

new maps are so bae

[fervent stream]

Finished the bulk of my Solar panels book - Excellent Panel/Accumulator Ratio - all fitting inside a city block, Tiles on top of each other for easy replacement going from T1 to T2 and easy expansion for Tier2 to Tier2 Extended. Blueprint book is here #bot-stuff message

Special thanks to @halcyon fog for their help dealing with my slow brain moments and trying to math

[maiden ferry]

Do the city block designs have universal size?