Quality

[grave condor]

how about legendary oil

[jaunty citrus]

Fluids don't get quality

[grave condor]

make a mod

[jaunty citrus]

That's not how mods work

[daring siren]

You can jank it, but it'll be janky

[half raptor]

you'd have to do barrels of quality fluid but you wouldn't be able to unbarrel it like normal

best to not even touch the idea

[cold wadi]

Thanks for the idea!
I'm gonna try it

Let's see if I get quality water or not

[sage vapor]

fluids can not have a quality

[daring siren]

I speculate a release

[molten bobcat]

Qualiity Pipes ?

Or only oumps

[sage vapor]

pipes also exist but only increase in health

like everything else

[molten bobcat]

Okay

[vocal dove]

Quality is amazing but boy does it require a lot of micromanaging before logistic robots time..

[daring siren]

It's good that logistic bots are quite early

[stable lagoon]

how does quality science work? can they be mix and matched or all the same quality?

[iron root]

quality science packs can be mixed

[torn swallow]

anything worth trying to get quality on early?

[jaunty citrus]

There are some gimmes, mainly anything you use in science

might as well make quality electric furnaces

solar panels are good for space platforms, and you can use the normal ones to power your base

[torn swallow]

yeah baby!!!

[twin peak]

how do i have the quality icon show on top?, it gets buried often (pictured here: a rare circuit)

[jaunty citrus]

Have the belt go a different direction?

[twin peak]

[hearty frigate]

of course

[kindred crater]

holy shit that's good

[high zenith]

how do you sum up all the qualities of a circuit signal?

[uncut helm]

arthimetic combinatior with add operation?

[high zenith]

That only does two qualities at once so I need 3 combinators

[uncut helm]

yeah

[high zenith]

Someone suggested for sources that only have a single item, decider with each > 0 => Q input count

[uncut helm]

@high zenith you can also do this

[high zenith]

Ah, the research on the selector hasn't finished yet (or did it?) so I haven't poked at it yet

[uncut helm]

ahh it doesnt actually sums them up

[high zenith]

yeah we'd need something like a "quality stripper" that translates all input signals to a different quality

[jaunty citrus]

Would a decider with [signal] > 0 or [signal_uncommon] > 0 or [signal_rare] > 0 etc. output input count work?

I don't know how the new deciders work in that situation

[high zenith]

good idea to test

(I've closed the game for the night, sorry)

[uncut helm]

no, unless you use 5 decider combinators each for different quality

[jaunty citrus]

rip

[uncut helm]

what we really need is multiple operations in the arthimetic combinator

same way we have multiple conditions in the decider

[jaunty citrus]

Yeah... I think I remember that immediately being requested after the FFF 😅

[raven hatch]

legendary rail signal.

[main talon]

Will higher quality get container with 1 slot stuck or?

[grand igloo]

yes

[daring siren]

Yep. It's recommended to use signals to control things with quality

For example, I have a parametrized blueprint with an inserter into a filtered storage chest. You choose the item and number of stacks and it sets the inserter to stop inserter when the logi network has more than that amount of item.
Because the chest is not limited, quality items can pile up there without a problem, in addition to the main item.

[stable lagoon]

is there any reason not to put quality in science assemblers early game?

[daring siren]

Yes, productivity has better numbers

But you should probably put quality in all assemblers that can accept prod

[main ruin]

can't *

[raven hatch]

stolen meme violently

[stable lagoon]

Is there a better solution to move quality items/ore by train than (2000 [Train Car inv] - 100 [2 Stack size, 1 stack per type of quality] ) * 4 [Train car length] = ( >= [Total amount] ) ?

[dire cosmos]

probably more efficient to dedicate each train to a single quality

all this quality optimization is breaking my brain lol

[half raptor]

You can, but you can also have mixed trains and trust the new train interrupt schedules to deliver your upgrades to the appropriate stations, like if you have a station and a station you can set your interrupts to deliver accordingly even if they're in the same train

Just make sure your inserters at your unloading station have filters set

[dire cosmos]

oh true, but what happens to the train when one of the quality's input storage gets backed up

would the train just not schedule a pickup in the first place

one of these days i'll figure out circuits enough to have optimized stations but today is not the day lol

single item loading stations still seem to be the most noob friendly option

guys how do direct insertion work with quality. Say i want to put quality modules in copper wires, which would then go into quality red circuit assembling. would I need to use the new "set recipe" circuit function on one of the red circuit assemblers

i wonder why we aren't allowed to just input any quality

[stable lagoon]

the problem is the loading not the delivery as that could be solved with a simple splitter.
If i get lets say 5 q1 and 2 q2 then the train won't ever leave the station because the stack isn't full. The above solution i used just minuises the possible unfilled stacks.

[stable lagoon]

that would make it so much simpler if you could

[dire cosmos]

yeah..... trying to figure out a direct insertion setup without logistic bots and its hell lol

[stable lagoon]

you would have to route the other qualitys out and filter the one you want each way

[dire cosmos]

yeah but belting/botting copper wires offends me on a spiritual level

for red circuit i'd basically need 3 qualities of green circuits at the ready, which would be okay with bots i guess but belting it is a mess

maybe its time to give up and just accept that some wires will need to be taken out lol

[stable lagoon]

well its only till you get to fulgoria you can then recycle them to go again

[dire cosmos]

i think quality setups are just better for late game 😔

rn i have no bots and no recylers lol

so only end products are getting qualitied

It still confuses me why they aren't letting you mix qualities lol

[raven hatch]

Some exploit in testing or smthn

With bonus prod

[dire cosmos]

oh dang. yeah i can see how that might happen, if you quality the cheapest ingredients to hell

[stable lagoon]

yeah but couldn't that be solved by defaulting to lowest quality and resetting prod when using a new tier of quality? Cause what i heard they were doing was using common parts with prod till just before it would make 2 and then change it to quality giving them potentially 2 legendary's.?

[dire cosmos]

i imagine you can also end up with net positive recycling loops even without abusing prod cycles

if you bring up the quality of something expensive via idk legendary iron plates or something, then recyle the end product

[stable lagoon]

you can't with the recycleing because there is a hard prod limit to prevent that

[dire cosmos]

oh wait really

i haven't gotten to the recylers yet

[stable lagoon]

you get 25% back normaly and there is a 300% max on prod so the very max you can get is to break even

[dire cosmos]

its 25% even for high quality items?

wouldn't a legendary item getting recycled end up with 100% of base items

so if you have normal everything, then use a single legendary copper wire to bring up the overall quality of an expensive product, then get high quality raws back via recycling

you can go over 100%

you can then for example start generating copper from iron or something

[stable lagoon]

yes, though you can up cycle. you can throw gears for example in that is uncommon and you will get 2 iron of its quality every 4 gears but have a small chance to get a rare depending on the modules

[stable lagoon]

no, not its 25% of the mats of that quality

[dire cosmos]

yeah exactly, so you definitely can get a net positive with mixed quality inputs

[stable lagoon]

not if the default was that you put a uncommon a rare and a legandary you only get back the least quality item

[dire cosmos]

for example a very expensive late game item requires a shit ton of copper ingredients but little iron. You use legendary iron plates to inclease the quality of the final product. recyle final product, get high quality copper intermediates completely disporportionate to the amount of iron you invested

so now you have a bunch of high quality copper products without doing a single thing

[distant eagle]

#1215078107334057984 message
I worked on this with Janky Quality

A buffer helped with temporary imbalances.in quality ratios.

[dire cosmos]

yeah but thats not direct insertion. its simple when you just belt the wires

[distant eagle]

If you want T2 modules, you need a second set of red assemblers, with quality modules, for each quality level. To match ratios with the T1 modules

Do you not belt wires for red circuits production normally?

[dire cosmos]

yeah but that's exactly it. with direct insertion, you'll need a combinator to automatically change the recipe based on what copper wire you manage to produce

then somehow belt in 3 different types of green circuits

tho not all red circuit assembler would need access to the high quality green circuits, its still a pain to set up a 6 to 1 direct insertion block

my usual red circuit block

this would be honestly kind of trivial with bots lol but im going for the no bots until space achievements

[half raptor]

Honestly, now that the game is out I'm coming up with much simpler solutions than what I had in mind months ago

[burnt reef]

bots are unlocked after space anyway

(well, logistics bots, which is what the achievement tracks)

[half raptor]

I have this convoluted idea that would require a lot of circuit conditions and complicated interrupt logic...

Or I can just make groups of quality production lines next door and use splitter logic to send upgrades to the right output station and use local recycling to recycle overflows. Any quality ingredients would just go to the line next door and process the upgraded ingredients. Each line would have its own quality demand stations and output. The thought is that it keeps things running until it overflows each quality and overfills at legendary.

Idea does need recyclers though

If I do this on every intermediate where it will just continue to cycle and recycle until the legendary output is full, it seems like a good use of a production line. It would only recycle if the station is overfull anyway

[dire cosmos]

i guess this wasn't too bad, only downside is that it only outputs two qualities

i can get it to 4 with some belt weaving but the fear is that throughput would become a problem

for the rarer qualities

figured that a 1% chance just isn't worth direct insertion

[gleaming quartz]

Would the most effective use of quality components be to try and get higher quality modules first? Unless theres a specific need, I feel like that should be the general aim

Higher quality quality modules means increased chance of quality down the road

[dire cosmos]

yes, and high quality prod modules

with stuff like solar panels it also never hurts to just through in some quality modules. doesn't matter if you end up with a weird assortment of qualities

[cold wadi]

Maybe my hunch was right!

[daring siren]

There's no quality fluids

[stable lagoon]

my mixed quality item trains solution seems to work without jamming or leaving part empty after i added a (And inactivity) to the second condition to make sure the train loaded up everything it possibly could.

[half raptor]

Why are you able to put quality modules in?

[dire cosmos]

almost everywhere

[lyric yacht]

mfw i roll 50 5% chances and don't get a single quality thing

[torpid niche]

I want to see if a quality thing (say, a lab) is "worth" making. How can I preview the stats of quality stuff without actually making it?

[main ruin]

in factorpedia hover over diamonds

[stable lagoon]

you can also alt left click on an item to go to its factoriopedia page instantly.

[distant eagle]

Factoriopedia mobile app?

[stable lagoon]

no the in game one

[distant eagle]

no, i wish there was a factoriopedia mobile app

[stable lagoon]

ahh

[frank warren]

just aim it at anything and it gives the info on it

basically Google lens but better

[arctic gyro]

factoriopedia is really cool

[weak ruin]

Okay, I think I'm starting to understand. Quality can move on in any level (albeit unlikely) even on Nauvis so you need to thonk upon what to do with any given level. High levels Intermediaries can be stockpiled and put in an Assembler for a specific job (like Armour or Guns). Mid-level stuff can be sent to a "Boutique Mall" for things where you want to focus on using the Quality, low-level stuff can go back on the main bus or be yote into a small Science maker and sinked out that way.

[lyric yacht]

anyone have that blueprint for quality where it only puts modules in the beacons after the craft started?

nvm i made it myself

[half raptor]

Why wouldn't you just start with quality modules in?

[lyric yacht]

because mech armor takes 60 seconds to make, so it'll start the craft with quality modules then once its started the beacons activate to give it the speed boost without dropping quality

[weak ruin]

Something I don't a clear answer on is what tiers you can make before leaving Nauvis, is it just Green and Blue?

[raven hatch]

Yep, you need to go to Gleba to get epic, and Aquilo for legendary

[lament hornet]

Can I craft higher quality machines by only using common quality intermediates and a quality module’d assembler?

or do i have to use higher quality intermediates

or would it create even higher quality machines if i use quality modules and high quality intermediates?

[clear scarab]

If you couldn't, how would you get anything quality to begin with?

[iron root]

It’s this case.
Quality ingredients sets the “base” quality of the product, which quality mods can rank up even further

[fallen urchin]

Legendary character entities?

[main talon]

Is that chance of getting better one.

Probably only worth doing on last nuclear step.

[eternal mural]

apparently player entity quality is scripting only

[main talon]

Afraid it destroys fun of handcrafting stuff.

[eternal mural]

wdym

[lament hornet]

i see ty ty tyt ytt y tyt yy tyt tytty tytyt MACHINE

[half raptor]

It's possible to make a machine using ingredients but it's not very likely. Even when you get the upgrade, it's a 1 in 1000 chance to upgrade 3 extra ranks on top of the chance to get the upgrade

The idea of stockpiling quality ingredients is that if you have a store of legendary ingredients, you're guaranteed a legendary result

[main talon]

Does it roll on each quality module or?